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Post by: Ouze
Should We Step in to Help Nigeria Find Kidnapped Girls?
It's been two weeks since 234 students were abducted by the terrorist group Boko Haram, and Nigerian lawmakers say the country needs help.
—By Erika Eichelberger | Thu May. 1, 2014 9:18 AM PDT
Update, Tuesday, May 6, 2014: On Tuesday, US Secretary of State John Kerry offered to send a team to Nigeria to help search for the kidnapped girls, MSNBC reports. Nigerian president Goodluck Jonathan accepted.
Two weeks ago, 234 Nigerian girls were kidnapped from a boarding school in the country's northernmost state of Borno by the al Qaeda-linked group Boko Haram. Today, most of them are still missing, and Nigerian lawmakers are calling on the international community to step in to help the rescue effort.
"Nigeria should seek international help," says Rep. Eziuche Ubani, who sits on the country's house of representatives' committee on defense. "The Nigerian armed forces are not in a position to defeat the insurgency in the northeast."
The schoolgirls were captured during a predawn raid on April 15 in the town of Chibok by members of Boko Haram, which the Obama administration recently designated as a terrorist organization. The group, whose name means "Western education is sinful," believes the Nigerian government has been corrupted by Western ways. In an effort to return the country to the pre-colonial days of Muslim rule, the group has terrorized the country over the past four-plus years, targeting schools in many of its killing sprees, and attacking churches, military checkpoints, highways, the UN building, and, recently, a bus station in the capital city of Abuja.
Though the abduction happened weeks ago, international press coverage of the missing girls has shot up in recent days after Nigerians criticized the foreign media's initial silence on the issue and launched the Twitter hashtag #BringBackOurGirls.
Nigerian President Goodluck Jonathan has vowed to rescue the girls, but two weeks after the kidnapping, many of the victim's parents are losing faith in the government's efforts, especially as reports have emerged that many of them have since been married off to the Boko Haram militants.
"Nigeria has one of the best armed forces" on the continent, says Kyari Mohammed, a professor of security studies at Modibbo Adama University of Technology in northern Nigeria, "but they are not trained for asymmetric warfare." The militants disguise themselves easily amongst their fellow Nigerians in Borno, and often escape to bordering countries or hideouts in the dense northern forests.
So elected officials in the country are calling for outside aid. The government must do "whatever it takes, even seeking external support to make sure these girls are released," Nigerian Sen. Ali Ndume told the Associated Press Wednesday. His colleague, Sen. Bukola Saraki, tells Mother Jones the international community should lend a hand to Nigeria in the same way it did to families of the victims of missing Malaysia Airlines flight 370.
The US gives about $1 million a year in aid to the Nigerian military and soon plans to start training Nigerian special forces to fight the insurgency in the north, but American forces would not be able to enter the country to help search for the kidnapped girls unless Nigeria officially requests that the US do so. A spokeswoman for the US State Department says that the department is "in discussions with the Nigerian government on what we might do to help support their efforts to find and free these young women."
Not everyone buys into the argument that Nigeria needs outside help. "What has happened to the girls is not what is beyond the capability of the Nigerian security forces to handle," says Mausi Segun, a Human Rights Watch researcher based in Borno state. "The reports we're getting out of the North is that nothing much is being done on the part of the security forces. They are not using information provided to them by residents and locals in that region." Parents have been searching the forests near Boko Haram camps in the north on their own for over a week, but they can only do so much, as they are in danger themselves of being killed by militants. Segun says the Nigerian military should make a good faith effort to find the girls before asking for international help.
The Nigerian military doesn't have a great track record when it comes to stemming attacks by the Islamist militants. Jonathan has promised to defeat Boko Haram, but the insurgency has become bloodier than ever over the past few months. One reason for that, Ubani says, is that the military does not coordinate with security forces in the countries that border Borno state—including Chad, Cameroon, and Niger—where Boko Haram members have been known to hide out. And the Nigerian military's expenditures are not tracked, Mohammed explains, so even though the country spends about $6 billion a year on its military, it is hard to determine how much of that money goes toward fighting Boko Haram and how it's used.
Human rights advocates contend the military is not only ineffectual, but that Nigerian security forces' response to the insurgency, including the indiscriminate killing of northern Muslim men, is worsening Boko Haram violence. The terrorist group has killed some 5,000 Nigerian men, women, and children since it emerged in 2009. In the the first few months of 2014, it has already killed 1,500 people. Boko Haram has abducted school children before, but this time the scale is unprecedented.
Emphasis mine, to make it clear that this is happening; the article was written before we've offered to help.
What do you guys think?
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Post by: whembly
No problem with that at all.
Just curious what exactly our "help" will consist of...
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Post by: djones520
whembly wrote:No problem with that at all.
Just curious what exactly our "help" will consist of...
Probably the kind that will make the kidnappers "regret" their actions...
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Post by: Gentleman_Jellyfish
whembly wrote:No problem with that at all.
Just curious what exactly our "help" will consist of...
The group, whose name means "Western education is sinful," believes the Nigerian government has been corrupted by Western ways. In an effort to return the country to the pre-colonial days of Muslim rule
We're about to corrupt the gak out of them with our Western ways.
Also would the fact that they are a Muslim group possibly start any kind of stirring in the ME?
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Post by: EmilCrane
America will bombard you with strongly worded letters and personal sanctions, you better fear them!
But seriously, hope someone helps out and saves those people. Nigeria isn't exactly prepared to take on this kinds of thing. My guess is France will step in.
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Post by: NuggzTheNinja
As much fun as it would be to kill those Nigerian scumbags, I have to wonder if it's "worth it," when putting those same lives on the line in Benghazi wasn't considered "worth it."
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Post by: whembly
NuggzTheNinja wrote:As much fun as it would be to kill those Nigerian scumbags, I have to wonder if it's "worth it," when putting those same lives on the line in Benghazi wasn't considered "worth it."
O.o
Ahem... carry on.
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Post by: djones520
NuggzTheNinja wrote:As much fun as it would be to kill those Nigerian scumbags, I have to wonder if it's "worth it," when putting those same lives on the line in Benghazi wasn't considered "worth it."
250ish girls, who are probably being repeatedly raped, and you don't think it's "worth it"?
Man, your moral compass needs some fine tuning.
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Post by: NuggzTheNinja
djones520 wrote: NuggzTheNinja wrote:As much fun as it would be to kill those Nigerian scumbags, I have to wonder if it's "worth it," when putting those same lives on the line in Benghazi wasn't considered "worth it."
250ish girls, who are probably being repeatedly raped, and you don't think it's "worth it"?
Man, your moral compass needs some fine tuning.
That gak happens every day in Africa. Genital Mutilation is practically foreplay to these people.
It's obviously wrong, but maybe the Europeans should step up for once. They fethed up Africa up in the first place...let them deal with it.
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Post by: hotsauceman1
A shiver goes up my mind when I think of those poor girls. Jesus, those people need to die.
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Post by: Jihadin
the group has terrorized the country over the past four-plus years, targeting schools in many of its killing sprees, and attacking churches, military checkpoints, highways, the UN building, and, recently, a bus station in the capital city of Abuja.
