I think these might be new First Company Primaris - perhaps it's just me, but that looks like a white company roundel on the tank to me, and white shoulder pads on the lieutenant.
Insane Ivan wrote: EDIT: cropped a pic from the vid. Nice pose. Funny to see GW taking the piss out of their own Lieutenant Addiction.
This looks 100% like Reiver Lt, has the mask, single pad, and knife.
I bet on him having zero access to any actual melee weapons and some random, garbage, uninspired special rule with so little impact no one will remember it
I think it looks like a smaller vehicle overall, probably the primaris equivalent of a rhino to the Repulsor's Land Raider.
Scouty dreadnought seems...I dunno, like the design space for dreadnoughts has been cartoonishly oversaturated for multiple editions now. We've literally got dozens of different dreadnought models. Boy oh boy I wonder what variation on standard marine-class weaponry and draednought statlines this one could have!?!?!?!
Then it looks like full kit boxes for Bolter Wielding Power Armor Squad #128283821812y9694619827361089261 and Primaris Scout Sniper Replacement Guys.
My hopes now all rest that the insulted and enraged design studio rep now heads back and destroys all the plans for future space marines and instead devotes the design studio to pure xenos for a few years
Overread wrote: My hopes now all rest that the insulted and enraged design studio rep now heads back and destroys all the plans for future space marines and instead devotes the design studio to pure xenos for a few years
Sounds better than it actually is .How many Kommandos in Primaris Lieutenant getup could you possibly need?
Hanskrampf wrote: Redemptor seems to have a twin-autocannon.
Reiver Lt was already in Shadowspear, so this is just another one with slightly different weapons?
No the lieutenant in shadowspear didn't had a combat knife...
This looks to me to be the complete Vanguard line. So new infils on left, a new character, new las snipers, a lighter transport and a lighter dread/suit (who hopefully can deepstrike).
Hanskrampf wrote: Redemptor seems to have a twin-autocannon.
Reiver Lt was already in Shadowspear, so this is just another one with slightly different weapons?
No the lieutenant in shadowspear didn't had a combat knife...
Hanskrampf wrote: Redemptor seems to have a twin-autocannon.
Reiver Lt was already in Shadowspear, so this is just another one with slightly different weapons?
No the lieutenant in shadowspear didn't had a combat knife...
Yeah, so... slightly different weapon.
Not really?
The Lieutenant from Shadowspear had the "knife fighter" rule and it raised a lot of eyebrows at the time as the Lt had more pointing towards him being a "sniper" styled infiltrator with the Occulus Bolt-Carbine granting him the ability to ignore Cover Saves.
godardc wrote: Doesn't look like a rhino, at all.
The same cutting edges and flanks and nose as a Land Raider or repulsor.
Was going to say this. Thing looks like a Repulsor with a new front plate in place of the hull mounted weapon. Furthermore, I'm not convinced that's actually a turret. Looks more like a communication dish to me.
Hanskrampf wrote: Redemptor seems to have a twin-autocannon.
Reiver Lt was already in Shadowspear, so this is just another one with slightly different weapons?
No the lieutenant in shadowspear didn't had a combat knife...
Yeah, so... slightly different weapon.
"Slightly" different in that he had a different knife, different rifle (and can't take pistols unlike Reivers), no access to their grenades, hooks, or skull mask.
So, had literally nothing in common with Reivers save for similar ability to deep strike. How is that "Reiver" lieutenant, again?
"Slightly" different in that he had a different knife, different rifle (and can't take pistols unlike Reivers), no access to their grenades, hooks, or skull mask.
So, had literally nothing in common with Reivers save for similar ability to deep strike. How is that "Reiver" lieutenant, again?
He has phobos armour, grav-chutes and sucks in close combat. Just like the Reivers.
So it looks like a Primaris Rhino/Razerback equivalent and a Primaris Dread Knight to my eye. Looking forward to better pictures of the cool new toys to paint up, but not to a SM codex that's nearly as big as the main 40k rule book
If they could just get around to releasing the Imperial/Crimson Fists upgrade sprue* that was including in the xmas Imperial Fists Battleforce box that would be great.
*ideally with the fist logo the right way around this time
The dread is interesting in that it kind of looks to me like there's a whole space marine sat in it, rather than just a bit of one in a sarcophagos.
The other stuff I really don't know. That appears to be another repulsor variant but maybe it's something else entirely. Maybe it's a transport for infiltrators, since the rest of this release looks like it's vanguard-type people. It's definitely a skimmer-type thing with a lot in common with the repulsor, but it seems slightly smaller. Not sure if it's a new sprue like the executioner or a whole new tank.
This does mean I'm probably not going out to buy three Repulsor Executioners this weekend. Probably for the best all round.
"Slightly" different in that he had a different knife, different rifle (and can't take pistols unlike Reivers), no access to their grenades, hooks, or skull mask.
So, had literally nothing in common with Reivers save for similar ability to deep strike. How is that "Reiver" lieutenant, again?
He has phobos armour, grav-chutes and sucks in close combat. Just like the Reivers.
Lord Damocles wrote: The parody doesn't work when GWactually keeps releasing Primaris Luitenant after Primaris Luitenant.
In fairness they've basicly stopped since they started getting in on the joke too. yes there was a new Primaris Lt released with shadowspear but he was differant eneugh to be a legit needed mini. really the only extranous primaris Lt to come out was the one in wake the dead.
What bothered me about the advert for these ridic new primaris weenies, is the text presuming these to be everyone's favs. Who is this "everyone"?
it seems to me that the intention is to either turn everyone into a home printing rules writer, or to turn everyone who ever did favour space marines to turn to chaos as the new cawliferous mechification of glory turns everyone's favorite, space marines, into drooling man children named Bifficus Rey (after the much beloved SW character).
jeff white wrote: What bothered me about the advert for these ridic new primaris weenies, is the text presuming these to be everyone's favs. Who is this "everyone"?
it seems to me that the intention is to either turn everyone into a home printing rules writer, or to turn everyone who ever did favour space marines to turn to chaos as the new cawliferous mechification of glory turns everyone's favorite, space marines, into drooling man children named Bifficus Rey (after the much beloved SW character).
Thoughts?
I liked old loyalists and I like Primaris, so I dont know what you're on about.
I also like Chaos Marines (well not really playing them anymore, but I like them).
jeff white wrote: What bothered me about the advert for these ridic new primaris weenies, is the text presuming these to be everyone's favs. Who is this "everyone"?
it seems to me that the intention is to either turn everyone into a home printing rules writer, or to turn everyone who ever did favour space marines to turn to chaos as the new cawliferous mechification of glory turns everyone's favorite, space marines, into drooling man children named Bifficus Rey (after the much beloved SW character).
Thoughts?
They're aimed at people who like Space Marines but want their models to actually look good.
Lord Damocles wrote: The parody doesn't work when GWactually keeps releasing Primaris Luitenant after Primaris Luitenant.
In fairness they've basicly stopped since they started getting in on the joke too. yes there was a new Primaris Lt released with shadowspear but he was differant eneugh to be a legit needed mini. really the only extranous primaris Lt to come out was the one in wake the dead.
And in fairness, the whining about Lieutenants was ridiculous to begin with.
There were two in Dark Imperium(the core starter set). Each one was set up differently.
Fast forward to the Dark Angels and Blood Angels releases, where each one got a single Lieutenant model as part of their releases--which otherwise was fairly unimpressive, just an upgrade frame for Primaris reboxed with vanilla stuff.
Then came Tooth and Claw with the Battle Leader, releasing as part of the whole thing for the Space Wolves.
And then Wake the Dead, which brought out the first 'vanilla' Marine Lieutenant that was available outside of Dark Imperium--and was clearly intended to be an Ultramarine.
Lastly we've had Shadowspear's Phobos Lieutenant, which was a fairly radical divergence as was(IMO) the Space Wolf variant.
We've had two promo ones, I think, but one isn't available outside of UK/Europe and the other is an event exclusive so don't really count.
And in fairness, the whining about Lieutenants was ridiculous to begin with.
There were two in Dark Imperium(the core starter set). Each one was set up differently. Fast forward to the Dark Angels and Blood Angels releases, where each one got a single Lieutenant model as part of their releases--which otherwise was fairly unimpressive, just an upgrade frame for Primaris reboxed with vanilla stuff. Then came Tooth and Claw with the Battle Leader, releasing as part of the whole thing for the Space Wolves. And then Wake the Dead, which brought out the first 'vanilla' Marine Lieutenant that was available outside of Dark Imperium--and was clearly intended to be an Ultramarine. Lastly we've had Shadowspear's Phobos Lieutenant, which was a fairly radical divergence as was(IMO) the Space Wolf variant.
We've had two promo ones, I think, but one isn't available outside of UK/Europe and the other is an event exclusive so don't really count.
I love this. I LOVE THIS! We got a whole message telling us “The Primaris Lt thing was overblown, there was only 10 different minis for the same model in the most recent 40k army!” Do you even look at how many different minis there are for other armies' models?
I love this. I LOVE THIS!
We got a whole message telling us “The Primaris Lt thing was overblown, there was only 10 different minis for the same model in the most recent 40k army!”
Do you even look at how many different minis there are for other armies' models?
Blood Angels, Dark Angels, and Space Wolves are considered different armies to Vanilla Space Marines.
Ultramarines aren't Raven Guard, Iron Hands, White Scars, or Imperial Fists either.
So there are 3 different models(the two Dark Imperium and the Phobos LT from Shadowspear), shared across 4 armies(Dark Angels, Blood Angels, Space Wolves, and Vanilla Marines).
And then there's 4 different models across 4 armies that share the same title but are made up specifically in that faction's aesthetics.
And then there's a few promo models that:
A) Not everyone has access to
B) No interest in because, spoiler, they're done up in the Ultramarines style again.
I remember the old days when the blurry soon to be C&D'ed pics of upcoming models were posted by the community and not gw. It's so much better to laugh with GW rather than at them.
Hybrid Son Of Oxayotl wrote: I love this. I LOVE THIS!
We got a whole message telling us “The Primaris Lt thing was overblown, there was only 10 different minis for the same model in the most recent 40k army!”
Do you even look at how many different minis there are for other armies' models?
Maybe you should look in the mirror then look at say Death Guard (more character models than Space Marines got in five armies in three years, in a single release, and it's about to be doubled with japanese boxes), Cults (ditto, including doubles of characters they already had), Chaos (including some random mooks no one uses, not vital HQsSM really need), Nurgle (as big offender as DG), or recent pile of other Chaos Daemons, or even more recent Gobbos, then you will realize how ridiculous SM whine sounds when literally every single army released in last 3 years got more, and often quite extraneous models. All while SM still have massive gaps in their line (no ancients or gravis HQs outside of old starter box for one), and that's just models that already have rules. The problem goes much deeper than that (still no melee HQs for primaris of any sort, or deep strikers, or access to any guns besides basic bolters, etc etc), frankly, if anyone got dumb, superfluous models that wasted release time recently it was not SM, sorry
Ultimately this is a good-natured mini-preview of some upcoming Primaris releases framed with some self-deprecating humour about the amount of Primaris Lt's they've put out and how that became a meme.
Kanluwen wrote: And in fairness, the whining about Lieutenants was ridiculous to begin with.
It wasn't whining, it was ridicule. And it was funny. The fact that you saw it as an attack on precious vulnerable GW isn't a surprise.
This video barely helped me at all. I have been working on a Primaris only army for a while now, and I only have one Primaris Lieutenant (the Shadowspear one). I need to up my PrimeLT game as the kids are callin' it. I count on the Primaris Lieutenant Daily (been watching since episode 314) so someday I wouldn't be a 1 PrimeLT scrub.
Finally, Wade Pryce gets a guy on that says he makes Primaris Lieutenants, and all that guy wants to do is talk about dreadnoughts and snipers like not fielding an entire army of PrimeLTs isn't the way to win all of 40k and life. It gets worse as the guy barely talks any PrimeLT before storming out of there.
You know what? I bet that guy doesn't even make Primaris Lieutenants. Probably said he does so he could talk about his dumb tanks, dreadnoughts and snipers on the Daily. Whatever. I know I am eagerly awaiting episode #724!
Looks like a riever styled LT, a new repulsor vehicle (not many guns so likely transport or specialist vehicle), the alluded to new snipers which we know from Apoc can take las fusils, and a stripped down redemptor dread (which strangely looks like the suits from Avatar).
Looks like a riever styled LT, a new repulsor vehicle (not many guns so likely transport or specialist vehicle), the alluded to new snipers which we know from Apoc can take las fusils, and a stripped down redemptor dread (which strangely looks like the suits from Avatar).
the suits from avatar where hardly unique to avatar though.the basic exoarmor is a pretty common sci-fi thingy.
I am thinking Eliminators(with the added option if Las Fusils) and Infiltrators(probably with alternate versions of the Bolt Carbine) will be regular parts-built kits. The Transport looks like it just has the weapon on the top like a Razorback. Those side projections are likely the booster engines like what are in the back with the Repulsor. I don't really see this as being a gunboat. It offers something the Repulsor does not. If it was a straight up weapon system, it would be somewhat invalidating the Repulsor. I bet it will only be able to carry Phobos and no Gravis or Fly units.
I REALLY hope that Dreadnought can infiltrate and has the No Deep Strike rule like the Phobos Captain and the Infiltrators do. It would even cooler if those huge antennas made it an even bigger radius.
Depending on what the Las Fusils can do, I will probably be getting two 3-man squads of the Eliminators. They will likely replace my Lascannon Devastators (sad day, they have been in my army since the very beginning). I am probably going to get two or three Hover Rhinos. If that Dread prevents deep strike, he will probably have a place in my army.
There is one other model in the one image that looks like it could be a character. He has a cloak or coat and maybe a tabard. Though it might just be a regular release of the Phobos Captain. The shape lines up.
even if the dread doesn't deep strike if it has a large radius of deep strike prevention it'll be handy as heck. put it in your back gunline and just be immune to deep strike!
BrianDavion wrote: even if the dread doesn't deep strike if it has a large radius of deep strike prevention it'll be handy as heck. put it in your back gunline and just be immune to deep strike!
Yeah, that is true. Even then, it might be quicker than the standard Dread (like Contemptor speed at 9"), you could still rush it up the board turn 1 and block deep strikers from getting into the middle of the board. Regardless, if it has that deep strike blocking ability, with the base size of a Dreadnought, there isn't a dang thing getting in my backfield.
