Togusa wrote: That looks nothing like any Savage Ork model in existence. The mount looks way more modern. No way, that has to be something from the new line. Look at the shield.
It's got to be the new "warboss" on "squig-wolf-pig" from the Dominion box. The branded leg was yesterdays rumour-engine pic.
streetsamurai wrote: IMO, it would have been a lot more interesting to have a regular human army in that box instead of Stormcast.
Really disappointing (though expected) to see that they are doing the 40k model of always putting in the same army.
If it turns out to be something less than an ork in size and strength then, yeah, Stormcasts are going to look like a right bunch of bullies.
The Nighthaunts at least had an evil supernatural theme going for them, and most were brandishing large weapons such as glaives, long swords and scythes. The Stormcasts made sense with their "know no fear" advantage to stand firm.
If its Hobogoblins then it would be far less embarrassing to match them up with Cities of Sigmar.
Togusa wrote: That looks nothing like any Savage Ork model in existence. The mount looks way more modern. No way, that has to be something from the new line. Look at the shield.
It's got to be the new "warboss" on "squig-wolf-pig" from the Dominion box. The branded leg was yesterdays rumour-engine pic.
That's my feeling as well. The skin and round features of the mount point to something new and unique. I'm guessing it has a spear or staff + that shield with the tusks on it. Maybe some kind of mounted witch doctor character? The wait for this reveal is fricking killing me. I've been bored to death all day long.
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Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote: Sod it, went for the Book and Kragnos. A birthday present to myself.
Awesome! I'm hoping to pick mine up from the GW store today. We shall see if they have one!
streetsamurai wrote: IMO, it would have been a lot more interesting to have a regular human army in that box instead of Stormcast.
Really disappointing (though expected) to see that they are doing the 40k model of always putting in the same army.
If it turns out to be something less than an ork in size and strength then, yeah, Stormcasts are going to look like a right bunch of bullies.
The Nighthaunts at least had an evil supernatural theme going for them, and most were brandishing large weapons such as glaives, long swords and scythes. The Stormcasts made sense with their "know no fear" advantage to stand firm.
If its Hobogoblins then it would be far less embarrassing to match them up with Cities of Sigmar.
I think you're underestimating the new Ghurian Trogwollies®
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Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote: They won’t have it today, as it’s pre-order this week, on the shelves next week
My Sadness intensifies. This is the week I go to the city, my GW store is over 140 miles from where I live. :(
I think you're underestimating the new Ghurian Trogwollies®
Togusa, I have been known to be wrong on occassion. We could be looking at a Galaxy Quest rock monster situation...
For sure. I've done it too, being wrong about things. I think it's easy to dismiss because it's right up front with the rest of the old models for orks, but if you look at it on zoom it clearly looks like something new!
My eyes keep playing tricks on me as I keep being convinced I can make out a one eyes fanged snout of a Fimir on the back of what ever it is, which would be amazing - but I'm well prepared and expecting it to be a weird trick and my own forlorn hope fueling that interpretation.
I have to admit that each piece of Visions of Beasts rumour engine has made me less excited about Dominion. Putting Emperor's finest against some Goblin and monsters from a swamp doesn't sound very epic. The only redeeming feature I can think of is that Destruction armies are potentially fun to paint with Contrast paints.
There is good chance that I am going to be positively surprised today because my expectations are really low.
I miss the days when Warhammer reveals were at 9 am and not 1 pm. :/
Also, I hope that Turnskin beastman story is a hint of new beastmen. Morghur was teased a lot, but I'm hoping the other "named" people in it are future characters and not just random beastmen in a random story. Ghosteater sounds pretty cool, just based on his name.
Some nice abilities, but still, profile wise color me
disappointed.
Yeah, their profiles are not so great. But why is Synessa "the Slaanesh Sorceress" limited to 1 cast and 1 denial a turn. Dexcessa is supposed to be choppy character but is limited to red -2 and damage 2. Heres hopping that they're pointed appropriately. I still can't help but feel disappointed given how much GW hyped them.
Same here.
The Epitome is better at casting/dispelling than Slaanesh's progeny...
Well, Dexcessa is 280 pts , and Synessa is 260 pts. So profile, scale, and points wise they're basically buffed Daemon Princes rather than Greater Daemons.
The twins are interesting because lore wise they sound like they should be supremely powerful, yet in points and stats we are seeing them more as cheaper toolbox options rather than powerhouses. Which is a neat direction because it suggests that their power within Slaanesh is more political than it is just raw power.
I think it also makes them neat to add into the army as a concept; making them cheap to slip into armies rather than super expensive and having to mandate the whole army being built around them.
A lot of our larger models which are named characters are big, expensive models that require you to build your army around them every time. Nagash (as an extreme) is near 1K points; which means he doesn't field well in smaller games and has to be built around even at 2K games.
Tempted to grab Drycha's kit just because I like named characters, and this time around GW is limiting pre-orders to one per order to every new release this week.
Overread wrote: The twins are interesting because lore wise they sound like they should be supremely powerful, yet in points and stats we are seeing them more as cheaper toolbox options rather than powerhouses. Which is a neat direction because it suggests that their power within Slaanesh is more political than it is just raw power.
I think it also makes them neat to add into the army as a concept; making them cheap to slip into armies rather than super expensive and having to mandate the whole army being built around them.
A lot of our larger models which are named characters are big, expensive models that require you to build your army around them every time. Nagash (as an extreme) is near 1K points; which means he doesn't field well in smaller games and has to be built around even at 2K games.
Judging by the spoilers,
Spoiler:
The Witch Hunter duo manage to deal with them no problem, so it seems they aren't powerhouses in fluff either.
Overread wrote: The twins are interesting because lore wise they sound like they should be supremely powerful, yet in points and stats we are seeing them more as cheaper toolbox options rather than powerhouses. Which is a neat direction because it suggests that their power within Slaanesh is more political than it is just raw power.
I think it also makes them neat to add into the army as a concept; making them cheap to slip into armies rather than super expensive and having to mandate the whole army being built around them.
A lot of our larger models which are named characters are big, expensive models that require you to build your army around them every time. Nagash (as an extreme) is near 1K points; which means he doesn't field well in smaller games and has to be built around even at 2K games.
Judging by the spoilers,
Spoiler:
The Witch Hunter duo manage to deal with them no problem, so it seems they aren't powerhouses in fluff either.
Spoiler:
Indeed, which will be interesting to see GW play out lore wise since a lot of their gods and leaders are very military in how they rule. Even Sigmar, whilst he's not fighting much these days, is very powerful and able to use that force to enforce his will on his followers if need be. And the same is true of many of the other leaders, Nagash is perhaps one of the most ultimate and yet he got cast down a few rungs by being made half insane.
That the Twins might not have the magic/muscle to back up their political position within Slaanesh will be interesting to see how it plays out long term with the other greater demons. We already know that Pretenders have been fighting to secure the throne for themselves. Of course Chaos being Chaos every Slaanesh demon is already part of Slaanesh to start with so in a sense it also doesn't matter which wins or loses as its all Slaanesh.
Of course they are also newborn and new ot the Realms and GW might also have wanted to give the cities some sense of being able to stand up to the gods and powres of the world. So this might be less of the twins not being powerful and more trying to up the threat of regular mortals.
Just remember that in previews commenting is basically nuts - several thousand people trying to get a comment in at once even with the forced slowdown twitch does makes it somewhat of a mad situation
Also note if you don't have any twitch stuff you watch, but you do have Amazon Prime then you can sub through Amazon prime once a month for free
GaroRobe wrote: LOTR/World of Warcraft vibes on the new greenskins...
LOTR, can't see WoW at all here
At the picture in the end, when the commander is going kaboom, the greenskin at the bottom right just sort of makes me think of WOW. All the other ones in that painting look like Azog
At the picture in the end, when the commander is going kaboom, the greenskin at the bottom right just sort of makes me think of WOW. All the other ones in that painting look like Azog
Love the new proportions on those stormcast, really salvaged the original concept from it's wonky first iterations. They will make for a great conversion base.
WTF with the proportions of the Killaboss. Hes is 2/3 torso and 1/3 legs.
