Following is contents of leaked doc from April 24 from GW.

May
Flesh-eater courts; repackage vampire counts + discontinuation of Fell Bets, Black Coach, Vadrghulf (decision 27 April; otherwise repackage)
Silver Tower (?) or alternatively release in late June/July
Age of Sigmar Elves repackaging (?) + release (?) or 40 000 Daemons supplement

June
Deathstorm Brood Lord, bases (decision 17 May; otherwise release on schedule)
Paint Bundles (MCY?)
Dark Angels Supplement + chaplain/company master (decision 3 June; MCY)
Silver Tower standalone (decision 19 June)
Skaven Discont. Gutter Runners, Night Runners (after Ogre Kingdoms)

July
Chaos Space Marines + PCW (decision 19 June; otherwise release on schedule)
Elves release + Discont.
Tzeentch kit/Vedros release (?)
Horus Heresy Nuceria (decision 7 June; otherwise release on schedule)
Lost patrol supplements (decision 7 June; otherwise release on schedule)
Hobbit (?)/LOTR Mordor, Fallen Realms re-release (MCY.72)

August
Vedros warboss (MCY.73)
Cities of Death (decision 7 June)
P/72/ Keeper of Secrets (decision 12 Dec; MCY.93)
Necrons + Necron Lord on KW (decision July 4)

September
Horus Heresy standalone
Dark Vengeance replac. Orks + Skitarii (?)
AOS Death (MCY.83)

Interesting. Not to dismiss out of hand, but anyone able to corroborate this (especially Horus Heresy Nuceria, Cities of Death and the HH standalone). Preferably quickly before Nafka/BoL(lock)S pick it up and go mental with it citing "exclusive anonymous sources"

What all those decisions mean? Release dates have been already decided so any source that claims there's decision to be done say on releases in June is pretty unreliable to say the least...

We have Start collecting: Chaos space marines and Start collecting: Militarum tempestus in two-three weeks from now.

Anyone who knows what MCY and PCW means

Keeper of Secrets! Gooo, Slaanesh!

This has clearly been heavily adapted, as a genuine doc wouldn't be full of ?s, yet keeps seemingly internal codes we can't comprehend. Interesting, but a bit odd, and seems wishlist-y without corroboration.

Are you the source?

I have a leaked release list too http://pastebin.com/9EC3qw3b

No General's Handbook on this list.

Dryadman11 wrote:
Following is contents of leaked doc from April 24 from GW.

May
Flesh-eater courts; repackage vampire counts + discontinuation of Fell Bets, Black Coach, Vadrghulf (decision 27 April; otherwise repackage)
Silver Tower (?) or alternatively release in late June/July
Age of Sigmar Elves repackaging (?) + release (?) or 40 000 Daemons supplement

June
Deathstorm Brood Lord, bases (decision 17 May; otherwise release on schedule)
Paint Bundles (MCY?)
Dark Angels Supplement + chaplain/company master (decision 3 June; MCY)
Silver Tower standalone (decision 19 June)
Skaven Discont. Gutter Runners, Night Runners (after Ogre Kingdoms)

July
Chaos Space Marines + PCW (decision 19 June; otherwise release on schedule)
Elves release + Discont.
Tzeentch kit/Vedros release (?)
Horus Heresy Nuceria (decision 7 June; otherwise release on schedule)
Lost patrol supplements (decision 7 June; otherwise release on schedule)
Hobbit (?)/LOTR Mordor, Fallen Realms re-release (MCY.72)

August
Vedros warboss (MCY.73)
Cities of Death (decision 7 June)
P/72/ Keeper of Secrets (decision 12 Dec; MCY.93)
Necrons + Necron Lord on KW (decision July 4)

September
Horus Heresy standalone
Dark Vengeance replac. Orks + Skitarii (?)
AOS Death (MCY.83)

Can someone please translate these code words... MCY P/72/ so confused. But for real, I thought Vedros was only available in North America... So GW is planning to release AOBR ork warboss in their regular site?

In September, AoS is dead?

MCY clearly stands for Monte Carlo Yacht, and PCW can only be Pina Colada Waiter. It's what the funds will go towards.

It's a one post wonder guys. Don't expect any follow up.

Nuceria would suggest World Eaters.. and makes sense.

From the Wiki:

Nuceria was a brutal, unforgiving world run by cruel slavemasters from the city of Desh'ea that forced their subjects to battle in gladiatorial arenas. The aggression-enhancing technology known as the Butchers Nails was a key part of this process. The young Angron was captured and forced to take part in this cruel game until he led a slave revolt. However at the height of the battle against the slavemasters he was teleported away by the Emperor, something which infuriated the Red Angel. In the aftermath of Angron's unwilling departure from Nuceria, his comrades were defeated and massacred by the slavemasters, which Angron referred to as the "High-Riders".[1][3]
Many years later, during the Horus Heresy, Angron returned to Nuceria alongside the Word Bearers' Primarch Lorgar. Upon his return he discovered that the slavemasters had told the planet's populace that he had fled in the final moments of his slave revolt. Infuriated at this lie, Angron ordered the purge of all life on Nuceria, something the World Eaters and Word Bearers brutally carried out. During the purge a large fleet of Ultramarines led by Roboute Guilliman himself arrived in orbit over Nuceria and engaged the traitor forces, eager for revenge for the Battle of Calth.[2]

 lord_blackfang wrote:
I have a leaked release list too http://pastebin.com/9EC3qw3b

I hope this one is true as it has Sisters of Battle in it

 lord_blackfang wrote:
I have a leaked release list too http://pastebin.com/9EC3qw3b

Yeah, the history of these "leaked future release lists" is a very dismal one.

