Is anyone else running into this problem? I mean 8th JUST dropped so I am hoping that once the hubbub dies down it won't be an issue.

Its been what, less than a week? It's The New Hotness(tm) so I'd give it a month or so to die down.

Yeah just people (rightly) trying out their new toys and rules. It'll pick back up.

30k is what you make of it.

Start a campain with a narrative based on something from one of the black books - i'm preparing for an Isstvan 3 series of games and the scope for scenarios that mean something is huge!

The mentions of rebellion aboard certain vessels in the traitor fleet are going to get some attention as well as the initial invasion of Isstvan 3 by loyalist forces of the warmaster.
I'm particularly looking forward to the resistance of the Ordo Reductor forces on board the 'Proudheart' (Eidolons personal flagship) - we already had a test game set in the hold using zone mortalis and core rules from 6th edition and it was wicked fun!
Favourite moment: my Magos reduced an armoured container to slag with the inferno-pistol on his machinator array, allowing the Thallax behind him to blast away at the enemy elite troops that were behind it.

Yeah, even me and my friends are hardcore 30K players, but we've been playing 8th. We'll be playing our first 30K game tomorrow, since the game store made the rules public (so about 3 weeks).

There is only so much time in one life, so when something new and exciting comes along, folks are going to try it out. It's way to early to be saying 8th is having any impact on 30K play.

Yep, 30k will die if it doesn't update to 8th.

 DarknessEternal wrote:
Yep, 30k will die if it doesn't update to 8th.

Getting tired of this type of talk. We had a lot more people watching our game of 30K today then the 40K game going on at the table next to us.

I went to my flgs earlier on and found two new HH players - one with ~6000pts of really nicely painted and customised world eaters and the other with about the same of white scars/custodes/sisters of silence; the custodes player was proxying caladius grav tanks as LRs in their 8th edition game.

My community has all but abandoned HH until it updates to 8th rules.

Wow. They do know that the upcoming rulebook is based on 7th, right?

I'm sure they do. We'll see what happens.

Literally all of them have hobby A.D.D. They jump from any number of games in the span of a month. This month it's 40K 8th. It will probably start cycling round next time the store owners decide that HH needs another push.

 SirDonlad wrote:
Wow. They do know that the upcoming rulebook is based on 7th, right?

Which is irrelevant to people who prefer to play 8th.
30K isn't going to "die" if it doesn't update to 8th, but it also isn't going to thrive, either. As new people come in to 40K and its 8th Edition rules, they will be unable to crossplay with 30K players. While one person rather dismissively put it in another thread "you're not playing 30K, you're playing 40K with a FW army list", it was still that very crossplay between the two that allowed 30K to thrive in the first place. All those new 8th Edition people who basically pick any army other than marines will be relegated to simply watching others play 30K. They won't get to play because they chose the "wrong" army in the "wrong" edition.

And even if those new players in 8th chose marines, there are people who will still tell them they chose the "wrong" marines, because MkVII isn't historically accurate in 30K.

 Tannhauser42 wrote:

 SirDonlad wrote:
Wow. They do know that the upcoming rulebook is based on 7th, right?

Which is irrelevant to people who prefer to play 8th.
30K isn't going to "die" if it doesn't update to 8th, but it also isn't going to thrive, either. As new people come in to 40K and its 8th Edition rules, they will be unable to crossplay with 30K players. While one person rather dismissively put it in another thread "you're not playing 30K, you're playing 40K with a FW army list", it was still that very crossplay between the two that allowed 30K to thrive in the first place. All those new 8th Edition people who basically pick any army other than marines will be relegated to simply watching others play 30K. They won't get to play because they chose the "wrong" army in the "wrong" edition.

And even if those new players in 8th chose marines, there are people who will still tell them they chose the "wrong" marines, because MkVII isn't historically accurate in 30K.

What are you on about ???

No one has taken anyone's codex from them with the cross over to 8th, if anyone wants a 30k vs 40k game all they need Is to use the codex they already own. MkVII was a heresy mark, and no one would turn down a game based on your "historically inaccurate" remark, lastly, paper , apps and all sorts of army list making tools exist, make 2, it's simple, once its malde it's made.

Sick of this sky is falling mentality.

@Formosa that assumes people already have a codex, not a guarantee now that they are obsolete.

 Formosa wrote:

 Tannhauser42 wrote:

 SirDonlad wrote:
Wow. They do know that the upcoming rulebook is based on 7th, right?

Which is irrelevant to people who prefer to play 8th.
30K isn't going to "die" if it doesn't update to 8th, but it also isn't going to thrive, either. As new people come in to 40K and its 8th Edition rules, they will be unable to crossplay with 30K players. While one person rather dismissively put it in another thread "you're not playing 30K, you're playing 40K with a FW army list", it was still that very crossplay between the two that allowed 30K to thrive in the first place. All those new 8th Edition people who basically pick any army other than marines will be relegated to simply watching others play 30K. They won't get to play because they chose the "wrong" army in the "wrong" edition.

And even if those new players in 8th chose marines, there are people who will still tell them they chose the "wrong" marines, because MkVII isn't historically accurate in 30K.

What are you on about ???

No one has taken anyone's codex from them with the cross over to 8th, if anyone wants a 30k vs 40k game all they need Is to use the codex they already own. MkVII was a heresy mark, and no one would turn down a game based on your "historically inaccurate" remark, lastly, paper , apps and all sorts of army list making tools exist, make 2, it's simple, once its malde it's made.

Sick of this sky is falling mentality.

The thing is with this is then you're stuck playing seventh, which is not great for the 40k player and the modern marine player can't use half the codex because he'll smash an equivalent amount of HH to absolute bits. Guillamen in 40k is like 100 points cheaper than 30k guillyguy and will absolutely decimate 30k girlybro, for example (actually, pretty sure gildyboat 40k beats all of the other primarchs thabks to 40k's Dtable)

30k and 40k are seperate games now, 100%. Very few people who did play 7th but didn't play 30k are going to want to continue to play 7th and most of the people unhappy with 8th would rather just get a 30k army than have the 7th ed codex (which again, can be made literally unbeatable for any 30k army).

The people who say that 30k will die out are doomsaying. You'll probably see a contraction in the base but it won't be significant enough to warrant concern.

 Formosa wrote:

 Tannhauser42 wrote:

 SirDonlad wrote:
Wow. They do know that the upcoming rulebook is based on 7th, right?