I wonder how much they will cost, as it is along with what role the units will be.
Will they have mortars? Will they be more useless HQ choices? Any Close combat squads or are we getting more shooty units that don't fit the aesthetic of 40k?
Will we finally see how a primaris chapter organizes itself?
What will the new transport have that distinguishes itself from the repulsor?
Will the new primaris come in and finally help with the close combat problem that primaris have desperately needed?
Or will we get a new heavy support choice with a minigun?
I hope that vehicle is a new, cheaper transport. Looks like a stripped back Repulsor which I'd be down with as long as it costs less points. And the dread looks like it could be cool.
Keen to see the proper reveal which I hope is soon.
Tiberius501 wrote: I hope that vehicle is a new, cheaper transport. Looks like a stripped back Repulsor which I'd be down with as long as it costs less points. And the dread looks like it could be cool.
Keen to see the proper reveal which I hope is soon.
The chunks sticking out from the sides are definitely NOT sponsons. The view from the picture with the hands definitely shows they are not weapons. They have flat fronts, no weapon barrels or missiles. My guess is they are the boosters like what the Repulsor has in the back. So the idea that this is a stripped down transport is pretty well on the money.
Awesome I want to keep expanding my crimson fists, currently painting a second repulsor and then I'll buying the executioner looks like I need this new stuff too and I still have a fair bit of shadowspear to paint....
Tiberius501 wrote: I hope that vehicle is a new, cheaper transport. Looks like a stripped back Repulsor which I'd be down with as long as it costs less points. And the dread looks like it could be cool.
Keen to see the proper reveal which I hope is soon.
The chunks sticking out from the sides are definitely NOT sponsons. The view from the picture with the hands definitely shows they are not weapons. They have flat fronts, no weapon barrels or missiles. My guess is they are the boosters like what the Repulsor has in the back. So the idea that this is a stripped down transport is pretty well on the money.
Another idea it might be, and I'm not saying I LIKE this idea, is some sort of scout vehicle. if those things are the side are jet boosters, it's a bit odd given it presuambly blocks the side doors. and it does apper to have something on top, maybe a sensor dish. so we're looking at a lighter faster version, whose parts suggest it's not optimzied for infantry carry. (although I bet it'll be capable of carrying an infantry squad) given it's release along side the vanguard, I could definatly see this being a light scout tank, sort of a space marine Salamander.
Tiberius501 wrote: I hope that vehicle is a new, cheaper transport. Looks like a stripped back Repulsor which I'd be down with as long as it costs less points. And the dread looks like it could be cool.
Keen to see the proper reveal which I hope is soon.
The chunks sticking out from the sides are definitely NOT sponsons. The view from the picture with the hands definitely shows they are not weapons. They have flat fronts, no weapon barrels or missiles. My guess is they are the boosters like what the Repulsor has in the back. So the idea that this is a stripped down transport is pretty well on the money.
Another idea it might be, and I'm not saying I LIKE this idea, is some sort of scout vehicle. if those things are the side are jet boosters, it's a bit odd given it presuambly blocks the side doors. and it does apper to have something on top, maybe a sensor dish. so we're looking at a lighter faster version, whose parts suggest it's not optimzied for infantry carry. (although I bet it'll be capable of carrying an infantry squad) given it's release along side the vanguard, I could definatly see this being a light scout tank, sort of a space marine Salamander.
Yeah, they did a good job obscuring anything that can tell us what this thing actually can do. There are some round sections on the sides toward the front that might be some sort of door, but that would be really bizarre and out of place for a Space Marine vehicle. I see the thing you are thinking might be a radar dish on the top toward the front. I almost think that might be a pintle Gunner though. There is some sort of turret toward the back though, so this thing probably won't be lugging around ten Marines. Probably more of a Razorback type capacity.
Tiberius501 wrote: I hope that vehicle is a new, cheaper transport. Looks like a stripped back Repulsor which I'd be down with as long as it costs less points. And the dread looks like it could be cool.
Keen to see the proper reveal which I hope is soon.
The chunks sticking out from the sides are definitely NOT sponsons. The view from the picture with the hands definitely shows they are not weapons. They have flat fronts, no weapon barrels or missiles. My guess is they are the boosters like what the Repulsor has in the back. So the idea that this is a stripped down transport is pretty well on the money.
Another idea it might be, and I'm not saying I LIKE this idea, is some sort of scout vehicle. if those things are the side are jet boosters, it's a bit odd given it presuambly blocks the side doors. and it does apper to have something on top, maybe a sensor dish. so we're looking at a lighter faster version, whose parts suggest it's not optimzied for infantry carry. (although I bet it'll be capable of carrying an infantry squad) given it's release along side the vanguard, I could definatly see this being a light scout tank, sort of a space marine Salamander.
Yeah, they did a good job obscuring anything that can tell us what this thing actually can do. There are some round sections on the sides toward the front that might be some sort of door, but that would be really bizarre and out of place for a Space Marine vehicle. I see the thing you are thinking might be a radar dish on the top toward the front. I almost think that might be a pintle Gunner though. There is some sort of turret toward the back though, so this thing probably won't be lugging around ten Marines. Probably more of a Razorback type capacity.
hard to tell really, there's really a number of options it could be we really need a better shot of it to make better guesses. course when we finally see it GW'll tell us what it is exactly so..
It doesn't make speculating and seeing other people's theories any less fun though.
The Dreadnought and the Tank are what I am most interested in. The Las Fusils are probably Str 8, AP-3, d3 or d6 damage based on their Apocalypse stats. So Eliminators don't really intrigue me.
In the non blurry pic with the hands it looks like the "dread" might have a cockpit/canopy. I think it might actually be a scout Walker rather than a dread.
SeanDrake wrote: In the non blurry pic with the hands it looks like the "dread" might have a cockpit/canopy. I think it might actually be a scout Walker rather than a dread.
SeanDrake wrote: In the non blurry pic with the hands it looks like the "dread" might have a cockpit/canopy. I think it might actually be a scout Walker rather than a dread.
It has way to much of the regular Dreadnought's profile, but it certainly would work.
for the record I think it's a dread because they specificly said when the Redemptor came out that it was going to basicly the the first of a new line of dreads based off it I seem to recall them saying
Uhh... kinda, yeah? TBH I'm just salty that I can't actually buy half these minis. I also wish they'd make some chapter specific characters, but that might changed with the IH guy.
yeah I'm hoping they put the space wolf and "ultramarines" one out in independant blisterpacks.
kinda sucks that the only Lts you can walk down to a local game shop and buy are for the blood angels and dark angels.
I agree that’s what it looks like. There seems to be a whole marine sat in there, not just a bit of one.
It looks like this is the full release for the shadowspear stuff, minus the suppressors. That kind of makes sense as they aren’t in Phobos armour, I guess.
Maybe primaris will be released in themed groups a bit like the stormcast were. I think Vanguard is even the name given to the sneaky versions of both forces. So first we got the basic intercessors, who are a lot like liberators. Now we get the sneaky guys. In future we might get a bunch of heavy shooty ones, or some choppy melee types - or whatever. Maybe they’ll stick rigidly to the formula and we’ll get a bunch of holy female marines next... wait!
Mandragola wrote: I agree that’s what it looks like. There seems to be a whole marine sat in there, not just a bit of one.
It looks like this is the full release for the shadowspear stuff, minus the suppressors. That kind of makes sense as they aren’t in Phobos armour, I guess.
Maybe primaris will be released in themed groups a bit like the stormcast were. I think Vanguard is even the name given to the sneaky versions of both forces. So first we got the basic intercessors, who are a lot like liberators. Now we get the sneaky guys. In future we might get a bunch of heavy shooty ones, or some choppy melee types - or whatever. Maybe they’ll stick rigidly to the formula and we’ll get a bunch of holy female marines next... wait!
Given the no primaris Grey Knights comments from GW I believe there will be a chamber of specialist psyker/anti-psyker primaris marines either before or after the chamber of heavy armoured/weaponry primaris and whatever the next chamber of stormcast are.
Primaris do seem to be designed around the same layout of sigmarines which Is a little ironic given they were created to be fantasy marines but now the marines are being copied from the sigmarines.
SeanDrake wrote: Given the no primaris Grey Knights comments from GW I believe there will be a chamber of specialist psyker/anti-psyker primaris marines either before or after the chamber of heavy armoured/weaponry primaris and whatever the next chamber of stormcast are.
Obviously we'll get anti-pysker Primaris when the Silent King returns and unleashes the Necronquake.
SeanDrake wrote: Primaris do seem to be designed around the same layout of sigmarines which Is a little ironic given they were created to be fantasy marines but now the marines are being copied from the sigmarines.
Eh, I guess if you want to see it, you'll see it. What modern Marines and Sigmarines have in common is that they are the designated hero faction that carries the setting and as such need to fill every conceivable battlefield role so as to allow every last potential customer to tailor their (Sig)Marine army to their exact preferences. There's no way to have meaningful distinction of two miniature lines if both build on the exact same design principle.
SeanDrake wrote: Given the no primaris Grey Knights comments from GW I believe there will be a chamber of specialist psyker/anti-psyker primaris marines either before or after the chamber of heavy armoured/weaponry primaris and whatever the next chamber of stormcast are.
Obviously we'll get anti-pysker Primaris when the Silent King returns and unleashes the Necronquake.
SeanDrake wrote: Primaris do seem to be designed around the same layout of sigmarines which Is a little ironic given they were created to be fantasy marines but now the marines are being copied from the sigmarines.
Eh, I guess if you want to see it, you'll see it. What modern Marines and Sigmarines have in common is that they are the designated hero faction that carries the setting and as such need to fill every conceivable battlefield role so as to allow every last potential customer to tailor their (Sig)Marine army to their exact preferences. There's no way to have meaningful distinction of two miniature lines if both build on the exact same design principle.
Don't tease me. Necrons need a new book and we need our big boy Silent King to come back. Give us Robot Guilliman dammit.
Saw someone mention on instagram that episode 723 could be alluding to the 23rd of July as a release/preorder date. Wonder if there is any truth to that.
Tyranid Horde wrote: Saw someone mention on instagram that episode 723 could be alluding to the 23rd of July as a release/preorder date. Wonder if there is any truth to that.
Tyranid Horde wrote: Saw someone mention on instagram that episode 723 could be alluding to the 23rd of July as a release/preorder date. Wonder if there is any truth to that.
Almost certainly not. It's just a joke. GW isn't going to start releasing stuff on Tuesdays.
This could well be one of the occasional far ahead forecasts that GW does. We're seeing models previewed weeks or months before they land nowadays - e.g. with the Repulsor Executioner. I'd love for these models to be out in two weeks but there's no proof that's the case, sadly.
Tyranid Horde wrote: Saw someone mention on instagram that episode 723 could be alluding to the 23rd of July as a release/preorder date. Wonder if there is any truth to that.
July 23rd is a Tuesday...
Ah, the archetypal Marine release day.
It'll be interesting to see. AoS open day is on the 20th and the first opportunity to play Warcry. If that's the preorder date for it, too, we'll have one week between Chaos Knights and that. Else Marines will be after, and we don't know if Warcry will occupy just one week or more.
Tyranid Horde wrote: Saw someone mention on instagram that episode 723 could be alluding to the 23rd of July as a release/preorder date. Wonder if there is any truth to that.
Almost certainly not. It's just a joke. GW isn't going to start releasing stuff on Tuesdays.
This could well be one of the occasional far ahead forecasts that GW does. We're seeing models previewed weeks or months before they land nowadays - e.g. with the Repulsor Executioner. I'd love for these models to be out in two weeks but there's no proof that's the case, sadly.
It could be 723 days after July 17, 2017 (8th Edition release date). Or maybe 723 days after the current Codex: Space Marines codex was released (which was like two weeks after that, if I remember right). Or literally just a random number they tossed out.
Maybe primaris will be released in themed groups a bit like the stormcast were. I think Vanguard is even the name given to the sneaky versions of both forces. So first we got the basic intercessors, who are a lot like liberators. Now we get the sneaky guys. In future we might get a bunch of heavy shooty ones, or some choppy melee types - or whatever. Maybe they’ll stick rigidly to the formula and we’ll get a bunch of holy female marines next... wait!
That was stated basically by Jervis in his interview. The next wave will be heavier support based on Gravis armour.
As an additional thought, I don't believe the dudes on the left are infiltrators, they don't have any projections from the top of their backacks. So maybe a new unit entirely or reivers/infils with different weapons/options?
Maybe not the date for pre order as those are always Saturdays but most likely the announcement date. Pre order that Saturday or the week after potentially.
Anyone heard about the "Silver Templars" supplement rumored? It's supposedly an all-Primaris Chapter. I've seen some 'leaked' photos of the book, but can't seem to find them again
MistaGav wrote: Maybe not the date for pre order as those are always Saturdays but most likely the announcement date. Pre order that Saturday or the week after potentially.
What's likely happening is that it's an announcement for a revamped Marines book that won't be up for preorder for a bit. We know there's an Iron Hands character coming, we know there's stuff coming for Vanguard, and I wouldn't be shocked to see another Gravis kit.
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Galef wrote: Anyone heard about the "Silver Templars" supplement rumored? It's supposedly an all-Primaris Chapter. I've seen some 'leaked' photos of the book, but can't seem to find them again
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There's no "leak". It's from the Warhammer 40,000: Conquest stuff over in UK/EU and apparently now Australia. Here's the pictures I could find:
Galef wrote: Anyone heard about the "Silver Templars" supplement rumored? It's supposedly an all-Primaris Chapter. I've seen some 'leaked' photos of the book, but can't seem to find them again
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That's the conquest Supplement right? Came with the latest delivery in the UK.
Jadenim wrote: Always worth remembering that we Brits don’t write our dates like that.
We do it properly!
As much as I accustomed to the Month/Day/Year format, I will admit I do like the Day/Month/Year format better. It just flows better.
Same goes for the metric system. It just makes more sense. No idea why we Americans do things the way we do sometimes
Jadenim wrote: Always worth remembering that we Brits don’t write our dates like that.
We do it properly!
What's the 23rd month?