I'm crossing my fingers for a big Wood Elves release, hopefully the rumors stay true.

RazorEdge wrote:
In September, AoS is dead?

Haha, makes it sound like that doesn't it?

It's referring to that death expansion rumor for silver tower.

More necrons! Yes.

Didn't AOS Death already come out, or am I confused?

casvalremdeikun wrote:Didn't AOS Death already come out, or am I confused?

I think that's in reference to this:

Baron Klatz wrote:

RazorEdge wrote:
In September, AoS is dead?

Haha, makes it sound like that doesn't it?

It's referring to that death expansion rumor for silver tower.

 Alpharius wrote:

casvalremdeikun wrote:Didn't AOS Death already come out, or am I confused?

I think that's in reference to this:

Baron Klatz wrote:

RazorEdge wrote:
In September, AoS is dead?

Haha, makes it sound like that doesn't it?

It's referring to that death expansion rumor for silver tower.

Ah, gotcha. That makes a lot more sense.

Dark Angels Supplement?
Hah, as if.

Silver Tower has already some leaks out. I doubt that Atia or the other, reliable rumormoungers would have missed said supplement.

 Thairne wrote:
Dark Angels Supplement?
Hah, as if.

Especially since they released an Interrogator-Chaplain a year ago. I suppose they could release the Dark Vengeance SE I-Chaplain and the Company Master separate (both are pretty cool models, so that would be fine by me, I guess), but I doubt it.

I noticed that there is no reference to Curse of the Wulfen Part 2, which may or may not have stuff for Dark Angels in it. Given the events of the last book, I would be surprised if it did not have something for DA.

 lord_blackfang wrote:
I have a leaked release list too http://pastebin.com/9EC3qw3b

I like this one a lot better.

 casvalremdeikun wrote:

 Thairne wrote:
Dark Angels Supplement?
Hah, as if.

Especially since they released an Interrogator-Chaplain a year ago. I suppose they could release the Dark Vengeance SE I-Chaplain and the Company Master separate (both are pretty cool models, so that would be fine by me, I guess), but I doubt it.

I noticed that there is no reference to Curse of the Wulfen Part 2, which may or may not have stuff for Dark Angels in it. Given the events of the last book, I would be surprised if it did not have something for DA.

Maybe curse of the wulfen 2 is the DA supplement?

But I want a Dark Angels supplement :(

Queue supermarket loudspeaker.
"Yeah can we get a rumor check on thread 6? Sad Panda please comment on thread 6."

Neronoxx wrote:

 casvalremdeikun wrote:

 Thairne wrote:
Dark Angels Supplement?
Hah, as if.

Especially since they released an Interrogator-Chaplain a year ago. I suppose they could release the Dark Vengeance SE I-Chaplain and the Company Master separate (both are pretty cool models, so that would be fine by me, I guess), but I doubt it.

I noticed that there is no reference to Curse of the Wulfen Part 2, which may or may not have stuff for Dark Angels in it. Given the events of the last book, I would be surprised if it did not have something for DA.

Maybe curse of the wulfen 2 is the DA supplement?

Possible. But I would more expect it to have Thousand Sons. Also, it was supposed to be late summer early autumn, not June.

Retrogamer0001 wrote:But I want a Dark Angels supplement :(

Me too, and I don't even play DA. Something that makes Deathwing and non-Ravenwing awesome.

Quick Q - I see Dark Vengeance replac. Orks + Skitarii (?)
Does this mean 8th ed 40k?...

juantheogre wrote:
Quick Q - I see Dark Vengeance replac. Orks + Skitarii (?)
Does this mean 8th ed 40k?...

8th Ed is supposed to be next year, so this adds even more salt to this pile. It could be a "Starter" in the way Stormclaw and Deathstorm were though.

I would buy the feth out of a Ork vs Admech boxset if it was ever made

Also interested in a Start Collecting MT boxset but it would need to be a 30-40% discount like the Lizardmen and Admech boxsets.

Why would you want a "Start Collecting: Tempestus" set?

Just buy the crummy Commissar blister and two boxes. Congrats. You've made an Allied Tempestus detachment.

The book is trash, the formations are trash, Scions are trash, and Commissars are overpriced trash that are being pushed far far far too heavily in what is portrayed in fluff as hardcore SpecOps with a fanatical devotion to the Imperium.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
And while we're at it?

I would be surprised if even a quarter of things from this, beyond the stuff we have from reliable sources(Sylvaneth, Lost Patrol, a Death themed Warhammer Quest thing), are true. The first bunch of stuff listed has a huge number of incorrect data to begin with--Elves got nothing reboxed in May, Death didn't get anything reboxed beyond the Flesh Eaters Court, etc.

Strange no mention of the two mini dexes... hmm

One post and he joined today. Come on people.

Scions are beautiful models, and therefore not trash. Best models in the entire IG/AM range, honestly.

 MrFlutterPie wrote:
I would buy the feth out of a Ork vs Admech boxset if it was ever made

Also interested in a Start Collecting MT boxset but it would need to be a 30-40% discount like the Lizardmen and Admech boxsets.

Only problem neither orks nor admech is space marines. Who expects GW to release 2 army set WITHOUT space marines?

Anybody? No? That's what I thought...

 Kanluwen wrote:
Why would you want a "Start Collecting: Tempestus" set?

