Here some rumours from Warseer, mostly by stickmonkey. Take all the salt you need, but these are 4 independent sources:

stickmonkey wrote:Been a long time, but I have a small item to add into the rumor mill
I'm hearing that there is a IG mini release being planned soon, I expect it to be Q1 2012 and be in a mixed release month.
Items I hear are the long rumored stormtrooper plastics. Plastic hydra, and possibly another chimera based kit.
Still a ways off, but ive had multiple sources mention it recently.
Cheers!
(...)
Just to add some fuel, I'm sure everyone knows forgeworld no longer sells the hydra upgrade, only the full kit, as it is based on the old chimera models...doesn't mean anything really, I suppose...
(...)
I haven't heard anything specific about twc (=Thunderwolf Cavalry), just what's been circulating everyone else has heard.
But what I have heard doesn't make them seem likely until 2012...

BramGaunt wrote:Afaik it's actually 3 kits, stormtrooper/veteran soldiers, hydra, Griffon (with colossus and medusa options), plus some finecast updates. Hydra is supposed to look a little different from the FW one.

anselminus wrote:yes i heard thats rumour for IG too!

Captain Ventris wrote:I've heard the same, platic storm troopers, hydra kit and a siege mortar kit to build the griffon, collosus, and medusa
Supposedly due out for february 2012

Nice! To little too late for my guard forces, but woohoo! all the same.

The Medusa would be great - armageddon closed variant.. even better!

I really hope if they release the Storm Trooper plastic kit, that it'd be like the oldschool one with berets.

IG needs more beret heads from official kits

I thought I heard the plastic storms/hydra over a year ago. Wonder what designs they have in mind

Interesting about a combined mortar kit though

Please be true!!!! Thank kroot for enlightening us.

Oh this may turn out to be my salvation from FW after all. But on a more serious note, why on earth dose it take so long for GW to come out with plastic moddels for Strom troopers and other key parts for Ig?

It does seem strange. Whenever I play guard, I find vets an stormtroopers to be very usefull, despite there being very few models for them.

Because vets can just be regular guardsmen with different heads, unique paint job, different bitz and bobs on them, and carrying lots of melta.

Sotrmtroopers have carapace armor, and hotshot lasguns with cable fed powerpacks, which are a little harder to convert.

I would guess they didn't put them out originally because they realized no one would buy stormooper plastic with the bad (according to some) rules. If they reworked the box to make them into both ST and veterans, with lots of bitz, head options, etc., then they'll sell lots more boxes.

Trondheim wrote:Oh this may turn out to be my salvation from FW after all. But on a more serious note, why on earth dose it take so long for GW to come out with plastic moddels for Strom troopers and other key parts for Ig?

Ask a Tyranid player where half their Codex is next time you think that.

Eaten by squats

Last concept I saw of the plastic Stormtroopers had them in the vein of the Stormtrooper Chimera Commander that FW sells.

Which is to say, thankfully, that they look very similar to Kasrkin.

Kanluwen wrote:Last concept I saw of the plastic Stormtroopers had them in the vein of the Stormtrooper Chimera Commander that FW sells.

Which is to say, thankfully, that they look very similar to Kasrkin.

Incoming groans of "More cadians?"

But I checked up on FW, and this guy looks exactly like any normal cadian. No idea what makes him a storm trooper

kenshin620 wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:Last concept I saw of the plastic Stormtroopers had them in the vein of the Stormtrooper Chimera Commander that FW sells.

Which is to say, thankfully, that they look very similar to Kasrkin.

Incoming groans of "More cadians?"

Could care less. The Cadians, by far, look the best of the 'normal' GW Guard range.

But I checked up on FW, and this guy looks exactly like any normal cadian. No idea what makes him a storm trooper

He has carapace armor on. That's why he's a stormtrooper.

I'm guessing the reason it took GW so long to produce these plastic kits (should the rumour prove to be true) is because there is easily parts available to make both Stormtroopers and Vets......not to mention Kasrkin = Stormtroopers, or those atrocious metal ones they produce.

This would be a cool release.

Here's hoping they won't be singy with the meltaguns.

I'm excited for all these things. Given GW's rumor lockdown, I'm amazed to hear any rumors at all.

Plastic stormtroopers would definitely make my day, particularly if they come with the requisite options to represent Guard or Inquisitorial forces (i.e. funny hats). And ideally the option of boltguns too.

I do not really see how a single kit could cover all the aspects of IG vets and stormtroopes in one kit without looking too biased for cadians (presuming they go in the kaskrin direction)

All I can say is, gasmasks please!!

I love kasrkins, love them to death but I have an undercoated squad that makes me groan every time I think of painting it because they're metal.

Please let these rumours be true! I'll be a good girl, I promise!

Kroothawk wrote:Eaten by squats

I love you Kroot...
...didn't they have plastic stormtroopers ala the starter box marines when they came out? and what happened to the Griffon model? I have one.... aroooo sooo confused.

Uktabi wrote:

Kroothawk wrote:Eaten by squats

I love you Kroot...
...didn't they have plastic stormtroopers ala the starter box marines when they came out?

Yea, the very first storms were actually plastic and instead of helmets, they wore berets

I loved those minis.

Hey, if it's true, then great. Otherwise I'm not sure why anyone continues to give Stickmonkey a fair shake after that summer of fliers business.

Kanluwen wrote:
He has carapace armor on. That's why he's a stormtrooper.

Wow, thats boring. I'd much prefer the current visualization of the STs, just in plastic.

bhsman wrote:Hey, if it's true, then great. Otherwise I'm not sure why anyone continues to give Stickmonkey a fair shake after that summer of fliers business.

Probably because it's been known for awhile that plastic Stormtroopers are done--they just have been sitting on them.

Las wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:
He has carapace armor on. That's why he's a stormtrooper.

