http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/7.page JForum - http://www.jforum.net
But first, our listeners have really stepped up to the plate with some very creative betrayal contest entries. Join us as we listen along and have a laugh, as well as award some prizes.

All that and our usual 'not too horrible' humor, with features such as:

- Rapid Fire
- The Hollywood Minute
- When Wives Attack
- Words from Wales
- & More

Check out the show here:
http://thed6generation.libsyn.com/index.php?post_id=470145

Please let us know what you think!

]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/692380.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/692380.page GMT
Getting an error message when trying to DL direct from the D6G site.

Edit: Tried iTunes as well and got an error there too.

Just a heads-up.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/692557.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/692557.page GMT
Getting an error message when trying to DL direct from the D6G site.

Edit: Tried iTunes as well and got an error there too.

Just a heads-up.[/quote]

Seems to be working ok at the moment, and we've already had lots of downloads. Give it another try, perhaps you were just experiencing a wierd Internet issue.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/692951.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/692951.page GMT
And was there something about a new Warmachine faction?

Can someone post links, please?

Thank you!]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/693232.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/693232.page GMT
And was there something about a new Warmachine faction?

Can someone post links, please?

Thank you![/quote]

New Mini's Game:

Arcane Legions: http://arcanelegions.com/

New Race for WM:
http://www.PrivateerPress.com (Check the banner on the right)

PP players know this will be Ios, the elves. It was hinted at very blatently in Legends.

]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/693264.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/693264.page GMT
Apologies for "Generic American Guy, " I love American's me ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/693297.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/693297.page GMT

Good discussion on the MkII rules, guys. Nice spread of opinions. Craig: do you think the changes would have made your tournament game against the Pirates any better?]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/693706.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/693706.page GMT Got it to work finally. Had to do the whole "disconnect everything, wait 10 seconds, reconnect" thing.
DL'ing now. Good thing too. I want to get some painting done tonight and I needed something to listen to. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/693790.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/693790.page GMT
You guys should really do a vodcast when reviewing a game because I fell like my brain is going to explode trying to visualise whats going on while Russ is going full steam ahead into describing it.



]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/693834.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/693834.page GMT BTW Russ do you listen to Security Now from Twit?]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/693839.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/693839.page GMT
My wife thought you said "Oh so [i]tired[/i]", though.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/693958.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/693958.page GMT I visited Beddgelert (http://www.beddgelerttourism.com/gelert/) when I was a kid. Lovely place!

I forgot to congratulate you on your trashtalkin' last ep and the help it so obviously gave Craig. See, you can always trust the Welsh to talk a good fight...

Great WWA too, as ever. The only bit I thought was missing was the advice that should be given to wives that when the loving and dutiful husband and father abandons his gaming evening to help clean up the vomit *your* kids have deposited all over the new carpet in response to your frantic screaming and, frankly, abuse over the phone, he at least should be given a "thankyou honey" afterwards... It's amazing what a well trained husband will do for a little pat on the head! Apart from that, I'm all with Raef on the issue of a man's "cave time"!

Right. I'm up to 2:24, I've got the WMII review to look forward to on my trip home. Should be good! Personally I'm hoping Russ complains about the downloadable PDF not having good enough artwork... ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/694359.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/694359.page GMT [/quote]

Oh the downloadable PDF is AWEFUL. It has no table of contents, no index, no pictures, and is entirly black and white!!!! I want my money back! ... oh wait. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/694503.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/694503.page GMT [/quote]

Oh the downloadable PDF is AWEFUL. It has no table of contents, no index, no pictures, and is entirly black and white!!!! I want my money back! ... oh wait. [/quote]

LOL!

