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TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/07 14:23:01


Post by: nels1031


New(and final?)DLC:




ABOUT THIS CONTENT

The Warden & the Paunch is the latest Lords Pack for Total War: WARHAMMER II. Introducing two rival Legendary Lords from the world of Warhammer Fantasy Battles, each with their own factions, objectives, mechanics, units and playstyle, for use in both the Eye of the Vortex and Mortal Empires campaigns, and custom/multiplayer battles.

Eltharion the Grim commands Yvresse (High Elves) while Grom the Paunch leads the Broken Axe Tribe (Greenskins). Neither Yvresse nor the Broken Axe tribe are involved in the Vortex race, but are pitted against one another as eternal nemeses, on a collision course to a final climactic encounter where only one can emerge the victor.



Long has Eltharion the Warden of Tor Yvresse stood sentinel, ever-watchful for signs of Greenskin incursion. While he campaigned overseas against the Druchii of Naggarond in ages past, Tor Yvresse nearly fell as the green tsunami of Grom the Paunch’s legendary Waaagh! roared through Ulthuan. After defeating Grom and scattering his hordes, Eltharion swore that no Orc or Goblin filth would ever set foot in his lands again.

But Grom has other designs. His cavernous belly aches for a rematch, and his hunger for vengeance is matched only by his titanic appetite. As his gobbos tend to the bubbling cauldron, delighting him with each tasty new morsel, his plans begin to set. He’ll gather them all, the bosses and the boys, wind them up to a fever pitch, and lead them on a Waaagh! the likes of which the world has never seen. This time, Tor Yvresse will fall, and its snooty Warden will kneel before the mighty Paunch!


High Elves - Eltharion the Grim (Yvresse)

Unique faction mechanics:

Athel Tamarha

In a secluded Yvresse mountainside lies Athel Tamarha, Eltharion’s base of operations. It lies in ruins, untouched since Grom’s previous Waaagh!, but Eltharion seeks to rebuild it in Tor Yvresse’s defence.
In Eltharion's campaign, Athel Tamarha is represented by a new panel where the player rebuilds structures to gain numerous unique benefits. In addition, Eltharion can use his unique Warden’s Cage ability against enemy Heroes and Lords in battle. Should they fall while under its influence, they will be imprisoned in Athel Tamarha for interrogation…

Athel Tamarha has a number of structures across two unique chains which can be rebuilt. Each enhances Tor Yvresse’s defence rating and grants the following:

The Silent Sentinels chain can increase Tor Yvresse’s defence rating and enable the recruitment and upgrading of elite Mistwalker units, plus increasing recruitment capacities for several unique elite unit types available to Eltharion.
The Watchers of Yvresse chain enable the interrogation of captured Heroes and Lords, improvements to the Mist of Yvresse, and bonuses to Eltharion’s Influence.
Through the questioning, vanquishing and indoctrination of captives, Eltharion can gain useful information and other benefits.

Mist of Yvresse
Tor Yvresse will become progressively shrouded by an enchanted mist, enhancing all of Eltharion's troops and disrupting enemies caught within it. 

Provides the unique Army Ability ‘Envelop in Mist’ which enhances your troops’ performance when fighting within its influence
Athel Tamarha upgrades grant additional effects as the Mist become stronger.
Increasing the strength of the Mist of Yvresse will eventually cause it to cover all of Ulthuan as a protective aid.

Defence of Yvresse
Eltharion will gradually build up defensive power at Tor Yvresse, as Eltharion's homeland becomes increasingly fortified against invasion.

At the campaign outset, the city of Tor Yvresse will begin in a damaged state until upgrades are completed, progressing the city into rebuilt then fortified states. This is reflected in any battles fought over Tor Yvresse, affording increasingly stronger defensive abilities and options for Eltharion. 
The Yvresse defence level also expands the Mist of Yvresse to cover further regions of Ulthuan, enhancing Eltharion’s forces and weakening interlopers.   

Rite: Invocation of Ladrielle
For Eltharion, the Invocation of Isha is replaced by the Invocation of Ladrielle, which empowers the Mists of Yvresse.
New Units and Characters:

Eltharion (Legendary Lord)
Eltharion the Grim is the unflinching warden of Tor Yvresse. Atop his mighty Griffon, Stormwing, he swoops into battle with peerless conviction.

Eltharion wields a spear and a sword, as well as being a caster of High Magic. This offers him the flexibility to alter his role in battle based on the circumstances at hand. His defence-focused abilities also make him excellent at holding firm battle lines.

Archmage (Lord)
The High Elven Archmages are amongst the greatest practitioners of Magic within the mortal realms. With the introduction of the Archmage, High Elf players now have access to all 8 core Winds of Magic and the Lore of High Magic to choose from, ideal for those who prefer a more magic-focused playstyle.

Rangers
High Elf Rangers are inhabitants of Ulthuan's more remote areas and are called upon in times of need.

Silverin Guard
Heavy Spear unit for High Elves. The Silverin Guard are tasked with defending the Watchstone of Tor Yvresse - a waystone of fabulous power.

War Lions of Chrace
These fearsome beasts are deadly hunting cats with a muscular frame and a sharp, cunning mind. Almost as tall at the shoulders as an Elven Steed, a War Lion is far stronger, able to break bones with each sweep of its claws and shatter even helmeted heads with a single chomp of its fanged maw.

Lion Chariot of Chrace
Many of the Phoenix King's bodyguard ride to battle in Lion Chariots. Each of these white-timbered constructions is drawn by a pair of snarling War Lions whose savage power is belied by their feline grace and elegantly plaited manes.

Arcane Phoenix
The Arcane Phoenix is a majestic and fearsome creature with a wingspan as great as any of the mighty War Eagles of the High Elves. Cloaked in blazing feathers that can turn the sharpest arrow, it is the living embodiment of the destructive and purging Wind of Aqshy.

Campaign Exclusive Units: Eltharion's Mistwalkers

The Skyhawks
Swift and energetic, the Skyhawks never weary of battle, always standing ready to fight to the death if necessary.

Sentinels of Astaril
Former training partners to the Warden himself in his youth, the Sentinels are amongst his most trusted servicemen.

Spire Guard of Tor Yvresse
The honour guards of the Warden’s tower are Tor Yvresse’s foremost defenders, and the anchor around which its armies gather.

Athel Tamarha Faithbearers
Once of the household of Eltharion’s late father, the Faithbearers’ guilt over their master’s death drives them to fight to reclaim their valour.

Knights of Tor Gaval
Thanks to the challenges of training in their murky homeland, the Knights of Tor Gaval are rightly said to be amongst the most talented of wingmen in all Ulthuan.

New Regiments of Renown
Talons of Tor Caleda (Archers Light Armour)
The Talons of Tor Caleda are an elite unit for Archers who serve the Prince of Caledor.

Rahagra's Pride (War Lions of Chrace)
Rahagra's Pride inherit their name from the fabled father of white lions.

Omen of Asuryan (Arcane Phoenix)
Arcane Phoenixes are the companions of Asuryan the Creator, harbingers of woe and bearers of hope in equal measure. They are drawn from Asuryan's side when the Winds of Magic howl through the world of mortals in mighty storms, and in distant mist-shrouded Ulthuan the High Elves are forewarned of the coming of these magical tempests by the sudden manifestation of Arcane Phoenixes in the skies above their island home. They are a mixed omen; a symbol of destruction soon to come as well as the hope of rebirth.


Greenskins - Grom the Paunch (Broken Axe)

Unique mechanics and features:

Grom's Cauldron

Grom has an insatiable appetite, as his girth attests to. In a Grom campaign, you’ll find a variety of ingredients around the world with which to cook up a range of recipes. By combining different ingredients in Grom's Cauldron, Grom and his boyz will be able to feast and gain special powers.

Unlock a wide range of different ingredients from campaign exploration, and by meeting the Troll Hag Food Merchant.
Combine ingredients to form dishes, each of which provides unique buffs to Grom and his army
Some dishes can add special units to Grom's army
Cooking up and sampling a certain number of dishes will permanently enhance Grom himself.

Blacktoof

During Grom’s legendary Waaagh!, his most trusted Shaman, Ol’ Blacktoof, nearly brought destruction to Ulthuan and beyond by felling the Elven Waystones and drawing their power into himself. Fate intervened in the form of Eltharion, who separated Blacktoof’s head neatly from his shoulders. But the shaman’s surging power helped him to cheat true death, and his disembodied head serves his master still.

While Niblet is Grom’s chief advisor, Blacktoof will from time to time utter guidance to Grom, delivering tasks and moulding the journey to his inevitable and decisive showdown with Eltharion.
Blacktoof’s head will also take on the role of a special item in Grom's campaign. He may be assigned to a Shaman, granting the ability to summon a Rogue Idol in battle.
New Units and Characters:

Grom the Paunch (Legendary Lord)
Grom is the self-styled king of the goblins. He wields the mighty Axe of Grom, and rides into battle atop the sturdy Chariot of Grom, with his trusty Night Goblin Assistant and standard bearer, Niblet.

The presence of Grom near friendly troops inspires them with a leadership buff. If Grom makes his way into the fighting, that buff increases.

Grom is ALWAYS mounted atop the Chariot of Grom.

Giant River Hag Troll (Hero)
Giant River Troll Hags are hateful and bitter creatures, far larger and more dangerous than their common kin. These Lore of Death casters are invested with an innate ability to shape the Winds of Magic as they stir the brackish waters in which they dwell.

Snotling Pump Wagons
The Snotling Pump Wagon is a wooden fighting platform on wheels. Like a chariot, a Pump Wagon hurtles towards the foe to run them over. However, the Pump Wagon rumbles under its own power, with momentum provided by Snotlings, who frantically pump crude contraptions and cranks to drive the belts that turn the wheels.

Snotling Pump Wagons (Flappas)
Flappas are crude wings, attached to the side of the Pump Wagon, and flapped up and down by the actions of the crew. This allows the Pump Wagon to make short jumps as it bounces along.

Snotling Pump Wagons (Spiky Rollers)
These Pump Wagons are fitted with a roller studded with sharp spikes.

River Trolls
A River Troll somewhat resembles a riverbed: coated in sediment, slime, rotting vegetation, fish carcasses, and various other stinky detritus whose precise nature and origin are too horrible to contemplate. In all probability the River Troll’s stink is even worse than that of the riverbed, since one can add the Troll’s personal miasma to the ill-omened mélange of odours emitted from the mucky smears on its skin.

Stone Trolls
Stone Trolls are a distinct breed of Troll which live exclusively in caves and the mountainous regions of the world. Since they live on rocky mountains, they tend to consume large quantities of stone, the natural magical inertia of which imbues them with a certain degree of magical resistance.

Rogue Idol
Rogue Idols are mighty magical constructs with the ability to crush armoured knights, batter city walls and just about anything else that gets in their way with their brutal fists.

New Regiments of Renown
Logey Bogey's Spore 'Sploda's (Snotling Pump Wagon)
The most unhinged Snotlings attach really big explodin' spores to the front of their Wagons, which burst when the Pump Wagon hits anything.

Da Swamp Fings (River Trolls)
Da Swamp 'Fings are a horrifying band of River Trolls which cause Terror and have Poison Attacks.

Da Big 'Un (Rogue Idol)
Da Big 'Un is the biggest, baddest, meanest, most cunning Rogue Idol ever conjured.



TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/07 15:42:27


Post by: H.B.M.C.


I'm happy that Prince Imrik is the FLC for this update.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/07 15:44:04


Post by: Commodus Leitdorf


I do enjoy the Mad Max feel of it.

I hope Grom rides Eternal, shiny and green...


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/07 16:16:51


Post by: Voss


Green is best.... but I did not expect those jiggle physics. [By the by- picture and magnify that for the great unclean one in TW3)

Also, general update to how greenskins work and other things:
https://www.totalwar.com/blog/total-war-warhammer-ii-the-warden-the-paunch-faq/

Accumulate Waagh! points in battle for a big army buff. Multiple times, but costing more each time.

Campaign Waagh! is a faction pool (not an army bar, like it currently is), and you send Waaagh! armies after regions.

Scrap is gathered post battle and used for upgrades and tech.

Character skills trees reworked

Azhag start position moved (and has his own faction, presumably). Reportedly to Karak Ungor, so gets to fight Ungrim, Kislev and eastern Empire early on. His diplo bonus with vampires may actually matter now.

Badlands area of the map updated


Also stream from earlier today (skip to about 12 unless you want to watch the 'something on the horizon' preview of emptiness):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ztt1y1V1ZWM

I don't particularly recommend watching it though- there is some information but they spend a lot of time just yakking rather than really showing things off.

Its mostly about the free greenskin rework. New Karak (Raziak) below Karak Ungor, for example.

They don't explain it very coherently, but the Waaagh! armies don't work the same- it isn't an 'allied subfaction' army. It basically creates a second stack bound to each of your other armies that fill over time, until you're basically running around with 40 stack armies. Army composition is determined by the region they're in.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/07 20:29:01


Post by: Trondheim


I had hoped for something else than High Elfs, but this does look good I have to say. Curious about the whole capturing of enemy lords and heroes but always nice with new features.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/07 21:57:19


Post by: Tiger9gamer


Man, I just finished my Lothern campaign. Every time I try to escape Ulthan, they just pull me back in!

I love everything I saw, and just cannot wait to play with it. it's going to be a pain in the arse two weeks before the DLC drops.

I just realized that the Teclis campaign is going to be even better than before. Imagine all those buffs that my boy teclis gives out, maximized with Archmages as generals... boy, that sounds awesome.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/07 22:48:05


Post by: Commander Cain


Getting some great Batman and Mad Max vibes from that trailer!

Really looking forward to this one, greenskins have always been one of the weakest factions by a mile and I can't wait to play as them now they've been revamped.

High Elves are always a joy to play as, still haven't finished a mortal empires campaign despite having over 1200 hours but I've come pretty close with the elves, hopefully this will push me over the edge.

Definitely going to have to brush up on my chariot skills, I'm usually really bad at using them as they require a lot of micromanaging but I have seen how deadly they can be in the right hands!


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/08 03:00:31


Post by: StygianBeach


Looks good, disappointed with Groms voice though.
I was hoping with something a bit more like the Goblin King from either the Hobbit movies (animated or otherwise).


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/08 06:47:53


Post by: Overread


I love their trailers and updates!

Sad to not see the sky chariot for the HE (there's always 3rd game for that to appear); but seeing a new phoenix and a new griffin and lion chariots - yes I'm happy! Looking forward to this dropping in only a few weeks!


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/08 07:17:42


Post by: flamingkillamajig


Lol at that description of the high elf rangers. That's like the equivalent of a hillbilly redneck elf that probably breeds with his cousin .


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/08 07:29:46


Post by: Not Online!!!


 flamingkillamajig wrote:
Lol at that description of the high elf rangers. That's like the equivalent of a hillbilly redneck elf that probably breeds with his cousin .


Called up in Times of need? Or the remote area.

That sounds more Like a conscript.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/08 13:57:33


Post by: Voss


 flamingkillamajig wrote:
Lol at that description of the high elf rangers. That's like the equivalent of a hillbilly redneck elf that probably breeds with his cousin .


Is that really a thing when the incest is already a hallmark of the nobles? Wouldn't the hillbilly elves be considered backwards because they don't do that?


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/11 14:43:00


Post by: Disciple of Fate


Uodate looks good so far. Curious about the Orc scrap mechanic. More Skaven ib the Old World is great as well, breaks up the Dwarf horde monotony.

Also dislike Grom"s voice though, sounds too close to Grimgor's one to me. Also Grimgor was made really green in the update, he seems lighter colored than other regular Orcs now, even though he is a Black Orc.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/11 22:40:18


Post by: Voss


There are a lot of videos on the free update to orcs (each LL has his own variant of the Waagh combat ability, and a higher chance to get certain units- feral wyverns, black orcs, doom divers and savage orcs).

Additionally CA did a 'let's play' video on Grom, which isn't vaguely a lets play, but does give some insight to some of the expansion units (especially the River Troll Witch hero) and his food mechanic.

It also had a brief look at the settlement tree, and apparently black orc big bosses are sneaking in.


Scrap seems fairly straightforward. You get it after battles and you get even more if you raze settlements, its used in the tech tree (50 or so for certain techs) and to upgrade units, and each LL has specialities- Grimgor can give black orcs even more armor, for example. Different units get different upgrades- some are really bad (you can give 25 armor to archers, but why?, or you can give 25% lower reload time).

Oh and Grimgors Immortalz banner is ludicrous. As long as their morale is greater than 50%, models in the unit can't die. Yep. They take damage, but don't lose models.
Just don't let them get rear charged or overwhelmed. Though plague and fire weapons can depress their leadership real quick.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/12 14:02:28


Post by: Commander Cain


I'm looking forward to using the new lava arachnarok spider, that thing looks incredible!

The RoR Golem looks good as well, it can throw boulders in addition to all the other stuff it does.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/12 19:16:54


Post by: Voss


Folks are showing off all the units now.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ECtLjvXC4ek

Some of them are campaign only, some interesting unexpected additions (at last for me, I paid more attention to the green)- War Lions (not attached to chariots), Rangers (anti-infantry) and Silverin Guard (mid-tier spears).

Several 'mistwalker' units that are basically exclusive to Yvresse.

High elves also got archmages and mages of all the lores. Fire can be on dragons. Yes, even heroes.
They also get adjusted models- mostly different colors for each lore.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/12 19:24:22


Post by: Overread


War lions not attached to chariots are something I wish had been in the real army (though considering its eventual demise in AoS I'm sort of half glad they weren't now )


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/13 19:23:38


Post by: Voss


A Grom Mortal Empires campaign
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TQG2upSxLv4

Building tree for Massif Orcal at about 16. The mysterious orc boss isn't there in this preview build (though it was in CA's build during their 'lets play' video). Speculation is that will be a free dlc as part of the Skull Throne event this year.

Orcal (which is Grom's ME starting point), does get a special stone troll building, however.

...
And finally some Eltharion coverage (Vortex, though he doesn't play the 'shoot colored lights at the spiral' game):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-XNI9eQOdgo

(warning: a large chunk of what Turin says is basically memes instead of the English language. I find it really annoying, but YMMV)

Also, for anyone unaware, the video title comes from the fact that Christian Bale is the voice actor for Eltharion (so he is Bat-elf), and his sidekick hero is named for Henry Cavill, who apparently plays TW and Warhammer (and several of the character's abilities are based on his role as Geralt the Witcher).


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/14 08:26:51


Post by: Not Online!!!


i still hope throgg gets access to these other trolls .

one can hope..
or atleast propper chaos trolls.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/15 18:04:14


Post by: Tiger9gamer


I think I'm most looking forward to playing Eltharion... I would have killed for that dungeon ability when I was fighting Bretonnia in my last game and Leon showed up 3 turns after I killed him with a new army. I would still have to deal with a new army every three turns, but at least he wouldn't be showing up every other fight if I lock him in the dungeon.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/15 18:23:15


Post by: Voss


Imrik mortal empires campaign:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kJnPKMpXOnk

Looks fun. New dwarf minor faction as well, so there's a huge enemy variety in the area.
So far, the Grom and Eltharion campaigns look really easy to cheese. They have some neat campaign mechanics, but they look to be really quick games.

Imrik has an amazing skill tree as well.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/20 01:16:58


Post by: H.B.M.C.


The wait for this DLC is unbearable...


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/20 06:13:40


Post by: Disciple of Fate


https://www.totalwar.com/blog/total-war-warhammer-ii-the-total-waaagh-update/

Patch notes are up. I wish the axing of the supply line mechanic from the proving grounds would go live already, its such a garbage doomstack encouraging mechanic when you want to play above normal campaign difficulty.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/20 08:50:53


Post by: Overread


They've made it so that the speed-up turns button remembers its position turn to turn!


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/20 13:54:38


Post by: Voss


 Overread wrote:
They've made it so that the speed-up turns button remembers its position turn to turn!


Sad to say the 'gate bug' didn't make it to the fix list. Its probably the longest lasting and most obnoxious bug in the series.

Still don't know who I'm going to start with. Feel obliged to go with greenskins, but I've got an itching to do Grimgor or even Azhag rather than Grom.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/20 14:16:50


Post by: Sterling191


So apparently if you play as Eltharion, your hero-sidekick is a Loremaster version of Henry Cavill.

https://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2020/05/20/look-for-a-nod-to-noted-total-warhammer-2-fan-henry-cavill-in-its-next-dlc/


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/20 14:23:15


Post by: Tiger9gamer


 Disciple of Fate wrote:
https://www.totalwar.com/blog/total-war-warhammer-ii-the-total-waaagh-update/

Patch notes are up. I wish the axing of the supply line mechanic from the proving grounds would go live already, its such a garbage doomstack encouraging mechanic when you want to play above normal campaign difficulty.


yea, I had to mod it out. It made the game unbearable before it was implimented, but after it almost became too easy? playing my empire campaign and I don't know if it's because I bumrushed Marienburg but I am at turn 87 and I already have an economy for 4 full sized elite armies. It's fun, but I now have a lock of suitable targets that wont tank alliances or destroy imperial prestige.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/20 15:44:43


Post by: Disciple of Fate


 Tiger9gamer wrote:

yea, I had to mod it out. It made the game unbearable before it was implimented, but after it almost became too easy? playing my empire campaign and I don't know if it's because I bumrushed Marienburg but I am at turn 87 and I already have an economy for 4 full sized elite armies. It's fun, but I now have a lock of suitable targets that wont tank alliances or destroy imperial prestige.

Supply lines to stop steamrolling might have been a good concept. But the convenience of making money and the difference in upkeep really destroyed the concept. When a unit of swordsmen is almost as expensive to maintain as greatswords, everyone will run around with greatswords, because that is what performs best when youre limited by upkeep in the early game.

They should have just put in higher upkeep on elite units or tried to implement some sort of manpower mechanic again. Something to make more and lower quality armies viable for lomger, especially for Orks and Skaven. The AI just bumrushes the most elite stack possible.

I use the table top caps mod for some balance in armies, but its also a problem on the money making end of the game. Table top caps with some form of flat income penalty per difficulty level for the player seems for me to be superior over a massive upkeep increase for a new army filled with Goblins or Skavenslaves.

Voss wrote:

Sad to say the 'gate bug' didn't make it to the fix list. Its probably the longest lasting and most obnoxious bug in the series.

At this point I don't honestly think they can fix it. It has been around in some form since Rome 2 at least, and last I heard its also in Three Kingdoms (haven't played that one). Its like CA's STD infecting each successive release. I'm starting to wonder if its just a flaw in the engine they use for those games.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/20 22:33:53


Post by: H.B.M.C.


They're likely ignoring it until the siege overhaul.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/21 02:19:28


Post by: Voss


 H.B.M.C. wrote:
They're likely ignoring it until the siege overhaul.


Which game do you figure that will be in? Troy, Warhammer 3, or <undisclosed historical title>?


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/21 03:13:38


Post by: H.B.M.C.


Warhammer 3.

I have very high hopes for that game.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/21 16:17:38


Post by: Voss


Ah. I'm cautiously optimistic about it, but I'd feel better if I knew how they were handling things (particularly chaos in general, not just daemons) and what factions would be the focus.
The latter particularly since the lord packs for 2 have really lavished attention on the base game factions (and the dlc factions from TW1 are really in a poor and incomplete state). And several of the prospective factions for TW3 simply don't have 6 LL candidates.

I also hope CA's enthusiasm sticks, now that GW has found a different partner for a AoS RTS game.


----
Oh, yeah, just a reminder, the Ararchnarok mount for Gobbo shamans and great shamans is out today as well. But you have to get it through Total War Access on their website, much like Gotrek and Felix and the TW1 regiments of renown.

And then you have to download Imrik separately from the DLC, as his own piece of FLC. This system is annoying. Just bundle everything together, or make the free lords and mounts part of the free patch update.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/21 18:15:50


Post by: Eumerin


WH:TW was - at the time (3K might have sold better) - CA's best selling game. I've no reason to think that they won't fully support the third game.

Also, do we know whether the AoS deal was an excluaive one? If it's not exclusive, then it doesn't really much matter who GW licenses with, provided they keep letting CA have access to it.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/21 18:24:20


Post by: Disciple of Fate


Frontier got the exclusive rights to an AoS strategy game, not sure what to expect given the studio titles though. I worry about this a little too, because while TWW is a strong seller, they have to share the dough with Steam and GW. A best seller like Three Kingdoms cuts GW out of the revenue stream. Yet the DLC for Three Kingdoms seems to do worse. Without a clear financial overview of sales and CA's cut, its hard to say if this would kill their incentive to develop TWW3 a lot after release.

Randomly picked article: https://www.pcgamer.com/a-warhammer-age-of-sigmar-rts-is-coming-from-elite-dangerous-developer-frontier/

Frontier has exclusive rights to develop and publish an RTS for both PC and consoles based on Age of Sigmar, and plans to release a game in fiscal year 2023, that is, the business year ending May 31, 2023. 


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/21 18:30:39


Post by: Overread


Don't forget CA wanted to make Warhammer. Their team clearly has a lot of fans of the game and I think this really shows in the level of quality and commitment they've put into the game. You don't commit 3 full games and as many factions and addons as they have without being sure of your numbers and also REALLY wanting to work on the content.


Frontier might have exclusivity, but at the same time GW might class TW warhammer as a hybrid or even turnbased with realtime battles not a "full RTS" whilst Frontier might have a licence for a "pure RTS" so closer to Dawn of War style (base building etc...)



We also don't know how exclusive that licence is; or even if the reporter is just hyping it up or getting it wrong.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/21 18:40:43


Post by: Disciple of Fate


But CA has SEGA breathing down its neck, who acquired the license. Its not all up the CA. Content has also slowed down.

The author got it from here, so exclusive it seems: https://otp.tools.investis.com/clients/uk/frontier_developments_plc/rns/regulatory-story.aspx?cid=1725&newsid=1388951

Under the terms of the Licence, Frontier has the exclusive rights to develop and publish a real-time strategy game worldwide on PC and console platforms, together with the rights for streaming services.  The game is planned for release in Frontier's financial year ending 31 May 2023 ("FY23").


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/21 21:16:39


Post by: Trondheim


Got the new DLC today, and so far its nothing breathtaking really. The HE plays more smoothly now and that is definitely a welcome thing, but the whole song and dance about the dragons have proven to be a good challenge. Particularly one of them was an utter nightmare to deal with, the Greenskins have yet to rear their ugly heads and make my life more miserable than the hotpot of High Elfs, Bretonnians, and Undead conspire to do on a regular basis.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/21 21:25:57


Post by: Voss


Having a lot of fun with Azhag.
Went sacking a bit in Ostermark, then withdrew into the mountains to sort things out.

Had a brief stumble with Ungrim (too many slayers backed with lots and lots of guns- I figured I could take him sallying out of his city, and was wrong). Came back a few turns later with the Waaagh. Fun fact- if you give the waagh armies to the AI to control, they no longer tick the battle Waaagh counter. :(

Caught the bloody spears leader in the mountains after he retook Mt. Gunbad, so got those settlements for free, then rolled over Zhufbar and the new Skaven faction there.

Now I've got the first quest battle, then going after the Dwarfs... if Grimgor and Wurzag don't beat me there.

-----
The big buff I'm seeing to the greenskins is the huge growth and obedience buffs due to the high Waaagh meter. Territory goes longer without rebellions and grows really fast.

Sacking to keep up with money demands really helps. Only problem is I'm leaving my starting territory with the best buildings further and further behind.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/21 23:23:53


Post by: H.B.M.C.


Voss wrote:
Had a brief stumble with Ungrim (too many slayers backed with lots and lots of guns- I figured I could take him sallying out of his city, and was wrong).
The changes to Slayers make them far harder to crack. Something to be wary of.



TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/22 03:20:23


Post by: Voss


 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Voss wrote:
Had a brief stumble with Ungrim (too many slayers backed with lots and lots of guns- I figured I could take him sallying out of his city, and was wrong).
The changes to Slayers make them far harder to crack. Something to be wary of.


Yeah, I thought I saw something about them, but it didn't stick until battle. Then I realized it was Ungrims passive- none die until their HP pool is at 50%


---

Well, I'm at turn 89 of Azhag's campaign. Its pretty crazy. I made it all the way down to the Silver Road and took out the Dwarfs (just before Wurzag got there, though he'd already failed his Waaagh goal a few turns before). Then Grimgor beat me to most of the Wolf Lands (Crookback mountain and the like from the last patch), so I jumped over to Nagashizzar and took it (as seemed appropriate) from the Silver Host (who had apparently colonized). Meanwhile, all- out-war has erupted between the Greenskins (all of us collectively) and Clan Mors, and the fight has spilled over to Eshin now that Mors is almost wiped out (I declare a Waaagh and razed their capital, they have a nice trophy bonus- growth and replenishment). Wurzag is also skirmishing with the Border Princes.

Meanwhile the Empire is overrun with Vampires. Almost everything below the River Talabec is undead, except for Wurtbad, all of Wissenland and Solland (which are held by Nuln now). The Golden Order grimly holds on to Fort Soll. Meanwhile Mannfred's reach extends all the way to Ubersreik, and battles unfold outside Altdorf on a regular basis (and Bretonnia annexed Eilhart and Helmgart). Mannfred also owns Southern Kislev and Ostland, but is at war with Clan Moulder, who have bypassed Kislev itself and taken (or raze) Fort Jakova and Nagenhof.

The forces of Chaos have yet to stir, but Kislev consists only of Praag, Reengrad and Fort Ostrosk, all of which are relying on massive garrisons and the vampire-skaven war to hold out. Given the fiarly pitiful size of Praag, I suspect it was sacked at least once.