The premise behind the speculation, currently, is simply that they wanted to make a joke work alongside of a little "easter egg" for something to come. Since July 20th is the Age of Sigmar Open Day, them starting a teaser campaign for a new 'phase' of the whole Primaris thing wouldn't be out of the question on the 23rd.
Yeah yeah yeah, Brits write things D/M/Y...but that's what makes the easter egg work. If they'd written it as episode 237, we'd likely be having the same discussion with people talking about how "we Brits write our dates like that"
Jadenim wrote: Always worth remembering that we Brits don’t write our dates like that.
We do it properly!
But the man running the show pronounces lieutenant properly. To go full blown conspiracy theorist on this, that may be a hint he's not using the British dating system.
Jadenim wrote: Always worth remembering that we Brits don’t write our dates like that.
We do it properly!
But the man running the show pronounces lieutenant properly. To go full blown conspiracy theorist on this, that may be a hint he's not using the British dating system.
or it might just be a joke on how it's oft mispronounced thanks to American pop culture being everywhere. I can't speak for the British experiance, but in Canada we offically pronounce it leftenant but lootenant is more commonly used by civilians simply because we get our info from TV which is all American programming for the most part.
Kanluwen wrote: Blood Angels, Dark Angels, and Space Wolves are considered different armies to Vanilla Space Marines.
Ultramarines aren't Raven Guard, Iron Hands, White Scars, or Imperial Fists either
.
are space marines
Kanluwen wrote: B) No interest in because, spoiler, they're done up in the Ultramarines style again.
are space marines
Irbis wrote: Maybe you should look in the mirror then look at say Death Guard
are space marines ¯\_(ツ)_/¯.
Irbis wrote: Cults (ditto, including doubles of characters they already had)
Is “double” more than “decuple”? Someone help me with this, please!
Irbis wrote: All while SM still have massive gaps in their line
Ahah that's a good one, you are funny man!
“We only got the biggest range in the game by orders of magnitude!!! Massive gaps!”
JSG wrote: No article today so god knows when we'll actually see the new models.
The list of outstanding releases isn't that long. Out of the stuff previewed in May, IIRC we only have these to go:
Warcry
AoS Sylvaneth battletome
Elf Blood Bowl team
New Titanicus knights & cards
Necromunda Enforcers (confirmed as August)
Another Blackstone expansion
Many of the specialist games items could may even be covered in a single week. I'd expect to see the new marines by late August / early Sept barring any surprises.
Jadenim wrote: Always worth remembering that we Brits don’t write our dates like that.
We do it properly!
But the man running the show pronounces lieutenant properly. To go full blown conspiracy theorist on this, that may be a hint he's not using the British dating system.
or it might just be a joke on how it's oft mispronounced thanks to American pop culture being everywhere. I can't speak for the British experiance, but in Canada we offically pronounce it leftenant but lootenant is more commonly used by civilians simply because we get our info from TV which is all American programming for the most part.
Weird, when I had joint training with the Canadian Army, the Lieutenants were referred to Lieutenants not Leftenants. Though by that time I was already a Captain, so maybe I just wasn't listening to it when it was said.
Jadenim wrote: Always worth remembering that we Brits don’t write our dates like that.
We do it properly!
But the man running the show pronounces lieutenant properly. To go full blown conspiracy theorist on this, that may be a hint he's not using the British dating system.
or it might just be a joke on how it's oft mispronounced thanks to American pop culture being everywhere. I can't speak for the British experiance, but in Canada we offically pronounce it leftenant but lootenant is more commonly used by civilians simply because we get our info from TV which is all American programming for the most part.
Weird, when I had joint training with the Canadian Army, the Lieutenants were referred to Lieutenants not Leftenants. Though by that time I was already a Captain, so maybe I just wasn't listening to it when it was said.
I might be wrong, it's also possiable it's changed. Canada is kind of an oddball country that sometimes has trouble making up it's mind if it wants to be American or British
I might be wrong, it's also possiable it's changed. Canada is kind of an oddball country that sometimes has trouble making up it's mind if it wants to be American or British
You left out the Quebecois which I think is a violation of some code or something in your country; they want to be neither but instead choose to want to be French! Even if the actual French will have nothing to do with them while taking humorous delight in their provincial "French" accents... or at least the two I've known in real life did!
French person here, I can confirm that Quebecois accent are absolutely, irremediably hilarious.
It's extremely disturbing when hearing actually dark things said with a Quebecois accent because you still can't shake the feeling that the person is talking in a voluntarily silly voice.
Hybrid Son Of Oxayotl wrote: French person here, I can confirm that Quebecois accent are absolutely, irremediably hilarious.
It's extremely disturbing when hearing actually dark things said with a Quebecois accent because you still can't shake the feeling that the person is talking in a voluntarily silly voice.
Pff always the same with you language Imperialists making fun of the local dialects! You are equally as bad as the germans and you should feel bad for that alone! :
Not Online!!! wrote: Pff always the same with you language Imperialists making fun of the local dialects! You are equally as bad as the germans and you should feel bad for that alone! :
Oh I love Swiss accents, such a small country but so many different accents!
Also I'm Swiss I have double citizenship (but I live in France and speak with a French accent, except when I make my best Genevois accent impression ^^).
Not Online!!! wrote: Pff always the same with you language Imperialists making fun of the local dialects! You are equally as bad as the germans and you should feel bad for that alone! :
Oh I love Swiss accents, such a small country but so many different accents!
Also I'm Swiss I have double citizenship (but I live in France and speak with a French accent, except when I make my best Genevois accent impression ^^).
Well your country saved my grandmother's life during WW2 so now I inherited Swiss nationality. I may go live in Chaux de Fond but not before you go all the way and expand the “No muezzin” law to include also “No church bells ringing” too, because damn that's crazy loud!
Hybrid Son Of Oxayotl wrote: Well your country saved my grandmother's life during WW2 so now I inherited Swiss nationality. I may go live in Chaux de Fond but not before you go all the way and expand the “No muezzin” law to include also “No church bells ringing” too, because damn that's crazy loud!
Switzerland is not laicistic and will never be, which insofar is good since the swiss state can intervene directly into religious ideology if unhappy (generally though the Federal level doesn't because Kantons solve their own issues.) . (regarding the last ruling of the federal jurisdiction you have no influence as a newcomer torwards local tradition i.e.cowbells, churchbells and or Fastnacht especially if you are not of the area.)
Also switzerland does not seperate Church from the state. (Teilung not Trennung) split of competences not Separation.
Adapt or don't bother is my recomendation.
Also rather the churchbells then general malaise.
Btw swiss german is not a dialect, it's literally german v 0,5 an older Version that also not had to suffer through lingua terci imperi.
Jadenim wrote: Always worth remembering that we Brits don’t write our dates like that.
We do it properly!
But the man running the show pronounces lieutenant properly. To go full blown conspiracy theorist on this, that may be a hint he's not using the British dating system.
or it might just be a joke on how it's oft mispronounced thanks to American pop culture being everywhere. I can't speak for the British experiance, but in Canada we offically pronounce it leftenant but lootenant is more commonly used by civilians simply because we get our info from TV which is all American programming for the most part.
Weird, when I had joint training with the Canadian Army, the Lieutenants were referred to Lieutenants not Leftenants. Though by that time I was already a Captain, so maybe I just wasn't listening to it when it was said.
I might be wrong, it's also possiable it's changed. Canada is kind of an oddball country that sometimes has trouble making up it's mind if it wants to be American or British
The unit was from Quebec, so that might have made a difference too. Trying to give/receive report on a "patient" with a fairly heavy accent (and I am from Minnesota, we practically sound Canadian anyway) was quite interesting. Definitely one of the more fun exercises I have been a part of.
The deviation primarily occurs today because of Brits feeling like they were being accosted by using the French pronounciation. Only the Commonwealth countries use Leftenant. The rest of the known universe uses Lieutenant.
The deviation primarily occurs today because of Brits feeling like they were being accosted by using the French pronounciation. Only the Commonwealth countries use Leftenant. The rest of the known universe uses Lieutenant.
The rest? I think majority of the English speaking countries are Commonwealth countries...
I suppose it is thematic to have former colonial overlords making fun of the provincial American accents though given that tomorrow is the 4th of July. It makes me glad to live in America where we only need to look from sea to shining sea for a wealth of silly accents! From my personal New England favs like NY/NJ extra on a gangster movie to the Da Bears superfan to the unintelligible at times Southern drawl to the nails on a chalkboard that is Boston's take on English, we need to look no further! Happy 4th of July tomorrow!
Hybrid Son Of Oxayotl wrote: French person here, I can confirm that Quebecois accent are absolutely, irremediably hilarious.
It's extremely disturbing when hearing actually dark things said with a Quebecois accent because you still can't shake the feeling that the person is talking in a voluntarily silly voice.
Pff always the same with you language Imperialists making fun of the local dialects! You are equally as bad as the germans and you should feel bad for that alone! :
Quebec is to a person from France a bit silly sounding. you gotta put it into context here. the British conquered New France (aka Quebec) in 1760. After that Quebec was an island of French surrounded by Anglophones with Anglophone rulers. They fought hard to preserve their language (it's honestly impressive French is still spoken today when you think about it) thing is, the language thus hasn't changed much since the conquest. Well French in France has, understandably evolved. So a frenchman hearing a Quebecquis speaking French it'd be like an English speaking having someone walk up and start speaking Shakespearian English at them. Understandably it might be hard to take them too seriously. This is pretty common knowledge among Canadians.
The deviation primarily occurs today because of Brits feeling like they were being accosted by using the French pronounciation. Only the Commonwealth countries use Leftenant. The rest of the known universe uses Lieutenant.
The rest? I think majority of the English speaking countries are Commonwealth countries...
And when the Chinese, Japanese, Latin Americans, and so on speak English, how do you suppose they pronounce Lieutenant?
The deviation primarily occurs today because of Brits feeling like they were being accosted by using the French pronounciation. Only the Commonwealth countries use Leftenant. The rest of the known universe uses Lieutenant.
The rest? I think majority of the English speaking countries are Commonwealth countries...
And when the Chinese, Japanese, Latin Americans, and so on speak English, how do you suppose they pronounce Lieutenant?
whatever way the then dominate english speaking power speaks it, a century ago I bet they pronounced it Leftenant
on a slightly differant note, I'll give Battletech props, one of their factions uses the English prounciation and they just spell it Leftenant to remove any and all doubt. GW should consider the same TBH
casvalremdeikun wrote: And when the Chinese, Japanese, Latin Americans, and so on speak English, how do you suppose they pronounce Lieutenant?
I don't know. But I know that in most countries where English is taught as a second language, the British English is the regional variant predominately being taught. Of course how people actually speak is influenced greatly by other factors, such as popular culture, and that may favour American spellings/pronunciation.
At any rate, however they spell or pronounce the word(for the record, the painting guide videos pronounce it lieu not left), it looks like we might finally be getting a general release of a Lieutenant model with this upcoming release. The image with the commentator pointing at the model seems to show a model Phobos Armor with a Combat Knife and a standard Bolt Pistol. His helmet on his hip has the red and white stripes if a Lieutenant helmet. He might have a Bolt Carbine slung on his back (I think I can kinda see a grip sticking out to his right), but I am not remotely sure. I don't really see the grab chute the LT from Shadowspear was equipped with, so who knows if that is going to be standard equipment or an option.
What I would really like, despite it not looking to be the case, is for that model with the cape/cloak to be a Techmarine, but he is wearing blue with no visible red, so that is probably a no.
casvalremdeikun wrote: At any rate, however they spell or pronounce the word(for the record, the painting guide videos pronounce it lieu not left), it looks like we might finally be getting a general release of a Lieutenant model with this upcoming release. The image with the commentator pointing at the model seems to show a model Phobos Armor with a Combat Knife and a standard Bolt Pistol. His helmet on his hip has the red and white stripes if a Lieutenant helmet. He might have a Bolt Carbine slung on his back (I think I can kinda see a grip sticking out to his right), but I am not remotely sure. I don't really see the grab chute the LT from Shadowspear was equipped with, so who knows if that is going to be standard equipment or an option.
What I would really like, despite it not looking to be the case, is for that model with the cape/cloak to be a Techmarine, but he is wearing blue with no visible red, so that is probably a no.
Speaking of Techmarines, there is that Iron Hands character that will probably drop with the rest of these marines.
Back on the differences between the writings of dates, I think the most important part is the month, as it gives you the best general idea of what to expect for weather in a region. So, since I read from left to right, seeing the month first is best in my opinion.
Apple Peel wrote: Back on the differences between the writings of dates, I think the most important part is the month, as it gives you the best general idea of what to expect for weather in a region. So, since I read from left to right, seeing the month first is best in my opinion.
I dunno with thew way the mind works I find a order of lowest to highest works best hence day month year
As fascinating as the discussion of dates formats and rank pronunciation may be, how about we take those elsewhere and leave this thread for actual news, hmm?
To be honest I'm intrigued they are trolling the customer base this hard... It seems the voices and the feedback has reached them but they simply decided they don't care. Taking the decision to rub peoples noses in it is a bit mean lol. I guess GW policies and decisions will forever remain a mystery to me.
Apple Peel wrote: Back on the differences between the writings of dates, I think the most important part is the month, as it gives you the best general idea of what to expect for weather in a region. So, since I read from left to right, seeing the month first is best in my opinion.
I dunno with thew way the mind works I find a order of lowest to highest works best hence day month year
Highest to lowest is nice, but if I’m in a rush, I’d like to know what clothing is appropriate for the expected weather.
Argive wrote: "GW releases a new primaris lieutenant"
In other news: Rain is wet....
To be honest I'm intrigued they are trolling the customer base this hard... It seems the voices and the feedback has reached them but they simply decided they don't care. Taking the decision to rub peoples noses in it is a bit mean lol. I guess GW policies and decisions will forever remain a mystery to me.
perhaps you should actually read the news, this isn't some primaris leuitenant... this is a SPECIAL primaris leuitenant. ohh and a multipart Infiltrator kit, and a new transport, ohh and a multipart eliminator kit, and a new dreadnought.. but the thing to take away from this is there's also a primaris Lt!
Again, if this guy is in his own clam pack, it is the first Primaris Lieutenant that will have a standard, individual release. Ever. That is actually important news. I get that Primaris Lieutenants are basically a meme character now, but this is actually news.
