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You know em: They don't offer much. They're a bolter that always fires 2 shots and not much else.
My question for you is whether or not the 'Assault' classification they fire at.would be worth to have in a dedicated close combat squad where everyone either has a storm shield or a lightning claw, so the bolt pistol isn't even giving an extra attack.
I'm mostly going for there for my army, but knowing their worth would be good i think.

I'd take them but they'd be first on the chopping block if you need to cut points.

I’d never pay points for them. Unless I was going for a WYSWYG model that already has one.

Keep your free weapons, and use the points anywhere else.

Also, what unit are you thinking of taking them on? The only one where you are more of a close combat squad who has the option to take stormbolers I can think of is a command squad. In which case they also have an option for a flamer. Which you will probably get more use out of. The point man of my command squad is a stormshield/flamer guy. First into the breach, first to die. But it was only 5 points to give him the flamer, so why not. Fills the hand and is more generically useful then a melta bomb.

You might have other options if using another codex. Not sure how BA/DA/SW do things.

I am using the vanilla dex, and yeah im talking about command squad. I just think they look.fricken sweet is all, lol. And after playing through space marine on xbox again and seeing how gross of a weapon it is, i really wanted to see a whole squad of them running around lol.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Btw, the deathwatch codex lets veterans all have storms too

I would use them sparingly. As has been said above, their only advantage over a flamer is their range, whereas a flamer will autohit and likely get you more hits at short range. The storm Bolter will only get you two hits max.

I agree with you that they look cool, and if you really want one, I would give it to one of the models for fun and really make him stand out.

Anyone going out of their way to include a Stormbolter is someone I would worry about doing well.

Inquisition codex --- you get carapace armoured men with them for 11 points.

Drop 10 of them out of a Land Raider and you can kill about 9 GEQ after shooting + charging. Then you can shoot and charge again the following turn.

Relatively cheap and tasty for what you pay for.

Nay, sadly. They're a wonderful weapon for cool factor, but not worth their points. I play them as Salvo 2/3, and it's okay. Nothing spectacular but not worthless either. Gives Terminators a little bit of an edge, too.

Meh. One extra thing to pump up the base price of PAGK they can't really take advantage of.

They're absurdly overpriced anywhere you need to pay points for them, except in Henchmen warbands where they're only sort of overpriced.

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
Anyone going out of their way to include a Stormbolter is someone I would worry about doing well.

Dude,

If he likes storm bolters and thinks they're cool, why be a dick about him working on having some in his army? Storm Bolters aren't great in the grand scheme but they do have some advantages over a bog standard bolter.

Are they optimal? Not in every circumstance, but they can work well in certain circumstances. Paired with Lightning claw or a power fist they're not a bad option to still allow a charge and give a good ranged shot on a model. On a command squad they're a cheap option that allows for a charge but have superior range versus a flamer (a similar option at the same point cost), and work better with Imperial Fist chapter tactics as an example.

Don't crap on someone because they like something.

Take it easy.

-Red__Thirst-

They might be considered if they were 2 points or less to me.

I'd be more inclined to say yay if their profile was salvo 2/3 or 2/4, but as it is now it's pretty meh. Even if it is cheap, and it's kinda difficult to make non-hero models look cool holding them. I'd have my sternguard loaded for bear with em if they could use the SIA.

So nay, just because aesthetics are tricky and they are pretty lame OTT.

Squad of terminators firing bunch of sustain fire dice of bolter goodyness and then if stationary repeat is good

What? Somebody doesn't play the superior edition that is 2nd ed? Weird.

IMO the only storm bolter worth it is Kantor's and Foesmitter, the rest don't cut it.

What about Calgar's fist bolters with ap2?

 koooaei wrote:
What about Calgar's fist bolters with ap2?

Those are "good" too but what sells me about the other two is that they have extra rules aside from damage, as well as double the rate of fire. Foesmitter has shred and master crafted which means that against light infantry he's highly likely to get 4 wounds out of 4 rolls and does well if you want to run a cheap character in a tac-squad. Cantor's has pinning and sinergizes very well with sternguard's krakenbolts. Calgar's weapon? Not so much of either of the two I'm a fraid. Not bad but certainly you aren't even factorizing the bolter when you take him: you want a CQC monster that provides nifty bonuses to your armies and is resilient. I mean, CM statline with AA and dual PF at initiative, that's his main dish. Then comes as an sidedish the fact that he gets to pick WT and allows the recycling of a doctrine. The bolter comes a far third in the list of considerations.

Voidraven5829 wrote:
I am using the vanilla dex, and yeah im talking about command squad. I just think they look.fricken sweet is all, lol. And after playing through space marine on xbox again and seeing how gross of a weapon it is, i really wanted to see a whole squad of them running around lol.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Btw, the deathwatch codex lets veterans all have storms too

I’m not sure if it’s the same with the deathwatch, but stormbolters are one of the few trap choices for sternguard. You can’t fire special ammo though them, so you end up spending points to make the squad worse.