Skarsnik is long dead (apparently at the hands of Belegar, but Eight Peaks is deep in Wurzag's territory. Nothing that isn't green lives in the badlands anymore (not even the Strigoi)

Tilea has taken Skavenblight, but Ikit is likely holding on to part of Estalia

Vlad is a firm ally of Mannfred, but was displaced to Averland and a dwarf hold he took from Gelt.

Imrik and the new Helheim dwarves were never seen by my greenskins- the skaven crushed them long ago (and Mors conquered Karak Azul before Grimgor took all those holds for himself.

Malus holds the Dragon Isles, though my Spider Shaman murdered him after he settled in the ash ridges mountains, so we're at war.
And Malekith has all of two cities back home. No idea what happened to him.

Krog-Gar and I had a brief truce while we fought vampires and skaven, but he betrayed me, so I'm razing his cities until he agrees to go away (or my Waaagh runs out), as I have little interest in those lands. I have taken the Plain of Bones above Nagashizzar, and plan on displacing the remaining skaven. I left a settlement of Queek's behind (I believe), so he may eventually re-establish himself.

No idea what Settra is up to, but the minor Tomb Kings are still around, so I suspect its not very much.

--
The lack of Chaos amuses me. When they come, they'll be facing a vampiric Empire and I'll need to relocate armies to Karak Ungor. Any salvation of humanity is going to have to come from Bretonnia.
Huh. Middenheim is ruled by Marienburg, who are the strongest Imperial faction. But not enough. The world is likely to end up Green and Undead.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/22 03:50:13


Post by: H.B.M.C.


Voss wrote:
The world is likely to end up Green and Undead.
So an endless battle against enemies that keep coming back? Sounds like Orc heaven.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/22 04:18:36


Post by: Voss


 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Voss wrote:
The world is likely to end up Green and Undead.
So an endless battle against enemies that keep coming back? Sounds like Orc heaven.


Somewhat. Though the empire just confederated Nuln and swept through a bunch of vampire provinces, and the main Moulder army is all the way down in Eschen, so I may have spoken too soon.

Though I did just gank Grimgor and took all his lands, now if I can only find Wurzag...
and stop all these skaven (and Malus) from running away (having a Waaagh army drops campaign map speed a _lot_), even hindering movement with my gobbo heroes, I'm only closing the gap (though the Wolf lands and Plain of Bones are large and empty)

And chaos arrived right after I took Grimgor's lands (which took me over the next chapter marker and into 30-some occupied provinces, so either might have caused that to trigger).
I guess Grimgor is going to defend my northern border once he returns.

There are some amazing greenskin landmarks now. Grom's Peak has a statue of His Immensity.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/22 08:02:26


Post by: Not Online!!!


So, i did a run as Grom, yesterday,
my opinion so far:

First off, grom is a monstrosity, like, Kholek suneater, a monstrosity against early game enemies which he can solo.
The cauldron is insane, between free mony, free growth, free reputation, more range,etc there is so much possible shenanigans you can achieve witht the food it's not even funny, heck i burnt down the empire in ME turn 64 more or less and killed off one of the wood elves for constantly declaring war and peacing out again.
Then there is the passive of grom, Goblins with 10% physical resist is just nuts, hand out scrap armour and use the improved techtree and your gobbos are actually a mainline unit you can use.
not to mention that you can bully skarsnik from the get go.

The new trolls are great, the troll hag is imo a must have hero.

Overall, i did also start a round with skarsnik and it went from an annoying slog to an actual interesting campaign.




TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/22 16:32:06


Post by: Henry


Not Online!!! wrote:

not to mention that you can bully skarsnik from the get go.

I didn't pay attention to any of the pre-release information, I bought the DLC without any thought. I don't do this for any other purchases and certainly not for computer games - the debacle that was Dragon Age 2 put a stop to that. But TW:WH can have my money so long as they keep pumping out stuff that I enjoy spending time with. And I do so enjoy this game.

Started a Grom campaign without any clue what I was doing. Turn 5 and I've confederated with Skarsnik. Did CA really intend for players to have the two strongest goblin armies working side by side (with the lightning strike / ambush shenanigans too) from the start? I'm only 15 turns in, having a lot of fun, but I can't believe this was what they wanted!?


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/22 16:44:17


Post by: nels1031


 Henry wrote:
Started a Grom campaign without any clue what I was doing. Turn 5 and I've confederated with Skarsnik. Did CA really intend for players to have the two strongest goblin armies working side by side (with the lightning strike / ambush shenanigans too) from the start? I'm only 15 turns in, having a lot of fun, but I can't believe this was what they wanted!?


You can do the same with Norsca as well. Their "defeat the leader and force a confederation" mechanic makes it fairly easy to get a large chunk of land fast.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/22 19:22:11


Post by: Voss


Ha. Pigbarter gets a new landmark for Orcs and Gobbos.

Gnoblar Underbelly
+2 cap for Gobbo Bigbosses,
-20% recruitment cost for gobbos and night gobbos
+2 recruit ranks for gobbos, nightgobbos and Bigbosses

---
Stomped and confederated with Wurrzag, which gives me almost all of the Badlands (there are still some savage orcs down in the Southern Badlands- and Zandri... what is Settra doing?).
He has... no spells unlocked. Level 16 and never even put a point in Gaze of Mork. OR his personal skill line. Instead he's focused on looting, sacking and buffing cav, trolls and giants.


Oh, and thanks to the Deathmaster, both Azhag (on his wyvern) and Raknik Spiderclaw (new technology unlocked shaman) on his Arachnarok have Stalk. Yep. They can't be seen on their giant mounts until they're too close.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/22 19:35:42


Post by: Blooddragon1981


I still cannot believe this game is not available on PS4. I miss my PC so much


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/22 21:24:02


Post by: Voss


I'd be more surprised if it was on PS4. That would be a punishing (and very expensive) port. They'd have to build the interface from the ground up, and a simple multi-army battle (like the new Waaaghs) would beat the crap out of the PS4 graphics capability. Definitely no ultra unit sizes.


-----

Found an amusing bug: some hero characters are inexplicably balancing on the back of their mounts. They aren't in the normal pose, they're standing with their arms out at a roughly 45 degree angle. Doesn't seem to affect everyone, but I can see a Vampire on pegasus and an empire captain with this behavior.

I didn't notice this primarily fighting skaven and dwarfs, as it doesn't come up.

---
And wow. Grimgor crumped Archaeon like he was kicking a three legged puppy.
Fun fight though. Kholek, Archaeon and the remnants of Saretheriol's army vs Wurrzag and Grimgor and their Waaagh armies. Reinforcements got really weird- Wurrzag was in underway stance, Kholek and their reinforcements came in at the front corner of my deployment area, and Grimgor came in behind Archaeon (which helped with the four Hellcannons). Kholek broke out but I was able just bombard his army with Brainburstas over and over again, while pitching my Savage orc boarboys against him and sticking him with Effigy of the Git.

Only chaos force left is Sigvald's and its at half strength, hiding in the hills south of Norden, while multiple empire factions circle the area (taking vampiric attrition). Though I think Louen is going to get him. Or resettle Norden like an opportunistic git.
And yep. Norden.

Ah well. Time to drop Mannfred as my ally. He's lost most of the Empire at this point, mostly because of Clan Moulder (and also suiciding stacks against Altdorf)


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/23 03:00:41


Post by: H.B.M.C.


Voss wrote:
He has... no spells unlocked. Level 16 and never even put a point in Gaze of Mork. OR his personal skill line. Instead he's focused on looting, sacking and buffing cav, trolls and giants.
I really do wish there was a "reset points" ability, either by default when you gain new Lords from confederating, or even something you have to pay gold for.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/23 04:13:34


Post by: Voss


 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Voss wrote:
He has... no spells unlocked. Level 16 and never even put a point in Gaze of Mork. OR his personal skill line. Instead he's focused on looting, sacking and buffing cav, trolls and giants.
I really do wish there was a "reset points" ability, either by default when you gain new Lords from confederating, or even something you have to pay gold for.


Yeah, there should be something, because the AI is ridiculously bad at skilling Lords. Most of the time anyway. Grimgor was almost perfect when I snagged him. 2 points in looter and 2 in devastating charge that I wouldn't have picked, but everything else was on point.

Well, campaign wrapped with a short victory (I don't want to go on a worldwide tour for 8 more scattered capitals.)

Mannfred ended up being crushed by a resurgent Empire. They have everything but two small towns controlled by an opportunistic Bretonnia- they lost Norden to Sigvald coming back and crushing Louen after they greedily settled it, Flensburg is a ruin for reasons unknown, and I have a small piece in Mordheim and Essen. But I wiped out Kislev and took Hell Pit to finish off the short victory condition. Also allied Cult of Pleasure- the only Dark Elves left, and they've lost most of the continent to High Elves.

Bretonnia is also entirely intact, Settra just had Khemri so I killed them off, and control the World's Edge mountains, the Badlands and everything eastward, and a fair chunk of Kislev.
Azhag ended up effectively out of the campaign for the second half, slogging his way north with the Waaagh army slowing him down. He did get to finish off Fort Ostrosk and Hell Pit at the end, and can throw an absurd amount of magic around.

Ended up chasing Sigvald across the Northern Empire, had him cornered at Middenheim by Grimgor and Wurrzag, and Todbringer swooped in out of nowhere and killed him, ending the Chaos invasion.
Pump wagons are neat, but as usually I find chariots too fiddly (and wagons too fragile)
At least Grimgor had the glory of cutting down Archaeon in one on one combat, even if Wurrzag got the credit for the win.

Stone Trolls are, I think, my favorite of the new units. They can go to town with a lot less worry than other trolls.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/23 08:45:10


Post by: Not Online!!!


 Henry wrote:
Not Online!!! wrote:

not to mention that you can bully skarsnik from the get go.

I didn't pay attention to any of the pre-release information, I bought the DLC without any thought. I don't do this for any other purchases and certainly not for computer games - the debacle that was Dragon Age 2 put a stop to that. But TW:WH can have my money so long as they keep pumping out stuff that I enjoy spending time with. And I do so enjoy this game.

Started a Grom campaign without any clue what I was doing. Turn 5 and I've confederated with Skarsnik. Did CA really intend for players to have the two strongest goblin armies working side by side (with the lightning strike / ambush shenanigans too) from the start? I'm only 15 turns in, having a lot of fun, but I can't believe this was what they wanted!?


TBF, i am sure that doing that is actually rather a bad move because you get a border with the empire and the dwarves which will attempt to punt you. Atleast in higher difficulties.

Further, i feel that skarnsiks waaggh is a lot better because of the chance to get an actual usefull unit, nothing against the pumpwagons but the skarsnik increased unit is just plain better and usefull for a waagh, no to mention that skarsnik has the better upgrades.

another thing is, especially why i find grom easy mode, if you invest in scrap armor for gobbos and do pick up goblin flood and the tech that gives them 5 % additional physical resistance you can have 15% phys res, 75 armor gobbos with 70+ morale with grom, with silver shields on top of it, that's gotta be the most efficent money vs bang unit to be fieldable.
Otoh, Night gobbo warbosses now automatically grant vanguard and got inspire and skarsnik is one aswell.




TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/23 08:46:24


Post by: Henry


Anyone know of a mod that changes wizards category from ranged to melee? I'm getting fed up of selecting all ranged and my mages deciding to kamikaze into melee.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/23 08:47:18


Post by: Not Online!!!


Stone Trolls are, I think, my favorite of the new units. They can go to town with a lot less worry than other trolls.

they are a bit worse then armored chaos trolls i believe,
but then again armored chaos trolls were a kinda hidden gem unit but with chaos relying even moreso on doomstacks then real armies atm especially on higher difficulties you did rarely field them though.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/23 08:52:22


Post by: Henry


Not Online!!! wrote:

TBF, i am sure that doing that is actually rather a bad move because you get a border with the empire and the dwarves which will attempt to punt you. Atleast in higher difficulties.

Playing VH/VH. I'm just about good enough to cope at this difficulty - although my last beastman campaign was an exercise in running the length of the map from the south lands to the chaos wastes as everything tried to kill me.

With Grom I beat Skarsnik, confederated, then abandoned Skaranik's territory, got Skarsnik killed off to reduce army upkeep and head back to Bretonia. It's probably not efficient but it was a lot of fun.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/23 08:57:31


Post by: Not Online!!!


 Henry wrote:
Not Online!!! wrote:

TBF, i am sure that doing that is actually rather a bad move because you get a border with the empire and the dwarves which will attempt to punt you. Atleast in higher difficulties.

Playing VH/VH. I'm just about good enough to cope at this difficulty - although my last beastman campaign was an exercise in running the length of the map from the south lands to the chaos wastes as everything tried to kill me.

With Grom I beat Skarsnik, confederated, then abandoned Skaranik's territory, got Skarsnik killed off to reduce army upkeep and head back to Bretonia. It's probably not efficient but it was a lot of fun.


i'd never kill of skarsnik but yeah abbandoning skarsniks rather bad position for orcal and prime raiding estate that is pavaron is the right call imo.

you gotta explain to me though the beasmen thingy:
first how you went from the badlands to the chaos wastes and secondly why?

that sounds like an iteresting TW story


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/23 09:28:49


Post by: Henry


Playing as Malagor, raided and sacked around the Badlands and Border Prince. Was having fun growing my warband. Then the Orcs decided to try to wipe me out. Sprinted south to recover and formed an alliance with Queek who liked what I'd been doing. Headed into the World's Edge Mountains to get some growth and wipe out some smaller Dwarf clans. Then Ungrim kicks off and I have to flee further south.

Lybras is buddies with Mors, so my nearest targets are the Lizardmen. I ambush and butcher Krok-Gar and I'm getting things back together. Then Lybras (for no frigging reason!) decides they don't like me and go to war, bringing their allies Mors with them. We've been best buddies since the start of the game and now the sneaky git stabs me in the back!

I'm now at war with everything in the east and south. I sprint over to Araby, and head up through the Badlands into the only place that likes me - undead territory. By now Chaos has turned up and I form an alliance, so things should be good. Right?

Somehow, Ostland is massive and powerful, as is Reikland. I tip-toe up the edge of the World's Edge, as I need to head west for Malagor's quest and the humans have decided its time for me to die. As I head north there's no sign of this supposed massive Chaos incursion - Empire have butchered them and I'm getting squeezed. I have to head into Troll Country, but now there's a never ending stream of armies of man following me. As I scramble into Norsca I find out Reikland and Ostland have beaten me there and there's another wall of armies waiting for me.

Encircled I make my last stand. In one turn, with my sole army, I lightning strike, ambush and kill four full stacks of greats words, demi-griffs and steam tanks. It is a moment of glory. My army, bloodied and battered has broken free of the snare!

Yeah, right! End turn and four new armies attack me simultaneously.

Sometimes the game decides you're not going to win.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Not Online!!! wrote:

i'd never kill of skarsnik
The army upkeep was killing me. It broke my heart to have to dispand the archnarok at this early point of the game. I'll get him back as soon as possible.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/23 10:02:41


Post by: Not Online!!!


 Henry wrote:
Playing as Malagor, raided and sacked around the Badlands and Border Prince. Was having fun growing my warband. Then the Orcs decided to try to wipe me out. Sprinted south to recover and formed an alliance with Queek who liked what I'd been doing. Headed into the World's Edge Mountains to get some growth and wipe out some smaller Dwarf clans. Then Ungrim kicks off and I have to flee further south.

Lybras is buddies with Mors, so my nearest targets are the Lizardmen. I ambush and butcher Krok-Gar and I'm getting things back together. Then Lybras (for no frigging reason!) decides they don't like me and go to war, bringing their allies Mors with them. We've been best buddies since the start of the game and now the sneaky git stabs me in the back!

I'm now at war with everything in the east and south. I sprint over to Araby, and head up through the Badlands into the only place that likes me - undead territory. By now Chaos has turned up and I form an alliance, so things should be good. Right?

Somehow, Ostland is massive and powerful, as is Reikland. I tip-toe up the edge of the World's Edge, as I need to head west for Malagor's quest and the humans have decided its time for me to die. As I head north there's no sign of this supposed massive Chaos incursion - Empire have butchered them and I'm getting squeezed. I have to head into Troll Country, but now there's a never ending stream of armies of man following me. As I scramble into Norsca I find out Reikland and Ostland have beaten me there and there's another wall of armies waiting for me.

Encircled I make my last stand. In one turn, with my sole army, I lightning strike, ambush and kill four full stacks of greats words, demi-griffs and steam tanks. It is a moment of glory. My army, bloodied and battered has broken free of the snare!

Yeah, right! End turn and four new armies attack me simultaneously.

Sometimes the game decides you're not going to win.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Not Online!!! wrote:

i'd never kill of skarsnik
The army upkeep was killing me. It broke my heart to have to dispand the archnarok at this early point of the game. I'll get him back as soon as possible.


ahh yes, the classic blunder, in regards to malagor, you don't stay in the southlands period, you go northwards for the bigger pirzes in money and the easier fights aswell as the easy to dominate borderprinces, vampirates of satrosa and estalia and tilea. Alternatively you spam nurgles stink trait warlords and herds and just win via morale.

More money, alot safer and most importantly as far away from the nutjobs down south.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/23 18:10:14


Post by: H.B.M.C.


Those damned Skaven.

I've not fought them once and they covered my entire south and western lands in plague. I was trying to fight the Lizardmen you idiots.

Thankfully I'm great friends with Settra, so he's leaving me along and kicking the crap out of anyone who heads into his territory.

And explosive arrows are amazing.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/23 19:13:22


Post by: Henry


Grom update:
After snagging Skarsnik I head back into Brettonia to stomp the Paravon rebellion that has grown. I attempt to get Skarsnik snuffed to reduce my army upkeep, charging him headlong into a mob of squires and pole arms. After wiping out half the peasants the night goblin goes down - only for him to somehow survive the encounter and still be on the campaign map. Aaargh!

I throw him and Grom against Carcassone's minor settlement, finally removing Skarsnik and pissing off the enchantress. After a little back and forth I wipe her out and capture Carcassonne.

I decide I'm going into Ulthuan, and head over there, teleporting to the quest battles as I go and unlocking the Waaagh. As soon as I set foot in Elf territory, the Waaagh pops and my scrap armoured goblins roll over everything before them. Tor Yvrese and Eltharion falls with barely a whimper. Tyrion and his annoying mate Alistar are no match. The towers of Lothern burn without much fanfare. In the twenty turns that the Waaagh has followed Grom around, two Elven empires have fallen and a pair of Legendary Lords are out of the game.

Having secured the south of Ulthuan, Skarsnik re-emerges and there's goblins running everywhere.

Grom is fun, but for me to be cruising with him proves that he really is easy mode. I've not touched his blue line (no lightning strike this time). His yellow and red lines make the average goblin a disgusting wrecking ball.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/24 09:43:46


Post by: Not Online!!!


 Henry wrote:
Grom update:
After snagging Skarsnik I head back into Brettonia to stomp the Paravon rebellion that has grown. I attempt to get Skarsnik snuffed to reduce my army upkeep, charging him headlong into a mob of squires and pole arms. After wiping out half the peasants the night goblin goes down - only for him to somehow survive the encounter and still be on the campaign map. Aaargh!

I throw him and Grom against Carcassone's minor settlement, finally removing Skarsnik and pissing off the enchantress. After a little back and forth I wipe her out and capture Carcassonne.

I decide I'm going into Ulthuan, and head over there, teleporting to the quest battles as I go and unlocking the Waaagh. As soon as I set foot in Elf territory, the Waaagh pops and my scrap armoured goblins roll over everything before them. Tor Yvrese and Eltharion falls with barely a whimper. Tyrion and his annoying mate Alistar are no match. The towers of Lothern burn without much fanfare. In the twenty turns that the Waaagh has followed Grom around, two Elven empires have fallen and a pair of Legendary Lords are out of the game.

Having secured the south of Ulthuan, Skarsnik re-emerges and there's goblins running everywhere.

Grom is fun, but for me to be cruising with him proves that he really is easy mode. I've not touched his blue line (no lightning strike this time). His yellow and red lines make the average goblin a disgusting wrecking ball.


Generally Goblins gotten better, by a large margine, even the basic tech that is available for them and the application for Nightgobbos and gobbos makes them actually a nice consideration to work with.
Albeit i feel that the new and improved skarsnik if it weren't for the ridicioulus cauldron, is head and shoulders above grom, simply for the ambush, steal magic items and his special upgrade just beat grom.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/24 11:51:49


Post by: H.B.M.C.


Completed the biggest WAAAGH you can do. Got the biggest pointy ear trophy replace the one I got for WAAAGH-ing Imrik out existence. It adds to missile damage, making my RPG Goblins even more dangerous.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/24 12:09:51


Post by: Bromsy


Played as Grom. I recruited Skarsnik by smacking him around a bit, then hung out in Massif Orcal and just raided and sacked the Brets until I was stupid rich. Recruited a third lord to watch my stuff and sailed to Ulthuan. Gobbos are just hilarious with all the buffs and scrap upgrades. I was wrecking face, but I quit after a bit when my units of night goblins were out shooting High Elves.

They may have taken this a bit too far. So now I'm playing as Eltharion to balance the scales.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/24 20:38:16


Post by: Voss


Played Etharion's campaign on the vortex map.

It was... odd, and short. Rough start, mostly because of Saltspite sailing around and diving in for settlements, but once I cleaned up the southern provinces and stabbed her in the face, it was a cakewalk.

Money became a non-issue and Grom randomly went south, calling a Waaagh on Kroq-Gar (and failed). I just walked over his starting region without a challenge. He then lost everything else to other factions' counter attacks. He has a Tier 1 settlement at the serpent coast which Kroq-Gar has unaccountably failed to take (but he hasn't settled the ruin in his starting province either)

Triggering the 'final battle' felt very artificial. The mistwalker units are faintly ridiculous, but not very interesting (and annoying to play rock/paper/scissors with the various interchangeable archer units to figure out which units they're supposed to target because they're anti infantry, anti large and whatever)

Bromsy wrote:Played as Grom. I recruited Skarsnik by smacking him around a bit, then hung out in Massif Orcal and just raided and sacked the Brets until I was stupid rich. Recruited a third lord to watch my stuff and sailed to Ulthuan. Gobbos are just hilarious with all the buffs and scrap upgrades. I was wrecking face, but I quit after a bit when my units of night goblins were out shooting High Elves.

They may have taken this a bit too far. So now I'm playing as Eltharion to balance the scales.


I felt that with the skaven - at least, Skryre and Eshin. The nukes and gear upgrades were ridiculous, as are Deathmaster's missions, but Eshin gets crazy just because of the armor-piercing on everything.

Empire got some nice units in their rework, especially the Elector Count specials, but they mostly don't feel as broken as the rats and greenies. Some are even bad.
Imrik is pretty crazy, but only his personal stack. The mistwalkers are cheesy, but don't feel like they matter- sisters of avelorn still seem better. Dark elves and lizards didn't ever get the sheer craziness that hit the other TW2 factions.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/24 23:21:51


Post by: H.B.M.C.


Finished off Malus. Man that guy can take a beating. He's can certainly take on a Rogue Idle, Magma Arachnarok, Grom and a Level 31 Hag Troll at the same time, and do some good damage on them.

Eventually had to rush him Stone Trolls/2x River Trolls to finally kill him.

But that worked, and now Malus and his faction are no more. The Fortress of Dawn got renamed to Darksmasha's Fortress after Warboss Darksmasha, who finished off Malus' armies in the final siege (the only threats in that battle were Malus and his Hag sorcerer... everything else vanished under explosive arrors, including one of my Gobbo spear units!!!).


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/25 09:14:41


Post by: Disciple of Fate


Have started about 5 new campaigns to try out things, not played the new LLs yet. Sad thing is, AI Grom get murdered within 10 turns of starting. In one game as Skarsnik he got wiped on turn 3... Seems like he suffers from the Nakai syndrome when AI controlled.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/25 20:03:11


Post by: Eumerin


So now that (what I think is supposed to be) the last TW: WH2 DLC has been released, what are the opinions on how all of the races compare to each other?


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/25 20:25:46


Post by: Not Online!!!


Eumerin wrote:
So now that (what I think is supposed to be) the last TW: WH2 DLC has been released, what are the opinions on how all of the races compare to each other?


The only really Bad outliers are atm imo :

Beastmen, because they have the Same issues orks had + gakky Horde mechanic in top.

Chaos warriors, Same as above , Sans orkz waagh BS but with even worse stances and the Same incomplete roster.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/25 20:42:12


Post by: Voss


Eumerin wrote:
So now that (what I think is supposed to be) the last TW: WH2 DLC has been released, what are the opinions on how all of the races compare to each other?


There's one more DLC. Likely Moulder (meaning Thrott) and ?? (possibly another TW1 faction, but based on vague 'starting factions' statements likely not beasts, warriors or wood elves)

Which is sad, because beasts, warriors and wood elves are in the worst state. Though in the case of the wood elves, their behavior is strongly constrained by an AI directive not to leave Athel Loren. They still declare pointless wars, but they rarely attack anymore to avoid some of the ridiculous behavior in earlier builds. Unit wise they're alright, but playing their campaign is maddening because of the ridiculous amber mechanic and their pathetic expansion settlements.

Norsca could also use some extra love, particularly in the LL area.


Beasts and warriors need some sort of spawn point, so when half a dozen armies march out of nowhere with 'laser-lock' on you, the campaign doesn't just arbitrarily end in an unwinnable fight.
They need the rest of their units as well.



TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/25 21:40:55


Post by: Eumerin


The third game is - from what I understand - supposed to be Chaos-focused. If so, perhaps the developers are waiting for that before they take another pass at Beastmen and Warriors.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/25 22:34:47


Post by: H.B.M.C.


I wouldn't expect anything to happen with Warriors or Beasts until the third game, where we'll get Chaos Daemons, Chaos Dwarfs, Ogre Kingdoms and Kislev.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/25 22:40:40


Post by: Voss


Eumerin wrote:
The third game is - from what I understand - supposed to be Chaos-focused. If so, perhaps the developers are waiting for that before they take another pass at Beastmen and Warriors.


Probably. There is some milling about the idea that there will be a preorder bonus for TW3, similar to how Norsca was supposed to be (presumably not mucked up as badly), that those who preorder 3 will get whatever-it-is for game 2, and it will be worked into game 3.
I could see beasts or warriors getting the attention then.

Still, it'll be a while, since 3 is still technically unannounced in most of the ways that matter and they'll want to focus PR on Troy (whenever they decide to shove that out the door, it'll likely lock down other games for a month or so on either side of its release). At this point I just want it to happen and get out of the way.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/26 00:35:51


Post by: H.B.M.C.


DLC for DLC for a different game as a pre-order bonus for 3? That might not sit well with the fanbase.

I don't care. I care more about them making Beastmen and Chaos whole more than I care about it being DLC for a DLC. But some people will.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/26 09:31:12


Post by: Lotet


Playing Imrik. Reeally glad about the addition of Rangers to the High Elf roster. Helps a lot with sieges, most especially sieges against Dwarfs. Wasn't keen on sending spearmen to fight dwarfs on a wall.

And replacing my regular shieldwall play style with one where I take the fight to the enemy, since I can't let the rangers just sit there and take hits, is a welcome change of pace.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/26 10:46:24


Post by: Henry


Little brother's playing Imrik now. Skaven have always been a frustrating (read not fun) for swamping you, breaking, being faster than you and returning. Over and over again. Packs of lions deal with this very easily - they break a unit then pursue it until it is shattered. Suddenly fighting through swarms of slaves doesn't look like such a problem. I might have to give Teclis another go.

Also Warp Lightning seems to have minimal effect on War Lions. They're perfect anti-skaven.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/27 03:10:26


Post by: Bromsy


I'm like turn 80 on Imrik in ME. It's been a bit of a slog - I blitzed East and crushed Eshin right away - that is sort of necessary due to the setup of the provinces, otherwise they dance around you with tunnels.

Then I went south, allied with the minor lizardmen there to take out Malus before he got leveled up.

By then, the Dorfs were down to like 3 one settlement factions and everything West of me was a giant sea of green. Grimgor was #1, with about 45 settlements. I blitzed through with Imrik, a high level mage, starting dragon and two legendary dragons. I was wiping out 2-3 stacks at a go.

But having to go the long way around really bogged me down, and I had to keep my economy razor thin, spinning off new armies to guard areas. Finally, I got to Barak Varr and started making headway once I could trade. Then Queek declared war on me. So I have a super porous Northern border, an even more porous Southern border, and I'm just trying to play whack a mole while Grimgor and Queek snipe random settlements here and there.

And the climate that Imrik gets makes for some weird experiences west of the mountains; taking the badlands proper is just a no-go, so if I wipe out Grimgor the Top Knots will just settle everything.

Oh, and Sylvania owns everything between me and the Chaos Wastes outside the mountains.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/27 18:24:16


Post by: Disciple of Fate


Its pretty refreshing to see the green tide in the badlands instead of the bearded doom that comes from that area.

Saw that IGN has more TW Troy news upcoming, if that will get a release date for this year (I think Britannia went from announcement to release in 6 months) then it will still be quite the wait for TWW3 in 2021.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/27 18:56:30


Post by: Eumerin


 Disciple of Fate wrote:

Saw that IGN has more TW Troy news upcoming, if that will get a release date for this year (I think Britannia went from announcement to release in 6 months) then it will still be quite the wait for TWW3 in 2021.


Perhaps. But we'll at least have the announcement trailer to look forward to, and then obsess over.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/28 00:16:48


Post by: H.B.M.C.


I'd rather we get some actual news on TWW3.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/28 03:06:14


Post by: Eumerin


 H.B.M.C. wrote:
I'd rather we get some actual news on TWW3.


