Don't have much yet, just two shots from someones twitter, but looks like necrons vs. Salamanders(?)

The money shot as it were the other is just showing off an overlord.


Since we got the leak, I imagine we'll see more info on it in the next few days. The cards match the models shown, 4 warriors, 2 immortals, 1 lychguard and 1 overlord. The marine on the cover is in green armor, with a flamer and a lizard scale loin cloth, so salamanders seems confirmed. The cover also includes a wraith but we don't see a card for that, so i suspect we are only seeing a little of what's contained.

Looks like 40k Quest

Space Marines are a given, but them being Salamanders and not Ultramarines is actually a very cool thing. It doesn't appear to be something like Silver Tower where everything was new. This looks more like Hamerhall, using miniatures that are already in production. Do we know if the box has some "exclusive" miniature? Maybe a Salamander captain or something?

Picture is a little easier to make out if flipped sideways...

But to be honest the name is a little ... lame, isn't it? I don't know. Too simple. Something like "Doom in the Tomb-World" would have been cooler?

Well it is better than the concept name. "Box of stuff that isn't selling".

I kid..

I'd really like a silver tower for 40k.

I can tell from the shoulders that those are the same immortals that come in the immortals box (and they are one of the banes of my existence). However that's a five man sprue, and can be built into deathmarks. That makes me suspect that these aren't the models that come with it. Also a thought, labyrinths usually store c'tan shards, could we be getting a plastic C'Tan?

It seems that this was shown off at a toy fair. I was expecting this to be the gama announcement. That it is being previewed now suggests we will see it in March alongside the codex.
I suspect that this is the standalone game James Hewitt said he designed for GW after going freelance.
I am curious about the Salamanders. Could they be new sculpts?

Tiles...

 Galas wrote:
But to be honest the name is a little ... lame, isn't it? I don't know. Too simple. Something like "Doom in the Tomb-World" would have been cooler?

Tomb Doom

Doesn't really look like that large a box. It's definitely intriguing, that's for sure.

Cool! Looks like another "introduction to 40k" boxed game intended for big box stores.

Doom!b World?

Ultramarine logo in the bottom corner. Interesting.
Also,
Big Trouble in Tomb Town

In this very blurry picture there are some marine cards at the bottom and some coloured dice in the box on the right.

Another possible Deathwatch game?

I’d guess it’s more in line with lost patrol if those are existing models.

 Bulldogging wrote:
I'd really like a silver tower for 40k.

Let's be honest here, Silver Tower was the best Warhammer drinking game.

I would love to even see Silver Tower get a conversion to make it 40k Compatible.

I mean, the simple concept of "Get the model you like and do an adventure thing with it" was great.

But to be honest the name is a little ... lame, isn't it? I don't know. Too simple. Something like "Doom in the Tomb-World" would have been cooler?

I definitely agree, it's a really generic sounding name for a game. What next? "Craftworld of the Eldar"? "Military base of the Imperial Guard"?

If it's on part/similar mechanics to Execution Force, that would be good in my book. Really wish we knew more.

Anyone have a source for these pictures? If you look at the picture with the Overlord in the foreground, you can see some Necron models on the box in the top right corner...I hope that means it comes boxed with some new Necrons, despite the fact that the ones in the pictures are nothing new...

Kind of bummed it's just the normal necrons. This was a good chance to get some snap fit really unique models for them.

The gameplay is the thing so I am interested in seeing the rules. Before buying I would need to know the Necrons are playable and not just run by the board game's AI. Zero interest in another GW game where my choices are limited to SMs and sometimes Orks.

 Ghaz wrote:
Picture is a little easier to make out if flipped sideways...

Doesn't the top left one look like a Lychguard with board and sword?

Maybe this is a custom sprue after all (in metallic flake silver plastic?)

 Tokhuah wrote:
The gameplay is the thing so I am interested in seeing the rules. Before buying I would need to know the Necrons are playable and not just run by the board game's AI. Zero interest in another GW game where my choices are limited to SMs and sometimes Orks.

It's listed as co-op so chances are slim that the Necrons are playable, unfortunately. I'd certainly be completely on board if they were.

Judging by the cards shown and the dice in the lid, players take control of a Marine from one of the big chapters. So a Salamander, Blood Angel, Ultramarine and Imperial Fist at the very least.

Game lid says 2-5 players, so at least one other chapter or maybe that the last player takes control of the necrons. Purely speculation on my part on what's been shown so far though.

 ScarletRose wrote:

But to be honest the name is a little ... lame, isn't it? I don't know. Too simple. Something like "Doom in the Tomb-World" would have been cooler?

I definitely agree, it's a really generic sounding name for a game. What next? "Craftworld of the Eldar"? "Military base of the Imperial Guard"?

I dunno about the rest of you but I’d buy ‘Military Base of the Imperial Guard’

 Cat_astrophe wrote:
I dunno about the rest of you but I’d buy ‘Military Base of the Imperial Guard’

Knock yourself out. I'm waiting for "Slaanesh's House of Ill Repute".

Wonder if they'll be standard push-fit Primaris? I'd imagine so based on the blurry Blood Angel image?

 JohnnyHell wrote:
Wonder if they'll be standard push-fit Primaris? I'd imagine so based on the blurry Blood Angel image?

That was my first thought as well. But the Salamander(?) on the box cover is carrying a flamer and his armour doesn't match the Primaris style. With the Crons being there existing kits the Marines could be regular kits as well. So possibly non Primaris or a mix of the two types. I do wonder why GW didn't go for DW Marines though.

Best guess, it's going to be the Kill Team Cassius sprue and 1 sprue each of old Warriors / Immortals / Lychguard.

 lord_blackfang wrote:
Best guess, it's going to be the Kill Team Cassius sprue and 1 sprue each of old Warriors / Immortals / Lychguard.

Why would the Marine on the box have green armour, and the Blood Angel card show red armour then?

Would be odd if they'd go for regular Marines instead of Primaris, but hey...I'm not the one in charge there.

 Malika2 wrote:
Would be odd if they'd go for regular Marines instead of Primaris, but hey...I'm not the one in charge there.

Why? Contrary to internet-fearmongering, GW said time and again they'd continue to support non-Primaris Marines (if perhaps no longer as the No. 1 product in their catalog).

Moreover, a lot of 40K board games (even non-Heresy) tend to be "historical".

Space Hulk had Brother Calistarius, i.e. Mephiston long before he became Mephiston even in the pre-8th "current" timeline of 3rd to 7th Edition. Overkill had Cassius in the DW before he returned to the Ultramarines in the pre-8th "current" timeline of 3rd to 7th Edition, etc..

Looks interesting, does this confirm a rumour that was floating around on here from a while back?

I think the rumour had Necron vs [something?] Silver Tower style game. I'm not the sure [something] was supposed to be Marines though, or whether it was ever detailed.

Sunny Side Up wrote:

 Malika2 wrote:
Would be odd if they'd go for regular Marines instead of Primaris, but hey...I'm not the one in charge there.

Why? Contrary to internet-fearmongering, GW said time and again they'd continue to support non-Primaris Marines (if perhaps no longer as the No. 1 product in their catalog).

Moreover, a lot of 40K board games (even non-Heresy) tend to be "historical".

Space Hulk had Brother Calistarius, i.e. Mephiston long before he became Mephiston even in the pre-8th "current" timeline of 3rd to 7th Edition. Overkill had Cassius in the DW before he returned to the Ultramarines in the pre-8th "current" timeline of 3rd to 7th Edition, etc..

