.MIkes., look in the Wiki under pilot and remote pilot, and manned and evacuation device, if the links provided do not work. Neither remote pilots, like the crabbot, nor regular pilots generate an order, unless the TAG has an evacuation device. http://infinitythewiki.com/en/Pilot and http://infinitythewiki.com/en/Remote_Pilot Only the anaconda has both the Manned and Evacuation Device skills. The pilot is no specialist though.
I've heard no concrete rumors about phasing out vanilla. I have heard that CB plans to have each unit in a sectorial. CB is unlikely to phase out vanilla. It would impact sales, and in a bad way.
Micky wrote: Its speculation/rumour/unofficial that seems to mostly be an attitude/suspicion among the player base that was kinda sparked by how enormous vanilla armies have become.
personally I don;t think its going away any time soon (given we're at the point where some profiles are specifically labelled as being sectorial-only), but I guess it could potentially be an ITS option.
CB very much seems to like to test this stuff in ITS first. I'd expect it to be an option like limited insertion first, so we all have a good year of losing our minds.
Personally, I'd not mind going sectoral only, but if they do, I'd hope you could take 2 lists from different sectorals under the same faction.
Kan, add those to your thread in the CB sub-forum, the thread with other image dumps. If you don't mind. It is a useful reference. And we should use the sub-forum a bit.
We should see the rest of those previews next Saturday. Koni has mentioned that the Studio Update videos, like that which CB released right after the GenCon seminar, will be an ongoing thing.
Goddamn! Those are some sexy renders. The Hollow Men look amazing, and that Rasyat? I need it. I just recently painted the old one, too. But that new design looks too awesome to pass up. I even like the new Aleph stuff, and I don't normally like their designs.
Speaking of Aleph, anyone notice that yellow seems to be creeping into their color scheme with these latest reveals? I find that odd, but I like the look it creates on that remote. Almost makes it look like some kind of racing machine with those colors.
Barzam wrote: Goddamn! Those are some sexy renders. The Hollow Men look amazing, and that Rasyat? I need it. I just recently painted the old one, too. But that new design looks too awesome to pass up. I even like the new Aleph stuff, and I don't normally like their designs.
Speaking of Aleph, anyone notice that yellow seems to be creeping into their color scheme with these latest reveals? I find that odd, but I like the look it creates on that remote. Almost makes it look like some kind of racing machine with those colors.
I love the white, purple and yellow scheme on the new Aleph dossiers.
Varuna (I really hope they'll release some basic infantry) and Aleph look like something I'll be on the lookout. I hope we'll get marksman rifle on PanO unit.
Knight wrote: Varuna (I really hope they'll release some basic infantry) and Aleph look like something I'll be on the lookout. I hope we'll get marksman rifle on PanO unit.
Varuna has always had Fusiliers tagged as their 'basic infantry'. It's not like NCA which had Auxilia in that role, yet somehow Fusiliers get the real limelight.
When is aleph due for the new release?
Coldfront is September/October for a release. The renders/dossiers I posted are from the "Beyond Coldfront" pack that is coming later this year(probably November/December).
The Asura Hacker with Multi-Rifle is October(releasing in November).
I was thinking about Kamau. Provided their AVA is going to be at 5. The single combi rifle in the starter sets up for a rather needles work of acquiring another one.
Knight wrote: I was thinking about Kamau. Provided their AVA is going to be at 5. The single combi rifle in the starter sets up for a rather needles work of acquiring another one.
I guess I'll have to get in touch with Shae.
I've heard AVA: Total on Kamau.
We'll see in November though. I'm more concerned about the Kamau HMG that is only in the Beyond Icestorm starter set.
CB is unlikely to phase out vanilla. It would impact sales, and in a bad way.
The reason I brought this up is...
1. Its easy to imagine at this point that balancing sectorials with vanilla lists is very difficult. Additionally, introducing new units into sectorials that don't heavily overlap existing faction units has always been difficult. We're already seeing some "sectorial only" stuff , but its very easy to imagine that eliminating vanilla as an option altogether (or limiting it as a playtype, like Limited Insertion) might ease a lot of possible design problems.
2. Carlos has mentioned at least twice that something will be happening soon that is even more controversial than the Yujing/JSA split. Its hard to imagine something that would blow up the player base even more than eliminating vanilla as an option. Can you imagine? At the same time, it seems like exactly the kind of thing CB might do.
This is just speculation, but the idea popped into my head the other day after I remembered discussion about "every army is a sectrial army" and how the newer starters are all focused on a single sectorial. Its easy to see how the pieces could all fit into place.
I know that I'd miss being able to play vanilla CA (since having a ton of mixed units is really the CA theme), but for most of the other armies "sectorial only" does seem more thematic, doesn't it?
With all that SWC for the Varuna starter, I wonder if they are actually gonna test out alternate arms. That would lead people to buy more starters and require less skus to stock.
BrotherGecko wrote: With all that SWC for the Varuna starter, I wonder if they are actually gonna test out alternate arms. That would lead people to buy more starters and require less skus to stock.
Doubtful.
Spoiler:
Shock Army of Acontecimento ──────────────────────────────────────────────────
Indeed, thought for Morats, killing just enouph to press the point to the enemy that surrendering is a really good idea and ensuring there is still enemy left to surrender is high level diplomacy...
Dysartes wrote: As someone from outside Infinity looking in, what exactly is meant to be diplomatic about that Rasyat?
Here's the relevant fluff:
Contact with the Combined Civilization forced some changes in the Morat Supremacy. Suddenly, it was required to have a diplomatic service, something absolutely unnecessary for the Morat before, with all foreign contact handled by the Aggression Forces. The old soldiers complained bitterly, believing diplomats were for weak and inferior races. With the creation of a diplomatic division, it was perceived the Supremacy was softening, becoming a bunch of crying cubs like the races which it had conquered, its prestige tarnished. To avoid this, the Rasyatnat Diplomatic Division was created as a new regiment of the Morat Aggression Force. This regiment, despite its youth, would be considered an elite force. Only the most dangerous, tough, vicious and xenophobic Surats could be diplomats and join the Rasyatnat. Their job was deemed to be an incursion into the heart of enemy territories to know and test their weakness through sudden attacks. Since the creation of the Diplomatic Division, the training of its members insists on aggressiveness and generation of extreme violence during any action. The Division swiftly acquired so much prestige that soon all regiments, even the most venerable ones, were competing in Sotarak to have representatives join the Supremacy’s aggressive diplomatic service. The Rasyatnat is the purest Morat philosophy applied directly: “The biggest gun always wins in any negotiation”, with diplomacy supplied in high impact bursts.
Loving the new bots!
Been waiting for these to get resculpted ever since they mentioned they weren't happy with them a year or two ago.
I find the current ones to be really ugly..
While there is a distinct CA flavour to them, they're different enough for me to be happy. I'm struggling to think what they remind me of, slightly insect-like, but I'm not sure which, and my brain keeps switching between recognising a face on the front of the abdomen, and a face on the front of the chin-gun.
I'm not really digging them. I think i preferred the sleeker old design. These just seem to chunky for Aleph, and the under slung guns seem to bulky to easily work in that position.
I really like the Rasyat. The pose echos the excellent pose of the original Combi version without being exactly the same, which is cool.
One of the things I always liked about that Rasyat model was that it looked like it was using it's big jetpack as a propulsion device to rush into combat instead of an AD device. There's no rule in the game that really represents that, but it would be cool to see the Rasyat with some kind of "boost" skill that allows for bursts of movement.
A few new IA units were shown. Looked like a light power armor unit built for speed and a heavy duty power armor (S5) built for assault.
Biggest thing I think was the new Shas merc that can be used in any vanilla army but can also be taken in SEF and NCA. SEF is expected but NCA seems like a nod to what is going to happen in 2019.
Apparently Interplanetario is going on right now and really blurry pictures are being thrown around on the internet. Expect better quality official images to be released soon.
A 15mm wargame and a space battle game were not confirmed, but they were listed under ideas Corvus Belli is exploring. Note that Aristeia was also listed as merely an idea before it came to full realization.
I forgot the 2nd biggest news was a new Kurgat with autocannon. Pose is similar to the suryat ML model. So if you take the current BSG kurgat and give it the autocannon you will have two awesome minis.
The Mowang is a big dude with big guns. Could be interesting (the art implies some level of CH, possibly Mimetism, but maybe higher), but IA isn't hurting for heavy hitters. Images are too blurry for me to glean much else from it. But it will obviously be our big, punchy S5 HI. Hopefully it is good (but doesn't obviate the rest of our punchy HI).
I'm waaaaaaaaay more interested in the Daoying. Those legs imply augmentation to its speed (same general artificial leg structure as the Hollow Men) and the name (Mirror Image/Reverse Image/Inverted Image... something along those lines) implies some kind of funky defensive ability (if I had to guess it is Holo2, but I'm hoping it will be something funky like Impersonation). It is really hard to tell if it is HI or not, though. The legs are obviously mechanical, but the upper torso looks like an LI or SK body. I'm kind of hoping it is something lighter since IA is starting to look a bit top heavy and needs some infusion of non-hackable troops in there with a cheaper price tag.
Either way, a lot of the new IA reveals have implied mobility rules, making me think that that may be their "thing". I certainly wouldn't mind an army with a lot of quick-moving and maneuverable hard-hitting troops. So far they have access to AD, likely some forward deployment, and at least two troops that look like they have Climbing Plus as well as a new one that is either rocking at least 6-2 movement and possibly Super Jump. If they have the low-end point support to allow them to actually field good mixes of this stuff then I am expecting to be in love with the IA. But there are still a lot of if's in that, since a list that is only high-end choices without an efficient low-end to support it won't get far.
I forgot the 2nd biggest news was a new Kurgat with autocannon. Pose is similar to the suryat ML model. So if you take the current BSG kurgat and give it the autocannon you will have two awesome minis.
Was there any mention of changes to the Autocannon profile? Because as nice as the model looks I feel like it will just join the existing model on the shelf and never see the table. It obviously didn't get Sapper, which is really too bad. I feel like MAF players have been asking for that since the unit came out in HS.
Also, if you took the Autocannon and put it on the BS Kurgat it would have an autocannon in one hand and a BS in the other. You could try to also swap their right arms, but the BS Kurgat's right arm is connected to his leg, so that might be really difficult. And I'm not sure if the arm swap would look good anyway., since the Kurgat would basically be tilting his head back to look directly into the side of his Autocannon while he makes a weird punching motion with his other arm.
I forgot the 2nd biggest news was a new Kurgat with autocannon. Pose is similar to the suryat ML model. So if you take the current BSG kurgat and give it the autocannon you will have two awesome minis.
Was there any mention of changes to the Autocannon profile? Because as nice as the model looks I feel like it will just join the existing model on the shelf and never see the table. It obviously didn't get Sapper, which is really too bad. I feel like MAF players have been asking for that since the unit came out in HS.
No idea as my Spanish is no where near good enough and his Spanglish is hard to hear in a medium quality stream. I hope it gets to join the Haris at the very least. Fingers crossed for a raicho revamp.
I forgot the 2nd biggest news was a new Kurgat with autocannon. Pose is similar to the suryat ML model. So if you take the current BSG kurgat and give it the autocannon you will have two awesome minis.
Was there any mention of changes to the Autocannon profile? Because as nice as the model looks I feel like it will just join the existing model on the shelf and never see the table. It obviously didn't get Sapper, which is really too bad. I feel like MAF players have been asking for that since the unit came out in HS.
No idea as my Spanish is no where near good enough and his Spanglish is hard to hear in a medium quality stream. I hope it gets to join the Haris at the very least. Fingers crossed for a raicho revamp.
I forgot the 2nd biggest news was a new Kurgat with autocannon. Pose is similar to the suryat ML model. So if you take the current BSG kurgat and give it the autocannon you will have two awesome minis.
Was there any mention of changes to the Autocannon profile? Because as nice as the model looks I feel like it will just join the existing model on the shelf and never see the table. It obviously didn't get Sapper, which is really too bad. I feel like MAF players have been asking for that since the unit came out in HS.
No idea as my Spanish is no where near good enough and his Spanglish is hard to hear in a medium quality stream. I hope it gets to join the Haris at the very least. Fingers crossed for a raicho revamp.
I doubt it will be able to. Honestly, you're lucky to get a damn resculpt--the Tankhunter Autocannon isn't getting one, despite being the only human piece with it.
I doubt they'll ever let an Autocannon join anything bigger than a Duo. There are some weapons they're clearly not comfortable giving link bonuses too.
I doubt it will be able to. Honestly, you're lucky to get a damn resculpt--the Tankhunter Autocannon isn't getting one, despite being the only human piece with it.
I assume the Tankhunter will get one eventually. The 3D Tankhunter models already exist. I think its just a matter of time. I suspect the only reason they haven't done it yet is that they want to focus on other TAK units and the old model is still popular.
I doubt they'll ever let an Autocannon join anything bigger than a Duo. There are some weapons they're clearly not comfortable giving link bonuses too.
