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Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/03/21 11:32:32


Post by: laam999


I'm sure you've all seen the new codex I coming so here is a thread for chat about it.



https://www.warhammer-community.com/2021/03/20/warhammer-preview-online-faith-damnation/

Binary at the end of the trailer says April.



Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/03/21 19:24:10


Post by: Kid_Kyoto


This guy should be here.



He's nice enough but uh, yeah, he looks like a kitbash of the Skitarii kit. There's a lot they could have done and they just... didn't.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/03/21 19:26:01


Post by: yukishiro1


He looks like heroes used to look back in the old days when they didn't charge you 5-10x as much for a hero as a normal dude.

At least he's got the tactical rock. That's how you know he's a leader (queue Monty Python joke).


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/03/21 19:27:37


Post by: Voss


yukishiro1 wrote:
He looks like heroes used to look back in the old days when they didn't charge you 5-10x as much for a hero as a normal dude.

Well, they'll still do that. But yeah, he looks better than some random giant yahoo with fifteen different 'signature' bits.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/03/21 19:37:43


Post by: Kid_Kyoto


Perfectly cromulant, but when you think of all things he could have been...

A six armed dude with a different weapon in each hand, a steampunk dude with an anti-matter blunderbuss, a Doc Ock with eight sensors and communications tendrils coming out of his back...

I mean, nice pose, nice flair, but not really $35 nice.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/03/21 19:47:24


Post by: yukishiro1


I can't remember the last 40k character release actually worth its cost. They're all hideously overpriced; it makes the rest of GW's product line look positively reasonable, which is probably a big reason they do it.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/03/21 20:35:08


Post by: Kanluwen


 Kid_Kyoto wrote:
Perfectly cromulant, but when you think of all things he could have been...

A six armed dude with a different weapon in each hand, a steampunk dude with an anti-matter blunderbuss, a Doc Ock with eight sensors and communications tendrils coming out of his back...

I mean, nice pose, nice flair, but not really $35 nice.

Every one of those things you described are called "Techpriests".

This is a Skitarii character.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/03/21 20:41:14


Post by: ImAGeek


He’s basically a promoted Skitarii, and looks like it. Fits perfectly. I really like it.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/03/21 20:52:54


Post by: Nostromodamus


Exactly how I would imagine a Skitarii leader to look. Perfection.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/03/22 08:19:16


Post by: The Black Adder


I think the marshal is great. There's no huge wow factor but he looks in keeping with his troops and there's no obvious detailing I'd change. I'm keeping my fingers crossed for some weapon options.

I don't like the tactical rock. This is not because they're common place for characters (I don't know that there are any others in the ad mech model line - Cawl has a 'tactical book') but simply for the reason I'm putting my ad mech on sector mechanics bases and I'll have to find something else to rest the marshal's foot on.

I'm excited to see what the codex brings for crusade rules.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/03/22 10:58:57


Post by: H.B.M.C.


I think he looks pretty cool. Marshall's a pretty boring name though (Tribune would'a been better).

 Kid_Kyoto wrote:
He's nice enough but uh, yeah, he looks like a kitbash of the Skitarii kit. There's a lot they could have done and they just... didn't.
What I like is how even in the video they thought about giving him weapon options, but decided against it.

That wasn't a Tech-Priest designing a new unit. That's the AI GW uses to strip options out of their kits.

yukishiro1 wrote:
He looks like heroes used to look back in the old days when they didn't charge you 5-10x as much for a hero as a normal dude.
Yup. If this guy'd come out around the time of the plastic Banshee/Wraith/Magister/Chaos Sorcerer he'd be around the AUD$30 mark. He'll be double that when he's released in April.

 Kanluwen wrote:
This is a Skitarii character.
And you know what a Skitarii character is more than anyone else, hey? You don't think the Adeptus Mechanicus would make their Skitarii leaders murder-machines as well? Just more excuses as usual...



Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/03/22 11:03:40


Post by: Agamemnon2


I'm glad the faction has another HQ pick, especially since it's a Skitarii and not an AdMech priest. Just a nice bit of expanded lore that hopefully lets people broaden the scope of available army builds a bit more.

I agree that the Marshal looks very "old-school" as a sculpt, but in the best of ways. He looks like you could almost cast him out of metal as-is.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/03/22 11:16:42


Post by: H.B.M.C.


 Agamemnon2 wrote:
I'm glad the faction has another HQ pick, especially since it's a Skitarii and not an AdMech priest. Just a nice bit of expanded lore that hopefully lets people broaden the scope of available army builds a bit more.
To me, with this character, I think the only thing we're missing is another type of robot. Something smaller and faster, but bigger than infantry. Something like the Vorax, really.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/03/22 11:58:01


Post by: Fergie0044


He's looks ... fine I guess. I'm just going to kit bash my own version of him - goodness knows I've got enough Skittari bits.

We definitely needed more HQ options, so I'll happily take a cheap as chips option with a minor buff. Shame there isn't a beat stick Sicarian version of him though.



Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/03/22 12:08:04


Post by: Marshal Loss


I like the Marshal. Great name as well.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/03/22 13:01:36


Post by: Wha-Mu-077


I wonder if he'll have a Ranger-esque head option like all Skitarii had thus far


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/03/22 14:15:33


Post by: Dysartes


 Marshal Loss wrote:
I like the Marshal. Great name as well.


You would think that


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/03/22 18:11:20


Post by: Nostromodamus


The Codex cover is beautiful too, lots to look at there.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/03/23 12:32:20


Post by: pogey


 Nostromodamus wrote:
The Codex cover is beautiful too, lots to look at there.


What are the chances we will get the thing on the cover? Do they still only have things there are miniatures of on the covers of codexs?


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/03/23 13:19:06


Post by: Tyranid Horde


Dumb tactical rock yet again, but the mini isn't bad overall.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/03/23 13:42:58


Post by: Marshal Loss


pogey wrote:
 Nostromodamus wrote:
The Codex cover is beautiful too, lots to look at there.


What are the chances we will get the thing on the cover? Do they still only have things there are miniatures of on the covers of codexs?


Won't happen, & no


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/03/23 13:46:44


Post by: Kanluwen


I'd say there's an extremely good chance of us getting "the thing on the cover" if I'm going to be honest.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/03/23 13:52:00


Post by: Tiberius501


 Kanluwen wrote:
I'd say there's an extremely good chance of us getting "the thing on the cover" if I'm going to be honest.


I dunno, I feel like we’ve gotten so many model releases so far, and there was no tease of us getting more figures after they announced our book and the Marshal.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/03/23 13:54:43


Post by: Marshal Loss


Little to no chance. It's by the same artist who did this wonderful piece, that's just his style. It's quite clearly not a representation of an actual kit, & if Mech were getting more models with their codex coming in April, we'd know about it by now.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/03/23 13:56:55


Post by: H.B.M.C.


AdMech are only getting one mini with their Codex - the Marshall. Their big second wave came during PA.



Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/03/23 13:59:42


Post by: Kanluwen


 Tiberius501 wrote:
 Kanluwen wrote:
I'd say there's an extremely good chance of us getting "the thing on the cover" if I'm going to be honest.


I dunno, I feel like we’ve gotten so many model releases so far, and there was no tease of us getting more figures after they announced our book and the Marshal.

We've gotten a number of models certainly, but they've been staggered significantly.
The Skorpius Disintegrator/Dunerider was June 26th, 2019 for a preorder date.
Techpriest Manipulus was January of 2019, locked in a Kill-Team box.
Engine War brought those two into a physical print format for the first time, May 30th 2020(two to three months after it was supposed to release at the end of March/start of April 2020 before GW shut down for COVID Wave I)
Pteraxii, Serberys, and Archaeopter all came out at that same time--along with a physical release for the Manipulus.

The majority of what has been released has been Skitarii but the stuff on the cover is predominantly Techpriest.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/03/23 14:30:47


Post by: Mr_Rose


It’d be nice to have a senior magos option that isn’t Cawl, but has gone nearly as far in terms of augmentation, if in a slightly different direction.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/03/23 14:55:37


Post by: Voss


 H.B.M.C. wrote:
 Agamemnon2 wrote:
I'm glad the faction has another HQ pick, especially since it's a Skitarii and not an AdMech priest. Just a nice bit of expanded lore that hopefully lets people broaden the scope of available army builds a bit more.
To me, with this character, I think the only thing we're missing is another type of robot. Something smaller and faster, but bigger than infantry. Something like the Vorax, really.


There are always the other four types of robots that went along with the Kastelan back in Rogue Trader (when it was the Castellan): Crusader, Colossus, Cataphract and Conqueror. Though presumably their weapon options would be 'Ad Mech-ed up.'

But yeah, I doubt we're getting anything else with this release.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/03/23 14:56:15


Post by: Mad Doc Grotsnik


 H.B.M.C. wrote:
 Agamemnon2 wrote:
I'm glad the faction has another HQ pick, especially since it's a Skitarii and not an AdMech priest. Just a nice bit of expanded lore that hopefully lets people broaden the scope of available army builds a bit more.
To me, with this character, I think the only thing we're missing is another type of robot. Something smaller and faster, but bigger than infantry. Something like the Vorax, really.


Ahh, I see you misspelled “several” and “another”. An easy mistake to make!

Because for the Tech faction of the Imperium, they don’t field a great many wonder machines. They’re definitely far better off now than at first, but even so.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/03/23 14:59:53


Post by: Kanluwen


They've written themselves into a corner with some of the stuff. There's a good chunk of Mechanicum stuff that is "heretek" now, because of ties to Horus.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/03/23 15:01:06


Post by: xttz


 Mr_Rose wrote:
It’d be nice to have a senior magos option that isn’t Cawl, but has gone nearly as far in terms of augmentation, if in a slightly different direction.


I'd love to see something like this turned into a model one day



One floaty science boi please GW


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/03/23 15:20:07


Post by: Ghaz


 xttz wrote:
 Mr_Rose wrote:
It’d be nice to have a senior magos option that isn’t Cawl, but has gone nearly as far in terms of augmentation, if in a slightly different direction.


I'd love to see something like this turned into a model one day

Spoiler:


One floaty science boi please GW

So something like Forge World's Archmagos Draykavac.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/03/23 15:48:51


Post by: GaroRobe


Draykavac is more like Judith from the SoB range, since it's a palaquin. I think the artwork is closer to that weird blobby Necromunda bountyhunter thing


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/03/23 22:04:39


Post by: H.B.M.C.


 Kanluwen wrote:
They've written themselves into a corner with some of the stuff. There's a good chunk of Mechanicum stuff that is "heretek" now, because of ties to Horus.
That's nothing new, and still they have robots.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/03/23 22:09:16


Post by: Voss


 H.B.M.C. wrote:
 Kanluwen wrote:
They've written themselves into a corner with some of the stuff. There's a good chunk of Mechanicum stuff that is "heretek" now, because of ties to Horus.
That's nothing new, and still they have robots.


Fresh shipment of cranial wafers; mumble, mumble unreliable narrator; corner escaped!


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/03/23 23:13:59


Post by: Olthannon


Voss wrote:
 H.B.M.C. wrote:
 Agamemnon2 wrote:
I'm glad the faction has another HQ pick, especially since it's a Skitarii and not an AdMech priest. Just a nice bit of expanded lore that hopefully lets people broaden the scope of available army builds a bit more.
To me, with this character, I think the only thing we're missing is another type of robot. Something smaller and faster, but bigger than infantry. Something like the Vorax, really.


There are always the other four types of robots that went along with the Kastelan back in Rogue Trader (when it was the Castellan): Crusader, Colossus, Cataphract and Conqueror. Though presumably their weapon options would be 'Ad Mech-ed up.'

But yeah, I doubt we're getting anything else with this release.


To be fair I think the crusader is the Vorax now. Most of the others are variations of the same which the kastalens now are. A heavier loadout would be a nice choice, maybe based on the Conquerer chassis (or would that be Konquerer now?)



Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/03/24 00:03:23


Post by: Tastyfish


Cataphract look like they might be the inspiration for the Thanatar, but yeah the others do look like variants and FW has already gone and made other classes.



Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/03/24 00:53:43


Post by: Stormonu


There’s also the mechanical ambulls that were released for Necromunda that could be drafted into Admech.



Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/03/24 00:59:40


Post by: Ghaz


 Stormonu wrote:
There’s also the mechanical ambulls that were released for Necromunda that could be drafted into Admech.

I doubt if we will see the Luthor pattern Excavation Automata in a front line role with the Adeptus Mechanicus.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/03/24 01:38:43


Post by: Argive


Id love to see a kit bash of a Mechanicum Vultarax Stratos-Automata and a Tech priest/ Magos.

Ad mech HH range has some absolute awesome models.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/03/29 18:43:34


Post by: Olthannon


 Stormonu wrote:
There’s also the mechanical ambulls that were released for Necromunda that could be drafted into Admech.



Yes I bought them exactly for this reason and I originally planned to add them to my Kastelan squad but unfortunately they don't match up in size. So instead I'm thinking of turning them into servitors..


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/03/29 18:52:52


Post by: MajorWesJanson


It would be cool if they inducted the Ogryn servitors from necromunda into a retinue unit for enginseers. .


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/03/30 07:29:01


Post by: Kinetochore


Just wish they would release rules for using a Thanatar in 40k!


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/03/30 07:44:22


Post by: AngryAngel80


I don't know why people think the Skittari character will be anything more than a glorified Lt. I am pretty sure that is all the new skittari character will be. Excited to see what they do with the codex though, ad mech are a fun feeling faction to me so I like to know they have some variety and goodness available.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/03/30 11:05:48


Post by: Sunny Side Up


 Ghaz wrote:
 Stormonu wrote:
There’s also the mechanical ambulls that were released for Necromunda that could be drafted into Admech.

I doubt if we will see the Luthor pattern Excavation Automata in a front line role with the Adeptus Mechanicus.


Yeah. Seems more like something they might add to GSC.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/03/31 05:32:46


Post by: Tiberius501


So, in theory, our book could be going up for preorder next week. But I’m guessing it’ll be a bit later in April, there’s other stuff they’ve shown off which can come sooner, right?


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/03/31 10:58:20


Post by: MajorWesJanson


 Tiberius501 wrote:
So, in theory, our book could be going up for preorder next week. But I’m guessing it’ll be a bit later in April, there’s other stuff they’ve shown off which can come sooner, right?


DE just came out, and then cursed city, followed by big elf release. I'm guessing there will be at least a week between that and Admech. Probably specialist game assortment. The war master titan would be a cool lead into admech thematically.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/03/31 11:14:27


Post by: xttz


 MajorWesJanson wrote:
 Tiberius501 wrote:
So, in theory, our book could be going up for preorder next week. But I’m guessing it’ll be a bit later in April, there’s other stuff they’ve shown off which can come sooner, right?


DE just came out, and then cursed city, followed by big elf release. I'm guessing there will be at least a week between that and Admech. Probably specialist game assortment. The war master titan would be a cool lead into admech thematically.


They did an article on the next Underworlds warband saying it's "available to preorder next month", so it's a fair bet that's shown this Sunday. They've released Titanicus stuff alongside Underworlds before, but I can't think of anything else likely to come out at the same time. Are there any new Blood Bowl teams still expected?

...or they could just drop the Warmaster alongside the AdMech book


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/03/31 11:41:32


Post by: Sunny Side Up


 MajorWesJanson wrote:
 Tiberius501 wrote:
So, in theory, our book could be going up for preorder next week. But I’m guessing it’ll be a bit later in April, there’s other stuff they’ve shown off which can come sooner, right?


DE just came out, and then cursed city, followed by big elf release. I'm guessing there will be at least a week between that and Admech. Probably specialist game assortment. The war master titan would be a cool lead into admech thematically.


Well, doesn't seem like there's much coming with AdMech. The Codex, some cards, perhaps dice and the new HQ, either single or as part of a new starter box.