Hmm, maybe you're right in that regard. Perhaps such games are also a means of still pushing older miniatures. But at the same time I don't fully feel yet that GW is pushing the Primaris enough, especially since they're the next generation post boys.

To me either way is fine, already happy to see some Salamander green instead of the usual Ultramarines or Blood Angels.

An Ultramarine and Blood Angel are also present though.

Judging by the colour of the dice, there ar an Ultramarine, Blood Angel, Salamander, and an Imperial Fist.

 BrookM wrote:
Judging by the cards shown and the dice in the lid, players take control of a Marine from one of the big chapters. So a Salamander, Blood Angel, Ultramarine and Imperial Fist at the very least.

Game lid says 2-5 players, so at least one other chapter or maybe that the last player takes control of the necrons. Purely speculation on my part on what's been shown so far though.

I don't know, force of 2-5 marines seems way too small to take on Necrons shown so far, unless these are movie marines. Plus, bringing a flamer against Necrons seems daft. Though, I wonder this is the game where we will get the Cryptek model shown recently?

Also, look at marine's knee. Straight trim, that can be only Mk IV armour. I wonder where the 'squat marines are getting so squatted we're going to receive jack squat releases' scaremongering crowd is now?

It's a mini-game, they usually take liberties.

A fun spin on things and justification for four snowflakes working together would be that they've escaped or been set free (as a joke, cause that's how he rolls) from Trazyn's collection.

Hmmm, interesting. Looking like a re-worked and updated version of space crusade. I like.

 Galas wrote:
But to be honest the name is a little ... lame, isn't it? I don't know. Too simple. Something like "Doom in the Tomb-World" would have been cooler?

"Raiders of the lost tesseract arc"

"Raiders of the lost tesseract arc"

Necrons.. Why's it always gotta be Necrons?

I'm really interested in seeing what happens with this box. Even the fact that it might be a different chapter than the Smurfs.

Things like SW:A are really interesting to me. I like smaller, niche games so this looks right up my alley. Especially if it comes with a campaign.

Potentially a breach and clear of a tomb by a team of marines?

I can think of few things I'd be less interested in than Space Marines vs. Necrons...but interesting to see GW continuing to put out new games.

I also second the fact this should be called: Gloom of the Doom Tomb.

Dig the name, very 80s feel.
I'd love to see some unique Necron models, so I'm sad to see the same old models in the pictures.

GW should know by now that people buy many of these games because of the models. So unless the game is really fun I'll pass, even though Necrons are my main faction.

GoatboyBeta wrote:

 JohnnyHell wrote:
Wonder if they'll be standard push-fit Primaris? I'd imagine so based on the blurry Blood Angel image?

That was my first thought as well. But the Salamander(?) on the box cover is carrying a flamer and his armour doesn't match the Primaris style. With the Crons being there existing kits the Marines could be regular kits as well. So possibly non Primaris or a mix of the two types. I do wonder why GW didn't go for DW Marines though.

Because thats been done already (Overkill)

Im genuinely looking forward to this. I got to play DW:OK friday and I think its great. Loving the standalone games based in the 40k universe. I plan n using some of them in larger 40k campaigns with some alterations where needed

 Cmdr_Sune wrote:
Dig the name, very 80s feel.
I'd love to see some unique Necron models, so I'm sad to see the same old models in the pictures.

GW should know by now that people buy many of these games because of the models. So unless the game is really fun I'll pass, even though Necrons are my main faction.

I wouldn't have ever expected "unique" Necron models for something like this. Lost Patrol didn't have any, Gorechosen didn't have any--that's what this is meant to be from the looks of it.

What likely is happening in how there are single Lychguard and Immortal models is that it uses the digital sculpting concepts situated as a single frame.

Labyrinth of the Necrons...

Dark Crystal of the Dark Eldar

Neverending Story of the Harlequins

Howling Moving Castle of the Knights

All Cogs go to Heaven

Land of the Lost Imperial Guard

The Point of the Chaos Space Marines

I’m willing to bet the ‘Labyrinth’ bit is a subtitle. Which suggests this might be the first in a series?

And given the additional info on the box cover, maybe this is something for general release, rather than GW stores?

Totally random observation but the unit card for the immortal is carrying a tesla carbine rather than a gauss blaster. Rules for different loadouts possibly?

Dudeface wrote:
Totally random observation but the unit card for the immortal is carrying a tesla carbine rather than a gauss blaster. Rules for different loadouts possibly?

Wouldn't be surprising. The assassinorium game had cultists with either Autoguns or Autopistols and CCW.

 Irbis wrote:

 BrookM wrote:
Judging by the cards shown and the dice in the lid, players take control of a Marine from one of the big chapters. So a Salamander, Blood Angel, Ultramarine and Imperial Fist at the very least.

Game lid says 2-5 players, so at least one other chapter or maybe that the last player takes control of the necrons. Purely speculation on my part on what's been shown so far though.

I don't know, force of 2-5 marines seems way too small to take on Necrons shown so far, unless these are movie marines. Plus, bringing a flamer against Necrons seems daft. Though, I wonder this is the game where we will get the Cryptek model shown recently?

Also, look at marine's knee. Straight trim, that can be only Mk IV armour. I wonder where the 'squat marines are getting so squatted we're going to receive jack squat releases' scaremongering crowd is now?

Deathwatch Overkill did movie marines pretty nicely. You really had to concentrate on one to get them to take them down since they could recover the next turn in most cases.

Also: The Last Space Marine Crusade

Since it is 2-5 players it could mean that one person plays the Necrons in the same way the game master plays the villain side in Conan, The Others, and additional games that have been trending over the past few years. It would mean in a five player game either one person wins or four people win. Much more interesting than a SM dungeon crawl game. Another Space Hulk: Death Angel game with miniatures is boring...

Ya'll doin' it wrong.

It's Inquistor Jones and the Labryrinth of Doom.

Rootin' tootin' robot shootin' ,take control of your colorful mutn'

Move 'em down the scary hall, move just one or move them all.

Check the corners, roll dem dice - hope dem numbers will be nice.

But if they ain't, my colorful mutn' -- dem robots will be doing the shootin'

Bottom right marine sort of looking thing. What's the symbol?

That's the Blood Angel symbol.

A bunch of space marines trying to fight there way out of Trazyns labyrinth seems interesting. It also opens up the possibility of creature of the week style expansions, because for all we know Trazyn could have old ones in there, we know he has at least one primarch (A clone of fulgrim), and all sorts of samples from every known faction.

Where are these pics from and why there are no pics of the Marines?

When there were first rumours about this, I thought it would have been about Inquisitors and Necrons, but disappointingly it just seems to be Necrons and Marines, and based on the cover art, not even Primaris Marines... It seems unlikely that I'll be getting this box.

Blood angels and necrons are allies in the background, so it makes sense they are in the game

 Fenrir Kitsune wrote:
Blood angels and necrons are allies in the background, so it makes sense they are in the game

 Grimgold wrote:
Don't have much yet, just two shots from someones twitter, but looks like necrons vs. Salamanders(?)

The money shot as it were the other is just showing off an overlord.


Since we got the leak, I imagine we'll see more info on it in the next few days. The cards match the models shown, 4 warriors, 2 immortals, 1 lychguard and 1 overlord. The marine on the cover is in green armor, with a flamer and a lizard scale loin cloth, so salamanders seems confirmed. The cover also includes a wraith but we don't see a card for that, so i suspect we are only seeing a little of what's contained.

This is such a great news I can hardly believe it

I hope there is more than the one board section. Otherwise its not much of a labyrinth.

Theres only one board section, but you fold it over in a mobius strip...