I know thats the common argument, but would it actually be a problem? I mean, B3 AP/EXP would be powerful, but it would be on a fragile line infantry unit that would cost 69/2 swc. The Feurbach is available to Thorakite as a 4 model line with Thrasymedes, 2 SMG Thoras and a Feurbach for about the same cost. The weapon isn't as powerful of course, but its on a unit with higher BS and ARM, an arguably more versatile selection of weapons (SMG, Nanopulsar, LRL, and ODD specialist and an extra model. The new Securitate can take a 3 model link with a Feurbach and 2 Combi rifles for just 48/1, and they also have better BS. I know the Autocannon is a more powerful gun, but I don't feel like it would be overpowered in a very fragile and expensive Kurgat Haris.
Some dice calculator numbers:
Thorakite fuerbach link (+3 range) vs Fusilier (-3 range): 82% 1 wound, 72% 2 wounds, 8% both miss, 6% takes 1 wound
Kurgat Autocannon link (+3 range) vs Fusilier (-3 range): 86% 1 wound, 81% 2 wounds, 6% both miss, 7% takes 1 wound
Thorakite fuerbach link (+3 range) vs Orc (-3 range): 81% 1 wound, 64% 2 wounds, 40% 3 wounds, 11% both miss, 8% takes 1 wound
Kurgat Autocannon link (+3 range) vs Orc (-3 range): 81% 1 wound, 75% 2 wounds, 60% 3 wounds, 9% both miss, 10% takes 1 wound
So thats interesting, and not quite what I was expecting. The weapons have about the same effectiveness at inflicting a single wound. The Kurgats are better at inflicting 2 or more wounds, but also more likely to take wounds. I think its important to remember that for about the same cost (and less SWC the Thorakite get an extra model. For less points than either the Nomads can get a full 5 model securitate team with a Feurbach that performs much better than either the Kurgats or Thorakite.
I don't know if any of this indicates that the Kurgat Autocannon should or shouldn't be able to link. Maybe being just a little bit more effective than the linked Feurbach is the cut off point as far as CB is concerned? But something needs to be changed, otherwise the model is going to stay onthe shelf forever.
Edit: It looks like the Tank Hunter Autocannon is MUCH more effective than a full link of Kurgats.
So the Tank Hunter is WAY more likely to inflict 1 or 2 wounds, a little more likely to inflict 3, and slightly less likely to inflict 3 or 5, but WAY less likely to take wounds in return (less than half as likely). So if a single Tankhunter for 34/1.5 can be way more effective than 3 Kurgats for 69/2 I don't see what the problem is.
September release list, all prices are USD MSRP: Hollow Men(!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!) Set of 4 for $42.99 ALEPH Rebots set of 2 for $33.49 Kazak Spetsnaz--says a boxed set of 3 for $30.99 Cube Jager $13.49 Joan Mobility Armor 2.0 w/ Spitfire $17.99 Rasyat Diplomatic Division $18.99
There's a listing for what might be a new Classified Objectives Deck for $15.49--not sure if we'd heard anything about a new one?
What CB is nervous to add to their game or won't add to their game looks to be barely more than a blind guess in light of what has come this year. Or old CBisms about stuff has been laid to rest by CB.
So really I see nothing that informs me that CB wouldn't make a kurgat autocannon haris. In fact I'd like to see the SWC cost for kurgat haris to disappear.
BrotherGecko wrote: What CB is nervous to add to their game or won't add to their game looks to be barely more than a blind guess in light of what has come this year. Or old CBisms about stuff has been laid to rest by CB.
So really I see nothing that informs me that CB wouldn't make a kurgat autocannon haris. In fact I'd like to see the SWC cost for kurgat haris to disappear.
Haris will always cost SWC, unless they change things significantly in November.
Kanluwen wrote: September release list, all prices are USD MSRP:
Hollow Men(!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!) Set of 4 for $42.99
ALEPH Rebots set of 2 for $33.49
Kazak Spetsnaz--says a boxed set of 3 for $30.99
Cube Jager $13.49
Joan Mobility Armor 2.0 w/ Spitfire $17.99
Rasyat Diplomatic Division $18.99
There's a listing for what might be a new Classified Objectives Deck for $15.49--not sure if we'd heard anything about a new one?
BrotherGecko wrote: What CB is nervous to add to their game or won't add to their game looks to be barely more than a blind guess in light of what has come this year. Or old CBisms about stuff has been laid to rest by CB.
So really I see nothing that informs me that CB wouldn't make a kurgat autocannon haris. In fact I'd like to see the SWC cost for kurgat haris to disappear.
Haris will always cost SWC, unless they change things significantly in November.
Not true. Some units do not pay SWC. Some units pay no additional SWC beyond the weapon they are carrying that costs SWC. Some units do pay a SWC of 0.5. And then there is Morats, who outside of Yaogats who pay no additional SWC and Kornak who pays no SWC, pay 1 SWC for Haris.
So at the very least I would like it dropped down to 0.5 SWC then.
BrotherGecko wrote: What CB is nervous to add to their game or won't add to their game looks to be barely more than a blind guess in light of what has come this year. Or old CBisms about stuff has been laid to rest by CB.
So really I see nothing that informs me that CB wouldn't make a kurgat autocannon haris. In fact I'd like to see the SWC cost for kurgat haris to disappear.
Haris will always cost SWC, unless they change things significantly in November.
Not true. Some units do not pay SWC. Some units pay no additional SWC beyond the weapon they are carrying that costs SWC. Some units do pay a SWC of 0.5. And then there is Morats, who outside of Yaogats who pay no additional SWC and Kornak who pays no SWC, pay 1 SWC for Haris.
So at the very least I would like it dropped down to 0.5 SWC then.
More units pay SWC for Haris than don't. Bagh-Mari and ORCs cost .5 SWC, Wildcats cost .5 SWC, Marauders cost a whopping 1 SWC for a Rifle+HFT, so on and so forth.
Damn son. Then we know for sure now that " Haris always pays SWC" is incorrect. Which was my point. Which means Kurgats could still be 0 SWC for Haris. Or inbuilt if the autocannon had Haris (makes sense to me, the support weapon needs support). Or get knocked down to 0.5 SWC. Or stay trash and continue to be 1 SWC.
BrotherGecko wrote: Damn son. Then we know for sure now that " Haris always pays SWC" is incorrect. Which was my point. Which means Kurgats could still be 0 SWC for Haris. Or inbuilt if the autocannon had Haris (makes sense to me, the support weapon needs support). Or get knocked down to 0.5 SWC. Or stay trash and continue to be 1 SWC.
I'm still standing by my statement--there's way more things paying for it than there are not.
Also, they seem to have been planning to do something like the Spetsnaz for the Kurgat. Support Group might see some more rules down the road--Operative Group seems to get Haris instead.
Also, they seem to have been planning to do something like the Spetsnaz for the Kurgat. Support Group might see some more rules down the road--Operative Group seems to get Haris instead.
Honestly, Minelayer or Sapper (or both) is about all I can see them doing in a minor revamp. Maybe a LSG or Assault Pistol. (tho neither of those are on the new dossier)
Also, they seem to have been planning to do something like the Spetsnaz for the Kurgat. Support Group might see some more rules down the road--Operative Group seems to get Haris instead.
Honestly, Minelayer or Sapper (or both) is about all I can see them doing in a minor revamp. Maybe a LSG or Assault Pistol. (tho neither of those are on the new dossier)
Also, they seem to have been planning to do something like the Spetsnaz for the Kurgat. Support Group might see some more rules down the road--Operative Group seems to get Haris instead.
Honestly, Minelayer or Sapper (or both) is about all I can see them doing in a minor revamp. Maybe a LSG or Assault Pistol. (tho neither of those are on the new dossier)
I could see Full Auto TBH.
Full Auto would solve the Kurgat Autocannon issue without doing a link, although if the reason they didn't want to do the link is the +1 burst I'm not sure why Full Auto is more acceptable. Anyway, I'd be happy to see Full Auto on the profile, even if it meant a points hike. At 33 points (a 5 point increase) it would be about as effective as the Tank Hunter at shooting, while trading Camo and better ARM for Engineering. Seems fair.
Trading camo and ARM for engineering I skeptical of it being a good trade. Engineer doesn't help a kurgat autocannon.
If no Haris, then I think Sapper and minelayer for no engineer. Sapper is a combat engineering skill so I think it would at the very least keep with fluff. Then with minelayer it could be a fairly solid defensive position.
BrotherGecko wrote: Trading camo and ARM for engineering I skeptical of it being a good trade. Engineer doesn't help a kurgat autocannon.
If no Haris, then I think Sapper and minelayer for no engineer. Sapper is a combat engineering skill so I think it would at the very least keep with fluff. Then with minelayer it could be a fairly solid defensive position.
I can't see them losing Engineer. It's part of the basic profile.
So separate it out. Operative Group gets engineer and Support Group gets Sapper. Because any additional rule outside of Haris will make the kurgat with autocannon more points and more points just makes the kurgat autocannon what it is now, a novelty model.
BrotherGecko wrote: So separate it out. Operative Group gets engineer and Support Group gets Sapper. Because any additional rule outside of Haris will make the kurgat with autocannon more points and more points just makes the kurgat autocannon what it is now, a novelty model.
Honestly, it seems like you want the Kurgat to be something other than they are.
The Support Group model is a 'firebase' piece. It still has Engineer, which inflates its points cost slightly but gives it a thing it can do as part of its toolkit--but it's still a 28 point model in comparison to the Tankhunter(the only other model featuring a Portable Autocannon in the whole game) which is 34pts thanks to its Camo.
I can't see them losing Engineer. It's part of the basic profile.
Repeater used to be part of the basic profile of the Securitate. I could see them doing something similar to what happened there, where it was pulled out of the basic profile and added as an optional one.
I can't see them losing Engineer. It's part of the basic profile.
Repeater used to be part of the basic profile of the Securitate. I could see them doing something similar to what happened there, where it was pulled out of the basic profile and added as an optional one.
Difference being that Kurgat aren't likely becoming the linkable and AVA Total Line Infantry for a Sectorial.
Securitate lost their Repeaters and Sixth Sense and Light Shotguns. Their profile was held up as one of the biggest examples of bloat for quite some time and anyone who didn't expect significant changes was deluding themselves.
By comparison, Kurgat are AVA3 with 4 profiles. Two of their profiles(the Mark 12s) are the exact same barring the addition of Haris. Because right now, it feels like the reasoning behind wanting the Autocannon to be Operative Group is simply so that you can make the Haris a full one rather than an undergunned one.
Ronin_eX wrote: The Mowang is a big dude with big guns. Could be interesting (the art implies some level of CH, possibly Mimetism, but maybe higher), but IA isn't hurting for heavy hitters. Images are too blurry for me to glean much else from it. But it will obviously be our big, punchy S5 HI. Hopefully it is good (but doesn't obviate the rest of our punchy HI).
I'm waaaaaaaaay more interested in the Daoying. Those legs imply augmentation to its speed (same general artificial leg structure as the Hollow Men) and the name (Mirror Image/Reverse Image/Inverted Image... something along those lines) implies some kind of funky defensive ability (if I had to guess it is Holo2, but I'm hoping it will be something funky like Impersonation). It is really hard to tell if it is HI or not, though. The legs are obviously mechanical, but the upper torso looks like an LI or SK body. I'm kind of hoping it is something lighter since IA is starting to look a bit top heavy and needs some infusion of non-hackable troops in there with a cheaper price tag.
Either way, a lot of the new IA reveals have implied mobility rules, making me think that that may be their "thing". I certainly wouldn't mind an army with a lot of quick-moving and maneuverable hard-hitting troops. So far they have access to AD, likely some forward deployment, and at least two troops that look like they have Climbing Plus as well as a new one that is either rocking at least 6-2 movement and possibly Super Jump. If they have the low-end point support to allow them to actually field good mixes of this stuff then I am expecting to be in love with the IA. But there are still a lot of if's in that, since a list that is only high-end choices without an efficient low-end to support it won't get far.
If you’re all done gushing over one model coming for MAF ...
Can we get more specifics on what was presented for IA?
Were these new dossiers? I assume no renders/profiles dropped.
I’m kinda surprised IA will add so many new units. Yu Jing already has a bunch of stuff with no sectorial home outside of ISS.
These were a mix of new and previously seen dossiers. I haven't seen high quality photos so haven't posted them.
Also, you're kind of reaching saying that they "have a bunch of stuff with no sectorial home". We know there's two Sectorials that are in the pipeline for Yu Jing. Their Svalarheim sectorial("Army of the Banner" IIRC) is slated to bring the Guilang, Daofei, Zhanshi, Tiger Soldiers and Shaolin Monks at least into a Sectorial.
Invincible Army on the otherhand is basically seeming to be a 'fresh start'. Originally we were told Zhanshi would be in there--but it might very well be the case they're not. We're also seeing what might be some 'support' troops to replace the standard Engineer/Doctor choices.
A bunch of colour coded "Banner" armies appeared in Uprising. the Green Banner Army was their army on Paradiso, and on another planet they had the Orange Banner Army.
Think we originally heard "White Banner Army" was the Svarl one?
If you’re all done gushing over one model coming for MAF ...
Can we get more specifics on what was presented for IA?
Were these new dossiers? I assume no renders/profiles dropped.
I’m kinda surprised IA will add so many new units. Yu Jing already has a bunch of stuff with no sectorial home outside of ISS.
There were a couple of new dossiers shown alongside the ones from GenCon, but the photos are all super low-res and hard to make out more than basic shapes on.