Actually I thought of you last night when I played the new WotR for the first time. The new WotR rulebook actually does have a functional index!! A proper one!!! I was gobsmacked! You should check it out - you'd love it!!]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/694908.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/694908.page GMT [/quote]

Oh the downloadable PDF is AWEFUL. It has no table of contents, no index, no pictures, and is entirly black and white!!!! I want my money back! ... oh wait. [/quote]

Well you are in luck. Here is the table of contents. It help a ton using the MK2 pdf. http://www.privateerpressforums.com/index.php?act=attach&type=post&id=9087 ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/694930.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/694930.page GMT
Well you are in luck. Here is the table of contents. It help a ton using the MK2 pdf. http://www.privateerpressforums.com/index.php?act=attach&type=post&id=9087 [/quote]

Ohh, nice. Ask and ye shall receive! ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/695038.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/695038.page GMT http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/695234.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/695234.page GMT http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/695783.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/695783.page GMT Ditto! And the D6G guys have a new catchphrase!

Strap it on, guys. Strap it on!

]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/696041.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/696041.page GMT
I be miffed. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/697279.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/697279.page GMT [/quote]

At least Hollywood pronounced my name correctly!

Owen: Don't apologize! You just hit it on the head. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/697798.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/697798.page GMT
I be miffed. [/quote]

Sorry about that, it turns out we missed a few other reviews too.

As an aside, it is kinda a pain to switch countries in iTunes to find the reviews, so if you leave us a review drop us an e-mail and I'll make a not to check your country when next the reviews come around.

Thank you for the reviews!!!

-Russ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/697896.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/697896.page GMT UK, I'd have entered. A little warning on competitions next time please! ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/697906.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/697906.page GMT
]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/698279.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/698279.page GMT http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/698556.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/698556.page GMT He is a little worried about Swine Flu at the moment though and refuses to take off his mask]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/698592.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/698592.page GMT http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/700010.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/700010.page GMT http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/701401.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/701401.page GMT
Oh and before i roll out the words from wales this week rocked keep up the good work owen.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/701959.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/701959.page GMT
I wanna thank Raef for strapping it on and masterfully wielding it when he transformed my shout-out from silver to gold. I am additionally pleased that, for a modest investment, I get to slightly tweak his world and force him to respond accordingly. In rebelling from my dark influence, he has incorporated it into his own being. I've even been assimilated into your shout-out [i]on[/i] shout-outs - and the fact that I remain unacknowledged merely means that I have maintained my cover of darkness. You are not and have never been anyone's stooge - but you now [b]are[/b] my contractual-basis minion.

[i]Mwuaaahhhhhhhahhhahh.[/i]

But at the same time, I must differ with the iTunes review that says that you should stop picking on THX. I disagree [b]not[/b] because I believe you are not picking on him - for you are. But I also think that in this way, much like a fine diamond or a steak, when heat and pressure are applied to the subject, it becomes even better - more refined and spicier.

And I know exactly how to deal with such unsettling comments as "Strap it on!" These comments must be taken from their wielders and used repeatedly and without interruption in order to sap them of their power. After all, consider the alternative!

[i]"In a world where semi-lewd entendres go unanswered..."[/i]

Craig - Gotcha. NOT hating Shifty. But I will at least inform you that right now, I will have an initial negative first impression of people who earn the nickname 'Shifty'. So I will confirm and agree that it is a no-hate assignation - but I also want to apprise you of the consequences. Should I eventually drive out to New England and meet your friends, I will be at least suspicious.

All: While I (as someone who doesn't play WH40K) would not be ordering from paintedfigs.com (sowwy), I am inspired by your reference to pink Space Marines with flowers on them - can you tell me what Company Johnny Dangerously would be painted like?

Russ: regarding Space Alert, you used "it's so unique that it's impossible to describe" (paraphrased again), and that's how you didn't describe Peggle last episode. To rip off Oscar Wilde, "To lose one description may be counted a misfortune - to lose two smacks of wordlessness." If you want, I can take a look at the game and describe it for you. [i]*snicker snicker*[/i]

Russ: I also got into the Blood Bowl beta - and I agree that I signed an NDA and therefore can't really say anything else. I can't possibly say how totally awesome it was, or that I'm so getting it when it comes out. Can't tell you that.