Just buy the crummy Commissar blister and two boxes. Congrats. You've made an Allied Tempestus detachment.

The book is trash, the formations are trash, Scions are trash, and Commissars are overpriced trash that are being pushed far far far too heavily in what is portrayed in fluff as hardcore SpecOps with a fanatical devotion to the Imperium.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
And while we're at it?

I would be surprised if even a quarter of things from this, beyond the stuff we have from reliable sources(Sylvaneth, Lost Patrol, a Death themed Warhammer Quest thing), are true. The first bunch of stuff listed has a huge number of incorrect data to begin with--Elves got nothing reboxed in May, Death didn't get anything reboxed beyond the Flesh Eaters Court, etc.

I guess my advantage is that I would not be using the MT as MT or even using them in the 41st millennium

 Kanluwen wrote:
Why would you want a "Start Collecting: Tempestus" set?

Just buy the crummy Commissar blister and two boxes. Congrats. You've made an Allied Tempestus detachment.

Isn't it odd to wonder why somebody would want cheaper models?-)

You don't want cheaper models?

 timetowaste85 wrote:
Scions are beautiful models, and therefore not trash. Best models in the entire IG/AM range, honestly.

And for all the gorgeous models that they are, there's basically no reason to take them. Everything they can do, Skitarii do better--and cheaper, both in points and cash wise.

tneva82 wrote:

 MrFlutterPie wrote:
I would buy the feth out of a Ork vs Admech boxset if it was ever made

Also interested in a Start Collecting MT boxset but it would need to be a 30-40% discount like the Lizardmen and Admech boxsets.

Only problem neither orks nor admech is space marines. Who expects GW to release 2 army set WITHOUT space marines?

Anybody? No? That's what I thought...

Well it be nice if they did. WHF before Age of Blandmar came about did, people can say what they want about fantasy but it did cycle armies in boxes. Now we have to look forward to Sigmarines in every one.

tneva82 wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:
Why would you want a "Start Collecting: Tempestus" set?

Just buy the crummy Commissar blister and two boxes. Congrats. You've made an Allied Tempestus detachment.

Isn't it odd to wonder why somebody would want cheaper models?-)

You don't want cheaper models?

You would have to pay me to buy a Start Collecting Tempestus set. It doesn't matter if you get the models for cheaper when there's not really a reason to take them in the first place.

Scions are WAAAAAAAAAY overpriced, like every other Elite slot choice in IG.

 timetowaste85 wrote:
Scions are beautiful models, and therefore not trash. Best models in the entire IG/AM range, honestly.

Pretty sure the entirety of Kanluwen's post was from a rules/performance perspective rather than an aesthetic judgement.

If we're going there, though, I'd say lauding them as the best in the IG range is pretty much the definition of damning with faint praise.


When it comes to GW rumours, there's a handful of trusted sources. This one post wonder is not one of them, ergo don't even bother with the salt. They haven't said anything worth paying attention to.

 Kanluwen wrote:

tneva82 wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:
Why would you want a "Start Collecting: Tempestus" set?

Just buy the crummy Commissar blister and two boxes. Congrats. You've made an Allied Tempestus detachment.

Isn't it odd to wonder why somebody would want cheaper models?-)

You don't want cheaper models?

You would have to pay me to buy a Start Collecting Tempestus set. It doesn't matter if you get the models for cheaper when there's not really a reason to take them in the first place.

Scions are WAAAAAAAAAY overpriced, like every other Elite slot choice in IG.

Agreed, its like to convert a gang of arbites from them costs you an insane amount. Id like to do it, but seriously?, there like what 42 pounds just for 10 guys and thats just to start. I can get a box of Mordhiem old sealed box for that.

 Kanluwen wrote:

tneva82 wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:
Why would you want a "Start Collecting: Tempestus" set?

Just buy the crummy Commissar blister and two boxes. Congrats. You've made an Allied Tempestus detachment.

Isn't it odd to wonder why somebody would want cheaper models?-)

You don't want cheaper models?

You would have to pay me to buy a Start Collecting Tempestus set. It doesn't matter if you get the models for cheaper when there's not really a reason to take them in the first place.

Scions are WAAAAAAAAAY overpriced, like every other Elite slot choice in IG.

*shrug* That assumes one is playing with current 7th ed rules. Applies to you maybe but not others.

I can find use for those. If they weren't almost 4£ per model with discount.

 timetowaste85 wrote:
Scions are beautiful models, and therefore not trash. Best models in the entire IG/AM range, honestly.

The models are great.

However, if I had an IG army, I'd never run them as MT. Veteran Troops with 3x special weapons, maybe. But not MT.

I bought a box on release and they make beautiful Inq henchman grenadiers

 Thairne wrote:
Dark Angels Supplement?
Hah, as if.

Silver Tower has already some leaks out. I doubt that Atia or the other, reliable rumormoungers would have missed said supplement.

Dark Angels supplement would kinda make sense, since they're currently headed for Fenris. For now though.. Salty.

Anyone who has more reliable rumours about upcoming HH?

nightshae007 wrote:
Anyone who has more reliable rumours about upcoming HH?

I don't have a source other than dakka threads but I thought that HH and the Warhammer Quest next full game were later in the year instead of the mid-point.
I just got Warhammer Quest built. They gotta have some mercy.

 privateer4hire wrote:

nightshae007 wrote:
Anyone who has more reliable rumours about upcoming HH?