Wow, thats boring. I'd much prefer the current visualization of the STs, just in plastic.

That IS the current visualization of STs.

My Praetorians and Squats will gladly accept any of the listed models, though the STs may get head-swapped with WW2 British Berets. Cuz yeah, Guard definitely needs more berets!

Thanks for the teaser Kroothawk!

Snarky wrote:I really hope if they release the Storm Trooper plastic kit, that it'd be like the oldschool one with berets.

IG needs more beret heads from official kits

Y'know Westwind will sell you all the beret heads you need.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Kroothawk wrote:Eaten by squats

Kroot wins the thread.

And all threads within d6"

Kanluwen wrote:

bhsman wrote:Hey, if it's true, then great. Otherwise I'm not sure why anyone continues to give Stickmonkey a fair shake after that summer of fliers business.

Probably because it's been known for awhile that plastic Stormtroopers are done--they just have been sitting on them.

You're using the word "known" quite wrongly there.

A new Griffon kit would be nice.

kenshin620 wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:Last concept I saw of the plastic Stormtroopers had them in the vein of the Stormtrooper Chimera Commander that FW sells.

Which is to say, thankfully, that they look very similar to Kasrkin.

Incoming groans of "More cadians?"

But I checked up on FW, and this guy looks exactly like any normal cadian. No idea what makes him a storm trooper

Isn't he a little short for a stormtrooper?

[Tips hat to warboss]

I'm very surprised at this, they have left it so long hat alternatives have prolly been sought limiting sales but this is welcOme news for me if true.

I am just happy to hear some rumors.... Thanks Kroothawk

ph34r wrote:

Las wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:
He has carapace armor on. That's why he's a stormtrooper.

Wow, thats boring. I'd much prefer the current visualization of the STs, just in plastic.

That IS the current visualization of STs.

These are outdated?



They're much better looking than that bore.

CadianCommander wrote:I love kasrkins, love them to death but I have an undercoated squad that makes me groan every time I think of painting it because they're metal.

Please let these rumours be true! I'll be a good girl, I promise!

really? is it because you find metal minis more difficult to paint or that the nostalgia of no more metal minis ever?

Las wrote:

ph34r wrote:

Las wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:
He has carapace armor on. That's why he's a stormtrooper.

Wow, thats boring. I'd much prefer the current visualization of the STs, just in plastic.

That IS the current visualization of STs.

These are outdated?



They're much better looking than that bore.

Better looking maybe, but with only a couple of body variants they are in serious need of an update

There is nothing wrong with these old "chaps" except that I never got around to painting them ALL to look IDENTICAL. I think they were a little too "uniform"

I had a metal heavy weapons team of these old GW stormtroopers, so I converted them into a sergent and a flamer, the loaders look fine, and I have a metal meltagunner to hopefully break up the monotony of the rest of the hellgunners a bit




although monotonous, these old collectables should look great alongside their Catachan brother lasmen.
It's a project, but one that excites me even more about new plastig stormtroopers.

If you say "unit X that is in the Codex but doesn't have a kit yet is getting a kit soon" for long enough you will eventually be right.

meh i really disliked those fricking kasrkin models as stormtroopers, it hey didn't look for a second that they could survive in a vacume like the 3rd ed ones could. I would have preferred to use em as vet in carapace armour. but meh only have steel legion and arbite snwoadays

While I am posting my unfinished Stormtroopers, I might as well show my Kasrkin, these seemed too cadian-ish for my Catachan tastes, so I started turning them into Inquisitorial Stormtroops (based on the old witch hunters codex), I'm not sure what to do with them now


it was a half-baked idea, but tbh, I never liked this sculpt, or the cadian look, althogh I bought a ton.

If these rumors are true, my Adeptus Mechanicus Guard army is going to receive some significant reinforcements. Curses, and I thought I had a clear run at finishing my Dark Eldar without distractions!

For obvious reasons I'm hoping for the "hooded" Stormtrooper variant over the rather bland Kasrkin.


Also,

Kroothawk wrote:
Eaten by squats

Kid_Kyoto wrote:
Kroot wins the thread.

And all threads within d6"

I second this motion.

Agamemnon2 wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:

bhsman wrote:Hey, if it's true, then great. Otherwise I'm not sure why anyone continues to give Stickmonkey a fair shake after that summer of fliers business.

Probably because it's been known for awhile that plastic Stormtroopers are done--they just have been sitting on them.

You're using the word "known" quite wrongly there.

Actually, I'm not.

It's been "known" for awhile that plastic Stormtroopers are done. We saw the concept model(Stormtrooper Sergeant with a shotgun) as long ago as 2007 or 2008. Before the Guard Codex redo.
By any standard of reasonable decision making, it makes sense that it's done and I have no problems saying that they are.

I don't understand how people can think that

looks more "characterful" than

I hope they never do anything with the old Stormtroopers personally. They look like crap and they never fit the army's aesthetic.

The old ones are better, Kasrkin are just that: up-armoured Cadians. They work for Cadian armies, not Guard armies as a whole. Storm troopers are supposed to look like they are support from outside the regiment.

The Kasrkin are awesome. I own 65 of the damned things, and they're the bestest greatest Storm Troopiest Storm Troopers ever made.

My only hate for kasrkin comes from that there are no plastic tri helmets in any IG set so you'll either have to buy FW or chop off kasrkin heads. Whats wrong with helmets GW?

H.B.M.C. wrote:The Kasrkin are awesome. I own 65 of the damned things, and they're the bestest greatest Storm Troopiest Storm Troopers ever made.

Absolutely 100% skippy, HBMC.

Kanluwen wrote:

H.B.M.C. wrote:The Kasrkin are awesome. I own 65 of the damned things, and they're the bestest greatest Storm Troopiest Storm Troopers ever made.

Absolutely 100% skippy, HBMC.

