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We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/07/21 15:31:27


Post by: Tiberius501


The mighty men and women of the free cities are finally being shown some love!
“Contained within you’ll find allegiance abilities for whichever city your army hails from, as well as over-arching abilities such as picking a retinue and personal advisor for your general.”
That last bit sounds badass.

Also chucking the Aelves and Duradin in along with the Free Peoples and Ironweld Arsenal.

[Thumb - A814EE8D-A022-41E7-B91C-9C2BBF43A41C.jpeg]


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/07/21 17:13:01


Post by: Strg Alt


Looks like a late April´s fool joke. But nice job anyway.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/07/21 17:39:31


Post by: auticus


No its real. It was announced this weekend. Its on the warhammer community blog.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/07/21 20:24:57


Post by: Ghaz


 Strg Alt wrote:
Looks like a late April´s fool joke. But nice job anyway.

As noted, that's a real book. This one was the joke...



We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/07/22 06:28:19


Post by: FrozenDwarf


comes with a minor bitter taste tough, some of the existing units from humans/elfs/dwarfs range will be chucked into legends status upon the release of the book.
and im not expecting any new units/heroes releases since sigmarines, steamdwarfs and walking trees can mix with this tome.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/07/22 11:48:46


Post by: Cronch


It's a nice way to keep the minor factions from being completely squatted or relegated to GH allegiances forever, and that's about all this is.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/07/22 11:54:56


Post by: Overread


I hope this is the next thing after Warcry, not because I don't want Destruction to get attention, but because of all the books this is the most impenetrable as to what GW will do with it. Plus there's the loss of models and the combination of armies and more. So whilst knowing the book exists it actually raises loads more questions than it answers.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/07/22 13:37:43


Post by: Tiberius501


Yeah I agree. I’d love to know if this is a book to be keen for or one to say goodbye to the old models with.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/07/22 13:42:08


Post by: auticus


laughs in slaves to darkness.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/07/22 15:36:41


Post by: NinthMusketeer


 auticus wrote:
laughs in slaves to darkness.
Well you have some new units (which are actually pretty good) to tie you over, at least!


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Overread wrote:
I hope this is the next thing after Warcry, not because I don't want Destruction to get attention, but because of all the books this is the most impenetrable as to what GW will do with it. Plus there's the loss of models and the combination of armies and more. So whilst knowing the book exists it actually raises loads more questions than it answers.
Agreed, it is something that has been needed badly since the original faction split.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/07/22 17:06:08


Post by: Overread


Also Slaves are unlikely to lose anything model wise with a big update and their army has remained pretty stable and clear through the lifespan of AoS, which has probably been why they've been overlooked for so long. If anything they'll get a load of new toys and models to play with even if just from warcry with the warbands and the chaos beasts.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/07/22 17:15:30


Post by: Dr. Mills


Always wanted a free people's army.

If thus book is any good, it could persuade me to dip my feet into AoS as a whole...


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/07/22 17:47:18


Post by: auticus


 Overread wrote:
Also Slaves are unlikely to lose anything model wise with a big update and their army has remained pretty stable and clear through the lifespan of AoS, which has probably been why they've been overlooked for so long. If anything they'll get a load of new toys and models to play with even if just from warcry with the warbands and the chaos beasts.


I'd just like to be able to play with my toys without getting my nose rubbed in pooh and told to git gud because my army is mathematically garbage and can't keep up with anything else.

Hell cut half of my model collection and put it into legends, I don't care, so long as I can get some competitive war scrolls and realistiic point costs.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/07/22 18:20:43


Post by: NinthMusketeer


At least you can use them in mono-god armies.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/07/23 14:32:34


Post by: Dynas


Yeah. Might finally come back to fantasy. Got lots of old Empire, Brets and Dwarves that need to come out of there cases. Hopefully they don't ditch all my models.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/07/23 14:37:02


Post by: Tiberius501


Even amongst all of the beautiful new models in AoS, my favorite faction is still the Free Peoples, (and Gloomspite) and I didn’t even play old fantasy.

Reckon we’re getting a terrain piece and endless spells?


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/07/23 14:49:31


Post by: Kanluwen


 Tiberius501 wrote:
Even amongst all of the beautiful new models in AoS, my favorite faction is still the Free Peoples, (and Gloomspite) and I didn’t even play old fantasy.

Reckon we’re getting a terrain piece and endless spells?

It would be really difficult, IMO, to do a terrain piece or Endless Spells to cover the different factions.

I'd guess we would see some kind of watchtower scenery piece though.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/07/23 14:53:52


Post by: nels1031


 Tiberius501 wrote:
Reckon we’re getting a terrain piece and endless spells?


I have no idea, but I'm getting a "minimal effort" vibe here, as far as new kits. I think perhaps the Collegiate Arcane will get bonuses to certain Endless Spells based on what particular flavor of wizard you bring. I think if they had new kits to show off, they would have. Empire(Freeguild's predecessor) was always the faction that made do with the generic stuff.

My main hype for this book (and the Orruk tome) is new rules and lore. I would love to be wrong that they aren't bringing more kits out, but I think if they were coming, we would have seen it at the reveal.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Kanluwen wrote:
I'd guess we would see some kind of watchtower scenery piece though.


Return of the Empire buildings would be awesome! As well as somewhat useable in Warcry.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/07/23 14:58:52


Post by: Kanluwen


I'd imagine it would be something new for design that could be compatible with the Azyrite Ruins.

I'm guessing(guessing here!) that what we'll see, if anything, for kits will be plastic heroes...or just the ability to make heroes out of existing kits ala FEC. There's a mention about your generals being able to have retinues of 'advisors' so that's a thing.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/07/23 15:07:51


Post by: nels1031


 Kanluwen wrote:
There's a mention about your generals being able to have retinues of 'advisors' so that's a thing.


I read that more as a unique version of Command/Mount Traits, personally.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/07/23 16:03:42


Post by: amazingturtles


Nifty! I mean a few years ago it didn't seem like it might ever happen, so i am going to be hopeful.

Hopeful do you hear me?!


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/07/24 04:14:19


Post by: Apple fox


Its about time GW.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/07/26 19:11:27


Post by: Ultra Grey


 auticus wrote:


I'd just like to be able to play with my toys without getting my nose rubbed in pooh and told to git gud because my army is mathematically garbage and can't keep up with anything else.

Hell cut half of my model collection and put it into legends, I don't care, so long as I can get some competitive war scrolls and realistiic point costs.


I share your pain. I started a small Tree army just so I could win from time to time.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/07/26 22:06:55


Post by: Belasko


As a dispossessed player I am certainly glad to see a Free peoples book finally. But I will wait and see since some units may be eliminated and until we ahve the book we wont be sure if what remains will have decent rules.

I would like to see dwarves get their artiillery back as part of the dispossessed (doubt it though).

I would like to see miners included in the new book (doubt it though) as they were a unit that helped with the slow dwarf movement issues.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/07/29 05:56:30


Post by: DeathKorp_Rider


Me and my Slave to Darkness continue to feel the neglect. It can only fuel our devotion to the gods of chaos...


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/07/29 13:20:53


Post by: EnTyme


Well, all the new Chaos units for Warcry are Slaves to Darkness models, so we've got that going for us.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/07/29 14:22:44


Post by: Kanluwen


 EnTyme wrote:
Well, all the new Chaos units for Warcry are Slaves to Darkness models, so we've got that going for us.

There's also the Darkoath Warqueen from Malign Portents, War Chief from Silver Tower, and the Godsworn Hunt from Underworlds.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/07/29 14:28:10


Post by: Skinnereal


A free book!?!??! Nice.

Oh, a book for 'Free Cities'. Nice too, but ...


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/07/29 15:48:32


Post by: auticus


The warcry stuff is nice. Yay new models. I like that.

However not being able to really use a competent army in AOS and having to resort to other factions still sucks.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/07/29 16:11:17


Post by: EnTyme


I'm sure we'll get a battletome soon(ish). I thought it might come out with Warcry, but sadly not. Maybe we'll see it when the two warbands that haven't been previewed yet are released. One of them (Spire Lords or something like that?) sound like very similar to Varanguard to me, and the popular speculation is that Everchosen and Slaves are being combined, so that makes sense to me. In either case, I don't think we really need to drag this thread off topic. This should be speculation about Free Cities, not complaining about Slaves to Darkness.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/07/29 16:25:29


Post by: Kanluwen


 EnTyme wrote:
I'm sure we'll get a battletome soon(ish). I thought it might come out with Warcry, but sadly not. Maybe we'll see it when the two warbands that haven't been previewed yet are released. One of them (Spire Lords or something like that?) sound like very similar to Varanguard to me, and the popular speculation is that Everchosen and Slaves are being combined, so that makes sense to me. In either case, I don't think we really need to drag this thread off topic. This should be speculation about Free Cities, not complaining about Slaves to Darkness.

Spire Lords are more Gladiator-inspired than anything else from what their fluff sounded like. It sounds like that's where the wires crossed over a Varanguard Warband.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/07/29 18:49:14


Post by: NinthMusketeer


 auticus wrote:
The warcry stuff is nice. Yay new models. I like that.

However not being able to really use a competent army in AOS and having to resort to other factions still sucks.
They aren't another faction; they are StD. I think I get what you mean though. However think of it this way; you can convert marauders to create large units utilizing the Warcry warscrolls. Total War has marauder champions (basically marauders with heavy armor); one could create a unit like that using the Iron Golems warscroll. 280 points for a 40-wound unit with rerollable 4+ armor is a major asset even if it isn't battleline.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/07/29 20:35:18


Post by: Elmir


Even the Chaos beasts are getting the StD keyword apparently. Also, I've taken this little quote from their warhammer community article:

One more thing! As you may have noticed at the weekend, both the Raptoryx and Furies have new warscrolls for use in your Slaves to Darkness army, representing stragglers and thralls that accompany Archaon’s armies as they sally forth from the Eightpoints.


I'm assuming this is a bit of a "slip of the tongue" admission that a Varanguard/slaves/Archaon book is being worked on.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/07/29 20:49:02


Post by: DeathKorp_Rider


 Elmir wrote:
Even the Chaos beasts are getting the StD keyword apparently. Also, I've taken this little quote from their warhammer community article:

One more thing! As you may have noticed at the weekend, both the Raptoryx and Furies have new warscrolls for use in your Slaves to Darkness army, representing stragglers and thralls that accompany Archaon’s armies as they sally forth from the Eightpoints.


I'm assuming this is a bit of a "slip of the tongue" admission that a Varanguard/slaves/Archaon book is being worked on.

Archaeon already has a book, Everchosen

Also we should move this conversation elsewhere


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/07/29 21:05:39


Post by: auticus


 NinthMusketeer wrote:
 auticus wrote:
The warcry stuff is nice. Yay new models. I like that.

However not being able to really use a competent army in AOS and having to resort to other factions still sucks.
They aren't another faction; they are StD. I think I get what you mean though. However think of it this way; you can convert marauders to create large units utilizing the Warcry warscrolls. Total War has marauder champions (basically marauders with heavy armor); one could create a unit like that using the Iron Golems warscroll. 280 points for a 40-wound unit with rerollable 4+ armor is a major asset even if it isn't battleline.


I don't think the warcry additions to the StD army makes them really viable when your opponent is rocking the tournament cheese. They are nice models but the core of the army is still putrid and they need better rules all around.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/07/29 21:14:53


Post by: EnTyme


Seriously, folks. This is supposed to be a thread for the Free Cities book. If want want to complain about StD not getting a book/speculate on what will/should be in that book, can we create a new thread for that? I'd like to continue the discussion, but this isn't the place.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/07/29 21:56:50


Post by: NinthMusketeer


Let's just take it to the general discussion thread.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/07/30 04:01:42


Post by: Tiberius501


Hopefully the book goes up for pre-order soon and we get to see some previews. I’d love to know what retinues and advisors mean for the army.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/07/30 08:15:45


Post by: Eldarsif


Only thing I fear and will annoy me and cause great ire is the fact that 99% of the CoS line is Direct Order. It means it will be a very inaccessible line where I live.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/07/30 09:43:39


Post by: Gir Spirit Bane


Any speculation on what Free Guild units are facing the chopping block? (barring the metal/failcast wanderers units)

I see them keeping Dwarf warriors, as the unit is still good looking in blocks and forms a core of a lot of players armies.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/07/30 11:32:46


Post by: Kanluwen


Gir Spirit Bane wrote:
Any speculation on what Free Guild units are facing the chopping block? (barring the metal/failcast wanderers units)

Literally the only Wanderer units that are metal/resin are Heroes. Pay. Attention. The units were cut when AoS dropped.

I see them keeping Dwarf warriors, as the unit is still good looking in blocks and forms a core of a lot of players armies.

Frankly? I expect Warriors to go.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Eldarsif wrote:
Only thing I fear and will annoy me and cause great ire is the fact that 99% of the CoS line is Direct Order. It means it will be a very inaccessible line where I live.

It likely won't be when the book drops.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/07/30 12:06:23


Post by: Future War Cultist


I’ve got a good amount of the old Pizzaro’s Lost Legion minis that are asking to be AoSified. So this book is good news to me. I’m curious to see how it’s all presented, and I’m also a little curious as to what minis are for the chop. I can see all the non plastic minis going, but I’m also thinking about the older plastic kits with the odd number of minis. The duardin warrior and quarreller/thunderer kits and the glade guard kit to be exact. Are they for the chop? Or are they going to change the unit sizes to match the box contents? Or will they jam in an extra sprue to bring them up to kits of 20? Personally I hope it’s number 3.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/07/30 12:37:42


Post by: Kanluwen


Frankly, I think a lot of what's "going" isn't even sold anymore.

There's a lot of Swifthawk Agents stuff(Spireguard, High Warden, Reavers) that was only in Island of Blood.

My hope is that Glade Guard are going to be revised from 'blocks of archers' and brought into a more 'skirmishing huntsmen' mentality like the old Deepwood Scouts/Waywatchers were.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/07/30 13:24:08


Post by: Gir Spirit Bane


 Kanluwen wrote:
Gir Spirit Bane wrote:
Any speculation on what Free Guild units are facing the chopping block? (barring the metal/failcast wanderers units)

Literally the only Wanderer units that are metal/resin are Heroes. Pay. Attention. The units were cut when AoS dropped.


That seemed a little rude to a genuine question bud.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/07/30 13:41:54


Post by: Tiberius501


Gir Spirit Bane wrote:
 Kanluwen wrote:
Gir Spirit Bane wrote:
Any speculation on what Free Guild units are facing the chopping block? (barring the metal/failcast wanderers units)

Literally the only Wanderer units that are metal/resin are Heroes. Pay. Attention. The units were cut when AoS dropped.


That seemed a little rude to a genuine question bud.


Also characters technically count as units too, so it was a little unnecessary.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/07/30 13:51:20


Post by: Kanluwen


Gir Spirit Bane wrote:
 Kanluwen wrote:
Gir Spirit Bane wrote:
Any speculation on what Free Guild units are facing the chopping block? (barring the metal/failcast wanderers units)

Literally the only Wanderer units that are metal/resin are Heroes. Pay. Attention. The units were cut when AoS dropped.


That seemed a little rude to a genuine question bud.

You're right and it was. Apologies, but it's been a common question and the point I've been trying to make since before the book's announcement has continually been ignored. It leads to some grumpiness on my part.

There isn't much left in the Wanderers range to even be cut. Between the Sylvaneth branching out(no apologies for the pun! ) into their own army and the cut of stuff at the launch of AoS? It's been cut to the bone.