But that is a footnote to the new Primaris Tank. And Dreadnought. And multi-part Eliminators (that are likely to have the Las Fusils, which is an Anti-Tank weapon, closing one of the holes Primaris armies have). And multi-part Infiltrators.
This release actually seems like it is filling a lot of gaps that people have for Primaris. It is going to be interesting. And that doesn't include the fact that we are likely to be getting a new Codex Space Marines with this release too.
casvalremdeikun wrote: Again, if this guy is in his own clam pack, it is the first Primaris Lieutenant that will have a standard, individual release. Ever. That is actually important news. I get that Primaris Lieutenants are basically a meme character now, but this is actually news.
But that is a footnote to the new Primaris Tank. And Dreadnought. And multi-part Eliminators (that are likely to have the Las Fusils, which is an Anti-Tank weapon, closing one of the holes Primaris armies have). And multi-part Infiltrators.
This release actually seems like it is filling a lot of gaps that people have for Primaris. It is going to be interesting. And that doesn't include the fact that we are likely to be getting a new Codex Space Marines with this release too.
actually there are some clampack Leuitenants already but they're dark angels and blood angels, so might wanna amend that to "first standard individual release for vanilla marines"
casvalremdeikun wrote: [Again, if this guy is in his own clam pack, it is the first Primaris Lieutenant that will have a standard, individual release. Ever. That is actually important news. I get that Primaris Lieutenants are basically a meme character now, but this is actually news.
But that is a footnote to the new Primaris Tank. And Dreadnought. And multi-part Eliminators (that are likely to have the Las Fusils, which is an Anti-Tank weapon, closing one of the holes Primaris armies have). And multi-part Infiltrators.
This release actually seems like it is filling a lot of gaps that people have for Primaris. It is going to be interesting. And that doesn't include the fact that we are likely to be getting a new Codex Space Marines with this release too.
actually there are some clampack Leuitenants already but they're dark angels and blood angels, so might wanna amend that to "first standard individual release for vanilla marines"
That is what I meant. First non-Chapter Specific clam pack Lieutenant.
Hybrid Son Of Oxayotl wrote: French person here, I can confirm that Quebecois accent are absolutely, irremediably hilarious.
It's extremely disturbing when hearing actually dark things said with a Quebecois accent because you still can't shake the feeling that the person is talking in a voluntarily silly voice.
Pff always the same with you language Imperialists making fun of the local dialects! You are equally as bad as the germans and you should feel bad for that alone! :
Quebec is to a person from France a bit silly sounding. you gotta put it into context here. the British conquered New France (aka Quebec) in 1760. After that Quebec was an island of French surrounded by Anglophones with Anglophone rulers. They fought hard to preserve their language (it's honestly impressive French is still spoken today when you think about it) thing is, the language thus hasn't changed much since the conquest. Well French in France has, understandably evolved. So a frenchman hearing a Quebecquis speaking French it'd be like an English speaking having someone walk up and start speaking Shakespearian English at them. Understandably it might be hard to take them too seriously. This is pretty common knowledge among Canadians.
Thank you i frequently get the same from Germans, "Could you speak in propper high german please?" GO FETH YOURSELF is my answer to that i am trying, i normally speak fething medieval to renaisance age german you bloody spanker so excuese me if I sometimes use Luegen instead of schauen.....
And no it is not silly, that statement is insulting.
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reds8n wrote: Dig the way the all Primaris chapter still has Land Raiders sat in the armoury that they cannot get into/drive/use.
They obviously want to sell you the new tanks....
That look more like orkz got a hand on them with all the dakka all over them...
reds8n wrote: Dig the way the all Primaris chapter still has Land Raiders sat in the armoury that they cannot get into/drive/use.
They obviously want to sell you the new tanks....
That look more like orkz got a hand on them with all the dakka all over them...
You have something against dakka? Because this really isn't the place...
I'm one of those very rare people who actually likes the repulsor. I think it’s the right kind of thing for space marines to go around in – tough, incredibly well-armed and mobile. It never made sense to me to have marines going around in rhinos, which were fragile, virtually unarmed and not particularly quick.
For the same reason, I’ve always quite liked the stormraven. I look forward to getting some kind of Primaris flyer.
reds8n wrote: Dig the way the all Primaris chapter still has Land Raiders sat in the armoury that they cannot get into/drive/use.
They obviously want to sell you the new tanks....
That look more like orkz got a hand on them with all the dakka all over them...
You have something against dakka? Because this really isn't the place...
I'm one of those very rare people who actually likes the repulsor. I think it’s the right kind of thing for space marines to go around in – tough, incredibly well-armed and mobile. It never made sense to me to have marines going around in rhinos, which were fragile, virtually unarmed and not particularly quick.
For the same reason, I’ve always quite liked the stormraven. I look forward to getting some kind of Primaris flyer.
No i absolutely love dakka on tanks.
I just feel that the Primaris stuff has overdone it.
I think for me it's the aesthetic of the Primaris tanks.
I've absolutely no problem with the main hull weapons, including the Heavy Stubbers. But the little rocket pods and that look literally tacked on. Like a younger, more enthusiastic Grotsnik went a bit bonkers in the ol' Bitz Box, and decided to up-gun it.
By all means, there's no reason the model shouldn't have that many weapons. But man, the execution.
I've absolutely no problem with the main hull weapons, including the Heavy Stubbers. But the little rocket pods and that look literally tacked on. Like a younger, more enthusiastic Grotsnik went a bit bonkers in the ol' Bitz Box, and decided to up-gun it.
By all means, there's no reason the model shouldn't have that many weapons. But man, the execution.
this, it looks overly enthusiasthic mekboy working parttime for the mechanicum then Imperium imo.
it's the natural evolution for marine tanks, old marines went for the WWI aesthetic for their inspiration,
the primeris is looking to the 30s pre WWII when lots of tanks with multiple turrets were designed by pretty much everybody (many of which looked like the designer had been scrabbling in the bits box)a
Edit: and quite a few of them had a pretty mixed loadout too, infanty suppression with MG turrets, antitank with 37/45mm high velocity guns, and anti fortification/infanty support with a larger lower velocity howitzer
OrlandotheTechnicoloured wrote: it's the natural evolution for marine tanks, old marines went for the WWI aesthetic for their inspiration,
the primeris is looking to the 30s pre WWII when lots of tanks with multiple turrets were designed by pretty much everybody (many of which looked like the designer had been scrabbling in the bits box)a
Edit: and quite a few of them had a pretty mixed loadout too, infanty suppression with MG turrets, antitank with 37/45mm high velocity guns, and anti fortification/infanty support with a larger lower velocity howitzer
If they retained that retro charm with excessively riveted hulls and non-streamlined hulls that would be one thing, but GW is going for a sleek sci-fi look instead. Honestly Primaris look much more sci-fi anime than real world inspired to me in that regard.
I dread to see the Dread. It's a sad, skinny looking thing from what I can discerned from the blurred video. I really hope good pictures will change that impression. I love Dreadnoughts. Except Contemptors. They're contemptible.
Can't disagree disliking the icarus rocket pod. It's a funny looking thing and weird in the game. I find that it's irritating to have to fire the thing, usually with no effect.
It might make sense for a tank like a repulsor to have some kind of AA gun attached. What makes no sense is to have a tiny one that does nothing.
I'm not much of a fan of the grenade launchers either. They'd be cooler if they were belt fed grenade launchers that could pivot to aim at things, rather than these weird boxes containing a few grenades to be fired in random directions.
I do like the coaxial guns and pintle mounts, which are pretty like real tanks. The little storm bolter turrets are a bit silly but I quite like them.
I see the grenade launchers as more being intended to be fired off just before you let your troops off in a circle around the vehicle. the idea not being to kill anyone but to supress enemy fire as your troops disembark. and frankly would have liked to see rules to reflectthat use rathert then just 'moar gunz!"
Jadenim wrote: Always worth remembering that we Brits don’t write our dates like that.
We do it properly!
But the man running the show pronounces lieutenant properly. To go full blown conspiracy theorist on this, that may be a hint he's not using the British dating system.
No he doesn’t. He pronounced it the American way, that was a conscious decision in the script for the video, and it made him wince every time he did it.
I do not believe that is correct. The Tau are anime inspired.
The first Space Marines were distinctly Medieval in design, featuring highly segmented foot armour and a Bascinet style helm. I believe, though I forget where I heard it, that the more detailed armour styling on the feet was changed because the Plastic moulding technology of the time was not up to the task. The decision to change the legs to the RTB01 style (first plastic Space Marines) of flared leg armour has informed the design of Space Marines ever since.
I do not believe that is correct. The Tau are anime inspired.
The first Space Marines were distinctly Medieval in design, featuring highly segmented foot armour and a Bascinet style helm. I believe, though I forget where I heard it, that the more detailed armour styling on the feet was changed because the Plastic moulding technology of the time was not up to the task. The decision to change the legs to the RTB01 style (first plastic Space Marines) of flared leg armour has informed the design of Space Marines ever since.
It was sincerely not my intent to derail. Someone was being mistaken and I offered them illumination.
Re: Inflation - a 10 man squad is £20-30 today. 75p (1987 price) x 10 figures x (inflation rate 2.76) = £20.70 Remembering that VAT (unavoidable tax) is actually higher now @20% than the 15% rate it was in 1987, so just under £22 in current money.
Anyway, looking forward to finding out whatever it is hidden behind the blurry pics in Primaris Lt. News. My guess is a GW/Sanrio tie-in.
I do not believe that is correct. The Tau are anime inspired.
The first Space Marines were distinctly Medieval in design, featuring highly segmented foot armour and a Bascinet style helm. I believe, though I forget where I heard it, that the more detailed armour styling on the feet was changed because the Plastic moulding technology of the time was not up to the task. The decision to change the legs to the RTB01 style (first plastic Space Marines) of flared leg armour has informed the design of Space Marines ever since.
Maybe the first few Rogue Trader ones. But Jes Goodwin in particular has been very explicit that anime has been/is the main inspiration for Marines since the late 90s.
Here's what he said about the first plastic Terminators released over 20 years ago.
This recent overhaul of the Terminator design brings it into line with progress made in appearance of the Space Marines in general. The suit is now bigger and takes on the “Anime” proportions bestowed on the rest of the range – longer legs, wider shoulders and a bigger chest. The larger bases and plastic component nature of the hard copies allows for more versatile poses especially in the legs giving the suits more dynamism. The hip shields are inherited from the new Grey Knight designs. Characters in Mark 3c suits are available but no traitor versions have yet appeared.
Tau have big Robots, true (especially since about 2014 with the release of the Riptide. But the visuals aren't nearly as "anime" as those of Space Marines (or Eldar, for that matter) with their wasp waist and literal oversized-anime-eyes-eye-lenses, etc..
I do not believe that is correct. The Tau are anime inspired.
The first Space Marines were distinctly Medieval in design, featuring highly segmented foot armour and a Bascinet style helm. I believe, though I forget where I heard it, that the more detailed armour styling on the feet was changed because the Plastic moulding technology of the time was not up to the task. The decision to change the legs to the RTB01 style (first plastic Space Marines) of flared leg armour has informed the design of Space Marines ever since.
Maybe the first few Rogue Trader ones. But Jes Goodwin in particular has been very explicit that anime has been/is the main inspiration for Marines since the late 90s.
Here's what he said about the first plastic Terminators released over 20 years ago.
This recent overhaul of the Terminator design brings it into line with progress made in appearance of the Space Marines in general. The suit is now bigger and takes on the “Anime” proportions bestowed on the rest of the range – longer legs, wider shoulders and a bigger chest. The larger bases and plastic component nature of the hard copies allows for more versatile poses especially in the legs giving the suits more dynamism. The hip shields are inherited from the new Grey Knight designs. Characters in Mark 3c suits are available but no traitor versions have yet appeared.
Tau have big Robots, true (especially since about 2014 with the release of the Riptide. But the visuals aren't nearly as "anime" as those of Space Marines (or Eldar, for that matter) with their wasp waist and literal oversized-anime-eyes-eye-lenses, etc..
If that's what Jes said I'll take it as gospel. He's talking about proportions of course. Beyond that you'd be hard pressed to compare a Space Marine of any era to anime save for a few regrettably bad mecha type models e.g. Centurions.
It was sincerely not my intent to derail. Someone was being mistaken and I offered them illumination.
Re: Inflation - a 10 man squad is £20-30 today. 75p (1987 price) x 10 figures x (inflation rate 2.76) = £20.70 Remembering that VAT (unavoidable tax) is actually higher now @20% than the 15% rate it was in 1987, so just under £22 in current money.
Anyway, looking forward to finding out whatever it is hidden behind the blurry pics in Primaris Lt. News. My guess is a GW/Sanrio tie-in.
Yeah but that is not exactly the correct comparison is it given that they were hand cast metal models being compared to mass produced plastics, the odd remains current metal marine is what about £15 I think so a 500% increase . As such the reality’s a little less rosy than just saying but there in line with inflation, if you wanted to be kinder to GW you can compare the original plastic marine box set to the modern marines adjusting for inflation roughly speaking the original box would be £26.54 compared to either £25 for mini marines or £35 for Primaris so that’s not too bad.
Oh hang on I nearly forgot the original box had 30 Marines so that’s £75.00 for mini’s or £105 for Primaris so 300% & 400% increases which yeah is better than the metal marines but still not great.
Those original marines were great. The first time I saw Primaris Phobos armour, the legs looked to me like a callback to those original marines. I reckon you could get a pretty good approximation by using Phobos armour with Mark VI helmets and standard shoulder armour.
I do not believe that is correct. The Tau are anime inspired.
The first Space Marines were distinctly Medieval in design, featuring highly segmented foot armour and a Bascinet style helm. I believe, though I forget where I heard it, that the more detailed armour styling on the feet was changed because the Plastic moulding technology of the time was not up to the task. The decision to change the legs to the RTB01 style (first plastic Space Marines) of flared leg armour has informed the design of Space Marines ever since.
Maybe the first few Rogue Trader ones. But Jes Goodwin in particular has been very explicit that anime has been/is the main inspiration for Marines since the late 90s.
Here's what he said about the first plastic Terminators released over 20 years ago.