No renders or profiles (although apparently some folks managed to glean some extra details, but either they're keeping exact things close to their chest or CB is right now).
As for the number of new units as opposed to using old ones, that is down to two factors. First, they're actually utilizing (as far as we can tell) a fair few existing profiles. The Guija, Hac Tao, Zhanshi (ugh), and Tiger Soldier all look to be in the lineup. This will leave the Guilang, Daofei, and Shaolin as our only orphaned profiles at that point (and White Banner has basically claimed those, as well as some StateEmpire overlap with IA).
The bigger thing to keep in mind is that CB's whole excuse for removing JSA was to "make room". Now, as an army with one sectorial when some are now on #4, this would only even partially make sense if the IA replaced the stuff they lost with the JSA departing. The JSA contained over a dozen unique profiles (characters included), gutting vanilla by 1/3rd. If they are gone to make room for our second sectorial, then that second sectorial has some big shoes to fill with regards to unique profiles, because right now, the only faction with less units than Yu Jing is the Tohaa.
Kanluwen wrote:These were a mix of new and previously seen dossiers. I haven't seen high quality photos so haven't posted them.
Also, you're kind of reaching saying that they "have a bunch of stuff with no sectorial home". We know there's two Sectorials that are in the pipeline for Yu Jing. Their Svalarheim sectorial("Army of the Banner" IIRC) is slated to bring the Guilang, Daofei, Zhanshi, Tiger Soldiers and Shaolin Monks at least into a Sectorial.
Invincible Army on the otherhand is basically seeming to be a 'fresh start'. Originally we were told Zhanshi would be in there--but it might very well be the case they're not. We're also seeing what might be some 'support' troops to replace the standard Engineer/Doctor choices.
Basically this. IA sort of needs to be, well, what they are in Yu Jing's background; that is, a reboot and a facelift for the faction as a whole. Rumblings from some folks that talked to them a bit has also suggested that we haven't seen all the IA units yet either, so while I'm still averse to getting excited, that at least hopefully means the IA will be a proper replacement for what we lost. But we'll have to wait and see.
Micky wrote:A bunch of colour coded "Banner" armies appeared in Uprising. the Green Banner Army was their army on Paradiso, and on another planet they had the Orange Banner Army.
Think we originally heard "White Banner Army" was the Svarl one?
Yeah, the Banner Armies are basically the forces that the IA are being poised to replace. They're the main-line Yu Jing regional StateEmpire armies and the reason Zhanshi are called what they are called (Troops of the Banner). Huangdi (the contintent Yu Jing control on Sval) is the home of the White Banner, and otherse are situated about the sphere. My guess is that most banner armies are fairly standard and that at most we'll only ever see a couple of them become sectorials (with White Banner being first as it is likely the one with the most unique feel). I am kind of also hoping that with Japan out of the way, we finally start seeing some actual backing behind the whole "Yu Jing is super multi-cultural!" bit of background that has never materialized. That is, I want my Korean and Thai sectorials damn it! And if the latter doesn't come with a unit whose EXPCCWs are its knees, I will be disappoint.
BrotherGecko wrote: Trading camo and ARM for engineering I skeptical of it being a good trade. Engineer doesn't help a kurgat autocannon.
If no Haris, then I think Sapper and minelayer for no engineer. Sapper is a combat engineering skill so I think it would at the very least keep with fluff. Then with minelayer it could be a fairly solid defensive position.
Well, I didn't mean good for the Kurgat so much as "more than fair". Camo and +2 ARM are way more valuable than Engineering and Mines, so I assume the change I proposed is balanced on the side of overcosted.
Unfortunately we already know the unit won't get Sapper (we've seen the model). I think Minelayer would be an excellent skill for Kurgats in general, but it does nothing to help the autocannon profile become worthwhile.
Because right now, it feels like the reasoning behind wanting the Autocannon to be Operative Group is simply so that you can make the Haris a full one rather than an undergunned one.
I feel like thats been the central and stated point of the argument from the beginning. The Kurgat Autocannon profile is awful. It either needs to be able to join the link or receive some kind of buff. There's literally no other reason to want it to be part of the operative group. Really, the only reason the Operative and Support groups even exist is to keep the Autocannon profile out of the Haris.
Thanks! The Kurgat looks nice. The old autocannon mini is still one of my favourites and has held up well imo, though the scale discrepancy is a bit noticeable. I like that they basically just updated the existing one.
Mysterio wrote: Kurgat w/ bro-fist mode is a weird pose, but should be a solid model in the end.
Because of how the hand is shaped I am very confident that a little bit of bending on both arms and a small amount of GS you can get the model to two hand fire that cannon. I still think it would also be better off putting the cannon arms on the awkwardly kneeling kurgat and then the sword/gun arms on the standing kurgat.
Mysterio wrote: Kurgat w/ bro-fist mode is a weird pose, but should be a solid model in the end.
Because of how the hand is shaped I am very confident that a little bit of bending on both arms and a small amount of GS you can get the model to two hand fire that cannon. I still think it would also be better off putting the cannon arms on the awkwardly kneeling kurgat and then the sword/gun arms on the standing kurgat.
I'll be curious to see if anyone can pull it off.
I really don't like the fist on this one. What is he supposed to be doing? I really prefer the classic model's firing pose. The armor and mask looks pretty nice though. I wish he kept more of the poches and the pack from the old model though.
Uhm, no. It is a sign of laziness. The sculptor is not doing his job and sculpting a detailed mini. He is 'hiding' everything under the TP. CB tends to overuse things because they looked good once, the first time. See: Rage Fist and Tactical Debris. We're seeing more than a few hooded short jackets too.
Red Harvest wrote: Uhm, no. It is a sign of laziness. The sculptor is not doing his job and sculpting a detailed mini. He is 'hiding' everything under the TP. CB tends to overuse things because they looked good once, the first time. See: Rage Fist and Tactical Debris. We're seeing more than a few hooded short jackets too.
Ragefist and tactical debris is a bit of a different quandry. It was because they didn't want to be bothered making more unique poses or messing around too much with the detailing.
Not every tactical poncho can be as cool as the Ayyar's.
Aida Swanson is interesting. A Shasvastii that is helping humans? The only sectorials able to take her are Shasvastii, which is obvious, and Neoterra. What? I'm down for more Shasvastii human infiltrators, I just wish she didn't look so much like a Tohaa instead of a human.
Well she is the smuggler who infiltrated Shasvastii on Nomad ships and started the Wotan conflict, she is the one who initiated the Treason crisis and she is the one who was seen on Dawn before the Kurage Crisis happened, so helping humans may be a stretch.
For sure this is a character that was on the Human sphere as mention for a long time.
Red Harvest wrote: Uhm, no. It is a sign of laziness. The sculptor is not doing his job and sculpting a detailed mini. He is 'hiding' everything under the TP. CB tends to overuse things because they looked good once, the first time. See: Rage Fist and Tactical Debris. We're seeing more than a few hooded short jackets too.
Its definitely not laziness. Sculpting good looking flowing cloth isn't an easy thing to do. We can also see that the torso of the model has been at least partially rendered, so this isn't a matter of the sculptor just looking for a shortcut. Also, as far as I know the sculptors don't get to leave out major details from the dossier,like a poncho that covers the model's entire torso.
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Barzam wrote: I just wish she didn't look so much like a Tohaa instead of a human.
But she doesn't look like a Tohaa at all. I mean, except for the similar skin color theres no resemblance, is there? She doesn't have any of the Tohaa physiology at all. She looks way more like a posthuman, although I'm guessing thats a coincidence too. I think her skin tone is mean to indicate that she's not quite human, but if you paint her with a more typical skin tone she'll look human.
Oh great. I'm surrounded by a bunch of poncho-philes.
Perverts.
Jake, that sort of detail, the flowing fabric, is easier to do. And it does mean the sculptor can spend less time on the mini. However, you're correct in that the sculptor cannot ignore major elements of the concept art. So I'll blame the people who conceived of the tactical poncho. It seems just one step short of an actual cape.
It also means the mini is easier and faster to paint. It does leave room for some interesting freehand if the painter is so inclined.
Any thoughts on that thing on Jeanne D'Arc V.2's head? Anyone?
I'm not minded to buy the Joan 2.0 at all. The Giraldez book LE has stood me well for some time and as there is no gun present on the mini she can represent both profiles, if I'm ever tempted to use 2.0, which so far I haven't.
As for the NCA's new recruit, I'm not bothered about the poncho (low tech mimetism I guess) but depending on the way the model fits together I might give her a stolen Bolt helmet and perhaps even a complete leg swap to give her a little more 'PanO-ness; as at the moment she seems to have turned up in an Ariadna kit.
Jake, that sort of detail, the flowing fabric, is easier to do. And it does mean the sculptor can spend less time on the mini. However, you're correct in that the sculptor cannot ignore major elements of the concept art. So I'll blame the people who conceived of the tactical poncho.
I'm not sure why you think that kind of flowing fabric is easy to do. It isn't. Or at least, that hasn't been my experience. But also, like a lot of Infinity models these days this model uses some recycled assets (like the legs and torso), but also has some brand new custom assets created JUST for her (the head and poncho). Re-using assets actually is a time saving shortcut (although it doesn't indicate that, as you said, the sculptor is lazy). Creating new custom assets is not a short cut and is actually a lot of work. So no, despite what you think the sculptor wasn't just being lazy. This release probably required as much or more work than most standard releases.
CB has done some embarrassingly lazy releases over the last few years (the Spetsnaz HMG, the general release Devil Dog), but this isn't one of them.
My experience is that flowing fabric is easy, easier than more defined detail. My experience is with clay for modelling/sculpting in larger scales and green stuff sculpting for conversions, but never anything from scratch using GS. Given that we have differing experiences, of course we have draw different conclusions.
Also, please, don't take my comments too seriously. Most of them are meant tongue in cheek, or maybe to stir something up.
News: Someone posted all the Interplantary tables on their blog, here,http://www.lead-rising.com/2018/08/interplanetary-2018-table-dump.html Some interesting things going on on a few of them.
And no word about Acontecimento at Interplanetario. Hmph.
Red Harvest wrote: My experience is that flowing fabric is easy, easier than more defined detail. My experience is with clay for modelling/sculpting in larger scales and green stuff sculpting for conversions, but never anything from scratch using GS. Given that we have differing experiences, of course we have draw different conclusions.
Also, please, don't take my comments too seriously. Most of them are meant tongue in cheek, or maybe to stir something up.
News: Someone posted all the Interplantary tables on their blog, here,http://www.lead-rising.com/2018/08/interplanetary-2018-table-dump.html Some interesting things going on on a few of them.
And no word about Acontecimento at Interplanetario. Hmph.
All the infinity stuff is sculpted using CAD now. From my relatively limited experience with CAD, anything organic or flowing would definitely be harder to model. Defined detail would be fairly easy, especially as you could zoom in.
Beginning of September, I believe. Season 10: Xenotech. There is to be a new Classified Deck.
ImAGeek wrote: All the infinity stuff is sculpted using CAD now. From my relatively limited experience with CAD, anything organic or flowing would definitely be harder to model. Defined detail would be fairly easy, especially as you could zoom in.
I had not considered this. Now that you mention it, I do recall hearing that the sculptors hand sculpted the fur on the antipodes and dog warriors because it was so much trouble to get it to look right using the CAD.
Mini Q&A session taking pre-selected questions from social media and ad-hoc ones from the crowd. Hosts were Bostria, Gutier and Alberto
Written by Phlyk from the offical forums.
Does anyone know the intended role for the Mowang? The “roll bars” (don’t know what else to call them) make them look almost bigger than a Yan Huo, but with shorter-ranged weapons.
I’d like to get back to playing Infinity, but Corvus Belli seems determined to give reasons not to.
I'm glad I got to use the deck of classifieds for a month lol.
ITS 10 begins next Monday, September 3rd. I guess we'll see the new information packet by then. I do hope there is a pdf or something of the classified objectives too. I'll not be participating in any ITS tournaments, and see no need to buy a deck.
Mastiff wrote: Does anyone know the intended role for the Mowang? The “roll bars” (don’t know what else to call them) make them look almost bigger than a Yan Huo, but with shorter-ranged weapons.
I’d like to get back to playing Infinity, but Corvus Belli seems determined to give reasons not to.
Likely similar to the Dayokai Dengekitai but with less of a CC focus.
Sorry for the Facebook images, but it is what it is for now. The TAK list looks to have a preview of the new Traktor Mul type being utilized by the Spetsnaz. "Kuryer" is Russian for "Courier".
Arjuna is a Hindu demigod that was known as "the best archer in all the world".
We don't know how Netrods are going to work come November with the 'big update'.
wo.
Excuse me, that what?
There's supposed to be some big gamechanging update for all of the old Sectorials and a lot of profiles are supposed to potentially see overhauls as well.
It's also when the Vedic and TAK lists are supposed to officially go live.
We don't know how Netrods are going to work come November with the 'big update'.
wo.
Excuse me, that what?
There's supposed to be some big gamechanging update for all of the old Sectorials and a lot of profiles are supposed to potentially see overhauls as well.
It's also when the Vedic and TAK lists are supposed to officially go live.
Cool! Fingers crossed for more linkable Order Sergeants.
Cool! Fingers crossed for more linkable Order Sergeants.