I don't have a source other than dakka threads but I thought that HH and the Warhammer Quest next full game were later in the year instead of the mid-point.
I just got Warhammer Quest built. They gotta have some mercy.

That's true. But GW loves rolling in the dough

 Kanluwen wrote:

Everything they can do, Skitarii do better--and cheaper, both in points and cash wise.

wait they can DS too?

excuse me while I go acquire a salt mine so I can properly handle this load..........

I would be down for a Scions Start Collecting box. Especially if it has a Taurox in it. Of course, I have no intention of using any of it I. 40k, but I'd be all over that set.

I already have 15 Scions for use in my SM army. Love those models WAY too much. Some of the best GW has ever done imo.

 aracersss wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:

Everything they can do, Skitarii do better--and cheaper, both in points and cash wise.

wait they can DS too?

Oh noes, they can't DS.

Not like anyone used Scions except in pods anyways--good fething riddance to that nonsense.

 Kanluwen wrote:

 aracersss wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:

Everything they can do, Skitarii do better--and cheaper, both in points and cash wise.

wait they can DS too?

Oh noes, they can't DS.

Not like anyone used Scions except in pods anyways--good fething riddance to that nonsense.

Really... does anyone actually play with scions? I just proxy them as stormtroopers/scouts/IG command/chaos cultist champions etc.

"Back in the days... when making up rumors was an artform..."

 Mymearan wrote:
I already have 15 Scions for use in my SM army. Love those models WAY too much. Some of the best GW has ever done imo.

I also really like my 15 scions!
I have turned the heads in different direction on the plasma guys, and slightly tilted down the pointing arm on one of them -now I can arrange them so they look like they are all pointing in different directions screaming and arguing with each other. Good times!


Oh, by the way, I really dont buy this rumor list. Obvious fake.

 Fayric wrote:

 Mymearan wrote:
I already have 15 Scions for use in my SM army. Love those models WAY too much. Some of the best GW has ever done imo.

I also really like my 15 scions!
I have turned the heads in different direction on the plasma guys, and slightly tilted down the pointing arm on one of them -now I can arrange them so they look like they are all pointing in different directions screaming and arguing with each other. Good times!

Yeah making 8 plasma guys was a bit of a pain (2 per squad and 4 in the command squad) but worth it!

Didn't hear about Start Collecting: MT Wishful thinking or confirmed?

juantheogre wrote:
Didn't hear about Start Collecting: MT Wishful thinking or confirmed?

Just wishful thinking so far.

Wishful thinking for the MT Start Collecting boxset.

OP listed it as "rumoured" to be coming out.

Nothing 100% confirmed.

This is GW next step in virial marketing, since the earthquake photos are getting old they thought theyd troll the forums with wishywoshy 'official' documents from catfish posters lol.

dubovac wrote:
We have Start collecting: Chaos space marines and Start collecting: Militarum tempestus in two-three weeks from now.

Hm, I could potentially go in for a bit of both of those, depending on which kits are included. Helbrutes FTW! What's the source on those?

AFAIK we shall be able to see the new Start Collecting boxes when we finally receive our WD, preorders at the end of the week. So sooner than what was already mentioned.

They are indeed Tempestus and CSM.

next week teaser: "Way of the Eldar" ... Oh boy!!!!!!!!

 aracersss wrote:
next week teaser: "Way of the Eldar" ... Oh boy!!!!!!!!

I dropped all of my aspect warriors but scorpions and shadow spectres, but PLEASE be a plastic aspect warrior kit!

 aracersss wrote:
next week teaser: "Way of the Eldar" ... Oh boy!!!!!!!!

Here comes the Eldar Start Collecting box!

Lythrandire Biehrellian wrote:

 aracersss wrote:
next week teaser: "Way of the Eldar" ... Oh boy!!!!!!!!

I dropped all of my aspect warriors but scorpions and shadow spectres, but PLEASE be a plastic aspect warrior kit!

oh dear god no please. My wallet can't handle plastic of that shininess.......

Does "chaos space marines" mean a new codex?

The list in the op isnt real, I have my sources

chaos0xomega wrote:
The list in the op isn't real, I have my sources

The list in the op is real, I have my sources

Neronoxx wrote:

chaos0xomega wrote:
The list in the op isnt real, I have my sources

The list in the op is real, I have my sources

There is a list in the op. I have my sources

chaos0xomega wrote:The list in the op isnt real, I have my sources

Neronoxx wrote:

chaos0xomega wrote:
The list in the op is real, I have my sources

The list in the op is real, I have my sources

You are both right. I have my sources.

RazorEdge wrote:
In September, AoS is dead?

Yes it is. In the story line, Emperor Karl Franz wakes up in his sprawling palatial bedroom back in Altdorf and realizes it was only a dream, and immediately orders everybody back to their square bases.

 BigWaaagh wrote:

RazorEdge wrote:
In September, AoS is dead?

Yes it is. In the story line, Emperor Karl Franz wakes up in his sprawling palatial bedroom back in Altdorf and realizes it was only a dream, and immediately orders everybody back to their square bases.

That's exactly the way Newheart ended. Man, GW cribs from everybody.

That beats the "and then he/she walked out of the shower" storyline everyone uses.

It's the old world, what shower?!

 CragHack wrote:
Keeper of Secrets! Gooo, Slaanesh!

Yes!

 BigWaaagh wrote:

RazorEdge wrote:
In September, AoS is dead?

