WarStages is THE scenery system you've been waiting for:
Modular as LEGO,
Epic as a Movie Set,
So Flexible that you can go from Super Massive Battles to
Skirmishes, even RPG, and everything in between!
Coming on Kickstarter in July 2017, with great Early Bird pledges, so don't miss the launch! Watch this space for more images daily, info, and the upcoming countdown clock...
Sign up to our special Warstages Newsletter, and follow us on Kickstarter (make sure you enable notifications) and Facebook.
go on then I'll manage the thread for this which actually looks quite impressive (although as I generally don't do scenery or terrain I won't be pledging unless something special comes up),
although July looks pretty crowded already with a fair number of big projects (CMON's Game of Thrones, Petersen Games Cthylhu Wars: Onslaught 3)
highlord tamburlaine wrote: So am I right in thinking this is going to be similar to the Battlesystems terrain? That's the vibe I got from the video and the press release stuff.
Did they mention what it's made of exactly?
Not to keen on still having early birds, but eh, I'm sure I'll get one regardless, at the very least to see if it's worth it.
In the end I'm pretty happy with my EB TGGG2 pledge.
wasn't expecting cardboard terrain. but I have to admit it looks good.
So, what material is used for this? Cardstock after all then? Or printed MDF? I see a lot of jargon being thrown around, a lot of shock and awe, but not a real peep on what it's made up of.
Sure looks similar to the Battlesystems terrain system. As a backer of said system's Kickstarter, that's fine, it works well enough, but keep in mind the following:
All those stairs and scatter terrain look great but hinder movement and placement of miniatures. Great for RPGs with miniatures or small unit skirmish wargames like Infinity or Necromunda/Kill Team, not so great for pitched WH40K battles. Keep the scatter to a minimum and any unit at the top of a set of complex stairs is pretty much immobile unless they can fly up/down, as you can expect a set of stairs to eat up 2-3 turns of movement if it's fancy.
Go big or go small with this sort of system, and build you buildings with play in mind rather that appearance. Turn the entire table into the inside of a cathedral to fight in, or make many smaller buildings. Medium buildings become very problematic because the walls make moving miniatures around very troublesome. Have large ground floor openings (doors and windows) so you can reach in to move miniatures, and keep you buildings to 12"x12" maximum so you an reach inside easily, and have exterior catwalks, not interior ones.
Alternatively, you can build large, low-walled buildings with no roof. You lose the vertical appeal of the terrain, but it becomes far more practical for game play. I really hope the KS includes good options for low wall sections (4" high walls leaves room for a catwalk) to enable this sort of use.
Also, the lightweight nature of this kind of scenery makes accidents more likely, especially if your scenery is sitting on top of the same slick glossy cardstock the walls are made of. A minor bump can send models tumbling over even guard rails, so how this connects to the baseplates will be very important.
BrookM wrote: So, what material is used for this? Cardstock after all then? Or printed MDF? I see a lot of jargon being thrown around, a lot of shock and awe, but not a real peep on what it's made up of.
If it were made out of cookies, would it be....delicious?
BrookM wrote: So, what material is used for this? Cardstock after all then? Or printed MDF? I see a lot of jargon being thrown around, a lot of shock and awe, but not a real peep on what it's made up of.
If it were made out of cookies, would it be....delicious?
But it would be Oatmeal Raisin, and thus, a war crime.
A friend in my Infinity group got the MDF printed terrain from Bandua and it was pretty spiffy despite being very basic in actual design. If this is on MDF, it might be good, but will pretty much be late
The prototypes look very much like very thick card stock, maybe the same sort as used by board games?
It does raise the question just how sturdy this all will be, especially when it is presented as "Modular as LEGO", which is fine and dandy, as long as it can withstand the wear and tear of it being assembled and broken down again.
Alpharius wrote: Not the picture this thread needs, but the one it deserves?
July is more than half way over now - any more detail on when in 'July' this is launching?
BrookM wrote: The prototypes look very much like very thick card stock, maybe the same sort as used by board games?
IIRC from what I read in their update about it, they didn't really say what the finished product would be made from. Just that the prototype was made by themselves. I can only hope that the professionally manufactured product will be even better.
I don't think anybody in that forum thread is a Reaper employee/representative.
That said, there's nothing new in there. Already fully covered in the threads for the previous two Kickstarters.
Also, ho-hum, they did a small update on the material:
JULY 18 UPDATE: OUR QUEST FOR THE PERFECT MATERIAL
The most common question you've asked so far is “What is it made of?”
During our one-year journey in the development of WarStages, we tried A LOT of things, both technically and artistically. And we came to a conclusion that may surprise some of you: the most effective, good-looking, affordable solution to build our large-scale epic scenery was the use of high-quality, super-dense coated color-printed cardboard.
You've already seen how good it looks in our video, let us tell you more about it.
It took many months and an extensive trial-an-error period to get there, but boy are we glad we took that time, because we are so pumped up about its possibilities, its qualities, its robustness, its visual impact, and its reasonable cost compared to the alternatives.
