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Hello everyone, for the last few years I've been designing a competitive two-player wargame set in a steampunk fantasy world populated by talking animals. The game was mostly inspired by Warmachine/Hordes and is a culmination of my experiences from playing miniatures games competitively for nearly a decade. I showed off the game at a game designer event last weekend named Protospiel, and it received praise from publishers and playtesters for its unique theme and simple but deep ruleset. The game is planned to have acrylic or thick cardboard cutouts mounted on a base, and fit a niche scale between a skirmish and a full wargame (units are typically between 1-6 figures) It was also considered to be an ideal entry-level game into the genre and for parents who wish to play a wargame with their kids but still wanted a game that was deep enough for experienced players. Unfortunately, I have a difficult decision to make for the game's art direction. Which I've attached as a photo and would like your opinion on which you feel would be the most suitable. Note that although the characters are cute and expressive, the overarching story is meant to be taken seriously and is oftentimes quite dark.

I'm looking for opinions on which would be the people's preference of the two styles, IGNORING that Style 1 is only sketched at the moment.

Style 1: Anthro style inspired by Zootopia. The benefits of this style over style 2 are that it may attract furries as a potential market but isn't furry enough that it alienates those who aren't. The environments are simpler to design, as not everything has to be designed for four-legged animals like in style 2. The characters are easier to pose and are better suited for fitting on a circle base if they are plastic miniatures, but also can have a greater variety of poses if they are illustrated. It is however much less original and would require me to scrap the original art, though this is the sunk cost fallacy.

Style 2: The protagonist species are inspired by ponies, but designed to look more like steampunk goats. However, this does mean that almost everyone who looks at them draws the comparison and may either think that they're cute and interesting or dismiss it because of the resemblance. In this art style the creatures' cities, weaponry, and furniture are all specially designed for four legged animals, creating a unique looking fantasy world. There are a few problems though, such as the characters needing a short ranged telekinesis to be able to manipulate tools and objects (no hands) and their poses are limited, too wide and the cutout won't fit on a base and if I went with plastic miniatures they may have a hard time fitting on the base.

I would greatly appreciate any and all comments and what your preference would be between style 1 and style 2. Please vote here:
http://www.poll-maker.com/poll749445x13ec4C08-30

I think style 1 is better, because they will be able to be used as alternative aliens in a bunch of different games. Style 2 is very cute tho, and I like them. lol

 Lockark wrote:
I think style 1 is better, because they will be able to be used as alternative aliens in a bunch of different games. Style 2 is very cute tho, and I like them. lol

Interesting, that's something I actually didn't consider

-

Thanks for the responses so far, every vote/comment helps

Why not both , have different units/factions

Both look good, but I like 1 better.

Part of that is the suspension of disbelief being kicked in by the second group. They have all that kit and clothing, but no opposable thumbs. How are they using any of it?

I voted for Style 1 because it's more unique, and you can do more interesting poses and equipment instead of Style 2's shin-gun and knee bends.

Style #1 seems to come together a bit nicer.

Style #2 I would agree needs a more quadruped friendly tech (back mounted turret, head mount tech, rather than knife sheath on leg more "wolverine" style retractable gear, any controls would have to fall within "mouth" reach or a kickable switch). It is VERY cute however.

A nod of the head to Pokémon style gear would be needed for Style 2 to work if serious about it.
The Disney esthetic already has a large pre-existing market so may have a better "chance" at success.

<edit> I know it looks nice but when I see belt buckles and hooves... unless they have a human or simian rider I just do not see it working.
Good job not showing buttons.
Lots of Velcro or zippers with large tabs.

With style #2 the lore explains that the animals of the planet evolved from an alien material called ragnicite which came from a meteor that collided with the planet eons ago, and as part of this evolution they developed psionic powers that would allow them to levitate objects and make up for their lack of hands. Unfortunately that's the best I could do to explain it without giving every character a mechanical arm on their back

 Talizvar wrote:
Style #1 seems to come together a bit nicer.

Style #2 I would agree needs a more quadruped friendly tech (back mounted turret, head mount tech, rather than knife sheath on leg more "wolverine" style retractable gear, any controls would have to fall within "mouth" reach or a kickable switch). It is VERY cute however.

A nod of the head to Pokémon style gear would be needed for Style 2 to work if serious about it.
The Disney esthetic already has a large pre-existing market so may have a better "chance" at success.

<edit> I know it looks nice but when I see belt buckles and hooves... unless they have a human or simian rider I just do not see it working.
Good job not showing buttons.
Lots of Velcro or zippers with large tabs.

I would have to go with style 1 also, I can see us in the minis in difernt games. So give more reason to grab one of minis as well as try the game.
Style two just doesn't fit with what I would be interested in, as well I don't mind psyonics and Magic, but it would lose me a bit if it was used in such a way.

So I think for me myself I would like to see style 1 100%, style 2 I would maybe get a few for other projects, but not buy into a game with that style. (This off corse could change if the product was really good and the written universe interesting, but would need more work for me)
:9

Apple fox wrote:
I would have to go with style 1 also, I can see us in the minis in difernt games. So give more reason to grab one of minis as well as try the game.
Style two just doesn't fit with what I would be interested in, as well I don't mind psyonics and Magic, but it would lose me a bit if it was used in such a way.

So I think for me myself I would like to see style 1 100%, style 2 I would maybe get a few for other projects, but not buy into a game with that style. (This off corse could change if the product was really good and the written universe interesting, but would need more work for me)
:9

Thanks for your input, do you think it'd help if I wrote a tl:dr version of the lore to post here?