This recent overhaul of the Terminator design brings it into line with progress made in appearance of the Space Marines in general. The suit is now bigger and takes on the “Anime” proportions bestowed on the rest of the range – longer legs, wider shoulders and a bigger chest. The larger bases and plastic component nature of the hard copies allows for more versatile poses especially in the legs giving the suits more dynamism. The hip shields are inherited from the new Grey Knight designs. Characters in Mark 3c suits are available but no traitor versions have yet appeared.
Tau have big Robots, true (especially since about 2014 with the release of the Riptide. But the visuals aren't nearly as "anime" as those of Space Marines (or Eldar, for that matter) with their wasp waist and literal oversized-anime-eyes-eye-lenses, etc..
If that's what Jes said I'll take it as gospel. He's talking about proportions of course. Beyond that you'd be hard pressed to compare a Space Marine of any era to anime save for a few regrettably bad mecha type models e.g. Centurions.
Google anime mecha from the 60s to the 80s and try not to see a bunch of multi color space marines. Most have large shoulders and flared legs.
Giant robots from Mazinger, Gundam (especially the Zaku) and even Macross. You can see where the space marine has its roots.
BrotherGecko wrote: Google anime mecha from the 60s to the 80s and try not to see a bunch of multi color space marines. Most have large shoulders and flared legs.
Giant robots from Mazinger, Gundam (especially the Zaku) and even Macross. You can see where the space marine has its roots.
We'll have to agree to disagree.
There's only so many ways to articulate an armoured suit, some similarities are inevitable but coincidental. To say Space Marines are rooted in anime is to ignore what Citadel Miniatures were producing in the mid 80's and what their influences were. 40k is literally the original Warhammer in space with medieval fantasy sensibilities e.g. melee combat. The only futuristic designs Citadel were producing prior to that were based on 2000ad licenses. That's why the Space Marine bikes look like Judge Dredd's Lawmaster motorcycle.
I would love a re sculpt of centurions, I think the idea of them is good and they should be a replacement for deveststors but they need to look less terrible.
Looking forward to a new marine book and I might actually use my crimson fists as crimson fists for once instead of Deathwatch.
Rogerio134134 wrote: I would love a re sculpt of centurions, I think the idea of them is good and they should be a replacement for deveststors but they need to look less terrible.
Looking forward to a new marine book and I might actually use my crimson fists as crimson fists for once instead of Deathwatch.
don't expect any major changes, just rolling new marine units into the book.
For what it's worth, Crimson fists as Crimson fists are reasonably good since the white dwarf rules came out.
I've thought about using reiver bodies with spare intercessor arms myself, to create a different-looking marine. This has mainly been prompted by the fact that I've got some reiver bodies, which would be useless as actual reivers but potentially useful as something else.
I reckon I might be able to use spare bits from the infiltrator kit when it comes out and make them into more infiltrators. I already used one body to create a standing eliminator, so I didn't have identical crouching ones in my shadowspear set.
Rogerio134134 wrote: I would love a re sculpt of centurions, I think the idea of them is good and they should be a replacement for deveststors but they need to look less terrible.
Looking forward to a new marine book and I might actually use my crimson fists as crimson fists for once instead of Deathwatch.
don't expect any major changes, just rolling new marine units into the book.
If this were the case, the book would have been out with Shadowspear and the CSM release.
BrotherGecko wrote: Google anime mecha from the 60s to the 80s and try not to see a bunch of multi color space marines. Most have large shoulders and flared legs.
Giant robots from Mazinger, Gundam (especially the Zaku) and even Macross. You can see where the space marine has its roots.
We'll have to agree to disagree.
There's only so many ways to articulate an armoured suit, some similarities are inevitable but coincidental. To say Space Marines are rooted in anime is to ignore what Citadel Miniatures were producing in the mid 80's and what their influences were. 40k is literally the original Warhammer in space with medieval fantasy sensibilities e.g. melee combat. The only futuristic designs Citadel were producing prior to that were based on 2000ad licenses. That's why the Space Marine bikes look like Judge Dredd's Lawmaster motorcycle.
The very first were just space knights, I agree. But the design that made GW millions and is the one everybody in the hobby is aware of is inspired by Japanese giant robot cartoons. And it is fine that they are. Those kinds of shows were pretty popular at the time (80s-90s) in the West and have very cool and noticable designs that would look great on the table (and did look great).
Jes acknowledges this so I think SM players who have been making fun of Tau need to come to terms with the fact that they have been playing the "anime" army all along (other than the Eldar who are so anime their guns shoot ninja stars).
Mandragola wrote: Yeah, a Primaris codex is what I'd expect too. The range is now large enough to support itself. I imagine it won't fully supersede the existing marine codex, but that maybe they'll leave the mini marines alone from now on.
I don't know, I'm kind of expecting to see something revising some things from the old Marines into single units rather than multi-units like they are now(Land Raiders, Terminators, Captains, Librarians, Chaplains, and Veterans notably) to kind of pare things down.
Looking at it: 3x Land Raider profiles that could be reworked into at least two. Terminators are in 4 different profiles(Tartaros, Cataphractii, Assault, Terminator) that could be condensed into two(Assault and Terminator) that just have bespoke rules for Tartaros, Cataphractii, or 'vanilla'. Captains have 4 profiles(Terminator/Cataphractii, Vanilla, Bike) that can be condensed into just a Captain profile with bespoke rules for the wargear they might buy. Librarians and Chaplains have 3 profiles(Terminator, Jump Pack and Vanilla) which can do the same. Veterans have 3 entries(Company, Sternguard, Vanguard) which could be rolled into one and given bespoke rules for wargear.
That's a whopping 20 profiles that could be rolled down into 8. Hell, and I forgot Bikes and Attack Bikes! Could put them as a single squad option and bump 22 into 10. That's...yeah. That opens up some room for the Vanguard stuff.
Rogerio134134 wrote: I would love a re sculpt of centurions, I think the idea of them is good and they should be a replacement for deveststors but they need to look less terrible.
Looking forward to a new marine book and I might actually use my crimson fists as crimson fists for once instead of Deathwatch.
don't expect any major changes, just rolling new marine units into the book.
If this were the case, the book would have been out with Shadowspear and the CSM release.
no it wouldn't have, we've got new units upcoming, the book'll be out with the marine release that comes with the release of multipart kits of the shadowspear stuff
Rogerio134134 wrote: I would love a re sculpt of centurions, I think the idea of them is good and they should be a replacement for deveststors but they need to look less terrible.
Looking forward to a new marine book and I might actually use my crimson fists as crimson fists for once instead of Deathwatch.
don't expect any major changes, just rolling new marine units into the book.
If this were the case, the book would have been out with Shadowspear and the CSM release.
no it wouldn't have, we've got new units upcoming, the book'll be out with the marine release that comes with the release of multipart kits of the shadowspear stuff
Sure it would have, because everything else could have came out around it too.
This has been a very long time frame between a release of monopose kits and the full kits with regards to the Vanguard stuff.
Rogerio134134 wrote: I would love a re sculpt of centurions, I think the idea of them is good and they should be a replacement for deveststors but they need to look less terrible.
Looking forward to a new marine book and I might actually use my crimson fists as crimson fists for once instead of Deathwatch.
don't expect any major changes, just rolling new marine units into the book.
If this were the case, the book would have been out with Shadowspear and the CSM release.
no it wouldn't have, we've got new units upcoming, the book'll be out with the marine release that comes with the release of multipart kits of the shadowspear stuff
Sure it would have, because everything else could have came out around it too.
This has been a very long time frame between a release of monopose kits and the full kits with regards to the Vanguard stuff.
Not really. GW never releases two big releases at once, those cannibalize sales (someone like me who plays both armies would have proably spent half of what they will with this release schedule)
let's consider some facts here. The last boxed set similer to Shadowspear we got, introduceing two armies worth of new units, was Dark Imperium. Which gave us wave 1 of Primaris marines, and Deathguard.
Dark Imperium was released in June 2017, followed by Space Marines in July 2017 as the first major codex release of 8th edition. Deathguard waited until september 2017 a good 3-4 months later.
now then Shadowspear and Codex Chaos Space Marines came out in March. it is now July. about 4 months later. so assuming a late July to early/mid august releaste date.. it's a good 4 or so months late.
Meanwhile Deathwatch Overkill came out for 7th edition in Febuary 2016, and it took until the SUMMER for GW to finally put out codex death watch and GSC. a 6 and 7th month wait respectivly.
So despite your claiming it's a "very long time" when one steps back and looks at GW's past release schedules. if the new Marines Vanguard stuff comes out in Late July or sometime in August...
I'm not getting into this in-depth, but suffice to say:
If they were concerned about "cannibalizing sales"? They wouldn't have released the CSM full kit within 2 weeks of the box.
Death Guard was a full range release, not simply resculpts or a few characters. Anyone expecting them immediately after the drops we saw in the start of 8th(Primaris was effectively a whole range drop and we saw a huge chunk of books released between DI and DG, including GK and CSM) was deluding themselves.
Deathwatch: Overkill was a board game, previewing a new range...and it was while they were working on 40k 8th edition.
Last but not least, we literally have had things implied that after Sororitas are released? They've got plans to revise the early released books.
Oh, and if I want to add another footnote:
Look at the way Stormcast were done.
Deathwatch: Overkill was a board game, previewing a new range...and it was while they were working on 40k 8th edition.
irrelevant both death weatch and GSC came out for 7th edition.
my point is simply that the wait has, when one looks at the facts not been super long.
If they were concerned about "cannibalizing sales"? They wouldn't have released the CSM full kit within 2 weeks of the box.
Irrelevant, I bought a buncha CSMs and shadowspear.
if they had had the vanguard come out alongside CSMs I would have had to make a chocie as to what to buy. I am one of the people who plays both Space Marines and Chaos Space Marines.
Mandragola wrote: Yeah, a Primaris codex is what I'd expect too. The range is now large enough to support itself.
I imagine it won't fully supersede the existing marine codex, but that maybe they'll leave the mini marines alone from now on.
I don't know, I'm kind of expecting to see something revising some things from the old Marines into single units rather than multi-units like they are now(Land Raiders, Terminators, Captains, Librarians, Chaplains, and Veterans notably) to kind of pare things down.
Looking at it:
3x Land Raider profiles that could be reworked into at least two.
Terminators are in 4 different profiles(Tartaros, Cataphractii, Assault, Terminator) that could be condensed into two(Assault and Terminator) that just have bespoke rules for Tartaros, Cataphractii, or 'vanilla'.
Captains have 4 profiles(Terminator/Cataphractii, Vanilla, Bike) that can be condensed into just a Captain profile with bespoke rules for the wargear they might buy.
Librarians and Chaplains have 3 profiles(Terminator, Jump Pack and Vanilla) which can do the same.
Veterans have 3 entries(Company, Sternguard, Vanguard) which could be rolled into one and given bespoke rules for wargear.
That's a whopping 20 profiles that could be rolled down into 8.
Hell, and I forgot Bikes and Attack Bikes! Could put them as a single squad option and bump 22 into 10. That's...yeah. That opens up some room for the Vanguard stuff.
Could go even further, especially if they loosened the "no part in the box, no options" limit.
Captain- option to take bike or jump pack. Or swap armor and weapons for indomitus, cataphractii or tartaros armor and terminator wargear (drops 5 entries into one with 6 options)
Primaris captain- weapon options, or trade armor and weapons for gravis armor or phobos armor and matching gear(drops 3 entries into 1)
Librarian- jump pack, TDA, bike options. (3 entries into 1 with 4 options)
Primaris Librarian- can swap for phobos armor and vanguard powers (2 entries into 1)
Chaplain- jump pack, TDA, bike options (2 entries into 1 with 4 options)
Primaris Lieutenant- Phobos Armor option (2 entries into 1)
Ancient- one per can upgrade to chapter ancient. (2 entries into 1)
Company veterans- may upgrade into either sternguard, vanguard, or honor guard. Vanguard get extra ccw and options for jump packs, Honour guard get artificer armor, sternguard get special issue ammo (4 entries into 1)
Champion- one per army can upgrade into chapter champion (2 entries into 1)
Terminators- allow mixed assault and melee squads. May upgrade to tartaros or cataphractii armor. (4 entries into 1)
Dreadnought- may upgrade to venerable or ironclad (3 entries into 1)
Land Raider- Crusader loadout base, may swap hurricane bolters for flamestorm cannons and fuel tanks -4 troop capacity, or lascannons and capacitors (-6 troop capacity) Freely swap heavy bolters or assault cannons. (3 entries into 1)
Repulsor- freely swap hull and rear weapons and pintle mount, may swap normal turret and side storm bolters for executioner turret. (2 entries into 1)
37 entries into 13 with more customization options.
sadly well this wpould save space it seems GW is avoiding this from a design philophsy POV, but the question is, will Marines force GW to change this design philophesy for a future edition? I think so. the Marine codex is getting to a size where GW's going to have to make a hard choice. and it'll come down to the following.
1: Trim out old or "unnesscary" units. (GW could for example expand the options terminators can take and just treat cataphracti and taratos as purely a cosmetic choice. They could also drop vanguard and sternguard veterns and simply make them "veterns") this would limit choices and see some grumbling.
2: Divide the space marine codices into codex Space Marines and Codex Primaris Marines. this runs the risk of embedding the old vs new community divide and IMHO is proably the worst choice here.
3: change their "data sheet for every variation of a unit" philoiphesy and go back to the old "one data sheet that is modded by wargear that you know the rules for. such as a single captain entry that simply says "may upgrade to terminator armor fo X points. may take a jump [ack for Y points")
IMHO 3 would be the most popular choice for the player base, and I suspect 1 might be where GW might consider going. I mean right now company veterns is something I could very easily see being cut.
My guess is from the (admittedly blurry) bits shown that it'll be a Primaris command squad with lots of bits and options so that they can open up some choices for the models.
warboss wrote: My guess is from the (admittedly blurry) bits shown that it'll be a Primaris command squad with lots of bits and options so that they can open up some choices for the models.
Ooo, I could maybe see that. Maybe a dual kit of Infiltrators (there are definitely Infiltrators based on the image with the hands point at the Lieutenant) and a Command Squad?
warboss wrote: My guess is from the (admittedly blurry) bits shown that it'll be a Primaris command squad with lots of bits and options so that they can open up some choices for the models.