What are card board unique set of qualities?
First it looks awesome! Right out of the box, you get a super detailed building full of complex textures, details and color. It allows for a crazy level of details.
No need to paint! Painting such huge scenery could be on the near side of forever. We've done awya with that.
It ain't flat! You might think that it would look somewhat flat, but as we first designed all the parts in 3D and then enhanced them with loads of photographic textures, it looks incredibly deep and tri-dimensional. On top of that, we use many visual tricks in the assembly of the structures to give them even more volume.
Easy to put away: Since most parts are not glued together, you have a lot of freedom in how to put it away once you're done gaming. You can completely break it down, or just disassemble the largest parts and keep the rest ready to go for your next battle. An under-bed plastic sweater box or two should do the trick.
It's quite light: Card board wins hands down compared to resin, plastic or MDF.
It's cost-effective: We wanted to make sure that tis epic scenery would remain affordable. Sure, like always with printing, you need large runs to keep cost reasonable, but once above certain quantities, the kits become very affordable compared to their actual size.
It's a very strong material: To our surprise, it is also extremely strong and resistant! A single sheet of card board may not feel like a strong object, but once it is assembled into a structure, it is super robust and can withstand heavy loads, in any case more heavy than any large mini you might place on it. If you are unsure about that, just browse the internet and see for yourself how people build real furniture (and even houses!) in cardboard...
Here's the story of how we got here:
Our goal with this project was to offer you incredible scenery that would feel epic and massive, the kind of scenery we've all seen displayed on the tables at conventions that one can only dream of
for it feels impossible to build or afford.
because we know we will never be able to afford or build.
Our goal was also to give you something that would have a cinematic mood, a movie stage quality for your games. Something that would make you feel like you suddenly got dropped into a siege scene in Lord of the Rings, or fighting your way through Gotham City, or in the many other great settings of your favorite movies and series.
Other materials
Our initial plan was to build this scenery in resin. But the sheer mass of the structures we wanted to make made it very clear that it would be a titan job to produce the casts, and that the costs would be absolutely prohibitive.
From then on, we started testing all other options. We looked into injected plastics. But to make it a viable option, it meant that it would have forced us to ditch variety and get a product that would look very repetitive, because the number of basic elements had to be reduced considerably to make it viable commercially.
We then looked into MDF and Plasticard. MDF is a popular option today, and a good one too. But it was not adapted to our plans, if only because of its weight. You would have ended up paying as much for shipping as for the cathedral due to the epic size of the kit. Plasticard was decidedly too expensive for our needs as well.
We even tried combinations of all these materials. But every approach left us with mixed feelings. Something was always missing and the prototype kits would always come out too expensive, too long to produce, or end up with a super limited set of very small bricks that would take countless hours to assemble into a big scenery.
Onwards to another solution
However, by that time, we had already designed many buildings and elements, and so just to test their size and mass, we started simply printing renders on paper and making mock-ups in cardboard.
And it was a revelation...
It was better than everything we had before: it was detailed, it was fully coloured and textured, it was fast to assemble and simple to store. But the biggest thing was that, even with mock-ups, the structures looked gorgeous on the table.
Best option
So here we are today with what is, in our opinion, probably the best option for scenery. When you set it on your table, it is hard to believe that it's just cardboard, it has so much tri-dimensionality and texture and depth! And all the accessories give so much life to it! It's just great!
Also, all these elements come together with a super nifty, nearly invisible assembly system. (Please note that it slightly differs from what you see on the photos and video of our prototype). We'll tell you all about it in a coming update, but know that it allows you to create an infinity of crazy combinations.
Thanks for clearing that up! Terrain is indeed a bit challenge to produce, especially since people are less inclined to spend a lot of money on than let's say their armies.
I can still one day see some nutter converting your kit with pieces of plastic card, other models, greenstuff, etc to make it look 3d. :O
IIRC the price for the sets was a sore point for many, as you didn't get a lot of terrain for what was asked. Though I could be incorrectly remembering it.
Looks great from the teaser...but..I am still waiting on ten fething miniatures from the previous kickstarter and I got in on that EAAAARLY. Going to recommend to just move along and find a company that should still have kickstarter rights.
BrookM wrote: Also, ho-hum, they did a small update on the material:
Spoiler:
JULY 18 UPDATE: OUR QUEST FOR THE PERFECT MATERIAL
The most common question you've asked so far is “What is it made of?”
During our one-year journey in the development of WarStages, we tried A LOT of things, both technically and artistically. And we came to a conclusion that may surprise some of you: the most effective, good-looking, affordable solution to build our large-scale epic scenery was the use of high-quality, super-dense coated color-printed cardboard.
You've already seen how good it looks in our video, let us tell you more about it.
It took many months and an extensive trial-an-error period to get there, but boy are we glad we took that time, because we are so pumped up about its possibilities, its qualities, its robustness, its visual impact, and its reasonable cost compared to the alternatives.