We'd all like actual news on TWW3. But the announcement trailer will likely be the first thing that we see.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/28 04:11:17


Post by: Voss


Well, CA used to do a 'What the teams are working on,' but they stopped doing that in Feb 2019.

I miss it personally. That one in particular mentioned they were working on an unnamed Saga game (Obviously Troy now), what they were working on with the launch delay of 3K, a lord pack for TW2, and motion capture for TW3, then in pre-production. Also the launcher and a 'secret project' by the 'access team.' And their new FPS, which is still unspecified as far as I know.

These days they seem to share a lot less.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/28 06:40:40


Post by: Disciple of Fate


CA has always seemingly been awful at communication. The what the teams are working on blog never really contained much information but get cancelled regardless. I have games on Steam that, even with a pandemic, give weekly updates with what they are working on if the game will still get more content. With CA its 5.5 months of silence before a two week flurry of announcements and back to silence.

I wish there was some more communication about what was happening, especially in regards to pretty big bugs and patching.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/28 08:53:15


Post by: Overread


Sometimes I'm glad that companies don't talk about games too early on. I recall EA doing it loads at one time and the problem was that they'd start throwing out loads of things they were working on and fun ideas that never ever made it into the final game itself. So it ends up being anti-marketing because they end up chopping and changing things.

I far prefer marketing closer to the launch date because its far more reliable. It's at the stage where features are confirmed and where a new batch of code won't suddenly break something that results in something else having to be changed or removed. Plus you've got what the game is actually like rather than what they hope the game might actually be.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/28 09:52:28


Post by: H.B.M.C.


 Overread wrote:
Sometimes I'm glad that companies don't talk about games too early on.
I'm not talking about a complete breakdown of everything in the game, just some news on what's happening and maybe what the starting races will be.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/28 14:20:25


Post by: Tiger9gamer


Been playing an Eltharion Hard / Hard campaign with a few mods such as giving mist walker units benefits, Less frustrating Warden Cage, and Region Trading just to make the slog less frustrating... didn't work, as for some bloody reason every enemy army seems to be hyped up on fight milk and bull shark testosterone and charging at me constantly.

The AI's ability to create endless hordes is really annoying too. There was one moment in my campaign where I had to send Eltharion from the badlands back to Ulthuan to rescue it from Rampaging Dark Elves and Skaven. I managed to destroy 6 full 20 man stacks, reclaimed Cortique and Chrace, but I couldn't bloody move from the island and do something else because of the constant tide of 20 unit Dark Elf armies charging to their deaths. I love a good challenge like this, but screw me sideways there comes a point where it just turns into tedium with this game. It doesn't even feel like i'm doing anything when I slaughter 400 Black Guard, as the enemy somehow makes more to throw at me in less than three turns. It's Ludicrious! I mean I have two great armies full of archers and Spireguard, but they can only be in so many places at once. It wanna make progress Dammit! every time I set myself up to fight the tomb kings there are always distractions like this.

Had to take a break and play Wuzzog and fool around with the new orks (after failing hard with Ahzag campaign twice), avoiding the ridiculous goblin tide to play with Ridiculous Orks and have to say that it was so fun. Savage orcs are a lot of fun in the "turn off your brain and smash those gits" kind of way.




TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/28 14:38:18


Post by: nels1031


 Tiger9gamer wrote:

The AI's ability to create endless hordes is really annoying too.


Everyone has their own playstyle and all, plus the situation may not warrant it, but I find getting skills that make ambushes more likely and lightning strike are great for this very reason.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/28 15:05:03


Post by: Tiger9gamer


 nels1031 wrote:
 Tiger9gamer wrote:

The AI's ability to create endless hordes is really annoying too.


Everyone has their own playstyle and all, plus the situation may not warrant it, but I find getting skills that make ambushes more likely and lightning strike are great for this very reason.


Oh no doubt! Thanks to legend of total war I always try to mainline it unless i’m Playing a caster LL

The problem is that the endless stacks of AI sail literally everywhere in my territory, and I just can’t afford enough armies to block them all. They can easily over run the crappy high elf garrisons too, so i’m Kinda stuck with that.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/28 19:26:22


Post by: Voss


Black orc big boss has arrived, as expected part of Skulls for the Skull Throne event.

Theoretically even in current campaigns, though mine says 'No characters currently available, a new character will be available on the next turn.' And the same message the next turn. And the turn after that.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/28 19:38:10


Post by: Not Online!!!


Voss wrote:
Black orc big boss has arrived, as expected part of Skulls for the Skull Throne event.

Theoretically even in current campaigns, though mine says 'No characters currently available, a new character will be available on the next turn.' And the same message the next turn. And the turn after that.


you need to restart the campaign.

On a sidenote, the things stupidly armored and a trainer, which makes it one of the best things to get for Skarsnik early on, allowing your gobo archers to just shoot at it.

Further side note, he improves morale significantly so double bonus.

It's a bit like the Beastmen hero bull, smaller but more tanky-


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/28 19:48:31


Post by: Voss


Not Online!!! wrote:
Voss wrote:
Black orc big boss has arrived, as expected part of Skulls for the Skull Throne event.

Theoretically even in current campaigns, though mine says 'No characters currently available, a new character will be available on the next turn.' And the same message the next turn. And the turn after that.


you need to restart the campaign.


Yeah, I figured. Happily I was done with that one anyway. Was waiting on the Grom 'vortex' campaign until he came out.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/28 20:18:20


Post by: Disciple of Fate


So unfortunate that the BOBB had to wait for the Skull throne Event, now everyone has played GS campaigns already.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/28 20:31:20


Post by: nels1031


 Disciple of Fate wrote:
So unfortunate that the BOBB had to wait for the Skull throne Event, now everyone has played GS campaigns already.


More than enough reason to launch a new campaign.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/30 11:57:39


Post by: Formosa


man orcs are so much fun to play now, the new waaagh mechanic makes it feel like a real green tide


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/30 14:18:30


Post by: djones520


Absolutely love this update. Running an Eltharion and an Imrik campaign right now. Most enthusiasm I've had for the game in a year.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/31 19:25:02


Post by: nels1031


Vlad and Mannfred have been running the board in the Empire regions for every campaign I’ve played since this patch. Started an Azhag campaign and it seems AI controlled VC get all of East Sylvania and a portion of West Sylvania right at the start. Seems kind of silly.

Also, playing as Belegar is even more fun now, with all the buffs to Greenskins. Just battled my way to taking Karak Eightpeaks and its surrounded by greenskins to the North and Clan Mors to the south. Having a blast with this patch, other then the VC getting silly right at the start..


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/05/31 20:40:16


Post by: Voss


 nels1031 wrote:
Vlad and Mannfred have been running the board in the Empire regions for every campaign I’ve played since this patch. Started an Azhag campaign and it seems AI controlled VC get all of East Sylvania and a portion of West Sylvania right at the start. Seems kind of silly.


To a point. Once the Empire gets its act together and starts confederating (mid game), they seem to roll right over the vampires. In mine they get to the gates of Altdorf, but once the first confederations start happening, the ball starts rolling and the VC are pushed back to Sylvania in a very fast dozen or so turns, and then snuffed. The battle calculations for greatswords and other late game units seems to really favor empire vs vampires, while the inverse seems to be true early on.

Part of it is the change to the AI- the vampires used to get in fairly pointless fights with the dwarfs, and burned a lot of armies that way. Now they're encouraged to focus on the empire, and having Azhag up north gives them an ally, rather than expansion space for Ungrim (or Kislev).


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/06/07 03:10:59


Post by: Tiger9gamer


Is anyone else having their maps being over run with Clan Mors or Cravenclaw while playing? As Eltharion I Hardly had a chance to fight Greenskins outside of the beginning two provinces, and didn’t even bloody get to see Grom, much less duke it out with him. Grimgor and Thorgrim got steamrolled by Clan mors, and Clan eshin took out Imrik. I think skaven took out half of bretonnia too Now I got Skaven empires on all sides, in a land war with Har greth, and may have to defend against more skaven soon.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/06/07 05:07:34


Post by: Voss


 Tiger9gamer wrote:
Is anyone else having their maps being over run with Clan Mors or Cravenclaw while playing? As Eltharion I Hardly had a chance to fight Greenskins outside of the beginning two provinces, and didn’t even bloody get to see Grom, much less duke it out with him. Grimgor and Thorgrim got steamrolled by Clan mors, and Clan eshin took out Imrik. I think skaven took out half of bretonnia too Now I got Skaven empires on all sides, in a land war with Har greth, and may have to defend against more skaven soon.


Nope. I'm seeing seas of vampires and greenskins. Skaven keep coming to bad ends relatively early on, with the exception of Moulder, which rolls over Kislev and the Norse Dwarfs (though in fairness Kislev often ends up fighting 3-4 factions, so gets distracted). Vampires eventually fade into the mid/late game, but Grimgor becomes a massive block with Wurrzag and all the minor tribes underneath him. Ikkit tends to go back and forth with Estalia and TIlea, but eventually falls to those minor powers (usually Tilea)

I finally figured out what was going on with the latter- I started up a Eltharion mortal empires campaign (which I didn't really like- the split starting locations is actually annoying).
Anyway, when the gobbos on Ulthuan have one province left, Grom confederates them. I thought that was odd, since he's way off in the Misty Mountain area, but move on, take the settlement anyway, and start building defensively their while I focus on the savage orcs (Top Knots). Then a few turns latter, Grom confederates Wurrzag, which seems odd, since those vampires are in between and I didn't think they were at war. A bit latter, the savages are gone, and I'm moving into Groms territory, get jumped by Grom and Wurrzag's stacks, win, and then suddenly Grimgor confederates Grom's tribe, and my war with Grom is over.

And it hits me- the AI gets both confederation options (beating in a fight and just doing it through diplomacy, which they're inclined to do when they've lost stacks and are weak.) So its turn ~30, and Grimgor has about 11 provinces, all of Grom's and Wurrzag's stuff, and they'll come back in 4-5 turns. And the ridiculous green juggernaut picks up speed- having both confederation options is just crazy, given how easily the AIs give into each other on that score. The only one I usually see crumped (or just sitting in his starting area) is Skarsnik. He just doesn't have anywhere to go that the AI can handle.


----
Skaven-wise, Queek seems to pick bad fights and gets plowed under, and while I suspect Eshin tend to take out Imrik early on, they tend to hit the green wall. The one major advantage Skaven have is their ambush. It lets them ignore Waagh armies, and those just vanish when their main army get wiped out.

I was playing a Vlad campaign, and south of the mountains, the dwarfs were hanging on, mostly by confederating westward, but they still get pushed out of Karaz-a-Karak. The weird thing here was Barak Var rallied and kicked Wurrzag back out of their city (which, I now suspect, is when Grimgor confederated with him). But Grimgor still took Karaz-a-Karak, and had 25-30 cities.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/06/07 05:48:27


Post by: H.B.M.C.


In my play through there are several blocks:

The High Elves have most of their island.
The Dark Elves have their area, and a bit of the HE's island.
The Lizzies have the south east.
I (Grom) have the south west, shared with Setra.

The Lizzies that were South West are gone ('cause of me!), and so is Imrik (also 'cause of me!). There is a group of allied Brets at the top of the area I'm in (all around Araby) that are being ground into dust by me and Setra. Somewhere in all this is clan Eshin, and they're the only Skaven I've seen so far.

I'm actually happy about that. From the all the stories I've heard from players, Skaven are terrifying. I don't want to face them.



TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/06/08 14:40:33


Post by: Voss


The trick with skaven is focusing on their cities and just accept the fact that they will ambush you, which means not overloading on missile and artillery units. With solid fighting units, the ambush devolves into a straight fight pretty quick, and the skaven AI tends not to do that well with army composition or utilizing the ambush set up properly (often they set up on one side and further away) Fast stuff that can run night/gutter runners down also helps (as does attacking any siege engines they may or may not bring).


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/06/08 14:50:26


Post by: Not Online!!!


Voss wrote:
The trick with skaven is focusing on their cities and just accept the fact that they will ambush you, which means not overloading on missile and artillery units. With solid fighting units, the ambush devolves into a straight fight pretty quick, and the skaven AI tends not to do that well with army composition or utilizing the ambush set up properly (often they set up on one side and further away) Fast stuff that can run night/gutter runners down also helps (as does attacking any siege engines they may or may not bring).


ever heard of, you know, heros that can scout?
Also remaining outside their attack range will make it neigh impossible to get ambushed by them.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/06/08 15:37:15


Post by: Voss


Not Online!!! wrote:
Voss wrote:
The trick with skaven is focusing on their cities and just accept the fact that they will ambush you, which means not overloading on missile and artillery units. With solid fighting units, the ambush devolves into a straight fight pretty quick, and the skaven AI tends not to do that well with army composition or utilizing the ambush set up properly (often they set up on one side and further away) Fast stuff that can run night/gutter runners down also helps (as does attacking any siege engines they may or may not bring).


ever heard of, you know, heros that can scout?
Also remaining outside their attack range will make it neigh impossible to get ambushed by them.


Er... skaven armies are invisible on the map when they want to be. Scouting heroes make no difference (beyond revealing the ruins as the skaven cities you already know they are), nor does their 'attack range.' You still have to get to their cities to wipe them out.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/06/09 05:42:15


Post by: trexmeyer


Anyone else running into the mouseover stance bug in the campaign map or the group option bug in battles?

I can't embed the GIF.

https://preview.redd.it/vr6ini0sjo351.gif?format=mp4&s=87b372e1e59064dcf0ed982679b1ab89d89af498

Edit: I'll have battles from time to time where the group option simply doesn't work.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/06/09 07:56:36


Post by: H.B.M.C.


Yes. It's bloody annoying.


In other news, defeating Gotrek gives your army leader the "Unbreakable" trait.

In other, other news, Grom now has the "Unbreakable" trait.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/06/09 20:13:16


Post by: Voss


This game does throw weird results from time to time.

Playing a Throgg campaign. Spent the first 20 turns uniting Norsca west of the dwarves (the last idiot, Kamaerhon the Bloody Hound, razed the Varg Camp then spent half-a-dozen turns running from me). Then Cothique declared war. So I turn Throgg into the ocean and start going west. As I'm passing the northern end of Bretonnian, I notice two huge stacks from the Red Duke in L'Anguille.

Next turn, bam, they've taken Couronne- all that's left that I can see is a solitary level 1 Prophetess of Beasts camped out in a field, and I believe the orc settlement in the mountains just next to Marienburg.

The Red Duke's army is wrecked, and the garrison in Couronne is 4 skeletons with spears, 2 zombies and 2 bats.

I managed to steal a frost wyrm, skin wolves and an Ice Chariot in addition to my starting units and marauder filler, and the sorcerer of metal I recruited gives +5 melee attack to the entire army. With throgg's buff, my ice trolls have 71 melee attack.

So I'm very, very tempted, despite wanting to see a normally third tier faction over-run the Brets.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/06/18 15:19:21


Post by: H.B.M.C.


New Patch!

"Da Nutz & Boltz" beta patch. They fixed a bunch of stuff, but among other things:
Gambling Winds of Magic will no longer give the same result each time
Removed the Lord of Changes’ influence on the stance list – it should no longer play mind games and close while moused over
Fixed an issue with army selection on the campaign map where having two armies nearby each other would sometimes block selection of the other
Updated Black Orc Big Boss with a stauncher skill tree
Heh. That last one. Very droll.



TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/06/18 15:34:49


Post by: nels1031


 H.B.M.C. wrote:


Fixed an issue with army selection on the campaign map where having two armies nearby each other would sometimes block selection of the other


Sweet feth, I needed this.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/06/19 02:41:31


Post by: Voss


Still think the 'hit box' for army selection is smaller than it used to be.

But still, they fixed some problems that have been dogging the game since the black orc boss mini-update


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/06/19 04:40:17


Post by: Argive


have done the eltharion campaign and now doing imrik on vortex.

Can report both are quite unique in the terms of mechanics.

Nice to be able to play as imrik without using mixus mod


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/07/01 16:14:07


Post by: trexmeyer


Is Grom completely OP right now? I'm at about turn 75ish in a hard Mortal Empires campaign and I've confederated Skarsnik and Azhag. The Golden Order, Border Princes, Clan Angrud, and a couple of other dwarf factions (Karaz and I think Karak Hirn?) are all dead by my hand. The Vampire Counts decided to start a war with me and I've destroyed several of their armies and claimed Castle Drakenhof. I also took Skavenblight and Skyre might be down to 1 army.

The cooking feels really broken. Early game you can exchange scrap for random gold to speed up your economy. Once you unlock all four slots, which is really easy even with bad quest RNG, doing the Hag quest gives 150 scrap/5k gold every couple of turns. Compared to my Skarsnik campaign I feel like I have a lot more scrap on hand.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/07/01 19:10:48


Post by: Voss


O&G in general are pretty ridiculous on campaign. I have a Wurrzag campaign I got rather bored of simply because it involved rolling over everything.

But yes, Grom is a cakewalk.

This seems to be a trend. Vampire coast was fairly OP on release, Ikkit and Deathmaster have absurdly broken mechanics.

----
The only start that I've found that is noticeably harder than it used to be is Empire (not Golden Order) and that's simply because the rebellion gets the mountain pass fort, and their AI almost always retreats there when you start taking cities. A stack behind the walls on top of that garrison is a pain for the empire early on.

And their relationships with the other empire states precludes exploiting them early on. Once past that hurdle, however, it isn't too bad.

Of course, Chaos, Beasts and Wood Elves still have issues as well.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/07/02 15:00:15


Post by: trexmeyer


I did get a WoC win on normal but it was painful and I cheesed it by basically never making marauders after turn 50~ in order to stack 2-3 armies together. I did enjoy the WoC quest battles and the three lords are great, Sigvuld less so, but damn that faction is boring as all hell. Especially in endgame when every army is just Chosen/Hellcannon/Knights except for Kholek and his Shaggoths. It feels like it has the least options out of any faction except maybe Norsca, but I haven't played most of the Order factions. They just seem to have more variance. Even running Grom as my faction leader I still use Black Orcs with Grimgor, Big 'uns with Azhag, Spider Riders with Raknik (which work surprisingly well), and Big 'uns/Orc Cav with the 'orrible. Though Spider Riders/Squig Hoppers seem much stronger than any Orc Cavalry unit.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/07/03 14:30:52


Post by: Voss


 trexmeyer wrote:
I did get a WoC win on normal but it was painful and I cheesed it by basically never making marauders after turn 50~ in order to stack 2-3 armies together. .

In fairness, that isn't cheesing it when it comes to chaos. General advice is to delete the marauder building turn 1 (so the next building costs less growth) and never recruit any marauders at all.
And often people don't bother with knights. Just stacks of Chosen and Hellcannons. Shaggoths sometimes take their place (even without Kholek).

Chaos worked a bit better in game 1, simply because no one could re-settle 'wrong terrain' cities. In 2, the ruins chaos leaves behind get rebuilt absurdly fast, and you get increasingly surrounded by enemies as you go.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/07/03 16:24:07


Post by: nels1031


I can only play and have fun using Chaos with them heavily modded. The attrition amongst hordes gets modded out, the buildings generate about 25% more income (at high end, with the upkeep reductions they actually produce income), using growth to build more hordes is gone, they can encamp after razing, can recruit low to mid end Norsca/BoC units (for variance and gaks and giggles.) and mods that make the AI more difficult to compensate the mod benefits.

Though right now, I'm trying to make a Beastmen campaign work. Took Kazhrak to Skavenblight and just raid them and keep them in check while I build up my hordes and unlock the other 2 Legendary Lords. Its pretty damn boring, but I'm too much of a fan of Beastmen to not play them every now and again.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/07/03 16:36:24


Post by: Eumerin


Voss wrote:

Chaos worked a bit better in game 1, simply because no one could re-settle 'wrong terrain' cities.


Which was also one of the most annoying things about playing a non-Chaos race in the first game. The Chaos invasion would hit, and you'd end up with a bunch of ruined cities neighboring your territories, with Chaos portals that you couldn't go in and clear out, meaning that you had a permanent corruption penalty in your provinces until one of the compatible AI races decided to resettle those provinces.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/07/22 01:20:25


Post by: trexmeyer


I have entirely too many hours played and I haven't even touched Wood Elves or Lizardmen at all.

A few thoughts.

Warriors of Chaos are bad, primarily because they are a melee infantry focused faction in a game where melee infantry is not good. It's not as a bad at lower level difficulties, but even on hard my High Elf Archers > Swordmasters of Hoeth. The melee buffs are stupid.

I don't want to contemplate how many hours I've spent on Greenskins. I restarted a Grom campaign after confederating Grimgor, Wurzag, and Skarsnik because Azhag was dead. So I then got the band together and won. I also played campaigns starting as Skarsnik and Azhag. Grom is clearly the best faction lord just because of the Cauldron. Wurzag is the best in battle lord thanks to spamming Foot of Gork. I really dislike that their Orc Boy cav is so bad it shouldn't be recruited. Somehow Forest Goblin Spider Riders are better. Orc Infantry is in general weak. Black Orcs are okay, but so damn slow. I think Night Goblin (fanatics) are underappreciated and Nasty Skulkers might be the best melee infantry in the game in terms of cost/effectiveness. I've had battles where they just destroy whatever they touch.

I ran a Morathi vortex campaign. The campaign itself is interesting after only doing vortex as Khalida, but damn is the Dark Elf roster not fun to me. Black Arks I think are implemented well.

I played Khalida to a win on Vortex, but not on ME. I think I'm like 3 turns away on it, but I don't want to go back to it just to kill Strygos. I played Settra to win on ME and tried getting into Arkhan.
I really dislike that the best unit for Tomb Kings is the Casket of Souls and that it is so heavily time gated. It's insane that the best opening strat is get 20 units - Casket of Souls - start facerolling.

Currently playing Imrik and Imrik's army is the stupidest thing in terms of being OP that I've played yet. It is beautiful.

I also played Ikit Claw. The wrong way. I ignored his Campaign Objectives and went east. Ratling Guns are amazing and they absolutely suck during sieges compared to Archers. Still, I managed to win some very lopsided fights (against me) thanks to Ratling Guns. I can't fathom playing another Skaven faction. I guess Clan Eshin might be okay.

I got like 80-100 turns deep in a Gelt campaign, but the Empire has been very underwhelming. Guns are more powerful than Crossbows, but the positioning requirements and borderline uselessness in sieges is very frustrating.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/07/30 00:54:09


Post by: Voss


Might as well go here

https://www.totalwar.com/blog/dev-blog-july-2020/


Soft announcement of the next DLC for WH2, another Lord Pack.

Featuring... Wood Elves! (and a WH2 race lord). This should be simple and straight-forward, but the they break it down twice and just keep it confusing.

First off, if you buy nothing, there is a Free hero character and a general game update.

If you buy the lord pack you get a Wood Elf vortex campaign and.. the 'opposite number' lord for this pack, who is probably skaven or dark elf.

If you have warhammer 1, you also get an Old World Update for WE in Mortal Empires.

If you also have the original WE DLC for warhammer 1, you also get a fourth WE lord (a 'her' according to the blog) and new units and characters for Mortal Empires.

Not sure if there is also a FLC lord for either Skaven or DE, or if the 'have everything' 4th WE lord takes that slot.

They allude to doing something like this again in the future if this works out. Presumably for beastmen, because they also need a major overhaul.

No word in the blog about TW3, blaming Covid for not announcing the 'next Total War title.' which I guess could be something else, but they've got an absurd road map for Troy (given that its Saga and theoretically 'early access' on the Epic store), and also announced a new DLC for 3k.

---
Reaction- personally, WE desperately need an overhaul, so I'm happy to see this. Lord #3 will likely be in Orean's Camp down in the southlands, and the FLC lord (#4) will probably be in the Laurelorn Forest in the Empire, for a lack of other options.
No idea who the counterpart lord would be. Maybe Thrott if its Skaven and... Kouran Darkhand? or Beastlord Rakarth? if DE. Maybe? I'm kind of out of DE characters I care about, and felt Malus was disappointing and Lokhir was rather forgettable in implementation, and even Hellebron's death night mechanic was annoying.

But really, they've over-complicated this. Just give people access to the whole shebang if they buy the new DLC. They broke it down twice and still called it confusing themselves, and promised clarification when it actually comes out. That's absurd.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/07/30 01:32:28


Post by: H.B.M.C.


DLC for a DLC. I honestly didn't think they'd do it.

And it's not the Beastmen either, which is weird. They've got bigger gaps than the Wood Elves.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/07/30 01:38:06


Post by: Argive


 trexmeyer wrote:
I have entirely too many hours played and I haven't even touched Wood Elves or Lizardmen at all.

A few thoughts.

Warriors of Chaos are bad, primarily because they are a melee infantry focused faction in a game where melee infantry is not good. It's not as a bad at lower level difficulties, but even on hard my High Elf Archers > Swordmasters of Hoeth. The melee buffs are stupid.

I don't want to contemplate how many hours I've spent on Greenskins. I restarted a Grom campaign after confederating Grimgor, Wurzag, and Skarsnik because Azhag was dead. So I then got the band together and won. I also played campaigns starting as Skarsnik and Azhag. Grom is clearly the best faction lord just because of the Cauldron. Wurzag is the best in battle lord thanks to spamming Foot of Gork. I really dislike that their Orc Boy cav is so bad it shouldn't be recruited. Somehow Forest Goblin Spider Riders are better. Orc Infantry is in general weak. Black Orcs are okay, but so damn slow. I think Night Goblin (fanatics) are underappreciated and Nasty Skulkers might be the best melee infantry in the game in terms of cost/effectiveness. I've had battles where they just destroy whatever they touch.

I ran a Morathi vortex campaign. The campaign itself is interesting after only doing vortex as Khalida, but damn is the Dark Elf roster not fun to me. Black Arks I think are implemented well.

I played Khalida to a win on Vortex, but not on ME. I think I'm like 3 turns away on it, but I don't want to go back to it just to kill Strygos. I played Settra to win on ME and tried getting into Arkhan.
I really dislike that the best unit for Tomb Kings is the Casket of Souls and that it is so heavily time gated. It's insane that the best opening strat is get 20 units - Casket of Souls - start facerolling.

Currently playing Imrik and Imrik's army is the stupidest thing in terms of being OP that I've played yet. It is beautiful.

I also played Ikit Claw. The wrong way. I ignored his Campaign Objectives and went east. Ratling Guns are amazing and they absolutely suck during sieges compared to Archers. Still, I managed to win some very lopsided fights (against me) thanks to Ratling Guns. I can't fathom playing another Skaven faction. I guess Clan Eshin might be okay.

I got like 80-100 turns deep in a Gelt campaign, but the Empire has been very underwhelming. Guns are more powerful than Crossbows, but the positioning requirements and borderline uselessness in sieges is very frustrating.


I think you are in for a treat with Lizard men.

Im currently doing a bretonia campaign but as Ive just unlocked hippogriff knights, its pretty much GG by now. With life mages nothings is topping me.

I own but still havent playeda campaign as any of these:

Wood elves
Skaven
Dwarves
Norsca
Vampire coast

Thing is once you unlock certain builds its just steam roll.
Except for high elves. You cant archer spam your way to victory

I found Groms campaign pretty fun. The cooking mechanic is very cool and rerally liked the new units except the wagons which sucked.. Chariots in general need bit of a buff IMO.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/07/30 03:00:56


Post by: Voss


 H.B.M.C. wrote:
DLC for a DLC. I honestly didn't think they'd do it.

And it's not the Beastmen either, which is weird. They've got bigger gaps than the Wood Elves.


In the model range, I'd agree. But the WE campaign is borderline non-playable in Mortal Empires. Only one option gives you an even vaguely average garrison in the outposts, and the Amber system is incredibly non-functional to start with, let alone when other factions can just deny you upgrades/tech/units and put you in amber-debt more or less without effort.

They're also tied for the least amount of LLs, and lords are something CA seems to inordinately value.

I'm still hoping both Beasts and Warriors get an overhaul (even if the latter has to wait until TW3). Since they share some significant problems- specifically the fragility of Horde based armies when the AI decides to hunt you en masse, it would make sense they'd tie the development together a bit, and pull in some ideas with what they may do with chaos in TW3.

Personally I want some deeply buried strongholds or shrines that they can fall back to. Similar in the way the Vampirates are horde/city factions, but less recruitment, and more upkeep and general buffs and traits (as well as a solid garrison)


---
DLC for DLC feels inevitable to me. They couldn't leave those factions to rot, especially given how their main sales outreach is streamers who love multiplayer.
And just looking at the ME campaign Lord Selection screen gives an obvious feeling of how unbalanced factions are, even for single-player.
2 factions with 6 choices, 2 with 5, then several 4s, a couple 5s, then 2, 4, 2, 3, 3.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/07/30 03:43:45


Post by: trexmeyer


I've done Imrik campaigns in ME and Vortex. Not finishing ME since Clan Eshin keeps confederating with other Skaven to dodge death. Vortex was a joke even on Hard. Every army by mid game is Archers/Sisters/Sea Guard. Usually with a Noble or two on flyers, Handmaiden because why not, Loremaster for Earthblood, Fire Mage, and Lord on Dragon. Endgame is same thing + 3-5 Dragons. Final battle was a Heroic Victory with Imrik's army (Fire Mage, Life Mage, Handmaid, 2 Sisters, 5 Sea Guard, RoR Dragons, and then a couple more Sun Dragons). Life Mage is just there to heal the dragons and Handmaiden holds a couple of buffs for the Archers. The strat is literally just infantry sit outside LoS in checkers, Imrik dives the center line, Dragons breathe on the blob, Fire Mage dumps Burning Head + Flame Vortex. It's silly.

