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I heard a rumor that the castellan is going up to over 700 points in the new faq. How mad would you be that a 200 dollar (Cdn) model got nerfered so hard because of command point spams. I play pure Knights no gaurd battalion and it bothers me.

That would be pretty disappointing. A nerf on the near infinite farm which makes the BA captain and Castellan so over the top would be a better first step.

If they are still dominating in post CP farm nerf allied and pure Knight forces then adjust the unit it self.

ballzonya wrote:
I heard a rumor that the castellan is going up to over 700 points in the new faq. How mad would you be that a 200 dollar (Cdn) model got nerfered so hard because of command point spams. I play pure Knights no gaurd battalion and it bothers me.

I would rather say why did you buy an expensive model because it was overpowered? It's not like you were not warned with multiple nerfs already in the year since 8th launched.

Chill out man, the faq isnt here yet. I think it's pretty unlikely that the castellan gets that much of a price hike.

I do not think they'd want a fresh new model like it to be underpowered. They have still have to make profit from it

On the other hand: I chose the valiant for my knights because it's just a ton more fun. The valiant is an underrated chassis. It hits like a wreckingball.

I bought it cause it rounds out my army perfectly at 2000 points and I love the model. If it goes up in points it doesn't become as useful.

The unit should be over 700 points. I play knights. It's just facts.

I wouldn't be too sad. I've coped with the garbage fire that the wraithknight has become, I can cope with this.

ballzonya wrote:
I heard a rumor that the castellan is going up to over 700 points in the new faq. How mad would you be that a 200 dollar (Cdn) model got nerfered so hard because of command point spams. I play pure Knights no gaurd battalion and it bothers me.

When has GW raised points in any FAQs? I thought that was Chapter Approved's job.

 ClockworkZion wrote:

ballzonya wrote:
I heard a rumor that the castellan is going up to over 700 points in the new faq. How mad would you be that a 200 dollar (Cdn) model got nerfered so hard because of command point spams. I play pure Knights no gaurd battalion and it bothers me.

When has GW raised points in any FAQs? I thought that was Chapter Approved's job.

Check the last FAQ. Points were changed at the end.

Dandelion wrote:

 ClockworkZion wrote:

ballzonya wrote:
I heard a rumor that the castellan is going up to over 700 points in the new faq. How mad would you be that a 200 dollar (Cdn) model got nerfered so hard because of command point spams. I play pure Knights no gaurd battalion and it bothers me.

When has GW raised points in any FAQs? I thought that was Chapter Approved's job.

Check the last FAQ. Points were changed at the end.

Hm. Must have missed that.

That said, I don't believe anything until I see it for myself. Too many years of "THE SISTERS ARE COMING" to fall for that old trap again.

HuskyWarhammer wrote:
I wouldn't be too sad. I've coped with the garbage fire that the wraithknight has become, I can cope with this.

There's your answer. Go play a few games with a Wraithknight and then run, skipping back to your slightly more expensive super knight.

 Elbows wrote:

HuskyWarhammer wrote:
I wouldn't be too sad. I've coped with the garbage fire that the wraithknight has become, I can cope with this.

There's your answer. Go play a few games with a Wraithknight and then run, skipping back to your slightly more expensive super knight.

Tasteless remark removed - BrookM

Maybe the Castellan is too cheap, or maybe there are other changes that force that points bump. Heck, maybe it doesn't even exist. Until we get the FAQ (which looks to be coming out next month at this rate) it's too soon to spend all your time being made about a possibility. Unless you're trying to get it out of your system just in case I guess.

I definatly agree that they need to fix the actual problem, and thats the guard CP farm. they can keep nerfing everyone else into the ground, or they can just fix the actual problem

It would be absolutely justified. CP nerf or not. Highest level players agree.

Wait, isn't the Castellan considered extremely effective to borderline OP when used without CP, but become hilariously broken with a CP farm?

Yeah, I can see the argument that the CP farm can cause unbalance, but it's disingenuous to say that even without it it's pretty darn effective for its points.

Is it worth 700pts? Maybe. But until we get it in black and white threads like these will inevitably just be back and forth fests.

 Dr. Mills wrote:
Wait, isn't the Castellan considered extremely effective to borderline OP when used without CP, but become hilariously broken with a CP farm?

To good players, yes it is.

Anyone who thought the Castelan was fairly costed was delirious.

"GW changes points cost of over performing and expensive unit so it is no longer performing and hobbyists purchase other models begrudgingly. In other news - the sky is blue and do bears truly poop in the woods?"

God, I hope so. The Castellan is well underpointed, everyone knows this.

