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Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 14:11:14


Post by: Kanluwen


Article here
Spoiler:

Spoiler:

The Emperor’s Champion is a paragon of faith and fury whose appearance on the battlefield strikes fear into the hearts of those who oppose him. And, rest assured, he won’t be standing alone.

Stay tuned to Warhammer Community, where the faithful are sure to receive further blessings very shortly.

* Portable spotlight for tabletop encounters available separately.


Figured since it's not Kill Team related it could get its own thread. Looks like "Miniature Monday" is back on the menu!
Warhammer Community's Kill Team: Octarius Article wrote:Going forwards, we’re looking at ways we can make sure you don’t miss out on other awesome box sets too. So if, for instance, there was a sweet new Black Templars launch box on the horizon (just imagine that!) then that also sounds like the sort of box we’d want to make sure you could all get your hands on.



Spoiler:

Spoiler:

You may have seen during our codex road map last week that the Black Templars are on the way soon, with a brand new Emperor’s Champion leading the charge and some whispers on the wind of a launch box in the works.

So to whet your appetite, here’s the spectacular cover art for the upcoming Codex Supplement: Black Templars. Chain your bolter to your wrist and put your crusading pants on, we’re going smiting.*
True heirs of Sigismund may notice that the gentleman in the middle has distinctly black-and-red shoulder pads, which mark him out as one of the elite Sword Brethren. But doesn’t he also appear to be wearing the armour of a Primaris Space Marine? How curious.

Source

Spoiler:


The rumours have been circulating for a while now. But with the codex supplement announced on our road map and new cover art revealed, the fervent prayers of the faithful have been heard – the Black Templars are on their way.

What’s more, they’re bringing some shiny heretic-purging wargear with which to immolate anyone foolish enough to besmirch the glorious name of the God-Emperor. Behold the Primaris Initiate with pyreblaster!
Flamers are cool and all – if it’s possible for a weapon that sprays liquid fire to be ‘cool’ – but when it comes to delivering fiery death to the masses, the Black Templars prefer to dial it up to 11.
Spoiler:

It’s got a sturdier design and longer barrel than a traditional flamer, so the pyreblaster can hurl promethium-based annihilation with devastating force. Those wielding these weapons can make their blazing presence known from further away while searing through an enemy’s armour with even greater vim. If you like your heretic steak ‘well done’, look no further than this formidable weapon.
You might have noticed that the pyreblaster comes complete with a chain attaching it to the warrior’s wrist in the traditional manner of the Black Templars – perhaps that’s a hint at what else is on the way. Or maybe this particular chap is just prone to misplacing his belongings.

We’ll have more intel on what awaits you in the new Black Templars codex supplement – and anything else that may be accompanying it – as we near its release date.



Marshal Helbrecht:
Spoiler:


Black Templar Army Set
Spoiler:





Marshal sprue from a mispacked Hexfire.
Spoiler:


Chaplain Grimaldus:
Spoiler:



Transfer Sheet:
Spoiler:


Up for preorder next Saturday!
Reinforcements!
Castellan(S!)
Firstborn:

Primaris:

Upgrade set:

Spoiler:



Sword Brethren:

Spoiler:







Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 14:12:35


Post by: MonkeyBallistic


It’s beautiful! It captures the feel and pose of the original and doesn’t overload it with too much bling. This is a perfect example of how to update a classic mini.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 14:13:59


Post by: ImAGeek


I think it should have either been closer to the pose of the original, or completely different. They’ve changed things slightly with the pose, and I think they all make it overall worse than the original, personally. It’s alright, but it was always gonna be hard to top the last one.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 14:14:27


Post by: Grimskul


I knew it was only a matter of time before BT got their EC's revamped into plastic. I'm glad they kept the same style of helm as the original, though is it just me or do the lens seem more round? I would have preferred it if it was more sleek/slit like. Overall, not bad, but I feel I still like the OG sculpt more. Plastic is definitely a plus over finecast though.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 14:20:16


Post by: Wha-Mu-077


Because we totally needed more Marines.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 14:20:29


Post by: Theophony


I need another angle, the wrist in back looks too thin and the twist to the hand I odd. Plus is he leaning forward? the greaves look strange. I'm sure it's just because of the angle, but who know.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 14:21:28


Post by: ThatDraz


I have my old one sitting in a box somewhere. Fantastic model that shows simplicity can be an absolute winner!


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 14:22:07


Post by: Mad Doc Grotsnik


Wonder if this one will have a bum? The original didn’t.

Not entirely sold on the chest plate being so plain. Think it could’ve done with some interesting detail.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 14:22:19


Post by: a_typical_hero


Finally! Give it to me now!


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 14:26:33


Post by: Shadow Walker


I like his sword but need to see more pics to judge the model properly.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 14:26:43


Post by: grahamdbailey


I concur with the consensus, I think the previous iterations were better. The chestplate, for example, is too unadorned ; its missing something.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 14:26:57


Post by: Theophony


 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
Wonder if this one will have a bum? The original didn’t.

Not entirely sold on the chest plate being so plain. Think it could’ve done with some interesting detail.


IF they did anything on the chest plate then it would stop so many conversions or uses in armies besides the Black Templars. Here we will see some lovely freehand work from real artists....not me though.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 14:28:15


Post by: Galas


All changes with the original have been for the worse, TBH. But is not a bad miniature, difficult to be better than the old one, it was perfect.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 14:30:35


Post by: Ghaz


grahamdbailey wrote:
I concur with the consensus, I think the previous iterations were better. The chestplate, for example, is too unadorned ; its missing something.

The current Emperor's Champion has nothing on his chestplate as well, just a gold chain around his neck

Spoiler:


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 14:36:35


Post by: Crimson


The armour is interesting, it blends primaris style with some callbacks to the old design. The pose seems a tad awkward, though I need to see 360.

I really wish they would bring back the original idea that other chapters had Emperor's Champions too.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 14:36:47


Post by: ERJAK


grahamdbailey wrote:
I concur with the consensus, I think the previous iterations were better. The chestplate, for example, is too unadorned ; its missing something.


The most internet thing ever: Claim a non-existent consensus to legitimize a purely subjective opinion.

There is no consensus. There is groupthink between you and the guy who actually had the original thought that you're parroting. Maybe that's what you meant?


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 14:37:01


Post by: a_typical_hero


By the way, based on the backpack, this is a Primaris Marine.

I would find it odd if THE iconic Black Templar model would not be able to ride in a Land Raider Crusader.

Do you think the backpack is just aesthetics? Or will we see Firstborn transports being able to carry Primaris? Or he is Primaris and has to take Primaris rides?


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 14:37:27


Post by: Tim the Biovore


Top half of the sculpt is ace, let down by the lower half. The legs lack that slightly pointed style that the original has that made it seem more knightly, which is very strange because the detail shots show that they put that detail into the elbows. Tactical rock makes the whole thing seem a bit too "By the power of Greyskull".

Still a brilliant model, just fails to surpass the original


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 14:38:36


Post by: Sgt_Smudge


a_typical_hero wrote:
By the way, based on the backpack, this is a Primaris Marine.

I would find it odd if THE iconic Black Templar model would not be able to ride in a Land Raider Crusader.

Do you think the backpack is just aesthetics? Or will we see Firstborn transports being able to carry Primaris? Or he is Primaris and has to take Primaris rides?
The leg armour too is indicative of being Primaris.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 14:40:58


Post by: oni


I dig it. It's a beautiful model. My only critique is... I wish they would have left the rosary around his neck to add a little detail to the open, flat chest plate.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 14:42:04


Post by: MorglumNecksnapper



The old one is AMAZING, it looks proud and menacing, this one looks derpy to me, don't know what causes it.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 14:42:13


Post by: Oguhmek


Very nice. Will look great with my little BT force.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 14:43:31


Post by: Crimson


a_typical_hero wrote:
By the way, based on the backpack, this is a Primaris Marine.

I would find it odd if THE iconic Black Templar model would not be able to ride in a Land Raider Crusader.

Do you think the backpack is just aesthetics? Or will we see Firstborn transports being able to carry Primaris? Or he is Primaris and has to take Primaris rides?


I really wish they would get rid of primaris/non-primaris distinction in the rules. It can be fluff justification for some units having slightly better stats and different gear, but that's it.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 14:46:07


Post by: GaroRobe


One thing I'd change is the robe. The chest piece seems blocky and I don't like how it wraps around his legs. The poor dude is gonna trip.

Also, the legs seem weird. Very thick and blocky armor, and the knee pad doesn't seem to be a separate piece from the leg armor?

Otherwise, love it.



I hope we get some backpack options, if they release an upgrade sprue. I want some braziers


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 14:50:35


Post by: oni


a_typical_hero wrote:
By the way, based on the backpack, this is a Primaris Marine.

I would find it odd if THE iconic Black Templar model would not be able to ride in a Land Raider Crusader.

Do you think the backpack is just aesthetics? Or will we see Firstborn transports being able to carry Primaris? Or he is Primaris and has to take Primaris rides?


He's definitely Primaris. I do not think we'll see a change in rules, so no Land Raider for him. The Black Templars book will be a supplement to the Space Marines Codex.

I immediately had the thought that the Armour of Faith is no longer the Armour of Faith. How could it be if the Emperor's Champion is now a Primaris Marine?

Times are changing for Space Marines... even though no one asked for it.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 14:55:43


Post by: GaroRobe


I thought there was more than one armor of faith? I know there's a story about an ork who captures the champion and then makes a suit of armor from the armor of faith.

So it's not as bad as the BT losing a single suit of armor passed down from generation to generation.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 14:56:11


Post by: endlesswaltz123


I'm getting confused with some of the conversations in this thread.

When you are talking about the 'original' model, are you talking about this one (the on on the article):



Or are you talking about the actual original model, which is this:



Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 14:58:50


Post by: Grimskul


 endlesswaltz123 wrote:
I'm getting confused with some of the conversations in this thread.

When you are talking about the 'original' model, are you talking about this one (the on on the article):



Or are you talking about the actual original model, which is this:



I assume most people are talking about the one on the article or the one that is basically on the GW store right now.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 14:59:03


Post by: a_typical_hero


 GaroRobe wrote:
I thought there was more than one armor of faith? I know there's a story about an ork who captures the champion and then makes a suit of armor from the armor of faith.

So it's not as bad as the BT losing a single suit of armor passed down from generation to generation.


Every Black Templar Crusade got their own set of Champion relics. Even if it is not stated somewhere, that is how it must be, as BT are constantly crusading in smaller fleets.

And how else would you be able to fit out 10.000 marines?


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 15:05:33


Post by: jaredb


What a fantastic model, perfect and makes me want to re-paint my marines black lol.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 15:10:03


Post by: bullyboy


Confirmed!! Primaris Repulsor Crusader to carry the Champion, now with even more guns!!


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 15:17:15


Post by: a_typical_hero


By the way, in the Octarius preview GW teases a Black Templar army box.


Going forwards, we’re looking at ways we can make sure you don’t miss out on other awesome box sets too. So if, for instance, there was a sweet new Black Templars launch box on the horizon (just imagine that!) then that also sounds like the sort of box we’d want to make sure you could all get your hands on.


HYPE


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 15:29:56


Post by: JimmyWolf87


As someone who typically shakes my head at GW's often unnecessarily extravagant designs, blinged up equipment and daft poses, I'm somehow looking at the new model and thinking it's actually rather... boring.

Would have preferred the laurels to be part of the helm as per the older models. The last version (shown in the article) has a certain elegance to it with that pose. This one seems to have gone for the same effect but it's been marred by the obligatory tactical rock and general bulkiness.

It's not exactly bad, just looks like a fairly run of the mill kitbash.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 15:44:50


Post by: Mentlegen324


Not a fan of this re-design, really. The post of the original version had a sense of nobility and chivalry to it, holding his sword aloft in a sort of casual yet proud way without showing off. The pose of the new one really has the usual problems of current designs, with it being obnoxiously emotive - the way he's holding the sword in combination with his stance gives it much more of an unreserved brash, boasting sort of feel, while the position of his legs and other arm at the same time make it feel quite busy and unsophisticated. Things can't just be a simple yet evocative pose anymore, everything has to have sort of forced feel' to it.

It's like it's gone from a believable in-universe pose showing a sense of honour for the Emperor's Chamption, to the sort of thing you'd get as a generic tone-deaf PVP video game's wacky obnoxious victory pose where everything needs to dramatically show off.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 15:47:46


Post by: MaxT


Old one is perfection, so this had quite the standard to try and uphold. I’ll stick with my current one thanks tho


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 15:54:08


Post by: changemod


Mm yeah, if I was at all likely to collect Templars I'd be minded to rescue a finecast one and rescue the head, torso and sword blade then rebuild him using... Probably deathwatch arms and legs.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 15:55:26


Post by: Scrub


Well, it isn't any better than the already available current iteration bar being plastic and a bit bigger, if that sort of thing floats your boat.
I like the left hand with the beads as well... Erm, otherwise the older one is just a bit nicer overall I find.

The floaty papery bits and hover wreath do nothing for me tbh.



Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 15:56:29


Post by: Malika2


Mind...blown!


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 16:02:01


Post by: H.B.M.C.


New model is... fine. The current one is exquisite though, so it's hard to top.

 endlesswaltz123 wrote:
Or are you talking about the actual original model, which is this:

Whenever I see this model the first thing I hear in my head is "I see you Schwartz is as big as mine!".

Much prefer the latter version that came out, and wasn't Limited. I have two: One as normal, and the other with a Jump Pack.



Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 16:04:10


Post by: Goose LeChance


What's with the long gorilla arms?

GW still can't sculpt cloth.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 16:12:31


Post by: Gimgamgoo


The swooshing lines of that top breastplate just makes me think he's wearing a Britney crop top.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 16:13:43


Post by: Blastaar


The parchment flapping about looks fake, and the folds of the cloth too sharp. GW's new sculpting/casting techniques don't do cloth very well.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 16:17:10


Post by: Saber


The floaty bits are terrible -- purity seals, laurels, etc. They ruin the weight of the model's pose and obfuscate its profile.

The pose isn't great either, as the left arm is at an odd, half-cocked angle. The relative position of the legs and arms places all of the weight on the model's right side.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 16:19:33


Post by: Goose LeChance


The tabard going under the chest armour and poking out of the stomach is a bad look and no one can change my mind. Please stop.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 16:25:36


Post by: Shadow Walker


Goose LeChance wrote:
The tabard going under the chest armour and poking out of the stomach is a bad look and no one can change my mind. Please stop.
I agree with this. It looks weird.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 16:27:10


Post by: Brutus_Apex


Looks okay.

The pose is a bit awkward.

Needs more bling…like a lot more


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 16:29:42


Post by: Ghaz


 Shadow Walker wrote:
Goose LeChance wrote:
The tabard going under the chest armour and poking out of the stomach is a bad look and no one can change my mind. Please stop.
I agree with this. It looks weird.

It however is consistent with the Bladeguard Veterans.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 16:31:12


Post by: Shadow Walker


 Ghaz wrote:
 Shadow Walker wrote:
Goose LeChance wrote:
The tabard going under the chest armour and poking out of the stomach is a bad look and no one can change my mind. Please stop.
I agree with this. It looks weird.

It however is consistent with the Bladeguard Veterans.

Yeah, it is consistent, still looks weird on both


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 17:06:35


Post by: Bob Lorgar


That's not how you hold a sword if you plan to actually hit someone with its edge. He's basically just holding it as "hey, look at my neat sword!"