Ooo, I could maybe see that. Maybe a dual kit of Infiltrators (there are definitely Infiltrators based on the image with the hands point at the Lieutenant) and a Command Squad?
could be, or it could be they where previewing a 5 man command squad and a 5 man infiltrator squad to throw us off scent. remember back when Primaris first came out, you could buy 5 man combat squad boxes?
warboss wrote: My guess is from the (admittedly blurry) bits shown that it'll be a Primaris command squad with lots of bits and options so that they can open up some choices for the models.
Would be a really easy way to release an Ancient and some Lieutenants outside of Dark Imperium...but I'm not expecting Command Squads for Primaris personally.
I would expect stuff to end up more akin to the Heresy/Crusade organization thanks to Guilliman's influence. It's why I'm wondering if what appears to be a model wearing a camo-cloak in that group shot might be our first look at a Moritat-inspired Lieutenant.
warboss wrote: My guess is from the (admittedly blurry) bits shown that it'll be a Primaris command squad with lots of bits and options so that they can open up some choices for the models.
Would be a really easy way to release an Ancient and some Lieutenants outside of Dark Imperium...but I'm not expecting Command Squads for Primaris personally.
I would expect stuff to end up more akin to the Heresy/Crusade organization thanks to Guilliman's influence. It's why I'm wondering if what appears to be a model wearing a camo-cloak in that group shot might be our first look at a Moritat-inspired Lieutenant.
my guess is he'll be the primaris Lt in Phobos armor, and when the full codex drops we'll have a choice of eaither the grav chute or cloak
Automatically Appended Next Post: So I'm going to make a prediction. Pre-orders of Augest tenth. my reasons? we have Volume 2 of the Uriel Ventris Chronicals AND Knights of Macragge both up for pre-order that day. GW doesn't really tie novel releases into mini releases too much anymore and the more obvious releases when they do, tend not to be advertised, but given we have two ultramarine books both valaibler at the same time makes we suspect.
warboss wrote: Whoah.. my throwaway joke about the Quebecois...
I suppose it is thematic to have former colonial overlords making fun of the provincial American accents though given that tomorrow is the 4th of July. It makes me glad to live in America where we only need to look from sea to shining sea for a wealth of silly accents! From my personal New England favs like NY/NJ extra on a gangster movie to the Da Bears superfan to the unintelligible at times Southern drawl to the nails on a chalkboard that is Boston's take on English, we need to look no further! Happy 4th of July tomorrow!
I know we've moved on, but hold up a second here. Did you just say NY/NJ were New England?
Them's fightin' words, boy.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
zend wrote: I think they’ll print a primaris codex when they commit to squatting Space Marines.
Was there ever any more info on the that rumored codex for a chapter that’s never had their own before?
Rumours continue to point to it being White Scars.
Not a bad deal, but not a great deal. unless I've miscalculated, basicly you get the space Wolf Battle leader and a space wolf primaris upgrade for free. this'll be a decent deal for space wolf players but it's not something non space wolf primaris players are going to line up to buy. Know no Fear is proably still the best start collecting box for basic primaris.
Kanluwen wrote: Disagree. KNF isn't full kits while this is.
Someone can also resell the Space Wolf Battle Leader and Primaris Upgrade or even just use it for making some Deathwatch if they so chose.
Ok. Looks ETB to me though.
All the models have sculpted pads from the SW upgrade sprue. Those are not compatible with the ETB kits.
I wonder if the other codex variant chapters will get a box as well? Instead of Agressors BA could have Inceptors and the DA could have a 5 man Helblaster squad. While a vanilla box without any upgrade sprues could have two 10 man squads.
Not a bad deal, but not a great deal. unless I've miscalculated, basicly you get the space Wolf Battle leader and a space wolf primaris upgrade for free. this'll be a decent deal for space wolf players but it's not something non space wolf primaris players are going to line up to buy. Know no Fear is proably still the best start collecting box for basic primaris.
Got to agree, I aren't sure why they used the wolves for this, does feel like if it ditched the wolves sprue and the battle leader, pop in a librarian/chaplain/captain, bang a £50 sticker on and enjoy the sales.
Not a bad deal, but not a great deal. unless I've miscalculated, basicly you get the space Wolf Battle leader and a space wolf primaris upgrade for free. this'll be a decent deal for space wolf players but it's not something non space wolf primaris players are going to line up to buy. Know no Fear is proably still the best start collecting box for basic primaris.
Got to agree, I aren't sure why they used the wolves for this, does feel like if it ditched the wolves sprue and the battle leader, pop in a librarian/chaplain/captain, bang a £50 sticker on and enjoy the sales.
because by doing this they can get people looking for a space wolf specific Primaris HQ to spend 100 bucks instead of 30.
Kanluwen wrote: Disagree. KNF isn't full kits while this is.
Someone can also resell the Space Wolf Battle Leader and Primaris Upgrade or even just use it for making some Deathwatch if they so chose.
Ok. Looks ETB to me though.
it's not. it's essentially the contents of tooth and claw sans the dreadnought.
Ah ok. Looking at the T&C marines they've done a better job of showcasing that it's a full kit squad there than they have done here. Should the Aggressors have some sort of missiles if they're full spec, or are those just optional bits?
Kanluwen wrote: Disagree. KNF isn't full kits while this is.
Someone can also resell the Space Wolf Battle Leader and Primaris Upgrade or even just use it for making some Deathwatch if they so chose.
Ok. Looks ETB to me though.
it's not. it's essentially the contents of tooth and claw sans the dreadnought.
Ah ok. Looking at the T&C marines they've done a better job of showcasing that it's a full kit squad there than they have done here. Should the Aggressors have some sort of missiles if they're full spec, or are those just optional bits?
They should if they're built with boltstorm gauntlets if you look closely you'll be able to see the ones in the preview pic are built with flamers. The agressors in T&C where built the same way. This really IS T&C without the dread
Instead of the Redemptor, the kit has 5 additional Intercessors (so a full 10-man kit instead of T&C's 5-man). I'll be passing on this since I already have the SW half of T&C. The Tsons one is interesting, although putting Ahriman in it means nobody is going to want more than one unless the price point is really good. Speaking of which, do we know what the price point of these will be (SC boxes vary a little these days).
It they instead had a hellblaster sprue instead of a second Intercessor one, I'd buy it right away. I'm admittedly not looking to build an optimized army for this edition but rather just to mix and match a few figs for fun.
hellblasters would make it swerve too far into the ehavy support grouping for a SC box. more useful maybe but.. I think it'd be a solid thing to buy WITH KNF actually. combine this with KNF and you have 3 sqauds of intercessors. 1 squad of hellblasters, a wolf lord, a battle leader and 3 agressors. not the best army but a very solid foundation to build from.
I got my Executioners at the weekend. It's a fairly difficult kit to assemble and the new top doesn't help. There are these little wedge-shaped pieces that go in where the side sponsons go, and they are not a good fit.
Mandragola wrote: I got my Executioners at the weekend. It's a fairly difficult kit to assemble and the new top doesn't help. There are these little wedge-shaped pieces that go in where the side sponsons go, and they are not a good fit.
At first I thought you were talking about the Leman Russ executioner and for a moment was confused. It just now occurred to me that there are two Imperial battle tanks now with this designation.
I would really like if it GW would stop doing this. It's one thing to have the same unit name used in completely disparate armies (i.e. Drukhari Reavers vs. Space Marine Reavers), but having stuff like multiple battle tanks called executioners and primaris rhinos (which can't transport primaris marines), Vanguard Space Marines and "vanguard" Space Marines, etc. is starting to get really irritating.
Sorry for the confusion. I thought it would be pretty clear since this is a Primaris thread.
Your wider point is very true. The Primaris rhino that can't transport Primaris marines is my favourite one of these. I hadn't thought of the vanguard vets thing.
Primaris Reivers are spelled differently to the many other kinds of reavers kicking around the 40k universe. And they are awful, so they don't actually exist in any meaningful way. I hate the concept of them though, and the hilarious suggestion that a marine should be scary just because he has a silly hat on.
Oh the confusion wasn't on you, no worries. I should have figured it out.
But when I saw "executioner" the first thing that came to my mind was the model/unit that has been in the game for years already (and also is a tank with sponsons that are kind of odd in terms of how they fit on the hull) - it's totally on GW that it made me do a double-take. I just took the opportunity to use your post to highlight why I think this is an issue (however minor) and vent a bit about it. I wouldn't mind so much if they wouldn't keep on doing this.
There are so many words in the English language that they really don't need to be rehashing stuff like this.
So in this case it’s arguably a consistent description or classification, rather than just a duplication. This doesn’t quite work if you stick a really big laser on your repulsor instead, of course, but it means they don’t have to create a new datasheet.
ZergSmasher wrote: The Tsons one is interesting, although putting Ahriman in it means nobody is going to want more than one
Except not really, if you downgrade the bling a bit using spare bits from rubrics, presto, instant foot or disc exalted sorcerer. I'd even say it's the troops which will be tougher second sale than the HQ model, especially for new players...
Kawauso wrote: I would really like if it GW would stop doing this. It's one thing to have the same unit name used in completely disparate armies (i.e. Drukhari Reavers vs. Space Marine Reavers), but having stuff like multiple battle tanks called executioners and primaris rhinos (which can't transport primaris marines), Vanguard Space Marines and "vanguard" Space Marines, etc. is starting to get really irritating.
Except SM ones are Reivers But yeah, rest of these examples could use a bit more creativity.
I would really like if it GW would stop doing this. It's one thing to have the same unit name used in completely disparate armies (i.e. Drukhari Reavers vs. Space Marine Reavers), but having stuff like multiple battle tanks called executioners and primaris rhinos (which can't transport primaris marines), Vanguard Space Marines and "vanguard" Space Marines, etc. is starting to get really irritating.
Any confusion between Primaris and not-Primaris units will likely go away with the next codex anyway, so there's that...
I would really like if it GW would stop doing this. It's one thing to have the same unit name used in completely disparate armies (i.e. Drukhari Reavers vs. Space Marine Reavers), but having stuff like multiple battle tanks called executioners and primaris rhinos (which can't transport primaris marines), Vanguard Space Marines and "vanguard" Space Marines, etc. is starting to get really irritating.
Any confusion between Primaris and not-Primaris units will likely go away with the next codex anyway, so there's that...
Mandragola wrote: I got my Executioners at the weekend. It's a fairly difficult kit to assemble and the new top doesn't help. There are these little wedge-shaped pieces that go in where the side sponsons go, and they are not a good fit.
Mine fit in just fine. I glued them to the top panel and then put the entire top panel on, and it slid together happily. Then I had to pry the front open since I forgot the hull hb mount...
Kawauso wrote: Fair enough - but they really seem to be selling the executioner on that big laser canon it has; I forgot it had the plasma option.
It should have a different appellation for the laser canon config, IMHO.
Annihilator would be twins lascannon, to probably closer to Destroyer, but that shares with a guard tank as well.
Google anime mecha from the 60s to the 80s and try not to see a bunch of multi color space marines. Most have large shoulders and flared legs.
Giant robots from Mazinger, Gundam (especially the Zaku) and even Macross. You can see where the space marine has its roots.
There was an article somewhere (a GW article, though - that or an interview with Bryan Ansell) where it was discussed that they wanted a visual profile that was distinct, and that going with that, they based the Space Marine design off the Chaos Warrior from WHFB. Think "Slambo" (original, of course). This is long before 40k Chaos was a thing, naturally...
Isn't Lievtenant (yes, with a "V") and antiquated French word meaning "replacement"? As-is the replacement for a Captain if they are killed in battle? And the Brits began pronouncing it Lef-tenant around the same time Americans subbed the V for a U just to spite the Brits? I think I read that somewhere, but I'm not sure
Etymology
The word lieutenant derives from French; the lieu meaning "place" as in a position (cf. in lieu of); and tenant meaning "holding" as in "holding a position"; thus a "lieutenant" is a placeholder for a superior, during their absence (compare the Latin locum tenens).
In the 19th century, British writers who considered this word either an imposition on the English language, or difficult for common soldiers and sailors, argued for it to be replaced by the calque "steadholder". However, their efforts failed, and the French word is still used, along with its many variations (e.g. lieutenant colonel, lieutenant general, lieutenant commander, flight lieutenant, second lieutenant and many non-English language examples), in both the Old and the New World.[citation needed]
Pronunciation
Pronunciation of lieutenant is generally split between the forms /lɛfˈtɛnənt/ (About this soundlisten) lef-TEN-ənt and /luːˈtɛnənt/ (About this soundlisten) loo-TEN-ənt, with the former generally associated with the armies of British Commonwealth countries and the Republic of Ireland; and the latter generally associated with anyone from the United States or other Western Hemisphere countries.[2] The early history of the pronunciation is unclear; Middle English spellings suggest that the /luː-/ and /lɛf-/ pronunciations may have existed even then.[3] The rare Old French variant spelling luef for Modern French lieu ('place') supports the suggestion that a final [u] of the Old French word was in certain environments perceived as an [f].[3] Furthermore, in Latin, the lingua franca of the era, the letter v is used for both you and v.
In Royal Naval tradition—and other English-speaking navies outside the United States—a reduced pronunciation /ləˈtɛnənt/ (About this soundlisten) is used. This is not recognised as current by recent editions of the OED (although the RN pronunciation was included in editions of OED up until the 1970s).
Galef wrote: Isn't Lievtenant (yes, with a "V") and antiquated French word meaning "replacement"? As-is the replacement for a Captain if they are killed in battle?
And the Brits began pronouncing it Lef-tenant around the same time Americans subbed the V for a U just to spite the Brits?
I think I read that somewhere, but I'm not sure
-
It is a bit more complicated than that (the Latin V was pronounced like the letter U or W anyway). And the Lieu usage predates America as a country. The Brits likely used the Left usage to spite the French.
At any rate, this was discussed at length a few pages back.
Galef wrote: Isn't Lievtenant (yes, with a "V") and antiquated French word meaning "replacement"? As-is the replacement for a Captain if they are killed in battle?
And the Brits began pronouncing it Lef-tenant around the same time Americans subbed the V for a U just to spite the Brits?
I think I read that somewhere, but I'm not sure
-
It is a bit more complicated than that. And the Lieu usage predates America as a country. The Brits likely used the Left usage to spite the French.
At any rate, this was discussed at length a few pages back.
Is Luft an abbreviation of lef-tenant? It would mean Luft Huron then a replacement Huron? Which could be another joke name for 40K like:
Vulcan Hes’tan= Vulcan He’s tan (reference to skin color)
Mag Ur Thrakka = Margret Thacher
Many others out there.