Seems as good as any "filler" release between the more miniature heavy weeks for AoS Elves or Cursed City. Seems like Sisters will be the next 40K release with a more substantial miniature-release.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/03/31 12:37:05


Post by: Ghaz


Sunny Side Up wrote:
 MajorWesJanson wrote:
 Tiberius501 wrote:
So, in theory, our book could be going up for preorder next week. But I’m guessing it’ll be a bit later in April, there’s other stuff they’ve shown off which can come sooner, right?


DE just came out, and then cursed city, followed by big elf release. I'm guessing there will be at least a week between that and Admech. Probably specialist game assortment. The war master titan would be a cool lead into admech thematically.


Well, doesn't seem like there's much coming with AdMech. The Codex, some cards, perhaps dice and the new HQ, either single or as part of a new starter box.

Seems as good as any "filler" release between the more miniature heavy weeks for AoS Elves or Cursed City. Seems like Sisters will be the next 40K release with a more substantial miniature-release.

I would expect to see 'Broken Realms: Be'lakor' sometime in April due to April's collectible coin:

Spoiler:


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/03/31 14:24:16


Post by: MajorWesJanson


 xttz wrote:
 MajorWesJanson wrote:
 Tiberius501 wrote:
So, in theory, our book could be going up for preorder next week. But I’m guessing it’ll be a bit later in April, there’s other stuff they’ve shown off which can come sooner, right?


DE just came out, and then cursed city, followed by big elf release. I'm guessing there will be at least a week between that and Admech. Probably specialist game assortment. The war master titan would be a cool lead into admech thematically.


They did an article on the next Underworlds warband saying it's "available to preorder next month", so it's a fair bet that's shown this Sunday. They've released Titanicus stuff alongside Underworlds before, but I can't think of anything else likely to come out at the same time. Are there any new Blood Bowl teams still expected?

...or they could just drop the Warmaster alongside the AdMech book


Warmaster looks like it will be paired with the loyalist legions book. Potentially the volkite weapons from fw as well.

I'm a bit curious how the skitarii squads will handle their special weapons. Still 2 plasma/ haywire/ arquebus at 5, and a third at 10, or limited more to match the box contents? Dark eldar showed both options. Warriors are still 1 special per 5, one heavy per 10, but wyches are one of each wych weapon per 10, can't take 3 of the same anymore.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/03/31 15:53:49


Post by: Kanluwen


Wild guess is that they'll put the Arquebus into its own category and Plasma Calivers and Arc Rifles will become 1 per 5, with Arquebus as its own thing.

Hopefully though? Ranger exclusivity for Arquebus at least.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/03/31 15:58:46


Post by: Slayer-Fan123


 Kanluwen wrote:
Wild guess is that they'll put the Arquebus into its own category and Plasma Calivers and Arc Rifles will become 1 per 5, with Arquebus as its own thing.

Hopefully though? Ranger exclusivity for Arquebus at least.

There has to be more people fighting this garbage after Plague Marines, Blightlords, and Wyches.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/03/31 16:34:09


Post by: Kanluwen


It's frankly anyone's guess how it will shake out.

I'm personally thinking that we'll get something kinda weird going on whether it be the Arquebus becoming Ranger only, 1:5 for special weapons, minimum squad sizes of 10, or some kind of 'balance' mechanism.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/03/31 16:41:27


Post by: Tiberius501


I really hope they don’t screw around with our weapons! I enjoy my specialised squads, thank you very much, GW...


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/04 11:16:53


Post by: xttz


Some more datasheet updates:

https://imgur.com/a/Y1YrlOU

Dragoons have a 3+ save and extra attack
Ironstriders have a 3+ save
Taser lance from -1 AP to -2
Jezzail goes from 0 AP to -2
Cognis Lascannon D3+3 damage
Cognis autocannon goes from 4 to 6 shots
Both are assault weapons

Serberys units change from T3 W3 to T4 W2, with an extra attack
Lots of weapon changes


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/04 11:28:45


Post by: Tastyfish


Definitely a hit to the Serberys, but Jezzail still sounds rubbish.
[edit]Hmm, two shots for the Jezzail - no, still rubbish. I think it needed higher damage to properly find a place.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/04 13:18:40


Post by: Irbis


Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
 Kanluwen wrote:
Wild guess is that they'll put the Arquebus into its own category and Plasma Calivers and Arc Rifles will become 1 per 5, with Arquebus as its own thing.

Hopefully though? Ranger exclusivity for Arquebus at least.

There has to be more people fighting this garbage after Plague Marines, Blightlords, and Wyches.

You mean Deathwatch. Starting back in 7th edition. Of course, protests and warnings of DW players were outright ignored by "I got mine, why should I worry about this lame army, frak them" crowd and GW got message it's completely OK to start cutting options. After all they could do it in such comically stupid, ham handed way as Kelly and Cruddace butchered 7th edition DW and almost nobody cared. Hell, GW even found idiots defending destroying signature ability of a faction it had for decades (with insane non-arguments like 'look, this bolter doesn't have this tiny square button on the side, so it's totally OK to make it complete trash, what do you mean converting it takes seconds and your whole army has them, no rules for you') making them care even less.

So, yeah, let me play this tiniest sob violin of sympathy, I hope your army will get as much support and attention as DW did - zero. Then maybe people who complain when they were affected will get a clue when there was right time to start protesting. Five years ago


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/04 13:27:51


Post by: lord_blackfang


Lol. Chaos got half its stuff cut before Deathwatch was even a codex.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/04 14:14:29


Post by: H.B.M.C.


He loves bringing up Deathwatch again and again like it makes any difference (or has any bearing) to what's happening now.



Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/04 14:33:35


Post by: Dawnbringer


 H.B.M.C. wrote:
He loves bringing up Deathwatch again and again like it makes any difference (or has any bearing) to what's happening now.



Yeah, saying Deathwatch have existed for decades (as a codex) is a Trumpian stretch / break of the truth. They didn't have a 3rd edition codex like Daemonhunters and Witchhunters, though even those aren't old enough to be decades old.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/04 14:35:05


Post by: Kanluwen


If you know someone is posting poor quality arguments, just put them on ignore and move on.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/04 15:14:57


Post by: StarHunter25


I'm looking forward to base ap2 taser lances, as well as the assault cognis lascannons. I have been making great use of stratoraptors and dragoons, so this is just a buff assuming points don't go up too much. I might even consider some Ballistarius for those sweet 6 autocannon shots each. 3 of those could be great marine mulchers


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/04 16:15:02


Post by: Tiberius501


Were the Sulphurhounds Flamer faces always -2AP. If not that seems pretty nice. Shame they’ve gone to 2w though.

EDIT: I also hope that 4 attacks and -2AP makes Dragoons work a tiny bit better vs DG. I wanna use them cos they’re such awesome models, but they are so useless against them right now (useless against everything atm tbh, just especially vs DG lol).


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/04 21:05:44


Post by: Slayer-Fan123


Amazing the AdMech electric stuff gains AP but Necron Tesla doesn't for reasons!


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/04 23:04:15


Post by: xttz


Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
Amazing the AdMech electric stuff gains AP but Necron Tesla doesn't for reasons!


Because every unrelated faction should get identical wargear & points values?

Also a big factor in the old Dragoon taser lance was the ability to stack modifiers for exploding hits on 4+, effectively doubling their attacks for 1CP. I fully expect the new rules to change that into an unmodified 6, which is why they're seeing additional AP & attacks to compensate.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/04 23:10:22


Post by: TheGuest


It's already in an unmodified 6 since the 9th edition.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/05 01:22:01


Post by: Slayer-Fan123


 xttz wrote:
Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
Amazing the AdMech electric stuff gains AP but Necron Tesla doesn't for reasons!


Because every unrelated faction should get identical wargear & points values?

Also a big factor in the old Dragoon taser lance was the ability to stack modifiers for exploding hits on 4+, effectively doubling their attacks for 1CP. I fully expect the new rules to change that into an unmodified 6, which is why they're seeing additional AP & attacks to compensate.

It was based on Tesla and you know that.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/05 03:19:33


Post by: AngryAngel80


I hope that they don't mess with the weapon set ups for Skittari I have all my squads set up for my liking and I really don't want the headache of re working them all now, not do I want large squads just to run 2 arqs in a squad, I liked my 5 man heavy sniper units.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/05 04:13:43


Post by: AngryAngel80


I'm a fan of those who say " Who stood up for me ?!?! " Ignoring the fact some have stood up to the insanity of some GW choices each and every time they happen. Then proceed to tell everyone to suck it even if we understand their upset.

GW, please just release a codex and maybe have me be totally pleased with it, for once.

At least aside from the annoyance with Plague marine and blightlord weapon load outs the Deathguard book feels good.

At least they didn't crap all over DE and the book looks good and seems to feel good to those who could play it so far.

I hope the Ad mech book is going to be good and they don't mess around with the weapon load outs.I guess it serves me right for using my last box of skittari not too long ago to finish up squads. don't mess it up GW, please.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/05 04:18:56


Post by: Tiberius501


 AngryAngel80 wrote:
I'm a fan of those who say " Who stood up for me ?!?! " Ignoring the fact some have stood up to the insanity of some GW choices each and every time they happen. Then proceed to tell everyone to suck it even if we understand their upset.

GW, please just release a codex and maybe have me be totally pleased with it, for once.

At least aside from the annoyance with Plague marine and blightlord weapon load outs the Deathguard book feels good.

At least they didn't crap all over DE and the book looks good and seems to feel good to those who could play it so far.

I hope the Ad mech book is going to be good and they don't mess around with the weapon load outs.I guess it serves me right for using my last box of skittari not too long ago to finish up squads. don't mess it up GW, please.


*GW reads this message*

*Looks at Skitarii codex entry*

*Sees weapon option section, where they can only take what’s in the box*

*Sweats profusely*


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/05 04:58:52


Post by: Slayer-Fan123


 AngryAngel80 wrote:
I'm a fan of those who say " Who stood up for me ?!?! " Ignoring the fact some have stood up to the insanity of some GW choices each and every time they happen. Then proceed to tell everyone to suck it even if we understand their upset.

GW, please just release a codex and maybe have me be totally pleased with it, for once.

At least aside from the annoyance with Plague marine and blightlord weapon load outs the Deathguard book feels good.

At least they didn't crap all over DE and the book looks good and seems to feel good to those who could play it so far.

I hope the Ad mech book is going to be good and they don't mess around with the weapon load outs.I guess it serves me right for using my last box of skittari not too long ago to finish up squads. don't mess it up GW, please.

They cramped on Wyches actually and gave them the Plague Marine treatment.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/05 06:24:17


Post by: AngryAngel80


 Tiberius501 wrote:
 AngryAngel80 wrote:
I'm a fan of those who say " Who stood up for me ?!?! " Ignoring the fact some have stood up to the insanity of some GW choices each and every time they happen. Then proceed to tell everyone to suck it even if we understand their upset.

GW, please just release a codex and maybe have me be totally pleased with it, for once.

At least aside from the annoyance with Plague marine and blightlord weapon load outs the Deathguard book feels good.

At least they didn't crap all over DE and the book looks good and seems to feel good to those who could play it so far.

I hope the Ad mech book is going to be good and they don't mess around with the weapon load outs.I guess it serves me right for using my last box of skittari not too long ago to finish up squads. don't mess it up GW, please.


*GW reads this message*

*Looks at Skitarii codex entry*

*Sees weapon option section, where they can only take what’s in the box*

*Sweats profusely*


At least the sweat would show they care lol.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
 AngryAngel80 wrote:
I'm a fan of those who say " Who stood up for me ?!?! " Ignoring the fact some have stood up to the insanity of some GW choices each and every time they happen. Then proceed to tell everyone to suck it even if we understand their upset.

GW, please just release a codex and maybe have me be totally pleased with it, for once.

At least aside from the annoyance with Plague marine and blightlord weapon load outs the Deathguard book feels good.

At least they didn't crap all over DE and the book looks good and seems to feel good to those who could play it so far.

I hope the Ad mech book is going to be good and they don't mess around with the weapon load outs.I guess it serves me right for using my last box of skittari not too long ago to finish up squads. don't mess it up GW, please.

They cramped on Wyches actually and gave them the Plague Marine treatment.


Yeah that is why the DE as a whole wasn't crapped on. They seem to pick and choose what we can figure out to buy multiple boxes of and what we can't. That somehow we can figure out to buy multiple boxes for heavy weapons but troop boxes ? I'm afraid we are far too stupid to do that. Who would ever in a million years figure out if they wanted 2 of a weapon that only comes one in a box, buy more than one box and spread the weapons out among different squads.

This all makes me sweat for my Scions which live off their small squad with 2 special set ups as well. I don't even know, if they jack up all my squads I may just sit out 9th entirely, I mean at this point it's only a couple years away anyways till 10th where they may change their minds again.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/05 08:20:40


Post by: TheGuest


 Tiberius501 wrote:
 AngryAngel80 wrote:
I'm a fan of those who say " Who stood up for me ?!?! " Ignoring the fact some have stood up to the insanity of some GW choices each and every time they happen. Then proceed to tell everyone to suck it even if we understand their upset.

GW, please just release a codex and maybe have me be totally pleased with it, for once.

At least aside from the annoyance with Plague marine and blightlord weapon load outs the Deathguard book feels good.

At least they didn't crap all over DE and the book looks good and seems to feel good to those who could play it so far.

I hope the Ad mech book is going to be good and they don't mess around with the weapon load outs.I guess it serves me right for using my last box of skittari not too long ago to finish up squads. don't mess it up GW, please.


*GW reads this message*

*Looks at Skitarii codex entry*

*Sees weapon option section, where they can only take what’s in the box*

*Sweats profusely*


Be prepared people, that's exactly what'll happen.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/05 08:31:58


Post by: tneva82


 xttz wrote:
Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
Amazing the AdMech electric stuff gains AP but Necron Tesla doesn't for reasons!


Because every unrelated faction should get identical wargear & points values?

Also a big factor in the old Dragoon taser lance was the ability to stack modifiers for exploding hits on 4+, effectively doubling their attacks for 1CP. I fully expect the new rules to change that into an unmodified 6, which is why they're seeing additional AP & attacks to compensate.


That same thing could be said about tesla as well. Their big thing was 3 hits for 5+ or even 4+. That went away. And as for compensation? Became more expensive than gauss. Good compensation!


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 TheGuest wrote:

Be prepared people, that's exactly what'll happen.


Maybe. Maybe not. GW hasn't been fully consistent with that though.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/05 14:29:56


Post by: MajorWesJanson


tneva82 wrote:
Maybe. Maybe not. GW hasn't been fully consistent with that though.


Wyches get one of each wych weapon if they number 10 models. Box contains 10 models and one of each wych weapon.
Warriors get one blaster or shredder per 5, and 1 splinter cannon or dark lance per 10. Box of 10 contains one of each, leaving an extra heavy but can double on the special which requires a second box.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/06 06:15:23


Post by: AngryAngel80


I'm hoping they just don't mess with it. Like I finally enjoy my Arqs, but fielding one for 5 would be lame, so would 1 for 10 like what is in the box. The squad set ups aren't kicking butt all over there is no reason to jostle them up other than to be twits.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/06 06:18:50


Post by: tneva82


 MajorWesJanson wrote:
tneva82 wrote:
Maybe. Maybe not. GW hasn't been fully consistent with that though.


Wyches get one of each wych weapon if they number 10 models. Box contains 10 models and one of each wych weapon.
Warriors get one blaster or shredder per 5, and 1 splinter cannon or dark lance per 10. Box of 10 contains one of each, leaving an extra heavy but can double on the special which requires a second box.


I didn't say they don't do that for all. But it's not consistent as in every single release in 9e has had it. That's what "not consistent" means by definition. Some are, some aren't. You can't say it happens for certainty WHEN IT HASN'T HAPPENED FOR ALL UNITS SO FAR!