Which is irrelevant to people who prefer to play 8th.
30K isn't going to "die" if it doesn't update to 8th, but it also isn't going to thrive, either. As new people come in to 40K and its 8th Edition rules, they will be unable to crossplay with 30K players. While one person rather dismissively put it in another thread "you're not playing 30K, you're playing 40K with a FW army list", it was still that very crossplay between the two that allowed 30K to thrive in the first place. All those new 8th Edition people who basically pick any army other than marines will be relegated to simply watching others play 30K. They won't get to play because they chose the "wrong" army in the "wrong" edition.

And even if those new players in 8th chose marines, there are people who will still tell them they chose the "wrong" marines, because MkVII isn't historically accurate in 30K.

What are you on about ???

No one has taken anyone's codex from them with the cross over to 8th, if anyone wants a 30k vs 40k game all they need Is to use the codex they already own. MkVII was a heresy mark, and no one would turn down a game based on your "historically inaccurate" remark, lastly, paper , apps and all sorts of army list making tools exist, make 2, it's simple, once its malde it's made.

Sick of this sky is falling mentality.

Did you even fething read what I wrote? I was specifically talking about new players, people new to the game, people coming into 40K through 8th Edition. In other words, people who wouldn't have a 7th Edition codex!

As for the MkVII comment, people in this very forum have stated they wouldn't play against it for that very reason.

As far as your "sky is falling mentality" comment, I'll remind you to read where I actually wrote that 30K is not going to die from not updating. I said it wouldn't thrive. Not thriving does not equal "the sky is falling".

Im looking forward to the change in typical army composition - i'm not a fan of the 'pride of the legion' rite of war that was used so much thanks to the BaC set; in my opinion it made a mockery of the force org allocation stat.

 Tannhauser42 wrote:

Did you even fething read what I wrote? I was specifically talking about new players, people new to the game, people coming into 40K through 8th Edition. In other words, people who wouldn't have a 7th Edition codex!

So they have to buy one book. Compared to price of models hardly unreasonable price.

Locally HH is as big as it ever was. Got a WHW trip planned for August for 6k a side game between Loyalists and Traitors (Whatever way you see those terms ) and I have a narrative weekend in October.

Just like most locals play 8th and HH and just play both. Infact one local has sold his 40k due to 8th to play HorusHeresy.

Similar to what I've heard from a few bods, all anecdotal of course. And there's similar being said on Heresy30k and B&C of people shelving their armies until HH 8th. A lot of people hate 7th for various reasons.

30K will be fine in the main, but the player base may stagnate for a while. Also, I do wonder how many players actually joined 30k because of its perceived balance and now that 8th is here, will shift back over?

 zedmeister wrote:
Also, I do wonder how many players actually joined 30k because of its perceived balance and now that 8th is here, will shift back over?

If they are hoping to find balance in the 8th they will be dissapointed.

That seems to be the way it's going around here as well. Everyone is busy with 8th edition, playing games, reorganizing their 40k armies, and tooling up for 8th tournaments and narrative events.

tneva82 wrote:

 Tannhauser42 wrote:

Did you even fething read what I wrote? I was specifically talking about new players, people new to the game, people coming into 40K through 8th Edition. In other words, people who wouldn't have a 7th Edition codex!

So they have to buy one book. Compared to price of models hardly unreasonable price.

Actually, NO, not one book. Try to keep up, please. They will need the rulebook from Forgeworld AND they will have to find a codex on the secondary market.

But you know what? I'm so absolutely done with you people who can't be bothered to a) read what I actually wrote and b) think about what I wrote.

Logically though, theres going to be a metric feth-ton of 7th edition codexes sat around and worth less than the price of having them disposed of!

Eh, give it some time to die down. People that play 30K either used their 30K armies to play 40K, or they have invested a lot of money into Forge World to play 30K. They are not going to just "walk away" from 30K. If anything, we might start seeing 30K models being used in 40K a lot more... but that bad, bad IA book... ugh.

About the comment about MK VII armor in 30K... some of us do really care about that sort of thing, so yeah. I would turn down such a player. Depending on the circumstances. If it's a kid or someone that just can't afford the Forge World models, then yeah, I'd play a game. If it was a "regular" or well established player, no. The Horus Heresy is as close to historical wargaming as you are going to get in 30K/40K.

 Tamwulf wrote:


About the comment about MK VII armor in 30K... some of us do really care about that sort of thing, so yeah. I would turn down such a player. Depending on the circumstances. If it's a kid or someone that just can't afford the Forge World models, then yeah, I'd play a game. If it was a "regular" or well established player, no. The Horus Heresy is as close to historical wargaming as you are going to get in 30K/40K.

Blood Angels and Imperial Fists would have very limited supplies of Mk VII at the Tail end of the heresy though. Mk VII can also easily stand in for Mk V armor if you mix and match it with the Mk III and IV.

With how cheap the heresy marks are since the launch of Betrayal at Calth and Battle for Prospero, theres no excuse to use Mark VII in HH.

And even more now that in ebay the sales of old marines have drop like the Euro since 2008 because of the Primaris hype

(But personally I'm the kind of player that just doesn't care, but I can understand why people don't like to play with 40k marines in HH. Just like I can understand why Historical Players don't want their romans fighting undead knights, even if I have played games of Flames of War where the Nazi commander of my enemy was modeled as Red Skull from Captain America )

 Galas wrote:
With how cheap the heresy marks are since the launch of Betrayal at Calth and Battle for Prospero, theres no excuse to use Mark VII in HH.

Not much plastic assault marines yet for HH.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Tannhauser42 wrote:

tneva82 wrote:

 Tannhauser42 wrote:

Did you even fething read what I wrote? I was specifically talking about new players, people new to the game, people coming into 40K through 8th Edition. In other words, people who wouldn't have a 7th Edition codex!

So they have to buy one book. Compared to price of models hardly unreasonable price.

Actually, NO, not one book. Try to keep up, please. They will need the rulebook from Forgeworld AND they will have to find a codex on the secondary market.

But you know what? I'm so absolutely done with you people who can't be bothered to a) read what I actually wrote and b) think about what I wrote.

Well okay rulebook though frankly group needs 1 so if he's joining existing group not really if money is issue(though if he can't find like pittances it costs to get 2nd hand 7th ed rulebook which is all he needs rulebook wise plus even cheaper codex he's in wrong hobby...Forget rulebooks. He can't afford ARMY in the first place. He wouldn't be able to play 8th ed anyway because not only he needs rulebooks and codex(more pricey there actually) AND army neither he could afford!).

It's going to be cheaper to start non-marine army to 30k than it would be for 8th ed.

 SirDonlad wrote:
Logically though, theres going to be a metric feth-ton of 7th edition codexes sat around and worth less than the price of having them disposed of!

Which again, just creates a situation where neither player has any fun...unless you give the HH player like an extra 200-4000pts depending on which codex you're using.