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 17:24:44


Post by: Grimtuff


Not a fan. Why not just rescale the current one into plastic? That Juan Diaz one is a masterpiece. The sword is at the wrong angle (complete with confusing Latin. "Light Emperor" makes no sense. At least "Emperor King" on the current one hits the ear right), the He-Man pose is not a scratch on the current one, where he looks like he's relentlessly coming for you and about to feth you up. Unnecessary ribbons all over him. The list goes on...


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 17:32:15


Post by: Irkjoe


Something about primaris looks off to me; the fat ankles and awkward leg poses don't make for a good silhouette. I will always take little marines over these.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 17:33:47


Post by: Formosa


Wow that is a boring model, easily converted from something else.

Swing and a miss for me


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 17:39:45


Post by: Agamemnon2


I think the flapping streamers mess with the silhouette too much for my liking, though that's in all likelihood less distracting when seeing the model as a 3D object and not a still image.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 17:43:45


Post by: Tiberias


It's a nice model, but the pose is not as good as the old one. The old emperors champion is perfection apart from its scale.

Also the new one is holding his sword wrong, what's up with that? No skilled swordsman would ever hold his weapon that way, ever. It's an easy fix, but still....


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 17:44:47


Post by: Lord Damocles


Why does he have straps on his greaves/chestplate? Are they the grimdark equivalent of extraneous non-functional zips?

Why doesn't he have the gorget which all other Mk10 plate features? (the artwork has it)

Is the belt supposed to be a replacement for the belt/waist section built into the armour why would you want that?

Why is his holster in such an inaccessible place?


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 17:54:52


Post by: rybackstun


a_typical_hero wrote:
By the way, in the Octarius preview GW teases a Black Templar army box.


Going forwards, we’re looking at ways we can make sure you don’t miss out on other awesome box sets too. So if, for instance, there was a sweet new Black Templars launch box on the horizon (just imagine that!) then that also sounds like the sort of box we’d want to make sure you could all get your hands on.


HYPE


I saw this as well. Hype indeed.

Glad to see they Bumped my boy EC into Primaris. I was considering making my own conversion but now I don't have to. Would love to see some more new stuff for my BT boys, but if this is all the new we get in a new BT box, as long as it comes with Assault Intercessors, I'm in!


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 17:57:17


Post by: Nightlord1987


I for one wanna know if we are gonna be able to take Primaris Company/Chapter Champions now.

Been holding off on my Lieutenant to Champion conversion for too long.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 18:02:00


Post by: Vorian


Tiberias wrote:
It's a nice model, but the pose is not as good as the old one. The old emperors champion is perfection apart from its scale.

Also the new one is holding his sword wrong, what's up with that? No skilled swordsman would ever hold his weapon that way, ever. It's an easy fix, but still....


He's not holding his sword as if he's fighting, he's raising it in acknowledgement.

The best description I can give is that he's doing a Lion-o


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 18:14:59


Post by: Wha-Mu-077


Vorian wrote:
Tiberias wrote:
It's a nice model, but the pose is not as good as the old one. The old emperors champion is perfection apart from its scale.

Also the new one is holding his sword wrong, what's up with that? No skilled swordsman would ever hold his weapon that way, ever. It's an easy fix, but still....


He's not holding his sword as if he's fighting, he's raising it in acknowledgement.

The best description I can give is that he's doing a Lion-o


He's doing a He-Man

NON-WARGAMING IMAGE REMOVED


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 18:30:14


Post by: Vorian


Your 80s icon of choice.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 19:12:17


Post by: The Phazer


Ooof. That's definitely the worst model in the entire Primaris range. It's not unforgivably awful, but it's a huge step down from the last version. The ribbon work, tabbard and pose are just much worse than its predecessor.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 19:16:24


Post by: Tiberias


Vorian wrote:
Tiberias wrote:
It's a nice model, but the pose is not as good as the old one. The old emperors champion is perfection apart from its scale.

Also the new one is holding his sword wrong, what's up with that? No skilled swordsman would ever hold his weapon that way, ever. It's an easy fix, but still....


He's not holding his sword as if he's fighting, he's raising it in acknowledgement.

The best description I can give is that he's doing a Lion-o


I'm sorry for being nitpicky on this, but even in such a scenario you wouldn't hold a sword that way. A sword handle is not round but oval shaped or has a rectangular cross section so you can always index the edge of the blade just by holding it in your hand. If you were to present the flat of your blade for whatever reason you'd turn your wrist, not just hold it wrong.
It's an easy fix on the model I know so it's not a big deal, but it really bothers me. Especially considering how perfect the pose one the old emperors champion is in comparison.

Also why do modern GW sculptors have such a weird relationship towards knees on their models? I have noticed this before on primaris lieutenants, but here it's also very noticeable: the knees kinda point inwards, making his stance look kind of awkward....why go for such a modeling choice?


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 19:44:57


Post by: Mr Morden


Its ok I guess - not wowed but I donlt hate it.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 19:57:35


Post by: Chopstick


 Mentlegen324 wrote:
Not a fan of this re-design, really. The post of the original version had a sense of nobility and chivalry to it, holding his sword aloft in a sort of casual yet proud way without showing off. The pose of the new one really has the usual problems of current designs, with it being obnoxiously emotive - the way he's holding the sword in combination with his stance gives it much more of an unreserved brash, boasting sort of feel, while the position of his legs and other arm at the same time make it feel quite busy and unsophisticated. Things can't just be a simple yet evocative pose anymore, everything has to have sort of forced feel' to it.

It's like it's gone from a believable in-universe pose showing a sense of honour for the Emperor's Chamption, to the sort of thing you'd get as a generic tone-deaf PVP video game's wacky obnoxious victory pose where everything needs to dramatically show off.


I agree, the new champion unfortunately is not a humble one.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 20:13:18


Post by: BertBert


Gonna need a 360 for a final assessment but the first impression is pretty good. The way he presents the flat of the blade irks me, though. I'll have to fix that.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 20:18:29


Post by: spiralingcadaver


So, when did GW retcon BT to be part of the imperial faith? (I played them in ages past but haven't paid much attention more recently... not a rhetorical question, was this new?)


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 20:20:03


Post by: grahamdbailey


 Ghaz wrote:
grahamdbailey wrote:
I concur with the consensus, I think the previous iterations were better. The chestplate, for example, is too unadorned ; its missing something.

The current Emperor's Champion has nothing on his chestplate as well, just a gold chain around his neck

Spoiler:


Yeah, but it breaks it up a bit.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 20:23:44


Post by: Dysartes


 H.B.M.C. wrote:
 endlesswaltz123 wrote:
Or are you talking about the actual original model, which is this:

Whenever I see this model the first thing I hear in my head is "I see you Schwartz is as big as mine!".

I always wanted to get one, swap out the sword for a fishing rod, and have him standing on a dock - possibly using a ripper as bait...


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 20:27:34


Post by: a_typical_hero


 spiralingcadaver wrote:
So, when did GW retcon BT to be part of the imperial faith? (I played them in ages past but haven't paid much attention more recently... not a rhetorical question, was this new?)

BT revered the Emperor as a god already back in 3rd IIRC. If not in codex Armageddon, it was stated in their own codex in 4th edition.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 20:27:47


Post by: Nevelon


It feels like he’s not presenting the sword, but the cross of the hilt, like he was warding off vampires.

Might be an interesting conversion to trim it down to just that, and put a different blade in his off-hand. Might make a nice judicar replacement. Rather a cross than an hourglass.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 20:32:44


Post by: Albino Squirrel


Must be really windy there.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 20:33:14


Post by: Theophony


He has the sword turned sideways so the enemy can read it before he smites them. After all: all xeno scum can read high gothic, it's just common humans that cannot read it.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 20:38:08


Post by: Lord Damocles


Also, why does he not have knees? I think that's what makes his legs look so very odd compared to most Primaris.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 20:40:23


Post by: EmperorsChampion


Nice, I finally got a new model.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 20:42:47


Post by: Wha-Mu-077


 EmperorsChampion wrote:
Nice, I finally got a new model.


Previous 130 didn't count for some reason, i assume?


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 20:55:15


Post by: Argive


I dig it.

Prefer the old one (got a metal one in my collection)

But its not bad.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 21:16:19


Post by: a_typical_hero


 Wha-Mu-077 wrote:
 EmperorsChampion wrote:
Nice, I finally got a new model.


Previous 130 didn't count for some reason, i assume?

2, actually. One of which was limited to a Games Day and both are ~20 years old. Just don't post if you only want to spew some nonesense that you know is wrong?


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 21:17:29


Post by: TheBestBucketHead


I think he meant space marine releases.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 21:18:00


Post by: Nevelon


a_typical_hero wrote:
 Wha-Mu-077 wrote:
 EmperorsChampion wrote:
Nice, I finally got a new model.


Previous 130 didn't count for some reason, i assume?

2, actually. One of which was limited to a Games Day and both are ~20 years old. Just don't post if you only want to spew some nonesense that you know is wrong?


Also, look at who you are responding to.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 21:24:12


Post by: Wha-Mu-077


a_typical_hero wrote:
 Wha-Mu-077 wrote:
 EmperorsChampion wrote:
Nice, I finally got a new model.


Previous 130 didn't count for some reason, i assume?

2, actually. One of which was limited to a Games Day and both are ~20 years old. Just don't post if you only want to spew some nonesense that you know is wrong?


Because you can't just... paint regular Marines black? For some reason?


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 21:45:36


Post by: a_typical_hero


Of course you can, but that doesn't change the fact that the Emperor's Champion only had two official models since 20 years.

Are new Chaos Terminators a substitute for an official Abaddon model just because you could kitbash them to have a sword and a claw?

Is the new Ork boss in megaarmor a substitute for Ghaz?



Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 21:49:06


Post by: Wha-Mu-077


a_typical_hero wrote:
Of course you can, but that doesn't change the fact that the Emperor's Champion only had two official models since 20 years.

Are new Chaos Terminators a substitute for an official Abaddon model just because you could kitbash them to have a sword and a claw?

Is the new Ork boss in megaarmor a substitute for Ghaz?



I'd argue all of those are much more important and needed relases than a dude holding a sword for a subfaction of a subfaction of an already bloated faction.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 21:50:28


Post by: Marshal Loss


Not the slam dunk I was hoping for, but still solid. The giant wreath hovering above the helm and the strange and mysterious movement of that ludicrously long loincloth are the main detractors for me.

Very excited to see what else they've cooked up for the BT.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 21:51:52


Post by: Wha-Mu-077


I finally remembered why i could've sworn i've seen this dude before. Just slap some greenstuff robes on him and ta-da.

[Thumb - 99070101032_SMPrimarisLieutenantPowerSword01.png]


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 22:01:42


Post by: Platuan4th


a_typical_hero wrote:
One of which was limited to a Games Day


No it wasn't. It was an Anniversary Limited Edition but released to all stores as both a blister and in the Heroes of the Imperium box.



Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 22:01:51


Post by: NightReconnaissance


So, if even the Emperor's Champion is being Primaris'd, does this put to bed the rumours that the 'first born' marines are going to be upscaled like the CSM and HH?





Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 22:05:10


Post by: TheBestBucketHead


NightReconnaissance wrote:
So, if even the Emperor's Champion is being Primaris'd, does this put to bed the rumours that the 'first born' marines are going to be upscaled like the CSM and HH?





Castellan Crowe is upscaled. But it might end up being a CSM and Grey Knight thing only.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/09 22:09:15


Post by: Tiberias


 Wha-Mu-077 wrote:
a_typical_hero wrote:
Of course you can, but that doesn't change the fact that the Emperor's Champion only had two official models since 20 years.

Are new Chaos Terminators a substitute for an official Abaddon model just because you could kitbash them to have a sword and a claw?

Is the new Ork boss in megaarmor a substitute for Ghaz?



I'd argue all of those are much more important and needed relases than a dude holding a sword for a subfaction of a subfaction of an already bloated faction.


While I get that people are not keen on seeing another space marine character, the emperors champion is as iconic a model as abaddon and ghaz. The original sculpt is legendary and has been around for decades. It's not fair to compare it to space marine lieutenant nr. 24 or newcomers like tor garadon.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/10 01:49:34


Post by: NightReconnaissance


 TheBestBucketHead wrote:
NightReconnaissance wrote:
So, if even the Emperor's Champion is being Primaris'd, does this put to bed the rumours that the 'first born' marines are going to be upscaled like the CSM and HH?





Castellan Crowe is upscaled. But it might end up being a CSM and Grey Knight thing only.


It could signal that GW made a change in creative direction, originally planning to squat the 'first born' but have changed their mind and there are still lots of models in the pipeline like this one from before that happened. That GW decided to remove all the variety and creativity of the old marines and their various marks of armour for the monotony of the Primaris was a very poor decision. (They came up with a silly justification for the Primaris, they couldn't come up with a silly explanation for why they'd have some variety in their armour?) And that's before we get into how poor the non-Intercessors look compared to their original rough equivalents (With the exception of the scouts) or how stupid it is that the CSM are now shorter than mainline marines.

They'll retcon or ignore everything else but the Primaris fluff is a hill they'll die on, everything must be made to be compliant with it even to the detriment of their products and hobby.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/10 01:55:18


Post by: Togusa


Oh wow! So Cool! More Space Marines. Screw those stupid Eldar and Tyranid factions. Bring me more power armor! YAY! GW BEST A#1 Marines BEST! YAY! s/

The model looks fine. But, meh. More marines....


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/10 02:31:58


Post by: bullyboy


I don't mind it but I'd want more Templar details on the model. The chest plate, greaves and waistcloth are very plain.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/10 02:40:52


Post by: Tygre


Nowhere in the article mentions he is a primaris and he is wearing relic armour, "The Armour of Faith", which would predate primaris.

My minor issues with it are the tabard and the pistol holster. The tabard over the belly looks weird, but that is likely just because of the paint job. The pistol holster is positioned for his right hand, in a cross draw, which is holding his sword. The holster should either be on the other side or face the other way for a left handed draw.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/10 02:50:53


Post by: Dread Master


What an awesome model! Can’t wait to see the rest of the BT releases.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/10 02:52:21


Post by: H.B.M.C.


Tygre wrote:
Nowhere in the article mentions he is a primaris and he is wearing relic armour, "The Armour of Faith", which would predate primaris.
You really think that this isn't a Primaris Marine? Even with the Primaris-style backpack, the hip armour and the knee pad flares?


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/10 04:16:02


Post by: Tygre


 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Tygre wrote:
Nowhere in the article mentions he is a primaris and he is wearing relic armour, "The Armour of Faith", which would predate primaris.
You really think that this isn't a Primaris Marine? Even with the Primaris-style backpack, the hip armour and the knee pad flares?


To me that is a regular marine backpack, I noticed no real difference. Yes his mk6 legs now have flares over the knees. The Armour of Faith supposed to be a relic and artificer armour. Are you telling me that now only primaris can become the Emperors Champion. Or can it be either and GW gave some stylistic similarities to both first born and primaris so it would fit with the different styles.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/10 04:43:42


Post by: ImAGeek


Tygre wrote:
 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Tygre wrote:
Nowhere in the article mentions he is a primaris and he is wearing relic armour, "The Armour of Faith", which would predate primaris.
You really think that this isn't a Primaris Marine? Even with the Primaris-style backpack, the hip armour and the knee pad flares?


