Here a new batch of rumours by Stickmonkey on Tau, where he updates earlier predictions by him (those in quotes).
Keep in mind that Hastings puts the Tau release first half 2013, after Dark Angels and Daemons.

Stickmonkey wrote:So I got a moment to go back and spend sometime with some old rumors. And I was able to get some updated information on where these rumors are...at least in so far as my sources will comment... So let's have a look shall we?

This is what I had earlier this year:

There has been some speculation on this, and I'm getting chatter now that seems to reinforce a few things, so I thought I'd post what is floating my way.

Tau Codex early next year.

Source still have first part of next year as timeline, I'm going to speculate and put this Q2/Q3, a little later as it does seem to have a lot ahead of it.

Kroot and other existing allies are there, however they are limited. There appears to be an "Allies" supplement which will be out about the same time and include many more options. (aside: Dare I start a Spring of Allies moniker...ah well then it will end up being 2 years from now... )

My sources are telling me kroot are in fact still part of Tau, and have a new unit or two including a beastly transport. They may have more options in a later supplement.
I also checked into the demiurge rumors, and was told "There are no demiurge in the Tau codex."

Crisis suits completely redone.

My sources all said to expect new crisis suits. These are not the forgeworld style, but are much more elegant compared to the current models. I also have rumors that confirm there are multiple new suits in the codex, crisis being what we know, there is also a smaller suit similar to the stealth suit, but not as bulky designed for close combat, and the broadsides while the same relative size as a crisis suit have much more bulk to them and are a separate build/model. Finally, I do have sources telling me there is a bigger suit, which has been reported from others. Reports have it being a ranged beast(metaphorically, not literally) with 2 twin linked rail cannons and a missile option. So I'm sure it will become a target of choice in games

Stealth suits completely redone.

Sounds like the reason for the redesign was this new cc suit which will share a box with the new stealth suit.

Pirahna has new option and I am not sure if it will be reboxed together or be sold as an upgrade kit.

From out of left field is word the new piranha option is to transport a cc suit unit, this option replaces the drone pods on the sides... I am personally very skeptical of this rumor. I really don't see it happening, based on other conversations I've had I expect the Pirahna will remain unchanged at this point.

New Pathfinders were seen being worked on a while back.

There is a plastic kit in the works for pathfinders, however my sources don't think it will be part of the initial tau release.

Ethereals expanded, new unit options around them.

This is again from the left field world...supposedly the ethereals have a new race that they are using as a psychic conduit. This new unit option is similar to a psychic choir, and their effectiveness diminishes the smaller the unit gets. Sounds like a way to retcon psychic powers into tau...I would steer clear of this rumor for now, their might in fact be a new unit here, but the established tau no psykers fluff seems too strong to do this IMO. And barring some stronger confirmation, I think this one can be dismissed for now.

There is a FW Tau model which has a unit entry in the codex. (My take is this might actually be a new plastic kit taking over a FW model, and before anyone yells GW doesnt cannibalize FW...yes, they do, they have, and they will.)

Supposedly the remora drones will be in the codex. And will be flyers.

The floating chair ethereal was seen being worked on for a new model.

Sources say this was a designer test model and the existing model is still in the line.

New fast skimmer sized between hammerhead and pirahna.

Could be the cc transport Pirahna, none of my sources had anything on this now. It could also be the flyer.

Flyer has dual gattling cannons

Sources are all sticking by this on the flyer.

Flyer has option for rail guns

Sources say there is a rail gun option for the flyer.

Flyer has bombs (not missiles!?)

Sources say it has options for AA missiles or bombs, But can't take both.

Rule rumors (these are rumors people! I hate posting rule rumors cause I am not involved in that. Please take fwiw)
Railguns have a JOWW effect, they can hit multiple models in a line, but if hitting vehicles has a max number of hull points it can cause. the way this is described is it draws a line from the barrel to table edge, every model under starts taking hits starting with the closest. if it hits a vehicle or structure with HP, its strength drops, once it hits 3 or a table edge or fails to make a penetrating hit its done. rhino line's watch out!

Little more on this. Mostly confirmed this is the way of it, but that it does have a max distance. Some conflicting rumors that you roll for number of hull points it penetrates when fired, or it's fixed. And also conflicting sources saying if it penetrates it causes 2 hull points of damage vs 1.

There is some rumor of an Anti Psyker weapon. like night fighting, but no psychic powers for a game turn.

My sources had little on this other than the one which attributed this to the new ethereal unit.

There is no flyer dedicated transport, and the existing flyer is going to be competing against some very good other options

All sources confirmed. There isn't a dt flyer.

The jetpack troops have some option to "pop up and shoot" from cover.

no information on this from anyone. So I'm going to say this is probably not valid any longer.

I hope to have some additional bits to add a little later after some sleep.

Cheers.

Edit:

Here another rumour set by an anonymous source on Faeit212:

via Faeit 212 (A Must Remain Anonymous Source) wrote:
-Tau are coming early next year.
-Unit profiles are being finalized.
-The Tau are looking more and more like it will utilize and potentially modify the allies feature.
-unique fortifications.

-Just info on rules, no idea on models:
-HQ option to make crisis suits troops (not a special character, just an upgrade)
-crisis suits remain roughly the same but have a couple new weapon options.
-New 1-per-squad weapons
-new heavy support suit that has stats like a carnifex and no jet pack, just a big mech
-new elite suit that has a lot of sub 18" gun options, with a high rate of fire, or low AP. High toughness and -good armour save at a minor loss of mobility (think jump pack instead of jet pack)
-two flyers, one for AtA one for AtG (same basic fuselage)
-fire warriors are a little bit better and have more of a stormtrooper / commando feel, than a rank and file guardsman feel.

-oh and one of the other things right now, I was able to confirm that the current playtest is that firewarriors who do move in the movement phase may immediately run after firing their pulse carbines in the shooting phase.

Uhhh... A close combat battlesuit? I'm going to be taking this with a grain of salt.

Well just when I was thinking about selling my Tau. You pull me back in.

Very cool stuff here. The Tau deserve this pretty bad. Lets hope they get the Necron treatment

I love it when people say things like tau can't have phykers and tau can't have cc. Where talking about GW here. They don't care as long as they attract new people and sell there models. You could say its logical that they would get added at some point. You would think the tau would notice that they have to do something about all the guys running at them with axes, and the best option would be to have guys that can take that treatment.

1.) The psyker unit for tau is still a very uncertain rumour.
2.) Tau being no psykers is established in fluff and will certainly be confirmed, not cancelled. The rulebook says, no generic psychic powers for Tau.
3.) We know of a psyker race within the Tau Empire, the Nicissar. Fits in with the "supposedly the ethereals have a new race that they are using as a psychic conduit" comment.

Heard all this before. Seems like Tau are always supposed to come out "early next year" and never do.

We Tau players have been down this road before. For almost 2 years we've been lied to by people claiming this and that. Until we see something in a WD screen shot the week before release I'm skeptical of all this. It sets us up for a huge let down just like before.

When Hastings says, Tau come next year, they come next year. And Harry also said for almost a year that Tau will be early 2013, so no fluctuation of rumours in this case.

Wait Tau after daemons, doesn't that brake the "marine, other, marine" circle?

After two Marine Codices (CSM and Dark Angels) it will indeed break again the myth of a Marine/other/Marine release schedule.

Naah man Chaos ain't "real marines" see, they has cultists.

 HoverBoy wrote:
Wait Tau after daemons, doesn't that brake the "marine, other, marine" circle?

Considering that's never existed in the first place it can't exactly be called "breaking".

Well I would love all of this, especially the close combat suit, no reason the fluff couldn't work. Always loved the remoras so a codex entry would be great for them. Kroot is right, they always said 2013 so perhaps this time is for real!

 Kroothawk wrote:
After two Marine Codices (CSM and Dark Angels) it will indeed break again the myth of a Marine/other/Marine release schedule.

The myth shall outlast each of us.

Here's hoping.. Saving my pennies for tau & sisters releases!

Come on Nautilus Defense Platform... be huge and awesome! I really want to see how the Tau Fortress option would be

Cool if it's true...

I fall with the skeptics. I'll believe it when I see the Tau in White Dwarf again.

 Kroothawk wrote:
1.) The psyker unit for tau is still a very uncertain rumour.
2.) Tau being no psykers is established in fluff and will certainly be confirmed, not cancelled. The rulebook says, no generic psychic powers for Tau.
3.) We know of a psyker race within the Tau Empire, the Nicissar. Fits in with the "supposedly the ethereals have a new race that they are using as a psychic conduit" comment.

I didn't mean that Tau would be the ones to get powers, but its inevitable that they acquire a race that has them. The Nicssar have had that conspiracy going on for a while.

I'm not sure i see Tau getting psykers, not in the same sense as other races anyway.

Having some kind of innate anti-psyker defenses which can be bolstered by etherial units tho... that I can see happening.

Oh boy, more Tau rumors!

Sorry, I am expecting all of this to just be bogus and lies. For the last couple years that I've been keeping up with Tau rumors I have gotten my hopes up and then destroyed in a matter of months of saving and it not coming.

I'm taking all these rumors in with a huge grain of salt. I just think it's lies.

 Avrik_Shasla wrote:
Sorry, I am expecting all of this to just be bogus and lies. For the last couple years that I've been keeping up with Tau rumors I have gotten my hopes up and then destroyed in a matter of months of saving and it not coming.

I'm taking all these rumors in with a huge grain of salt. I just think it's lies.

Until Harry or Hastings confirms them, this is pretty much the right stance to take.

As a competitive tau player (yeah, I know, its an oxymoron) I continue to play my blueskins regardless of any rumors or other activity.

I am excited about the prospect of putting more FW units into the codex...after all, I had supported GW shareholders buying their models...I would appreciate them supporting me by giving me more games to play them in....


Of course, I would be thrilled by a new dex...as long as its not "too good" as it were. While personally, I don't think tau need a whole new dex to be stronger (a few tweaks would do it) I welcome new content ...but with a bit of trepidation.

I love my necrons as well...but felt the old army was ...gutted...shall we say. I know that they want to sell new models, but I am not terribly pleased with the prospect that a lot of my old models (I have about 8k of tau) may not be as useful anymore.

However, as I have limited 40k experience with over the years (only been playing since 5th) can someone comment on whether traditionally have existing models always taken a hit (rules wise) in favor of new models? or was this just a coincidence in the necron and nid books?

Thanks for the rumor update kroot....

Hmmm, might not sell the Tau after all...

I'm really hoping they get human auxillaries

 Riddick40k wrote:
I'm really hoping they get human auxillaries

Why would they when IG can ally?

 Happygrunt wrote:

 Riddick40k wrote:
I'm really hoping they get human auxillaries

Why would they when IG can ally?

So they can have cheap troops with Tau weapons

 Happygrunt wrote:

 Riddick40k wrote:
I'm really hoping they get human auxillaries

Why would they when IG can ally?

Excellent question. As a player who has human aux in my army (can't run them all the time, mind you....).

1 - I may not want to pay the HQ tax (allies don't always fit in a 1500 point game, which is common in my area) - one squad of human aux are VERY cheap troops, good for going to ground behind an aegis line...
2 - A squad of human aux with emp grenades actually has a small amount of tank shock defense, as opposed to the higher cost of firewarriors with EMP.
3 - I may decide to use my allies slot on something I can't get in either the tau or the guard codex; troops good at holding objectives against assault or units good at assault offensively.
4 - Some players may have personal objections against "allies". Whether you agree or disagree with them, it may be the case.

I have considered buying more guard units (gw adds allies, sells more models...film at 11..) to flesh out my human aux...but to be honest, besides the amazing air support (the highly coveted vendetta gunship) other dexes give thing tau need more - durable scoring units.

Just my 2 cents...

Again, I hope for a new tau dex...I just hope the changes are not too radical.

Oh, and I would actually give the rumored railgun "joww" rumors a bit more consideration than six months ago...why?
It was the FIRST thing I thought of when I read the "beam" weapon type in 6th....."ahhh...that could be the new railgun....".

I just hope if this is done, the STR is only reduced by other vehicle hits...otherwise, I can see infantry screens popping up to reduce STR of the shots...

Great work as always KH. Ill wait for as long as it takes. Just please FAQ us a skyfire weapon soon GW

Oh look even more tau rumors...
They sound rather ok this time, but not really special.
Will just wait for the shine pictures (that will come out in several years when they are really released -.-)

This'll make my brother in law very happy, and me even more so if they do make the battlesuits more elegant; it'll be nice to shoot the crap out of something sleek as opposed to those manoeverable brick walls they currently have.

 Brother SRM wrote:

 Avrik_Shasla wrote:
I'm taking all these rumors in with a huge grain of salt. I just think it's lies.

Until Harry or Hastings confirms them, this is pretty much the right stance to take.

Hastings already confirmed the tau for next year (first half even).

Surprised to see the Demiurge not there. Was looking forward to them.

Remember there are rumors of mercenary supplementals. So we may yet see the Demiurge.

via Faeit 212 (A Must Remain Anonymous Source) wrote:
-Tau are coming early next year.
-Unit profiles are being finalized.
-The Tau are looking more and more like it will utilize and potentially modify the allies feature.
-unique fortifications.

-Just info on rules, no idea on models:
-HQ option to make crisis suits troops (not a special character, just an upgrade)
-crisis suits remain roughly the same but have a couple new weapon options.
-New 1-per-squad weapons
-new heavy support suit that has stats like a carnifex and no jet pack, just a big mech
-new elite suit that has a lot of sub 18" gun options, with a high rate of fire, or low AP. High toughness and -good armour save at a minor loss of mobility (think jump pack instead of jet pack)
-two flyers, one for AtA one for AtG (same basic fuselage)
-fire warriors are a little bit better and have more of a stormtrooper / commando feel, than a rank and file guardsman feel.

-oh and one of the other things right now, I was able to confirm that the current playtest is that firewarriors who do move in the movement phase may immediately run after firing their pulse carbines in the shooting phase.

Hopefully Tau Fighter Drones offer up a choice for CHEAP air choices.

Like, cheap as in 100 points per model kindve cheap. I don't care if they are AV10 all sides and BS3 with STR 4 or 5 guns, I want to be able to field a cheap but filled out air force.

I had seen rumors of the Chaos Heldrake clocking in at around 170 points, but I seriously doubt it. And I want a Squadron of fliers!

 Thunderfrog wrote:
I had seen rumors of the Chaos Heldrake clocking in at around 170 points, but I seriously doubt it.

It's not just a rumor anymore.

 pretre wrote:

via Faeit 212 (A Must Remain Anonymous Source) wrote:
-Tau are coming early next year.
-Unit profiles are being finalized.
-The Tau are looking more and more like it will utilize and potentially modify the allies feature.
-unique fortifications.

-Just info on rules, no idea on models:
-HQ option to make crisis suits troops (not a special character, just an upgrade)
-crisis suits remain roughly the same but have a couple new weapon options.
-New 1-per-squad weapons
-new heavy support suit that has stats like a carnifex and no jet pack, just a big mech
-new elite suit that has a lot of sub 18" gun options, with a high rate of fire, or low AP. High toughness and -good armour save at a minor loss of mobility (think jump pack instead of jet pack)
-two flyers, one for AtA one for AtG (same basic fuselage)
-fire warriors are a little bit better and have more of a stormtrooper / commando feel, than a rank and file guardsman feel.

-oh and one of the other things right now, I was able to confirm that the current playtest is that firewarriors who do move in the movement phase may immediately run after firing their pulse carbines in the shooting phase.

Elite suit sounds a lot like the XV9 with its manuverability stripped. Definitely interested in seeing special/heavy weapons in FW squads. Interesting tidbit about FW running after shooting if armed with PC...would actually make taking them over PR useful...

Of course, after being burned last year, I'll remain cautious about the details, but if Hastings says first half of next year, I feel pretty comfortable with getting a little excited for the new Codex.