Forcing a 40k player to keep playing 7th is basically a hate crime.

ERJAK wrote:

 SirDonlad wrote:
Logically though, theres going to be a metric feth-ton of 7th edition codexes sat around and worth less than the price of having them disposed of!

Which again, just creates a situation where neither player has any fun...unless you give the HH player like an extra 200-4000pts depending on which codex you're using.


Forcing a 40k player to keep playing 7th is basically a hate crime.

By extra codexes being lying around?-)

And you are kidding yourself if you think 8th ed won't require one codex receive more points than others to be about equal.

ERJAK wrote:

 SirDonlad wrote:
Logically though, theres going to be a metric feth-ton of 7th edition codexes sat around and worth less than the price of having them disposed of!

Which again, just creates a situation where neither player has any fun...unless you give the HH player like an extra 200-4000pts depending on which codex you're using.


Forcing a 40k player to keep playing 7th is basically a hate crime.

Hey, well, thats just, like, your opinion man..

Theres no worries on the unit strength front, FW stated a while back that if you were playing 30k with a 40k codex that you couldn't use formations and we have some nasty gak in M31, it just costs lots of points.
Once thats accepted, then keeping the points level above 2500 and an HH army is upper mid-teir i recon.

 SirDonlad wrote:

ERJAK wrote:

 SirDonlad wrote:
Logically though, theres going to be a metric feth-ton of 7th edition codexes sat around and worth less than the price of having them disposed of!

Which again, just creates a situation where neither player has any fun...unless you give the HH player like an extra 200-4000pts depending on which codex you're using.


Forcing a 40k player to keep playing 7th is basically a hate crime.

Hey, well, thats just, like, your opinion man..

Theres no worries on the unit strength front, FW stated a while back that if you were playing 30k with a 40k codex that you couldn't use formations and we have some nasty gak in M31, it just costs lots of points.
Once thats accepted, then keeping the points level above 2500 and an HH army is upper mid-teir i recon.

That doesn't seem very fun. That's not a point level many 40k players play at (it's basically apoc.) And those are some pretty harsh restrictions.




Automatically Appended Next Post:

tneva82 wrote:

ERJAK wrote:

 SirDonlad wrote:
Logically though, theres going to be a metric feth-ton of 7th edition codexes sat around and worth less than the price of having them disposed of!

Which again, just creates a situation where neither player has any fun...unless you give the HH player like an extra 200-4000pts depending on which codex you're using.


Forcing a 40k player to keep playing 7th is basically a hate crime.

By extra codexes being lying around?-)

And you are kidding yourself if you think 8th ed won't require one codex receive more points than others to be about equal.

No moreso than HH. Or any other points based game.

ERJAK wrote:

That doesn't seem very fun. That's not a point level many 40k players play at (it's basically apoc.) And those are some pretty harsh restrictions.

Wait, what? Dude, the snowflake rules-bloat of formations was one of the key problems with 7th edition!

I think that the argument over whether adding more points over 1850 extends the game has been done enough in a different thread, but the level i find it noticeably extends the game is 3000+

My typical game is 2000pts so the extra 500 only adds two units and a dusting of extra wargear for the rest of the army.

 SirDonlad wrote:
I think that the argument over whether adding more points over 1850 extends the game has been done enough in a different thread, but the level i find it noticeably extends the game is 3000+

My typical game is 2000pts so the extra 500 only adds two units and a dusting of extra wargear for the rest of the army.

Plus points of HH!=points of 40k in terms of speed. In HH units are a) generally bigger b) more expensive thus resulting in less units per point level=faster. Also generally guys wielding same weapons in squad fastens it up.

1800 pts of 40k can easily be faster than 2500 pts HH. Especially without formations.

And frankly not everything needs to be lightning fast. 2 hours is plenty fast for me. Having taken time to generate unique scenario for every game and unload models I would want game not to be over in 30 minutes anyway Imagine how much time scenario creation would eat up then!

I find HH to be way faster then 7th ed 40k. Everything in HH is just so lethal and everything dies pretty fast.

I've roundly beaten 7th ed 40k armies in a tournament setting without a points crutch lol

What I'm hoping is perhaps this desire for some Xenos players to port over or play with their 30k friends will lend some weight to FW making a Great Crusade supplement to include alien factions to fight!

Sticking with 7th ed rules was a bad idea. It is a bloated overly complicated mess. It's gonna turn people away and make the game less popular. HH needs to be 8th for it to succeed.

 hotsauceman1 wrote:
Sticking with 7th ed rules was a bad idea. It is a bloated overly complicated mess. It's gonna turn people away and make the game less popular. HH needs to be 8th for it to succeed.

That hyperbole though. In my local group 2-3 have started HH DUE to 8th edition. The sky isn't falling and all is well.

 AaronWilson wrote:

 hotsauceman1 wrote:
Sticking with 7th ed rules was a bad idea. It is a bloated overly complicated mess. It's gonna turn people away and make the game less popular. HH needs to be 8th for it to succeed.

That hyperbole though. In my local group 2-3 have started HH DUE to 8th edition. The sky isn't falling and all is well.

Having the same situation here. Now people have a few games of 8th under their belts and not loving it suddenly there looking at how to port their armies over to HH. For the marine / guard players it's easy, the one Nid player not so much.

 Tamereth wrote:

 AaronWilson wrote:

 hotsauceman1 wrote:
Sticking with 7th ed rules was a bad idea. It is a bloated overly complicated mess. It's gonna turn people away and make the game less popular. HH needs to be 8th for it to succeed.

That hyperbole though. In my local group 2-3 have started HH DUE to 8th edition. The sky isn't falling and all is well.

Having the same situation here. Now people have a few games of 8th under their belts and not loving it suddenly there looking at how to port their armies over to HH. For the marine / guard players it's easy, the one Nid player not so much.

I've always welcomed xenos factions to 30K. Orks, Nids, and Crons aren't game breaking. Eldar need some tweaks, I typically neuter D options. Tau are a no-no. Cause fluff is still a part of why we play the game.

I know they theoretically exist, but never seen in person a 30k player willing to welcome 40k armies on the board. It's led to some very bored 30k players during 8th edition's launch.

I welcome IG, Orks, dark eldar and 40k marines (on a case-by case basis) all without the formations, but with max troop unit numbers doubled etc.

I also prefer my orks with +1T army-wide.