To me that is a regular marine backpack, I noticed no real difference. Yes his mk6 legs now have flares over the knees. The Armour of Faith supposed to be a relic and artificer armour. Are you telling me that now only primaris can become the Emperors Champion. Or can it be either and GW gave some stylistic similarities to both first born and primaris so it would fit with the different styles.


It can be either, yeah. There are more than one sets of Armour of Faith. This is a Primaris version.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Wha-Mu-077 wrote:
 EmperorsChampion wrote:
Nice, I finally got a new model.


Previous 130 didn't count for some reason, i assume?


Missed the name of the person you’re replying to, I assume?


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/10 05:09:59


Post by: tneva82


Nah he just wants to complain about gw so twists everything to attack for gw.

Were gw to declare 99% price cut and 100 releases for every faction next month he would still attack gw. Gw bad, gw evil.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/10 05:15:30


Post by: H.B.M.C.


tneva82 wrote:
Were gw to declare 99% price cut and 100 releases for every faction next month he would still attack gw. Gw bad, gw evil.
No he wouldn't. Your hyperbole doesn't help here.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/10 07:14:31


Post by: a_typical_hero


 Platuan4th wrote:
a_typical_hero wrote:
One of which was limited to a Games Day


No it wasn't. It was an Anniversary Limited Edition but released to all stores as both a blister and in the Heroes of the Imperium box.

My bad. I could have sworn it was GD exclusive. Mandela effect, huh. Never heard of the Heroes of the Imperium box before, despite being quite active from 3rd to 6th.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/10 07:29:14


Post by: kirotheavenger


His backpack has the Primaris round bulge on the back, but lacks the Primaris armour plates on the vent nodules.

His legs are 100% Primaris, they have the hip plates, knee flares, ankle bulges, top of the foot plate.

His helmet lacks the Primaris ear plates.

To me, this looks like a Primaris with older armour marks integrated, no doubt to show off the relic-ness of the armour.
Pretty cool, it's great to see Primaris showing something other than plain, bland, Mk.X.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/10 07:44:52


Post by: ph34r


Ok, is it just me or is the sword nowhere near straight, or even centered correctly?



Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/10 08:15:12


Post by: Grimtuff


a_typical_hero wrote:
 Platuan4th wrote:
a_typical_hero wrote:
One of which was limited to a Games Day


No it wasn't. It was an Anniversary Limited Edition but released to all stores as both a blister and in the Heroes of the Imperium box.

My bad. I could have sworn it was GD exclusive. Mandela effect, huh. Never heard of the Heroes of the Imperium box before, despite being quite active from 3rd to 6th.


Because you (presumably) live in Germany. That box was a USA exclusive, Europe (well certainly the UK) only got the anniversary blister.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/10 08:20:18


Post by: Nazrak


Having had another look at this, something I find quite interesting about it is how it mixes Primaris and MkVII design cues in a way we've not seen before. There's some obvious Primaris stuff – the shape/design of the lower legs, the round plate on the back of the power pack – but some other stuff – the "ears" on the helmet, lack of raised gorget on the torso, the shape of the power pack vents and top section – are very old-school.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/10 09:13:27


Post by: Geifer


I want to see a 360 view before final judgment, but so far the model looks like a very expensive source of bits to me. I don't think I would have considered it inspiring if the old model didn't exist. In direct comparison, it boggles the mind that GW would consider the new one an adequate replacement.

Like, how hard can it be for a manager to go and say "this one, but bigger"? It's kind of hard to believe nobody was aware that the old one was a beloved and iconic sculpt and improving on it was going to be close to impossible.

 ph34r wrote:
Ok, is it just me or is the sword nowhere near straight, or even centered correctly?



That probably means the sword is tipped forward. Not that you can't get it wrong, but CAD sculpting is somewhat proof against accidentally building in unintended bends.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/10 09:21:36


Post by: Nazrak


I'm gonna go against what most other people have been saying here – the previous one was a very cool sculpt in isolation, but in the context of the rest of the Space Marine range, always felt a bit slight and insubstantial to me, like, almost too elegant to be a Space Marine (arguably, that's Juan Diaz for you). This lad looks like he'd hit like a truck. And I say this as someone who would have largely much preferred to see Proper Marines get the same upscaling job the Chaos fellas got rather than Primaris Nonsense.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/10 09:33:39


Post by: Crimson


 kirotheavenger wrote:
His backpack has the Primaris round bulge on the back, but lacks the Primaris armour plates on the vent nodules.

His legs are 100% Primaris, they have the hip plates, knee flares, ankle bulges, top of the foot plate.

His helmet lacks the Primaris ear plates.

To me, this looks like a Primaris with older armour marks integrated, no doubt to show off the relic-ness of the armour.
Pretty cool, it's great to see Primaris showing something other than plain, bland, Mk.X.


Yeah, it's a mix. Cool concept. And as veteran intercessors are now a separate unit, I really wish they would do a dedicated veteran intercessor kit in this style, primaris armour mixed with the older elements. It could represent veterans that have undergone the Rubicon Primaris and decided to keep some of their old armour.

I much prefer primaris over the older models, but one thing I miss from the older line is the small differences that allow some personalisation; primaris are too uniform for my liking.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/10 09:42:08


Post by: Billicus


I just kit bash my primaris with the more recent classic scale power armoured stuff, 90% of the heads, shoulder pads, weapons and sticky on bling bling look just fine. You even get away with arms if you stick them on a little low in the shoulder joint and cover that with the shoulder pad. I'd like better chapter upgrade sets like the old dark angel veteran and black templar chapter upgrade sets over having too much more bling on the basic kits though, they're expensive enough as it is


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/10 09:53:36


Post by: Crimson


Billicus wrote:
I just kit bash my primaris with the more recent classic scale power armoured stuff, 90% of the heads, shoulder pads, weapons and sticky on bling bling look just fine. You even get away with arms if you stick them on a little low in the shoulder joint and cover that with the shoulder pad. I'd like better chapter upgrade sets like the old dark angel veteran and black templar chapter upgrade sets over having too much more bling on the basic kits though, they're expensive enough as it is


Yeah, I do that as well and it works fine. Still, I wouldn't mind that variety being built in. The chests in particular are a bit of a hassle, as they're all identical and customising them takes more than a simple kitbash. I often shave the eagle off and glue various bits, but I would certainly welcome some variant primaris chest pieces!


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/10 19:37:58


Post by: EmperorsChampion


 Nevelon wrote:
a_typical_hero wrote:
 Wha-Mu-077 wrote:
 EmperorsChampion wrote:
Nice, I finally got a new model.


Previous 130 didn't count for some reason, i assume?

2, actually. One of which was limited to a Games Day and both are ~20 years old. Just don't post if you only want to spew some nonesense that you know is wrong?


Also, look at who you are responding to.


A woosh moment...

But i'm excited, it's been 15+ years since the BT had had a new model.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/10 19:42:19


Post by: Togusa


 ph34r wrote:
Ok, is it just me or is the sword nowhere near straight, or even centered correctly?



The things people find to complain about never cease to amaze me.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 EmperorsChampion wrote:
 Nevelon wrote:
a_typical_hero wrote:
 Wha-Mu-077 wrote:
 EmperorsChampion wrote:
Nice, I finally got a new model.


Previous 130 didn't count for some reason, i assume?

2, actually. One of which was limited to a Games Day and both are ~20 years old. Just don't post if you only want to spew some nonesense that you know is wrong?


Also, look at who you are responding to.


A woosh moment...

But i'm excited, it's been 15+ years since the BT had had a new model.


Is there a chance that they would do a squad Grimaldis? Would a Unit of Characters work? Cause that might interest me given my love for the book.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/10 19:43:39


Post by: Albertorius


Togusa wrote:
The things people find to complain about never cease to amaze me.

What a notion, am I right? That people's suspension of disbelief can be broken by different things.

Boggles the mind.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/10 19:51:43


Post by: EmperorsChampion


I foresee them updating Helbrecht, maybe Grimaldus as well...rumors were floating around about a BT specific Ancient. Seems like a load of new models and we've never seen this kind of primaris release outside of the basic models. I would love a new crusader squad...but I shall not be too greedy.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/10 22:29:31


Post by: rybackstun


Both Helbrecht and Grimaldus seem like they'd be way too old to survive the Rubicon. Mind you that doesn't mean it wouldn't happen but I think we'd be more likely to see new characters rather than them getting bumped.

Also I think, much like GKs ant TSs, this will be the only new model in a potential BT box coming.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/10 23:43:14


Post by: Kanluwen


Nah. They wouldn't be doing a launch box if it was just one new model.

It might be Initiates or packed in with an upgrade frame or something, but there's likely to be a ton of New New New.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/11 00:04:05


Post by: H.B.M.C.


Togusa wrote:
The things people find to complain about never cease to amaze me.
What's more disturbing is that anyone would call that a "complaint" rather than just "an observation".


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/11 01:26:16


Post by: rybackstun


 Kanluwen wrote:
Nah. They wouldn't be doing a launch box if it was just one new model.

It might be Initiates or packed in with an upgrade frame or something, but there's likely to be a ton of New New New.


I mean I'd be crazy happy with that. Primaris Crusade squads would be fantastic.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/11 01:32:37


Post by: H.B.M.C.


What would Primaris Neophytes even look like...

How does Primaris recruiting work?


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/11 01:38:16


Post by: TalonZahn


 H.B.M.C. wrote:
What would Primaris Neophytes even look like...

How does Primaris recruiting work?


Test Tubes where their arms stick out the sides.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/11 02:00:18


Post by: Kanluwen


 rybackstun wrote:
 Kanluwen wrote:
Nah. They wouldn't be doing a launch box if it was just one new model.

It might be Initiates or packed in with an upgrade frame or something, but there's likely to be a ton of New New New.


I mean I'd be crazy happy with that. Primaris Crusade squads would be fantastic.

The reason I said "Initiates" is that Scouts are due an update and I could see Black Templars actually getting a unique "Initiate" unit in lieu of just using Scouts which could come later with a Kill Team set.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/11 03:43:37


Post by: Marshal Loss


New neophytes/scouts are coming with this release, per folks with inside knowledge. Sword Brethren are also getting a dedicated kit (not an upgrade sprue). It's a sizable release with c. 5 Primaris characters, 2 Primaris units, and an upgrade sprue.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/11 06:13:27


Post by: Dudeface


 Marshal Loss wrote:
New neophytes/scouts are coming with this release, per folks with inside knowledge. Sword Brethren are also getting a dedicated kit (not an upgrade sprue). It's a sizable release with c. 5 Primaris characters, 2 Primaris units, and an upgrade sprue.


I'd never have put money on templars being the chapter to get the first dedicated primaris unit kit over the bigger chapters.

I don't really count the bodyguard guys for the ultras due to being bundled with a special character.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/11 06:14:09


Post by: tneva82


 rybackstun wrote:
Both Helbrecht and Grimaldus seem like they'd be way too old to survive the Rubicon. Mind you that doesn't mean it wouldn't happen but I think we'd be more likely to see new characters rather than them getting bumped.

Also I think, much like GKs ant TSs, this will be the only new model in a potential BT box coming.


They survive it if GW writes it

GW writes fluff to suit models that were designed. Not design models over fluff.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Kanluwen wrote:
Nah. They wouldn't be doing a launch box if it was just one new model.

It might be Initiates or packed in with an upgrade frame or something, but there's likely to be a ton of New New New.


And how many new grey knights newest launch box had?-)


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/11 06:25:54


Post by: Hanskrampf


tneva82 wrote:
 rybackstun wrote:
Both Helbrecht and Grimaldus seem like they'd be way too old to survive the Rubicon. Mind you that doesn't mean it wouldn't happen but I think we'd be more likely to see new characters rather than them getting bumped.

Also I think, much like GKs ant TSs, this will be the only new model in a potential BT box coming.


They survive it if GW writes it

GW writes fluff to suit models that were designed. Not design models over fluff.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Kanluwen wrote:
Nah. They wouldn't be doing a launch box if it was just one new model.

It might be Initiates or packed in with an upgrade frame or something, but there's likely to be a ton of New New New.


And how many new grey knights newest launch box had?-)

Hexfire is a battlebox though, where mostly always just a new character is included (like Tooth & Claw, Wraith something, or even before Primaris the Baal box, etc), whereas a launch box like the SoB, Lumineth, Beastsnaggas has only new models.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/11 06:27:51


Post by: Dudeface


tneva82 wrote:
 rybackstun wrote:
Both Helbrecht and Grimaldus seem like they'd be way too old to survive the Rubicon. Mind you that doesn't mean it wouldn't happen but I think we'd be more likely to see new characters rather than them getting bumped.

Also I think, much like GKs ant TSs, this will be the only new model in a potential BT box coming.


They survive it if GW writes it

GW writes fluff to suit models that were designed. Not design models over fluff.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Kanluwen wrote:
Nah. They wouldn't be doing a launch box if it was just one new model.

It might be Initiates or packed in with an upgrade frame or something, but there's likely to be a ton of New New New.


And how many new grey knights newest launch box had?-)


Sorry to nitpick but the grey knights are in a battle box (there's been many all of which are old models with new characters as I'm sure you're aware, like the prophecy of the wolf box for example), a launch box or early release box is more like the beast snaggas box, or lumineth and again with sisters in recent years.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/11 15:49:46


Post by: Irbis


Tygre wrote:
Nowhere in the article mentions he is a primaris and he is wearing relic armour, "The Armour of Faith", which would predate primaris.

Except Armour of Faith was always quickly adjustable plate (it can't be custom fitted due to random, temporary owners). That's why it has straps. It has to go over whatever armour frame the chosen marine has, and modifying it to fit primaris one was probably pretty easy, seeing Mk X is the most modular and adaptable SM mark produced so far.

The pistol holster is positioned for his right hand, in a cross draw, which is holding his sword. The holster should either be on the other side or face the other way for a left handed draw.

Not really. He can draw it with his left hand just fine if he rotates his wrist. And holster on the back of hip makes a lot of sense because it can't be hit from the front damaging the gun (or worse, exploding ammunition right into weak hip joint) when the owner is advancing, or it can't be caught on dumb wrist chain, etc. New holster is better positioned than old one considering EC main job and primary role.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/11 16:03:46


Post by: ImAGeek


I’m not massively au fait on Black Templar lore but looking at the various wikis, it seems like the Armour of Faith isn’t one specific suit of armour anyway, it’s more a name they give the artificer armour worn by the Emperors Champion after it’s been blessed and consecrated and inscribed with whatever wards they use and stuff.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/11 16:14:29


Post by: Kanluwen


 Marshal Loss wrote:
New neophytes/scouts are coming with this release, per folks with inside knowledge. Sword Brethren are also getting a dedicated kit (not an upgrade sprue). It's a sizable release with c. 5 Primaris characters, 2 Primaris units, and an upgrade sprue.

Ehh...all the rumors that have pointed to Neophytes suggest they're going to be a dedicated BT unit not updated Scouts. Scouts are supposed to be later and tied to Kill Team.

The Sword Brethren rumors I've seen imply that it's "a dedicated kit and not just an upgrade sprue"...but the Wolves of Morkai are a dedicated unit that's made with just an upgrade sprue and were billed as "a dedicated kit" too.
Dudeface wrote:

I'd never have put money on templars being the chapter to get the first dedicated primaris unit kit over the bigger chapters.