Galef wrote: Isn't Lievtenant (yes, with a "V") and antiquated French word meaning "replacement"? As-is the replacement for a Captain if they are killed in battle?
And the Brits began pronouncing it Lef-tenant around the same time Americans subbed the V for a U just to spite the Brits?
I think I read that somewhere, but I'm not sure
-
It is a bit more complicated than that. And the Lieu usage predates America as a country. The Brits likely used the Left usage to spite the French.
At any rate, this was discussed at length a few pages back.
Is Luft an abbreviation of lef-tenant? It would mean Luft Huron then a replacement Huron? Which could be another joke name for 40K like:
Vulcan Hes’tan= Vulcan He’s tan (reference to skin color)
Mag Ur Thrakka = Margret Thacher
Many others out there.
No, because it’s Lugft, not Luft, and the abbreviation of Lieutenant (we don’t spell it leftenant) is Lt.
It was sincerely not my intent to derail. Someone was being mistaken and I offered them illumination.
Re: Inflation - a 10 man squad is £20-30 today. 75p (1987 price) x 10 figures x (inflation rate 2.76) = £20.70 Remembering that VAT (unavoidable tax) is actually higher now @20% than the 15% rate it was in 1987, so just under £22 in current money.
Anyway, looking forward to finding out whatever it is hidden behind the blurry pics in Primaris Lt. News. My guess is a GW/Sanrio tie-in.
aggretsuko the Space Marine version? Instead of singing death metal the cute little animal in power armour goes around saying "Blood for the Blood God" or "For the Emperor!"... that could be kinda neat honestly.
warboss wrote: So... does discussing the etymology of a 300 year old word count as news or is it a rumor? I'm just curious.
It does not, other than the fact the video made a point to pronounce it a way they have not pronounced it before.
At any rate, I wonder when we are going to get any more information on this new release. When is the two-year anniversary of the SM codex?
Pretty sure Dark Imperium came out in June 2 years ago. We should either be upon the 2 year anniversary of the SM Codex or past it already as it was the first to be released.
Thing is, this week is a bunch of random (though awaited) preorders, and then they promised Warcry this month, and you know that they're going to hype that quite a bit more before it comes out. There's two more warbands that they haven't revealed yet, after all.
If Space Marines are going to get something new, it'll likely be at the end of June or into August.
As for the pronunciation, it was polled and the Primaris Lieutenant has decreed that..
Thanks for voting in this Pronunciation Poll, everyone - with your input, I can now confirm it's pronounced "Primaris Lieutenant".
All other pronunciations are heresy.
So this isn't nesscarrily related to the upcoming release and we may not see any of these models in production, but there's an image from a GW recruitement trainee thingy that shows some models we've not seeing before, including
Could be a genuine slip up(remember how the GSC Kelermorph accidently got put in the display cabinets?) or they could be scrapped/unused test or concept sculpts.
GoatboyBeta wrote: Could be a genuine slip up(remember how the GSC Kelermorph accidently got put in the display cabinets?) or they could be scraped/unused test or concept sculpts.
If the pic is from a recruitment promotion, they'll be test sculpts done by trainee sculptors or applicants. One of the things they get prospective sculptors to do is to reproduce an existing model, to show how well they can match the style.
The thing that jumps out at me from that pic is that the Commissar appears to be better proportioned than the 'real' model...
Which are the new ones? The dude in the middle with all the skulls looks very dark apostle to me, but he also has a marine backpack so I can't tell? If loyalist I can't remember seeing a marine with those sorts of markings.
Likewise the guy on the far left, he's flying, has a power maul with something trailing off it, an iron halo as well so some kind of captain?
Dudeface wrote: Which are the new ones? The dude in the middle with all the skulls looks very dark apostle to me, but he also has a marine backpack so I can't tell? If loyalist I can't remember seeing a marine with those sorts of markings.
Likewise the guy on the far left, he's flying, has a power maul with something trailing off it, an iron halo as well so some kind of captain?
yeah those are the two new ones, the one that looks dark apostate is actually a space Marine, look closely and you'll see he's definatly wearing MK X armor.
H.B.M.C. wrote: Just because there's no general 40K news thread like there is for AoS, I'll ask this here:
Why were the Cadian Squad and Command Squads up for pre-order this week?
Probably repackaged in some way. The Leman Russ popped up the same way during the Apocalypse bundle preorders.
Or they were flagged incorrectly- that happens from time to time (for several weeks, Rubrics didn't show up in the Thousand Sons section).
The Demolisher, Sentinels and HW Teams are in 'new releases' alongside the Cadians. (at least on the US store)
BrianDavion wrote: So this isn't nesscarrily related to the upcoming release and we may not see any of these models in production, but there's an image from a GW recruitement trainee thingy that shows some models we've not seeing before, including
GW get trainees to replicate an existing sculpt as part of their training. I remember Darren Latham saying he did the old Brian Nelson freelance knight. That's what I think these are.
Sterling191 wrote: "We're gonna get a huge release on this day, you'll see!!!!!!!"
*short, silly tweet posts a different day*
"SEEEE WE WERE RIGHT!!!!!!!!!!!"
For feths sake.
Well, as I'm the only person to have noted it in here, I'll consider that a direct response - I never asserted there would be any leaks on any date. More over your reaction is more dramatic than the people (if not me) you are complaining about.
I just want to be able to freely equip my Primaris character from the armoury. The predetermined gear combos for characters is my biggest peeve with the Primaris, especially as many of the loadouts are completely idiotic. Gravis Captain has two expensive melee weapons, whilst Phohos Captains and Lieutenants with an ability to deploy close to the enemy do not get real melee weapons at all. It is so frustrating.
Crimson wrote: I just want to be able to freely equip my Primaris character from the armoury. The predetermined gear combos for characters is my biggest peeve with the Primaris, especially as many of the loadouts are completely idiotic. Gravis Captain has two expensive melee weapons, whilst Phohos Captains and Lieutenants with an ability to deploy close to the enemy do not get real melee weapons at all. It is so frustrating.
agreed. and even regular captains and lts have a really odd limiter that annoys me, the ability to take master crafted auto bolt rifles or stalker bolt rifles but not STANDARD bolt rifles. it drives me batty.
Crimson wrote: I just want to be able to freely equip my Primaris character from the armoury. The predetermined gear combos for characters is my biggest peeve with the Primaris, especially as many of the loadouts are completely idiotic. Gravis Captain has two expensive melee weapons, whilst Phohos Captains and Lieutenants with an ability to deploy close to the enemy do not get real melee weapons at all. It is so frustrating.
agreed. and even regular captains and lts have a really odd limiter that annoys me, the ability to take master crafted auto bolt rifles or stalker bolt rifles but not STANDARD bolt rifles. it drives me batty.
Why would a cappy carry a standard bolt gun? I would expect him to have a master crafted specialist bolt gun
But a master crafted bolt rifle would be good for him to then move up the board with hellblasters and still be a threat with (probably) 2x Ap-1 D2 shots
Crimson wrote: I just want to be able to freely equip my Primaris character from the armoury. The predetermined gear combos for characters is my biggest peeve with the Primaris, especially as many of the loadouts are completely idiotic. Gravis Captain has two expensive melee weapons, whilst Phohos Captains and Lieutenants with an ability to deploy close to the enemy do not get real melee weapons at all. It is so frustrating.
agreed. and even regular captains and lts have a really odd limiter that annoys me, the ability to take master crafted auto bolt rifles or stalker bolt rifles but not STANDARD bolt rifles. it drives me batty.
Why would a cappy carry a standard bolt gun? I would expect him to have a master crafted specialist bolt gun
Because their is a lot of inconsistency in the rarity of these things and their relationship to cost. In the lore weapons of different kinds are rarer than the point values in the game would leave you to believe. Even though a master crafted bolt pistol isn't much more expensive and isn't that significant a step up from a normal bolt pistols a Chapter likely has more Lascannons than master crafted bolt pistols. Consider that at one time in the IG codex there was a page that gave an in universe run down on a typical battalion, 200+ guardsmen and they only had 1 plasma gun, that was considered a relic reserved for the most dire of circumstances. At the same time we're told bolters and by extension storm bolters are rare, but they're common enough to stick on IG tanks and shipping containers... At that level of scarcity there are still more plasma guns and storm bolters in the galaxy than space marines, and they could in theory all be equipped with those weapons. The galaxy is huge and the way astartes bolters are described and venerated there is an argument to be made that their bolters and bolt pistols are all notionally master crafted, and by extension a master-crafter bolter is a master-of-master-crafted weapon.
On the table top what's the difference between the sculpt for a bolt pistol and a master crafted bolt pistol, a couple strokes of gold paint?
Crimson wrote: I just want to be able to freely equip my Primaris character from the armoury. The predetermined gear combos for characters is my biggest peeve with the Primaris, especially as many of the loadouts are completely idiotic. Gravis Captain has two expensive melee weapons, whilst Phohos Captains and Lieutenants with an ability to deploy close to the enemy do not get real melee weapons at all. It is so frustrating.
agreed. and even regular captains and lts have a really odd limiter that annoys me, the ability to take master crafted auto bolt rifles or stalker bolt rifles but not STANDARD bolt rifles. it drives me batty.
Why would a cappy carry a standard bolt gun? I would expect him to have a master crafted specialist bolt gun
I mean a styandard mastercrafted bolt rifle. not the assault or staslker varient.
Crimson wrote: I just want to be able to freely equip my Primaris character from the armoury. The predetermined gear combos for characters is my biggest peeve with the Primaris, especially as many of the loadouts are completely idiotic. Gravis Captain has two expensive melee weapons, whilst Phohos Captains and Lieutenants with an ability to deploy close to the enemy do not get real melee weapons at all. It is so frustrating.
agreed. and even regular captains and lts have a really odd limiter that annoys me, the ability to take master crafted auto bolt rifles or stalker bolt rifles but not STANDARD bolt rifles. it drives me batty.
What makes it even funnier (and dumber) is the fact they got stalker bolt rifle option a year before model with it was released, said model being mega-limited-buy-me-now-only-in-GW-stores junk, so unless you happened to grab it during a few hours it was available, the bit does not exist for all intents and purposes...
Crimson wrote: I just want to be able to freely equip my Primaris character from the armoury. The predetermined gear combos for characters is my biggest peeve with the Primaris, especially as many of the loadouts are completely idiotic. Gravis Captain has two expensive melee weapons, whilst Phohos Captains and Lieutenants with an ability to deploy close to the enemy do not get real melee weapons at all. It is so frustrating.
agreed. and even regular captains and lts have a really odd limiter that annoys me, the ability to take master crafted auto bolt rifles or stalker bolt rifles but not STANDARD bolt rifles. it drives me batty.
What makes it even funnier (and dumber) is the fact they got stalker bolt rifle option a year before model with it was released, said model being mega-limited-buy-me-now-only-in-GW-stores junk, so unless you happened to grab it during a few hours it was available, the bit does not exist for all intents and purposes...
Crimson wrote: I just want to be able to freely equip my Primaris character from the armoury. The predetermined gear combos for characters is my biggest peeve with the Primaris, especially as many of the loadouts are completely idiotic. Gravis Captain has two expensive melee weapons, whilst Phohos Captains and Lieutenants with an ability to deploy close to the enemy do not get real melee weapons at all. It is so frustrating.
agreed. and even regular captains and lts have a really odd limiter that annoys me, the ability to take master crafted auto bolt rifles or stalker bolt rifles but not STANDARD bolt rifles. it drives me batty.
Why would a cappy carry a standard bolt gun? I would expect him to have a master crafted specialist bolt gun
I mean a styandard mastercrafted bolt rifle. not the assault or staslker varient.
So it's strictly a rules thing? People want the AP-1?
Crimson wrote: I just want to be able to freely equip my Primaris character from the armoury. The predetermined gear combos for characters is my biggest peeve with the Primaris, especially as many of the loadouts are completely idiotic. Gravis Captain has two expensive melee weapons, whilst Phohos Captains and Lieutenants with an ability to deploy close to the enemy do not get real melee weapons at all. It is so frustrating.
agreed. and even regular captains and lts have a really odd limiter that annoys me, the ability to take master crafted auto bolt rifles or stalker bolt rifles but not STANDARD bolt rifles. it drives me batty.
Why would a cappy carry a standard bolt gun? I would expect him to have a master crafted specialist bolt gun
I mean a styandard mastercrafted bolt rifle. not the assault or staslker varient.
So it's strictly a rules thing? People want the AP-1?
The standard rifle is the most flexible. It probably matches the troops he’s leading into battle. It looks cool. The rules crunch is one reason, but there are plenty of fluff and aesthetic reasons as well.
For me, I’d like it so he matches the troops. He’s going to be doing the same things they are, so should be able to shoot in a similar fashion. I actually prefer the looks of the other rifles, but generally like the flexibility of the standard one. Sometimes you need to sit back, sometimes move up. My marines are there for TAC roles, and the rapid fire suits them best. The captain leading them should fit.
Crimson wrote: I just want to be able to freely equip my Primaris character from the armoury. The predetermined gear combos for characters is my biggest peeve with the Primaris, especially as many of the loadouts are completely idiotic. Gravis Captain has two expensive melee weapons, whilst Phohos Captains and Lieutenants with an ability to deploy close to the enemy do not get real melee weapons at all. It is so frustrating.
agreed. and even regular captains and lts have a really odd limiter that annoys me, the ability to take master crafted auto bolt rifles or stalker bolt rifles but not STANDARD bolt rifles. it drives me batty.
Why would a cappy carry a standard bolt gun? I would expect him to have a master crafted specialist bolt gun
I mean a styandard mastercrafted bolt rifle. not the assault or staslker varient.
So it's strictly a rules thing? People want the AP-1?
The standard rifle is the most flexible. It probably matches the troops he’s leading into battle. It looks cool. The rules crunch is one reason, but there are plenty of fluff and aesthetic reasons as well.
For me, I’d like it so he matches the troops. He’s going to be doing the same things they are, so should be able to shoot in a similar fashion. I actually prefer the looks of the other rifles, but generally like the flexibility of the standard one. Sometimes you need to sit back, sometimes move up. My marines are there for TAC roles, and the rapid fire suits them best. The captain leading them should fit.