Of coursxe 8th is gonna make it hard to find games of 30k, people are playing the new thing at the min and as they get settled in it i expect people to play both mostly. The actual problem is in recruiting new players to the hobby of warhammer and then getting them involved in 30k. The game they are going to be introduced to is 8th edition 40k and they are either going to enjoy it or not if they do thats great but if you try and then get this new person to play 30k you are essentially teaching them an entirely new game and that is ridiculous, the player base wil be current 30k players and people who dont like 8th and decide heresy is the only way to keep playing. I do not even in the slightest believe this is permament, i expect angelus will be the last true 7th edition book and that is probably due to most of the work already having been done.

 SirDonlad wrote:
I welcome IG, Orks, dark eldar and 40k marines (on a case-by case basis) all without the formations, but with max troop unit numbers doubled etc.

I also prefer my orks with +1T army-wide.

I draw the line at 40K imperium armies. I don't have a problem if a guy wants to proxy is IG for Solar Auxilia, or his Marines for a legion, but I'm not facing grav spam, and the like.

Almost no 30k players in my 'circle'. The gap between 30k and 40k right now basically turns my army into expensive proxies. :(
I also really, really like 8th edition which kind of kills my motivation for HH.

I don't see any 30k players getting ready to jump ship b/c 8th edition rules came out.

If you think about it, part of the reason many people liked 30k in the first place is the fact it's better balanced. I don't think 8th is better than 7th in that regard.

Actually, most people so far think 8th is definitely better balanced than the trainwreck that was 7th.

Show me data about this with a representative sample size or take your spurious claims elsewhere.

8th hasn't been out long enough for anyone to draw meaningful conclusions. The MVP of most of my games has been a Kharbdis Assault Claw, there are definitely flaws to exploit.

 techsoldaten wrote:
8th hasn't been out long enough for anyone to draw meaningful conclusions

A bit of a hypocrite there, given your previous post.

But if you insist on evidence even though you're hypocritically making claims without any, yourself...

https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/731565.page

Out of a sample size of 337 players, 207 (61%) say that 8th is the best rule set to date.

We also have smaller polls, like one that that suggests that 8th is more balanced than 5th (8th won handily at 76% out of 92 votes).

What is not being argued is that 8th is perfect. But you'll find it hard to find a substantial percentage of people who think 7th was balanced at all, never mind better than any other edition.

 djones520 wrote:

 Tamereth wrote:

 AaronWilson wrote:

 hotsauceman1 wrote:
Sticking with 7th ed rules was a bad idea. It is a bloated overly complicated mess. It's gonna turn people away and make the game less popular. HH needs to be 8th for it to succeed.

That hyperbole though. In my local group 2-3 have started HH DUE to 8th edition. The sky isn't falling and all is well.

Having the same situation here. Now people have a few games of 8th under their belts and not loving it suddenly there looking at how to port their armies over to HH. For the marine / guard players it's easy, the one Nid player not so much.

I've always welcomed xenos factions to 30K. Orks, Nids, and Crons aren't game breaking. Eldar need some tweaks, I typically neuter D options. Tau are a no-no. Cause fluff is still a part of why we play the game.

Just curiosity, why Tyranids and Necrons are viable but Tau not? I can understand Necrons. "A Dinasty just opened 10.000 years before after thousand of mileniums sleeping" but Tyranids didn't reach the galaxy until late 41M

The Hive Fleets that the Imperium knows of didn't appear until then. There's evidence of pre-Imperium Tyranids in the galaxy though.

 Melissia wrote:

 techsoldaten wrote:
8th hasn't been out long enough for anyone to draw meaningful conclusions

A bit of a hypocrite there, given your previous post.

But if you insist on evidence even though you're hypocritically making claims without any, yourself...

https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/731565.page

Out of a sample size of 337 players, 207 (61%) say that 8th is the best rule set to date.

We also have smaller polls, like one that that suggests that 8th is more balanced than 5th (8th won handily at 76% out of 92 votes).

What is not being argued is that 8th is perfect. But you'll find it hard to find a substantial percentage of people who think 7th was balanced at all, never mind better than any other edition.

Well, my claim was anecdotal, and based on common statements made on this board over the last several years. If you think it's not better balanced then 7th edition 40k, feel free to explain why.

Your claim is made about a game that's been out for a couple weeks using a sample size of 337 players. GW is a company that does over $125 mil in revenue annually. That sample size is, what, 0.001% of the actual market?

Forgive me for being skeptical of boisterous claims about a new ruleset, which is about to change with the release of Codexes and where few people have tried the rules in more than a couple games. I am sure that balance will be maintained. GW has such a good record in that department.

That said, I still don't see anyone clamoring for 8th edition rules in HH. Maybe over time?

 DarknessEternal wrote:
The Hive Fleets that the Imperium knows of didn't appear until then. There's evidence of pre-Imperium Tyranids in the galaxy though.

Those where only the Genestealer with Cthulu faces that they find on some moon, no? From Rogue Trader, that they retconed to make them Tyranid vanguard units.

 Galas wrote:

 DarknessEternal wrote:
The Hive Fleets that the Imperium knows of didn't appear until then. There's evidence of pre-Imperium Tyranids in the galaxy though.

Those where only the Genestealer with Cthulu faces that they find on some moon, no?

No.

 Melissia wrote:

 techsoldaten wrote:
8th hasn't been out long enough for anyone to draw meaningful conclusions

A bit of a hypocrite there, given your previous post.

But if you insist on evidence even though you're hypocritically making claims without any, yourself...

https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/731565.page

Out of a sample size of 337 players, 207 (61%) say that 8th is the best rule set to date.

We also have smaller polls, like one that that suggests that 8th is more balanced than 5th (8th won handily at 76% out of 92 votes).

What is not being argued is that 8th is perfect. But you'll find it hard to find a substantial percentage of people who think 7th was balanced at all, never mind better than any other edition.

I've gotta wonder how many of the people who've responded to it have even played a game. I mean a good portion of posts in "Proposed Rules" are from people who admit they haven't played a game yet. Using that poll as anything resembling empirical data is just beyond silly.

 Melissia wrote:

 techsoldaten wrote:
8th hasn't been out long enough for anyone to draw meaningful conclusions

A bit of a hypocrite there, given your previous post.

But if you insist on evidence even though you're hypocritically making claims without any, yourself...

https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/731565.page

Out of a sample size of 337 players, 207 (61%) say that 8th is the best rule set to date.

We also have smaller polls, like one that that suggests that 8th is more balanced than 5th (8th won handily at 76% out of 92 votes).

What is not being argued is that 8th is perfect. But you'll find it hard to find a substantial percentage of people who think 7th was balanced at all, never mind better than any other edition.

Of course you have to consider they are comparing it to 7th ed 40k. HH is lot different and lot more balanced to 40k 7th ed.

 techsoldaten wrote:
Well, my claim was anecdotal

As was mine, but you still hypocritically demanded evidence even though you have none, yourself, and I provided some. You may not like what I've provided, but the fact is, unlike you, I have something. And you? You have nothing.