 Galas wrote:

 Fenrir Kitsune wrote:
Blood angels and necrons are allies in the background, so it makes sense they are in the game

Spoiler:

No, it’s true. Was in one of campaign backgrounds, so there’s no reason why the two forces shouldn’t team up again.

 ThaneCawdor wrote:
Theres only one board section, but you fold it over in a mobius strip...

That's no labyrinth then. Hardly even registers as a maze...

ZebioLizard2 wrote:That's the Blood Angel symbol.

Oh it's on a shoulder pad! I just kept seeing an angry face.

Space Marine Adventures: Labyrinth of the Necrons

Space Marine Adventures: Labyrinth of the Necrons is a 2-5 player cooperative game coming from Games Workshop in 2018

https://twitter.com/BoardGameGeek/status/965340599116292097

Well, that looks pretty underwhelming.

Kevin Rountree, recovering the "Games" in the Workshop since 2016!

 Crimson wrote:
Well, that looks pretty underwhelming.

For us, wargamers in the short them, it is. For the community in general quite the contrary. How many people entered the hobby thanks to Space Hulk? Space Crusade? Warmasters?

Those are the space marine heroes minis from japan. This is an interesting way of bringing them to rest of the world.

I believe those are the Space Marine Heroes from the Japan only release. At least 5 of them possibly more since the sprues are still in the box.

Also NINJA'd

And more - "Open now" - a legacy style game possibly? That'd be cool. More likely a rough GM'd approach though.

That looks pretty freakin' cool, tbh! "Space Marine Adventures" . I'm hoping for more of these

Ok so assuming that pic shows the whole game contents it looks like there is one more Ultramarine still on the sprue, and two more board sections.

This actually does look pretty cool and the small board is actually drawing me in a lot. I too hope (assuming it is a fun game) that this is just part of a series of Space Marine Adventures.

If those where the space marines heroes line I'd be interested, but I don't think they are. The flamer guy has a helmet on instead of the bare head / gas mask on the heroes line.

Still if it's a full ten man squad of new mono pose marines I'd find a use for them pretty quick.

GoatboyBeta wrote:
Ok so assuming that pic shows the whole game contents it looks like there is one more Ultramarine still on the sprue, and two more board sections.

I doubt there are more than 5 figs (it says it’s a 5 player game). Not sure why it shows that but likely whoever set it up already had a fig (especially if it’s in Japan)

 Tamereth wrote:
If those where the space marines heroes line I'd be interested, but I don't think they are. The flamer guy has a helmet on instead of the bare head / gas mask on the heroes line.

Still if it's a full ten man squad of new mono pose marines I'd find a use for them pretty quick.

I think every model in the Heroes set has a helmet and bare head option on the sprue

Hmmmm... with the rumour I had really hoped it would be far more like Warhammer Quest, with all sorts of mixed heroes. But still, this would also provide a nice introductory Necron set for use in SW:A as well.. one thing that puzzles me though - is it a GW release proper, or a licensed product designed by an outside team? The usual GW and 40k branding/logos aren't visible as I would have expected.

 Tamereth wrote:
If those where the space marines heroes line I'd be interested, but I don't think they are. The flamer guy has a helmet on instead of the bare head / gas mask on the heroes line.

The Tale of Painters blog show the sprues for Brother-Sergeant Sevastus and Brother-Captain Brother-Captain Thassarius. They both have options for a helmeted or bare head.

http://taleofpainters.blogspot.com/2017/11/review-japan-exclusive-space-marine.html

And ninja'd. Sorry.

I'm all for this sort of stuff, especially if it's as affordable as the other mini-games they've released over the years.

And called it!

 Ssgt Carl wrote:

I doubt there are more than 5 figs (it says it’s a 5 player game). Not sure why it shows that but likely whoever set it up already had a fig (especially if it’s in Japan)

True that is odd. Possibly GW wanted to put an extra Marine in there so there is a bit more choice when you have a full set of players? Or it could be there to show how the kits will be packed in the box? Speaking of which there doesn't seem to be enough room in the box for the Necron kits. Is it possible that the displayed Crons are placeholders? I've been looking at the close up pics and I'm still unsure if they are silver plastic or painted silver.

The box and contents on display are prototypes, they usually have some sprues included to show off the contents as they are upon purchase.

I'm pretty sure those Necrons will be "easy to build" versions.

It is kinda lame that they just recycle these generic Ultramarine sculpts for characters of other chapters. That hairless Space Wolf looks particularly wrong.

Well sure, I guess one way to make the subtitle 'Labyrinth of the Necrons' look better is to make the main title 'Space Marine Adventures'..?

The age rating on this game is 8+ like battle for Vedros. Gw stuff is usually 12+ . This is clearly a product aimed at new players, hence the name featuring the two races involved. With several more space marine heroes not in the box and a series 2 coming to Japan, we could see more space marine adventures games in the future if this proves popular.

I am totally down with buying this, using the marines and selling the crons.

unless it's actually fun, but... prob not.

It'll be interesting if the 'Crons are Ezy-2-Build.

Sigh... the five SMs confirm it is just another GW game where you play a bunch of Imperium maggots slogging a conga line against foes, except instead of Alien they are fighting Terminator.

I have less than zero interest in this game and will tune out of the thread rather than busting out the flame thrower.

If there are 5 marines why isn't it 1-5 players if co-op or 2-6 if one player is the Necrons?

ecurtz wrote:
If there are 5 marines why isn't it 1-5 players if co-op or 2-6 if one player is the Necrons?

Many co-op board games are listed as two or more players even though you can play alone. Most of the time when playing alone you would take control of two or more characters, so, even though you are the only person playing, you are still acting as two or more players.

The marine in the box is Savastas, which is the blue guy on the board, so I guess they are showing us sprue and assembled for him. I don't think the necron figurines are part of that box, it looks like the game uses tokens for the Crons. I guess The necron minis are there for SnG, because the token colors match the card colors. Tile based with five boards of tiles. At a guess it's in the 50 buck range.

So, yeah looks like a cheaper version of lost patrol mixed with DW:OK.

You're saying the full game will use tokens for the adversaries?

Yikes...

That's what it looks like, as I said near the beginning I was skeptical that the immortals shown came in the box, because those immortals have two alternate options they can be built in (tesla and deathmark), and that seemed needlessly complex for a game of this style. I was hoping we would get new sprues, but instead it looks like they are giving us tokens. Not that you can't use your models if you have them.

I think the idea is to make the base game as cheap as possible, with probably most of the budget tied up in the tiles. Then they can add onto it with additional heroes, new tiles and new enemies.

Hmm. I wonder if there's a connection between this game and the Blitz Bowl game? A series of cheaper games to draw new players into the 'Games Workshop Hobby' and then onto games like Warhamer 40,000 and Blood Bowl and maybe some of the other games as well?

Maybe GW have a couple people working on more child friendly games aimed at the board game market or toy stores? Like it's a new initiative for sales parallel to their normal market?

 Chamberlain wrote:
Maybe GW have a couple people working on more child friendly games aimed at the board game market or toy stores? Like it's a new initiative for sales parallel to their normal market?

I think this is correct. With the younger age rating and coloured push fit plastic this and blitzbowl are products that are not really aimed at anyone who uses this forum.
Battle for vedros has not had a single mention on the community site. I wonder if these products will be more like that. Hence the lack of a community site article despite them being shown off publicly last weekend.

Chikout wrote:
Battle for vedros has not had a single mention on the community site.

GW hasn't posted on the Battle for Vedros Facebook page since early last May, so I think its safe to say that it's a dead product line.

You know, part of me hopes that in terms of game mechanics, this is actually fun to play.