Yay, you two agree on something and the world is another step closer to oblivion!

Will be good timing if accurate, going back to Guard in the new year, and plastic Stormtrooper/vets would be very interesting.

kenshin620 wrote:My only hate for kasrkin comes from that there are no plastic tri helmets in any IG set so you'll either have to buy FW or chop off kasrkin heads. Whats wrong with helmets GW?

I'm not sure what you mean by "tri-helmets". Do you mean the ones with the respirators and tactical goggles?

I will also say that the Respirator Upgrade Packs are some of the stupidest best buys I've made from FW. You get not only fantastic looking heads(and save yourself countless man hours of work because no flesh to paint yaaay!)--you also get backpacks and stuff you can use to detail the interior(or exterior even!) of a Chimera with in the form of ammo boxes, stored demo charges, etc.

If the plastics are anything like those greens from a few years ago, happy-happy joy-joy indeed.

Excellent timing for me. Having recently been employed, finally, I might actually be up to thinking about Guard again by the time they come out. I like the more armored aesthetic and would be interested in doing an army of them (not a big fan of the Cadian models)

About frigg n time for the rest of the guard stuff.I hope they also make a Penal troopers set.

I'd doubt they make penals. Or if they did, probably use finecast since they're not that popular

dsteingass wrote:

CadianCommander wrote:I love kasrkins, love them to death but I have an undercoated squad that makes me groan every time I think of painting it because they're metal.

Please let these rumours be true! I'll be a good girl, I promise!

really? is it because you find metal minis more difficult to paint or that the nostalgia of no more metal minis ever?

She has a valid point in my opinion. I find metal is more prone to chipping during the painting process (I always drop a model at least once whilst painting it) and doesn't seem to hold the paint as well as the plastic.

I'm as happy as the next man with the thought of new Storm Troopers but its the new vehicle varients that have got my juices flowing. Been looking for a Collossus option for a while now.

Commander Cain wrote:

Better looking maybe, but with only a couple of body variants they are in serious need of an update

Oh I agree. Theres no reason they cant just make a plastic kit with that look, instead of making them boring Cadian clones.

Las wrote:

Commander Cain wrote:

Better looking maybe, but with only a couple of body variants they are in serious need of an update

Oh I agree. Theres no reason they cant just make a plastic kit with that look, instead of making them boring Cadian clones.

It is true that if GW pulled their act together and produced multipart plastic models along the line of the metal ST's we would be in for a treat, however, this is GW, who knows what they have planned!...

Commander Cain wrote:
It is true that if GW pulled their act together and produced multipart plastic models along the line of the metal ST's we would be in for a treat, however, this is GW, who knows what they have planned!...

They're gonna pull off another IG manticore arent they?

Kanluwen wrote:

Agamemnon2 wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:

bhsman wrote:Hey, if it's true, then great. Otherwise I'm not sure why anyone continues to give Stickmonkey a fair shake after that summer of fliers business.

Probably because it's been known for awhile that plastic Stormtroopers are done--they just have been sitting on them.

You're using the word "known" quite wrongly there.

Actually, I'm not.

It's been "known" for awhile that plastic Stormtroopers are done. We saw the concept model(Stormtrooper Sergeant with a shotgun) as long ago as 2007 or 2008. Before the Guard Codex redo.
By any standard of reasonable decision making, it makes sense that it's done and I have no problems saying that they are.

I don't understand how people can think that

Spoiler:

looks more "characterful" than

Spoiler:

I hope they never do anything with the old Stormtroopers personally. They look like crap and they never fit the army's aesthetic.

I rather like the old versions.

Also:

Kanluwen wrote:

I have no problems acknowledging that people have different ideas.

What I have a problem with is that everyone assuming that what they want is what everyone should want.

Alpharius wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:

Agamemnon2 wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:

bhsman wrote:Hey, if it's true, then great. Otherwise I'm not sure why anyone continues to give Stickmonkey a fair shake after that summer of fliers business.

Probably because it's been known for awhile that plastic Stormtroopers are done--they just have been sitting on them.

You're using the word "known" quite wrongly there.

Actually, I'm not.

It's been "known" for awhile that plastic Stormtroopers are done. We saw the concept model(Stormtrooper Sergeant with a shotgun) as long ago as 2007 or 2008. Before the Guard Codex redo.
By any standard of reasonable decision making, it makes sense that it's done and I have no problems saying that they are.

I don't understand how people can think that

Spoiler:

looks more "characterful" than

Spoiler:

I hope they never do anything with the old Stormtroopers personally. They look like crap and they never fit the army's aesthetic.

I rather like the old versions.

That's fine. I don't. I had some when I started my Guard army, and I hated them even then. When the Kasrkin released my FLGS at the time bought my old metal stormtroopers back from me and put the money towards Kasrkin.

Makes me wish I had the old FLGS still, as they'd likely let me trade my Kasrkin for plastics...

Also:

Kanluwen wrote:

I have no problems acknowledging that people have different ideas.

What I have a problem with is that everyone assuming that what they want is what everyone should want.

Fun fact: I originally was going to put something in there saying about "I'm aware of the irony that can crop up from this, so don't even bother quoting it, Alpharius!".

I should also add that those 'old' Stormtroopers in any modern context look terrible. They don't look like they have carapace armor, they don't look like they're specialist troops or anything like that.
They just look like they're generic scifi troops.

Right, still:

Kanluwen wrote:I have no problems acknowledging that people have different ideas.

What I have a problem with is that everyone assuming that what they want is what everyone should want.

Kanluwen wrote:
I should also add that those 'old' Stormtroopers in any modern context look terrible. They don't look like they have carapace armor, they don't look like they're specialist troops or anything like that.
They just look like they're generic scifi troops.

Generic sci fi is pretty advanced in terms of 40k

methinks imperial guard players are very easy to please these days...