We lost:
Waywatchers(unit)
Shadowdancer(hero version of Wardancers)
Wardancers(unit)
Deepwood Scouts(unit, they were built out of the Glade Guard kit)
Glade Lords(Hero, had five versions: foot, Great Stag, Forest Dragon, Great Eagle, Elven Steed)
Glade Captain(Hero, had three versions: foot, Banner Bearer, Elven Steed)
Spellsinger(Minor tier Wizard Hero)
Great Eagles(Monster unit)
Warhawk Riders(unit)
Unicorn mount option for Spellweavers(it was also there for Spellsingers)
Sisters of Twilight(named characters with a Forest Dragon or Great Eagle mount)

We also, technically, lost Araloth. We kinda/sorta still have him as the Nomad Prince.

Onto the Sylvaneth side of things...
Treemen Ancients(Monster, Lord choice)
Drycha(named character)
Dryads(unit)
Treeman(Monster unit)

And both factions didn't get the Tree-Kin(Ogre sized Treeman unit in between Treemen and Dryads).

So all told we lost 16 unit entries(not counting mount options) in exchange for:
-A "generic" Araloth
-Sisters of the Watch(a unit taken from the High Elves and given to us, for some reason, and thrown in as a Battleline If Waywatcher is General option).

If you can find some stuff to cut without dropping Wanderers from their current depressingly small unit count? I'd be open to hearing it.

Right now, Wanderers consists of:

Heroes
Waywatcher
Nomad Prince
Wayfinder
Waystrider
Spellweaver

Units
Wild Riders
Sisters of the Thorn
Glade Guard
Eternal Guard
Wildwood Rangers
Sisters of the Watch

That's a whopping 11 unit entries left, with 2 of them(Wild Riders/Sisters of the Thorn and Eternal Guard/Wildwood Rangers) being a dual kit and one(Sisters of the Watch/Shadow Warriors) being one half of a dual kit

 Tiberius501 wrote:

Also characters technically count as units too, so it was a little unnecessary.

When most people say "units", specifically in the context of cutting things, they're not referring to characters. At least in my experience. It's why I make a point of referring to "unit entries".


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/07/30 15:08:17


Post by: Gir Spirit Bane


Spoiler:
 Kanluwen wrote:
Gir Spirit Bane wrote:
 Kanluwen wrote:
Gir Spirit Bane wrote:
Any speculation on what Free Guild units are facing the chopping block? (barring the metal/failcast wanderers units)

Literally the only Wanderer units that are metal/resin are Heroes. Pay. Attention. The units were cut when AoS dropped.


That seemed a little rude to a genuine question bud.

You're right and it was. Apologies, but it's been a common question and the point I've been trying to make since before the book's announcement has continually been ignored. It leads to some grumpiness on my part.

There isn't much left in the Wanderers range to even be cut. Between the Sylvaneth branching out(no apologies for the pun! ) into their own army and the cut of stuff at the launch of AoS? It's been cut to the bone.

We lost:
Waywatchers(unit)
Shadowdancer(hero version of Wardancers)
Wardancers(unit)
Deepwood Scouts(unit, they were built out of the Glade Guard kit)
Glade Lords(Hero, had five versions: foot, Great Stag, Forest Dragon, Great Eagle, Elven Steed)
Glade Captain(Hero, had three versions: foot, Banner Bearer, Elven Steed)
Spellsinger(Minor tier Wizard Hero)
Great Eagles(Monster unit)
Warhawk Riders(unit)
Unicorn mount option for Spellweavers(it was also there for Spellsingers)
Sisters of Twilight(named characters with a Forest Dragon or Great Eagle mount)

We also, technically, lost Araloth. We kinda/sorta still have him as the Nomad Prince.

Onto the Sylvaneth side of things...
Treemen Ancients(Monster, Lord choice)
Drycha(named character)
Dryads(unit)
Treeman(Monster unit)

And both factions didn't get the Tree-Kin(Ogre sized Treeman unit in between Treemen and Dryads).

So all told we lost 16 unit entries(not counting mount options) in exchange for:
-A "generic" Araloth
-Sisters of the Watch(a unit taken from the High Elves and given to us, for some reason, and thrown in as a Battleline If Waywatcher is General option).

If you can find some stuff to cut without dropping Wanderers from their current depressingly small unit count? I'd be open to hearing it.

Right now, Wanderers consists of:

Heroes
Waywatcher
Nomad Prince
Wayfinder
Waystrider
Spellweaver

Units
Wild Riders
Sisters of the Thorn
Glade Guard
Eternal Guard
Wildwood Rangers
Sisters of the Watch

That's a whopping 11 unit entries left, with 2 of them(Wild Riders/Sisters of the Thorn and Eternal Guard/Wildwood Rangers) being a dual kit and one(Sisters of the Watch/Shadow Warriors) being one half of a dual kit

 Tiberius501 wrote:

Also characters technically count as units too, so it was a little unnecessary.

When most people say "units", specifically in the context of cutting things, they're not referring to characters. At least in my experience. It's why I make a point of referring to "unit entries".


I can understand repeating yourself constantly on the same subject can quickly wear down anyone's nerves, and thank you for both the apology and genuinely great write up on it

I have Chaos and Destruction armies but I am very much interested in having a Order shooting army, so of course Wanderers and Iron weld Arsenal have my eye so this may be the start of a new project for me


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/07/30 15:33:26


Post by: Kanluwen


I'd highly suggest Overlords for shooting. I know they're in a rough spot right now, but thematically they do it so well!


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/07/30 20:23:16


Post by: herjan1987


 Kanluwen wrote:
Gir Spirit Bane wrote:
 Kanluwen wrote:
Gir Spirit Bane wrote:
Any speculation on what Free Guild units are facing the chopping block? (barring the metal/failcast wanderers units)

Literally the only Wanderer units that are metal/resin are Heroes. Pay. Attention. The units were cut when AoS dropped.


That seemed a little rude to a genuine question bud.

You're right and it was. Apologies, but it's been a common question and the point I've been trying to make since before the book's announcement has continually been ignored. It leads to some grumpiness on my part.

There isn't much left in the Wanderers range to even be cut. Between the Sylvaneth branching out(no apologies for the pun! ) into their own army and the cut of stuff at the launch of AoS? It's been cut to the bone.

We lost:
Waywatchers(unit)
Shadowdancer(hero version of Wardancers)
Wardancers(unit)
Deepwood Scouts(unit, they were built out of the Glade Guard kit)
Glade Lords(Hero, had five versions: foot, Great Stag, Forest Dragon, Great Eagle, Elven Steed)
Glade Captain(Hero, had three versions: foot, Banner Bearer, Elven Steed)
Spellsinger(Minor tier Wizard Hero)
Great Eagles(Monster unit)
Warhawk Riders(unit)
Unicorn mount option for Spellweavers(it was also there for Spellsingers)
Sisters of Twilight(named characters with a Forest Dragon or Great Eagle mount)

We also, technically, lost Araloth. We kinda/sorta still have him as the Nomad Prince.

Onto the Sylvaneth side of things...
Treemen Ancients(Monster, Lord choice)
Drycha(named character)
Dryads(unit)
Treeman(Monster unit)

And both factions didn't get the Tree-Kin(Ogre sized Treeman unit in between Treemen and Dryads).

So all told we lost 16 unit entries(not counting mount options) in exchange for:
-A "generic" Araloth
-Sisters of the Watch(a unit taken from the High Elves and given to us, for some reason, and thrown in as a Battleline If Waywatcher is General option).

If you can find some stuff to cut without dropping Wanderers from their current depressingly small unit count? I'd be open to hearing it.

Right now, Wanderers consists of:

Heroes
Waywatcher
Nomad Prince
Wayfinder
Waystrider
Spellweaver

Units
Wild Riders
Sisters of the Thorn
Glade Guard
Eternal Guard
Wildwood Rangers
Sisters of the Watch

That's a whopping 11 unit entries left, with 2 of them(Wild Riders/Sisters of the Thorn and Eternal Guard/Wildwood Rangers) being a dual kit and one(Sisters of the Watch/Shadow Warriors) being one half of a dual kit

 Tiberius501 wrote:

Also characters technically count as units too, so it was a little unnecessary.

When most people say "units", specifically in the context of cutting things, they're not referring to characters. At least in my experience. It's why I make a point of referring to "unit entries".


You forgot Orion.

Does anyone know how good the Dark elf Dreadspears/Darshards/Bleakswords kit sell? I need to grab a few of each and there would be a redundancy with the Eternal Guard/Wilwood Rangers kit in spear elves. Also the Dark elves minis where not present on the display where they announced the Cities of Sigmar book.

Also does anyone know that when do the Ogre battletome will comeout. I need to pick up some of maneaters and some Ironguts.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/07/30 21:56:20


Post by: Kanluwen


I always forget Orion and his Hunting Hounds(two separate units!)!

Which is hilarious since they're the things I've most wanted to come back.

We didn't see a lot of things shown off, so I wouldn't read anything into it. There really isn't any crossover between them and the Wanderers stuff.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/07/30 23:53:42


Post by: Eldarsif


 Kanluwen wrote:
Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Eldarsif wrote:
Only thing I fear and will annoy me and cause great ire is the fact that 99% of the CoS line is Direct Order. It means it will be a very inaccessible line where I live.

It likely won't be when the book drops.


Nah, it will continue to be DO unless the manufacturing and box printing output changes for GW. Beasts of Chaos is still a huge range in Direct Order for the most part for example.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/07/31 01:55:53


Post by: Inquisitor Jex


I'm awaiting the Free citites book. I don't know which unit they'll remove, thought I can imagine the huntsmen box getting the chop, leaving hte box to be elven exclusive, leaving humans with crossbows and handguns.

The human wizard box is also OOP, so that's one thing that's either getting a makeover or is gone for good.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/07/31 02:06:46


Post by: nels1031


Inquisitor Jex wrote:
The human wizard box is also OOP, so that's one thing that's either getting a makeover or is gone for good.


Didn’t they change it to a multi-character box?


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/07/31 03:12:36


Post by: Ghaz


Inquisitor Jex wrote:
I'm awaiting the Free citites book. I don't know which unit they'll remove, thought I can imagine the huntsmen box getting the chop, leaving hte box to be elven exclusive, leaving humans with crossbows and handguns.

The human wizard box is also OOP, so that's one thing that's either getting a makeover or is gone for good.

The Collegiate Arcane Mystic Battle Wizards kit is still in production (albeit as a Direct Only product).


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/07/31 12:44:45


Post by: Marleymoo


I thought the Wanderer stuff got aos'ed ages ago. With the round bases and new boxes, etc. I'm surprised it took them this long to get put into a proper army book.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/07/31 12:57:46


Post by: Kanluwen


 Ghaz wrote:
Inquisitor Jex wrote:
I'm awaiting the Free citites book. I don't know which unit they'll remove, thought I can imagine the huntsmen box getting the chop, leaving hte box to be elven exclusive, leaving humans with crossbows and handguns.

The human wizard box is also OOP, so that's one thing that's either getting a makeover or is gone for good.

The Collegiate Arcane Mystic Battle Wizards kit is still in production (albeit as a Direct Only product).

There's definitely redesign potential though.


From the Age of Sigmar RPG. They just posted it on Monday. A lot of what we've been seeing from them has been almost 1:1 on models, so I wouldn't be shocked if this or something like it ends up making an appearance.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Marleymoo wrote:
I thought the Wanderer stuff got aos'ed ages ago. With the round bases and new boxes, etc. I'm surprised it took them this long to get put into a proper army book.

Wanderers have been in a weird spot. For at least 2 General's Handbooks now we've had Allegiance Abilities, Relics, and Command Traits. We got round based fairly early on for the Eternal Guard/Wildwood Rangers(both were popular kits for Incubi conversions locally, so I'd be surprised if that wasn't the case elsewhere too) and Wild Riders/Sisters of the Thorn and Glade Guard came awhile later. Same goes for the Nomad Prince(who was out of stock for a good five months or so), our only plastic hero choice.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/03 01:00:07


Post by: Inquisitor Jex


 Ghaz wrote:
Inquisitor Jex wrote:
I'm awaiting the Free citites book. I don't know which unit they'll remove, thought I can imagine the huntsmen box getting the chop, leaving hte box to be elven exclusive, leaving humans with crossbows and handguns.

The human wizard box is also OOP, so that's one thing that's either getting a makeover or is gone for good.


The Collegiate Arcane Mystic Battle Wizards kit is still in production (albeit as a Direct Only product).


Ah I didn't saw that one, thanks!


Automatically Appended Next Post:
UPDATE: I jsut went to the GW page, and they added a few/alot of models to thier last cahnce to order page

https://www.games-workshop.com/en-CA/Warhammer?N=3123050006+3155674414&Nr=AND%28product.locale%3Aen_CA_gw%2Csku.siteId%3ACA_gw%29&Nrs=collection%28%29%2Frecord%5Bproduct.startDate+%3C%3D+1564768920000+and+product.endDate+%3E%3D+1564768920000%5D

So yeah...new leaders boxset is coming I assume


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/03 02:23:42


Post by: Tiberius501


Ouch, that is a LOT of characters... yeah I really hope they do a couple of new models or something, because that’s a little bit rough.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/03 02:29:04


Post by: timetowaste85


I can’t ever keep track...does LCTB on these mean they’re not coming back in any way, shape or form? Or are they LCTB so they can get round bases and a new box?


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/03 02:31:08


Post by: Tiberius501


 timetowaste85 wrote:
I can’t ever keep track...does LCTB on these mean they’re not coming back in any way, shape or form? Or are they LCTB so they can get round bases and a new box?


Pretty sure this means they’re going for good, so this is your last change to get them before they’re gone.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/03 03:05:59


Post by: Ghaz


 Tiberius501 wrote:
 timetowaste85 wrote:
I can’t ever keep track...does LCTB on these mean they’re not coming back in any way, shape or form? Or are they LCTB so they can get round bases and a new box?


Pretty sure this means they’re going for good, so this is your last change to get them before they’re gone.

Sometimes 'Sold Out - No Longer Available' does come back reboxed as it's a different product code than the discontinued box.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/03 03:11:39


Post by: Tiberius501


 Ghaz wrote:
 Tiberius501 wrote:
 timetowaste85 wrote:
I can’t ever keep track...does LCTB on these mean they’re not coming back in any way, shape or form? Or are they LCTB so they can get round bases and a new box?


Pretty sure this means they’re going for good, so this is your last change to get them before they’re gone.

Sometimes 'Sold Out - No Longer Available' does come back reboxed as it's a different product code than the discontinued box.


But these guys are in the Last Chance to Buy section, with a banner on the main page saying, “get them before they’re gone.” So looks like they’re leaving us. RIP General Ludwig, and Witch Hunter Fitzgrim, you’ll be missed.

[Thumb - FD019FC3-9E3B-466E-993B-09ECA0577E93.png]


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/03 03:33:09


Post by: Ghaz


'Sold Out - No Longer Available' is what I mentioned, not 'Last Chance to Buy'.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/03 04:57:36


Post by: amazingturtles


Man, that is a... lot, isn't it? There's a few there that i've wanted to get for a while but it looks like it's already too late for some of them.
'


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/03 05:11:27


Post by: NinthMusketeer


I just dropped $200 on dwarf infantry.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/03 11:28:11


Post by: timetowaste85


I just bought a second witch hunter and a spellsinger. Probably would have grabbed the War Altar if it wasn’t already gone, so maybe it’s good that it is.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/03 11:39:50


Post by: auticus


Dont forget that going to legends does not make it unplayable except in the strictest tournament settings.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/03 12:55:52


Post by: timetowaste85


Witch Hunter is now sold out. I’m glad I picked one up last night. Considered waiting until I went to the GW store today, and I’m glad I didn’t wait.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/03 15:29:54


Post by: Tiberius501


 auticus wrote:
Dont forget that going to legends does not make it unplayable except in the strictest tournament settings.