Mh, call me an optimist, but I think chances for Tau next spring are pretty good. It might be conjecture, but Black Library has two tau centric stories scheduled for next year (january and march).

Well looks i will just have to wait until the models come out.
Ill just get a bit of other models, like fire warriors and kroot.
I hope Broadsides come down to atleast 30$, I'm happy they are sperate, right now i have been waiting 2 weeks for the upgrade kit to come.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 taudau wrote:
Mh, call me an optimist, but I think chances for Tau next spring are pretty good. It might be conjecture, but Black Library has two tau centric stories scheduled for next year (january and march).

And fire caste has what the new suits might look like.
Also I wonder what the Logic will be fore the Tau CC unit. Hardened Stealth Suit Pilots that grew adept at CC from being so close to the enemy?

I really hope these rumors are true, This stuff will probably be the only thing that I preorder from games workshop. I love the tau, but they don't have very much in the way of variance these days.

 hotsauceman1 wrote:
Well looks i will just have to wait until the models come out.
Ill just get a bit of other models, like fire warriors and kroot.
I hope Broadsides come down to atleast 30$, I'm happy they are sperate, right now i have been waiting 2 weeks for the upgrade kit to come.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 taudau wrote:
Mh, call me an optimist, but I think chances for Tau next spring are pretty good. It might be conjecture, but Black Library has two tau centric stories scheduled for next year (january and march).

And fire caste has what the new suits might look like.
Also I wonder what the Logic will be fore the Tau CC unit. Hardened Stealth Suit Pilots that grew adept at CC from being so close to the enemy?

Short ranged, high damage shooting weapons sounds more like it tbh - think hazards but smaller?

Well Ok, that makes more sense, But still my idea would make an awesome idea for a unit.

Despite the many times tau players have been given rumors only to find out that it was just false hope, I do enjoy seeing rumors again.

I take it the rumor that we would get a flyer before the codex is no longer valid?

Well it was the same with eldar, and we havent heard anything, so i doubt it sadly.

Or the kroot finally wised up and asked for some fancy gear.

I am really looking forward to this. I certainly hope the Mayans were wrong about their calendar and the world doesn't end in 2012.

 crazyK wrote:
I am really looking forward to this. I certainly hope the Mayans were wrong about their calendar and the world doesn't end in 2012.

There was an article on the Mayan Calendar a couple months back. They supposedly found another one that predates the most widely known one. It was put on all the walls of a house, and goes another 500+ years. It was an interesting read.

 Thunderfrog wrote:
Hopefully Tau Fighter Drones offer up a choice for CHEAP air choices.

Like, cheap as in 100 points per model kindve cheap. I don't care if they are AV10 all sides and BS3 with STR 4 or 5 guns, I want to be able to field a cheap but filled out air force.

I had seen rumors of the Chaos Heldrake clocking in at around 170 points, but I seriously doubt it. And I want a Squadron of fliers!

As it stands right now, if you're willing to shell out about $60, you can get a pack of two Remoras from Forge World that fit those criteria. Not exactly cheap, but priced very similarly to GW's other flyers. Only thing holding them back is the fact that they only have TL LB Burst Cannons, a networked markerlight, and two seeker missiles, which limits their effectiveness against armor, but if GW releases them in the new codex and amps them up with a heavier hitting weapon option to change the LB BCs out with, they would definitely be a much more viable option.

Mwahahahaha, Face the power of Flying Rail-guns.

GW has refused to accept the Greater Good. These rumors will just fizzle out as always.

I hope the battlesuit rumors are all true. Tau would be the only army that I'd take Apoc level.

I understand that these are just rumours and not set in stone, but as somebody getting into 6th and finishing off a Tau army, its a double edged sword.

yes it would be cool to get a new codex with shiny new toys and more fluff/characters. On the other hand | am a little concerned about the majority of my army becoming obsolete or relegated to counts as.

I don't think that would occur, Mecha. I think that you'd run into a few different things with older models (particularly base size) but that issue wouldn't be among them.

The one thing that does inspire me here is the idea of the Tau having an effective Fire Warrior squad special or heavy weapon. That's really fascinating to me as it could give the squads some much-needed flexibility.

I don't think it'll be that bad. Yeah, looks like new Crisis suits are in order, but Firewarriors, the current vehicles, Kroot, and all the drones won't get new models.

And while Tau players have been burned before, the rumour mill has been fairly consistent for quite a while now about the new book being early-mid 2013, so I'm feeling optimistic.

Re the close combat suits, wasn't the Spyrer Necromunda suits built by an alien race, recording the wearers actions and transmitting that info elsewhere?

I don't think they ever said who was getting that info?

Cheers

Andrew

 megatrons2nd wrote:

 crazyK wrote:
I am really looking forward to this. I certainly hope the Mayans were wrong about their calendar and the world doesn't end in 2012.

There was an article on the Mayan Calendar a couple months back. They supposedly found another one that predates the most widely known one. It was put on all the walls of a house, and goes another 500+ years. It was an interesting read.

The myan thing is total 100% bunk. Its a repeating calendar, based upon celestial movements, exactly like ours is. The world does not end when ours repeats, nor does it theirs.
(theirs is based upon the precession of the earth - and it's not their calendar, its the Olmec's - who were amazing architects and astronomers....but were crushed by the xenophobic imperium...).

Back on topic...

I am hoping that eventually gw gets to making solid core dexes, and just keeps them current via small updates.
Heck, even the current tau could be made very competitive again (6th helped) with a hand full of simple changes. Most books could.

I do get that eventually GW wants lots of new units, so they can sell models (they are a business after all - I accept that).

As a player who has not shelved his tau (I do play my other xenos occasionally....) I would love a new book...and I too....had got excited in the past.
This time, the only thing that gives me any shred of hope, is the fact that there are not that many books left to update....

Honestly, what I want the most is my awesome looking forgeworld units in the dex...heck ,I don't even care if they give them completely different stats....I just want to use those cool models I paid for...

I just want the codex before the yearly price rise makes it $55. It is already to expensive as it is. Although, some brainiacs decided to pay $80+ for a pointless special edition, so I can see them making the codecies much higher in cost.

Nice to know they will be updated soonish.

Stickmonkey wrote:I am not one to go against Hastings, it's entirely plausible the April slot is tau and I have information wrong. However, my sources are pointing to this 40k supplement book expanding on allies somehow, and how better to promote that than a closely released Tau book, who fluff wise rely on allies heavily? It makes marketing sense, but I guess the argument is when has gw made sense?

Also, with regard to faeit's rumors update.

I can definitely see the supposed cc option being a close range hail of fire unit when it comes to tau. But my sources call it a cc variant, so that's what im reporting.

I heard a long time ago about tau, nid, ork, and eldar terrain being worked on, I can certainly see these coming with codex releases as fortifications. Xenos terrain is sorely missing, but the question is can they sell it? I think if it's army themed and in the codex they can.

librerian_samae wrote:I can back up stick on the xenos terrain for what it's worth, it's been at least ready to be produced for 2ish years, about 2-3 gamesdays back Jez and phil when talking about dark eldar during their preview and were saying about webway kits etc being done and awesome.

At the time however all that was released was the small webway template, maybe they have kept all the xenos terrain back for a big release and/or gap in the release schedule.

shaso_iceborn wrote:I know my sources are "unreliable" at best, but I have been told to watch/start watching for information in March. Of course they still talk about the Mako as well as the Copperhead for flier names. My sources still say June for the release (last year they told me in April to expect a June release they did not say 2013 though) I have also heard the Hammerhead will receive a Swordfish option turret and be one of the first 4-in 1 tank kit boxes with an extra sprue added as well as a price increase. I usually stay silent anymore as people bash terribly but figured I would try to chime in once again.

All I can say is bring it on. Tau. New Tau!!!

It's been too long.

Mecha_buddha wrote:
I understand that these are just rumours and not set in stone, but as somebody getting into 6th and finishing off a Tau army, its a double edged sword.

yes it would be cool to get a new codex with shiny new toys and more fluff/characters. On the other hand | am a little concerned about the majority of my army becoming obsolete or relegated to counts as.

I don't think it'll be that bad. Yeah, looks like new Crisis suits are in order, but Firewarriors, the current vehicles, Kroot, and all the drones won't get new models.

Its not always about new models... While tau is my main army (they are the ones I take to tournaments, play in local leagues, etc.) I also have a few other xenos bands...specifically crons and nids (yes, I am that kind of glutton for punishment).

As someone who actually played crons in 5th (Yes, the older dex - I never claimed to be smart) and had some old nids....I know exactly what this double edged sword is about...
(ask how many nid players used carnifexes in 5th...or how many cron players used their ctan's or monoliths after the new dex).

Its about the newer units being just ...better...than the older ones. Or maybe,you don't want to convert them....(wanna know how many metal gauss immortals I had?) or that once fun unit sits on the shelf (ever see a nightbringer at a soup kitchen or try to get a job at a temp agency...its sad really) for whatever reason.

Oh, yeah, if there are new suits...I will run my old ones. if they are crisis suits, and that unit is still the powerhorse it is now. Of course if its just new weapons, the majority of my tau army is fully magnitized, so that may just be weapon swaps.

Regardless or possible "unit obsolesce" I am excited about the possibility of new dex....and THIS time, I think we may actually get it.
Of course this is not based upon the excitement of "no, this time its real!" kind of thing...its just the plain fact there are so few old books left....

Anyway, honestly, one of the biggest things I want to see is a good solid dex, that can be further kept up to standards with minor rules tweaks (the current one can, for the most part...but that is another story) not too good (one of my armies was shelved when their new dex came out...it was embarassing) and not too meh (I won't mention names., but I love their models...).

The next thing I want....please for the love of all that is holy, please put FW models in there.
Support those who have supported you all these years.

Pak out....

 Kroothawk wrote:

shaso_iceborn wrote:I know my sources are "unreliable" at best, but I have been told to watch/start watching for information in March. Of course they still talk about the Mako as well as the Copperhead for flier names. My sources still say June for the release (last year they told me in April to expect a June release they did not say 2013 though) I have also heard the Hammerhead will receive a Swordfish option turret and be one of the first 4-in 1 tank kit boxes with an extra sprue added as well as a price increase. I usually stay silent anymore as people bash terribly but figured I would try to chime in once again.

Swordfish? Haven't heard that one...could it be something like FW's turret options from the Taros Campaign IA book? A 4-in-1 tank kit is pretty believable, considering GW's recent love for multi-kits. I can see it being priced like the new Chaos Forgefiend/Maulerfiend kit ($66 USD).

I can say that I am firmly in the camp of folks that want to see some love for the Forge World models, however, I would really like to see some completely new and original units, too. If we get XV9s and Remoras, for example, I don't see them being all that different in price from their resin counterparts. Granted, there are some great discount retailers out there that would give us a good deal on them, but I kind of like the exclusivity that the FW units provide, not so much in terms of playing the game (I'm not a tourney player), but in terms of owning a model that most folks just drool over. That being said, I'd love to get an XV9 in plastic, with a big sprue with all the weapon options!

I tried ordering broadside guns and was Told that they are out of stock at gw and unlikely to be renewed!

davou wrote:
I tried ordering broadside guns and was Told that they are out of stock at gw and unlikely to be renewed!

Don't get your hopes up too much. Especially if it was your FLGS or even local GW Storefront. More often than not, the reps know just as much, if not less than those of us on the net about upcoming releases.

Additionally, as stated during several rumor threads past, this fall/winter season is pretty much hashed out to WoC, LotR, DA, and Daemons. Unless GW throws everybody for a loop and gets a surprise release for Tau, we're not going to see the Codex drop until at least Spring, if not early Summer. That being said, it's highly unlikely that they will cease sale/production of the Broadside upgrade kit for that long. It's also listed as backordered for 1-2 weeks on the US GW site. Sorry to dash your hopes, but as the reliable rumor sources said, not until at least Q2 2013...

I'm good either way.... I'll either get an updated kit, or I can get them when they arent back-ordered anymore

Im Wondering if the Mech they are talking about is kinda like the new forgefiend. I wnat a tau version of that.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

davou wrote:
I tried ordering broadside guns and was Told that they are out of stock at gw and unlikely to be renewed!

I ordered one two weeks ago. I called all this week :( Nothing, Even the owner told me that they will call me when it arrives because it never takes this long.

 hotsauceman1 wrote:
Im Wondering if the Mech they are talking about is kinda like the new forgefiend. I wnat a tau version of that.

Ugly and overpriced?

Previous Crisis Suits were Appleseed+Robotech. I'm wondering if this new gen will be Code Geass+Macross Frontier.

It'd be really nice if Devilfish could replace their gun drones with shield drones for a pinpoint barrier system.

 spectreoneone wrote:
Swordfish? Haven't heard that one...could it be something like FW's turret options from the Taros Campaign IA book?

It is a Hammerhead with twin linked Railguns from the Epic ruleset:

Epic Rules wrote:The Swordfish is also a relatively new addition to the Tau armed forces, being based on the familiar chassis of the Hammerhead and Devilfish. Its defining feature is, without a doubt, the huge twin-linked Railgun mounted on its turret, which makes it extremely effective at taking out enemy armour at great range. This was exactly the role it has been built to fulfil, after the sometimes painful experiences with Imperial armour and heavy armour won during the Damocles crusade.

In typical Tau fashion, it is not a replacement for, but an addition to the Hammerhead, taking on targets that are exceptionally well armoured. However, the design isn’t fully developed yet and the Swordfish is suffering from some minor problems as a consequence, especially during long-term campaigns. It requires an extensive amount of maintenance and repair/refit with spare parts, but its impressive fighting capabilities make up for this drawback.

 Kroothawk wrote:

 spectreoneone wrote:
Swordfish? Haven't heard that one...could it be something like FW's turret options from the Taros Campaign IA book?

It is a Hammerhead with twin linked Railguns from the Epic ruleset:

Epic Rules wrote:The Swordfish is also a relatively new addition to the Tau armed forces, being based on the familiar chassis of the Hammerhead and Devilfish. Its defining feature is, without a doubt, the huge twin-linked Railgun mounted on its turret, which makes it extremely effective at taking out enemy armour at great range. This was exactly the role it has been built to fulfil, after the sometimes painful experiences with Imperial armour and heavy armour won during the Damocles crusade.

In typical Tau fashion, it is not a replacement for, but an addition to the Hammerhead, taking on targets that are exceptionally well armoured. However, the design isn’t fully developed yet and the Swordfish is suffering from some minor problems as a consequence, especially during long-term campaigns. It requires an extensive amount of maintenance and repair/refit with spare parts, but its impressive fighting capabilities make up for this drawback.

Ah, thanks Kroot. Never played Epic, so I hadn't heard of it before. Kind of sounds like a redundant option to have that will end up costing way too many points to replace Broadsides. As it stands right now, with the addition of HP to vehicles and the beefing up of 2+ armor saves, Hammerheads are finding a smaller and smaller place in my army, never mind that I can get 2 Broadsides for the price of one Railhead. I just hope that when the new codex drops, they fixed the cost of many of the units. That's what we need more than anything, as many of our units have wacky point values.

davou wrote:
I tried ordering broadside guns and was Told that they are out of stock at gw and unlikely to be renewed!

The US online store has them listed as:
" Availability:
This product is expected to despatch in one to two weeks."

Who knows how long they have been listed in that way?

 hotsauceman1 wrote:
Im Wondering if the Mech they are talking about is kinda like the new forgefiend. I wnat a tau version of that.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

davou wrote:
I tried ordering broadside guns and was Told that they are out of stock at gw and unlikely to be renewed!

I ordered one two weeks ago. I called all this week :( Nothing, Even the owner told me that they will call me when it arrives because it never takes this long.

Same over here too at my GW store, I ordered it weeks ago and still nothing... the store even had to give me a store Broadside for the tournament they were running since it wasnt showing.