Craig: Munchkin is cool, but it is [b]not[/b] CC. It's much lighter, a bit sillier and (IMHO) is unfortunately a bit vulnerable to gang-up-on-the-leader syndrome. (Which is kinda good, as it means usually nobody can run away with it. But it's kind of annoying to know that as soon as you make a good play and break away from the pack a little bit, you get beaten down. It's the gamer version of how the GOP describes progressive tax rates.) There are many non-gamers I know whose only entry into gaming is Munchkin.

Raef & Russ: I'm still looking forward to my first game of Descent - but my brain rebels at the term "fatigue" as a currency. If I'm [i]spending[/i] fatigue, I should become [i]more[/i] energized. There are enough gamer synonyms for "stamina" that I think they could have found one. I'm just sayin'. (Anybody remember how to make money in the Infocom-Douglas Adams game Bureaucracy?)

Raef & Craig: if you have time to put something up here or talk about it next time you're on, I want to ask you a question. For RPG games where you've put together the story and enemies yourself, how do you balance the enemies vs. the party? I get completely paralyzed trying to even [i]consider[/i] what would constitute "a fair and interesting fight". I get so stymied I completely chicken out and run talk-and-skill-check games - which [b]can[/b] be cool, but some of my players have been unsatisfied. I'm playing in a Shadowrun Fourth Edition game now, and it's reminding me how cool crunchy-stat RPGs are. So, in your mind, how do you approach the creation of a fight?

Russ: Regarding the news on Arcane Legions, I seem to recall some sort of historic antipathy on your part for "blind purchase" on constructible games (to wit, CCGs or CMGs as opposed to regular minis games). With the announcement that they are guaranteeing that if you buy a case, you get one of each type - how do you feel about that? I will say that the last two sets of the Star Wars Miniatures game have basically been packed in this tightly controlled way - a case gets you EXACTLY eight of each common, four of each uncommon, one each of the rares and a smattering of the ultrarares. It feels good as a [b]COLLECTOR[/b] to have this - but as someone in a group with three other gamers all purchasing cases, it completely depletes the fun trading session after a set comes out, and it also sticks us with a full set of duplicate rares when we buy two cases to get more of the ultra-rares. And these rare sets are anvils, because everyone else who plays has them. If you for a moment set aside your antipathy for blind packaging - would it be better if they mixed up the individual boosters more, but then offered a "mega-set" non-blind purchase edition with all the figs? Or does that steal away from the inherent thrill of a collectible game?

And does the addition of Bejeweled and Peggle to WoW suggest that WoW has grown to the point where it attracts users interested in the community aspect of it who don't actually [i]PLAY[/i] the game?

All: The pronunciation issue of "dakka" came up again - whoda thunk it? But as a note on why people *might* use the o-sound ("dokka") rather than the a-sound, consider one of our generation's earliest influences - the comedy stylings of Fozzie the Bear.

"Wakka wakka wakka."
Now say, in the same rhythm:
"Dakka dakka dakka."

There you go.

To the listeners - do you think anyone can tell which contest entry was mine? I wonder how the audience might know.

But speaking of contests - you made a plea during Rapid Fire for advice on how to increase your number of entrants into contests. Speaking as one who didn't make it to the final four, I would only advise that entering a contest where the result is a die roll is, [b]even[/b] on the d6 Generation, a little disheartening. If you ask for skill in writing and presentation, it is beholden to you to actually summon the courage to offer a final determination on said creativity. Take that English judge's wig you have on your nightstand - and strap it on.

And to take that wig onto my own head (but as it is not mine, I will NOT be strapping it on) - I might have given it to "No - the LOOT rides shotgun." It lacked some of the glitz and flash of the other entries, but it is succinct and elegant, and is very very intimidating to consider hearing after a long hard road out of a dungeon with the treasure.

But it was VERY weird to hear Raef spice up my [b]very[/b] long betrayal story with a snack reference - seeing as I am personally allergic to peanuts and peanut butter. Just [b]nutty[/b] irony. And yes, I know it's very long, and thus absolutely needed HD's spice - but I feel so -helpless- about the issue. If anyone ever saw Sports Night with Jeremy's first baseball feature, they will know that that The Storm Clouds Are Gathering.

Oh, and how to do 1-in-4 with d6s - 2d6. Check each die for 1-3 vs. 4-6 - that's two 50% distributions.