Yes it is. In the story line, Emperor Karl Franz wakes up in his sprawling palatial bedroom back in Altdorf and realizes it was only a dream, and immediately orders everybody back to their square bases.

How nice that would be. To live is to dream I suppose. As for the rest of the list, this is an interesting array of possibilities but as with all rumours I've got a shaker of Morton's at hand.

Baron Klatz wrote:
That beats the "and then he/she walked out of the shower" storyline everyone uses.

It's the old world, what shower?!

I think that might be the smallest continuity error created by a GW retcon ever

 casvalremdeikun wrote:

chaos0xomega wrote:The list in the op isnt real, I have my sources

Neronoxx wrote:

chaos0xomega wrote:
The list in the op is real, I have my sources

The list in the op is real, I have my sources

You are both right. I have my sources.

I do too!

Would love to see what Sad Panda/Atia/Hastings says...

I'm completely out of the loop, but is there a realistic chance that real Warhammer could make a return? The square base game we played and loved for like thirty years?

 Therion wrote:
I'm completely out of the loop, but is there a realistic chance that real Warhammer could make a return? The square base game we played and loved for like thirty years?

Nothing is impossible but I would rather try to win lottery 3 times in a row than bet in favour of warhammer coming back...

But fan driven 9th ed is 8th ed except better.

 Therion wrote:
I'm completely out of the loop, but is there a realistic chance that real Warhammer could make a return? The square base game we played and loved for like thirty years?

Nope.

 Mymearan wrote:

 Therion wrote:
I'm completely out of the loop, but is there a realistic chance that real Warhammer could make a return? The square base game we played and loved for like thirty years?

Nope.

It's unlikely, and it won't come at the expense of AoS, but given the givens that's a pretty overconfident answer. A financial report that will apparently show pretty flat figures on GW products(ie AoS ain't setting the world aflame) but is going to beat expectations because of a big boost in licensing cash from the hugely successful TW:WH game, which evidently GW weren't expecting? That might be enough impetus for a return of some form if Rowntree's got his head screwed on properly, though the best that could probably be hoped for is FW takes it on with LotR-level support.

 Yodhrin wrote:

 Mymearan wrote:

 Therion wrote:
I'm completely out of the loop, but is there a realistic chance that real Warhammer could make a return? The square base game we played and loved for like thirty years?

Nope.

It's unlikely, and it won't come at the expense of AoS, but given the givens that's a pretty overconfident answer. A financial report that will apparently show pretty flat figures on GW products(ie AoS ain't setting the world aflame) but is going to beat expectations because of a big boost in licensing cash from the hugely successful TW:WH game, which evidently GW weren't expecting? That might be enough impetus for a return of some form if Rowntree's got his head screwed on properly, though the best that could probably be hoped for is FW takes it on with LotR-level support.

Who knows? Can see current 8th ed gamers going all old hammer in future AOS editions

tneva82 wrote:

 MrFlutterPie wrote:
I would buy the feth out of a Ork vs Admech boxset if it was ever made

Also interested in a Start Collecting MT boxset but it would need to be a 30-40% discount like the Lizardmen and Admech boxsets.

Only problem neither orks nor admech is space marines. Who expects GW to release 2 army set WITHOUT space marines?

Anybody? No? That's what I thought...

GW did. Tyranids and Blood Angels. Oh sorry. I thought you ment playable Space Marines.

That being said, well there is an Astrum Militarium box set now, with the Taurox in it. Would this kill the MT boxset rumours?

 MadCowCrazy wrote:

 lord_blackfang wrote:
I have a leaked release list too http://pastebin.com/9EC3qw3b

I hope this one is true as it has Sisters of Battle in it

Doubt it. The post says deleted document. I looked through it and the Squiggotaur was a rumored gargantuan creature that was going to be released in the 2014 7th edition ork release. 2 years later no squiggotaur. I wouldn't look too far into this

 Traditio wrote:
Does "chaos space marines" mean a new codex?

Greatest troll post ever!

 Therion wrote:
I'm completely out of the loop, but is there a realistic chance that real Warhammer could make a return? The square base game we played and loved for like thirty years?

Maybe with Forgeworld.

Dark Vengeance replac. Orks + Skitarii (?)

LOL no. When have they ever had the balls to not include some kind of poster boy marine army in these?

 Orock wrote:
Dark Vengeance replac. Orks + Skitarii (?)

LOL no. When have they ever had the balls to not include some kind of poster boy marine army in these?

Well I do agree 100%, I do have to admit that SM+Skitarii vs. orks could be interesting TBH. Maby even have the SM be Iron Hands, so you could make some cool SM bionics in plastic.

 Orock wrote:
Dark Vengeance replac. Orks + Skitarii (?)

LOL no. When have they ever had the balls to not include some kind of poster boy marine army in these?

Bad question. Better is "when have they been willing to not sell what sells".

Marines are what sells. If customers aren't happy with them being elsewhere...Well buy less of them.

tneva82 wrote:

 Orock wrote:
Dark Vengeance replac. Orks + Skitarii (?)

LOL no. When have they ever had the balls to not include some kind of poster boy marine army in these?

Bad question. Better is "when have they been willing to not sell what sells".

Marines are what sells. If customers aren't happy with them being elsewhere...Well buy less of them.

That's a simplistic view that takes no account of the differing levels of support given to each army. SM sell demonstrably better than CSM, but a decent chunk of those extra sales will be driven by the fact that since the last basic CSM infantry kit came out SM have had a full recut and then full replacement of all of their basic infantry as well as multiple faction-specific variants of basic infantry. IG are still using plastic kits for infantry from the very early oughts. Eldar are still stuck with Aspect Warriors in Finecast that were originally sculpted back in 2nd Edition.