I don't really count the bodyguard guys for the ultras due to being bundled with a special character.

Dark Angels, and Space Wolves have all had "dedicated primaris units" since the release of their Lieutenant models, if you want to get nitpicky. They have loadouts nobody else gets in the form of the MC Bolt Carbine+Axe for SW and the Plasma Pistol+Power Sword for DA.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/11 18:11:03


Post by: Dudeface


 Kanluwen wrote:
 Marshal Loss wrote:
New neophytes/scouts are coming with this release, per folks with inside knowledge. Sword Brethren are also getting a dedicated kit (not an upgrade sprue). It's a sizable release with c. 5 Primaris characters, 2 Primaris units, and an upgrade sprue.

Ehh...all the rumors that have pointed to Neophytes suggest they're going to be a dedicated BT unit not updated Scouts. Scouts are supposed to be later and tied to Kill Team.

The Sword Brethren rumors I've seen imply that it's "a dedicated kit and not just an upgrade sprue"...but the Wolves of Morkai are a dedicated unit that's made with just an upgrade sprue and were billed as "a dedicated kit" too.
Dudeface wrote:

I'd never have put money on templars being the chapter to get the first dedicated primaris unit kit over the bigger chapters.

I don't really count the bodyguard guys for the ultras due to being bundled with a special character.

Dark Angels, and Space Wolves have all had "dedicated primaris units" since the release of their Lieutenant models, if you want to get nitpicky. They have loadouts nobody else gets in the form of the MC Bolt Carbine+Axe for SW and the Plasma Pistol+Power Sword for DA.


The Lieutenants are exactly that however, they have a specific load out but are functionally no different, the nearest are death company intercessors and hounds of morkai as you note, but are just "standard primaris unit with bits on".

If sword brethren get a bespoke kit and unit profile that isn't just "blade guard but black and maybe without shield", then it's setting a new precedent for units like primaris sanguinary guard, or wulfen etc. to get kits in the future.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/11 18:45:03


Post by: Kanluwen


The lieutenants are "functionally no different" aside from being faction locked.

Like I said, rumors pointed to Hounds of Morkai being a "dedicated kit". We saw what happened with that.


I'm thinking that what we're most likely to see is a "Crusader Squad" for a Troops choice for BT, being an upgrade sprue+Assault Intercessor Squad.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/12 04:57:35


Post by: Marshal Loss


 Kanluwen wrote:
 Marshal Loss wrote:
New neophytes/scouts are coming with this release, per folks with inside knowledge. Sword Brethren are also getting a dedicated kit (not an upgrade sprue). It's a sizable release with c. 5 Primaris characters, 2 Primaris units, and an upgrade sprue.

Ehh...all the rumors that have pointed to Neophytes suggest they're going to be a dedicated BT unit not updated Scouts. Scouts are supposed to be later and tied to Kill Team.

The Sword Brethren rumors I've seen imply that it's "a dedicated kit and not just an upgrade sprue"...but the Wolves of Morkai are a dedicated unit that's made with just an upgrade sprue and were billed as "a dedicated kit" too.


The Neophyte rumours have been worded differently all over the place, but the SB ones are consistent: it is a full dedicated kit, not an existing kit packaged with an upgrade sprue, per those that have seen the models. No rumour mongers billed the Morkai as a "dedicated kit", that's just GW's advertising. AFAIK we have no concrete information on the Crusaders or what the vehicle upgrade sprue contains at this stage.

It's pretty obvious that this is the first chapter-specific Primaris release of significant scale, so comparisons with existing supplements are probably going to fall short of the mark. In any case, we'll see soon enough.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/12 11:55:18


Post by: Crimson


Could we get some recap on the scout/neophyte rumours? Because those are definitely something that would need new models, the old ones are pretty much unusable.

I am also really interest to see what the sword brethren will look like, if the rumour turn out to be true. I have some unfinished blade guards on my work bench, but perhaps I will wait for this new kit to see if it is something these could be kitbashed with.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/14 22:45:55


Post by: Olgerth Istaarn


The new EC model gets goofier the longer you look at it.

He holds the sword like it's a crucifix instead of like, you know, a sword. He's not giving a sermon, he's supposed to be challenging the enemy's Big Bad.

The breastplate is oddly short and very plain. There's nothing there to break up the empty space, where the old one had the necklace.

The pistol is set up for crossdraw with the sword hand. And while he COULD in theory draw with his left hand it would be awkward as hell. If they wanted the pistol to be rigged for crossdraw it should be farther to the right on his back or on his right hip (like on the old model)

The tabard looks all weird and angular on his abdomen and then winds around his leg all goofy-like.

He's supposed to have an iron halo... Iron halo is a backpack-mounted projector, not a helmet bling. It's also sticking up in a dopey fashion. It looks more or less right because he's tucking his chin in, but if his head is at a normal angle looking forward, the wreath would stick up in the air like a pair of horns.

His lower legs look MASSIVE, and make his arms look weedy.

The shoulder pads are plain, without the ridges that the ECs always had, another miss.

I actually liked the old champ. He looked purposeful and menacing and struck just the right balance between being special but also having plainer armor in BT's tradition. Shame they didn't do him justice with the update.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/15 02:02:45


Post by: Rihgu


Dudeface wrote:
 Kanluwen wrote:
 Marshal Loss wrote:
New neophytes/scouts are coming with this release, per folks with inside knowledge. Sword Brethren are also getting a dedicated kit (not an upgrade sprue). It's a sizable release with c. 5 Primaris characters, 2 Primaris units, and an upgrade sprue.

Ehh...all the rumors that have pointed to Neophytes suggest they're going to be a dedicated BT unit not updated Scouts. Scouts are supposed to be later and tied to Kill Team.

The Sword Brethren rumors I've seen imply that it's "a dedicated kit and not just an upgrade sprue"...but the Wolves of Morkai are a dedicated unit that's made with just an upgrade sprue and were billed as "a dedicated kit" too.
Dudeface wrote:

I'd never have put money on templars being the chapter to get the first dedicated primaris unit kit over the bigger chapters.

I don't really count the bodyguard guys for the ultras due to being bundled with a special character.

Dark Angels, and Space Wolves have all had "dedicated primaris units" since the release of their Lieutenant models, if you want to get nitpicky. They have loadouts nobody else gets in the form of the MC Bolt Carbine+Axe for SW and the Plasma Pistol+Power Sword for DA.


The Lieutenants are exactly that however, they have a specific load out but are functionally no different, the nearest are death company intercessors and hounds of morkai as you note, but are just "standard primaris unit with bits on".

If sword brethren get a bespoke kit and unit profile that isn't just "blade guard but black and maybe without shield", then it's setting a new precedent for units like primaris sanguinary guard, or wulfen etc. to get kits in the future.


What about Victrix Guard?


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/15 06:00:09


Post by: BrianDavion


Rihgu wrote:
Dudeface wrote:
 Kanluwen wrote:
 Marshal Loss wrote:
New neophytes/scouts are coming with this release, per folks with inside knowledge. Sword Brethren are also getting a dedicated kit (not an upgrade sprue). It's a sizable release with c. 5 Primaris characters, 2 Primaris units, and an upgrade sprue.

Ehh...all the rumors that have pointed to Neophytes suggest they're going to be a dedicated BT unit not updated Scouts. Scouts are supposed to be later and tied to Kill Team.

The Sword Brethren rumors I've seen imply that it's "a dedicated kit and not just an upgrade sprue"...but the Wolves of Morkai are a dedicated unit that's made with just an upgrade sprue and were billed as "a dedicated kit" too.
Dudeface wrote:

I'd never have put money on templars being the chapter to get the first dedicated primaris unit kit over the bigger chapters.

I don't really count the bodyguard guys for the ultras due to being bundled with a special character.

Dark Angels, and Space Wolves have all had "dedicated primaris units" since the release of their Lieutenant models, if you want to get nitpicky. They have loadouts nobody else gets in the form of the MC Bolt Carbine+Axe for SW and the Plasma Pistol+Power Sword for DA.


The Lieutenants are exactly that however, they have a specific load out but are functionally no different, the nearest are death company intercessors and hounds of morkai as you note, but are just "standard primaris unit with bits on".

If sword brethren get a bespoke kit and unit profile that isn't just "blade guard but black and maybe without shield", then it's setting a new precedent for units like primaris sanguinary guard, or wulfen etc. to get kits in the future.


What about Victrix Guard?


they came with a character so people tend to discount them. a flunky that accompanies a character is a bit differant from say a seperate box of that unit.

that said my guess is from the rumors we'll see new scouts, a mixed scout/assault marine unit, and a chapter specific unit in sword brethren.. which may yes just be a boix of something that already exists with an upgrade sprue, we'll have to wait and see, new scouts is pretty big news IMHO


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/15 10:34:59


Post by: Nevelon


New scout models would be bigger news if their rules weren’t a flaming dumpster fire. I’ve enjoyed playing scouts for my entire 40k career, but what 9th did to their rules was bad.

Would adding them to crusade squads make them viable? It would at least put them back as troops (I assume) and out of the elite slot. But they are not cheep wounds for the squad anymore. Sure, they might be less points per model, but half the wounds. They would give you some flavorful weapon options in the tac squad.

Not going to argue that the scouts don’t need a redo. They are old and badly sculpted. (Snipers aren’t horrible, but the regular guys most defiantly are) If done as a Kill Team release, I could see it. But for 40k, they are going to go straight from the factory to collecting dust on shelves.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/15 10:42:05


Post by: ERJAK


tneva82 wrote:
 rybackstun wrote:
Both Helbrecht and Grimaldus seem like they'd be way too old to survive the Rubicon. Mind you that doesn't mean it wouldn't happen but I think we'd be more likely to see new characters rather than them getting bumped.

Also I think, much like GKs ant TSs, this will be the only new model in a potential BT box coming.


They survive it if GW writes it

GW writes fluff to suit models that were designed. Not design models over fluff.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Kanluwen wrote:
Nah. They wouldn't be doing a launch box if it was just one new model.

It might be Initiates or packed in with an upgrade frame or something, but there's likely to be a ton of New New New.


And how many new grey knights newest launch box had?-)


2 Counterpoints: 1. Obviously, not a launch box. 2. How many new models did the Adepta Sororitas Launch Box have? Or the Beast Snaggas?


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/15 13:27:51


Post by: RoterBaronH


 Nevelon wrote:
New scout models would be bigger news if their rules weren’t a flaming dumpster fire. I’ve enjoyed playing scouts for my entire 40k career, but what 9th did to their rules was bad.

Would adding them to crusade squads make them viable? It would at least put them back as troops (I assume) and out of the elite slot. But they are not cheep wounds for the squad anymore. Sure, they might be less points per model, but half the wounds. They would give you some flavorful weapon options in the tac squad.

Not going to argue that the scouts don’t need a redo. They are old and badly sculpted. (Snipers aren’t horrible, but the regular guys most defiantly are) If done as a Kill Team release, I could see it. But for 40k, they are going to go straight from the factory to collecting dust on shelves.


I can't see this happening. If they release scouts they are going to be some kind of primaris scouts. Like scouts but different.

It would be a first that they rework an excisting SM unit and not making a new one which is similar.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/15 13:32:24


Post by: Kanluwen


The whole Primaris bit doesn't come into play with Scouts. Scouts are still a thing in all-Primaris Chapters. They just have "big brothers" in the form of the Vanguard Company which is also part of the 10th in codex chapters.

That all said, Primaris based Initiates and Neophytes for BT could easily be worked up using Phobos and Tacitus gear since the main power armor for the Primaris is a modular system.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/15 13:38:18


Post by: RoterBaronH


 Kanluwen wrote:
The whole Primaris bit doesn't come into play with Scouts. Scouts are still a thing in all-Primaris Chapters. They just have "big brothers" in the form of the Vanguard Company which is also part of the 10th in codex chapters.

That all said, Primaris based Initiates and Neophytes for BT could easily be worked up using Phobos and Tacitus gear since the main power armor for the Primaris is a modular system.


While this is true. Primaris are a rework of the SM line and I would be really surprised if they take over the scouts as they are now. I think that, like all Primaris kits, they're going to be some kind of re-imagination of the old scouts.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/15 13:42:10


Post by: Crimson


 Kanluwen wrote:
The whole Primaris bit doesn't come into play with Scouts. Scouts are still a thing in all-Primaris Chapters. They just have "big brothers" in the form of the Vanguard Company which is also part of the 10th in codex chapters.

I don't really see why GW wouldn't differentiate between primaris and non-primaris scouts if a new kit is being released. That has been their tactic the whole time.


That all said, Primaris based Initiates and Neophytes for BT could easily be worked up using Phobos and Tacitus gear since the main power armor for the Primaris is a modular system.

Well, the rumour said that neophytes would have two wounds and attacks like all primaris. And can take shotguns. I suspect they will have scout armour, but that was not mentioned.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/15 14:26:00


Post by: Kanluwen


Don't forget that there were two mentions of Neophytes...

One of a dedicated 3 model kit and one of a Primaris upgrade frame "including an arm holding a helmet and a shotgun arm".

Truthfully, I don't know what all to expect. The big rumor dump seemed to point towards a dedicated unit rather than them just redoing the whole "Neophytes=Scouts 100%" thing.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/15 14:28:22


Post by: Nevelon


Game mechanics/models, phobos armor has pretty much replaced scouts 100%.

From a lore POV, is the black carapace still the last step of implants? If that happens after those new fangled primaris implants, we would still have primaris scouts, with all the perks barring power armor.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/15 14:32:49


Post by: Kanluwen


Black Carapace is still the last, yeah.

The biggest thing to note is that the three Primaris organs aren't really "visible distinctions" and can be implanted at any point during a Marine's career. The visibility part might explain why the rumor is a 3 model Neophytes box I guess, putting them as a unit upgrade or optional bit rather than mandatory?


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/15 16:34:13


Post by: GaroRobe


https://www.instagram.com/p/CSj2x4HnQZA/

This simple conversion (it's photoshop, but easily convertible) really makes me dislike the new EC model.

Like, with a better body, it's 100x better


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/15 17:03:07


Post by: Geifer


 GaroRobe wrote:
https://www.instagram.com/p/CSj2x4HnQZA/

This simple conversion (it's photoshop, but easily convertible) really makes me dislike the new EC model.

Like, with a better body, it's 100x better


That makes the "look at my sword" thing he's got going on even worse in my opinion...


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/15 18:57:43


Post by: Grimtuff


 GaroRobe wrote:
https://www.instagram.com/p/CSj2x4HnQZA/

This simple conversion (it's photoshop, but easily convertible) really makes me dislike the new EC model.

Like, with a better body, it's 100x better


And for the benefit of us who don't have Instagram?


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/15 19:00:11


Post by: beast_gts


 Grimtuff wrote:
 GaroRobe wrote:
https://www.instagram.com/p/CSj2x4HnQZA/

This simple conversion (it's photoshop, but easily convertible) really makes me dislike the new EC model.

Like, with a better body, it's 100x better


And for the benefit of us who don't have Instagram?



Automatically Appended Next Post:
Kabewski's Hobby Idea 35: Primaris Emperor's Champion!
So this is some thing I've made my self using the indomitus Chaplain and the Resin Emperor's Champion, but you can use the upcoming plastic Emperor's Champion to make this.
This is in case you didn't like the new one and want something more gothic and ornate.
Other options to make Primaris Emperor's Champions are the normal Primaris Chaplain, the Dark Angels lieutenant and the primaris librarian!



Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/15 19:02:28


Post by: a_typical_hero


I like the change and just like the predecessor model, I will use it for many kitbashes to come in the next decades.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/15 19:03:00


Post by: Grimtuff


Cheers bud. Looks far nicer.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/15 19:29:54


Post by: BertBert


Awesome, this just made me buy the Chaplain on eBay.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/16 04:06:51


Post by: BrianDavion


 Nevelon wrote:
Game mechanics/models, phobos armor has pretty much replaced scouts 100%.

From a lore POV, is the black carapace still the last step of implants? If that happens after those new fangled primaris implants, we would still have primaris scouts, with all the perks barring power armor.


yes scouts are still a thing,. the 8.5 marine codex lays it out real nicely. if you don't have it see if you can find someone you know with it, from a Lore POV the 8.5 marine codex was one of the better ones. the 9E codices are, lore wise a MAJOR step back


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/16 10:09:00


Post by: Nevelon


BrianDavion wrote:
 Nevelon wrote:
Game mechanics/models, phobos armor has pretty much replaced scouts 100%.

From a lore POV, is the black carapace still the last step of implants? If that happens after those new fangled primaris implants, we would still have primaris scouts, with all the perks barring power armor.


yes scouts are still a thing,. the 8.5 marine codex lays it out real nicely. if you don't have it see if you can find someone you know with it, from a Lore POV the 8.5 marine codex was one of the better ones. the 9E codices are, lore wise a MAJOR step back


I have the codex, but don’t read all the BL stuff that’s been churned out. As fluff is often overridden and conflicting, I thought I’d doublecheck.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/16 13:12:44


Post by: Bago


New WarCom article teases Primaris BT Units.

"True heirs of Sigismund may notice that the gentleman in the middle has distinctly black-and-red shoulder pads, which mark him out as one of the elite Sword Brethren. But doesn’t he also appear to be wearing the armour of a Primaris Space Marine? How curious."

This should confirm the rest of the BT rumours.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/16 13:17:34


Post by: a_typical_hero


I really don't like the art. The Castellan's head seems out of place.

Bummer.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/16 13:17:45


Post by: Kanluwen


Yup, and first post is updated!

This is going to be make or break for that big rumor dump whenever we see the launch box.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/16 13:27:49


Post by: MobileSuitRandom


a_typical_hero wrote:
I really don't like the art. The Castellan's head seems out of place.

Bummer.

Maybe that's actually a neophyte standing on another's shoulders, in one suit of power armour? He's got really tiny arms compared to his torso and legs, too. Ugh, that pic is really a mess :|


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/16 13:30:42


Post by: Kanluwen



It's a bit easier to see here that there's some rubble that the Sword Brethren is standing on.

And there's what looks to be a Neophyte in Phobos armor with a Bolt Carbine!


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/16 13:39:21


Post by: Wha-Mu-077


Absolute peak of Space Marine proportions

[Thumb - mbJIll6yXMMf0KTb.jpg]


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/16 13:43:13


Post by: jaredb


Again, absolutely phenomenal cover art. 9th edition has got to have the best cover art so far.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/16 13:48:15


Post by: Arbitrator


Something about the chap in focus just looks really... off. I can't tell if his head just looks tiny or what.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/16 13:52:23


Post by: Theophony


Image of 2 thunderhawks in the picture....Plastic Thunderhawks incoming


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/16 14:00:16


Post by: bullyboy


Art looks great to me, will be interested to see what the new models look like.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/16 14:02:35


Post by: CorwinB


 Theophony wrote:
Image of 2 thunderhawks in the picture....Plastic Thunderhawks incoming


https://youtu.be/-ya9LA0NCZY


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/16 14:19:28


Post by: H.B.M.C.


Didn't they say there'd also be a banner bearer? 'Cause that's in the shot as well.

I love the crusader helms on the Primaris Marines.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/16 14:26:42


Post by: Dysartes


 Arbitrator wrote:
Something about the chap in focus just looks really... off. I can't tell if his head just looks tiny or what.


I'm pretty sure I saw him in the Super Mario Bros movie, though he wasn't in armour at the time.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/16 14:35:12


Post by: Tyranid Horde


According to Valrak on YouTube, the release box for Templars is including a Marshal, Emp's Champ, Redemptor and a Crusader Squad with 6 Initiates and 4 Neophytes.

If they price that at £125, there might be a few disgruntled voices but you do get a Ltd Edition codex out of it.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/16 14:35:14


Post by: GaroRobe


That's a neophyte on the right, right?
To the left of the guy holding the sword, and below the bolter guy.

The shoulder pads are different, he's helmetless, etc.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/16 14:37:06


Post by: Kanluwen


 GaroRobe wrote:
That's a neophyte on the right, right?
To the left of the guy holding the sword, and below the bolter guy.

The shoulder pads are different, he's helmetless, etc.

That's what I'm thinking, yes. He does seem to additionally be wearing a Reiver helmet rather than being helmetless.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/16 15:11:36


Post by: Sotahullu


 Kanluwen wrote:
 GaroRobe wrote:
That's a neophyte on the right, right?
To the left of the guy holding the sword, and below the bolter guy.

The shoulder pads are different, he's helmetless, etc.

That's what I'm thinking, yes. He does seem to additionally be wearing a Reiver helmet rather than being helmetless.


I think it is actually a hood, outline is bit odd for a reaver.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/16 15:16:47


Post by: grahamdbailey


 Kanluwen wrote:

It's a bit easier to see here that there's some rubble that the Sword Brethren is standing on.

And there's what looks to be a Neophyte in Phobos armor with a Bolt Carbine!


That Sword Brethren is overdue a visit from the Inquisition. Mutation can be the only reason I can think of for what must be a rediculously long neck.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/16 15:21:53


Post by: Dread Master


Cover seems to confirm several items from the rumor dump such as the primaris sword brethren, the initiates and their armaments, and the neophytes. Looking forward to this!


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/16 15:57:37


Post by: Crimson


I'm rather hyped and I just want to see the models! (When are they gonna show us the models?) I don't collect Black Templars, but it seems like this might be a good amount of cool primaris stuff to kitbash with other kits.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/16 16:02:54


Post by: endlesswaltz123


If they are all meant to be primaris, the flamer in the background right is quite interesting


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/16 16:04:55


Post by: Abaddon303


The marine on the right of the picture, there's no exhaust vents on the back pack. It's not that clear but it looks a little like the existing scouts weird triangular back. The armour looks lighter like phobos, but the gun theyre holding isn't either of the carbines used by infs or incs. nor does it look like any of the bolt rifles?


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/16 16:10:29


Post by: endlesswaltz123


Abaddon303 wrote:
The marine on the right of the picture, there's no exhaust vents on the back pack. It's not that clear but it looks a little like the existing scouts weird triangular back. The armour looks lighter like phobos, but the gun theyre holding isn't either of the carbines used by infs or incs. nor does it look like any of the bolt rifles?


I agree, it also seems to have a reiver style face plate on the lower part of the face (not necessarily a skull like plate), but the upper is either hair or a hood. Interesting.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/16 16:35:46


Post by: GaroRobe


Can anyone tell if the flag in the back matches the rumor engine skeleton with the "W"? I keep flip-flopping on whether it matches or not


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/16 16:54:24


Post by: Grimtuff


 Arbitrator wrote:
Something about the chap in focus just looks really... off. I can't tell if his head just looks tiny or what.


Oh lawd, don't say gak like that. They'll all start thinking Primaris Marines are too small as well...


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/16 18:15:21


Post by: Grimskul


 Grimtuff wrote:
 Arbitrator wrote:
Something about the chap in focus just looks really... off. I can't tell if his head just looks tiny or what.


Oh lawd, don't say gak like that. They'll all start thinking Primaris Marines are too small as well...


Did someone say Primaris CENTURIONS?


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/16 18:38:19


Post by: MobileSuitRandom


 GaroRobe wrote:
Can anyone tell if the flag in the back matches the rumor engine skeleton with the "W"? I keep flip-flopping on whether it matches or not

Seems so, doesn't it? Here, for reference


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/16 22:06:04


Post by: Marshal Loss


Love it. Looks like regular Monday updates for BT as well, so hopefully Crusaders/SB next week.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/16 22:29:36


Post by: Voss


 Arbitrator wrote:
Something about the chap in focus just looks really... off. I can't tell if his head just looks tiny or what.


Yeah. Like most 9th edition covers so far, it doesn't particularly make me want to crusade. More just point and laugh.
The centerpiece guy is egregiously mis-proportioned, though.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/16 23:22:47


Post by: H.B.M.C.


 endlesswaltz123 wrote:
If they are all meant to be primaris, the flamer in the background right is quite interesting
Well spotted.

New Gravis flamer unit? Or a Helblaster equivalent, but with 3 flavours of flamer?

Hopefully, if true, not BT specific.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/16 23:45:56


Post by: MajorWesJanson


 H.B.M.C. wrote:
 endlesswaltz123 wrote:
If they are all meant to be primaris, the flamer in the background right is quite interesting
Well spotted.

New Gravis flamer unit? Or a Helblaster equivalent, but with 3 flavours of flamer?

Hopefully, if true, not BT specific.


Hellfury? Or just an option for the crusader squad to take a flamer?


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/16 23:52:30


Post by: ph34r


MobileSuitRandom wrote:
 GaroRobe wrote:
Can anyone tell if the flag in the back matches the rumor engine skeleton with the "W"? I keep flip-flopping on whether it matches or not

Seems so, doesn't it? Here, for reference
Huh yeah, W for 'Witch' maybe?

Wha-Mu-077 wrote:Absolute peak of Space Marine proportions
Agreed 100%, that's certainly the Primaris of Necks if I ever saw one.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/17 00:01:00


Post by: Ghaz


 Marshal Loss wrote:
Love it. Looks like regular Monday updates for BT as well, so hopefully Crusaders/SB next week.

Nope. Sunday's pre-order announcement will be for the Stormcast Eternals and Orruk Warclans battletomes as GW confirmed them for an August pre-order back near the release of Dominion.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/17 00:03:57


Post by: H.B.M.C.


 Ghaz wrote:
 Marshal Loss wrote:
Love it. Looks like regular Monday updates for BT as well, so hopefully Crusaders/SB next week.

Nope. Sunday's pre-order announcement will be for the Stormcast Eternals and Orruk Warclans battletomes as GW confirmed them for an August pre-order back near the release of Dominion.
I think Marshall meant Crusaders/SB for the Monday update, not for pre-orders.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/17 01:10:02


Post by: posermcbogus


Man, I'm so nervous about this. I've waited since the beginning of me being in this hobby for any kind of lovin' for the Templars and...

...like I guess I'm cautiously optimistic about an upgrade sprue/transfers? Templars don't have any transfers available RN, other than on the 30k fists one, which is less than ideal, and as much as I love the current plastic upgrade (I'd love if GW could just stop retiring things), I think some new bits in crisper cut plastic would be great too (and rather selfishly I have plenty of the current bits in my bits box).
But at the same time, while part of me was looking forward to de-embiggening some primaris marines into proper marines, the Emperor's Champion(I'd maybe??? steal the head, and the hands, but there's nothing else really there that's enviable, he doesn't even have purity seals)? This codex cover with bikeshorts chaplain-helmets-but-not-chaplains as neophytes? Sword Brother Giraffe-stein-ius? It doesn't fill me with a ton of confidence about how they're gonna treat my boys, the best chapter in 40k.

I want, with like, 6? 7? years of longing, for this to be a banging release, to see some kickass new bits and details, maybe a new character, and lord knows how much I wanted for a unique unit, or for Sword Brethren to be a thing other than just "here's a box of squad leaders have fun", or a way to make scouts and neophytes a bit less visually dry and more medieval. I fear that after all my waiting, I might be left high and dry, and that sucks man. GW, please prove me wrong.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/17 07:53:55


Post by: Marshal Loss


 H.B.M.C. wrote:
 Ghaz wrote:
 Marshal Loss wrote:
Love it. Looks like regular Monday updates for BT as well, so hopefully Crusaders/SB next week.

Nope. Sunday's pre-order announcement will be for the Stormcast Eternals and Orruk Warclans battletomes as GW confirmed them for an August pre-order back near the release of Dominion.
I think Marshall meant Crusaders/SB for the Monday update, not for pre-orders.


Yep


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/17 12:32:31


Post by: Geifer


 posermcbogus wrote:
Man, I'm so nervous about this. I've waited since the beginning of me being in this hobby for any kind of lovin' for the Templars and...

...like I guess I'm cautiously optimistic about an upgrade sprue/transfers? Templars don't have any transfers available RN, other than on the 30k fists one, which is less than ideal, and as much as I love the current plastic upgrade (I'd love if GW could just stop retiring things), I think some new bits in crisper cut plastic would be great too (and rather selfishly I have plenty of the current bits in my bits box).
But at the same time, while part of me was looking forward to de-embiggening some primaris marines into proper marines, the Emperor's Champion(I'd maybe??? steal the head, and the hands, but there's nothing else really there that's enviable, he doesn't even have purity seals)? This codex cover with bikeshorts chaplain-helmets-but-not-chaplains as neophytes? Sword Brother Giraffe-stein-ius? It doesn't fill me with a ton of confidence about how they're gonna treat my boys, the best chapter in 40k.

I want, with like, 6? 7? years of longing, for this to be a banging release, to see some kickass new bits and details, maybe a new character, and lord knows how much I wanted for a unique unit, or for Sword Brethren to be a thing other than just "here's a box of squad leaders have fun", or a way to make scouts and neophytes a bit less visually dry and more medieval. I fear that after all my waiting, I might be left high and dry, and that sucks man. GW, please prove me wrong.


If you don't like Primaris and think of this release as a means of getting new bits, I expect there won't be much point in any of the actual kits for you. They'll be all Primaris with steep price tags. Might be cool stuff in there, but you'll probably be looking at bits sellers here. Considering Templars will have access to the regular Primaris kits, I hope there will be an upgrade sprue for them like other chapters have in addition to their unique units, though. Would be weird if there wasn't unless Crusaders/Sword Brethren have extra bits in the kits that are meant to be used for other models. I could see GW do that, as they may believe locking shoulder pads in more expensive kits might make them more money. We'll see soon enough, I guess.

On the bright side, I don't think the codex cover art has any bearing on the quality of the models, so there's that.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/17 12:46:47


Post by: H.B.M.C.


 Geifer wrote:
On the bright side, I don't think the codex cover art has any bearing on the quality of the models, so there's that.
Other than Marshall Extenta Faucium, what's wrong with the cover art?


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/17 13:00:56


Post by: Geifer


 H.B.M.C. wrote:
 Geifer wrote:
On the bright side, I don't think the codex cover art has any bearing on the quality of the models, so there's that.
Other than Marshall Extenta Faucium, what's wrong with the cover art?


Not a whole lot, I think. Someone said Cap'n Longneck also has scrawny arms, and posermcbogus doesn't seem to be a fan of Phobos armor for Neophytes. I don't remember anything else standing out.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/18 00:48:24


Post by: dogfender


I’m curious why the art has them storming an imperial world/city/palace?
Chaos got a new codex


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/18 02:01:00


Post by: alphaecho


dogfender wrote:
I’m curious why the art has them storming an imperial world/city/palace?
Chaos got a new codex



Some scribe missed a comma that COMPLETELY changed the tone of a report to the High Lords of Terra.