If it doesnt show up this week. Im taking the crisis suit i made and making it into a regular one. If it takes 3 weeks it might take longer.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

RogueRegault wrote:

 hotsauceman1 wrote:
Im Wondering if the Mech they are talking about is kinda like the new forgefiend. I wnat a tau version of that.

Ugly and overpriced?

Previous Crisis Suits were Appleseed+Robotech. I'm wondering if this new gen will be Code Geass+Macross Frontier.

It'd be really nice if Devilfish could replace their gun drones with shield drones for a pinpoint barrier system.

I mean big/Centerpiece of an army.
Decry all you want about how it looks, you cant deny when it comes on the field, Eyes are drawn to it.

I wonder if they are going to make shadowsun's upgrades available to the rest of the army. Dual weapon stealth suits would be fun.

Also, If Tau don't have something with "missile lock" I am going to be supremely disappointed.

I hope They also make it so commanders can take Stealth Suits.

 hotsauceman1 wrote:
I hope They also make it so commanders can take Stealth Suits.

Very much this. Though I hope they keep shadowsun in the codex.

 DakkaHammer wrote:

 hotsauceman1 wrote:
I hope They also make it so commanders can take Stealth Suits.

Very much this. Though I hope they keep shadowsun in the codex.

I hope they rewrite her statline completely. A special character that isn't an IC, has short ranged weapons and a leadership banner in a long ranged army, and gets ID'd by plasma? What were they thinking?

RogueRegault wrote:

 DakkaHammer wrote:

 hotsauceman1 wrote:
I hope They also make it so commanders can take Stealth Suits.

Very much this. Though I hope they keep shadowsun in the codex.

I hope they rewrite her statline completely. A special character that isn't an IC, has short ranged weapons and a leadership banner in a long ranged army, and gets ID'd by plasma? What were they thinking?

I have had a lot of success with her. A pair of deepstriking meltas that can pop two different vehicles and hit on 2's (not to mention eat pretty much anything else). She has epic saves, extra drones, and can jetpack away from danger now. The LD thing is just an extra that I ignore, unless my other stealth suits go farther upfield.

 spectreoneone wrote:

 Kroothawk wrote:

 spectreoneone wrote:
Swordfish? Haven't heard that one...could it be something like FW's turret options from the Taros Campaign IA book?

It is a Hammerhead with twin linked Railguns from the Epic ruleset:

Epic Rules wrote:The Swordfish is also a relatively new addition to the Tau armed forces, being based on the familiar chassis of the Hammerhead and Devilfish. Its defining feature is, without a doubt, the huge twin-linked Railgun mounted on its turret, which makes it extremely effective at taking out enemy armour at great range. This was exactly the role it has been built to fulfil, after the sometimes painful experiences with Imperial armour and heavy armour won during the Damocles crusade.

In typical Tau fashion, it is not a replacement for, but an addition to the Hammerhead, taking on targets that are exceptionally well armoured. However, the design isn’t fully developed yet and the Swordfish is suffering from some minor problems as a consequence, especially during long-term campaigns. It requires an extensive amount of maintenance and repair/refit with spare parts, but its impressive fighting capabilities make up for this drawback.

Ah, thanks Kroot. Never played Epic, so I hadn't heard of it before. Kind of sounds like a redundant option to have that will end up costing way too many points to replace Broadsides. As it stands right now, with the addition of HP to vehicles and the beefing up of 2+ armor saves, Hammerheads are finding a smaller and smaller place in my army, never mind that I can get 2 Broadsides for the price of one Railhead. I just hope that when the new codex drops, they fixed the cost of many of the units. That's what we need more than anything, as many of our units have wacky point values.

I dunno. The obvious thing to do is simply not give it submunitions. That way you choose either a slightly less reliable Railgun that can also take on infantry well, or a far more reliable railgun that's only effective against armour.

And if it DOES have submunitions, Where does that leave Broadsides? Broadsides will have to get cheaper or have more tricks up their sleeve.

 spectreoneone wrote:

 Thunderfrog wrote:
Hopefully Tau Fighter Drones offer up a choice for CHEAP air choices.

Like, cheap as in 100 points per model kindve cheap. I don't care if they are AV10 all sides and BS3 with STR 4 or 5 guns, I want to be able to field a cheap but filled out air force.

I had seen rumors of the Chaos Heldrake clocking in at around 170 points, but I seriously doubt it. And I want a Squadron of fliers!

As it stands right now, if you're willing to shell out about $60, you can get a pack of two Remoras from Forge World that fit those criteria. Not exactly cheap, but priced very similarly to GW's other flyers. Only thing holding them back is the fact that they only have TL LB Burst Cannons, a networked markerlight, and two seeker missiles, which limits their effectiveness against armor, but if GW releases them in the new codex and amps them up with a heavier hitting weapon option to change the LB BCs out with, they would definitely be a much more viable option.

Thanks for the heads up!

It seems you could field 2 Barraccuda's and 5 Remoras in a regular list with 3 FA choices, if you go by the new IA.

 hotsauceman1 wrote:
And if it DOES have submunitions, Where does that leave Broadsides? Broadsides will have to get cheaper or have more tricks up their sleeve.

True, however you can get 2 XV88s for close to the price of one Railhead. I'd be willing to bet that you'd be able to get a full squad for the same price, or less, than the Swordfish option. 1TL railgun shot vs 3? I'll take the 88's with a pair of shield drones. With that 2+, they're definitely more survivable than a 3HP 13/12/10. The 88's only downfall is that ridiculous T4.

Now, if they were to add Skyfire to the Swordfish...well, that would change my mind. But, honestly, the submunition option is just not enough to pull me away from 88's. I'd rather have the FW fusion cannon or LB BC option for the HH.

Yeah,
What Im hoping for is something like making stealth suits along the line of sternguard. Giving burst Cannons Specials Adaptable Ammo.
For something that operates in the outfield it isnt adaptable

 hotsauceman1 wrote:
Yeah,
What Im hoping for is something like making stealth suits along the line of sternguard. Giving burst Cannons Specials Adaptable Ammo.
For something that operates in the outfield it isnt adaptable

That's not a bad idea, but my problem with the BC is its lack of punch against anything better than GEQ. I'd like to see an anti-MEQ weapon for the Stealthsuits. I'd love to have the rail rifle, or even the plasma rifle, as an option for that role. I think that if they can carry FBs, they should be able to carry those.

I would like to see something like an grenade launcher wuld be cool.
Really, Stealth Suits need options.
but TBH we might very well get them, Remember how few Necrons and grey knights had? Then they exploded with units and options.

Yea, giving the stealthys rail rifles has always been a great idea for me. They would have been better last ed with the old night fighting rules but even now, I would never take a burst cannon again on them.

Saw this on the GW site.



Looks like they're getting slightly darker aesthetics

 spectreoneone wrote:

 hotsauceman1 wrote:
And if it DOES have submunitions, Where does that leave Broadsides? Broadsides will have to get cheaper or have more tricks up their sleeve.

True, however you can get 2 XV88s for close to the price of one Railhead. I'd be willing to bet that you'd be able to get a full squad for the same price, or less, than the Swordfish option. 1TL railgun shot vs 3? I'll take the 88's with a pair of shield drones. With that 2+, they're definitely more survivable than a 3HP 13/12/10. The 88's only downfall is that ridiculous T4.

Now, if they were to add Skyfire to the Swordfish...well, that would change my mind. But, honestly, the submunition option is just not enough to pull me away from 88's. I'd rather have the FW fusion cannon or LB BC option for the HH.

Don't forget that that 3HP 13/12/10 tank has (at the moment at least) a 3+ cover save in the open if it moves and 2+ cover behind a ruin whether it moves or not against shooting over 12" away thanks to Disruption Pods. Considering it will always have a Multi-tracker and therefore be able to move 12" and still fire 2 of its guns at full BS it becomes quite tricky for an opponent to get within that 12" to negate the Disruption Pods.

That makes our Hammerheads tougher than a Land Raider. A Railgun will roll a Glance or Penetrate on a Hammerhead 2/3rds of the time. However, in the open after moving, 1/3 of those successful shots will be negated, resulting in a 2/9 chance of losing a hull point from a successful Railgun Shot.

A Land Raider in the open has a 1/2 chance of losing a Hull Point to a Rail Gun Shot.

Behind a ruin the Land Raider will have a 1/4 chance whilst the Hammerhead has a 1/9 chance of losing a Hull Point.

Also, if you ever play against a Necron list with lots of Warriors then you'll miss not having that Submunition Round. It kills them by the handful, making it easier to wipe out entire units and deny them their get back up save.

Wouldn't surprise me if a Railhead got a points reduction (to say 30?) and a Swordfish became the new 50pt (or even 60pt) option.

If that railgun "beam" rule comes into effect, the Swordfish might get some sort of special benefit out of it if it's twin-linked. Double penetration distance?

Not a big fan of stealths as the burst cannon at 18" isn't very effective and if you are close enough for fusion you're dead next turn. They need a weapon that has at least 24" range and they would become awesome. I would love to see a plasma rifle option personally. Even if it was the same cost as now a team of six plasma rifle stealths for say 300pts in an elite slot. Would you take them over say a fireknife team which can throw down more shots down range per turn per man and for a 100 pts. less. That's the big question for me. And as far as the Hammerhead goes. My money is on those forgeworld turrets as a regular option. I run 2 plasmaheads and my only gripe is that I wish the burst cannons had longer range. Any rumors about if the cib will become a regular xv8 option?

Ledabot wrote:Yea, giving the stealthys rail rifles has always been a great idea for me. They would have been better last ed with the old night fighting rules but even now, I would never take a burst cannon again on them.

I was totally against giving them rail rifles in 5th, as it would have made them a broken unit (with JSJ, you would have been able to hit units at 36" and never be fired upon). With the change in the rules to the suit, it is definintely a viable option now.

A Town Called Malus wrote:Don't forget that that 3HP 13/12/10 tank has (at the moment at least) a 3+ cover save in the open if it moves and 2+ cover behind a ruin whether it moves or not against shooting over 12" away thanks to Disruption Pods. Considering it will always have a Multi-tracker and therefore be able to move 12" and still fire 2 of its guns at full BS it becomes quite tricky for an opponent to get within that 12" to negate the Disruption Pods.

That makes our Hammerheads tougher than a Land Raider. A Railgun will roll a Glance or Penetrate on a Hammerhead 2/3rds of the time. However, in the open after moving, 1/3 of those successful shots will be negated, resulting in a 2/9 chance of losing a hull point from a successful Railgun Shot.

A Land Raider in the open has a 1/2 chance of losing a Hull Point to a Rail Gun Shot.

Behind a ruin the Land Raider will have a 1/4 chance whilst the Hammerhead has a 1/9 chance of losing a Hull Point.

Also, if you ever play against a Necron list with lots of Warriors then you'll miss not having that Submunition Round. It kills them by the handful, making it easier to wipe out entire units and deny them their get back up save.

I've had nothing but bad luck with the submunition round, as scatter dice tend to just hate me. I've found the ion cannon to be far more effective than the blast when combined with a FW gunline. I also understand that a HH is a very survivable vehicle when used properly, however it only takes that one lucky roll to destroy it. In order to bring down an XV88 team with shield drones, you need to focus a lot of fire. In the last game I played, I had a team of two 88's with two shield drones soak up three turns worht of fire from two Storm Ravens, with one surviving at game's end. My HH, on the other hand, was smashed on turn 2 with one bloodstrike missile from one of the Ravens. My problem is that both units fulfill pretty much the same role, just in a slightly different manner. What the HH really needs is a points cost reduction, or something that will truly set it apart from the 88's, aside from maneuverability (which doesn't really do much for the HH, as I'm not going to rush it up the field, railgun blazing).

On that point as well...I'd really like to see the Skyray get skyfire for its MLs and a Skyfire variant of the seeker missiles. It just might then be a viable choice for my army!

Have been thinking about Tau, but don't want to get in too deep if new stuff is on the horizon.

I take it that it would be safe to invest in Fire Warriors and basic suits until then?

Yeah, Im going to do that, and put 100$ from each paycheck for the bundle until then.

 d-usa wrote:
I take it that it would be safe to invest in Fire Warriors and basic suits until then?

Various rumours have said new Crisis, Broadside and Stealth suits are planned, and I wouldn't be surprised at all to see a recut Firewarrior kit with Pathfinder bits, which actually fit together better as well.

I'd say the safest options are the tanks. Rumours haven't said the Piranha, Devilfish or Hammerhead are changing, aside from the Hammerhead becoming a quad kit with all the different turrets included.

Well aslong as the new crisis suits dont have a different Base, They are fine.

I would love to see some new tau stuff. I have always been interested in getting some but there was not really enough multipart plastic goodies for me to sink my teeth into!

Lots of new suits and a recut firewarrior set (they look a little soft atm) could change that for me.

Im hearing nothing about new firewarriors.
Now a pathfinder kit i would understand.

 hotsauceman1 wrote:
Im hearing nothing about new firewarriors.
Now a pathfinder kit i would understand.

Doing a Pathfinder kit and not doing it as a dual kit with Fire Warriors would be completely against GW's new release MO. Anything vaguely similar gets lumped into a dual kit. Considering Pathfinders are basically just Fire Warriors without the shoulder shield and armed with carbines, with options for Rail Rifles, I'd be completely shocked if we didn't get a recut Fire Warrior kit with Pathfinder bits.

That's where I was coming from with Fire Warriors probably changing - because it's a pretty solid guess. Pathfinders need a plastic kit, they're basically Fire Warriors with different options, dual kit. Likely with less models, my guess would be 8 rather than 12, with enough rifles and carbines to equip every model, and the full allotment of possible Rail Rifles.

 -Loki- wrote:

 hotsauceman1 wrote:
Im hearing nothing about new firewarriors.
Now a pathfinder kit i would understand.

Doing a Pathfinder kit and not doing it as a dual kit with Fire Warriors would be completely against GW's new release MO. Anything vaguely similar gets lumped into a dual kit. Considering Pathfinders are basically just Fire Warriors without the shoulder shield and armed with carbines, with options for Rail Rifles, I'd be completely shocked if we didn't get a recut Fire Warrior kit with Pathfinder bits.

That's where I was coming from with Fire Warriors probably changing - because it's a pretty solid guess. Pathfinders need a plastic kit, they're basically Fire Warriors with different options, dual kit. Likely with less models, my guess would be 8 rather than 12, with enough rifles and carbines to equip every model, and the full allotment of possible Rail Rifles.

This does indeed make sense. Of course, they could just go for finecast pathfinders as well, considering most players do not run a lot of them.
Unless of course, we get pathfinders in troop....

Another scenario might be if we get another type of infantry similar to pathfinders (I have no idea) - either an elite or fast infantry...some kind of small unit.
Then it could be a five model box that does either pathfinders or something else (similar to how you have necron dual kits).

I just don't see pathfinders mixed with firewarriors at this point, as one is a troop, and the other is not; perhaps if they add a lot of other firewarrior options - but otherwise its a lot of investment to make new molds for a unit that is already made (similar to how necron warriors remained the same).

Overall however, I think your reasoning is quite sound...(dual kits are the new future) - I just doin't think the firewwarriors will get one unless its with another "troop" class infantry unit. (new weapons could be handled with "upgrade packs" similar to the noise marine sonic weapons, etc.).

What GW wants, besides firing up the whole line, is to sell new kits...thus either new models (other recent dexes: wraiths, oblits, immortals, etc.) or new units which need new models (tomblades, stalkers, etc.).

I am perfectly happy with these scenarios...they will get lots of cash from me for it....

What I DO NOT like it when it is facilitated by making older (i.e. we already have the models) units less useful in the game (carnifex, ctan, etc.).

davethepak wrote:
I just don't see pathfinders mixed with firewarriors at this point, as one is a troop, and the other is not; perhaps if they add a lot of other firewarrior options - but otherwise its a lot of investment to make new molds for a unit that is already made (similar to how necron warriors remained the same).