I'll eat my words. They aren't very much imaginative but I'm liking more the ork boys than the stormcast. I expected more gritty dark souls stormcast, the best models are the basic spearmen.
Galas wrote: WTF with the proportions of the Killaboss. Hes is 2/3 torso and 1/3 legs.
I'll eat my words. They aren't very much imaginative but I'm liking more the ork boys than the stormcast. I expected more gritty dark souls stormcast, the best models are the basic spearmen.
He's two Grots standing on top of each other, clearly.
Galas wrote: WTF with the proportions of the Killaboss. Hes is 2/3 torso and 1/3 legs.
I'll eat my words. They aren't very much imaginative but I'm liking more the ork boys than the stormcast. I expected more gritty dark souls stormcast, the best models are the basic spearmen.
He's two Grots standing on top of each other, clearly.
Galas wrote: WTF with the proportions of the Killaboss. Hes is 2/3 torso and 1/3 legs.
I'll eat my words. They aren't very much imaginative but I'm liking more the ork boys than the stormcast. I expected more gritty dark souls stormcast, the best models are the basic spearmen.
He's two Grots standing on top of each other, clearly.
It looks like all these guys have tiny legs...
I feel like sneaky orks need long gangly legs
Smaller legs and feet make less noise, obviously. Orky Thinking
Galas wrote: The spearmen even having tiny legs look much better proportioned and look better but the boss in the mount looks too ... strange.
Yeah, the small legs look fine to me.....on everything except the mounted boss. The proportions look way off. That's the only one of new Orcs I don't really like, specifically because of that.
Binabik15 wrote: The Hobgrots look terrible and they're the moat numerous. Bummer.
Yah. I really didn't like them. The orcs and stormcast both look superb though. (Though as noted, the legs of the mounted orc look really weird, at least from the angle the photo was taken.)
Galas wrote: The spearmen even having tiny legs look much better proportioned and look better but the boss in the mount looks too ... strange.
Yeah, the small legs look fine to me.....on everything except the mounted boss. The proportions look way off. That's the only one of new Orcs I don't really like, specifically because of that.
Well the mounted boss also has a skin(?) skirt which makes legs look shorter then it is. Could look better.
Here I was, looking forward to thoroughly enjoying the stormcast and not caring about the new orcs… But I really like their design. The sharp edges, the callback to the shields and armor of old, and the hobgoblins armor...I am liking them. Makes me feel better about the box set.
The stormcast spearmen gave me some vibes that didn't followed in the heroes. They look much more "old school" stormcasts to me.
Meh. If instead of swamp uruk hais we had receive 20 hobgoblins with Chaos Dwarfs units and a big bull centaur boss like the Executioner I would be all over this box, but after this I'm good with not buying it, even knowing it is limited like Indomitus.
Galas wrote: The spearmen even having tiny legs look much better proportioned and look better but the boss in the mount looks too ... strange.
Yeah, the small legs look fine to me.....on everything except the mounted boss. The proportions look way off. That's the only one of new Orcs I don't really like, specifically because of that.
Well the mounted boss also has a skin(?) skirt which makes legs look shorter then it is. Could look better.
That's true, It just looks strange to me. Might look better with more angles.
I get where the comments about LotR inspirations came from. There's also a fair bit of that unique Rackham whimsy in the orc line-up that's been creeping into GW visuals for a while now. I wonder if they got some former Rackham designers on the team.
Highlight is the Boss mount, the shaman, the SC standard bearer and the Praetors, especially the female one.
I'm loving some of the new stormcasts - the halberd and spearmen look great, and the Hobgrotz are wonderful.
The quality of the new orcs is amazing, but still not for me. The Hobgrots though... they are legit great.
However it's a bit of a relief that I'm not tempted to get the set.
I am kinda hopeful they do smaller starter sets like the did for 40k. A set that combines the halberd guys and the spearmen would be perfect for me. Or a warcry/underworlds warband, perhaps might scratch the itch to model with them.
CMLR wrote: Reminder: this is a launch box for the edition, not the proper starter boxes.
It stinks, but I would expect they to limit the order like the last time or right now with the last batch of pre-orders for Broken Realms bundles.
I imagine if it goes out of stock to quick and people are vocal enough, they may do a made to order like Indomitus. And you could get the reprinted Indomitus for quite a while after it was put out.
Also worth stating, that this will sell considerably less copies than Indomitus, just by virtue of not being 40k. So hopefully it will be available for quite a while.
Chaos Dwarfs are already popping up in AOS lore, way before this latest and greatest tease.
"Another of the attendees was shrouded in all-concealing robes and a
hood, with a strange, segmented mask hiding their face. The facets of the
mask were marked with what might have been duardin runes, though not
ones Bok recognised. The runes glowed dimly..."
"On the stage was a long table, and upon it were various objects of interest:
a loose pile of thin volumes, obviously a set of some sort; a gruesome, bull-shaped icon that bore all the hallmarks of duardin craftsmanship..."
"The stranger in the segmented mask claimed the grotesque, bull-shaped icon
with a sizeable bid of two thousand comets."
Love the new Stormcast that are coming out after the box too. Probably would have been better the release the ETB Orc kits first as Stormcast have......a lot of choices....
As much as I was hating on the skinny orc from the CGI I have to admit that the kruleboyz are a refreshing reimagining of the Orc.
Stormcast are cool too and I'd have loved it if these were the first stormcast models, but I really resent them being Primaris'ed in like 3 years of their introduction.
frankelee wrote: I try, but I simply can't relate to how anyone could want those Stormcast models.
Tried imagining them on different colours?
Not going to lie, Stormcast look fantastic in Teal, Purple, or Black. Until I saw them in different colors in 2nd edition, I never really was a fan of them in gold or silver.
I wonder if that marks the end of GW gorilla orcs. They haven't.got anything since their release, and it would be surprising if the get anything in the near to mid future considering all the love the kb will get
- They limit the release like they did for Indomitus. Given that AoS is still not dominant over 40K, I expect it will not sell out as quickly.
- To win the lottery before they release this.
Wow..... what a boring looking boxed set. The stormcasts look like statues, the orcs look completely jarring visually from what has been established so far in AoS for greenies. Everything seems overdone to me. These orruks also look like they will tower over ironjawz, who I thought were supposed to be the hardest of the lot. It’s just a really abrupt visual change on top of being super busy , but somehow not at all interesting to look at. Glad for those excited about this, but an easy pass for me.
Nice looking LoRT Orcs, but for AoS i'd rather they'd marketed and painted them all as hobgoblinz,
as I think they're too distinct from the rest of the Orcs (not bad, just they really look like a different species, especially with their odd proportions being distinct from the existing Orcs odd proportions)
OrlandotheTechnicoloured wrote: Nice looking LoRT Orcs, but for AoS i'd rather they'd marketed and painted them all as hobgoblinz,
as I think they're too distinct from the rest of the Orcs (not bad, just they really look like a different species, especially with their odd proportions being distinct from the existing Orcs odd proportions)
Agreed. In fact i would have like them to be a bit more fishlike and be a completely different race. As is, they are cool models, but a bit boring
The new Orks look like a right pain to paint, just so much going on. Personally I think they would look a bit better with a darker green or red skin tone.
ListenToMeWarriors wrote: The new Orks look like a right pain to paint, just so much going on. Personally I think they would look a bit better with a darker green or red skin tone.
I thought more pale green could work.
Not big fan on shields however. Works on heroic guys but not on rank and file (and I mean spear guys).
ListenToMeWarriors wrote: The new Orks look like a right pain to paint, just so much going on. Personally I think they would look a bit better with a darker green or red skin tone.
I thought more pale green could work.
Not big fan on shields however. Works on heroic guys but not on rank and file (and I mean spear guys).
I'm thinking the shields would look good painted the same color as the shield Kragnos carries:
ListenToMeWarriors wrote: The new Orks look like a right pain to paint, just so much going on. Personally I think they would look a bit better with a darker green or red skin tone.
I thought more pale green could work.
Not big fan on shields however. Works on heroic guys but not on rank and file (and I mean spear guys).
I'm thinking the shields would look good painted the same color as the shield Kragnos carries:
Spoiler:
Not bad idea but I am leaning towards shields similar to what current Gor kit has.