"but look! he has slightly bigger armorplates, and a cable to his backpack! thats amazing! take my money!"

I like the old stormtroopers. They have tons of gear, spec-ops looking helmets, and serious looking guns. It also does not matter if they match aesthetic because stormtroopers all come from the same regiment that is distinct in itself.

H.B.M.C. wrote:The Kasrkin are awesome. I own 65 of the damned things, and they're the bestest greatest Storm Troopiest Storm Troopers ever made.

70 of them and some of my favourite miniatures too.

Plastic ones would be very nice. As would the Medusa, save me buying it from Forge World.

I think the old ones look great. They have that WWI chemical warfare, trench fighter feel. Their hotshots look deadly, and overall seem separate from being just another Cadian unit. Why do you want more Kasrkins? They already exist. If you want Kasrkins, buy Kasrkins.

I (and from what I can see, others) want stormtroopers. If we wanted Kasrkins, we would have bought the kits they already have.

alphaomega wrote:

H.B.M.C. wrote:The Kasrkin are awesome. I own 65 of the damned things, and they're the bestest greatest Storm Troopiest Storm Troopers ever made.

70 of them and some of my favourite miniatures too.

Plastic ones would be very nice. As would the Medusa, save me buying it from Forge World.

Same here - I'd love for there to be a proper, good looking, plastic Medusa model!

That would probably be the thing that would get me to get my guard army up to speed in 5th...

Las wrote:I think the old ones look great. They have that WWI chemical warfare, trench fighter feel. Their hotshots look deadly, and overall separate from being just another Cadian unit. Why do you want more Kasrkins? They already exist. If you want Kasrkins, buy Kasrykins.

I (and from what I can see, others) want stormtroopers. If we wanted Kasrkins, we would have bought the kits they already have.

Oh of course. Why Should GW make plastic GK? If we wanted GK, we would have bought the kits they already have.

Should I provide more examples?

Plus it is also ironic that you can still buy the old storms
http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?catId=cat440248a&prodId=prod810031a

This rumor is about an update on stormtroopers not kasrkins. Are you surprised that some of us dont want our stormtroopers to look exactly like kasrkins?

Im not saying the kasrkins dont deserve a plastic set. If GW decided to do that, fine, cool, great. But this is about stormtroopers and Im merely stating that some of us want them to retain a separate look considering theyre, you know, a separate unit.

Las wrote:I think the old ones look great. They have that WWI chemical warfare, trench fighter feel.

Uh no they don't. They look nothing like "WWI chemical warfare, trench fighters".

Their hotshots look deadly

No they don't. They look like Lasguns with a longer barrel, with the tips painted gold.

and overall feel separate from being just another Cadian unit. Why do you want more Kasrkins? They already exist. If you want Kasrkins, buy Kasrkins.

I (and from what I can see, others) want stormtroopers. If we wanted Kasrkins, we would have bought the kits they already have.

If you want stormtroopers, buy stormtroopers. They already exist. They're still for sale, and they're actually cheaper than Kasrkin for a 'squad' of 5($19.75 for the old Stormtroopers which is a box of the Veteran Sergeant and 4 hellgun equipped troopers. $14 for Special Weapon packs of 2 though).

Las wrote:This rumor is about an update on stormtroopers not kasrkins. Are you surprised that some of us dont want our stormtroopers to look exactly like kasrkins?

Im not saying the kasrkins dont deserve a plastic set. If GW decided to do that, fine, cool, great. But this is about stormtroopers and Im merely stating that some of us want them to retain a separate look considering theyre, you know, a separate unit.

I was merely pointing out the irony in your post about "if they want X, then they should buy X" which is clearly possible for the old storm troopers

Also I bolded something I thought was funny since storms and kasrkins are, you know, the same unit game wise

Kanluwen wrote:
Uh no they don't. They look nothing like "WWI chemical warfare, trench fighters".

Their hotshots look deadly

No they don't. They look like Lasguns with a longer barrel, with the tips painted gold.

Right, uhm, as Alpharius has been doing, Im going to point you toward your own post...

Kanluwen wrote:I have no problems acknowledging that people have different ideas.What I have a problem with is that everyone assuming that what they want is what everyone should want.

Also, notice the emphasis in the following quote

Las wrote:I think the old ones look great. They have that WWI chemical warfare, trench fighter feel.

You cant just say "no it doesnt," you can say "No, I dont think they do," and maybe some form of discussion can continue.

Kanluwen wrote:If you want stormtroopers, buy stormtroopers. They already exist. They're still for sale, and they're actually cheaper than Kasrkin for a 'squad' of 5($19.75 for the old Stormtroopers which is a box of the Veteran Sergeant and 4 hellgun equipped troopers. $14 for Special Weapon packs of 2 though).

Thanks, tips. This thread is about the rumor of new stormtroopers, not new kasrkins. Cant you see why I would be rooting for the stormtroopers to therefore, not resemble kasrkins? As kasrkins arent what I want from my box of stormtroopers?

If you want new plastic Kasrkins, great, when a rumor thread pops up declaring that very thing on the horizon, I can tell you I wont be there declaring that they should look like stormtroopers.

kenshin620 wrote:
I was merely pointing out the irony in your post about "if they want X, then they should buy X" which is clearly possible for the old storm troopers

Maybe I should have said "if they want X, they should buy X, or wait for new X to be released, instead of insisting that Y become X"

Though I will admit I was mistaken, for some reason I had it in my head that Kasrkins had separate rules. My bad.

Las wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:
Uh no they don't. They look nothing like "WWI chemical warfare, trench fighters".

Their hotshots look deadly

No they don't. They look like Lasguns with a longer barrel, with the tips painted gold.

Right, uhm, as Alpharius has been doing, Im going to point you toward your own post...

Kanluwen wrote:I have no problems acknowledging that people have different ideas.What I have a problem with is that everyone assuming that what they want is what everyone should want.