I can toss out the models included and buy my own. While I could easily go and get Space Hulk, I still want a good 40k 'Space Marine' game. I did not enjoy Deathwatch: Overkill.

 Grimgold wrote:
That's what it looks like, as I said near the beginning I was skeptical that the immortals shown came in the box, because those immortals have two alternate options they can be built in (tesla and deathmark), and that seemed needlessly complex for a game of this style. I was hoping we would get new sprues, but instead it looks like they are giving us tokens. Not that you can't use your models if you have them.

I think the idea is to make the base game as cheap as possible, with probably most of the budget tied up in the tiles. Then they can add onto it with additional heroes, new tiles and new enemies.

It seems strange that they'd be showing the Necrons if the models weren't part of the game. Then again, those are some sketchy paint jobs and the Marines are in colored plastic. I hope this is just a concept photo and not meant for distribution.

 Adeptus Doritos wrote:
You know, part of me hopes that in terms of game mechanics, this is actually fun to play.

I can toss out the models included and buy my own. While I could easily go and get Space Hulk, I still want a good 40k 'Space Marine' game. I did not enjoy Deathwatch: Overkill.

Assassinorium is still fun (if easy with base rules) to our group, so a new similar one should be interesting enough.

Wow really cute game, too bad the enemies will be tokens.

 Manchu wrote:
Wow really cute game, too bad the enemies will be tokens.

Are we absolutely sure about that though? It could just be that their are blip tokens which are on the board until the marines enter visual range and then the baddies are shown with models.

It doesnt even look like the necrons would fit in the box to me.

It would seem odd to me that GW would set up a promo display with Necron models if they are just going to be tokens in game. But then looking at the sprue layout of the Necron kits it is hard to see how anything other than the Overlord would fit in the box. They could be placeholders for new Necron kits that GW doesn't want to show off yet. But they would have to be part of another Necron release as I cant see GW sculpting new kits just for a small game like this.

Well given how precious that box is, I'd be tempted to buy up some crons to use with it. So marketing startegy works?

Whoa!

Love it so far, just for looking so much like Space Crusade.

sorry to say but i will miss this box...only the Marines in the box with Counters for Necrons and that for such a price ? No Way. You see all items from the box in that one picture and there are the Necron counters on the right side. 5 Marines (Ultramarines Sgt, Salamanders Flame Thrower, Imperial Fist Heavy Bolter, Blood Angels Tactical (with Auspex maybe Lt. ?), Space Wolf with Bolter.

I very much doubt the Necron models would be tokens - that would hurt GW's image by having paper chits instead of models.

I could see it having "blips", as the tiles look very Space Hulkish as it is with 1-square wide corridors. Does make me wonder if it will be compatible with Space Hulk...

I'd certainly like a boardgame-like game, but I don't know, I've got enough models from both factions and my fear is the rules are of the sort that they were written on a napkin, like so many in the past. This just feels...like the same sort of releases like Kerunch and Lost Patrol.

GoatboyBeta wrote:
It would seem odd to me that GW would set up a promo display with Necron models if they are just going to be tokens in game. But then looking at the sprue layout of the Necron kits it is hard to see how anything other than the Overlord would fit in the box. They could be placeholders for new Necron kits that GW doesn't want to show off yet. But they would have to be part of another Necron release as I cant see GW sculpting new kits just for a small game like this.

Maybe new E2B Immortals? I would be all over that...

And if you look close to the cards of the marines and compare them to the heroes that are released to Japan you see that they are those miniatures but made in a different colour so it fits the game (Made in England ;-) )...so its a clever recyling and you get 5 of the Marines that you normally get out of the Heroes Box that is only available in Japan...

Maybe we get a second game for the other 5 Marines :-))

Looks very interesting

Regarding the tokens, have you ever played Space Crusade? This has no correlation to wether there are Necron models in the game. Chances are very high there will be anyway of course. This is a Games Workshop product. And like with Gangs of Commoragh they seem to include already available models, allowing the game to be priced more moderately.

I'm very interested in the gameplay and mechanics. We still play Space Crusade occassionaly. Modernized mechanics would be good. Can't wait to read some reviews.

 ShortyPreds wrote:
sorry to say but i will miss this box...only the Marines in the box with Counters for Necrons and that for such a price ?

Are you a Time Lord, to be posting from the future? No price has been announced yet (or even an official announcement that it's even coming out. )

My understanding is that this is the only way GW can release the exclusive Japanese Space Marine Heroes outside of Japan.

There was a bit of an outcry that the minis could only be bought from Japan and GW wanted the rest of the world to be able to buy them but the terms of the deal meant they had to be re-boxed and sold as part of a game (no idea why but that's the rumour I heard).

So effectively this a way to buy the Space Marine Heroes minis and you get a free game chucked in... This also suggests there will be a second game to complete the set?

I assume that the Necrons aren't controlled by a player - so you can play solo just by controlling all the Marines. Same with Execution Force and plenty of other board games.

That could also be a reason for why the Necrons are represented by counters (if that is indeed the case); to visually distinguish the players' pieces from the rest of the game.

Isn't the series made up of twelve or so miniatures though?

But yeah, I can see them do more of these self-contained games involving a band of power armoured snowflakes in unique settings like the Space Hulk of the Orks, Temple of the Chaos Cultists, Webway of the Eldar or Sphincter of the Hive Mind.

Given that the game is Space Marine Adventures: Labyrinth of the Necrons, I bet there's at least one more in the series planned.

I wonder how well these tiles will go alongside the ones from Necromunda?

They should have no Problems because of the brand "Space Marine Adventures" to bring more short games like this one...like you said still missing the rest of the Japan Collect Marines...and dont forget they are ready for Wave 2 in Japan ;-)...so maybe we will see a Terminator in a future Adventure.

 BrookM wrote:
Isn't the series made up of twelve or so miniatures though?

Thirteen, even, Japan also did promo Captain in Mk8 power armour, who is so far literally the only SM officer (barring Artemis in modified Mk8) having one. So, yeah...

I miss the days of HeroQuest. Maybe this is a toe-dip in the waters to see if people would play a 40k version of say Silver Tower?

Saying that I really need to pick up Silver Tower.

Interesting! I approve, though Necrons and marines are not that interesting to me - but I'd play it.

If it includes the necrons I'll give it a go, but if it is 5 marines vs tokens it's a bit of a bust.

Who is the source of the information there won't be Necron models in it? Manchu? Did he talk to GW at the toy fair? Space Crusade and Space Hulk features radar blip tokens and also uses models when SM get LoS to them. Why would this be different? Seeing the Necron models on the side of the box set and following the conversations on Twitter where two of these photos came from there is nothing indicating the contents shown at the Toy Fair are not the actual content of the game. If there is information saying otherwise someone please provide a link.

It is interesting (and seems to me to indicate no necron models) that the necron cards feature art while the Marine cards have photos of the figs. The necron cards I see also have some warrior cards and only on immortal card

Yeah we can see the slot where the sprues go. We can see the Necron tokens on that sheet. We can see that the entire board seemingly consists of that one tile.

Box look too small to hold any more sprue beside the marine, after you put the cardboard on top of it.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Yeah we can see the slot where the sprues go. We can see the Necron tokens on that sheet. We can see that the entire board seemingly consists of that one tile.

Except you can see other tiles with the same edge design as the board underneath the token sheet at the bottom-right of the picture.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Yeah we can see the slot where the sprues go. We can see the Necron tokens on that sheet. We can see that the entire board seemingly consists of that one tile.

I would have though a tile-ophile like yourself would have better tile pattern recognition than that HBMC.