Spoiler:
Those are fairly big, looks like they are made from scrap and matches authentics quite well.
And back from reality and catching up on the preview - I have to say I'm not an Ork fan nor much of an Orruk fan. I've loved them in lore and stories and computer games, but I've never wanted them as an army over the years. That said these new Cruelboyz I really do love. There's a deadly smartness to them that speaks of cunning and deadly intent. THESE Are the greenskins of your nightmares.
Note the jovial madness of the gitz nor the bash-smash brutality of Orruks. These are the dark swampy monsters that come for you in the dark of night. That strike without fear; that stab you through the chinks in your armour and wear down your defences with precision strikes. All the brutality of an ork with all the cunning of - dare I say it - almost a human or aelf.
I love them as a concept and if I ever collect greenskins these would be the ones for me!
Stormcast are great and whilst their army gets a bit more bloated the new designs are very sweet. A degree of elegance to them now, even the hounds are looking very sleek and deadly. The new chariot is awesome and makes me jealous that they get it (DoK need a chariot!)
Great preview and whilst neither army is "mine" to collect I'm greatly looking forward to seeing the future. I will have to keep an eye out when the new boxed set goes on sale and see if I can snag a cheap secondhand split box copy of the rules at some stage.
Right I collect destruction and stormcasts so this box ticks all boxes...Well not quite.
Im not sure I want another flavour of Orc, they seem to have blended the black goblins with orcs since these share aesthetic of both ( which would be cool if they stopped there) But they introduced LOTR references and somehow these look more 3d STL file typical lack of character models than the previous races I mentioned. They look extremely boring to paint up.
Believe it or not the only redeeming thing of these models are the yellow hobgoblins troops... those are freaking unique and different in a good way since they are their own thing.
Stormcast FRICK me! All of this are just the perfect range extension we needed. No faults there, every single model is what I wanted.
So its a mixed bag for me and its not impulse buy for sure...which means, being limited edition + me not ordering in the first 15 minutes of preorder = no box for me.
Good box I love 60% of it but due to GW new boxset limited shenanigans, I will pass. This box would be something I would buy myself as an extra, later on in the year just for the bits I like.
By the time they release the split typical 3 boxes Im probably looking to something else also. I don't think the Orcs will age well with me so I will probably like them less down the line.
In my small bubble I would rather see things like a full hobgoblin army like those yellow fellas, or expansions to what we already have in destruction like spider gobs, savage orcs. Not this blend of concepts.
I hope people enjoy this box though.
Any prices yet?
Also we can expect that the new Orks will get the same treatment that Necrons and Nighthaunt got - so a pretty fast turn over of new models (corona delays might be factor of course) and fleshing out of their army. Which is a great thing for a new army to launch into life with a big injection of fresh models.
Overread wrote: Also we can expect that the new Orks will get the same treatment that Necrons and Nighthaunt got - so a pretty fast turn over of new models (corona delays might be factor of course) and fleshing out of their army. Which is a great thing for a new army to launch into life with a big injection of fresh models.
I agree, this seems very likely. I am curious to see what sort of army they are. They have Gitmob-style sidekicks and a new type of Troggoth. I wonder if they will have units of them too or if those will be their own factions.
I am thrilled that they teased the Furnace Kings of Azgorh. I've wanted them for ages.
Another overhaul of Orc models.... They look great tbf, very inspired by the Hobbit orcs and goblins it seems, but still, look great.. It's just a strange overhaul for me in terms of need/requirement.
ListenToMeWarriors wrote: The new Orks look like a right pain to paint, just so much going on. Personally I think they would look a bit better with a darker green or red skin tone.
I thought more pale green could work.
Not big fan on shields however. Works on heroic guys but not on rank and file (and I mean spear guys).
Agree that a really pale green would work.
I'm not a fan of the bright red, but I'm absolutely sure that brimey and oiley colours are going to look 10/10
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ScarletRose wrote: I didn't expect the winged stormcast leader to be part of the box.
I'm definitely picking one up, when are the preorders supposed to be?
Again, I'm pretty sure they confirmed her to be part of the deal.
Just a point about the limited natures. Surely those comparing it to Imdomitus must remember that GW did a brief Made-to-Order after release for those that missed it on the day. Should we expect the same this time?
DeadEyeDuk wrote: Just a point about the limited natures. Surely those comparing it to Imdomitus must remember that GW did a brief Made-to-Order after release for those that missed it on the day. Should we expect the same this time?
No. There is no guarantee of a 'Made to Order' so plan appropriately.
I gotta admit, I really like the new hobgoblins (and the yellow skintone works really well).
Fingers crossed that if/when GW decides Chaos Dwarfs need to return, I hope you can take Hobgrot Slittas as part of your force. That would pull me back into the gaming aspect in a heartbeat!
DeadEyeDuk wrote: Just a point about the limited natures. Surely those comparing it to Imdomitus must remember that GW did a brief Made-to-Order after release for those that missed it on the day. Should we expect the same this time?
MTO was made in response to the speed of the sell out and the outcry afterwards. Hopefully they've produced more so won't need it this time 'round. But the box is fantastic, will be getting it and trading the boyz half for Stormcast.
DeadEyeDuk wrote: Just a point about the limited natures. Surely those comparing it to Imdomitus must remember that GW did a brief Made-to-Order after release for those that missed it on the day. Should we expect the same this time?
No. There is no guarantee of a 'Made to Order' so plan approriately.
Yup. Besides they said on stream that once its gone its gone, even if they did plenty of boxes this time around.
If you want the box be sure not to wait for a potential 2nd run and just preorder.
DeadEyeDuk wrote: Just a point about the limited natures. Surely those comparing it to Imdomitus must remember that GW did a brief Made-to-Order after release for those that missed it on the day. Should we expect the same this time?
No guarantee, especially not after Cursed City. Presumably they're keeping their arses covered so that if it does sell out in literal seconds, they can say they're doing it to meet demand and get good publicity but on the off chance it doesn't, they're not in a position where they have to either.
I just recall that, in the UK at least, even after Indomitus sold out there were still copies floating around until the second printing. Granted some of that might have been people who ordered made-to-order copies not panicking, but I think that GW did have good stocks of it initially.
So I'm hoping they do well this time around - AoS isn't quite as big, but a 3rd edition should be big news and sell well
DeadEyeDuk wrote: Just a point about the limited natures. Surely those comparing it to Imdomitus must remember that GW did a brief Made-to-Order after release for those that missed it on the day. Should we expect the same this time?
No. There is no guarantee of a 'Made to Order' so plan approriately.
Yup. Besides they said on stream that once its gone its gone, even if they did plenty of boxes this time around.
If you want the box be sure not to wait for a potential 2nd run and just preorder.
Also reinforced by complaints from a bunch of stores that ordered in a ton of the made to order only for (scalper) customers to turn round and say they didn't want them after all since they were no longer limited enough to make resale at an inflated price easy,
Kanluwen wrote: That's something that I'll never understand.
Why would you let someone preorder something and not pay up front?!
Even if you pre-order you can still cancel an order. So stores likely took money and had to refund it likely didn't want to fight a debit or credit card reverse charge claim if they refused to refund. Some might charge a restocking fee, but its likely something rare enough for most smaller wargame stores that they likely don't have any kind of restocking or similar fee in place. It's just not a common enough thing for them to need a policy on it.
The two sprues with Killerboss Rider/Boltboyz/Banner and Yandrasta/Annihilators/Banner will most likely be exclusive to Dominion for some time and then be released like the Necron and Space Marine chars from Indomitus at a huge price mark up. If you want those, better get the Dominion box.
By comparing the Dominion box with Indomitus (and the Elite/Recruit boxsets), I come to this prediction for the upcoming startersets (after the limited Dominion Box is gone).
Late to the thread, but the new Orcs are fairly interesting. I'm a big fan of traditional Orcs and Goblins and I have a huge army of them, but I think this is a cool reimagining and I'm actually pretty happy they went for a new design. Some of the models are overly busy of course, most modern GW models are, and the names are cringey as feth, but I like the design overall and agree that these are more LOTR than WFB.