And as I'm going to point you towards: GW is the one doing this. It's not just "what I want so that's what needs to be done", it's what they have been doing with the Imperial Guard line as they've been redoing it.
Look at the Imperial Guard line.
Ogryn--they've been given Cadian styled armor, Cadian styled fatigues, etc.
Ratlings--given Cadian styled fatigues as well. Don't believe me? Look at the cut of the tunic. It folds in exactly the same place as the Cadian's tunics do.
Master of Ordnance--Cadian styled fatigues, armor is cut in the same style as Cadian armor and given embellishment reminiscent of the Death Korps General.
Primaris Psyker--Cadian cut fatigues, breastplate done in the same vein as the Master of Ordnance.
Heck, even the crew chiefs manning the Heavy Bolters in the waist of the are wearing armor that looks remarkably similar to Cadian gear.

Also, notice the emphasis in the following quote

Las wrote:I think the old ones look great. They have that WWI chemical warfare, trench fighter feel.

You cant just say "no it doesnt," you can say "No, I dont think they do," and maybe some form of discussion can continue.

You can think that the old ones look great all you want. I have no problem with that, you like them and I like the Kasrkin. That's fine and dandy.
You're purposely clipping out part of what I said to try to prove a point. I said that they do not have a WWI chemical warfare or trench fighter feel.

Why did I say that? Because nothing about them harkens to WWI trench fighters--the armor is too compacted, and it's clearly designed to be worn as a composite chestplate.
The only thing that harkens to WWI and chemical warfare are the gas masks on some of the figures, and those style gas masks are still in use today.
Why? Because there's basically two kinds of gas masks you can make that actually function.
The classic 'bug eye' where you have the filter and two eye lenses on the mask and the 'faceplate' style you see today where it's a large rounded "visor" essentially that allows for much much better vision capabilities.

Kanluwen wrote:If you want stormtroopers, buy stormtroopers. They already exist. They're still for sale, and they're actually cheaper than Kasrkin for a 'squad' of 5($19.75 for the old Stormtroopers which is a box of the Veteran Sergeant and 4 hellgun equipped troopers. $14 for Special Weapon packs of 2 though).

Thanks, tips. This thread is about the rumor of new stormtroopers, not new kasrkins. Cant you see why I would be rooting for the stormtroopers to therefore, not resemble kasrkins? As kasrkins arent what I want from my box of stormtroopers?

I should take this chance to say that I didn't say "I want new Kasrkin!".
My exact quote, uncut and unedited, from the first page.

Kanluwen wrote:Last concept I saw of the plastic Stormtroopers had them in the vein of the Stormtrooper Chimera Commander that FW sells.

Which is to say, thankfully, that they look very similar to Kasrkin.

If you want new plastic Kasrkins, great, when a rumor thread pops up declaring that very thing on the horizon, I can tell you I wont be there declaring that they should look like stormtroopers.

Heh. I can tell you that if plastic Kasrkin were released, the least of the complaints will be "HOW DARE THEY MAKE PLASTIC KASRKIN!".

It will be "WTF CODEX CADIA!".

I think its important that the Stormtroopers get away from looking like Cadians... Karsikins are Cadia's home grown elites... my gripe is that Stormtroopers shouldn't look planet specific. IG have really moved away from their distinctly Imperial feel. The units that give the IG that characteristic are some of the most marginalized units in the army. Stormtroopers are least so, but that aspect of them coming from some where in the heart of the Imperium, rather than being raised on the local planet has been pretty much forgotten and not represented. In as much that a space marine looks exotic next to a guardsmen... to a similar degree so should stormtroopers. I think the Vostroyen give more of the intergalactic Imperium vibe than Karsikins... but I think something better suited could be imagined as well.

aka_mythos wrote:I think its important that the Stormtroopers get away from looking like Cadians... Karsikins are Cadia's home grown elites...

Agreed, to a point. Kasrkin are Cadia's hometown heroes, but right now Cadians are considered to be the 'standard' for Imperial Guardsmen. And when the Cadians need Stormtroopers, they field the Kasrkin.

my gripe is that Stormtroopers shouldn't look planet specific.

Agreed, wholeheartedly.

IG have really moved away from their distinctly Imperial feel.

I actually think that's not a bad thing myself, but I can understand why you want it returned.

The units that give the IG that characteristic are some of the most marginalized units in the army.

Again, I agree with this to a point. In the case of Ogryn, it makes sense that they kind of 'adopt' the characteristics of the regiments they serve with. They're supposed to be fairly imitative with a Bone 'Ead in charge.

Stormtroopers are least so, but that aspect of them coming from some where in the heart of the Imperium, rather than being raised on the local planet has been pretty much forgotten and not represented.

Considering I can't think of a time where they really "came from the heart of the Imperium" I have to disagree. Stormtroopers are raised by the Schola Progenium on worlds which range from hellish deathworlds to civilized parities of humanity at its peak, and the Progenium most definitely is an Imperial institution, but the Stormtroopers themselves are part of the Munitorum. When we get down to it, all their equipment will likely be done in a 'local' pattern based on where they're being brought in from wouldn't you think?

In as much that a space marine looks exotic next to a guardsmen... to a similar degree so should stormtroopers.

They should look exotic, but not so exotic that they don't fit in with the setting.

I think the Vostroyen give more of the intergalactic Imperium vibe than Kasrkins... but I think something better suited could be imagined as well.

I think the Vostroyans only do that because Blanche had a hand in designing the Vostroyans, and he's always been big on the kind of 'gothic' aspects of the Imperial Guard if that makes any sense. A lot of his artwork after the Vostroyans released also featured the Vostroyans or Guardsmen patterned to look like them, and most of it was meant to show generic unnamed regiments with him given free reign to do so.