Prove your own damn argument. You can't, but try anyway, I will enjoy watching you fail. Freaking calling other people out demanding evidence to back up their opinions, mutter mutter...


Automatically Appended Next Post:

tneva82 wrote:
Of course you have to consider they are comparing it to 7th ed 40k. HH is lot different and lot more balanced to 40k 7th ed.

And yet I was challenged regarding 7th ed, not horus heresy.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 djones520 wrote:
I've gotta wonder how many of the people who've responded to it have even played a game.

I'm guessing about the same percentage of people played at least one game of 8th in that thread as in the thread about how horus heresy is dead because 8th edition got released.

Could people stop declaring that they know what everybody is thinking please? Its really tired as an argument (as well as being impossible to verify either way)

Only socopaths, psychopaths and the mentally ill think they know what everyone else is thinking.

I havent found the number of games of 30k i play diminish because if youre genuinely into the historical setting of the HH you arent going to 'drop it' ever.
I have seen a lot of people wanting to get more games in before they shout their mouth off though. The current debate at my flgs is "is a quicker game better?".

Give it about 6 months qnd we'll have a proper idea of how people regard 8th - mainly because thats how long i think it will take people to stop trying to give biased opinions to skew the overall trend in opinion as they see it.
L

tneva82 wrote:

Of course you have to consider they are comparing it to 7th ed 40k. HH is lot different and lot more balanced to 40k 7th ed.

Snuh? HH is 7th edition.

Or do your 30k games somehow not have deathstars, invisibility bombs, quad-launchers, knights, etc?

 DarknessEternal wrote:

tneva82 wrote:

Of course you have to consider they are comparing it to 7th ed 40k. HH is lot different and lot more balanced to 40k 7th ed.

Snuh? HH is 7th edition.

Or do your 30k games somehow not have deathstars, invisibility bombs, quad-launchers, knights, etc?

Formations. The issue with 40K 7th edition was Formations. They flat out broke the game. Without it, 7th is a relatively decent system, hence why we all enjoy 30K so much.

This is not to say that there certainly wasn't ways to improve the rules of 7th with some tweaks, but the core rule system itself was overall fine.

 djones520 wrote:

Formations. The issue with 40K 7th edition was Formations.

Hahahahahahahahaha. Yeah, the big issue was formations. Ok, sure.

All those other issues were fine and created great gaming experiences. Snicker.

 DarknessEternal wrote:

 djones520 wrote:

Formations. The issue with 40K 7th edition was Formations.

Hahahahahahahahaha. Yeah, the big issue was formations. Ok, sure.

All those other issues were fine and created great gaming experiences. Snicker.

In all fairness formations were ONE of the major problems with 7th, I have never hidden the fact I cant stand free points in games and 7th made this soooo much worse, add to the the outdated morale system that almost every army ignored, heavy bias to shooting, Eldar, Tau and Space Marines, a nonsensical allies system... i could go on, but so could you lol

This thread title sounds very 'First world Problems' those who invest in 30K models will come around to playing it soon enough, and 30K will have its own 8th port soon.

 Orlanth wrote:
and 30K will have its own 8th port soon.

Only a fan-based one. Forge World is sticking with 7th.

 Melissia wrote:

 techsoldaten wrote:
Well, my claim was anecdotal

As was mine, but you still hypocritically demanded evidence even though you have none, yourself, and I provided some. You may not like what I've provided, but the fact is, unlike you, I have something. And you? You have nothing.

Prove your own damn argument. You can't, but try anyway, I will enjoy watching you fail. Freaking calling other people out demanding evidence to back up their opinions, mutter mutter...

My anecdote was based on years of posts on this forum. Your anecdote is based on a game that has been out for a few weeks. There is no way to prove an anecdote, it's just an observation people can either agree with or disagree with.

This exchange does prove something about you, however. Alpharius would likely ban me were I to point it out.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
You know, until Thousand Sons and Space Wolves were released, I would have said Horus Heresy is about as close to a good balance as this game is going to get. Even when I was getting toasted by someone, the mistakes were mine and not due to some awful mechanic in the game.

One of the reasons I like the fact HH is staying with 7th edition rules is that it's more complicated. Call me crazy, but there are times 8th edition streamlining leaves me dissatisfied. I played a game with my Kharbdis Assault Claw where it deep struck, dropped a Helbrute, then proceeded to eat a Dreadnought and 2 Razorbacks over the next couple turns. This would have been impossible in 7th edition, but right now the KAC and Laspreds are my 8th edition MVPs.

I will probably keep playing 40k for a while, but I definitely look forward to moving back to HH.

 DarknessEternal wrote:

 Orlanth wrote:
and 30K will have its own 8th port soon.

Only a fan-based one. Forge World is sticking with 7th.

Weird. Any reason why? Guessing "too much work to change over"?

 Melissia wrote:
Weird. Any reason why? Guessing "too much work to change over"?

Two possibilities: either it's too much work, or FW acknowledges that 8th is a dumpster fire and sees more value in maintaining the existing rules than in moving them over to an edition with inferior core rules. I hope it's the second, 30k works pretty well with the 7th edition core rules and avoids most of the problems of 7th edition 40k. IMO the best possible outcome of moving to 8th was that the quality of the rules stays the same, and there is a lot of potential to ruin 30k. So why do it?

 Peregrine wrote:

 Melissia wrote:
Weird. Any reason why? Guessing "too much work to change over"?

Two possibilities: either it's too much work, or FW acknowledges that 8th is a dumpster fire and sees more value in maintaining the existing rules than in moving them over to an edition with inferior core rules. I hope it's the second, 30k works pretty well with the 7th edition core rules and avoids most of the problems of 7th edition 40k. IMO the best possible outcome of moving to 8th was that the quality of the rules stays the same, and there is a lot of potential to ruin 30k. So why do it?

I'm not gonna challenge your second statement, but, we all know is the first possibility. GW and FW had demostrated through the years that they have no problem with ruining their own game systems

 Peregrine wrote:

 Melissia wrote:
Weird. Any reason why? Guessing "too much work to change over"?

Two possibilities: either it's too much work, or FW acknowledges that 8th is a dumpster fire and sees more value in maintaining the existing rules than in moving them over to an edition with inferior core rules. I hope it's the second, 30k works pretty well with the 7th edition core rules and avoids most of the problems of 7th edition 40k. IMO the best possible outcome of moving to 8th was that the quality of the rules stays the same, and there is a lot of potential to ruin 30k. So why do it?