Four plus years.....and no drone strikes. WTH
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Post by: Grey Templar
The sad thing is that Africa is probably a few centuries away from anything approaching civilized except for a few exceptions along the coasts and certain countries.
Socially, it might as well be a thousand years ago with inter-tribal warfare and general brigandage. Except instead of spears they have AKs.
The only way things will change is either veeeeeery slowly over time with very small shifts in attitude OR if things get totally shaken up by an outside power forcing change and then holding it for a generation or so to allow things to change rapidly. Either way, its a seriously messed up situation.
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Post by: Relapse
I remember the ugly circumstances of Biafra when there was a civil war in Nigeria during the 60's. Looks like that country is about to revisit its magical past and although it's great we want to rescue the girls, I hope we don't find ourselves getting stuck in over there.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nigerian_Civil_War
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Post by: hotsauceman1
Grey Templar wrote:The sad thing is that Africa is probably a few centuries away from anything approaching civilized except for a few exceptions along the coasts and certain countries.
Socially, it might as well be a thousand years ago with inter-tribal warfare and general brigandage. Except instead of spears they have AKs.
The only way things will change is either veeeeeery slowly over time with very small shifts in attitude OR if things get totally shaken up by an outside power forcing change and then holding it for a generation or so to allow things to change rapidly. Either way, its a seriously messed up situation.
Hear me out, but could this be the result of colonialism? Africa May not have had the time necessary to change those attitudes, being colonized and such. So when much of the colonist left, they did not have their attitudes changed resulting in a gap in where what should have developed never did? Sort of like a child in a closet for a year or two.
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Post by: Grey Templar
Yeah, I would say its because they weren't colonies long enough.
It would have been best for them to either not have been colonized at all(and thus not have all this technology they aren't ready for) OR for them to still be colonies, and thus have access to the infrastructure and specifically education that the Mother Country would have built. And influx of colonists would also have helped speed the development.
I know this kinda sounds like "The White Man's Burden" BS, but there is a grain of truth to it.
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Post by: hotsauceman1
Y'know whats going to happen right? We are going to find a few of them months later, some of them with stockholm syndrome, some pregnant and some just dead and buried.
I know its not something people want to hear, but two weeks is enough to separate and hide them well enough. This situation wont end well.
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Post by: EmilCrane
Grey Templar wrote:Yeah, I would say its because they weren't colonies long enough.
It would have been best for them to either not have been colonized at all(and thus not have all this technology they aren't ready for) OR for them to still be colonies, and thus have access to the infrastructure and specifically education that the Mother Country would have built. And influx of colonists would also have helped speed the development.
I know this kinda sounds like "The White Man's Burden" BS, but there is a grain of truth to it.
Its not white mans burden as all, just a fact that many people aren't willing to accept. While I love NZ's rich cultural heritage I do like my penicillin, internet, education and not getting my head bashed in by a stone club in a tribal dispute.
Africa's current situation can't be solely blamed on white people, despite so many's people attempts to. They became colonies later in history, so they had less money spent in development relative to India and the Dominions before the world wars came around and messed everything up, then the europeans left in a hurry before the nations were ready to join the international community. Combine that with years of mismanagement by local leaders and you have the hell hole that africa is today.
Sorry, almost got common sense in the way of forced cultural guilt there.
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Post by: commisar rhodes
I think its a good idea for the US/ any other countries willing to help get those girls back, mite also help as a deterrent in the future if the Boko Haram group know that if they try this stuff again they'll end up in deep doo doo. Also what's the state of Nigeria's military/ specialized law enforcement? because I'm guessing its not really up to dealing with these kinds of situations.
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Post by: Jehan-reznor
All this talk about colonialism is just bull, these girls need to be saved (if they are still alive :() The Africans have killed each other long before the Europeans came, and the whole tribal thinking is still strong in Africa. (the whole genocide in Kongo with the Hutsi's and the Tutsi's in the past).
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Post by: LuciusAR
NuggzTheNinja wrote:
It's obviously wrong, but maybe the Europeans should step up for once. They fethed up Africa up in the first place...let them deal with it.
Yeah because before we turned up Africa was a happy place. They had flowery meadows and rainbow skies, and rivers made of chocolate, where the children danced and laughed and played with gumdrop smiles.
Seriously though I'm happy the US is helping. I hope the UK will be sending help soon as well.
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Post by: Medium of Death
Maybe if the British Empire was still a thing this wouldn't be happening... YEAH EMPIRE! http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/may/07/nigeria-kidnap-schoolgirls-us-uk-help The United States and Britain have offered military and technical support to Nigeria to hunt down the Islamist group which has abducted a new batch of schoolgirls, piling pressure on the Nigerian authorities to find and free the victims. President Barack Obama led a mounting international outcry on Tuesday and said Nigeria's government had accepted help from US military and law enforcement officials to pursue Boko Haram militants. Gunmen believed to be from the group kidnapped eight more girls, aged between eight and 15, in an overnight raid on a village in the sect's stronghold in north-eastern Borno state on Monday. It was already holding 257 girls from a raid on a school on 15 April. Obama said the US was doing its utmost to help resolve the "heartbreaking" and "outrageous" situation but stopped short of offering to send troops – in contrast to Britain, which is prepared to send special forces and intelligence gathering aircraft. "In the short term our goal is obviously to help the international community, and the Nigerian government, as a team to do everything we can to recover these young ladies," Obama told NBC. "But we're also going to have to deal with the broader problem of organisations like this that ... can cause such havoc in people's day-to-day lives." The president said Boko Haram was one of the world's worst terrorist organisations. "I can only imagine what the parents are going through," added Obama, a father of two daughters aged 15 and 12. The offers from Washington and London follow widespread criticism of the Nigerian government's perceived sluggish response to the crisis. Relatives of the girls have protested in the capital, Abuja. Boko Haram's leader, Abubakar Shekau, has threatened to sell the captives into slavery and said militants would attack more schools and abduct more girls. The group's name means "Western education is sinful". In a separate atrocity this week militants reportedly shot at least 52 people in a remote village. White House spokesman Jay Carney said the US embassy in Abuja would help assemble a team of technical experts, including military and law enforcement personnel skilled in intelligence, investigations, hostage negotiating, information sharing and victim assistance. The US was not considering sending armed forces, Carney said. John Kerry, the secretary of state, said Washington had been in touch with Abuja since "day one". It rebuffed US offers of help until Tuesday when Kerry spoke with Nigeria's president, Goodluck Jonathan. "I think now the complications that have arisen have convinced everybody that there needs to be a greater effort," Kerry said at a state department news conference. "And it will begin immediately. I mean, literally, immediately." In London Whitehall officials said Britain was prepared to send intelligence-gathering aircraft and members of the Special Air Service (SAS), or its naval equivalent, the Special Boat Service (SBS), if asked by Abuja. Officials at a meeting of the government's emergency committee, Cobra, discussed options. The Nigerians are expected to make an official request on Wednesday following unofficial talks between London and Abuja. Urgency grew after Boko Haram released a video threatening to sell their captives as "slaves" and gunmen slaughtered people in the village of Waraba. It straddles the Gwoza mountain range, a network of caves which stretches into neighbouring Cameroon and