Do they get point costs? Or are they an Open Play thing only?


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/03 16:10:58


Post by: vaklor4


 Tiberius501 wrote:
 auticus wrote:
Dont forget that going to legends does not make it unplayable except in the strictest tournament settings.


Do they get point costs? Or are they an Open Play thing only?


Legends (SOMEWHERE on the weird hard to navigate downloads) does indeed include points. Bare in mind these points are usually final, so if you think something is over or under costed, tough cookie. But bare in mind 99% of the time, pick up games even in a non-tournament setting don't enjoy getting legends dropped on them, you should ask before hand, even though most of them are far and below the power of the newer stuff.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/03 16:52:37


Post by: auticus


Most legends indeed have points.

Gw points are largely garbage anyway for balance so having legend units never get updated is meh to me because those units will and always be overcost unoptimal anyway.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/03 17:07:41


Post by: Commodus Leitdorf


Meh, being Overcosted/Unoptimal only matters in a tournament scene. I'm lucky in that I gave up being a serious tournament guy long ago. So long as I can still play them for fun with my gaming buddies it's not a problem.

Frankly most of the "Culling" was about what I expected. Only one or two odd choices (Like the Empire General kit).


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/03 17:28:08


Post by: auticus


Then youll be fine and be able to keep on using your stuff


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/03 17:39:27


Post by: Future War Cultist


Did the Cogsmith survive the cull?

And I’m trying to be positive. For example, I’m really hoping that some of the culled kits might be getting replaced rather than dropped altogether. It’s strange for example to create that mercenary artillery company and then immediately stop selling the kits for it altogether.

Like, a new duardin warrior kit that better matches the longbeard/hammerer kit in design. Surely that would be easy to do, and would probably sell like hot cakes.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/03 18:13:33


Post by: Commodus Leitdorf


Yeah the Cogsmith is fine, Gunsmith is gone though. Good thing I have a pile of Empire Engineers I can substitute!


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/03 18:45:35


Post by: NinthMusketeer


 auticus wrote:
Dont forget that going to legends does not make it unplayable except in the strictest tournament settings.
It does mean they get no allegiance beyond grand alliance, though.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/03 19:02:20


Post by: herjan1987


 Future War Cultist wrote:


Like, a new duardin warrior kit that better matches the longbeard/hammerer kit in design. Surely that would be easy to do, and would probably sell like hot cakes.


Or they will be only the 30 pound basic infantry option.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/03 19:41:40


Post by: Inquisitor Jex


Well, I got a couple of Empire Generals, everything else I was intrested in is now gone; sad since I play the Warhammer RPG, a couple of Sigmarite Priests would have gone nicely, but too late it seems- or no longer available online...

EDIT: Yup, only got the 130$ house thing background, 4 metal Elves for 45$ and some Elven chariot left...damn that went on fast.. I think my local store got that Slayer and Loremaster models, so at least I'll have those to use, if they're still there tomorrow.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/03 21:49:29


Post by: NinthMusketeer


Not sad to see jellyfish-blaster (loremaster) go honestly, that posing always looked so awkward to me.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/03 22:00:09


Post by: Ghaz


From the Warhammer Age of Sigmar Facebook page:

Spoiler:


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/04 06:25:05


Post by: Tiberius501


I’m a little concerned after this culling that this book will just be a way to field a miss matched bunch of some of the better models of the old world and have some rules chucked in to call it a book.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/04 09:52:23


Post by: FrozenDwarf


 Tiberius501 wrote:
I’m a little concerned after this culling that this book will just be a way to field a miss matched bunch of some of the better models of the old world and have some rules chucked in to call it a book.


is not that the entire purpouse of this book?
get rid of old generic stuff GW cant copyrite and give the old time fantasy nostalgians something if not usefull, atleast playable for AoS for what remains, preferably if mixed in with sigmarines.





We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/04 12:16:48


Post by: timetowaste85


Hellblasters and Demigryph Knights with Karl Franz ordering them where to smoosh things. Sounds about right for the empire. And you still have wizards and infantry. Honestly, what did the empire lose; a General on horse, warrior priests (should have stayed, but metal), a war altar (why the hell didn’t this stay?!) regular Knights and a cannon? Still have demigryphs, infantry except archers, specialist infantry (GSs and Flagellants), mages, and the crazy artillery stuff (hellblaster, hellstorm, stank). Empire didn’t make out too badly. Their culling was mostly as expected except that damn war altar. Getting rid of that WAS a bit pants-on-head.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/04 12:38:51


Post by: Overread


 FrozenDwarf wrote:

get rid of old generic stuff GW cant copyrite


GW can pretty much only copyright the specific design and the name. So they don't have to withdraw a model to copyright protect it in that fashion, they just change the name on the product. A simplistic store change and a change in the packaging the next time they do a bulk order for boxes and its done.

Remember nothing for AoS has any more protection than that. Stormcast - nothing stops any 3rd party company making their own models akin to them. Sure they can't copy the name "stormcast" nor can they copy the exact same model, but they can make alternates, spare parts etc... They just have to call them something else like "Surge Knights" or something.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/04 16:19:17


Post by: Future War Cultist


The altar kit was a surprise drop imo.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/04 16:31:06


Post by: Tiberius501


Yeah me too. Especially considering they kept the Hurricanum which is pretty much the same model with a different bit on the top.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/04 16:40:07


Post by: Kanluwen


Frankly the weirdest thing is how much of the Devoted of Sigmar faction they purged...and what they left.

REMOVED
Warrior Priest models(all)
Witch Hunter model
War Altar

KEPT:
Flagellants

I lose my Glade Guard but the frigging Flagellants stay? Graaaaaaaaaaaar!


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/04 17:40:14


Post by: timetowaste85


Well, the silver tower priest stayed. But since he was MADE for AoS...yeah. I think a fleshed out Witch Hunters/Devoted of Sigmar army would have made me rekindle an order army. But, I guess I can be thankful to only stay loyal to Chaos!


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/04 18:27:39


Post by: Kanluwen


The Excelsior War Priest hasn't been on sale for ages...so who knows what's happening there.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/05 00:58:37


Post by: Commodus Leitdorf


They may be revamping the Devoted of Sigmar and want Warrior Priests that look more like the Excelsior model.

I do hope they have rules for individual Cities or a way to custom one.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/05 01:12:29


Post by: nels1031


 Kanluwen wrote:
The Excelsior War Priest hasn't been on sale for ages...so who knows what's happening there.


It was the same for The Doomseeker. It went back on sale when the FS Battletome came out. Perhaps it will come back with Free Cities.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/05 08:52:36


Post by: Future War Cultist


I think that’s a great idea, bringing back the excelsior warpriest. He’s suitably AoS and would fill the void left by the metal models perfectly.



We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/05 09:09:55


Post by: Sarouan


 Kanluwen wrote:
Frankly the weirdest thing is how much of the Devoted of Sigmar faction they purged...and what they left.

REMOVED
Warrior Priest models(all)
Witch Hunter model
War Altar

KEPT:
Flagellants

I lose my Glade Guard but the frigging Flagellants stay? Graaaaaaaaaaaar!


I think there is a twist here. On GW Website, what is actually on "last chance to buy" is Volkmar on the War Altar. The Luminarch of Hysh and Celestial Hurricanum still stay, and since it's the same kit used for making all of them, you will still be able to build a war altar anyway.

It's clear to me the Excelsior warpriest will be the "default" warrior priest in the future book. Maybe the war altar will stay as well. They just decided for some reason to make sure Volkmar was out for good, but the kit is still there in fact.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/05 09:16:24


Post by: Overread


I believe the War Alter had an additional part and a slightly different price to the regular Luminarch/Celestial kit.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/05 12:19:57


Post by: timetowaste85


It’s not the exact same kit. It’s like 2/3 the same. There is a basic 2 sprues that are the same, and the third in one box is warrior priest/Volkmar (who is alive and well in AoS pissing Sigmar off now) with griffin statue, while the third sprue in the second box is the wizard/magic stuff. Or something like that. So yeah, it sucks and is fairly disappointing and a real head scratcher.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/05 12:45:41


Post by: Ghaz


Looking at this old unboxing video it's basically the same as the Bloodthirster/Skarbrand kits, where each multi-sprue kit has one unique sprue specifically for that kit..


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/05 12:47:52


Post by: auticus


I remember when it was a new kit. It was the beginning of their dual purpose kits.

You have to also remember that many of the tomb king kits that came out AFTER that were removed from the store several years ago.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/05 13:30:57


Post by: EnTyme


 FrozenDwarf wrote:
 Tiberius501 wrote:
I’m a little concerned after this culling that this book will just be a way to field a miss matched bunch of some of the better models of the old world and have some rules chucked in to call it a book.


is not that the entire purpouse of this book?
get rid of old generic stuff GW cant copyrite and give the old time fantasy nostalgians something if not usefull, atleast playable for AoS for what remains, preferably if mixed in with sigmarines.



This old chestnut again? Here is a comprehensive list of the battletomes released since 2nd edition launched (not necessarily in order):

Dudes in Armor
Ghosts
Teslapunk Man-Rats
Goblins
Cannibal Not-zombies
Satyrs and Minotaurs
Angry Dwarven Naturists
Angry Trees
Red Barbarians and Literally Just Demons
Purple Barbarians and VD Demons


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/05 15:48:22


Post by: Commodus Leitdorf


 Overread wrote:
I believe the War Alter had an additional part and a slightly different price to the regular Luminarch/Celestial kit.


Yeah the chassis of the War Altar is the same as the Luminark/Hurricanum. Its just the top part that is different. I mean it could be that they are just throwing the War altar extra sprue into the Luminark kit and making it one big box instead of 2 separate ones.

We don't know whats really coming until we start seeing previews. GW has gone out of their way to make sure all the bits in their old dual kit are useful to make units out of everything left over. I mean if you build a Cauldron of Blood you can use the Medusa as a separate unit and Vis-Versa with the Khaine Statue.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/05 15:49:18


Post by: Kanluwen


The Medusa and Cauldron of Blood thing existed before. The Khaine Statue is really the only new one.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/05 15:59:51


Post by: Commodus Leitdorf


Well I say that more as a way to illustrate that GW is willing to take a second look at their large dual kits and open up options on how to field them. In the preview pictures for the Free Cities book the Freeguild General is on a two headed Griffon when that was not an option before.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/05 16:02:45


Post by: Kanluwen


Yeah, but the two-headed Griffon was basically wasted space until now.

I wouldn't be shocked to see it be a 'relic' for The Living City.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/05 16:11:48


Post by: NinthMusketeer


It'll be a new mount option or named character.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/05 16:12:20


Post by: nels1031


 NinthMusketeer wrote:
It'll be a new mount option or named character.


That's my thought as well.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/05 16:15:11


Post by: Kanluwen


 NinthMusketeer wrote:
It'll be a new mount option or named character.

Yeah...I doubt that it will be a named character.

They just seem to not be doing anywhere near as many of them for AoS these days.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/05 16:16:02


Post by: NinthMusketeer


I doubt it too, but Vhordrai showed us it can happen.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/05 16:22:37


Post by: Kanluwen


Sure, but we didn't get a similar character for FEC.

Also, pulling the picture up again:


I thought you guys were meaning that it was a Freeguild General on it. That's just the way they've always shown the Amber Wizard on Griffon.

It even currently has rules:

Two-Headed lets it reroll hit rolls of 1 with its "Twin Beaks"


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/05 16:41:08


Post by: Future War Cultist


I just realised, with the old generals kit gone, there’s now a big gap in their ‘command structure’. You know how most armies might go ‘general on foot’, then ‘general on small mount’, then ‘general on big mount’? Unless I’m very much mistaken, the freeguild now only have ‘general on big mount’. Which is probably what most people want anyway but it’s nice to have options for smaller games or supporting characters.

It does leave the option for future kits to plug the gap. Freeguild general on Demi-gryph anyone?



We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/05 16:46:16


Post by: Kanluwen


You're assuming they'd release a kit instead of just dumping Demi-gryphons down to a unit size of 2 for the minimum and showing you 'how to build a Demi-Gryphon mounted General!" out of the kit.

Also, Freeguild still have this guy:


Frankly? I might have to step away from this whole subject. This is the most frustrated I've been with GW since Skitarii got clumped in with the Cult Derpicus.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/05 16:48:50


Post by: Commodus Leitdorf


There is still a general on foot. That one with the guys wielding the Zweihander, w just don't have a Empire General that has anything other then a Great Weapon now.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/05 17:08:29


Post by: Future War Cultist


I’m surprised he’s still here! Is that model plastic or resin?


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/05 17:08:29


Post by: NinthMusketeer


I'd be happy to see the banner-of-battleshock-immune go away.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/05 17:16:59


Post by: Kanluwen


 Future War Cultist wrote:
I’m surprised he’s still here! Is that model plastic or resin?

Plastic. He was part of the initial wave of plastic clamshell characters.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/06 01:02:37


Post by: Tiberius501


Hmm, I think I know why they got rid of the General on horse. He is 2 general’s in one box. You could make one on foot and one on the horsey. So to stop sales prevention from the silly guy holding a sword wrong, they got rid of the better box. I don’t think there are any boxes that can build multiple characters in one now? Obviously excluding Marathi


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/06 02:02:37


Post by: Kanluwen


The Magmadroth kit can build as many as 3(depending on which one you build mounted).
Carnosaur/Troglodon can build a couple of them, assuming you build things a specific way.
Terrorgheist/Zombie Dragon can build two if you build a Ghoul King on foot.

Frankly it was more likely done because it was an exceedingly popular kit over the years and thus has seen a lot of mould wear.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/06 05:40:49


Post by: Just Tony


So how many bog standard horse kits still exist? It seems that's the main thing in their crosshairs right now.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/06 06:37:45


Post by: Tiberius501


From what I can tell, pretty much just the Hurricanum/Luminark, the Pistoliers/Outriders, Dark Aelf Dark Riders and their chariot, I think are all that’s left which aren’t chaos horsies.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/06 06:50:13


Post by: Just Tony


Those of you who want those kits I'd hit them now...


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/06 08:31:53


Post by: Cronch


 Just Tony wrote:
So how many bog standard horse kits still exist? It seems that's the main thing in their crosshairs right now.

Outriders/pistoliers, marauder horsemen, the luminark, and I guess depending on your definition of horse, the chaos knights and doomfire warlocks/dark riders.
To my knowledge there's been not a single normal horse released for new AoS armies since the start. Which kind of makes sense, if everyone else is riding around on raptors dinosaurs, fat dog-birds or laser spewing not-dragons, your horse is more of a snack than serious contender.

They definitely want to get rid of horses, is what I'm saying.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/06 09:02:42


Post by: Overread


I don't think GW is getting rid of horses so much as they are simply sculpting new fantasy beasts whilst most of their old mounts were VERY bland. Most horses were almost just stock standing still or trotting with very simplistic movements and the horses themselves were often not highly detailed.

They have also added horses, they are just mostly skeleton to undead rotting horses that they've added to the setting.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/06 14:02:29


Post by: NinthMusketeer


Despite the neighsayers I think GW won't be getting rid of horses entirely, so IMO don't pony up all your earnings to get horse-containing kits just yet.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/06 14:41:05


Post by: EnTyme


I'm definitely going to go ahead and pick up a box of Marauders (yes, I actually like the kit) and a couple boxes of Marauder Horseman before the Slave/Everchosen tome comes out just in case.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/06 18:44:57


Post by: Commodus Leitdorf


Well they didn't get rid of the Outrider/Pistoliers....so I have some time but I will have to make plans to get a box or 3...just in case


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/08 06:41:58


Post by: frozenwastes


Some related quotes from GW's latest financial report:

"We will continue to review our core product range to ensure we have the right products in the right place at the right time."