Gotta digest some more but I think fair play to them for giving us something that's "common Orcs and Goblins" but with a bit of a spin and interesting visual design.
Good on them for really going for it! AoS designs are often polarising, and sometimes I feel like they miss the mark, but these guys have hit it.
I probably won't get any though, all the same! I've enough Orcs and Goblins of various manufacture to keep me going for a long while yet. But I'm happy there'll be more cool greenskin armies in AoS that actually have the feel of a horde of orcs with a clear visual identity.
Overread wrote: And back from reality and catching up on the preview - I have to say I'm not an Ork fan nor much of an Orruk fan. I've loved them in lore and stories and computer games, but I've never wanted them as an army over the years. That said these new Cruelboyz I really do love. There's a deadly smartness to them that speaks of cunning and deadly intent. THESE Are the greenskins of your nightmares.
I'm glad you like them but the pictures I've seen so far have me concerned about proportions. Yes, I know it's fantasy and all but I just can't get past it. The Killaboss on Great Gnashtoof looks like someone stuck a megaboss' torso on a grot's legs. It's as if someone saw the Deadpool 2 scene with Wade standing on toddler's legs and said, "What a great idea for an army." I hope it's just bad camera angles but for now I think I'll pass.
Overread wrote: And back from reality and catching up on the preview - I have to say I'm not an Ork fan nor much of an Orruk fan. I've loved them in lore and stories and computer games, but I've never wanted them as an army over the years. That said these new Cruelboyz I really do love. There's a deadly smartness to them that speaks of cunning and deadly intent. THESE Are the greenskins of your nightmares.
I'm glad you like them but the pictures I've seen so far have me concerned about proportions. Yes, I know it's fantasy and all but I just can't get past it. The Killaboss on Great Gnashtoof looks like someone stuck a megaboss' torso on a grot's legs. It's as if someone saw the Deadpool 2 scene with Wade standing on toddler's legs and said, "What a great idea for an army." I hope it's just bad camera angles but for now I think I'll pass.
When they showed that mini, I couldn't stop looking at his stomach area because it looks like a tube or barrel.
A very nice boxset that delivers on its promise. Destruction players are in for some interesting additions while the Stormcast have bought some pleasant surprises of their own, especially the new Knights. AoS looks like its in good hands for the next three years.
Apart from a few Stormcast models, its not for me. Will most likely pick up the smallest starter set and then the Stormcast battletome and warscrolls when they drop. The Knight Judicator looks pretty cool too...
2nd edition was great for experimental game modes such as sky battles, AoS: Skirmish, create your own characters and solo-coop. It left 40K looking boring in comparison and I hope AoS doesn't go the same way.
Man I am really excited but also really worried. Whenever anyone says that their next thing is 'the best ever' the first question that comes to mind is 'so what's wrong with it?' And apparently no one has told GW that when EVERY edition and box set is is best ever, it comes across like someone trying to sell a shiny car with a fault engine. At least for me, but maybe that's just me being jaded and cynical.
I guess what I am trying to say is I would be much more excited if they DIDN'T call it the best ever, if they dialed back the hype language a bit. Let the rules & models speak for themselves more. The models are certainly doing quite a lot of sweet talk already...
they have stopped saying that the next release is the best thing since the moon landing, so they already dialed back
and of course they sell you a car with a faulty engine as double turns are still there and everything that they come up to "compensate" will be either meaningless or fuel the codex power creep
Nice looking models but really not for me, intrigued by the mention of expanding the narrative campaign system though. I think that is where the game really shines when playing with like minded people so anything that makes that better can only be a good thing in my eyes. I hope that if they are doing a repatch for points though it can be done in the GH book sooner rather than in BT later.
Da Boss wrote: Late to the thread, but the new Orcs are fairly interesting. I'm a big fan of traditional Orcs and Goblins and I have a huge army of them, but I think this is a cool reimagining and I'm actually pretty happy they went for a new design. Some of the models are overly busy of course, most modern GW models are, and the names are cringey as feth, but I like the design overall and agree that these are more LOTR than WFB.
Gotta digest some more but I think fair play to them for giving us something that's "common Orcs and Goblins" but with a bit of a spin and interesting visual design.
Good on them for really going for it! AoS designs are often polarising, and sometimes I feel like they miss the mark, but these guys have hit it.
I probably won't get any though, all the same! I've enough Orcs and Goblins of various manufacture to keep me going for a long while yet. But I'm happy there'll be more cool greenskin armies in AoS that actually have the feel of a horde of orcs with a clear visual identity.
Damn i think you nailed it for me. The models feel more Tolkien than warhammer.
ingtaer wrote: Nice looking models but really not for me, intrigued by the mention of expanding the narrative campaign system though. I think that is where the game really shines when playing with like minded people so anything that makes that better can only be a good thing in my eyes. I hope that if they are doing a repatch for points though it can be done in the GH book sooner rather than in BT later.
I would imagine we'll get a new edition of the Generals' Handbook along with Dominion much like we did with a new edition of Chapter Approved was released along with Indomitus.
The Orks? I like them. I think the models are very characterful and interesting. And I like them taking a fresh approach to what was previous a pretty homogenous race.
But? I don’t love them. I feel no particular desire to own them. And as a dyed in the wool slag for GW, that’s kind of a first for me,
ScarletRose wrote: I didn't expect the winged stormcast leader to be part of the box.
I'm definitely picking one up, when are the preorders supposed to be?
Some point in June, probably with a two week pre-order lead in like Indomitus had.
Have fun with the scalper bots.
Went by the Warhammer store today. Was told to expect preorder in mid june with a two week set. Then release at the end of the month. Customers being limited to one copy per visit (no, you can't go to your car and then walk back and count that as a second visit.). GW has also instituted some new online stuff to shut down scalpers, as it was explained to me if you add the set to your cart on preorder day, you must fully complete checkout before it will unlock your IP address for another order. In addition I was told they looked at pre order hype and ordered like 7 times what they expect to be the sales for the first week.
As for the models, I'm in love with them. These Kruel boyz are flipping amazing. They genuinely look terrifying, not silly like the IronJawz and Savage Orcs. I almost want to ditch my Orruck Warclans in favor of just these boyz. The Stormcast are way better than I expected, enough so that I'm finally gonna get that stormcast army I have always wanted. The new Troggoth and the Hobgoblins have to be my favorites so far.
The Orks? I like them. I think the models are very characterful and interesting. And I like them taking a fresh approach to what was previous a pretty homogenous race.
But? I don’t love them. I feel no particular desire to own them. And as a dyed in the wool slag for GW, that’s kind of a first for me,
Really? These are an instant buy for me. I loved hearing about how they hid from Chaos and now that that is over they're coming back. I especially like the description of them having elongated arms and legs because they run on all fours and stay low to the ground, hiding in the bog mists and waters. I think these look WAY better than the current ork line.
Upright Orks - interesting. I wonder if they are taller than Orruks?
One of the nice things about AoS is that it is allowing GW to reimagine core races in some novel ways - fish and cow elves, fire dwarfs and now swamp Orcs.
It’s something they really can’t do in 40K without being stormed by a horde of angry fans (admittedly including me).
To be fair, i largely missed the stream, as my friend and her kids were over and they got tore into my Transformers (with permission of course!)
I’ve of course seen the models, but didn’t get the chance to hear the chit chat.
Don’t get me wrong. I definitely do not hate the models. And there’s precisely sod all wrong with them. They’re just leaving me a bit cold is all. I can’t really put my finger on why.
Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote: Don’t get me wrong. I definitely do not hate the models. And there’s precisely sod all wrong with them. They’re just leaving me a bit cold is all. I can’t really put my finger on why.
Honestly I feel much the same. Though I'm not an AoS fan so maybe for people who are, they'll get more excited.
I saw them and thought, those are nice looking models, but no I don't want to buy them and no I'm not excited.
For me I think part of it was I thought to myself "Those half orcs look like a fecking nightmare to paint". Having painted many Orcs in the past, I eschew ones that look like they'll be very fiddly to paint.
ScarletRose wrote: I didn't expect the winged stormcast leader to be part of the box.