You're talking about PanO. The Sectorial where the biggest compliment someone can give to their Sectorials is "It doesn't even feel like playing PanO!".
jake wrote: I guess the BS 14 Kurgat Autocannon is too much, but the BS 20 Orc Feurbach is cool (it is a very cool model though).
You're assuming that ORCs will be able to run Core Fireteams or that it won't be a unique profile that can't be linked.
I am, but it seems like a safe bet. Carlos have said that Orcs will be focused on in Varuna, and since they're already able to Haris in Neo Terra and ASA it seems likely they'll be able to do a full or Special Core line in Varuna. Its not impossible that the Feurbach could be a solo unlinkable piece, but I doubt it. We've already seen multiple Core Fireteams with the weapon. But who knows? Even if it is only available in a Haris it will still very much outperform the proprosed Kurgat Autocannon Haris.I suspect even as a solo unit without the extra Burst from the Haris it comes close to being as effective.
Kanluwen wrote: Just so we're clear, it's not been "Orcs will be focused on in Varuna" but rather that they're supposed to get Varuna specific loadouts.
Yes, thats what I was talking about when I said "Orcs will be focused on in Varuna". Getting sectorial specific profiles would be what I consider "being focused on".
We don't know how Netrods are going to work come November with the 'big update'.
wo.
Excuse me, that what?
There's supposed to be some big gamechanging update for all of the old Sectorials and a lot of profiles are supposed to potentially see overhauls as well.
It's also when the Vedic and TAK lists are supposed to officially go live.
Hope they address the sectorials they left out in the cold these last few years. CJC, NCA, Acontecimento could all use some love.
I mean more mixed fire teams, remotes options in fire teams, & options to link doctors/engineers.
For those who aren't following the RPG stuff(I wasn't, but someone posted this as it's relevant) Pavel McMannus is in this photo. He's the gentleman with the axe over his shoulder.
Vasilly is also in there with the Autocannon and so is Bran de Castro and Le Muet. Guy in the center with the green armor is O-12.
For those who aren't following the RPG stuff(I wasn't, but someone posted this as it's relevant) Pavel McMannus is in this photo. He's the gentleman with the axe over his shoulder.
Vasilly is also in there with the Autocannon and so is Bran de Castro and Le Muet. Guy in the center with the green armor is O-12.
I hope that means we’re getting a new Bran do Castro sculpt
For those who aren't following the RPG stuff(I wasn't, but someone posted this as it's relevant) Pavel McMannus is in this photo. He's the gentleman with the axe over his shoulder.
Vasilly is also in there with the Autocannon and so is Bran de Castro and Le Muet. Guy in the center with the green armor is O-12.
Well yeah I suppose, given it's an MI. But I was more thinking of that AD deploying troops now no longer need to use the landing template. They can be placed wherever their base fits (so long as it's not inside a building).
Finding places to land AD troops in high density terrain is a PITA. No more!
.Mikes. wrote: Well yeah I suppose, given it's an MI. But I was more thinking of that AD deploying troops now no longer need to use the landing template. They can be placed wherever their base fits (so long as it's not inside a building).
Finding places to land AD troops in high density terrain is a PITA. No more!
Oh. I hadn't seen that mentioned. Wow. thats a huge change. Jesus, there'll be Yuan Yuan, Tiger Soldiers, Fractaa and Hellcats everywhere.
That really makes Rasyats much easier to use too.Being able to land closer to the enemy is a huge deal for them. Well, for every AD unit. But not having to waste orders walking in form the board edge or risk missing the landing roll will be really nice for order tight Morat lists.
That's a really nice change. The drop zone was really restrictive to table layouts. We've always been a little loose on it, but its nice to see it go away.
MI FD1 is interesting. Intruders aren't going to complain.
.Mikes. wrote: Well yeah I suppose, given it's an MI. But I was more thinking of that AD deploying troops now no longer need to use the landing template. They can be placed wherever their base fits (so long as it's not inside a building).
Finding places to land AD troops in high density terrain is a PITA. No more!
Oh. I hadn't seen that mentioned. Wow. thats a huge change. Jesus, there'll be Yuan Yuan, Tiger Soldiers, Fractaa and Hellcats everywhere.
That really makes Rasyats much easier to use too.Being able to land closer to the enemy is a huge deal for them. Well, for every AD unit. But not having to waste orders walking in form the board edge or risk missing the landing roll will be really nice for order tight Morat lists.
If im not misinterpreting what you wrote, you still need to roll for the landing ant scatter as normal if you fail the roll. You just dont have to use the template to check were you can land.
I think this should be a permanent rule since it simplifies things in a good way. It makes tables easier to do since you dont have to think about were AD can land and cuts down on time having to find a good place to land.
At first glance i really dont like what they have done with the classifieds in some missions (Intelcom card). Like Biotechvore were if your lucky and draw the right symbol and your opponent i unlucky and draws cards with the "wrong" symbol they just gets cancelled by the intelcom.
And then there is just weird stuff like in Capture and Protect were you can use an Intelcom card to make classifieds with a certain symbol be worth 2vp instead of 1vp but you still cant go over 10vp. The first problem in this mission is that there is only 1 classified so in reality the Intelcom card does nothing but throws away you ability to complete a classified since you forfeit the use of the card as a classified to use it as an Intelcom card.
Second problem with stuff like this is it gives you a classified that is worth 2vp. So you only have to complete one card while you opponent has to complete two for the same effect because you were lucky with the card draw. (This is without knowing what the card with the symbol is)
And did CB really need to buff the 10 point MK5 post-human even more and into a nobrainer pick since its a MI?
I think this should be a permanent rule since it simplifies things in a good way.
They seem to be doing these beta rules pretty frequently now. It's not a "permanent" rule, but they did keep Fatality on TAGs and no Order denial vs single combat groups. I suspect these will join the pile unless they prove problematic somehow.
I think this should be a permanent rule since it simplifies things in a good way.
They seem to be doing these beta rules pretty frequently now. It's not a "permanent" rule, but they did keep Fatality on TAGs and no Order denial vs single combat groups. I suspect these will join the pile unless they prove problematic somehow.
ITS is becoming more and more a platform for Beta testing rule changes lately, for both good and bad reasons.
.Mikes. wrote: Well yeah I suppose, given it's an MI. But I was more thinking of that AD deploying troops now no longer need to use the landing template. They can be placed wherever their base fits (so long as it's not inside a building).
Finding places to land AD troops in high density terrain is a PITA. No more!
Oh. I hadn't seen that mentioned. Wow. thats a huge change. Jesus, there'll be Yuan Yuan, Tiger Soldiers, Fractaa and Hellcats everywhere.
That really makes Rasyats much easier to use too.Being able to land closer to the enemy is a huge deal for them. Well, for every AD unit. But not having to waste orders walking in form the board edge or risk missing the landing roll will be really nice for order tight Morat lists.
If im not misinterpreting what you wrote, you still need to roll for the landing ant scatter as normal if you fail the roll. You just dont have to use the template to check were you can land.
I think this should be a permanent rule since it simplifies things in a good way. It makes tables easier to do since you dont have to think about were AD can land and cuts down on time having to find a good place to land.
That's correct, and I agree. I reckon we'll see an upsurge in EVOs now too because of this.
While I like the idea of AD units not being limited by the template for this season, I like how certain table layouts make it harder for deployment making you really think where you want to land.
Maybe the could, after this season, update the assisted landing program to be either a +3 OR not needing the template. Could create an interesting trade off
Not saying you're wrong, but it's not easy getting off a proper AD deployment as is. Most AD troops have a Phys of 11 or 12, so only just better then even odds, then every army has access to Disrupt Aircraft hacking program. And that's before havning to find a place where the marker can fit means your trooper has a decent chance of not being in total cover when they land.
I'm no rules guru by any stretch, but I reckon for everye attemmpted AD landing I've seen five AD troops just walk in from the side.
I'm no rules guru by any stretch, but I reckon for everye attemmpted AD landing I've seen five AD troops just walk in from the side.
I haven't played for a little while but AD troops are virtually non existant round here. I use them sporadically as PanO but have never once risked the landing roll, usually on turn 2 or 3 there's a weak point in my opponent's flank defence where I can squeeze a spitfire in to start murderin'.
Another thing I like is sneaking a cheap combi guy on from the side and just sitting straight on suppressive fire which can really cause problems for an opponent planning to advance down a flank.
But trying to land in the middle of the board, with all risks that entails? No chance!
dulydude wrote: While I like the idea of AD units not being limited by the template for this season, I like how certain table layouts make it harder for deployment making you really think where you want to land.
Maybe the could, after this season, update the assisted landing program to be either a +3 OR not needing the template. Could create an interesting trade off
While I'm excited to run bunches of AD again, I can't be the only one who rememebrs the days of super effective AD spam lists after original HS. Back when wiping out your enemy on your first turn with an AD blitz was pretty viable? I think it was one of the reasons that real table density actually became a thing.
While the render of the Odalisque is technically "better" than the old models the CADN3 design strikes again with what is lost for the hand sculpted stuff.
PsychoticStorm wrote: Its a new concept artist, his first concept art shown was the new Rasyat diplomatic division,
Is it the same person? That Rasyat looks like a very different art style (from what I remember. I should go back and take a closer look). In fact, I would have guessed that these two Odalisque dossiers were drawn by different artists.
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Chairman Aeon wrote: While the render of the Odalisque is technically "better" than the old models the CADN3 design strikes again with what is lost for the hand sculpted stuff.
Yeah. back when I was still doing my review blog (which sadly I never got back to) one of the things i was constantly noting was that while CAD was allowing for some really amazing fine details, facial expression, hair, etc, poses were in general getting more static and less interesting, and it seemed like the same 5 or so poses were being used over and over again. There are still stand outs, of course. Last month's Rasyat, for example. But so many poses are like this Odalisque (just standing there, kind of looking lost) or the PanO models shown above (kind of generically advancing forward, or kneeling, or with a foot up on something). They all just kind of look the same these days.
I think CB has realized that many of their more "dynamic" poses were both silly and interfered with gameplay.
This game does require exact positioning, and facing matters, so having a model hang off its base will interfere with playing the game correctly and cleanly.
Grey Templar wrote: I think CB has realized that many of their more "dynamic" poses were both silly and interfered with gameplay.
This game does require exact positioning, and facing matters, so having a model hang off its base will interfere with playing the game correctly and cleanly.
Dynamic doesn't have to mean silly or hanging off the base. I know that often when people complain about dynamic models they say "I don't want my model backflipping across the table" (which is ironic, since theres not a single infinity model doing a backflip in the entire range), but the word dynamic just means "characterized by constant change". The illusion of movement can be created through natural poses that convey energy and motion even if all they are doing is a simple gesture. Sometimes CB manages to do this with their simpler poses (look at that Deva. See the way her entire torso is slightly turned to convey a sense of motion? See how her weight is shifted?). More often the models look stiff and unnatural. And even when a modern model has a pretty good pose (the advancing male and female Kamau seen above) its one we see used over and over to the point that it becomes boring.
I feel like Infinity has always beniffited froma wide variety of poses, from very simple and generic to realistic real world inspired crouching and advancing to wild jumping and running and weird sword stances. But for the last few years the range has been leaning very heavily toward very simple and generic poses and away from both realist human movement and over the top actionmovie/anime poses.
I like the sculpts a lot, sure they aren't the most dynamic but they are perfect for game play. I think dynamic minis fit more into blisters.
Again, awesome minis especially the Grenzer.
Bladerunner2019 wrote: Nice nomads. Shame they don’t think feuerbach & MSR Securitate were worth putting in the box :-/
Can someone sum up the results of the Kurage Campaign?
Will there be any changes to the fluff/storyline as a result?
TLDR:
It's more or less what caused Coldfront to happen. The booklet for Coldfront has some interesting fluff that seems to indicate the event played out the way they expected.
Basically anything that didn't make the cut for having enough detail to qualify as a "real" battle report is not counted at the end of the campaign. but they still allow those reports to pad the numbers everyone can see.
Thats why it was kinda viewed as "Propaganda" from the setting perspective. Yu Jing actually had an interesting effect with this in the first campaign. They were initially viewed as winning an area, but then lost it after the "propaganda" was removed from the metrics.
Calling it cheating is just a poor choice of words IMO. I doubt there was much, if any, actual attempts to falsify battle reports. And I doubt a fake battle report would be left blank, actual cheaters would probably put some effort into it. Wouldn't be hard to take some staged photos of a game and type up a few paragraphs about how a staged game went. Or take a bunch of photos of one game and spread them out over several battle reports.
Is Shakti supposed to have NWI? because she feels like she should.
Anyway, OSS looks great. It an army I've been wanting for years. i'm super excited for it.
I do kind of wish that they left the Posthumans out though. They're great, but because they're so good they make some other really neat choices in the list less attractive.
Has anyone who pre ordered from their website during gen con received their stuff yet? Still waiting on mine, cant remember the shipping date they said it would dispatch I'm sure it was early September....
I just noticed the Samekh FTO (Waht does FTO stand for?) is a Wildcard. Thats great! I was loving the Clipper in Druze.
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Kanluwen wrote: There's a lot of errors. And why would they leave the Posthumans out? This is the Sectorial they were designed for.
I know that. As I think I clearly said, I feel like they're so good that they make other options much less desirable.