"Range management - as discussed above we are reviewing our range to ensure that we are exploring all opportunities. The risk is that we don’t fully exploit all the opportunities that are available to us or that we have too much stock."

"To ensure we have the right product at the right place at the right time, we have been investing in our merchandising and logistics team throughout the period. This has enabled us to implement a product category approach and extend our range planning time horizon to support more effective product launches and to minimise waste. In August 2018 we implemented a new forecasting tool which is supporting improvements in customer service and product availability. This tool will help us to manage our stock levels better too, a challenge we have been working to address."

--

It's entirely possible that GW has reviewed their sales and made their forecasts and products that just came out too low in terms of both recent sales and forecasted future sales just have to be retired. GW is producing at capacity and if they need to take the tools out of the machines so many more times in a day to restock a huge variety of things that barely sell and then make sure GW's distribution centres have them on stock, then that's time and shipping and inventory storage they're not using on their more profitable products.

Part of it must be the direct result of them doing pretty much nothing to sell those kits. They largely left many of them in limbo. They appared a bit on their web store when they added Allies to matched play, but that's about it. It's entirely possible that had Firestorm not been some sort of odd hybrid legacy board game campaign system and instead was just Battletome: Free Cities, many of those kits would have sold well enough over the last year that they'd not be cut.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/08 08:33:29


Post by: Overread


I think sales had less of an impact than people think this time around. See GW knows that sales will be lower for models which have no viable army and which are waiting on rules which everyone (esp since the start of the last financial year) knew were coming "at some point". I can bet Gutbusters are selling really badly at present as well (ok they might have picked up with the new model announced, but only since then).

I think for them it was about cleaning the aelves down a good peg to leave room to add more without making AoS the "game of Aelves". Some of the kits removed were odd choices, this leaves one to wonder if GW is replacing them or if there were other factors in the background.

Sales they imght have taken into account would have been more historical sales - though I'd wager things like the high elf dragon kit have been good sellers for years (one would hope).



It could also just be that GW wanted rid of things like "cone head helms" and some other design aesthetics that they don't feel fits with the AoS theme any more.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/08 09:01:34


Post by: Future War Cultist


What I’m hoping for personally is that this book is just a ‘get you by’ for the next couple of years whilst they better organise the factions within. Then gradually, the factions branch off in their own. Yes, sadly it means that a lot of kits will be retired (and I’m genuinely surprised at what went) but hopefully they can build upon what’s left.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/08 10:02:39


Post by: Cronch


I'm more pessimistic in outlook I suppose, I believe this is meant to make space for new factions in the future. So Dispossessed will forever be relegated to the CoS with Freeguilds, but somewhere along the line we will see new dwarfs under Grungni, separate from the "dour and grudge-holding" dispossessed. Same with humans, we'll probably see a separate sigmar-inspired human army in the future that won't be the pajama boys of CoS.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/08 14:22:02


Post by: Commodus Leitdorf


I mean we really don't know what GW plans with it. I honestly do believe sales do have somewhat to do with it as the stuff that has remained for the Freeguild I always see "out of stock" when I check the site. SO it seems those kits are still moving at a brisk enough pace that it's worth keeping them.

Frankly we won't know anything until we start getting previews of the book and who knows when that will be. Just, PLEASE GW, give me a Start Collecting box! Properly starting a Free Peoples army will finally give me an excuse to buy those non-puffy sleeved soldiers to build a force with.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/08 15:26:06


Post by: Kanluwen


Freeguild != Free Peoples.

Free Peoples are the Elves, Dwarves, and Humans.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/08 16:52:46


Post by: Commodus Leitdorf


Freeguild are free peoples

but not all free peoples are in the guild


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/08/08 20:52:24


Post by: NinthMusketeer


I didn't see any kits that I was sad to see go. A lot of them were really dated and there is a certain relief for me having it all 'cleaned up' so to speak and better organized. I guess it appeals to my OCD side. I will miss the dispossessed infantry kits, but I am aware that is nostalgia on my part.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/16 03:24:39


Post by: Tiberius501


So the book is coming within the next few weeks, I reckon it’ll be coming next, after Beastgrave, as there’s nothing else to come, apart from the last 2 marine supplements, but they’re rumoured to be coming in October.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/16 13:30:24


Post by: Kanluwen


 Tiberius501 wrote:
So the book is coming within the next few weeks, I reckon it’ll be coming next, after Beastgrave, as there’s nothing else to come, apart from the last 2 marine supplements, but they’re rumoured to be coming in October.

Orruks, Ogors, single blister releases of the Arch-Revenant, Archregent, Skaven Rocket Guitarist, and the Loonboss on Great Cave Squig all are potential releases--just on the AoS side alone.

40k side has the Manipulus and Kellermorph(the two Kill Team exclusive characters for AdMech and GSC respectively) and the Impulsor and Infiltrator/Incursor kit for Marines(if people have to wait till October--that's going to be an issue and just showcases how heavily dragged out this release was).


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/16 15:25:47


Post by: Tiberius501


Hmm these are all true.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/16 15:40:46


Post by: Kanluwen


Not saying those are all guarantees, mind you. I'd think the single characters will likely be in November--as I'm personally speculating that the Sororitas Army Pack will be the 'initial' release with the full army releasing in January/February(as a big box is more palatable as a Christmas thing than a whole range potentially would be) but the Army Pack being able to get people playing right out of the gate.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/19 20:23:26


Post by: Chris521


This book will be a big factor on whether I get an AOS army or not. I'm very interested in having a Dwarf army. While I would no doubt have some Kharadron Overlords and perhaps some fire Slayers (very small amount), my favorite models are the classic dwarf units. Bringing the Dwarfs, Dispossessed, and arsenal under one banner with minimal squatting (preferably none) would be very attractive to me.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/19 21:50:45


Post by: Future War Cultist


Has there been talk of Endless spells and terrain for this faction?


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/19 22:11:54


Post by: auticus


It was said they are not getting those.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/19 22:55:32


Post by: nels1031


 Future War Cultist wrote:
Has there been talk of Endless spells and terrain for this faction?


The news broke(to me at least) about CoS not having Endless Spells/Terrain in this video, made by folks who attended the NOVA event:

Warhammer Weekly Preview review:





Summary:

-Modular Rohan buildings(LotR scale , but could have a place in AoS due to modularity possibly)
-3 year plan of releases for Warcry
-not just Chaos monsters in the new supplement
-finally have a use for the Warqueen
-NOVA hotel is haunted!
-Mortarch has a unique Skarbrand style damage/attacks profile. If you attack him, scroll dude dies first, then bird guy, then standard bearer then Samurai Jack, then when they are dead, the Mortarch deigns to fight you and it gets bonkers.
-The Ossiarch Bonereaper range is bigger than what was shown.
-Not in preview article:
~Cities of Sigmar/Orruk tomes will not have faction specific Endless Spells or a terrain feature.
~Will have unique rules to counteract their absence.
~Both coming so soon that they didn’t bother with a preview at the seminar or in the article

At the end: expect an imminent announcement coming about how FW works, what it produces and how it will interact with GW going forward. Big changes. Attendees were told its a positive change and the seminar guys were excited about it, but who knows...


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/20 13:32:12


Post by: Commodus Leitdorf


Well the one rumor I heard from someone who has supposedly seen the book is that they will get terrain piece, just not a new one.

now please take this with a HUUUUGE grain of salt but the Free Cities will get the Watchtower re-released as the cities terrain piece. But whether or not that is true...well...i'm not sure. Especially as some of the other rumors I heard from the same guy I'm not totally sure of.

Just throwing out what I've heard from my own source.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/20 16:11:00


Post by: Tiberius501


Interesting. What did the Watchtower look like?


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/20 17:20:06


Post by: Commodus Leitdorf




This watchtower. One of the terrain pieces that was discontinued after AoS dropped.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/20 17:34:14


Post by: auticus


I'd have to say... if the developer team specifically stated there were no terrain or endless spells, I'd have to believe them and chalk this up to someone's wishful thinking.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/20 17:59:25


Post by: Overread


We heard a "its not the same as we've seen before" kind of reply. baring in mind that GW also marketed one of the Underworld warbands as "something we've never seen before" and it was 3 goblins on 3 wolves. So technically mounted troops in warcry; but at the same time whilst it was a very welcome sight it wasn't something totally out of sync with what we've seen for Underworld thus far.

So it could be that the Endless Spells, for example, are 4 spells one for each City or such. I'd be surprised at this stage if GW abandoned the terrain and spells since they are proven strong sellers to most customers and clearly a feature GW wanted to push and has even bled into 40K as well.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/20 18:01:37


Post by: Commodus Leitdorf


 auticus wrote:
I'd have to say... if the developer team specifically stated there were no terrain or endless spells, I'd have to believe them and chalk this up to someone's wishful thinking.


Perhaps, but at the same time ever other faction has an gotten and Endless spell and a terrain piece. Maybe the free cities wont but the idea that Ironjaws, one of the new factions made for AoS, will not get one when all the other ones have gotten one seems wrong.

I just chalk it up to word play. "Oh we're not making any new terrain pieces for them." *wink* *wink* *nudge* nudge*.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/20 18:06:37


Post by: auticus


That could very well be. GW likes its obfuscation.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/20 18:13:07


Post by: Overread


It could also be that the marketing team wasn't told and thus had to make something up a bit; even though they likely know what the answer should be; they might not have been "read into it" to know it for certain.

Sometimes its hard to tell what is a choice at GW and what is the result of inter-departmental isolation within their system


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/20 18:21:34


Post by: nels1031


 Commodus Leitdorf wrote:
This watchtower. One of the terrain pieces that was discontinued after AoS dropped.


Think that was discontinued way before AoS, but I could be wrong.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/20 18:37:52


Post by: auticus


The watchtower was available at my GW store about 6-9 months into AOS because I had bought a couple more for our second AOS campaign.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/20 18:50:35


Post by: Commodus Leitdorf


Yeah I believe it was a part of the First Great Culling of minis a few months after AoS dropped. Either way I do believe both books will get something, if not right away then perhaps in a later, staggered, release.

Like I said though, take it with a grain of salt like I have. Just thought I'd throw it out there as we got a picture of a book and no new information and I NEED MY FREEGUILD!!!!


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/22 17:10:20


Post by: Tiberius501


And here we go!

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2019/09/22/coming-soon-middle-earth-mortal-realms-and-more/

Looks like it’s just the book, but should be sweet.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/22 17:31:25


Post by: Overread


Book, warscrolls and two new getting started sets.

No mention of spells or terrain for either army. I wonder if the issue with Sylvaneth led GW to ordering from another site/factory/region in china which resulted in a gap in their orders for those factions since we've seen that bonereapers do have faction terrain.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/22 18:00:52


Post by: Kanluwen


 Overread wrote:
Book, warscrolls and two new getting started sets.

No mention of spells or terrain for either army. I wonder if the issue with Sylvaneth led GW to ordering from another site/factory/region in china which resulted in a gap in their orders for those factions since we've seen that bonereapers do have faction terrain.

There's not really anything that can be done for something which is spread across all the different Realms.

Hell, they've already added a weird choice to the Living City by plugging Dark Riders from Shadowblades for them.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/22 18:07:36


Post by: Overread


 Kanluwen wrote:
 Overread wrote:
Book, warscrolls and two new getting started sets.

No mention of spells or terrain for either army. I wonder if the issue with Sylvaneth led GW to ordering from another site/factory/region in china which resulted in a gap in their orders for those factions since we've seen that bonereapers do have faction terrain.

There's not really anything that can be done for something which is spread across all the different Realms.

Hell, they've already added a weird choice to the Living City by plugging Dark Riders from Shadowblades for them.


And yet we are all happy playing with Purple Death Suns even though every faction can summon them from the pure good of order to the pure chaos of chaos.

You can certainly unit the spells and a terrain feature for a faction that, whilst made of different races and nations, is pulling together as a single army. Plus on reason at all that Orruks couldn't have both since they are all orks


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/22 21:05:33


Post by: Commodus Leitdorf


Yes New Start Collecting!!!

....no Freeguild...

Seems like an oversight.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/22 21:30:34


Post by: Kanluwen


 Overread wrote:

And yet we are all happy playing with Purple Death Suns even though every faction can summon them from the pure good of order to the pure chaos of chaos.

Because the Purple Sun of Xereus is a Death spell, now given a bit of sentience?


You can certainly unit the spells and a terrain feature for a faction that, whilst made of different races and nations, is pulling together as a single army. Plus on reason at all that Orruks couldn't have both since they are all orks

Other than this was a hodgepodge stopgap, you mean.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/23 00:15:54


Post by: auticus


A true moment of truth will be if these books allow for viable builds or will they just be soggy blankets.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/23 00:53:55


Post by: Eldarain


It's a tall order. With all the freedom you'd like to see available given the diversity collected here it's going to be just as easy to have some hobby killer builds as be useless all around.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/23 01:50:43


Post by: NinthMusketeer


As their rules stand there are a lot of units one set of decent allegiance abilities away from being solidly OP. But I'd be surprised if the warscrolls weren't reworked.

As for terrain/spells, I'm fine with it. When everyone gets them it isn't as cool.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/23 08:15:54


Post by: Cronch


 Commodus Leitdorf wrote:
Yes New Start Collecting!!!

....no Freeguild...

Seems like an oversight.

They know freeguild will sell with or without SC set, while it might be harder sell to get people excited for old dwarfs with firebabies and steampunk dwarves around.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/23 09:05:45


Post by: beast_gts


 Commodus Leitdorf wrote:
Yes New Start Collecting!!!

....no Freeguild...

Seems like an oversight.


They are interesting choices - Greywater Fastness is two £30 units & two £15 characters, while Anvilgard is £40, £27.50 & £17.50 with a £15 character...


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/23 13:22:49


Post by: Crispy78


The thing I really struggle with is...

It's been, what, centuries or even millennia since The End Times. Dwarfs have evolved into steampunk zeppelin dudes / angry naked punks. There's a whole new race of underwater elves. And yet - the images so far from the Cities Of Sigmar book still seem to be stuck in exactly the same faux Holy Roman Empire schtick from the Old World... Has there been no progress in all this apparent time?


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/23 13:29:35


Post by: Overread


Crispy78 wrote:
The thing I really struggle with is...

It's been, what, centuries or even millennia since The End Times. Dwarfs have evolved into steampunk zeppelin dudes / angry naked punks. There's a whole new race of underwater elves. And yet - the images so far from the Cities Of Sigmar book still seem to be stuck in exactly the same faux Holy Roman Empire schtick from the Old World... Has there been no progress in all this apparent time?


Eh this was always going to happen unless GW did away with the entire OldWorld model range. It also isn't helped that they sort of skipped the golden age of the Realms and the Chaos Age and went for the 3rd age.

I think its important to remember that the lore serves the game not the other way around; meanwhile the Mythic age wasn't built off the back of the Old World. Many of the races escaped the Old World with nothing and most were shattered in numbers and organisation and thrown into crazy realms with monsters, beasts, godbeasts and more. So I suspect that whilst a lot was achieved, they likely only rebuilt so far. Heck Dwarves in the Old World had steampunk airships and copters and such and iron hulled ships - some were just limited others were against their own internal rules to build. The KO bubble's are simply a means to take that same concept and make it practical to put on a tabletop game rather than having huge blimp designs eating up a lot of empty space.

Cities are indeed running on the same visuals and that makes sense - GW isn't re-releasing the whole army. So they can run with the same archaic designs. Inspired by tales of ancient heroes; technologies once forgotten being remembered once again etc...


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/23 13:59:10


Post by: auticus


So long as some of the older warhammer models are being used, that imagery has to remain.