I think the big problem will be that if this truly is a combined veteran/stormtrooper kit--then there's no avoiding a Kasrkin or Cadian feel.

Kanluwen wrote:
Why did I say that? Because nothing about them harkens to WWI trench fighters--the armor is too compacted, and it's clearly designed to be worn as a composite chestplate.
The only thing that harkens to WWI and chemical warfare are the gas masks on some of the figures, and those style gas masks are still in use today.
Why? Because there's basically two kinds of gas masks you can make that actually function.
The classic 'bug eye' where you have the filter and two eye lenses on the mask and the 'faceplate' style you see today where it's a large rounded "visor" essentially that allows for much much better vision capabilities.

Guh, youre being quite pedantic.

Go into your 5th ed codex to the Stormtrooper page and look at the artwork. Then look at this. Do you see where similarities can be made? How, in my opinion, I could see connection in influence when it comes to artistic style which matches up with my own personal taste? I realize its not exactly the same (obviously!) but your's isn't the impression I get from it, and I like it. If you dont agree, fine, but dont tell me my interpretation is wrong. Its insulting and frankly a terrible way to go about discussion.


Edit: link doesnt seem to be working so....

Yeah... no. Look, I'm not quite as pedantic as The Kan about this whole thing, but those older Stormies look nothing like the WWI guy. GW already made WWI guys - they're called Steel Legion and the Death Korp of Krieg.


I dislike those older Storm Trooper models because they look 'puffy', as in they are badly sculpted. The actual imagery that they have is fine - there are lots of pieces of artwork out there that use that design and they look great - but the models themselves have too many curves and not enough sharp angles. That's why the Kasrkin are amazing - they're clean cut with hard edges.

I'm sure if the old Stormies were redone in plastic a lot of those sculpting issues would vanish, and they'd look fine - and honestly they're proper Stormies, in that they look like no other regiment because Stormies aren't part of any regiment, they're a completely separate special forces from a completely separate organisation, the Scholar Progenium.

But if we're just talking about the models as they stand now, the Kasrikin are just superior (even if they are up-armoured Cadians).

Again, im not saying they look exactly like them. But I get that feel from them, and its part of the reason I like them, as I said. Its not the current storm sculpts I am defending per se, more the established aesthetic. I want the sculpts to be updated in plastic kits, I just want them to keep the overall look, it's not a complicated concept.

And really? Nothing like that pic? Also, do I have to point out the fact that theyre called "stormtroopers." There is obvious influence.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stormtroopers

These are also called Stormtroopers and look nothing like them, so let's not have a "it's all in the name" style argument.

In any case, Stormtroopers (or in the case of 40K, Storm Troopers) is more a description of their role.

Getting a little tense around these parts...

So, how about a plastic colossus? Wouldn't mind a couple of them for my army!

If the Stormtrooper/Veterans thing is true, then my natural assumption would be they'd be based on the Kasrkin as they look more like Cadians, thus the Vet part of the kit would fit in more.

Not saying I wouldn't mind updated versions of the older metal Stormtroopers, but in my mind, it seems most likely they'll go the Kasrkin route.

Of course I like the Kasrkin as well, so I really don't mind which way they go.

I don't care what the frakkin stormtroopers look like, I want sprues of meltaguns and shotguns and demo charges

I just hope they do the griffon. Thou I also hope that they don't release some cool vehicles, then change the 6th ed rules to scale them back.

kenshin620 wrote:


Oh of course. Why Should GW make plastic GK? If we wanted GK, we would have bought the kits they already have.

Should I provide more examples?

Because the old GK models didn't provide for the range of new wargear options available in the new codex.

If they give me plastic Kasrkin and make them cheaper then $41 and I'll be a happy camper.

Can we wait till we see them to argue how they should have looked?

For all we know they're plastic Vostreans.

Kid_Kyoto wrote:For all we know they're plastic Vostreans.

Oh god, GW would have all my money forever if they made plastic Vostroyans.

terrainguy wrote:

Kid_Kyoto wrote:For all we know they're plastic Vostreans.

Oh god, GW would have all my money forever if they made plastic Vostroyans.

Ha ha ha for me it´s like 3 years too late. I almost started Vostoryans until I checked the prices. But on the other hand some Clam Shell helmeted Storm troopers would be nice or even some head only for HWT conversions.

M.

Kid_Kyoto wrote:Can we wait till we see them to argue how they should have looked?

For all we know they're plastic Vostreans.

I would be even more excited for more affordable Vostroyans than affordable Kriegers.

Heh maybe since its "Storm Troopers", perhaps there would be Terrax Guard

By I agree, wait and see

Bicker, bicker...

Look, girls, if you want " special" troops with cables from weapon to backpack, try Ramshackle Games' Support troopers-- come with gas masks or bare heads, choice of weapons, right size etc.

If you want variety in your IG regiments, look around, there's plenty out there. I've just had a batch of Prince August "Warzone" Imperial infantry from ebay, at about £4 for 10 troops (ie a fifth of the cost of GW equivalents), again all with gasmasks, M16 lookalike guns, WW1 helmets, and a basic paint job makes them presentable as another IG unit.

The market's awash with 28mm figures, most at prices way below GW'S. Don't get me wrong, I like GW- the sculpting and moulding are great, they're fairly easy to kitbash, etc etc etc.
BUT if you want to field a horde army (like,errmm, IG), you want/need lots of troops, preferably at less than £7 each.

Here endeth the lesson......

Ahh but here is the predicament

Some people like/have to play at GW stores. They wont take kindly to 3rd party products

The market is not 'awash' very few plastic products out there and no one wants 20 pounds of pewter for an army

IG GENERAL wrote:Here endeth the lesson......

I'm guessing you were home schooled?