Never short cut on peer review and proof reading.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/18 02:04:26


Post by: No One Important


dogfender wrote:
I’m curious why the art has them storming an imperial world/city/palace?
Chaos got a new codex

Because they were singing their psalms in Low Gothic and the Black Templars sing theirs in High Gothic.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/18 12:37:41


Post by: AduroT


If you kill the loyalists then they can’t turn traitor later.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/18 13:06:30


Post by: Theophony


alphaecho wrote:
dogfender wrote:
I’m curious why the art has them storming an imperial world/city/palace?
Chaos got a new codex



Some scribe missed a comma that COMPLETELY changed the tone of a report to the High Lords of Terra.

Never short cut on peer review and proof reading.


Let's eat Grandma
(Punctuation is important)


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/18 15:53:12


Post by: Dysartes


 Theophony wrote:
alphaecho wrote:
dogfender wrote:
I’m curious why the art has them storming an imperial world/city/palace?
Chaos got a new codex



Some scribe missed a comma that COMPLETELY changed the tone of a report to the High Lords of Terra.

Never short cut on peer review and proof reading.


Let's eat Grandma
(Punctuation is important)

Uncle Jack and horses springs to mind...


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/23 15:36:04


Post by: Ghaz


A new weapon for the Black Templars:



Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/23 15:38:58


Post by: Albertorius


How many variants of flamer are in the game, by now? These kinda bespoke weapon craze leaves me very, very cold, ironically enough in this case.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/23 15:40:01


Post by: xttz


 Ghaz wrote:
A new weapon for the Black Templars:



That profile matches the B&C rumour dump, which said there would be a new 15" AP -1 flamer weapon


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/23 15:43:29


Post by: Crimson




So it seems that the rumours about the new flamer and more importantly the dedicated primaris crusader kit were true. Probably the rest is true as well then. Too bad they didn't show any more models. How long they're gonna drag this out?


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/23 15:46:03


Post by: Wha-Mu-077


Did we really need dedicated Primaris units for sub-sub-factions?


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/23 15:47:24


Post by: GaroRobe


Well, they still have:
Sword brethern
and
HQs

so hopefully not too much longer


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/23 15:47:25


Post by: Albertorius


 Wha-Mu-077 wrote:
Did we really need dedicated Primaris units for sub-sub-factions?

As much or as little as for regular marines, would be my guess?


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/23 15:49:12


Post by: Gert


Yeah, why add actual options to subfactions so they aren't just some special rules and Characters? /s
This looks to be shaping up like a good supplement IMO.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/23 15:49:23


Post by: Kanluwen


Wonder if this means we'll finally see the Hellfuries released?


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/23 15:49:25


Post by: xttz


 Crimson wrote:
Too bad they didn't show any more models. How long they're gonna drag this out?


They've been showing a single new model every Monday for a while now. The rest will probably come in a studio preview, probably at Gencon if not before.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/23 15:50:03


Post by: Kanluwen


 Gert wrote:
Yeah, why add actual options to subfactions so they aren't just some special rules and Characters? /s
This looks to be shaping up like a good supplement IMO.

Hopefully the other supplements will see something similar. Even if it's just weapon options via upgrade sprues or whatever.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/23 15:50:04


Post by: GaroRobe


Ugh.

Look at the way the cloth interacts with the kneepad.

Looks like they'll have the bladeguard "under armor" robes as well. At least it fits better with BT than something like DA


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/23 15:52:10


Post by: H.B.M.C.


On one hand, it sucks that it's a BT-only thing.

But on the other hand, it's good because it means that we don't have a weird situation where there's a Marine unit not in the Marine Codex, necessitating a whole series of slow updates to all the other armies (ala the Psychic Awakening books, that contained tons of reprints of just the same Datasheets for each flavour of Marines).

 endlesswaltz123 wrote:
If they are all meant to be primaris, the flamer in the background right is quite interesting
You called it!


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/23 15:52:58


Post by: Dysartes


 Ghaz wrote:
A new weapon for the Black Templars:



Has this been amended already? Showing as D2 here, but D1 on the WHC article now...


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/23 15:54:51


Post by: jullevi


Wow. That is the worst looking flamer I have seen in a long, long time.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/23 15:55:05


Post by: Shadow Walker


 Dysartes wrote:
 Ghaz wrote:
A new weapon for the Black Templars:



Has this been amended already? Showing as D2 here, but D1 on the WHC article now...

Yeah, it shows D1 now. Quick fix by the WHC.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/23 15:55:56


Post by: Wha-Mu-077


 Gert wrote:
Yeah, why add actual options to subfactions so they aren't just some special rules and Characters? /


Probably, because that's how it goes for every single subfaction for every single faction that's not Marines. And probably because every relase spent further bloating out Marines is a relase not spent updating Eldar.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/23 15:56:00


Post by: Dysartes


I did think that a D2 Infantry flamer looked a little odd at first glance, and thought the article was going to comment on it...

...then I just thought I'd been seeing things.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/23 15:56:00


Post by: Gert


 Kanluwen wrote:
Hopefully the other supplements will see something similar. Even if it's just weapon options via upgrade sprues or whatever.

I'm of two minds where I don't want to see more Space Marines but at the same time, I also want to see the subfactions expanded out beyond single Characters.

 Wha-Mu-077 wrote:
Probably, because that's how it goes for every single subfaction for every single faction that's not Marines. And probably because every relase spent further bloating out Marines is a relase not spent updating Eldar.

Just get resigned to the fact that Craftworlds aren't getting an update. It makes your life easier.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/23 15:56:20


Post by: Axlbush


Wow that damage mistake is real irritating


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/23 15:58:00


Post by: Valkyrie


Hoping it stays D1 to be honest.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/23 15:59:30


Post by: Sasori


Does this Flamer line up with that big dump of Rumors we got?


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/23 15:59:57


Post by: VictorVonTzeentch


Why do they keep having Marines hold the weapon by the carry handle or have top mounted grips when they have a handguard modeled on the weapon?


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/23 16:02:51


Post by: GaroRobe


So...he's called a Primaris Initiate.

Is that like the primaris version of a neophyte?


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/23 16:04:06


Post by: Shadow Walker


jullevi wrote:
Wow. That is the worst looking flamer I have seen in a long, long time.
Tastes vary. I really like it (I may have a bad taste though )


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/23 16:04:33


Post by: VictorVonTzeentch


 GaroRobe wrote:
So...he's called a Primaris Initiate.

Is that like the primaris version of a neophyte?

No, Initiate is the rank of a standard battle brother in the Templars.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/23 16:05:59


Post by: Gert


Every other Chapter uses the term interchangeably for Scouts/recruits IIRC.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/23 16:07:44


Post by: H.B.M.C.


 VictorVonTzeentch wrote:
Why do they keep having Marines hold the weapon by the carry handle or have top mounted grips when they have a handguard modeled on the weapon?
Why do Primaris bolt weapons all have the 41st millennium equivalent of a picatinny rail yet insist on mounting nothing on them?


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/23 16:07:46


Post by: VictorVonTzeentch


 Gert wrote:
Every other Chapter uses the term interchangeably for Scouts/recruits IIRC.


Most other Chapters do, but the Templar are odd ducks and use Initiate for their Battle Brothers, since they have been initiated into them and Neophyte for the new guys.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 H.B.M.C. wrote:
 VictorVonTzeentch wrote:
Why do they keep having Marines hold the weapon by the carry handle or have top mounted grips when they have a handguard modeled on the weapon?
Why do Primaris bolt weapons all have the 41st millennium equivalent of a picatinny rail yet insist on mounting nothing on them?


No one in GW has ever used or held a weapon? Also, theres like 2 weapons with stuff on them, but they go on that weird round part of the gun for some reason.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/23 16:08:48


Post by: endlesswaltz123


 endlesswaltz123 wrote:
If they are all meant to be primaris, the flamer in the background right is quite interesting


Called it


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/23 16:11:34


Post by: a_typical_hero


I like the model, but i'm not sold on the weapon.

I guess it is just the Primaris version of a flamer and we might see a heavy pyreflamer as well.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/23 16:25:32


Post by: tneva82


 Albertorius wrote:
How many variants of flamer are in the game, by now? These kinda bespoke weapon craze leaves me very, very cold, ironically enough in this case.


People wanted bespoke, they are getting it


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/23 17:02:02


Post by: Lord Damocles


It's not a Heavy Flamer!

It's a totally original and necessary new weapon!



Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/23 17:10:39


Post by: Crimson


 Lord Damocles wrote:
It's not a Heavy Flamer!

It's a totally original and necessary new weapon!


I think I'm gonna use the bit to make some heavy flamers for my primaris-based sternguard.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/23 17:27:10


Post by: Wha-Mu-077


 Lord Damocles wrote:
It's not a Heavy Flamer!

It's a totally original and necessary new weapon!



It's a Long Flamer. Totally new and original.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/23 17:44:58


Post by: Valkyrie


 VictorVonTzeentch wrote:
Why do they keep having Marines hold the weapon by the carry handle or have top mounted grips when they have a handguard modeled on the weapon?


Why do they always have to have this bit as well?



Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/23 17:48:39


Post by: No wolves on Fenris


The 15’ range will fit nicely with the bolt rifles in the squad firing at half range and rapid firing


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/23 18:28:41


Post by: Daedalus81


Would it make people feel better if the flamer was ap0 and 12" and the unit had rules to add range and ap?


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/23 19:02:21


Post by: Valkyrie


 Daedalus81 wrote:
Would it make people feel better if the flamer was ap0 and 12" and the unit had rules to add range and ap?


I'd just prefer 12" and Ap-1.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/23 19:26:48


Post by: GoatboyBeta


Those sculpted shoulder pads are sharp . Hope that either the BT kits come with extras or there is a infantry upgrade sprue.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/23 20:25:12


Post by: Crimson


 Valkyrie wrote:
 VictorVonTzeentch wrote:
Why do they keep having Marines hold the weapon by the carry handle or have top mounted grips when they have a handguard modeled on the weapon?


Why do they always have to have this bit as well?


I've been wondering about that as well. It looks cool, but I really cannot imagine what its function could be as it is found on so many completely different weapons.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/23 20:29:34


Post by: Theophony


Isn't that the accelerator doomahicky??? Just be glad that they decided to add that instead of another skull.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/23 20:37:07


Post by: Crimson


 Theophony wrote:
Isn't that the accelerator doomahicky???

Has it actually been explained somewhere?


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/23 20:44:12


Post by: lord_blackfang


So glad the Trademarkable NounVerb random name generator has been upgraded to support flamer weaponry.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/23 21:06:39


Post by: Wha-Mu-077


 lord_blackfang wrote:
So glad the Trademarkable NounVerb random name generator has been upgraded to support flamer weaponry.


Don't you mean the Primaris Copyrightable BrandLabel NounVerber?


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/23 21:22:52


Post by: Theophony


 Crimson wrote:
 Theophony wrote:
Isn't that the accelerator doomahicky???

Has it actually been explained somewhere?


Explained? Not sure, but on the assembly guides I think it calls it that so your models are proper WYSIWYG.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/23 21:48:49


Post by: Marshal Loss


Love the model. Worth noting that the stats on that flamer correspond to the major leak we recently (with the Chaos Chosen, Squats, etc), so that's another point in its favour.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/23 22:03:50


Post by: Wha-Mu-077


Never thought i'd live to see the day where the return of Squats is plausible.

Then again, i never thought i'd live to see plastic DKoK either.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/23 22:53:46


Post by: silverstu


 Wha-Mu-077 wrote:
Never thought i'd live to see the day where the return of Squats is plausible.

Then again, i never thought i'd live to see plastic DKoK either.


Yeah Im just hoping I like them [the squats] when they arrive. Im fairly optimistic given the job they did on the Kharadrons..


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/23 23:04:25


Post by: H.B.M.C.


On one hand it seems strange that GW went through the whole rationalisation of flame-type weaponry to make them all range 12", only to give Marines a super-special 15" flamer because... Primaris?

On the other hand, perhaps this opens up some design space for other flame weapons that perhaps should have longer ranges (Hellhounds being a good example - they had a 24" range back in the day!).


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/24 00:03:58


Post by: Abaddon303


You have 18" baleflamers. Maybe hellhounds might match that at least?



Automatically Appended Next Post:
Oh flamestorm on the Baal predator is 18" too isn't it?


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/24 00:08:30


Post by: Arbitrator


 H.B.M.C. wrote:
On one hand it seems strange that GW went through the whole rationalisation of flame-type weaponry to make them all range 12", only to give Marines a super-special 15" flamer because... Primaris?

On the other hand, perhaps this opens up some design space for other flame weapons that perhaps should have longer ranges (Hellhounds being a good example - they had a 24" range back in the day!).

Makes the Primaris models feel even more extra special or something?


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/24 00:26:42


Post by: alphaecho


 H.B.M.C. wrote:
On one hand it seems strange that GW went through the whole rationalisation of flame-type weaponry to make them all range 12", only to give Marines a super-special 15" flamer because... Primaris?

On the other hand, perhaps this opens up some design space for other flame weapons that perhaps should have longer ranges (Hellhounds being a good example - they had a 24" range back in the day!).




I think I still have my 2nd Ed 'cut from White Dwarf and stuck on cereal box card' double flamer template for the Exorcist at home.

Variety.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/24 00:38:42


Post by: MinMax


 H.B.M.C. wrote:
On one hand it seems strange that GW went through the whole rationalisation of flame-type weaponry to make them all range 12", only to give Marines a super-special 15" flamer because... Primaris?

On the other hand, perhaps this opens up some design space for other flame weapons that perhaps should have longer ranges (Hellhounds being a good example - they had a 24" range back in the day!).


Hellhounds already have a 16" range - probably the rationale is that it's twice the range of a (then-) normal 8" flamer. Next codex it'll probably pop up to 24".


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/24 02:29:08


Post by: posermcbogus


Excuse me while I burst into a flaming ball of rage that Black Templars have literally gotten the thing I fantasized about for years but it's only for Big Marines. There are some nice details on that mini, and it's cool that GW are chaining weapons to wrists like all good Templars should, but goddamn. This is so close to what I've wanted.

Also the name of the Big Marines' Big Flamer is silly.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/24 03:59:08


Post by: Voss


What is the rationale for the chained weapons?

It seems insane, as it would only be a detriment: limiting mobility, fouling shots, dragging at the arm (especially in close combat), etc.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/24 04:07:56


Post by: MajorWesJanson


Voss wrote:
What is the rationale for the chained weapons?

It seems insane, as it would only be a detriment: limiting mobility, fouling shots, dragging at the arm (especially in close combat), etc.


IIRC it's somewhat symbolic that they cant be separated from their weapon.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/24 05:01:46


Post by: AduroT


Super jealous and I hope we get those for my Salamanders.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/24 05:58:33


Post by: posermcbogus


Voss wrote:
What is the rationale for the chained weapons?

It seems insane, as it would only be a detriment: limiting mobility, fouling shots, dragging at the arm (especially in close combat), etc.


Excuse me while I put on my cool nerd fact hat.

So! There are 2 kinds of chains the Black Templars use, I forget the names but...