shelters the militants. "They were many, and all of them carried guns," Lazarus Musa, a resident, told Reuters. "They came in two vehicles painted in army colour. They started shooting in our village. The Boko Haram men were entering houses, ordering people out of their houses." The village was now deserted, said Marcus James, a Waraba resident who moved to the capital, Abuja, last year to escape cross-border raids. "The last I heard from my relatives is that around two dozen gunmen had been shooting for about three hours. At that time, my family called to say they were hiding in the bush, and I haven't heard from them since." On Monday, Cameroonian officials said two soldiers were killed in a shootout with militants, in the latest sign of insurgents using porous borders to their advantage. Nigeria's army has struggled against a fleet-footed enemy which launches lightning raids before disappearing into rugged mountain and desert terrain. The five-year insurgency in the country's north-east has claimed more than 4,000 lives and forced almost half a million people to flee their homes, according to International Crisis Group. The latest assaults come as Nigeria prepares to hold the World Economic Forum in Abuja, where two bombs in the last three weeks have killed at least 95. Roadblocks and security checkpoints have choked traffic as the government seeks to reassure heads of states and dignitaries of their security. Ordinary citizens have been less convinced. Early on Tuesday, jittery parents in the suburb of Nyanya rushed to pull their children out of school after armed men hijacked an empty private school bus. The scale and audacity of the 15 April mass abductions in remote Chibok – several truckloads of militants were able to run rampant for almost five hours – has shocked Nigerians. "We want to know what happens to all the money being spent on security every year. What is it for?" said one protestor in Abuja, referring to the government's $6bn annual security budget. Officials have scrambled to provide explanations. On Sunday Patience Jonathan, the president's wife, accused local officials of being partially responsible for the attacks by opening Chibok school, even though others in the area had shut down. African leaders have rallied around Nigeria. "All of us are fathers, and I could just imagine that my daughter could be one of them," said Ghana's president, John Dramani Mahama, who added he had written a letter on behalf of 14 other west African nations offering assistance. The United Nations warned that any parties participating in the buying or selling of the schoolgirls could face prosecution under international law. "We warn the perpetrators that there is an absolute prohibition against slavery and sexual slavery in international law," said UN rights spokesperson Rupert Colville. "So just because they think they are safe now, they won't necessarily be in two years, five years or 10 years' time," he told a news briefing in Geneva. I thought they generally prefer to deploy African troops in these regions to appear less colonial? The only problem with that being the won't be able to get the job done.
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Post by: Frazzled
NuggzTheNinja wrote:As much fun as it would be to kill those Nigerian scumbags, I have to wonder if it's "worth it," when putting those same lives on the line in Benghazi wasn't considered "worth it."
This thread has now officially been Gazzied!
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Post by: kronk
If Nigeria is asking for international help to recover 200+ kidnapped school girls, plus however many others that they may be holding, I say let's help them.
This is an example of what we should be doing.
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Post by: Ouze
I have mixed feelings. I've generally been a champion of isolationist policies in the past. I didn't want us to get involved militarily in Syria, or Libya, or the Ukraine. I'm a pretty ardent supporter of John Quincy Adam's advice on this:
America does not go abroad in search of monsters to destroy. She is the well-wisher to freedom and independence of all. She is the champion and vindicator only of her own.
So, there's that on the one hand. We're not the world police.
On the other hand, feth these guys. If there were ever dudes that need to get got, it's these guys. There are plenty of ways I can rationalize how this is different: Libya was (and is) unclear as to where our best interest lies, same with Syria, you could sort of call the Nigerian situation piracy, which has long been a universal crime that any interested jurisdiction can prosecute - and so on. But at the end of the days that's a lot of self serving crap. These guys kidnapped a large number of children who's only crime was going to school, and we can probably help to get them back home. I think we should, consistency be damned.
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Post by: hotsauceman1
Ouze wrote:I have mixed feelings. I've generally been a champion of isolationist policies in the past. I didn't want us to get involved militarily in Syria, or Libya, or the Ukraine. I'm a pretty ardent supporter of John Quincy Adam's advice on this:
America does not go abroad in search of monsters to destroy. She is the well-wisher to freedom and independence of all. She is the champion and vindicator only of her own.
So, there's that on the one hand. We're not the world police.
But we are living in a very small world now one could say.
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Post by: Frazzled
So?
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Post by: NuggzTheNinja
kronk wrote:If Nigeria is asking for international help to recover 200+ kidnapped school girls, plus however many others that they may be holding, I say let's help them.
This is an example of what we should be doing.
Who is this "we" you speak of? Will you be going to help with their scavenger hunt?
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Post by: hotsauceman1
Making it both hrd to ignore and hard to justify when things like this come up. Im quite frankly against Isolationism.
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Post by: d-usa
Ouze wrote:I have mixed feelings. I've generally been a champion of isolationist policies in the past. I didn't want us to get involved militarily in Syria, or Libya, or the Ukraine. I'm a pretty ardent supporter of John Quincy Adam's advice on this:
America does not go abroad in search of monsters to destroy. She is the well-wisher to freedom and independence of all. She is the champion and vindicator only of her own.
So, there's that on the one hand. We're not the world police.
I am pretty mixed on this as well.
These guys are doing what they are doing because they feel that the west is forcing itself on them and their culture. Having the west come in at gunpoint and kill them and take 'their' children and put them back into schools isn't going to change that perception. Unless we are going to kill every single person that thinks that way, or decide to stick a peace-keeping force there, it is just a feel good mission. Save these girls, remind the people that the extremists are right about the "west" forcing themselves on them, go home and let them continue to do what they do to girls there. They will now also go after anybody that might have given any kind of aid to the "west".
If this is truly the problem:
"Nigeria has one of the best armed forces" on the continent, says Kyari Mohammed, a professor of security studies at Modibbo Adama University of Technology in northern Nigeria, "but they are not trained for asymmetric warfare." The militants disguise themselves easily amongst their fellow Nigerians in Borno, and often escape to bordering countries or hideouts in the dense northern forests.
Then let's help them fix that. I'd even be fine with helping them rescue the girls that are in trouble right now as long as there is an understanding that we are not going to come swooping in every time they can't handle their own problems. Make it a case of "we are going to help you this one time as long as you agree to letting us (preferable a UN us) set up training programs for your military to take care of this yourself.
Doing a feel good mission after we ignored everything in the past and are going to ignore the future isn't going to help anybody long term. Either put in a program (not permanent US troops, a program) to fix it or stay away from it.
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Post by: Medium of Death
NuggzTheNinja wrote: kronk wrote:If Nigeria is asking for international help to recover 200+ kidnapped school girls, plus however many others that they may be holding, I say let's help them.
This is an example of what we should be doing.
Who is this "we" you speak of? Will you be going to help with their scavenger hunt?
Are you trying to say that the actions of a nations armed forces don't reflect on its people and that they shouldn't have a say?
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Post by: Ouze
This is an opinion I've seen expressed often; that civilians who don't wear a uniform somehow don't have a right to an opinion on military matters. I guess we're just relegated to paying for every article of clothing a soldier wears, the rifle in his hands, the ammunition he shoots, the food he eats, and his healthcare for life. Remember - shut up and pay your taxes!
The meta-level irony here is that Kronk was told to shut up on a forum that, as a DCM, he freely helps financially support by someone who does not.