Las wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:
Why did I say that? Because nothing about them harkens to WWI trench fighters--the armor is too compacted, and it's clearly designed to be worn as a composite chestplate.
The only thing that harkens to WWI and chemical warfare are the gas masks on some of the figures, and those style gas masks are still in use today.
Why? Because there's basically two kinds of gas masks you can make that actually function.
The classic 'bug eye' where you have the filter and two eye lenses on the mask and the 'faceplate' style you see today where it's a large rounded "visor" essentially that allows for much much better vision capabilities.

Guh, youre being quite pedantic.

Go into your 5th ed codex to the Stormtrooper page and look at the artwork. Then look at this. Do you see where similarities can be made? How, in my opinion, I could see connection in influence when it comes to artistic style which matches up with my own personal taste? I realize its not exactly the same (obviously!) but your's isn't the impression I get from it, and I like it. If you dont agree, fine, but dont tell me my interpretation is wrong. Its insulting and frankly a terrible way to go about discussion.


Edit: link doesnt seem to be working so....

Spoiler:

I don't see it.

What I DO see with the 3rd ed Stormies is these guys with gas masks and packs:



As someone who owns 4 different styles of Stormtrooper(2nd, 3rd, Kasrkin, and DKoK Grenadiers), the 3rd ed haven't aged well.

Great news, plastic storm troopers would be great, been put off coughing up for the metal box set. But for conversion purposes this kit could be nice. I will keep my eye's on this, cheers Kroot.

Kanluwen wrote:Again, I agree with this to a point. In the case of Ogryn, it makes sense that they kind of 'adopt' the characteristics of the regiments they serve with. They're supposed to be fairly imitative with a Bone 'Ead in charge.

I'm ok with the different units being given militaristic looks... and admittedly ogryns don't look all that cadian at present... ratlings kinda... I'm just happy they got redone. For those two and even the rough riders... their form is as much a defining part of their exotic nature. So it doesn't need to be as showy in the way Stormtroopers need to be.

Kanluwen wrote:
Considering I can't think of a time where they really "came from the heart of the Imperium" I have to disagree. Stormtroopers are raised by the Schola Progenium on worlds which range from hellish deathworlds to civilized parities of humanity at its peak, and the Progenium most definitely is an Imperial institution, but the Stormtroopers themselves are part of the Munitorum. When we get down to it, all their equipment will likely be done in a 'local' pattern based on where they're being brought in from wouldn't you think?

I just mean "heart of the Imperium" as a more general way of saying that Stormtroopers, because their allegiance is suppose to be to the Imperium rather than any particular planet... don't necessarily get posted where they trained. So properly Imperium raised Stormtroopers, shouldn't necessarily look like the local grown "stormtroopers"... similar but not the same. Thats part of what makes them exotic. They be dress appropriate to their respective planet, but I imagine there would be more uniformity between Stormtrooper regiments than between the local grown regiments of any two given planets.

Consider the Adeptus Arbites... they also come from the Schola Progenium... and they are pretty uniformly equipped across the galaxy. Since they're primarily a paramilitary police force first... while Stormtroopers are frontline combatants, it seems reasonable that they'd be at least as consistently equiped as the Arbites, if not more so. Maybe that consistency and Imperial style has been emulated and they should look like Karsikins... but its simply not as colorful or as interesting as it could be.

Kanluwen wrote:They should look exotic, but not so exotic that they don't fit in with the setting.

Agreed.

Kanluwen wrote:I think the Vostroyans only do that because Blanche had a hand in designing the Vostroyans, and he's always been big on the kind of 'gothic' aspects of the Imperial Guard if that makes any sense. A lot of his artwork after the Vostroyans released also featured the Vostroyans or Guardsmen patterned to look like them, and most of it was meant to show generic unnamed regiments with him given free reign to do so.

I think the "gothic" aspect is something really lost on the Imperial guard. The army is so much an analogue for modern armies that they tend not to have as much of the ornaments or impracticalities that define the looks of all the other armies. They have them, just not to the same degree. Vostroyans work because from the ground up they were designed to capture that feel with their anachronisms. Cadians were never so intended... when they were concieved the notion was that the mixture of platoons from different planets would give the army its "from many world" feel.

Kanluwen wrote:I think the big problem will be that if this truly is a combined veteran/stormtrooper kit--then there's no avoiding a Kasrkin or Cadian feel.

I think this last idea of yours summarizes my concerns. Something else to consider is that GW seems insistent on supporting Catachan and they aren't exactly supported by a Kasrkin look. Its one reason I think ST should be a separate, but similar enough, style of IG.

aka_mythos wrote:

Kanluwen wrote:
Considering I can't think of a time where they really "came from the heart of the Imperium" I have to disagree. Stormtroopers are raised by the Schola Progenium on worlds which range from hellish deathworlds to civilized parities of humanity at its peak, and the Progenium most definitely is an Imperial institution, but the Stormtroopers themselves are part of the Munitorum. When we get down to it, all their equipment will likely be done in a 'local' pattern based on where they're being brought in from wouldn't you think?

I just mean "heart of the Imperium" as a more general way of saying that Stormtroopers, because their allegiance is suppose to be to the Imperium rather than any particular planet... don't necessarily get posted where they trained.

That's true, but that's also true for practically every Guard Regiment out there. They still are equipped based upon where they're raised/trained, as the worlds responsible for their training are also responsible for equipping them when that training is finished.
As time wears on though and the replacement gear that they have from the founding onwards, it's likely they'd start getting stuff that isn't really "localized" through the Munitorum.

So properly Imperium raised Stormtroopers, shouldn't necessarily look like the local grown "stormtroopers"... similar but not the same.