I'm definitely picking one up, when are the preorders supposed to be?
Some point in June, probably with a two week pre-order lead in like Indomitus had.
Have fun with the scalper bots.
Went by the Warhammer store today. Was told to expect preorder in mid june with a two week set. Then release at the end of the month. Customers being limited to one copy per visit (no, you can't go to your car and then walk back and count that as a second visit.). GW has also instituted some new online stuff to shut down scalpers, as it was explained to me if you add the set to your cart on preorder day, you must fully complete checkout before it will unlock your IP address for another order. In addition I was told they looked at pre order hype and ordered like 7 times what they expect to be the sales for the first week.
As for the models, I'm in love with them. These Kruel boyz are flipping amazing. They genuinely look terrifying, not silly like the IronJawz and Savage Orcs. I almost want to ditch my Orruck Warclans in favor of just these boyz. The Stormcast are way better than I expected, enough so that I'm finally gonna get that stormcast army I have always wanted. The new Troggoth and the Hobgoblins have to be my favorites so far.
Really good to hear about those anti-scalper measures. As for ditching warclans in favor, I have some good news for you; the Great Waaagh! allegiance goes off the ORRUK keyword so you can mix these guys in as soon as you have the warscrolls.
Hobs are definitely my favorite as well, I want an army of THEM!
I'm a bit torn the new Stormcast. I like their sculpts overall but also don't think these would look as good as Stonecast. which was an aesthetic I liked for them.
Not sure what to think about the swampy boys yet tbh.
ScarletRose wrote: I didn't expect the winged stormcast leader to be part of the box.
I'm definitely picking one up, when are the preorders supposed to be?
Some point in June, probably with a two week pre-order lead in like Indomitus had.
Have fun with the scalper bots.
Went by the Warhammer store today. Was told to expect preorder in mid june with a two week set. Then release at the end of the month. Customers being limited to one copy per visit (no, you can't go to your car and then walk back and count that as a second visit.). GW has also instituted some new online stuff to shut down scalpers, as it was explained to me if you add the set to your cart on preorder day, you must fully complete checkout before it will unlock your IP address for another order. In addition I was told they looked at pre order hype and ordered like 7 times what they expect to be the sales for the first week.
As for the models, I'm in love with them. These Kruel boyz are flipping amazing. They genuinely look terrifying, not silly like the IronJawz and Savage Orcs. I almost want to ditch my Orruck Warclans in favor of just these boyz. The Stormcast are way better than I expected, enough so that I'm finally gonna get that stormcast army I have always wanted. The new Troggoth and the Hobgoblins have to be my favorites so far.
Really good to hear about those anti-scalper measures. As for ditching warclans in favor, I have some good news for you; the Great Waaagh! allegiance goes off the ORRUK keyword so you can mix these guys in as soon as you have the warscrolls.
Hobs are definitely my favorite as well, I want an army of THEM!
Yep! In general I'm extremely pleased with what I saw today and it makes my purchase of Kragnos feel even better!
I’m definitely feeling a bit mixed about the Kruleboyz. I like the unit with shields a lot but I’m not feeling the hobgrots at all. I just don’t like the heads or the helmets.
The Stormcast are fantastic. With each successive wave of minis they have got better. I really hope the rumours of Stormcast cavalry on sleek dragons are true.
I know im repeating myself, but im really disappointed that they took the marine approach with AOS by always including sce in the starter set. Would have been much more exciting to see a brand new race/army
streetsamurai wrote: I know im repeating myself, but im really disappointed that they took the marine approach with AOS by always including sce in the starter set. Would have been much more exciting to see a brand new race/army
If they were the origional style of stormcasts I'd feel the same way, but given the new look I don't mind it do much.
Now in a few years when they do 4th edition and fully commit alternate activation (which they seem to be dipping their toes into, perhaps using this edition as an experiment to see how people like/ease the community into it) I'd hope for a different army to take center stage.
streetsamurai wrote: I unfortunately think it won't be the case, since new sce are probably really low effort to make
Unless I'm mistaken, the sculpting team is salary; they are going to get paid the same if they sculpt one model or one hundred. (Well, assuming they justify only sculpting one!) The biggest question is if GW sees there being enough profit in pushing different starter armies.
For 40k its already too late- they pushed marines for so hard, so long they are over half the game. Thge market is so full of marine players that they would be crazy not to put marines in the starter as it's a close to guaranteed sale as they are likely to come.
For AoS it's different. it's clear that they WANT stormcasts to be the equivalent of spacemarines (or at least someone still does) but I don't think it worked out as well as they would like. I think the re-design is both an attempt to get them away from being too overtly space marine influenced design wise and make them a bit more unique and interesting, which would make them more appealing to people who didn't like that element of them (like myself!) as well as using the redisgn to try a second attempt at getting them to marine level popularity.
I think it might work, but it makes a me a little sad- because I fear (maybe irrationally) that the more successful stormcasts are the less a chance that we'll see other types of order humans. But then maybe that's what "the old world" will be for.
streetsamurai wrote: I know im repeating myself, but im really disappointed that they took the marine approach with AOS by always including sce in the starter set. Would have been much more exciting to see a brand new race/army
All three starters have had a brand new army has the opposition, and with Stormcast they have done a good job keeping the new models distinct and different from the old; the Extremis, Vanguard, and Sacrosanct all play very differently to the core warrior chambers. We'll see if that continues here.
streetsamurai wrote: I unfortunately think it won't be the case, since new sce are probably really low effort to make
Unless I'm mistaken, the sculpting team is salary; they are going to get paid the same if they sculpt one model or one hundred. (Well, assuming they justify only sculpting one!) The biggest question is if GW sees there being enough profit in pushing different starter armies.
For 40k its already too late- they pushed marines for so hard, so long they are over half the game. Thge market is so full of marine players that they would be crazy not to put marines in the starter as it's a close to guaranteed sale as they are likely to come.
For AoS it's different. it's clear that they WANT stormcasts to be the equivalent of spacemarines (or at least someone still does) but I don't think it worked out as well as they would like. I think the re-design is both an attempt to get them away from being too overtly space marine influenced design wise and make them a bit more unique and interesting, which would make them more appealing to people who didn't like that element of them (like myself!) as well as using the redisgn to try a second attempt at getting them to marine level popularity.
I think it might work, but it makes a me a little sad- because I fear (maybe irrationally) that the more successful stormcasts are the less a chance that we'll see other types of order humans. But then maybe that's what "the old world" will be for.
Yeah, but they can reuse a lot of the digital assets they already have to sculpt new sce, while starting a new army from scratch would take a lot more time
We'll see if the anti-scalper measures actually help. I'm not planning on getting it, but for once I'd love to skip the whole 'omg GW is awful I didn't get the box I wasn't planning on buying!' phase of the regular complaint cycle.
Yeah, but they can reuse a lot of the digital assets they already have to sculpt new sce, while starting a new army from scratch would take a lot more time
Thta's true, but if you're a company and you have to pay the sculptors anyway you might as well make it worth the money. And if one of those ideas ends up being more profitable you can bet they will pursue it.
Right now is still a key moment in the development of AoS. It's still a young game in the grand scheme of things, and while GW is obviously trying to push stormcasts it's still possible another faction could well overtake them in popularity. (As i suspect new human order factions might, if they were to ever be released.)
drbored wrote: We'll see if the anti-scalper measures actually help. I'm not planning on getting it, but for once I'd love to skip the whole 'omg GW is awful I didn't get the box I wasn't planning on buying!' phase of the regular complaint cycle.
Sometimes ya just gotta accept that haters gunna hate.
Only in the bizarro-world of GW fandom could customers being upset they're unable to buy product due to mismanagement and scalper-baiting policies be characterised as "hating"
Anyway - kudos to GW, they might finally have done it. I look at this box and I like almost all of the models - I can take or leave the SCE characters - enough on their own merits(ie not for use with whatever WHFB army concept they're riffing on or as fodder for conversions for 40K), and those models exist far enough outside the design space of existing IPs, that I'm actually contemplating picking it up and keeping them as what they are. I don't even care that much that the baddies weren't, as some hoped, Fimir. They may well never see a tabletop because I still can't muster any enthusiasm for the setting itself, but technically speaking I will have "collected an AoS army" so GW wins again.