We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/23 14:01:12


Post by: Kanluwen


There's at least potentially one new unit in the art.

There's an Aelf with Wildwood Rangers garb and a bow.


Silhouetted against the beam of light in the upper right.
Down by the Nomad Prince(antlered helmet) is a Shadow Warrior for comparison.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/23 14:29:46


Post by: SamusDrake


Not my cup of tea, but this has been a long time coming for many players. Super-happy for them!


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/23 16:05:38


Post by: Crispy78


 Overread wrote:
Crispy78 wrote:
The thing I really struggle with is...

It's been, what, centuries or even millennia since The End Times. Dwarfs have evolved into steampunk zeppelin dudes / angry naked punks. There's a whole new race of underwater elves. And yet - the images so far from the Cities Of Sigmar book still seem to be stuck in exactly the same faux Holy Roman Empire schtick from the Old World... Has there been no progress in all this apparent time?


Eh this was always going to happen unless GW did away with the entire OldWorld model range. It also isn't helped that they sort of skipped the golden age of the Realms and the Chaos Age and went for the 3rd age.

I think its important to remember that the lore serves the game not the other way around; meanwhile the Mythic age wasn't built off the back of the Old World. Many of the races escaped the Old World with nothing and most were shattered in numbers and organisation and thrown into crazy realms with monsters, beasts, godbeasts and more. So I suspect that whilst a lot was achieved, they likely only rebuilt so far. Heck Dwarves in the Old World had steampunk airships and copters and such and iron hulled ships - some were just limited others were against their own internal rules to build. The KO bubble's are simply a means to take that same concept and make it practical to put on a tabletop game rather than having huge blimp designs eating up a lot of empty space.

Cities are indeed running on the same visuals and that makes sense - GW isn't re-releasing the whole army. So they can run with the same archaic designs. Inspired by tales of ancient heroes; technologies once forgotten being remembered once again etc...


Yeah, I do get all that. Just feels like a bit of a waste I guess.

I mean, GW weren't shy in completely revamping Dwarfs with new models. Deepkin are new. DoK are mostly new. So far (insert disclaimers about reserving final judgement until actual release; I could be very wrong; could be a big surprise release etc) by comparison this feels a bit lumped together and dashed off as an after-thought with relatively little effort. And I'd feel a lot more charitable towards that if this was a release right at the start of the AoS timeframe, but people have been waiting for this for 4 years now.

Personally, I don't have any skin in the game. Maybe this is enough for former Empire etc players, and if so then great. But it's not really swaying me any.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/23 16:34:47


Post by: Ghaz


From the Warhammer Age of Sigmar Facebook page:

Spoiler:


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/23 16:55:59


Post by: auticus


For me, if I was an empire player, this would be a great thing. It makes you at least somewhat relevant and not getting your nose rubbed in pooh everytime Joe Optimizer is across the table from you.

I'd be ecstatic if I got a slaves to darkness book that was just updated warscrolls and what not without new models.

We're coming to the end of the 2.0 era, so I expect a 2.5 or 3.0 coming in the next year or so. The way they give some armies multiple books within a short span means that there is a good shot that in 2 or 3 years that free people mark ii comes out with new models.

In the meantime, be happy that you are relevant and maybe even competitive and not forced to run flaming garbage while the optimizers min max you off the table with the tournament tier lists.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/23 17:09:32


Post by: Commodus Leitdorf


Yeah man I can't wait! This is the Battletome I have been waiting for. And the fact that i can just Mix/Match with Dwarf and Elf models makes it even better! I can just grab a box of stuff I like and add it to my army.

Well I guess I'd better get to work on the stuff I have been putting off for awhile now!


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/23 17:59:34


Post by: EnTyme


 auticus wrote:
I'd be ecstatic if I got a slaves to darkness book that was just updated warscrolls and what not without new models.



I'm expecting we'll get a similar book early next year. Of course, I said the same thing about this time last year.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/23 18:32:55


Post by: auticus


The date keeps getting shuffled. This time last year it was that we were getting a book by summer 2019. Then summer came and it was fall to late 2019.

We're almost out of legacy forces now so it has to be by mid 2020 or else they start doing reprints of older books first, which is not outside the realm of possibility either, leaving StD to be a warcry prime faction only.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/23 19:11:03


Post by: EnTyme


I know the customs issue threw off the release schedule quite a bit. The chance of Slaves to Darkness/Everchosen not getting a battletome in the near future is 0%, though. They're still the primary antagonists of the game.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/24 09:53:16


Post by: Overread


Yeah I don't think it will even take till next summer for Slaves to Darkness. The only reason it would is if GW was doing a MASSIVE overhaul of the whole faction. Otherwise I'd expect Q1 of 2020. If we assume that Ogres are coming end of this year then Slaves is the last army without any Battletome ever (really odd for the games primary enemy); and only 3 that need a tune-up for 2.0


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/24 11:10:07


Post by: auticus


You are forgetting the light elves and malerion's elves (the dark elves).


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/24 11:13:07


Post by: Overread


 auticus wrote:
You are forgetting the light elves and malerion's elves (the dark elves).


Well not really as they aren't out yet as models. So it doesn't matter that they don't have 2.0 rules because, well, they aren't actual armies yet, just concepts that we really hope GW will make as they've teased them enough at us. However considering the surprise Death release I wonder if GW might throw another surprise out like another Destruction army first. It wouldn't be bad since destruction and death are grand alliances with neat themes and concepts, but also woefully undersupported in models compared to chaos and order. Of course there's also a lot of models to update through the whole range of alliances too.

So there's plenty to get in the way.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/24 11:25:22


Post by: auticus


Thats why if Slaves to Darkness get a book before summer I would be highly surprised.

I also see Slaves to Darkness as a launching point for AOS 3.0, which we might say is way too soon for a 3.0... but I also disagree as GW is quick to change up rules paradigms to sell new books.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/24 11:26:23


Post by: terry


 Overread wrote:
 auticus wrote:
You are forgetting the light elves and malerion's elves (the dark elves).


Well not really as they aren't out yet as models. So it doesn't matter that they don't have 2.0 rules because, well, they aren't actual armies yet, just concepts that we really hope GW will make as they've teased them enough at us. However considering the surprise Death release I wonder if GW might throw another surprise out like another Destruction army first. It wouldn't be bad since destruction and death are grand alliances with neat themes and concepts, but also woefully undersupported in models compared to chaos and order. Of course there's also a lot of models to update through the whole range of alliances too.

So there's plenty to get in the way.

GW ofcourse already have grot skypirates in lore if they want to introduce another destruction army


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/24 12:12:53


Post by: Overread


 auticus wrote:
Thats why if Slaves to Darkness get a book before summer I would be highly surprised.

I also see Slaves to Darkness as a launching point for AOS 3.0, which we might say is way too soon for a 3.0... but I also disagree as GW is quick to change up rules paradigms to sell new books.


I think you're looking at years before there's a 3.0 release and GW won't hold slaves back that long (its Slaves to Darkness not Masochists of Darkness). Now new models might not appear until then, but the Battletome certainly will come long before a 3.0 move. Heck if GW wants 3.0 to work then having 2.0 complete is clearly on the cards since its what they've done with 40K and also since otherwise Slaves - a whole cornerstone of lore and army - isn't going to actually "work" in AoS 2.0.











Anyway this is a cities thread right - back to the cities and praying for more dwarven cannon!


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/24 12:57:08


Post by: Kanluwen


You're not getting Dwarf cannons.

Hell, they've retconned the scouts bit of Living City apparently, which is what Glade Guard were supposed to do--instead Dark Riders are taking that slot.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/24 13:05:41


Post by: auticus


 Overread wrote:
 auticus wrote:
Thats why if Slaves to Darkness get a book before summer I would be highly surprised.

I also see Slaves to Darkness as a launching point for AOS 3.0, which we might say is way too soon for a 3.0... but I also disagree as GW is quick to change up rules paradigms to sell new books.

I think you're looking at years before there's a 3.0 release and GW won't hold slaves back that long (its Slaves to Darkness not Masochists of Darkness). Now new models might not appear until then, but the Battletome certainly will come long before a 3.0 move. Heck if GW wants 3.0 to work then having 2.0 complete is clearly on the cards since its what they've done with 40K and also since otherwise Slaves - a whole cornerstone of lore and army - isn't going to actually "work" in AoS 2.0.


Time will tell. But I will be super highly surprised if the design team sticks to their current design ethos for years, because they have never done so in 30 years.



We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/24 15:45:16


Post by: Tiberius501


I’m uncertain whether I’m going to stick to all free guild or branch out into Duardin and/or Wanderers. This book seems really fun to make armies with, so much choice!


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/24 16:06:07


Post by: Kanluwen


There's not really anything left for people to branch out into for Wanderers.

You're better off looking at Dark Elf or High Elf stuff.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/24 16:07:17


Post by: Sasori


 auticus wrote:
 Overread wrote:
 auticus wrote:
Thats why if Slaves to Darkness get a book before summer I would be highly surprised.

I also see Slaves to Darkness as a launching point for AOS 3.0, which we might say is way too soon for a 3.0... but I also disagree as GW is quick to change up rules paradigms to sell new books.

I think you're looking at years before there's a 3.0 release and GW won't hold slaves back that long (its Slaves to Darkness not Masochists of Darkness). Now new models might not appear until then, but the Battletome certainly will come long before a 3.0 move. Heck if GW wants 3.0 to work then having 2.0 complete is clearly on the cards since its what they've done with 40K and also since otherwise Slaves - a whole cornerstone of lore and army - isn't going to actually "work" in AoS 2.0.


Time will tell. But I will be super highly surprised if the design team sticks to their current design ethos for years, because they have never done so in 30 years.



I don't think we're going to get AoS 3.0 so quick. It hasn't even been two years of AoS 2.0. Most editions of GW games tend to last around 4 or more years unless it's a complete disaster.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/24 16:10:18


Post by: auticus


Probably not a hard push to 3.0, but I suspect that Slaves to Darkness will be "2.0 but written towards the new 3.0".


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/24 21:50:50


Post by: Ghaz


Tempest's Eye from Facebook:

Spoiler:


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/25 13:05:25


Post by: Ghaz


Greywater Fastness from the Warhammer Age of Sigmar Facebook page:

Spoiler:


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/25 13:18:30


Post by: Eldarsif


 auticus wrote:
Probably not a hard push to 3.0, but I suspect that Slaves to Darkness will be "2.0 but written towards the new 3.0".


I think it is more likely we'll get AoS 2.5 similarly to how 40k is getting their 8.5 right now.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/25 13:25:31


Post by: Dynas


So can I finally try this game and be competitive? I have old Empire and Dwarfs, no pointy ears though. Do we know what date the book will actually drop?


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/25 13:30:49


Post by: auticus


 Eldarsif wrote:
 auticus wrote:
Probably not a hard push to 3.0, but I suspect that Slaves to Darkness will be "2.0 but written towards the new 3.0".


I think it is more likely we'll get AoS 2.5 similarly to how 40k is getting their 8.5 right now.


3.0... 2.5.... whatever we want to call a design paradigm shift that your army should be written towards if you want to be competitive / viable in that era.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/25 17:07:24


Post by: NinthMusketeer


That isn't really true though, sometimes the books 'written forward' end up being in quite a bad spot, or old books become able to exploit how outdated mechanics work with new rules, or even just stay relevant. Bonesplittaz, for example. What actually happens is old books have had time for their cheese elements to be nerfed so they don't hold up to the top-tier stuff, leading to the classic "it wins tournaments or it's trash" fallacy.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/25 17:21:52


Post by: auticus


When we look at current edition, its generally accepted that the 1.0/1.5 books were at a serious disadvantage to the 2.0 books.

The exception being the books that come out at the dawn of the edition seem to be on par with the recent edition but quickly get outpaced.

So when I say 3.0/2.5 or whatever - shortly into that era things tend to get distinctly better than the previous edition. The first couple books into that new era tend to suck.



We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/25 21:54:44


Post by: NinthMusketeer


It's a whole line of discussion on it's own that could get off-topic pretty quickly. But I think we can all agree that going from no battletome to having one is an improvement, so this will be great for a lot of players wanting to play their old empire/elves/dwarfs.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/25 22:14:56


Post by: Kanluwen


Not for me. My Wood Elf list got gutted for the second time in as many editions.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/25 23:31:22


Post by: auticus


 NinthMusketeer wrote:
It's a whole line of discussion on it's own that could get off-topic pretty quickly. But I think we can all agree that going from no battletome to having one is an improvement, so this will be great for a lot of players wanting to play their old empire/elves/dwarfs.


Absolutely. Its certainly a giant step forward.

I will continue to guffaw in Slaves to Darkness though haha


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/26 04:09:46


Post by: NinthMusketeer


 Kanluwen wrote:
Not for me. My Wood Elf list got gutted for the second time in as many editions.
If the battletome makes your army worse then don't use it.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/26 04:49:13


Post by: Kanluwen


 NinthMusketeer wrote:
 Kanluwen wrote:
Not for me. My Wood Elf list got gutted for the second time in as many editions.
If the battletome makes your army worse then don't use it.

what a great solution to them removing units!

You understand that the "gutting" is them removing, again, the flavor and feel of the faction right?
Glade Guard were supposed to be the scouts for the Living City. Wanderers themselves are supposed to be present at most of these various Free Cities--but not actually living within their premises, since they're y'know...Wanderers.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/26 05:21:18


Post by: NinthMusketeer


 Kanluwen wrote:
 NinthMusketeer wrote:
 Kanluwen wrote:
Not for me. My Wood Elf list got gutted for the second time in as many editions.
If the battletome makes your army worse then don't use it.

what a great solution to them removing units!

You understand that the "gutting" is them removing, again, the flavor and feel of the faction right?
Glade Guard were supposed to be the scouts for the Living City. Wanderers themselves are supposed to be present at most of these various Free Cities--but not actually living within their premises, since they're y'know...Wanderers.
So you are upset about something different, and are just here making off-topic posts crapping on people excited for the battletome.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/26 12:25:46


Post by: Astmeister


Is this a new free guild model or just a kitbash?

Spoiler:








Automatically Appended Next Post:
I checked the GW store and it seems to be mostly consisting of Greatsword peaces. :-(


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/26 13:10:39


Post by: Kanluwen


 NinthMusketeer wrote:
So you are upset about something different, and are just here making off-topic posts crapping on people excited for the battletome.

If I were in here crapping on people excited for the battletome, I'd be actively trying to do that.

You understand that my postings aren't actually telling other people to not be excited, right? And that your nonsense reply of "If the battletome makes your army worse then don't use it" was pointless?

There's nothing in this battletome, seemingly, that will make up for them swiping Glade Guard and the non-plastic heroes out of the Wanderers range. Everything I'm posting right now is based off initial impressions--we haven't actually gotten a whole lot of insight with regards to how the Free Cities are working mechanically. Everything I have to go off of right now is based off of the simple fact that they cut an army that they had already cut to the bone and then jammed it into a book that they didn't need to.

Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Astmeister wrote:
Is this a new free guild model or just a kitbash?

Spoiler:








Automatically Appended Next Post:
I checked the GW store and it seems to be mostly consisting of Greatsword peaces. :-(

Free Cities and Orruk Warclans are bringing no new models.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/26 13:41:22


Post by: Astmeister


That sucks. At least I can soon order the Fireforge Northmen warriors which exactly match the empire aesthetic.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/26 15:50:04


Post by: NinthMusketeer


 Kanluwen wrote:
 NinthMusketeer wrote:
So you are upset about something different, and are just here making off-topic posts crapping on people excited for the battletome.

If I were in here crapping on people excited for the battletome, I'd be actively trying to do that.