Underneath the token card and poking out the top I see at least two more tiles with similar "wall" illustrations.

edit: well I got ninja'd by quite a while...

The "Open Now" side of the box has the same space as the space marines, which could fit the necrons in.

How big are the necron sprues?

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2018/02/19/new-games-new-york/

Have these games, and similar ones from GW, been any good?

Despite it not having Necron models, I am kind of interested in it.

 Ghaz wrote:

Spoiler:

Well, it does look like the Necrons are just tiles. Of course, chances are they'll stick a box of Necrons near the game as an 'expansion'.

Baffling that this is 'Regular Marine' and not Deathwatch...

It reminds me of assassionorium lookwise, and that one's plenty good for a few off games now and then.

No way they make easy to build necrons for this

 Adeptus Doritos wrote:

 Ghaz wrote:

Spoiler:

Well, it does look like the Necrons are just tiles. Of course, chances are they'll stick a box of Necrons near the game as an 'expansion'.

Baffling that this is 'Regular Marine' and not Deathwatch...

Not that baffling when it's really a way to use the pre existing space marine heroes line.

Looks like a great introduction for kids.

Vorian wrote:
Not that baffling when it's really a way to use the pre existing space marine heroes line.

Looks like a great introduction for kids.

Well, hopefully I can swap some shoulderpads out, at least.

If it's priced low enough it's a nice easy way to get people into 40k like Space Crusade was for me.

 Adeptus Doritos wrote:

Vorian wrote:
Not that baffling when it's really a way to use the pre existing space marine heroes line.

Looks like a great introduction for kids.

Well, hopefully I can swap some shoulderpads out, at least.

From the look of a quick Google, I don't think so. Easy enough to use other similarly armed DW models if it suits the game better for you though.

Vorian wrote:
From the look of a quick Google, I don't think so. Easy enough to use other similarly armed DW models if it suits the game better for you though.

Oh, no I was going to use them to add into my other Space Marines. Having no insignia at all would be great.

I was going to bring in other Deathwatch Marines to this game, if it was worth playing.

Obviously there is nothing official, but anybody know how much this is likely to be? Have GW done anything similar before?

I'm trying to start up a lunch time games thing at work, this and the mini blood bowl might be ideal.

It is sad that it looks like just tiles, but if the price is decent...

Heh. "if the price is decent".

Herbington wrote:
Obviously there is nothing official, but anybody know how much this is likely to be? Have GW done anything similar before?

It'll probably be about $50.00, just a guess. That one gladiator game for AoS (I forget the name) was about the same price and came with 4 models and a bit less cardboard.

 Adeptus Doritos wrote:

Herbington wrote:
Obviously there is nothing official, but anybody know how much this is likely to be? Have GW done anything similar before?

It'll probably be about $50.00, just a guess. That one gladiator game for AoS (I forget the name) was about the same price and came with 4 models and a bit less cardboard.

Yeah gorechosen, which was fun but kind of a dead end. 50$ is my guess as well.

This game has very low content like Lost Patrol and therefore it is miles away from the likes of Space Hulk or Deathwatch. I won´t be buying this one.

 Strg Alt wrote:
This game has very low content like Lost Patrol and therefore it is miles away from the likes of Space Hulk or Deathwatch. I won´t be buying this one.

Are you an eight-year-old tugging on daddy’s sleeve in the generic toy store? No? Then no loss.

Looks like the community site has confirmed that the Necrons will just be markers. Well, there goes my enthusiasm.

 Mr_Rose wrote:

 Strg Alt wrote:
This game has very low content like Lost Patrol and therefore it is miles away from the likes of Space Hulk or Deathwatch. I won´t be buying this one.

Are you an eight-year-old tugging on daddy’s sleeve in the generic toy store? No? Then no loss.

Eight-year-olds as target group? Jesus Christ!

 EnTyme wrote:
Looks like the community site has confirmed that the Necrons will just be markers. Well, there goes my enthusiasm.

It's clearly a preview of what necrons will be like in 8th ed. On the bright side, getting cover saves denying LoS will be much easier

Warhams-77 wrote:
Who is the source of the information there won't be Necron models in it? Manchu?

Nope, just speculation from earlier in the thread. I just said it'd be too bad if there were no Necron models in the box but I still might buy it.

 Strg Alt wrote:

 Mr_Rose wrote:

 Strg Alt wrote:
This game has very low content like Lost Patrol and therefore it is miles away from the likes of Space Hulk or Deathwatch. I won´t be buying this one.

Are you an eight-year-old tugging on daddy’s sleeve in the generic toy store? No? Then no loss.

Eight-year-olds as target group? Jesus Christ!

Uh...yeah? Did you read the Community article? It's explicitly designed as a gateway product for kids. That's why they're previewing it at a toy fair.

Rather, making it more readily available in gaming stores across the US and Canada.

 ProtoClone wrote:
Have these games, and similar ones from GW, been any good?

Despite it not having Necron models, I am kind of interested in it.

Silver Tower is poorly balanced but fun with a little house ruling.

Assassinorum whatever has poor replay value but is nice every now and then: good mechanics, no variety.

Lost Patrol is horribly, terribly, unplayably poorly balanced unless you like games where one side is handicapped hard. Which sucks, since its first edition was fine.

Space Hulk is a classic.

The Betrayal at Calth game is actually amazing and doesn’t deserve to be discarded as though it was the ballast keeping your box of shiny new MkIV marines from flying away in the breeze.

Gorechosen is a lot of fun, and well worth the money (especially when considering the individual model's costs), and hopefully this follows suit. The Bloodbowl- lite has me curious too, especially if it ends up allowing all the current teams to be played.

At least White Dwarf attempted to spice up the rules for some of these releases such as Lost Patrol with unit variety, and Assassin Execution Force had rules for fighting summonable Daemons as well.

If GW toss a few articles in the mag to expand upon these, seems cool to me. Having games aimed at kids is great for precisely just that- getting kids interested in this stuff again!

 Mr_Rose wrote:
The Betrayal at Calth game is actually amazing and doesn’t deserve to be discarded as though it was the ballast keeping your box of shiny new MkIV marines from flying away in the breeze.

Yep. And sadly, I wish they would have had more games aside from that one and Prospero.

 Strg Alt wrote:
Eight-year-olds as target group? Jesus Christ!

And what's the problem with that, again?

I was playing Talisman around 10-11, this game looks much simpler than that...

 Irbis wrote:

 Strg Alt wrote:
Eight-year-olds as target group? Jesus Christ!

And what's the problem with that, again?

I was playing Talisman around 10-11, this game looks much simpler than that...

Yeah, i love when there are games with minis that i can easily play with my nephews or younger cousins! they're really getting into the age where they want to mess around with rules and more structured things, so that's where i'm more hopeful with this.

Looks like yet another "Direct To Garbage Can" GW board game, as a vehicle to simply get less expensive models. I just dont see why people would want these specific models. Pretty wild they are targeting 8 year olds considering 40k has always been an early teenager game due to the price, assembly and painting aspect (Not to mention rules that lawyers can barely decipher)

 Adeptus Doritos wrote:

 Mr_Rose wrote:
The Betrayal at Calth game is actually amazing and doesn’t deserve to be discarded as though it was the ballast keeping your box of shiny new MkIV marines from flying away in the breeze.

Yep. And sadly, I wish they would have had more games aside from that one and Prospero.

Well there's always potential for that in the future. I'm hoping for some plastic Mk5 dudes myself...