Odds are good but it's not certainty because it hasn't happened to every 9e book so far.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/06 12:35:39


Post by: TheGuest


tneva82 wrote:

I didn't say they don't do that for all. But it's not consistent as in every single release in 9e has had it. That's what "not consistent" means by definition. Some are, some aren't. You can't say it happens for certainty WHEN IT HASN'T HAPPENED FOR ALL UNITS SO FAR!

Odds are good but it's not certainty because it hasn't happened to every 9e book so far.


You are right but it'll happen for the skitarii anyway.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/06 12:43:43


Post by: the_scotsman


I dunno, I feel like they kind of did it semi-strategically with the drukhari.

Like, they wanted to make people field wracks in 5-man squads, wyches and kabals in 10. And wyches you can basically control their statlines via combat drugs, so they wanted to buff their weapons up a bit but probably didnt want to make it crazy powerful if you stacked on matching wargear to create, say, a 10-wych all razorflail unit with +1A drugs that gets like 60 attacks.

But they didnt feth much with kabals, becuase there always was a benefit to going to 10 - you get an extra special out of the deal.

And wracks I guess they just didnt want to go full death guard stupid of 'you can field a 5-man squd with 1 of each special weapon item'.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also, the only HQ they did it to was the haemonculus, whose sculpt has a weird funky 'four weapons' setup that never really worked with the flexible wargear setup. The basic haemonculus model was actually an illegal loadout for the longest time - haemie tools, scissorhand, stinger pistol and injector when in theory you were supposed to only have two of those.



Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/07 15:57:41


Post by: Slayer-Fan123


https://www.warhammer-community.com/2021/04/07/the-regimental-standard-failure-the-adeptus-mechanicus-and-you/
New regimental standard talks about AdMech, so more previews are inevitable I guess.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/07 16:04:26


Post by: lord_blackfang


Gah for a moment I thought that was an Ordinatus


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/07 17:59:09


Post by: Mr Morden


 lord_blackfang wrote:
Gah for a moment I thought that was an Ordinatus


Nope sadly all that cool stuff languishes in the world of 30k alone :(


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/13 13:19:13


Post by: Tiberius501


Oh wow, I really like the changes to the galvanic rifle and arc rifle!


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/13 13:31:48


Post by: Mad Doc Grotsnik


Decent boost for Galvanic Rifles. I always felt they were a bit lacking from their first release, but now they make a decent fire base if you ask me,


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/13 13:34:40


Post by: Quasistellar


I like all the changes. d3 damage on the Arc weapons is a bit "meh", but the haywire 4+ wounding is great.

At first I didn't like the change to heavy 2 on the galvanic rifles, but the more I think about it the more I don't mind -- often rangers are sitting still anyway, and it's more shots at range.

Strict improvements across the board.

Unfortunately, Ruststalkers will need more than an improvement on AP to be good. They really need a stratagem to let them deep strike closer or something -- really lean into the "stalker" aspect.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/13 13:41:56


Post by: Kanluwen


Ruststalkers just need Slaughtersprint from the Killclade back.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/13 14:01:04


Post by: Fergie0044


Nice to see arc rifles finally behaving like they're supposed to! The old extra damage against vehicles bonus didn't come up much when you were only wounding them on a 5+!

Galvanic rifles being heavy is a bit weird, but its not like my rangers moved much I suppose.

I really want confirmation on the special weapon loads out restrictions (if any). Are the Skitarii going to get screwed like Plague Marines were?


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/13 14:02:45


Post by: Tiberius501


I think the heavy on galvanic rifles makes sense. They’re big, long rifles which seem made for firing when stationary. While the carbines of the vanguard are for firing on the move. Gives me WW1/2 weapon vibes.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/13 14:06:45


Post by: Chopstick


That's a nice Killteam buff for them.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/13 15:38:43


Post by: Slayer-Fan123


New Galvanic Rifles are pretty decent for how I was using them before. The Arq is what I'm really interested in though.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/13 15:52:05


Post by: Tiberius501


Please rip the bandaid off and show us how bad our weapon option restrictions are now. I’m really happy with these weapon changes, but I’m quite anxious about the restrictions coming in, like DG and DEldar.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/13 16:12:55


Post by: H.B.M.C.


Oh, that's fantastic. I was worried that the game wasn't deadly enough.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/13 22:15:07


Post by: MajorWesJanson


 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Oh, that's fantastic. I was worried that the game wasn't deadly enough.


A lot of it is just baking changes into the stat lines and making them more consistent, replacing bespoke rules. Instead of a special assault rule on heavy weapons, they are just assault weapons now. Rangers now have the AP consistently speeding up rolls, and more shots at range, but trade that for being heavy and thus less mobile.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/13 22:15:48


Post by: Voss


 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Oh, that's fantastic. I was worried that the game wasn't deadly enough.


Its pretty clear at this point that everyone is going to get adapted to the 2 Wound Space Marine era (which means the Chaos marines are going to come in in a kind of sad state, as they hit tables that are already adapted to them).

The big problem, that GW doesn't even seem vaguely aware of, is that vehicles and monsters are now made of paper. It was already a problem, but there's been some element of random swinginess to it with all the d6s. Now there's just so many D3+3 or d6+2 weapons running around that armored vehicles and 'big scary monsters' are simply a joke.


Huh. I was thinking of digging tyranids out and doing a medium bug focused force. I... don't think I will. Its just too easy to scoop out the chunky center and then mop up the little stuff.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/13 22:18:39


Post by: alextroy


Voss wrote:
The big problem, that GW doesn't even seem vaguely aware of, is that vehicles and monsters are now made of paper. It was already a problem, but there's been some element of random swinginess to it with all the d6s. Now there's just so many D3+3 or d6+2 weapons running around that armored vehicles and 'big scary monsters' are simply a joke.
And the circular anti-tank weapon debate continues:

"My anti-tank weapons can't kill tanks fast enough."
"Here's some more powerful anti-tank weapons"
"My tanks are dying too fast."


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/13 22:24:56


Post by: Sunny Side Up


 alextroy wrote:
Voss wrote:
The big problem, that GW doesn't even seem vaguely aware of, is that vehicles and monsters are now made of paper. It was already a problem, but there's been some element of random swinginess to it with all the d6s. Now there's just so many D3+3 or d6+2 weapons running around that armored vehicles and 'big scary monsters' are simply a joke.
And the circular anti-tank weapon debate continues:

"My anti-tank weapons can't kill tanks fast enough."
"Here's some more powerful anti-tank weapons"
"My tanks are dying too fast."


Which is honestly only solvable by limiting the number of tanks/monsters and especially super-heavies.

If the anti-tank/tank balance is right so 2000 points of all-tanks/monsters/knights don't run roughshod over everything, having just 500 or 1000 points worth of them in a 2000 point game is usually moot. If the anti-tank/tank balance is right that, say, a single tank and 2 transport make comfortable, tough-enough anchor-points in a 2000 points army, skewing a list to be all-tanks/monsters/knights/etc.. will probably be OP as hell.



Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/13 22:31:11


Post by: Voss


 alextroy wrote:
Voss wrote:
The big problem, that GW doesn't even seem vaguely aware of, is that vehicles and monsters are now made of paper. It was already a problem, but there's been some element of random swinginess to it with all the d6s. Now there's just so many D3+3 or d6+2 weapons running around that armored vehicles and 'big scary monsters' are simply a joke.
And the circular anti-tank weapon debate continues:

"My anti-tank weapons can't kill tanks fast enough."
"Here's some more powerful anti-tank weapons"
"My tanks are dying too fast."


That hasn't been a circle for quite a while. Gun output has been static until recently.
The problem has been way too much unpredictable random results, with both the current system and the old penetration/glancing system. Sometimes you can pound on tanks for ages, other times they pop in a couple shots.

But when you only need 2-3 successful hits from big guns (which frankly now come in the numbers of 'lots'), and 4 from a special weapon that you can take 3/squad (and rapid fires) to kill a battle tank, you've pretty clearly gone too far.
Think about how many torsion cannons and cognis lascannons you can just drop into an Ad Mech list. One's a troops choice, for crying out loud! And the new arc rifle is just something you can toss onto the cheap units and its absurdly effective AT. Plus yeah, all the non-AT weapons that win by weight of dice.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/13 23:34:16


Post by: H.B.M.C.


 alextroy wrote:
And the circular anti-tank weapon debate continues:

"My anti-tank weapons can't kill tanks fast enough."
"Here's some more powerful anti-tank weapons"
"My tanks are dying too fast."
It's only circular if you don't understand what the problem is.

Tanks are too easy to kill, and there are too many mid-strength mid-damage multi-shot weapons making AT weapons a waste of time because you're better off with the smaller stuff as you just put out more shots. Rolling more dice = more likely to get a good result.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/14 16:39:53


Post by: StarHunter25


IMO the reason why tanks & monsters are as squishy as they are is because GW went over their S10 cap over and over, but never their t10 (really 8) cap. If Land Raiders were t12 w16 2+, holy heck that's gonna be tough to crack. A great opportunity for stat granularity came and went in the blink of an eye. Unfortunately, this will never change. But as someone who loves their Ryza AdMech, I'll laugh in binary as everything burns to ash.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/14 23:50:55


Post by: MajorWesJanson


StarHunter25 wrote:
IMO the reason why tanks & monsters are as squishy as they are is because GW went over their S10 cap over and over, but never their t10 (really 8) cap. If Land Raiders were t12 w16 2+, holy heck that's gonna be tough to crack. A great opportunity for stat granularity came and went in the blink of an eye. Unfortunately, this will never change. But as someone who loves their Ryza AdMech, I'll laugh in binary as everything burns to ash.


Agreed. It actually got worse at the high ends- titans dropped in toughness by a ton. Warlords went from T16 down to T9. With damage becoming more reliable, toughness needs to go up for mid and high end vehicles. Before, AV 14 Land Raiders took 4 results of a 5+ on a S9 Lascannon to kill. Now the lascannon does 4-6 damage a shot vs 16 wounds T8, 3 or 4 hits wounding on 3+ will do the job. Going to T12 for heavy vehicles would also help smooth out the S6 vs S7 transition a bit as well. Land Raiders, Monoliths, Tyrannofex scale monsters, Baneblades ar T12, Russes, Battlewagons, carnifexes and greater daemons at T10, most tanks and monsters in the T 8-9 range. Transports at 7-8. Light vehicles at 6-7, up from 5 or 6 now.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/15 05:57:10


Post by: AngryAngel80


 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Oh, that's fantastic. I was worried that the game wasn't deadly enough.


Well just so you can sleep well, they are making sure the ad mech is deadlier than ever before ! You'll have the whole seat to read the codex, but you'll only need the EDGE !!!!


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/24 07:00:13


Post by: Olthannon




Saw this pop up on reddit this morning as a potential leak for the combat patrol.

Was sort of expecting the marshal to be in it as opposed to an enginseer.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/24 09:00:47


Post by: H.B.M.C.


Put the new hotness in the new box? Can't imagine them doing that.

At least it's not a Tech-Priest Dominus mini. I'm no longer sure how many of those I own because of how they came just about in every box and bundle.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/24 09:25:59


Post by: Wha-Mu-077


 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Put the new hotness in the new box? Can't imagine them doing that.

At least it's not a Tech-Priest Dominus mini. I'm no longer sure how many of those I own because of how they came just about in every box and bundle.


I mean, they removed them from the Start Collecting too


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/24 09:41:41


Post by: Fergie0044


That's a good box, 2 or 3 of them is a great way to start Ad Mech. Assuming its £85 like the previous ones, its a saving of £42.50 (if you believe the priest is worth the default £20 is another matter though).


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/24 11:24:54


Post by: JWBS


Seems good, reinforces what I originally thought about Combat Patrols, contrary to most, that they're good value ala Start Collecting, but different, making them a great buying opportunity for new players and veterans alike. Some of them haven't panned out that way but some definitely have (like this one, I'm not super fussed about those tracked servitors but the rest is spot on and the value seems to be the same as SC). Personally I'm now looking forward to GSC, I assume it'll still be a long time off but will maybe include a Rockgrinder. I'm doen buying SC GSC, it being my favourite one I bought a few of them, but I'll potentially buy a CP GSC, which is a positive for both myself and GW. So yeah, I still think the CP (or SC mkii if you like) sets are a good idea whose value depends heavily on what they choose to include, and not, as some people will say, and inferior, more expensive, more cynical version of SC.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/24 11:34:17


Post by: Arbitrator


 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Put the new hotness in the new box? Can't imagine them doing that.

At least it's not a Tech-Priest Dominus mini. I'm no longer sure how many of those I own because of how they came just about in every box and bundle.

To be fair, didn't the last Mechanicus SC include the Not-Higgins boat?

Makes sense they'd including the Tech-Priest, since none was buying those over the old metal Guard one for less than half the price.

I still think Combat Patrol(tm) boxes are worse than a Start Collecting for actually functioning as starter boxes, since the novelty of the latter was they're relatively cheap 'n cheerful compared to the rest of the hobby for what you get. Cranking the price up higher is more likely to give Mrs Jacobs a heart attack when she sees the pound signs and tell Lil Timmy he's getting a video game instead.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/24 11:45:43


Post by: Kanluwen


Frankly, I think this one just isn't great. Nobody complained about the prices on Skitarii--it's the Electropriests and Kataphrons that are the issue for a $$$ perspective.

I would far, far rather have seen this as a Dominus+Kataphron+Electropriests box, with either Priests or Kataphron doubled up.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/24 11:49:42


Post by: Sotahullu


- Dunewalke 60€/45£
- Skitarii 35€/27.50£
- Kataphron 46€/35£
- Enginseer 25€/20£
Total: 166€/127.50£

So that set does save money but I think there could be better choices for box content.


Although I will recommend getting AM current getting started set if possible before that drops.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/24 13:58:01


Post by: JWBS


So the criticisms are that this box isn't 100% optimal? With respect, that will never be the case, because as soon as this box includes whatever exact units people want to see all bundled up for cheap, there becomes a new king of "This is too expensive because it isn't in a value box" (ie Serberys for AdMech, they'll be eligible for a value box eventually and people will say "This box would be better with Serberys because currently there's no way to buy Serberys at a discount"). The only way to please literally everyone would be to include every option in some sort of discount buy, aka a range-wide price reduction.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/24 14:27:02


Post by: Olthannon


I think it's more the fact that this is barely 500 points, and I thought the idea was that each combat patrol was at least enough to play a game. I assume the points of various units will be going up with the new codex.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/24 14:27:07


Post by: Wha-Mu-077


So. It's basically a rehash of the previous start collecting, but with 3 (count 'em) more minis, that's presumably gonna cost twice as much? Is this why they replaced the previous Start Collecting so recently?


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/24 14:39:26


Post by: Kanluwen


I'm not going to pretend to speak for anyone else.

For me? It's the lack of a 'theme' in the box. Compare this to the Drukhari, Death Guard, or Space Wolves sets. They all have a kind of 'theme' going through them. Drukhari is Kabal with a token squad of Incubi, Death Guard is Typhus+some Plague Marines with some Zombie buddies, and Space Wolves is a hunting pack with some Hounds of Morkai and an Invictor.

This just feels like they took the previous Start Collectings, removed the Skorpius from the most recent and removed the Dominus from the first one, and threw in Kataphron before calling it a day.

It actually is disheartening to see such little thought put into it...and it bodes poorly for the Datasmiths getting put into HQ, which they should be if Enginseers are HQ choices, as that could have been a 3 kit box if they'd gone Kataphrons+Kastelans+Electropriests--bam, the trifecta of overpriced Cult products in one go!


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Olthannon wrote:
I think it's more the fact that this is barely 500 points, and I thought the idea was that each combat patrol was at least enough to play a game. I assume the points of various units will be going up with the new codex.

This too!