The Tervigon is a HQ/Troop support creature, while the Tyrannofex is a Heavy Support gun platform. The Coven Throne is a Lord/Hero chariot mount, while the Mortis Engine is a Rare slot support chariot. Units don't have to be the same slot, or even the same role, for GW to make them into a dual kit. As long as there's common parts, they'll do it these days. The fact that you won't get as many Fire Warriors to a box is just gravy to GW - you'll be buying more kits to make the same sized quad you can now for less, which is what they want you to do.

What about, in a similar grain to the Chaos Space Marine update, we have the same Firewarrior kit now with a Finecast Pathfinder upgrade sprue ala Thousand Sons? That, to me, seems more likely than a dual kit with Firewarriors. Either that or like davethepak said, a pathfinder/new unit dual kit.

The difference is that the Thousand Son parts existed in metal before they were finecasted.

Well, I would hope that Pathfinders get something akin to the Necrons-Immortals treatment.

Warriors (Firewarriors) stay the same, but Pathfinders get a multi-part plastic kit that builds Pathfinders and, possibly, other variant "elite" units of the basic Firewarrior.

One can hope I guess

 spectreoneone wrote:


As it stands right now, with the addition of HP to vehicles and the beefing up of 2+ armor saves, Hammerheads are finding a smaller and smaller place in my army, never mind that I can get 2 Broadsides for the price of one Railhead. I just hope that when the new codex drops, they fixed the cost of many of the units. That's what we need more than anything, as many of our units have wacky point values.

I only use my Hammerheads with railguns when I am against lightly armoured foes such as Orks, Imperial Guard, Tyrannid, Eldar & Dark Eldar. I just use submunition rounds and it kills a good 8 men a turn.


More suits will be fun I think
Something I am hoping for though is more special characters for the Tau!

 spectreoneone wrote:
something that will truly set it apart from the 88's, aside from maneuverability (which doesn't really do much for the HH, as I'm not going to rush it up the field, railgun blazing).

Manoeuvrability on Hammerheads is awesome! In 'Big Guns Never Tier' scenarios, you can move your hammerheads 18" per turn and gain a 2+ cover save from most shooting. Great to claim objectives with.

Yes! Tau need more characters. Its one of the things that really separate them form the other factions. Different characters can mean giving some really interesting ways in which an army is played and i want to see some variety with my tau force when it hits.

Doubt this, but I'll believe it when I see it. I would think another Space Marine codex would come out before anything else, but you never know.

My beloved Tau have taken a backseat ever since 2008...

Ah we know, we want our tau and it seems like its always 'early next year'

Anyway. I was messing around on the GW site and I found that farsight is not able to be added to cart. I checked the uk tab and the us one but none seemed to work. the normal suits seemed fine. Anyone else got this or just me?

This could be really good for us, or just another cheep re-fincast or something equally annoying and kinda trolley on GWs part.

I hope the upgrade for pirahna is like, more options rather then gun drones, Imagine giving them smart missle systems, or sniper drones.
Infact all vehicles should be able to replace gun drones with sniper drones.

Stickmonkey wrote:"Beastly Transport" ---> Unit Type="chariot"...Size=Flying oval

I wonder then if this beastly transport could be the fw greater knarlock? Its about that size.

Being a chariot would make sense for sure. Interesting combo actually.... Chariot + Transport + Open Topped?
But then.... would it have armour and hull points, or toughness and wounds?

I could see Tau functioning based heavily on auxiliaries/allies.

You'd have the basic Tau kit, comprised of members from the actual castes of Tau society. It does certain things well and comes with various packages or upgrades you could field in the form of auxiliaries - psykers, melee, etc - all while staying within the (new) Tau codex. Of course, this is further customizable by reaching out to Allies in the main rulebook - bring some power armor and such.

It's very intriguing.

From rumors my understanding is that plastic kits are coming for the various Chaos factions/legions, wouldn't be so farfetched then to have plastic kits for Vespid, Kroot, etc, and maybe a Tau 'upgrade' kit so you could make auxiliaries from other existing 40k kits.

It might allow for other Tau castes to make an appearance as well.... bring an Air caste HQ and you get access to the Tau Navy, bring a Water caste HQ and you gain access to more allies / auxillaries, bring an Earth caste HQ and you gain access to... i dunno. tau fortifications? heavy vehicles?
And a Fire caste HQ gives you access to battlesuits.

Yay for making stuff up that would be cool!

Earth cast HQ could totally work like a techmarine. Bolster defences, repair vehicles and structures, stuff like that. The only caste that doesn't really fit 40k are the diplomatic caste (water?).

 -Loki- wrote:
The only caste that doesn't really fit 40k are the diplomatic caste (water?).

How about... having an air caste HQ allows you to bring *two* allied armies?

Or perhaps the water caste person is just an upgrade you buy for your army to let you mess with your opponent or take more allies. It wouldn't necessarily be reflected by a model on the table.

I could see us having Caste HQ's that don't take up a slot, but you can still buy them (like IG tech marines and priests). It would be a lot of fun!

Edited for wording.

A neat ability for the Water Caste would be on a roll changing the type of allies to desperate alliance thus removing many of the beneficial points. They could also make reserves more difficult as they "negotiate" with the parent faction, thus delaying reserves.

Yeah, I envisioned the Water Caste almost working as a psyker in being able to destroy the morale of the enemy, mess with their reserves, etc.

Also I could see them increasing the number of auxiliaries/allies, changing what is and isn't a scoring unit, etc.

The Reserves sound kinda cool

I could see Air Castes opening up allied races, messing with other peoples reserve rolls, or maybe not having to take an allied "HQ" and just being able to take 2 troops.

The new rules open up lots of options, although I assume that is all mostly wish listing at this point.

I kinda hope that we see air caste models piloting the fliers at least. In fact to see all the castes playing their part in a battle would be cool.

But I personally don't like the idea of auxiliaries/allies dependance. Let it be available to those who want it, but don't make the army depend on it. Some of us enjoy playing pure Tau.

 Archonate wrote:
I kinda hope that we see air caste models piloting the fliers at least. In fact to see all the castes playing their part in a battle would be cool.

But I personally don't like the idea of auxiliaries/allies dependance. Let it be available to those who want it, but don't make the army depend on it. Some of us enjoy playing pure Tau.

I'm sure that if there are any actual manned Tau aircraft, the pilots will be air caste members, just like the FW flyers. Granted, I have a feeling that there will also be drone aircraft as well.

I agree with you on the allies issue in terms of having a viable Tau-only force, but I think having some sort of enhanced allies functionality would be very fluffy for the Tau. I'm very anxious to see where they go with things in the new Codex.

I'll be so disappointed if the Barracuda isn't added as the flyer. The model has always been my favorite from the FW Tau line, I do hope it's inducted into the standard Tau line and doesn't go the way of the Dodo. If it does, I'll just have to buy it to turn it into a sexy paperweight.

Xyrael wrote:
I'll be so disappointed if the Barracuda isn't added as the flyer. The model has always been my favorite from the FW Tau line, I do hope it's inducted into the standard Tau line and doesn't go the way of the Dodo. If it does, I'll just have to buy it to turn it into a sexy paperweight.

Forgeworld models don't get turned plastic very often. I'd have loved to see the Helltalon instead of the Heldrake, and I assume that Tau will get a wholly new aircraft over anything from Forgeworld.

Yeah, it's a bit frustrating. FW sometimes has very nice stuff, and GW just wastes it. GW could've taken the Helltalon as a Chaos flyer and taken the time to instead remake the CSM and Havocs, but nooo. Some stupid transformer is what they get instead.

At least it'll take them some effort to make a bad looking Tau vehicle.

Antipathy from Warseer wrote:I have heard that there is a new unit for the Kroot in all areas to make them potentially viable - the old trackers (elite cavalry with sniper rifles), vultures (fast attack jump infantry), and ridden kroot monsters previously from fw.I

dont know how strong the initial source is, but they are reasonably accurate.

so Kroothawk might get a model?

 Brother SRM wrote:

Xyrael wrote:
I'll be so disappointed if the Barracuda isn't added as the flyer. The model has always been my favorite from the FW Tau line, I do hope it's inducted into the standard Tau line and doesn't go the way of the Dodo. If it does, I'll just have to buy it to turn it into a sexy paperweight.

Forgeworld models don't get turned plastic very often. I'd have loved to see the Helltalon instead of the Heldrake, and I assume that Tau will get a wholly new aircraft over anything from Forgeworld.

Remember that everything new in the 4th edition codex except for Space Pope and plastic stealth suits were from Forgeworld. Tau are right next to Witch Hunters on the "Bare minimum effort" list.

Shadow Strike, Vespids, Sniper Drones

RogueRegault wrote:

 Brother SRM wrote:

Xyrael wrote:
I'll be so disappointed if the Barracuda isn't added as the flyer. The model has always been my favorite from the FW Tau line, I do hope it's inducted into the standard Tau line and doesn't go the way of the Dodo. If it does, I'll just have to buy it to turn it into a sexy paperweight.

Forgeworld models don't get turned plastic very often. I'd have loved to see the Helltalon instead of the Heldrake, and I assume that Tau will get a wholly new aircraft over anything from Forgeworld.

Remember that everything new in the 4th edition codex except for Space Pope and plastic stealth suits were from Forgeworld. Tau are right next to Witch Hunters on the "Bare minimum effort" list.

That was also a long time ago; GW don't co-opt FW stuff very often anymore.

Any possibility that the tau broadsides will get the same treatment that the necron heavy destroyers got (simply being an upgrade to a crisis battle suit squad)?

I don't think so. Broadsides don't have jump jets, have different armor, and generally don't want to be anywhere near the ranges Crisis suits excel at.

 Brother SRM wrote:
I don't think so. Broadsides don't have jump jets, have different armor, and generally don't want to be anywhere near the ranges Crisis suits excel at.

At this point I kind of want to see them go the opposite route and make the Broadsides an entirely separate model rather than an upgrade kit.

Although I wouldn't object to a König Monster style Broadside that could forgo shooting to jump to another location on the battlefield.

Having just picked up a couple of the finecast broadside upgrade kits...


....I think I'll be buying my broadsides from FW from now on.

 Brother SRM wrote:

RogueRegault wrote:

 Brother SRM wrote:

Xyrael wrote:
I'll be so disappointed if the Barracuda isn't added as the flyer. The model has always been my favorite from the FW Tau line, I do hope it's inducted into the standard Tau line and doesn't go the way of the Dodo. If it does, I'll just have to buy it to turn it into a sexy paperweight.

Forgeworld models don't get turned plastic very often. I'd have loved to see the Helltalon instead of the Heldrake, and I assume that Tau will get a wholly new aircraft over anything from Forgeworld.

Remember that everything new in the 4th edition codex except for Space Pope and plastic stealth suits were from Forgeworld. Tau are right next to Witch Hunters on the "Bare minimum effort" list.

That was also a long time ago; GW don't co-opt FW stuff very often anymore.

I wouldn't discount it, either, especially since GW and FW are seemingly now working closer together than ever. Honestly, if they were to include all the Tau units/options (non-Apocalypse, that is) from FW into the new Tau codex, and tweak the rules and models for some of the existing units, we'd be doing pretty well. I know we all like the "Ooooh, shiny!" factor of brand-new units/models, and there are many who are frothing at the mouth to jack up the power of the Tau, but we don't really need all of that. I don't want Tau to be the 5th ed. GK reincarnated and be spammed by WAAC players or TFGs, because I don't want to be grouped with those folks.
Even though I lose as much as I win with my Tau, they can win, even against top tier armies. The problem is, your strategy must be flawless and you can't botch many rolls, as they are one of the most unforgiving armies. I just don't want to see Tau be turned into something called OP or cheesy. What I really want is a balanced, mid-tier army, with new, recut sprues and a handful of new shinies, and I think that FW has most of that to offer.

You really shouldn't want FW models included in the codex. FW have an agreement with the studio that they won't update rules for anything the studio includes in a studio publication - this is why we're stuck with the heriophant referencing psychic powers and biomorphs from the 4th edition Tyranid codex and have updated rules for the Scythed Heirodule but not the Barbed Heirodule. GW included the Heirophant and Barbed Heirodule in Apocalypse, so FW can't touch the rules, and GW can't be bothered updating the rules.

This is not a situation you want to be in with units in the codex. While GW might leave Tau to stew for another 2 editions, FW can update their stuff (and have! The new Tetra rules are quite nice) independantly as long as they don't get thrown in a GW publication.

Only thing I am interested in here - any news of Space Dwarves????!!!11!!! ?

I know ghost21 was discredited as being a fraud, but was there any chance his rumours of Demiurg were true? Or are we just going to see a bunch of new Playmobil-esque flyers again??

See first post:

Stickmonkey wrote:I also checked into the demiurge rumors, and was told "There are no demiurge in the Tau codex."

Make of that what you want.

 Micky wrote:
Having just picked up a couple of the finecast broadside upgrade kits...


....I think I'll be buying my broadsides from FW from now on.

You got those?
My store cant get any of mine, I ended up getting a refund. Got more fire warriors and turned the Suit i bought into a crisis.

 hotsauceman1 wrote:

 Micky wrote:
Having just picked up a couple of the finecast broadside upgrade kits...


....I think I'll be buying my broadsides from FW from now on.

You got those?
My store cant get any of mine, I ended up getting a refund. Got more fire warriors and turned the Suit i bought into a crisis.

It took about 6 weeks to arrive and frankly my 10 year old paint stripped second hand metal one looks better. The finecast kit is utter rubbish (and btw, no flaws either, its just crap)

When you consider that, postage aside, a FW broadside costs roughly the same as a GW crisis suit + broadside kit.... getting an upgrade kit was pretty dumb.

 -Loki- wrote:
You really shouldn't want FW models included in the codex. FW have an agreement with the studio that they won't update rules for anything the studio includes in a studio publication - this is why we're stuck with the heriophant referencing psychic powers and biomorphs from the 4th edition Tyranid codex and have updated rules for the Scythed Heirodule but not the Barbed Heirodule. GW included the Heirophant and Barbed Heirodule in Apocalypse, so FW can't touch the rules, and GW can't be bothered updating the rules.

This is not a situation you want to be in with units in the codex. While GW might leave Tau to stew for another 2 editions, FW can update their stuff (and have! The new Tetra rules are quite nice) independantly as long as they don't get thrown in a GW publication.

If they do it like with the Tyranids codex (Trygon, Mawloc) then it is great. The units go to core game, and stay updated which I think is were every on is going with wanting the FW included. The rumors look like a lot of FW or at least FW inspired units are the new ones for the codex.

Well if they;re grabbing FW stuff....

Stuff that makes sense:
- Tetra
- Piranha variant
- Hammerhead Turrets (tho we know they wont)
- Hazard Suits
- Barracuda
- Remora
- Knarloc Riders

But what about Commander Farsight?

He hates dem allies (No kroot or auxilliaries for him!)

So Tau would have to have at least one pure 'Tau' list for Farsight/

Im expecting Alot of different Characters for them.
All I want is for Crisis Suits to be made T5, or Monsterous creatures.

They would be the first monstrous creatures with a 2" base and I doubt they will get T5. In fact, i can't see them changing any stats except BS, A or Ld. They're pretty good as they are anyway so I wouldn't complain.

Original playtesting for crisis suits had them with 3 wounds, but it was considered too powerful. I agree MC status is too far for a regular suit. The issue with crisis has always been ID - especially from the horribly ubiquitous krak missile.

 troy_tempest wrote:
Original playtesting for crisis suits had them with 3 wounds, but it was considered too powerful. I agree MC status is too far for a regular suit. The issue with crisis has always been ID - especially from the horribly ubiquitous krak missile.

This. Krak Missiles are our bane. Cheap and easy to spam in Marine lists of almost all flavours and they completely nullify the 2 wounds of our suits with no armour save.