What are card board unique set of qualities?
First it looks awesome! Right out of the box, you get a super detailed building full of complex textures, details and color. It allows for a crazy level of details.
No need to paint! Painting such huge scenery could be on the near side of forever. We've done awya with that.
It ain't flat! You might think that it would look somewhat flat, but as we first designed all the parts in 3D and then enhanced them with loads of photographic textures, it looks incredibly deep and tri-dimensional. On top of that, we use many visual tricks in the assembly of the structures to give them even more volume.
Easy to put away: Since most parts are not glued together, you have a lot of freedom in how to put it away once you're done gaming. You can completely break it down, or just disassemble the largest parts and keep the rest ready to go for your next battle. An under-bed plastic sweater box or two should do the trick.
It's quite light: Card board wins hands down compared to resin, plastic or MDF.
It's cost-effective: We wanted to make sure that tis epic scenery would remain affordable. Sure, like always with printing, you need large runs to keep cost reasonable, but once above certain quantities, the kits become very affordable compared to their actual size.
It's a very strong material: To our surprise, it is also extremely strong and resistant! A single sheet of card board may not feel like a strong object, but once it is assembled into a structure, it is super robust and can withstand heavy loads, in any case more heavy than any large mini you might place on it. If you are unsure about that, just browse the internet and see for yourself how people build real furniture (and even houses!) in cardboard...
Here's the story of how we got here:
Our goal with this project was to offer you incredible scenery that would feel epic and massive, the kind of scenery we've all seen displayed on the tables at conventions that one can only dream of
for it feels impossible to build or afford.
because we know we will never be able to afford or build.
Our goal was also to give you something that would have a cinematic mood, a movie stage quality for your games. Something that would make you feel like you suddenly got dropped into a siege scene in Lord of the Rings, or fighting your way through Gotham City, or in the many other great settings of your favorite movies and series.
Other materials
Our initial plan was to build this scenery in resin. But the sheer mass of the structures we wanted to make made it very clear that it would be a titan job to produce the casts, and that the costs would be absolutely prohibitive.
From then on, we started testing all other options. We looked into injected plastics. But to make it a viable option, it meant that it would have forced us to ditch variety and get a product that would look very repetitive, because the number of basic elements had to be reduced considerably to make it viable commercially.
We then looked into MDF and Plasticard. MDF is a popular option today, and a good one too. But it was not adapted to our plans, if only because of its weight. You would have ended up paying as much for shipping as for the cathedral due to the epic size of the kit. Plasticard was decidedly too expensive for our needs as well.
We even tried combinations of all these materials. But every approach left us with mixed feelings. Something was always missing and the prototype kits would always come out too expensive, too long to produce, or end up with a super limited set of very small bricks that would take countless hours to assemble into a big scenery.
Onwards to another solution
However, by that time, we had already designed many buildings and elements, and so just to test their size and mass, we started simply printing renders on paper and making mock-ups in cardboard.
And it was a revelation...
It was better than everything we had before: it was detailed, it was fully coloured and textured, it was fast to assemble and simple to store. But the biggest thing was that, even with mock-ups, the structures looked gorgeous on the table.
Best option
So here we are today with what is, in our opinion, probably the best option for scenery. When you set it on your table, it is hard to believe that it's just cardboard, it has so much tri-dimensionality and texture and depth! And all the accessories give so much life to it! It's just great!
Also, all these elements come together with a super nifty, nearly invisible assembly system. (Please note that it slightly differs from what you see on the photos and video of our prototype). We'll tell you all about it in a coming update, but know that it allows you to create an infinity of crazy combinations.
Ye gods, it's, like, the superest, mostest, bestest, epicest, awesomest thing evar!!1!
My brain is still whirling from all the adjectives.
Yeah, not surprised at all that it's full color cardboard. If it's a nice solid cardboard, with good printing and a quality finish, then I may jump on it (not literally).
Schmapdi wrote: Wasn't there a line of terrain like this made for Malifaux a few years ago? Terraclips or something like that?
I remember thinking it looked neat at the time, but they only ever made the initial 3 kits and no more.
I'm reminded of World Works Games, one of the early proponents/purveyors of card terrain. Checking their catalog, yep, they're the ones that did the Terraclips. They've more-or-less been out of the business for some years now, just maintaining the storefront and providing the files, but nothing new has happened. I always liked the look of a lot of their terrain (love the sailing ship), but it's all print-and-build-it-yourself stuff. Which I've never had the time or resources for.
Right.. the high quality card terrain market was a two horse race, but after the partnership between WWG/ Wyrd didn't really go anywhere and Terraclips died off it became Battlesystems game to loose. They are doing pretty well for themselves but they have only really dipped their toes into the gothic future thing. So there is room for another competitor in this arena but we will have to see how delicious RH cardboard terrain really is.