Stop it Peregrine. You scare me when I agree with you.

I am not ued to Peregrine making sense either.
However he has a point, and I hadnt seen it that way before, even though I see the pattern as possibly paving the way for a specialist games WHFB in th future.

30K is not an entry level product and doesnt therefore need entry level rules. While I agree in principle with most of th changes in 8th, though not all, there is a market for a separate product in 7th.
Also Forgeworld marks its products well in advance as the books are themselves artistic. An edition change might get in the way of the artistic flow. and force republication, which is too much like hard work for the editorial team, which from all accounts is a lot lazier than the design team.

 Peregrine wrote:

 Melissia wrote:
Weird. Any reason why? Guessing "too much work to change over"?

Two possibilities: either it's too much work, or FW acknowledges that 8th is a dumpster fire and sees more value in maintaining the existing rules than in moving them over to an edition with inferior core rules. I hope it's the second, 30k works pretty well with the 7th edition core rules and avoids most of the problems of 7th edition 40k. IMO the best possible outcome of moving to 8th was that the quality of the rules stays the same, and there is a lot of potential to ruin 30k. So why do it?

Or it could be because the lead writer for Forge World, the guy that wrote all the Horus Heresy rule books, has DIED. And not only that, it was apparently a long, and drawn out illness that prevented any appreciable work to be done on the Horus Heresy books over the last 2-3 years, which is why Inferno took so long to come out, and why it's such a poorly written and edited book (the worst of the HH series for sure).

Forge World has always been a small, sub-studio under the umbrella of GW, and only since HH came out has GW really expressed any interest at all into what FW does. As big of a company as GW is, and after working for such a large company, the bureaucracy must be insane! I bet whole sections/studios/divisions have no clue about what is going on in the bigger company, and considering how secretive GW has been, they have probably been compartmentalizing information. Based on that kind of assumption and that the lead Studio Author/Designer for Horus Heresy was on his death bed, it's entirely plausible that FW had zero idea that 8th edition was coming besides a few hints or rumors. It probably caught them with their pants down.

Given how much bigger the resources are for GW for rules development and play testing, I'm impressed that FW managed to throw together the Imperial Armor books as quickly as they did! Those books are trash though. I wouldn't even bother with them until they come out with the next "updated edition". While Forge World looks for a new Lead Designer/Writer, they are probably just sitting on HH because they don't want to screw it up. 30K is like the Cadillac of Warhammer. If they mess it up, no one is going to pay the premium price for the books or models, and FW will quietly die.

For me, I'm glad they are finishing out the Heresy in 7th edition... or at least the Legions. After that, they can do whatever they want with HH (which means update to 8th...). I just want to see the last three Primarchs rules so we can have a "which Primarch is the best?" Arena Death Match game.

 DarknessEternal wrote:

tneva82 wrote:

Of course you have to consider they are comparing it to 7th ed 40k. HH is lot different and lot more balanced to 40k 7th ed.

Snuh? HH is 7th edition.

Or do your 30k games somehow not have deathstars, invisibility bombs, quad-launchers, knights, etc?

They are vastly different and lot more balanced. Perfect? No. Nothing is perfect. But much more logical than 8th

Ok, you're welcome to continue having Invisible Magnus keep dishing out 2d6 D hits to everything within 2 feet.

I think people pretending HH is perfectly balanced are a bit naive, but I would say the curve is closer then 8th (Maybe JUST magnus withstanding?)

 DarknessEternal wrote:
Ok, you're welcome to continue having Invisible Magnus keep dishing out 2d6 D hits to everything within 2 feet.

Yes that could be bad. But the chances of you getting all of that is pretty slim. And as a Thousand Sons player I will admit that Magnus is fething busted unless you agree to tone him the feth waaaaaaay down.

If they fix the D Nova and remove Santic demo from HH he would be where he needs to be. Oh and ignore that invisibility stacking with his ability to not get hit

Overall the Inferno armies are at a different level than what came before. It is what it is, and we'll probably be waiting for a long time before any of Inferno's many issues are addressed. I'm not sure if they'll even bother addressing them for 7th edition. Updating the 30K armies for 8th is a big job, but so is maintaining their own 30K core rules, and IMO that's even less of a core competency for them than developing supplemental items. They'd probably punt on both fronts if they could, but they can't.

Look, I'm a fan of FW. I love what they do well, because they do those things very well. I just placed a 250+ GBP order with them. But rules support isn't one of those things, and I think a lot of people are whistling past the graveyard on that and how it relates to the future of 30K, even before we get to what the loss of AB means for them.

Fortunately for me a lot of people in my gaming club still prefer, and play, 30k over 40k 8th ed at the moment. We have just started an escalation campaign that I run, and we are having a lot of fun building and painting our new armies and then playing each other.

I can recommend this for anyone wanting to try and hype the game up again for your gaming friends. Starting low (we started at 750 points) lets people buy some models, get them painted and playing with them quite fast, and then they are hooked!

In regards to the new rulebook, I only really want to see the psychic phase tuned a bit. As a TS player I feel it takes up a lot of time, and could be simplified just a bit. Maybe not to the degree of 8th edition, but somewhere in the same direction. I still love 7th edition in 30k games, but I haven't played that many 40k 8th edition games yet to really have a strong opinion on that.

So what would your group say to someone playing an army not available in 30k?

They come in to the store, purchase some Tau, and get out their fire warriors and say "hey, can I play a game?".

Waht do you do? Say "Nah, you have to play marines to play here"?

We still have more 40k players than 30k players. I'm just saying we have a steady number of people who still play 30k, and I'm glad about it. I also wanted to suggest the escalation thing, it's a great way to get people interested in 30k.

I don't really understand the point of your comment, why would we ever blow someone off like that? If a Tau player comes in we say: "Cool, we are playing Horus Heresy at the moment, but talk to the 20 other guys over there and they'll hook you up".

What's with the attitude?

 Melissia wrote:
So what would your group say to someone playing an army not available in 30k?

They come in to the store, purchase some Tau, and get out their fire warriors and say "hey, can I play a game?".

Waht do you do? Say "Nah, you have to play marines to play here"?

In the case of my group we play 30k in the majority, but there are 40k players too. So they would be catered for. We shouldn't all have to suffer through 8th edition in order for people to get pick-up games. If you want a scene, build it. That's always been the way with 30k. Methinks a few people had it a bit too good when they arrived a little later to the party. 30k took a fair while to get going even with my group and were all 30k crazy. For a long time there was about 2 people painting stuff and one of those wasn't gaming.

 alleus wrote:
We still have more 40k players than 30k players. I'm just saying we have a steady number of people who still play 30k, and I'm glad about it. I also wanted to suggest the escalation thing, it's a great way to get people interested in 30k.