I prefer Style 1, but from a manufacturing standpoint I would caution against those thin digitigrade ankles. They have a strong tendency to break due to the flex point. The second and third from the left would be really fragile in resin, and iffy in metal or plastic depending on the scale of the model. You can get around that by sculpting them a little beefier through added shoes, padding, whatever, but it does need to happen as naked feet to scale won't do the trick.

As reference, I did a lot of the resin production for Brush Fire back in the day, and that was a really common issue transferring from the metals to resin.

Zoot wrote:
With style #2 the lore explains that the animals of the planet evolved from an alien material called ragnicite which came from a meteor that collided with the planet eons ago, and as part of this evolution they developed psionic powers that would allow them to levitate objects and make up for their lack of hands. Unfortunately that's the best I could do to explain it without giving every character a mechanical arm on their back

Then I would suggest items used that can levitate do not need handles.
A double ended blade in a sheath would look suitably "angry" to compensate.
Buckles as a big metal square with no visible button etc.
Saddle-bag side guns would not look too horrible.
I would still lean toward some more organic blend of interlocking components or plates (Pokémon) than human clothes adapted to animals.
I assume the psionics are not the level of control demonstrated by Magneto so most items would have to be fairly simple.

Just seeing if a unique style can be made without it looking like people suddenly got changed into horses (unless people like that look...).
I guess it is where people are comfortable to draw their line for magical thinking.
If it had to be logical we would not be looking at cutesy figures.

Style 1 is the obvious correct choice. You can make artistic arguments for either (though drop the awkward fluff about telekinesis and embrace the fact that you're doing MLP with guns), but style 2 has manufacturing issues and style 1 doesn't. It doesn't matter how good or bad your art style is if you can't make a finished product.

 Peregrine wrote:
Style 1 is the obvious correct choice. You can make artistic arguments for either (though drop the awkward fluff about telekinesis and embrace the fact that you're doing MLP with guns), but style 2 has manufacturing issues and style 1 doesn't. It doesn't matter how good or bad your art style is if you can't make a finished product.

Perhaps, though I was considering making the characters acrylic cutouts instead of plastic miniatures to make the game affordable

Option 1 is the best choice of the two for many reasons.

While I do not have done any significant market research and the various ponies figures kickstarters did ok, I doubt there is much larger audience for such models or that a similar looking product will achieve more, from a lore perspective the design makes little to no sense (if they have psionics they would have developed a different tool making concept and not go into tools that require manipulator arms) and finally it will be difficult to cast especially in single piece.

Option one has the merit of been an established aesthetic (not only form Disney) that does not need hand-waving for it to function (though some things may need some extra attention like buttons and gun grips) it can deliver recognisable poses since essentially it is a human silhouette and can indeed be used in other games, although I would strongly advice against designing with this in mind, it creates compromises that will be problematic for the line in the future for insignificant overlap (and the vast majority who will overlap will do so anyway regardless of compatibility).

Have you thought of a marketing plan? so far it seems a nice herbivores vs carnivores situation, but it could be more elaborate than that, entry point wargames for new or unrelated gamers is somethign we discuss down in the game design forum, you can join in the discussion if you want.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Zoot wrote:

Perhaps, though I was considering making the characters acrylic cutouts instead of plastic miniatures to make the game affordable

With the elevated expectations kickstarter has created (for good or evil) this will not work even in boardgames with really good designer names behind it miniatures is a key deciding factor.

Although I voted style 1, I have to say they would look great as six legged animals. 4 for locomotion, 2 for manipulation.

A possibility would be that instead of using telekinesis, the characters have mechanical augments on their shoulders that act as a second set of arms and can manipulate objects, they can also fold up when not in use. Something like this perhaps but augmented into their shoulders?

 Mathieu Raymond wrote:
Although I voted style 1, I have to say they would look great as six legged animals. 4 for locomotion, 2 for manipulation.

vestigial wings that have developped prehensile ends would be a good explanation. They could fold back on their backs.

Zoot wrote:A possibility would be that instead of using telekinesis, the characters have mechanical augments on their shoulders that act as a second set of arms and can manipulate objects, they can also fold up when not in use. Something like this perhaps but augmented into their shoulders?

Spoiler:

Mathieu Raymond wrote:vestigial wings that have developped prehensile ends would be a good explanation. They could fold back on their backs.

As Mathieu Raymond said it must be an organic part of the creature, species must first naturally have tools manipulation in their physical form one way or another before they make augments for better manipulation.

That's very true :( I am leaning heavily towards anthro unless a publisher wants me to go with style 2. At least I'm not starting from scratch this time and it's converting from quadruped to two legged

 PsychoticStorm wrote:

Zoot wrote:A possibility would be that instead of using telekinesis, the characters have mechanical augments on their shoulders that act as a second set of arms and can manipulate objects, they can also fold up when not in use. Something like this perhaps but augmented into their shoulders?

Spoiler:

Mathieu Raymond wrote:vestigial wings that have developped prehensile ends would be a good explanation. They could fold back on their backs.

As Mathieu Raymond said it must be an organic part of the creature, species must first naturally have tools manipulation in their physical form one way or another before they make augments for better manipulation.

I'd avoid the more MLP-inspired designs for a few reasons. For one, you'd be kind of shoehorning yourself in with a fad from a few years back. For two, how would they make guns and armor with hooves for hands? Style 1 both makes more sense from a universe perspective, and shows a distinctive art style that's all yours. You'd be doing yourself a disservice to have it just look like MLP fanart.

To be honest, this doesn't appear to be my cup of tea.

I would probably not play the anthro game.

I would definitely not play the quadruped one.