 A Town Called Malus wrote:
This. Krak Missiles are our bane. Cheap and easy to spam in Marine lists of almost all flavours and they completely nullify the 2 wounds of our suits with no armour save.

And every Tyranid Warrior in the cosmos cries out:

"Yeah... and? 'Least you can withstand Heavy Bolter fire."

 Roleplayer wrote:
But what about Commander Farsight?

He hates dem allies (No kroot or auxilliaries for him!)

So Tau would have to have at least one pure 'Tau' list for Farsight/

If Dark Eldar can ally with Chaos Daemons, giving you an army that contains Slaaneshi Daemons and Harlequins at the same time... then I really doubt Farsight has much of a claim to 'pure' armies.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:


If Dark Eldar can ally with Chaos Daemons, giving you an army that contains Slaaneshi Daemons and Harlequins at the same time... then I really doubt Farsight has much of a claim to 'pure' armies.

Logical fallacy.

Dark Eldar can also make a list without any Slaaneshi Daemons or Harlequins. The option to have a diverse list doesn't infringe upon your ability to make a "pure" list with Dark Eldar. Neither should it with Tau.

Inversely, the option to make a pure list shouldn't in any shape or form restrict people who want to make a more diverse list.

 Ledabot wrote:
They would be the first monstrous creatures with a 2" base and I doubt they will get T5. In fact, i can't see them changing any stats except BS, A or Ld. They're pretty good as they are anyway so I wouldn't complain.

...aside from the eldar avatar, you mean?

Bolognesus wrote:

 Ledabot wrote:
They would be the first monstrous creatures with a 2" base and I doubt they will get T5. In fact, i can't see them changing any stats except BS, A or Ld. They're pretty good as they are anyway so I wouldn't complain.

...aside from the eldar avatar, you mean?

Who was, at the time, one of the larger models GW produced. He's meant to be on a dreadnought base now.

I have no idea why anyone thinks Crisis suits should be Monstrous Creatures. I really don't get that idea at all.

Current policy is that no FW model is copied directly to GW Codices, they usually try to create a new model even when close to a FW one. Let's see if they stick to this policy.

 Brother SRM wrote:

Bolognesus wrote:

 Ledabot wrote:
They would be the first monstrous creatures with a 2" base and I doubt they will get T5. In fact, i can't see them changing any stats except BS, A or Ld. They're pretty good as they are anyway so I wouldn't complain.

...aside from the eldar avatar, you mean?

Who was, at the time, one of the larger models GW produced. He's meant to be on a dreadnought base now.

I have no idea why anyone thinks Crisis suits should be Monstrous Creatures. I really don't get that idea at all.

Yeah, Crisis Suits shouldn't be MCs. If they were then all of our suits would suddenly become quite lethal in CC, against non-CC dedicated units at least. Hammer of Wrath (though I think they should have that now), 3 attacks on the charge at S5, AP2 thanks to Smash with the option of less attacks at S10. Kind of silly, really.

I think that the most ideal solution for making XV8s more survivable would be a built-in Invulnerable save, 5+ or so, which works similar to a Disruption Pod or reverse Defensive Grenade (i.e if you're shot within 8" then no Invulnerable Save). Then you can still have Shield Generators which provide a better save and work at short range and CC.

I thought Crisis suits had a 2+ armour save?

admittedly i haven't played against one in a few years.

 Brother SRM wrote:

Bolognesus wrote:

 Ledabot wrote:
They would be the first monstrous creatures with a 2" base and I doubt they will get T5. In fact, i can't see them changing any stats except BS, A or Ld. They're pretty good as they are anyway so I wouldn't complain.

...aside from the eldar avatar, you mean?

Who was, at the time, one of the larger models GW produced. He's meant to be on a dreadnought base now.

GW's own webstore, just ago, wrote:This pack contains The Avatar of Khaine - a finely detailed resin cast kit that comes in five components and is supplied with a 40mm round base.

that model is still supposed to be played on a 40mm base

 Praxiss wrote:
I thought Crisis suits had a 2+ armour save?

admittedly i haven't played against one in a few years.

3+ save, 2 wounds.


I'd just want Shas'vre to have BS4, and the return of "Shots target drones first". Maybe some kind of cheap "Skilled Flier" upgrade that doesn't take a hardpoint.

RogueRegault wrote:

 Praxiss wrote:
I thought Crisis suits had a 2+ armour save?

admittedly i haven't played against one in a few years.

3+ save, 2 wounds.


I'd just want Shas'vre to have BS4, and the return of "Shots target drones first". Maybe some kind of cheap "Skilled Flier" upgrade that doesn't take a hardpoint.

I'd just want all Suits to have BS4 they are in our Elite slot afterall

I'd just like to see more suits from the various size ranges, so far only the XV1, XV2, XV8, and XV9 are used, i wanna see more kinds of suits even if they are in an existing size classes.
I also suspect Broadsides will get XV9 status with a reduction in armor.

So will you be able to have a suit-only army?

 Melissia wrote:
So will you be able to have a suit-only army?

Most likely with a named character.

Interesting. Guess I'll have to prepare for them.

That's not really backed in any fact, so don't prepare too hard.

 MasterSlowPoke wrote:
That's not really backed in any fact, so don't prepare too hard.

True. This is a rumor thread and until we get scans or official word, then obviously things aren't Fact.

There are some rumors that support the all suit army.

HQ option to make crisis suits troops (not a special character, just an upgrade)

Yea it was just a hunch.

 Zweischneid wrote:
Logical fallacy.

Bwahahahaha! You missed my point in its entirety. That’s... impressive.

My point was that the idea of keeping Farsight’s rules ‘pure’ (as in no allies) makes little sense given the very rules that govern the game as a whole allow for matchups that include Slaaneshi Daemons and Harli’s working side by side.

To put it another way, if that can happen why should the Tau get a special dispensation against stupid combinations? Because their fluff says so? Well the fluff also says that Slaanesh is the Eldar’s mortal and eternal enemy... yet Harli/Daemonette combos are possible.

D’ya get it yet?

When I said it, I meant more its a restriction placed on Farsight.

He isn't allowed any kroot, only 1 of a lot of choices...so I wouldnt be surprised to see if you take commander Farsight you are just banned from taking allies.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

 Zweischneid wrote:
Logical fallacy.

Bwahahahaha! You missed my point in its entirety. That’s... impressive.

My point was that the idea of keeping Farsight’s rules ‘pure’ (as in no allies) makes little sense given the very rules that govern the game as a whole allow for matchups that include Slaaneshi Daemons and Harli’s working side by side.

To put it another way, if that can happen why should the Tau get a special dispensation against stupid combinations? Because their fluff says so? Well the fluff also says that Slaanesh is the Eldar’s mortal and eternal enemy... yet Harli/Daemonette combos are possible.

D’ya get it yet?

Logical fallacy!

Just because someone can potentially take a stupid combinations should not prevent someone from taking a list composed of the models they want from an army they want...

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

 Zweischneid wrote:
Logical fallacy.

Bwahahahaha! You missed my point in its entirety. That’s... impressive.

My point was that the idea of keeping Farsight’s rules ‘pure’ (as in no allies) makes little sense given the very rules that govern the game as a whole allow for matchups that include Slaaneshi Daemons and Harli’s working side by side.

To put it another way, if that can happen why should the Tau get a special dispensation against stupid combinations? Because their fluff says so? Well the fluff also says that Slaanesh is the Eldar’s mortal and eternal enemy... yet Harli/Daemonette combos are possible.

D’ya get it yet?

Tau do not and should not get a special dispensation. But neither should they be forced to take models they don't want, just like no Dark Eldar player is ever forced to take Slaaneshi Daemons.

Having the option to build your own (Dark) Eldar army with Slaaneshi allies is a great thing precisely because their fluff is so closely intertwined, hence it's likely someone will like to spin a story from it.

But it shouldn't ever be imposed on any Dark Eldar/Eldar players to use Slaanesh Daemons. Likewise, it should never be imposed upon any Tau player to use allies. Ergo, providing them with an option for a "Tau-only" army, even if only unlocked through a certain Character/Upgrade/whatever, would make intuitive sense to retain the maximum amount of options.

If there is an HQ upgrade allowing an all suit army and Farsight doesn't have it then I'll be annoyed.

I'd just like suits to be BS4 T5.

I just don't think the Crisis suits warrant T5. There isn't much outside of MCs and special characters that have T5. It makes sense to me that a krak missile, which is designed to penetrate armored vehicles, can pop a Crisis suit in one shot.
I know that there is a lot of missile spam, but that doesn't mean that you should just buff a unit to negate tactics to mitigate the risk to your units. It's not like Crisis suits are walking tanks of death; they're relatively lightweight, mobile, versatile exoskeletons. And it's not as if there aren't options to help make them tougher. Between iridium armor, shield drones, and shield generators, you have the options there to make suits more survivable.
Make no mistake, the Tau are not a beginner's army, nor are they forgiving in terms of making mistakes in your tactics. You have to stay mobile, use cover, and carefully plan out your next move in order to stay alive. I am strongly against changing this. I really only agree with BS4 for the XV suits in terms of buffs, aside from a few points cost adjustments.

Edit: Grammar

 TheMind wrote:
I'd just like suits to be BS4 T5.

T5 may be a step too far, but I agree that every Shas'vre and Shas'ui should see BS 4 (or about a 5 point drop)

 spectreoneone wrote:
I just don't think the Crisis suits warrant T5. There isn't much outside of MCs and special characters that have T5. It makes sense to me that a krak missile, which is designed to penetrate armored vehicles, can pop a Crisis suit in one shot.
I know that there is a lot of missile spam, but that doesn't mean that you should just buff a unit to negate tactics to mitigate the risk to your units. It's not like Crisis suits are walking tanks of death; they're relatively lightweight, mobile, versatile exoskeletons. And it's not as if there aren't options to help make them tougher. Between iridium armor, shield drones, and shield generators, you have the options there to make suits more survivable.
Make no mistake, the Tau are not a beginner's army, nor are they forgiving in terms of making mistakes in your tactics. You have to stay mobile, use cover, and carefully plan out your next move in order to stay alive. I am strongly against changing this. I really only agree with BS4 for the XV suits in terms of buffs, aside from a few points cost adjustments.

Edit: Grammar

Interestingly enough there's at least one suit coming rumored to have "stats like a carnifex and no jet pack, just [be] a big mech." Not a crisis suit, but still.

T5 is a must. I dont want them being knocked out by missile launcher.

Since we're wish-listing now, how about this:

ECM drone: For x points, a gun drone attached to a XV8 or XV88 can be upgraded to exchange its guns for an advanced suite of tools that disrupt enemy targeting systems. While not powerful enough to conceal its controller a la stealth suits, it helps to ensure that the controller at best only suffers glancing blows from enemy heavy weapons.

All XV8 or XV88 models in a unit containing an ECM drone ignore ID from shooting attacks.

I think T5 makes more sense than S5. Why would they build for strength when they know they suck in close combat? No, durability makes more sense.

Dentry wrote:

 spectreoneone wrote:
I just don't think the Crisis suits warrant T5. There isn't much outside of MCs and special characters that have T5. It makes sense to me that a krak missile, which is designed to penetrate armored vehicles, can pop a Crisis suit in one shot.
I know that there is a lot of missile spam, but that doesn't mean that you should just buff a unit to negate tactics to mitigate the risk to your units. It's not like Crisis suits are walking tanks of death; they're relatively lightweight, mobile, versatile exoskeletons. And it's not as if there aren't options to help make them tougher. Between iridium armor, shield drones, and shield generators, you have the options there to make suits more survivable.
Make no mistake, the Tau are not a beginner's army, nor are they forgiving in terms of making mistakes in your tactics. You have to stay mobile, use cover, and carefully plan out your next move in order to stay alive. I am strongly against changing this. I really only agree with BS4 for the XV suits in terms of buffs, aside from a few points cost adjustments.

Edit: Grammar

Interestingly enough there's at least one suit coming rumored to have "stats like a carnifex and no jet pack, just [be] a big mech." Not a crisis suit, but still.

And that's fine. My point was that for a suit that's not much larger than a Termi that has less armor, it makes absolutely no sense for it to be tougher than practically everything in its class. It's not meant to wade into enemy fire and take shots all day. Now, if they give us a beast of a suit like the one previously mentioned, then I can go for that.

hotsauceman1 wrote:T5 is a must. I dont want them being knocked out by missile launcher.

Again, see above. It makes absolutely NO sense to make a Crisis suit that tough. A Krak missile is used against tanks with much heavier armor than a Crisis suit, so why shouldn't it cut through them like the proverbial hot knife through butter. You're not supposed to just blindly charge up the field with your XV8s and expect them to survive. You're supposed to use their maneuverability to jump into the fray, unload your weapons, then jump to safety. It's also not like your rank and file XV8 pilot is anybody special, or they're imbued with super-human toughness. Look, I know it's frustrating that there are so many armies that can spam S8 AP3 missiles, but we have wargear that can negate that, as I've said before. You can spend points to get an invuln. save and prevent pure ID to your suits. Is the shield generator over-costed? Yeah, I think so, but that's where Tau needs their tweaks.

spectreoneone wrote:Make no mistake, the Tau are not a beginner's army, nor are they forgiving in terms of making mistakes in your tactics. You have to stay mobile, use cover, and carefully plan out your next move in order to stay alive. I am strongly against changing this.

I agree with this. While it sucks that you can kneecap yourself fairly easily, it is fun playing an army that requires finesse.

agnosto wrote:I think T5 makes more sense than S5. Why would they build for strength when they know they suck in close combat? No, durability makes more sense.

I think that the second wound is what represents their durability. While they can take more of a beating than space marines, an anti-tank rocket is still going to cause enough damage to the suit that it won't function any more.
The S5 fits IMO because it is a giant mech suit, and that is bound to be pretty strong. It doesn't mean that they purpose-built the suits for robo-punches, but they are pretty big.

If a missile launcher can 1 Shot a Hammerhead, why shouldn't it be able to 1 shot a crisis or broadside?

I just want any drones(gun, marker, shield, whatever) put into a Suit squad to have T* so they don't run afoul of majority toughness rules.

Also, all drones should be able to Look Out Sir! suits regardless of whether or not the original target of the attack is a character. Gun drones should LoS! on a 4+ and shield drones on a 2+.


The BS for Shas'ui doesn't need to be boosted, they just need to make markerlights cheaper and more available across the army.

RogueRegault wrote:
I just want any drones(gun, marker, shield, whatever) put into a Suit squad to have T* so they don't run afoul of majority toughness rules.

Also, all drones should be able to Look Out Sir! suits regardless of whether or not the original target of the attack is a character. Gun drones should LoS! on a 4+ and shield drones on a 2+.


The BS for Shas'ui doesn't need to be boosted, they just need to make markerlights cheaper and more available across the army.

We are only Shas'ui in a suit should be BS4. They are our Elites for Pete's sake. According to the fluff it takes over 4 years of service and combat to even be able to pilot a Crisis, Broadside, or Stealth Suit. Keep infantry Shas'ui BS3. Reduce the cost of Shas'ui for Fire Warriors and Pathfinders and auto include him and photon grenades into the units.

Can we get back to rumors before this gets locked for wishlisting?

But i only got to do it once.

 pretre wrote:
Can we get back to rumors before this gets locked for wishlisting?

Yeah...I honestly think that, again, the rumors have dried up (thus the move to wishlisting)...not just for Tau, either. I'm thinking that due to the lack of any strong rumors so close to a WD release, November may be for LotR (or GW has effectively choked off the a lot of the leakers), which means that DA is probably going to be the first 40k codex of 2013. With WoC and Daemons rumored to be on the docket as well, I'm thinking that at the earliest we would see Tau is possibly March/April timeframe, which puts it in line with what most of the reputable rumor mongers have said.

Which is a good thing. The earliest codexes of the new edition end up being eclipsed fairly rapidly.

I'm happy to wait.