The most common is a symbolic thing. Before battle you chain you weapons to yourself, and when the battle is over, you take them off. It's a ceremonial/symbolic thing.
It goes back to before the Heresy. The founder of the Black Templars, Sigismund iirc, was either originally a World Eater, or hung out with the World Eaters a lot. He was a real cool dude who wasn't afraid of nothing, and they asked him to join, but he said no and went off to join/carried on being one of the Imperial Fists, founding the Templar Brethren. He took with him the World Eaters tradition of chaining your weapons to your wrists because the World Eaters are maniacs like that.

The second, slightly rarer chain is much more hardcore. It's a vow a Templar takes where they never remove the weapon chained to them, and carry it until they die. Again, symbolic, but much more permanent. I think this one is usually like a pennance thing but I don't have my old codex on this side of the planet.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/24 06:10:09


Post by: Lord Damocles


The White Dwarf design notes accompanying the 4th edition codex said that the chained weapons was symbolic of the Templars not laying down their weapons until their crusade is ended or they meet their death.

Similarly the prevalence of lanterns on Templar models represents them bringing the Emperor's light to the galaxy.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/24 06:18:05


Post by: Not Online!!!


 posermcbogus wrote:
Excuse me while I burst into a flaming ball of rage that Black Templars have literally gotten the thing I fantasized about for years but it's only for Big Marines. There are some nice details on that mini, and it's cool that GW are chaining weapons to wrists like all good Templars should, but goddamn. This is so close to what I've wanted.

Also the name of the Big Marines' Big Flamer is silly.


Not to be wierd but what did you expect?
that Normal marine Heavy flamers become initially decent enough to force you NOT to buy the new and improved primaris nounverb?

I mean, unlike the cover art, this ones neck isn't long though so there's that



Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/24 08:35:55


Post by: posermcbogus


Not Online!!! wrote:
 posermcbogus wrote:
Excuse me while I burst into a flaming ball of rage that Black Templars have literally gotten the thing I fantasized about for years but it's only for Big Marines. There are some nice details on that mini, and it's cool that GW are chaining weapons to wrists like all good Templars should, but goddamn. This is so close to what I've wanted.

Also the name of the Big Marines' Big Flamer is silly.


Not to be wierd but what did you expect?
that Normal marine Heavy flamers become initially decent enough to force you NOT to buy the new and improved primaris nounverb?

I mean, unlike the cover art, this ones neck isn't long though so there's that



Idk man, hope dies last I guess.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/24 08:54:11


Post by: Gert


Sigismund was First Captain of the Imperial Fists Legion and fought in the World Eaters Gladiator Cages, as did Nassir Amit, the Flesh Tearer, and IIRC Sevatar. In fact, Amir and Kharn were good friends and often fought together in the arena while chained together.
The Gladiators of Nuceria would chain their weapons to their wrists, a traditional the World Eaters continued. Sigismund saw its worth and applied it to the Templars when they were founded.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/24 10:51:22


Post by: Crimson


 posermcbogus wrote:
Excuse me while I burst into a flaming ball of rage that Black Templars have literally gotten the thing I fantasized about for years but it's only for Big Marines. There are some nice details on that mini, and it's cool that GW are chaining weapons to wrists like all good Templars should, but goddamn. This is so close to what I've wanted.

Have you considered stopping pointlessly hating on the primaris and enjoying the cool new models instead?


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/24 11:09:43


Post by: kirotheavenger


If GW could produce a cool new model without derpy looking guns or eye-rollingly inflated statlines, sure.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/24 11:27:06


Post by: BertBert


 Wha-Mu-077 wrote:
Never thought i'd live to see the day where the return of Squats is plausible.

Then again, i never thought i'd live to see plastic DKoK either.


For all the gak GW is getting, this is really something to applaud. They keep reviving things from the past like GSC, Sisters, Zoats, the Ambull etc, even if it's just a single model for a specialist game.
I still don't see squats as an army, but maybe a Killteam or as Tau auxiliaries. Whatever it will be, the one thing keeping me engaged is the knowledge that pretty much anything can happen at this point (Kroots now!)


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/24 12:08:39


Post by: tneva82


 Crimson wrote:
 posermcbogus wrote:
Excuse me while I burst into a flaming ball of rage that Black Templars have literally gotten the thing I fantasized about for years but it's only for Big Marines. There are some nice details on that mini, and it's cool that GW are chaining weapons to wrists like all good Templars should, but goddamn. This is so close to what I've wanted.

Have you considered stopping pointlessly hating on the primaris and enjoying the cool new models instead?


Some want to play with 7 feet space marines rather than 8 feet. Wouldn't fit fur campaign for example as timeline doesn't match. No primaris yet around.



You know for some people fluff matters more than latest op junk


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/24 12:21:03


Post by: Rihgu


tneva82 wrote:
 Crimson wrote:
 posermcbogus wrote:
Excuse me while I burst into a flaming ball of rage that Black Templars have literally gotten the thing I fantasized about for years but it's only for Big Marines. There are some nice details on that mini, and it's cool that GW are chaining weapons to wrists like all good Templars should, but goddamn. This is so close to what I've wanted.

Have you considered stopping pointlessly hating on the primaris and enjoying the cool new models instead?


Some want to play with 7 feet space marines rather than 8 feet. Wouldn't fit fur campaign for example as timeline doesn't match. No primaris yet around.



You know for some people fluff matters more than latest op junk


If they cared more for the fluff than the latest op junk and were running a timeline set pre-primaris, they would have absolutely 0 interest in using a primaris unit with a newly invented weapon anyways...


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/24 12:25:45


Post by: Crimson


tneva82 wrote:

Some want to play with 7 feet space marines rather than 8 feet.


And that's the primaris. Old models are six feet marines as they're same height as GW's normal humans.

Cadian/skitarii/cultist: about 32mm
Primaris marine: about 38mm

If we assume 32mm human model to represent about 180 cm tall person, then 38mm primaris marine would be about 215 cm i.e. seven feet. (Do the math.)

And don't bring up the Custodians again. they're fringe faction and furthermore there really isn't a reason to assume that they're much taller than seven feet either.

I hope this has now been conclusively covered now and you can stop incessantly bringing it up.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/24 12:32:33


Post by: Geifer


I find that Templar a bit meh.Basic Mk.X Marine as is to be expected, but he could have used a little more decoration. He doesn't need to look like a Chirstmas tree, but a little more adornment to counteract the inherent tacticool look of Primaris wouldn't go amiss. Maybe there are optional bits on the sprue like purity seals and other things that got revved from the old upgrade sprue and this will be a moot point, but from what's shown I'm not particularly happy with the Initiate. And the flamer is pure junk, but that's Primaris weapons for you.

 BertBert wrote:
For all the gak GW is getting, this is really something to applaud. They keep reviving things from the past like GSC, Sisters, Zoats, the Ambull etc, even if it's just a single model for a specialist game.


True, though Sisters really don't belong in that list. GW never actually stopped selling the metal range until the plastic range was ready for release, and rules were mostly updated to the latest edition.

That said, I'm willing to believe that their plastic update was partially enabled by GW's newfound faith in its Eighties and Nineties designs.

 BertBert wrote:
I still don't see squats as an army, but maybe a Killteam or as Tau auxiliaries. Whatever it will be, the one thing keeping me engaged is the knowledge that pretty much anything can happen at this point (Kroots now!)


It really depends on how ambitious GW is willing to be. AoS has seen a lot of truly new factions, some with bigger, some with smaller ranges. Getting a Squat Kill Team at all is a great start, but it doesn't actually take much more to allow people to fill the mandatory slots of a FOC and at least make an allied force. And considering how Genestealers and Mechanicus were built up over several waves and years, Suqats might actually be the next army to get that treatment.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/24 12:52:54


Post by: Crimson


 Geifer wrote:
I find that Templar a bit meh.Basic Mk.X Marine as is to be expected, but he could have used a little more decoration. He doesn't need to look like a Chirstmas tree, but a little more adornment to counteract the inherent tacticool look of Primaris wouldn't go amiss. Maybe there are optional bits on the sprue like purity seals and other things that got revved from the old upgrade sprue and this will be a moot point, but from what's shown I'm not particularly happy with the Initiate.

I think the rumour said that there would be separate Sword Brethren kit too, so presumably they will look more extra. But I just want to see all the new models so I can make a proper judgement. I really wish there is a great variety of bits. Primaris marines generally look cool, but sameyness is their big weakness. I really hope they break away from that with this release.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/24 12:56:04


Post by: posermcbogus


 Crimson wrote:
 posermcbogus wrote:
Excuse me while I burst into a flaming ball of rage that Black Templars have literally gotten the thing I fantasized about for years but it's only for Big Marines. There are some nice details on that mini, and it's cool that GW are chaining weapons to wrists like all good Templars should, but goddamn. This is so close to what I've wanted.

Have you considered stopping pointlessly hating on the primaris and enjoying the cool new models instead?


Oh man. I'm so sorry. So sorry that I've posted an opinion you don't agree with. You are right, and I was foolish and wrong.

I'm sorry that I'm posting an opinion about the upcoming black templars release, in the black templars thread. I'm sorry I voiced some disappointment. I'm sorry that I spent years painstakingly learning to model and convert black templars, because GW wouldn't make more of their own. I'm sorry for that enthusiasm and passion. I'm sorry that I waited with baited breath for a new character, or campaign, or even just some extra fluff, a battle report, dared to even dream of a new transfer sheet, for YEARS. I'm sorry the last time my chapter got any love was back at the end of 7th, and we only got a bit of artwork showing us hanging out with xenos, and a formation to use for like 3 weeks before 8th dropped. Your snarky remarks about how pointless it is that I have a large army already, and don't want to re-buy stuff because big marines are only allowed to ride in big cars, and never be backwards compatible with anything has made me see the light. My opinions are pointless, I am just a hater, I should just toss all of my existing minis, and shut up and buy primaris like a good boy, because nothing retro is ever of value, and opinions like mine should be ban worthy. Thank you so much for behaving like a mod and telling Tevna and I to move on after you got your parting shot in, you really are an asset to this community.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/24 13:02:09


Post by: Dudeface


 posermcbogus wrote:
 Crimson wrote:
 posermcbogus wrote:
Excuse me while I burst into a flaming ball of rage that Black Templars have literally gotten the thing I fantasized about for years but it's only for Big Marines. There are some nice details on that mini, and it's cool that GW are chaining weapons to wrists like all good Templars should, but goddamn. This is so close to what I've wanted.

Have you considered stopping pointlessly hating on the primaris and enjoying the cool new models instead?


Oh man. I'm so sorry. So sorry that I've posted an opinion you don't agree with. You are right, and I was foolish and wrong.

I'm sorry that I'm posting an opinion about the upcoming black templars release, in the black templars thread. I'm sorry I voiced some disappointment. I'm sorry that I spent years painstakingly learning to model and convert black templars, because GW wouldn't make more of their own. I'm sorry for that enthusiasm and passion. I'm sorry that I waited with baited breath for a new character, or campaign, or even just some extra fluff, a battle report, dared to even dream of a new transfer sheet, for YEARS. I'm sorry the last time my chapter got any love was back at the end of 7th, and we only got a bit of artwork showing us hanging out with xenos, and a formation to use for like 3 weeks before 8th dropped. Your snarky remarks about how pointless it is that I have a large army already, and don't want to re-buy stuff because big marines are only allowed to ride in big cars, and never be backwards compatible with anything has made me see the light. My opinions are pointless, I am just a hater, I should just toss all of my existing minis, and shut up and buy primaris like a good boy, because nothing retro is ever of value, and opinions like mine should be ban worthy. Thank you so much for behaving like a mod and telling Tevna and I to move on after you got your parting shot in, you really are an asset to this community.


You're entitled to an opinion and shouldn't be degraded (despite doing the exact same in return), but simultaneously they gave you exactly what you wanted - exciting new cool black templar models so you don't need to convert any more of your own. You can't then complain they gave you the wrong new minis just because you don't want to buy something.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/24 13:12:56


Post by: Crimson


Whilst I may have been unnecessarily snarky, it was a genuine suggestion. Space marines are primaris now. That's the reality. Tilting at that windmill is not gonna get anyone anywhere.

Ultimately they're space marine models that look pretty good, and these new BT ones are bound to be more knightly and less tacticool. And that was the common complaint about the primaris. Some people preferred to old more knightly look over the sleek tacticool look. But now you can have that too.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/24 13:17:50


Post by: Gert


I found the complaints about BT getting unique units to be funny. Wasn't one of the biggest Primaris gripes that SM all looked the same (which they did anyway BTW)? Now there are distinct units for subfactions and people are complaining.
I'd say make up your mind but alas the Internet is the Internet after all.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/24 13:20:45


Post by: Wha-Mu-077


 posermcbogus wrote:
 Crimson wrote:
 posermcbogus wrote:
Excuse me while I burst into a flaming ball of rage that Black Templars have literally gotten the thing I fantasized about for years but it's only for Big Marines. There are some nice details on that mini, and it's cool that GW are chaining weapons to wrists like all good Templars should, but goddamn. This is so close to what I've wanted.

Have you considered stopping pointlessly hating on the primaris and enjoying the cool new models instead?


Oh man. I'm so sorry. So sorry that I've posted an opinion you don't agree with. You are right, and I was foolish and wrong.

I'm sorry that I'm posting an opinion about the upcoming black templars release, in the black templars thread. I'm sorry I voiced some disappointment. I'm sorry that I spent years painstakingly learning to model and convert black templars, because GW wouldn't make more of their own. I'm sorry for that enthusiasm and passion. I'm sorry that I waited with baited breath for a new character, or campaign, or even just some extra fluff, a battle report, dared to even dream of a new transfer sheet, for YEARS. I'm sorry the last time my chapter got any love was back at the end of 7th, and we only got a bit of artwork showing us hanging out with xenos, and a formation to use for like 3 weeks before 8th dropped. Your snarky remarks about how pointless it is that I have a large army already, and don't want to re-buy stuff because big marines are only allowed to ride in big cars, and never be backwards compatible with anything has made me see the light. My opinions are pointless, I am just a hater, I should just toss all of my existing minis, and shut up and buy primaris like a good boy, because nothing retro is ever of value, and opinions like mine should be ban worthy. Thank you so much for behaving like a mod and telling Tevna and I to move on after you got your parting shot in, you really are an asset to this community.


Just paint any Marines black dude, they all look the same anyway/


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/24 13:27:15


Post by: Geifer


 Crimson wrote:
 Geifer wrote:
I find that Templar a bit meh.Basic Mk.X Marine as is to be expected, but he could have used a little more decoration. He doesn't need to look like a Chirstmas tree, but a little more adornment to counteract the inherent tacticool look of Primaris wouldn't go amiss. Maybe there are optional bits on the sprue like purity seals and other things that got revved from the old upgrade sprue and this will be a moot point, but from what's shown I'm not particularly happy with the Initiate.

I think the rumour said that there would be separate Sword Brethren kit too, so presumably they will look more extra. But I just want to see all the new models so I can make a proper judgement. I really wish there is a great variety of bits. Primaris marines generally look cool, but sameyness is their big weakness. I really hope they break away from that with this release.


True, more kits open more possibilities for extras. I just hope we get any at all, regardless of which kit(s) they're in. These days I can't help but feel wary about that kind of stuff until I actually see what get. It seems like GW has been cutting down on optional bits so much in the more recent past compared to what we used to have. maybe not universally, but the optional bits seem to be getting sparser.

But yeah, we'll see how Templars fare in that regard.