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/24 15:03:52


Post by: endlesswaltz123


 MajorWesJanson wrote:
StarHunter25 wrote:
IMO the reason why tanks & monsters are as squishy as they are is because GW went over their S10 cap over and over, but never their t10 (really 8) cap. If Land Raiders were t12 w16 2+, holy heck that's gonna be tough to crack. A great opportunity for stat granularity came and went in the blink of an eye. Unfortunately, this will never change. But as someone who loves their Ryza AdMech, I'll laugh in binary as everything burns to ash.


Agreed. It actually got worse at the high ends- titans dropped in toughness by a ton. Warlords went from T16 down to T9. With damage becoming more reliable, toughness needs to go up for mid and high end vehicles. Before, AV 14 Land Raiders took 4 results of a 5+ on a S9 Lascannon to kill. Now the lascannon does 4-6 damage a shot vs 16 wounds T8, 3 or 4 hits wounding on 3+ will do the job. Going to T12 for heavy vehicles would also help smooth out the S6 vs S7 transition a bit as well. Land Raiders, Monoliths, Tyrannofex scale monsters, Baneblades ar T12, Russes, Battlewagons, carnifexes and greater daemons at T10, most tanks and monsters in the T 8-9 range. Transports at 7-8. Light vehicles at 6-7, up from 5 or 6 now.


In addition to this, I think a version of the old double toughness rule of the strength of the weapon need to be brought in (usually would be unable to wound). I'd make it triple the toughness maybe, or if toughness is over double the weapon cannot wound it. There really is zero reason bolt rifles should be able to hose down multiple wounds on nearly any armoured vehicle, let alone the heavier ones. The only issue is mid tier strength, high output weapons. Heck, I'd reintroduce the old wounding mechanic wholesale personally, I think that alone would solve a lot of problems, though many vehicles do need a shunt up in toughness still.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Kanluwen wrote:
I'm not going to pretend to speak for anyone else.

For me? It's the lack of a 'theme' in the box. Compare this to the Drukhari, Death Guard, or Space Wolves sets. They all have a kind of 'theme' going through them. Drukhari is Kabal with a token squad of Incubi, Death Guard is Typhus+some Plague Marines with some Zombie buddies, and Space Wolves is a hunting pack with some Hounds of Morkai and an Invictor.

This just feels like they took the previous Start Collectings, removed the Skorpius from the most recent and removed the Dominus from the first one, and threw in Kataphron before calling it a day.

It actually is disheartening to see such little thought put into it...and it bodes poorly for the Datasmiths getting put into HQ, which they should be if Enginseers are HQ choices, as that could have been a 3 kit box if they'd gone Kataphrons+Kastelans+Electropriests--bam, the trifecta of overpriced Cult products in one go!


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Olthannon wrote:
I think it's more the fact that this is barely 500 points, and I thought the idea was that each combat patrol was at least enough to play a game. I assume the points of various units will be going up with the new codex.

This too!


I disagree, why be funnelled down a 'theme' with a start collecting box. It should be a good base for nearly any new starter to the army, no matter what direction they decide to take their army.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/24 15:22:54


Post by: MajorWesJanson


The combat patrol isnt really exciting, but it is really functional. Enginseers are cheap HQs and can be used in Guard armies as well, so buying 2-3 of these doesnt leave you with extra characters just taking up space like Typhus


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/24 15:41:34


Post by: Kanluwen


 endlesswaltz123 wrote:

I disagree, why be funnelled down a 'theme' with a start collecting box. It should be a good base for nearly any new starter to the army, no matter what direction they decide to take their army.

Then it fails miserably at that too, unless there are drastic changes to the way AdMech is going to function again.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 MajorWesJanson wrote:
The combat patrol isnt really exciting, but it is really functional. Enginseers are cheap HQs and can be used in Guard armies as well, so buying 2-3 of these doesnt leave you with extra characters just taking up space like Typhus

And that's fundamentally what makes this a less than stellar box in my eyes. This isn't an "army in a box" or a genuine start to a collection. It's a glorified Start Collecting/discount box.

This is a wasted opportunity to put the more expensive Cult releases(Kataphron and Electropriests, notably) in alongside of a token HQ like the Enginseer(who is an Elite choice in Guard, as a reminder). Those items were wildly overpriced to begin with and still are.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/24 16:16:01


Post by: tneva82


 Olthannon wrote:
I think it's more the fact that this is barely 500 points, and I thought the idea was that each combat patrol was at least enough to play a game. I assume the points of various units will be going up with the new codex.


Goal is to have 25pl in it


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/24 16:22:25


Post by: H.B.M.C.


 Kanluwen wrote:
It's a glorified Start Collecting/discount box.
That's what these Combat Patrol boxes are. They're just a slightly increased barrier to entry containing a slightly larger group of minis than the SC! boxes.

The Blood Angel and Dark Eldar ones are, I believe, the only ones offering any real value. And on the opposite end of the spectrum you've got the Deathwatch one which doesn't actually come with a single Deathwatch mini, just Primaris and upgrade sprues, and the Death Guard one, that comes with a special character, an illegal choice of units, and 3 incomplete Plague Marines. These are not great boxes.

 Arbitrator wrote:
To be fair, didn't the last Mechanicus SC include the Not-Higgins boat?
 Wha-Mu-077 wrote:
I mean, they removed them from the Start Collecting too
Hence why I said "just about in every box" rather than "in every box". This site already has one Irbis, who jumps into threads to nitpick the most innocuous and irrelevant details, often missing the context or meaning of what it is he's criticising. We don't need two more.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/24 16:28:16


Post by: JWBS


The value calculation has been done above and the result is £127.5 of stuff for £85. That's a 30% saving, you have to have a post-modern perspective on the definition of 'real' to say that's not real.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/24 18:06:36


Post by: alextroy


tneva82 wrote:
 Olthannon wrote:
I think it's more the fact that this is barely 500 points, and I thought the idea was that each combat patrol was at least enough to play a game. I assume the points of various units will be going up with the new codex.


Goal is to have 25pl in it
- Dunecrawler PL 6
- Skitarii PL 5 at 10 model unit or PL 6 as two 5 Model units
- Kataphron PL 5 (Breachers) or PL 7 (Destroyers)
- Enginseer PL 2
Total: PL 18 to 21

So a bit of a miss on the Combat Patrol target unless there are some serious PL/Points increases coming in these units.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/24 18:08:49


Post by: Wha-Mu-077


tneva82 wrote:
 Olthannon wrote:
I think it's more the fact that this is barely 500 points, and I thought the idea was that each combat patrol was at least enough to play a game. I assume the points of various units will be going up with the new codex.


Goal is to have 25pl in it


Shame literally nobody cares about PL


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/24 18:35:33


Post by: MajorWesJanson


 Wha-Mu-077 wrote:
tneva82 wrote:
 Olthannon wrote:
I think it's more the fact that this is barely 500 points, and I thought the idea was that each combat patrol was at least enough to play a game. I assume the points of various units will be going up with the new codex.


Goal is to have 25pl in it


Shame literally nobody cares about PL


Crusade is king locally. Stating opinion as fact is poor debate


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/24 20:21:32


Post by: Olthannon


Even PL wise its not on target.

Thing is I like the box and the minis are a good pick. Fairly solid set up which is what you want for a battalion box. Just it could have done with another unit to bulk it up. Something a little unusual for a change that would have made up the numbers.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/24 20:36:56


Post by: Imateria


It does feel a little empty. 2 troops, and HQ and a vehicle is alright but Drukhari had an HQ, troops, an elite, a transport and a gunboat that could be built as another transport. Definitely feels like it could have had another unit in there, but thats probably more a reflection of how expensive their models are.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/24 20:55:03


Post by: Nostromodamus


 Wha-Mu-077 wrote:
tneva82 wrote:
 Olthannon wrote:
I think it's more the fact that this is barely 500 points, and I thought the idea was that each combat patrol was at least enough to play a game. I assume the points of various units will be going up with the new codex.


Goal is to have 25pl in it


Shame literally nobody cares about PL


It’s the only way I play nowadays and I’m getting really tired of people trying to tell me I’m playing toy soldiers wrong for doing so.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/24 21:41:38


Post by: tneva82


 Olthannon wrote:
Even PL wise its not on target.

Thing is I like the box and the minis are a good pick. Fairly solid set up which is what you want for a battalion box. Just it could have done with another unit to bulk it up. Something a little unusual for a change that would have made up the numbers.


Well assuming no pl changes.

Also another unit=higher price.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/24 22:07:42


Post by: Fergie0044


I hope we will see some point/PL increases with the new codex - alongside an appropriate buff for the units. I really didn't like how 8th edition turned my semi-elite techy boys into a sort of horde army.

As for the box set, for a beginner I think it serves really well as a foundation for an army. I'm not sure why people doesn't think it have a theme - it screams 'Ad Mech gunline' to me.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/24 22:24:39


Post by: Irbis


tneva82 wrote:
Also another unit=higher price.

Wot?

It's barely better than old, excellent value AM start collecting box. For nearly twice the price. They already had huge price jump, throwing in 5 more troops wouldn't touch GW profits one bit and it would do a lot to assuage complains.

It feels every CP box is becoming more and more garbage, just look at a whole TEN minis in DA one and now this...


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/24 22:33:15


Post by: kurhanik


So...is this literally the old Start Collecting box, but with the HQ swapped out and a Kataphron unit added in? The old one was 90 bucks before they replaced it right? That means bumping up to 140, and noting that the Enginseer is apparently 3$ cheaper than the Dominus (though both are drastically overpriced), the savings on this compared to the old box would be....5$. But on the whole, it increases the barrier for entry.

I've said it before, but I feel that if the Combat Patrols were in addition to Start Collecting boxes, they would be fantastic. You'd have a "Start Here" box plus an "Expand Here" box to get a small army fast. Replacing them wholesale just makes the entry point into the hobby more expensive, and makes me less likely to spend on it. I've for one have bought several of the Start Collecting boxes for "eventually" projects, because in Warhammer terms they were cheap and gave a small baseline, but haven't even touched the Combat Patrols - I find the concept of 1-5 extra models in the box for an additional 50 dollars a bit too rich for my taste.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/24 22:41:41


Post by: Wha-Mu-077


 Irbis wrote:
tneva82 wrote:
Also another unit=higher price.

It's barely better than old, excellent value AM start collecting box. For nearly twice the price. They already had huge price jump, throwing in 5 more troops wouldn't touch GW profits one bit and it would do a lot to assuage complains.


Not 5, 3. 3 more troops


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/24 22:43:43


Post by: Irbis


 kurhanik wrote:
I've said it before, but I feel that if the Combat Patrols were in addition to Start Collecting boxes, they would be fantastic. You'd have a "Start Here" box plus an "Expand Here" box to get a small army fast. Replacing them wholesale just makes the entry point into the hobby more expensive, and makes me less likely to spend on it. I've for one have bought several of the Start Collecting boxes for "eventually" projects, because in Warhammer terms they were cheap and gave a small baseline, but haven't even touched the Combat Patrols - I find the concept of 1-5 extra models in the box for an additional 50 dollars a bit too rich for my taste.

What is really funny is the fact that they DID this before!

I still remember Blood of Baal (BA vs Tyranids) - it had both base box, and expansion. I also recall expansions to similar boxes for SM, CSM, SW, and orks. I still regret not getting it, even though it was kinda overpriced in my local shop at the time - it would be a bargain today

Yes, yes, I get GW can't produce fast enough, and selling for very high prices might be better than being permanently understocked, but they are really killing the hobby side of things by scaring away new customers (and burning out the old) in their constant pursuit of ever higher $$$...


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/25 06:18:06


Post by: tneva82


 Irbis wrote:
tneva82 wrote:
Also another unit=higher price.

Wot?

It's barely better than old, excellent value AM start collecting box. For nearly twice the price. They already had huge price jump, throwing in 5 more troops wouldn't touch GW profits one bit and it would do a lot to assuage complains.

It feels every CP box is becoming more and more garbage, just look at a whole TEN minis in DA one and now this...


It already has about 30% discount. You really think gw is going to give it bigger? 127.5 for 85. If you think gw wouldnt add up to price i got island to sell for you.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/25 07:12:02


Post by: Sunny Side Up


Honestly, PL got off to a bad reputation due to "competitive" players hating it on principle just to be edgy.

But the new, much more streamlined points in all the 9th ed. books with points removed for 95% of all options is now essentially just a PL system that's only still called "points" to market it to the PL-haters.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/25 09:35:36


Post by: CMLR


Not to be pessimistic, but I'm very afraid of what this could mean for the Tau CP. The current SC! is basically the best one in the 40K range and it's base 19 PL already.

Screw over it and add something like Pathfinders or trade the Ethereal for and Enforcer or a Fireblade and a Devilfish and this could be either an alright change or pretty much a price increase for the sake of it.

Yeah, so far the only CP to really work for me has been the DE one. That box is just heavy.

At least this one still encourages you to buy more than one box, but my FLGS still has one with Cawl in it, if I want to buy it.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/25 09:49:48


Post by: AngryAngel80


From a more seasoned player, I like the box more, as I couldn't want another Dominus but I also can't use another onager, so the box is a wash for me.

Of course GW cheap it up, it's GW the more money they make the worse deals they want to give. So for that I'm about as surprised as I am Tuesday comes after Monday.

If its a good buy, really is up to the new players and what they feel they get out of the box at this point.

At least it's not the worst and is better imo than the DG offering.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/25 10:36:59


Post by: Irbis


tneva82 wrote:
It already has about 30% discount. You really think gw is going to give it bigger? 127.5 for 85. If you think gw wouldnt add up to price i got island to sell for you.

Well, seeing past boxes had 50% off, yes, I expected them to keep doing so, especially when they already killed attractiveness of 'starter' boxes by squashing the impulse buy appeal. Especially seeing they don't even keep the 25 CP promise. Silly me

 CMLR wrote:
Not to be pessimistic, but I'm very afraid of what this could mean for the Tau CP. The current SC! is basically the best one in the 40K range and it's base 19 PL already.

I was mildly optimistic after DE, but that was obviously just a fluke seeing they had someone pushing them hard in both mini and rule department. Expect 10 minis, like DA box, they will probably throw in stealth suits, double price, and call it a day...

 AngryAngel80 wrote:
From a more seasoned player, I like the box more, as I couldn't want another Dominus

Dunno why people keep saying this when it just makes no sense. First, Dominus is more expensive, so the box would be more attractive with him. Second, they didn't run any boxes with Dominus for years now so no new player is going to have him, and big mini would be more appealing to someone starting than a mook who can be easily converted from a Skitarii and doesn't even look that different to them. Third, finally, if you really need seer more than Dominus it's trivial to convert him into one. Replace head, cut off bottom to make him 'human' sized, done. Converting into other direction is far harder. There is literally zero appeal in seers. The only reason GW started to put them into boxes is to price gouge the new players who need Dominus, if only because higher points tag actually helps them field legal army. No one besides min-maxing wombo-combos with big collection has any need for seer, and these types are the last people who should be considered for starter box...


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/25 13:04:02


Post by: The Black Adder


I've got a reasonable amount of admech but having seen that the transport has disappeared in the transition from start collecting to combat patrol box I've just ordered 2 more of the SC boxes. More skitarii for weapon options and the possibility of themed ranger or vanguard forces are always welcome and I'll probably make one of the HQs into a genestealer cult HQ.

I'll probably also grab a CP box on release too as it has at least £80 of models I want.

I think either box makes a good option for a new player, they both have big discounts and don't include any special characters that you wouldn't want duplicates of.

I've just seen the dice leaked images and whilst nothing special it'll be good to have some so I'll probably try to grab a few packs when the pre-orders go up.