And when GW do pay attention to the other factions, it's demonstrable that the level of success they enjoy is linked to the type of support they receive - when they bring out big, OTT kits that only add to the existing range(Orks) they might sell plenty of those specific kits, but uptake of the faction as a whole remains relatively static since all the new kits do is highlight the disparity in quality between modern kits and the much older ones the rest of the faction is stuck with; meanwhile when they put in the effort and resources to actually revamp old core units(DEldar, Tau) there's a big spike in new players buying in and older players revamping their existing armies.

Partly, SM will always sell well because they're SM, and plenty of folk love either their superficial presentation as heroic space-knights or their less obvious true nature as barbarous genetically engineered killing machines, but a good portion of the lead SM have over other factions in the sales figures is GW's deliberate lavishing of support on them in terms of both rules and models, far above what they do for other factions. "Who cares, sales is sales" seems to be the attitude of GW and their more strident apologists, but it doesn't seem to have been doing that well for them of late - without variety people get bored, and I doubt painting your Marines a different colour is sufficient variety to sustain the company.

 Therion wrote:
I'm completely out of the loop, but is there a realistic chance that real Warhammer could make a return? The square base game we played and loved for like thirty years?

But not loved enough to make it a profitable line? No. If you rework something because it isn't selling and the new thing doesn't sell either you don't go back to the first thing, you either try a third approach or you give it the axe it deserves.

 lord_blackfang wrote:

 Therion wrote:
I'm completely out of the loop, but is there a realistic chance that real Warhammer could make a return? The square base game we played and loved for like thirty years?

But not loved enough to make it a profitable line? No. If you rework something because it isn't selling and the new thing doesn't sell either you don't go back to the first thing, you either try a third approach or you give it the axe it deserves.

Did I just imagine the whole New Coke/Classic Coke thing then?

All the information we have indicated WHFB was, in fact, a profitable line, GW just wanted it to be more profitable than it was. They evidently believed it was possible to equal 40K in revenue/profit terms with a fantasy product, and that taking a more 40K-ish approach with AoS would achieve that better/faster than giving WHFB the same level of investment and support as 40K - the fact the upcoming financial report appears to show relatively flat figures propped up by licensing from the unexpectedly(by GW) large sales of TW:WH indicates that one or both of those conclusions was overly optimistic or flat-out wrong.

 Yodhrin wrote:

 lord_blackfang wrote:

 Therion wrote:
I'm completely out of the loop, but is there a realistic chance that real Warhammer could make a return? The square base game we played and loved for like thirty years?

But not loved enough to make it a profitable line? No. If you rework something because it isn't selling and the new thing doesn't sell either you don't go back to the first thing, you either try a third approach or you give it the axe it deserves.

Did I just imagine the whole New Coke/Classic Coke thing then?

All the information we have indicated WHFB was, in fact, a profitable line, GW just wanted it to be more profitable than it was. They evidently believed it was possible to equal 40K in revenue/profit terms with a fantasy product, and that taking a more 40K-ish approach with AoS would achieve that better/faster than giving WHFB the same level of investment and support as 40K - the fact the upcoming financial report appears to show relatively flat figures propped up by licensing from the unexpectedly(by GW) large sales of TW:WH indicates that one or both of those conclusions was overly optimistic or flat-out wrong.

Or it shows that a well made game in a popular series (Total War) that's branched into fantasy as opposed to being historical was very successful. Don't twist facts to make them fit your narrative.

 lord_blackfang wrote:

 Therion wrote:
I'm completely out of the loop, but is there a realistic chance that real Warhammer could make a return? The square base game we played and loved for like thirty years?

But not loved enough to make it a profitable line? No. If you rework something because it isn't selling and the new thing doesn't sell either you don't go back to the first thing, you either try a third approach or you give it the axe it deserves.

Of course by the time they decided to scrap it it was still 3rd best selling game in USA and made profit(ie not loss)...It then started to drop because of lousy support and high prices.

tneva82 wrote:

 Orock wrote:
Dark Vengeance replac. Orks + Skitarii (?)

LOL no. When have they ever had the balls to not include some kind of poster boy marine army in these?

Bad question. Better is "when have they been willing to not sell what sells".

Marines are what sells. If customers aren't happy with them being elsewhere...Well buy less of them.

Exactly. Marines make up somewhere around 50% of sales by themselves. And I bet the reason we see them in the starter sets time after time is because they continue to sell well. I would sincerely doubt they would make a non-Marine starter set.

So is AOS death literally discontinuing AOS or is it AOS death faction?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Something weird by the way, no blood bowl

 lord_blackfang wrote:

 Therion wrote:
I'm completely out of the loop, but is there a realistic chance that real Warhammer could make a return? The square base game we played and loved for like thirty years?

But not loved enough to make it a profitable line? No. If you rework something because it isn't selling and the new thing doesn't sell either you don't go back to the first thing, you either try a third approach or you give it the axe it deserves.

if you dont remember the coke thing.

How about mars and the disastrous NEW MARS, that was just awful, or i dunno how about Cadbury bringing back Wispa... things return. Please stop acting like its AOS or the highway when it clearly is not. do you have sales from about 10 stores in the UK regarding warhammer?, because I do.

AOS is flagging compared to WFB sales.