You understand that my postings aren't actually telling other people to not be excited, right? And that your nonsense reply of "If the battletome makes your army worse then don't use it" was pointless?

There's nothing in this battletome, seemingly, that will make up for them swiping Glade Guard and the non-plastic heroes out of the Wanderers range. Everything I'm posting right now is based off initial impressions--we haven't actually gotten a whole lot of insight with regards to how the Free Cities are working mechanically. Everything I have to go off of right now is based off of the simple fact that they cut an army that they had already cut to the bone and then jammed it into a book that they didn't need to.
It would have been a lot easier to say "yes."


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/26 16:41:10


Post by: Kanluwen


 NinthMusketeer wrote:
It would have been a lot easier to say "yes."

For someone trying to accuse others of spam/off-topic, you're doing a pretty great job yourself.

What the hell am I supposed to be posting? "My Wanderers are looking great! There's totally so much information for me to have my fears assuaged!" style of posts?

Because that ain't happening. There hasn't been enough information posted up with regards to how things are working for me to feel anything other than spite right now because of the shift for my Wanderers--despite them having just gotten updated Allegiance abilities this year!


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/26 17:10:13


Post by: nels1031


 Kanluwen wrote:
What the hell am I supposed to be posting?


Just vague complaints about balance and Slaves to Darkness. Anything else is offtopic, no matter the contents of the thread.



We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/26 17:15:23


Post by: Sasori


 Kanluwen wrote:
 NinthMusketeer wrote:
 Kanluwen wrote:
Not for me. My Wood Elf list got gutted for the second time in as many editions.
If the battletome makes your army worse then don't use it.

what a great solution to them removing units!

You understand that the "gutting" is them removing, again, the flavor and feel of the faction right?
Glade Guard were supposed to be the scouts for the Living City. Wanderers themselves are supposed to be present at most of these various Free Cities--but not actually living within their premises, since they're y'know...Wanderers.



Kan,

As a Tomb kings player, I understand your frustrations. My only advice would just wait to see how things pan out in the book. Things might not be so bad.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/26 22:12:48


Post by: NinthMusketeer


 Kanluwen wrote:
 NinthMusketeer wrote:
It would have been a lot easier to say "yes."

For someone trying to accuse others of spam/off-topic, you're doing a pretty great job yourself.

What the hell am I supposed to be posting? "My Wanderers are looking great! There's totally so much information for me to have my fears assuaged!" style of posts?

Because that ain't happening. There hasn't been enough information posted up with regards to how things are working for me to feel anything other than spite right now because of the shift for my Wanderers--despite them having just gotten updated Allegiance abilities this year!
Units getting cut =/= battletome release. Go start a thread to talk about the units getting cut. It sucks, its frustrating, and I fully support you voicing that frustration.

But the way I see it the conversation is basically:
"I am excited for this battletome"
"My army had units cut this sucks."

So you can probably understand why I would find that irksome.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/27 08:06:48


Post by: Hecube


Hey quick question i just haven't been able to find an answer to anywhere - i'm a 40k player looking to jump into AoS and have a DoK battleforce i haven't started yet and am very interested in FC, but I wanted to pick up those battle wizards in the box kit but they are gone from the GW webstore under the new FC tab, are they removed from the game does anyone know? So is the only collegiate arcane units we can get the chariots?


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/27 13:16:37


Post by: Commodus Leitdorf


Hmm Seems like they did remove the box set. I mean I know they got rid of the 2 man version but the one with 4 wizards was still available.

Either way it should't matter. Its not like getting an Empire Wizard is hard, there are dozens all over Ebay.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/27 22:20:10


Post by: Kanluwen


...And Wild Riders are back to not having shield options again. We literally JUST HAD A FAQ ABOUT THIS GW!
Armour of Thorns(that's what it is called now) is explicitly only affecting Wanderers models, as it should be.

Shadow Warriors are now under Shadowblades faction. Look around, there's some interesting tweaks but I'm still going to be salty for awhile.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/28 00:46:15


Post by: Future War Cultist


Did they really get rid of the human wizard set? That seems really sort sighted. What is there to represent the collegiate arcane then, besides the big warmachines? Plus I see that kit in conversions all the time, so it seemed like a big seller too.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/28 00:54:07


Post by: nels1031


The Fire Wizard is in one of the promo photos, for what its worth. Maybe another reboxing?


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/28 01:09:29


Post by: Kanluwen


 Future War Cultist wrote:
Did they really get rid of the human wizard set? That seems really sort sighted. What is there to represent the collegiate arcane then, besides the big warmachines? Plus I see that kit in conversions all the time, so it seemed like a big seller too.

Toooooooooootally couldn't be a reboxing to say "Free Cities" instead of "Collegiate Arcane"...

Even if that set were to go away though, there's the warmachines and the Griffon riding Mage.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/28 01:09:37


Post by: Hecube


Thanks Commodus yea guess you're right. Seems petty and sad though to me, i have been eyeing off that box set for ages. Oh well!

Edit - Oh yea, didn't even consider a reboxing - fingers crossed!


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/28 01:23:16


Post by: Future War Cultist


I hope it’s a reboxing. Even if it’s a bit of an odd ball these days what with having 2 models in it instead of one, it’s still a good kit to keep. In fact, aesthetically they fit in even better with AoS than the other empire kits imo.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/28 01:52:08


Post by: Ghaz


 Future War Cultist wrote:
Did they really get rid of the human wizard set? That seems really sort sighted. What is there to represent the collegiate arcane then, besides the big warmachines? Plus I see that kit in conversions all the time, so it seemed like a big seller too.

The Collegiate Arcane Mystic Battle Wizards are still on the website.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/28 03:12:38


Post by: Tiberius501


On the Ozzie site the 4 wizards are still there, they have round bases.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/28 04:04:14


Post by: Hecube


Yep, just saw, they're back! Thanks everyone, they were missing for a while and ordinarily i wouldn't sweated it but there's a new book and lots of squatting going on with many of the FC units so was a bit worried.

Very glad to see they're still there and very keen to get the book and start building my first AoS force


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/28 04:30:24


Post by: Apple fox


I think they removed all the minis i would really want for this release :(
Which sucks, so may have to see if i can find alternatives if the rules work out.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/28 04:41:06


Post by: Tiberius501


I’m very happy with the changes to the Gryph Knights. Also, the Steam Tank is for some reason in German but looks like he can be an actual commander and gets a command ability, which is pretty boss.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/28 10:42:04


Post by: Commodus Leitdorf





GMG Has the book and put up a review. I'm going through it now so we'll see if some of the rumor I heard were true.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/28 11:20:37


Post by: Cronch


I'm going to be honest, I'm really tempted to make a steam tank company. On a more practical level, I will be attaching the battle wizard to my SCE more, they have some nice spells (i don't know how changed they are, but I don't recall them being that versatile?)


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/28 12:40:12


Post by: Kanluwen


Frankly, I'm disappointed.

I was expecting something more substantive from the retinue rules given the teases/implications that were being made. It's free wounds for low points generals...that's not exactly earth shattering.

My Wanderers will remain shelved at this point. Maybe I'll get Glade Guard, Waywatchers, etc back one day but this isn't engendering confidence for me.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/28 12:43:52


Post by: Tiberius501


Yeah I gotta say, I’m weirdly underwhelmed. The rules seem sort of good but it doesn’t seem particularly interesting.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/28 12:46:55


Post by: Kanluwen


The rules, from what I saw going through the updated warscrolls, seemed manic as all heck.

Some stuff got better, some stuff got weirder, and some stuff just got keyword changes.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/28 16:05:54


Post by: Future War Cultist


Longbeards can now dispel magic just by complaining about it. That’s amazing...and hilarious.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/28 16:21:39


Post by: NinthMusketeer


I like that they standardized all the musicians and standard bearers. I know some guys in my group who have difficulty remembering a bazillion little rules that is going to seriously help.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/28 16:56:12


Post by: Astmeister


Can someone sum up stuff from the book? It's hard to find out via phone.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/28 20:38:03


Post by: VBS


It's nice to finally have an update and all. Overall feels underwhelming though....

Maybe I was expecting too much but it simply looks like a detailed Firestorm-supplement and some warscrolls + points update. Would have been very cool to have some sort of general tables/rules to make your own Free City based on fighting style, races, factions all bashed together to give your army its own flavor.
Same goes for rules like the Retinue. Missed opportunity to make something along the lines those command squads in 40k, representing a General's trusted guard or something.
Also, some of the warscrolls are not that well thought out... There are many elite infantry units, yet their utility isn't all that varied. Could have been a chance to completely rework some of them. Obvious example, Greatswords and Executioners. Others appear overpriced from the start, like Cold Ones for a whopping +50p. (more armor but no rerolls. better in combat but still 1A, which was their issue to start with).

I still like the more streamline direction, with command groups doing the same or shields giving flat +1 armor. The bazillion warscroll specific named rules for each unit was very annoying, so this is good.

Even if I have lots of (old) Free Cities models, I'm not even sure to buy the book. The squatting, lack of "count as" for certain units, and feeling the book is somewhat rushed or simply uninteresting makes it meh.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/29 18:36:13


Post by: Tiberius501


Well after the initial disappointment, having another watch of the review I think I’d go the Living City. I’d have this list I think.

LEADERS
- General on Griffon
- Nomad Prince
- Branchwych
BATTLELINE
- 20x Freeguild Guard w/ Sword and Board
- 10x Freeguild Guard w/ Halberds
- 10x Freeguild Guard w/ Halberds
OTHER
- 6x Gryph Knights
- 10x Wild Riders
- 10x Sisters of the Watch
- 10x Sisters of the Watch
- 6x Kurnoth Hunters w/ Greatswords


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/30 09:59:08


Post by: Astmeister


I looked through the rules of the various cities now. It seems to me that it's really hard to just play Freeguild, since you would be loosing some abilities of the cities. A bit sad...


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/30 10:37:48


Post by: Tiberius501


Yeah that list I did above is also invalid because the points changed haha. It seems sort of hard to make lists now with everything going up quite considerably in points. And all the abilities are mainly flat stat buffs, none of it is particularly interesting. Seems powerful though


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/30 11:13:04


Post by: auticus


Powerful is interesting to a lot of people lol if it can at least hang and be viable then it would be a positive, though that means the middle of the road books will be slipping down a notch to C-/D+ lists.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/30 11:42:11


Post by: Cronch


 Astmeister wrote:
I looked through the rules of the various cities now. It seems to me that it's really hard to just play Freeguild, since you would be loosing some abilities of the cities. A bit sad...

That I think is on purpose. The goal was to make armies of the cities, and not just collect freeguild, disposessed or darkling allegiances in one tome, since that already happened in GA:Order book. It also helps set it apart from other, mono-species armies like DoK or Nighthaunt etc.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/30 12:04:29


Post by: Mr Morden


 Commodus Leitdorf wrote:



GMG Has the book and put up a review. I'm going through it now so we'll see if some of the rumor I heard were true.


Hmm started watching and already grating that he gets city locations wrong - unless its changed Greywater is in the Realm of Life!


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/30 12:10:17


Post by: Tiberius501


 Mr Morden wrote:
 Commodus Leitdorf wrote:



GMG Has the book and put up a review. I'm going through it now so we'll see if some of the rumor I heard were true.


Hmm started watching and already grating that he gets city locations wrong - unless its changed Greywater is in the Realm of Life!


Isn’t that what he said?


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/30 12:15:09


Post by: Mr Morden


 Tiberius501 wrote:
 Mr Morden wrote:
 Commodus Leitdorf wrote:



GMG Has the book and put up a review. I'm going through it now so we'll see if some of the rumor I heard were true.


Hmm started watching and already grating that he gets city locations wrong - unless its changed Greywater is in the Realm of Life!


Isn’t that what he said?


Nope he said Aqshy - Realm of Fire city..... also he had was excited by the "revelation" that the Wanderers abadonned Alarielle - like its been from the very beginning.... I thnk he would be better with a script rather than trying to make up stuff as he goes along and getting it wrong.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/30 13:03:20


Post by: Commodus Leitdorf


Yeah the only annoying bit is there is no way to run the armies separately. If I make a Freeguild army from Hammerhal I have to use the Hammerhal rules, which means I can't make a Freeguild Great Company.

However an Excuse to throw in some dwarfs is tempting indeed...


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/30 14:25:47


Post by: Astmeister


So could one still use the rules from the GH for the Freeguild Great Company with the updated Points Cost and Datasheets for the units in Cities of Sigmar?


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/30 14:52:12


Post by: auticus


I would say probably not. The rules presented in the new book supersede older lists. At least officially. Unofficially your group can do whatever it wants.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/30 19:44:04


Post by: Venerable Ironclad


Without an official ruling, I cant say this for certain but as long as all necessary names and key words stay the same for the Freeguild Great Company, you might be able to use it provided you stay Grand Alliance Order.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/09/30 20:51:35


Post by: Future War Cultist


I’m a little sad that they ditched the duardin artillery. I thought that there was still life in those kits yet.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/10/01 12:17:29


Post by: BomBomHotdog


 Astmeister wrote:
So could one still use the rules from the GH for the Freeguild Great Company with the updated Points Cost and Datasheets for the units in Cities of Sigmar?


I don't see why not? You just don't get to use any of the Alliance stuff from Cities. I, for one, will be running Darkling Covens and if they lose their Alliance Abilities from GH by taking a City Alliance then I will be going back to the GH.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/10/01 12:39:08


Post by: terry


BomBomHotdog wrote:
 Astmeister wrote:
So could one still use the rules from the GH for the Freeguild Great Company with the updated Points Cost and Datasheets for the units in Cities of Sigmar?


I don't see why not? You just don't get to use any of the Alliance stuff from Cities. I, for one, will be running Darkling Covens and if they lose their Alliance Abilities from GH by taking a City Alliance then I will be going back to the GH.

if the new warscrolls don't have the right keywords, you can't use any of the old stuff


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/10/01 12:41:57


Post by: Commodus Leitdorf


BomBomHotdog wrote:
 Astmeister wrote:
So could one still use the rules from the GH for the Freeguild Great Company with the updated Points Cost and Datasheets for the units in Cities of Sigmar?


I don't see why not? You just don't get to use any of the Alliance stuff from Cities. I, for one, will be running Darkling Covens and if they lose their Alliance Abilities from GH by taking a City Alliance then I will be going back to the GH.


I mean we will have to see how it pans out. The main issue right now is that GW dropped the Empire General kit and changed the warscroll of the Freeguild General. No option to mount him, no optional weapons like a Lance or shield and a Pistol. Heck not even an option for a Battle Standard! Which I am a bit upset about as I have a General with banner I built for a skirmish campaign.

Now he just has a Zweinhander and no other options. Well see in the next General's Handbook whether or not the Freeguild is still a thing or not.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/10/01 13:29:10


Post by: Astmeister


The new Warscrolls from Cities of Sigmar still have the Freeguild keyword though.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/10/01 13:45:12


Post by: Tiberius501


Is it weird that this book has made me want to finally take the plunge and get a full Sylvaneth army?


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/10/01 13:47:24


Post by: Kanluwen


 Commodus Leitdorf wrote:
BomBomHotdog wrote:
 Astmeister wrote:
So could one still use the rules from the GH for the Freeguild Great Company with the updated Points Cost and Datasheets for the units in Cities of Sigmar?


I don't see why not? You just don't get to use any of the Alliance stuff from Cities. I, for one, will be running Darkling Covens and if they lose their Alliance Abilities from GH by taking a City Alliance then I will be going back to the GH.