I don't really understand the point of your comment, why would we ever blow someone off like that? If a Tau player comes in we say: "Cool, we are playing Horus Heresy at the moment, but talk to the 20 other guys over there and they'll hook you up".

What's with the attitude?

Agreed.

 alleus wrote:
I don't really understand the point of your comment, why would we ever blow someone off like that

Why not? Your post gave the impression you would do exactly that.

 Melissia wrote:

 alleus wrote:
I don't really understand the point of your comment, why would we ever blow someone off like that

Why not? Your post gave the impression you would do exactly that.

He said a lot of his group. Not all.

Methinks youre seeing what you want to see.

 Melissia wrote:
So what would your group say to someone playing an army not available in 30k?

They come in to the store, purchase some Tau, and get out their fire warriors and say "hey, can I play a game?".

Waht do you do? Say "Nah, you have to play marines to play here"?

If someone really wanted to play Tau versus a 30k army, that person would need a 7th edition Codex.

From what I hear from Tau players, they prefer it over the 8th edition Index.

 Fenriz wrote:
Methinks youre seeing what you want to see.

On the contrary; I wouldn't want to see that happen, as it would basically mean the group is a bunch of jerks, which would be certainly be a bad way to maintain the hobby in your area. Rather, I think your statement more applies to yourself, if you're really unwilling to see how it might come across that way.

It seems to me you are just trolling, Melissia, and looking for a fight. Our group is welcoming to anyone, I don't know how you got any other impression.

All I said in my post was that we have quite a few people who prefer Horus Heresy over 40k. What's wrong with that? They are two different game systems now. Do you also get mad when you bring a 40k Tau army to a group of people playing Age of Sigmar and are not allowed to play with them?

 alleus wrote:
Our group is welcoming to anyone

I'm glad to hear it.

[MOD EDIT - RULE #1 - Alpharius]

RULE #1 - BE POLITE.

If you see a post that you feel is against the rules of the site, just report it and move on.

 Melissia wrote:
> Accuses me of trolling
> Goes on to troll

If you think I'm trolling, I could not care any less. If that bothers you, report my post.

*sigh*

Let's de-escalate this situation.

Inclusion is making people feel welcome and invited into a community. Choice of game system is probably the smallest factor in someone's decision whether or not to join a group. There are 40k groups, there are 30k groups, but most people decide which ones to be part of based on the people. The ruleset matters, but it's like ice cream. You might have your heart set on chocolate or vanilla, but on a hot day you would probably be content with either so long as it's cold.

Melissa has expressed some enthusiasm for 8th edition rules in Horus Heresy, which is great. Horus Heresy uses a different ruleset and (given what happened to poor Mr. Bligh) will continue doing so for some time, with few changes, at least until they release the remaining Legion armies. I have not met anyone clamoring for 8th edition rules in HH outside this thread, but I do see people creating new armies all the time. The ones who do seem to be enjoying themselves.

Given the fact the rules are what they are, it's probably not some offense against social justice to start a 30k group. I have helped build communities of gamers that included over 100 people and been in situations (i.e. the release of 7th edition) where bad rules caused the group to diminish. This is not one of those situations.

Melissa has every right to feel the way she does, no one needs to tell her she is wrong for her opinions even if she chooses to express them strongly. It's not personal, it's her own valid, unique perspective. It would be wrong to elevate the observations she has shared to the level of offense. At the end of the day, does it really matter that she would not want to join your group? Given all that she's said, would you actually want to be in a group she's in?

Gaming is social, and social means you meet a lot of people. That doesn't mean you have to like all of them.

 techsoldaten wrote:

Melissa has expressed some enthusiasm for 8th edition rules in Horus Heresy, which is great. Horus Heresy uses a different ruleset and (given what happened to poor Mr. Bligh) will continue doing so for some time, with few changes, at least until they release the remaining Legion armies. I have not met anyone clamoring for 8th edition rules in HH outside this thread, but I do see people creating new armies all the time. The ones who do seem to be enjoying themselves.

Pretty much everyone in the store I play at has been wanting 8e rules for the Heresy, they'll still play HH as is, but they want it updated.

 techsoldaten wrote:

Melissa has every right to feel the way she does, no one needs to tell her she is wrong for her opinions even if she chooses to express them strongly. It's not personal, it's her own valid, unique perspective. It would be wrong to elevate the observations she has shared to the level of offense. At the end of the day, does it really matter that she would not want to join your group? Given all that she's said, would you actually want to be in a group she's in?

Gaming is social, and social means you meet a lot of people. That doesn't mean you have to like all of them.

Sure, I just don't know why I was attacked in the first place. All I did was express my own joy that I have friends that like playing 30k with 7th edition. She goes on to insult me and my group by implying that we are exclusive and rude to 40k players, when nothing such was said. Expressing strong opinions is fine, but doing it while also insulting others (however passive it was) is not OK. Now I did not see what Fenriz wrote that warranted a mod stepping in, but it was probably not good either.

I am letting this go now, this is not something worth getting upset about. Respect each other, life gets easier that way.

 VictorVonTzeentch wrote:

 techsoldaten wrote:

Melissa has expressed some enthusiasm for 8th edition rules in Horus Heresy, which is great. Horus Heresy uses a different ruleset and (given what happened to poor Mr. Bligh) will continue doing so for some time, with few changes, at least until they release the remaining Legion armies. I have not met anyone clamoring for 8th edition rules in HH outside this thread, but I do see people creating new armies all the time. The ones who do seem to be enjoying themselves.

Pretty much everyone in the store I play at has been wanting 8e rules for the Heresy, they'll still play HH as is, but they want it updated.

The opposite in my local. Half of our 30K group was angry that 8th edition wasn't happening, and then they played 8th edition 40K. Now all they want to do is play 30K.

Yeah its gonna be different everywhere you go.

Well. Everybody in my group was glad, that FW stays with 7th edition. Especially now, because 8th edition is just......not realy fleshed out, it seems.

I like each system for what it is.

HH feels like it's more tactically precise. Appropriate for sets of armies fighting at the pinnacle of their advancement.

8th edition feels like it's more action-oriented. Accounts for differences between different races with widely varying battle styles.

Having both use the same set of rules would remove these distinctive qualities. I don't feel like we're losing anything with the way things are currently set up. Also, I don't feel like I would be less likely to field a Heresy-era army if the system looked more like 8th edition.

 alleus wrote:

 techsoldaten wrote:

Melissa has every right to feel the way she does, no one needs to tell her she is wrong for her opinions even if she chooses to express them strongly. It's not personal, it's her own valid, unique perspective. It would be wrong to elevate the observations she has shared to the level of offense. At the end of the day, does it really matter that she would not want to join your group? Given all that she's said, would you actually want to be in a group she's in?