 Kirasu wrote:
Looks like yet another "Direct To Garbage Can" GW board game, as a vehicle to simply get less expensive models. I just dont see why people would want these specific models. Pretty wild they are targeting 8 year olds considering 40k has always been an early teenager game due to the price, assembly and painting aspect (Not to mention rules that lawyers can barely decipher)

Remember that this, and the Blood Bowl Blitz game (or whatever it's called) previewed at a Toy Fair.

To me these seem like the kinds of things that go out to regular toy stores, rather than GWs (or as well as GWs, at the very least). A bit like the simple build'n' paint Marine/Ork sets from the year before last.

As much as a lot of us would want a fully realised corridor-based Necron v Marines board game filled with endless amounts of high quality themed tiles... *mind wanders off* wait, where was I... oh yes, as much as we'd want a game like that there's nothing really wrong with GW's current approach.

If we could look at a thread from the future, we might see a bunch of thirty year olds saying "yeah Space Marine Adventures was very simple but Labyrinth of the Necrons got me into 40k as a kid and here I still am playing 16th Edition."

 Manchu wrote:
If we could look at a thread from the future, we might see a bunch of thirty year olds saying "yeah Space Marine Adventures was very simple but Labyrinth of the Necrons got me into 40k as a kid and here I still am playing 16th Edition."

this guy gets it. beyond the game and plastic, GW's most valuable asset is their Intellectual Property. The more kids who learn what a "Necron" is, the more consumers are ready for the blockbuster 40k movies (yes this will happen).

 Manchu wrote:
If we could look at a thread from the future, we might see a bunch of thirty year olds saying "yeah Space Marine Adventures was very simple but Labyrinth of the Necrons got me into 40k as a kid and here I still am playing 16th Edition."

And I can honestly sit here and say what got me into Warhammer/40k was Hero Quest.

I didn't read through all six pages so hopefully I'm not repeatin this... anyone notice the marines are the Japanese space marine hero figures, just in multiple colors instead of just blue?

Looks like the space marine heroes line will be released in the usa in a different way.

Game looks cool, I'm in for a space marine dungeon crawl

 Adeptus Doritos wrote:

 Manchu wrote:
If we could look at a thread from the future, we might see a bunch of thirty year olds saying "yeah Space Marine Adventures was very simple but Labyrinth of the Necrons got me into 40k as a kid and here I still am playing 16th Edition."

And I can honestly sit here and say what got me into Warhammer/40k was Hero Quest.

Heroquest was a complex and creative game tho where players routinely designed entire campaigns. It got me into a lot of these games as well but very few games since have managed to replicate that feeling. Descent was okay but so clunky.

THis look ultra crappy, but I guess it might be useful to get new players into the game.

Stil, as Kirasu said I doubt it has enough complexity to hook new players up (like HQ did for so many of us)

Based closer examination of one of the pictures, one can make out "Do Not Open" on the three red/white packs of cards.

See the first picture....
http://mezmaronslair.blogspot.com/2018/02/games-workshop-announces-space-marine.html

Attached is a closeup...

Might this indicate a more complicated campaign approach, or even a legacy-style game mechanic?

Mez

Good eye! That sounds like it could be a neat twist.

Look like one of those Risk pack where it add some random event and modifier.

Yes, much like Risk: Legacy, or even Pandemic: Legacy.

This would have to be much more simple however, but it would still make it more fun.

One thing I don't understand is the 1-4 players, although there are 5 miniatures.... Anyone have ideas on that?

 Mezmaron wrote:
.

One thing I don't understand is the 1-4 players, although there are 5 miniatures.... Anyone have ideas on that?

The box says 2-5. Perhaps the community site simply erred.

The big pack says open now. This could be a legacy system or it could be like Shadespire where they have prebuilt decks to start then add the deck building mechanic later.
My oldest son is 6 now. A game like this looks like an ideal introduction to Warhammer. If it hits a £20 or £30 price point, I will probably pick it up.

 Kirasu wrote:

 Adeptus Doritos wrote:

 Manchu wrote:
If we could look at a thread from the future, we might see a bunch of thirty year olds saying "yeah Space Marine Adventures was very simple but Labyrinth of the Necrons got me into 40k as a kid and here I still am playing 16th Edition."

And I can honestly sit here and say what got me into Warhammer/40k was Hero Quest.

Heroquest was a complex and creative game tho where players routinely designed entire campaigns. It got me into a lot of these games as well but very few games since have managed to replicate that feeling. Descent was okay but so clunky.

Heroquest was simple. 99.9% of people will have played the book and nothing more. It was for ages 10+ and I was playing it around 8 years old.

Vorian wrote:

 Kirasu wrote:

 Adeptus Doritos wrote:

 Manchu wrote:
If we could look at a thread from the future, we might see a bunch of thirty year olds saying "yeah Space Marine Adventures was very simple but Labyrinth of the Necrons got me into 40k as a kid and here I still am playing 16th Edition."

And I can honestly sit here and say what got me into Warhammer/40k was Hero Quest.

Heroquest was a complex and creative game tho where players routinely designed entire campaigns. It got me into a lot of these games as well but very few games since have managed to replicate that feeling. Descent was okay but so clunky.

Heroquest was simple. 99.9% of people will have played the book and nothing more. It was for ages 10+ and I was playing it around 8 years old.

I still have mine, along with the likes of Space Fleet (a dumbed down version of Battlefleet Gothic), Lost Patrol (the re-released version) and Advanced Space Crusade (missed getting a copy of Space Crusade). I've also bought the various Horus Heresy and Deathwatch:Overkill game - some of them without the miniatures, so I could have the game itself.

However, this looks to me like a hard pass for me - unless it manages to come in under $20. What really kills it for me is that it doesn't come with necron minis - that just leaves me faberglasted. All I can say is, this isn't the old GW we know, I couldn't imagine them passing up a chance to put minis into the box in the past. The minis were always the drivers before ... could they be actually focusing on the gameplay this time around?

Some more news from Toy Fair

https://icv2.com/articles/news/view/39672/space-marine-adventures-blitz-bowl

'SPACE MARINE ADVENTURES' AND 'BLITZ BOWL'

Upcoming Games Workshop Boxed Games

Posted by Nicole Bunge on February 19, 2018 @ 6:05 pm CT


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At New York Toy Fair, Games Workshop unveiled two new introductory games to familiarize players to the Games Workshop settings and worlds. Both games are self-contained sets which are playable right out of the box. Both games will release later this year.

Space Marine Adventures is for 1 – 4 players who attempt to break into the Necron labyrinth. Each character plays a unique Space Marine with special skills, which is represented by a miniature assembled from easy-build kits. An easy introduction into the 41st Millennium, the game is sutible for players 8 and up.



Blitz Bowl is set in the Blood Bowl arena, playing similarly, but with smaller teams and faster actions. The skirmish games take place in the Crush recruitment rituals as each player tries to prove their worth in the eyes of Nuffle, their patron deity.

 Kirasu wrote:

 Adeptus Doritos wrote:

 Manchu wrote:
If we could look at a thread from the future, we might see a bunch of thirty year olds saying "yeah Space Marine Adventures was very simple but Labyrinth of the Necrons got me into 40k as a kid and here I still am playing 16th Edition."

And I can honestly sit here and say what got me into Warhammer/40k was Hero Quest.

Heroquest was a complex and creative game tho where players routinely designed entire campaigns. It got me into a lot of these games as well but very few games since have managed to replicate that feeling. Descent was okay but so clunky.

This:

I could see getting this for my 10 year old nephew. Not understanding people failing to grasp the "young audience, intro game" nature of this product.

 Adeptus Doritos wrote:

 Ghaz wrote:

Spoiler:

Well, it does look like the Necrons are just tiles. Of course, chances are they'll stick a box of Necrons near the game as an 'expansion'.