Yodhrin wrote: Only in the bizarro-world of GW fandom could customers being upset they're unable to buy product due to mismanagement and scalper-baiting policies be characterised as "hating"
.
Most of those complaints were justified. I think it was more a snipe at the fake complainers. The people who will loudly proclaim, at every opportunity, that they hate GW and haven’t bought a GW product for years, as if that makes them superior beings. The ones who call GW idiots for not buying the “much better” minis from every other company (90% of which are just inferior copies of GW minis). Many of those same people will then complain vociferously that something has sold out quickly. It’s just another angle of attack in their bizarre, dysfunctional relationship with a toy company (of all things). Like that guy who complains out his ex, that he split with 5 years ago, every time he gets drunk.
However, I’ll be first in line to complain if I don’t manage to get one because I’m actually intending to buy it. I’ll moan about it to anyone who’ll listen (and a few of those who don’t want to) for a couple of weeks.
Then, I’ll get over it, because I’ll realise it’s just toy soldiers and I probably already own enough to keep me painting for several years.
I'm in weird spot. Would want sce half but nobody seems to be keen to get orcs from my side. Not gambler in character so if nobody shows interest in advance will skip and just look for cheapest book to get what needed for rules. Hoping similar to 40k field manual with scenarios and all the rules barring crusade.
I dont mind the goofy cartoon greenskins GW usually use as comic relief, but I must say this is a great addition to the greenskin range.
They really look the part of a more sneaky kind skulking in the swamps.
The weird proportions is leaning towards the stone troggoths now, I think.
Also, between the new 40k Orks riding giant cyber squiggs and this more realistic approach, I must say i prefer these cruel boys.
Just having a rewatch of the boxset video it looks like there might be new terrain there - if it's not just something they 3D printed for the pictures. Might be for the Command edition equivalent.
There's a partially ruined building under reconstruction, a statue with a lion shield and domed towers that have a mixed SCE and KO look.
DaveC wrote: Just having a rewatch of the boxset video it looks like there might be new terrain there - if it's not just something they 3D printed for the pictures. Might be for the Command edition equivalent.
There's a partially ruined building under reconstruction, a statue with a lion shield and domed towers that have a mixed SCE and KO look.
Some of that is plastic for sure.
I'd wager the release will mimic 40k 9th, so yeah, Command Edition set, a box of terrain and another board, etc.
Yodhrin wrote: Only in the bizarro-world of GW fandom could customers being upset they're unable to buy product due to mismanagement and scalper-baiting policies be characterised as "hating"
.
Most of those complaints were justified. I think it was more a snipe at the fake complainers. The people who will loudly proclaim, at every opportunity, that they hate GW and haven’t bought a GW product for years, as if that makes them superior beings. The ones who call GW idiots for not buying the “much better” minis from every other company (90% of which are just inferior copies of GW minis). Many of those same people will then complain vociferously that something has sold out quickly. It’s just another angle of attack in their bizarre, dysfunctional relationship with a toy company (of all things). Like that guy who complains out his ex, that he split with 5 years ago, every time he gets drunk.
Yeah, it‘s quite strange, isn‘t it?
It‘s annoying when you can‘t get what you want at the push of a button, but GW certainly has no obligation to stop people from selling their purchases onwards at a premium (ie scalping). If they enact measures, that‘s clearly an attempt to improve relations with the fans (and to broaden their appeal, building a base of returning customers). Not everything works and not everything is well-executed, but hey, they are trying.
The main complaint from the haters though, apart from pricing, seems to root in GW not producing their toys fast enough to meet demand. Funny that.
I‘m buggered that at the moment I can‘t get the new Underworlds warband immediately at my independent store, because apparent supply issues at GW/Brexit. But I will wait for that sweet discount and for supporting a 3rd party retailer.
lord_blackfang wrote: Really feels like the Kruelbozy were assigned to the sculpting A team and the Beast Snaggas to the C team.
Not quite more like LOTR team. It really does nothing for me in WFB.
I think I will cherry pick the hobgoblins in this set and ignore the rest of the orcs and wait for the other smaller starters to see the stormcast selection on those. I wonder how much the order half will go for on eBay.
The mask on that Stormcast wizard is very cool, but it doesn't really fit the Stormcast aesthetic.
I'm very meh on the whole faction, although these do appear to be the best rendition so far. The halberdiers really benefit from having somewhat conventional looking weapons, a lot of the more 'unique' Stormcast weaponry has looked terrible.
Gryphs are one of the few things I like about them, so cool to see more of them. The bigger ones with the chariot are *chef's kiss*.
Orks are also very meh. Not sure the setting needed slightly different ones and there are surely other, more interesting avenues that could've been pursued instead. Different paint jobs might shift the needle a bit, I definitely don't like the skin tone they've gone with.
Yodhrin wrote: Only in the bizarro-world of GW fandom could customers being upset they're unable to buy product due to mismanagement and scalper-baiting policies be characterised as "hating"
.
Most of those complaints were justified. I think it was more a snipe at the fake complainers. The people who will loudly proclaim, at every opportunity, that they hate GW and haven’t bought a GW product for years, as if that makes them superior beings. The ones who call GW idiots for not buying the “much better” minis from every other company (90% of which are just inferior copies of GW minis). Many of those same people will then complain vociferously that something has sold out quickly. It’s just another angle of attack in their bizarre, dysfunctional relationship with a toy company (of all things). Like that guy who complains out his ex, that he split with 5 years ago, every time he gets drunk.
Yeah, it‘s quite strange, isn‘t it?
It‘s annoying when you can‘t get what you want at the push of a button, but GW certainly has no obligation to stop people from selling their purchases onwards at a premium (ie scalping). If they enact measures, that‘s clearly an attempt to improve relations with the fans (and to broaden their appeal, building a base of returning customers). Not everything works and not everything is well-executed, but hey, they are trying.
The main complaint from the haters though, apart from pricing, seems to root in GW not producing their toys fast enough to meet demand. Funny that.
I‘m buggered that at the moment I can‘t get the new Underworlds warband immediately at my independent store, because apparent supply issues at GW/Brexit. But I will wait for that sweet discount and for supporting a 3rd party retailer.
Ok right! I see no hater here hating this box so far but I see some of you guys bitching about people... So I yeah keep trolling thats a positive thing for sure. Or maybe just maybe stop poking the bear and concentrate on this nice shiny box.
Really not overly keen on the Kruelboyz.
The models look decent, but some appear to be about 10 sizes too big for their legs.
They also feel very much LoTR instead of AoS.
Ironically (and I can't believe I'm saying this) I really like the new look for stormcasts.
The sleeker armour design is a big win for me.
Not going to buy the box though as I don't plan on a new army.
Neither really give me that spark to want to go out and buy them sadly.
Sotahullu wrote: Well atleast Kruelboyz get hefty release like the Nighthaunts got.
I wouldn't be surprised if we get some Hobgrot related kits so you could run them as unified force if you want to.
That would be the perfect box set man!
I noticed theres actually 2 units of 10 there ( not just one like I thought) and they have different heads and seems like different standard bearers too. 20 hobgobs is a very nice start and I really hope they flesh out champs and characters and maybe a shooty unit to go with some CD's.
Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote: To be fair, i largely missed the stream, as my friend and her kids were over and they got tore into my Transformers (with permission of course!)
I’ve of course seen the models, but didn’t get the chance to hear the chit chat.
Don’t get me wrong. I definitely do not hate the models. And there’s precisely sod all wrong with them. They’re just leaving me a bit cold is all. I can’t really put my finger on why.
.
Perhaps its because these are the first "serious" greenskins in well over a decade? 40K Orks were always more of a hooligan than a serious force, with a touch of comic relief thrown in (in a dark bloody brutal sort of way of course). Old World orks were often more "serious" but they still had machines that threw gobbos with wings strapped to them; that and their Old World lore was a bit less developed as they were an evil force so got a bit less attention than the good guys - who were often just beating them up.