HD - your commentary on time prioritizing is good and gutsy - you definitely had it strapped on firmly and snugly. However, it was perhaps a little less...um...deliberative than the first part. And the tone was perhaps more combative than recommended by the manufacturer - might not be surprised if thine lifemate chooses to, verbally speaking, strap it on. (Or not.) But still always great to hear your voice unfiltered.

Nicole and Karen: Interesting to hear that Oxford in England is a home to a majority-female boardgaming population. My immediate response, however, is to say that most of the men in that town are probably playing Games Workshop games. While these too are technically "boardgames", I suspect that's not what your respondent was referring to. And while Warhammer 40K is probably a lot less friendly to consider approaching than Pandemic or Puerto Rico.

Oh, and not so old-fashioned to live separately until marriage - my wife and I did it too.

Kudos to both of you for pointing out something I missed - that I [u]am[/u] playing an MMO. (I'm crediting you rather than the boys for this, as I think you treated the subject more seriously.) I've more or less moved on from Vampire Wars to Mafia Wars, but I didn't even really *feel* like either was an MMO, because of the text interface and the limits on energy vs. missions. BUt yes, I *am* online with many many people playing the same game. The critical differences here between these games (which I like) and WoW and other subscription MMOs are A) the ones I like not only don't encourage staying on 24-7, but actually [b]limit[/b] your play time, and B) there's really no raid or instance structure - you never have to worry about when you're online, because the other players you know only assist you passively. In terms of play action, you're always soloing.

And to refer to Raef's earlier question on what the hook is - it's the same hook as most MMOs. It's RPG stat crack, combined with the abilities to complete quests and talk about the game with your friends. It's just a smaller MMO paradigm, but it's still there.

Raef: You're saying "I don't get it" more often than usual this show. Are you using that to put exposition in context - or did you strap it on in the wrong place?

All: While I don't play WM, I can appreciate thoughtful analysis on any gaming topic. The review of the WM-M2 design was obviously the digested intelligence of experienced and thoughtful players. Very interesting.

Great show, gentlemen and ladies - I continue to eagerly await that next episode.

]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/702812.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/702812.page GMT http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/703070.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/703070.page GMT
Anyway, I hope you've been able to participate in the rerelease of Cutthroat Caverns and snare a copy - it'd be a shame if a d4 roll cost you your only opportunity for a game you've been yearning to own.

And hey - have you thought about asking to be included on the eBay shout-out auctions? It'd give me one more host to visit before my reign of eBay tyranny is ended. But even if you only accepted shoutouts from Welshpersons, it'd still be cool.

Welshpeople? Welshians? Walespeople just sounds wrong, but there should be something a bit more inclusive than Welshmen. Welshists? Welshites? (That doesn't look good. I should stop here.)





[i]Waleans?[/i]]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/703100.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/703100.page GMT http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/703102.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/703102.page GMT Oh, was not in [b]ANY[/b] way making a complaint about the Dakka/Dokka question. I just know that our esteemed hosts have at times expressed a sense of confusion about how anyone might arrive at the "Dokka" pronunciation, and I was just saying that there [b]IS[/b] a legitimate source.

For nothing is so legitimate as the Muppet Show.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/703183.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/703183.page GMT

[size=18][/size]Y Cymru "The People" - Welshmen will do though


Would love to do shoutouts, ask Russ ?, I know a few people have asked in the past and I do have an interested Sponser but I dont want to tread on any New Hampshire toes so its their call....

Not got a cutthroat caverns yet but will as soon as the bank lets go of my balls....]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/703193.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/703193.page GMT
Try and bag a slot at the Carnage instead and I'll play you there!]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/703282.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/703282.page GMT GT In Texas in November.