Edit: I've changed my mind. I thought the Posthumans were AVA 2. At AVA 1 they remain super desirable while still leaving plenty of room for other good options.
jake wrote: I just noticed the Samekh FTO (Waht does FTO stand for?) is a Wildcard. Thats great! I was loving the Clipper in Druze.
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Kanluwen wrote: There's a lot of errors. And why would they leave the Posthumans out? This is the Sectorial they were designed for.
I know that. As I think I clearly said, I feel like they're so good that they make other options much less desirable.
Edit: I've changed my mind. I thought the Posthumans were AVA 2. At AVA 1 they remain super desirable while still leaving plenty of room for other good options.
I think FTO is Fireteam Operative, but it’s not said anywhere (that I know of), it’s just a guess.
ImAGeek wrote: Quite like ‘em. Nothing spectacular, but solid.
I like them too. Nice design and okay poses. The half twist on the male's torsos is a nice touch and gives them a good sense of movement. Also nice to see a male sniper/female gunner (its so often the other way). I really wish they'd try some more interesting hacking poses though. They used to do some neat stuff (Kamau, Vangaurd, Al Hawwa, Dasyuu, Ninja) but now its just the exact same pose over and over.
Automatically Appended Next Post: OSS question:
Shakti has Fireteam: Core. I know she counts as a Yadu for fireteam composition, but as far as I can see theres no Core Fireteams she can join? And of course she's AVA 1 and can't be a a Fireteam by herself. Does she allow for a Yado Core fireteam?
About the yadu, the profiles pdf mentions them having ft:core and Shakti only has "counts as a yadu".
Maybe they're supposed to be core base, maybe they can only form a core ft with Shakti ? I'd wait for them to clear up the Army app before making plans
B0B MaRlEy wrote: The web army app has been changed, the yadu now have ft core in their profile!
Any other changes? its hard to see the forest for the trees.
Nothing I noticed (except the HMG yadu now having the english NCO skill rather than the spanish name).
There are still oddities when comparing with the profiles PDF (the sophotects there have a special fireteam option listed but not explained,...).
B0B MaRlEy wrote: The web army app has been changed, the yadu now have ft core in their profile!
Any other changes? its hard to see the forest for the trees.
Nothing I noticed (except the HMG yadu now having the english NCO skill rather than the spanish name).
There are still oddities when comparing with the profiles PDF (the sophotects there have a special fireteam option listed but not explained,...).
I noticed that the NCO kept her Combi rifle along with her HMG. That surprised me, since I assumed it was an error.
The NCO yadu is very likely a mistake, the spanish version doesn't have those weapons and when you add it to your list the BS weapons list of your list doesn't contain them, only the HMG.
There are still some things to fix ...
Edit:
The weapons have been fixed on the web app for the yadu, so there's progress!
Those look pretty good. I think maybe I like the designs of the old ones better? I'm not sure. They do look like they'd fit in pretty well with the old models.
I've been waiting for this. I've almost bought every single model in that pack multiple times, but I knew this was coming and somehow managed to fight it. Finally gonna get me some space knights.
Not sold on the paint scheme though. Are any of these models unique to a specific order or can I paint them like any?
Hospitallers(the 'full' Knights on the far left) and Joan of Arc are specifics. The Crusader Brethren(farthest right with the jump pack, MULTI Rifle+LFT), Blackfriar(the model to his lower left), and the Order Sergeants(the four model set in Hospitaller colors to Joan's right) aren't.
For those interested, the box actually comes out to this:
Spoiler:
Military Orders ──────────────────────────────────────────────────
10 JOAN OF ARC Lieutenant MULTI Rifle, Nanopulser / Pistol, APCCW. (+1 | 49) CRUSADER MULTI Rifle + Light Flamethrower / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 31) BLACK FRIAR (Albedo, Biometric Visor L1) MULTI Rifle, Nanopulser, Drop Bears / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 28) KNIGHT HOSPITALLERHMG / Pistol, APCCW. (2 | 41) KNIGHT HOSPITALLER Combi Rifle / Pistol, APCCW. (0 | 33) KNIGHT HOSPITALLER Doctor (MediKit) Combi Rifle / Pistol, DACCW. (0 | 37) KNIGHT HOSPITALLER Boarding Shotgun / Pistol, DACCW. (0 | 33) SPEC. SERGEANT Hacker (Hacking Device) Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 21) ORDER SERGEANT Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 13) SPEC. SERGEANT Heavy Rocket Launcher + AUXBOT_1 / Assault Pistol, Knife. (1.5 | 19) AUXBOT_1 Heavy Flamethrower / Electric Pulse. (- | 4)
The Spec Sergeant's Auxbot can be on the plain old Combi Rifle Order Sergeant...but in that case, it's still over by at least 4 points. Which means it's technically a 301pt list--and I went as light as I could on Joan and the Knights.
I've been waiting for this. I've almost bought every single model in that pack multiple times, but I knew this was coming and somehow managed to fight it. Finally gonna get me some space knights.
Not sold on the paint scheme though. Are any of these models unique to a specific order or can I paint them like any?
The Knights themselves is unique to a specific order (Hospitlars), but you can paint them in whatever color you like. There is nothing in Infinity that forces you to paint something in a specific way just do what you like.
Kanluwen wrote:Hospitallers(the 'full' Knights on the far left) and Joan of Arc are specifics. The Crusader Brethren(farthest right with the jump pack, MULTI Rifle+LFT), Blackfriar(the model to his lower left), and the Order Sergeants(the four model set in Hospitaller colors to Joan's right) aren't.
For those interested, the box actually comes out to this:
Spoiler:
Military Orders ──────────────────────────────────────────────────
10
JOAN OF ARC Lieutenant MULTI Rifle, Nanopulser / Pistol, APCCW. (+1 | 49)
CRUSADER MULTI Rifle + Light Flamethrower / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 31)
BLACK FRIAR (Albedo, Biometric Visor L1) MULTI Rifle, Nanopulser, Drop Bears / Pistol, CC Weapon. (0 | 28)
KNIGHT HOSPITALLERHMG / Pistol, APCCW. (2 | 41)
KNIGHT HOSPITALLER Combi Rifle / Pistol, APCCW. (0 | 33)
KNIGHT HOSPITALLER Doctor (MediKit) Combi Rifle / Pistol, DACCW. (0 | 37)
KNIGHT HOSPITALLER Boarding Shotgun / Pistol, DACCW. (0 | 33)
SPEC. SERGEANT Hacker (Hacking Device) Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 21)
ORDER SERGEANT Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 13)
SPEC. SERGEANT Heavy Rocket Launcher + AUXBOT_1 / Assault Pistol, Knife. (1.5 | 19)
AUXBOT_1 Heavy Flamethrower / Electric Pulse. (- | 4)
The Spec Sergeant's Auxbot can be on the plain old Combi Rifle Order Sergeant...but in that case, it's still over by at least 4 points. Which means it's technically a 301pt list--and I went as light as I could on Joan and the Knights.
Just use the Order sergeant labeled as hacker as a paramedic and your good to go at 299points.
Simply put the issue is that the Sergeants box was less than optimal for anyone wanting to play Sergeants.
If it had come out with a redone Military Orders starter? Different case entirely. As it stands, there's a slew of profiles still missing for the Sergeants which leads me to think they'll get shoveled into a Varuna/Shock Army styled box where we don't get any of the 'basic' models and it's something that can't be played right out of the gate.
I own the entire Shas line, along with way too many Aswuangs, so I'm both excited and terrified at the prospect of the gribblies finally getting some love. Excited for new profiles and sweet af new sculpts ... but terrified because I'mma get pulled back into Infinity and be driven to replace all my OF sneaky dudes with the new sexiness
EDIT: Regardless of the snipe, Shas are still early 2019, right? The reckoning approacheth
I thought Shas at first too, but Shas all have shinguards and three toes, not two.
re: Army updates. The fireteam list on the Wiki got updated - remember that the Wiki fireteam list is the one that takes precedence over Army and PDF.
http://infinitythewiki.com/en/List_of_Fireteams
Bah, you’re right. You dashed my hopes quite expertly sir.
Can someone remind me again where in the fluff Helots are ever mentioned? I thought antipodes were the only known aliens from the Human Sphere.
There's a bit about them in the Varuna section in the PanO RPG book. Basically they're a labour force for PanO native to Varuna, and there are rebel cells on Varuna that blow up factories
Not quite, they were bioengineered (uplifted) by the Tohaa to fight the CA, and then abandoned when they were deemed a failure.
After discovering them on Varuna, PanO developed technology to regulate the Helots temperament, which was pressure dependent (high pressure = calm, low-to-atmosphere pressure = bullish and angry), to something that promoted inter-species cooperation, then exploited the hell out of them as the would any other unrepresented workforce in their sphere of influence. Some (most) Helots are quite happy with the improvements that interactions with PanO have brought as it enables them to think with clarity and control their emotional state independent of what depth of ocean they're currently sitting in, a minority are not and have turned to domestic terrorism against both PanO and other Helot "collaborators".
Bostria is claiming that the Military Orders will see points adjustments "making the 300 point army box actually 300 points"...
Smooth move, guys.
Q&A video for Comic Con Africa.
A few highlights, not watching it all as it's fairly boring.
Guijia in Invincible Army.
"New rules coming allowing for Invincible Army to have a full Heavy Infantry army and still have Orders"--Military Orders are the same.
Her Ye Her Ye! News from the front! Acontecimento finaly explodes! Troops in the sectorial got taken out back and shot in the back of the head as in them taking the same path as MRRF. (Playable but models gets discontinued (october 15))
It's hysterical that they added the NA2 faction header for factions that could theoretically 'split off' from their parent faction. MRRF could have done so and Knights could have done so, but instead they've removed the models from sale.
Kanluwen wrote: More incompetence on display from Corvus Belli.
It's hysterical that they added the NA2 faction header for factions that could theoretically 'split off' from their parent faction. MRRF could have done so and Knights could have done so, but instead they've removed the models from sale.
If the issue is they can’t keep producing so many models, moving the sectorial to NA2 wouldn’t make any difference.
Kanluwen wrote: More incompetence on display from Corvus Belli.
It's hysterical that they added the NA2 faction header for factions that could theoretically 'split off' from their parent faction. MRRF could have done so and Knights could have done so, but instead they've removed the models from sale.
If the issue is they can’t keep producing so many models, moving the sectorial to NA2 wouldn’t make any difference.
And the issue with their whole "can't keep producing so many models" is because of their incompetence when it comes to refusing to do multiple arm sets or raising the number of models in a box.
I don't think they know how to handle the model/faction bloat they have and don't want to move things to direct order only.
Honestly there's too much crap in this game which is why I've mostly lost interest in it. I don't have time to play a game that takes 3 hours because I only get to play it once a month because of how long it takes and thus never learn everything enough to get the game down to a more reasonable hour.
Yet they have to keep selling new things so new figures, rules and so on get added that just make it more annoying to keep trying to play if your causal.
Pure speculation:
CB tried to bring back life to the sectorial with new models but sales for the range is still low (What i heard they were very low before they got updated sculpts to) so they got axed before the others to free up SKU space.
And does this mean that each faction will be capt at 3 production sectorials at a time since poth PanO and Ariadna has four with one not supported with models?
Yes, Acontecimento is the next sectorial to get the same treatment as MRRF.
Models of the faction will be playable, nothing will be removed from a gameplay standpoint and they may get some quality of life improvements along the way.
The only real effect this has, is there SKU mentioned will not be available to order from CB from the cutoff day onward.
Bubbalicious wrote: Pure speculation:
CB tried to bring back life to the sectorial with new models but sales for the range is still low (What i heard they were very low before they got updated sculpts to) so they got axed before the others to free up SKU space.
And does this mean that each faction will be capt at 3 production sectorials at a time since poth PanO and Ariadna has four with one not supported with models?
The only "new models" that the Sectorial saw were:
Shock Army starter set, which was awful in terms of its setup(it's way heavy on SWC for the points and they crammed a stupid Knight in there)
Bagh-Mari boxed set and HMG blister
The other stuff(which is really just the Akali Spitfire and Akali BSG) were released prior to the Sectorial's starter set release.
If they wanted to "bring back life to the Sectorial", they screwed the pooch from the outset. They got the result they wanted.
Bubbalicious wrote: Pure speculation:
CB tried to bring back life to the sectorial with new models but sales for the range is still low (What i heard they were very low before they got updated sculpts to) so they got axed before the others to free up SKU space.
And does this mean that each faction will be capt at 3 production sectorials at a time since poth PanO and Ariadna has four with one not supported with models?
The only "new models" that the Sectorial saw were:
Shock Army starter set, which was awful in terms of its setup(it's way heavy on SWC for the points and they crammed a stupid Knight in there)
Bagh-Mari boxed set and HMG blister
The other stuff(which is really just the Akali Spitfire and Akali BSG) were released prior to the Sectorial's starter set release.
If they wanted to "bring back life to the Sectorial", they screwed the pooch from the outset. They got the result they wanted.
This is one of the biggest issues with getting people into the game, and I know it's a dead horse by now, but it's stupid that their starters aren't starters and several aren't legally playable. Really make me wonder how they come to such a decision.
Starters were always envisioned as a point to start and expand the faction, not as a fully balanced ready to go "starter set" to be played on the same level as the other starter sets, I know its not the usual logic of starter sets, but still a valid viewpoint.