People in the Uk club network are basically using 9th age or 6th ed wfb. If there is demand WFB will return you can count on it. unless gw are colossally stu... oh..

 casvalremdeikun wrote:

tneva82 wrote:

 Orock wrote:
Dark Vengeance replac. Orks + Skitarii (?)

LOL no. When have they ever had the balls to not include some kind of poster boy marine army in these?

Bad question. Better is "when have they been willing to not sell what sells".

Marines are what sells. If customers aren't happy with them being elsewhere...Well buy less of them.

Exactly. Marines make up somewhere around 50% of sales by themselves. And I bet the reason we see them in the starter sets time after time is because they continue to sell well. I would sincerely doubt they would make a non-Marine starter set.

Ofcourse, it would make more sense to put some low selling army in the starter box to give it a boost.
Anyway, marines is by far the best option for a starter box -relatively easy to paint, can be used in a straight forward easy to learn game style, make up an essential part of the lore, and also useable by by a wast part of the existing players.
Put the skitarii in the hands of a noob and get some seriously messed up kitbash abomination with details drowned in thick paint, not to mention the confusion of doctrines and weird weaponary. The poor noob would probably not know if they were the good guys or not (because they are neither!). Messed up all around.
There is a really good reason the Emprah made marines to begin with.

 Fayric wrote:
Ofcourse, it would make more sense to put some low selling army in the starter box to give it a boost.

Of course then likely it wouldn't sell nearly as well. Starters sell well because they have marines which, funnily enough, sold well from the get-go.

They didn't become poster boys because GW decided "let's make marines poster boys!". They became poster boys because they sold well from the get-go and have only continued. Players want more marines, GW is only happy to oblige. Especially when their unit sale count is dropping.

All of this talk about how AOS is falling behind in sales, and yet no one here has any actual sales figures to reference.

tneva82 wrote:

 Fayric wrote:
Ofcourse, it would make more sense to put some low selling army in the starter box to give it a boost.

Of course then likely it wouldn't sell nearly as well. Starters sell well because they have marines which, funnily enough, sold well from the get-go.

They didn't become poster boys because GW decided "let's make marines poster boys!". They became poster boys because they sold well from the get-go and have only continued. Players want more marines, GW is only happy to oblige. Especially when their unit sale count is dropping.

Of course you make alot of sense, if somewhat simplified.
Also the "boost an unpopular army" really only work if the first army of the box is popular(=marines).

@nightshae007, it's referring to the death expansion for Silver Tower.

GW confirmed they have the AoS storyline and continuation planned for the next 4-5 years. So no worries on a sudden stop on the AoS awesome train.

@Auticus, what? Things being said on the internet with no supporting facts and only wild speculation? The hell you say!

 auticus wrote:
All of this talk about how AOS is falling behind in sales, and yet no one here has any actual sales figures to reference.

Ill do you a solid and post a sample of my data on Orruks shall i? ( god that name...)
The maw crusher you think would sell right? out of the 20 boxes ( that gw thrust on them one Lgs store sold 3, and none sold over 11 ), you could say over 50 percent of sales was good right? compare this to the End times big skaven Verminlord which sold out and they had to get new stock, in all but 1 of my test group, this was in the first 2 weeks of new stock mind.



Now maybe its different in the USA, it could be and id love if i could get data from US stores to do a comparison.

migooo wrote:
Now maybe its different in the USA, it could be and id love if i could get data from US stores to do a comparison.

Well in USA stores are dumping them at the loss because that's cheaper for them...

Funny how AOS defenders critizise lack of evidence yet use equally lack of evidence claiming FB was discounted because it wasn't profitable(when it was. Just wasn't selling marines level. GW wasn't even happy on 3rd best selling game. It had to sell equally much as the #1).

Wait, AOS Death? What's that mean?

 Matthew wrote:
Wait, AOS Death? What's that mean?

A faction of some sort.

EDIT: Ah, str00dles got it!

It relates to Silver Tower Warhammer Quest. Currently the plan is to release a big box expantion like silver tower but undead themed

str00dles1 wrote:
It relates to Silver Tower Warhammer Quest. Currently the plan is to release a big box expantion like silver tower but undead themed

ohh - hope we see some vampires - preferably some of Neferta's handmaidens

migooo wrote:
if you dont remember the coke thing.

Old coke sold well and was loved by all, the whole new coke debacle was based on a poorly conducted study of taste preferences. Going back to old coke made sense when they knew old coke was good. WHFB wasn't good. Stop making inane analogies.

migooo wrote:

 lord_blackfang wrote:

 Therion wrote:
I'm completely out of the loop, but is there a realistic chance that real Warhammer could make a return? The square base game we played and loved for like thirty years?

But not loved enough to make it a profitable line? No. If you rework something because it isn't selling and the new thing doesn't sell either you don't go back to the first thing, you either try a third approach or you give it the axe it deserves.

if you dont remember the coke thing.

How about mars and the disastrous NEW MARS, that was just awful, or i dunno how about Cadbury bringing back Wispa... things return. Please stop acting like its AOS or the highway when it clearly is not. do you have sales from about 10 stores in the UK regarding warhammer?, because I do.

AOS is flagging compared to WFB sales.

People in the Uk club network are basically using 9th age or 6th ed wfb. If there is demand WFB will return you can count on it. unless gw are colossally stu... oh..

And where is it written that AoS sales are flagging? Besides your imagination, that is?
Nobody save those who work at the top in GWHQ knows how well it's doing. Also, WHFB has been around for decades whereas AoS has been out just shy of a year. Your comparison is moot.