Edit:
Dice pics here https://spruesandbrews-com.cdn.ampproject.org/v/s/spruesandbrews.com/2021/04/24/adeptus-mechanicus-combat-patrol-and-dice-spotted/amp/?amp_js_v=a6&_gsa=1&usqp=mq331AQFKAGwASA%3D#aoh=16193474403897&csi=0&referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com&_tf=From%20%251%24s&share=https%3A%2F%2Fspruesandbrews.com%2F2021%2F04%2F24%2Fadeptus-mechanicus-combat-patrol-and-dice-spotted%2F

Somebody with some know how can direct link to the image.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/26 06:46:11


Post by: AngryAngel80


 Irbis wrote:
tneva82 wrote:
It already has about 30% discount. You really think gw is going to give it bigger? 127.5 for 85. If you think gw wouldnt add up to price i got island to sell for you.

Well, seeing past boxes had 50% off, yes, I expected them to keep doing so, especially when they already killed attractiveness of 'starter' boxes by squashing the impulse buy appeal. Especially seeing they don't even keep the 25 CP promise. Silly me

 CMLR wrote:
Not to be pessimistic, but I'm very afraid of what this could mean for the Tau CP. The current SC! is basically the best one in the 40K range and it's base 19 PL already.

I was mildly optimistic after DE, but that was obviously just a fluke seeing they had someone pushing them hard in both mini and rule department. Expect 10 minis, like DA box, they will probably throw in stealth suits, double price, and call it a day...

 AngryAngel80 wrote:
From a more seasoned player, I like the box more, as I couldn't want another Dominus

Dunno why people keep saying this when it just makes no sense. First, Dominus is more expensive, so the box would be more attractive with him. Second, they didn't run any boxes with Dominus for years now so no new player is going to have him, and big mini would be more appealing to someone starting than a mook who can be easily converted from a Skitarii and doesn't even look that different to them. Third, finally, if you really need seer more than Dominus it's trivial to convert him into one. Replace head, cut off bottom to make him 'human' sized, done. Converting into other direction is far harder. There is literally zero appeal in seers. The only reason GW started to put them into boxes is to price gouge the new players who need Dominus, if only because higher points tag actually helps them field legal army. No one besides min-maxing wombo-combos with big collection has any need for seer, and these types are the last people who should be considered for starter box...


You did read the part where I said " As a more seasoned player " yeah ? If GW wanted to make it a better savings, they would, they did not. However you can't also over look that one of each troop box is a good idea for a new player. I don't really think its an amazing box. To their credit though, they may have gotten some requests to use a different HQ unit now and then as the Dominus was all over for awhile.

Though honestly I don't think Ad mech is an army a new player would be steered to with how costly it can be for them so not sure how much milking they will do with the Dominus. Even before it was more expensive I'd seen a good number of new Ad mech players burn out when the cost mounted to high for the fun they would have with them.That experience is of course anecdotal but I can't imagine it hasn't happened to fresh players with them and other such factions around more than just my area. Some of these forces are stupid expensive to really flesh out to be functional.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I'll say as well, the dice look nice, but I am sure they'll cost so much they won't feel nice. We will see I suppose.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/26 08:52:49


Post by: H.B.M.C.


 AngryAngel80 wrote:
I'll say as well, the dice look nice, but I am sure they'll cost so much they won't feel nice. We will see I suppose.
There are two things that could make me buy dice: The symbol of the Inquisition, and the symbol the Adeptus Mechanicus. I fear I won't be able to resist these.

 AngryAngel80 wrote:
You did read the part where I said " As a more seasoned player " yeah ?
Look who you're talking to?



Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/26 11:15:40


Post by: Kanluwen


Spoiler:

Dice image, in case anyone doesn't want to have to click through to Sprues & Brews.

They're very RED.

Also there's that big, weird exoskeletally equipped Techpriest again!


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/26 12:13:03


Post by: ImAGeek


Well yeah, it’s the codex cover.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/04/26 12:29:02


Post by: Kanluwen


Look you, the point is that it's still a weird dang thing to see!


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/08 19:15:14


Post by: laam999


Kataphron box leaks! breachers have a 2+ and destroyers a 3+

https://www.reddit.com/r/AdeptusMechanicus/comments/n7ufy0/kataphron_boxed_rules/


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/09 09:28:21


Post by: Dysartes


Quite nice dice - good and legible.

As an aside, given we're in May, should the thread title get an update?


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/09 17:35:08


Post by: MajorWesJanson


 Dysartes wrote:
Quite nice dice - good and legible.

As an aside, given we're in May, should the thread title get an update?


Just replace April with a question mark, since Vampires are up next for some reason. Bit of breathing room for my wallet at least.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/09 20:03:41


Post by: AngryAngel80


Vampires killed the ad mech !!!

That said, I'm really on the ropes about the dice. I may just break down and get them, but I know I'll dislike doing so later as they'll be expensive for dice. At least they are easy to read.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/10 13:20:09


Post by: Kanluwen


Really, really frustrating that they were so dismissive of AdMech during Warhammer Fest while there was a reveal/discussion on a model that literally goes up for preorder on Saturday.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/10 13:25:21


Post by: ImAGeek


 Kanluwen wrote:
Really, really frustrating that they were so dismissive of AdMech during Warhammer Fest while there was a reveal/discussion on a model that literally goes up for preorder on Saturday.


It’s weird, but the difference is that everything for AdMech is already revealed, while the vampire stuff wasn’t. Still, I was sure it would be AdMech this weekend, and definitely before the Vamps.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/10 13:33:02


Post by: Octovol


 Kanluwen wrote:
Really, really frustrating that they were so dismissive of AdMech during Warhammer Fest while there was a reveal/discussion on a model that literally goes up for preorder on Saturday.


The worst thing for me was that sure, there was nothing Admech left to reveal, fair enough, I don't expect rules previews at events like this, so no discussion on it because it was so imminently close to release. Yet somehow not as imminent as a whole lot of stuff that people have been waiting a pretty short amount of time for that's all of a sudden up for pre-order. They're really picking and choosing what to delay and what not to delay and we seem to be at the bottom of the pecking order. Feels like the Admech codex has been delayed several times by now so that other releases can be more complete. We've already had a codex supplement come out before the actual supplement and even had a second supplement announced before even the release date of the codex!

Just release the damn book! Hell, we haven't even had any rules previews for the marshall yet, not even an inkling of what role it plays or what it can do and yet we're supposed to believe the codex is so close to release there's nothing more to talk about? No codex rules, no canticles revamp? Nothing? I mean we're not exactly as downtrodden as craftworlds or GSC or Tau, but they've had nothing at all so they expect nothing, rather than dangling a whole load of stuff in front of them and constantly keeping it out of reach.

We've over a years worth of models not even in our current codex, something like 10 datasheets lol


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/10 13:34:06


Post by: Kanluwen


So what if "everything was already revealed"? We had three shows that covered Vampire stuff. We know more about Kragnos than we do the Skitarii Marshal.

It's extremely vexing. They could have taken a few damn minutes and just flashed his stats up on the screen on one of the two 40k days. Or instead of talking about the "Roadshows" coming back.

PS:
I genuinely don't believe that we've seen everything. "No model, no rules" also supposedly applies to "No art". Whatever the hell is on the cover of the book has been prominent and it is not a standard Techpriest.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/10 13:40:18


Post by: Quasistellar


I mean, what if it's just as simple as some of the AdMech books or some special yet unseen AdMech model were held up on a container somewhere and still isn't ready for simultaneous global release, while the Vamp stuff just happens to be ready?

I'm of the opinion that occam's razor applies to most of this stuff. Global shipping has been fubar.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/10 13:51:20


Post by: ImAGeek


The no art that isn’t models isn’t anywhere near as strict as it was these days. And if that thing on the cover was coming as a model, they’d have shown it by now. They don’t really do surprise model drops anymore.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/10 13:51:22


Post by: Kanluwen


Doesn't fly, they've been holding things back regionally for the past year. They did it as recently as the Lumineth release, with everywhere but North America getting the Shrine Luminor at launch and NA getting it weeks later.
The unseen model would at least have been showcased, since it would be produced in-house unless it was terrain.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 ImAGeek wrote:
The no art that isn’t models isn’t anywhere near as strict as it was these days. And if that thing on the cover was coming as a model, they’d have shown it by now. They don’t really do surprise model drops anymore.

The dragon-vamp literally got shown a week ago and is up for preorder on Saturday. It's not common, but it is not unheard of.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/10 15:00:55


Post by: Octovol


I'm still waiting on those floating tech-priests from the 8th edition artwork though


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also, Cawl needs to stop restoring other people's relics and start pushing our codex out. Literally only just seen the teaser of that new Sisters high lord and we have a full datasheet and rules breakdown the first working day after.

Not bitter at all lol. It's a nice model but come on, that codex isn't coming out before ours and we still have no idea what the marshall does.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/16 17:08:42


Post by: Dysartes


I'm a little surprised at the non-AdMech stuff being released at the same time, though I'm glad for DE players that Lelith won't be stuck as only available in Piety & Pain for all that long - I assume the Palantine will get her release alongside the rest of the SoB stuff when that 'dex drops.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/16 17:10:40


Post by: Kanluwen


It's about damn time.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/16 17:12:43


Post by: Olthannon


"Available as a 120-page hardback or thrice-blessed collector’s edition, the codex includes all the lore, bestiaries, new and improved rules (more on this in the coming days), and datasheets for the Adeptus Mechanicus, as well as a stunning miniatures showcase and more besides."

I would have bragged more about the stunning miniature showcase if there was more than one new model being released myself.

Still, it's about time.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/16 17:17:12


Post by: beast_gts


 Dysartes wrote:
I'm a little surprised at the non-AdMech stuff being released at the same time

I'm taking it as a sign they've got the warehouse issues sorted out and can actually ship stuff now.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/16 17:21:26


Post by: Kanluwen


 Olthannon wrote:
"Available as a 120-page hardback or thrice-blessed collector’s edition, the codex includes all the lore, bestiaries, new and improved rules (more on this in the coming days), and datasheets for the Adeptus Mechanicus, as well as a stunning miniatures showcase and more besides."

I would have bragged more about the stunning miniature showcase if there was more than one new model being released myself.

Still, it's about time.

They always talk about the <insert glowing praise here> "miniature showcase", even if the book is just revised.

The Skitarii Marshal is an important release. I'll allow it...especially if they have alternate parts.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/16 17:52:31


Post by: tneva82


 Olthannon wrote:
"Available as a 120-page hardback or thrice-blessed collector’s edition, the codex includes all the lore, bestiaries, new and improved rules (more on this in the coming days), and datasheets for the Adeptus Mechanicus, as well as a stunning miniatures showcase and more besides."

I would have bragged more about the stunning miniature showcase if there was more than one new model being released myself.

Still, it's about time.


So all other codexes have only new models shown? Not old?

That text is standard copy&paste...weird thing to focus on


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/16 18:18:03


Post by: lord_blackfang


Looks like GW solved whatever gak needed solving, that's one hefty preorder week.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/16 18:48:49


Post by: Spoletta


That patrol box currently would be 18PL. If it now is 20 PL, we could be looking at some increases in cost.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/16 18:55:26


Post by: Irbis


WHAT THE feth

So, AoS is getting new, nice, great value Start Collecting box, when 40K players get gigantic frak you middle finger in Vanguard SC being killed in favour of yet another garbage CP box. With a transport thrown in, even though it has negative synergy with all other units in it, instead of something like the Vanguard walker. Oh, and someone should tell WC team '10 Infiltrators or Incursors' claim is utter nonsense, because these models can be ONLY built as Infiltrators!


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/16 18:57:23


Post by: Kanluwen


Spoletta wrote:
That patrol box currently would be 18PL. If it now is 20 PL, we could be looking at some increases in cost.

I think the only thing we have not seen Power costs for is the Enginseer, so that's likely to be the culprit.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/16 18:57:40


Post by: Tiberius501


When do the juicy leaks begin? I think I ask this every time, but my brain is barely capable of cognitive function so I forget. Generally around the weekend of the pre-order we get reviews though at the latest.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/16 18:59:51


Post by: Spoletta


How much is usually the cost for one of those patrol boxes? Because the marine one while badly assembled seems to contain around 200 euros of stuff.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/16 19:03:05


Post by: Wha-Mu-077


Spoletta wrote:
How much is usually the cost for one of those patrol boxes? Because the marine one while badly assembled seems to contain around 200 euros of stuff.


Thus far, all of them have been 110 Euros.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/16 19:13:29


Post by: Slayer-Fan123


 Irbis wrote:
WHAT THE feth

So, AoS is getting new, nice, great value Start Collecting box, when 40K players get gigantic frak you middle finger in Vanguard SC being killed in favour of yet another garbage CP box. With a transport thrown in, even though it has negative synergy with all other units in it, instead of something like the Vanguard walker. Oh, and someone should tell WC team '10 Infiltrators or Incursors' claim is utter nonsense, because these models can be ONLY built as Infiltrators!

AoS is notoriously cheaper to get into, with the Start Collecting sets being only the icing on the cake. That's really why I'm hoping for a rebalance of 3.0 as I got some Stormcast on the cheap.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/16 19:29:54


Post by: Kanluwen


 Tiberius501 wrote:
When do the juicy leaks begin? I think I ask this every time, but my brain is barely capable of cognitive function so I forget. Generally around the weekend of the pre-order we get reviews though at the latest.

The reviews would be Saturday, yes.

We've had some datasheets get shown off. They're on the AdMech subreddit, compiled, if you really need things.

Supposedly we get articles this week from Warhammer Community. We'll see if they are useful.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/16 19:31:05


Post by: Dysartes


What do y'all think of the Necron box, btw?

- Overlord
- 10 Immortals/Deathmarks
- 3 Tomb Blades
- Flying Croissant of Death

Not sure about it as a starter, but it looks like it has promise to build onto Indomitus or the current starter sets.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/16 19:31:46


Post by: Kanluwen


It's a Combat Patrol, so I guess that works?


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/16 19:51:31


Post by: GaroRobe


Is the Ad Mech Combat Patrol even a deal?

It's pretty much the original start collecting, swapping out the Magos for an enginseer, and adds destroyers/breachers. I think the OG set was $85, and then add $60 of destroyers=140ish. So...it's a start collecting, with an extra unit? Eh


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/16 19:59:45


Post by: Kanluwen


SC Skitarii was always a good deal. Problem was that the Dominus was jammed in.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/16 20:29:26


Post by: lord_blackfang


I welcome the new boxes with Enginseers instead of Dominus, now if they could just stop spamming Rangers...

Precentage wise the discount is exactly the same as the current SC! AdMech.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/16 21:19:59


Post by: lord marcus


 lord_blackfang wrote:
I welcome the new boxes with Enginseers instead of Dominus, now if they could just stop spamming Rangers...

Precentage wise the discount is exactly the same as the current SC! AdMech.


You will welcome it until its $110 euro/GBP/equivalent instead of that $85 discounted SC


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/16 21:42:49


Post by: Kanluwen


 lord marcus wrote:
 lord_blackfang wrote:
I welcome the new boxes with Enginseers instead of Dominus, now if they could just stop spamming Rangers...

Precentage wise the discount is exactly the same as the current SC! AdMech.


You will welcome it until its $110 euro/GBP/equivalent instead of that $85 discounted SC

It hasn't been $85 for awhile now.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/16 22:20:50


Post by: lord_blackfang


Current SC is 80€ for 120€ worth of stuff, Combat Patrol is 110€ for 166€ worth of stuff

(basically add the Kataphrons and swap the tank for a different tank that costs the same, contents go up by +46€, price goes up by +30€, discount goes from 40€ to 56€)

I mean, it's still inflated because nobody is actually paying 25€ for Enginseers I would assume, but since he's a smaller fraction of the box now the Character tax is actually a bit less, percentage wise.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/16 22:33:55


Post by: Octovol


The problem is not that they kept jamming in Enginseers, Dominus and Rangers, the problem has been that those units are dead weight. Possible exception of Arquebus MSU Rangers depending.