AoS very heavily followed the 40K model for the Orruk, making them into a big hulking hooligan army again. Not so much evil as just sporting for a darn good fight. Gloospite Gitz meanwhile are psychopath druggies high on shrooms and half insane and wanting to spread the gloom of their world all over the realms whilst also just wanting to stab people cause it makes them giggle.
These new greenskins aren't any of that. They've got armour; they've got ranged weapons; they've got that smart look to their faces that says that they aren't here for fun. These are perhaps not hooligans sporting for a fight nor insane or here for some fun. These are "Lord of the Rings" and pure "Old World" style ORKS. These are the nightmare that comes with organised plans and, whilst they might be in Destruction, I've a feeling that we'll see them as the most generally militant and organised and perhaps will construct cities of their own 0 in an orky way.
Granted this serious angle is somewhat diluted by their heavy use of squig parts
drbored wrote: We'll see if the anti-scalper measures actually help. I'm not planning on getting it, but for once I'd love to skip the whole 'omg GW is awful I didn't get the box I wasn't planning on buying!' phase of the regular complaint cycle.
Get a VPN, tie a bot to it, scalp away. Companies like Nike, adidas etc. have been dealing with scalpers for years and they always get through. The professional scalpers i mean, not some rando that ordered 10 boxes by hand.
drbored wrote: We'll see if the anti-scalper measures actually help. I'm not planning on getting it, but for once I'd love to skip the whole 'omg GW is awful I didn't get the box I wasn't planning on buying!' phase of the regular complaint cycle.
Get a VPN, tie a bot to it, scalp away. Companies like Nike, adidas etc. have been dealing with scalpers for years and they always get through. The professional scalpers i mean, not some rando that ordered 10 boxes by hand.
Sadly this is true. The only way to stop scalpers, is to not make anything in limited numbers. Personally I wish GW would move more to a made to order model for all of their limited stuff. A time limited window for orders, rather than a limited production run.
That's one issue, GW's anti-scalper might stop the casual scalpers, which likely have been on the rise a lot (esp for GW). It will also limit most of their customers to a single box, which will naturally spread the stock out a lot more (at least when ordered direct from their own site).
However it might just free up stock for a professional scalper with their bot farm and such, to just swoop in and take even more. Of course GW might find other ways to stop them - eg at the point of delivery and shipping when they spot oddities such as dozens of orders going to the same address or all going to the same block of flats or such.
It's one thing to order 30 copies to the same address, but it would be rare for a whole block of flats or linked addresses or mail boxes to also order tens to hundreds of copies.
This might also explain why sometimes we see stock re-appear after its sold out, because GW have gone through the addresses and orders, spotted an oddity and cancelled the orders.
drbored wrote: We'll see if the anti-scalper measures actually help. I'm not planning on getting it, but for once I'd love to skip the whole 'omg GW is awful I didn't get the box I wasn't planning on buying!' phase of the regular complaint cycle.
Get a VPN, tie a bot to it, scalp away. Companies like Nike, adidas etc. have been dealing with scalpers for years and they always get through. The professional scalpers i mean, not some rando that ordered 10 boxes by hand.
I wonder how many actual scalpers there are for warhammer stuff. I ran a poll on another forum and about 80% of the people who tried to buy Cursed City were able to get hold of one.
This suggests that gw didn't make as few copies as people think. It's pretty easy now to get hold of a copy of Indomitus without paying ridiculous money. Given the relative popularity of the two systems if GW make the same number of copies it might be enough.
Personally I love the Stormcast but I'm not crazy about the Kruleboyz. If I can wander into my local store on launch day and check out the models in the flesh, I may well buy a copy but unlike with Cursed City, I'm not going to take part in the pre-order day scramble.
Chikout wrote: I wonder how many actual scalpers there are for warhammer stuff. I ran a poll on another forum and about 80% of the people who tried to buy Cursed City were able to get hold of one.
I think it's massively dependent on location, because they did send a lot out to retailers in addition to the online sales, so if the local community was excited they would have sold out almost immediately, and if the local community didn't care you could end up with copies sitting on shelves for weeks or months or years even (assuming the local retailer isn't savvy enough just to put them on eBay with a massive mark up).
Out here, I called all the shops I typically frequent and none of them had it. The local GW used their system to check if there were any in stock in other GW's in the area (there's 7 of them throughout the city) and none had any stock, the only GW that did have some left in stock was hundreds of miles away.
I'm torn on the orcs. On the one hand I've always liked the appearance of Lord of the Rings orcs so getting some for Age of Sigmar gives me a Destruction army I may be interested in. On the other hand, what the hell are Lord of the Rings orcs doing in AoS?
Sigmarines look good for the spearmen and halbardiers. The banner bearer is also cool. The rest isn't inspiring.
So a pretty mixed bag for me. There's probably not enough in the box that I like to justify the considerable price it's bound to have. Not the worst thing that can happen since it'll like sell out in five minutes anyway.
DaveC wrote: Just having a rewatch of the boxset video it looks like there might be new terrain there - if it's not just something they 3D printed for the pictures. Might be for the Command edition equivalent.
There's a partially ruined building under reconstruction, a statue with a lion shield and domed towers that have a mixed SCE and KO look.
The (assumed) equivalent to the 40k starter box with terrain in it is what has me interested much more than Dominion. It'll be interesting to see what they do with it. I've been wanting AoS ruins akin to the 40k ones for years, but GW has so far not gone for the modular panel approach. Which is a shame in my opinion. Not that some of the terrain they make for AoS isn't cool, but it's hardly anything you get more than one of to build something larger.
Would be nice to see that change with the new starter set or, if it contains more purpose-made terrain because it's a starter set, an individual release of modular ruins afterwards.
tneva82 wrote: That would hurt sales of starter and solo sets.
Not if this WAS the starter...
A) it would hurt solo set sales even more
B) gw has 3 starters(recruit, elite, command). This is and never was starter set,. You want starter set, you buy starter set. This doesn't even have stuff starter sets are. Are you willing to turn this 160e discount box to 250e starter set?
Less lotr orcs, I assume people mean the orcs from the movies and subsequent GW game - which all looked interesting, more like 80s GW orcs, which is a good thing. Best orcs GW has produced in a very long time. Definitively going to pre-order this even though its a shame about the game.
I very much like these new orcs. They do however look like they come from an entirely new game or setting.
The proportions on the hobs kind of push them a little too far to the silly looking side but I don't hate them.
So far this is the only AOS army that I really like the overall look of. I don't know if it's enough to get me to drop what will likely be a large sum on the box (if I'm even able to order it before a sellout), though.
Kanluwen wrote: That's something that I'll never understand.
Why would you let someone preorder something and not pay up front?!
Because not every sales system is set up that way? Because some companies(BBTS, Entertainment Earth, Walmart, Target, Amazon) are large enough to not have to worry about left over stock not selling? Because some local stores get more than enough demand that they have a wait list if you can't pay?
There's tons of reasons and it's actually MORE common to have an order system where they pay on receipt than on order. Of the countless stores I've frequented in the 10+ states I've lived in, ONLY GW has ever had a "Pay on order" system.
Kanluwen wrote: That's something that I'll never understand.
Why would you let someone preorder something and not pay up front?!
Because not every sales system is set up that way? Because some companies(BBTS, Entertainment Earth, Walmart, Target, Amazon) are large enough to not have to worry about left over stock not selling? Because some local stores get more than enough demand that they have a wait list if you can't pay?
There's tons of reasons and it's actually MORE common to have an order system where they pay on receipt than on order. Of the countless stores I've frequented in the 10+ states I've lived in, ONLY GW has ever had a "Pay on order" system.
Most times I've preordered things they either don't ask for money up front at all, or they ask for a deposit of 10 to 20% to ensure you are motivated to come back and get it months later when it actually comes out.
Given GW's preorders are typically only a week in advance it doesn't make a huge difference if they ask you to pay up front I guess, but you'll still have headaches if people change their mind and want their money back.
Maybe I'm just weird then, because my FLGS that I frequent gives us the option to "pay it now" for a preorder on most things...but for these kind of LE sets(and not just from GW!)? They won't reserve/preorder one for you unless you pay up front.
Kanluwen wrote: That's something that I'll never understand.
Why would you let someone preorder something and not pay up front?!