Baffling that this is 'Regular Marine' and not Deathwatch...

Like Space Crusade, each playing piece is coloured differently to make them stand apart from each other. So, make those colours the Chapter colours, and add a bit of setting flavour to the colour choices.

As for the enemies being tokens, it looks like you might draw them randomly from the bag, which is a little hard to do with miniatures.

I was just about to say that this reminds me of Space Crusade, but you beat me to it. I find it interesting that GW is going the old boxed stand alone games route again. Titanicus, Space Marine Adventures, etc. All kinds of smaller games of fun. I am happy to see it personally.

This and Blitz Bowl remind me of the old "box lid games" from the early 90s; Kerrunch (simple Blood Bowl), Ultramarines (simple Space Hulk, but with rival squads of Scouts rather than Terminators vs Genestealers) and Mighty Warriors (simple Advanced Heroquest - no, not the same thing as Heroquest!). This time round, they're not using the box lid as a hit/miss matrix.

Just bring back Bommerz Over Da Sulphur River!

 Bulldogging wrote:
I'd really like a silver tower for 40k.

Right!? That'd be a license to print money, imo...

Maybe it's just me, but I think that the Space Marines in the Labyrinth of the Necrons game might be using the molds from the Space Marine Heroes collection out of Japan.

I believe you are correct.

 RiTides wrote:

 Bulldogging wrote:
I'd really like a silver tower for 40k.

Right!? That'd be a license to print money, imo...

Would that not just be a reprinting of Space Crusade?

No, Space Crusade wasn't really a dungeon crawl. Each player had an entire squad of space marines to command and it played a little bit more like Space Hulk than it did something like Hero Quest or Silver Tower (although it was more forgiving of screw-ups on the SM side, being a kids game).

I too would love a 40k Warhammer Quest like game (I'd prefer a bit more campaign/character advancement stuff in it than Silver Tower had, but that sort of thing), perhaps centred around an Inquisitor and his retinue (or a Rogue Trader and crew going on space adventures).

When Deathwatch: Overkill came out, I thought it was going to be the 40K version of Silver Tower. In fact, I think it could still be done - primarily changing the enemies (Chaos, Necrons, Dark Eldar, etc.). Could even do non-marine heroes too (An Admech Dominus + Skitarri guards, A sister of Battle, Slybo and/or the Last Chancers, even Xeno "allies" - an Eldar Aspect Warrior, an Ork Nob, maybe a reprogrammed Necron Immortal...)

 Zethnar wrote:
No, Space Crusade wasn't really a dungeon crawl. Each player had an entire squad of space marines to command and it played a little bit more like Space Hulk than it did something like Hero Quest or Silver Tower (although it was more forgiving of screw-ups on the SM side, being a kids game).

I too would love a 40k Warhammer Quest like game (I'd prefer a bit more campaign/character advancement stuff in it than Silver Tower had, but that sort of thing), perhaps centred around an Inquisitor and his retinue (or a Rogue Trader and crew going on space adventures).

Space Crusade was more forgiving of screw-ups on the SM side? Well, we must played different games then. This game was pure hell for the SM side would better describe the situation on the board. Here are some points off the top of my head:

1. There was a time limit for the SM represented by a random events card deck. A lot of these events were very detrimental for the Astartes (Booby trap, Genestealer Ambush, etc.).

2. Clever positioning of the blips made sure that the Invaders could attack first. This is very bad for the SM grunts (see 2 & 3).

3. Armour did NOT protect in close combat. I know it sounds weird but this was a fact. The combatant who scored higher won the fight and the loser lost an amount of wounds which was equal to the difference of the respective rolls (e.g: Attacker rolls 4, Defender rolls 1; Defender loses 3 wounds).

4. A squad consisted of four SM grunts (each with 1 wound) & a Sergeant (six wounds). Needless to say, the grunts always died in droves. Why? Well, see point 3. Orks & Gretchin would just assault them in close combat and hope for the best because their ranged attack sucked vs. power armour.

5. There were also reinforcements blips in some missions. This meant even more adversaries to kill. Did the SM get any boni against these odds? Nope! What a slaughter.

6. The Chaos Dreadnought. Jesus Christ, this thing was just brutal. Just imagine Ed-209 (robot from Robocop) on dope. Apart from twin-linked bolters it also had two heavy weapons. You cannot imagine the carnage this thing was capable of. Just deploy it right from the start against the SM player who was less suited to combat it effectively and your chances are very high to wipe out all the grunts in a single turn.

Ed-209 in action:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A9l9wxGFl4k


Did I enjoy this game? It was great and the video game had an awesome soundtrack.

Soundtrack:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dt8gwTho6Ag


The only gripe were the low chances for success, if you were not from the Blood Angels chapter. Their Sergeant had the only tools for reliable survival in each mission (Force Field: Armour 3; Bionic Arm: reroll one dice in close combat). ALWAYS equip him with power sword & power glove and he would wreck face. Also pick a melta bomb to destroy the Dreadnought in close combat.
The Sgt. of the Imperial Fists on the other hand would always die because he lacked any sort of defensive gear. And the Sgt. was crucial to the game. This guy always had to survive each mission in order to get promoted. Promotions meant that the squad would get more equipment cards and more order cards in the future.
Meanwhile equipping a Sgt. with the heavy bolter at the start of a mission was akin to a death sentence. He just couldn´t defend himself in melee properly from all those close combat attacks hurled his way.



Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Stormonu wrote:
When Deathwatch: Overkill came out, I thought it was going to be the 40K version of Silver Tower. In fact, I think it could still be done - primarily changing the enemies (Chaos, Necrons, Dark Eldar, etc.). Could even do non-marine heroes too (An Admech Dominus + Skitarri guards, A sister of Battle, Slybo and/or the Last Chancers, even Xeno "allies" - an Eldar Aspect Warrior, an Ork Nob, maybe a reprogrammed Necron Immortal...)

The factor which makes Deathwatch enjoyable is that SM can fight two times in one turn, have two wounds and can even heal themselves by forfeiting an opprtunity for atttack. This makes them durable as they are portrayed in the fluff. Other imperial models would also need these rules for survival but that would infringe upon superhuman SM territory. So, human imperials would just suck. You would need the likes of Assassins or special characters (e.g.: Sly Marbo) for these Deathwatch missions.
Though other enemies would be a nice change to the gameplay but I don´t think the game system can support a lot of different cannon fodder units like gretchin, chaos cultist, etc. They would all end up with more or less the same statline. And Chaos Marines? They should only be armed with bolters and not with any sort of heavy weapon otherwise it would be too tough for the SM.

You must have been a better Alien player than I was. I found that inflicting damage on Marines was too difficult, and that having three Marine players co-ordinating their actions was too difficult for me to deal with. I couldn’t get enough attacks on Marines to hurt them. Except for one game where I simply put most of the blips in a single board section.

 AndrewGPaul wrote:
You must have been a better Alien player than I was. I found that inflicting damage on Marines was too difficult, and that having three Marine players co-ordinating their actions was too difficult for me to deal with. I couldn’t get enough attacks on Marines to hurt them. Except for one game where I simply put most of the blips in a single board section.

The road to success as an Alien player was to concentrate your attacks on one SM chapter at a time. It´s like in 40K. Just unload all your guns on one unit and destroy it. Then pick another enemy unit. Rinse & repeat.

A lot of Alien players just used their Orks & Gretchins in a wrong way. NEVER shoot SM grunts because the odds are not in your favour. You basically have to roll a 10+ on two D6 (Ranged Firepower: Two white attack dice) to kill an Astartes. Just circumvent their power armour by attacking them in cc (see my previous post).