As an aside there were actually six Terraclips kits although the fact that most people only remember the first three is part of the problem. The first wave was Something of Malifaux. The second wave was their Dungeons Rise series (or maybe that was the name of one of the sets) that was focussed around D&D style dungeons.
Alpharius wrote: Hopefully it really is 'affordable' and that the almost inevitable delays don't make delivery stretch out the near side of forever.
My predictions are not going to happen to the first bit and delays will indeed happen to the second, especially as this is them working with a completely new medium and it all still being in the home-made prototype stage right now.
BrookM wrote: IIRC the price for the sets was a sore point for many, as you didn't get a lot of terrain for what was asked. Though I could be incorrectly remembering it.
I think the real sore spot was not enough clips to do the full set that were in the boxes and the clips separately were idiotically expensive.
a detail bit from facebook (wonder if the edges will be precoloured in what's on offer? that might add a fair bit of value as its a hassle doing it yourself on paper stuff)
Detail on the screens looks good, less chuffed with how the spikes on top look and the lower arch in the middle. I get that it's for sturdiness, but it looks off.
Nah. Chisel point black sharpie. Super easy and still faster than painting. I've built dozens of cardstock buildings, and the only pain is tight acute corners.
BrookM wrote: Detail on the screens looks good, less chuffed with how the spikes on top look and the lower arch in the middle. I get that it's for sturdiness, but it looks off.
Is the piece in the picture a finished product, or one of their handmade prototypes? Just wondering how indicative it will be of the final product.
Anyway, regarding the edges, markers are easy to use. But, wouldn't it also be possible to use a cardboard that's already black (or other appropriate color) to begin with?
We're now just days away, WarStages: The Gothic Cathedral Kickstarter will launch this week! We’ll tell you exactly when as soon as all the t's are crossed and the i's are dotted. Look for a countdown clock about a day before. New images on WarStages.
It's ALL in the DETAILS...
We spent A LOT of hours crafting detailed textures to dress up the Cathedral and the Gothic Daedalus. Most were 3D-sculpted first to be sure you'd get a maximum sensation of depth and volume. Then we carefully added and altered photographic textures for even more richness and realism. For example, the WarStages' Furniture beautifully shows the intricacy of the design and texture work. On the computer console above, the panels appear engraved with gothic tracery combined with super detailed retro high tech components. They'll look as intricate as jewels on the gaming table. See more on WarStages.
It's Gonna be a LIMITED EDITION
The Cathedral and the Gothic Daedalus Extension will be a Limited Edition. This is due to the nature of printing works, where costs are kept reasonable only by ordering large runs at a time. So we'll cover the campaign's Rewards plus a small extra stock, and then that's it. So get onboard during the campaign as it'll be a lot more complicated to get your WarStages once crowdfunding is over... Read and see more on WarStages.
Automatically Appended Next Post: I think the LE idea is a bad one even if it does mean a few extra backers spending a bit of extra cash in case they miss out
after all if you really believe in your product (and don't have other similar stuff to sell like you do with the odd LE mini) why rule out ever being able to sell it again especially after you've invested a bunch of time (& money?) in developing the product, manufacturing techniques etc
better to say that due to the printing costs of small runs its unlikely this will be an item regularly stocked (but importantly it doesn't prevent them running off another set if it is wildly popular)
Edit:
actually looking at their site that is pretty much what they're doing as they don't say LE there, but very unlikely to reprint, and
However, we do have plans for a few more projects, so there will be new and compatible scenery to comes so you’ll be able to expand and vary your WarStages in the future. Some gothic, and some non-gothic...
If it is similarly priced to Battlesystems, I might get some of this to mix and match with my Battlesystems Sci-Fi sets. Some of if will probably work with the Fantasy set as well.
I'm not impressed. I am not normally interested in cardboard scenery, but even so, I think that console highlights one of the biggest problems of super awesome detailed texture: it all goes out of the window once you factor in reflecting light. I have a few old GW cardboard buildings and the best thing about them is that, by and large, the texture is reasonably refrained, even and boring. It blends pretty well. Shine some light on that console up there and see how flat it all looks.
So, this just happened.. Raging Heroes has made a return to Facebook with their other account, I think it was their customer support account. All this time I had a hidden friend on my list, who it turns out wasn't some cutie from the UK, but someone from Raging Heroes.
looking at kicktraq their TTG2 looks to have got about 70% of its cash and about 80% of its backers in the first week, (and they'll have the data of what came in via the PM)
so it might well be that they think it makes most sense to go short
(plus a month long campaign would mean no August Holiday which is where France traditionally shuts down for the month, so I wonder if they'd been able to start sooner they might have run a bit longer)
No, I think they want to capitalise on the short run as much as possible, forcing people who usually stay on the fence to act sooner rather than later.
Honestly, when it's pretty much a glorified preorder, I don't think a KS campaign needs more than a week. Most people who know about it are all ready to back it, and folks that learn about it too late can just get in on the pledge manager.