Dudeface wrote:
Spoiler:
 posermcbogus wrote:
 Crimson wrote:
 posermcbogus wrote:
Excuse me while I burst into a flaming ball of rage that Black Templars have literally gotten the thing I fantasized about for years but it's only for Big Marines. There are some nice details on that mini, and it's cool that GW are chaining weapons to wrists like all good Templars should, but goddamn. This is so close to what I've wanted.

Have you considered stopping pointlessly hating on the primaris and enjoying the cool new models instead?


Oh man. I'm so sorry. So sorry that I've posted an opinion you don't agree with. You are right, and I was foolish and wrong.

I'm sorry that I'm posting an opinion about the upcoming black templars release, in the black templars thread. I'm sorry I voiced some disappointment. I'm sorry that I spent years painstakingly learning to model and convert black templars, because GW wouldn't make more of their own. I'm sorry for that enthusiasm and passion. I'm sorry that I waited with baited breath for a new character, or campaign, or even just some extra fluff, a battle report, dared to even dream of a new transfer sheet, for YEARS. I'm sorry the last time my chapter got any love was back at the end of 7th, and we only got a bit of artwork showing us hanging out with xenos, and a formation to use for like 3 weeks before 8th dropped. Your snarky remarks about how pointless it is that I have a large army already, and don't want to re-buy stuff because big marines are only allowed to ride in big cars, and never be backwards compatible with anything has made me see the light. My opinions are pointless, I am just a hater, I should just toss all of my existing minis, and shut up and buy primaris like a good boy, because nothing retro is ever of value, and opinions like mine should be ban worthy. Thank you so much for behaving like a mod and telling Tevna and I to move on after you got your parting shot in, you really are an asset to this community.


You're entitled to an opinion and shouldn't be degraded (despite doing the exact same in return), but simultaneously they gave you exactly what you wanted - exciting new cool black templar models so you don't need to convert any more of your own. You can't then complain they gave you the wrong new minis just because you don't want to buy something.


Actually, you can complain about getting the wrong new models just fine. It's just not realistic to expect old Marines to actually get releases anymore. It wasn't a realistic prospect when Primaris were first released four years ago, and the absence of old Marines outside of sideshow releases in the meantime should have put the final nail in that coffin by now even for diehard holdouts. It's a shame if you like old Marines, but it's over. Old Marines are done. That's just the way it is.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/24 13:27:26


Post by: posermcbogus


None of which is lost on me, hence my original post started with "excuse me". I know it's pedantic. None of the irony, stupid as I may seem, of waiting years years for an update, only to Veruca Salt it and say "i don't want this one" is lost on me. Jesus, if I'd have known it was going to start such a fething dogpile I'd have kept it to myself.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/24 13:31:07


Post by: Kanluwen


Take it to PMs please. These kinds of compilation threads are difficult enough to keep on track over time without nonsense flaring up.

Thank you in advance.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/24 14:37:25


Post by: bullyboy


The super flamer was to be expected. We got super bolters, super plasmas, then super meltas, so naturally if a flame weapon was to be released it wasn;t going to be just a basic flamer. Thank God they corrected the D2 though, that would have been obnoxious.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/24 14:49:25


Post by: H.B.M.C.


I'm surprised that the super flamer isn't Gravis.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/24 14:53:04


Post by: Nevelon


 H.B.M.C. wrote:
I'm surprised that the super flamer isn't Gravis.


Agressors already have burny fists, and if they do an eradicator option, it will need to be more broken then this.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/24 14:55:56


Post by: Kanluwen


 Nevelon wrote:


Agressors already have burny fists, and if they do an eradicator option, it will need to be more broken then this.

It could always just be the already mentioned Hellfuries, if and when they do a Gravis option. Could come with 3 different versions even.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/24 15:08:48


Post by: H.B.M.C.


 Kanluwen wrote:
It could always just be the already mentioned Hellfuries, if and when they do a Gravis option. Could come with 3 different versions even.
What if Hellfuries were just what would eventually become Eradicators?


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/24 15:24:00


Post by: changemod


Tbh the only sense I can make of the whole primaris thing after all this time is that, unless Kirby being fired cancelled an AoS style reboot and primaris were meant to be the marines of a functionally unrelated setting, then this is a result of the sculpting team having too much power and going “We’re going to make a completely new range of marines no matter how impossible it is to reconcile with the setting’s lore”.

That said, if you still think by now old mark armour is gone you’ve not really been paying attention to the fact the same inmates running the asylum who made double marines up are also fanboys of the classic style. We’re going to have space marines and lore-unfriendly awkward marines side by side for a really long time.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/24 17:09:59


Post by: Daedalus81


 Arbitrator wrote:
 H.B.M.C. wrote:
On one hand it seems strange that GW went through the whole rationalisation of flame-type weaponry to make them all range 12", only to give Marines a super-special 15" flamer because... Primaris?

On the other hand, perhaps this opens up some design space for other flame weapons that perhaps should have longer ranges (Hellhounds being a good example - they had a 24" range back in the day!).

Makes the Primaris models feel even more extra special or something?


It's likely so the weapon can work with bolt rifles. The AP also keeps it from competing for air with the assault bolters.

It basically needed to have these stats.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/24 18:05:50


Post by: changemod


 Daedalus81 wrote:
 Arbitrator wrote:
 H.B.M.C. wrote:
On one hand it seems strange that GW went through the whole rationalisation of flame-type weaponry to make them all range 12", only to give Marines a super-special 15" flamer because... Primaris?

On the other hand, perhaps this opens up some design space for other flame weapons that perhaps should have longer ranges (Hellhounds being a good example - they had a 24" range back in the day!).

Makes the Primaris models feel even more extra special or something?


It's likely so the weapon can work with bolt rifles. The AP also keeps it from competing for air with the assault bolters.

It basically needed to have these stats.


Did they need to give mark 10 armour marines Scyllax bolters as standard in the first place?


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/24 18:29:27


Post by: BertBert


So about this fella here, what is your take? Will there be a new neophyte kit or could this be an expanded Reiver kit with an additional BT-specific sprue similar to the hounds of morkai?
Reivers don't seem to have been received all too well and are somewhat hampered by subpar rules, so this might be a way to get them off the shelves.


[Thumb - neo.JPG]


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/24 18:49:48


Post by: Kanluwen


The so-far-correct rumor suggested there is a "3 model Neophyte set" on the way, packed with a Black Templar upgrade frame that would "allow for you to build Neophytes with Shotguns or Bolt Pistols+CCWs" but that they would be able to take "Boltguns, Shotguns, or Bolt Pistols+CCWs". The latter would line up with a full Reiver kit plus a BT sprue if the person who reported the kit initially to the rumormonger mistook the Bolt Carbine for a standard Boltgun and the Heavy Bolt Pistol for a standard Bolt Pistol...which is possible.

That would jibe with the (as far as I can see)no longer available 3 model Reiver ETB set which had and has been making me think that the Neophytes outside of the Crusader Squads(which have been implied to be a dedicated SKU..and I'm wondering if it's some kind of mix of Reiver and Intercessor sprues) might just be that ETB kit plus the BT sprue.

TLDR:
Yeah, I definitely think that's a Neophyte. How they'll be released? Who knows!

Sidenote!
Finding the details of the rumors again, there's some...interesting bits. A Reddit post has the BT army box list and it suggests 4 Neophytes to 6 Initiates in the Crusader Squads from the BT army box listing. I distinctly recall seeing 3 for the box listings of individual units and the Initiates being a 5 model set, while the Reddit post has 4:6 for the individual boxes. Might be a SOB situation where the army pack has unique sculpts on set frames that the full kits won't have.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/24 22:00:37


Post by: Marshal Loss


The so-far correct rumour never listed 3 Neophytes, so I'm not sure where you're getting that information from. Absolutely zero chance of an ETB kit being repackaged with an upgrade sprue.

These are the only rumours we have any reason to believe at this stage:


BT army box in September, containing:

Codex
Cards
Crusader Squad (6 Initiates and 4 Neophytes)
Emperor's Champion
Seneschal
Redemptor

October and November 2021:
Complete BT release with

Ancient
Helbrecht
Grimaldus
Emperor's Champion
Seneschal
Initiates (6 Marines with Intercessor CC equipment or auto bolt rifles),
4 Neophytes (boltguns or chainswords)

The Crusader kit will have options for a Sword Brother unit leader with cape, and there's a 15" AP-1 flamer.
The Sword Brother kit will have plenty of CC options and the option to make a Marshal (like with the Custodes Warden kit that gives you the option of making a Captain).
There will be two Crusader Squads: the old one that everyone knows and a new one made up exclusively of Primaris. The latter will be 5-11 Primaris Initiates, 4-8 Primaris Neophytes, and 1 Primaris Sword Brother. Neophytes will have 2W and 2A like other Primaris.

There'll also be a conversion/bitz/upgrade sprue that will have Templar relics on it (so-and-so's helmet, the sword of such-and-such, etc.), shotguns for Neophytes, and more customisation options like extra arms (Neophyte holding a helmet), or backpack-mounted candles. There will also be a multi-melta which will become a BT vehicle option. It'll replace the stubber on Primaris vehicles.


They were translated from French, thus "Seneschal" instead of "Marshal".

Since those were posted, the contents of the launch box have been corroborated by Valrak, who claims to have seen it. His earlier comments about the models BT are going to receive are identical to the above. Apply salt as required


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/24 22:05:29


Post by: Kanluwen


My brain must have cross-pollinated the 3 from a different subject with the BT rumor day of...because I've got it listed going as far back as last Sunday!

My bad! Either way, I'll be interested to see how it shakes out.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/24 22:43:51


Post by: H.B.M.C.


 Marshal Loss wrote:
They were translated from French, thus "Seneschal" instead of "Marshal".
Aww... and here I was thinking Seneschal was the new BT-equivalent of a Primaris Lieutenant.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/24 23:55:33


Post by: Jack Flask


 H.B.M.C. wrote:
 Marshal Loss wrote:
They were translated from French, thus "Seneschal" instead of "Marshal".
Aww... and here I was thinking Seneschal was the new BT-equivalent of a Primaris Lieutenant.


I think they still might be.

From a release perspective, it doesn't really make sense to me that they would release a unique clam pack Marshal... Only to then have options in the Sword Brother kit to build a distinctly different Marshal.

Plus, to satisfy my own curiosity (as a non French speaker) marshal and seneschal are distinctly present in both languages sharing a common Germanic origin, so it wouldn't make much sense from a linguistic/localization perspective to switch from one to the other between languages either.

Plus even old Helbrecht is called "High Marshal" on the French GW webstore.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/25 13:26:41


Post by: pgmason


Black Templars used to have a rank called Castellan which was below a marshal, and commanded a particular chapter keep or detachment. Seneschal is probably that, and will be their lieutenant equivalent.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/25 18:41:29


Post by: Jack Flask


pgmason wrote:
Black Templars used to have a rank called Castellan which was below a marshal, and commanded a particular chapter keep or detachment. Seneschal is probably that, and will be their lieutenant equivalent.


They still do have that rank in lore, but it's more equivalent to Captain rank due to the Templars unorthodox structure.

Helbrecht is the High Marshal and by typical Space Marine standards is the Chapter Master. However each Crusade operates independently as though it were a sub-Chapter in it's own right.

So the Marshal's Household contains similar roles and assignments as a codex Chapter's command staff, making each Marshal more responsible than a codex Captain but less significant than a Chapter Master. Below that are multiple Fighting Companies structured similar to the Companies of a codex chapter, giving a Castellan equivalent responsibility to a Captain.

So they could add Seneschal as a Lieutenant equivalent ranking between Sword Brothers and the Castellan in a fighting company.

Spoiler:


Edit: I will say though that it is odd that there is no mention of a Castellan kit or upgrade in the rumor so Seneschal could be a mistake, or there could be Castellan options buried in one of the kits and the rumormonger didn't see it.

I do think though that unless the current BT structure is changed then Seneschal is likely their Lt-eq, with Marshal = CM-eq and Castellan = Cpt-eq


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/25 22:02:42


Post by: pgmason


As I understand it the Rumours are from a french source. Seneschal is basicaly the french word for castellan - i.e. someone who manages a castle.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/26 00:08:33


Post by: Jack Flask


pgmason wrote:
As I understand it the Rumours are from a french source. Seneschal is basicaly the french word for castellan - i.e. someone who manages a castle.


Did you look that up or just assume it was true because someone else said it?
All three titles were introduced into English via French around the 14th century.

Also neither the Knight Castellan and Castellan Crowe are referred to as "Seneschal" on the French GW webstore...


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/26 02:15:59


Post by: Marshal Loss


 Jack Flask wrote:
pgmason wrote:
As I understand it the Rumours are from a french source. Seneschal is basicaly the french word for castellan - i.e. someone who manages a castle.


Did you look that up or just assume it was true because someone else said it?
All three titles were introduced into English via French around the 14th century.


Very strong "I don't read French but I like to use Google" energy.

In any case, to clear this up, directly from the rumour monger:

Seneshal/Seneschal is supposed to be Marshal: I got a little mixed up in my translations.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/20 03:28:57


Post by: Jack Flask


 Marshal Loss wrote:
 Jack Flask wrote:
pgmason wrote:
As I understand it the Rumours are from a french source. Seneschal is basicaly the french word for castellan - i.e. someone who manages a castle.


Did you look that up or just assume it was true because someone else said it?
All three titles were introduced into English via French around the 14th century.


Very strong "I don't read French but I like to use Google" energy.


Which should be infinitely preferable to either someone pulling info out of their bum or parroting someone else without any sort of investigation.

 Marshal Loss wrote:

In any case, to clear this up, directly from the rumour monger:

Seneshal/Seneschal is supposed to be Marshal: I got a little mixed up in my translations.


Not finding the post you're supposedly quoting, but in the process of actually confirming I found a French Warhammer wiki describing a Seneschal in the same way as a Marshal and citing it to the 4e 'dex, so fair enough.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/26 08:18:06


Post by: Marshal Loss


 Jack Flask wrote:
 Marshal Loss wrote:
 Jack Flask wrote:
pgmason wrote:
As I understand it the Rumours are from a french source. Seneschal is basicaly the french word for castellan - i.e. someone who manages a castle.

Did you look that up or just assume it was true because someone else said it?
All three titles were introduced into English via French around the 14th century.

Very strong "I don't read French but I like to use Google" energy.

Which should be infinitely preferable to either someone pulling info out of their bum or parroting someone else without any sort of investigation.


Yes, your flailing attempts to correct others using etymology available on Wikipedia is no doubt an inspiration to researchers across the globe.

 Jack Flask wrote:
Not finding the post you're supposedly quoting


Better investigate a little harder next time


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/26 16:02:13


Post by: pgmason


I stand corrected.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/08/26 19:18:43


Post by: Albino Squirrel


 VictorVonTzeentch wrote:
Why do they keep having Marines hold the weapon by the carry handle or have top mounted grips when they have a handguard modeled on the weapon?


Probably because the arm can't actually reach the handguard underneath, so they have to do that to hide the fact that the proportions don't actually work with these hugely oversized weapons. But yeah, I don't know why they design the weapons to have that handguard that nobody can use.


Black Templars Compiled thread(Updated 10/4) PREORDERS OCT 9. @ 2021/09/20 13:06:51


Post by: Kanluwen


I didn't forget about this!

Here's Marshal Helbrecht: