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The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/27 05:00:51


Post by: Manchu


Just a few more days until The Book of Boba Fett comes out on D+.

For those currently not subbed, will this show make you sub/resub?

For those who plan to sub/resub, are you going to do so right away and watch every week or wait until some/all of the episodes are out?

Do you guys think this will be as good as Mando S1 & 2?

Anyone here not like the show and not looking forward to Book o’ Boba?


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/27 05:06:54


Post by: Grimskul


I've never been subbed to begin with, if you know where to look, you can always find ways of procuring the show soon after its weekly episode release.

I feel like there's potential for it be stronger than Mando in the sense that we don't have to worry as much with regards to side quests like the weird heist episode, since Boba has a pretty clear focus in becoming the new underworldian kingpin of Tatooine/Hutt Space, it'll be much more localized in that regard. It also gives a chance to provide some much needed context of how he survived the Sarlaac Pit and just how high his ambitions are. It'll really depend on the execution and how they balance Boba being a premier bounty hunter and why he's now choosing to fill in the power vaacuum on his own versus before when he served Jabba.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/27 05:09:07


Post by: Voss


I thought Mando was pretty mediocre (and at times outright plodding), and this is, at best, more of the same?

Beyond 'this 'memberberry was a real popular dude-guy, lets do more with him, because we like money' I don't see the point of this one.

At least let's hope there's no bait and switch from Underworld Crime to Refugee Childcare this time around.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/27 05:11:07


Post by: Grimskul


Voss wrote:
I thought Mando was pretty mediocre (and at times outright plodding), and this is, at best, more of the same?

Beyond 'this 'memberberry was a real popular dude-guy, lets do more with him, because we like money' I don't see the point of this one.

At least let's hope there's no bait and switch from Underworld Crime to Refugee Childcare this time around.


How much you want to bet there's going to be an orphanage that Boba is going to end up taking care of and it's something the other criminal organizations try to target?


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/27 05:18:27


Post by: Manchu


I ended up loving Mando despite some pretty deep concerns about the Baby Yoda-sploitation angle. Felt a lot better about the show after it became clear that Grogu was more than a mascot.

But, yes, I really hope there is no “but he cares about children” bull gak to try to make Boba more sympathetic. Also, Grimskull, I am torn about whether I want the backstory on him escaping the Saarlac but nonetheless am pretty certain we will get it.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/27 05:38:04


Post by: H.B.M.C.


I'm just concerned that this show about the criminal underworld of SW, and Boba Fett rising to the top to fill the void left by Jabba will be Disney-fied to the point where he's not really breaking the law, and not really doing anything bad, because we can't have a bad guy be the main character.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/27 05:41:48


Post by: trexmeyer


I feel like the Mandalorian ended up benefitting from having incredibly short episodes because those end up being ignored when people think of the series as a whole. There were some absolutely awful episodes. It had some really solid ones and the show as a whole was fun. My biggest criticism of that series is that it felt like a fan-made film at times.

I really doubt The Book of Boba Fett is going to be good. Sophie Thatcher's character looks like a Joan Jett transplant. That doesn't really mesh with Star Wars.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/27 05:49:28


Post by: Grimskul


 H.B.M.C. wrote:
I'm just concerned that this show about the criminal underworld of SW, and Boba Fett rising to the top to fill the void left by Jabba will be Disney-fied to the point where he's not really breaking the law, and not really doing anything bad, because we can't have a bad guy be the main character.


Yeah, that is another area that I'm not sure Disney can really do adequately since they've already shown that they will handwave pretty inexcusable stuff (Wanda's enslavement of Westview) for the sake of them being the protagonist, and the trailer constantly showing Fett to be "collaborative" does seem to undermine him being an actual player like Maul was in enforcing his will over others with the Shadow Collective. So I'm sure they'll gloss over whatever human/alien trafficking the other guys do and Fett will only get involved in stuff like loan sharking, spice trading and "protection fees", so more Yakuza than Breaking Bad.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/27 06:10:39


Post by: Manchu


Mando left a dude hanging off a pole to be eaten alive by monsters.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/27 09:16:21


Post by: AduroT


I want someone to directly ask Boba how he survived the Sarlock and I want Boba to pointedly ignore/not answer them.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/27 10:06:19


Post by: Manchu


That would be great!


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/27 11:29:45


Post by: Lance845


Can't wait for Bobba to meet an ever growing extended cast of SW characters once per episode.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/27 11:38:08


Post by: AduroT


A growing cast? Fool! He’s just going to meet the same people every other character meets.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/27 11:55:28


Post by: LordofHats


 AduroT wrote:
I want someone to directly ask Boba how he survived the Sarlock and I want Boba to pointedly ignore/not answer them.


I think this would honestly be best because I don't think any given answer could ever live up to the mystery.

Treat it like Kirk beating the Kobayashi Maru test, except Kirk never admits how he did it.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/27 12:01:10


Post by: AduroT


 LordofHats wrote:
 AduroT wrote:
I want someone to directly ask Boba how he survived the Sarlock and I want Boba to pointedly ignore/not answer them.


I think this would honestly be best because I don't think any given answer could ever live up to the mystery.

Treat it like Kirk beating the Kobayashi Maru test, except Kirk never admits how he did it.


Ugh. Kobayashi was one of the worst parts of the Abrams reboots.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/27 12:07:33


Post by: LordofHats


 AduroT wrote:
 LordofHats wrote:
 AduroT wrote:
I want someone to directly ask Boba how he survived the Sarlock and I want Boba to pointedly ignore/not answer them.


I think this would honestly be best because I don't think any given answer could ever live up to the mystery.

Treat it like Kirk beating the Kobayashi Maru test, except Kirk never admits how he did it.


Ugh. Kobayashi was one of the worst parts of the Abrams reboots.


A good example of how sometimes revealing the 'secret' really just kills the entire mystique, especially when the scene is dumb.

I'm generally on the side of the JJ films not being as bad as people make them out to be, but this scene was eye-roll inducing. He didn't even bother trying to hide that he cheated, which was stupid. It would have been much better for Kirk to have been more subtle (because he was in TOS and the original films) and for Spock to kind of hound him out of unproven suspicion. Instead, he made it so obvious the only reason he wasn't expelled was plot armor. Which was dumb.

But admittedly, we already knew he cheated the test before that movie was made. Kirk admits to cheating in Wrath of Khan to Savik, but they were smarter there and kept it fairly vague. He said he changed the parameters of the test to make it winnable, and we have to imagine TOS Kirk was more clever than Kelvin Kirk because Shatner got commended for ingenuity. That at least maintained the mystique of what he'd done cause we had to sit there and wonder how the feth he managed to cheat and get commended for it. Somehow, I don't think it was by making the test a joke and eating an apple while grinning like a moron.

Sometimes too much information ruins the story and there's definitely a trend these days to overload in information.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/27 12:14:53


Post by: Geifer


 AduroT wrote:
 LordofHats wrote:
 AduroT wrote:
I want someone to directly ask Boba how he survived the Sarlock and I want Boba to pointedly ignore/not answer them.


I think this would honestly be best because I don't think any given answer could ever live up to the mystery.

Treat it like Kirk beating the Kobayashi Maru test, except Kirk never admits how he did it.


Ugh. Kobayashi was one of the worst parts of the Abrams reboots.


Luckily Book of Boba is done by people who know how to make good Star Wars, so there's less to worry about.

On the Sarlacc, was anyone from the barge or escorts even alive to tell anyone Boba took the scenic route?


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/27 13:17:29


Post by: AduroT


I don’t mind that we know that he cheated. I don’t even mind that he cheated in so obviously blatant a fashion. It makes for a good I will Never just accept an unwinnable and I will do Whatever it takes so save people kind of thing. What I hate is how no one seems to understand that he cheated. They’re just like I don’t know how he won. How did he possibly beat the unbeatable.I don’t get it.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/27 15:38:44


Post by: trexmeyer


I thought Boba Fett's method of surviving the Sarlaac in the EU was fine...


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/27 15:48:39


Post by: Manchu


 Geifer wrote:
Luckily Book of Boba is done by people who know how to make good Star Wars, so there's less to worry about.
Honestly, this is what I am counting on ...


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/27 17:18:24


Post by: BobtheInquisitor


The only explanation we need is Boba’s new personal motto: this too shall pass.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/27 21:40:33


Post by: Mad Doc Grotsnik


I’m well up for it.

Greatly enjoyed The Mandalorian, and Boba certainly impressed in that.

As ever, I’m avoiding spoilers and reviews.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/28 09:20:12


Post by: Manchu


Me too, MDG. Mando has been a bright spot.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/28 10:55:36


Post by: H.B.M.C.


 Manchu wrote:
Mando left a dude hanging off a pole to be eaten alive by monsters.
Mando left a bad guy that betrayed him hanging to be killed by other people (or things).

That's like James Bond killing the "bad" Bond Girl any time she appears in a film; indirectly usually via an accident or someone else doing it. It lets the good guy win whilst keeping his hands clean.





The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/28 21:46:44


Post by: Manchu


IMO the scene in question made Mando feel quite dark as in that situation just executing the guy seemed like it would have been more merciful.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/29 08:47:06


Post by: AduroT


They really go out of their way to show Fett as a kinder, gentler, more down to earth crime lord. Also

Spoiler:
my hope was immediately crushed as the opening scene right out of the gate Shows you how he escaped the Pit.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/29 10:21:47


Post by: Mad Doc Grotsnik


I really enjoyed it.

Spoiler:
The how of his survival is answered in good time, as well as “what’s he been up to?”.

Love the new Tattooine Gribbly. Very reminiscent of The Kraken from Clash of the Titans. Seems Matt Berry is in it, but I didn’t realise until the credits. Guess I’ll be watching it again! I reckon he’s the Aqualish visitor to Boba’s Palace, as his voice and face are pretty distinctive.

Also quite sparing with the dialogue, which is kinda fitting.

Did I see 4-LOM? We definitely saw 8D8, and we already saw a reprogrammed 9D9 in Mando.

Jonesing for chapter 2 now.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/29 11:20:26


Post by: Nicky J


 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
I really enjoyed it.

Spoiler:
Seems Matt Berry is in it, but I didn’t realise until the credits. Guess I’ll be watching it again! I reckon he’s the Aqualish visitor to Boba’s Palace, as his voice and face are pretty distinctive.


Spoiler:
He was the droid in the throne room when they were receiving the tributes. I clocked it fairly quickly, as you say his voice is VERY distinctive!


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/29 11:21:23


Post by: Mad Doc Grotsnik


Huh. I need to pay more attention!


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/29 11:53:55


Post by: chromedog


The Twi'lek bar owner is played by Jennifer Beals (she was also the sheriff in the DC "Swamp thing" series that got canned after 1 season - oh and got her big role in "Flashdance").

It's a regular role (this was reported in Variety a few months ago) not just a one-off.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/29 13:54:45


Post by: Voss


'Stranger in a Strange Land' is an... interesting... episode title, given where he ends up in the flashbacks and also the present.
(See the Heinlein book of the same name if you want the implications here)

If this turns into a Lawrence of Arabia thing, I'm going to spit.

Gotta say, the string of circumstances has me straining the edge of disbelief already, and the duo in the present day seem... under-armed... for walking around in their current circumstances.

Definitely not impressed yet, but still willing to poke at it.

--
The mayor's assistant also struck me as a familiar actor, but couldn't put a name on him.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/29 14:19:20


Post by: Mad Doc Grotsnik


I liked how the Majordomo’s physical expressions were close to Bib Fortuna’s in ROTJ.

Not identical, but close enough to possibly be a formal thing, or just a Twi’lek species thing.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/29 14:55:36


Post by: H.B.M.C.


As I saw from one review: "The Pamphlet of Boba Fett". God... that was scarcely 2 acts worth of plot. The show ended half-way through a flashback!!!

This might be a "wait until it's finished" show if they're doing the "don't show or tell" route.




The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/29 15:38:09


Post by: AduroT


Depends on how long they drag out the Dances With Massiffs thing or if that lasts the whole season.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/29 15:44:28


Post by: Voss


Calling it now by the way:

Fennec betrays him. Maybe because he's doing it wrong, maybe to 'save his life.'
But mostly because foxes are tricky.

So sudden but inevitable betrayal is in the cards.

 AduroT wrote:
Depends on how long they drag out the Dances With Massiffs thing or if that lasts the whole season.

Yeesh, good call. This one is really wearing its influences on its sleeves, isn't it?

I wonder how many Godfather references will be in the conference room episode (from the trailer)?


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/29 16:12:59


Post by: AduroT


Oh my god I want him to have a Loth-Cat on his lap.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/29 16:16:35


Post by: Mad Doc Grotsnik


Interesting observation.

Super buff topless Twi’lek dude had ear horns, rather than ears. Which is a physical trait of lady Twi’leks.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/29 17:03:37


Post by: AduroT


 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
Interesting observation.

Super buff topless Twi’lek dude had ear horns, rather than ears. Which is a physical trait of lady Twi’leks.


I noticed that. Didn’t pause or rewind but I tried and failed to tell if those were the ears or if they were just covers.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/29 17:28:04


Post by: Aash


Just watched the first episode. Eh, it was ok I suppose.

I like that it has the same visual language and look as the Mandalorian, but I’d prefer to have had another season of that over what this was.

I’m not really sure what was wrong, but this just didn’t really grab me.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/29 17:29:58


Post by: Stevefamine


That was some dope pilot


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/29 17:31:29


Post by: DaveC


 AduroT wrote:
 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
Interesting observation.

Super buff topless Twi’lek dude had ear horns, rather than ears. Which is a physical trait of lady Twi’leks.


I noticed that. Didn’t pause or rewind but I tried and failed to tell if those were the ears or if they were just covers.


Just rechecked he has a head dress with cones over the ears but you don't see his actual ears so it doesn't go against previous male Twi'lek designs.

I think this might be a series best watched in 1 sitting not a bad start and got a few questions cleared up early on but it probably needed a double episode to start. Boba needs better Gamorrean guards! (not that they were ever very competent)


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/29 17:37:34


Post by: Mad Doc Grotsnik


On the wider scenes shown?

Remember, this is mainstream. Not everyone tuning in a going to be as familiar with Boba as Us Nerds.

Showing his earl days, his escape from the Sarlacc early, and showing off Jawas, Sand People and Sand Puppers is necessary for less knowledgeable viewers helps to establish exactly who Boba is.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also?

Spoiler:
With Mando taking place 9ABY, which is approx 5 years after Endor.

Now. We know for sure Boba was out and about when Mando encountered Shennec.

But what we don’t currently know how long Boba was in the Sarlacc.

My take is that it perhaps wasn’t all that long. Rationale here is we see Jawas rocking up at the sight, to do what Jawas do. Given how notorious Jabba was, whilst folk finding out what happened to him outside his Court may not be immediate? It would be pretty quick, especially as we can assume Bib Fortuna would’ve made his claim fairly quickly.

Certainly I don’t think we’re seeing him emerging, earning respect of the Sand People, grabbing some gear then finding the critically wounded Fennec.

Now….the Sheriff bloke from Mando S2? He’s actually mentioned in the first Aftermath novel. I’ll need to read that again to be sure, but apparently him trading for Boba’s armour was days after Endor/Sarlacc battles.

So…….what was Boba up to in the intervening years?


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/29 18:21:24


Post by: Aash


I’m not a huge Star Wars fan, but I like it well enough. I’ve seen all the live action films, and the Mandalorian. I’ve not read any of the books or watched the animated stuff etc, so I guess I’m a fairly casual fan, so can someone clear up the timeline a bit?

Boba Fett is a child in Attack of the Clones, around maybe 10 years old or so at a guess, and Revenge of the Sith is set what, 2 or 3 years later, making him about 13 when Luke and Leia were born, so about the same age as Han Solo given that Harrison Ford is 9 years older than Mark Hamill and 14 years older than Carrie Fisher.

So why does Boba Fett look like he’s in his 60s when he should be around 35-40 in Return of the Jedi and the Mandalorian (5 years later). If anything Boba Fett should be younger than Mando?


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/29 18:58:34


Post by: Voss


 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
On the wider scenes shown?

Remember, this is mainstream. Not everyone tuning in a going to be as familiar with Boba as Us Nerds.

Showing his earl days, his escape from the Sarlacc early, and showing off Jawas, Sand People and Sand Puppers is necessary for less knowledgeable viewers helps to establish exactly who Boba is.


I couldn't disagree with you more here. Jawas and Tuskens have frog-all to do with the story of who Boba Fett is. They're there because 'member Star Wars?'
He could have scavenged a skiff, walked or jetpacked out of the desert in his flashback and it would have moved on just as well. And I would've much rather had vague, disjointed dreams of heat exhaustion rather than a... stormtrooper tube , wall punching and somehow digging a reverse hole as the 'explanation' of the Sarlacc escape. Not least because it now requires an explanation of why he isn't dead of exposure. Or wounds. Or exhaustion. Or more exposure. Or lack of food/water. Or beatings. Or... well, its all a bit much.

----
Honestly, for brand new or less knowledgeable viewers, I don't know why they'd care about anything this first episode presents. They probably have very pointed questions about who he took over from (and how), and why he's still wounded from his flashbacks (yes, they're probably present day wounds, but the episode makes no effort to explain what his injuries are or how he got them). Also why any of it matters. Apart from a few name drops, there's not much of anything for the 'less knowledgeable' to latch on to. New crime boss is somehow entrenched, but completely naive. The end.

Anyone who doesn't know RotJ backwards and forwards, doesn't know anything about the old EU and hasn't watched (or rewatched) the Mando probably doesn't feel all that welcome.

Aash wrote:So why does Boba Fett look like he’s in his 60s when he should be around 35-40 in Return of the Jedi and the Mandalorian (5 years later). If anything Boba Fett should be younger than Mando?

They'd be about the same age- Mando was orphaned by the clone wars (ie, when Boba was about 10), and was probably 5-10 when that happened.

But as for looking 60? I don't think he does, particularly. But between the digestive juices, raw exposure to desert planet wind and suns (passed out or tied up), being put to work while malnourished and beaten and so on, I wouldn't expect him to look like a spring chicken.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/29 19:01:24


Post by: Mad Doc Grotsnik


Voss.

PM me when you actually enjoy something, yeah?


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/29 19:20:29


Post by: Voss


 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
Voss.

PM me when you actually enjoy something, yeah?


I enjoy lots of things. But they actually have to be good.
(Off the top of my head- She-ra (reboot, obviously), Raya, Shang-Chi)


But don't throw a hissy at me because I don't like things you like. Feel free to disagree with me, but I'd really like to see actual reasons why you think Jawas and Tuskens are important to the story of Boba Fett (either the crime boss or the bounty hunter), or what new viewers have to latch onto with this first episode. You put forth a theory that the early days are important for less knowledgeable viewers- back it up with... something. Because what I saw requires a pretty hefty knowledge base and explains very little.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/29 19:32:58


Post by: endlesswaltz123


A reverse hole? You mean a tunnel...


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/29 19:34:04


Post by: Aash


Voss wrote:


Aash wrote:So why does Boba Fett look like he’s in his 60s when he should be around 35-40 in Return of the Jedi and the Mandalorian (5 years later). If anything Boba Fett should be younger than Mando?

They'd be about the same age- Mando was orphaned by the clone wars (ie, when Boba was about 10), and was probably 5-10 when that happened.

But as for looking 60? I don't think he does, particularly. But between the digestive juices, raw exposure to desert planet wind and suns (passed out or tied up), being put to work while malnourished and beaten and so on, I wouldn't expect him to look like a spring chicken.


Maybe, but I’d expect Boba Fett in this era to look like Jango Fett did in Attack of the Clones. Especially given that it’s the same actor, and he was age appropriate in attack of the clones and is in his 60s now, they should have either recast the role, or de-aged the actor. (Or I suppose they could have set it around the time of the sequel trilogy so the actor was the right age for the character).


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/29 19:50:28


Post by: Jadenim


If they need to, I think they can just explain away any age discrepancy by “clone problems”.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/29 20:02:19


Post by: endlesswaltz123


 Jadenim wrote:
If they need to, I think they can just explain away any age discrepancy by “clone problems”.


He isn't like the other clones though, he was a perfect clone that does not age like the other clones.



The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/29 20:17:20


Post by: trexmeyer


EU handled Boba Fett wildly better even if he was ultimately no more than a Man With No Name knockoff that later became "the bestest Mandalorian ever". The show has the same issue that The Mandalorian had at times. It looks cheap. I don't know how or why, but even 90's scifi generally didn't look this cheap even with rubber forehead aliens.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/29 20:25:55


Post by: Turnip Jedi


it's passable with a strong hint of memberberries, but in the streaming age passable isn't enough

and like Mando I'm surprised The Mouse sprang for live action when animated would be cheaper and good enough


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/29 20:42:14


Post by: warboss


Well, that premiere episode was mediocre. Hopefully the next one will be better...


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/29 20:49:49


Post by: Voss


 endlesswaltz123 wrote:
A reverse hole? You mean a tunnel...


Nope. A tunnel has some structure to it, and will actually remain a passage.

Reverse hole is admittedly a terrible term, but digging up? Into sand? Its just stuff collapsing on you. The 'walls' aren't going to keep any sort of integrity. A depression might form at the top, and a really strong digger might get somewhere, but just a human guy that spent some amount of time being digested? Its not going to go well.

It certainly isn't going to work like frikkin Terraria, mining out of the 'evil biome' into the desert biome, and climbing out on sand blocks.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/29 21:59:58


Post by: warboss


Yup. You did vertically through sand and you're just treading it.

I think I'm more interested in Ming Na Wen's character than Boba. Even when just acting like an angry bitch, she's a better actress. Morrison has a very limited range and is best with quick simple lines in the helmet as I don't he is capable of much more. She is but is purposefully limited herself as the role calls for it and still pulls it off better IMO.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/29 23:24:08


Post by: H.B.M.C.


 warboss wrote:
Well, that premiere episode was mediocre. Hopefully the next one will be better...
I think it's unfair to call it mediocre given that, based upon its structure, we've only seen the first 1/3 to 1/2 of the episode.

Sure, Disney may call it "Chapter One", but, there's no way what we saw was a full episode.

Right... ?


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/30 02:57:39


Post by: Voss


Hey, the main action sequence was almost longer than the credits. That... probably counts for something.

And they talked to, like... 6 people. (Sort of). And went for a walk.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/30 03:17:18


Post by: Lance845


I liked the lizard man centaur monster.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/30 03:35:52


Post by: Manchu


Golly.

Am I unsatisfied because I want more? Or because I didn’t get enough?

The name and image of Boba Fett has floated around in pop culture for decades but to be honest there has never been much character there until the second season of The Mandalorian. Now that Boba is the protagonist of his own show, it’s important to actually give him some personality, starting with some brief flashes of Kamino and Geonosis from Attack of the Clones before striking out into the story of what happened to him between Return of the Jedi and “now” — so to speak.

I wasn’t initially sold on the idea of non-sequential exposition until I realized that establishing Boba’s personality is a pretty steep challenge. The pop culture iconography of Boba Fett is all about one-note badassery. Does that make for a interesting protagonist? Maybe for a one-and-done short but not for a whole season of a show. In the intercut time sequences, we see that Boba is more complex. He is restrained, not prone to losing his temper or lashing out. He’s not arrogant and he’s certainly not invincible. Surprisingly, he is actually pretty good-natured.

The overall impression I have of him is that he’s patient, thoughtful, and calculating. It’s not just that he doesn’t mind being underestimated; that seems to be his strategy, both as a hostage to the Sand People and as the new strong man in Mos Espa. The structure of the episode unquestionably asks us to think about the parallel here. Is Boba a fish out of water just winging it from moment to moment — or is the hunter baiting a masterful trap for the prey he has carefully cultivated to be unwary?

An interesting question to be sure but somehow the opening episode posed it in a frustrating way. I could carefully sift through the structure beat by beat but my instinct is, it’s the Mos Espa action sequence. The antagonists‘ strange cattle prod/energy shield weaponry make the stakes confusing. Do they want to assassinate Boba? Capture him? Just humiliate him? The scene shows our main characters caught off guard — but why? And then the fight shows us Boba trying thing after thing, none of which really work, until he’s flat on his ass. At which point, Fennec takes over solo and there is a much more dynamic chase scene where she seems (puzzlingly? tellingly?) much more competent alone.

Fortunately, Boba gets to shine in the second major action sequence in his next dream flashback. But the parallel tracks of the story feel unbalanced. In the earlier timeframe, shown later, Boba does better (in a more clearly defined scene), than the later timeline that was shown earlier. Narratively, this is not a satisfying or even coherent arc. It’s backwards, or inside-out. We learned some interesting things about Boba but what did Boba himself learn? And then the episode just ends during the flashback, underscoring that not only have neither plot track resolved but also that they haven’t really connected properly.

It’s not so much that we got half an episode. It’s more like we got two-thirds of an episode; two acts of a three-act story. So I have to conclude that I am unsatisfied more because I didn’t get enough. But nevertheless this first episode has also left me wanting mode. It did set up Boba as a complex and compelling character: not just “a simple man trying to make his way through the galaxy” like his father Jango, but a man of subtle depth. And both Mos Espa and the Tusken culture are very promising in terms of mystery and adventure.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/30 04:57:27


Post by: Voss


 Lance845 wrote:
I liked the lizard man centaur monster.