There's a lot of unknown territory here, not sure if I'd call this a pre-order, as this is something they haven't tackled before.
Current predictions are: seven days of hype, several years of waiting interspersed with buzzwords.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Got my email just now:
Hello BrookM,
Remember the great games you played? The ones where the deployment phase didn’t drag on forever, the dice rolls were great, the moments, epic? When everybody had such a great time?
Well, we want this campaign to feel the same for you.
We want it to be exciting, with unlocks everyday. We all want to skip over the weeks in the middle where nothing really happens and you start to wonder “Is this going somewhere?”. It's summer, so together, let’s make this a unique moment where things keep moving all the time, where you'll see your pledge get bigger and bigger with freebies. And when it is over you'll think “It was short, but boy, it was great!”.
This is why we chose to do a short campaign, trim the fat, and only keep the best moments: the excitement of the launch and the rush of the final days...
JULY 26 UPDATE: One-Week WarStages Kickstarter Launches July 29 at 6PM (Paris, France time)
The full piece (as there's lots of...good stuff in there):
JULY 26 UPDATE: One-Week WarStages Kickstarter Launches July 29 at 6PM (Paris, France time)
It’s finally happening! We are launching this Saturday! It will be a VERY SHORT campaign, full of FREEBIES, and with exciting EARLY BIRD Pledges.
Time and Date Worldwide: To know exactly the hour at which it launches in your city/country, click here.
And keep your eye on our countdown clock.
A 7-day Campaign!
You read this right! The Campaign will only run for ONE WEEK. It will end between Saturday August 5th and Sunday August 5th (depending on where you live in the world).
Why So Short?
If you’ve already experienced a Kickstarter campaign, you know that there’s a lot of excitement at the beginning, a lot of excitement at the end, and not so much happening in the middle. Usually, project creators plan longer campaigns in the hope of attracting more people during that time. This is a wise strategy on specific project types that are more geared to the general public such as technology or music projects.
But in the Games category and with the backers we are looking for, we know that people are aware of the project’s existence and we don’t need to wait for several weeks for the general media to pick up on the campaign.
We thought about this long and hard. If you're concerned about this, remember that our first campaign was about 34 days and did $698,000. Our second campaign was about 16 days and was even more successful with $801,000.
In truth, we realise now that A LOT of the excitement has already been happening in the past few days with our revealing new info and images on this project. And so we thought we’d cut to the chase and shorten the quiet days between the beginning and the end of the campaign, especially since it is summer. So let's have this blitzkrieg!
Stretch Goals: Freebies and More Freebies
95% of the Stretch Goals planned for this campaign will be Freebies, so get ready for the ride! The better the campaign does, the more Freebies you’ll get as part of your pledge.
And that’s not all. The bigger you pledge, the more Freebies you’ll get!
In this campaign, we have the opportunity to give you more free stuff when you choose a higher tier, so that’s what we’ll be doing.
In fact, it will be fun for you to come back daily and watch your pledge get more and more Rewards!
And there's lots more info on our WarStages page...
Wait - I haven't gotten all my stuff from the second campaign. Was I supposed to have?
I can't decide if I like it or not. I too prefer more restrained cardboard terrain (though I love it generally), and more restrained in general. If the terrain is better than my painting, that is an issue.
Ignoring the first kickstarters Art Book (which we will never get?!), only like half a dozend miniatures fro the second kickstarter are still missing.
They're still ~1.25 years late... but it's almost over.
"soon" I'll recceive my Battle Systems cardboard terrain and I highly doubt that Warstages from Raging Heroes will even come close. Battle Systems had 4 projects and in each and every single one they delivered a steady improvement on the earlier project. They fixed the few holes they had, were extremely open and communicative and had updates on all major developments.
Alpharius wrote:Hopefully it really is 'affordable' and that the almost inevitable delays don't make delivery stretch out the near side of forever.
$185 to get in the door, and...
Geifer wrote:I'm not impressed. I am not normally interested in cardboard scenery, but even so, I think that console highlights one of the biggest problems of super awesome detailed texture: it all goes out of the window once you factor in reflecting light.
So much this. I'd be a hard pass if this was $40, let alone nearly 5 times that. I'm sure it looks terrific under very specific lighting (dim and offset), but I think in any normal playing conditions it's going to look exactly like what it is: a cardboard castle set with hard to see textures because of the high gloss finish you're sure to get.
I get that it's easy to transport, light, doesn't need to be painted, and all that jazz, but man you can buy a giant pile of Pegasus terrain for half that and I think it would look way better in actual playing conditions. I can see a good case for when you have limited storage space or travel a lot to play and there won't be terrain, of course.
I wish them the best of luck, which I am sure they don't need.
Compared to Battle Systems, it is way pricey. Where battle systems gives you more useable square footage in terms of terrain, this is more about a look. There is a lot of the cardboard terrain that just looks and not useable because it goes high (which isn't necessarily a bad thing, but something that doesn't interest me). Given that it is limited edition, we have no idea how many are ordered for this "print run" then that means someone wanting to dip their toes in, then expand later could be out of luck.