I tried Lizardmen and hated it. No artillery, short range at best, and magic seems mediocre compared to what it should be. I don't like infantry focused armies.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/07/30 04:38:41


Post by: Dreadwinter


 trexmeyer wrote:
I've done Imrik campaigns in ME and Vortex. Not finishing ME since Clan Eshin keeps confederating with other Skaven to dodge death. Vortex was a joke even on Hard. Every army by mid game is Archers/Sisters/Sea Guard. Usually with a Noble or two on flyers, Handmaiden because why not, Loremaster for Earthblood, Fire Mage, and Lord on Dragon. Endgame is same thing + 3-5 Dragons. Final battle was a Heroic Victory with Imrik's army (Fire Mage, Life Mage, Handmaid, 2 Sisters, 5 Sea Guard, RoR Dragons, and then a couple more Sun Dragons). Life Mage is just there to heal the dragons and Handmaiden holds a couple of buffs for the Archers. The strat is literally just infantry sit outside LoS in checkers, Imrik dives the center line, Dragons breathe on the blob, Fire Mage dumps Burning Head + Flame Vortex. It's silly.

I tried Lizardmen and hated it. No artillery, short range at best, and magic seems mediocre compared to what it should be. I don't like infantry focused armies.


I always play Lizardmen as a Monster focused army. Those big dinos do big damage and their flying units are pretty strong. They do not compare to an army full of Sisters though. Sisters seriously need a nerf.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/07/30 15:25:21


Post by: trexmeyer


And that does look somewhat appealing, but how many turns does it take to get there? Maybe I'll give Mazdamundi a try on Vortex.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/07/30 16:41:25


Post by: Voss


 trexmeyer wrote:
And that does look somewhat appealing, but how many turns does it take to get there? Maybe I'll give Mazdamundi a try on Vortex.


Quite a few, at least without a very structured build order and a lot of sacking. Lizard income is pretty bad, their upkeep is rough, and trying to go wide (a lot of territory) is something of a trap, as its too easy to spread money too thin.

Lizard growth is also pretty slow without buildings and tech.

For Mazda specifically, Hexoatl starts with a gold mine, but in terms of actual income, its pretty bad- 600 at level 3.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/07/30 21:56:08


Post by: Dreadwinter


Voss wrote:
 trexmeyer wrote:
And that does look somewhat appealing, but how many turns does it take to get there? Maybe I'll give Mazdamundi a try on Vortex.


Quite a few, at least without a very structured build order and a lot of sacking. Lizard income is pretty bad, their upkeep is rough, and trying to go wide (a lot of territory) is something of a trap, as its too easy to spread money too thin.

Lizard growth is also pretty slow without buildings and tech.

For Mazda specifically, Hexoatl starts with a gold mine, but in terms of actual income, its pretty bad- 600 at level 3.


The upside is they are in areas with a lot of special buildings. Lots of gold mines and such in the area. Trade is pretty easy with them. But yeah, money is their biggest issue. You are going to have to do a lot of work for that. But those special spawned monsters are beefy.

Edit: Just started a game as Khemri. So if anybody knows any good strats with the Tomb Kings I would appreciate it.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/07/30 23:21:21


Post by: Argive


 trexmeyer wrote:
I've done Imrik campaigns in ME and Vortex. Not finishing ME since Clan Eshin keeps confederating with other Skaven to dodge death. Vortex was a joke even on Hard. Every army by mid game is Archers/Sisters/Sea Guard. Usually with a Noble or two on flyers, Handmaiden because why not, Loremaster for Earthblood, Fire Mage, and Lord on Dragon. Endgame is same thing + 3-5 Dragons. Final battle was a Heroic Victory with Imrik's army (Fire Mage, Life Mage, Handmaid, 2 Sisters, 5 Sea Guard, RoR Dragons, and then a couple more Sun Dragons). Life Mage is just there to heal the dragons and Handmaiden holds a couple of buffs for the Archers. The strat is literally just infantry sit outside LoS in checkers, Imrik dives the center line, Dragons breathe on the blob, Fire Mage dumps Burning Head + Flame Vortex. It's silly.

I tried Lizardmen and hated it. No artillery, short range at best, and magic seems mediocre compared to what it should be. I don't like infantry focused armies.


Hmm .. the early game is somewhat a struggle. I pretty much always start as Kroq Gar and go for stegadon/ancient stegadon as a decent ranged altirely weapon also engine of the gods is hella fun. Unlocking a slaan takes a few turns but once you get fire magic its happy days.

With a mosnter build (feral bastiladons/stegadons - Stegadons beign the superior choice) are actualy fairly cheap earlyish game if you go full skins for the meatshield. Need life/fire magic to really make it work. Scar vets on carnosaurs are great fun. Really like the lizard campaigns esepcialy in vortex.

They can somewhat struggle against very min maxed ranged focused armies but you can counter with fats cav monsters fliers and chamelon skins to poison so they cant get away. The tool box is pretty extensive but it might take a few tries in order to get the hand of it. Very in your face kind of army. I like big dinos and I cannot lie

Think the worse match up tends to be skaven for me... Once had an epic 6v2 stack battle and all that wa sleft was a couple stegadons with few Hp points left by the end of.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/07/31 00:36:12


Post by: trexmeyer


 Dreadwinter wrote:
Voss wrote:
 trexmeyer wrote:
And that does look somewhat appealing, but how many turns does it take to get there? Maybe I'll give Mazdamundi a try on Vortex.


Quite a few, at least without a very structured build order and a lot of sacking. Lizard income is pretty bad, their upkeep is rough, and trying to go wide (a lot of territory) is something of a trap, as its too easy to spread money too thin.

Lizard growth is also pretty slow without buildings and tech.

For Mazda specifically, Hexoatl starts with a gold mine, but in terms of actual income, its pretty bad- 600 at level 3.


The upside is they are in areas with a lot of special buildings. Lots of gold mines and such in the area. Trade is pretty easy with them. But yeah, money is their biggest issue. You are going to have to do a lot of work for that. But those special spawned monsters are beefy.

Edit: Just started a game as Khemri. So if anybody knows any good strats with the Tomb Kings I would appreciate it.


It's probably too late for this advice, but if you restart or anyone is starting a new one this what I've done for Khalida/Arkhan/Settra. It's a bit cheesy though.

You should start with military building for archers. Don't upgrade it. Maybe make the income building or chariot building since chariots are at useful for rear charges and breaking morale. I actually managed to get 200+ kills on 2 chariot units cycle charging Saurus warriors in one battle and that was the only reason I won. :/

Nehekara Warriors are borderline useless. Tomb Guard aren't, but they aren't worth rushing to get. The Dynasty Lord with Tomb Guard buffs + the 2 Heralds that buff them (IIRC Deathblow and Frenzy) make them better, but they'll never carry a battle.

All you do is sit in your starting province, recruit your archers, demo that building if you need gold, get to a 20 stack, get 5k gold, get Casket of Souls. Also, get the starting Liche Priest. Using Global Recruitment this should only take 4-5 turns. At this point your army is going to be TK, LP, Casket of Souls, 4x Archers, maybe 2x Chariots, Spearmen, and your respective starting units. It will be fully capable of beating anything else you can face this early outside of the Books of Nagash armies. From here I rush a settlement, sack, occupy, move to the next one. Once I get to the last settlement of the starting enemy I'll sack it for a turn or two, maybe more, especially if I have my second TK over there with 19x Spearmen. Getting levels on your Priest is huge.

Aside from that, make sure to get another Casket of Souls off of CD and try not to lose them.

Other things.

Get Necrotects that unlock additional Sphinx, Tomb Scorpions, or Ushbati. Any other traits are worthless, just recruit and disband them if you have the money.

Banishment is probably the best offensive spell you have access to and you can't heal constructs. Spearmen/Archers/Tomb Guard are easy and quick to replace, constructs can take forever. Make sure to bring a Necrotect to heal your constructs.

Unlock the TK heal trait (red line) ASAP. It might even be more of a priority than LS.

The Rite that causes attrition gives you an additional 50% ambush chance. It is amazing for defense especially in ME as Khalida as you can lock down the two land paths into Lahmia and easily wipe out enemy armies.

Ushbati work best as flankers, TG/Spearmen should be your frontline.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/08/02 05:32:12


Post by: Dreadwinter


I didn't see this until I had about 70ish rounds in to my campaign. But I did put your advice to good use. Casket of Souls are amazing and I hadn't made one up until that point.

I also didn't do the sack/occupy for a long time. Which is really my fault tbh, I use that tactic on other factions but didn't use it here for some reason. On the Faction that probably uses it the most.

I knew about Necrotects having special traits thankfully from a attempt before.

I am going for a Priest and Necrotect in every army I have but I wasn't sure what magic school for priests. I have been going with Nehekhara and it is working very well.

Tomb Guard seem pretty good as far as front lines go honestly. Some of the strongest melee I have seen on any of the factions really. They hold well.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/08/04 22:57:15


Post by: trexmeyer


 Dreadwinter wrote:
I didn't see this until I had about 70ish rounds in to my campaign. But I did put your advice to good use. Casket of Souls are amazing and I hadn't made one up until that point.

I also didn't do the sack/occupy for a long time. Which is really my fault tbh, I use that tactic on other factions but didn't use it here for some reason. On the Faction that probably uses it the most.

I knew about Necrotects having special traits thankfully from a attempt before.

I am going for a Priest and Necrotect in every army I have but I wasn't sure what magic school for priests. I have been going with Nehekhara and it is working very well.

Tomb Guard seem pretty good as far as front lines go honestly. Some of the strongest melee I have seen on any of the factions really. They hold well.


Light is the "best" because so much of TK damage is ranged and Net is great, but they all work.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/08/07 18:13:35


Post by: trexmeyer


Beat Vortex on Luthor (H/N). I had only played VCoast before on E/E. I had started and quit a couple of campaigns as Luthor, Noctilus, and Aranessa before settling on the last one.

A few thoughts.

The goal was to not take territory and use Pirate Coves as my source of income, which mostly worked. I only had 5 Provinces at the end and spent 90% of the campaign with only 2. I took my starting one since it's a mandatory for Unified Mind, a two settlement one nearby that had two ports and was easily defensible, Galleon's Graveyard later on (since it's the most defensible port I know of), and then two island provinces that the Order of Loremasters had.

For up until the Third Shanty fight I only had up to 5 armies, which were just the Technology Lords. Shipbuilding is amazing. I only recruited normal lords for office slots and then 1 more for the Third Shanty fight since my other armies were out of position.

I ran 3 Mortars in every army and a Gunnery Wight in most, prioritizing ammo refill trait since it gives another 35 rounds of ammunition to mortars.

Started with Handgunners, but replaced them with Deck Gunners in most armies. Not sure if Deck Gunners are necessarily better, but they seem easier to position due to their range and unit size (playing on Ultra).

Necrofex are probably the best unit in terms of killing power, but I think they're overrated to a degree. Leviathans are better in melee and are all I need to lock up the enemy army while my ranged goes to work. I did get my Noctilus run up to about 10 Necrofex with double Arcane Conduit and overcast healing spell trait (I forget the name), but it wasn't as effective as Luthor on a Terrorgheist supported by a Fleet Captain, 3x Mortars, The RoR Gun, Leviathans, and Deck Gunners/Hand Gunners.

Depth Guard (with healing) surprised me at how well they can chew through chaff.

Luthor's killing power with the right gear once he has Unified Mind is tremendous. For sieges I'd let my artillery take out a couple of towers and then work on the ranged and Luthor could take out the rest solo. I had him at 52% Ward Save at the end and he could just charge in, get blobbed, and then drop a Vargheist's Revenge on the blob. He had just shy of 700 kills in the final battle and routinely picked up 600+. Didn't crack 1k though, but I was mainly fighting High Elves and they don't have those kinds of numbers.

Vargheist's Revenge > Winds of Death, at least on Ultra, but the healing spell is almost too good to pass up. I think most of my late game armies were around 1k-1200 and I'd frequently restore upwards of 100 units (basically all the damage I took) with heals after the army loss penalty was inflicted.

Some annoyances with the VCoast roster.

1. The best artillery unit is tier 2. I never recruited the cannons. Captured one once and disbanded it. Not sure why you would ever get one when Hand Gunners/Deck Gunners can melt monsters/cavalry just fine when focusing. I had a siege where the garrison had 3 dragons and they actually flew out past the walls. 6 Deck Gunners killed one before it landed and the other two were around half health when they landed (and got chewed up by regular Depth Guard). The mortars are good, but Empire artillery is dramatically better.

2. Can't recruit RoR outside of friendly territory. Every other faction that has RoR can use them as emergency troops anywhere.

3. No cavalry. I suppose you have Deck Droppers and Rotting Prometheans...the latter are okay, but their role is also filled by Leviathans. The gunnery version of Rotting Prometheans seems pointless. As do Deck Droppers.

4. The roster is small and many units seem pointless. Mournguls, Syreens, Handcannons, the bomb throwing guys, the Deck Droppers, Bloated Corpses (with the exception of early gam raise dead) don't really provide any benefit over other units that can do the same thing. At least in SP.

5. Terrible mount options and only Luthor can access a flyer. To make matters worse, the mounts barely increase speed.

It's certainly not a weak faction, but it suffers from having a lack of viable options. Army builds are basically Necrofex spam or a gun line variant.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/08/15 02:41:30


Post by: trexmeyer


If anyone is curious Isabella's Flying Circus is effective and amusing. For those who don't know, Isabella unlocks two additional Vampires, starts with two, gives embedded Vampires +10 Melee Attack/+10 Melee Defense, and I think a weapon strength bonus as well...but that doesn't display in game anywhere I can see even though I see the effect. So once they go down the melee line the Vampires have 70-80 MA, 50-60 MD, 500-600 WS, 100+ armor, 80+ leadership, and a self-heal on top of Isabella's Invocation of Nehek. They can also get Dread Incarnate for -4 to enemy leadership and this effect stacks.

The one I had running at endgame was Isabella, 16 Vampires (I believe 10-11 Dread Incarnate), and 3 Varghulfs for Siege Attacker and because you need ground units to avoid some penalties. 17 Arcane Conduits with excess of 250 starting Winds of Magic. It might actually top the Imrik Dragon stack.



TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/08/20 05:17:22


Post by: trexmeyer


Debating the best Greenskins stack.

I racked up 1400~ kills on Azhag in a siege against Skaven which is the most I've gotten for any lord. This is with the special building that reduces cooldown on Death Magic spells by 20%, level 40 Azhag with maxed out melee and magic skills (not literally every spell, just the krumpin ones), 3 Orc Shaman for Arcane Conduit/Foot of Gork, and the item that reduces ability CD by 15 seconds. He had regeneration trait from Isabella, but I also had the skill.

The stack was Azhag, 3 Shaman, 4 Black Orc Big Bosses (for melee attack/LD buff, Tormentor Sword, Helm of Discord, double Glittering Scales -5 MA each), and 12 Arachnarok Spiders to include the queen. You can send Azhag onto walls to fight while the mounted Black Orcs sit below since the buffs will still apply. Black Orc Big Bosses are amazing with Arachnarok Spiders regardless. With Azhag the full temporary buffs are +40 Armor, +24 MA, and then the debuffs are -10 MA from 2x Glittering Scales (constant), -24 from Tormentor Sword, -24 from Helm of Discord (iirc). Basically you can bring any non elite/lord/hero infantry down to 0 melee attack for a time. You can even just go full melee for the hell of it since Orc Shaman give another 24 MA/24 MD and 40 MA with two spells. Goblin Shaman would make it even better with their buffs. Then Azhag can nuke enemy leadership, damage, and armor via 2 Death Spells. Lastly, you could throw 6x Scarecrow Banners on the Spiders/Black Orcs for -48 Leadership (constant) to the enemy.

In summary the temporary effects would be the following.

Buffs:

MA: +24, +24, +40, total of 88...absolutely pointless...isn't 100 the cap?
Armor: +40 total
LD: +8 (Death Spell iirc), +16 Black Orc Buff, +24 total plus the Black Orc Aura
MD: +24 total

Debuffs:
MA: -24, -24, -10 x2 Glittering Scales, -68 total
MD: No debuffs...though I think Discord and Tormentor Sword both bring it down, I just don't recall
Weapon Strength: -30% Lore of Death
Armor: -30% Lore of Death
LD: -16 (Death Spell iirc), -8 x6 Scarecrow Banners for -48, -64 total and Spiders cause terror

The numbers may be off slightly, but for about 30 seconds the combo is unkillable in melee and with 4 Black Orcs you can cycle their buff for near constant uptime.

Also, Azhag has a flyer and is the only Orc LL to get one.

In my mind, Skarsnik and Grimgor are out of the discussion for just being footsloggers. Also, not being casters hurts as well.

Wurzag is an excellent caster, has a mount, but more importantly gives the best buffs to Arachnarok Spiders in the form of 25% physical resistance. He also strips magical resistance, but Fate of Bijuana (sp?) and the Purple Sun are superior to Foot of Gork (even the cheap one) and Brainbursta IMO.

So out of the three legendary lords left.

Azhag:
Terrible Army buffs for lategame, but vanguard deployment is amazing midgame for Orc Boar Boyz as I use them to hunt artillery and casters.
To maximize his individual effectiveness you have to give up redline buffs for your army if you want Lightning Strike. This isn't that big of a deal because 3 points will be wasted at least since his stack will just be heroes/spiders.
Not unstoppable in melee like a Vlad tier character, but has Regen, 80+ MA, and 700+ WS. He is vulnerable to anti-large in lategame, but basically every top tier LL will be. As far as caster lords on flyers go I don't know who is clearly superior overall as a melee/magic hybrid.
Having a flyer means he can easily pick his battles and most importantly can wipe ranged units on walls all day.
Only way to get a Lord with Lore of Death.

Grom:
Has the best faction buffs from start to finish.
Gives all Spiders maternal instincts. Useful for at least hitting flanks/rear of the enemy.
-10% spell cooldown and +10 winds of magic. Faster Foot of Gork is better.
Chariot is good for krumping.
Can't fight on walls.
Is best when cycle charging (i.e. not sieges).
Not a spellcaster.
Will get red line buffs.

Wurzag:
Strips magic resistance.
+25% physical resistance and red line buffs for your best units.
Cheapest Foot of Gork.
Okay in melee.
Can't fight on walls.

For a doomstack I think Grom is automatically out as well. Wurzag is more a straightforward nuke 'em till they glow type, but he's mediocre in melee, and much slower than Azhag.

I think the ideal stack would be:
Azhag
2x Night Goblin Shaman for faster Arcane Conduit, Little Waagh spells
1x Orc Shaman for Arcane Conduit, Big Waagh...mainly the melee buffs if it's a choice between Foot of Gork and Purple Sun.
6x Black Orc Bosses. Keep their melee buff up constantly and hopefully have a couple of Glittering Scales, Tormentor Swords, Helms of Discord. Plus they're freaking tanks.
10x Arachnarok Spiders with 1 being the ROR Queen or swap one out of the ROR Rogue Idol.


TLDR: I used think Azhag sucked, now I'm convinced he's the best. Also Black Orc Boss stacking is silly.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/08/20 08:06:35


Post by: Laughing Man


There's no cap on MA. It's pretty trivial to get Tyrion over 150 MA with zero support characters or spells, and it absolutely works wonders.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/08/20 12:55:18


Post by: trexmeyer


Well in that case they're clearing 150-160 since Black Orcs are around 70 with traits sans items.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/08/24 20:49:56


Post by: trexmeyer


Anyone else get war declarations from just about everyone playing as Norsca? I've tried 3 starts with various tactics and as soon as I took Albion via confederation the Elves and Dark Elves went HAM on me.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/08/24 20:56:49


Post by: Voss


 trexmeyer wrote:
Anyone else get war declarations from just about everyone playing as Norsca? I've tried 3 starts with various tactics and as soon as I took Albion via confederation the Elves and Dark Elves went HAM on me.


Yes. (And from Norsca- at least Vanaheimlings and World Walkers in non-Norsca games). There seems to be something about those sea zones around Albion. As soon as you have presence there, various factions become automatically aware of you and start declaring war. It happens in any game after I take Marienburg, for example.

For Norsca games, Hellebron and Karond Kar tend to be particularly aggressive about war. They often don't follow up, but they seem very coded to make the declaration, then peace out pointlessly after a while.
Louen also seems scripted to go nuts about Norsca at some point.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/08/24 21:05:20


Post by: trexmeyer


I have one campaign with a Wulfrik near 40, a Nurgle Lord (for regen on a mammoth) near 30, and probably a dozen mammoths between them sitting in Courenne, but it's like turn 140 and the Dark Elves are gone. I razed Har Ganeth and Karond Kar. Rictus and Nehek cleaned up Cult of Pleasure and Naggarond. Eataine is the only real Ordertide going, but they're about to drop Rictus.

I'm trying to come up with a good starting strat.

Take your starting province, maybe take out the one near Kislev, treaty Clan Moulder, wipe Kislev, head to Nordland? That should be doable by turn 30-40.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/08/24 23:58:56


Post by: Voss


I'd actually leave Kislev alone, if at all possible. They don't really matter long term, and they've got plenty of idiots to keep them occupied these days (Moulder, Azhag, several Elector Counts, and Manfred also seems to like northwards expansion, to the point that I've seen him end up as the Bulwark against the Doomtide more often than not).

I've never played a Norsca campaign where Moulder didn't betray me the second they had a spare moment (and sometimes even when they didn't have spare moments). Going directly for the Empire and keeping the confederation wave and/or alliance network under control early seems better.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/08/25 00:26:48


Post by: Argive


So im currently playing as rictus its my first campaign as skaven on hard in Mortal Empires.

I haven't played in that mode and corner of the map for a while. I forgot the chaos armies keep spawning in the sea right offf slavers bay.

I went east first (First mistake) and took the slavers bay and north frozen city. I left dark elves and wanted to channel them south to fight Alith anar however they just pounced around my territories and didint go conquering and the HE juggernaut just started rolling them over.

Rather then eventually get rolled over I decided to atatck the Elves when they got a bunch of their armies hbattered clearing the chaos around shrine of khaine.

Bunch of turns later theres yet another chaos spawn I forgot how annoying those were.

In hindsight I should have probably just gone to war with the dark elves as soon as I took frozen city and then the High elves would have been a buffer between me and the chaos invasions. Also I seem to be really struggling with economy. I Only really have like 2 good armies the rest is mainly chaff slinger units. My campaign is going really uphill as the ulthaun elves are now somehow throwing dragons at me left right and center.

So whats the best way to skaven ?
Holding territory or sacking/razing?
How do I maintain food ? Seems to always be on the lowest bracket..

The walls are really important but not really sure what else to build and what to focus on. My armies are mainly jezzails and ratling guns with some mortars and artillery. with a smidgen of gutter runenrs screening. warlock engineer and a spellcaster lord apart from tretchs army who has a caster as well as the warplock engineer. but it all seems very expensive.. hellpit abominations or rat ogres really don't seem worth it.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/08/25 00:58:43


Post by: Voss


So whats the best way to skaven ?
Holding territory or sacking/razing?
How do I maintain food ? Seems to always be on the lowest bracket..


To the first... Rictus is basically hard mode for skaven. Tretch was a FLC lord before CA decided that 'crazytown' was the place for each following DLC. He doesn't even compare to the plague buffed Skrolk, let alone Skryre or Eshin. I personally like Queek more than Tretch, just for the starting neighborhood.

I tend to like a lot of sacking these days, regardless of faction. A small number of upgraded core territories is better for a while than spreading out too much. Expansion can come later after a solid core starts spitting out higher tier units. Razing I don't like, as it just makes other enemies stronger, as re-settling is too easy/cheap.

This is especially true for skaven, as food doesn't naturally ramp up until a lot of techs (without switching the full province bonuses over to food production).

Shoddy raiding armies can help with food, but mostly you want to be constantly attacking and eating fools (the natural post battle food gain, the option to pick food doesn't really give that much, though it can help in a pinch).

Building wise, specialized provinces help. Small (two city) provinces should largely just be money provinces, but growth buildings always help. Recruitment provinces depend on what you want in your army.

Army composition depends a bit on style, but you do want line units to soak losses and slow enemies so your preferred killers can get into position. Mainly jezzails and ratling guns plus mortars and artillery sounds bad to me. Not enough blocking forces to keep cavalry, monsters or even infantry armies off you. Gutter runners aren't even vaguely enough

Personally I don't bother with multiple casters, too much micro, not enough Winds of Magic.

In general for ranged attacks, I prefer arcing shots (mortars and plague catapults) over straight line weapons- TW2 just doesn't have enough elevated terrain to make the latter worthwhile, and dragging the guns into position leaves them vulnerable and takes time away from shooting.

I find rat ogres useful in reserve for their high damage AP (good for counter charging cavalry).


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/08/25 01:08:58


Post by: A Town Called Malus


For Food with skaven, cheese it.

Sack cities over and over to farm food from the poor garrison, let the enemy build armies and then ambush them and wipe them out (sack city with main army > ambush stance with main army > kill any army that tries to recruit or arrives to reinforce > sack city again with cheap slave army now it has a weak garrison and broken walls > Cheap slave army goes into raid stance > repeat from step 2). Battles are your main supply of food so make sure you have a constant source of them. Although it can be tempting to spam out a ton of cheap armies, each of those armies costs food so sometimes a bit of restraint can help. If you do have a lot of armies then set them to raid, even if it is in your own territory (in a province which doesn't produce much wealth). You raid and produce food (3 per raiding army), then when it rebels you kill the rebels for more food and also some experience for your general. Lure out the betrayer-traitor, yes-yes.

Beeline to the various Monstrous/Virulent/etc. Plans techs on the technology tree if you don't have anything you are particularly working towards to help your armies. Most will give you passive food income.

With Skaven you kinda want to get into a rhythm where you are always capturing the city of a province at at least tier 3 by spending your food. So you want to make sure that you have farmed enough before you commit to taking that city. Thankfully the skaven mechanics means there is no downside to repeatedly sacking settlements and cities as you can use your food to instantly occupy them at whatever level you wish. This is very powerful and you should be using it at every opportunity you can, it really gives you an advantage in getting access to high tier buildings quicker than other races can hope to ever match. If you don't have enough food for that, then it is not time to occupy that city/settlement.

Don't expand too fast, your cities each cost food to maintain, as does the under-empire. A couple of food producing under-empire builds in cities which you won't take for a while and which will be safe from being razed (so nowhere where Chaos is likely to come a-marauding) is okay but if you go crazy on it then you'll run into food (or income from funding your food) issues. Keep an eye out for settlements with pastures or exotic creatures, these can build a building chain which produces food (pastures produces more food). The only other regular building which does so is a tier 4+ building which can only be built in cities and which only produces 1 food. Some unique buildings produce food, I think and so does corrupted Lizardmen spawning pools (though that'll be a bit of a trek for you). Make use of the +2 food provincial order thing as well, I end up with it turned on on pretty much all my provinces unless I am actively recruiting or building in one.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/08/25 01:58:34


Post by: Argive


Voss wrote:
So whats the best way to skaven ?
Holding territory or sacking/razing?
How do I maintain food ? Seems to always be on the lowest bracket..


To the first... Rictus is basically hard mode for skaven. Tretch was a FLC lord before CA decided that 'crazytown' was the place for each following DLC. He doesn't even compare to the plague buffed Skrolk, let alone Skryre or Eshin. I personally like Queek more than Tretch, just for the starting neighborhood.

I tend to like a lot of sacking these days, regardless of faction. A small number of upgraded core territories is better for a while than spreading out too much. Expansion can come later after a solid core starts spitting out higher tier units. Razing I don't like, as it just makes other enemies stronger, as re-settling is too easy/cheap.

This is especially true for skaven, as food doesn't naturally ramp up until a lot of techs (without switching the full province bonuses over to food production).

Shoddy raiding armies can help with food, but mostly you want to be constantly attacking and eating fools (the natural post battle food gain, the option to pick food doesn't really give that much, though it can help in a pinch).

Building wise, specialized provinces help. Small (two city) provinces should largely just be money provinces, but growth buildings always help. Recruitment provinces depend on what you want in your army.

Army composition depends a bit on style, but you do want line units to soak losses and slow enemies so your preferred killers can get into position. Mainly jezzails and ratling guns plus mortars and artillery sounds bad to me. Not enough blocking forces to keep cavalry, monsters or even infantry armies off you. Gutter runners aren't even vaguely enough

Personally I don't bother with multiple casters, too much micro, not enough Winds of Magic.

In general for ranged attacks, I prefer arcing shots (mortars and plague catapults) over straight line weapons- TW2 just doesn't have enough elevated terrain to make the latter worthwhile, and dragging the guns into position leaves them vulnerable and takes time away from shooting.

I find rat ogres useful in reserve for their high damage AP (good for counter charging cavalry).


Thanks for the tips.

To be honest I am very happy with how ive built my army. Its expensive but it suits my style as It's very aggressive and I never defend. I have 2 casts of harrowing warp gale, so I can stop multiple phoenix and dragon charges. While vermintide spell and menace below will bog down any cavalry. I have unlocked lightning stike so I can carve my way through about 3 full stack high elves armies without much trouble one at a time and have the numbers left over to take a city. The overwhelming firepower the army kicks out is insane. (A rooted star dragon dies in under 3 seconds) and the mortars just obliterate any infantry. The cavalarly and lords are the biggest pain but luckily ive managed to kill most dragon princes and the elves are leaning towards phoenixes and infantry. Cav is indeed the biggest pain to deal with.
I was using suicidal warp grinders for a time to use their root ability but with the amount of archers they tend to bring to the field it doesn't work and they tend to get insta broken. One of my armies has a couple Hell Pit abominations on either flank to guard against flankers and cav but they got a huge hit box so end up taking a lot friendly fire lol. But I think its the right play. Will probably just drop the gutter runners for more ratling guns or warp lightining cannons

Its the campaign tactical/ mechanics I am not familiar with which is giving me grief.
I will try to do more sacking and consolidating my core rather than over reach. I think I was trying to avoid rebelions too much but in hindight its a food source.. Reminds me oif my DE campaign cheesing the slave economy
Next time around Id go full on and kill DE... Damn malakieth let me down big time pussyfooting around not pulling his weight.
Might just go to war with him once I beat the latest chaos wave.

Btw how does the chaos waves spawnining mechanic work ? Every how many turns is it? Its been a while since I had to deal with it.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/08/25 21:50:29


Post by: trexmeyer


Edit: Wiped it all out to make room for this.

I finally found out how to modify favor. It was in a Lua Script not the DB files.

I tweaked Norsca a bit. Mainly QoL changes. Slightly stronger early game, but not significantly so IMO after playing 40 turns while testing.

Changes:

- Razing settlements now grant the chosen god 9 favor, up from 6 and reduces favor
for other gods by 3, up from 2.
- Monster Hunt offerings now grant the chosen god 18 favor, up from 12 and reduces favor
for other gods by 6, up from 4.

Norsca Marauder Chieftain Traits have been changed to give the following. Each Chaos God has a total of 9 points to
invest with the final trait locking out the others. i.e. you can get Pestilence of the Crow (Regen) but not Sorcery
of the Eagle. In the base game you can only get bonuses from a single Chaos God.

Values were chosen based on their favored numbers. Khorne is 8, Slaanesh is 6, Nurgle is 7, Tzeentch is 9.

Khorne (The Hound) Bonuses:
Charge Bonus: 24
Weapon Strength: 8
Melee Attack: 16
AP Damage: 16

Slaanesh (The Serpent) Bonuses:
Health: 12
Fatigue Resistance: -30
Melee Attack: 12
Leadership: 12

Nurgle (The Crow) Bonuses:
Physical Resistance: 14
Weapon Strength: 7
Melee Defense: 14
Health: 7

Tzeentch (The Eagle) Bonuses:
Magic Resistance: 9
Speed: 9
Armor: 18
Ward Save: 9

Only The Eagle's final ability has been changed. It now gives Fate of Bijuna (same version as Azrik the Maze Keeper) and
+15 Winds of Magic Reserve. The reserve is to largely cover the cost of one cast (22 WoM) as the previous ability was
Bound Fireball with 4 casts.

Norsca major settlement main buildings give an additional 10 Income and 10 Growth.
Norsca minor settlement main buildings give an additional 5 Income and 5 Growth.
Loot Piles give an additional 10 Growth.
Ports give an additional 5 Growth.
This translates to an additional 40 Growth for the World Walker's starting province.

Outposts have not been touched.

All Chaos Gods give an additional favour effect at rank 1 Favor.

Crow: 10% Physical Resistance
Hound: 10 Melee Attack
Serpent: 10% Speed
Eagle: 10% Magic Resistance

Serpent rank 2 bonus of +5 to Lord recruit rank increased to +8.

I'm considering changing all the bonuses to reflect their favored numbers however.

Range for Throwing Axes and Javelins has been increased from 80 and 90, respectively, to 90 and 100. Damage has been slightly
increased for each.

Marauder Chieftains have had their base defense increased from 40 to 45 when on foot or on a horse.
Marauder Chieftains have had their HP increased to 4400 when on foot, up from 4260.



TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/08/29 03:58:32


Post by: trexmeyer


Working on giving Azrik the Maze Keeper optional skills. Removed his starting ones, but kept the Lore of Metal and Death.

Image won't embed.
https://imgur.com/9TzCu8H

Edit: I realize his default skill is redundant with the two Loremaster traits. Not sure what else to do. It's simple enough to swap out unique line skills. Working on giving him a unique weapon.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/09/06 00:32:12


Post by: trexmeyer


So I didn't realize Vashnaar's Conquest was notable until googling his lore after killing him once again. I don't know if he's weaker now because I've never personally had a problem with him, but apparently he used/still does run rampant through the game at times. I have witness him conquer middle Lustria once or twice, which is hilarious.

The only other particularly odd thing I've seen was when playing Court of Lybaras on ME VH. I quit the game around turn 150ish at strength rank 3/4. Sylvania was number 1 and had destroyed the Empire. Literally, every Imperial faction outside of the Golden Order was gone and the Golden Order was a few turns from death. Von Carsten was still alive and independent. Grimgor was number 2 and had trashed Karaz-a-Karak and Clan Eshin. The strongest dwarf faction left was Greybeard's Prospectors. Bretonnia only had their Araby Crusade holdings. Everything else was Clan Rictus/World Walkers/Sylvania.

First time I've seen Empire and Dwarves both get stomped out by the AI.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/09/20 04:44:42


Post by: trexmeyer


It does look like this thread is dead. :/

I ran through a VH on Norsca (Wulfrik) and then a H as Clan Angrund and a VH as Ungrim.

Norsca actually feels stronger than either Angrund or Ungrim. Just to summarize.

Norsca:
Ranged is lacking, but you have very good anti-large range in javelins.
Skin Wolves are pretty solid flankers/anti-large flankers.
Infernal Dominance stacking can get silly.
You have access to Fire Magic which is IMO the best school of magic.
Lords lack skill options, but red/blue line buffs are critical for basically every non caster lord so melee self buffs aren't that important. Big thing is you get Mammoths with Regen, +15% Missile Resistance, and +15% Weapon Strength.
The Dragon Ogre's Horn and Unidentified Hydra head will wipe swarmed infantry when combined. I've literally kill 800+ by sending in my lord with those to get swarmed and popping both.
Monster Hunts in general are one of the most fun and rewarding faction features. Some rewards are mediocre, but I prefer it to just crafting.
3x Skin Wolf Werekin (might be 4x) can stack all 3 (might be 4) levels of the MA attack buff. This combined with disbanding until you get Infernal Dominance leads to stupid MA values. My Wulfrik stack had Mammoths buffed in excess of 120 MA.
Marauder Horsemasters are actually decent as harassment units and with full buffs get pretty solid missile damage.
The tech you gain from capturing capitals snowballs quick. I had captured all of them except for 2-3.
You control when Archaon arrives, thus no Ordertide.

The early game trick is to level up 2 Lords while not confederating any Norscan faction with Albion. I beat up on Norsca for a long minute before sniping Couronne and then Altdorf a few turns later. After that it turned into a snowball where I just focused on preventing counterattacks while clearing out Reikland and sniping other capitols for tech. I won the campaign after the final challenger. I think trying to buddy up with Archaon to win is a mistake.

Dwarves meanwhile:
Artillery outside of Organ Guns (which are amazing) is unimpressive.
Runesmiths/Runelords are really only good for the DR rune and the slow rune.
Generic Lords are markedly inferior to Norscan lords.
Painfully slow unless you stack Engineers and then only your ranged are fast. You can really only do this with one army, but that army will wreck. (70 speed, 247 missile damage rangers)
Slayers are questionable picks outside of Ungrim's army. With Ungrim they're silly.
No magic hurts a lot and MR is not valuable (imo) at all in SP because the AI doesn't make good use of magic.
The greatest strength is that you are part of the Order Tide. On both Angrund and Ungrim I helped out allies, avoided confederation except to fill out a province here or there, and just focused on the objectives. Whereas with Norsca I was #1 in strength from basically turn 60-70 onwards. I never reached that point on Dwarves.
Some gear combos are amazing. Every character can get 8 HP regen with no downsides, perfect vigor, and cause terror. They become very tanky.
Grudgethrowers have a horrific firing arc for sieges. It might be the worst one I've dealt with yet.

I feel like Dwarves used to be strong, but got left behind with the power creep. Their rune crafting, which should be vital, doesn't even exist. Ungrim was fun and Angrund was as well until I took Eight Peaks, but they don't seem like they've been updated in a while.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/09/20 08:02:29


Post by: Not Online!!!


Alot of the older races needed an update more then dwarfs, that the orks got one that is Fun and works for them is by no means a small thing aswell.

Also you are stuck to deal with skaven, which are with their hordes a Real pain in the ass.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/09/20 16:36:58


Post by: trexmeyer


Not Online!!! wrote:
Alot of the older races needed an update more then dwarfs, that the orks got one that is Fun and works for them is by no means a small thing aswell.

Also you are stuck to deal with skaven, which are with their hordes a Real pain in the ass.


Wasn't Warhammer just the following?

The Empire (Better than Dwarves in everything other than melee infantry...I think...maybe Greatswords are comparable to Hammerers)
The Greenskins (Worse range by far, but better elsewhere)
Vampire Counts (No range, but they're incredibly strong)
Beastmen (bad)
Warriors of Chaos (not bad so much as the Horde mechanic needs a rework and they're facing an uphill battle by fighting basically everyone)
Wood Elves (getting the next DLC)

Edit: Now, I do dislike fighting the AI Dwarves, but I think that's primarily due to the following: they confederate quickly and constantly, magic resistance is much better for the AI in SP than the player, and they're part of the Ordertide.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/09/20 19:11:06


Post by: Eumerin


 trexmeyer wrote:
Not Online!!! wrote:
Alot of the older races needed an update more then dwarfs, that the orks got one that is Fun and works for them is by no means a small thing aswell.

Also you are stuck to deal with skaven, which are with their hordes a Real pain in the ass.


Wasn't Warhammer just the following?

The Empire (Better than Dwarves in everything other than melee infantry...I think...maybe Greatswords are comparable to Hammerers)
The Greenskins (Worse range by far, but better elsewhere)
Vampire Counts (No range, but they're incredibly strong)
Beastmen (bad)
Warriors of Chaos (not bad so much as the Horde mechanic needs a rework and they're facing an uphill battle by fighting basically everyone)
Wood Elves (getting the next DLC)

Edit: Now, I do dislike fighting the AI Dwarves, but I think that's primarily due to the following: they confederate quickly and constantly, magic resistance is much better for the AI in SP than the player, and they're part of the Ordertide.


Norsca was added to the first game when the second game was released.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/09/20 19:21:14


Post by: trexmeyer


I think they're in a better spot than Dwarves despite the lack of unit variety.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/09/20 21:38:56


Post by: Argive


I finnaly got around to fighting as norsca.

My first run of the campaing was ok. But the armies need really high tier units to have a chance against Bretonia or empire and thats just too expensive.

Ended up just droping out, I was beating DE and bretonia soundly but then the empire decided to join in and I just couldint afford to recruit another high tier army.. Probably could have salvaged the campaign but it just wasnt enjoyable.

I found even with constant sacking/raiding I was struggling to fight on 3 fronts.

Marauders /trolls are just straight up terrible and thats what you are stuck with trying to win vs high mobility brets who are just constantly attacking in small bands which is annoying as heck...


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/09/20 21:43:13


Post by: Voss


Eumerin wrote:
 trexmeyer wrote:
Not Online!!! wrote:
Alot of the older races needed an update more then dwarfs, that the orks got one that is Fun and works for them is by no means a small thing aswell.

Also you are stuck to deal with skaven, which are with their hordes a Real pain in the ass.


Wasn't Warhammer just the following?

The Empire (Better than Dwarves in everything other than melee infantry...I think...maybe Greatswords are comparable to Hammerers)
The Greenskins (Worse range by far, but better elsewhere)
Vampire Counts (No range, but they're incredibly strong)
Beastmen (bad)
Warriors of Chaos (not bad so much as the Horde mechanic needs a rework and they're facing an uphill battle by fighting basically everyone)
Wood Elves (getting the next DLC)

Edit: Now, I do dislike fighting the AI Dwarves, but I think that's primarily due to the following: they confederate quickly and constantly, magic resistance is much better for the AI in SP than the player, and they're part of the Ordertide.


Norsca was added to the first game when the second game was released.

Also the Bretonnian free update in between Wood Elves and Norsca


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/09/20 21:46:43


Post by: trexmeyer


Trolls are worthless unless with Throgg. They could use a Troll/Fimir lord that gives them additional buffs over what Chieftains can do.

Both varieties of Fimir Warriors are good, but not great. Definitely better than trolls.

Skin Wolves win 1v1 against cavalry that isn't anti-large.

Norscan Ice Wolves/Chariots (forced into melee mode) are good anti-ranged/artillery and okay flankers.

Early game I spam so many Javelin Throwers that Bretonnia and it's trash infantry just don't matter. What I was most worried about was Hellfire Rocket Batteries, but the AI is dumb. I found that you can split your force in two halves, spread far apart, and charge from both sides. AI ends up spamming reform to target whoever is closest. Works even better if you have a Fire Sorceror to nuke them while they're fiddling about.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/09/20 22:24:23


Post by: Argive


 trexmeyer wrote:
Trolls are worthless unless with Throgg. They could use a Troll/Fimir lord that gives them additional buffs over what Chieftains can do.

Both varieties of Fimir Warriors are good, but not great. Definitely better than trolls.

Skin Wolves win 1v1 against cavalry that isn't anti-large.

Norscan Ice Wolves/Chariots (forced into melee mode) are good anti-ranged/artillery and okay flankers.

Early game I spam so many Javelin Throwers that Bretonnia and it's trash infantry just don't matter. What I was most worried about was Hellfire Rocket Batteries, but the AI is dumb. I found that you can split your force in two halves, spread far apart, and charge from both sides. AI ends up spamming reform to target whoever is closest. Works even better if you have a Fire Sorceror to nuke them while they're fiddling about.


Yep thats another thing. Fire casters take a while to get with norsca.

Over all thought I think the provinces just dont make enough money to be able to field enough high tier armies.
Marauders, trolls and skin wolves against shades, hellstorms and rifles is a bad day..

Its not unwinable but its not a fun match up and always takes lots of damage.. The wolves are very cool unit as a flanker/ranged munchers but way too much upkeep.
I struggled a lot with catching bret armies on the campaign maps.

With a melee army you will always take heavy casulaties and key to victory imo is getting those big wins where you loose a chaff unit and wipe out an enemy high tier stack and then can penetrate into their lands and sack/raze/occupy.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/09/21 06:16:27


Post by: trexmeyer


It's doable. I've ran through like 4-5 campaigns as Norsca. The learning curve is steeper than I think every other faction I've played. Confederation is a trick imo. You're best off beating the snot out of other tribes for the first 40-50 turns and leveling up to lords to mammoths before you attempt to go south.

Ran through Talsyn on hard for the first time. Won on turn 109 (it didn't trigger until the next turn :/). I had Mixu's Tabletop Lords mod which gives 3 Spellsinger Lord variants. Not that it mattered because I never leveled any lord other than Orion past 11 and the second highest was a Glade Lord.

The blue line needs to be reworked to bring it in line with other factions. Requires 5 points instead of 4 and LS is way too deep. I think it was the most dorked up blue line I've seen outside of maybe WoC.
I like not being able to fully settle outside of forests, but I would at least bring their settlement options on par with Norsca in that they have outposts with a different set of buildings that can go up to t3/t5 or at least t3 for every major settlement and t5 for faction capitols.

Orion is mediocre IMO as a legendary lord. Could use a mount and either better AoE, fire when shooting, or being more of a tank.

Waystalkers are bonkers. My final Orion army was 2 Spellsingers + Waystalker hero with Talon trait, 4 Wild Riders (for fluff), 3 Sisters of the Thorn for buffs and debuffs, and the rest were Waystalkers. They melt targets faster than anything I've seen in 1000+ hours.

Honestly, after hearing so much about how hard they are I was not impressed. You can raze settlements for 100k+, you get +30 rep with everyone eventually and +70 with certain factions. It was really simple to just ally with the Ordertide and send a couple of armies out to wreck enemy settlements.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/09/23 03:15:41


Post by: Argive


Im playing as the awekened currently.

I almost got order tied but the dwarves love me coz I keep fighting cult of pleasure so I amanged to broker a peace with them and trade and am about to get a defensive alliance to try and trick them into going to war with empire lol.

Necrofex collossus + vamp magic and gunnery wight are just soo good.. Its a shame they are just hands over heels better than rotting leviathans or terroghaist.

Will probably revisit Norsca again on my week off before moving onto stunties.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/09/24 19:51:49


Post by: trexmeyer


 Argive wrote:
Im playing as the awekened currently.

I almost got order tied but the dwarves love me coz I keep fighting cult of pleasure so I amanged to broker a peace with them and trade and am about to get a defensive alliance to try and trick them into going to war with empire lol.

Necrofex collossus + vamp magic and gunnery wight are just soo good.. Its a shame they are just hands over heels better than rotting leviathans or terroghaist.

Will probably revisit Norsca again on my week off before moving onto stunties.


Rotting Leviathans are pretty good. Necrofex is definitely better in Noctilus's army, but in other ones I think it's more of a tossup. I ran through an Awakened campaign a while back where I only took 2-3 provinces and just dropped Pirate Coves all over. It was more fun than trying to paint the map.

In general Vampire Coast is a really good faction. My only actual complaint about their roster is that their mount options are pointless except as a way to increase the character's mass. They should really be 55-65 speed.

Also, Gunnery Wights are possibly the best ranged hero in game right now. I kept two in my Queen Bess army to refill the ammo. It's my favorite buff ability.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/09/24 20:15:00


Post by: A Town Called Malus


 trexmeyer wrote:
 Argive wrote:
Im playing as the awekened currently.

I almost got order tied but the dwarves love me coz I keep fighting cult of pleasure so I amanged to broker a peace with them and trade and am about to get a defensive alliance to try and trick them into going to war with empire lol.

Necrofex collossus + vamp magic and gunnery wight are just soo good.. Its a shame they are just hands over heels better than rotting leviathans or terroghaist.

Will probably revisit Norsca again on my week off before moving onto stunties.


Rotting Leviathans are pretty good. Necrofex is definitely better in Noctilus's army, but in other ones I think it's more of a tossup. I ran through an Awakened campaign a while back where I only took 2-3 provinces and just dropped Pirate Coves all over. It was more fun than trying to paint the map.

In general Vampire Coast is a really good faction. My only actual complaint about their roster is that their mount options are pointless except as a way to increase the character's mass. They should really be 55-65 speed.

Also, Gunnery Wights are possibly the best ranged hero in game right now. I kept two in my Queen Bess army to refill the ammo. It's my favorite buff ability.


Yeah, Gunnery Wights are required. Thanks to them I've won countless sieges without having to even enter the city. Their ability to improve accuracy, which makes artillery laser-guided effectively, and replenish ammo is crazy useful.

Pop accuracy, fire until buff runs out, wait for recharge, repeat. Not a shot wasted.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/09/24 21:22:36


Post by: Argive


I had a big slugfest today vs 3 empire stacks.

Does anyone find empire AI spams luminarks & hellstorms? lol.

I neheked my way out of trouble.

I found a decent balance is to have like 4 leviathans and the rets in necrofexes.

Pop down drowned dead to create a blob/speedbump and when /if they close charge the leviatahns in and wreck face. They are tanky as hek but I think like 4-5 is all youd want. Easy to focus neheks and create a big blob.

The only downside is friendly fire. so gotta keep tabs on what the encros are firing at. I like to sprinkle 2 terroghieists in as well to go on flying general sniping missions/hit HVT in the rear like missle units and artilery..

Wish the depth guard was better than it is.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/09/24 23:19:05


Post by: trexmeyer


Depth Guard are good at eating low-tier/mid-tier infantry, but they need to be supported by some kind of meat shield. I would combo them with Zombie Mobs of the Polearm variety.

Honestly, the place they absolutely shined the most for me was in sieges vs Tomb Kings. I'd take out the towers and send them up the walls since they eat TK infantry.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/09/25 07:02:51


Post by: AllSeeingSkink


Gonna give TWW2 a crack for the first time in a couple of years. Is it worth getting the Grom DLC for playing an O&G vortex campaign?


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/09/25 07:50:30


Post by: Not Online!!!


AllSeeingSkink wrote:
Gonna give TWW2 a crack for the first time in a couple of years. Is it worth getting the Grom DLC for playing an O&G vortex campaign?


If you like goblins, cooking, and nice troll ladies, then yes.



Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Argive wrote:
I had a big slugfest today vs 3 empire stacks.

Does anyone find empire AI spams luminarks & hellstorms? lol.

I neheked my way out of trouble.

I found a decent balance is to have like 4 leviathans and the rets in necrofexes.

Pop down drowned dead to create a blob/speedbump and when /if they close charge the leviatahns in and wreck face. They are tanky as hek but I think like 4-5 is all youd want. Easy to focus neheks and create a big blob.

The only downside is friendly fire. so gotta keep tabs on what the encros are firing at. I like to sprinkle 2 terroghieists in as well to go on flying general sniping missions/hit HVT in the rear like missle units and artilery..

Wish the depth guard was better than it is.


Yes,...

As for the crabbies, the ones with guncrew ontop are actually one of the most cost effective units (provided you run normal battle difficulty) because they fire in melee.
Leviathans are kinda, disapointing, especially compared to the necros or smaller crabs.

Personally, i have 2 variant armies i run with Vampire coast, siege armies and Necro spam.

Siege armies i center around a vampire lore lord if possible, 2 carronades and 3 mortars aswell as 2 gunnery weights. The rest is gunnery mob and some melee mob in an 50/50 rate later on some depth guard and sireens.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/09/25 15:49:44


Post by: trexmeyer


AllSeeingSkink wrote:
Gonna give TWW2 a crack for the first time in a couple of years. Is it worth getting the Grom DLC for playing an O&G vortex campaign?


Yes. It adds faction wide buff mechanic via Grom's Cauldron (cooking). You start off with access to food items that give two buffs and that can progress to three. There are buffs for IIRC every unit type in the roster. Grom himself is a pretty good lord and buffs up regular Goblins (not Night Goblins) quite a bit. Also it unlocks a new hero caster that has access to Shadow magic as well as a couple of other units.

I haven't played as Eltharion, but I know he adds a bit to High Elves as well.

OG will snowball slower in Vortex due to no confederations, but Grom should still be a beast. If you're familiar with the game he's too strong to play on normal/easy.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I did a Wulfhart campaign out of curiosity. The heroes are interesting. The Waystalker ends up much stronger than normal Waystalkers and the Paladin is a tank. The Imperial Supplies feature is interesting.

The campaign left a bad taste in my mouth. Wulfhart is evil. He's a European colonizer expy wiping out the natives in a South America expy. I've played other evil factions, but none bothered me like he does. I think it's the combination of rampant racism against the Lizardmen and the fanatical belief that the Empire is somehow the pinnacle of civilization. Also with other evil characters you get it into expecting them to be evil. Chaos wants to end the world, Dark Elves are slavers, Vampire Counts want to dominate the Empire, Skaven are insane, Norsca wants to sack and pillage, etc. The Empire is supposed to at least pretend to be good...but then you spend the entire campaign wiping out the most ancient defender of civilization.

I think I have to play Nakai now just for redemption.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/09/29 08:02:37


Post by: trexmeyer


AllSeeingSkink wrote:
Gonna give TWW2 a crack for the first time in a couple of years. Is it worth getting the Grom DLC for playing an O&G vortex campaign?


I decided to give Grom a go on Vortex VH to see if it was as easy I expected. It's easier...assuming you do a little bit of cheese.

I opened by sacking Arachnos settlements until Grom was level 8-9.

Then I finished them off and the Dwarves.

Imrik declared war on me but his forces were strangely split into two partial stacks. I had enough gold to raise a second army of goblins so I attacked Imrik's starting province with Grom. My second army chain sacked his last settlement (where the vampires start) until that lord was about 18~. I didn't want to stop but the vampire rebels took the settlement and then TK rebels took it from them.

After that Grom took out the Wood Elves and the second army wiped out Numas.

Then the Last Defenders declared war on me. I started wiping them, allied with Clan Mors and together we wiped out the rest of the Lizardmen on the continent. I had to take out an Yvresse army that tried to invade my northern lands, but aside from that they haven't come.

Right now Grom has like 5-6 Big Spiders in his army and a third army has a few as well. I'm about to fill out a 19 stack with the Workshop Boy Night Goblin Shaman boss that gives spider buffs. That army with Maternal Instincts will be able to spawn around 100~ little Spiders in combat and since I have Arachnos + the Workshop Lord they'll have massive buffs.

Grom's food buffs are insanely OP along with his starting buffs. I think my goblins in his army have like 40% physical resistance with 40MD/40MA. The biggest thing is the food buff that gives +8 Public Order and +10% Income.

To make matters worse I have only fought one battle manually, Grom's quest. Everything else has been autoresolved. The ability to recruit rank 9 anything at the same speed or faster as locally is absurd.

Also somehow a rank 8 Black Orc Big Boss killed 1000+ TK skeletons in an autoresolve.




TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/09/29 10:46:15


Post by: Not Online!!!


Auto resolve is fething drunk half the time :
and grom makes gobos from 0-hero extremely fast.

THat said i blame the regular tech tree orks got for that aswell, considering the gobbo techs pretty much make them in any ork army something to be desired.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/09/29 12:05:56


Post by: Argive


I need to fight manualy vs empire halberd spam... coz they have bonus to large the ai thinks im going to wade into cc with them with my necro frexes.


Btw. Im having trouble recruiting heroes for my luthor harkon campaign. I build the buildings for gunnery wights but it does not increase the total pool :( anyone know if this is a feature or a bug?


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/09/29 15:43:58


Post by: Not Online!!!


 Argive wrote:
I need to fight manualy vs empire halberd spam... coz they have bonus to large the ai thinks im going to wade into cc with them with my necro frexes.


Btw. Im having trouble recruiting heroes for my luthor harkon campaign. I build the buildings for gunnery wights but it does not increase the total pool :( anyone know if this is a feature or a bug?


When did you start it?

You also can increase the limit via the pirate cove mechanic...


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/09/29 16:04:16


Post by: trexmeyer


Making Clan Moulder your vassal as Warriors of Chaos earns you the greatest voice line game.
Spoiler:


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/09/29 19:47:45


Post by: Not Online!!!


 trexmeyer wrote:
Making Clan Moulder your vassal as Warriors of Chaos earns you the greatest voice line game.
Spoiler:


Wait ,lol that is in the game:
?


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/09/29 20:00:07


Post by: Overread


Having read their patch change lists I can well believe that is in game without any mod alteration. The CA team (or at least their creative/content team) clearly love their warhammer.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/09/29 22:23:08


Post by: trexmeyer


Not Online!!! wrote:
 trexmeyer wrote:
Making Clan Moulder your vassal as Warriors of Chaos earns you the greatest voice line game.
Spoiler:


Wait ,lol that is in the game:
?


Yes, that is in the game. Along with the Skaven singing 'Underground, overground, Skaven are we'. I lost it when he said that.

I did finish Grom VH Vortex on turn 153. Could've gone faster, but Rictus confederated Clan Mors so I wiped them out of my jungle before going after Yvresse. That did end up being easy. I think I only called 3 Waaghs all game, one against Imrik, Last Defenders, and Eltharion. I never got my ingredient reward from either High Elf Waagh despite Eltharion being SR 10 when I declared against him so it might be bugged.

Vortex is kind of cheese as a non ritual faction just because even on VH you can time your invade while Chaos is going HAM as well. On the other hand, Grom VH Vortex was much easier than Khalida H Vortex so maybe I've gotten much better or Grom > TK. I do like the Vortex map a lot more. The ocean feels considerably larger.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/09/30 00:47:46


Post by: AllSeeingSkink


Thanks for the Grom tips.

How on earth do you get through campaigns so fast? It usually takes me ages to get up to turn 100, lol.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/09/30 02:26:32


Post by: trexmeyer


I only fought two manual battles. Honestly, I doubt I spent more than 3-5 minutes on the average turn that game.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/09/30 04:23:52


Post by: H.B.M.C.


I love explosive arrows on Gobbos.

Thanks to that recipe of Grom's, enemy units just tend to vanish under a hail of explosions.



TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/09/30 07:04:09


Post by: trexmeyer


 H.B.M.C. wrote:
I love explosive arrows on Gobbos.

Thanks to that recipe of Grom's, enemy units just tend to vanish under a hail of explosions.



And it stacks with the scrap upgrade. I think R9 Goblin Archers were over 50 missile damage. Not sure if that was with the High Elf Waaagh buff or not however.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/10/05 01:06:05


Post by: Argive


Not Online!!! wrote:
 Argive wrote:
I need to fight manualy vs empire halberd spam... coz they have bonus to large the ai thinks im going to wade into cc with them with my necro frexes.


Btw. Im having trouble recruiting heroes for my luthor harkon campaign. I build the buildings for gunnery wights but it does not increase the total pool :( anyone know if this is a feature or a bug?


When did you start it?

You also can increase the limit via the pirate cove mechanic...


Like last week? Dunno. Had a week off and was getting stoned while playing a lot of WHTW2 lol.
I ended up steam rolling through with Harkon even without more than 3 gunenry wights. Got bored of constantly fighting empire crap stacks so I just called it a day coz I was as good as won.

Finaly played as wood elves. Played as Durthu.
Took a couple tries because the initial campaign is tricky and doing sieges as wood elves takes a bit of know how. Not a fan of the campaign mechanic, felt very restrictive in terms of empire building. The look outs were a bit meh. Ended up taking an early strength 2 ranking and just steam rolled the diplomacy and care-bareing with all the order factions with barely any provinces.

SO what i have left now is the dwarves..


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/10/06 19:37:23


Post by: lord marcus


I need to get my pc upgraded. I can play warhammer 2 i just have cooling issues. its time for at least a new case and some fans.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/10/07 04:19:43


Post by: AllSeeingSkink


 lord marcus wrote:
I need to get my pc upgraded. I can play warhammer 2 i just have cooling issues. its time for at least a new case and some fans.