Does anybody know a good UK seler for CC


Cheers


Owen ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/703889.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/703889.page GMT On Warmachine as someone who is going to try and get into Warmachine should I worry too much about the factions or pick the faction that is the most visually appealing. Currently that is the Mercenary faction and the Mariner & Mule jacks look impressive.
Thanks,
Devore
]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/704808.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/704808.page GMT
I just discovered you guys on itunes.... amazing!
your show is so informative and entertaining. i have a job where i work 80+ hours a week with TONS of downtime. needless to say with a wife at home my gaming time is kept to a bare minimum. but since i've discovered your podcast time just passes with ease. almost seems like 3 hours a show isnt enough! jk. HOLLYWOOD yout the man, dont let craig and russ cramp your style! keep up the good work guys, your show makes my time away from my life a breeze! awesome job!]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/705155.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/705155.page GMT RPG, Collossal Arena, Fluxx, ect... what do you guys think?]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/705200.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/705200.page GMT http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/705210.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/705210.page GMT Dev: Raef briefly gives out some advice on picking WM factions in Ep 31 (it's recorded, and will go live on Monday). All the factions are strong, although Mercs are considered one of the weaker factions unless you play pirates. They have gotten better.

Card Games: We do play a lot of non-collectible card games. I have Infernal Contraption (and the expansion), and we play Bang! (reviewed), and Cutthroat Caverns. In Ep 31 we'll cover another one. I also enjoy Race (or Raef) for the Galaxy. Hmm, maybe you do have a great topic idea there.

Thanks for listening!]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/705237.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/705237.page GMT http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/705272.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/705272.page GMT I am really beginning to like your posts! Really no joke.

HD]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/705808.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/705808.page GMT
Oh, and now the contest is over, I picked up Cutthroat Caverns and the first expansion. I'll probably get a game in with my local group within the next two weeks. Lookin' forward to it, thanks to your show.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/705954.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/705954.page GMT I just finished this Ep, and I wanted to say: great show guys (as always).

I always love when you guys do Warmachine stuff because although it ain't the game for me, I love how open and communicative Privateer is with their consumers. So while their flagship game may be going down a semi-familiar road to what GW went through twenty-ish years ago, it is fantastic to hear about the ways in which they are able to make (at least most of) their fans more comfortable through the transition.

The one time I did play Warmachine I immediately knew it wasn't the game for me. I don't like keeping track of stat cards for every model and having power-up tokens applied to units, etc. Its just too much micro-management for me and plus it is infused with just a tad too much Fantasy for my tastes (I like laser guns). So it was kind of refreshing for me to hear that the MKII rules are basically just the same game but streamlined, as that let me know it is still a game I can safely stay away from (and I mean that in a positive way because the last thing I need is an excuse to buy more minis).


As an outsider of the game listening to you run down the WM changes a few things sprung to mind:

Regarding the use of 'icons': If they've removed the rules text from the unit cards hasn't that freed up a lot of space that they could at least use to list the 'title' of the skill [i]as well as[/i] the icon for that skill on the card?

I would think listing the name [b]and[/b] icon for a skill would be the way to go because that way you wouldn't always have to remember what each and every icon was without looking back in the rules (you'd have a name as well to help jog your memory) but the writers would still be able to use just the icons when they needed to print a unit or weapon's stats in brief (or people in a forum wanted to write out a statline without using all the skill names to save some space).

I can't see how using [i]just[/i] icons instead of in conjunction with the names of the skills will make things any easier. Unless there are less than 10 icons total in the game then there is absolutely no way (IMHO) it is ever going to be easy for anyone but veteran WM players to have them all memorized.

Another thing about removing the rules text from the cards: Isn't that half the point of having unit cards in the first place, so you don't have to refer back to the rulebook all the time? As I mentioned above, one thing that instantly bothered me about Warmachine (and I know not everyone feels this way) was having unit cards on the table for every model/unit. But [b]at least[/b] those cards contained the rules I needed to help me, as a newbie, remember what the heck my models could do.

By removing the rules text it seems like the whole [i]point[/i] of the unit cards are degraded a bit, in that, unless you are veteran who has all the icon skills memorized, you're now going to have to continually refer back to the rulebook to remember what your skills do. That doesn't sound necessarily like progress to me.