Knight wrote: B-b-but Acontecimento is cool! Sadness.
Ya, think of the RPG players losing access to models for their characters... (It's weird that the war-game is pruning off flavour as the RPG expands it.)
CB really should rethink what they want to do for N4 before they demi-squat the least popular (read: lowest selling) sectorials. Soon they'll end up with GW's problem of only making space marines because only space marine sell. OK, Infinity isn't as bad as 40K that way, but there seems to be a funnelling effect to put it mildly.
PsychoticStorm wrote: Starters were always envisioned as a point to start and expand the faction, not as a fully balanced ready to go "starter set" to be played on the same level as the other starter sets, I know its not the usual logic of starter sets, but still a valid viewpoint.
And yet more factions than not have them as playable.
They are based on "what do we feel the players would need to have them as the core of their 300pts army" sometimes it is basic troops, sometimes it is SWC options, sometimes the points are cheap, sometimes the box is almost half the list.
LunarSol wrote: They said there will be one of these for every new sectorial added. I can't say I'm surprised, nor will I be when Corregidor vanishes.
Corregidor vanishes. Dude, that is some weak trollin'. CB loves them some Nomads. Corregidor is going nowhere.
About the month's releases: Those Haqq remotes look nice. I may eventually get them. The Asuras too. A very nice looking set of releases for this month.
Well, ASA. Not good news. I do want CB to soften the blow by fixing Kirpal Singh, among other things. And make the resculpted Montesa spitfire available as a single.
LunarSol wrote: They said there will be one of these for every new sectorial added. I can't say I'm surprised, nor will I be when Corregidor vanishes.
Thankfully Nomads aren’t due for a 4th sectorial anytime soon.
Automatically Appended Next Post: I would have thought NCA would get axed before ASA (sorry Kan).
Other than MO, I really don’t understand what the identity of the PanO sectorials is supposed to be. I know their places in the fluff, but in execution they sound like they’d play in alignment with that identity.
I feel they would get better traction with sectorials if Vanilla lists weren’t the predominant way the game was still played. Considering the direction the game has gone, one would think Vanilla lists would have been eliminated by now...
LunarSol wrote: They said there will be one of these for every new sectorial added. I can't say I'm surprised, nor will I be when Corregidor vanishes.
Thankfully Nomads aren’t due for a 4th sectorial anytime soon.
Probably the case, but it's not one in one out on a faction level either.
That's literally what's happening. Varuna is getting added, Shock Army is being removed. We still have Svalarheim to consider as well.
Bladerunner2019 wrote:I would have thought NCA would get axed before ASA (sorry Kan).
Other than MO, I really don’t understand what the identity of the PanO sectorials is supposed to be. I know their places in the fluff, but in execution they sound like they’d play in alignment with that identity.
I feel they would get better traction with sectorials if Vanilla lists weren’t the predominant way the game was still played. Considering the direction the game has gone, one would think Vanilla lists would have been eliminated by now...
Honestly? I thought NCA would go first too. They don't know what the hell they're doing with them and it's clear they have no interest in addressing the issues there. They want to have their cake and eat it too with the Military Orders, and realistically that faction should have been amputated when we got the Non-Aligned Armies added in.
To me this goes along with "we want you to buy new products". Svalarheima seems in the green, especially, if it's going to share a number of models with MO and generic force.
Toni tried to warn you all against this madness and CB killed her and then came after Army of Acontecimento!
This is one of the biggest issues with getting people into the game, and I know it's a dead horse by now, but it's stupid that their starters aren't starters and several aren't legally playable. Really make me wonder how they come to such a decision.
Years and years of players complaining that the starter weren't a good value because they couldn't contain the most ideal models. Players begged for the kind of starters we have now for years.
Hopefully they wouldn't ever kill a Sectorial off permanently. As in, never ever have any new physical releases for it ever again.
Frankly, CB just needs to get smarter about how they release stuff for this game. Multi-part kits for one thing would let them decrease SKU count if that is a genuine problem. One figure which could be assembled as many different models is eminently possible. They're even doing it in practical terms with their new 4 man boxes that have different arms on the same body. They just need to expand on that more.
One could easily manage to have a single blister for each unit, that could make several different profiles.
Take the Blackjack. That is a unit which has 2 SKUs when it could easily, trivially, get away with one. Just pack the Sniper Rifle and HMG bits in the same kit with one body. Charge a little extra to cover the cost and you are golden.
A unit should really only have multiple SKUs if it is a basic core unit.
I feel like certain sectorials going away has been inevitable and obvious for a few years now. CB has been talking about their limited design and production capabilities for years. They can only support so many armies at a time. As long ago as 2013 they noted that eventually some sectorials would be complete and they could move on to other projects.
Honestly, I feel like this is a good thing. I play Shock Army frequently and love it, and have no problem with this.
- The army will still be 100% playable.
- The models are still available for sale now, and will likely not be very hard to find in the future (I rarely have trouble finding out of production Infinity models, even super old stuff. I';m guessing recent ASA stuff will be available at good prices for years).
- The current range of models look great and don't really need an update.
This is kind of an ideal situation for a product range that needs to be discontinued. I honestly don't see what there is to complain about, unless you were a die hard ASA player who was hoping for a serious expansion in the future. If you were, you have my sympathy. But I'm guessing there aren't many of those out there.
I full expect we'll see many other armies discontinued in the same way in the future. Possibly eventually every HS era sectorial. We should get used to it. The game is changing and growing, but we're not losing anything in the process. This is a good thing.
jake wrote: CB has been talking about their limited design and production capabilities for years.
Its one thing to say that.
Its another to say it while wasting the allegedly limited design and production capabilities on stuff like TAG Pilots and Tech BEE, who got rules after the fact. Or making a million different HVT figures.
For a company that moans about limited resources, they don't act like a company with limited resources. They seem to actively go out of the way to have the most inefficient SKU layout possible.
Grey Templar wrote: Hopefully they wouldn't ever kill a Sectorial off permanently. As in, never ever have any new physical releases for it ever again.
Frankly, CB just needs to get smarter about how they release stuff for this game. Multi-part kits for one thing would let them decrease SKU count if that is a genuine problem. One figure which could be assembled as many different models is eminently possible. They're even doing it in practical terms with their new 4 man boxes that have different arms on the same body. They just need to expand on that more.
One could easily manage to have a single blister for each unit, that could make several different profiles.
Take the Blackjack. That is a unit which has 2 SKUs when it could easily, trivially, get away with one. Just pack the Sniper Rifle and HMG bits in the same kit with one body. Charge a little extra to cover the cost and you are golden.
A unit should really only have multiple SKUs if it is a basic core unit.
The 4 man boxes aren't new. They've been doing those for over 10 years.
Also, while I agree that your BlackJack solution is viable, this community has thrown massive fits over stuff like that before. Fits that have gone on for years. Its an idea that some people love and some people hate.
Packing extra arms into a blister might help a little, but it won't solve the overall problem of too many armies. The current solution of discontinuing model lines while allowing the army itself to still exist is a much better approach. They can bring back ASA, MRRF or any other army at any time if they decide to (they still have all the assets) or produce new models or rules for those armies, and in the meantime the armies themselves are completely playable and the models are widely available.
As a side note, while i appreciate the economy of having multiple sets of arms for the same figures, in my opinion it usually creates one nice looking figures and one poor, awkward or silly looking one. Many of the 2 body/4 model boxes have 2 great looking models, and 2 that I'd rather not put on the table. Additionally, I don't like having duplicate models in my army, so having the same three guys with different guns isn't appealing to me at all. Thats why I didn't buy the Shotgun Devil Dog, despite being really excited about the unit.
jake wrote: CB has been talking about their limited design and production capabilities for years.
Its one thing to say that.
Its another to say it while wasting the allegedly limited design and production capabilities on stuff like TAG Pilots and Tech BEE, who got rules after the fact. Or making a million different HVT figures.
For a company that moans about limited resources, they don't act like a company with limited resources. They seem to actively go out of the way to have the most inefficient SKU layout possible.
The TAG pilots were very popular, and the community had been begging for them for years. Same with the HVT models. Making them was hardly a mistake. Again, the problem clearly isn't individual models, but entire armies. They've talked about this several times in the past. they can't support this many individual armies.
Theres a LOT of venom in this thread over what seems to be a very good and fan/player friendly decision on CB's part. I'm not actually sure what you're all so angry about. I'm going to chalk this up to "Gamers are furious about everything, no matter what" and step away.
jake wrote: I feel like certain sectorials going away has been inevitable and obvious for a few years now. CB has been talking about their limited design and production capabilities for years. They can only support so many armies at a time. As long ago as 2013 they noted that eventually some sectorials would be complete and they could move on to other projects.
It's understanable that they can't keep such a huge catalog going for retail but it's kind of silly to say a sectorial is "complete" then stop selling it. At least make it direct order. Since it won't be in distrubution doing so won't be that much of a workload to just spin some up every once and a while (even state on their website that they only ship the product once a month or something).
It always feels like they're making the wrong decisions for the right reasons and that there should be a better way for them to solve their problems (like multi part kits). Even though, in the long run, this doesn't really hurt current players at any level (especially comparied to the JSA debocle earlier this year) it still is just bad optics and makes people think the company is having issues or is just greedy and trying to force people to buy new stuff (even though the old stuff is legal). It doesn't help when I was at a con where Carlos was and he flat out said that 2018 would be a good year if CB could get people to stop playing their old armies and buy new ones. Sure the contex was more in that CB hopes all the new stuff is so awesome people want to play it but context is lost once it gets posted on the forum or social media.
It's going to be more of an issue as more things dissapear. If they really need to remove one army to add another that means theoretically Pan-O will loose an army every year or two and get to the point where they just cycle between complete armies being avalible for purchase with noting new ever really comming -- which is just strange for a game to do.
Grey Templar wrote: Hopefully they wouldn't ever kill a Sectorial off permanently. As in, never ever have any new physical releases for it ever again.
According to the forums it's been almost 5 years since both MRRF and Shas went on "Hold" with Shas slated for next year so it could be a very long time to see this come back.
Meh this just killed the fledgling infinty scene in my area, no one is going to start a game that regularly effectively kills armies.
Also we have a couple of yu players and a merro player who were unhappy and now an aggrieved shock army player. It all has left a bad taste in people's mouths when also.talking CB's official position has been a little shoddy.
SeanDrake wrote: Meh this just killed the fledgling infinty scene in my area, no one is going to start a game that regularly effectively kills armies.
Also we have a couple of yu players and a merro player who were unhappy and now an aggrieved shock army player. It all has left a bad taste in people's mouths when also.talking CB's official position has been a little shoddy.
The MRRF and SAA players are aware the rules aren’t going anywhere right? If they already had the models it doesn’t affect them at all. Mero were improved though the process, in fact.
Lots of folk need a continual drip of new releases otherwise they get bored and give up as the game is 'dead', so it's hardly surprising that CB doing this is going to drive some players away
but that isn't necessarily a bad thing (well except for those players) if in doing so it gives them enough design space to carry on releasing other stuff and so keep the majority of the player base happy and retailers on side with a control of SKUs
OrlandotheTechnicoloured wrote: Lots of folk need a continual drip of new releases otherwise they get bored and give up as the game is 'dead', so it's hardly surprising that CB doing this is going to drive some players away
but that isn't necessarily a bad thing (well except for those players) if in doing so it gives them enough design space to carry on releasing other stuff and so keep the majority of the player base happy and retailers on side with a control of SKUs
You know what else would "control SKUs"?
Corvus Belli not releasing things in a pants on head idiotic fashion.
The overall response from MRRF was especially positive with negative response lower than expected, if nothing else MRRF tournament appearance has increased after the update, I have no data on SAA (or ASA) of course as it has not happened yet.
That does not mean we do not look or take into account negative responses, we value all feedback.
PsychoticStorm wrote: The overall response from MRRF was especially positive with negative response lower than expected, if nothing else MRRF tournament appearance has increased after the update, I have no data on SAA (or ASA) of course as it has not happened yet.
That does not mean we do not look or take into account negative responses, we value all feedback.
"We"?
I didn't know you were officially part of CB - this is good to know!
ImAGeek wrote: The MRRF and SAA players are aware the rules aren’t going anywhere right? If they already had the models it doesn’t affect them at all. Mero were improved though the process, in fact.
Primarily, to me, the most concerning is cutting off the potential new players. If you enjoy talking about SAA you're going to find yourself talking to an ever decreasing number of people. A small release does work wonders to attract new interests as well as keeping players who simply find their niche very happy. New content also works, from story to art, however, if a company is willing to drop the production of a product, it doesn't really look good. The question is why would you try to make content for a product that's effectively dead in the production and selling sense?
The rules can be problematic in the sense how you're going to handle syncing with the release of ever more power rules and meta. This doesn't concern me as I've jumped out of ITS a long time ago.
It would have been nice if they'd at least updated the Guarda de Asaulto before eliminating the faction. Interesting that this move also eliminates most of PanO's characters.
I didn't know you were officially part of CB - this is good to know!
We as part of the feedback mechanism, not as a CB employee, sorry if this got confusing.
Edit
But I can assure you no feedack is blocked, especially negative, CB does not live in an echo chamber of positive viewpoints.