At least the new arc rifles are amazingly good so hopefully Vanguard receive a useful buff.

Looking at the projected PL of 20 for that box i'm willing to bet Kataphrons went up for sure, too many buffs not to. Thats fine though, because they're now a more elite choice (except that damnable 4+BS/WS) exceptional weapons and durability, more akin to terminators now but with actually good weapons

I'd also hazard a guess that they finally gave the enginseer, something...what'd be nice ios if they gave the enginseer the RR1 in shooting and gave the dominus something new and flavourful.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/17 10:08:02


Post by: Nazrak


I think it's a bit of a shame they've ditched the PL parity across Combat Patrol boxes for this. Like, would it really have killed them to put another sprue in to bump it up to 25PL, same as the others? Oh well.

Tbh I wonder if it's just a case of more stuff literally not fitting in the box.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Although if they'd even just thrown the Dominus sprue in instead of the Enginseer, that would've bumped it to PL24. Weird.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/17 12:23:20


Post by: Spreelock


Intresting, Mars dogma allows Skitarii units to benefit from canticles, and seems like the Kataphron units are not core


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/17 12:23:33


Post by: Kanluwen



So Skitarii don't get Canticles natively, but can as Mars. I've been wondering how they would handle this.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/17 12:38:41


Post by: Octovol


I wonder if they only benefit from canticles while near tech priests, but Mars units can do so wherever they are?


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/17 12:53:24


Post by: bullyboy


 Irbis wrote:
WHAT THE feth

So, AoS is getting new, nice, great value Start Collecting box, when 40K players get gigantic frak you middle finger in Vanguard SC being killed in favour of yet another garbage CP box. With a transport thrown in, even though it has negative synergy with all other units in it, instead of something like the Vanguard walker. Oh, and someone should tell WC team '10 Infiltrators or Incursors' claim is utter nonsense, because these models can be ONLY built as Infiltrators!


It's not terrible (yet the invictor would have made more sense), as you're basically getting the current $95 start collecting vanguard, and adding a $75 Impulsor for $45. You can still find plenty of the older sets right now though. The infiltrator/incursor statement was a big oops though.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/17 13:15:24


Post by: Kanluwen


Octovol wrote:
I wonder if they only benefit from canticles while near tech priests, but Mars units can do so wherever they are?

We know that Doctrina Imperatives are back, so that's likely how things will shake out.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/17 13:50:25


Post by: Irbis


 bullyboy wrote:
It's not terrible (yet the invictor would have made more sense), as you're basically getting the current $95 start collecting vanguard, and adding a $75 Impulsor for $45. You can still find plenty of the older sets right now though. The infiltrator/incursor statement was a big oops though.

It is not terrible, but it's yet another dilution of discount and moving the box out of impulse buy/convince unsure friend to start price range. Especially seeing no unit in the box actually wants the transport and there were loads of better choices.

Plus, it's still feels like middle finger, because AoS is getting great value SC at the same time, not to mention torrent of pseudo-SCs with each Broken Realms book, while 40K side keeps getting more and more shafted

 Nazrak wrote:
Although if they'd even just thrown the Dominus sprue in instead of the Enginseer, that would've bumped it to PL24. Weird.

I honestly wish they had done this, Magos is much better looking mini and can be converted into Enginseer if you really want to easily, something that is impossible the other way...


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/17 15:44:53


Post by: yukishiro1


A lot more people play 40k that don't play AOS than vice versa.

Modern GW never does anything out of the goodness of its heart. 40k is GW's gravy train, they're going to keep milking it more and more forcibly until they reach the point where further milking will damage the animal. And judging by last year, there's still a lot of milking they can do.

It's pretty clear these combat patrol sets are mostly about throwing together whatever junk didn't sell well on its own last edition (which ironically, as we've seen e.g. with DE, may or may not be what won't sell when the codex comes out!), as opposed to the SC model that was, well, about starting collections.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/17 15:56:06


Post by: CragHack


I'm just here to comment that the dice look ace. And the HQ will fit in nicely in 30k lists.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/17 15:57:43


Post by: Slayer-Fan123


Sooooo Skitarii lose Canticles? That's stupid.

Otherwise hard to say which Subfaction is better. Graia giving Fearless might work more for me since I'm all about max size Skitarii units. Losing the 6+++ For a 5+++ to only mortal wounds is lame though.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/17 16:04:43


Post by: Mariongodspeed


 Spreelock wrote:
Intresting, Mars dogma allows Skitarii units to benefit from canticles, and seems like the Kataphron units are not core


What makes you think Kataphrons are not core?


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/17 16:06:10


Post by: Kanluwen


Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
Sooooo Skitarii lose Canticles? That's stupid.

What was stupid is that they made Canticles the de facto army trait to begin with while putting Doctrina Imperatives as a Stratagem.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Mariongodspeed wrote:
 Spreelock wrote:
Intresting, Mars dogma allows Skitarii units to benefit from canticles, and seems like the Kataphron units are not core


What makes you think Kataphrons are not core?



This right here.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/17 16:08:32


Post by: DarkHound


It would be weird if Skitarii just don't benefit from canticles unless they're Mars. That precludes half the army from a central mechanic, which Knight of the Iron Cog's language implies is exclusive to pure AdMech anyway. I think Octovol's idea is probably correct. The canticle effects might just be auras or are projected by the user. Unfortunately there's nothing to guess about Doctrinas yet.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/17 16:09:21


Post by: yukishiro1


Non-CORE Troops is just weird. Looks like they decided that Skitarii would be CORE and everything else wouldn't be.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/17 16:11:59


Post by: Kanluwen


 DarkHound wrote:
It would be weird if Skitarii just don't benefit from canticles unless they're Mars. That precludes half the army from a central mechanic, which Knigh of the Iron Cog's language implies is exclusive to pure AdMech anyway. I think Octovol's idea is probably correct. The canticle effects might just be auras or are projected by the user. Unfortunately there's nothing to guess about Doctrinas yet.

We know they're not stratagems anymore, as the datacards product info calls them out separate to the stratagems.

Datacards: Adeptus Mechanicus
To help you make the most of your shiny new codex, you’ll want to grab a set of datacards too. This 57-card set includes easy-reference datacards for all of the Stratagems, Doctrina Imperatives, and Canticles of the Omnissiah available to the Adeptus Mechanicus and their mightiest forge worlds. These datacards make keeping track of your assets on the battlefield an absolute breeze (even Mars has wind, after all – those red dunes didn’t form all by themselves).


I'm gonna die laughing if they swapped Canticles back to the "for X units featuring the Canticles of the Omnissiah rule, consult the table to see what it does" method.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/17 16:21:01


Post by: Octovol


It's not stupid that Skitarii don't get canticles, they never had them to begin with until lazy 8th edition came along.

Essentially what it looks like we have now is:

Cult mech get canticles each turn (however the mechanic works now)

Skitarii get doctrina imperitives each turn (however the mechanic works now)

Mars Skitarii get both of them. It's functionally a toning down of the old Mars Dogma where everything got double 'canticles'.

Now Cult mech gets their canticles like they used to, Skitarii get their doctrinas like they used. Both are in theory functionally identical as they used to be in 7th: a buff to one sub-faction of the army.

Hopefully they dont bring back the whole if you take more Skitarii/cult mech your doctrinas/canticles are improved. It would be cool if there was some form of favoured faction choice to be had but counting units is cumbersome as hell lol.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/17 17:54:01


Post by: Tiberius501


What makes people think Skitarii are getting Doctrina as a faction rule?


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/17 18:18:55


Post by: Kanluwen


 Tiberius501 wrote:
What makes people think Skitarii are getting Doctrina as a faction rule?

Datacards: Adeptus Mechanicus
To help you make the most of your shiny new codex, you’ll want to grab a set of datacards too. This 57-card set includes easy-reference datacards for all of the Stratagems, Doctrina Imperatives, and Canticles of the Omnissiah available to the Adeptus Mechanicus and their mightiest forge worlds. These datacards make keeping track of your assets on the battlefield an absolute breeze (even Mars has wind, after all – those red dunes didn’t form all by themselves).

If it were a Stratagem, they wouldn't have listed it separately.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/17 18:25:18


Post by: Daedalus81


yukishiro1 wrote:
Non-CORE Troops is just weird. Looks like they decided that Skitarii would be CORE and everything else wouldn't be.


Feels necessary given the gun upgrades on top of catching T6 if they want to.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/17 18:30:10


Post by: DarkHound


Octovol wrote:
It's not stupid that Skitarii don't get canticles, they never had them to begin with until lazy 8th edition came along.

Essentially what it looks like we have now is:

Cult mech get canticles each turn (however the mechanic works now)

Skitarii get doctrina imperitives each turn (however the mechanic works now)

Mars Skitarii get both of them. It's functionally a toning down of the old Mars Dogma where everything got double 'canticles'.

Now Cult mech gets their canticles like they used to, Skitarii get their doctrinas like they used. Both are in theory functionally identical as they used to be in 7th: a buff to one sub-faction of the army.

Hopefully they dont bring back the whole if you take more Skitarii/cult mech your doctrinas/canticles are improved. It would be cool if there was some form of favoured faction choice to be had but counting units is cumbersome as hell lol.
I'm sure they won't bring back the canticle's increased effect per singer. That would split the book in half again, and that's bad for diversity since Cult would essentially have 1 build.

I expect canticles will probably stay largely the same from 8th (perhaps just more powerful), but Doctrinas are going to have to be overhauled. Compared to 7th the hit cap ruins the trade-off mechanic, and it was kind of one dimensional anyway. It would be interesting to see defensive and movement Doctrina effects, but I'd also like to see it be more mechanically distinct from canticles' rotating buffs.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/17 19:08:14


Post by: Kanluwen


Canticles not being on Skitarii already "splits the book in half again".

They absolutely, 100% could bring back the scaling effect again for Canticles though. It worked just fine once they added Servitors and Techpriest Enginseers--and that didn't even include tricksy bits like Knight of the Cog allowing you to grant them Canticles.

Additionally, I'm kind of expecting to see the other Doctrina Imperative from the big webstore bundle show up. "Executioner Extremis" was a Primus Imperative, granting 3 to both WS/BS. It could never be used more than once.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/17 19:17:47


Post by: Gadzilla666


yukishiro1 wrote:
Non-CORE Troops is just weird. Looks like they decided that Skitarii would be CORE and everything else wouldn't be.

Not really. Neither cultists nor Poxwalkers are CORE for Death Guard.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/17 19:19:16


Post by: DarkHound


The book only gets split if the effect is modified by the number of units using it. In that case, you want to maximize the effect by taking only Cult units. Otherwise it's just a separate buff pool for half your units.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/17 21:56:13


Post by: The Black Adder


 DarkHound wrote:
. Otherwise it's just a separate buff pool for half your units.


Which I wouldn't mind at all. The necrons have a similar split between their core and destroyer units.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/17 23:27:09


Post by: DarkHound


I didn't mean to imply otherwise, I think that's exactly what it should be. I'd like it to be more interesting than two tables of rotating buffs, but that's fine.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/18 01:33:32


Post by: Slayer-Fan123


The real question is have we gotten any other leaks so far?


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/18 02:16:53


Post by: Kanluwen


Just datasheets. We don't really get leak-leaks anymore.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/18 04:59:15


Post by: Slayer-Fan123


 Kanluwen wrote:
Just datasheets. We don't really get leak-leaks anymore.

Yeah I still haven't seen anything for Skitarii. Hope the Plasma Caliver got a proper buff.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/18 11:25:56


Post by: Octovol


Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
 Kanluwen wrote:
Just datasheets. We don't really get leak-leaks anymore.

Yeah I still haven't seen anything for Skitarii. Hope the Plasma Caliver got a proper buff.


Why would the plasma caliver get a buff? It's already better than everyone else's plasma gun. I'm not expecting anything from plasma at all, but, maybe a range increase? Plasma is a ranged power sword, the base high ap weapon for everything else to work from. Though I'd take an arc rifle over a plasma caliver at this point so...maybe you're right and it needs something to elevate it.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/18 12:50:41


Post by: stahly


I'll wonder if they do the same thing they did with Wyches in the new Drukhari codex, allowing only one of each of the special weapons for Skitarii as there is only one of each on the sprue.

They seem to have a fetish to remove any options that don't translate 1:1 to the options included in their kits.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/18 13:42:03


Post by: Rihgu


Is the bit about the Transvector transporting larger squads between multiple ships a rules preview or just weird fluff that doesn't see the tabletop?


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/18 13:53:04


Post by: Quasistellar


Rihgu wrote:
Is the bit about the Transvector transporting larger squads between multiple ships a rules preview or just weird fluff that doesn't see the tabletop?


I'm sensing a rules preview--can't see any other reason for them to introduce such a specific and unusual piece of fluff. Pretty interesting.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/18 14:16:57


Post by: Cripple X


 stahly wrote:
I'll wonder if they do the same thing they did with Wyches in the new Drukhari codex, allowing only one of each of the special weapons for Skitarii as there is only one of each on the sprue.

They seem to have a fetish to remove any options that don't translate 1:1 to the options included in their kits.


Honestly, that's something I am okay with them doing. It's more consumer friendly since you don't have the expense of having to buy extra boxes of models you won't use, pay a huge mark up to get the options from eBay or 3D printed, or converting/kitbashing your own. I would prefer they just put the additional options in the box to begin with, but if they won't then limiting the available options rules-wise to what comes in the box is fine with me. There's no need for an additional tax just to have the all options available to a player.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/18 14:22:40


Post by: Octovol


Cripple X wrote:
 stahly wrote:
I'll wonder if they do the same thing they did with Wyches in the new Drukhari codex, allowing only one of each of the special weapons for Skitarii as there is only one of each on the sprue.

They seem to have a fetish to remove any options that don't translate 1:1 to the options included in their kits.


Honestly, that's something I am okay with them doing. It's more consumer friendly since you don't have the expense of having to buy extra boxes of models you won't use, pay a huge mark up to get the options from eBay or 3D printed, or converting/kitbashing your own. I would prefer they just put the additional options in the box to begin with, but if they won't then limiting the available options rules-wise to what comes in the box is fine with me. There's no need for an additional tax just to have the all options available to a player.


As long as we don't have to field a unit of 10 to get them, for sure, also our plasma caliver would definitely need a boost in power if we're only allowed one of them. However, compared to other squads with special weapons options it'd be a significant restriction. If we can still take 1 for 5 and maybe 2 for 10 then that's fine, I guess, but feels like an unnecessary nerf and just makes our basic troops even less appealing than they already are.

Edit: Wait, i take that back, unless we can move and fire the arquebus!


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/18 14:34:45


Post by: Kanluwen


I could see the Caliver going exclusive to Vanguard and Arquebus exclusive to Rangers while both get Arc Rifles.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/18 14:56:07


Post by: Slayer-Fan123



"Fluff article" seems a bit wrong compared to "please buy these super expensive kits we tried to push from PA".


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/18 15:10:13


Post by: Sacredroach


I actually quite like all these units...but my work table is currently full of Slaanesh demons and Mierce Ysians at the moment...


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/18 18:06:21


Post by: 0XFallen


I'll take our old 3 shots plasma back any day.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/18 19:15:08


Post by: KidCthulhu


I hope they don't do the "one per squad 'cause that's what's in the box". I have one squad of rangers and one squad of vanguard, but my rangers have two arquebusses and my vanguard have two plasma cavilers.

(I'm preparing to be disappointed )

[Edited for Ork-moji fail]


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/19 13:32:05


Post by: beast_gts


Let’s Join the Adeptus Mechanicus For a Sing-along of Death


Automatically Appended Next Post:







Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/19 13:39:28


Post by: Kanluwen


Doctrina Imperatives look solid, but the real star of the show was this art:


Also, lol they said nothing significant about the Marshal still.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/19 13:53:39


Post by: the_scotsman


The article seemed to imply that the Doctrina Imperatives were more of an aura ability. I would guess that they are closer to guard orders and thus require the presence of a marshal or techpriest to get them to work/perhaps improve them in some way.