I mean we will have to see how it pans out. The main issue right now is that GW dropped the Empire General kit and changed the warscroll of the Freeguild General. No option to mount him, no optional weapons like a Lance or shield and a Pistol. Heck not even an option for a Battle Standard! Which I am a bit upset about as I have a General with banner I built for a skirmish campaign.
Now he just has a Zweinhander and no other options. Well see in the next General's Handbook whether or not the Freeguild is still a thing or not.

There's still the option for the Griffin mounted version. You really shouldn't be shocked at the loss of the Battle Standard, as they removed everyone else's options long before that--and the horse mounted General had nothing he would synergize with.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Tiberius501 wrote:
Is it weird that this book has made me want to finally take the plunge and get a full Sylvaneth army?

Yes. Yes, it is.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/10/01 14:31:30


Post by: Commodus Leitdorf


 Kanluwen wrote:
There's still the option for the Griffin mounted version. You really shouldn't be shocked at the loss of the Battle Standard, as they removed everyone else's options long before that--and the horse mounted General had nothing he would synergize with.


I'm not surprised the option was dropped. I'm just not sure in the 2020 General's Handbook Freeguild will be a thing with their own Allegiance ability now that Cities of Sigmar is out.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/10/01 14:35:23


Post by: Kanluwen


 Commodus Leitdorf wrote:
 Kanluwen wrote:
There's still the option for the Griffin mounted version. You really shouldn't be shocked at the loss of the Battle Standard, as they removed everyone else's options long before that--and the horse mounted General had nothing he would synergize with.


I'm not surprised the option was dropped. I'm just not sure in the 2020 General's Handbook Freeguild will be a thing with their own Allegiance ability now that Cities of Sigmar is out.

When they first talked about Cities of Sigmar, they did mention race specific Allegiance traits--we'll see if that's in.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/10/01 14:43:44


Post by: Astmeister


 Kanluwen wrote:
 Commodus Leitdorf wrote:
 Kanluwen wrote:
There's still the option for the Griffin mounted version. You really shouldn't be shocked at the loss of the Battle Standard, as they removed everyone else's options long before that--and the horse mounted General had nothing he would synergize with.


I'm not surprised the option was dropped. I'm just not sure in the 2020 General's Handbook Freeguild will be a thing with their own Allegiance ability now that Cities of Sigmar is out.

When they first talked about Cities of Sigmar, they did mention race specific Allegiance traits--we'll see if that's in.


The youtube reviews clearly show that they are not in. Unless they are hidden somewhere.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/10/02 14:36:06


Post by: Boss Salvage


Dumb question re: all the marketing hype about taking Stanks and other behemoths as core: they're still capped by the behemoth limit, right? And FEC is the only faction that isn't, and that's because of their FAQ?

I have a fierce desire to do an army of Kharibdyss, however I'm not seeing that that's really a thing.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/10/02 15:25:12


Post by: auticus


I believe that steam tanks etc becoming core will override their behemoth limitations.

Because why not.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
And bottles picture on twitter just now confirms. He's playing against that book tonight he says and the picture shows 8 steam tanks and a khadron overlord ship.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/10/02 15:30:00


Post by: Boss Salvage


Yea, the hype around The Steam Tank army has me wondering if I missed something / assuming that this may well be FAQ'd into reality ...


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/10/02 15:40:16


Post by: auticus


Without seeing all the rules I can't comment. My gut instinct is that they are over optimal, and that taking 8 of them is a no brainer. It would basically be a high save high wound high offensive model that can plow into things and generate a ton of mortal wounds with high movement and only require less than a dozen models.

We already see that 8 is likely the max you can take in a 2000 pt game. The question is whether or not their damage output and durability put them on the bell curve (meaning you won't see them very often since that is not broken) or above the bell curve (meaning that they are doing more than their points cost and thus optimal). Until you see the new warscrolls though that question cannot be answered.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/10/02 15:46:44


Post by: nels1031


 auticus wrote:
Until you see the new warscrolls though that question cannot be answered.


Is the Warscroll on the GW website not the updated one? Has the Cities of Sigmar keyword.

Seems like a unit thats at the mercy of dice rolls. And they can gain the "Hero" keyword if you make it a commander.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/10/02 15:46:52


Post by: Boss Salvage


I actually looked at the Steam Tank rules, these things aren't behemoths or artillery or anything limited. So I suppose that answers that for now.

For fun, here's what Greywater Fastness does for them, according to 1d4chan:
Spoiler:
City Allegiance: Greywater Fastness (Ghyran)

The polluted, industrial gunpowder city in the Realm of Life.
Battle Traits

Amidst the Ghoul Mere: Greywater Fastness is from Ghyran.

Runelord: In your hero phase, ONE Greywater Fastness Runelord can chant the following prayer

Rune of Unfaltering Aim: On a 2+, select a friendly Greywater Fastness Ironweld Arsenal war machine within 3", until the start of your next hero phase it gets +1 to hit with its missile weapon attacks.

Home of the Great Ironweld Guilds: Friendly Greywater Fastness Ironweld Arsenal missile attacks have their maximum range increased by 3". In a pitched battle, you can include an additional artillery unit.

Command Ability:Salvo Fire: Use this in your shooting phase. Pick 1 friendly Greywater Fastness Freeguild Handgunners or Irondrakes unit wholly within 12" of a hero. Add 1 to hit rolls for missile attacks made by that unit until the end of the phase. Doesn't stack.

Command Traits

Seat on the Council: If this general is on the battlefield, roll a dice in your hero phase. On a 4+ you gain a CP.
Drillmaster: Reroll hit rolls of 1 for friendly missile weapon attacks made by units wholly within 12" of this general as long as the general is more than 3" away from any enemy units.
Ghoul Mere Ranger: Friendly units wholly within 12" of the general can run and still shoot later in the same turn.

Artefacts Of Power

Steam Piston Plate Mail: Add 1 to save rolls for the bearer. If the bearer does not have a mount, add 1 to its move.
Runic Munitions: Pick 1 of the bearer's missile weapons, add 1 to its damage characteristic.
Magnificient Macroscope: Start the game with 1 extra CP, and add 1 to hit for missile attacks made by the bearer.


Spell Lore

Descending Ash Cloud: Cast on a 6, pick an enemy unit within 18" that is visible to the caster, subtract 1 from hit rolls made by that unit until the start of your next hero phase.
Eroding Blast: Cast on a 6, pick a terrain feature wholly within 18" and visible to the caster. Roll a die for every model within 1" of the feature. On a 5+ they suffer a mortal wound. In addition until your next hero phase that terrain gains the Deadly Scenery Rule.
Choking Fumes: Cast on a 6, pick 1 enemy unit within 15" that is visible to them, roll a die for every model that is within 15". For each 5+ that unit suffers a mortal wound. Combine with balewind vortex to get a bit more range.
Hella powers up that Steam Tank Commander O_O

EDIT: Assuming these are the current warscrolls, as I have no way to know, besides them being linked to by GeeDub and having the right keywords.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/10/02 15:48:05


Post by: Commodus Leitdorf


There is a limit to the number of Behemoths you can take. While having a handful of large, hard hitting multi wound models may look scary. You do kind of have to play the objective of whatever battleplan your using. I don't see how they can hold multiple objectives with a list such as that.

Most likely if you see a Steam tank commander you'll maybe only see 1 other tank in the list to make room for more useful units.

Also, lets not forget that the Steam Tank rules have changed as well.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/10/02 16:08:14


Post by: Ghaz


 Boss Salvage wrote:
I actually looked at the Steam Tank rules, these things aren't behemoths or artillery or anything limited. So I suppose that answers that for now.

For fun, here's what Greywater Fastness does for them, according to 1d4chan:
Spoiler:
City Allegiance: Greywater Fastness (Ghyran)

The polluted, industrial gunpowder city in the Realm of Life.
Battle Traits

Amidst the Ghoul Mere: Greywater Fastness is from Ghyran.

Runelord: In your hero phase, ONE Greywater Fastness Runelord can chant the following prayer

Rune of Unfaltering Aim: On a 2+, select a friendly Greywater Fastness Ironweld Arsenal war machine within 3", until the start of your next hero phase it gets +1 to hit with its missile weapon attacks.

Home of the Great Ironweld Guilds: Friendly Greywater Fastness Ironweld Arsenal missile attacks have their maximum range increased by 3". In a pitched battle, you can include an additional artillery unit.

Command Ability:Salvo Fire: Use this in your shooting phase. Pick 1 friendly Greywater Fastness Freeguild Handgunners or Irondrakes unit wholly within 12" of a hero. Add 1 to hit rolls for missile attacks made by that unit until the end of the phase. Doesn't stack.

Command Traits

Seat on the Council: If this general is on the battlefield, roll a dice in your hero phase. On a 4+ you gain a CP.
Drillmaster: Reroll hit rolls of 1 for friendly missile weapon attacks made by units wholly within 12" of this general as long as the general is more than 3" away from any enemy units.
Ghoul Mere Ranger: Friendly units wholly within 12" of the general can run and still shoot later in the same turn.

Artefacts Of Power

Steam Piston Plate Mail: Add 1 to save rolls for the bearer. If the bearer does not have a mount, add 1 to its move.
Runic Munitions: Pick 1 of the bearer's missile weapons, add 1 to its damage characteristic.
Magnificient Macroscope: Start the game with 1 extra CP, and add 1 to hit for missile attacks made by the bearer.


Spell Lore

Descending Ash Cloud: Cast on a 6, pick an enemy unit within 18" that is visible to the caster, subtract 1 from hit rolls made by that unit until the start of your next hero phase.
Eroding Blast: Cast on a 6, pick a terrain feature wholly within 18" and visible to the caster. Roll a die for every model within 1" of the feature. On a 5+ they suffer a mortal wound. In addition until your next hero phase that terrain gains the Deadly Scenery Rule.
Choking Fumes: Cast on a 6, pick 1 enemy unit within 15" that is visible to them, roll a die for every model that is within 15". For each 5+ that unit suffers a mortal wound. Combine with balewind vortex to get a bit more range.
Hella powers up that Steam Tank Commander O_O

EDIT: Assuming these are the current warscrolls, as I have no way to know, besides them being linked to by GeeDub and having the right keywords.

Whether a unit is a Leader, Battleline, Artillery or Behemoth wouldn't show up on their warscroll, but in the Pitched Battle Profiles at the back of the battletome.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/10/02 16:24:43


Post by: NinthMusketeer


I seriously doubt the 8-tank army is going to be that overpowered, even if steam tanks are an army running 4-6 of them will be superior for its ability to bring in other troops. Gristlegore could get away with it because it was still summoning in additional troops on top of those behemoths, and when push came to shove it lost to Blisterskin anyways.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/10/02 16:52:51


Post by: Commodus Leitdorf


 Ghaz wrote:
Whether a unit is a Leader, Battleline, Artillery or Behemoth wouldn't show up on their warscroll, but in the Pitched Battle Profiles at the back of the battletome.


Spoiler:


Linked image will show both the Steam Tank and Steam Tank Commander are Behemoths, so they will still be restricted as normal (Points are grayed out as I pulled it from Bell of Lost Souls)


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/10/02 17:05:02


Post by: auticus


Interesting. Then that makes the game Bottle is playing and posting about on Twitter not matched play. Which is very odd for what he normally posts.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/10/02 17:20:37


Post by: Sterling191


With the correct general the regular tanks become battleline.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/10/02 17:48:39


Post by: Boss Salvage


 Commodus Leitdorf wrote:
 Ghaz wrote:
Whether a unit is a Leader, Battleline, Artillery or Behemoth wouldn't show up on their warscroll, but in the Pitched Battle Profiles at the back of the battletome.
Spoiler:
Linked image will show both the Steam Tank and Steam Tank Commander are Behemoths, so they will still be restricted as normal (Points are grayed out as I pulled it from Bell of Lost Souls)
I can't see that image. But riiiiiiiiight, I forgot that AOS doesn't put 'Behemoth' on the warscrolls of Behemoth class units. Honestly, that's straight up weird, but I do suppose that Behemoth has really nothing to do with anything except limiting army comp. A halfling riding a goat based on a 25mm round could be a Behemoth and thus limited in access ... even if it certainly defies expectations to do so.

So huh. Still wondering if COS will get a FAQ ala FEC, again given all the marketing hype. Though yet again, they could simply be gushing about Not Matched Play gaming, in which case I could put down two dozen Kharibdyss for great victory


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/10/02 18:09:04


Post by: auticus


Yeah ... but Bottle usually (I have no recollection of him ever not so using the word usually in case I have missed something) posts matched play games.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
And Ben Johnson (lead designer, avid tournament matched play) is the owner of that army it looks like based on his own tweet. I'm heavily leaning towards thats a matched play legal force.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/10/02 18:55:25


Post by: NinthMusketeer


They decided as of FEC that battleline trumps behemoth requirement, so it is matched play legal. But we already knew that a while ago when they did the preview article showing steam tanks could be battleline.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/10/02 19:22:06


Post by: Boss Salvage


 NinthMusketeer wrote:
But we already knew that a while ago when they did the preview article showing steam tanks could be battleline.
Seems to me that a unit can be restricted as a Behemoth but still provide comp requirements as Battleline, unless of course that FEC FAQ applies to all armies? I know from experience that that is entirely not how GW players tend to interpret army FAQs

EDIT: If it matters at all, the complete FAQ:
Q: In a Pitched Battle, Royal Terrogheists and Royal Zombie Dragons from a Gristlegore army are Battleline. Are they still counted Behemoths as well?
A: No.
It is eminently plausible that this will apply to Stanks and Kharibs - part of me is still wondering if it's simply hidden in the COS book or even the BBB somewhere!


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/10/02 20:00:54


Post by: Commodus Leitdorf


Yeah that seems like....a really dumb ruling.

But I don't play competitively...and if I did I'd use my Gutbusters so I guess I don't care.

Seems silly though.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/10/02 22:20:25


Post by: NinthMusketeer


I agree that it is strange, and prefer how they did it with BCR.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/10/02 22:22:18


Post by: Kanluwen


 NinthMusketeer wrote:
I agree that it is strange, and prefer how they did it with BCR.

Wellllllllll, we do have the Mawtribes coming so BCR might be going the FEC route.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/10/02 23:24:56


Post by: auticus


Seems to be their precedent. Also was asked on those pictures if it was a matched play game and it was affirmed it was.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/10/03 13:43:37


Post by: Ghaz


https://www.warhammer-community.com/2019/10/03/building-the-cities-of-sigmargw-homepage-post-3/

An interesting article on Warhammer Community on how they built some of the scenery built in the Cities of Sigmar battletome.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/10/04 13:10:35


Post by: Sterling191


Welp, I think this is the book thats officially going to push me into AoS. The stupid question is, where do I start? I saw they're coming out with the Gaming Book that seems to be the distilled down essences of matched play stuff (its typically how my local scene rocks). Would that be a worthwhile place to dive in?


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/10/04 13:46:04


Post by: Kanluwen


Sterling191 wrote:
Welp, I think this is the book thats officially going to push me into AoS. The stupid question is, where do I start? I saw they're coming out with the Gaming Book that seems to be the distilled down essences of matched play stuff (its typically how my local scene rocks). Would that be a worthwhile place to dive in?

It's not "distilled down essences", it's the full kit and kaboodle.
The Core Rules are something like 8 pages.

This bit? This is the important stuff for you in Matched Play:
- Additional matched play and Pitched Battle rules – perfect if you're attending events or tournaments
- 31 matched play battleplans, offering you a vast degree of choice in how you choose to conquer the Mortal Realms
- Rules for battling in each of the Mortal Realms, complete with game-changing Realmscape Features and powerful spells of the Mortal Realms
- A huge selection of Artefacts of the Realms, giving every army a vast selection of magical items and weapons for using in your games

Some of that stuff is otherwise only in Malign Sorcery(which is something like $100 by itself with all the Endless Spells in it).
Some of it comes from the General's Handbook, which has updated points(not something you need with Free Cities).