This is demonstrably false. WarCors are part of the echo chamber and we've had a few notations of late with regards to how shoddy the Techbee's original rules were and how the concept was received, and yet it still came out.
Also, see again how people have made suggestions or had their independent retailers make suggestions regarding how to address SKU bloat...and yet we're still seeing blisters for units that should be boxed.
PsychoticStorm wrote: Again only as models to purchase, this has zero effect as far as gameplay goes.
Sure. For people who already have the models and/or as long as the current supply of models lasts.
In a year or two once the big retailers have had the stores depleted you’ll see a big drop off.
Someone reading the fluff might want to start a SAA army, cause SAA is cool, but then gets gut punched when the only models available are expensive and hard to find. That experience will sour them on the game as a whole and not just on the discontinued sectorial.
I wonder if it's worth, whilst the models are still being produced, CB making enough extra to fill a couple of direct-sale only boxes of "Complete SAA model collection" - not with all the fancy packaging but essentially one box/blister each of the SAA releases currently available.
It would be expensive and you'd get stuff you don't necessarily want (I've never seen the point of the Drago for example) but if someone does fall in love with SAA then there's a way of buying in.
I didn't know you were officially part of CB - this is good to know!
We as part of the feedback mechanism, not as a CB employee, sorry if this got confusing.
Edit
But I can assure you no feedack is blocked, especially negative, CB does not live in an echo chamber of positive viewpoints.
This is demonstrably false. WarCors are part of the echo chamber and we've had a few notations of late with regards to how shoddy the Techbee's original rules were and how the concept was received, and yet it still came out.
Also, see again how people have made suggestions or had their independent retailers make suggestions regarding how to address SKU bloat...and yet we're still seeing blisters for units that should be boxed.
PsychoticStorm said they listen to and welcome feedback -- never said they do anything with it. So technically he didn't say anything untrue.
Riquende wrote: I wonder if it's worth, whilst the models are still being produced, CB making enough extra to fill a couple of direct-sale only boxes of "Complete SAA model collection" - not with all the fancy packaging but essentially one box/blister each of the SAA releases currently available.
It would be expensive and you'd get stuff you don't necessarily want (I've never seen the point of the Drago for example) but if someone does fall in love with SAA then there's a way of buying in.
I'm going to be brutally honest here.
Them doing "direct sale" is a horrible idea. There are still people who ordered Coldfront and the GenCon stuff that haven't received shipping notices, let alone the actual product.
What they should have done if they knew they were doing this(and mark my words, they knew--these guys plan things in excruciating detail in advance) was instead of releasing a SAA starter set? They should have just made it an army box ala JSA and USARF. Could have retired a large number of SKUs that way.
Kanluwen wrote: There are still people who ordered Coldfront and the GenCon stuff that haven't received shipping notices, let alone the actual product.
Well aware of that, I'm in the same boat (technically my friend is, who placed the group order). But the shortages and delays there are caused by high demand of the latest hotness, when there isn't something like that going on I'm sure the average delivery times go way down.
The TAG pilots were very popular, and the community had been begging for them for years. Same with the HVT models. Making them was hardly a mistake. Again, the problem clearly isn't individual models, but entire armies. They've talked about this several times in the past. they can't support this many individual armies.
Theres a LOT of venom in this thread over what seems to be a very good and fan/player friendly decision on CB's part. I'm not actually sure what you're all so angry about. I'm going to chalk this up to "Gamers are furious about everything, no matter what" and step away.
Just because something is popular doesn't mean its good for the game. Particularly when you are, allegedly, struggling under the weight of SKU bloat. TAG pilots were an unnecessary addition to the game, and the rules they received felt very hamfisted and forced at first. While I think the rules for them ended up in a good spot and added something good to the game, it was still a case of the Tail wagging the Dog.
You are correct that its not just TAG pilots, HVT models, etc... Its all the little things stacking together. Its a ridiculous number of redundant SKUs spread across many factions.
The correct solution to this problem isn't to squat entire factions. Its to consolidate existing SKUs and have more efficient models. If a particular unit has 3 different blisters, combine them into a single blister with multiple arm and weapon options. Every unit type should really have a single blister or box set and nothing else, besides a possible inclusion in a starter or army pack.
There is a reason that every. single. other. table top wargame miniature company(whose game pieces have different possible equipment loadouts) does this. Its because it is simply the best way to go.
Corvus Belli clearly isn't struggling as a company. So perhaps if they can't support this many factions with their current setup maybe they need to. you know. expand! Like any sensible business would. And if you don't want to expand, you'll need to be more efficient. Multi-part kits to reduce SKUs. Fewer frivolous miniature releases like TAG pilots, HVTs, etc...
Does Joan de Arc really need 3 different models?
Do ORC troops need 3 different SKUs, plus being in the Starter kit?
Why are there 2 Blackjack SKUs when there really should only be a single model with different weapon options?
Why are there 3 different Ninja SKUs?
Why do the Bootleg models even exist?
etc...
Corvus Belli has ZERO justification for whining about their model bloat when its something they've done to themselves, and aren't taking the sensible steps to fix it. Instead of pulling a splinter out of their finger they're just deciding to chop it off.
The correct solution to this problem isn't to squat entire factions. Its to consolidate existing SKUs and have more efficient models. If a particular unit has 3 different blisters, combine them into a single blister with multiple arm and weapon options. Every unit type should really have a single blister or box set and nothing else, besides a possible inclusion in a starter or army pack.
There is a reason that every. single. other. table top wargame miniature company(whose game pieces have different possible equipment loadouts) does this. Its because it is simply the best way to go.
Corvus Belli clearly isn't struggling as a company. So perhaps if they can't support this many factions with their current setup maybe they need to. you know. expand! Like any sensible business would. And if you don't want to expand, you'll need to be more efficient. Multi-part kits to reduce SKUs. Fewer frivolous miniature releases like TAG pilots, HVTs, etc...
Does Joan de Arc really need 3 different models?
Do ORC troops need 3 different SKUs, plus being in the Starter kit?
Why are there 2 Blackjack SKUs when there really should only be a single model with different weapon options?
Why are there 3 different Ninja SKUs?
Why do the Bootleg models even exist?
etc...
Corvus Belli has ZERO justification for whining about their model bloat when its something they've done to themselves, and aren't taking the sensible steps to fix it. Instead of pulling a splinter out of their finger they're just deciding to chop it off.
Saying that ASA is getting Squatted it a little extreme -- the Bugs got Squatted -- ASA will still be in the game just not purchasable.
Expanding may not be much a better option as there's only so much stuff that a game store is willing to carry. GW and Privateer both have this problem both have direct order and doing larger army boxes as well as everything else you mentioned.
A big concern that turns me personally off is since ASA is being removed from production from low sales right after getting a bunch of resculpts that pretty much means nothing is safe so why should anyone purchase anything that doesn't seam to be the most popular stuff as CB can just stop selling things for it out of the blue? Start buying a new faction and find out it's getting it's production stopped and you'll never get the rest of the models for it.
I'm glad that JSA is pretty much done with all it's new sculpts as I'll pick them up this year and might be done with my Infinity purchases for quite some time. My other army is Tohaa and I don't have much confedence when Carlos was talking to some people at LVO where I was sitting about how no one bought or played Tohaa so no one will care if there's no releases for them this year.
btw. about we can't pack 2 different weapons in blister/box, price or what ever other reason they give you, apparently they can do it with Aristeia, since they give you cards for 4 languages. That is a lot of cards you can basically just throw after you buy box, since you don't need them. They still charge you for them though.
The correct solution to this problem isn't to squat entire factions. Its to consolidate existing SKUs and have more efficient models. If a particular unit has 3 different blisters, combine them into a single blister with multiple arm and weapon options. Every unit type should really have a single blister or box set and nothing else, besides a possible inclusion in a starter or army pack.
There is a reason that every. single. other. table top wargame miniature company(whose game pieces have different possible equipment loadouts) does this. Its because it is simply the best way to go.
Corvus Belli clearly isn't struggling as a company. So perhaps if they can't support this many factions with their current setup maybe they need to. you know. expand! Like any sensible business would. And if you don't want to expand, you'll need to be more efficient. Multi-part kits to reduce SKUs. Fewer frivolous miniature releases like TAG pilots, HVTs, etc...
Does Joan de Arc really need 3 different models?
Do ORC troops need 3 different SKUs, plus being in the Starter kit?
Why are there 2 Blackjack SKUs when there really should only be a single model with different weapon options?
Why are there 3 different Ninja SKUs?
Why do the Bootleg models even exist?
etc...
Corvus Belli has ZERO justification for whining about their model bloat when its something they've done to themselves, and aren't taking the sensible steps to fix it. Instead of pulling a splinter out of their finger they're just deciding to chop it off.
Saying that ASA is getting Squatted it a little extreme -- the Bugs got Squatted -- ASA will still be in the game just not purchasable.
Good point - which really pisses me off that CB wasn't able to give the Exrah continued rules support for some reason or other, but here, it is shown that they can do this, if they want?
smurfORnot wrote: btw. about we can't pack 2 different weapons in blister/box, price or what ever other reason they give you, apparently they can do it with Aristeia, since they give you cards for 4 languages. That is a lot of cards you can basically just throw after you buy box, since you don't need them. They still charge you for them though.
While I think yes, options in boxes is definitely a thing CB should be doing, Aristeia cards are really not a good example. Metal prices are way higher than cardboard, and you don't have to sculpt a card. The art for them is largely done anyway as concepts for the model, so its not like they're spending anything more than pennies to add the cards in
smurfORnot wrote: btw. about we can't pack 2 different weapons in blister/box, price or what ever other reason they give you, apparently they can do it with Aristeia, since they give you cards for 4 languages. That is a lot of cards you can basically just throw after you buy box, since you don't need them. They still charge you for them though.
While I think yes, options in boxes is definitely a thing CB should be doing, Aristeia cards are really not a good example. Metal prices are way higher than cardboard, and you don't have to sculpt a card. The art for them is largely done anyway as concepts for the model, so its not like they're spending anything more than pennies to add the cards in
Since the cards are done out of their manufacturing chain, I'd say it is not a bad example.
smurfORnot wrote: btw. about we can't pack 2 different weapons in blister/box, price or what ever other reason they give you, apparently they can do it with Aristeia, since they give you cards for 4 languages. That is a lot of cards you can basically just throw after you buy box, since you don't need them. They still charge you for them though.
While I think yes, options in boxes is definitely a thing CB should be doing, Aristeia cards are really not a good example. Metal prices are way higher than cardboard, and you don't have to sculpt a card. The art for them is largely done anyway as concepts for the model, so its not like they're spending anything more than pennies to add the cards in
Those extra 70ish cards also add weight to package which adds more to postage costs too. Though by same definition you can say, but those 4 plastic minis also basically cost them few pennies, because actually they do, look at boardgames today, and how much plastic you get in them for around 100€ not to mention cardboard, cards, big box etc, so what exactly are we paying them 30€ for? 4 mediocre plastic minis worth few cents and few cents of cards? Compare it to boardgames and you are being ripped off.
smurfORnot wrote: Those extra 70ish cards also add weight to package which adds more to postage costs too. Though by same definition you can say, but those 4 plastic minis also basically cost them few pennies, because actually they do, look at boardgames today, and how much plastic you get in them for around 100€ not to mention cardboard, cards, big box etc, so what exactly are we paying them 30€ for? 4 mediocre plastic minis worth few cents and few cents of cards? Compare it to boardgames and you are being ripped off.
That's really not how it works. The models may only cost a few pennies to make, but the molds are extremely expensive. If you take the expense of the mold and then apply it to the number of models that you expect to sell, the price per model can vary considerably (for instance, Corvus Belli is likely to sell far fewer Aristeia copies than something like Blood Rage). If the models aren't one piece, then you have the added cost of somebody cutting all the pieces off sprues and making sure the right ones end up together (or gluing them together in the case of pre-assembled models). Then shipping from China or wherever. Models don't cost a few cents. It's highly dependent on how many unique models there are in a box and how many boxes you expect to sell.
(Back when BattleLore was released, it had over 100 miniatures and tons of cards and cardboard, but Days of Wonder were unable to ever make more base sets for it because it cost more than they sold the box for. It's one of the reasons why DoW sold BL to Fantasy Flight Games)
Cards are printed on giant sheets, dozens to hundreds at a time, which is then cut down to individual cards. These are almost certainly done in sets that are packaged together. This means that having only 59 cards instead of 60 in a package (if 60 is the amount that are printed on a sheet) would actually cost more (because you'd be throwing away a card, or otherwise moving it to a different set). Breaking a 60 card sheet into 3 sets of 20 cards works out well. Breaking it into 5 sets of 11 cards, less so. So there's a sweet spot for the number of cards in a product. It's not that they add a card or two. It's more like they have a certain number of cards they can and should use.