I'll watch it but definitely seems like something that I won't be getting involved with.
Initially grabbed a Medium EB, but upon further reflection (and checking competitor products) I decided to drop it.
I just vastly prefer actual 3d terrain, and seeing what I could get from the likes of Pegasus or Puppetswar for a similar price point, I couldn't justify this to myself.
You're not kidding, maybe it's cause I've never used card stock before but that seems insanely high for what to me is just printed cardboard and some plastic clips.
I'm currently sitting on an EB medium pledge (ye gods, I would love that extra large), but I suspect I will have to drop it. The price really is a concern. I do have a lot of terrain already, and I could really use that money for expanding my Primaris marines army.
While some of y'all brought up the Pegasus Hobbies terrain as an alternative, you didn't mention who actually sells it, because it seems to be out of stock or overpriced everywhere I looked.
Tannhauser42 wrote: I'm currently sitting on an EB medium pledge (ye gods, I would love that extra large), but I suspect I will have to drop it. The price really is a concern. I do have a lot of terrain already, and I could really use that money for expanding my Primaris marines army.
While some of y'all brought up the Pegasus Hobbies terrain as an alternative, you didn't mention who actually sells it, because it seems to be out of stock or overpriced everywhere I looked.
Tannhauser42 wrote: I'm currently sitting on an EB medium pledge (ye gods, I would love that extra large), but I suspect I will have to drop it. The price really is a concern. I do have a lot of terrain already, and I could really use that money for expanding my Primaris marines army.
While some of y'all brought up the Pegasus Hobbies terrain as an alternative, you didn't mention who actually sells it, because it seems to be out of stock or overpriced everywhere I looked.
Right on their website.
And what would "their" website be? One I did see is the website for a hobby store in California of the same name. Are you saying that the store in California and the company that makes the gothic cathedral kits are the same?
Tannhauser42 wrote: I'm currently sitting on an EB medium pledge (ye gods, I would love that extra large), but I suspect I will have to drop it. The price really is a concern. I do have a lot of terrain already, and I could really use that money for expanding my Primaris marines army.
While some of y'all brought up the Pegasus Hobbies terrain as an alternative, you didn't mention who actually sells it, because it seems to be out of stock or overpriced everywhere I looked.
Right on their website.
And what would "their" website be? One I did see is the website for a hobby store in California of the same name. Are you saying that the store in California and the company that makes the gothic cathedral kits are the same?
The Pegasus store in Montclair, California is the same company as the one who does the plastic scenery.
They made all kinds of stuff besides scenery over the years, especially in regards to SciFi movie related plastic kits. There was a prepainted resin terrain line they made as well as the plastic gothic stuff.
Just saw a new War of the Worlds diorama kit based on the Spielberg movie in there today.
They actually have quiet a bit of stuff they've put out over the years.
Bi'ios wrote: This terrain, while it is very very cool, is just way too pricey here. Almost 200 for the minimum, and that's just enough for a skirmish-sized setup
I don't know based on the pictures the terrain, even the small set looks like it would fill up a table. obviously everyone has a differant opion of what alot of terrain is but for me the small set would cover a 4'x4' area nicely
Bi'ios wrote: This terrain, while it is very very cool, is just way too pricey here. Almost 200 for the minimum, and that's just enough for a skirmish-sized setup
I don't know based on the pictures the terrain, even the small set looks like it would fill up a table. obviously everyone has a differant opion of what alot of terrain is but for me the small set would cover a 4'x4' area nicely
It does look like if you broke it up into its various components, it'd fill the area up, but I suppose I see terrain like this being built into a large something. I think breaking it up and spreading it around like that kinda makes it loose it's appeal. The "cinematic" nature of a set like this is both a strength and weakness.
I really do think it's very nice in appearance, and is probably worth what they're asking for it. I just think it's a pretty high buy-in for something that's use is more or less limited to skirmish usage, narrative gameplay (D&D type stuff), or diorama/display. It's way too busy and large of use with a "full-size" wargame (40k, AoS, etc)
All this being strictly my opinion, of course. If I played SWA/Necromunda, or Infinity, I'd be all over this in a heartbeat, no doubt.
A bit more expensive than the Battle Systems stuff was at kickstarter, though Battle Systems was a few years ago. Most of the cost of these kits seems to be sunk into vertical space - high walls and towers that look good, but don't offer huge amounts of useful terrain space.
So, less practical than Battle Systems, but definitely shinier kit. The Daedelus Extension is definitely the winner of the offerings, too bad you have to buy a full kit before the expansion. It would be interesting to see the full Medium kit broken down to make lots of smaller, shorter buildings.
The Pegasus Hobbies stuff looks great and decent prices for plastic buildings. Mantic's modular line isn't cheap at retail prices but it's pretty versatile and rock solid and heavy in a way card terrain never will be. Battle Systems Sci-Fi 2 set should be available soon as well.