Crimson wrote: I just want to be able to freely equip my Primaris character from the armoury. The predetermined gear combos for characters is my biggest peeve with the Primaris, especially as many of the loadouts are completely idiotic. Gravis Captain has two expensive melee weapons, whilst Phohos Captains and Lieutenants with an ability to deploy close to the enemy do not get real melee weapons at all. It is so frustrating.
agreed. and even regular captains and lts have a really odd limiter that annoys me, the ability to take master crafted auto bolt rifles or stalker bolt rifles but not STANDARD bolt rifles. it drives me batty.
Why would a cappy carry a standard bolt gun? I would expect him to have a master crafted specialist bolt gun
Because their is a lot of inconsistency in the rarity of these things and their relationship to cost. In the lore weapons of different kinds are rarer than the point values in the game would leave you to believe. Even though a master crafted bolt pistol isn't much more expensive and isn't that significant a step up from a normal bolt pistols a Chapter likely has more Lascannons than master crafted bolt pistols. Consider that at one time in the IG codex there was a page that gave an in universe run down on a typical battalion, 200+ guardsmen and they only had 1 plasma gun, that was considered a relic reserved for the most dire of circumstances. At the same time we're told bolters and by extension storm bolters are rare, but they're common enough to stick on IG tanks and shipping containers... At that level of scarcity there are still more plasma guns and storm bolters in the galaxy than space marines, and they could in theory all be equipped with those weapons. The galaxy is huge and the way astartes bolters are described and venerated there is an argument to be made that their bolters and bolt pistols are all notionally master crafted, and by extension a master-crafter bolter is a master-of-master-crafted weapon.
On the table top what's the difference between the sculpt for a bolt pistol and a master crafted bolt pistol, a couple strokes of gold paint?
Agree with this.
Aside from the points values part at the top.
Points values in game aren’t assigned by lore at all, just by the rules and abilities something has.
I’d say who gets what may be from lore sure, but that’s not points at that point (as in Just because it can have it doesn’t mean it has to).
But then on the table top equally unless they made a rule where Although several profiles can take X weapon, you can only have 1 in the army.
Then it’s just getting too messy.
I don’t think lore and game points can met really.
Point is. More captain and LT models with loadouts the better. If they aren’t going to give us multi part kits with weapons options anymore. Then they need to make more options.
(That’s a different bugbear of mine though..)
Crimson wrote: I just want to be able to freely equip my Primaris character from the armoury. The predetermined gear combos for characters is my biggest peeve with the Primaris, especially as many of the loadouts are completely idiotic. Gravis Captain has two expensive melee weapons, whilst Phohos Captains and Lieutenants with an ability to deploy close to the enemy do not get real melee weapons at all. It is so frustrating.
agreed. and even regular captains and lts have a really odd limiter that annoys me, the ability to take master crafted auto bolt rifles or stalker bolt rifles but not STANDARD bolt rifles. it drives me batty.
What makes it even funnier (and dumber) is the fact they got stalker bolt rifle option a year before model with it was released, said model being mega-limited-buy-me-now-only-in-GW-stores junk, so unless you happened to grab it during a few hours it was available, the bit does not exist for all intents and purposes...
I meant Lt with stalker rifle. The starter one only comes with assault bolter, the only Lt with stalker was the 500 stores model that came out 18 months after lieutenants got the option in Codex. And GW obviously didn't even consider using this captain as Lt, because if they did, Lts would have frakking melee + rifle option already outside of wolfwolf special snowflake one...
The HQ models made by Games Workshop have always been more or less locked into one or two weapon options, with the exception of the old Space Marine Commander kit. That’s why I’ve always preferred to kitbash my own HQs.
The models aren’t the problem. The problem is that they’re sticking with only giving them loadouts that appear on the models. GW doesn’t want to inspire conversions anymore.
The more I read this, the more I realise that it’s exceptionally obvious.
NivlacSupreme wrote: The HQ models made by Games Workshop have always been more or less locked into one or two weapon options, with the exception of the old Space Marine Commander kit. That’s why I’ve always preferred to kitbash my own HQs.
The models aren’t the problem. The problem is that they’re sticking with only giving them loadouts that appear on the models. GW doesn’t want to inspire conversions anymore.
The more I read this, the more I realise that it’s exceptionally obvious.
GW doesn't want to inspire 3rd party bits makers anymore, that's the core of the problem.
NivlacSupreme wrote: The HQ models made by Games Workshop have always been more or less locked into one or two weapon options, with the exception of the old Space Marine Commander kit. That’s why I’ve always preferred to kitbash my own HQs.
The models aren’t the problem. The problem is that they’re sticking with only giving them loadouts that appear on the models. GW doesn’t want to inspire conversions anymore.
The more I read this, the more I realise that it’s exceptionally obvious.
GW doesn't want to inspire 3rd party bits makers anymore, that's the core of the problem.
But this has nothing to do with that! I want to be able to kitbash different GW kits with each other!
Yep, I 100% get "no part, no rules" as a defense against 3rd party companies swooping in, but I think it's absurd that they've gone to the lengths of "no model, no rules," since so many kits have spare weapons that you'll have around if you collect the army at all. Kitbashing is a really enjoyable part of the hobby, and I think that rejecting that hurts the game and, to the extent that rules sell models, probably isn't the best for GW. (If, for instance, the only thing wrong with a model is its inability to take stripped down gear (because their rules are a valuable niche but not for the price) or the right generic heavyweight melee weapon, then chances are they're losing sales where they otherwise wouldn't be.)
NivlacSupreme wrote: The HQ models made by Games Workshop have always been more or less locked into one or two weapon options, with the exception of the old Space Marine Commander kit. That’s why I’ve always preferred to kitbash my own HQs.
The models aren’t the problem. The problem is that they’re sticking with only giving them loadouts that appear on the models. GW doesn’t want to inspire conversions anymore.
The more I read this, the more I realise that it’s exceptionally obvious.
But the thing is, you at the same time NEED to kitbash most of the primaris range anyway. Want stalker on Lt? Kitbash was the only option last 2 years, unless you scored 500 shops model on that one day. Captain with plasma pistol? Kitbash only, unless you got store birthday model. Sarges? Literally every singe melee option requires kitbashing. Ancient? Kitbash or starter model. Etc, etc, it's really dumb and irregular while at the same bleeding sales from stupid inconsistencies (like reiver sarges not being able to actually take any melee options to make the unit less toothless, or only half of the range having access to plasma pistols for no reason, while the other half has access to melee weapons, making it impossible to combine iconic power sword/plasma pistol loadout on anything...)
Crimson wrote: But this has nothing to do with that! I want to be able to kitbash different GW kits with each other!
The fact that you can't easily do that these days has everything to do with their fear of third party bits makers.
They're trying to remove a market for 3rd party stuff. If there is no reason(rules/whatever) for you to need a different weapon than what specifically come in the box, then they dont have to worry about you spending hobby$€£¥ elsewhere.
Crimson wrote: But this has nothing to do with that! I want to be able to kitbash different GW kits with each other!
The fact that you can't easily do that these days has everything to do with their fear of third party bits makers.
They're trying to remove a market for 3rd party stuff. If there is no reason(rules/whatever) for you to need a different weapon than what specifically come in the box, then they dont have to worry about you spending hobby$€£¥ elsewhere.
Which is daft on their part because the 3rd party market has long since switched to two main areas:
1) bits/models that are directly analagous to GW stuff, but give you a different/custom aesthetic
2) wargear GW gives you too little of in official kits (CSM Chain reaper cannon for example.)
The established 3rd party companies like Kromlech and Anvil aren't going to disappear because GW cut down on the options they give us, as that's not what's been generating their money. However, GWs current choices regarding those restrictions and the subsequent kit design do mean one of the more fun parts of the hobby for some of us, kitbashing, is being made incrementally more difficult and unecessary.
And Anvil’s main market seems to be the Guard now. They offer about as many warhead options as GW does and only really have more aesthetic differences.
NivlacSupreme wrote: The HQ models made by Games Workshop have always been more or less locked into one or two weapon options, with the exception of the old Space Marine Commander kit. That’s why I’ve always preferred to kitbash my own HQs.
The models aren’t the problem. The problem is that they’re sticking with only giving them loadouts that appear on the models. GW doesn’t want to inspire conversions anymore.
The more I read this, the more I realise that it’s exceptionally obvious.
GW doesn't want to inspire 3rd party bits makers anymore, that's the core of the problem.
Then they've failed miserably as 3rd party bits have never been MORE popular. So basically GW is making their kits less useful because of a problem that isn't a problem
Crimson wrote: I just want to be able to freely equip my Primaris character from the armoury. The predetermined gear combos for characters is my biggest peeve with the Primaris, especially as many of the loadouts are completely idiotic. Gravis Captain has two expensive melee weapons, whilst Phohos Captains and Lieutenants with an ability to deploy close to the enemy do not get real melee weapons at all. It is so frustrating.
agreed. and even regular captains and lts have a really odd limiter that annoys me, the ability to take master crafted auto bolt rifles or stalker bolt rifles but not STANDARD bolt rifles. it drives me batty.
Why would a cappy carry a standard bolt gun? I would expect him to have a master crafted specialist bolt gun
I mean a styandard mastercrafted bolt rifle. not the assault or staslker varient.
So it's strictly a rules thing? People want the AP-1?
The standard rifle is the most flexible. It probably matches the troops he’s leading into battle. It looks cool. The rules crunch is one reason, but there are plenty of fluff and aesthetic reasons as well.
For me, I’d like it so he matches the troops. He’s going to be doing the same things they are, so should be able to shoot in a similar fashion. I actually prefer the looks of the other rifles, but generally like the flexibility of the standard one. Sometimes you need to sit back, sometimes move up. My marines are there for TAC roles, and the rapid fire suits them best. The captain leading them should fit.
YMMV.
So it's like guard players getting sick of being the only army where they can't just take their standard rifle on NCO's and Officers. Which means it'll never happen because GW likes watching us suffer for some reason
Crimson wrote: But this has nothing to do with that! I want to be able to kitbash different GW kits with each other!
The fact that you can't easily do that these days has everything to do with their fear of third party bits makers.
They're trying to remove a market for 3rd party stuff. If there is no reason(rules/whatever) for you to need a different weapon than what specifically come in the box, then they dont have to worry about you spending hobby$€£¥ elsewhere.
Well for my money that backfired on them hard, since that trend contributed to my general dissatisfaction with 40K and now I spend more money on Legion than I do on GW.
Crimson wrote: But this has nothing to do with that! I want to be able to kitbash different GW kits with each other!
The fact that you can't easily do that these days has everything to do with their fear of third party bits makers.
They're trying to remove a market for 3rd party stuff. If there is no reason(rules/whatever) for you to need a different weapon than what specifically come in the box, then they dont have to worry about you spending hobby$€£¥ elsewhere.
Well for my money that backfired on them hard, since that trend contributed to my general dissatisfaction with 40K and now I spend more money on Legion than I do on GW.
doesn't legion have even less customization then 40k?
sockwithaticket wrote: The established 3rd party companies like Kromlech and Anvil aren't going to disappear because GW cut down on the options they give us, as that's not what's been generating their money. However, GWs current choices regarding those restrictions and the subsequent kit design do mean one of the more fun parts of the hobby for some of us, kitbashing, is being made incrementally more difficult and unecessary.
We never said that their choices were logical, only that they were doing them and we know the reasons why.
Crimson wrote: But this has nothing to do with that! I want to be able to kitbash different GW kits with each other!
The fact that you can't easily do that these days has everything to do with their fear of third party bits makers.
They're trying to remove a market for 3rd party stuff. If there is no reason(rules/whatever) for you to need a different weapon than what specifically come in the box, then they dont have to worry about you spending hobby$€£¥ elsewhere.
Well for my money that backfired on them hard, since that trend contributed to my general dissatisfaction with 40K and now I spend more money on Legion than I do on GW.
doesn't legion have even less customization then 40k?
It might? It's an FFG game, so AFAIK unless you're playing in super-serial tournaments what matters are the cards and doodads not the models, so long as they're vague approximations. Regardless, I'm largely spending the money on the models because I want the models, I can use them in any number of games and RPGs.
It's not like I've quit buying GW stuff and burned my army on youtube, but the state of the rules generally and the lack of customisation relative to previous/other GW games specifically, combined with the fluff changes, means I don't play regular 40K any more, and GW have gone from having 90% of my hobby money just prior to the canning of WHF to, between Legion, third party, and 3D printing, maybe 20%? Which is, IMO, why removing options to try and counter third parties is pointless - the vast majority of its customers neither know, nor care to know about third party model and bits makers, and would have been kitbashing other GW parts to access the options that are now gone. The ones that do know about them and use them are also the most likely to be heavily involved in tabletop as a hobby in a more general sense than just The Hobby, and so also the ones most able to simply redirect their spending elsewhere if they're not satisifed.
sockwithaticket wrote: The established 3rd party companies like Kromlech and Anvil aren't going to disappear because GW cut down on the options they give us, as that's not what's been generating their money. However, GWs current choices regarding those restrictions and the subsequent kit design do mean one of the more fun parts of the hobby for some of us, kitbashing, is being made incrementally more difficult and unecessary.
We never said that their choices were logical, only that they were doing them and we know the reasons why.
Dumb reasons are still reasons.
Oh I know, I was just chiming in with my own "They're being idiots", in mild disbelief.
NivlacSupreme wrote: The HQ models made by Games Workshop have always been more or less locked into one or two weapon options, with the exception of the old Space Marine Commander kit. That’s why I’ve always preferred to kitbash my own HQs.
The models aren’t the problem. The problem is that they’re sticking with only giving them loadouts that appear on the models. GW doesn’t want to inspire conversions anymore.
The more I read this, the more I realise that it’s exceptionally obvious.
GW doesn't want to inspire 3rd party bits makers anymore, that's the core of the problem.
Then they've failed miserably as 3rd party bits have never been MORE popular. So basically GW is making their kits less useful because of a problem that isn't a problem
The point was made to them in the whole Chapterhouse Studios suit; even when people buy third party bits and parts it means people buy the GW models to put them on. GW might think they're protecting their IP and helping their bottom line but all GW is doing is taking people who would have still bought their GW products then supplemented it with 3rd party bits and pushed them towards just finding complete 3rd party alternatives or not buying at all.
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