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Post by: NuggzTheNinja
Medium of Death wrote: NuggzTheNinja wrote: kronk wrote:If Nigeria is asking for international help to recover 200+ kidnapped school girls, plus however many others that they may be holding, I say let's help them.
This is an example of what we should be doing.
Who is this "we" you speak of? Will you be going to help with their scavenger hunt?
Are you trying to say that the actions of a nations armed forces don't reflect on its people and that they shouldn't have a say?
Everyone is entitled to an opinion, but unless you actually have a dog in the fight (i.e., you are going, or you know people who are), it's kind of weak to say offhand, "Let's risk someone else's life to do what I find to be morally correct." Automatically Appended Next Post: Ouze wrote:This is an opinion I've seen expressed often; that civilians who don't wear a uniform somehow don't have a right to an opinion on military matters. I guess we're just relegated to paying for every article of clothing a soldier wears, the rifle in his hands, the ammunition he shoots, the food he eats, and his healthcare for life. Remember - shut up and pay your taxes!
The meta-level irony here is that Kronk was told to shut up on a forum that, as a DCM, he freely helps financially support by someone who does not.
This analogy is completely derptastic, but feel free to send your toy soldiers to look for these girls if that rubs your moral compass the right way.
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Post by: Frazzled
hotsauceman1 wrote:Making it both hrd to ignore and hard to justify when things like this come up. Im quite frankly against Isolationism.
But you're in college with no skin in the game when your "against isolation."
As a Dad I'm hyper pro isolation.
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Post by: Medium of Death
Isn't that the point of the armed forces? Doing what people who are out of harms way tell you to do?
American or British (as Britain has said they'll send troops) are probably more likely to fair better in this particular situation given the type of conflicts that they've been fighting recently. I don't think people are disregarding the possibility of soldiers dying, they are more likely thinking that either of these two nations are more likely to get the job done.
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Post by: SlaveToDorkness
If our objective is to rescue these poor girls I say no. At this point it's going to be like sending the fire department to watch your house finish burning. After 3 weeks these girls are gone.
Much like Syria, we should have helped a long time ago.
If the objective is to blow the gak out of these dirtbags then yes, we go and we let the Specials do what they do best.
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Post by: NuggzTheNinja
Medium of Death wrote:Isn't that the point of the armed forces? Doing what people who are out of harms way tell you to do?
American or British (as Britain has said they'll send troops) are probably more likely to fair better in this particular situation given the type of conflicts that they've been fighting recently. I don't think people are disregarding the possibility of soldiers dying, they are more likely thinking that either of these two nations are more likely to get the job done.
.
The United States Army serves as the land-based branch of the U.S. Armed Forces. §3062 of Title 10 US Code defines the purpose of the army as:[8][9]
Preserving the peace and security and providing for the defense of the United States, the Commonwealths and possessions and any areas occupied by the United States
Supporting the national policies
Implementing the national objectives
Overcoming any nations responsible for aggressive acts that imperil the peace and security of the United States
According to Wikipedia, is the "mission" of the US Army. It might be tough to shoehorn the wellbeing of Nigerians into that, unless we want to adopt a Team America World Police national policy.
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Post by: SlaveToDorkness
I just want to see John Kerry say "feth YEAH!"
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Post by: Ouze
SlaveToDorkness wrote:If our objective is to rescue these poor girls I say no. At this point it's going to be like sending the fire department to watch your house finish burning. After 3 weeks these girls are gone.
I think you're probably right on that latter element.
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Post by: Medium of Death
Wouldn't they be sending hostage rescue specialists to deal with this problem? Do they all fall under the Army?
I guess the main danger here is getting embroiled with another Islamic Fundamentalist group while the two that the UK & US (and others) are fighting are still around causing problems.
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Post by: whembly
Ouze wrote:I have mixed feelings. I've generally been a champion of isolationist policies in the past. I didn't want us to get involved militarily in Syria, or Libya, or the Ukraine. I'm a pretty ardent supporter of John Quincy Adam's advice on this:
America does not go abroad in search of monsters to destroy. She is the well-wisher to freedom and independence of all. She is the champion and vindicator only of her own.
So, there's that on the one hand. We're not the world police.
On the other hand, feth these guys. If there were ever dudes that need to get got, it's these guys. There are plenty of ways I can rationalize how this is different: Libya was (and is) unclear as to where our best interest lies, same with Syria, you could sort of call the Nigerian situation piracy, which has long been a universal crime that any interested jurisdiction can prosecute - and so on. But at the end of the days that's a lot of self serving crap. These guys kidnapped a large number of children who's only crime was going to school, and we can probably help to get them back home. I think we should, consistency be damned.
I like this... a lot.
Consistency be damned indeed.
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Post by: CptJake
Personally, I think providing intel and a couple of advisors to either Nigerian SOF or some African Union unit is about as far as I would like to see this go.
Inevitably, any rescue mission is going to end up with dead hostages. If the Nigerians or AU do it, they'll pat themselves on the back for the ones saved and brush off the international media condemnation.
If it was a US unit that did the takedown, we'll be hammered in the press and for a variety of reasons, that ends up being a very bad thing.
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Post by: kronk
NuggzTheNinja wrote: Medium of Death wrote: NuggzTheNinja wrote: kronk wrote:If Nigeria is asking for international help to recover 200+ kidnapped school girls, plus however many others that they may be holding, I say let's help them. This is an example of what we should be doing. Who is this "we" you speak of? Will you be going to help with their scavenger hunt? Are you trying to say that the actions of a nations armed forces don't reflect on its people and that they shouldn't have a say? Everyone is entitled to an opinion, but unless you actually have a dog in the fight (i.e., you are going, or you know people who are), it's kind of weak to say offhand, "Let's risk someone else's life to do what I find to be morally correct." Edit: You're not worth it.
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Post by: reds8n
Back to the topic please folks.
Ta.
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Post by: Frazzled
CptJake wrote:Personally, I think providing intel and a couple of advisors to either Nigerian SOF or some African Union unit is about as far as I would like to see this go.
Inevitably, any rescue mission is going to end up with dead hostages. If the Nigerians or AU do it, they'll pat themselves on the back for the ones saved and brush off the international media condemnation.
If it was a US unit that did the takedown, we'll be hammered in the press and for a variety of reasons, that ends up being a very bad thing.
Agreed. Nigeria is not a place we want to get embroiled in, and they would love us to.
Nigeria has multiple rebel groups and is a poster boy for "unstable African nation ." Automatically Appended Next Post: kronk wrote: NuggzTheNinja wrote: Medium of Death wrote: NuggzTheNinja wrote: kronk wrote:If Nigeria is asking for international help to recover 200+ kidnapped school girls, plus however many others that they may be holding, I say let's help them.
This is an example of what we should be doing.
Who is this "we" you speak of? Will you be going to help with their scavenger hunt?
Are you trying to say that the actions of a nations armed forces don't reflect on its people and that they shouldn't have a say?
Everyone is entitled to an opinion, but unless you actually have a dog in the fight (i.e., you are going, or you know people who are), it's kind of weak to say offhand, "Let's risk someone else's life to do what I find to be morally correct."
Edit: You're not worth it.
Hey I'm worth it!
A question -would they still be in Nigeria at this point? I'd bet good money they are being shipped out of country.