Because not every sales system is set up that way? Because some companies(BBTS, Entertainment Earth, Walmart, Target, Amazon) are large enough to not have to worry about left over stock not selling? Because some local stores get more than enough demand that they have a wait list if you can't pay?
There's tons of reasons and it's actually MORE common to have an order system where they pay on receipt than on order. Of the countless stores I've frequented in the 10+ states I've lived in, ONLY GW has ever had a "Pay on order" system.
Most times I've preordered things they either don't ask for money up front at all, or they ask for a deposit of 10 to 20% to ensure you are motivated to come back and get it months later when it actually comes out.
Given GW's preorders are typically only a week in advance it doesn't make a huge difference if they ask you to pay up front I guess, but you'll still have headaches if people change their mind and want their money back.
They can cancel and get their money back anyway...that way you just have to spend more effort returning the money
I'll pick up this box if I can and try to trade the SCE half for the hobgob half.
Hah! If you were UK based I'd done just that with you. I 'like' the Hobgobs, but... no thanks. I really like the Stormcast, but the Hobgobs look like a massive time sink painting wise. They are greatly detailed, an amazingly good reimagining... but something about them just does not appeal.
GrosseSax wrote: I can't really put my finger on it but something about these hobgoblins scream 80's dark fantasy. Digging it.
Some of my favorite Citadel sculpts are the mid/late 80's orcs and hobgoblins, ie, pre-Kev Adams. RR15 Throg's Hobgoblin Despoilers (Jes Goodwin?) and BC2 Manic Hobgoblin Hero (perhaps one of my favorite sculpts of all time) and Nick Lund's BC4 Mighty Ugezod's Death Commandos,
They said around Indomitus pricing, so most likely £130-£140.
Sounds about right!
...but will they fall into exactly the same trap as with Indomitus by severly under estimating / under producing?
They didn't "fall into some trap" or "under estimated", they're not stupid, they made precisely as many as they needed to, so they could create artificial scarcity and exploit FOMO. It was a calculated business decision.
I forgot about the forced scarcity nonsense with these sets. Nah, not gonna be interested in this for sure knowing that.
But I looked at the models again and I like them even more the second time. Definitely a range to keep an eye on. I actually like the weird proportions, I think it makes them look properly different.
judgedoug wrote: These new models look like an insane reimagining of Nick Lund as filtered through Gary Chalk and I love 'em.
Yeah, they're all kinds of retro and modern fantasy at once - to me, they have a "LoTR as in the current 'Shadow of ...' video games, but then reimagined by the folks who made the new Dark Crystal series" zany horror vibe that works really really well for me, much more than the first AoS orruks and the various 40k Ork iterations since, IDK, 2nd Ed.
Yodhrin wrote: Only in the bizarro-world of GW fandom could customers being upset they're unable to buy product due to mismanagement and scalper-baiting policies be characterised as "hating"
We weren't speaking about people leveling legitimate criticisms--we were speaking about people who claim they do not want the box, complain they cannot get the box, and do both simultaneously with the box still being widely available. Which happened with Indomitus. A lot.
You elected to mischaracterize the original sentiment to create a straw man rather than engaging on a reasonable level. This is something you do frequently across multiple different discussions.
tneva82 wrote: That would hurt sales of starter and solo sets.
Not if this WAS the starter...
A) it would hurt solo set sales even more
B) gw has 3 starters(recruit, elite, command). This is and never was starter set,. You want starter set, you buy starter set. This doesn't even have stuff starter sets are. Are you willing to turn this 160e discount box to 250e starter set?
Sigh, the starter sets in the past seemed OK, well it worked well for decades... GW kind of milked these differently now creating the Limited box then splitting into smaller boxes with terrain as different entry points etc... It works probably great for GW...and for people wanting terrain on smaller sets... For people that just want the minis like the old starters before indomitus not so much. They miss the week of release and game over.
Are you telling me in the past GW did not profit on solo sales, thats amazing considering the profits reports XD
Just because they do it like this now does not mean:
_ We don't understand its not intended as starter
_ If they sold as starter they would still profit on solos as they did since ever in the past.
_ Old starters were good deals for us too so yeah This could have been a starter that would linger for years and not a few week limited thing.
_ I don't need to turn anything into anything I just don't buy period. Besides old boxes were not expensive as you say this would be.
_ don't want to talk prices too much cause we don't know... and GW has increased the prices on some kits ridiculously recently. So no point arguing it.
I find bizarre people discard or choose to forget decades of practice for 1 year or so of a new practice.
GW stepped up to make things right with Indomitus though; they saw what happened and then did another (unplanned) print run to make sure everyone could get it. And it was/is available at tabletop stores for months afterword. My flgs didn't sell its last copy until April.
Like by all means criticize GW for making mistakes, but dumping on them after making their best effort to fix it just sends the message that they shouldn't bother.
At the end of the day it was a limited product to go along with the release. Companies do this all the time across a wide variety of industries, so faulting GW for that behavior isn't entirely fair, or productive. Though as mentioned before criticism should absolutely be leveled at poor execution.
Someone who always craps on GW for everything or who always praises GW for everything is just a black/white knight and their opinion doesn't mean anything. Even HNBC will give GW credit at times, and he has to put up with their Australian pricing scheme!
Tldr; we should go back to criticizing GWs handling of balance or Cursed City, that's where the juicy complaints are to be had!
tneva82 wrote: That would hurt sales of starter and solo sets.
Not if this WAS the starter...
A) it would hurt solo set sales even more
B) gw has 3 starters(recruit, elite, command). This is and never was starter set,. You want starter set, you buy starter set. This doesn't even have stuff starter sets are. Are you willing to turn this 160e discount box to 250e starter set?
Sigh, the starter sets in the past seemed OK, well it worked well for decades... GW kind of milked these differently now creating the Limited box then splitting into smaller boxes with terrain as different entry points etc... It works probably great for GW...and for people wanting terrain on smaller sets... For people that just want the minis like the old starters before indomitus not so much. They miss the week of release and game over.
Are you telling me in the past GW did not profit on solo sales, thats amazing considering the profits reports XD
Just because they do it like this now does not mean:
_ We don't understand its not intended as starter
_ If they sold as starter they would still profit on solos as they did since ever in the past.
_ Old starters were good deals for us too so yeah This could have been a starter that would linger for years and not a few week limited thing.
_ I don't need to turn anything into anything I just don't buy period. Besides old boxes were not expensive as you say this would be.
_ don't want to talk prices too much cause we don't know... and GW has increased the prices on some kits ridiculously recently. So no point arguing it.
I find bizarre people discard or choose to forget decades of practice for 1 year or so of a new practice.
I like the new practice that they started with the Indomitus Set. I won't buy this box set. I don't like either of the center piece leaders and I'm not a huge fan of the majority of the weirdly proportioned goblin/orcs. If they release a different follow on set with terrain and some of the models I will buy them. I have a ton of models and honestly need updated plastic terrain over models.
At the end of the day it was a limited product to go along with the release
The problem is, it looks like a starter set, it acts like a starter set, but now it's not a starter set, it's a Limited Launch Product and the "starter sets" to follow after it are frankly, trash in comparison. It's only limited edition cause GW said so. They will produce the same models they put in this set later and just split them into smaller "starters" with less value.
At the end of the day it was a limited product to go along with the release
The problem is, it looks like a starter set, it acts like a starter set, but now it's not a starter set, it's a Limited Launch Product and the "starter sets" to follow after it are frankly, trash in comparison. It's only limited edition cause GW said so. They will produce the same models they put in this set later and just split them into smaller "starters" with less value.
Yes? That's the point of the launch box. It's for all experience levels of players to start a new army with a bit of a discount, whereas the starters are for new players to be able to start the game but it won't be as big as a discount (or have as many miniatures) as the launch box. The launch box should be seen more in line with the battle boxes (e.g., Aether War or Shadow & Pain) and not a starter.
ok, and? I'm getting an inferior product as a customer if I don't manage to nab one of those low production run Special Limited Boxes when GW clearly could supply plenty of Soul Wars boxes. Why. I mean beyond corporate greed, because as far as I can see, there is no redeeming quality to this shift.