Ok, So what do you guys speculate the close combat suits will be? And i wonder how they will look, will they be just as bulky as they are now?

 hotsauceman1 wrote:
Ok, So what do you guys speculate the close combat suits will be? And i wonder how they will look, will they be just as bulky as they are now?

Oh my imagination went all sorts of directions when I saw this rumor.
I picture them being either XV1 or XV2 sized.
Personal flechette dischargers on the suit?
Close range built in mini disruption pod?
I imagine they will be built for speed, and not bulky power. Maybe even enhanced speed, requiring a lot of training to get used to it.

I picture them using a sword type weapon with a plasma blade that flashes out from the handle when it's swung, and retracts back in after the swing. That way it doesn't drag the way a conventional blade would and they can swing it much more rapidly... Maybe have a plasma pistol incorporated on the back of the other hand.

OR maybe a shield device on one hand that emits a razor sharp circular energy field.

Whatever it does, this suit has the potential to sell the army for being high tech ninja.

I think if Tau get a "close combat" Crisis suit, it won't actually be geared for close combat. It would have some kind of blast radius around it or assault deterrent like flechette launchers to wound things on the way in, and then Hit & Run to get away from any given fight. Giving Tau a bunch of Gundams with beam sabers is silly and unfluffy.

I can totally see Tau units taking flash bangs to let them use the blind special rule. WS 2 means nothing if your enemy is WS 1!

The photon grenades and the photon grenade launchers on the pulse carbines should really allow one to deliver Blind attacks instead of the funky Stealth USR and making the carbines pinning.

As for the 'Close Combat' suits,I am thinking a light version of the Hazard suit with built in defensive grenades, hit and run and short range, high rate of fire weapons. Maybe a template weapon in place of a Flechete Discharger style weapon.

Vague idea that a Farsight list might have an option for giving Crisis suits power swords...

NO, WAIT. PHASED ION SWORDS. WHICH ARE POWER WEAPONS WITH AP3.

Sigh.

Tau players, you are awesome. Despite playing an army that essentially is made of smurfs with an incredibly outdated codex, you still play on! Your will seems to be unbreakable! Your courage is yet to be matched!

It would only be fair, GW, if you allowed Tau to take Railcannons as a standard choice. It's not much asked for and Tau really deserve this! Those guys are awesome!!!

Post may or may not be influenced by the fact that Necrons can take Tau allies and lack AP2.

 Sigvatr wrote:
Tau players, you are awesome. Despite playing an army that essentially is made of smurfs with an incredibly outdated codex, you still play on! Your will seems to be unbreakable! Your courage is yet to be matched![/size]

Pfft if DE players can rough it for 14 years we can at least try to match them

I have always wanted to like tau, hopefully they get a cc monster (metaforically) which won't be lychguard'ed and be made to cost a whole small game for a max size unit... (butthurt)

 HoverBoy wrote:

 Sigvatr wrote:
Tau players, you are awesome. Despite playing an army that essentially is made of smurfs with an incredibly outdated codex, you still play on! Your will seems to be unbreakable! Your courage is yet to be matched![/size]

Pfft if DE players can rough it for 14 years we can at least try to match them

Didn't Grey Knights suck for quite a while as well?

 d-usa wrote:

 HoverBoy wrote:

 Sigvatr wrote:
Tau players, you are awesome. Despite playing an army that essentially is made of smurfs with an incredibly outdated codex, you still play on! Your will seems to be unbreakable! Your courage is yet to be matched![/size]

Pfft if DE players can rough it for 14 years we can at least try to match them

Didn't Grey Knights suck for quite a while as well?

Don't forget Necrons.

True but i think DE hold the record for now.

The moment 6th ed tau are actually announced I shall sell both my old blood angel and orginial tau models and start a brand new fresh tau army (alot of the tau models are 6-7 years old :S)

 Superscope wrote:
The moment 6th ed tau are actually announced I shall sell both my old blood angel and orginial tau models and start a brand new fresh tau army (alot of the tau models are 6-7 years old :S)

The Fire Warrior model is actually quite nice - very crisp and stylish. The crisis suits now look too gundam-y, and I would prefer a style closer to Macross or Evangelion. Then again, I'm in love with the current Eldar models. I strongly dislike the forgeworld vehicles past Remora drones though, so I hope they don't steal much besides the xv-9's that I currently use as broadsides.

uberjoras wrote:

 Superscope wrote:
The moment 6th ed tau are actually announced I shall sell both my old blood angel and orginial tau models and start a brand new fresh tau army (alot of the tau models are 6-7 years old :S)

The Fire Warrior model is actually quite nice - very crisp and stylish. The crisis suits now look too gundam-y, and I would prefer a style closer to Macross or Evangelion. Then again, I'm in love with the current Eldar models. I strongly dislike the forgeworld vehicles past Remora drones though, so I hope they don't steal much besides the xv-9's that I currently use as broadsides.

The Remora drones look sweet! I have no idea what they do, or what's special about them since I've had my Tau army for about 3 days haha

uberjoras wrote:

 Superscope wrote:
The moment 6th ed tau are actually announced I shall sell both my old blood angel and orginial tau models and start a brand new fresh tau army (alot of the tau models are 6-7 years old :S)

The Fire Warrior model is actually quite nice - very crisp and stylish. The crisis suits now look too gundam-y, and I would prefer a style closer to Macross or Evangelion. Then again, I'm in love with the current Eldar models. I strongly dislike the forgeworld vehicles past Remora drones though, so I hope they don't steal much besides the xv-9's that I currently use as broadsides.

I'd rather they keep the suits similar to what they are now but slightly sleeker (after all, technology becomes smaller over time so it makes sense that the XV8s would become slightly smaller as the Tau develop ways to fit the same tech into a smaller volume) and more customisable/posable. The suits in Evangelion don't look like they're a piloted machine, more like a giant man. So my personal preference is to keep the somewhat grounded in reality look.

uberjoras wrote:
The Fire Warrior model is actually quite nice - very crisp and stylish. The crisis suits now look too gundam-y, and I would prefer a style closer to Macross or Evangelion.

No, they don't look like Gundams. There is not a single design element shared between Gundams and XV-8s, apart from both having straight lines. If that's all it takes to look like a Gundam, then Johnny 5 from Short Circuit is a Gundam. I really wish this meme would die.

What GW needs to do is not copy someone else's IP style, but rather come up with their own designs that look good. The concept sketches for XV-8s that were made way back in preparation for Codex: Tau Empire are perfectly good, original designs that capture the Tau aesthetic without copying anyone else's style. Why GW didn't run with them what, 5 years ago is anyone's guess.

 A Town Called Malus wrote:

uberjoras wrote:

 Superscope wrote:
The moment 6th ed tau are actually announced I shall sell both my old blood angel and orginial tau models and start a brand new fresh tau army (alot of the tau models are 6-7 years old :S)

The Fire Warrior model is actually quite nice - very crisp and stylish. The crisis suits now look too gundam-y, and I would prefer a style closer to Macross or Evangelion. Then again, I'm in love with the current Eldar models. I strongly dislike the forgeworld vehicles past Remora drones though, so I hope they don't steal much besides the xv-9's that I currently use as broadsides.

I'd rather they keep the suits similar to what they are now but slightly sleeker (after all, technology becomes smaller over time so it makes sense that the XV8s would become slightly smaller as the Tau develop ways to fit the same tech into a smaller volume) and more customisable/posable. The suits in Evangelion don't look like they're a piloted machine, more like a giant man. So my personal preference is to keep the somewhat grounded in reality look.

The EVAs aren't piloted machines, they're clones of an angel that have a cockpit stabbed into their back.

Tau esthetic is one part Appleseed, one part Macross, five parts blatant copying from RIFTS World Book 5:Triax and the NGR.

 caminacambob wrote:
Just because someone can potentially take a stupid combinations should not prevent someone from taking a list composed of the models they want from an army they want...

I didn't say that either. Hell, I didn't even imply it.

I personally LOVE the design of the XV9's.. they remind me A LOT of the good days of armored core (Everything pre-AC 5)

 A Town Called Malus wrote:

uberjoras wrote:

 Superscope wrote:
The moment 6th ed tau are actually announced I shall sell both my old blood angel and orginial tau models and start a brand new fresh tau army (alot of the tau models are 6-7 years old :S)

The Fire Warrior model is actually quite nice - very crisp and stylish. The crisis suits now look too gundam-y, and I would prefer a style closer to Macross or Evangelion. Then again, I'm in love with the current Eldar models. I strongly dislike the forgeworld vehicles past Remora drones though, so I hope they don't steal much besides the xv-9's that I currently use as broadsides.

I'd rather they keep the suits similar to what they are now but slightly sleeker (after all, technology becomes smaller over time so it makes sense that the XV8s would become slightly smaller as the Tau develop ways to fit the same tech into a smaller volume) and more customisable/posable. The suits in Evangelion don't look like they're a piloted machine, more like a giant man. So my personal preference is to keep the somewhat grounded in reality look.

They don't look like piloted machines, because they aren't piloted machine. It's the equivilent of lobotomizing and cyborgifying a greater daemon and sticking a cultist "pilot" inside it to attempt to make their mind more like its to make it move.

 TheMind wrote:

 A Town Called Malus wrote:

uberjoras wrote:

 Superscope wrote:
The moment 6th ed tau are actually announced I shall sell both my old blood angel and orginial tau models and start a brand new fresh tau army (alot of the tau models are 6-7 years old :S)

The Fire Warrior model is actually quite nice - very crisp and stylish. The crisis suits now look too gundam-y, and I would prefer a style closer to Macross or Evangelion. Then again, I'm in love with the current Eldar models. I strongly dislike the forgeworld vehicles past Remora drones though, so I hope they don't steal much besides the xv-9's that I currently use as broadsides.

I'd rather they keep the suits similar to what they are now but slightly sleeker (after all, technology becomes smaller over time so it makes sense that the XV8s would become slightly smaller as the Tau develop ways to fit the same tech into a smaller volume) and more customisable/posable. The suits in Evangelion don't look like they're a piloted machine, more like a giant man. So my personal preference is to keep the somewhat grounded in reality look.

They don't look like piloted machines, because they aren't piloted machine. It's the equivilent of lobotomizing and cyborgifying a greater daemon and sticking a cultist "pilot" inside it to attempt to make their mind more like its to make it move.

Which would explain why it doesn't look like a machine and make it even less sensible to have the Tau driving them (or something that looks like them considering the technology required to make a machine which could move and look like that) around.

 A Town Called Malus wrote:

 TheMind wrote:

 A Town Called Malus wrote:

uberjoras wrote:

 Superscope wrote:
The moment 6th ed tau are actually announced I shall sell both my old blood angel and orginial tau models and start a brand new fresh tau army (alot of the tau models are 6-7 years old :S)

The Fire Warrior model is actually quite nice - very crisp and stylish. The crisis suits now look too gundam-y, and I would prefer a style closer to Macross or Evangelion. Then again, I'm in love with the current Eldar models. I strongly dislike the forgeworld vehicles past Remora drones though, so I hope they don't steal much besides the xv-9's that I currently use as broadsides.

I'd rather they keep the suits similar to what they are now but slightly sleeker (after all, technology becomes smaller over time so it makes sense that the XV8s would become slightly smaller as the Tau develop ways to fit the same tech into a smaller volume) and more customisable/posable. The suits in Evangelion don't look like they're a piloted machine, more like a giant man. So my personal preference is to keep the somewhat grounded in reality look.

They don't look like piloted machines, because they aren't piloted machine. It's the equivilent of lobotomizing and cyborgifying a greater daemon and sticking a cultist "pilot" inside it to attempt to make their mind more like its to make it move.

Which would explain why it doesn't look like a machine and make it even less sensible to have the Tau driving them (or something that looks like them considering the technology required to make a machine which could move and look like that) around.

Exactly. Now a style closer to macross than Gundam I could get behind, because outside the original series, Zeta and Katoki's works, the MS design in gundam has always been kinda iffy. Now Macross's stuff looks fantastic.

Gundams are also 30ft tall. Tau suits are really more akin to the power suits the Mobile Infantry wear in Starship Troopers.

And before anyone throws a hissy fit, go read that book. The proper employment of Crisis suits is even identical to how the MI operates.

Truth!

The XV8s look clumpy.
I never thought they quite fit the Tau aesthetic of smooth curves and I'm happy to hear they're being redesigned.

If you look at the crisis suits done by forge world there is a trend there for the suits to be more shaped rather than "blocky", shame they can't be used for standard 40k rule cos they are unbelieveable

The XV-8 variants, XV-88-B type, and XV-9 suits are approved for use in Warhammer 40,000 games. Many tournaments don't allow Forgeworld, which is of course their choice, but if you don't play in tournaments and instead focus on having fun you won't have any problems there.

Do Forgeworld provide a set of rules for their stuff? I'm ordering some Tetras (since the general consensus is that they're awesome)

Rules for that stuff is in their books. I think volume 3 has alot about Tau.

stubacca wrote:Do Forgeworld provide a set of rules for their stuff? I'm ordering some Tetras (since the general consensus is that they're awesome)

Duncan_Idaho wrote:Rules for that stuff is in their books. I think volume 3 has alot about Tau.

Yes they do. Forgeworld made a PDF update for pretty much everything Tau from IA;3 which can be found here

If they fix the Crisis Suits aestheticsI might actually play Tau. As of now I cannot stand the XV8's blocky nature, it just looks very poor to me.

Wow, someone sent me the Forgeworld PDF (thank you! I can't think who, coz it's too much effort on my phone to check but thanks all the same! )

I'm amazed at how sucky some of the Tau stuff is BS2 for some things?! How did these guys manage to conquer anything, they're worse than Stormtroopers haha

 stubacca wrote:
Wow, someone sent me the Forgeworld PDF (thank you! I can't think who, coz it's too much effort on my phone to check but thanks all the same! )

I'm amazed at how sucky some of the Tau stuff is BS2 for some things?! How did these guys manage to conquer anything, they're worse than Stormtroopers haha

Those are all our drones lol. GW hasa strange affinity that automated drones are never smart and in no way could a Xenos race that always uses drones and advancing in technology on a constant basis can't make higer BS drones.

 Enigma Crisis wrote:

 stubacca wrote:
Wow, someone sent me the Forgeworld PDF (thank you! I can't think who, coz it's too much effort on my phone to check but thanks all the same! )

I'm amazed at how sucky some of the Tau stuff is BS2 for some things?! How did these guys manage to conquer anything, they're worse than Stormtroopers haha

Those are all our drones lol. GW hasa strange affinity that automated drones are never smart and in no way could a Xenos race that always uses drones and advancing in technology on a constant basis can't make higer BS drones.

Indeed. GW seems to believe that a computer is inferior to a man when it comes to calculating trajectories of projectiles in real time in order to hit a target.

On the other hand, all our BS2 drone stuff is twin-linked, which actually makes it more reliable than base BS3. And of course they benefit from markerlights.

Sentry Drone Turrets with Missile Pods are actually a tough, points-cheap, points-efficient way of get some additional anti-air into a list.

 ShatteredBlade wrote:
If they fix the Crisis Suits aestheticsI might actually play Tau. As of now I cannot stand the XV8's blocky nature, it just looks very poor to me.

Its funny, im kinda of opposite. The blocky reminds me more of transformers which is why I started playing them. I wouldn't mind a few more specialized units or unit leaders redesigned with a sleaker look thats for sure. i spent a lot of time customization poses and cutting them up. Im more interested in a more dynamically posable units.

 Riker210 wrote:
The blocky reminds me more of transformers

Funny you should say that, since i'm currently making a purple suit with a single eye a missing arm replaced with a plasma rifle and a custom even blockyer chest.

I must be alone in that I really like the XV-8s....
I just make their legs longer, repose the arms and they look great.

I chopped up all my XV-9s and gave them Xv-8s head to make them closer to the normal crisis suit asthetic

I rather like the XV-8s myself, but the legs/ankles/feet do bug me. I think they should be more chunky and articulated.