I also agree with you Russ that the new points value system ultimately seems like a bad idea. I think it is something they will be able to make work now, as they're currently re-balancing all the units at once. But I think it will bite them in the ass in the long run as it will really make it difficult for them to create new units as they will always have to make themn perfectly balanced with all other existing units in that same point bracket.

So say they come up with a really cool idea for a unit's special rules but including that rule would make the unit more powerful than other comparable units in that point level, but not quite powerful enough to be bumped up to the next point level. Now PP will either have to leave the unit to cheap or too pricey for what it does, or worse, just remove the cool special rule altogether.

Worse still, if they do manage to release a unit that is costed improperly, they will now no longer really have the option to just tweak the point value of the unit through an errata (something that is regrettable but easily digested by gamers as the unit doesn't change, just the relative value of the unit does). Instead, they will be forced to change the [b]rules[/b] of the unit via errata to make it fit better into that point level (which is a much more difficult change as players then have to get used to playing differently with that unit).

Ultimately that just seems like the tail wagging the dog to me and I hope they reconsider and scrap this new points system before they get too far into the revamp.


Oh, and on GW's insistence on remaining in the black & white print realm: Russ you're [i]assuming[/i] it is because GW is cheap. But the fact is, GW has never really been shy about putting more money into their products and then passing that expense onto their consumer, so I don't personally think for even a micro-second that if they wanted to do full color codices/rulebooks they wouldn't do it immediately and then jack the price of their books up by $10 (or so).

You have to remember that black & white artwork can be an aesthetic choice that (clearly you do not care for Russ) some people do actually care for and enjoy. Yes, color artwork and pages can be glorious, but especially in the case of 40K, those classic black and white Blanche pieces kind of define the universe in a way that doesn't come across quite right in full color (Blanche does work in color sometimes and I think it doesn't capture the feeling of his vision nearly as well).

The same people who have been making GW books 20+ years ago are still at that company and I think the truth of the matter is [b]they just really like black & white artwork[/b] and so they keep making books that feature it.

Of course that's just speculation on my part as well, so who knows for sure!


And last, Owen I must cast yet another vote for the return of 'generic American guy'. Oh that was quite the humorous bit! And remember: generic American guy hates soccer (football), finds rugby confusing and pointless, drinks crappy beer, loves Monday Night Football and delights in watching reality TV shows. His favorite games are definitely Poker and maybe playing Madden on his old PS2.


Keep up the good work all!

]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/707409.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/707409.page GMT
I really enjoyed hearing the Mark 2 overview, but I've got a quick question - is there any way of getting hold of the rules now that Privateer have closed the preview site down? I'd been meanign to grab them for a couple of days, and when I finally had the chance to sit downa nd do it, found out that I'd left it too late.

As I understand it, the rules are in PDF format, so I don't know if there's any kind of watermarking applied to them to discourage sharing the files, or if there's simply a caveat on them, asking people not to share them. If so, please accept my apologies, I'm simply trying to get hold of the rules, as I'd like to give the game a try, particularly with the new rules which, to my ears, sound like I would enjoy playing more than the current ones.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/707643.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/707643.page GMT
[b]Icons:[/b] There aren't that many icons (about 10), and it would be logical for a 'quick reference card' to be produced in the final product. There are still abilities and their rules printed on the cards for unique abilities for the unit, just not for common abilities. A GW analogy would be the "Commissar" entry on page 32 of the IG codex. Their "Summary Execution" ability is fully described, while "Stubborn" and "Independent Character" are just listed. You'd have to go to the main rule book to look those up. In WM mark 2, a "Commissar" would have icons for Stubborn and IC, and would have Summary Execution listed with full rules text. The nice thing about the icons is that you can glance at your opponents cards from accross the table and easily see the large symbols, and have an idea of at least the core abilities you're up against.

[b]Points: [/b] Someone sent me a theory that the point system was just done this way for the play test, so that testers wouldn't get hung up on complaining about the exact points of the model, and that they may very well switch back in the final version. A theory so crazy it just might be true. I've no idea, but I agree with your comments.