What's overheating? Are you overclocking it to run the game? Often it's better to upgrade the coolers than the case, and sometimes it's just the thermal interface material that goes bad and needs to be replaced. I've seen people pull off the side of their case and run desk fans into their overheating gaming computers when there was just some simple thing to fix that they missed.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/10/07 10:03:45


Post by: A Town Called Malus


AllSeeingSkink wrote:
 lord marcus wrote:
I need to get my pc upgraded. I can play warhammer 2 i just have cooling issues. its time for at least a new case and some fans.


What's overheating? Are you overclocking it to run the game? Often it's better to upgrade the coolers than the case, and sometimes it's just the thermal interface material that goes bad and needs to be replaced. I've seen people pull off the side of their case and run desk fans into their overheating gaming computers when there was just some simple thing to fix that they missed.


Hell, one time I had a laptop where the cooling fan broke (apparently a motherboard issue as replacing the fan didn't fix it).

Set it up with a table fan positioned underneath to blow upwards into it. Couldn't really tax it but made it useable, at least before I sent it into Dell as they had a trade in offer going to get a load of money off a new one (and the fan miraculously started working again like the week before I sent it in so I could say that it was working 100% ).


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/10/07 17:05:44


Post by: lord marcus


AllSeeingSkink wrote:
 lord marcus wrote:
I need to get my pc upgraded. I can play warhammer 2 i just have cooling issues. its time for at least a new case and some fans.


What's overheating? Are you overclocking it to run the game? Often it's better to upgrade the coolers than the case, and sometimes it's just the thermal interface material that goes bad and needs to be replaced. I've seen people pull off the side of their case and run desk fans into their overheating gaming computers when there was just some simple thing to fix that they missed.


Its my graphics card that overheats. I've got a noctua case fan and the GPU has a double fan on it.

Nope, not overclocking. After diagnosing it with my buddy who also works in IT, we think its that the case my rig is currently built with just doesn't have good enough airflow. Plan is to get a better case (current is an old as balls chinese knockoff of an Alienware case) and potentially replace any stock fans in it with more Noctua fans.



TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/10/08 03:02:34


Post by: AllSeeingSkink


 lord marcus wrote:
AllSeeingSkink wrote:
 lord marcus wrote:
I need to get my pc upgraded. I can play warhammer 2 i just have cooling issues. its time for at least a new case and some fans.


What's overheating? Are you overclocking it to run the game? Often it's better to upgrade the coolers than the case, and sometimes it's just the thermal interface material that goes bad and needs to be replaced. I've seen people pull off the side of their case and run desk fans into their overheating gaming computers when there was just some simple thing to fix that they missed.


Its my graphics card that overheats. I've got a noctua case fan and the GPU has a double fan on it.

Nope, not overclocking. After diagnosing it with my buddy who also works in IT, we think its that the case my rig is currently built with just doesn't have good enough airflow. Plan is to get a better case (current is an old as balls chinese knockoff of an Alienware case) and potentially replace any stock fans in it with more Noctua fans.



The easy way to check if it's the case is to take the side off the case and see what temperature it reaches under load when it's open to free air. The best cases aren't going to be much better than a cheap case with the side open And Noctua fans aren't likely to cool better, they tend to be geared for silence rather than cool running and will often make a case hotter if you just replace the cheap crappy high speed fans on a cheap case with the low speed Noctuas (and I say that as someone who owns about $250 of Noctua products )

It's usually silent cases (which tend to be designed without many openings, thick walls and heat retaining padding to reduce noise) or HTPC or slimline style cases (where everything is mounted super close together and there's no space for airflow) which tend to create problems rather than cheap cases.

Cheap cases are usually fine cooling wise with 1 or 2 case fans, assuming you aren't overclocking or running the bleeding edge of technology, and worst case scenario you just open the side panel or cut a hole for an extra fan.

I only bring it up because I'd hate to see someone waste money upgrading a case when the reason it's overheating is a fault with a component and it would be better spent upgrading the hardware inside, cases probably have the worst return-on-investment in terms of performance, nerds buy fancy cases more for aesthetics, build quality and silence, the cooling benefit is usually not great versus the cheap cases.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/10/09 05:50:52


Post by: AllSeeingSkink


So playing as Grom, is the idea to just keep buffing your regular common goblins and stick with them throughout the campaign?

I'm just 20 turns in and so far battles have been pretty easy: send in the gobbos with shields while the gobbos with arrows pound them down, while running Grom around the backline to deal with archers and crash into the back of the enemy's frontline wherever they look to be causing trouble.

But I imagine that's not a tactic that will work forever?


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/10/09 07:31:37


Post by: Not Online!!!


No , you'll want rocklobbaz and trollhag (s) eventually.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/10/09 10:52:59


Post by: H.B.M.C.


Most of my armies are:

Leader (sometimes fighty, sometimes magic).
Sub-Leader (sometimes fighty, sometimes magic).
Troll Hag (magic + all important unit regeneration - Orcs don't get much naturally, and the Hag gives you heaps!).
2 or so units of Stone Trolls (good against incoming missiles, and generally leadership isn't a problem).
3-4 units of Black Orcs to act as the front line.
6 units of Gobbo Archers upgraded.
4 Doom Divers, as they're amazing.
One big Spider or big rock thingy.

And I always have a recipe that includes "exploding arrows", as units vanish when they come under that level of firepower.



TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/10/09 18:33:13


Post by: AllSeeingSkink


Geeze, approaching turn 50 with Grom and not doing so well. I probably tried expanding too much, took the mountain holds that separate Bretonnia from the Empire and was starting to expand east when the Empire declared war on me from the north and High Elves started attacking from the west. Got rid of the high elves, but not before they wiped out one of my smaller armies and captured a decent chunk of my territory.

Playing the Orcs / Grom, is it best to go around razing rather than trying to occupy land? Seems like I overextended, but I don't feel like I'm extending further than other armies I've played (granted, I haven't played in the past couple of years).


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/10/09 18:36:40


Post by: Overread


I find if you've got multiple fronts than razing on one front helps because you get the fast cash injection you need during war, but at the same time you don't get the investment issues of having to try and armour cities and capture/build up on two fronts or more. In theory it also means if the AI is colonising your raised side its costing them more and should eat into their war coffers to continue to expand. Stalling and hopefully making them pause giving you a bit of a lull


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/10/09 18:55:06


Post by: Eumerin


TW: Warhammer 2 is free to play this weekend.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/10/09 19:14:04


Post by: Overread


If you've not tried it - TRY IT - its utterly fantastic!


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/10/09 19:20:02


Post by: Argive


AllSeeingSkink wrote:
Geeze, approaching turn 50 with Grom and not doing so well. I probably tried expanding too much, took the mountain holds that separate Bretonnia from the Empire and was starting to expand east when the Empire declared war on me from the north and High Elves started attacking from the west. Got rid of the high elves, but not before they wiped out one of my smaller armies and captured a decent chunk of my territory.

Playing the Orcs / Grom, is it best to go around razing rather than trying to occupy land? Seems like I overextended, but I don't feel like I'm extending further than other armies I've played (granted, I haven't played in the past couple of years).


The problem with gobbo spam and all other factions really that have to go up against Empire is the hellstorm rocket battery... Sadly AI always spams at least 3-4 in every empire army pretty early so if your army relies on any infantry you are screwed... so have to end up sacrifice fast big hitting units in order to remove those or play very cagey and really long it out.

It's not too bad in forests and such coz you can hide your infantry and then exhaust the ammo with fast single entitie units but chances are they will have hippo knights or other cav that can counter and greenskins dont really have easy access to fliers. .

For my grom campaign on vortex, I did a lot of fluffy balanced armies rather than spam idols or big spiders.
But against empire I would take the Big spiders idols and some gobbo launchers.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/10/10 04:24:59


Post by: trexmeyer


 Argive wrote:
AllSeeingSkink wrote:
Geeze, approaching turn 50 with Grom and not doing so well. I probably tried expanding too much, took the mountain holds that separate Bretonnia from the Empire and was starting to expand east when the Empire declared war on me from the north and High Elves started attacking from the west. Got rid of the high elves, but not before they wiped out one of my smaller armies and captured a decent chunk of my territory.

Playing the Orcs / Grom, is it best to go around razing rather than trying to occupy land? Seems like I overextended, but I don't feel like I'm extending further than other armies I've played (granted, I haven't played in the past couple of years).


The problem with gobbo spam and all other factions really that have to go up against Empire is the hellstorm rocket battery... Sadly AI always spams at least 3-4 in every empire army pretty early so if your army relies on any infantry you are screwed... so have to end up sacrifice fast big hitting units in order to remove those or play very cagey and really long it out.

It's not too bad in forests and such coz you can hide your infantry and then exhaust the ammo with fast single entitie units but chances are they will have hippo knights or other cav that can counter and greenskins dont really have easy access to fliers. .

For my grom campaign on vortex, I did a lot of fluffy balanced armies rather than spam idols or big spiders.
But against empire I would take the Big spiders idols and some gobbo launchers.


I'd have to pull up my Vortex campaign to double check, but I'm 99% sure I had artillery in only one army. I don't think it's worth it at all as Grom. Your Spiders can spawn spiderlings, your Trolls can be Unbreakable, your cavalry can get obscenely fast, and an Orc Shaman + a SEU Doomstack is more effective against pretty much everything.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/10/10 10:38:52


Post by: AllSeeingSkink


 trexmeyer wrote:
 Argive wrote:
AllSeeingSkink wrote:
Geeze, approaching turn 50 with Grom and not doing so well. I probably tried expanding too much, took the mountain holds that separate Bretonnia from the Empire and was starting to expand east when the Empire declared war on me from the north and High Elves started attacking from the west. Got rid of the high elves, but not before they wiped out one of my smaller armies and captured a decent chunk of my territory.

Playing the Orcs / Grom, is it best to go around razing rather than trying to occupy land? Seems like I overextended, but I don't feel like I'm extending further than other armies I've played (granted, I haven't played in the past couple of years).


The problem with gobbo spam and all other factions really that have to go up against Empire is the hellstorm rocket battery... Sadly AI always spams at least 3-4 in every empire army pretty early so if your army relies on any infantry you are screwed... so have to end up sacrifice fast big hitting units in order to remove those or play very cagey and really long it out.

It's not too bad in forests and such coz you can hide your infantry and then exhaust the ammo with fast single entitie units but chances are they will have hippo knights or other cav that can counter and greenskins dont really have easy access to fliers. .

For my grom campaign on vortex, I did a lot of fluffy balanced armies rather than spam idols or big spiders.
But against empire I would take the Big spiders idols and some gobbo launchers.


I'd have to pull up my Vortex campaign to double check, but I'm 99% sure I had artillery in only one army. I don't think it's worth it at all as Grom. Your Spiders can spawn spiderlings, your Trolls can be Unbreakable, your cavalry can get obscenely fast, and an Orc Shaman + a SEU Doomstack is more effective against pretty much everything.


What do you choose for with your Grom cavalry, Wolf Riders with spears or just go for the Boar Riders? As a table top Orc and Gobbo player I loved Wolf Chariots, but I can't make them work in TWW.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/10/10 14:21:59


Post by: Argive


AllSeeingSkink wrote:
 trexmeyer wrote:
 Argive wrote:
AllSeeingSkink wrote:
Geeze, approaching turn 50 with Grom and not doing so well. I probably tried expanding too much, took the mountain holds that separate Bretonnia from the Empire and was starting to expand east when the Empire declared war on me from the north and High Elves started attacking from the west. Got rid of the high elves, but not before they wiped out one of my smaller armies and captured a decent chunk of my territory.

Playing the Orcs / Grom, is it best to go around razing rather than trying to occupy land? Seems like I overextended, but I don't feel like I'm extending further than other armies I've played (granted, I haven't played in the past couple of years).


The problem with gobbo spam and all other factions really that have to go up against Empire is the hellstorm rocket battery... Sadly AI always spams at least 3-4 in every empire army pretty early so if your army relies on any infantry you are screwed... so have to end up sacrifice fast big hitting units in order to remove those or play very cagey and really long it out.

It's not too bad in forests and such coz you can hide your infantry and then exhaust the ammo with fast single entitie units but chances are they will have hippo knights or other cav that can counter and greenskins dont really have easy access to fliers. .

For my grom campaign on vortex, I did a lot of fluffy balanced armies rather than spam idols or big spiders.
But against empire I would take the Big spiders idols and some gobbo launchers.


I'd have to pull up my Vortex campaign to double check, but I'm 99% sure I had artillery in only one army. I don't think it's worth it at all as Grom. Your Spiders can spawn spiderlings, your Trolls can be Unbreakable, your cavalry can get obscenely fast, and an Orc Shaman + a SEU Doomstack is more effective against pretty much everything.


What do you choose for with your Grom cavalry, Wolf Riders with spears or just go for the Boar Riders? As a table top Orc and Gobbo player I loved Wolf Chariots, but I can't make them work in TWW.


It depends on the army. I think they might be legendary from confederation but i have generals that get bonuses to different things.

Tbh i mainly take the goblin launcher so i can fly the goblin manualy to do trick shots rather than it being effective. Catapults have more utility for sieges inmo. But flying a suicide goblin is pretty fun lol

And i usualy run at least 4 black ork units 2 infantry bonus and 2 large bonus coz i really like heavy infantry. I think on my last play through i only had one cheesy spider & idol "doomstack".

In my boar rider general im running 4× anti infantry and 4x anti large boar boys and the 4 black orks plus a couple spiders ans GQs.

I think the chariots are the same for all races. Really good early game but just dont cut the mustard as they require constant micro and cycle charging and are very vulnerable to canons/missles. Alao the path finding is not best in the game so getting chariots out of big blobs is a pain. I prefer the old skool boar chariots. Wolfs just dont pack enough punch.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/10/10 14:26:47


Post by: trexmeyer


I really only use dedicated cavalry with the two Workshop Boyz legendary lords.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/10/15 17:52:06


Post by: AllSeeingSkink


Does anyone use the scrap upgrades for units? I haven't really touched them, but noticed other Orc armies seem to be using them a lot.

Also, WOW! I can see why people complain the Orc confederation mechanic is a bit overpowered. I'm on turn 86 as Grom, was struggling with all the wars I was fighting, one of those wars was with Grimgor (sent Skarsnik down to capture 8 peaks and picked a fight with them). Just as they were closing in on me I managed to win a battle against Grimgor.

I went from 4 armies (2 of which were only half stacks, and another I only just started to defend Massif Orcal from HE attacks). Now I have 8 armies, and most of Grimgors were BO heavy, and Grimgor was holding so much territory that I'm still in positive income. I think it might be time to head to over to the High Elf island and smash some pointy ear skulls as I finally have the resources to do it now. Also picked up Wurrzag, Grimgor must have already confederated with him before I bashed him.




TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/10/15 18:15:14


Post by: Voss


AllSeeingSkink wrote:
Does anyone use the scrap upgrades for units? I haven't really touched them, but noticed other Orc armies seem to be using them a lot.


They're just straight up buffs. No reason not to use them.
There's quite a few anti-infantry and anti-large bonuses that just make units better.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/10/15 21:27:58


Post by: Argive


Voss wrote:
AllSeeingSkink wrote:
Does anyone use the scrap upgrades for units? I haven't really touched them, but noticed other Orc armies seem to be using them a lot.


They're just straight up buffs. No reason not to use them.
There's quite a few anti-infantry and anti-large bonuses that just make units better.


Straight up.

Scrap is bit of a limited resource early game and you need it to level up tech so bit scarce. Splashing it out on chaff goblins/boys maybe not good early game strategy. I rushed for the tech that gives you scrap every turn.
High tier units like BO though just straight up buff. I always run 4 BO in reserve. 2 with infantry bonus and 2 with anti large bonus to plug the hole in my line. Its a cool mechanic.

CA did orks good in this update. Feel much more fleshed out.
My only lament is that you are not requirered to plan tactically to move on ulthuan as you don't have to move your army to assult Tor Yveress and can just teleport there..


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/10/15 22:30:34


Post by: H.B.M.C.


You can do some nasty things with Scrap, Goblin Archers and Grom's cauldron.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/10/15 22:48:17


Post by: Argive


 H.B.M.C. wrote:
You can do some nasty things with Scrap, Goblin Archers and Grom's cauldron.


I didint have luck with this build against imrik in vortex
Overcoming elves was so hard coz of the massive range difference... Came across elff archer spam stack and just got rolled up while imrik plowed into my lines with some cav.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/10/16 04:08:09


Post by: H.B.M.C.


To be fair, I haven't fought Elves in a long time.

I'm playing Grom in a Vortex campaign, and Imrik was the first High Elf I fought, and I haven't had to fight them since (did try to make a beachhead on Ulthuan, but that didn't go well).

Have fought Dark Elves, but they didn't mass up their crossbox. There was one High Elf settlement, but I got pretty close to them and they didn't last long.

Haven't faced much ranged since then. I guess I'd just send up my heroes to waste their ammo.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/10/16 17:35:05


Post by: Eumerin


The Wood Elf DLC as been confirmed for December. For those who aren't aware, the contents of this update will vary based on what you own.

If you own Warhammer 2, but don't buy the DLC, then you get a new hero.

If you own Warhammer 2 and buy the new DLC, then you'll also get two Legendary Lords, and be able to play the Wood Elves in the campaign.

If you also own Warhammer 1, then it'll add the new Wood Elves to the Mortal Empires campaign.

And finally, if you also own Realm of the Wood Elves, you'll get an additional Legendary Lord.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/10/16 23:44:15


Post by: Voss


Out of curiosity, where did the news actually pop?
I did some digging around and news about it is obviously out in the wild now, but there's no official announcement that I can find.

I'd like to know just to know who to pay attention to in the future, as direct from CA seems a poor choice at the moment (all Troy, Troy, Troy on the main page)


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/10/16 23:51:33


Post by: Argive


Do we know who the other faction is ?

Im more intrigued with beastment

But doing a proper Wood elf campaign would be cool.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/10/17 00:38:35


Post by: nels1031


Voss wrote:
Out of curiosity, where did the news actually pop?
I did some digging around and news about it is obviously out in the wild now, but there's no official announcement that I can find.

It'd like to know just to know who to pay attention to in the future, as direct from CA seems a poor choice at the moment (all Troy, Troy, Troy on the main page)


Total War Facebook page:

We understand you've wanted more information on the upcoming WARHAMMER II DLC release - however, the working from home situation has made it more difficult for us to keep you as updated as we would have liked. We can now confirm that the DLC will be released in December and we will look to confirm an actual date with you a little closer to the time.
We understand the lack of information has been difficult but we didn't want to confirm a month until we were sure. Hopefully this will at least give you a month to look forward to.


14 Hours ago, sandwiched between 3K Furious Wild news and weirdly, a Shogun 2 battle release, previously a pre-order bonus.






TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/10/17 03:44:21


Post by: Eumerin


Yeah, I spotted it on Facebook. Oddly, there was no mention of it on the blog. The general details of the DLC have been known for months. The news right now is the release month announcement.

There is no other race in this DLC. It's purely a Wood Elf update.

Soeaking of which, Sega - CA's owner - is having a 60th anniversary sale right now, and pretty much every title by Sega or one of its subsidiaries is on sale. That includes all of the Total War stuff, including the Realm of the Wood Elves DLC.

General belief is that the Beastmen will get a rework in the third game, which is supposed to have a Chaos focus. I *think* this is supposed to be the last paid DLC for the second game.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/10/17 09:46:06


Post by: Overread


I think there's no blog mention because it was basically a community rep in Redit that commented on the release date as a way to appease loud fans in fan groups. Right now all it is is that they estimate December and haven't released any more info. Chances are the marketing info - blog posts, photos, details - will all come in November in a biuld up toward its release


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/10/17 13:19:51


Post by: Voss


Eumerin wrote:
Yeah, I spotted it on Facebook. Oddly, there was no mention of it on the blog. The general details of the DLC have been known for months. The news right now is the release month announcement.

There is no other race in this DLC. It's purely a Wood Elf update.

Soeaking of which, Sega - CA's owner - is having a 60th anniversary sale right now, and pretty much every title by Sega or one of its subsidiaries is on sale. That includes all of the Total War stuff, including the Realm of the Wood Elves DLC.

General belief is that the Beastmen will get a rework in the third game, which is supposed to have a Chaos focus. I *think* this is supposed to be the last paid DLC for the second game.


Maybe. I've seen people assert there is one more, but it may just be the preorder bonus for WH3 (like Norsca theoretically was for 2)

There used to be a proper roadmap for FLC/DLC releases, but I haven't seen it in ages.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/10/17 17:07:57


Post by: Eumerin


Voss wrote:


There used to be a proper roadmap for FLC/DLC releases, but I haven't seen it in ages.


There's an old image out there showing the planned FLC releases. Some of them are just "Legendary Lord", and the last couple of entries are just empty boxes without even that detail. However, there were five FLC on the list after Alith Anar. And we've had five free legendary lords (the last one is Imrik) since then.

I haven't seen anything with the DLC release schedule for the second game.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/10/20 06:08:57


Post by: trexmeyer


I've seen people claim that CA is 'uncomfortable with the fact WH2 is receiving the lion's share of attention and want to focus more on their inhouse IPs'. I'm not sure if it is receiving the most attention...but it does seem that way on r/totalwar.



TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/10/20 06:32:07


Post by: Not Online!!!


 trexmeyer wrote:
I've seen people claim that CA is 'uncomfortable with the fact WH2 is receiving the lion's share of attention and want to focus more on their inhouse IPs'. I'm not sure if it is receiving the most attention...but it does seem that way on r/totalwar.



The issue is, with their inhouse IP's, that they really went stagnant after Shogun 2 in terms of games mechanics.
Especially pre gunpowder dominance Possibilities suffer from the engine that they created and then modified in ETW...

There's also been a lot of dumbing down in regards to campaigns, with army limits and only an army with general can work curbing a lot of playstyles and strategies from the get go.
There's also atleast from the single player the issue of hidden combat modifiers associated with difficulty. Troy, is a victim of this, technically i'd would have one of the more interesting rock paper scissors systems for unit combat in place but as soon as you go higher then normal difficulty that goes out the window leading to the over dominance of Missile units you also can see in WHTW.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/10/20 09:15:31


Post by: Overread


I think the main worry for them is that one of their biggest earners is an IP they have to pay for and which could be removed if they fell out with GW at some point in the future. Or GW might come to the table and ask for more money to continue the licence - even if the game itself was made and Warhammer 3 was out the door and done.

In the end I'd be expecting Warhammer to be getting a lions share right now because the 3rd game should be in development now.



As for their in-house - I'd wager they should work of Medieval 3.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/10/20 09:40:08


Post by: Not Online!!!


hopefully with a better engine then the one in use now though, which is still attrocious for melee.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/10/20 15:07:46


Post by: Voss


 trexmeyer wrote:
I've seen people claim that CA is 'uncomfortable with the fact WH2 is receiving the lion's share of attention and want to focus more on their inhouse IPs'. I'm not sure if it is receiving the most attention...but it does seem that way on r/totalwar.



I could see Sony leaning on them for that.
Both for not liking the licensing fee to another company (when to someone with a spreadsheet it seems unnecessary) and for the extra entanglement.


Overread wrote:In the end I'd be expecting Warhammer to be getting a lions share right now because the 3rd game should be in development now.

?
Its been in development for quite a while now. If you go back far enough in their blog you can find updates on it, including motion capture for animations.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/10/20 17:19:06


Post by: Eumerin


Three Kingdoms is their best selling game to date. And it included a lot of new mechanics to shake things up. Some are working. Some aren't.

I think the decisions shown in 3K show that they're willing to try new thinga. The question is whether they can find the right mix of changes as they move forward.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/10/21 02:32:01


Post by: H.B.M.C.


I doubt that Creative Assembly are unhappy that one of their games is really really successful.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/10/21 04:19:05


Post by: trexmeyer


 H.B.M.C. wrote:
I doubt that Creative Assembly are unhappy that one of their games is really really successful.


Bioware specifically started new IPs despite the success of their Star Wars and Neverwinter Nights games for the sake of doing something inhouse. I could see them not being thrilled if SWTOR had overshadowed the ME and DA series.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/10/21 04:25:36


Post by: AllSeeingSkink


Will be good to see a WE update. I just started a game with them and they really suck. The amber system... I don't hate it in essence. But in practice it sucks hairy balls, having technology, buildings, military units, and campaign advancement competing for amber is just annoying in its current incarnation. Why on earth do Glade Riders cost amber?


 Overread wrote:
I think the main worry for them is that one of their biggest earners is an IP they have to pay for and which could be removed if they fell out with GW at some point in the future. Or GW might come to the table and ask for more money to continue the licence - even if the game itself was made and Warhammer 3 was out the door and done.

In the end I'd be expecting Warhammer to be getting a lions share right now because the 3rd game should be in development now.



As for their in-house - I'd wager they should work of Medieval 3.


I'm sure they have a licence for X number of games or some such, GW can't just turn around and ask for more money for games that are already released and they've agreed to in whatever way.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/10/21 04:59:03


Post by: Eumerin


 trexmeyer wrote:
 H.B.M.C. wrote:
I doubt that Creative Assembly are unhappy that one of their games is really really successful.


Bioware specifically started new IPs despite the success of their Star Wars and Neverwinter Nights games for the sake of doing something inhouse. I could see them not being thrilled if SWTOR had overshadowed the ME and DA series.


Bioware started doing licenses. Moving away from licenses was the change for them. For Creative Assembly, it's the opposite - they've done lots and lots of games that didn't require licenses. The Warhammer games are the only games that they've released to date that had licenses.


Also -

According to SteamDB, the highest total players ever playing Total War: Warhammer on Steam was just over 113,000. The sequel's high point was 84,920. The high point for Three Kingdoms was a little over 192,000.

Note that these are not total sales. They are the total number of people logged into Steam playing the game on a day to day basis. Needless to say, the numbers for Three Kingdoms are *dramatically* higher than those of the Warhammer games. In comparison, the totals for Attila (the previous major game) were just over 26,000.

There's one curiosity that caught my attention, though. The numbers for the first Warhammer game and the Three Kingdoms game are from the game launch, with smaller spikes when the DLC are released. But the number for Warhammer 2 is from either May or June of this year. The Warden and the Paunch came out at that time, and it looks like that DLC generated a bigger surge of interest in Warhammer 2 than the initial game launch did.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/10/21 05:57:36


Post by: AllSeeingSkink


Eumerin wrote:
According to SteamDB, the highest total players ever playing Total War: Warhammer on Steam was just over 113,000. The sequel's high point was 84,920. The high point for Three Kingdoms was a little over 192,000.


Look at the chart though. Three Kingdoms had a spike of 192,000 on day 1 of launch, was below 30k at the end of June and other than some small bumps has been puttering along below 15k.

TWW2 never had that big spike, rather it's been sitting between 15 and 40k for three years solid, sitting about 25k for the entirety of the past year. Right now, Three Kingdoms has less than half the players of TWW2.

It suggests to me that the Warhammer series has a bigger base, but the launch of TWW2 was poor for whatever reason, even TWW1 had a higher spike at launch.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/10/21 07:10:25


Post by: Eumerin


I'm not sure why you think that TWW2 didn't have spikes. It hit numbers just under 75K at launch, and then quickly dropped to 25K. It bumped up again to just over 41K not long after (probably for the release of Mortal Empires), and then came down to just under 16K. Then there are bumps ever several months up to the 40K range - probably DLC releases - before it slides back down again. The thing to remember is that TWW2 is an unusual game. It's a combination of two games - something that CA hasn't done before. So it draws attention from a different kind of crowd than Three Kingdoms does.

All three games had spikes that were most likely due to DLC. But the spikes for the other games were significantly smaller. It's only TWW2 that got the big bumps. The bumps for TWW1 were noticeably lower than the bumps for TWW2.

In any case, the "roughly 200,000 in sales" for Three Kingdoms is what probably interests CA the most. It had double the base game sales of Warhammer 2. Yes, the Three Kingdoms bumps are lower. But those likely represent people playing the new DLC. If 100K more people pay launch price retail for Three Kingdoms, but 45K fewer buy the much less expensive DLC (as suggested by the bumps when DLC are released), then Three Kingdoms still comes out ahead as a retail product. CA will likely look at that when trying to figure out what to work on next, while simultaneously trying to figure out how to ensure that the DLCs for the next game get interest levels similar to that of Warhammer 2.



TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/10/21 09:09:27


Post by: AllSeeingSkink


Eumerin wrote:
I'm not sure why you think that TWW2 didn't have spikes.
I never said it didn't have spike, I looked at the graph to come up with my numbers so obviously I saw the spikes, what I said was it "never had that big spike", meaning it dropped from 75k to 25k (66% drop) where Three Kingdoms dropped from 192k to below 15k (92% drop).

It had double the base game sales of Warhammer 2.
Except you can't extrapolate that from the big launch spike. All we can say is that Three Kingdoms launched harder, but given TWW2 has remained consistently higher that TK for its entire 3 year life suggests that either people who bought it play more, or more people bought it but just not on launch day. I don't know as much about TK, but I think there's a good argument for the latter for TWW2. Several people I know waited a month or two to buy it, because for a Warhammer player it didn't seem like great value at launch with only a few factions and it initially didn't carry over the factions from TWW1.

I think a lot of people bought TWW2 in the few months after it launched at a price not far off the launch price, hence why it maybe didn't have that big of an initial spike but rather has remained consistently high for 3 years in a row.

I'm sure a big part of the reason Three Kingdoms had such a successful launch was people being introduced to the TW franchise via Warhmmer.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/10/21 09:47:16


Post by: Overread


When Warhammer 2 came out there was some controversy around Norsca who basically were added at the end of the Warhammer 1 cycle as a faction not originally planned for. CA also did different things with how they operated. However those different things basically broke the game porting system between the two games. So CA couldn't add them to Warhammer 2.