That said, I don't think the WarStages is super overpriced - again, you're buying vertical space more than anything, but it's definitely not discounted for kickstarter.
Well, after going over the project a few times.. I don't think we're actually considering the size/dimensions correctly.
Yes, the biggest one is 765$.. but it is also ONE METER AND SIXTY CM tall. That is as tall as my wife. Even the medium one is 80 cm tall. If you put it on a table, you'll have the top close to your eyes.
That is super tall. Is it neccessary? NO! But tall indeed. And hight can only be done with more cardboard. There will be hundreds or more cardboard DinA4 boards for the bigger cathedrals. IF NOT MORE. DinA4 is ~30cm. So you need 6 boards just for getting the height done.
The amount of "free" extra stuff you get is insane as well.
http://i.imgur.com/6Xme7lZ.jpg XL gets 87 boxes/crates. EIGHTY SIX BOXES/CRATES. Thats way more than a dozend cardboard sheets.
Again: Do you need all of it? Absolutely no. It is Raging Heroes.. excessive is in their nature.
But: I think we need to appreciate the magnitude of it.
The interior add on would be tempting if it was available alone, but as has been said I don't really need tall shiny cardboard walls with a million tiny details that repeat over and over again. Kudos on the effort though, I hope to see one someday.
Alpharius wrote: The full piece (as there's lots of...good stuff in there):
JULY 26 UPDATE: One-Week WarStages Kickstarter Launches July 29 at 6PM (Paris, France time)
It’s finally happening! We are launching this Saturday! It will be a VERY SHORT campaign, full of FREEBIES, and with exciting EARLY BIRD Pledges.
Time and Date Worldwide: To know exactly the hour at which it launches in your city/country, click here.
And keep your eye on our countdown clock.
A 7-day Campaign!
You read this right! The Campaign will only run for ONE WEEK. It will end between Saturday August 5th and Sunday August 5th (depending on where you live in the world).
Why So Short?
If you’ve already experienced a Kickstarter campaign, you know that there’s a lot of excitement at the beginning, a lot of excitement at the end, and not so much happening in the middle. Usually, project creators plan longer campaigns in the hope of attracting more people during that time. This is a wise strategy on specific project types that are more geared to the general public such as technology or music projects.
But in the Games category and with the backers we are looking for, we know that people are aware of the project’s existence and we don’t need to wait for several weeks for the general media to pick up on the campaign.
We thought about this long and hard. If you're concerned about this, remember that our first campaign was about 34 days and did $698,000. Our second campaign was about 16 days and was even more successful with $801,000.
In truth, we realise now that A LOT of the excitement has already been happening in the past few days with our revealing new info and images on this project. And so we thought we’d cut to the chase and shorten the quiet days between the beginning and the end of the campaign, especially since it is summer. So let's have this blitzkrieg!
Stretch Goals: Freebies and More Freebies
95% of the Stretch Goals planned for this campaign will be Freebies, so get ready for the ride! The better the campaign does, the more Freebies you’ll get as part of your pledge.
And that’s not all. The bigger you pledge, the more Freebies you’ll get!
In this campaign, we have the opportunity to give you more free stuff when you choose a higher tier, so that’s what we’ll be doing.
In fact, it will be fun for you to come back daily and watch your pledge get more and more Rewards!
And there's lots more info on our WarStages page...
Am I the only one that's starting to "hear" their press releases in a comedian-parodying-Trump voice?
JULY 18 UPDATE: OUR QUEST FOR THE PERFECT MATERIAL First it looks awesome! Right out of the box, you get a super detailed building full of complex textures, details and color. It allows for a crazy level of details. On top of that, we use many visual tricks in the assembly of the structures to give them even more volume. When you set it on your table, it is hard to believe that it's just cardboard, it has so much tri-dimensionality and texture and depth! And all the accessories give so much life to it! It's just great!
So, the perfect material amounts to artwork printed on pre-punched cardboard, eh?
Geifer wrote: I'm not impressed. I am not normally interested in cardboard scenery, but even so, I think that console highlights one of the biggest problems of super awesome detailed texture: it all goes out of the window once you factor in reflecting light. I have a few old GW cardboard buildings and the best thing about them is that, by and large, the texture is reasonably refrained, even and boring. It blends pretty well. Shine some light on that console up there and see how flat it all looks.
You talking about the glossy shine? If that's the case why not just spray the terrain with a matt varnish?
Does it even matter once you play? You're not going to be staring at the terrain all the time nor look at it close up.
I think the idea is that you focus on the minis and your eyes simply blend in the background, the background of most cartoons are horrible yet people hardly notice because the focus is on the characters.
Terrain feels a bit flat though, especially those side panel walls.
Would have loved this terrain to be resin but then the cost of the basic stuff would probably have been 2-3x as high.