[b]GW Books[/b]: A lot of folks keep e-mailing me about this very topic, defending GW's black and white books as an 'artistic choice.' Perhaps I should re-phrase my issue with the GW 40k and WHFB Army book/codex line. They do not look artistic in any way to me. They appear to be designed to deliver the most amount of text as effectively as possible. Example: I love the background and fluff of 40k, and as such a person I'll generally acquire cool books on the subject (such as FFG's new works). As a die hard ork player of old, the recent ork codex looked rather blah to me, and I did not pick it up. I DID buy the 40k 5th edition collectors edition of the rules. That book IS beautiful, and artistic, despite being mono-chrome. However I also just purchased the IG codex, because I want to play my IG. While I like the rules and what they've done with the IG in this codex, and think it is a great codex in general. As an artistic work I think it is uninspired. It looks and feels almost like a school text book, with the graphs and charts replaced with token pictures from the archives unless they need to scrounge up some new artwork for a new unit.

Can GW produce good looking books? They sure as heck can. The LoTR line is ENTIRELY in color and all those books look great. Their 40k/WHFB RPG lines are also in color (even prior to selling it to FFG). The art books and the 5th Ed collectors edition are also EXCEPTIONAL.

So why not put that kind of effort in the 40k and WHFB expansion books? I think the answer is, they don't have too. LoTR needs it because it is not as popular, RPG's need it because ALL PRODUCTS in that space are full color. But 40k and WHFB sell almost whatever they put out, as long as the rules are reasonable.

Again, just my 2 cents. But I'd LOVE to see a GW IG book or ork book that looked like Dark Heresy: Creatures Anathema.


]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/707740.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/707740.page GMT 40k and WHFB expansion books? I think the answer is, they don't have too. LoTR needs it because it is not as popular, RPG's need it because ALL PRODUCTS in that space are full color. But 40k and WHFB sell almost whatever they put out, as long as the rules are reasonable. [/quote]

I gotta disagree here Russ. I don't know the reasoning for GWs book production choices, but I can't believe that people are going to be more inclined to buy LoTR because the books are in colour (until your plans for world domination are complete and we are all Wakelin clones ). 40K and WHFB are living proof that you don't need colour books to make massively popular miniature games.

I agree it's an anomaly that LoTR is produced largely in colour, and one that I can't explain. My only thought on the subject is that one of the characteristics of the WHFB and 40K books is that they reference a bunch of old art work each time, which I think is really cool, and I'm not sure that colour and black and white art prints mix that well in books.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/707774.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/707774.page GMT
Looks very slick! Who's the artist? (or will that be an ep. 31 topic?)

What podcast doesn't need a devilish-looking cherub as their mascot? ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/708088.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/708088.page GMT
[b]Icons:[/b] There aren't that many icons (about 10), and it would be logical for a 'quick reference card' to be produced in the final product. There are still abilities and their rules printed on the cards for unique abilities for the unit, just not for common abilities. A GW analogy would be the "Commissar" entry on page 32 of the IG codex. Their "Summary Execution" ability is fully described, while "Stubborn" and "Independent Character" are just listed. You'd have to go to the main rule book to look those up. In WM mark 2, a "Commissar" would have icons for Stubborn and IC, and would have Summary Execution listed with full rules text. The nice thing about the icons is that you can glance at your opponents cards from accross the table and easily see the large symbols, and have an idea of at least the core abilities you're up against.[/quote]


It's good that there aren't that many icons, and I do get that they are just like universal special rules in 40K, I was just saying it seems like a good idea if they kept the NAME of the skill ALONG WITH the icon wherever they have the space to do so. Because I think, especially for new players, remembering the name of a skill is easier than remembering an icon.

The other benefit of doing it that way is that it is also a constant reminder to players about what each icon is (because the name is frequently there as a reminder), so that the times when there [i]isn't[/i] the space for the skill name and just room for the icon now newer players are more likely to remember what icon means what.