 Micky wrote:
I rather like the XV-8s myself, but the legs/ankles/feet do bug me. I think they should be more chunky and articulated.

They kind of work if you imagine the suit as flying/hovering all the time and the feet are just glorified landing gear.

But yes, bulking up the ankles is one of the more popular conversions.

 Roleplayer wrote:
I must be alone in that I really like the XV-8s....
I just make their legs longer, repose the arms and they look great.

Same here: I love the XV-8s, I just have to get rid of the head, the body, the arms, the legs and the weapons, and they look great

 Kroothawk wrote:

 Roleplayer wrote:
I must be alone in that I really like the XV-8s....
I just make their legs longer, repose the arms and they look great.

Same here: I love the XV-8s, I just have to get rid of the head, the body, the arms, the legs and the weapons, and they look great

I see what you did there.

Getting away from this nonsensical conversation about teenage fantasy anime, I think the cc suits might be a bit like warp spiders but with an empashis on danger close shooting. Would love to see a dedicated flamer/pulse cannon stealthsuit that retained stealth field rules.

The remora drones are way overpriced in FW rules, costing as much as a Vendetta, while only having minimal weapons in comparison. Not to mention their guns wouldn't be very effective in air-to-air. I suppose shrouded plus jink would be sexy for an air unit.

Any word on a dedicated AA unit... like the Sky-Ray getting a skyfire markerlight or something? Also, Tetras not going to be added? Sad face.

Xyrael wrote:
Getting away from this nonsensical conversation about teenage fantasy anime, I think the cc suits might be a bit like warp spiders but with an empashis on danger close shooting. Would love to see a dedicated flamer/pulse cannon stealthsuit that retained stealth field rules.

The remora drones are way overpriced in FW rules, costing as much as a Vendetta, while only having minimal weapons in comparison. Not to mention their guns wouldn't be very effective in air-to-air. I suppose shrouded plus jink would be sexy for an air unit.

Any word on a dedicated AA unit... like the Sky-Ray getting a skyfire markerlight or something? Also, Tetras not going to be added? Sad face.

A CQC suit might be a cool idea, but I'm unsure how wel it'll work out for them. WIth the new charge ranges, you'll end up hoping that you knock out the threat before they eat your squad.

I think the CQC Suit will probably be a Stealth Suit variant that trades in the stealth field generator for a shield generator or VRRT and will probably be used like the Hazard Suits are.

Jump in between soon to be charged unit and the enemy unit. Ravage it with fire and either counter-charge or draw off the enemy charge on themselves. Survive combat for a little bit then Hit and Run out of combat so everyone else can shoot the nasty unit.

Xyrael wrote:
Getting away from this nonsensical conversation about teenage fantasy anime, I think the cc suits might be a bit like warp spiders but with an empashis on danger close shooting. Would love to see a dedicated flamer/pulse cannon stealthsuit that retained stealth field rules.

The remora drones are way overpriced in FW rules, costing as much as a Vendetta, while only having minimal weapons in comparison. Not to mention their guns wouldn't be very effective in air-to-air. I suppose shrouded plus jink would be sexy for an air unit.

Any word on a dedicated AA unit... like the Sky-Ray getting a skyfire markerlight or something? Also, Tetras not going to be added? Sad face.

Nice try on getting this thread back on almost a rumor thread and away from "Discussion on tau suit aesthetics".
However, this is marginally only better than wishlisting....perhaps this should be locked until we get some actual rumors?

1 - In regards to a "danger close shooting" suit;
It would need to be deadly in overwatch, or some other mechanic, to be effective.
If it is no good in CC, it would need hit and run to get out of it (and the int to make it work).

I think a stealth suit with better weapons would be awesome. Plasma rifle ? Yes please.
Flamer? Yes please? Now give them hit and run, or something so they can stay out of assault...yes please.

2 - Remora
I love the models. Love the stats. these things would be great at about 45 points each, maybe even 50!
Honestly, if they were treated as "flying marker light drones, with a secondary weapon" for 50 points, then maybe I could see using them.
At their current point cost and weapons load out? They are laughably bad at best.
Oh, and lets not even get started on the barracuda. Lets just say mine will be a "counts as " storm talon for my allied marines.
Its that terrible.

3 - Skyray
This should be a no brainer. The markers have should skyfire. I mean, isn't that the point of the unit?
Of course, it should be a no brainer that if you somehow hit a flyer with a markerlight, then the seeker is BS5 to hit it.
(I cannot believe they somehow did not make this clear, either way, in the faq....).

4 - Tetras
Yes please. Really, love the model. Current FW stats are actually decent too!
(in fact its one of the non-imperial fw units that actually have good rules!!!).

I'm worried about having to buy everything new again :/

I wouldn't worry too much. Suits I think will be the only change along with vespid. Got all my tau tanks and troops ready for new book

I'm hoping the base stats will change, nothing major, but improve the vespids kinda thing. I want to like them but everything I've heard/read about them makes them sound worse than poop

I hope not only the suits gets changes, but also the Piranhas, they can bring so much more with so little changes such and underrated unit, hope they bring them up because i love the movel. I can still keep it up with the Tetras from FW, such an easy and simple conversion to do with simple Piranha. I cant make the cockpit as the FW one, but i can bring everything else with just a lil`thought and a Shield generator

Im kinda sad that the Demiurg wont be coming out for table top but thats ok ill make my own.
hope the cc suits are true. must defeat brothers all zerker army!

I hope the Crisis suits wont look like the Forgeworld suits. I actually prefer the current suits and think the heads on the Forgeworld models look weird.
Though, this is one of the only armies I won't mind using old models with new ones at all. It's just a showing of Tau progress, and it's not like they'd just phase out all the old battle suits.

What would be super neat is a fully modular, customisable suit, like the armored core games. With the direction they took with CSM, I wouldn't be all that surprised if they totally blew up the crisis suit options. My friends were surprised when they actually looked at the tau codex; they were under the impression our suits were totally build-from-scratch: It'd be awesome if they actually were! Then again, since cruddace is supposedly writing it...

For the 'fastest growing race' I think they need more close range weapons and weapon skill. We'll happily let units get within 12" with a one shot melta, but no flamers or other items? You would imagine we would need something to combat CC more efficiently.

Crisis Suits can get flamers...

... and a failsafe detonator.

 Minx wrote:
... and a failsafe detonator.

Be nice if you could use it outside of a sweeping advance, though.

75hastings69 wrote:Anybody who might be interested in what tau models (or at least one of them) you can really expect next year might want to type "Fil Dunn tau" into a google image search

verydarkshadow wrote:This is what I found ...

Why am I not surprised?

shaso_iceborn wrote:Basically according to my sources it's pretty much a Dreadknight sized suit with dual (note not twin linked) rail cannons and SMS with a rule for something I will call "hail-fire" in that it shoots massive barrage of weapondry if not moving in the movement phase.

75hastings69 wrote:Just to clear things up there IS something very similar to that image coming for tau.

And just this past weekend I pulled out my Tau because I was going to take pictures of everything and list them on ebay/swap shop....

Good thing I got all sentimental and put them back in the closet!

Hey look the games day model from a few years back.

 SickSix wrote:
And just this past weekend I pulled out my Tau because I was going to take pictures of everything and list them on ebay/swap shop....

Good thing I got all sentimental and put them back in the closet!

Haha, i did that twice with models i wanted to get rid of. Sayonara unbuilt CSM. What, new book? Dont look at me with those bloodthirsty puppy dog eyes! Im sorry, i didnt mean it.

If the new models look that advanced..... i'll die happy!

 Kroothawk wrote:

75hastings69 wrote:Anybody who might be interested in what tau models (or at least one of them) you can really expect next year might want to type "Fil Dunn tau" into a google image search

verydarkshadow wrote:This is what I found ...

Why am I not surprised?

shaso_iceborn wrote:Basically according to my sources it's pretty much a Dreadknight sized suit with dual (note not twin linked) rail cannons and SMS with a rule for something I will call "hail-fire" in that it shoots massive barrage of weapondry if not moving in the movement phase.

75hastings69 wrote:Just to clear things up there IS something very similar to that image coming for tau.

Always been a huge fan of Fil Dunn's model there. Very District 9-esque too IMHO.

If Tau get that, like Fil Dunn modelled it, that'd be cool (if it's more Fil Dunn than Dreadknight). It'd also fit the trend of big new toys with Codices these days (IMHO); such as the Dreadknight, Helldrake etc.

If the new models look THAT advanced ill be pissed. It doesn't mesh with any current model.

Don't get me wrong it looks sweet but clearly out dates everything that's been out since.

 MechaBeast wrote:
If the new models look THAT advanced ill be pissed. It doesn't mesh with any current model.

Don't get me wrong it looks sweet but clearly out dates everything that's been out since.

It doesn't mesh with any current model because it's a mishmash of everything.

If we see something like that, you can almost be certain that it will mesh with everything else because of the fact that it will not be one massive conversion.

 MechaBeast wrote:
If the new models look THAT advanced ill be pissed. It doesn't mesh with any current model.

Don't get me wrong it looks sweet but clearly out dates everything that's been out since.

I can understand where you are coming from.
I am just of looking at playful little robots across the table. But i would look a little strange to see all the cartoon models then that thing.

 Kanluwen wrote:

 MechaBeast wrote:
If the new models look THAT advanced ill be pissed. It doesn't mesh with any current model.

Don't get me wrong it looks sweet but clearly out dates everything that's been out since.

It doesn't mesh with any current model because it's a mishmash of everything.

If we see something like that, you can almost be certain that it will mesh with everything else because of the fact that it will not be one massive conversion.

Isnt that weird though? Its made from everything, looks like nothing else

 MechaBeast wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:

 MechaBeast wrote:
If the new models look THAT advanced ill be pissed. It doesn't mesh with any current model.

Don't get me wrong it looks sweet but clearly out dates everything that's been out since.

It doesn't mesh with any current model because it's a mishmash of everything.

If we see something like that, you can almost be certain that it will mesh with everything else because of the fact that it will not be one massive conversion.

Isnt that weird though? Its made from everything, looks like nothing else

Not really.

For myself, I'm dissecting it into the component parts and not seeing the model as a whole.

With a model that size, you really could see a lot of people using gundum bits on there models. Great way to feed the image that tau = anime.

Just had to be the wet towel. I can't wait for a big stompy suit.

*sigh* one thing I liked about the Tau was their semi-realism. Battlesuits actually made sense as a concept because of their compactness combined with mobility, not like ridiculous oversized Gundams with lightsabers. Looks like that's going out the window.

excellent...

 Harriticus wrote:
*sigh* one thing I liked about the Tau was their semi-realism. Battlesuits actually made sense as a concept because of their compactness combined with mobility, not like ridiculous oversized Gundams with lightsabers. Looks like that's going out the window.

The Tau Crisis suits are not to scale. They are actually quite larger, more of the Gundam size.

Unless the pilots were sitting in a fetal position while piloting them. They are not as large as a Gundam though, more along the line of a Dougram, or Aura Battler. Pilot in the chest, and about 3 times the size of the pilot. Battlesuits are about twice the pilots size, so are only slightly too small.

Terminators, appear to also be slightly to small, appearing to be along the lines of the Appleseed type suits.

The Taros Campaign sourcebook gives the following stats on a XV-8 battlesuit.

crew : 1
weight : 2.5 tonnes
length : 1.7 m
Width : 1.9 m
Height : 2.8 m

so not very big..and I know hardly anything about Gundam thingies , but what few pics I have seen would lead me to believe there is litle size comparisons.

(I personally dislike a anime look for my tau, and have gone for a real world combat look for mine )

A giant battlesuit..meh, oh well at least it will be SOMETHING new...me I would prefer some new heavy grav tanks.

That would put them at 9 ft tall. I really don't think that's right. They would only be 2 ft taller than a space marine that way. I've heard that they are about the same height as a dreadnought. That makes more sense.

well battlesuits are not built to human specs, tau are smaller and slighter than average humans, so 9' ish seems likely pretty good size to them, 2 ft larger than a superhuman demigod soldier is fine

it does weigh 2.5 tons, so its not exactly a feather weight., and if you put the minis next to each other flat footed, I bet it rings in at around the 9' range.

If its any consolation the Xv-9 is easily 10-12 tall.

Actually the minis themselves are not to scale with each other (hence the heroic) so using them for size comparisons won't be "accurate", quite easy to see by the fact a guardsman is the same size as a marine that is certainly not how it should be.

It's a beautiful conversion, but it defies everything we know about the Tau. The Tau are mobile. The Tau use combined arms. When Tau need heavy/super-heavy vehicles, they depend on skimmers and aircraft.

While a beautiful robot, what role does that conversion serve in a battle that can't be served by lighter, nimbler vehicles? A super-heavy robot would be slower than a skimmer, require more maintenance, and not be any more durable. What role does such a lumbering behemoth play in any of the Tau hunt doctrines?

GW have built a pretty good design for the Tau, and giant robots just don't fit the design. To plop in a giant robot kit because it will sell well to everyone who wants their Tau to be an anime proxy would be to show that GW doesn't care about their own work, and just wants to move product. It would show that apart from employees named Jes, their studio just doesn't give a damn.

So I guess what I'm saying is, expect a Tau giant robot kit, and expect it to be silly.

Right because broadsides are fast and mobile.

The Broadsides (with ASS) are certainly more mobile than most other infantry heavy weapons teams. But they do lend themselves more to a static philosophy than most other units.

I think GW is really seeking to have in each army a big flying thing and a big monstrous creature/walker type thing. They look impressive on the table, can do a lot of damage if the rules are decent, and allow them to rake in a lot of money. With this in mind it's only natural that the Tau will wind up with what may be a form of Super Broadside.

However, the big mech doesn't necessarily mean it will be slow. For all we know, like the Nemesis Dreadknight, it may be able to upgrade into a Jump or Jet Pack unit. I personally think the latter would be awesome.

I don't care about new units, I want the units we've already got to get a slight boost stat wise! *cough* vespids

 stubacca wrote:
I don't care about new units, I want the units we've already got to get a slight boost stat wise! *cough* vespids

Good luck. It doesnt fit GW's business model, see the Necron Codex.

Oh? Let's see what's become of mainstay units of the old Necron 'dex:
1) Monoliths: not something I'd ever take - but it's a matter of taste. I've seem plenty of them played and they do quite well still.
2) Immortals: (sure they have new models, but it's not as if the old ones are less useful; gauss immies are just as good as their tesla counterparts): these see play a LOT now. I know several folk who had 20 or even 30 of those under the old dex - they have 20-30 immies still seeing play now. Competitively.
3) Warriors: still quite good, still used quite a lot.
4) Wraiths (sure new models but the old ones are valid; whip coils aren't hard to DIY): good, competitive unit.
5) Scarabs: these guys got good, no doubt about that.
6) Spyders: used plenty. again, new model available but the old one works fine!
7) Pariahs: ...okay meh. warscythe lychguard can be fun but... meh. still, that's just one unit (and they convert to crypteks just fine with some bits from the lychguard/praetorian kit if you're so inclined!)
8) Destroyers: ...this is actually the only unit that got the 'fex treatment this codex. one. fethin. unit. just one.

all in all someone with an existing army bought a couple of transports and suddenly had a tournament-competitive army to play with.