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Post by: hotsauceman1
Frazzled wrote: hotsauceman1 wrote:Making it both hrd to ignore and hard to justify when things like this come up. Im quite frankly against Isolationism.
But you're in college with no skin in the game when your "against isolation."
As a Dad I'm hyper pro isolation.
But in aa world where more and more things are global, can we afford to be Isolationist?
And Im sure I have skin, I mean, I would be bleeding to death if I had no skin.
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Post by: Frazzled
Can we afford to not be isolationist?
When Switizerland, China, Saudia Arabia, and Brazil are sending their armies out, come back to me.
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Post by: ironicsilence
Has there been any mention of what resources the US is sending? I've been rather out of the loop on this issue
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Post by: NuggzTheNinja
hotsauceman1 wrote: Frazzled wrote: hotsauceman1 wrote:Making it both hrd to ignore and hard to justify when things like this come up. Im quite frankly against Isolationism.
But you're in college with no skin in the game when your "against isolation."
As a Dad I'm hyper pro isolation.
But in aa world where more and more things are global, can we afford to be Isolationist?
And Im sure I have skin, I mean, I would be bleeding to death if I had no skin.
I see what you're saying...the issue is that our interests are intertwined with what happens in other nations.
The question is, does this qualify as "our" interests?
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Post by: SlaveToDorkness
I'm going to have to say a firm "no".
Horrible gak happens throughout the world we can't fix it all. Maybe if Nigeria has to actually deal with it's own heinous issues it might help it grow up.
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Post by: Allod
Hm. To be honest, I don't think there is a *group* of girls left to rescue, they're probably pretty dispersed by now.
Staying consistent with what I said on the death sentences in Egypt, I must confess that I'd have a pretty hard time working up compassion if somebody bombed the gak out of Boko Haram, but I doubt that it'd change much. If West African nations want a firewall against muslim extremists, they will have to build it themselves (which we could and should assist), it's not as if the Americans could drop a functioning civil society from stealth bombers.
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Post by: daedalus
SlaveToDorkness wrote:I'm going to have to say a firm "no".
Horrible gak happens throughout the world we can't fix it all. Maybe if Nigeria has to actually deal with it's own heinous issues it might help it grow up.
Truly, Nigeria just needs to pick itself up by its bootstraps
The US has the best military in the world, in pretty much every way possible. It took us 10 years to kill one guy. How long do you think it will take them to find a bunch of girls help captive somewhere in fething Africa.
I strongly detest America playing world police. I hate self-serving military conflict. This is the one and only situation I think I've seen that, when asked for help, we should send in everything. Acts of cruelty and just pure evil of this magnitude can't be left unbalanced.
We might be getting our hands dirty once again at a time where the last thing we want to do is waste 10 more years of resources and lives in some crapsack place, but we're better than that. Better we be doing it for the sake of some helpless women abducted by fundamentalist pedophiles than for prime government contracts.
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Post by: ironicsilence
Everyone seems to be talking like we are sending in the Marines to burn them out....which is just not the case. The US Armed forces are not being sent it to deal with this
"The technical experts heading to Nigeria will include U.S. military and law enforcement personnel skilled in intelligence, investigations, hostage negotiating, information sharing and victim assistance, as well as officials with expertise in other areas, White House spokesman Jay Carney said.
U.S. armed forces were not being sent, Carney noted."
More likely its prolly a team from the state department and a team from the FBI
Not saying that there isnt a chance in the future for a seal team 6 raid on a compound...but for right now the boots on the ground are law enforcement and not armed forces
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Post by: Seaward
ironicsilence wrote:Has there been any mention of what resources the US is sending? I've been rather out of the loop on this issue
I don't think there has been.
My guess? A token amount. A couple drones, maybe some JSOC staff guys to pad the resume. And since where JSOC goes the FBI goes these days, a few special agents. Automatically Appended Next Post: ironicsilence wrote:Everyone seems to be talking like we are sending in the Marines to burn them out....which is just not the case. The US Armed forces are not being sent it to deal with this
"The technical experts heading to Nigeria will include U.S. military and law enforcement personnel skilled in intelligence, investigations, hostage negotiating, information sharing and victim assistance, as well as officials with expertise in other areas, White House spokesman Jay Carney said.
U.S. armed forces were not being sent, Carney noted."
More likely its prolly a team from the state department and a team from the FBI
Not saying that there isnt a chance in the future for a seal team 6 raid on a compound...but for right now the boots on the ground are law enforcement and not armed forces
I'm curious how military and law enforcement personnel aren't "armed forces," but then a lot of things Carney says confuse me.
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Post by: Jihadin
Jebus that was a goof on Carney part. Though I have to say. Whatever Carney getting paid they need to triple it. He does a Heck of a tap dance on the podium
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Post by: Ensis Ferrae
NuggzTheNinja wrote: kronk wrote:If Nigeria is asking for international help to recover 200+ kidnapped school girls, plus however many others that they may be holding, I say let's help them.
This is an example of what we should be doing.
Who is this "we" you speak of? Will you be going to help with their scavenger hunt?
As someone who Kronk's taxes paid for, I agree with him. It shows some in the international community that "we" the American people, when asked to help in a situation, will give the help needed. I can't think of too many Americans who wouldnt be behind his line of thinking (and honestly, those who don't actually agree with this line of thinking seem to gravitate towards the extreme ends of the political spectrum)
As to what this "help" would end up being, I can't particularly say, but I'd hope it includes a can of whoop ass:
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Post by: Frazzled
I'm sure no one will remind him of that when he returns to journalism.
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Post by: Jihadin
I love the C17
Look at all that leg room
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Post by: CptJake
I once had the pleasure of the guy sitting across from me in a C130 yacking all over my pants, ruck and reserve. Bless his heart.
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Post by: whembly
You may have that leg room... but, jeebus, those seats look uncomfortable. o.O
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Post by: Jihadin
Try being in one for 18+ hours
That's a Airborne Op Ensis posted of. Like max flight time is four hours.
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Post by: Da Boss
I wish we'd send some troops in too. I think it's absolutely the right thing to do. This story is sickening.
Think how many of those girls might come home infected with HIV. I mean, just at the low end of the spectrum of horror here, but still devastating.
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Post by: Jihadin
What is "US Interest" in Nigeria to justify a US Military/US Armed Forces response?
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Post by: Ensis Ferrae
Jihadin wrote:What is "US Interest" in Nigeria to justify a US Military/US Armed Forces response?
I don't honestly think there is one, besides "they asked us to" which to me, I would think "they asked us to blow gak up for them" is better than "they have something bad, so we're gonna go in there and give them freedom" that many people see us doing.
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Post by: whembly
Jihadin wrote:What is "US Interest" in Nigeria to justify a US Military/US Armed Forces response?
How about A) help was requested and B) these guys deserves a MOAB up their arse.
This is one instance where I would favor an actual military strike. Go in there with special forces and kill all the kidnappers. Cover them in the blood of swine and leave their corpses on pikes to rot in the jungle heat.
If we're going to go in there and make a statement... then by Allah there should be no question as to what the actual outcome should be.
The key here is that they asked for our help... we ain't jollygagging without their permission in this.