[quote]
[b]GW Books[/b]: A lot of folks keep e-mailing me about this very topic, defending GW's black and white books as an 'artistic choice.' Perhaps I should re-phrase my issue with the GW 40k and WHFB Army book/codex line. They do not look artistic in any way to me. They appear to be designed to deliver the most amount of text as effectively as possible. Example: I love the background and fluff of 40k, and as such a person I'll generally acquire cool books on the subject (such as FFG's new works). As a die hard ork player of old, the recent ork codex looked rather blah to me, and I did not pick it up. I DID buy the 40k 5th edition collectors edition of the rules. That book IS beautiful, and artistic, despite being mono-chrome. However I also just purchased the IG codex, because I want to play my IG. While I like the rules and what they've done with the IG in this codex, and think it is a great codex in general. As an artistic work I think it is uninspired. It looks and feels almost like a school text book, with the graphs and charts replaced with token pictures from the archives unless they need to scrounge up some new artwork for a new unit.

Can GW produce good looking books? They sure as heck can. The LoTR line is ENTIRELY in color and all those books look great. Their 40k/WHFB RPG lines are also in color (even prior to selling it to FFG). The art books and the 5th Ed collectors edition are also EXCEPTIONAL.

So why not put that kind of effort in the 40k and WHFB expansion books? I think the answer is, they don't have too. LoTR needs it because it is not as popular, RPG's need it because ALL PRODUCTS in that space are full color. But 40k and WHFB sell almost whatever they put out, as long as the rules are reasonable.

Again, just my 2 cents. But I'd LOVE to see a GW IG book or ork book that looked like Dark Heresy: Creatures Anathema.
[/quote]

But again, I'd say you're naturally assuming that GW is doing something from a negative point of view (because they don't HAVE to). While that may absolutely be true, there is at least an equal chance that they are specifically choosing to do so because:

A) They think B&W artwork suits the 40K/WHFB universes well.
B) They have a long history of B&W images to pull from and they don't want to just give up that history and move onto entirely new artwork.

Theoretically they could include B&W artwork on full-color pages, but I do think that would look pretty strange.


In the end it is all just guessing, but my point always is: Why necessarily [i]assume[/i] that the reason is something negative (like they just don't care or because they feel like they don't have to) when the answer could just as easily be something positively simple: They choose that style (which you don't happen to like) because they think B&W suits those particular books better?



[/quote]]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/708258.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/708258.page GMT 40k Radio.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/708914.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/708914.page GMT [/quote]

We chat about this a bit in Ep 31. And wouldn't that logo look so much cooler if it was artistically black and white??? Nah, I didn't think so either. ;-)

(See how I did that? Wove two topics togeather.)

For long time listeners that is, of course, Charlie.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/708990.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/708990.page GMT
Fair enough. My disappointment in the 40k codex appearance isn't really because I think there is an evil plot afoot. My disappointment is that of all the games I now play, GW has the most drab, uninspired looking texts, IMHO. So when someone asks "what would you improve?" my answer is clear: make 'em look cooler.

Of course, I'm sure there are many folks out there that think they look plenty cool already. But my bet is these folks haven't ventured far from the GW line.]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/708992.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/708992.page GMT 40k Radio.[/quote]

Our show is quite a bit different from other podcasts, in that each segment is a mini-show in and of itself. And our starting segment, Rapid Fire, is something of an aquired taste according to some.

If you'd like to check out the WM section in Ep 30, just fast forward to around the 2 hour mark.

In any case, thanks for giving our show a try!]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/709053.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/709053.page GMT 40k Radio.[/quote]

Our show is quite a bit different from other podcasts, in that each segment is a mini-show in and of itself. And our starting segment, Rapid Fire, is something of an aquired taste according to some.

If you'd like to check out the WM section in Ep 30, just fast forward to around the 2 hour mark.[/quote]
Yes, I think that's it, really. It's very jarring.

EDIT: The WM2 coverage was very nice, I really enjoyed the analysis. ]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/709189.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/709189.page GMT
I think of Rapid Fire as a sort of initiation into the show, like a hazing or other rite-of-brotherhood style ritual. If you can survive Rapid Fire, the glorious benefits of the show will unfold. Besides, now I know that it sets up the issues in the show, I really like it as an off-the-wall intro. It's so much better than, "On today's show..."]]> http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/711199.page http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/preList/238314/711199.page GMT