Ehhh. I can agree with this to a point, but I think it's kind of a sketchy subject. Most worlds don't actually have anything like "stormtroopers".
That's what makes the Kasrkin such a unique piece of the whole Cadian lore. They're trained in the same tactics as Stormtroopers and they can function as Stormtroopers if the need wills it, but what makes them so damned important to the Cadians is the fact that they're hard as nails and they know how to fight conventional wars alongside the Cadian Shock.
Bear in mind, I'm sure that you or someone else will bring up the point of the Death Korps Grenadiers or any of the Carapace Armored Regiments(Urdeshi, Volpone, Jantine, etc) but they are essentially "Stormtroopers Lite". They don't function in the same role as Stormtroopers--they just use the same basic equipment(Carapace and Hellguns).

Stormtroopers, in the sense of the actual Progenium's Stormtroopers, when we see them used by the Imperium at large are best used at the forefront of an attack or operating by themselves.

Thats part of what makes them exotic. They be dress appropriate to their respective planet, but I imagine there would be more uniformity between Stormtrooper regiments than between the local grown regiments of any two given planets.

I wouldn't. The local grown regiments of any two given planets might be supplied by the same Forge Worlds--which means, in all likelihood, their equipment would look similar enough that you'd be hard-pressed to tell the difference.

Consider the Adeptus Arbites... they also come from the Schola Progenium... and they are pretty uniformly equipped across the galaxy. Since they're primarily a paramilitary police force first... while Stormtroopers are frontline combatants, it seems reasonable that they'd be at least as consistently equipped as the Arbites, if not more so. Maybe that consistency and Imperial style has been emulated and they should look like Kasrkins... but its simply not as colorful or as interesting as it could be.

I think the Arbites are kind of a bad example. Their armor isn't meant to simply be practical, it's also meant to readily identify them as Arbites. If you look at police forces around the world, you can almost always recognize them as "Oh, that's a police officer!".

With soldiery, you can do the same but you won't necessarily recognize a designated marksman from a USMC platoon versus a designated marksman from a Russian Spetznaz unit. The only thing that will tell you that they're "marksmen" likely will be the guns having longer barrels, bipods, and bigger scopes.

Kanluwen wrote:They should look exotic, but not so exotic that they don't fit in with the setting.

Agreed.

This is one of those things where I think it's the hardest part to 'make it fit'. You can do so much with the concept of a "Stormtrooper", but how much of it actually makes sense for 40k?

Kanluwen wrote:I think the Vostroyans only do that because Blanche had a hand in designing the Vostroyans, and he's always been big on the kind of 'gothic' aspects of the Imperial Guard if that makes any sense. A lot of his artwork after the Vostroyans released also featured the Vostroyans or Guardsmen patterned to look like them, and most of it was meant to show generic unnamed regiments with him given free reign to do so.

I think the "gothic" aspect is something really lost on the Imperial guard. The army is so much an analogue for modern armies that they tend not to have as much of the ornaments or impracticalities that define the looks of all the other armies. They have them, just not to the same degree. Vostroyans work because from the ground up they were designed to capture that feel with their anachronisms. Cadians were never so intended... when they were conceived the notion was that the mixture of platoons from different planets would give the army its "from many world" feel.

You know, I've never really understood why people feel a Guard army needs to look like it represents every single world.
I don't begrudge people who want their army to look that way, but I've always felt it kind of detracts from the army as a whole.

Kanluwen wrote:I think the big problem will be that if this truly is a combined veteran/stormtrooper kit--then there's no avoiding a Kasrkin or Cadian feel.

I think this last idea of yours summarizes my concerns. Something else to consider is that GW seems insistent on supporting Catachan and they aren't exactly supported by a Kasrkin look. Its one reason I think ST should be a separate, but similar enough, style of IG.

I think depending on how they do the kit, you could easily have something that fits with Catachans.
The big problem with Catachans though is that when you compare them and their vests to the Cadians...even the least armored Cadians look like hardcore heavy troopers.
But carapace armor+bared forearms(not wholly bared arms or carapace armor zipped open or whatever), knives attached to the armor in such a way that it's easy to reach for wetwork, smaller shoulderpads, etc could work quite well for a 'Catachan Stormtrooper' I think.

Stormtroopers/Veterans plastic kit?

Oh please, let there be camo-cloaks to make some Tanith 1st and Only minis!


Ah, wishful thinking... What a great concept!

I'm with Las on this one. Give us some proper IG Storm Trooper upgrades. Although I like the look of the 3rd ed metals much more than the Cadians and their Kasrkin, you can tell when comparing the two that the STs are in sore need of a new sculp and/or plastic kit, whereas the latter look just fine (plastics will be welcome at any point, of course, but the Kasrkin models have some years in them yet, in my opinion).

Additionally, it's quite clear (in name, fluff, battlefield role and aesthetic) that the IG STs are conceptually based on the original German Stormtroopers (which is why they look right at home next to the DKoK and Steel Legion). To deny this is just being pedantic. Which brings me to me next point: in response to those saying the 3rd metals look "out of place in the IG", is simply not the case. Go look up some old IG battle reports (specifically the one with Steel Legion Mechanised vs. Necrons), painted up nice, they look fine - like special forces/shock troops, just as they should do.

For those who like the Kasrkin and not the current ST models, that's fine. But you need to understand that the Kasrkin are the home grown, Cadian-specific, Cadian-themed answer to the generalised ST regiment that most other IG regiments deploy. Therefore, obviously, they look right at home - with Cadians! They might even cut it for some players who like the Cadian look and are happy to field Kasrkin as "counts as" models for IG STs. However, for many others (like myself), I prefer the 3rd ed aesthetic, and think that a current ed sculpt would do wonders for that visual concept and we'd have some awesome looking minis.

Unfortuneately for myself and those who think like me, it appears that others may be right when they point out the current pattern of "Cadian-ifying" the IG codex in terms of minis. Personally, if they did plastics/updates of both STs and Steel Legion, they can have all my money! If they keep the IG the way it is, then I'll just have to keep on dreaming . . .

<thread terminated; please don't revive threads that are more than one month gone.>