Edit: Also, CB is not a huge company. The number of products they support isn't just about the number of products they put on the FLGS' shelves - it's about warehouse storage, keeping the molds available, reprinting boxes, and so on. Every time they run out of a product, they have to recreate it. If there is only demand for a few hundred, but CB must create a few thousand to get the price down, then that is a product where they would lose money during the next printing. And storing hundreds of unwanted products in their warehouse means they can't store hundreds of more wanted products. Pruning the line and removing things that sell poorly in favor of things that sell well is just common sense. Keeping around a sectorial that relatively few people play limits how the game can grow.
smurfORnot wrote: Those extra 70ish cards also add weight to package which adds more to postage costs too. Though by same definition you can say, but those 4 plastic minis also basically cost them few pennies, because actually they do, look at boardgames today, and how much plastic you get in them for around 100€ not to mention cardboard, cards, big box etc, so what exactly are we paying them 30€ for? 4 mediocre plastic minis worth few cents and few cents of cards? Compare it to boardgames and you are being ripped off.
That's really not how it works. The models may only cost a few pennies to make, but the molds are extremely expensive. If you take the expense of the mold and then apply it to the number of models that you expect to sell, the price per model can vary considerably (for instance, Corvus Belli is likely to sell far fewer Aristeia copies than something like Blood Rage). If the models aren't one piece, then you have the added cost of somebody cutting all the pieces off sprues and making sure the right ones end up together (or gluing them together in the case of pre-assembled models). Then shipping from China or wherever. Models don't cost a few cents. It's highly dependent on how many unique models there are in a box and how many boxes you expect to sell.
(Back when BattleLore was released, it had over 100 miniatures and tons of cards and cardboard, but Days of Wonder were unable to ever make more base sets for it because it cost more than they sold the box for. It's one of the reasons why DoW sold BL to Fantasy Flight Games)
Cards are printed on giant sheets, dozens to hundreds at a time, which is then cut down to individual cards. These are almost certainly done in sets that are packaged together. This means that having only 59 cards instead of 60 in a package (if 60 is the amount that are printed on a sheet) would actually cost more (because you'd be throwing away a card, or otherwise moving it to a different set). Breaking a 60 card sheet into 3 sets of 20 cards works out well. Breaking it into 5 sets of 11 cards, less so. So there's a sweet spot for the number of cards in a product. It's not that they add a card or two. It's more like they have a certain number of cards they can and should use.
Edit: Also, CB is not a huge company. The number of products they support isn't just about the number of products they put on the FLGS' shelves - it's about warehouse storage, keeping the molds available, reprinting boxes, and so on. Every time they run out of a product, they have to recreate it. If there is only demand for a few hundred, but CB must create a few thousand to get the price down, then that is a product where they would lose money during the next printing. And storing hundreds of unwanted products in their warehouse means they can't store hundreds of more wanted products. Pruning the line and removing things that sell poorly in favor of things that sell well is just common sense. Keeping around a sectorial that relatively few people play limits how the game can grow.
Exactly.
This is the price of their success, especially if we want new sectorials.
I don't think ASA models will be too hard to get even after they're discontinued. They were left in a better state than MRRF who never got fully fleshed out.
They can always come back later and revisit like they will do shortly with Shas.
Exactly.
This is the price of their success, especially if we want new sectorials.
I don't think ASA models will be too hard to get even after they're discontinued. They were left in a better state than MRRF who never got fully fleshed out.
They can always come back later and revisit like they will do shortly with Shas.
Merovingia were more fleshed out than people seem to think. They missed some core boxes but that was obviously the result of them shelving the sectorial.
Are there even any major gaps in the ASA model range? A new Guarda de Assalto would be nice, but the current one isn't BAD, just a bit small. And a couple more Regulars wouldn't hurt. I guess they could conceivably put out a new one via a Dire Foes character, although that seems unlikely.
Realistically the only thing missing entirely is a Regular Hacker. The Guarda never got a new sculpt which is a shame, and the Montesa relies on its N2 sculpt to fill in as a few of its options (man I want to see what a combi+LRL looks like).
Akal Boarding Shotgun I think might be the only other gap, I think there was an N2 one that got withdrawn and never replaced.
There are a couple of other loadouts that you wouldn't expect to see, such as Akal with combi+emitter, Regular Sensor/minelayer, so on. All are probably supposed to just use the combi guys.
Got to love punishing your fan base for your own business decisions.
I honestly can't tell if they're just bad planners or if they're doing it on purpose now.
If they want to control SKU's then they should release proper unit boxes and kits with multiple options instead of nickel and diming us with multiple box and blister releases for single units.
Hell, I was going to originally make a comment about how the CG box was underwhelming because it suffered from the usual problem of being a box set that could only be built one way and forced either buying from a box-splitting service or converting to get the options you actually wanted out of it (and still no CG Boarding Shotgun! Guess that'll be another blister!).
When they introduced FIreteams and started driving troop costs down with uber-efficient price cutting practices (SMGs, Frenzy on things intended for fire teams, conspicuous dump stats, hand-tweaked discounts, etc.) they changed the game from the 1st Edition/Early 2nd tiny 10-model conflict with little repetition in to what is basically getting close to an under-strength platoon-scale skirmish game. But their releases are still patterned like they were back when the game was originally released (albeit with large box sets added to the mix).
Hell, their release pattern is actively reminding me of one of the issues that killed AT-43 (and Rackham with it). Splitting units across multiple products with no customization not only bloats SKU's, but makes it a nightmare on the player's end to actually get functional forces together. SWC boxes are terrible for that. Either requiring people to buy multiple boxes (and thus giving them duplicates of things they don't need) or requiring they go on the secondary market to deal with box splitters and re-sellers (or force people to convert the minis themselves, which is easier said than done given that they don't do much in the way of conversion bits). But instead of fixing their unsustainable and insane release model, they're just going to discontinue people's armies, or shunt them to different factions, or just outright get rid of them altogether.
Just like the release of N3 itself, it feels like their complete redesign when CAD sculpting and the scale shift came along was a wasted opportunity for a real revision of how things were done. Now a few years on from the revamp and it feels like they need to revamp again before we just end up having another cycle of the issues that brought us here in the first place.
I'll be honest, I was starting to get a glimmer of hope with the IA reveals, but after a few recent decisions on CB's part, I'm closer to washing my hands of them now than I was back when Uprising hit. They just make it so tiring being a fan of their games that I'm not sure I can be any more.
Ronin_eX wrote: Got to love punishing your fan base for your own business decisions.
I honestly can't tell if they're just bad planners or if they're doing it on purpose now.
If they want to control SKU's then they should release proper unit boxes and kits with multiple options instead of nickel and diming us with multiple box and blister releases for single units.
Hell, I was going to originally make a comment about how the CG box was underwhelming because it suffered from the usual problem of being a box set that could only be built one way and forced either buying from a box-splitting service or converting to get the options you actually wanted out of it (and still no CG Boarding Shotgun! Guess that'll be another blister!).
When they introduced FIreteams and started driving troop costs down with uber-efficient price cutting practices (SMGs, Frenzy on things intended for fire teams, conspicuous dump stats, hand-tweaked discounts, etc.) they changed the game from the 1st Edition/Early 2nd tiny 10-model conflict with little repetition in to what is basically getting close to an under-strength platoon-scale skirmish game. But their releases are still patterned like they were back when the game was originally released (albeit with large box sets added to the mix).
Hell, their release pattern is actively reminding me of one of the issues that killed AT-43 (and Rackham with it). Splitting units across multiple products with no customization not only bloats SKU's, but makes it a nightmare on the player's end to actually get functional forces together. SWC boxes are terrible for that. Either requiring people to buy multiple boxes (and thus giving them duplicates of things they don't need) or requiring they go on the secondary market to deal with box splitters and re-sellers (or force people to convert the minis themselves, which is easier said than done given that they don't do much in the way of conversion bits). But instead of fixing their unsustainable and insane release model, they're just going to discontinue people's armies, or shunt them to different factions, or just outright get rid of them altogether.
Just like the release of N3 itself, it feels like their complete redesign when CAD sculpting and the scale shift came along was a wasted opportunity for a real revision of how things were done. Now a few years on from the revamp and it feels like they need to revamp again before we just end up having another cycle of the issues that brought us here in the first place.
I'll be honest, I was starting to get a glimmer of hope with the IA reveals, but after a few recent decisions on CB's part, I'm closer to washing my hands of them now than I was back when Uprising hit. They just make it so tiring being a fan of their games that I'm not sure I can be any more.
I have a feeling all this ire will dissolve when new IA, Shas, & Varuna all drop.
I'll probably regret asking this but...
For all the outrage here, how many people here actually play ASA as their primary and will be effected by the SKUs getting discontinued?
Everyone who plays them now likely has everything they want already or will be able to get anything they had held off on for at least another year.
This isn't like the death of the exrah folks, they aren't being squatted.
I'll probably regret asking this but...
For all the outrage here, how many people here actually play ASA as their primary and will be effected by the SKUs getting discontinued?
Everyone who plays them now likely has everything they want already or will be able to get anything they had held off on for at least another year.
This isn't like the death of the exrah folks, they aren't being squatted.
I play ASA, and have done so since 2013. This means I have pretty much all I need, so I'm not really affected. I never did get the new starter, because it had no appeal for me. I never got a Dragoe. Meh.
ASA needed/wanted a resculpted Montesa Combi, a resculpted Guarda de Assalto, and the Regular hacker. Kirpal SIngh could be resculpted. Everything else is up to date, or not slated to go OOP.
Mysterio wrote: ...as usual, not sensing too much actual 'outrage' here, and painting it as such seems to be doing legitimate concerns and criticisms a disservice.
CB needs to figure this stuff out sooner rather than later.
This. There have been some good suggestions on how this could have been handled in this thread, and we know CB do pay attention to forums, so finger crossed they take some on board.
I have a feeling all this ire will dissolve when new IA, Shas, & Varuna all drop.
I'll probably regret asking this but...
For all the outrage here, how many people here actually play ASA as their primary and will be effected by the SKUs getting discontinued?
Everyone who plays them now likely has everything they want already or will be able to get anything they had held off on for at least another year.
This isn't like the death of the exrah folks, they aren't being squatted.
Its not really about SAA. Its about all the other sectorials. Do I need to worry about USAriadna getting dumped? What about ISS? Or Military Orders? Or Qapu Khalqi? Onyx Contact Force? etc...
Grey Templar wrote: Its not really about SAA. Its about all the other sectorials. Do I need to worry about USAriadna getting dumped? What about ISS? Or Military Orders? Or Qapu Khalqi? Onyx Contact Force? etc...
Yes. Everybody panic! Corvus Belli is going to replace all the models in the game with My Little Ponies! And not the good ones either!
They took the JSA out of Yu Jing, and while it upset the apple cart for a little bit, it turns out that it didn't kill the game and it ultimately wasn't that bad. Removing an unpopular sectorial or two isn't exactly a doomsday scenario here.
Grey Templar wrote: Its not really about SAA. Its about all the other sectorials. Do I need to worry about USAriadna getting dumped? What about ISS? Or Military Orders? Or Qapu Khalqi? Onyx Contact Force? etc...
Yes. Everybody panic! Corvus Belli is going to replace all the models in the game with My Little Ponies! And not the good ones either!
They took the JSA out of Yu Jing, and while it upset the apple cart for a little bit, it turns out that it didn't kill the game and it ultimately wasn't that bad. Removing an unpopular sectorial or two isn't exactly a doomsday scenario here.
People's perception is what is important here. CB is sending a bad message by showing they can and will shelve a sectorial. It doesn't build confidence in the game when your customers know that if they pick something that is unpopular they are at risk of not seeing any further releases.
JSA getting moved to another faction is nothing like this. Because for starters they got a LOT of new profiles, and the dedicated JSA players weren't the ones who got screwed. It was the Vanilla Yu Jing players who had a mixture of JSA and other Yu Jing. Now they can't use their JSA models in their Yu Jing lists anymore. However from the general atmosphere most people who played Yu Jing were either hardcore into the Japanese profiles or didn't really do anything with them much at all. So it was a relatively clean break. And they can still buy JSA models if they want to play Japanese.
Thats not the case with SAA players, and anybody else whose sectorial will get shelved in the future. They're looking at never getting anything new, and even the stuff that exists now won't be getting produced. New players will look at the SAA rules on Army and may want to play, but find that they can't get the models anywhere without paying exorbitant prices because they are OOP.
I get it. Change is bad. Yeargh! Change! So frustrating!
I'm just having a hard time mustering up the outrage over something so predictable. SAA isn't that popular and it hasn't gotten nearly the support that most of the other sectorials haven't gotten. If you had to drop a sectorial from Infinity, it's the one to drop. Hell, I forgot it even existed for a while there. And so did you, and you know it.
CB is probably going to make some other changes to game in the near future. Just a warning. Don't want you to be blind sided again.
Shock Army of Acontecimento
6
KNIGHT OF MONTESA Lieutenant Spitfire, Chain-colt / Breaker Pistol, Shock 
AKAL COMMANDO Hacker (Assault Hacking Device) Combi Rifle / Pistol, E/M 
REGULAR (Sapper) MULTI Sniper Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (1.5 | 22)
Military Orders
JOAN OF ARC Lieutenant MULTI Rifle, Nanopulser / Pistol, 
CRUSADER MULTI Rifle + Light Flamethrower / Pistol, Knife. (0 | 31)
BLACK FRIAR (Albedo, Biometric Visor L1) MULTI Rifle, Nanopulser, Drop Bears / Pistol, 
KNIGHT HOSPITALLER 
SPEC. SERGEANT Hacker (Hacking Device) Combi Rifle / Pistol, Knife. (0.5 | 21)
business decisions.