Strombolters have remained static since 3rd edition. Everything else has improved. While the regular bolter’s statline has remained the same, the rapid fire rule was progressively improved every edition up until 6th. It used to be you got one shot at half range if you moved, and if you stood still the 2 at half and 1 at full range. So the stormbolter not only provided the ability to assault, but was also able to project fire while mobile, even at range. Well worth the points. Now you just get the ability to charge and the one more shot in the 12-24” bracket. Not that impressive.

There are a few things in the 40k universe I’d like to use. They are iconic and cool. But the rules/points just don’t make it worth fielding. Plasma pistols are another victim of this. I will sometimes pay points for something to look cool. IMHO the concussive rule is not worth the 5 points that separates a thunderhammer from a power fist. I do think it looks 5 points cooler though, so modeled one on my jump captain. Stormbolters can fall into this category.

Are they a efficient use of points? Not really. The one thing I would warn about, it not to do anything silly because you took it. For example, would the squad be better off running closer to the foe, rather then taking a few long range pot shots?

Nay.

In my entire history of list building from 2008 to now, when faced with a remainder of 5 points, I've never once thought "I should give some jackass a storm bolter!"

They're on my terminators because they come that way.

 kronk wrote:
In my entire history of list building from 2008 to now, when faced with a remainder of 5 points, I've never once thought "I should give some jackass a storm bolter!"

Same here. Stormbolters are a Special Weapon choice for my SoB (and my BA I guess) but IMO the only thing "special" if I take one is me...

I'd rather have an extra flamer or a meltabomb.

About the only places I'll take them are:

Retributors Superior, and Priests that hang out with Retributors, because taking advantage of their act of faith means you need maximum volume of fire. It helps a little, and Sisters need the small edge.

Bolting an extra one onto an Exorcist to give me a shot at not having the missile launcher blown off. 5 points still feels dubious here, but it's the only good option. (A hunter-killer missile costs double, but doesn't really help more.)

Back in the day, my command squad was all decked out with them. 30 pt Commander, plus command squad, all sporting storm bolters, let me put 12 shots downfield, regardless of moving, every turn. Danged handy!

Mind you, this is when normal bolters only fired 24" if stationary, otherwise just 12".

In this day and age? They've kind of lost their pep. They should really switch 'em up to be, well, a pair of boltguns ... 2 shots at 24", *4* shots at 12", and heck, go ahead and call 'em rapidfire... Terminator suits are designed to slowly walk around while spraying fire everywhere, not go leaping into melee. That'd be a fair trade for the increase in firepower.

Love the idea of 'em, but the execution needs a touch of work.

I'd consider using them more with the following:

Sternguard can use SIA with storm bolters.
Cost drops to 2-3 points, not 5. Never, ever more than 5.
Profile changes to Assault 4, while the combi-bolter becomes "Rapid-Fire 2, Twin-Linked" - 2 shots at 24", 4 at 12".

(We already have a "Rapid-Fire 3" weapon, the hurricane bolter. Nobody calls it that, though.)

Same fix as heavy bolters. Rending!

Lord Kragan wrote:

 koooaei wrote:
What about Calgar's fist bolters with ap2?

Those are "good" too but what sells me about the other two is that they have extra rules aside from damage, as well as double the rate of fire. Foesmitter has shred and master crafted which means that against light infantry he's highly likely to get 4 wounds out of 4 rolls and does well if you want to run a cheap character in a tac-squad. Cantor's has pinning and sinergizes very well with sternguard's krakenbolts. Calgar's weapon? Not so much of either of the two I'm a fraid. Not bad but certainly you aren't even factorizing the bolter when you take him: you want a CQC monster that provides nifty bonuses to your armies and is resilient. I mean, CM statline with AA and dual PF at initiative, that's his main dish. Then comes as an sidedish the fact that he gets to pick WT and allows the recycling of a doctrine. The bolter comes a far third in the list of considerations.

Dorn's Arrow has pinning? Where was that?

Primarch's Wrath is pretty ballin' too. Shame about the whole "one relic a character" bull.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Red__Thirst wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
Anyone going out of their way to include a Stormbolter is someone I would worry about doing well.

Dude,

If he likes storm bolters and thinks they're cool, why be a dick about him working on having some in his army? Storm Bolters aren't great in the grand scheme but they do have some advantages over a bog standard bolter.

Are they optimal? Not in every circumstance, but they can work well in certain circumstances. Paired with Lightning claw or a power fist they're not a bad option to still allow a charge and give a good ranged shot on a model. On a command squad they're a cheap option that allows for a charge but have superior range versus a flamer (a similar option at the same point cost), and work better with Imperial Fist chapter tactics as an example.

Don't crap on someone because they like something.

Take it easy.

-Red__Thirst-

I'm sorry, but this is a bad argument. What is taking a Lightning Claw or Power Fists to go with the Storm Bolter? No Captain is going to be using them, and Chaplains and Librarians won't.

Also even WITH Imperial Fists Chapter Tactics you're still better off with Grav Guns because of weight of fire being better, or Melta Guns because they're still putting out great damage. Rerolling 1's to hit doesn't make them any good or drastically increase their damage output.

So yeah, it is better to warn somebody that it is a bad idea before it is modeled on.