Dunno. Maybe the Techpriest Dominus and other TP units enable the canticles and skitarii marshals and enginseers enable doctrinas.

HQs whose job is actually commanding troops! a wild concept!


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/19 14:09:03


Post by: Tiberius501


I wonder how the synergies of Mars Skitarii getting Cantaicles will be, could be interesting.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/19 14:10:40


Post by: Seneca


 the_scotsman wrote:
The article seemed to imply that the Doctrina Imperatives were more of an aura ability. I would guess that they are closer to guard orders and thus require the presence of a marshal or techpriest to get them to work/perhaps improve them in some way.

Dunno. Maybe the Techpriest Dominus and other TP units enable the canticles and skitarii marshals and enginseers enable doctrinas.

HQs whose job is actually commanding troops! a wild concept!



Considering that the lore in 7th Was the doctrinas are send from ships in orbit I wouldn't assume that they are aura abilities now.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/19 14:16:56


Post by: Rihgu


 Seneca wrote:
 the_scotsman wrote:
The article seemed to imply that the Doctrina Imperatives were more of an aura ability. I would guess that they are closer to guard orders and thus require the presence of a marshal or techpriest to get them to work/perhaps improve them in some way.

Dunno. Maybe the Techpriest Dominus and other TP units enable the canticles and skitarii marshals and enginseers enable doctrinas.

HQs whose job is actually commanding troops! a wild concept!



Considering that the lore in 7th Was the doctrinas are send from ships in orbit I wouldn't assume that they are aura abilities now.


Well, Synapse is beamed down from Norn Queens in their Hive Ships in orbit, and Synapse is an aura ability, so who can even know, at this point?


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/19 14:19:50


Post by: Iracundus


 Tiberius501 wrote:
I wonder how the synergies of Mars Skitarii getting Cantaicles will be, could be interesting.


So long as it doesn't result in Mars being the no-brainer choice from that.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/19 14:33:17


Post by: Octovol


Iracundus wrote:
 Tiberius501 wrote:
I wonder how the synergies of Mars Skitarii getting Cantaicles will be, could be interesting.


So long as it doesn't result in Mars being the no-brainer choice from that.


I mean if the Skitarii keyword is all that's needed to receive an imperative all Mars disintegrators, stratoraptors and onagers could potentially have a 2+ save or 2+ BS depending on if you go first or second, then they can re-roll one hit, wound and damage roll every time they fire. That's super powerful.

though if we're talking about an orders system presumably imperative might be limited by how many HQs or imperative issuing units you have.

I also feel like the galvanic field might be gone and be replaced by the manipulus having greater control or number of imperatives. Issuing multiple or from a greater range or even ignoring the deprecations maybe.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/19 14:38:13


Post by: the_scotsman


 Seneca wrote:
 the_scotsman wrote:
The article seemed to imply that the Doctrina Imperatives were more of an aura ability. I would guess that they are closer to guard orders and thus require the presence of a marshal or techpriest to get them to work/perhaps improve them in some way.

Dunno. Maybe the Techpriest Dominus and other TP units enable the canticles and skitarii marshals and enginseers enable doctrinas.

HQs whose job is actually commanding troops! a wild concept!



Considering that the lore in 7th Was the doctrinas are send from ships in orbit I wouldn't assume that they are aura abilities now.


So what you're saying is, GW is caught between a small detail of established lore, and structuring a rule in such a way that it would help to sell a new model.

Well this is an interesting conundrum, I'm really curious to see how GW will go with this! Changing the lore to sell a model would be a bizarre and crazy step for them, really new territory.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/19 14:38:47


Post by: Kanluwen


Iracundus wrote:
 Tiberius501 wrote:
I wonder how the synergies of Mars Skitarii getting Cantaicles will be, could be interesting.


So long as it doesn't result in Mars being the no-brainer choice from that.

As long as Cawl is the only named, Mars will always be considered by some as the "no-brainer" choice.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/19 14:46:24


Post by: Sunny Side Up


So AdMech still keep Canticles in a soup army?


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/19 14:56:44


Post by: Octovol


Sunny Side Up wrote:
So AdMech still keep Canticles in a soup army?


All we know for sure at the moment is what some of the canticles and imperatives are. Things we do not know:

What units benefit from canticles
How units are eligible to benefit from canticles
What units benefit from imperatives
How units are eligible to benefit from imperatives
How many units can benefit from imperatives (if we assume they're akin to orders made by HQs)


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/19 15:01:14


Post by: DarkHound


Well, we do know that Knight of the Iron Cog was designed to be compatible with the codex and includes the clause:
That unit gains the Canticles of the Omnissiah ability and is considered to have the ADEPTUS MECHANICUS keyword for the purposes of this ability (the inclusion of this unit in your army does not prevent ADEPTUS MECHANICUS units in your army from using any rules that require every model in your army to have the ADEPTUS MECHANICUS keyword).
That all but states that Canticles don't apply unless all units have the Adeptus Mechanicus keyword.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/19 15:29:21


Post by: Octovol


That's kinda par for the course though, faction-wide rules requiring all your units to be from that faction.

Canticles is probably the more straightforward one of the two, just how they're chosen each round and how many times per game etc is still unknown. We could assume there's still 6 and you roll for them or pick them as is the case now. But those cards dont include any numbers on them.

Imperatives has more questions, we could assume it works the same as guard orders, but that would be dull so I hope it's a tad more interesting than that.

I don't remember from 7th (don't have my book to hand) whether imperatives applied to onager and ballistarii/dragoons. Kinda hope it just applies to all skitarii but looking at the bonuses so far they make more sense on infantry/cavalry. I'm still pretty hopeful our vehicles won't be left out in the cold canticles/imperatives wise.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/19 16:02:00


Post by: Kanluwen


Octovol wrote:
That's kinda par for the course though, faction-wide rules requiring all your units to be from that faction.

Canticles is probably the more straightforward one of the two, just how they're chosen each round and how many times per game etc is still unknown. We could assume there's still 6 and you roll for them or pick them as is the case now. But those cards dont include any numbers on them.

Imperatives has more questions, we could assume it works the same as guard orders, but that would be dull so I hope it's a tad more interesting than that.

I'm not expecting it to work the same as Guard Orders. It just won't work unless the Marshal can tag multiple units at once or something wonky like that.

I don't remember from 7th (don't have my book to hand) whether imperatives applied to onager and ballistarii/dragoons. Kinda hope it just applies to all skitarii but looking at the bonuses so far they make more sense on infantry/cavalry. I'm still pretty hopeful our vehicles won't be left out in the cold canticles/imperatives wise.

Imperatives applied to all Skitarii, and were selected at the start of your Movement phase. Each could only be used once per game.

If I had to take a wild stab in the dark?
Imperatives are going to be across the board, with the Data-Tethers letting units ignore the drawbacks.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/19 16:09:20


Post by: Slayer-Fan123


Imperatives seem fun with the drawback on each one.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/19 17:09:36


Post by: Argive


So Ad Mech looks set to get Expert Crafters+1 .. Cool.. cool...


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/19 17:22:49


Post by: The Forgemaster


 Kanluwen wrote:


If I had to take a wild stab in the dark?
Imperatives are going to be across the board, with the Data-Tethers letting units ignore the drawbacks.





That is an idea I could get behind, I have been wondering what they could do.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/19 17:29:37


Post by: Quasistellar


 Argive wrote:
So Ad Mech looks set to get Expert Crafters+1 .. Cool.. cool...


If the Drukhari codex is anything to go by, I wouldn't worry about craftworlds. Even at their lowest point in many years, they still have competitive units in a soup army.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/19 18:47:30


Post by: Ail-Shan


First they take our Swooping Hawks, then our flyer mobility advantage, now our best custom trait


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/19 20:13:45


Post by: DarkHound


Well, it's your best custom trait active all the time versus a buff we can apply to some of our army for one turn. Eldar are underpowered, but that's not really a 1:1 example.

My heart does go out to you, though. I am in love with the Iyanden space-elf-necromancer-mechas angle and will start a wraith construct army as soon as that codex drops.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/19 21:17:24


Post by: Argive


 DarkHound wrote:
Well, it's your best custom trait active all the time versus a buff we can apply to some of our army for one turn. Eldar are underpowered, but that's not really a 1:1 example.

My heart does go out to you, though. I am in love with the Iyanden space-elf-necromancer-mechas angle and will start a wraith construct army as soon as that codex drops.


My point was that people have voiced that that EC is too good (im inclined to agree in some/lot of cases)
I don't see how introducing EC+1 is going to end well... Not sure if its going to be a one turn thing or not but like OP SM doctrines of yesteryear, it smacks of the same lack of foresight/ play testing.



Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/19 21:31:26


Post by: Daedalus81


 Argive wrote:
 DarkHound wrote:
Well, it's your best custom trait active all the time versus a buff we can apply to some of our army for one turn. Eldar are underpowered, but that's not really a 1:1 example.

My heart does go out to you, though. I am in love with the Iyanden space-elf-necromancer-mechas angle and will start a wraith construct army as soon as that codex drops.


My point was that people have voiced that that EC is too good (im inclined to agree in some/lot of cases)
I don't see how introducing EC+1 is going to end well... Not sure if its going to be a one turn thing or not but like OP SM doctrines of yesteryear, it smacks of the same lack of foresight/ play testing.



EC is good when you can small extreme MSU and make the most of the rerolls. The units that benefit from this generally do not run in those sizes, but it will be interesting to see how this shapes up.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/19 22:02:07


Post by: Sunny Side Up


 Argive wrote:
So Ad Mech looks set to get Expert Crafters+1 .. Cool.. cool...


It's called Death Skullz


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/19 23:30:16


Post by: alextroy


 Argive wrote:
 DarkHound wrote:
Well, it's your best custom trait active all the time versus a buff we can apply to some of our army for one turn. Eldar are underpowered, but that's not really a 1:1 example.

My heart does go out to you, though. I am in love with the Iyanden space-elf-necromancer-mechas angle and will start a wraith construct army as soon as that codex drops.


My point was that people have voiced that that EC is too good (im inclined to agree in some/lot of cases)
I don't see how introducing EC+1 is going to end well... Not sure if its going to be a one turn thing or not but like OP SM doctrines of yesteryear, it smacks of the same lack of foresight/ play testing.
Really depends on how much you are able to utilize that Canticle. Is it every other Battle Round like the current rules, with the option to attempt to roll into it? Is it once per battle like Necron Command Protocols? The devil is always in the details.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/20 00:22:59


Post by: Argive


 alextroy wrote:
 Argive wrote:
 DarkHound wrote:
Well, it's your best custom trait active all the time versus a buff we can apply to some of our army for one turn. Eldar are underpowered, but that's not really a 1:1 example.

My heart does go out to you, though. I am in love with the Iyanden space-elf-necromancer-mechas angle and will start a wraith construct army as soon as that codex drops.


My point was that people have voiced that that EC is too good (im inclined to agree in some/lot of cases)
I don't see how introducing EC+1 is going to end well... Not sure if its going to be a one turn thing or not but like OP SM doctrines of yesteryear, it smacks of the same lack of foresight/ play testing.
Really depends on how much you are able to utilize that Canticle. Is it every other Battle Round like the current rules, with the option to attempt to roll into it? Is it once per battle like Necron Command Protocols? The devil is always in the details.


For sure. I think fron the overall language in the article it seems like canticles will be a per round thing like doctrines, protocols and DE pfp. But who knows rly..
On face value thought it seems like somebody in the design team heard of EC and thought "ooohh this is strong! Lets add moar!"


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/20 01:11:22


Post by: DarkHound


 alextroy wrote:
Really depends on how much you are able to utilize that Canticle. Is it every other Battle Round like the current rules, with the option to attempt to roll into it? Is it once per battle like Necron Command Protocols? The devil is always in the details.
Every other battle round? You can only pick each canticle once per battle, and only pick it a second time by spending 2 CP. The canticle effects are not generally worth 2CP, so playing AdMech without Cawl is about choosing the order you activate canticles to maximize their effect. That will almost certainly continue to be the case. I expect there to be 6, with the option to roll for repeats, yes.

On the other half, there are only 4 Doctrinas so you'll necessarily have to repeat them. Given that they come with downsides, each effect isn't a no-brainer, so you'll probably be able to repeat the effect each turn. It also seems very likely it'll rely on having nearby HQs. It may be the case that you pick one Doctrina to apply to all Skitarii units that turn; that would complicate builds and hurt the Conqueror Doctrina particularly. You can give up weapon skill for a turn or two while the melee units move into position, but you don't want to give up ballistic skill on your ranged units when that contingent charges. In that case, there may be turns when you activate no Doctrinas.

Mostly I'm glad the canticles effects won't rely on the number of users. That's great news, and healthy for the build diversity of the book. Plus Knights are going to be fantastic, my personal interest.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/20 07:15:36


Post by: The Black Adder


 DarkHound wrote:
. Plus Knights are going to be fantastic, my personal interest.


Yeah I hope that when they redo the Knights we get a good way to mix them without jumping through too many hoops. Knights are THE admech superheavies. They definitely need to be optimised for inclusion in an admech force even if other armies can take them as an option.

Edit to remove weird double post



Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/20 08:42:44


Post by: Spreelock


Anyone else concerned about the role of Skitarii Marshall? The doctrine imperatives seems very strong buff to skitarii units, maybe they tone it down to aura-type buff from Marshall..


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/20 11:05:59


Post by: The Black Adder


 Spreelock wrote:
Anyone else concerned about the role of Skitarii Marshall? The doctrine imperatives seems very strong buff to skitarii units, maybe they tone it down to aura-type buff from Marshall..


Not really. We'll find out on Saturday, once the you tube reviewers get to release their videos, so there are only a few days to wait. I think that any buff he provides will be in addition to the doctrines but we won't know if that's good or not until we get some points/ power levels and a few games in.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/20 11:14:09


Post by: Octovol


 Spreelock wrote:
Anyone else concerned about the role of Skitarii Marshall? The doctrine imperatives seems very strong buff to skitarii units, maybe they tone it down to aura-type buff from Marshall..


until we know exactly how imperatives are a pplied it's difficult to say, but some theories I have are:

If they're orders-like on specific units issued by HQs the marshall could issue more imperatives, or issue without negatives or issue from a greater range.
If they're army wide, being in range of a marshall could negative the negatives. That feels a bit generic though, like all TP should be able to do that.

The marshall might not be related at all, but they do call out marshall and TP as instigators of these imperatives, so they're surely inolved somehow.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/20 11:34:06


Post by: Irbis


Sunny Side Up wrote:
 Argive wrote:
So Ad Mech looks set to get Expert Crafters+1 .. Cool.. cool...

It's called Death Skullz

No, it's called Both Thieving Xenos Stole It From Salamanders™


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/20 13:13:09


Post by: Kanluwen


Crusade article




There's some cool stuff. Wish we'd gotten more Marshal info though.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/20 13:52:48


Post by: Octovol


Only regular rules takeaways I have from that is that Robots are back to being Monsters so susceptible to poison again (but not to haywire) also brings in to question all the strats we have with the vehicle keyword and the master of machines abilities. presumably see some updates to those.

The second is that one of our regular relics has moved to being a crusade relic, so there's some potentially big shake-ups on the relic front as well.

And finally that it looks like data tethers are set to have much more active role in battles, which is interesting, potentially means that vehicles aren't core but if you give them a tether they're eligible for core targeted abilities.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/20 13:57:41


Post by: xttz


 Kanluwen wrote:
Crusade article

There's some cool stuff. Wish we'd gotten more Marshal info though.


Looking forward to the Goonhammer artwork for tech priest finger guns


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/20 14:28:54


Post by: The Black Adder


Those are some really hefty crusade rules; safe plasma and the ability to bring models back with 6 wounds!