I'd suggest going with the Gaming Book and Free Cities Book. If you want the Warscroll Cards for Cities of Sigmar, try to hunt those down on Saturday as they're sold out online. Those sets tend to have counters/markers for status effects that will make life easier on you.


Beyond that, can't help you as I haven't sat myself down and forced myself to look at things too heavily.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/10/06 06:49:37


Post by: NinthMusketeer


Getting through the new battletomes, still digesting them but preliminary feelings are pretty positive. Orruk changes still preserve what the armies were but also 'clean up' the allegiance... for the most part. Big Waaagh seems like it could have used a bit more development time as it seems 'messy' in the sense of a mash of different rules from the two allegiances with a mechanic that ties them together. There are advantages to that approach though, and I really like how the ironjawz/bonesplittaz allegiances look on their own.

Free Cities got a massive overhaul, and I am less critical of the massive cuts now as there would be a ton of clutter from units with overlapping rules had they all been crammed in here. Still would have preferred they did things a bit differently but it is what it is. Book looks really cool but the extent of the updates also comes with some bigger rough patches where I feel the point costs are way off or certain combinations are vastly superior. But there is a lot in this book for a lot of potential builds, for narrative/fluffy gamers especially it's a gold mine.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/10/06 08:28:57


Post by: Elmir


I've been mulling over all the units that got the axe and was wondering if there were any units that couldn't act as stand ins for something else that does have a warscroll.

And looking at how massive that warscroll card pack for cities is, it's pretty friggin obvious there needed to be some pruning.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/10/06 10:21:54


Post by: NinthMusketeer


The GW we have right now wouldn't do this, but I would have loved to see something like "Free City Guard" that has a generic warscroll profile for a basic melee troop with options for longspears, two-handed weapon, spear & shield, or hand weapon & shield. The unit picks one of three options: gain the human freeguild keywords, gain the duardin dispossessed keywords with -1 movement and +1 bravery, or gain the aelf darkling coven keywords with +1 movement +1 bravery and one worse a save. It condenses a lot of warscrolls into one place and allows OOP kits to continue to see play without taking up their own warscroll slots.

A good chunk of Free Cities units could have been done this way:
Quarrellers/Crossbowmen (longer range no rend shooting)
Thunderers/Handgunners (shorter range rend shooting)
Archers/Glade Guard (scout movement/bonus for being in cover)
Greatswords/Hammerers/Executioners (heavy armor strong melee attack)
Hellblaster/Organ Gun (close range multi-shot artillery)
Rocket/Duardin Cannon (long range multi-damage artillery)

Then more unique units can do more unique things since basic rolls are covered on a generic level. But I'm just daydreaming.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/10/06 12:01:09


Post by: Commodus Leitdorf


I do wish they had an option for a Generic city so we could build our own. But so far I'm liking what I'm seeing...just not sure which City to base my army off of yet.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/10/06 12:06:40


Post by: Overread


 Commodus Leitdorf wrote:
I do wish they had an option for a Generic city so we could build our own. But so far I'm liking what I'm seeing...just not sure which City to base my army off of yet.


It's probably better that they didn't go down that pathway. I recall one of the earlier Tyranid books that tried that. You could gene-craft almost anything you wanted, the problem was it was not only so free that it was too much freedom for most gamers; but it also left itself open to some horrible potential abuses of the game balance. Sometimes its a lot easier to define set blocks that work and then let gamers get creative with conversions and paint schemes for making "their own" interpretation of a city


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/10/06 12:18:20


Post by: Future War Cultist


Yeah the only time I’ve ever seen a customisable GW theme set really work was with the Kharadron Overlord Code, and even that was undermined by the named ports being better in every way with some being yet better than others.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/10/06 14:16:06


Post by: Kanluwen


So I'm doing two things here, spoilering the Kantankerous Speech:
Spoiler:

Someone at GW seems to really dislike Elf cavalry with shields.

Dark Riders no longer have them listed as part of their wargear, despite the models clearly displaying them. I'm assuming it's an oversight as the Dark Riders have a 4+ save instead of 5+ that Wild Riders and the Pistoliers/Outriders have...but still, would be nice to have a list.

Wild Riders apparently still have the shoddy shield rules...but only if you check the most recent app. It's not in the book and it wasn't in the downloadable rules as of this morning. -2 Movement for a reroll of save rolls of 1s is not an acceptable thing. -2 Movement should be bumping you from a 5+ to a 4+ or something like that--or giving you a shield vs Mortal Wounds or certain Rend values.

Glade Guard suffered from a lack of designer competency, in my opinion. They chose to continue a unit design philosophy which was for a rank and file archer unit--and then gave them a 'gimmick' shot.

They would have been smarter to utilize the Deepwood Scouts template of a smaller, skirmishing unit. But that's all gone at this point.


Now, for The Good Part...

The fluff in the book is nice. It's interesting to see how the cities function, and we get our first glimpse as to what was going on with Malerion and his nonsense with the Order Serpentis(spoiler: Order Serpentis were being jerks to the other races and Malerion thought it was hilarious, so he stuck up for them to Sigmar).

Scourge Privateers became amazing. My loss of Wanderers characters is somewhat tempered by the fact that I can do some nasty stuff with Anvilgard. A Kharibdyss can potentially be a -3 to Bravery with the right Drakeblood Curse...couple that with Dark Riders for a 12" aura of -4 Bravery?

That's...yeah. That's something potentially nasty.

Also, the name of an Anvilgard regiment of Freeguild Marines is "The Rumrunners".



We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/10/06 16:10:50


Post by: nels1031


As a fan/collector of Knights Excelsior and a bigger fan of the Callis & Toll stories that were initially set in and around Excelsis, I was kind of bummed that they didn’t have rules for the City of Secrets.

But after seeing how Excelsis is mentioned in the Orruk battletome, perhaps they will have their time to shine(or not, depending on who wins) soon. Maybe have their rules in a “Forbidden Power-esque” supplement, like Lethis and Legion of Grief?

Regarding the battletome, I do like how each city is restricted to the realm that they are based out of, in regards to selecting Realm specific items etc. Its a small thing and makes narrative sense but also has an impact on the gaming table. Would like to see more of that personally. Granted, it wouldn’t make sense to do that across the board as some factions are inherently mobile, but I kind of like it.

Which means this will be the only battletome to have those restrictions.



We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/10/06 16:57:41


Post by: Future War Cultist


I’m glad to see the ‘standard issue’ stuff getting some love.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/10/06 18:38:00


Post by: NinthMusketeer


 nels1031 wrote:
As a fan/collector of Knights Excelsior and a bigger fan of the Callis & Toll stories that were initially set in and around Excelsis, I was kind of bummed that they didn’t have rules for the City of Secrets.

But after seeing how Excelsis is mentioned in the Orruk battletome, perhaps they will have their time to shine(or not, depending on who wins) soon. Maybe have their rules in a “Forbidden Power-esque” supplement, like Lethis and Legion of Grief?

Regarding the battletome, I do like how each city is restricted to the realm that they are based out of, in regards to selecting Realm specific items etc. Its a small thing and makes narrative sense but also has an impact on the gaming table. Would like to see more of that personally. Granted, it wouldn’t make sense to do that across the board as some factions are inherently mobile, but I kind of like it.

Which means this will be the only battletome to have those restrictions.

I like that aspect too. The way the book is designed it would be easy for them to add new cities in the future--each city is just two pages after all. They could even add new cities in white dwarf.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/10/06 21:04:54


Post by: Kanluwen


I'm hoping we get to see some more factions get Realm 'locked' based on their background.

Looking at you, FEC...


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/10/06 21:08:29


Post by: Mr Morden


 NinthMusketeer wrote:
 nels1031 wrote:
As a fan/collector of Knights Excelsior and a bigger fan of the Callis & Toll stories that were initially set in and around Excelsis, I was kind of bummed that they didn’t have rules for the City of Secrets.

But after seeing how Excelsis is mentioned in the Orruk battletome, perhaps they will have their time to shine(or not, depending on who wins) soon. Maybe have their rules in a “Forbidden Power-esque” supplement, like Lethis and Legion of Grief?

Regarding the battletome, I do like how each city is restricted to the realm that they are based out of, in regards to selecting Realm specific items etc. Its a small thing and makes narrative sense but also has an impact on the gaming table. Would like to see more of that personally. Granted, it wouldn’t make sense to do that across the board as some factions are inherently mobile, but I kind of like it.

Which means this will be the only battletome to have those restrictions.

I like that aspect too. The way the book is designed it would be easy for them to add new cities in the future--each city is just two pages after all. They could even add new cities in white dwarf.


Agreed - they only did two Realms with this book I think?


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/10/07 06:27:59


Post by: Stux


 Overread wrote:
 Commodus Leitdorf wrote:
I do wish they had an option for a Generic city so we could build our own. But so far I'm liking what I'm seeing...just not sure which City to base my army off of yet.


It's probably better that they didn't go down that pathway. I recall one of the earlier Tyranid books that tried that. You could gene-craft almost anything you wanted, the problem was it was not only so free that it was too much freedom for most gamers; but it also left itself open to some horrible potential abuses of the game balance. Sometimes its a lot easier to define set blocks that work and then let gamers get creative with conversions and paint schemes for making "their own" interpretation of a city


Yeah, this is always an issue with 'build you own' stuff. We're seeing it with the Space Marine successor rules now:

"Oh cool, I can create a custom chapter that reflects the lore I want and have that impact how they work on the tabletop" - what everyone thinks moments before every chapter become Master Artisans.

Basically, there's usually a clear best option for your army build, and almost everyone picks that.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/10/07 09:08:11


Post by: Eldarsif


 Elmir wrote:
I've been mulling over all the units that got the axe and was wondering if there were any units that couldn't act as stand ins for something else that does have a warscroll.

And looking at how massive that warscroll card pack for cities is, it's pretty friggin obvious there needed to be some pruning.


I have about 1500 points of High Elves and already I am seeing where each High Elf unit I have could stand in for another. I mean, my Ellyrian Reavers will be Dark Riders for example.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/10/07 12:22:05


Post by: Future War Cultist


How do the dark elf minis look with more ‘goodie’ paint scheme? Because I look at them and how sinister and evil they look, and I wonder if they really fit in well with the human, duardin and other Aelf factions. But a good, unifying paint scheme can work wonders.

It does make me wish though that the high elves had a more up to date mini range before a lot of it got squatted. They’d have looked good alongside the others. The scale mail they wore in particular would have looked sweet alongside the dwarf units.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/10/07 12:53:32


Post by: Stux


 Future War Cultist wrote:
How do the dark elf minis look with more ‘goodie’ paint scheme? Because I look at them and how sinister and evil they look, and I wonder if they really fit in well with the human, duardin and other Aelf factions. But a good, unifying paint scheme can work wonders.

It does make me wish though that the high elves had a more up to date mini range before a lot of it got squatted. They’d have looked good alongside the others. The scale mail they wore in particular would have looked sweet alongside the dwarf units.


I agree DE really look odd alongside the other factions... A brighter paint job will definitely help though.

As for High Elves, my assumption is GW is ultimately planning to do a Tyrion and Teclis faction. The characters are still a big deal in the lore, so it makes sense to me they would eventually reinvent High Elves through them.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/10/07 12:54:52


Post by: Kanluwen


Reading the Order Serpentis, Darkling Coven, and Scourge Privateer fluff...there's A Good Reason for it.

They're part of the Free Cities, but only because they're biding their time/getting something for it.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/10/07 15:42:11


Post by: Uriels_Flame


Did dark elves retain repeater bolt throwers?

If not, can we still utilize them with the dark elves free rules?


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/10/07 16:07:34


Post by: NinthMusketeer


 Kanluwen wrote:
Reading the Order Serpentis, Darkling Coven, and Scourge Privateer fluff...there's A Good Reason for it.

They're part of the Free Cities, but only because they're biding their time/getting something for it.
They are evil self serving criminals, that they still represent a good choice of ally says a lot about what the free cities are up against.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/10/07 18:07:29


Post by: Athariel


The main issue for counts as seems to be around armoured cavalry and horse mounted leaders

I have tons of Bretonnians, Empire Knights and Dragon Princes as well as equivalent mounted leaders and find it very difficult to fit them in to anything.

Archers I was just thinking of going counts as crossbowmen.

Ellyrians either Pistoliers with small conversion or Dark Riders.

Swordmasters as Greatswords


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/10/07 19:05:27


Post by: Astmeister


2 Knights on one large base = count as Demigriph Knights?


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/10/08 03:15:11


Post by: BomBomHotdog


 Uriels_Flame wrote:
Did dark elves retain repeater bolt throwers?

If not, can we still utilize them with the dark elves free rules?


Only if you bring the Legacy Dark Elves, which means no Free Cities. Which sucks cause I love my Repeater Bolt Throwers :( Also annoyed that they didn't put all the points for units in the book, only the updated ones.

On the note of "good" Dark elves, remember that Order doesn't equal "Good." Just look at Deepkin, Daughters, or some of the Stormcast in the fluff. The dark elf factions are self serving and power hungry. The fact that they work with SIgmar and his allies is to further their own ends more-so then to enact any kind of righteousness. In short, the aelves of Ulgu sided with Sigmar out of convince and mutual hatred of Chaos.

Supposedly Malerion is actually a Chaos god now. There's a picture of what looks like a scene setup from Realmslayer part three that has him listed as such. Not sure of the authenticity but if true could make for an interesting shakeup of the story.

So, spell combo from Anvilgard. Requires at least 2 Wizards (90 points Sorcs on foot) and Spellportals endless spell. Sorc 1 casts an empowered portal spell letting you put it where ever but keep it within 6" of an enemy unit. Sorc 2 casts Vitriolic Spray (range 6") through the portals turning a units Save to "-". Throw in a Sorc on Black Dragon for bladewind and deal 9 MW automagically. Downside is that this combo would cost at least 580ish points and you couldn't Bladewind on turn 1 unless you huddle around the portal. On the plus side, throw a cheap unit next to the Sorceresses to kill models from for +2 to casting (and be a guard unit for backline drops). Could 1-shot on-foot heroes turn 1 with some luck or take that 30 man Stormcast shield-wall to a 5+ at best iirc. Good? Probably not, but sounds fun to try.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/10/08 03:38:41


Post by: nels1031


BomBomHotdog wrote:

Supposedly Malerion is actually a Chaos god now. There's a picture of what looks like a scene setup from Realmslayer part three that has him listed as such. Not sure of the authenticity but if true could make for an interesting shakeup of the story.


David Guymer has come out and said that was clearly a mistake. Though he did add “Unless someone knows something I don’t”


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/10/08 12:14:30


Post by: Kanluwen


BomBomHotdog wrote:
 Uriels_Flame wrote:
Did dark elves retain repeater bolt throwers?

If not, can we still utilize them with the dark elves free rules?


Only if you bring the Legacy Dark Elves, which means no Free Cities. Which sucks cause I love my Repeater Bolt Throwers :( Also annoyed that they didn't put all the points for units in the book, only the updated ones.

It's because this is the Cities of Sigmar book. It says right at the top of the points page, these points are for the units presented in Cities of Sigmar.

Anything not in that list can't be Cities of Sigmar.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/10/08 12:18:47


Post by: Overread


Ally some Stormcast with a Celestar Ballista and use the Repeater Bolt thrower as a proxy.


We’re Getting a Free Cities Book!  @ 2019/10/08 14:21:13


Post by: terry


 Overread wrote:
Ally some Stormcast with a Celestar Ballista and use the Repeater Bolt thrower as a proxy.

you don't need to ally in stormcast, 1 in 4 units can be stormcast in a city army