 Mr Morden wrote:

str00dles1 wrote:
It relates to Silver Tower Warhammer Quest. Currently the plan is to release a big box expantion like silver tower but undead themed

ohh - hope we see some vampires - preferably some of Neferta's handmaidens

I highly suspect they are going to do a plastic vampire and I am going to end up buying the expansion because I want a plastic vampire. *sigh*

Looking forward to that expansion (among many other things). I wonder what the lore will be? Best the undead guardians and main antagonist to escape the realm of death (maybe even regain life if your undead as well)?

Would love a Flesh-Eater courtier who dresses like an actual courtier. (Obviously it'd be a tattered and ragged outfit but try to tell that to the delusional cannibal )

(P.S. @Shinros, thank you so much for correcting that moron on reddit that it's flesh-eater court and not counts. )

If it Orks vs. Skitarii isn't this a problem for "new" players. Orks are pretty forgiving, but Skitarii can be pretty harsh against beginners.

 Bi'ios wrote:

 Yodhrin wrote:

 lord_blackfang wrote:

 Therion wrote:
I'm completely out of the loop, but is there a realistic chance that real Warhammer could make a return? The square base game we played and loved for like thirty years?

But not loved enough to make it a profitable line? No. If you rework something because it isn't selling and the new thing doesn't sell either you don't go back to the first thing, you either try a third approach or you give it the axe it deserves.

Did I just imagine the whole New Coke/Classic Coke thing then?

All the information we have indicated WHFB was, in fact, a profitable line, GW just wanted it to be more profitable than it was. They evidently believed it was possible to equal 40K in revenue/profit terms with a fantasy product, and that taking a more 40K-ish approach with AoS would achieve that better/faster than giving WHFB the same level of investment and support as 40K - the fact the upcoming financial report appears to show relatively flat figures propped up by licensing from the unexpectedly(by GW) large sales of TW:WH indicates that one or both of those conclusions was overly optimistic or flat-out wrong.

Or it shows that a well made game in a popular series (Total War) that's branched into fantasy as opposed to being historical was very successful. Don't twist facts to make them fit your narrative.

That's not the fact that fits the narrative, it's the relatively flat figures part that indicates AoS hasn't taken off as GW hoped(the TW:WH bit merely indicates that there was plenty of life in the old gal from a fiction/IP standpoint, and is a little touch of irony). Unless of course 40K has taken a nosedive and AoS has made up the difference, that's possible. I'm not having a pop at AoS, just pointing out that there's not quite as much reason to be utterly certain WHF is dead & gone forever as some seem to think there is.

 angelofvengeance wrote:

migooo wrote:

 lord_blackfang wrote:

 Therion wrote:
I'm completely out of the loop, but is there a realistic chance that real Warhammer could make a return? The square base game we played and loved for like thirty years?

But not loved enough to make it a profitable line? No. If you rework something because it isn't selling and the new thing doesn't sell either you don't go back to the first thing, you either try a third approach or you give it the axe it deserves.

if you dont remember the coke thing.

How about mars and the disastrous NEW MARS, that was just awful, or i dunno how about Cadbury bringing back Wispa... things return. Please stop acting like its AOS or the highway when it clearly is not. do you have sales from about 10 stores in the UK regarding warhammer?, because I do.

AOS is flagging compared to WFB sales.

People in the Uk club network are basically using 9th age or 6th ed wfb. If there is demand WFB will return you can count on it. unless gw are colossally stu... oh..

1.And where is it written that AoS sales are flagging? Besides your imagination, that is?
Nobody save those who work at the top in GWHQ knows how well it's doing. 2.Also, WHFB has been around for decades whereas AoS has been out just shy of a year. Your comparison is moot.

1. The financial report is apparently going to be slightly above what they were projecting in the previous "don't get your hopes up, investors" communique from HQ, but they've already attributed that to licensing money(ie, TW:WH). If this year's report continues the trend of the last couple that means we can only conclude either AoS is selling around the same as/slightly less than WHFB, or AoS is doing well but 40K is sliding hard(or both are marginally down and the difference was made up by the boxed games). And "don't discuss GW finances unless you know as much as GWHQ" functionally means "don't discuss GW finances", given how hard they work to obfuscate specifics in their reports there will always be an element of speculation involved, but nobody here is making any outlandish claims that AoS is dying on its arse or anything, merely that if the preview info about the report is roughly accurate then it;s likely AoS isn't meeting GW's expectations.

2. Given we've been told that most sales of GW product occurs when it's brand new and shiny, I don't know that you're making the point you thought you were there. If AoS isn't shifting at the level GW want now, it likely never will meet that expectation, unless the General's Handbook is tremendously well-received of course which isn't beyond the realms of possibility - I know several people who didn't give AoS a second look who're now at least interested in what that book will bring.

 Yodhrin wrote:

2. Given we've been told that most sales of GW product occurs when it's brand new and shiny, I don't know that you're making the point you thought you were there.

Nah, not at all. He's saying comparing the sales is unfair since AoS is much younger than WFB and doesn't have the same following/momentum/whatever yet. The fact that "GW product sells best when it's new" doesn't undermine that at all, because it's a fair assumption that new product in a well-established game with a dedicated following is going to sell better than new product in a new game with less of a following, so AoS being 1 year old versus WFB being 25 years old still matters when comparing their sales numbers.

I mean, comparing it to the New Coke thing! That was clearly a marketing thing from the outset.

edit, nevermind