In fact they had to go back and rebuild Norsca from the ground up to make them work in Warhammer 2. It was a mistake on their part and segments of the community got a bit hostile about it. That and this was the first time CA had done the whole idea of one game expanding into the next.


I'd also say the other big bonus for Warhammer is a total lack of competition. Whilst sci-fi RTS/strategy has the monster that is Starcraf 2, there basically isn't any other fantasy real time strategy game on the market at present and there hasn't been one for quite a long time. With RTS being basically ignored right now, Warhammer Total War has the market for that almost totally to itself.


Three Kingdoms in contrast has a big asian popularity base, but that market also has a lot of other games competing in the same bracket. Koei makes several strategy type games that have steady come to the west and I'd wager within the Asian market there's a lot more that we never see. So Three Kingdoms is impressive, but at the same time it does have competition in its biggest market area. That would likely explain the big initial sale but then the quicker fall off in active players. They've got other games they can get a Three Kingdoms fix from - whilst for fantasy strategy in real time battles you're either looking at older games or Warhammer 2/1


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/10/21 09:53:01


Post by: Not Online!!!


three kingdoms, whilest it inovated aswell overall also has some of the most restrictive unit to general tie in for armies that put off me atleast.

also it still has the blobbing issue due to the engine limitation.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/10/21 10:34:01


Post by: AllSeeingSkink


 Overread wrote:
When Warhammer 2 came out there was some controversy around Norsca who basically were added at the end of the Warhammer 1 cycle as a faction not originally planned for. CA also did different things with how they operated. However those different things basically broke the game porting system between the two games. So CA couldn't add them to Warhammer 2.

In fact they had to go back and rebuild Norsca from the ground up to make them work in Warhammer 2. It was a mistake on their part and segments of the community got a bit hostile about it. That and this was the first time CA had done the whole idea of one game expanding into the next.


Ah yes, I remember now. I remembered there were some issues but had forgotten the specifics. Wasn't it something like they planned to import Norsca straight into TWW2, but the team working on Norsca wasn't communicating with the team working on TWW2, and too late they realised they'd done it in a way it wouldn't port straight in?

But yeah, I do remember there were reasons people weren't jumping on it immediately.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/10/21 17:55:12


Post by: Eumerin


Pretty much.

I don't think the Norsca issue kept people ftom jumping in, though. Norsca was a completely new army competing with four armies that already had established fan bases. Rather, I suspect that the big issue was that Mortal Empires - one of the big draws of the game - wasn't available for the first few weeks after release.



TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/10/25 01:41:47


Post by: lord marcus


Eumerin wrote:
Three Kingdoms is their best selling game to date. And it included a lot of new mechanics to shake things up. Some are working. Some aren't.

I think the decisions shown in 3K show that they're willing to try new thinga. The question is whether they can find the right mix of changes as they move forward.


if they do the same retinue system with small ass armies in a potential Medieval total war 3 i will be annoyed


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/10/25 05:25:21


Post by: Eumerin


 lord marcus wrote:
Eumerin wrote:
Three Kingdoms is their best selling game to date. And it included a lot of new mechanics to shake things up. Some are working. Some aren't.

I think the decisions shown in 3K show that they're willing to try new thinga. The question is whether they can find the right mix of changes as they move forward.


if they do the same retinue system with small ass armies in a potential Medieval total war 3 i will be annoyed


It recognized a long-standing issue - namely, that you can only run around with huge super-stacks of armies. The problem is that it didn't really fix the issue. You still have huge super-stacks with 21 units (including generals). It's just that now the stack is composed of three groups of 7 instead of one large group of 21.

Despite your claim, it is slightly superior to the previous system, since it allows you to detach half a dozen units (plus their general) and stick them somewhere important. This can be useful if you need to leave someone in a spot where they can keep an eye on the border. That's not really cost-effective under the previous games since the cost increase for each additional general was a lot more dramatic (to keep the number of super-stacks low). The original solution was to merely recruit a few units (without a general), and add them to whichever garrison you wanted to fortify. Giving each individual general a smaller army is a compromise solution between the old system and the existing one before 3K was released. But it still only ends up being an imperfect solution since any army that isn't a full-size stack will likely end up getting steam-rolled.

Also, if one of your generals ends up being an enemy agent, things don't turn out as badly if he takes his army stack and joins the enemy.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/10/25 10:15:41


Post by: Overread


The core issue is that having your army in one place and using that army to attack an enemy is typically the best way to win most wars. At least in computer games where we typically have a much simplified system of play and a visually smaller area of combat and objectives. Geographically most key targets are within a small travelling area so keeping your army contained to a smaller area means when they hit they hit hard.


The real counter is to have maps like the Mortal Empires map, split between perhaps only 4 or so factions. Ergo where the you then have regions that can raise armies on their own and the travelling time between regions is much greater. Then you'd have more potential to have your armies split and to hit different regions because if you pooled all in one place you would leave yourself open to attack.

With a bigger area to patrol smaller armed forces conducting strikes starts to have more impact because now they can get in - do their work and not risk being hit by a main army. You can cut an opposing faction to bits with a thousand little cuts at outlying territories.


Of course this kind of game is far more involved in terms of complexity at dealing with one opponent, let alone more. So it wouldn't work well with your standard TW game - you'd have so much visual space you'd easily get overwhelmed.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/10/25 16:27:03


Post by: Eumerin


There's another issue in play, and that's the current system of bumping up your army costs for every general that you have. Having a few generals with minimal-strength armies is more expensive than running a single general with a full-size stack. Three Kingdoms got around that by putting the maximum army size for a single general at six (plus the general). That made having that extra general that you wanted to leave somewhere else more financially practical.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/10/25 17:23:00


Post by: Argive


I really liked the Rome 1 system. Still play that game very often.

The downside to having stacks not led by a character is the leadership nerf which really matters when flanking and rear charges mattered.
Also, 4 unit of phalanx could hold a city street against 2 full armies


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/10/26 01:24:48


Post by: Eumerin


 Argive wrote:
I really liked the Rome 1 system. Still play that game very often.

The downside to having stacks not led by a character is the leadership nerf which really matters when flanking and rear charges mattered.
Also, 4 unit of phalanx could hold a city street against 2 full armies


Small stacks are typically used as a mobile defense in the hinterlands of your empire against opportunistic opponents. Usually they're present to back up a local garrison. As an example, if you're running the Empire in Total War: Warhammer, you might have your army clustered against one opponent, only to have a group of orcs spawn in your rear areas (which happens often enough; random groups of beastmen often do the same), halfway across the map. There aren't that many orcs in the group. But there are enough to take out the garrisons in your settlements. If you could recruit a few units and leave them in a mini-stack in your backfield, then you could react to the orcs without having to pull a lord off of the front lines to send him back (and you'd likely lose a settlement or two before your stack arrived anyway). And the handful of units would likely be enough to bolster the defense of the local garrison, causing the orcs to reroute into a rival's territory, or maybe even wipe out the orcs outright.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/10/26 04:34:01


Post by: Argive


Eumerin wrote:
 Argive wrote:
I really liked the Rome 1 system. Still play that game very often.

The downside to having stacks not led by a character is the leadership nerf which really matters when flanking and rear charges mattered.
Also, 4 unit of phalanx could hold a city street against 2 full armies


Small stacks are typically used as a mobile defense in the hinterlands of your empire against opportunistic opponents. Usually they're present to back up a local garrison. As an example, if you're running the Empire in Total War: Warhammer, you might have your army clustered against one opponent, only to have a group of orcs spawn in your rear areas (which happens often enough; random groups of beastmen often do the same), halfway across the map. There aren't that many orcs in the group. But there are enough to take out the garrisons in your settlements. If you could recruit a few units and leave them in a mini-stack in your backfield, then you could react to the orcs without having to pull a lord off of the front lines to send him back (and you'd likely lose a settlement or two before your stack arrived anyway). And the handful of units would likely be enough to bolster the defense of the local garrison, causing the orcs to reroute into a rival's territory, or maybe even wipe out the orcs outright.


It depends if you have to pay supply lines % upkeep penalty.
Wish you could garrison units without generals


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/10/26 07:32:21


Post by: Not Online!!!


 Argive wrote:
Eumerin wrote:
 Argive wrote:
I really liked the Rome 1 system. Still play that game very often.

The downside to having stacks not led by a character is the leadership nerf which really matters when flanking and rear charges mattered.
Also, 4 unit of phalanx could hold a city street against 2 full armies


Small stacks are typically used as a mobile defense in the hinterlands of your empire against opportunistic opponents. Usually they're present to back up a local garrison. As an example, if you're running the Empire in Total War: Warhammer, you might have your army clustered against one opponent, only to have a group of orcs spawn in your rear areas (which happens often enough; random groups of beastmen often do the same), halfway across the map. There aren't that many orcs in the group. But there are enough to take out the garrisons in your settlements. If you could recruit a few units and leave them in a mini-stack in your backfield, then you could react to the orcs without having to pull a lord off of the front lines to send him back (and you'd likely lose a settlement or two before your stack arrived anyway). And the handful of units would likely be enough to bolster the defense of the local garrison, causing the orcs to reroute into a rival's territory, or maybe even wipe out the orcs outright.


It depends if you have to pay supply lines % upkeep penalty.
Wish you could garrison units without generals

Medieval two had that.
Personally i'd have likes a medieval 2 with province System of etw including that economy and decentral nature...


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/10/26 09:27:44


Post by: Overread


Part of the issue is that garrisons need bolstering with an army to survive a proper army attack. They give you an edge in combat, but if you don't have an army there they aren't going to hold it off. In fact they only really work against very small roaming mobs (which get free units every turn they are not killed off so quickly become a full army).


I actually rather like Knights of Honour's system whereby each regional settlement you choose how it develops and builds up and can hold a halfsize garrison/army. Meanwhile the area map has several smaller settlements which have no defences but contribute to the resources the region generates. The enemy can then attack each resource point mini settlement which eats up time as they raid it. Raiding complete its destroyed for a period of time. It's rather like Mount and Blade in that the smaller settlements basically let you attack and raid the resources of a region without taking on a castle.

So raiding armies have a threat level without having to be full armies. TW's system of just one regional site means that you sort of have to have full armies to be any threat.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/11/19 16:30:06


Post by: nels1031


New DLC:

Never really into either faction, but I may give Throt a test drive.

Also, ZOATS!!!!

This Lords Pack for Total War: WARHAMMER II introduces two new Legendary lords for the Skaven and the Wood Elves. Each leads their own faction and features new characters, units, unique gameplay mechanics and narrative objectives.

The wild energies of the Great Vortex have torn a rift in the Dreaming Woods. Could this form the site of a Daemonic invasion? Sensing great peril, Queen Ariel of Athel Loren dispatches her trusted emissaries, the Sisters of Twilight, to prepare the way for a ritual of closure.

Catching wind of Ariel’s plan, Throt the Unclean scents opportunity. If he can defeat the Sisters and capture the Elven queen while she is vulnerable, perhaps he can harness her essence and cure the eternal pangs of starvation caused by his Warpstone-infused metabolism…
Legendary lords

Wood Elves: The Sisters of Twilight

Once a single being, divided into siblings by The Weave, Naestra and Arahan are two sides of the same coin. They work together in the service of queen Ariel, marshalling the woodland warriors at her command, and cannot be slain unless both fall in battle. The Twilight Sisters must prepare the glade for Ariel’s arrival and protect her as she performs the ritual.



Forge of Daith:

Daith, the master smith of Vaul’s Anvil, will forge and upgrade unique items for the Sister of Twilight. These items are crafted through incidents and dilemmas which appear through the course of a Sisters of Twilight campaign.

Units:

Ariel: The Queen of Athel Loren is recruitable as a Legendary Hero. She is a powerful spellcaster who is more than capable in melee combat too
Spellweaver: Spellcaster Lord who can be recruited to wield the Lores of Life/Beasts/Shadow/Dark/High magic
Zoats: Powerful Monstrous Beasts who have access to bound Lore of Life spells
Great Stag Knights: heavy Wood Elf cavalry used to penetrate infantry lines and decimate lighter cavalry
Bladesingers: Elite, sword-wielding Wardancers


Skaven: Throt the Unclean

An eternal hunger gnaws at Throt, the Master Mutator of Clan Moulder. A lifetime of auto-experimentation has made him powerful, but his vastly enhanced metabolism means he must feed constantly to maintain himself. He is hell-bent on reducing the Wood Elf queen to a magical pulp, which he will consume to satiate himself at long last.



The Flesh Laboratory:

Moulding muscle and bone like living clay, Throt can use his Flesh Laboratory to fashion hideous new abominations for the battlefield. Numerous augmentations can be stacked to make existing units perform in horrifying new ways, but flesh can only bear so much torment before the subject becomes unstable. Even such aberrations have a use though, as they can be rendered down for valuable materials. More Growth Juice for the vats, Yes-yes!

Units:

Ghoritch: A former general of Archaon the Everchosen, once ignored his commander’s orders and was sent to Hell Pit as punishment. There Throt transplanted his brain into the body of a Rat Ogre, creating an aberration of incredible speed, strength and intelligence. Ghoritch is recruitable as a Legendary Hero.
Packmaster: This Hero unit performs a support role with AoE and targeted buffs, summons Wolf Rats to the thick of battle, and may be mounted on a Brood Horror
Wolf Rats: Highly mobile pack-beasts which come in poisonous and armour-piercing varieties
Mutant Rat Ogre: a large single-entity monster adept at brawling.
Brood Horror: A huge, fast-moving monster adept at punching through infantry lines. Can also be chosen as a mount for Throt the Unclean and Packmaster Heroes.


FAQ :

The Twisted & The Twilight is the latest Legendary Lords Pack for Total War: WARHAMMER II, and introduces two rival Legendary Lords from the world of Warhammer Fantasy Battles, each with their own factions, objectives, mechanics, units and playstyle, for use in both the Eye of the Vortex and Mortal Empires campaigns as well as custom and multiplayer battles.

Throt the Unclean, Master Mutator of Clan Moulder, has grown ravenously hungry following a lifetime of mutating experiments, believing that consuming the magic of Ariel, Queen of the Wood Elves, can save him from his eternal starvation. He is opposed by the Sisters of Twilight, Elven twins who were once a single being before being split into two bodies by the Weave. Together they must complete their mission to prepare the glade for Ariel’s ritual, which will heal the rift in the world.

The Twisted & The Twilight includes:

Two unique Legendary Lords leading their own factions:
Throt the Unclean, Master Mutator of Clan Moulder and one of the nine Lords of Hell Pit
The Sisters of Twilight Naestra and Arahan, Emissaries of Queen Ariel
Powerful new units and Heroes for both the Skaven and the Wood Elves, including:
Brood Horrors, Mutant Rat Ogres, Packmasters, Wolf Rats, and the terrifying Ghoritch for the Skaven
Zoats, Great Stag Knights, Bladesingers, Spellweavers, and Queen Ariel of Athel Loren herself for the Wood Elves
An Old World Update for the Wood Elves
For full details on The Twisted & The Twilight, including the full unit rosters for both Legendary Lords, head over to the Steam page to read more as well as get 10% off the launch price if you pre-order.

FAQ
WHEN WILL THE TWISTED & THE TWILIGHT BE RELEASED?
The Twisted & The Twilight will be released on the 3rd of December 2020.

IS THERE A PRE-PURCHASE DISCOUNT?
You’ll get a 10% discount if you pre-purchase The Twisted & The Twilight on Steam before release.

DO I NEED TO START A NEW CAMPAIGN?
If you want to make the most of the recent plethora of changes then yes, we’d advise that you do start a new campaign.

CAN I KEEP MY MODS?
We advise that you remove all mods until their respective creators have updated them in alignment with the update.

STEAM IS NOT INSTALLING THE DLC OR THE FREE-LC – WHAT’S HAPPENING?
Be patient. If there’s an issue with the DLC, we will communicate this via our official social channels. If you don’t see anything there, you should clear your cache and restart Steam.

WILL THE NEW LEGENDARY LORDS BE AVAILABLE IN BOTH THE EYE OF THE VORTEX AND MORTAL EMPIRES CAMPAIGN?
Yes, The Twisted & The Twilight will be available to play in both the Eye of the Vortex and Mortal Empires Campaign, and can also be used in campaign, custom, and battle modes.

WHAT NEW UNITS WILL BE AVAILABLE IN THE TWISTED & THE TWILIGHT?
The Twisted & The Twilight introduces the following new units for the Skaven: Ghoritch (Legendary Hero), Brood Horrors, Mutant Rat Ogres, Packmasters, and Wolf Rats.

It also includes the following new units for the Wood Elves: Ariel (Legendary Hero), Zoats, Great Stag Knights, Bladesingers, and Spellweavers.

WHAT NEW MECHANICS WILL THROT THE UNCLEAN BRING TO THE TWISTED & THE TWILIGHT?
The new campaign mechanic for Throt the Unclean is The Flesh Laboratory.

When playing as Throt the Unclean, you gain access to his personal Flesh Laboratory. Here you can grow new monsters or augment existing ones to create new horrific abominations.

Shape and customise your units with augments that can be stacked to create different combinations of effects
Augmenting a unit too much can make them unstable and lead them to slowly mutate, gaining negative traits
Units can be “recycled” for raw materials, so even defective units still have a purpose
Recycled units can also be replaced by monsters grown in the Growth Vat
The more Growth Juice in the Growth Vat, the better the quality of monster that comes out
WHAT NEW MECHANICS WILL THE SISTERS OF TWILIGHT BRING TO THE TWISTED & THE TWILIGHT?
The new campaign mechanic for the Sisters of Twilight is The Forge of Daith.

During a Sisters of Twilight campaign, the Sisters will gain a series of incidents and dilemmas that will grant them access to unique items crafted by Daith, the master smith of Vaul’s Anvil.

These dilemmas will enable the creation of new items or the upgrade of existing items made by Daith.

WHAT’S THE FREE CONTENT THAT WILL BE RELEASED ALONGSIDE THE DLC?
The Twisted & The Twilight will be accompanied by the release of the Skaven Chieftain Hero and the malevolent Legendary Lord Drycha – more information will be released soon.

WHAT’S IN THE FREE OLD WORLD UPDATE THAT WILL BE RELEASED ALONGSIDE THE DLC?
The Twisted & The Twilight will be released alongside an update of the Wood Elves faction. This includes:

AMBER AND TECHNOLOGY REWORK

Amber is no longer required for units or buildings, and all technologies that previously cost Amber have had the cost removed and been reworked
Eight new technologies have been added – these are the only things that will now cost Amber
Amber is no longer gained from controlling territory, and is instead awarded for healing Forests
HEALING THE FORESTS

In Mortal Empires, the Wood Elves still need to heal Athel Loren and restore the Oak of Ages. However, to do so they now need to travel the world and heal special Forest regions spread around the map. Each healed Forest will provide unique bonuses
A Forest’s health can be built up over time through various actions, such by securing its borders and building certain buildings. Once sufficiently restored, a Ritual can be performed to permanently heal the Forest
Every Forest also has unique Forest Encounters – interactable markers that provide narrative choices and let the player shape how they heal the Forest
As part of this system, new regions have been added to the campaign – four to Mortal Empires, and two to Vortex – giving the Wood Elves a presence on every part of the map
TRAVELLING THE DEEPROOTS

Wood Elves can now instantly transport their armies between Forest regions using the new Travel Deeproots ability (this ability comes with a cooldown)
WHEN WILL THE FREE CONTENT BE AVAILABLE?
On the release day of The Twisted & The Twilight – the 3rd of December 2020.

WILL THE TWISTED & THE TWILIGHT BE RELEASED ON MACOS AND LINUX?
This will be coming shortly after the release of The Twisted & The Twilight – stay tuned!



TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/11/19 16:47:29


Post by: Overread


ZOATS?!!!:!:

Bladesingers, deer cavalry, wolf rats, brood horrors - the Everqueen and the twins - and more - this pack is so very much full of awesome things!


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/11/19 17:43:41


Post by: Voss


Yeah. Somebody is taking cues from the studio's zoat kick. Wonder what it portends.

Legendary heroes are a surprise. I suspect we'll see more of those in WH3.

Throt is not a surprise. (though that he gets a mount is)

Drycha as the FLC lord.

Good riddance to Amber. The forest encounters sound interesting.

Curious where the new regions will go, and if hey will be a bit iffy and poorly justified insertions of WE areas in Naggaroth and Lustria.

---
Also, apparently this is not the last DLC.
Confirmed by the CA PR person (CA_Grace) here: https://www.reddit.com/r/totalwar/comments/jx58ti/sick_of_the_skaven/gcu92bt/?context=3

---
Oh, also, the Everchosen tournament is streaming the 28th/29th. They will almost certainly show off some of the new stuff, probably in an exhibition match between rounds of the tournament.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/11/19 18:44:55


Post by: A Town Called Malus


Seems almost a bit backwards to me to have the Sisters as the Legendary Lords and Ariel as the Hero.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/11/19 19:25:19


Post by: nels1031


 A Town Called Malus wrote:
Seems almost a bit backwards to me to have the Sisters as the Legendary Lords and Ariel as the Hero.


Ya, Lizardmen have that issue with Kroak, as well. Weird design choice.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/11/19 20:19:22


Post by: Kanluwen


With Wood Elves it works a bit easier, since the Sisters' power is independent of the forest.

As the forest breaks, Ariel (and Orion) break too.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/11/19 21:56:02


Post by: Voss


Its also largely a benefit. A dedicated hero caster can 100% focus on being ridiculous with magic, while a pure magic lord tends to fall behind trying to get the utility and army skills.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/11/19 22:07:26


Post by: H.B.M.C.


I like the idea of Ariel as a hero. Means she can go around healing the forest or whatever without having to be an army general.

And Zoats!!!


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/11/19 22:15:49


Post by: nels1031


Voss wrote:

---
Also, apparently this is not the last DLC.
Confirmed by the CA PR person (CA_Grace) here: https://www.reddit.com/r/totalwar/comments/jx58ti/sick_of_the_skaven/gcu92bt/?context=3


That's probably the most exciting thing to me. Holding out hope for some Chaos (both factions) love or Ogre Kingdoms.



TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/11/19 22:19:21


Post by: Overread


It wouldn't surprise me if CA had perhaps wound up with a delay on their next big game project as a result of Corona; so could be shifting more content in Warhammer 2 to make up for it


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/11/19 22:21:07


Post by: H.B.M.C.


I'm hoping we get a Dwarf LL as part of the final DLC. Bring the Dawi into the Vortex campaign (Spine of Sotek, with Grimm Burlocksson (or however you spell that) as their leader).

 nels1031 wrote:
That's probably the most exciting thing to me. Holding out hope for some Chaos (both factions) love or Ogre Kingdoms.
Ogres? Nah, man. They're going to be a TWW3 core race. Almost guaranteed.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/11/19 22:23:27


Post by: nels1031


Ya, its a pipe dream.

It will probably be another Lizardmen or High Elf character...


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/11/19 22:30:50


Post by: H.B.M.C.


Aren't Dark Elves missing a LL compared to the others?


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/11/19 22:35:12


Post by: Argive


Noice.
Looking forward to this.

I hope roided up rat ogre things mean rat ogres will get better! I like my monstrous infantry and monster units.

Currently they just suck and running a ratling gun/warplock + arty spam and corner camping is too good to pass up.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/11/19 22:44:29


Post by: A Town Called Malus


 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Aren't Dark Elves missing a LL compared to the others?


Only one that would really fit would be Rakarth as a Beastmaster lord, probably make him the legendary lord of Karond Kar (and with a unique building in Clar Karond)?

Legendary Hero wise I'd give Malekith Kouran (captain of the Black Guard so halberd master), Hellebron gets Tullaris (captain of the Har Ganeth Executioners so great weapon master), Morathi gets Shadowblade (assassin obviously), and Malus could either get his mother Eldire as a sorceress or Hauclir (the only one of his retainers to survive the events of the novels, as far as I can remember) as some form of assassin/master hybrid thing to represent his roguishness?


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/11/19 22:59:52


Post by: Voss


 Overread wrote:
It wouldn't surprise me if CA had perhaps wound up with a delay on their next big game project as a result of Corona; so could be shifting more content in Warhammer 2 to make up for it


Currently it sounds like things were delayed but not changed. Someone mentioned in passing that they would have at least formally announced WH3 pre... well, pre 2020 playing out.

Most likely prospect for the final DLC is Dark Elves (Bringing them to 6 LLs like the other base WH2 factions) vs ? <hopefully Beastmen>

There are already beast herds that are part of the early game in Naggaroth, so it'd be real easy to add a LL there, fill the holes in the roster and do a pass at updating their mechanics.

Definitely not ogres.. they said long ago that there would be no more 'new faction' DLC for WH2

-----
Early playthrough already with Orion (but only old stuff, no new units, just the overhaul changes):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZtM6mICilVI


Oh: major change- campaign start has a Chaos Invasion toggle. You can ramp the difficult up or... turn it off.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/11/21 16:11:20


Post by: Voss


A few other things pop up in that video:

The dilemmas and special forest encounters are rather interesting, if sometimes a little repetitive. They give you something to do even while playing defensively, and are key to building forest health.

The deep roots teleportation is pretty impressive.
There is a forest added to lustria and Naggaroth (spawning pools and the witch? Wood). Also a forest to the west of The dwarven capital and the griffin wood, in the eastern empire, above the VC provinces, I believe.
Also the gaean vale on ulthuan.

In addition to the chaos invasion toggle, there's another quality of life improvement: the ability to abandon settlements.

This is global, not just WE.

Another global adjustment: missiles are no longer partially blocked when shooting from forests (for a short distance), but still provide some blocking cover when shooting into units in forests.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/11/24 20:15:38


Post by: trexmeyer


I've seen some complaints about the Anvil of Daith elsewhere and I wanted to point about some things in case anyone has similar views.

1) Some people have brought up customizable weapons/armor/etc. It's not happening unless they modify the game engine. Weapons/Armor/Enchanted Items/Banners/Etc are all treated as Ancillaries that are restricted to specific slots. The buffs on them are static. Each variation or permutation requires a new item to be stored in the database. This includes additional localization text for the item name and details.

The number of items you'd have to have stored to cover all permutations would be absurd. The only way this is changing is if they set up a slot system for ancillaries.

2) A lot of the big fancy new mechanics are just older tweaked mechanics with a new UI.

TK/Dwarf crafting are just extensions of the Ritual system. I'm 99% sure that Grom's Cauldron is as well.
Ikit's Lab is just a prettied up technology system. Throt's Lab looks similar. I don't know which came first, Undercities or Pirate Coves, but it's the same system. I think Chivalry is built off of Favor of the Gods.

In short, CA isn't really building new systems for DLC, they're repurposing old ones. I wouldn't expect anything extensive in terms of new mechanics until Warhammer 3.



TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/11/24 22:49:47


Post by: Argive


 trexmeyer wrote:
I've seen some complaints about the Anvil of Daith elsewhere and I wanted to point about some things in case anyone has similar views.

1) Some people have brought up customizable weapons/armor/etc. It's not happening unless they modify the game engine. Weapons/Armor/Enchanted Items/Banners/Etc are all treated as Ancillaries that are restricted to specific slots. The buffs on them are static. Each variation or permutation requires a new item to be stored in the database. This includes additional localization text for the item name and details.

The number of items you'd have to have stored to cover all permutations would be absurd. The only way this is changing is if they set up a slot system for ancillaries.

2) A lot of the big fancy new mechanics are just older tweaked mechanics with a new UI.

TK/Dwarf crafting are just extensions of the Ritual system. I'm 99% sure that Grom's Cauldron is as well.
Ikit's Lab is just a prettied up technology system. Throt's Lab looks similar. I don't know which came first, Undercities or Pirate Coves, but it's the same system. I think Chivalry is built off of Favor of the Gods.

In short, CA isn't really building new systems for DLC, they're repurposing old ones. I wouldn't expect anything extensive in terms of new mechanics until Warhammer 3.



Totaly agree.

Alas, I have pre-rodered the DLC anyway

Lookign forward to it.
The biggest question is detarmining if I play as rats or green clad pointy ears first

Leaning towards rats. Make rat ogers great!


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/11/24 23:42:19


Post by: H.B.M.C.


I think they're testing mechanics.

I'm all but certain that Grom's cauldron is a "beta test" for eventual OK gut magic/butcher cauldron stuff.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/11/25 00:28:36


Post by: trexmeyer


 H.B.M.C. wrote:
I think they're testing mechanics.

I'm all but certain that Grom's cauldron is a "beta test" for eventual OK gut magic/butcher cauldron stuff.


That's not what I'm getting at at all.

I'm not modding it anymore so I got rid of my archive GUI, but I'm almost positive (without checking) that Grom's Cauldron reuses/extends from the preexisting Ritual code. It's almost identical to the TK/Dwarf crafting system.

Basically Grom's Cauldron:
-River Hag on world map reuses the Gotrik/Felix system (I think this was the first one)
-River Hag triggers a Dilemma
-Ingredients replace Resources (same functionality in that they are required)
-Scrap replaces Oathgold/Jars for the spendable item
-TK/Dwarf Crafting actually has an option for a cooldown (only was used for epic items), for Grom it's a 1 turn lock out
-Instead of Ancillaries you get an assortment of buffs

The big "difference" is primarily UI.



TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/11/25 00:35:16


Post by: Argive


I think people are expecting too much from WHTW3.