Would seem like typical GW move. Once again try to fix issue by completely missing mark.

Castellan is broken when it\s raven and has plenty of CP's to use. Ie part of soup with IG.

What happens with this? Well for starters it hurts more PURE knights rather than soup. Indeed it drives pure knight armies toward soup as they might have to drop entire knight and then just to use points have to take something like IG battallion. Meanwhile soup armies can adapt more easily as they have more cheap stuff they can drop. With knights you are easily looking at dropping 400 pts knight to make room for 100 pts price increase...

And how big issue pure knights with zero allies are? Looking at tournament lists knights are invariably with soup allies.

So once again if true GW just swings wildly off the target. But then again everybody knows GW doesn't even care about balance so no surprise.

Just a gentle reminder to keep things nice and let's not resort to such tasteless remarks in the future okay?

The pt increase for the Castellan is justified.
But GW still works at the symptoms and is not considering the syndrome of CP farming as a whole.

ballzonya wrote:
I heard a rumor that the castellan is going up to over 700 points in the new faq. How mad would you be that a 200 dollar (Cdn) model got nerfered so hard because of command point spams. I play pure Knights no gaurd battalion and it bothers me.

How many would it be if rumours were actually worth a damn. We'd have had a Lion miniature with the Dark Angel codex late last year, joined a few weeks ago by a Leman Russ miniature, a plastic Thunderhawk for ages, the rumour engine tail pic of Moriathi would've been Fulgrim, as all rumour-sites at the time agreed and first army of Warhammer Fantasy 9th Edition would've been a complete re-launch of the Bretonnian range as rumour-royalty proclaimed in unity up to a week or so before GW did a weird new game called Age of Sigmar.

I'd say you missed the point of the hobby or have an extremely tournament focused playgroup if a model's worth is only determined by its current points values.

Why are you getting angry over a hypothetical change?

Has anything been confirmed? If not, why not just wait and see.

The Castellan is only good because of a mix of the Cawls Wrath relic, Raven Stratagem/House trait, WLTs and then access to easy CP aka, the CP farm. Take some of those away instead and suddenly it's not so hot.

May I point out the fact that should that rumor be true, CPs are getting fixed together with this nerf?

GW is aware of the CP problem, but the castellan still needs a fix.

MistaGav wrote:
The Castellan is only good because of a mix of the Cawls Wrath relic, Raven Stratagem/House trait, WLTs and then access to easy CP aka, the CP farm. Take some of those away instead and suddenly it's not so hot.

Which shows the problem with all these traits and relics that do not cost points. They massively affect the effectiveness of the unit. So if the unit gets pointed based on its effectiveness with them, it will be absurdly overcosted without them, basically forcing everyone to run that one specific setup. Considering that both the relic and the stratagem are locked to Questoris Mechanicus, it is pretty damn annoying to Questoris Imperialis players who would still like to field a Castellan.

 Crimson wrote:

MistaGav wrote:
The Castellan is only good because of a mix of the Cawls Wrath relic, Raven Stratagem/House trait, WLTs and then access to easy CP aka, the CP farm. Take some of those away instead and suddenly it's not so hot.

Which shows the problem with all these traits and relics that do not cost points. They massively affect the effectiveness of the unit. So if the unit gets pointed based on its effectiveness with them, it will be absurdly overcosted without them, basically forcing everyone to run that one specific setup. Considering that both the relic and the stratagem are locked to Questoris Mechanicus, it is pretty damn annoying to Questoris Imperialis players who would still like to field a Castellan.

Yea that's my take as well the Castellan doesn't need a points increase it needs a nerf to the CP farm and the Raven stratagem in particular as even a Crusader with that stratagem is still pretty effective. I don't mind some house specific stratagems but relics being restricted to mechanicus or imperial is really annoying as it forces people down specific builds. The relics for the Castellan and Valiant are almost mandatory in order to get the best out of the units are without they are really not great.

I think the fact that with Cawl's Wrath, they can almost one shot a Shadowsword (or knock an expected 22 wounds off one, leading it to shoot back on a 6+) if they get the first turn without using any CP or traits.


If the Shadowsword shoots first, it knocks off an expected 15.6 wounds - only knocking the knight down one damage band. With Ionbulwark and RIS, that drops to 7.8 wounds. Not enough to reduce the Knight's returning firepower.

Even if it gets lucky and does more damage, with wrath of the machine spirit you're still going to get hit by an undamaged Castellan.

Anything that can cripple a Shadowsword on an average shot without using stratagems, having just been hit by said Shadowsword, should probably cost more than just 100pts over the tank.