I hope some of the techno-arcana crafted items give a manipulation ability instead of just straight damage and resilience bonuses that the other categories cover.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/20 14:44:21


Post by: Tiberius501


Those crusade rules seem really fun! Really keen to start a crusade when I get the book.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/20 15:03:08


Post by: Iracundus


 xttz wrote:
 Kanluwen wrote:
Crusade article

There's some cool stuff. Wish we'd gotten more Marshal info though.


Looking forward to the Goonhammer artwork for tech priest finger guns


Just modify the below to be more 40K Tech Priest and add Pew! Pew! sounds:



Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/20 15:52:20


Post by: DarkHound


I could not care less about the power level of the crusade upgrades, I just hope the archeotech system is a little more involved than get parts for a relic. Maybe some kind of specialization for types of relics or upgrade path for improving relics. I'd like something to sink my teeth into. I do like that there is a requisition dump; after about 6-10 battles you can run out of things to spend requisition on.

Hopefully there are a lot of archeotech, say a dozen plus, and that they have interesting effects. I think the Digital Cannon, while humorous, is a bit of a missed opportunity to show the possibilities of the system. It's a gun you fire once per game that zaps an infantry model, meh. They didn't even show its cost, but I have to assume a basic item like that only uses one or two parts. It'll be interesting to see the maximum cost, or if some things use multiple of the same part type. Hopefully there's a requisition for disassembling archeotech so you can make use of parts while you're saving up.

Addendum, I do think the relic they showed is really cool. I'm glad that they didn't show off some some super cog axe and gave a unique effect. What's funny is attempting to use it prevents explosions entirely, since the relic never says to activate those on-death effects again.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/20 23:31:07


Post by: Argive


 Irbis wrote:
Sunny Side Up wrote:
 Argive wrote:
So Ad Mech looks set to get Expert Crafters+1 .. Cool.. cool...

It's called Death Skullz

No, it's called Both Thieving Xenos Stole It From Salamanders™


You mean: Noble xenos factions got the left over, hand-me-down left overs from the chad space marine table?


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/21 07:46:19


Post by: Mr_Rose


 Argive wrote:
 Irbis wrote:
Sunny Side Up wrote:
 Argive wrote:
So Ad Mech looks set to get Expert Crafters+1 .. Cool.. cool...

It's called Death Skullz

No, it's called Both Thieving Xenos Stole It From Salamanders™


You mean: Noble xenos factions got the left over, hand-me-down left overs from the chad space marine table?

What do the T’au have to do with this?


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/21 08:18:14


Post by: Dysartes


 Mr_Rose wrote:
 Argive wrote:
 Irbis wrote:
Sunny Side Up wrote:
 Argive wrote:
So Ad Mech looks set to get Expert Crafters+1 .. Cool.. cool...

It's called Death Skullz

No, it's called Both Thieving Xenos Stole It From Salamanders™


You mean: Noble xenos factions got the left over, hand-me-down left overs from the chad space marine table?

What do the T’au have to do with this?

Absolutely nothing - after all, everyone knows that "noble Xenos" is a contradiction in terms...


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/21 13:11:20


Post by: Tiberius501


Ah so they’ve made the new command traits into upgrades, and changed how they work a little. Seems fun, and means we can also use command traits on them as well.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/21 13:12:48


Post by: Kanluwen


Slightly concerned as to how bad the Marshal is going to be, given they've spent basically zero time since that preview show teasing it.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/21 13:16:34


Post by: Tiberius501


 Kanluwen wrote:
Slightly concerned as to how bad the Marshal is going to be, given they've spent basically zero time since that preview show teasing it.


Yeah... that’s a bit concerning... I really hope he’s at least useable! The model is so cool.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/21 14:14:53


Post by: Tyran


 Kanluwen wrote:
Slightly concerned as to how bad the Marshal is going to be, given they've spent basically zero time since that preview show teasing it.

That probably means he is broken.

These days, what GW doesn't tease is usually the strong stuff.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/21 14:31:00


Post by: 0XFallen


 Tyran wrote:
 Kanluwen wrote:
Slightly concerned as to how bad the Marshal is going to be, given they've spent basically zero time since that preview show teasing it.

That probably means he is broken.

These days, what GW doesn't tease is usually the strong stuff.


Looks at sisters >.>


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/21 18:17:28


Post by: Dysartes


Yeah, not doing a rules preview for the one new guy before he goes up on pre-order seems a bit... odd.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/21 18:34:14


Post by: Kanluwen


 Dysartes wrote:
Yeah, not doing a rules preview for the one new guy before he goes up on pre-order seems a bit... odd.

Or when they announced him during the preview show, or when they glossed over Mechanicus entirely for the 40k preview day...

So, the basic rundown:
>In your command phase, you can choose a friendly forge world skitarii unit within 9 "of this model or you can choose forge world skitarii units with friendly date series anywhere on the battlefield. until the start of your next phase command, that unit ignores the neglected effect of the doctrine imperative active at that time

Link to Servo Skull (Aura): As long as a friendly Forge World Skitarii Base unit is within 6in of this model, each time one model of that unit makes an attack, re-roll wound rolls of 1.


No power sword option despite power sword on the model is a Bold Move.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/21 18:37:39


Post by: Rihgu


Haha, marshall seems awful. Pick 1 unit within 9" or with a data tether to ignore the bad part of doctrina. Terrible statline + weapons.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/21 18:42:37


Post by: Kanluwen


Rihgu wrote:
Haha, marshall seems awful. Pick 1 unit within 9" or with a data tether to ignore the bad part of doctrina. Terrible statline + weapons.

Based on the translation?
You pick a unit within the 9"...or units with data-tethers.

That's kind of a Big Deal.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/21 18:44:32


Post by: Ghaz


So no option for weapons on the Marshal other than the pistol and rod, despite having a sword at his waist?...

Spoiler:


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/21 18:45:12


Post by: Rihgu


 Kanluwen wrote:
Rihgu wrote:
Haha, marshall seems awful. Pick 1 unit within 9" or with a data tether to ignore the bad part of doctrina. Terrible statline + weapons.

Based on the translation?
You pick a unit within the 9"...or units with data-tethers.

That's kind of a Big Deal.


My translation of it is "you can choose a friendly SKITARII <FORGE WORLD> unit within 9" of this model or you can choose a friendly SKITARII <FORGE WORLD> unit with DATA SERIES anywhere on the battle field"

1 unit in either case. But I'm not an expert.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/21 18:49:44


Post by: Kanluwen


Either way, it's still a nice perk for a 3 Power model. I'll die on that hill.

BUT we need to talk about the fact that Daedalosus is now a generic <Forge World> HQ choice!
Spoiler:


Technoarchaeologist is now a generic HQ choice. Dominus and Manipulus can take 2 Enginseers/Technoarchaeologists without burning HQ slots apparently.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/21 19:00:07


Post by: the_scotsman


Rihgu wrote:
Haha, marshall seems awful. Pick 1 unit within 9" or with a data tether to ignore the bad part of doctrina. Terrible statline + weapons.


he also gives a rr1s to hit aura for skitarii core. Don't need to be too expensive for those two abilities to be worth it.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/21 19:05:07


Post by: Kanluwen


 the_scotsman wrote:
Rihgu wrote:
Haha, marshall seems awful. Pick 1 unit within 9" or with a data tether to ignore the bad part of doctrina. Terrible statline + weapons.


he also gives a rr1s to hit aura for skitarii core. Don't need to be too expensive for those two abilities to be worth it.

And while we're at it, let's talk about who does not, as a Skitarii, have a Data-Tether...

Uhhhh...Sicarians, Sulphurhounds, and Pteraxii? Is that about right?


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/21 19:21:11


Post by: the_scotsman


yeah, looking over these rules there are a HELL of a lot of ways to buff up skitarii, like holy gak.

So, if Kastelans are not CORE....and Kataphrons are not CORE...does that mean Electropriests are literally the only CORE unit that is not Skitarii?

and if so....does a Skitarii marshall just do almost everything a TPD does minus pointless combat stats and abilities, plus the whole 'i make everyone ignore the negatives of doctrine imperatives' thing?


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/21 19:34:52


Post by: Kanluwen


Well, he doesn't get a power sword. Major negative in the Marshal's corner.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/21 19:55:15


Post by: Spoletta


 the_scotsman wrote:
yeah, looking over these rules there are a HELL of a lot of ways to buff up skitarii, like holy gak.

So, if Kastelans are not CORE....and Kataphrons are not CORE...does that mean Electropriests are literally the only CORE unit that is not Skitarii?

and if so....does a Skitarii marshall just do almost everything a TPD does minus pointless combat stats and abilities, plus the whole 'i make everyone ignore the negatives of doctrine imperatives' thing?


Kastellan robots can get core from Datasmiths.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/21 19:57:28


Post by: Quasistellar


I'm cautiously optimistic. I hope the Datasmith gets some rules updates. I always thought the idea of this guy literally swapping floppy discs mid battle was hilariously silly. Trouble was that they didn't take effect until the next battle round, so generally useless, and the datasmith wasn't quite good enough shooting or fighting to justify bringing.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/21 20:46:25


Post by: 0XFallen


Cawl though lmao.
He is so senile he forgot he is an archmagos. With mediocre offensive and defensive capabilities (5++ lmao) it's really bold to call him a monster and a Supreme commander. Basically paying 100 points extra to lock him up in mars and giving one unit hit rerolls in comparison to the dominus


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/21 20:55:51


Post by: yukishiro1


Cawl apparently lost his 4+ roll this edition to see whether he gets made awesome or terrible.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/21 21:31:52


Post by: Quasistellar


It is pretty outrageous for a character like that to only have a 5++. Are we to believe cawl can't make a better energy field for himself?


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/21 21:59:46


Post by: Kanluwen



So, no alternate heads or weapons or anything.

Thankfully, I have a bag full of Secutarii heads but that's a big ol' yikes from me.
Also: so much lols that the power sword isn't even optional, it's fused to the robes...while not being a part of his armament!


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/21 22:43:19


Post by: Spreelock


Right, I did some search at reddit, and as poorly as I can translate Italian, here's how doctrine imperatives work;

Doctrine protection
+ 1 bs
- 1 ws

Doctrine conqueror
+ 1 ws
- 1 bs

Doctrine bastionne
+ 1 armour save
- 3 movement

Doctrine (?)
+ 3 movement
- 1 armour save

Edit, forgot the last one, I think it was called aggression


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/21 22:45:55


Post by: Quasistellar


I actually really like the head but would remove the crest or turn it Mohawk style.

The awkwardly molded in power sword that isn’t on the datasheet is lulz worthy. I generally really dislike swords molded to the front of figures but at least it isn’t as huge and dumb looking as the collectors edition terminator captain (which thankfully could be left off, unlike this one)


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/21 23:24:30


Post by: H.B.M.C.


Some more leaks:

Skitarii: 8ppm for both vanguard and rangers, rangers have a 3" pregame move now, are core (obviously) squads of 5-20, 8ppm for both vanguard and rangers, and under 10 models you can only take 1 of each special weapon (like wyches) (not completely sure about the weapon loadout) Rad Carbines are still same profile, but 6s to hit autowound instead of 2d on 6s to wound. Arc Pistol is S5 ap2 d1 (d2 and 4+ wound vs vehicle )
GW's rules inanity continues it seems...


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/21 23:25:21


Post by: Kanluwen


Those are unconfirmed. They cropped up as text only.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/22 01:35:36


Post by: Tiberius501


Under 10, or 10 and under? If it’s under 10 then my squads of 10 are safe. But if it’s 10 and under then I’m gonna flip some tables.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/22 01:45:51


Post by: Voss


Quasistellar wrote:
I actually really like the head but would remove the crest or turn it Mohawk style.

The awkwardly molded in power sword that isn’t on the datasheet is lulz worthy. I generally really dislike swords molded to the front of figures but at least it isn’t as huge and dumb looking as the collectors edition terminator captain (which thankfully could be left off, unlike this one)


What makes it a power sword rather than just a symbolic sword worn for stupid dogma reasons?
The blade is sheathed and the hilt doesn't have the usual little power plant box.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/22 02:02:11


Post by: Quasistellar


Voss wrote:
Quasistellar wrote:
I actually really like the head but would remove the crest or turn it Mohawk style.

The awkwardly molded in power sword that isn’t on the datasheet is lulz worthy. I generally really dislike swords molded to the front of figures but at least it isn’t as huge and dumb looking as the collectors edition terminator captain (which thankfully could be left off, unlike this one)


What makes it a power sword rather than just a symbolic sword worn for stupid dogma reasons?
The blade is sheathed and the hilt doesn't have the usual little power plant box.


That’s true, it could technically be anything, but it kinda goes against the way GW usually writes rules. Generally if it’s identifiable as a weapon or unique wargear on the model, it gets some kind of rule. Even something as simple as “make one extra attack at strength user with ceremonial blade”.

Just makes my eye twitch to have a sword literally molded front and center of the model with no rules. It’s weird!


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/22 02:31:57


Post by: Kanluwen


It happened with Araloth(Nomad Prince) when that first dropped. He's modeled in Light Armor(same as the Eternal Guard/Wildwood Rangers) but did not have it in his wargear. It took almost six months for them to FAQ it in.

The Wild Riders took three years to have their shields recognized in AoS, despite being in the box and not a Legacy option. And then Cities of Sigmar removed them again! One of the Mega-Gargants even has a Wild Rider shield on his belt!


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/22 02:57:50


Post by: Voss


Quasistellar wrote:
Voss wrote:
Quasistellar wrote:
I actually really like the head but would remove the crest or turn it Mohawk style.

The awkwardly molded in power sword that isn’t on the datasheet is lulz worthy. I generally really dislike swords molded to the front of figures but at least it isn’t as huge and dumb looking as the collectors edition terminator captain (which thankfully could be left off, unlike this one)


What makes it a power sword rather than just a symbolic sword worn for stupid dogma reasons?
The blade is sheathed and the hilt doesn't have the usual little power plant box.


That’s true, it could technically be anything, but it kinda goes against the way GW usually writes rules. Generally if it’s identifiable as a weapon or unique wargear on the model, it gets some kind of rule. Even something as simple as “make one extra attack at strength user with ceremonial blade”.

Just makes my eye twitch to have a sword literally molded front and center of the model with no rules. It’s weird!


Looking at the Soulblight stuff, it might be a new rules paradigm kicking in.
Several of their units (skeletons, blood knights) have weapon 'options' that are meaningless rules-wise. Lances/spears or swords are all the same.

I could definitely stand fewer rules on every single doohickey simply because the sculptor went overboard. I wouldn't mind not having to care about the differences between arc claws, arc mauls, chord claws, and transonic blades/razors/whatever.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/22 02:59:11


Post by: Kanluwen


Lances/spears being the same is not the same as things entirely being missing.


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/22 07:44:09


Post by: Either/Or


 Kanluwen wrote:
Lances/spears being the same is not the same as things entirely being missing.


Lumineth spearmen and cav have swords on the model with stats only for main weapon.

Doesn’t the tau fireblade dude not have rules for his sword?


Grease the cogs, AdMech codex I coming April. @ 2021/05/22 10:57:26


Post by: The Black Adder


Well I just watched the review of the codex by Ash at GMG on YouTube. I like the look of what I'm seeing.

Unfortunately it looks like some codex deliveries
(including mine) willl be delayed because of GW production/ shipping issues but I can wait to go through it in detail.

It seems like they made an interesting choice with the off brand make your own forgeworlds- if you choose to duplicate an existing forgeworld it seems as though you get all of their rules without any extra cost. That differs from other codexes, even those released this edition. I know that space marines have to pay extra CP for relic access and necrons don't get access to relics or specific strategems. I have a Mars army so it won't affect me but I wish they'd do the same with the other codexes so that people don't feel locked to rules associated with a paint job.