Geifer wrote: I'm not impressed. I am not normally interested in cardboard scenery, but even so, I think that console highlights one of the biggest problems of super awesome detailed texture: it all goes out of the window once you factor in reflecting light. I have a few old GW cardboard buildings and the best thing about them is that, by and large, the texture is reasonably refrained, even and boring. It blends pretty well. Shine some light on that console up there and see how flat it all looks.
You talking about the glossy shine? If that's the case why not just spray the terrain with a matt varnish?
Does it even matter once you play? You're not going to be staring at the terrain all the time nor look at it close up.
I think the idea is that you focus on the minis and your eyes simply blend in the background, the background of most cartoons are horrible yet people hardly notice because the focus is on the characters.
Terrain feels a bit flat though, especially those side panel walls.
Would have loved this terrain to be resin but then the cost of the basic stuff would probably have been 2-3x as high.
As mentioned before, I'm not normally interested in cardboard terrain. The only reason I'm following this because I usually like Raging Heroes' work and I was curious how their scenery kickstarter turned out. But since I don't do cardboard scenery, adding work on top of it to remove flaws as best as possible is not an enticing idea. Plus, while I'm not sure and I guess it's worth a try, depending on lighting matt varnish may not actually do anything.
Is there any word on what these are printed on? Because unless it's black cardboard, you'd have to paint the edges as well and that's just something I wouldn't be able to do without losing the will to live.
Does it matter? To me, yes. You're not going to believe this, but I am easily distracted during games and enjoy the view a lot more than I should. I would get hung up on the look of the scenery. No doubt about it.
MadCowCrazy wrote: [You talking about the glossy shine? If that's the case why not just spray the terrain with a matt varnish?
Does it even matter once you play? You're not going to be staring at the terrain all the time nor look at it close up.
I think the idea is that you focus on the minis and your eyes simply blend in the background
This isn't a particularly vigorous selling point - "buy our terrain for hundreds of dollars, but you'll barely even look at it"
Anyway, in my limited experience, I got the Space Hulk re-release a few years back, and I imagine it's very similar if not identical. The shine on the material makes the graphics pop but it also obscures a lot of detail at the same time, it's really reflective. I'd be hesitant to spray it with any kind of matte sealant - I'm not sure how it would react with cardboard. Best case, you go really light, and it wears off very fast with normal play. Worst case, you go really heavy, and it warps as it dries.
Which is another observation: my Space Hulk tiles all started to warp a little after about a year or so. It's nothing awful, just kind of a gentle arc to some pieces - but this is stored flat, in a box, in the dark. I would definitely be concerned about the long-term longevity of a cardboard terrain set like this.
This just seems like a swing and a miss from me, and I've gotten up on the previous Raging Heroes kickstarters, and I was happy with what I got from those.
Well, the project is safe since it already founded. Guess the short campaign with limited edition was a good call, after all. All rushed to secure their early bird pledge.
To me, this terrain is more suited to have an easy and awesome background for the occasionnal striking game, especially in clubs for conventions. It is indeed more intended to look impressive in height and could be interesting for big games with titans hiding behind the highest point of the cathedral itself.
The price is killing my envy, though I do have a big army of sisters of battle and that terrain would be just perfect for them. So far, what they're saying about posting costs isn't really encouraging. We're not that far from buying something equivalent in GW hard plastic gothic terrain.
Expected for June 2018...One year before expecting something to come, in something Raging Heroes never made before. Hm. That's a lot of unknown factors.
I still struggle (it would look cool on the pictures I could take with this...), but Reason is having quite strong arguments to win over Heart. Let's see what will be said in the next days.
Sarouan wrote: Expected for June 2018...One year before expecting something to come, in something Raging Heroes never made before. Hm. That's a lot of unknown factors.
I expect a lot of delays, and a lot of condescending posts about said the delays, but I am sure they will (eventually) ship exactly what they promise to, and it will look exactly like they promise it will. If you like the product and can stomach the price you definitely should buy in, I think, because I think they will definitely deliver. Eventually.
I don't know why, but the freebies just don't attract me.
If only they allowed to take separate towers, large entries, and so on, so that we can add more things that are really strong point of the project (tall impressive things!), that would be another matter.
So far, I really wonder if the best way is just take the 1$ pledge to access to the whole thing and add money later when they advance enough to the point of delivery/adding new things they didn't predict in the first place. Like the previous Kickstarters.
Because let's be honest, they will open something later for this one. I can totally see it coming.
Bumping this ancient thread (sorry) for a very important reason.
This KS is about to come to a close, as the deadline for paying for shipping is June 1st.
If you participated in this KS and have not paid for shipping, missing this deadline will mean missing out on your pledge.
From their last update:
In that case and if you are going through a special situation, please do not hesitate to contact our customer service at RagingHeroesTeam@gmail.com and we'll find a solution, no worries.
I had a fairly big pledge in for this project and ended up cancelling it before the campaign closed. I assumed it would be really late but I had no idea it hadn't been shipped yet!