If you were up against three SM chapters, attack the Imperial Fists first and just put one blip or even none for the other players to kill. The placement of your blips is also crucial. Never put them in the first room. Put them in the second room or let them wait in a hallway but out of LOS. Remember, you want to strike first. Imperial Fists with suspensored heavy weapons are very dangerous to all of your minions. Also pay attention to the orders that were picked by the SM players. These could screw you over.

The main advantage of the Fists were their Suspensors attached to their heavy weapons (Movement: 6). Kill these yellow grunts in the first or the second turn with the Chaos Dreadnought and swarm the Sgt. with the rest of your blips. This is not only a valid tactic from a gameplay perspective but also terrifies the other two players on a psychologically level as they can only watch helplessly in horror as their fellow brothers are annihilated in a quick and brutal fashion. When the Fists are finished choose the next squad for eradication...

The Chaos Dreadnought is only susceptible to heavy weapons and a Sgt. with power glove & power sword. It´s armour value of 4 is just so intimidating. How will it survive? Just kill the grunts with heavy weapons first, and attack the Sergeants without proper melee gear in cc.
But how do you deal with this nasty Blood Angel Leader? He is such a monster in melee. Well, just use a Blood Bowl tactic here. The answer is stalling. First, the BA Sgt. can only kill one invader at a time. With all of his grunts dead this is very bad news for him. Just choke the hallway or room in which he is standing with Gretchins & Orks and shoot him. Your chances of hurting him are very slim but this not your goal. You are just creating a quagmire in which he cannot escape. And now let the turns pass away. While you do this, you are becoming stronger because you are drawing a random event card per turn. And now even Gretchins and Orks can become dangerous with cards like Gretchin Bomber or Ork Mek (both two red ranged attack dice). If the random event deck is empty and the Sgt. doesn´t make it to his boarding ship, he is considered dead.

 Strg Alt wrote:

 Zethnar wrote:
No, Space Crusade wasn't really a dungeon crawl. Each player had an entire squad of space marines to command and it played a little bit more like Space Hulk than it did something like Hero Quest or Silver Tower (although it was more forgiving of screw-ups on the SM side, being a kids game).

I too would love a 40k Warhammer Quest like game (I'd prefer a bit more campaign/character advancement stuff in it than Silver Tower had, but that sort of thing), perhaps centred around an Inquisitor and his retinue (or a Rogue Trader and crew going on space adventures).

Space Crusade was more forgiving of screw-ups on the SM side? Well, we must played different games then.

To tell the truth I played it as a kid against other kids. I don't remember it being overly frustrating as a space marine, but I remember losing all the time as the alien player. I also remember everyone wanting to play as the Imperial Fists because they had the suspensors which let you move further with your heavy weapons. I guess it may be a very different game playing it as an adult.

 Strg Alt wrote:


The factor which makes Deathwatch enjoyable is that SM can fight two times in one turn, have two wounds and can even heal themselves by forfeiting an opprtunity for atttack. This makes them durable as they are portrayed in the fluff. Other imperial models would also need these rules for survival but that would infringe upon superhuman SM territory. So, human imperials would just suck. You would need the likes of Assassins or special characters (e.g.: Sly Marbo) for these Deathwatch missions.
Though other enemies would be a nice change to the gameplay but I don´t think the game system can support a lot of different cannon fodder units like gretchin, chaos cultist, etc. They would all end up with more or less the same statline. And Chaos Marines? They should only be armed with bolters and not with any sort of heavy weapon otherwise it would be too tough for the SM.

They did a prequel mission for Overkill, with an Inquisitor and some Kappic eagles (stormtroopers) - rules are up on the Community site
Stormtroopers still get two turns, but only have one wound.

 Zethnar wrote:

 Strg Alt wrote:

 Zethnar wrote:
No, Space Crusade wasn't really a dungeon crawl. Each player had an entire squad of space marines to command and it played a little bit more like Space Hulk than it did something like Hero Quest or Silver Tower (although it was more forgiving of screw-ups on the SM side, being a kids game).

I too would love a 40k Warhammer Quest like game (I'd prefer a bit more campaign/character advancement stuff in it than Silver Tower had, but that sort of thing), perhaps centred around an Inquisitor and his retinue (or a Rogue Trader and crew going on space adventures).

Space Crusade was more forgiving of screw-ups on the SM side? Well, we must played different games then.

To tell the truth I played it as a kid against other kids. I don't remember it being overly frustrating as a space marine, but I remember losing all the time as the alien player. I also remember everyone wanting to play as the Imperial Fists because they had the suspensors which let you move further with your heavy weapons. I guess it may be a very different game playing it as an adult.

Back in the day I was also a teenager playing this boardgame but you also had to play the videogame to become really proficient at it. There the AI would teach you a harsh lesson each mission you tried to accomplish. Just a few or even one bad dice roll could screw you over. It´s the same with Blood Bowl. If you are only playing against humans, your skill level will not increase significantly due to time constraints which lead to just a few games in a month. On the other hand, you can play against the AI several times at home on an evening and you learn much more.

I presented Blood Bowl yesterday to a young couple in a sort of gaming club which can be frequented once per month without attached costs. Both played Humans. They have never played a GW boardgame before. On the 7th turn the girl scored a TD and her boyfriend conceded the game because in his opinion the game was too difficult to understand. He also claimed that he was not interested in sport games at all. Then why did he chose to play Blood Bowl, you might be asking? I responded that you just need more practice to become good at it and thought that his ego was bruised because he was dominated by his girlfriend in these seven turns.

Up to this point she had lost one player due to a foul and severely injured three players (well, to be precise one of them tripped while sprinting and suffered a serious concussion). I acted as a referee and repeated the three steps to a successful turn over and over. Blood Bowl is not rocket science after all:

Step 1: Move all your players that are NOT in an opponent´s tackle zone in favoured positions. This means screening a ball on the pitch from the oppostion, preparing two dice blocks by the use of assists, barring the way for the opposition or screening your future ball receiver with another player. In a nutshell: Activate players for actions for which you do not have to roll a dice. Blood Bowl is a game about positioning your players and less about senseless mayhem.

Step 2: Perform actions with a high success rate. This would mean two dice blocks or even three dice blocks. After that do rolls on 2+ or even rolls on 3+ but you should have a reroll on hand. Also one dice blocks with a Block skill fall in this category.

Step 3: Perform risky moves or do nothing. Fouls fall in this category and all other actions with a lower chance of success than the ones described above. This always depends on the actual situation on the field. You have to evaluate here risk with the potential reward.

Did the guy listen to me? Nope! The majority of his turns ended quickly because of a turnover and he got frustrated by it. His following turns started with enraged one dice Blitz attempts and he also did two very stupid things:
First, he fouled with a Blitzer without any assists. I advised against it and told him to use a Lineman or even do something different because the chances of penetrating the armour is just too slim. But he fouled anyway, did nothing, was sent off the pitch and his turn ended. This was his first action of his turn...
The second blunder was about ball control. With a lot of luck, he acquired the ball from the opposition, threw it and received it without any disposable rerolls. And now he stretched his luck too far. He was in a very comfortable position but chose to sprint. Well, the player in question tripped of course and suffered a serious concussion for his efforts.
His opponent picked up the ball, performed a hand-off and scored the TD.

She on the other hand heeded my advice and performed her turn in these three steps. She only had to end one of her seven turns prematurely because of an unsuccessful block attempt.

What do I want to say with this? You have to play a game several times to find out how it functions and to avoid making less optimal moves.