How was that a bad update? Really. Hey, I got stung by the 'Nid upgrade so I know updates can be bad but Necrons are a good example of an update which was great for pretty much anyone playing a Necron army (aside from destroyerwing, and arguably even those aren't half as bad as, say, oh over half of the 'nid dex ) - as were for example GK and SW - in all those examples you *could* get a whole new army of shiney new toys - but the old toys worked just fine, just as well.
If codex: Tau goes along the lines of those, you'll get some new shinyness you could always just ignore, but you'll get decent rules for existing models as well

 Bolognesus wrote:
Oh? Let's see what's become of mainstay units of the old Necron 'dex:
1) Monoliths: not something I'd ever take - but it's a matter of taste. I've seem plenty of them played and they do quite well still.
2) Immortals: (sure they have new models, but it's not as if the old ones are less useful; gauss immies are just as good as their tesla counterparts): these see play a LOT now. I know several folk who had 20 or even 30 of those under the old dex - they have 20-30 immies still seeing play now. Competitively.
3) Warriors: still quite good, still used quite a lot.
4) Wraiths (sure new models but the old ones are valid; whip coils aren't hard to DIY): good, competitive unit.
5) Scarabs: these guys got good, no doubt about that.
6) Spyders: used plenty. again, new model available but the old one works fine!
7) Pariahs: ...okay meh. warscythe lychguard can be fun but... meh. still, that's just one unit (and they convert to crypteks just fine with some bits from the lychguard/praetorian kit if you're so inclined!)
8) Destroyers: ...this is actually the only unit that got the 'fex treatment this codex. one. fethin. unit. just one.

all in all someone with an existing army bought a couple of transports and suddenly had a tournament-competitive army to play with.

How was that a bad update? Really. Hey, I got stung by the 'Nid upgrade so I know updates can be bad but Necrons are a good example of an update which was great for pretty much anyone playing a Necron army (aside from destroyerwing, and arguably even those aren't half as bad as, say, oh over half of the 'nid dex ) - as were for example GK and SW - in all those examples you *could* get a whole new army of shiney new toys - but the old toys worked just fine, just as well.
If codex: Tau goes along the lines of those, you'll get some new shinyness you could always just ignore, but you'll get decent rules for existing models as well

I totally agree with all of this!

P.S. i like your sig

Normally I’d say something like “Get ready for the pendulum to swing” and for all the effective Tau units to suddenly become useless and vice versa... but how many effective Tau units are there? Can you really nerf an army that doesn’t function as intended?

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Normally I’d say something like “Get ready for the pendulum to swing” and for all the effective Tau units to suddenly become useless and vice versa... but how many effective Tau units are there? Can you really nerf an army that doesn’t function as intended?

I expect they'll do their best!

 Bolognesus wrote:
Oh? Let's see what's become of mainstay units of the old Necron 'dex:
1) Monoliths: not something I'd ever take - but it's a matter of taste. I've seem plenty of them played and they do quite well still.
2) Immortals: (sure they have new models, but it's not as if the old ones are less useful; gauss immies are just as good as their tesla counterparts): these see play a LOT now. I know several folk who had 20 or even 30 of those under the old dex - they have 20-30 immies still seeing play now. Competitively.
3) Warriors: still quite good, still used quite a lot.
4) Wraiths (sure new models but the old ones are valid; whip coils aren't hard to DIY): good, competitive unit.
5) Scarabs: these guys got good, no doubt about that.
6) Spyders: used plenty. again, new model available but the old one works fine!
7) Pariahs: ...okay meh. warscythe lychguard can be fun but... meh. still, that's just one unit (and they convert to crypteks just fine with some bits from the lychguard/praetorian kit if you're so inclined!)
8) Destroyers: ...this is actually the only unit that got the 'fex treatment this codex. one. fethin. unit. just one.

all in all someone with an existing army bought a couple of transports and suddenly had a tournament-competitive army to play with.

How was that a bad update? Really. Hey, I got stung by the 'Nid upgrade so I know updates can be bad but Necrons are a good example of an update which was great for pretty much anyone playing a Necron army (aside from destroyerwing, and arguably even those aren't half as bad as, say, oh over half of the 'nid dex ) - as were for example GK and SW - in all those examples you *could* get a whole new army of shiney new toys - but the old toys worked just fine, just as well.
If codex: Tau goes along the lines of those, you'll get some new shinyness you could always just ignore, but you'll get decent rules for existing models as well

1.) Monoliths got totally nerfed. Lost Lance/Melta Immunity. Lost Deep Strike protection. Weapon Strength Reduced. All weapons minus door can now be destroyed.
2.)Both Immortals and Warriors got nerfed in their ability to res only on a 5+ now without an orb. Orb tax makes them way more expensive than original Immortals. Now with 1 less toughness, and rapid fire Gauss Blasters versus the far superior original Assault 2 S5 AP4 gun. Yes Tesla is awesome but really, the original Immortals were removed from the game and the models became 3rd edition warriors slightly better and 1 point cheaper.
3.)Warriors quite good? In what game are you playing. They are only fielded because they are a cheap troop choice and 6th gave them the ability to glance vehicles to death, but since hardly anyone takes decent vehicles anymore the point is moot. The codex gives us 2 troops options, and that is the only reason you see warriors as they are a cheap troop and unlock NightScythes. Warriors Res on a 5+ instead of 4+ and lost an Armour point. They got 5 points cheaper but the Res. Orb tax doesn't make up for the point decrease.
4.) Canoptek Wraiths are not event the same unit they were in 3rd. They kept the 3+ Inv. save and rending weapons but other than that they were totally remade and lost the ability to resurrect. They are now one of the best units in the entire game as they grew in size from max 3 models to 6 but that is all GW needed to change was increasing the unit size.
5.) Scarabs were awesome now they pretty much suck. They were faster in 3rd edition through 5th. 6th edition pretty much nerfed them and made flamers so much better that scarabs die quick and pointless deaths on the 40k battlefields these days. Plus no one takes the units that Scarabs are able to devour in seconds unless they happen to be transports loaded with flamer troops that again, kill them quickly.
6.) Spyders changed very little, but did get nerfed in their ability to be purchased in squads of 3 and placed separately and did not have to maintain coherency.
7.) Lychguard are not Pariahs. At best you can wysiwyg proxie them as Warscythe Lychguard. that is where their similarity ends. Pariahs had built in S5 AP4 assault 2 guns, Warscythes that ignored all saves(even Inv. saves), were fearless, caused Psykers to flee and could reduce their iniative to 1 in CC and they reduced all opposing models leadership to 7 within 12" of the unit. GW deleted these from the game because they sold poorly. But they only needed a little tweaking and a plastic kit and Pariahs would have been amazing if included in the new codex. They suffered from not being able to use the Veil or monolith's teleportation and couldn't ressurect. If that was fixed they would be an amazing unit far superior to Lychguard.
8.) Destroyers got totally nerfed though the ability to combine Heavies with Regulars is a plus.


The point I was making was that Destroyers, Monoliths, warriors, and Lords were amazing and GW didn't need to sell more models of them so they Nerfed them. The few Tau players left have plenty of Hammerheads, Stealth suits, Firewarriors, Kroot and Broadsides so I don't expect them to make any of those must have units in the new book. New unit entries will be amazing so that you buy the new models and ignore your old non-essential units. Broadsides may still be amazing though they will probably get a new kit and options that aren't present on your existing models, making your old ones obsolete and force you to purchase new kits. GW's business model positions players to purchase new kits with new codexes. I totally understand it and acutally support the model, you just have to expect your favorite units from the current book to get eclipsed to a certain degree by new models and units.

Actually I would say destroyers are quite powerful. But it really depends on the meta.

Against meqs, yes.
Against TEQs and vehicles...you'll need heavies.

Against hoards...nope, useless.

 NecronLord3 wrote:
The point I was making was that Destroyers, Monoliths, warriors, and Lords were amazing and GW didn't need to sell more models of them so they Nerfed them. The few Tau players left have plenty of Hammerheads, Stealth suits, Firewarriors, Kroot and Broadsides so I don't expect them to make any of those must have units in the new book. New unit entries will be amazing so that you buy the new models and ignore your old non-essential units. Broadsides may still be amazing though they will probably get a new kit and options that aren't present on your existing models, making your old ones obsolete and force you to purchase new kits. GW's business model positions players to purchase new kits with new codexes. I totally understand it and acutally support the model, you just have to expect your favorite units from the current book to get eclipsed to a certain degree by new models and units.

If they found a way so that Kroot are even worst than theyre right now, its not goin to change much, i doubt anyone actually gets them to the table since they can do little more than stay on a forest and shoot anything comes close enough, they cant charge anymore thanks to overwatch, so its not a needed unit anymore, Firewarriors are insanely better with the new rules for shooting, so unless the new FW kit brings a whole lot of heavy weaponry for them, i dont see the need to buy a new one, and i will not be a surprise that they dont get a new kit with new things, it will probably just become a Firewarrior/Pathfinder kit with the Rail Rifles that the Firewarrior unit cant take, and even if they make it possible, Pulse Rifle are easily convertible to Rail Rifles.

Stealth Suits are probable getting new options, like when they changed from XV15 to XV25, and i will not be bothered with this, since i will still use my XV15 for the model with Pulse Cannon, the XV25 for the Fusion, and the new one for the shiny weapon they bring to the team. Broadsides are hard to take down, since they pack up the best weapon on the Codex with a TL, HH are on the line to pack up a multikit with Rail/Ionhead and the Skyray with some luck.

Anyway, just as was already told a few post above, its hard to make a useless unit more useless(Stealth, Vespid, Kroot), if they bring a new Troop unit for Tau it will be good on everyway, since we have just 1 option thanks to the Assault nerf on 6th. While good ones are going to still be good becouse they are so into the Codex with their best options that i cant see a way to change it unless GW says now that the Railgun its a 9S2AP weapon : /

 NecronLord3 wrote:

 Bolognesus wrote:
Oh? Let's see what's become of mainstay units of the old Necron 'dex:
1) Monoliths: not something I'd ever take - but it's a matter of taste. I've seem plenty of them played and they do quite well still.
2) Immortals: (sure they have new models, but it's not as if the old ones are less useful; gauss immies are just as good as their tesla counterparts): these see play a LOT now. I know several folk who had 20 or even 30 of those under the old dex - they have 20-30 immies still seeing play now. Competitively.
3) Warriors: still quite good, still used quite a lot.
4) Wraiths (sure new models but the old ones are valid; whip coils aren't hard to DIY): good, competitive unit.
5) Scarabs: these guys got good, no doubt about that.
6) Spyders: used plenty. again, new model available but the old one works fine!
7) Pariahs: ...okay meh. warscythe lychguard can be fun but... meh. still, that's just one unit (and they convert to crypteks just fine with some bits from the lychguard/praetorian kit if you're so inclined!)
8) Destroyers: ...this is actually the only unit that got the 'fex treatment this codex. one. fethin. unit. just one.

all in all someone with an existing army bought a couple of transports and suddenly had a tournament-competitive army to play with.

How was that a bad update? Really. Hey, I got stung by the 'Nid upgrade so I know updates can be bad but Necrons are a good example of an update which was great for pretty much anyone playing a Necron army (aside from destroyerwing, and arguably even those aren't half as bad as, say, oh over half of the 'nid dex ) - as were for example GK and SW - in all those examples you *could* get a whole new army of shiney new toys - but the old toys worked just fine, just as well.
If codex: Tau goes along the lines of those, you'll get some new shinyness you could always just ignore, but you'll get decent rules for existing models as well

1.) Monoliths got totally nerfed. Lost Lance/Melta Immunity. Lost Deep Strike protection. Weapon Strength Reduced. All weapons minus door can now be destroyed.
2.)Both Immortals and Warriors got nerfed in their ability to res only on a 5+ now without an orb. Orb tax makes them way more expensive than original Immortals. Now with 1 less toughness, and rapid fire Gauss Blasters versus the far superior original Assault 2 S5 AP4 gun. Yes Tesla is awesome but really, the original Immortals were removed from the game and the models became 3rd edition warriors slightly better and 1 point cheaper.
3.)Warriors quite good? In what game are you playing. They are only fielded because they are a cheap troop choice and 6th gave them the ability to glance vehicles to death, but since hardly anyone takes decent vehicles anymore the point is moot. The codex gives us 2 troops options, and that is the only reason you see warriors as they are a cheap troop and unlock NightScythes. Warriors Res on a 5+ instead of 4+ and lost an Armour point. They got 5 points cheaper but the Res. Orb tax doesn't make up for the point decrease.
4.) Canoptek Wraiths are not event the same unit they were in 3rd. They kept the 3+ Inv. save and rending weapons but other than that they were totally remade and lost the ability to resurrect. They are now one of the best units in the entire game as they grew in size from max 3 models to 6 but that is all GW needed to change was increasing the unit size.
5.) Scarabs were awesome now they pretty much suck. They were faster in 3rd edition through 5th. 6th edition pretty much nerfed them and made flamers so much better that scarabs die quick and pointless deaths on the 40k battlefields these days. Plus no one takes the units that Scarabs are able to devour in seconds unless they happen to be transports loaded with flamer troops that again, kill them quickly.
6.) Spyders changed very little, but did get nerfed in their ability to be purchased in squads of 3 and placed separately and did not have to maintain coherency.
7.) Lychguard are not Pariahs. At best you can wysiwyg proxie them as Warscythe Lychguard. that is where their similarity ends. Pariahs had built in S5 AP4 assault 2 guns, Warscythes that ignored all saves(even Inv. saves), were fearless, caused Psykers to flee and could reduce their iniative to 1 in CC and they reduced all opposing models leadership to 7 within 12" of the unit. GW deleted these from the game because they sold poorly. But they only needed a little tweaking and a plastic kit and Pariahs would have been amazing if included in the new codex. They suffered from not being able to use the Veil or monolith's teleportation and couldn't ressurect. If that was fixed they would be an amazing unit far superior to Lychguard.
8.) Destroyers got totally nerfed though the ability to combine Heavies with Regulars is a plus.


The point I was making was that Destroyers, Monoliths, warriors, and Lords were amazing and GW didn't need to sell more models of them so they Nerfed them. The few Tau players left have plenty of Hammerheads, Stealth suits, Firewarriors, Kroot and Broadsides so I don't expect them to make any of those must have units in the new book. New unit entries will be amazing so that you buy the new models and ignore your old non-essential units. Broadsides may still be amazing though they will probably get a new kit and options that aren't present on your existing models, making your old ones obsolete and force you to purchase new kits. GW's business model positions players to purchase new kits with new codexes. I totally understand it and acutally support the model, you just have to expect your favorite units from the current book to get eclipsed to a certain degree by new models and units.

Poppycock.
warriors and immortals not only lost *some* stuff but they got a helluvalot cheaper, too. per point they're way more effective now: no, that resorb tax works out at less than 3 pts per model on a 20 model unit and that lord has more uses than just that res orb!), have you even *tried* using ghost arks (I don't, myself but I've seen it combined with large blob units to great effect) with your warriors? obviously not, from your statements.
I don't think I said pariahs=lychguard; I just said that's what they'd Counts-As for. If you'd have cared to read even halfway closely you'll see I mentioned them as a disappointment, with destroyers the only nerf.
Monoliths not good? I see you haven't played either with or against them, obviously. they work *just* fine. Differently, yes. Which is good, last codex they were just annoying. Not even that good, just a *(&*()^ to take out.
if you can't make scarabs work you suck at the psychological warfare aspect of the game; they present a disproportionate threat for the points they cost, and dealing with them takes time. No, if your opponent manages to get his flamer troops right up to them before they inflict some harm either he expended significant resources not doing anything more useful, or you're just incompetent
Wraiths might not resurrect but they're even better for the points than they were so again, tiny, tiny violin

Basically, the old codex **sucked** as for fun-to-play either with OR against.
...so yeah, playstyles changed. For the better, mostly, but yeah you have to adapt. once you do that though, **all** those units, except for destroyers and to a lesser degree your old pariahs, make for useful, effective and potentially tier 1 competitive choices. *maybe* not scarabs, but everything else? Hell yeah.

And about those warriors: I like tough troops better, as well so I play immortals too but I can see loads of uses for those warriors and as soon as my first 2K pts list is done, those 40 warriors I still have lying around which I painted as an, I believe, 12 or 13 year old kid when they first came out will hit the brake fluid right quick - I've seen them used to great effect; it just takes a *little* more tactical thinking than just "advance all, and fire at anything that looks squishy" which was all the previous codex *could* do.