EDIT: ninja'ed by Ensis
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Post by: daedalus
Jihadin wrote:What is "US Interest" in Nigeria to justify a US Military/US Armed Forces response?
Human interest. Why do you hate children?
(I do not actually think you hate children.)
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Post by: Frazzled
I hate children.
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Post by: daedalus
You wouldn't if they stayed off your lawn.
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Post by: Frazzled
Or would just climb into this oven, er special closet. Mmmmthe other other white meat.
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Post by: ironicsilence
I would say that we would need something from the UN before sending in any real military units, though personally this seems like something the UN should handle. However history is chalk full of examples of how useless the UN is when it does anything in Africa. This also seems like something a true military contractor could handle ala executive outcomes actions in Sierra Leone in 95
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Post by: Jihadin
Its cheaper detailing Drones with Hellfire there.
They're hiding in a national Jungle Park that's way bigger then Yellowstone.
The JOTC was closed late 80's early 90's in Panama.
We've no experience in Jungle Operations.
Do we actually want to deploy military Task Force in country? We're out of Iraq and soon to be, real SOON, in Afghanistan. I do not believe that Obama is quite that willing to begin Combat Operations in another country with "Boots on Ground"
Edit
To similar how we got involve in Somalia
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Post by: CptJake
Jihadin wrote:
The JOTC was closed late 80's early 90's in Panama.
We've no experience in Jungle Operations.
It looks like others have noticed the lack of jungle prepared troops. I read this earlier today: http://www.armytimes.com/article/20130604/NEWS/306040004/Hawaii-unit-re-establishing-jungle-warfare-school
Not yet an 'official' as in you can schedule it through your unit training NCO course, but they are trying hard to make it so.
By the way, as someone who was in Panama 'till 99, I can tell you JOTC was running rotations at least through 98. Nothing like crossing a caiman infested river, swimming while pushing your poncho raft, at night. I love Ft Sherman. Except the black palms. Those were not fun.
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Post by: whembly
Jihadin wrote:Its cheaper detailing Drones with Hellfire there.
They're hiding in a national Jungle Park that's way bigger then Yellowstone.
The JOTC was closed late 80's early 90's in Panama.
We've no experience in Jungle Operations.
Do we actually want to deploy military Task Force in country? We're out of Iraq and soon to be, real SOON, in Afghanistan. I do not believe that Obama is quite that willing to begin Combat Operations in another country with "Boots on Ground"
Edit
To similar how we got involve in Somalia
Nah... I'd ramp up intelligence operations there...
You know... find them.
Then send in the drones/special forces. Oh... maybe one spectre gunship to loiter around.
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Post by: CptJake
An AC130 is not a good tool for rescuing hostages. It may be decent overwatch for a rescue force, but even though they have very good fire control, when dealing with kids who will run anywhere, it would be hard to get fires cleared.
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Post by: whembly
CptJake wrote:An AC130 is not a good tool for rescuing hostages. It may be decent overwatch for a rescue force, but even though they have very good fire control, when dealing with kids who will run anywhere, it would be hard to get fires cleared.
I was being cheeky...
I know we can't just drop munitions all over the place.
This would definitely require actual kick ass boots on the ground.
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Post by: CptJake
Which is why I am very much in favor of those being Nigerian boots. Way too risky of a mission for me to want to see us take the blame for dead hostages. If they were US hostages (even some) I would be for US door kickers.
I participated in a very limited support role during hostage situation in Peru when Tupac Amaru took over the Japanese Ambassador's residence and know a bit about the sensitivities of host nation and US interests and the potential for gak to go sideways.
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Post by: whembly
CptJake wrote:Which is why I am very much in favor of those being Nigerian boots. Way too risky of a mission for me to want to see us take the blame for dead hostages. If they were US hostages (even some) I would be for US door kickers.
I participated in a very limited support role during hostage situation in Peru when Tupac Amaru took over the Japanese Ambassador's residence and know a bit about the sensitivities of host nation and US interests and the potential for gak to go sideways.
Sure... I get that and maybe the best solution is to train the Nigerians to combat this.
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Post by: welshhoppo
I wish them the best of luck in finding these poor girls. I don't know if they'll have any luck, but I hope they do.
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Post by: Easy E
I'm fine with us sending FBI teams, and intelligence assets over there to help with the search. It is the proper thing to do.
However, if any asses need to be whooped, let the Nigerians do it themselves while we watch and nod approvingly.
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Post by: EmilCrane
One pitfall people are falling into when discussing Nigeria is that they are acting like its some unstable dictator of the week African country. While it does have a degree of instability like all such countries, Nigeria also has the largest economy in Africa, it's one of the most populous nations in Africa and is the major regional power in sub Saharan Africa. I would classify it as a nation on the edge of westernising.
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Post by: LordofHats
Nigeria isn't as bad off as its sometimes made out to be. It has very little sectarian violence compared to other African nations despite having one of the most ethnically diverse populations on the continent. It's one of the Next Eleven nations for a good reason. Despite its problems with religious conflict, Nigeria is in a good position to grow very stable and strong over the next century.
I don't have issue with the US going and helping them out. Its a nice change of pace from our usual 'lets invade' philosophy
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Post by: daedalus
EmilCrane wrote:One pitfall people are falling into when discussing Nigeria is that they are acting like its some unstable dictator of the week African country. While it does have a degree of instability like all such countries, Nigeria also has the largest economy in Africa, it's one of the most populous nations in Africa and is the major regional power in sub Saharan Africa. I would classify it as a nation on the edge of westernising.
Absolutely. it's a foothold of civilization. That makes providing assistance when requested more important, I think.
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Post by: Jihadin
If we're going to train the Nigerian military up then they need to come here.
S.F.
School of America
JRTC version of Hawaii "JOTC"
Thanks Jake for the update. One rotation there in '92 and someone threw "brass" at the Howler Monkies"
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Post by: Ensis Ferrae
EmilCrane wrote:One pitfall people are falling into when discussing Nigeria is that they are acting like its some unstable dictator of the week African country. While it does have a degree of instability like all such countries, Nigeria also has the largest economy in Africa, it's one of the most populous nations in Africa and is the major regional power in sub Saharan Africa. I would classify it as a nation on the edge of westernising.
Their economy is even larger than South Africa?? I mean, I would assume that, outside of the formerly stable Egypt, RSA would be your next "best" country on the Continent, since they have probably the most external influence (especially from Australia, and NZ around this time of year, and then in August)
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Post by: djones520
Ensis Ferrae wrote: EmilCrane wrote:One pitfall people are falling into when discussing Nigeria is that they are acting like its some unstable dictator of the week African country. While it does have a degree of instability like all such countries, Nigeria also has the largest economy in Africa, it's one of the most populous nations in Africa and is the major regional power in sub Saharan Africa. I would classify it as a nation on the edge of westernising.
Their economy is even larger than South Africa?? I mean, I would assume that, outside of the formerly stable Egypt, RSA would be your next "best" country on the Continent, since they have probably the most external influence (especially from Australia, and NZ around this time of year, and then in August)
It is ranked second to South Africa. 3rd on the continent.