Gaming is social, and social means you meet a lot of people. That doesn't mean you have to like all of them.

Sure, I just don't know why I was attacked in the first place. All I did was express my own joy that I have friends that like playing 30k with 7th edition. She goes on to insult me and my group by implying that we are exclusive and rude to 40k players, when nothing such was said. Expressing strong opinions is fine, but doing it while also insulting others (however passive it was) is not OK. Now I did not see what Fenriz wrote that warranted a mod stepping in, but it was probably not good either.

I am letting this go now, this is not something worth getting upset about. Respect each other, life gets easier that way.

I was just speaking in your defense. Cest La Vie. We can all agree to disagree.

Your group sounds nice though, which is always a good thing. Happy gaming!

My small group of gamers ( about 8 of us) are glad that 30k stayed 7th edition as we wanted all the legions and stuff to be finished in one rule set. I think it would of been a huge mess if they had most of the rules 7th and then made the BA,WS and DA with 8th edition rules and tried to port over the rest of the legions with 'get you by rules' until they could get back around to them.

Once everything is finished rules wise with the legions, I would be more then willing to have them port over 30k to 8th edition as we could choose what edition of rules to use. More choice is always a good thing I reckons.

I myself prefer 7th for HH as it plays different then main line 40k as it got rid of most of the most visible offenders in 7th ( taudar, super friends deathstar, tau riptide/sugre wings, eldar.. well everything , space marine grav spam....) but it still has some gaping holes such as spaming quad launchers with phosphex, Thousand Son Magnus... ( ug really my friend chris has been waiting for ever for TS and he felt so bad after playing magnus for the first time), Some of the space wolf shenanigans. But all in all it's way better then the mess that the end of 7th edition was.

Now lets go out there and make either Horus, the Emperor or the Omnissiah ( as his guise of the Un-maker god my personal fav) proud!

I like Horus Heresy with 7th edition, mostly because it's nice having two different rulesets to go between. If HH was 8th edition rules as well it could have gotten stale I think, since you would play it both in 30k and 40k.

With two different rulesets you get more variety, which is a good thing. Only if you have to play though, obivously, otherwise it could be a problem. Though, even if it was 8th edition rules, playing against 40k factions proably wouldn't work well anyway. It didn't in 7th edition, and I don't see why it would in 8th edition.

What I like about HH is the depth of its rules. I was amped up for 8th, however now that it has dropped and I have seen the rules, I have found the game to be nowhere near as enjoyablenas 7th Edition HH.

The part that absolutely kills me however is that players will have this barrier where they will have to find a 7th edition 40k rule book in order to even play HH. So now our game has this barrier between our game and the rest of the 40k armies that makes it even more difficult for us to find a match.

HH is dead in my area. Its just the same three guys playing with the same three armies. No more great crusade matches against Orks, no more purging of Xenos on outer reach planets.

Is anyone actually having trouble finding HH games since 8th edition came out? This has been on my find for a while.

If anything, I am finding more people playing HH than 8th edition. The people playing HH tend to be older gamers and they tend to have been playing it for at least a year. Mostly in the DC area.

 techsoldaten wrote:
Is anyone actually having trouble finding HH games since 8th edition came out? This has been on my find for a while.

If anything, I am finding more people playing HH than 8th edition. The people playing HH tend to be older gamers and they tend to have been playing it for at least a year. Mostly in the DC area.

I have had one game of HH since 8th dropped. The interest in the area evaporated and it shows no signs of coming back. There is one other fellow who has two HH armies that was driving it and he seems to have jumped ship as well.

I have no doubt that in some areas HH is still going but here? Basically gone.

Not touched 8th and done plan too, heresy is all me and my group play now, that and fantasy.

 Nurgle wrote:
What I like about HH is the depth of its rules. I was amped up for 8th, however now that it has dropped and I have seen the rules, I have found the game to be nowhere near as enjoyablenas 7th Edition HH.

The part that absolutely kills me however is that players will have this barrier where they will have to find a 7th edition 40k rule book in order to even play HH. So now our game has this barrier between our game and the rest of the 40k armies that makes it even more difficult for us to find a match.

HH is dead in my area. Its just the same three guys playing with the same three armies. No more great crusade matches against Orks, no more purging of Xenos on outer reach planets.

I think that when Forgeworld releases their new 7th edition rulebook specifically for Horus Heresy, the hype train will depart once more for the game. At least I hope so, the game and the miniatures really deserve more players!

Dark angels and Blood angels, so looking forward to both.

Well, yes, Angelus as well. I was mostly thinking about the rulebook itself, but Angelus should be good. Unfortunately it seems it will not come until late 2018.

Hopefully the rulebook comes quicker than that.

 AaronWilson wrote:
I think people pretending HH is perfectly balanced are a bit naive, but I would say the curve is closer then 8th (Maybe JUST magnus withstanding?)

I think that people who keep on saying that anyone is claiming HH to be perfectly balanced are being a bit disingenuous.

And for the record, I much prefer 8th ed to 7th, whether it is for HH or 40k.

 techsoldaten wrote:
Is anyone actually having trouble finding HH games since 8th edition came out? This has been on my find for a while.

Anecdotally, my gaming group hasn't played any HH since 8th dropped, and I'm not sure any of us plan to. We went from a strictly 30k group to a 40k one.

Anecdotally, my gaming group hasn't played any HH since 8th dropped, and I'm not sure any of us plan to. We went from a strictly 30k group to a 40k one.

I for my part prefer 7th over 8th, by far.

My gaming group (12 Guys and one girl called "Lyla") was 100% committed to 40k. When 8th dropped our jaws did the same
and now we went all over to Horus Heresy and shelved our old units. Nobody can envisage to ever play 40k again.
It is almost unbelievable.

Prinster wrote:

Anecdotally, my gaming group hasn't played any HH since 8th dropped, and I'm not sure any of us plan to. We went from a strictly 30k group to a 40k one.

I for my part prefer 7th over 8th, by far.

My gaming group (12 Guys and one girl called "Lyla") was 100% committed to 40k. When 8th dropped our jaws did the same
and now we went all over to Horus Heresy and shelved our old units. Nobody can envisage to ever play 40k again.
It is almost unbelievable.

That's interesting. It seems like most groups gravitate more towards 40k 8th, with some exceptions. I'm lucky enough to have a gaming club where both are very active, so I do like 8th edition 40k as well. I just like Horus Heresy more