I fully expect it to be essentialy a slightly better TW WH2. Different map, different starting position etc. (just like WHTW2 is just slightly better first game wth vortex mechanic and a different map)

I'd have absolutely no issue with that whatsoever

I do hope they fix flanking and rear charges to be much more relevant. Wheeling around, keeping formation and sacrificing units to achieve better positioning rather then just have a big mosh pit.

Then again that ship has sort of sailed with things like dread saurian running around


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/11/25 12:46:37


Post by: AllSeeingSkink


 Argive wrote:
I think people are expecting too much from WHTW3.


What were people expecting? I only ever expected the same as TWW2, but a couple of new armies and a new campaign (like we got the vortex in TWW2). I wasn't even expecting any major map changes, as there's a blank spot on the current ME map for Ogre Kingdoms to live.

Switching back to the Skaven/WE DLC. Listening to some videos from people who have early access, apparently the WE's ME campaign is nerfed as there's an economy cap later in the game and that cap isn't high enough to defend yourself late game, once it hits life gets hard. From the sounds of things, you're forced into a diplomatic style campaign because you won't be able to survive late game.

But still, I'm gonna preorder it. WE are one of my favourite factions on the table top but the amber system drove me too insane to get too far in their campaign. At least the early part of the game looks a lot more entertaining.




TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/11/25 13:24:48


Post by: trexmeyer


I don't understand why they bother with certain nerfs and then let players get SP achievements with mods. You can literally run a Legendary campaign with unlimited income and immortal units and still get the achievement for victory if you want.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/11/25 13:47:24


Post by: AllSeeingSkink


I never pay attention to the achievements, so that doesn't really bother me.

It's more that it seems playing WE beyond turn 100 (at least according to folk who have early access) you eventually just hit an economy wall, even though other AI factions will keep snowballing.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/11/25 15:19:36


Post by: Voss


AllSeeingSkink wrote:
I never pay attention to the achievements, so that doesn't really bother me.

It's more that it seems playing WE beyond turn 100 (at least according to folk who have early access) you eventually just hit an economy wall, even though other AI factions will keep snowballing.


That doesn't seem possible. Razing settlements for big cash is an option for wood elves (I've seen 10K for a small settlement in the early game), and that's entirely what drives the chaos warrior economy.
WE also get access to more full settlements now, so there is also room for normal economic growth.

You'll likely still lose small settlements regularly, but you also don't have to spend a lot to replace and upgrade those; and personally most of my money in TW campaigns goes into town upgrades, not armies.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/11/25 15:28:04


Post by: trexmeyer


I've heard that the WE raze income got nerfed and heroes/lord upkeep increased dramatically.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/11/25 16:17:00


Post by: Overread


I can accept that if they've now got more options with main settlements. To me one issue with them was that they had too much of their economic reliance settled in the one starting woodland area. So you HAD to capture that to progress because it was the only real area of advance you had.

If they've increased their ability to spread out and added more woodlands and such then I can see them having some higher upkeep costs to balance their greater steady economic growth.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/11/25 16:25:01


Post by: AllSeeingSkink


 trexmeyer wrote:
I've heard that the WE raze income got nerfed and heroes/lord upkeep increased dramatically.


I've heard heroes are roughly 2.5 times their previous cost now. It seems CA doesn't want people spamming heroes, but I think in practice it'll mean a lot of heroes simply won't get taken any more.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Overread wrote:
I can accept that if they've now got more options with main settlements. To me one issue with them was that they had too much of their economic reliance settled in the one starting woodland area. So you HAD to capture that to progress because it was the only real area of advance you had.

If they've increased their ability to spread out and added more woodlands and such then I can see them having some higher upkeep costs to balance their greater steady economic growth.


Yeah it was vague to me what he meant, it was LegendofTotalWar over on YT who mentioned it in a live stream. Unfortunately I can't quote it exactly as it was a 4 hour stream and I'm not going to go through trying to find it again. His suggestion was even if you ignore the bankruptcy cheese that WE used to have and have now lost, WE are still a lot weaker late game than they used to be. They have gained a more interesting campaign, but overall they've lost more than they've gained in terms of performance in campaign, which isn't great as they were one of the weaker factions to begin with.

The big one he mentioned was the economy running out of legs and not having the resources to defend the various forest regions in the late game (I guess because you don't have enough to sustain several high tier armies that are required to compete late game), the other one he mentioned was the tech tree diplomacy benefits have been dialled back combined with some of the events that see you fighting races you'd rather befriend making life harder.

But we'll see how it goes. Based on his comments I'm not going to embark on setting the difficulty excessively high and hopefully I'll be able to work through the late game issues he was talking about.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/11/25 17:02:57


Post by: Overread


It might be that they are weaker now, but CA might have built a more robust and easy to understand system for them so that when they make a few minor adjustments in a patch later; they can be boosted up or down as need be with good effect.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/11/25 21:46:04


Post by: Dreadwinter


 nels1031 wrote:
Voss wrote:

---
Also, apparently this is not the last DLC.
Confirmed by the CA PR person (CA_Grace) here: https://www.reddit.com/r/totalwar/comments/jx58ti/sick_of_the_skaven/gcu92bt/?context=3


That's probably the most exciting thing to me. Holding out hope for some Chaos (both factions) love or Ogre Kingdoms.



I'll be honest. I could have sworn they said that Tomb Kings was going to be the last DLC for TW2 so all these extras have been little surprises for me.

Next DLC needs some Empire love. Badly.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/11/25 22:50:49


Post by: trexmeyer


Dwarves and Beastmen are lagging behind the most. WoC are not great, but WH3 will fix them, not sure how much it will touch Beastmen.

I could see them doing Beastmen vs The Empire however. It would make more sense as The Empire is fairly popular and I don't think Dwarves are up there. Dwarves are really bad though...I think as faction they're less interesting from a gameplay perspective than everyone else (sans Beastmen). Only thing they have going for them are Gyrobombers.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/11/25 22:55:50


Post by: H.B.M.C.


AllSeeingSkink wrote:
I've heard heroes are roughly 2.5 times their previous cost now. It seems CA doesn't want people spamming heroes, but I think in practice it'll mean a lot of heroes simply won't get taken any more.
Unfortunately CA tend to balance the game for mutliplayer, not realising that what's good in MP isn't always good in campaign, so when they fix something in the "meta" for MP they might be killing something people do in single-player for no reason.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/11/25 23:06:12


Post by: trexmeyer


That's the upkeep cost, not the recruit cost. MP should be unchanged. It's solely a SP nerf as far as I know.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/11/25 23:31:33


Post by: Voss


 Dreadwinter wrote:
 nels1031 wrote:
Voss wrote:

---
Also, apparently this is not the last DLC.
Confirmed by the CA PR person (CA_Grace) here: https://www.reddit.com/r/totalwar/comments/jx58ti/sick_of_the_skaven/gcu92bt/?context=3


That's probably the most exciting thing to me. Holding out hope for some Chaos (both factions) love or Ogre Kingdoms.



I'll be honest. I could have sworn they said that Tomb Kings was going to be the last DLC for TW2 so all these extras have been little surprises for me.

Never. After Vampire Coast (the second race pack, TK was 1st) they said no more new races, just lord packs for existing factions, which they've stuck to.

Next DLC needs some Empire love. Badly.


Empire already got reworked. It won't get worked over again (until maybe a couple years into TW3).

Dwarves got tweaks, and they're unlikely to do a lord pack without a warhammer 2 race (Dark Elves, bringing them up to 6 lords like HE, Lizards and Skaven).

Now maybe they'll do a FLC lord for dark elves and focus on two old world races, but I doubt it.



TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/11/26 01:32:02


Post by: Argive


 trexmeyer wrote:
Dwarves and Beastmen are lagging behind the most. WoC are not great, but WH3 will fix them, not sure how much it will touch Beastmen.

I could see them doing Beastmen vs The Empire however. It would make more sense as The Empire is fairly popular and I don't think Dwarves are up there. Dwarves are really bad though...I think as faction they're less interesting from a gameplay perspective than everyone else (sans Beastmen). Only thing they have going for them are Gyrobombers.


I think thats maily the fault with the game design as a whole heavily favouring missle spam..
They need to make melee infantry hit harder and more relevant when hitting flanks, and also stop from the entire unit firing its missles at once.

If they only had half the starting amount of models able to shoot that would nerf some of the output.
At the moemnt, focus firing and ranged armies are just way too good at applying damage.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/11/26 22:36:25


Post by: Dreadwinter


Voss wrote:
 Dreadwinter wrote:
 nels1031 wrote:
Voss wrote:

---
Also, apparently this is not the last DLC.
Confirmed by the CA PR person (CA_Grace) here: https://www.reddit.com/r/totalwar/comments/jx58ti/sick_of_the_skaven/gcu92bt/?context=3


That's probably the most exciting thing to me. Holding out hope for some Chaos (both factions) love or Ogre Kingdoms.



I'll be honest. I could have sworn they said that Tomb Kings was going to be the last DLC for TW2 so all these extras have been little surprises for me.

Never. After Vampire Coast (the second race pack, TK was 1st) they said no more new races, just lord packs for existing factions, which they've stuck to.

Next DLC needs some Empire love. Badly.


Empire already got reworked. It won't get worked over again (until maybe a couple years into TW3).

Dwarves got tweaks, and they're unlikely to do a lord pack without a warhammer 2 race (Dark Elves, bringing them up to 6 lords like HE, Lizards and Skaven).

Now maybe they'll do a FLC lord for dark elves and focus on two old world races, but I doubt it.



Doubtful. Dwarves have already had one rework and need another rework badly. Empire will get another. Vampires are at a point they almost need another.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/11/26 22:40:46


Post by: Argive


I recently played a dward campaign for the first time. Seemed okay to me.

What do you think the issue with dwarves is ?


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/11/26 22:56:21


Post by: Voss


 Dreadwinter wrote:


Doubtful. Dwarves have already had one rework and need another rework badly. Empire will get another. Vampires are at a point they almost need another.


I have no idea why you believe any of this.

Certainly not the 'will get.' CA has given no indication they're going to revisit factions for TW3 and they definitely aren't going to revisit already revised factions in the lifespan of TW2.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/11/26 22:56:35


Post by: trexmeyer


The current Rune system is absolute garbage. It's basically non existent. This is a big one, as they're essentially missing an entire segment of gameplay in magic.

Heroes outside of the Engineer are mediocre at best. Also, they should have a hero Slayer variant.

Slayers are flat out bad outside of Ungrim's personal army.

Grombrindal (because of Ancestral buffs) and Belegar (because of Ancestor Heroes) are the only lords comparable to the top options for other factions.

All of their army options are extremely slow with the exception of Engineer stacking increasing range speed.

Their melee options feel very mediocre compared to many other armies.

Grudges are a minor pain to deal with, but not terrible.

IIRC they don't have any interesting faction mechanics.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/11/28 07:09:13


Post by: AllSeeingSkink


Over on YT some folk are putting out videos with the Sisters of Twilight and Drycha now.

Drycha starts in the Empire, and taking her makes Elf units in your faction weaker, but tree units better and adds a bit of flavour to them also. She also gets to recruit "beasts" in a similar way to raise dead which looks pretty cool. She can bring in Wolves, Spiders, Bats, Feral Manticores and Hawks (without riders). Not sure how Drycha will go late game as those units seem good early on but I think they'll struggle against late game units.

The Sisters start over in Dark Elf territory and seem like a good option for a more traditional WE army. The main buff they seem to get is arrow of kurnous on hawk riders which seems super powerful so I wonder if it'll get nerfed eventually.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/11/28 16:47:32


Post by: Voss


Drycha also has a skill in her tree which 'un-weakens' elves in her army (just her stack though). So you can veer towards a more normal army. Though she gives a lot of buffs on top of getting better versions of tree units in the first place (her 'malevolent dryads' have frenzy, for example), so finding the right mix isn't obvious.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/11/28 17:15:16


Post by: Overread


Drycha is sounding like she's going to be one leader I really like - a wild woodland army is something I've wanted from GW for years.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/12/03 07:48:31


Post by: AllSeeingSkink


So the update is coming in 10 hours, I'm curious, what happens to existing campaigns? Do they get updated, stay the same, or die? Would suck to lose the Vampire campaign I'm currently playing.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/12/03 10:44:13


Post by: Overread


AllSeeingSkink wrote:
So the update is coming in 10 hours, I'm curious, what happens to existing campaigns? Do they get updated, stay the same, or die? Would suck to lose the Vampire campaign I'm currently playing.


Depending how much of the core game changes the campaigns will either break or remain functional.

Purely adding new campaign content normally they manage to allow existing ones to keep running on the old save and you'd only get full new features by starting a new one.


However when they start to change some areas of the games core mechanics this can break old saves; and if you use any mods they might need updates to work and can break as a result of changes.





TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/12/03 17:45:36


Post by: AllSeeingSkink


It's out now. Seems it didn't do anything to the vamps campaign, though I haven't tried playing it, just loaded it to check and the map is unchanged.

Played a couple of turns as Sisters of Twilight, but have to go to work so will come back to it later!


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/12/03 17:50:13


Post by: Voss


Reminder- for one of the heroes (can't remember if its the glade lord captain or the skaven chieftain), you have to go through Total War Access rather than the in-game FLC download.
Because reasons.

Edit- its the glade captain. The skaven chieftain is a separate FLC from the DLC. Also because reasons.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/12/03 22:44:54


Post by: Argive


I will be able to binge on this the entire weekend as the missus is away


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/12/03 22:48:03


Post by: Overread


Voss wrote:
Reminder- for one of the heroes (can't remember if its the glade lord captain or the skaven chieftain), you have to go through Total War Access rather than the in-game FLC download.
Because reasons.

Edit- its the glade captain. The skaven chieftain is a separate FLC from the DLC. Also because reasons.


CA basically holds their own community site and forums through CA Access. So with most steam users having a phobia of "non-steam" they have to be bribed to get off and try something different

Though really its just semi-regular free stuff like that which CA uses to encourage people to sign up - use the forums - use the support and other resources. Works well.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/12/03 22:52:51


Post by: Argive


 Overread wrote:
Voss wrote:
Reminder- for one of the heroes (can't remember if its the glade lord captain or the skaven chieftain), you have to go through Total War Access rather than the in-game FLC download.
Because reasons.

Edit- its the glade captain. The skaven chieftain is a separate FLC from the DLC. Also because reasons.


CA basically holds their own community site and forums through CA Access. So with most steam users having a phobia of "non-steam" they have to be bribed to get off and try something different

Though really its just semi-regular free stuff like that which CA uses to encourage people to sign up - use the forums - use the support and other resources. Works well.


Except I can never remeber how to figure out how to get the free hero..
I log in on their site and then it doesn't really interface with steam really well. I've managed it once but cant remember how I did it now lol. Need to get Joanne D' Ar... i mean Rapansetm.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/12/03 23:05:41


Post by: Overread


 Argive wrote:
 Overread wrote:
Voss wrote:
Reminder- for one of the heroes (can't remember if its the glade lord captain or the skaven chieftain), you have to go through Total War Access rather than the in-game FLC download.
Because reasons.

Edit- its the glade captain. The skaven chieftain is a separate FLC from the DLC. Also because reasons.


CA basically holds their own community site and forums through CA Access. So with most steam users having a phobia of "non-steam" they have to be bribed to get off and try something different

Though really its just semi-regular free stuff like that which CA uses to encourage people to sign up - use the forums - use the support and other resources. Works well.


Except I can never remeber how to figure out how to get the free hero..
I log in on their site and then it doesn't really interface with steam really well. I've managed it once but cant remember how I did it now lol. Need to get Joanne D' Ar... i mean Rapansetm.


Go to the main site https://dashboard.totalwar.com/home
Log in - then you should see "your inventory" Which is basically the main page full of big icons. Scroll down and you can click to unlock the relevant items for free. You just have to sign into steam (which if you don't use your browser might ping a security check so steam emails your registered email with a code to enter) and then allow and its done. Few clicks, few moments all done.

Rapanese though isn't part of that at all. She's on Steam. You log into steam, go to the store page for the game, scroll down the DLC, click on Repanse and then just "play" or "download" on her page and it should enable in the game when it launches from clicking that. Same as all the other free steam stuff. Sometimes it can be a bit fussy but normally it will appear as DLC on the dlc tab for things you down own on the main menu in game.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/12/03 23:28:54


Post by: trexmeyer


It would be super cool if Steam wasn't sitting on 1.8/3.2 GB for an hour.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/12/03 23:28:57


Post by: Argive


Cheers.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/12/04 01:06:40


Post by: AllSeeingSkink


trexmeyer wrote:It would be super cool if Steam wasn't sitting on 1.8/3.2 GB for an hour.

Have you tried turning it off and on again?

Overread wrote:
 Argive wrote:
 Overread wrote:
Voss wrote:
Reminder- for one of the heroes (can't remember if its the glade lord captain or the skaven chieftain), you have to go through Total War Access rather than the in-game FLC download.
Because reasons.

Edit- its the glade captain. The skaven chieftain is a separate FLC from the DLC. Also because reasons.


CA basically holds their own community site and forums through CA Access. So with most steam users having a phobia of "non-steam" they have to be bribed to get off and try something different

Though really its just semi-regular free stuff like that which CA uses to encourage people to sign up - use the forums - use the support and other resources. Works well.


Except I can never remeber how to figure out how to get the free hero..
I log in on their site and then it doesn't really interface with steam really well. I've managed it once but cant remember how I did it now lol. Need to get Joanne D' Ar... i mean Rapansetm.


Go to the main site https://dashboard.totalwar.com/home
Log in - then you should see "your inventory" Which is basically the main page full of big icons. Scroll down and you can click to unlock the relevant items for free. You just have to sign into steam (which if you don't use your browser might ping a security check so steam emails your registered email with a code to enter) and then allow and its done. Few clicks, few moments all done.

Rapanese though isn't part of that at all. She's on Steam. You log into steam, go to the store page for the game, scroll down the DLC, click on Repanse and then just "play" or "download" on her page and it should enable in the game when it launches from clicking that. Same as all the other free steam stuff. Sometimes it can be a bit fussy but normally it will appear as DLC on the dlc tab for things you down own on the main menu in game.


Argh, I totally forgot about that, bought the DLC but didn't have the FLC of the Glade Captain. I really hate it when companies do crap like this, it wasn't enough for me to spend money on the game and the DLC, they want me to link their bespoke account to my Steam account so they can spy on me too. I guess my profile is private except for the username, so supposedly they can't see that stuff.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/12/04 01:43:13


Post by: Overread


Eh I don't think they get anything from steam itself anyway - at least not user data and such. Besides they already likely have your play time logged

I think TW Access is more them getting you to use their direct communication and social site rather than them having to use steams own system. So encouraging by giving away free stuff helps them because it increase the chance that you might talk on the forums or use their support system etc...


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/12/04 01:54:36


Post by: Argive


I used it to report the slaan buga while back.
Was gutten when I finaly got to play as lizardmen and my slan wouldint show up in my lords pool after doing the rite of awekening :(


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/12/04 03:53:40


Post by: trexmeyer


82 turns into a Sisters of Twilight ME Campaign on Hard/Normal Battle/Very Hard Chaos (because I still expect Chaos to be a joke).

I had previously done a Hard Orion Campaign (and won). The "hardest" thing I've done on ME would be VH Norsca and VH WoC (with a personal mod to encamp after razing >.>...I think it makes a big difference).

Wood Elves are 100% better so far. I've only fought two actual battles. SoT starting army is great. The Stag Knights are beasts in autoresolve and pretty good in battle (at least on normal). The SoT aren't anything crazy in battle, but they turn Hawk Riders into monsters. The new caster lords are a nice addition. The Glade Guard Captain is very nice, especially on an Eagle. Ariel is a beast from turn 1 and is quite versatile. Deep Roots is a nice mechanic. I spent some time securing one confederation prior to bouncing back over and abusing the Dark Elves (necessary for LL quest) as well as the Exiles of Nehek.

The forest incursions so far have been a joke. There has been zero reason to fight any of them as they have all been successful ambushes with something like 90-95% advantage each time. Even the healing incursions were no better. I killed two before they spawned and ambushed the one that did spawn.

My economy with only the starting forest + one of the original provinces is enough on H to finance two armies. I currently have three and am in the red, but am avoiding losing money by having all of them actively engaged. I think each those two forests are bringing in around 2500-3000 each currently.

The Forge of Daith is uninteresting, but the new tech tree, Deep Roots mechanic, new units, new LLs, Forest Healing mechanic and Forest Incursions make up for it.

Lastly, the AI does resettle, but they're no longer beelining to ruins and I have experienced no rebellions so far.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/12/04 04:15:01


Post by: H.B.M.C.


At least CA have realised how lazy the Forge of Daith is compared to the lavish attention that Skaven received (again):

CA wrote:We’ve heard your feedback regarding the Forge of Daith, and we’re going to work to make various improvements.

Short-term, we’re going to focus on implementing some changes that should deal with some of the most notable pain points raised in the last few days:

1. Reforged items will no longer return to their base level upon expiring, and instead will revert to the level they were before being Reforged.

2. When you receive Forge of Daith dilemmas that affect a maximum-level item, you will be able to choose to reduce the time until the next Daith’s Gift event – Naestra will no longer walk away without anything (she’s generous, but not that generous!).

3. We also want to do a pass on the item effects overall to ensure that they provide interesting and exciting gameplay choices.

Longer term we want to make continued improvements – while we don’t want to make fundamental changes to the underlying gameplay and UI, there are two areas in particular we want to focus on:

1. Letting you see in advance which item you receive from the Daith’s Gift dilemma

2. Investigating what new visual elements we can create to support the system

We appreciate your feedback and patience so far and are confident that we’ll be able to work together to make the Sisters a truly unique campaign experience.

As always, development is subject to change - so while this is currently the plan, we appreciate your patience and understanding if this changes in the future, and we will let you know if that is the case.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/12/04 09:33:28


Post by: Not Online!!!


I am having time this weekend aswell.
I will attempt to skavenslave my way to total domination...
Considering i can get them to start with 5 random mutagens pretty early on i can drown the world in skaven...

Also, i will probably need a lot of heros to pullt that one off.



TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/12/04 09:43:34


Post by: AllSeeingSkink


 trexmeyer wrote:
82 turns into a Sisters of Twilight ME Campaign on Hard/Normal Battle/Very Hard Chaos (because I still expect Chaos to be a joke).

I had previously done a Hard Orion Campaign (and won). The "hardest" thing I've done on ME would be VH Norsca and VH WoC (with a personal mod to encamp after razing >.>...I think it makes a big difference).

Wood Elves are 100% better so far. I've only fought two actual battles. SoT starting army is great. The Stag Knights are beasts in autoresolve and pretty good in battle (at least on normal). The SoT aren't anything crazy in battle, but they turn Hawk Riders into monsters. The new caster lords are a nice addition. The Glade Guard Captain is very nice, especially on an Eagle. Ariel is a beast from turn 1 and is quite versatile. Deep Roots is a nice mechanic. I spent some time securing one confederation prior to bouncing back over and abusing the Dark Elves (necessary for LL quest) as well as the Exiles of Nehek.

The forest incursions so far have been a joke. There has been zero reason to fight any of them as they have all been successful ambushes with something like 90-95% advantage each time. Even the healing incursions were no better. I killed two before they spawned and ambushed the one that did spawn.

My economy with only the starting forest + one of the original provinces is enough on H to finance two armies. I currently have three and am in the red, but am avoiding losing money by having all of them actively engaged. I think each those two forests are bringing in around 2500-3000 each currently.

The Forge of Daith is uninteresting, but the new tech tree, Deep Roots mechanic, new units, new LLs, Forest Healing mechanic and Forest Incursions make up for it.

Lastly, the AI does resettle, but they're no longer beelining to ruins and I have experienced no rebellions so far.


On my Sisters campaign I'm fighting most of the battles rather than autoresolve not because they're bad on auto, but because the replenishment is slow so I'm trying to minimise losses.

Folk have said the updates to WE made it hard from turn 100+, as the economy stalls and you end up with not enough to maintain enough armies to manage all the forests, but we'll see how it goes I guess.



Automatically Appended Next Post:
 H.B.M.C. wrote:
At least CA have realised how lazy the Forge of Daith is compared to the lavish attention that Skaven received (again):
Good to hear they're listening. I didn't realise reforged items returned to their base level when they expire, I just got one of my items reforged and I wouldn't have done it knowing it'd go back to baseline after that.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/12/04 11:24:24


Post by: trexmeyer


Forge of Daith is bad because there is no choice. It boils down to pick 1 of 4 items, hit upgrade (or leave) every 2 turns.

Ikit's Workshop is essentially just a tech tree that you pay for with currency with RoR unlocks tagged on, but you have a plethora of options in terms of filling it out and there may be so many that you won't max it out until after turn 200~. I've only gotten 120-130~ turns in with Ikit and I don't think I was close to finishing it.

Clan Eshin's special mission table gives a ton of choices as does Grom's Cookbook. I think those two are actually the gold standard for LL mechanics even though I don't really like the special missions.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Update at turn 120~

Very Hard Chaos Invasion spawned at turn 95. 7-8 Stacks north of Naggarond, 8-9 in the Chaos Wastes by Gormandy. Naggarond got beat down, partly because they kept throwing armies into my ambushes.

I confederated the last 3 OG Wood Elf factions around turn 95, killed Drycha around 115~, and confederated Laurelon around 90~. That gives me enough income to cover 5 armies + 3k gold/turn, but I still have a fair amount of t2 Glade Guard and t2 Eternal Guard in my armies. With the upkeep dilemma buff I could probably run 6 armies since I make enough off of post-battle loot/razing for 3k~ negative/turn to not matter.

In short, I don't think the Wood Elf economy is a problem on Hard.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/12/04 15:06:29


Post by: AllSeeingSkink


Damn, I think I'm going to have to make friends with the Lizardmen. Decided to pop over there through the deeproots to try and take the forest there and got my arse handed to me.

How do you fight Lizardmen when playing as Wood Elves in campaign? I didn't really have an answer to Saurus/Temple Guard/Dinos, and the Skinks were harassing almost as well as my own. Arrow of Kurnous doesn't seem to hurt them much either so spamming Hawk Riders probably isn't the answer.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/12/04 15:17:45


Post by: trexmeyer


I actually haven't gone to Lustria yet. Hexoatl is a Defensive Ally (for now) because they loved me for pummeling Morathi. I haven't fought Tomb Kings, Lizardmen, High Elves, or Bretonnia yet.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/12/04 15:53:28


Post by: nels1031


Did a few exploratory turns as Drycha. That looks like it will be a fun campaign.

Just gotta wait for a few of my key mods to get updated and I'll deep dive into it.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/12/04 23:01:45


Post by: trexmeyer


Short Campaign Victory on turn 127.

Final Chaos Invasion was 18~ stacks (at Very Hard) north of Kislev and 10~ north of Naggarond. The Old World one dropped Reikland from strength rank 4 down to 26~, but petered out after wiping out I want to say 4~ major settlements (Reikland) in the north. I think Kislev, Praag, Hell Pit, and the Dwarf one. New World invasion tore through the Dark Elves and I ended up having to bounce them since I controlled Naggarond. I didn't contribute anything to defending the Old World and the invasion fell apart within 20-25 turns.

If you want a big Chaos Invasion and you're not Clan Moulder/Empire/Azhag I'd go with Legendary. The AI for hordes is not good.


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/12/05 03:57:10


Post by: AllSeeingSkink


Was never a huge fan of the Chaos invasion so I'll probably just turn it off when I get to playing another ME campaign.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
So I wonder if the reason I got my arse handed to me by the Lizards is much of my armies are still relying on Glade Guard with basic arrows that I've had since early on. They seemed to work well enough against Dark Elves, Skaven, Chaos and so on, but maybe time to upgrade?

What's a good mix for archer heavy armies later in the game, just pay the premium for the Waywatchers to get good armour piercing, or better off with some Swiftshiver Scouts or Hagbane Glade Guards?


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/12/05 08:21:48


Post by: Not Online!!!


AllSeeingSkink wrote:
Was never a huge fan of the Chaos invasion so I'll probably just turn it off when I get to playing another ME campaign.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
So I wonder if the reason I got my arse handed to me by the Lizards is much of my armies are still relying on Glade Guard with basic arrows that I've had since early on. They seemed to work well enough against Dark Elves, Skaven, Chaos and so on, but maybe time to upgrade?

What's a good mix for archer heavy armies later in the game, just pay the premium for the Waywatchers to get good armour piercing, or better off with some Swiftshiver Scouts or Hagbane Glade Guards?


I am more surprised as to why you get stopped by lizzard men? Normmally they die to any type of ranged.

Checkerboard formation and 1-3 Heros up front should buy you enough time against lizzard men.

But then again i was mostly back in the old world part playing skaven slave mutant spam, which whilest hillarious doesn't make for a great army. So i have no idea if they boosted the armour and defense rating of lizzardmen


TW: Warhammer 2 'The Silence and the Fury' Jul 14 Final DLC! @ 2020/12/05 09:08:25


Post by: AllSeeingSkink


I dunno, I probably just suck, haha, I'll admit I'm not great at micro. My typical Sisters army (though this one was led by a Treeman) consists of a couple of Eternal Guard and a couple of Treekin along with the Ancient Treeman and a hero to hold the front line then Glade Guard behind that to give DPS while Hawks run interference and use Arrow of Kurnous to melt any blobs.

But against the Lizards, they just ran over the Eternal Guard, Treekin hung around a while longer but some went up to Temple Guard which they lost to pretty fast, and the Glade Guard couldn't lay down the DPS to help before they got overrun. The Hawks dealt with the Terradons pretty easily, but then didn't seem to hurt anything else much.

Maybe I was just out tiered, but the balance of power was only slightly in the Lizards favour to begin with an normally that means an easy win.