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Post by: LordofHats
I'm pretty sure they're the largest growing economy, meaning that they have the biggest opportunity for growth in Africa which isn't too outlandish. Automatically Appended Next Post: Boko Haram in the news again;
http://news.yahoo.com/shocked-survivors-count-dead-boko-haram-attack-194032325.html
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Post by: Jehan-reznor
daedalus wrote: Jihadin wrote:What is "US Interest" in Nigeria to justify a US Military/US Armed Forces response?
Human interest. Why do you hate children?
(I do not actually think you hate children.)
America always claims to be the (LA)PD of the world, so they should offer their help, Or there must be OIL or Titanium off course. Isolation really, should have done that in 40-45 the europe and russia would have been part of the 1000 year reich
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Post by: Seaward
Jehan-reznor wrote:America always claims to be the (LA)PD of the world, so they should offer their help,
I don't believe we've ever made that claim.
Other countries have certainly claimed we are or believe ourselves to be, but I don't recall any of our leaders or public institutions ever having accepted the mantle.
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Post by: Evil_Toast
Ensis Ferrae wrote: EmilCrane wrote:One pitfall people are falling into when discussing Nigeria is that they are acting like its some unstable dictator of the week African country. While it does have a degree of instability like all such countries, Nigeria also has the largest economy in Africa, it's one of the most populous nations in Africa and is the major regional power in sub Saharan Africa. I would classify it as a nation on the edge of westernising.
Their economy is even larger than South Africa?? I mean, I would assume that, outside of the formerly stable Egypt, RSA would be your next "best" country on the Continent, since they have probably the most external influence (especially from Australia, and NZ around this time of year, and then in August)
Yup, this happened recently. We seem to be stagnating a little the last few years, but this is a discussion for a different place.
As for your second point, the only thing we're influencing in Oz and NZ at the moment, is the bottom places on the combined log (with my team holding onto top spot, but still got away games against the Crusaders [gulp] and Brumbies to worry about). As for August...
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Post by: Frazzled
Ensis Ferrae wrote: EmilCrane wrote:One pitfall people are falling into when discussing Nigeria is that they are acting like its some unstable dictator of the week African country. While it does have a degree of instability like all such countries, Nigeria also has the largest economy in Africa, it's one of the most populous nations in Africa and is the major regional power in sub Saharan Africa. I would classify it as a nation on the edge of westernising.
Their economy is even larger than South Africa?? I mean, I would assume that, outside of the formerly stable Egypt, RSA would be your next "best" country on the Continent, since they have probably the most external influence (especially from Australia, and NZ around this time of year, and then in August)
Nigeria is potentially one of the largest oil producers int he world. The make, well nothing else, except rebel groups and crime. They're real good about that. Also killings of Christians (no one noted these Christian girls) is common in certain regions.
Corruption is so bad, pretty much no US company can do business there. I remember starting a bank call with the CEO starting by saying "the good news, no one was killed in the attack." The call went downhill from there.
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Post by: Dreadclaw69
The US will get involved. Two reasons - they spent a lot of time and money setting up AFCOM. And China is growing in influence in the continent and signing lots of deals for vital mineral resources
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Post by: Easy E
That is a good call out.
Africa is still a "battleground" to determine who controls what spheres of influence there.
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Post by: Dreadclaw69
Thank you. China has started to grow its influence in Africa because it doesn't want to sign any deals that involve promoting human rights, or aid. It wants resources and wants to pay for them - no more, no less. And this seems to work out pretty well for them.
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Post by: whembly
Here's more info on what this "help" will be...
Pentagon outlines plans to help rescue kidnapped girls in Nigeria
WASHINGTON — The Pentagon on Wednesday unveiled its plans to help rescue more than 200 girls who were kidnapped by Islamic militants in Nigeria.
At the direction of the White House, the U.S. military will send a small team of experts to the embassy in Abuja, Nigeria’s capital, to form an interagency “coordination and assessment cell” that will work the Nigerian government to locate and free the teenagers who were abducted from their school by Boko Haram last month, Pentagon spokesman Col. Steve Warren told reporters.
The U.S. military team will consist of fewer than 10 uniformed military personnel, who will advise and assist the Nigerians with communications, logistics, and intelligence, according to Warren.
Warren would not say whether the U.S. will send surveillance drones to Nigeria to search for the girls, but did say that the “we are discussing with the Nigerian government any type of information sharing arrangements that we can — that we can agree to.”
The Defense Department does not have any intention of using American special operations forces against Boko Haram to liberate their captives, according to Warren.
“[The team’s] mission there is to simply assess and advise … At this time we are not considering a U.S. operation to help rescue the girls,” he said.
The advisory team will augment the existing U.S. military presence in Nigeria. There are currently about 50 American troops stationed at the embassy in Abuja, including embassy security, Office of Military Cooperation and defense attache staff. There are also 20 U.S. Marines temporarily in country participating in training exercises, according to Warren.
The Marines won’t be part of the efforts to help the Nigerians find the abducted girls, but the other U.S. servicemembers will.
“Everyone is working towards trying to find these girls. This is a horrible event and it’s a tragedy,” Warren said. “All U.S. military personnel [at the embassy] in Nigeria will help contribute to the efforts to find these girls.”
Warren said AFRICOM stood up a crisis response planning cell after the kidnappings occurred, and U.S. troops in Nigeria have been “doing what they were capable of doing” up to this point.
Boko Haram was designated a terrorist organization by the U.S. State Department last year. The group has links to al-Qaida and is responsible for thousands of deaths in Nigeria over the past several years, according to the State Department. The militants have previously targeted civilians in their attacks, including women and children.
Abubakar Shekau, the leader of the group, has reportedly threatened to sell the girls to human traffickers.
“These girls were captured and kidnapped 22 days ago and time is of the essence,” White House Press Secretary Jay Carney told reporters Tuesday. “Appropriate action must be taken to locate and to free these young women before they are trafficked or killed.”
Some lawmakers are pushing the Obama administration to take a stronger approach. Rep. Ed Royce, R-Calif., the chairman of the House Foreign Affairs Committee, announced that he will hold a hearing to examine the administration’s response to the kidnappings and to the threat posed by Boko Haram.
In a letter sent to Secretary of Defense Chuck Hagel and Secretary of State John Kerry on Wednesday, Royce criticized the administration’s approach as shortsighted.
“While I welcome the Administration’s efforts in response to the kidnapping, including offering a team of military and law enforcement officials to the Nigerian government, I believe this temporary response will not sufficiently combat Boko Haram’s long-term threat to the region and U.S. interests,” he wrote.
Royce argued that the U.S. government needs to develop a “strategic, multifaceted approach” to help Nigeria combat the militants, including more robust security assistance and intelligence sharing with Nigeria, and better coordination with other countries in the region to thwart the group’s cross-border activities.
“It is clear that a piecemeal approach to Boko Haram, with limited U.S. military involvement, has been ineffective to date,’ Royce said in the letter. “A more aggressive U.S. commitment against al-Qaeda affiliated Boko Haram is overdue.”
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Post by: ironicsilence
Heres an interesting article in response to the lately Selfie Rage sweeping the net
http://monsterhunternation.com/2014/05/08/operation-pouty-face/
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Post by: Jihadin
SOCOM
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Post by: kronk
Holy crap funny! On the Real Men Don’t Buy Girls campaign… Holy gak… Seriously? That is so blindingly obvious that it takes a campaign on Twitter? “OMG! I was totally buying some child brides for my harem and then I saw that Ashton Kutcher said slavery was bad! LOL. I would have been soooo embarrassed!” said no Saudi prince ever. The situation, however, is very sad. I hope the girls are found and returned home soon.
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Post by: LordofHats
whembly wrote:Here's more info on what this "help" will be...
Pentagon outlines plans to help rescue kidnapped girls in Nigeria
WASHINGTON — The Pentagon on Wednesday unveiled its plans to help rescue more than 200 girls who were kidnapped by Islamic militants in Nigeria.
At the direction of the White House, the U.S. military will send a small team of experts to the embassy in Abuja, Nigeria’s capital, to form an interagency “coordination and assessment cell” that will work the Nigerian government to locate and free the teenagers who were abducted from their school by Boko Haram last month, Pentagon spokesman Col. Steve Warren told reporters.
The U.S. military team will consist of fewer than 10 uniformed military personnel, who will advise and assist the Nigerians with communications, logistics, and intelligence, according to Warren.
Warren would not say whether the U.S. will send surveillance drones to Nigeria to search for the girls, but did say that the “we are discussing with the Nigerian government any type of information sharing arrangements that we can — that we can agree to.”
The Defense Department does not have any intention of using American special operations forces against Boko Haram to liberate their captives, according to Warren.
“[The team’s] mission there is to simply assess and advise … At this time we are not considering a U.S. operation to help rescue the girls,” he said.
The advisory team will augment the existing U.S. military presence in Nigeria. There are currently about 50 American troops stationed at the embassy in Abuja, including embassy security, Office of Military Cooperation and defense attache staff. There are also 20 U.S. Marines temporarily in country participating in training exercises, according to Warren.
The Marines won’t be part of the efforts to help the Nigerians find the abducted girls, but the other U.S. servicemembers will.
“Everyone is working towards trying to find these girls. This is a horrible event and it’s a tragedy,” Warren said. “All U.S. military personnel [at the embassy] in Nigeria will help contribute to the efforts to find these girls.”
Warren said AFRICOM stood up a crisis response planning cell after the kidnappings occurred, and U.S. troops in Nigeria have been “doing what they were capable of doing” up to this point.
Boko Haram was designated a terrorist organization by the U.S. State Department last year. The group has links to al-Qaida and is responsible for thousands of deaths in Nigeria over the past several years, according to the State Department. The militants have previously targeted civilians in their attacks, including women and children.
Abubakar Shekau, the leader of the group, has reportedly threatened to sell the girls to human traffickers.
“These girls were captured and kidnapped 22 days ago and time is of the essence,” White House Press Secretary Jay Carney told reporters Tuesday. “Appropriate action must be taken to locate and to free these young women before they are trafficked or killed.”
Some lawmakers are pushing the Obama administration to take a stronger approach. Rep. Ed Royce, R-Calif., the chairman of the House Foreign Affairs Committee, announced that he will hold a hearing to examine the administration’s response to the kidnappings and to the threat posed by Boko Haram.
In a letter sent to Secretary of Defense Chuck Hagel and Secretary of State John Kerry on Wednesday, Royce criticized the administration’s approach as shortsighted.
“While I welcome the Administration’s efforts in response to the kidnapping, including offering a team of military and law enforcement officials to the Nigerian government, I believe this temporary response will not sufficiently combat Boko Haram’s long-term threat to the region and U.S. interests,” he wrote.
Royce argued that the U.S. government needs to develop a “strategic, multifaceted approach” to help Nigeria combat the militants, including more robust security assistance and intelligence sharing with Nigeria, and better coordination with other countries in the region to thwart the group’s cross-border activities.
“It is clear that a piecemeal approach to Boko Haram, with limited U.S. military involvement, has been ineffective to date,’ Royce said in the letter. “A more aggressive U.S. commitment against al-Qaeda affiliated Boko Haram is overdue.”
Damn, I was kind of hoping for the premise to an awesome sequel to Team America.
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Post by: ironicsilence
kronk wrote:
Holy crap funny!
On the Real Men Don’t Buy Girls campaign… Holy gak… Seriously? That is so blindingly obvious that it takes a campaign on Twitter? “OMG! I was totally buying some child brides for my harem and then I saw that Ashton Kutcher said slavery was bad! LOL. I would have been soooo embarrassed!” said no Saudi prince ever.
The situation, however, is very sad. I hope the girls are found and returned home soon.
I also like how most of the celebs that are posting these selfies are the same ones that get all butt hurt when the US tries to be a World Cop
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Post by: Ouze
I too found this stupid hashtag campaign to be inane. I remember when the Syria thing first started blowing up, people kept using some hashtag about a student who had gotten lit up, and was wondering how many retweets it took to get an ambulance for him. These sorts of campaigns are the lamest forms of slacktivism.
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Post by: d-usa
Come on guys, we totally solved a problem with #Kony2012.
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Post by: hotsauceman1
Ouze wrote:I too found this stupid hashtag campaign to be inane. I remember when the Syria thing first started blowing up, people kept using some hashtag about a student who had gotten lit up, and was wondering how many retweets it took to get an ambulance for him. These sorts of campaigns are the lamest forms of slacktivism.
This happened and I made the comment it is unlikely that we find them all.
I could feel the rage of facebook on me that moment Automatically Appended Next Post: d-usa wrote:Come on guys, we totally solved a problem with #Kony2012.
It gave us this
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Post by: LordofHats
hotsauceman1 wrote:
This happened and I made the comment it is unlikely that we find them all.
I could feel the rage of facebook on me that moment
Fore shame. How dare you even suggest that we won't catch Kony!
I am very disappointed Sauce
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Post by: NuggzTheNinja
hotsauceman1 wrote: Ouze wrote:I too found this stupid hashtag campaign to be inane. I remember when the Syria thing first started blowing up, people kept using some hashtag about a student who had gotten lit up, and was wondering how many retweets it took to get an ambulance for him. These sorts of campaigns are the lamest forms of slacktivism.
This happened and I made the comment it is unlikely that we find them all.
I could feel the rage of facebook on me that moment
Automatically Appended Next Post:
d-usa wrote:Come on guys, we totally solved a problem with #Kony2012.
It gave us this
And this!
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Post by: SlaveToDorkness
My favorite part:
Real men don’t punch out their wives either.
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Post by: hotsauceman1
Why is it "Real me dont buy girls" This isnt human traficking, it is a kidnapping.
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Post by: ironicsilence
hotsauceman1 wrote:Why is it "Real me dont buy girls" This isnt human traficking, it is a kidnapping.
because human traficking is a much "sexier" cause, no one cares about kidnapping
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Post by: DarkTraveler777
hotsauceman1 wrote:Why is it "Real me dont buy girls" This isnt human traficking, it is a kidnapping.
The leader of Boko Haram threatened to sell the girls. So this is about human trafficking.
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-africa-27283383
I am not defending the lame hastag gak, but your statement genuinely confused me.
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Post by: whembly
I'm glad it's finally getting attention. It's a shame that we didn't do more earlier when they were killing boys/men on those villages. I also think it's a disgrace we didn't do more in Darfur.
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Post by: hotsauceman1
Oh, I did not know about that.
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