I kinda want to know if they were gathering its eggs, and the kid knew that they might run into one, or if the ecology of Tatooine is so weird that is just spontaneously manifests fragile shells filled with just plain water for no apparent reason.
Just... have a passing background shot with someone through eggs and bugs into a still and getting some water out the other end, not just cracking open fresh water sand gourds. It doesn't need to have a comment or any attention drawn to it. Just... not random six packs in the sand and homesteads with a frikkin' water fountain in the front yard.

But the show definitely needs an old man yelling 'Unleash the Kraken!' at some point. Maybe the Tusken can build a fake one and have a parade in the next flashback.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/30 09:23:07


Post by: Thargrim


I've got such mixed feelings on this. The only real positive I can think of is nostalgia. But really it feels like it's been amateur hour for Star Wars ever since Disney got a hold of it.

And that centaur lizard thing was one of the worst monsters i've ever seen come from Star Wars. Even the weird creatures from old SW galaxies pixelated video game looked better.

And another gripe, they take the effort to have the Tuskens speak gibberish. But I miss when all the aliens spoke weird languages. It feels super off to have Trandoshans speaking english, along with most other aliens. Even the old KOTOR games did better than this, my god. There's something about this that feels highly un-authentic.



The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/30 09:46:08


Post by: Manchu


I loved the centaur lizard. It was a merry allusion to Harryhausen and reminded me of the Rancor effects.

One thing that does bother me along the lines of “inauthenticity” is how twi’leks are so human looking — I mean, think about how ugly Bib was in RotJ. But this isn’t new to Disney. Even in RotJ, Oola hardly seemed to be of the same species as Bib. In the prequels, Aayla Secura cemented the “hot human” look that Filoni faithfully followed in his Clone Wars series and is being reproduced in this show. I think the same uncannily human twi-lek’s also appeared in KotOR? (EDIT: yes, e.g., Mission Vao: although Twi’lek males could still be pretty rough looking.) So really, Bib and that really fat senator from the prequels (Orn Free Ta) are the only gross looking ones.

Note that the Aqualish and the Rodian both spoke in their own languages.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/30 10:23:31


Post by: endlesswaltz123


I wasn't that impressed.

I actually want a ruthless, power hungry Boba as well, not some idealist. Young Boba (clone wars) was like this.

Whilst some will have forgot in the time period about Boba, the intimidation of him seems to be lost/forgotten by everyone, he doesn't need to be quite as scary as Vader appearing on screen to the other characters, but he should be quite scary still.

Lastly, where was the badass that absolutely ruined the storm troopers in the Mandolorian? He was a schmuck in that fight in Mos Espa.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/30 10:54:32


Post by: warboss


 Manchu wrote:
I loved the centaur lizard. It was a merry allusion to Harryhausen and reminded me of the Rancor effects.


Yeah, I got the feeling that it was done on purpose to look like the classic stop motion at times. I dont think it was a happy accident as substandard or rushed cgi has its own issues that look different. That was competently done to look like classic effects (faults and all) similar to how they built a physical ship model for the Mando Razor Crest both to use for in camera shots and to guide the cgi. Then there is the Imperial capital ship that was purposefully made in 3d to look like a hand built kitbash. I think this is the next incarnation of that effort but, unlike the other two.cases, I don't feel it was the best choice.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/30 11:14:57


Post by: Dreadwinter


I liked that a lot. Looked really good, enjoyed all the characters. Going to be a fun watch.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/30 14:52:45


Post by: Dysartes


 Manchu wrote:
The name and image of Boba Fett has floated around in pop culture for decades but to be honest there has never been much character there until the second season of The Mandalorian. Now that Boba is the protagonist of his own show, it’s important to actually give him some personality, starting with some brief flashes of Kamino and Geonosis from Attack of the Clones before striking out into the story of what happened to him between Return of the Jedi and “now” — so to speak.

While it may not be canon any more - probably because the Mouse doesn't want to pay the royalties to the authors that it should - the EU had expanded on Boba Fett's character quite a bit from what was seen on screen.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/30 15:13:03


Post by: xerxeskingofking


 Manchu wrote:
Golly.

An interesting question to be sure but somehow the opening episode posed it in a frustrating way. I could carefully sift through the structure beat by beat but my instinct is, it’s the Mos Espa action sequence. The antagonists‘ strange cattle prod/energy shield weaponry make the stakes confusing. Do they want to assassinate Boba? Capture him? Just humiliate him? The scene shows our main characters caught off guard — but why? And then the fight shows us Boba trying thing after thing, none of which really work, until he’s flat on his ass. At which point, Fennec takes over solo and there is a much more dynamic chase scene where she seems (puzzlingly? tellingly?) much more competent alone.


i can sort of understand that, given she is an assassin, not a bodyguard, and might well be at a disadvantage when she has to think in terms of protecting a charge as opposed to killing a target. once she is set loose to hunt she is much more in her element.

what puzzled me was why didnt Fett USE THE BLOODY JETPACK?!? He could easily have boosted clear with a short hop, and forced the attackers to split up or otherwise break the encirclement, but it never seems to occur to him. even if he didnt want to leave fennec alone, like i said he could have just made a short hop to escape the sheild wall and still be in the fight. I get that the narrative purpose was let the Gamoreans come in to save the day (and by extension, validate his mercy and show the merits of his methods), but it just feels a clumsy way to do it. that, and the sudden disappearance of the Gamoreans who had previously been glued to Fetts shoulders (which i noticed pretty quickly) kind of telegraphed something about to happen. something as simple as a quick command to them to hang back slightly form Fett so he can discuss things with Fennec could have closed that loop hole (or maybe show them being held up by other assassins),


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/30 15:23:48


Post by: Voss


xerxeskingofking wrote:
 Manchu wrote:
Golly.

An interesting question to be sure but somehow the opening episode posed it in a frustrating way. I could carefully sift through the structure beat by beat but my instinct is, it’s the Mos Espa action sequence. The antagonists‘ strange cattle prod/energy shield weaponry make the stakes confusing. Do they want to assassinate Boba? Capture him? Just humiliate him? The scene shows our main characters caught off guard — but why? And then the fight shows us Boba trying thing after thing, none of which really work, until he’s flat on his ass. At which point, Fennec takes over solo and there is a much more dynamic chase scene where she seems (puzzlingly? tellingly?) much more competent alone.


i can sort of understand that, given she is an assassin, not a bodyguard, and might well be at a disadvantage when she has to think in terms of protecting a charge as opposed to killing a target. once she is set loose to hunt she is much more in her element.

what puzzled me was why didnt Fett USE THE BLOODY JETPACK?!? He could easily have boosted clear with a short hop, and forced the attackers to split up or otherwise break the encirclement, but it never seems to occur to him. even if he didnt want to leave fennec alone, like i said he could have just made a short hop to escape the sheild wall and still be in the fight. I get that the narrative purpose was let the Gamoreans come in to save the day (and by extension, validate his mercy and show the merits of his methods), but it just feels a clumsy way to do it. that, and the sudden disappearance of the Gamoreans who had previously been glued to Fetts shoulders (which i noticed pretty quickly) kind of telegraphed something about to happen. something as simple as a quick command to them to hang back slightly form Fett so he can discuss things with Fennec could have closed that loop hole (or maybe show them being held up by other assassins),


The whole fight was weird, from the distant bodyguards, to Fett shooting a missile directly at the shield (which was only ever going to blowback on them), not using his flamer on their exposed legs, neither Fett nor Fennec ever drawing their guns, it was strange and one-sided. It looked, honestly, like a public beatdown of someone who didn't know the rules of the game, which is a poor starting point for someone trying to latch onto a place of power in the underworld.

I do hope the show will at least introduce the concept of why he thinks he wants or needs to be the 'new Jabba.' Because it seems like a poor fit, both for the character and for his understanding of what it entails.
I don't think anyone else in the SW underworld would have accepted a small box of coins or a ratty-looking wookie pelt as 'tribute.'


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/30 15:53:56


Post by: Manchu


TBH the idea that Boba is some kind of badass largely comes from his cool costume. In ESB itself, Boba is shown to be cautious and cunning. But he’s not shown to be an expert marksman or terrifying close quarters combatant. Moreover, his infamously poor showing in RotJ makes it clear he is much more man than myth.

By the time the EU got off the ground in the 90s, the first generation of childhood Star Wars fans were becoming writers and artists and they seemed to remember Boba more as a really cool action figure than a screen presence. I remember Boba’s various appearances in Dark Horse comics and Del Ray novels, not to mention video games. The gap between the character in the movies and the pop icon was becoming a yawning chasm. This was even more the case after the Prequels turned everything “up to 11” and we got Jango Fett.

This Book of Boba version of Boba feels much closer to the “scum” Admiral Piett contemptuously dismissed in ESB. Keep in mind, Boba had the same idea as Han to drift away with the garbage; and probably not because Boba was a genius, but for the same reason Han thought of it. Namely, they’re both practical, modestly capable survivors.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/30 18:25:41


Post by: Voss


It isn't really 'not being a badass' (though maybe I'm misremembering his fight with stormtroopers in Mando, where that seemed to be the entire and only point of a very long sequence, while the protagonist of that series was standing around like a doof), in this fight he looked, at best, barely competent.

No one who's used the weapon before is going to fire a missile at (a shielded) someone a few feet away, and whatever else he is, he was a bounty hunter for some time. That requires at least a few skills. I don't even like the character, and I think its weird that in the premiere of his own show, he spends most of it on the ground being pummeled like a small child in a universe too big and cruel for him to understand.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/30 19:00:28


Post by: Hulksmash


Honestly, the lack of dialogue (what there was was decent to good), the bad backdrops, and the plodding pace were kinda rough. The only decent to good scenes had Fennec in them.

I've got fingers crossed it improves as I'll keep watching. But my kids, who were way into The Mando, were drifting hard on this one.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/30 19:08:48


Post by: Voss


Some of the Fennec scenes were weird, too. Not the actress, but there were a couple closeup zooms on her so you could see her eyes, and the helmet looked really plastic and fake. Like a baseball batting helmet and a faceplate that looked like it was scavenged the day before and moulded into the rough shape overnight. Cheap props add to the uneven feel of the show.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/30 19:38:29


Post by: warboss


Does anyone else feel like Morrison is acting his age in the show in terms of action? Every time he moves, I feel like he should be doing an old man grunt as his moves seem weighted and slow. Obviously he is in great shape (shirtless scene proves that) but I don't think that it carries over to action scenes like the market ambush. It's him because they're having him fight helmet off so they can't easily cover it up with a stunt double either. And that's on top of the bad to nonsensical fight choreography.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/30 19:52:58


Post by: Hulksmash


 warboss wrote:
Does anyone else feel like Morrison is acting his age in the show in terms of action? Every time he moves, I feel like he should be doing an old man grunt as his moves seem weighted and slow. Obviously he is in great shape (shirtless scene proves that) but I don't think that it carries over to action scenes like the market ambush. It's him because they're having him fight helmet off so they can't easily cover it up with a stunt double either. And that's on top of the bad to nonsensical fight choreography.


Yes, he moves like an old man. And not like one that's lived a life where he's been beaten up but still game and plucky but like he's a 70 year old avoiding a fist fight with teens.

I feel like he moved better in the Mando scene we had with him. Maybe they are milking the "injured" thing. Was he hurt I. The Jabba palace take over onscreen?


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/30 20:04:00


Post by: warboss


He's still chronically injured likely from the Sarlacc pit because he has to sleep in the bacta tank apparently every night.

The "problem" (assuming others agree) would have been to simply have him put his helmet on after his lines in the street and have the stunt double do the fight scenes. I don't understand why they'd have an old man (admittedly in better shape than me!) risk doing the fight scenes and having to choreograph them as plodding and nonsensical (the point blank rocket blast against the shields).


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/30 20:06:11


Post by: Geifer


Maybe he just isn't in peak physical condition anymore after his vacation in the Sarlacc and with the Sand People. I don't mind that depiction one bit. It also serves as motivation to take over Jabba's (or Bib's) business as a retirement plan since he won't be doing so well bounty hunting anymore. Yeah, it's a bit hard reconciling that with his big showing in Mando, but come on. He beats up Stormtroopers. Big whoop. You put a nicely cushioned couch in a room full of Stormtroopers, they're going to get beat up by the couch. Real bad like.

On the narrative structure, it makes some sense in principle. At least I can see what the idea might have been.

Dream, part one: Well, this sucks. Everything is hard!
Here and now: Hey, this might actually work out. No, wait. It sucks after all. Everything is hard!
Dream, part two: Okay, still sucks. Still is hard. But I put in the work and pulled myself out of it. Go me!

There's two things missing for me. The present doesn't establish very well the overall suckage of his situation and gets lost in small time insolence and thuggery. The second one is that the show ends with winning over the Tusken, when it would be more relevant as a morale boost in the present. The latter is probably going to come through in the next episode or two. I have a feeling Book of Boba is going to be closer to the Bad Batch than Mandalorian in that it flows way, way better if watched in one go.

Overall I'm happy with it so far. More, please.

 endlesswaltz123 wrote:
I actually want a ruthless, power hungry Boba as well, not some idealist. Young Boba (clone wars) was like this.


He really wasn't. When he had his own crew and was on the job he was shown as professional, which of course comes with a measure of ruthlessness. That's bounty hunting for you. When set out to blow up Mace, though, he was strongly opposed to murdering anyone else to achieve that goal. He was as far from ruthlessness as possible.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/30 20:09:25


Post by: warboss


For those who haven't seen the scene, someone put up a clip on youtube.




Now that I'm rewatching it, I'm wondering if he's trying to coordinate the fight to a Maori haka. He seems to do one on every behind the scenes Star Wars thing I watch with him so it's obviously very important to him and I wonder if he's trying to incorporate that part of his culture. Fortunately, the attackers are obliging letting him forcefully deflect each blow (whether before or after contact) with seconds to spare before the next person tries.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
For comparison, here is a similar scene from Mando S2 with both him and a stunt double. I feel like the fight choreography with both him and the double is leagues better than the Boba one.




The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/30 22:28:44


Post by: trexmeyer


Second fight scene looks better overall, by all measures I can think of off the top of my head. A few thoughts.

-Stormtroopers are generally amongst the lowest tier of mooks in Star Wars, particularly in The Mandalorian. Only surpassed by maybe Tusken Raiders, Battle Droids, and low level mercenaries, i.e. Jabba the Hutt's mooks.

-Stormtroopers are likely not trained in melee combat at all and the their rifles aren't even a decent size or length for butt strokes or bayoneting...if they even had bayonets. My point is that their rifles are likely a hindrance in combat over fighting even empty handed.

-Boba Fett had two advantages of surprise in The Mandalorian scene. First was the sneak attack and the second was when he returned with his armor and its gadgets.

-In the first scene, Fett and Fennec are on the defensive. Fett doesn't have any useful weaponry outside of his armor which he doesn't use particularly well in close quarters. He could have use a flame-thrower at their feet for one.

-He also gets wounded in the first scene or at least zapped a bit which gets progressively worse as the fight goes on. He takes no hits versus the Stormtroopers.

-The shielded assassins were far more competent than the Stormtroopers and are at least a "tier" up for mooks. If only for melee combat.

The Book of Boba Fett scene doesn't look as good and I doubt anyone really wants to see Boba get manhandled by mooks, but it's not completely terrible. It does have some minor value for narrative purposes at least in that the Gamorrean (sp?) guards are shown to be loyal for now and that he can't afford to be soft in his Mos Espa dealings.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/30 22:47:32


Post by: BertBert


I'm not too excited about the first episode. It's nice to follow Boba's story after his escape from the sarlac pit, but this was all a bit tepid and didn't feel much like Star Wars to me. The whole ninja ambush and parcour sequence in particular felt out of place and gave off strong power rangers vibes, which is not a good thing in the context of Star Wars.

Props to the composer who adapted the cantina theme, it was recognisable but still a fresh take.




The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/30 22:59:59


Post by: Voss


 Hulksmash wrote:

I feel like he moved better in the Mando scene we had with him. Maybe they are milking the "injured" thing. Was he hurt I. The Jabba palace take over onscreen?

Nope. They just wandered in and shot a handful of people. Barely an inconvenience.


The problem with the 'chronic injuries' argument is it should have affected the Mando scenes as well (and with less recent medical care), barring woo-woo Tusken healing magics.
Mando season 2 and BoBF take place the same year in chronological order, so whatever is affecting him 'now' would have been affecting him 'then,' and as far as we know he didn't have a Bacta tank until after taking over Jabba's palace from Bib.

There is a lot we don't know about the 5 year period between RotJ and Mando/BoBF, but from what's been said, Boba and Fennec went from the Mando climax to Tattoine and straight to Jabba's palace, where they took over and had, well, this day. With maybe a couple days getting the palace in order before seeing the people who bothered coming to him.

There's a huge difference in his capabilities in what's basically a month or so (or less) later (depending on hyperspace travel times).


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/30 23:13:52


Post by: Hulksmash


Voss wrote:
 Hulksmash wrote:

I feel like he moved better in the Mando scene we had with him. Maybe they are milking the "injured" thing. Was he hurt I. The Jabba palace take over onscreen?

Nope. They just wandered in and shot a handful of people. Barely an inconvenience.


The problem with the 'chronic injuries' argument is it should have affected the Mando scenes as well (and with less recent medical care), barring woo-woo Tusken healing magics.
Mando season 2 and BoBF take place the same year in chronological order, so whatever is affecting him 'now' would have been affecting him 'then,' and as far as we know he didn't have a Bacta tank until after taking over Jabba's palace from Bib.

There is a lot we don't know about the 5 year period between RotJ and Mando/BoBF, but from what's been said, Boba and Fennec went from the Mando climax to Tattoine and straight to Jabba's palace, where they took over and had, well, this day. With maybe a couple days getting the palace in order before seeing the people who bothered coming to him.

There's a huge difference in his capabilities in what's basically a month or so (or less) later (depending on hyperspace travel times).


I dont generally agree with your take on media but that was my confusion with this as well. It just feels like they added an issue to add an issue amd we got sub par choreo on top of that. Plus the purpose of the shield dudes is super muddled since they seemed to be just hitting them with low voltage tasers.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/31 01:08:30


Post by: Voss


I admittedly wrote that off as it wasn't an assassin team but a capture team.

With the hope that there would be an explanation at some point, because really, he's a bounty hunter with an assassin friend who's trying to jump from 'asset' to 'boss' and the Star Wars underworld has a _lot_ of heavy weights who won't take kindly to that sort of thing. Most wouldn't hesitate to squash him, and he doesn't seem to have any sort of backers who would care if they did.

Which is probably my biggest issue with what's been presented so far. He's trying to muscle into controlling Hutt territory as an independent with no backing. That's... laughable. The Hutts made both the Empire and the Republic (for thousands of years) quietly look away and find something more productive to do.

---
The alternative to capture is 'something something magic mandalorian metal, so don't bother with assassination by blaster,' but that line of thinking annoys me.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/31 01:40:51


Post by: beast_gts


He could have had a Bacta tank in Slave 1, or wearing his armour again is putting an increased strain on him.

I wonder where Slave 1 was while he was with the Tuskens - does Jabba's palace have parking?


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/31 01:42:58


Post by: Lance845


beast_gts wrote:
He could have had a Bacta tank in Slave 1, or wearing his armour again is putting an increased strain on him.

I wonder where Slave 1 was while he was with the Tuskens - does Jabba's palace have parking?


He says it's in hammerhead. "We get there and we can get off world."


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/31 03:24:55


Post by: warboss


Voss wrote:

The problem with the 'chronic injuries' argument is it should have affected the Mando scenes as well (and with less recent medical care), barring woo-woo Tusken healing magics.
Mando season 2 and BoBF take place the same year in chronological order, so whatever is affecting him 'now' would have been affecting him 'then,' and as far as we know he didn't have a Bacta tank until after taking over Jabba's palace from Bib.

There is a lot we don't know about the 5 year period between RotJ and Mando/BoBF, but from what's been said, Boba and Fennec went from the Mando climax to Tattoine and straight to Jabba's palace, where they took over and had, well, this day. With maybe a couple days getting the palace in order before seeing the people who bothered coming to him.

There's a huge difference in his capabilities in what's basically a month or so (or less) later (depending on hyperspace travel times).


That's a good point and disintegrates a pretty big hole in that chronic unhealed injury theory. Obviously it was just an in universe attempt to explain the more practical change of fight choreography/actors but still...


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/31 04:17:45


Post by: Manchu


Just something to note, Boba Chap 1 and Mando Chap 14 that warboss linked above were both directed by Robert Rodriguez. Mando Chap 14 is IMO the worst in the entire show and a lot of it is due to the eye-rolling, boring action sequences.

Something that’s been nagging at me: why was there a Storm Trooper with Boba in the Sarlaac Pit?


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/31 04:36:11


Post by: Voss


 Manchu wrote:
Just something to note, Boba Chap 1 and Mando Chap 14 that warboss linked above were both directed by Robert Rodriguez. Mando Chap 14 is IMO the worst in the entire show and a lot of it is due to the eye-rolling, boring action sequences.

Something that’s been nagging at me: why was there a Storm Trooper with Boba in the Sarlaac Pit?


So he could have a breathing tube or... whatever that was... for a single lungful of air as dug his way out the hard way through tons of sand. Honestly, the Sarlaac spitting him out because of the armor would have been easier to swallow than that sequence. Big creatures reacting poorly to what they've swallowed at least has a history in SW.

But yeah, the Stormtrooper is weird. If Jabba had some sort of problem with a stormtrooper, he would have had him quietly murdered or blackmailed/paid off an officer to deal with the problem. He wouldn't have put on the big circus of execution that he did for Luke and friends.

I guess one could have wandered across it and fell in (presumably during the search for R2 and 3PO), but that seems absurdly unlikely. And even less likely that the oxygen tank (that I guess stormtrooper armor has now) would've been intact after a couple years in the Sarlaac. There's little other reason for stormtroopers to be on planet, and almost no reason for them to be outside the big settlements that have space ports.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/31 07:55:27


Post by: chromedog


 warboss wrote:
 Manchu wrote:
I loved the centaur lizard. It was a merry allusion to Harryhausen and reminded me of the Rancor effects.


Yeah, I got the feeling that it was done on purpose to look like the classic stop motion at times. I dont think it was a happy accident as substandard or rushed cgi has its own issues that look different. That was competently done to look like classic effects (faults and all) similar to how they built a physical ship model for the Mando Razor Crest both to use for in camera shots and to guide the cgi. Then there is the Imperial capital ship that was purposefully made in 3d to look like a hand built kitbash. I think this is the next incarnation of that effort but, unlike the other two.cases, I don't feel it was the best choice.


Gideon's cruiser was an ACTUAL model, not just a 3d model that looked like a kitbash. There is footage of the crew setting up the motion control camera shots for the compositing. It's in the BTS features.
And Phil Tippet's crew did the stop-motion scrap walkers from a previous mando series, too. With actual models. So stop motion fx work is and always has been a thing for the SW movies/shows.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/31 09:53:20


Post by: Dysartes


 chromedog wrote:
Gideon's cruiser was an ACTUAL model, not just a 3d model that looked like a kitbash. There is footage of the crew setting up the motion control camera shots for the compositing. It's in the BTS features.
And Phil Tippet's crew did the stop-motion scrap walkers from a previous mando series, too. With actual models. So stop motion fx work is and always has been a thing for the SW movies/shows.

That's cool to hear, chromedog - always like to see practical effects, as well as CGI, where appropriate.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/31 10:39:31


Post by: chromedog


John Knoll built the motion-control rig for mando in his garage.

When he showed off the first "sizzle reel" to lucasfilm, they wanted him to do something NOBODY had ever done with a MC shot before. A front-on POV shot that swings around in an arc to side view and then aft, while the ship itself "waggled" - so he had to build the custom 3-axis gimbal to go with it.

The same rig was used in the filming of S2 of mando.
Which was also when they switched from using a stock commercially available render engine for the volume to a proprietary one that they wrote themselves (which John Knoll also had a hand in - since he and his brother wrote photoshop back in the day, and he'd done a bit of coding for several editdroid iterations.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/31 12:04:37


Post by: DaveC


beast_gts wrote:
He could have had a Bacta tank in Slave 1, or wearing his armour again is putting an increased strain on him.

I wonder where Slave 1 was while he was with the Tuskens - does Jabba's palace have parking?


Jabba's palace has a hangar underneath, you can see the hangar door in some of the trailers so presumably Slave 1 was parked up there for the duration. Hopefully they validate parking or that will be an expensive bill

https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Jabba%27s_Palace/Legends


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/31 12:07:41


Post by: Mad Doc Grotsnik


There’s also a possibility he’s not a perfect Clone after all, which could tie into later plot lines as he seeks a permanent fix for organ degradation etc.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/31 12:11:32


Post by: DaveC


 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
There’s also a possibility he’s not a perfect Clone after all, which could tie into later plot lines as he seeks a permanent fix for organ degradation etc.


and Omega could tie into that but she's unlikely to appear in live action until they've finished up the Bad Batch story - assuming she's still alive


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/31 12:38:35


Post by: Mad Doc Grotsnik


It’s also possible he’s still just healing from the Sarlacc.

Sure his skin looks great, but given Bacta is a liquid, one suspects it works from the outside in. So any organ damage (and we saw there wasn’t much fresh air in there, hence the breathing tube, so his lungs might be knacked) could take longer.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/31 13:38:32


Post by: warboss


 chromedog wrote:


Gideon's cruiser was an ACTUAL model, not just a 3d model that looked like a kitbash. There is footage of the crew setting up the motion control camera shots for the compositing. It's in the BTS features.


Glad to hear they built the physical model for Gideon's ship as well.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/31 14:21:37


Post by: trexmeyer


 Manchu wrote:
Just something to note, Boba Chap 1 and Mando Chap 14 that warboss linked above were both directed by Robert Rodriguez. Mando Chap 14 is IMO the worst in the entire show and a lot of it is due to the eye-rolling, boring action sequences.

Something that’s been nagging at me: why was there a Storm Trooper with Boba in the Sarlaac Pit?


He was looking for droids and fell.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2021/12/31 21:39:16


Post by: ProtoClone


 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
It’s also possible he’s still just healing from the Sarlacc.

Sure his skin looks great, but given Bacta is a liquid, one suspects it works from the outside in. So any organ damage (and we saw there wasn’t much fresh air in there, hence the breathing tube, so his lungs might be knacked) could take longer.


This is my thought as well.

The sarlacc digestive juices are meant to dissolve a person for years, thousands if I'm right. So that might also mean the juices have a means of preserving the life of the victim at the same time as they digest them.
He was in the pit for a while and he obviously was exposed to enough of the digestive juices for it pit his skin and turn it grey. My thought is the juices worked their way into Fett much deeper than we saw and are causing nerve and muscle damage forcing him to rely on the bacta tank to stem their effect.





The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/01 20:34:30


Post by: endlesswaltz123


That Stormtrooper could have been there for a longgggg time


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/02 00:34:59


Post by: nels1031


I thought it was decent, though I think the pig dudes should’ve had more clothing.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/02 04:36:29


Post by: hotsauceman1


 nels1031 wrote:
I thought it was decent, though I think the pig dudes should’ve had more clothing.

Now see here i was thinking they needed less.
Oink Oink.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/02 04:44:29


Post by: trexmeyer


 nels1031 wrote:
I thought it was decent, though I think the pig dudes should’ve had more clothing.


Their heads were much better than the RotJ ones, but they looked cheaper by being semi-nude.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/02 06:23:14


Post by: Manchu


that’s a fair take trexi

EDIT: I’m kinda torn about whether it’s a bad thing, I wonder if the producers are going for less bleak, gritty look


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/02 08:48:27


Post by: Geifer


I think the new live action Gamorreans are a good bit less corpulent than we've come to expect from Return of the Jedi.

Skipping bulking up the bodies makes them look more like real life wrestlers with a mask than aliens.

I'm generally down for the look of the Mandalorian and Book of Boba. There's some great stuff there, visually. But the (more or less) background aliens aren't always that well done. Lekku are another area where the costumes are lacking, generally being too rigid. For contrast Boba's Rodian pal seemed fine.

I think it may be a case of so many things being well done that the instances where that's not the case stand out. It's not just aliens either. I had my doubts about the beaten Stormtrooper armor look in Mandalorian. It didn't look properly weathered to me. Too artificial.

Back to Gamorreans, I thought their outfits looked fine in principle. They don't need to be covered up more in universe. Real life, more coverage would make it easier to bulk them up without having to worry about making the organic parts look good.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/02 15:37:00


Post by: trexmeyer


 Geifer wrote:
I think the new live action Gamorreans are a good bit less corpulent than we've come to expect from Return of the Jedi.


You're right! They are a lot smaller. They're also greener. On a strictly technical level TBBF's aliens are better than the OT...I'd say the designs are generally better as well. The camera angles and specific cameras they're using are making it look...worse? I definitely think lighting and shooting angles aren't helping things.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/03 14:57:43


Post by: LunarSol


Pretty meh on this one to be honest. I'm not the biggest Boba fan though. It didn't overstay its welcome though, just kind of bland. Curious to see where it goes.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/04 11:16:57


Post by: Ahtman


Voss wrote:
The whole fight was weird, from the distant bodyguards, to Fett shooting a missile directly at the shield (which was only ever going to blowback on them), not using his flamer on their exposed legs, neither Fett nor Fennec ever drawing their guns


To add insult to injury the concept art at the end credits shows the two with their guns drawn in that scene, which obliviously never happened in the episode.

I too thought it was odd that there was a Storm Trooper in the Sarlacc. Just random Storm Troopers lying around the galaxy in a helpful way is kind of nice, I suppose.

I didn't hate it but it definitely feels like they are not going to be as brutal as the story of a Crime Lord rising would need to be. I think in the end The Mandolarian will have been more violent than this and that the amoral bounty hunter is gonna pull a lot of punches in an attempt to make him something of an anti-hero.

Yes I am late I just go to see it last night.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/04 12:18:34


Post by: Voss


trexmeyer wrote:
 Geifer wrote:
I think the new live action Gamorreans are a good bit less corpulent than we've come to expect from Return of the Jedi.


You're right! They are a lot smaller. They're also greener. On a strictly technical level TBBF's aliens are better than the OT...I'd say the designs are generally better as well. The camera angles and specific cameras they're using are making it look...worse? I definitely think lighting and shooting angles aren't helping things.


Lighting makes the biggest difference. It's worth remembering that almost all scenes with alien costumes in the OT were shot in dim rooms. The skiffs were basically the only exception, and the Weequays (?) basically look like guys in bandanas and a bit of face putty. And there are a surprising amount of distance shots there to make up for it.

Its the traditional big cheat of creature scenes,show it but obscure, so the audience tricks itself


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/04 12:24:17


Post by: Manchu


I thought the mayor’s aid looked a lot worse than the Gamorreans.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/04 12:25:47


Post by: Mad Doc Grotsnik


Typically, I’m schedule for a phone shift at 8am tomorrow.

Still intend to stick it on as soon as it’s available, and hope the phone shift is quiet.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/04 14:30:44


Post by: Manchu


Yeah, gonna rewatch Ch. 1 right before Ch. 2. I think it will feel more satisfying that way.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/04 14:42:44


Post by: LunarSol


 Ahtman wrote:
I think in the end The Mandolarian will have been more violent than this and that the amoral bounty hunter is gonna pull a lot of punches in an attempt to make him something of an anti-hero.


I'm going to rule by respect rather than fear.

Okay Mr. "No Disintegrations"


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/04 14:47:15


Post by: AduroT


 LunarSol wrote:
 Ahtman wrote:
I think in the end The Mandolarian will have been more violent than this and that the amoral bounty hunter is gonna pull a lot of punches in an attempt to make him something of an anti-hero.


I'm going to rule by respect rather than fear.

Okay Mr. "No Disintegrations"


That was One Time! You people just won’t let that go!


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/04 15:09:15


Post by: Mad Doc Grotsnik


 LunarSol wrote:
 Ahtman wrote:
I think in the end The Mandolarian will have been more violent than this and that the amoral bounty hunter is gonna pull a lot of punches in an attempt to make him something of an anti-hero.


I'm going to rule by respect rather than fear.

Okay Mr. "No Disintegrations"


Well, he’s had a bit of a journey since then and seems to be embarking upon a new career.

Will “respect not fear” last? Who knows! I suspect it may come to a mix. So long as you respect him as Big Boss, and pay your dues? You won’t be subject to the whims Jabba and indeed Hutts are said to be noted for. But, that comes from a fear that if you try to shaft Boba, you’re dead.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/04 17:02:44


Post by: Manchu


You guys aren’t buying this whole “I don’t know what I’m doing” con Boba is pulling, do you?

I think he is acting naive to draw out his enemies and get them to underestimate him.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/04 17:08:59


Post by: warboss


Or maybe the show writers are playing 4d Dejarik instead!


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/04 17:14:36


Post by: Mad Doc Grotsnik


 Manchu wrote:
You guys aren’t buying this whole “I don’t know what I’m doing” con Boba is pulling, do you?

I think he is acting naive to draw out his enemies and get them to underestimate him.


Not sure anyone has suggested that

We’re given the impression he’s still not to be effed with. And we know he’s at least feigned injury after some relatively, as his line of work used to be, light combat.

That could all be for show. A way for an ultimately nascent crime boss to draw out those who might be problematic nice and early.

All speculation from me though.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/04 17:22:54


Post by: Voss


 Manchu wrote:
You guys aren’t buying this whole “I don’t know what I’m doing” con Boba is pulling, do you?

I think he is acting naive to draw out his enemies and get them to underestimate him.


If its a con, it seems weird that its directly almost entirely at Fennec (and the audience)


The injury certainly isn't feigned, as the orcs had to pull him off the street and drag him to the bacta tank.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/04 18:09:56


Post by: Ahtman


 Manchu wrote:
You guys aren’t buying this whole “I don’t know what I’m doing” con Boba is pulling, do you?

I think he is acting naive to draw out his enemies and get them to underestimate him.


Not about him specifically but the show in general. It should be an R affair but could get by as a PG-13 but in the end they will go PG to ensure it is a softer, family friendly organized crime story.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/04 18:33:05


Post by: Mad Doc Grotsnik


He…he blew someone up in the first episode. Fennec hoofed someone off a roof in the first episode. We saw a decapitated beasties’ bonce, and whilst not graphically, exactly how it happened to be careless enough to lose its bonce in the first episode.

None of it graphic, but all of far from implied violence.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/04 18:36:07


Post by: Geifer


 Ahtman wrote:
 Manchu wrote:
You guys aren’t buying this whole “I don’t know what I’m doing” con Boba is pulling, do you?

I think he is acting naive to draw out his enemies and get them to underestimate him.


Not about him specifically but the show in general. It should be an R affair but could get by as a PG-13 but in the end they will go PG to ensure it is a softer, family friendly organized crime story.


I'm not all that familiar with the criteria for the American rating system. According to IMDB the original and prequel trilogies are rated PG. You know, the ones with torture and slavery, terrorists happily murdering private and state security, the mining accident on Alderaan, the little oopsy with the younglings at the Jedi temple. Seems to me that themes that are hinted at or executed without excessive violence or swearing don't appear to warrant much of an age rating. Without blood, boobs or drugs Star Wars seems to have been considered family friendly from the beginning.

What makes you think an R rating would be warranted when historical precedent suggests Star Wars media can get away with stuff just fine by telling you all about it but not showing it graphically?


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/04 19:35:48


Post by: trexmeyer


In the early 1980s, complaints about violence and gore in films such as Indiana Jones and the Temple of Doom and Gremlins, both of which received PG ratings, refocused attention on films seen by small children and pre-teens.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motion_Picture_Association_film_rating_system#From_M_to_GP_to_PG

This led to the addition of the PG-13 rating which would not have been in play for ANH or ESB. ASFAIK ANH is the only one to feature blood and ESB did feature amputation, but ROTJ had neither of those. ROTS was the most graphic of all, most notably for the final duel between Anakin and Obi-Wan. It received a PG-13 rating.



The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/04 20:20:59


Post by: Ahtman


 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
None of it graphic, but all of far from implied violence.


Thus the PG and not PG-13; it is holding back. Mal kicking a guy into an engine in Firefly was more visceral than this milquetoast violence and that was network tv.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/04 20:25:33


Post by: Mad Doc Grotsnik


And your point is?

I’m genuinely sorry to be rude. But this a Disney production. Not a Troma Studios production.

It’s mass market. Which means the initial violence can be blatant, the end result is always off screen.

What exactly is it that you were expecting? Boba Fisting?


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/04 21:05:01


Post by: Geifer


As an aside it would be pretty amazing to see a Troma Star Wars but with the production values a Disney budget would afford.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/04 23:53:51


Post by: Manchu


 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
What exactly is it that you were expecting? Boba Fisting?


I think the point is only this, that the pop culture iconography of Boba Fett suggests that he is a cold-blooded killer and a show about him thugging out in the seediest part of the SW galaxy seems like it could be pretty hardcore.

But of course you’re right, this is Disney+, not HBO, and the audience is not tuning in to see bare asses, incestuous romance, steaming viscera, and live flayings. In all these years since RotS, people are still clutching pearls about Anakin murdering children. I think it’s safe to say that no one really wants to see Star Wars in the key of Game of Thrones.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/04 23:58:20


Post by: LordofHats


...

I'd watch Star Wars in the key of Game of Thrones. I'm the guy who proposed Star Wars the West Wing because I'd totally watch a show about the humdrum lives of people working in the galactic senate and how they deal with issues big small and stupid.

Just saying XD You know. As long as it's season 1-4 Gome of Thrones. The ones that weren't slowly cascading toward awfulness. Season 8 is right out.

Disney is underestimating if it thinks there isn't a market for Star Wars: Scarface sort of content. Whether they bother to make it is another matter, but I'm not sure the audience is the one pearl clutching about whether or not Star Wars can have dark content. Star Wars has had dark content (that it didn't bother trying to lighten up that is) for decades, just not on screen.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/05 00:07:01


Post by: Lance845


I don't think anyone is clutching pearls. It's just the drastic change in Vaders character.

While Vader is present, it's Grand Moff Tarkin who blows up Alderon. He's complicit but he is not the hand that did the deed.

The end of RotJ is Vaders redemption just by turning on his master. He gets to be a force ghost and everything.

Then we see TPM and the 10 yr old kid he was. The annoying apprentice he is in TCW. And then the sudden jump to personally murdering a room full of children. We knew vader had a hand in hunting down the remaining Jedi. We assumed that meant trained adults who could at least attempt to defend themselves. The kids is something else entirely that was never even alluded to.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/05 00:30:36


Post by: Manchu


People absolutely clutch pearls about Anakin and, Lance, your post is an excellent example. “He was never that evil” is silly (it has always been understood that he is indeed that evil) and really just amounts to “we didn’t need it spelled out that explicitly.” Which is the larger point. By and large, people do not want to see this kind of stuff in Star Wars, whether it’s mutilated bodies or even off-screen child murder. They certainly object to it on behalf of their own kids but, edgelords aside, they also don’t want it for themselves. Sorry, LoH, but as a dude who also wants SW CSPAN, you’re a corner case.


 Lance845 wrote:
The end of RotJ is Vaders redemption just by turning on his master.
disappointedyoda.gif

Sith turn on their masters as a matter of course. That’s not what happened in RotJ. Vader did not betray Palpatine. Anakin saved Luke. This was possible because, as Luke saw, there was still good in him — which is not to say that Anakin was suddenly free from all the evil and twisted things he had done for decades; just that there was more than just evil and that, however little the spark, it could be enough. Anakin joining Yoda and Obi-Wan as force ghosts isn’t a declaration that all three are purged of their failings; just an acknowledgement that the bad things cannot hold the good back from going forward.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/05 00:42:19


Post by: Lance845


See I disagree because the disconnect isn't in how evil he is but in how evil he is shown to be coupled with his redemption. The redemption in the OT with the actions we saw in the OT is a fair trade. We see the arch play out and at the end it's satisfying that Vader is now good and becomes a Force Ghost and joins Jedi Heaven or whatever.

The prequels throw the balance of the equation out of whack. And THAT is what people have a disconnect about. The redemptive act no longer balances the book with the actions we have seen.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/05 00:47:19


Post by: Manchu


I think you have just missed the point of RotJ. Its moral vision isn’t about paying off a debt; rather, it is about a radical and totally gratuitous love that cannot be merited. Luke loves his father, regardless of his father’s unforgivable sins, and refuses to kill him. This, rather than any philosophical abstractions, is what gets through to Anakin at last. The PT shows us that Anakin fell trying to save someone he loved; this corresponds to the OT showing us that Vader is redeemed by someone who loves him trying to save him.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/05 01:27:46


Post by: trexmeyer


I know this is going to sound edgy...but that's not my intention.

How is Anakin killing children worse than Anakin killing civilians of any age, gender, species, etc? I understand that were biologically programmed to protect children as part of basic animal need to propagate and that most cultures condition their people to protect women and children so Lucas likely knew it would induce a visceral reaction (well, I think he that, but he's an odd one) and included it for that reason. The scene was the moral equivalent of a jump scare.

There's no fair trade with the redemption. Maybe Lucas intended for Luke to have Messianic undertones. As Manchu said, he loved his father unconditionally. That's how great, for lack of a better word, Luke was and it moved Anakin enough to save his son, cast down The Emperor, and, I assume, lead to the eventual destruction of The Empire. I'm basing that on the SE scenes that were later tacked on. I don't know if that warrants Anakin getting pseudo-immortality as a Force Ghost, but...that's really not my place to decide. I think it works within a certain context beyond the limitations of human morality.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/05 01:43:31


Post by: Lance845


 Manchu wrote:
I think you have just missed the point of RotJ. Its moral vision isn’t about paying off a debt; rather, it is about a radical and totally gratuitous love that cannot be merited. Luke loves his father, regardless of his father’s unforgivable sins, and refuses to kill him. This, rather than any philosophical abstractions, is what gets through to Anakin at last. The PT shows us that Anakin fell trying to save someone he loved; this corresponds to the OT showing us that Vader is redeemed by someone who loves him trying to save him.


I didn't miss that point. What I am saying is that people get hung up on the killing of the kids for the reasons that I stated. It's not the killing the kids that has people "clutching the pearls". It's the scenes in RotJ in the context of killing the kids where people are like... "wtf..."

Case in point I have never seen any exchange about the kid killing that was longer than a single comment that didn't then add in getting to go to jedi heaven because he chucked the Emperor down a shaft. The 2 are linked in peoples minds. And thats where the problem comes from.

I am not saying this is how I feel. I am saying this is the trend I see. Ultimately killing some kids is less of a problem then blowing up a planet. Doesn't matter. Vader did the kid killing with his own hands and he got off easy as far anyone can see.

People are not sensitive about the singular act of kid killing. It's the whole thing.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/05 01:52:44


Post by: trexmeyer


Well, he's dead and remembered in-universe as a villain and murderer.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/05 01:54:32


Post by: Voss


 Manchu wrote:
I think you have just missed the point of RotJ. Its moral vision isn’t about paying off a debt; rather, it is about a radical and totally gratuitous love that cannot be merited. Luke loves his father, regardless of his father’s unforgivable sins, and refuses to kill him. This, rather than any philosophical abstractions, is what gets through to Anakin at last. The PT shows us that Anakin fell trying to save someone he loved; this corresponds to the OT showing us that Vader is redeemed by someone who loves him trying to save him.


That sounds more about Luke than Vader. In fact, explains that way, it sounds even more like paying off a moral debt, except the person with the debt doesn't have to do much of anything other than 'be loved.' Squeeze out a few kids for cheap and easy 'redemption' later in life. Don't even have to raise or care about the little rugrats at all.

As far as philosophical abstractions go (and the idea of redemption is very much a philosophical abstraction), its pretty horrifying.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/05 03:33:41


Post by: Manchu


trexmeyer wrote:
The scene was the moral equivalent of a jump scare.
That is extremely well said and a very interesting concept that will have me mulling over it for a long time, no doubt.
trexmeyer wrote:
I don't know if that warrants Anakin getting pseudo-immortality as a Force Ghost, but...that's really not my place to decide. I think it works within a certain context beyond the limitations of human morality.
The force ghost thing is quite ambiguous IMO. It doesn’t seem to be quite the same as eternal salvation. Note that Obi-Wan as a force ghost retains a limited perspective and is touched by guilt, shame, fear, and the same limited moral imagination that burdened him before his physical demise. This is hardly a transcendent existence on the far side of moral conflict. I think Anakin’s appearance as a force ghost ultimately has more to do with the ambiguity of the plural/singular form of “Jedi” — the eponymous “Return of the Jedi” is not only about the prospective rebirth of the organization via Luke but also and more particularly there is a literal Jedi who returned, i.e., Anakin.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/05 03:45:40


Post by: Lance845


But again, Anakin returns to the Jedi fold for almost nothing. Luke saves him. He doesn't save himself. He does almost nothing.

To equate it to the Buddhist traditions it's philosophy is based on. Someone else can show you the path to enlightenment but they cannot walk that path for you. Anakin falls because of his attachments and ultimately betrays his dark master because of his attachments. He never actually follows any of the light side code. Luke nails it though. Even at risk to himself. Even when, if he has to be killed, his sister is next. He refuses to take anothers life in anger. Luke goes straight up Buddihism and Anakin falls into the same old rut, even if in the end it's for better people.

Why the feth does he get to be a ghost with Obi and Yoda?


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/05 03:49:33


Post by: Manchu


Voss wrote:
(and the idea of redemption is very much a philosophical abstraction)
In the sense of salvation, I’d agree. But what we see in RotJ is much more immediate — Luke feels the redeeming character of his father still surviving, somehow, within the twisted and evil cyborg war criminal. The loving son is able to see that despite everything. And it is to the loving father that the son cries out to for help. In this simple, intuitive relationship, Anakin breaks out of his imprisonment within evil for a moment to do a good act, to rescue his son from death. This ought to be a very low threshold for morality (at the very least, parents owe their children care and protection) but it requires a near revolution within Vader’s heart, diseased as it has become by a lifetime of evil. Anakin is not saved by his own action; he does not in any way earn his redemption. No, it is given to him, freely, by his son. It is not all that Anakin would require, had he survived. He would need to make amends with Leia and with a million others; probably nothing could ever “pay back” all his evil deeds. That is why his redemption cannot really be merited, it has to be given to him like a gift, not like a payment or an award; it is something he does not and cannot deserve. It isn’t about intellectual abstractions, it’s about instinct and emotion.

That is the level of moral reality in Star Wars, something the prequels mostly miss — perhaps intentionally, to some extent, to point out how out of touch the Jedi Order had become by the end of the Republic. It is captured pretty well, however, by the Mandalorian. Din’s immediate connection with Grogu is not about high-minded ideals. He just immediately relates to a fellow foundling. I think Book of Boba Fett is trending in this direction, too, with Boba seeming to have an intuitive grasp on what is right. Now, whether he is actually committed to what’s right or simply leveraging the appearance of a good character for the sake of power remains to be seen.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/05 05:42:10


Post by: Ahtman


 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
And your point is?

I’m genuinely sorry to be rude. But this a Disney production. Not a Troma Studios production.

It’s mass market. Which means the initial violence can be blatant, the end result is always off screen.

What exactly is it that you were expecting? Boba Fisting?


You're getting to caught up in what is, at best, just meant as an illustrative point and not a literal call for those ratings. No where did I say it had to be a blood bath or a slasher movie, and there are many films in the R rating that have little to no gore but it is about the nature of the story and the people involved. Even then I explicitly stated that it wouldn't be that level anyway but that the problem is that they went to far down to where it is practically toothless and difficult to really feel invested in a story. It should be closer to the Logan Wolverine but we know that would be to much for Disney but instead of toning it down a bit they have gone closer to Super Hero Squad Wolverine.

Now mind you this is just the first episode so it might improve a bit but since it is the only one out it is the only one we can discuss.

Also to be fair to Disney making very adult things for kids isn't new or just something they have done. Wolverine, Punisher, Robocop, Rambo, Aliens, and Predator all have had toys aimed at them.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/05 05:52:35


Post by: Voss


 Manchu wrote:
Voss wrote:
(and the idea of redemption is very much a philosophical abstraction)
In the sense of salvation, I’d agree. But what we see in RotJ is much more immediate — Luke feels the redeeming character of his father still surviving, somehow, within the twisted and evil cyborg war criminal. The loving son is able to see that despite everything. And it is to the loving father that the son cries out to for help. In this simple, intuitive relationship, Anakin breaks out of his imprisonment within evil for a moment to do a good act, to rescue his son from death. This ought to be a very low threshold for morality (at the very least, parents owe their children care and protection) but it requires a near revolution within Vader’s heart, diseased as it has become by a lifetime of evil. Anakin is not saved by his own action; he does not in any way earn his redemption. No, it is given to him, freely, by his son. It is not all that Anakin would require, had he survived. He would need to make amends with Leia and with a million others; probably nothing could ever “pay back” all his evil deeds. That is why his redemption cannot really be merited, it has to be given to him like a gift, not like a payment or an award; it is something he does not and cannot deserve. It isn’t about intellectual abstractions, it’s about instinct and emotion.

Yeah... I don't see that as redemptive in any sense. Luke is offering his own personal forgiveness (though ultimately, he has to beg for Vader to get out of his navel-gazing), not redemption. Seeing a stranger being brutally tortured should motivate anyone into knocking the torturer off a convenient cliff, let alone if the 'stranger' is actually the observer's own child. The whole 'still good in you' rings very hollow to me, as he was still following orders and (as far as he knew) dooming Luke to his own fate every step of the way. That he did the very bare minimum AND got to escape any consequences of his actions was an unexpected bonus. Death, for Vader, was a mercy and a release, but it had squat to do with justice or redemption. If we're going to go for practical redemption with no abstractions, its got to be about restorative justice, which Vader never bothers with. He got to kill his abuser and seeing his own fate imposed on his son (in rather heavy-handed flashes) was a motivator, but its mostly about revenge (something reinforced by the original film title).


The force ghosts are interesting, just that for all anyone knows, they're completely in Luke's head- his own personal concept that his mentors and father figures would be proud of him. It's effectively a reward for his own deeds (and achieving his own 'knighthood') when even his mentors thought he should go in and just kill in that confrontation.

---
For Boba... eh. Its too early to say, but it feels really off. What we see of him is a pretty casual killer (in Mando), and someone who has to be warned by Vader not to disintegrate his targets. He was sometimes principled as a younger man, but he seemed to have a fairly welcome relationship with the notorious gangster Jabba the Hutt. It wasn't a quick drop off and leave, he hung around the palace in a way that spoke of familiarity and indifference to the kind of crap that goes on there.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/05 06:03:50


Post by: Ahtman


don't think it was redemption in some legalistic sense but more that his soul was redeemed. If he hadn't died I'm sure their would have been consequences to face.


As for "Seeing a stranger being brutally tortured should motivate anyone into knocking the torturer off a convenient cliff" you are referring to a guy who turned on his friends and literally killed a room full of children.

Admittedly he probably shouldn't have gotten to be a force ghost. That certainly felt unearned.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/05 06:40:24


Post by: Azreal13


AFAIK Force Ghostism isnt a reward, it's just a learned technique that allows a Jedi to keep his consciousness coherent rather than becoming one with the force, so while there's no obvious way Anakin learned it (Qui Gon taught Yoda and Obi Wan, and presumably one or all of them taught Luke) it isn't a commentary on his worthiness.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/05 07:14:41


Post by: Manchu


Being a force ghost is totally mysterious.

It isn’t a delusion. Yoda can hear Obi-Wan as a force ghost as clearly as Luke.

It’s definitely not heaven. As noted above, Obi-Wan as a ghost is worried and guilty, just as he was while physically alive.

It certainly is not a reward. Anakin does not meaningfully earn it; also Yoda and Obi-Wan have their own guilty consciences.

It isn’t a Jedi technique. Despite what Yoda implies in RotS. Anakin has no time to learn it existed much less learn how to do it.

It may not be limited to Jedi. Han Solo may have manifested as one in RoS, but who really knows.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/05 07:18:26


Post by: Ahtman


 Azreal13 wrote:
AFAIK Force Ghostism isnt a reward, it's just a learned technique that allows a Jedi to keep his consciousness coherent rather than becoming one with the force, so while there's no obvious way Anakin learned it (Qui Gon taught Yoda and Obi Wan, and presumably one or all of them taught Luke) it isn't a commentary on his worthiness.


I believe that is correct but it doesn't change that there isn't any explanation of how Vader learned it or that it just felt a bit cheap having him be there with the other ghosts. Being pulled away from the dark side at the end was a good enough story beat but to then just say screw it and let him be a force ghost out of left field seems undeserved from a narrative point of view.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/05 07:29:35


Post by: Manchu


Best I can figure is, people and events can make impressions in the energy field of the Force. Maybe some learn to do this. Maybe it just happens at other times. In the old EU, Marka Ragnos and Exar Kun were darksiders who persisted after death as spirits. Furthermore, Palpatine devised a way to transfer his spirit between bodies. Also, certain areas (like the cave near Yoda’s home on Dagobah) were said to be particularly “thick” with the Force. And of course there is the whole idea that Anakin himself was a “vergence” in the Force.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/05 07:51:56


Post by: Mad Doc Grotsnik


Chapter 2 is up a few minutes early!

I’m strapped in and ready to go.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Well, I suspect this might be another divisive episode, but I bloody loved it!

Spoiler:
Action scenes were pretty cool, and it’s clear that Mr Morrison’s Māori heritage is a significant influence. Particularly enjoyed seeing his Gaffi stick being made.

Nose Lizard was an odd choice, but I do wonder if there’s some kind of cultural reference going over my head. The vision quest scenes were otherwise really rather fun.

Bit of a treat for Clone Wars fans seeing Pikes without their helmets. And a proper iceberg moment with Camie and Fixer, who you may know from ANH deleted scenes set at the Tosche Station.

Big old scary Wookiee wasn’t named in the credits, so I’m not sure if it’s meant to be the same naughty boy from Dr Aphra? Just Googled, and it is indeed Black Krrsantan. So that’s another little treat for long time fans,

I would like more stuff set in the present, but we’ve five more episodes to go, so hopefully plenty of time.

Hutts were kind of cool, but they’ve still never topped Jaba’s physical puppet from ROTJ


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/05 13:18:48


Post by: AduroT


 BertBert wrote:
I Props to the composer who adapted the cantina theme, it was recognisable but still a fresh take.


We can always use more fresh cantina goo songs.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Man, they go Hard on the white savior and noble savage tropes in this one. All we need is for Fett to marry the chiefs daughter.

Also, was that Black Krrsantan or just a generic Wookie we think? Like it’s gotta be Krrsantan.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/05 15:28:05


Post by: trexmeyer


The Wookie looks good. The Hutt litter is painfully stupid. In a universe of robots, Wookies, Gamorreans, hover technology, etc, you decide to have at least 2 tons of Hutt lard carried by 16~ skinny guys on a litter that is warping under their weight? C'mon now.

The train looting scene is straight out of Lawrence of Arabia.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/05 15:35:07


Post by: AduroT


I imagine it’s intended to be impractical as a sign of power. An extreme show of dominance, like the dumb living furniture stuff that shows up occasionally.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/05 15:38:21


Post by: Aash


 AduroT wrote:
 BertBert wrote:
I Props to the composer who adapted the cantina theme, it was recognisable but still a fresh take.


We can always use more fresh cantina goo songs.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Man, they go Hard on the white savior and noble savage tropes in this one. All we need is for Fett to marry the chiefs daughter.

Also, was that Black Krrsantan or just a generic Wookie we think? Like it’s gotta be Krrsantan.


White saviour seems an odd accusation considering Temuera Morrison isn’t white.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/05 15:44:27


Post by: trexmeyer


Yes, but this episode is heavily inspired by The Last Samurai, Dances with Wolves, Lawrence of Arabia, and who knows what else.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/05 15:52:59


Post by: ListenToMeWarriors


I am here for a Boba Fett: Disappointed Driving Instructor spin off.

Really enjoyed the episode.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/05 17:08:10


Post by: H.B.M.C.


Hey! They went to town with weapons this time. Smart.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/05 17:37:28


Post by: Voss


ListenToMeWarriors wrote:
I am here for a Boba Fett: Disappointed Driving Instructor spin off.


Having subtitles on was really great for that sequence.
"Exciting music plays"

trexmeyer wrote:
Yes, but this episode is heavily inspired by The Last Samurai, Dances with Wolves, Lawrence of Arabia, and who knows what else.

Honestly, I think that's just the whole show. Its pretty groan-worthy. The 'present' looks a lot more interesting and it feels like another bait and switch. Come for the SW Underworld, get shown something else. In this case, 'Civilized Man Raising up the Savages'
It just needs his trainer turning out to be female and ending up his wife. Something, something tragic massacre and then he goes looking for his armor, all sad and stuff but having learned something about 'Respect'
-----

It was really, really hard not to see 'civilized man co-opts and destroys noble savages' way of life while offering them salvation from the great steel monster'

Meanwhile, I'm just thinking they could just... not camp on the hilltops along the train's route. Or line up to be shot. Just... 25 feet past the crest of the dune, and they'd be fine
But as long as he keeps speaking English, slowly, loudly and deliberately, it will all be fine.


So... they get their wood from psychotropic lizard dreams? That's... something.
And they then discard almost all of it and replace all but a little with really crudely 'forged' metal that will fall apart within minutes of use. The weapon crafting was actually painful to watch- I've done more reliable work pinning miniatures, not just sticking flanges in a grove and hoping that goop placed on the outside of the join and heated will keep it in place.

---
So I assume the evil wookie gladiator will pop up again. His costuming and prosthetics were SOOO much better than anything else in the show thus far. Like a mastercraft surrounded by cheap and functional apprentice work. It'd be an absolute waste to just be a random appearance for no reason.

Its interesting how much better the concept art stills are compared to the actual show. The workshop in the end slide show was amazing. The actual lean-to and fireplace was not.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/05 17:53:02


Post by: warboss


Mixed feelings about the episode. Morrison is an awful actor and I really wish he was a part of Mando's clan so that we wouldn't have to see his cringey grimaces so much. That said, I enjoyed the second half of the episode more than the first. I can't shake the feeling that this is derivative of the Mandalorian despite knowing the opposite is the case.

Spoiler:


Seriously, that is one gak group of amateur assassins the Hutts keep.

Fett: We can torture you for weeks to months of unending intense pain the likes of which you can't imagine.
Assassin: I'll never talk!
Fett: Ok. Quick death in seconds being eaten by rancor it is instead.
Assassin: Nooooooo! I'll tell you everything!I

The assassin was almost as stupid as the tuskens who know the train is coming and its course yet don't hide themselves or their banthas behind one of the DOZENS of dunes surrounding them and instead let them get shot.

I did love the addition of a new wookie that wasn't a Chewie clone and I hope they do something meaningful with the character. Liking the look of both the gear and fur style/color of the new wookie.

The second half was better though for the most part. The train heist was enjoyable and I liked the creation of the Gaffi stick and the donning of his new outfit with his acceptance into the tribe. I also knew that he'd work in a Maori haka somewhere as the actor is as predictable as his acting his bad.

I laughed at the introduction of the infamous psychedelic snot gecko of Tattoine though. I suppose having the offworlder from a water world saving the desert tribe experiencing visions after ingesting the spice he just captured might be a bit too derivative of a certain other property though.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/05 18:23:19


Post by: Albertorius


Aash wrote:
 AduroT wrote:
 BertBert wrote:
I Props to the composer who adapted the cantina theme, it was recognisable but still a fresh take.


We can always use more fresh cantina goo songs.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Man, they go Hard on the white savior and noble savage tropes in this one. All we need is for Fett to marry the chiefs daughter.

Also, was that Black Krrsantan or just a generic Wookie we think? Like it’s gotta be Krrsantan.


White saviour seems an odd accusation considering Temuera Morrison isn’t white.


And still, the good human has to teach the savage aliens how it's done... seriously it really is the very same trope, all over again. The script is being followed quite straight, here. As said above, but adding Avatar to the mix too, in case the problem is the aliens.

Voss wrote:
It just needs his trainer turning out to be female and ending up his wife. Something, something tragic massacre and then he goes looking for his armor, all sad and stuff but having learned something about 'Respect'

The trainer looks very female, yes, so...

Also, the wookie seems to be pretty clearly Black Krrsantan, a regular from the Doctor Aphra comic series.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/05 19:43:23


Post by: AduroT


All you really need to know about Black Krrsantan is that’s he’s an unstoppable killing machine with few if any morals who will lay waste to everyone before him, so long as the paycheck clears.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/05 19:56:53


Post by: warboss


Thanks for the tip. I'll go look him up on Wookieepedia.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/05 19:57:18


Post by: Voss


 AduroT wrote:
All you really need to know about Black Krrsantan is that’s he’s an unstoppable killing machine with few if any morals who will lay waste to everyone before him, so long as the paycheck clears.

Climatic fight before final confrontation, check. Aka, Sub-boss.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/05 20:07:02


Post by: AduroT


Voss wrote:
 AduroT wrote:
All you really need to know about Black Krrsantan is that’s he’s an unstoppable killing machine with few if any morals who will lay waste to everyone before him, so long as the paycheck clears.

Climatic fight before final confrontation, check. Aka, Sub-boss.


I’m betting Fett offers to pay him more and he switches sides, given he works for the main characters in the comics.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/05 20:15:20


Post by: Voss


 AduroT wrote:
Voss wrote:
 AduroT wrote:
All you really need to know about Black Krrsantan is that’s he’s an unstoppable killing machine with few if any morals who will lay waste to everyone before him, so long as the paycheck clears.

Climatic fight before final confrontation, check. Aka, Sub-boss.


I’m betting Fett offers to pay him more and he switches sides, given he works for the main characters in the comics.


Sure, that could work, too. Recruiting the gruff lieutenant is a workable trope for this show.

But I'm still betting on a Fennec betrayal and sad walking away music, like the old Incredible Hulk TV series.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/05 21:41:19


Post by: warboss


Voss wrote:

But I'm still betting on a Fennec betrayal and sad walking away music, like the old Incredible Hulk TV series.


Too simple. She will best him first in some way then will walk away. I agree on the sad walking music... probably wind instrument.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/05 21:42:56


Post by: trexmeyer


FYI, The Tusken Raider in Black has a stuntwoman, not a stuntman.

Please don't be Sophie Thatcher's character.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/05 22:32:03


Post by: Togusa


Started the show today. It's great, really enjoying it. I'm really excited to see where this goes. If only Star Trek would get this kind of treatment.

I am really glad to see that they learned from Mando S1 and S2 and made these hour long episodes.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/05 22:43:50


Post by: beast_gts


The train driver was the best bit of that episode.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/05 23:33:29


Post by: AduroT


Oh! Yes, quite right! The train driver was a hoot.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/06 02:39:24


Post by: Voss


beast_gts wrote:
The train driver was the best bit of that episode.


I dunno. I quite liked
"This is my gift to you. Hey, that's mine!"


The train was honestly overly complicated in execution (though simplistic in what it was trying to invoke).

The biggest problem is... its pointless. They're on Tattoine, the backside of the Outer Rim, with no governance or oversight, no laws from the Republic (or Empire at the time of the flashback), the big head crime lord is recently dead.
Why in any possible world is it useful to import in Spice from Kessel, run it in a train across the surface of Tattoine, then send it back up into space to be sold and distributed? Who are they smuggling the Spice past (seriously, what normal trade routes exist here)? Why take it off whatever ship landed with it? Why not land in the other spaceport? Why bring it to the furthest point from the 'bright center of the universe?'

I get that they want to remind the audience that only a civilized man can protect the savages from the evils of civilization, but this was a really wacky way to introduce fish-cowboys shooting natives and buffalo across the Old Space West.
No wonder Boba is so slow and ponderous on camera. He's hauling these moral anvils all over the place.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/06 06:50:40


Post by: ZergSmasher


I kind of figured the train was part of the spice runners' on-planet distribution network. I was wondering why the Tuskens didn't just, well, take better cover when the train went past though. Made zero sense to me. Still better than a lot of what was in the sequel trilogy though.

Somehow I missed the fact that the couple in Tosche Station were supposed to be Fixer and Camie; now that I know that I think it's a great little nod to the deleted scene from the original movie. The Black Krrsantan reference eluded me as well, but I'm not familiar at all with Star Wars comics outside of the Dark Empire ones (which I have in graphic novel form).


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/06 07:34:32


Post by: Manchu


trexmeyer wrote:
The Hutt litter is painfully stupid. In a universe of robots, Wookies, Gamorreans, hover technology, etc, you decide to have at least 2 tons of Hutt lard carried by 16~ skinny guys on a litter that is warping under their weight? C'mon now.
It’s a very intentional symbol, both diegetically and for the audience.
Aash wrote:
White saviour seems an odd accusation considering Temuera Morrison isn’t white.
Yeah, people who say that are missing the point that Boba is his own kind of indigenous person, albeit one who never got to live in his native land. Also, the Tuskens are not savages (noble or otherwise) except according to the most superficial analysis.
 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
There’s also a possibility he’s not a perfect Clone after all, which could tie into later plot lines as he seeks a permanent fix for organ degradation etc.
I think you are right about this and I suspect Boba may not survive this show.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/06 07:37:27


Post by: StygianBeach


Loved the second episode apart from the hangover Assassin from last episode.

While I was wondering why they didn't hide better from the spice train I could forgive this because of the train heist and the fact there wre training scenes.



The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/06 08:03:40


Post by: Manchu


I really enjoyed Chapter 2.

It seems like the theme of this show is that the different peoples of Tatooine can live together productively, without sacrificing who they are. Boba Fett’s goal is not merely to be a gang lord. He wants to build a better society. He’s not an anti-hero at all. He’s a straightforward hero. To me, that is a welcome surprise.

The Mos Espa scenes in this chapter were very well done, if sparse. The encounter with the mayor had some fascinating insights about whether power is anything more than brute coercion. Boba’s ethos, and why it has a chance of working in a violent world, is coming into better focus: he doesn’t insist on conflict and there are some who can deeply appreciate that. I loved the scene with the Hutts. It is now totally clear that for Boba, this is something he is willing to die for. Perhaps unlike what many were expecting, Boba is not a violently reactive “badass” but rather a restrained, mature person. The fact that the Twins are also patient and above being baited shows them as the real, and quite formidable threat.

Once again, the Tusken scenes stand out more than the present-day ones. At the end of Ch. 1, Boba was no longer a prisoner of the Sand People. In this chapter, we see him become their ally. In these experiences, we are shown how Boba begins to conceive of his life’s purpose as something greater than merely surviving from job to job, as Jango once said “making his way through the galaxy.” He sees the reckless indifference to life on the fringe and can imagine something better, something many other fringers (and apparently also some audience members) cannot imagine.

This show is not really in step with the current cynical mood of our culture. For me, it is a breath of fresh air.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/06 08:35:43


Post by: Lance845


The train is dumb in a world with space ships that could land anywhere on the planet within minutes. Starwars has always been dumb in this way.

The Hutt litter is also dumb in that there is nowhere near enough people to carry that much weight. This is a new way in which Starwars is being dumb.

White Savior is the trope that does not require the savior in question to be white in the same way that the Magical Black Man doesn't need to be Black or a Man.




Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Manchu wrote:

Once again, the Tusken scenes stand out more than the present-day ones. At the end of Ch. 1, Boba was no longer a prisoner of the Sand People. In this chapter, we see him become their ally. In these experiences, we are shown how Boba begins to conceive of his life’s purpose as something greater than merely surviving from job to job, as Jango once said “making his way through the galaxy.” He sees the reckless indifference to life on the fringe and can imagine something better, something many other fringers (and apparently also some audience members) cannot imagine.


Starwars is not a universe that changes. Every time they even slightly start to change something it resets to the status quo lightning fast. The Book of Boba Fett is not where we will see Mose Isley become something other than a wretched hive of scum and villany.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/06 10:49:08


Post by: Aash


 Lance845 wrote:


White Savior is the trope that does not require the savior in question to be white in the same way that the Magical Black Man doesn't need to be Black or a Man.


That’s news to me. I’ve always understood that race and especially the saviour figure being white was the central factor in the white saviour trope and associated criticism.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_saviour

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_savior_narrative_in_film


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/06 11:21:32


Post by: AduroT


https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/MightyWhitey

As the following examples will show, the trope tends to be used pretty liberally, especially because of the historical difficulty of defining the term "white" (i.e., whether it should primarily refer to Europeans, Caucasoids, or simply light-skinned people). It's most convenient to define this trope as a "modern" character achieving mastery over "ancient" or "backward" characters, not necessary with respect to race per se.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/06 11:37:48


Post by: Aash


 AduroT wrote:
https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/MightyWhitey

As the following examples will show, the trope tends to be used pretty liberally, especially because of the historical difficulty of defining the term "white" (i.e., whether it should primarily refer to Europeans, Caucasoids, or simply light-skinned people). It's most convenient to define this trope as a "modern" character achieving mastery over "ancient" or "backward" characters, not necessary with respect to race per se.


I’m well aware of the stock character and the various uses it can be put to, but labelling it as a white savior trope when the character in question isn’t white is applying a racial element which simply doesn’t exist here.

By all means call it a colonial stereotyping or an outsider or what have you, but it’s disingenuous if not outright dangerous to call an actor of Māori extraction a “white saviour”, and when I see that behaviour I’m going to call it out.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/06 13:00:26


Post by: Albertorius


Aash wrote:
 AduroT wrote:
https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/MightyWhitey

As the following examples will show, the trope tends to be used pretty liberally, especially because of the historical difficulty of defining the term "white" (i.e., whether it should primarily refer to Europeans, Caucasoids, or simply light-skinned people). It's most convenient to define this trope as a "modern" character achieving mastery over "ancient" or "backward" characters, not necessary with respect to race per se.


I’m well aware of the stock character and the various uses it can be put to, but labelling it as a white savior trope when the character in question isn’t white is applying a racial element which simply doesn’t exist here.

By all means call it a colonial stereotyping or an outsider or what have you, but it’s disingenuous if not outright dangerous to call an actor of Māori extraction a “white saviour”, and when I see that behaviour I’m going to call it out.


So you understand that the trope refers not to race, but to circunstances, but you don't care. Alright then.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/06 13:23:13


Post by: Aash


 Albertorius wrote:
Aash wrote:
 AduroT wrote:
https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/MightyWhitey

As the following examples will show, the trope tends to be used pretty liberally, especially because of the historical difficulty of defining the term "white" (i.e., whether it should primarily refer to Europeans, Caucasoids, or simply light-skinned people). It's most convenient to define this trope as a "modern" character achieving mastery over "ancient" or "backward" characters, not necessary with respect to race per se.


I’m well aware of the stock character and the various uses it can be put to, but labelling it as a white savior trope when the character in question isn’t white is applying a racial element which simply doesn’t exist here.

By all means call it a colonial stereotyping or an outsider or what have you, but it’s disingenuous if not outright dangerous to call an actor of Māori extraction a “white saviour”, and when I see that behaviour I’m going to call it out.


So you understand that the trope refers not to race, but to circunstances, but you don't care. Alright then.


You seem to be misunderstanding me. I’m saying that the term “white saviour” shouldn’t be applied to an actor or character that isn’t white. “White Saviour” is a specific example of an “enlightened outsider” or “superior colonialist” where the saviour/outsider/colonialist etc. is in fact white. In this instance it is incorrect because the the saviour in question isn’t white.

I find the use of the term “white saviour” to refer to an actor of Māori extraction offensive and little more than casual racism. As such I’m pointing out that the term isn’t applicable in this context.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/06 14:10:54


Post by: Albertorius


Aash wrote:
 Albertorius wrote:
Aash wrote:
 AduroT wrote:
https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/MightyWhitey

As the following examples will show, the trope tends to be used pretty liberally, especially because of the historical difficulty of defining the term "white" (i.e., whether it should primarily refer to Europeans, Caucasoids, or simply light-skinned people). It's most convenient to define this trope as a "modern" character achieving mastery over "ancient" or "backward" characters, not necessary with respect to race per se.


I’m well aware of the stock character and the various uses it can be put to, but labelling it as a white savior trope when the character in question isn’t white is applying a racial element which simply doesn’t exist here.

By all means call it a colonial stereotyping or an outsider or what have you, but it’s disingenuous if not outright dangerous to call an actor of Māori extraction a “white saviour”, and when I see that behaviour I’m going to call it out.


So you understand that the trope refers not to race, but to circunstances, but you don't care. Alright then.


You seem to be misunderstanding me. I’m saying that the term “white saviour” shouldn’t be applied to an actor or character that isn’t white. “White Saviour” is a specific example of an “enlightened outsider” or “superior colonialist” where the saviour/outsider/colonialist etc. is in fact white. In this instance it is incorrect because the the saviour in question isn’t white.

I find the use of the term “white saviour” to refer to an actor of Māori extraction offensive and little more than casual racism. As such I’m pointing out that the term isn’t applicable in this context.


Ok, you're objecting to the term, them, just because of the "white", even though the actual trope is inespecific. Ok.

What name should we use, then? The trope will stay the same, but if you can't stand the name, well, let's change it.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/06 14:14:28


Post by: trexmeyer


Aash wrote:

“White Saviour” is a specific example of an “enlightened outsider” or “superior colonialist” where the saviour/outsider/colonialist etc. is in fact white. In this instance it is incorrect because the the saviour in question isn’t white.


For all intents and purposes, humans are the "white people" of The Star Wars universe.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/06 14:19:39


Post by: Pacific


It seems I am an episode behind.

I enjoyed seeing the ninja guy get blown up by a missile in the first episode


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/06 15:20:04


Post by: Manchu


Something confusing is happening when people bring up a criticism of racism but at the same time insist on brushing off the specific question of race. For those who say that Boba Fett is a white savior, what exactly are you getting at? When we say Kevin Costner played a white savior in Dances With Wolves, the point is to criticize the film for fictionalizing the historical plight of non-white people for the purpose of emotionally reassuring, in the face of ongoing racism, actual white people in the audience. Are people arguing that the point of Book of Boba Fett is to comfort white people about real racism? This is a non-rhetorical question. I realize some people might say yes. But so far ITT I am not seeing an argument that the show is racially problematic; only that it is boring/predictable. To be clear, the main problem with white savior stories is NOT that they’ve been done before.

Furthermore, if Dances With Wolves had starred Denzel Washington rather than Costner, it would be quite convoluted to try to make the same “white savior” criticism. Similarly, Temuera Morrison’s race is certainly relevant to the question of whether, or to what extent, Book of Boba Fett is a white savior narrative (if not solely determinative). To be clear, I understand that the white savior criticism is directed at the character of Boba Fett rather than the actor Morrison. For those making the criticism, “white” apparently means “people who use blasters and space ships.” Boba is “white” in this sense; so are all Mandalorians, along with non-humans such as Gamorreans, Trandoshans, Wookies, Hutts, etc. So we see that there is already a problem with this approach: we’ve left the realm of racial, or even cultural, distinction altogether, in favor of a strictly technological distinction. In this view, Tusken people would become “white” as soon as they started piloting spaceships. In reality, indigenous people do not become white when they start driving cars. Or do they? Again, is that the debate here?

There is also the issue that Book of Boba Fett is part of The Mandalorian, a show that does not easily blur racial and cultural distinctions in favor of a clear-cut materialist/technologist viewpoint. Mandalorians are not the same “race” as non-Mandalorians. In previous seasons, the question of who is Mandalorian and why is a central issue. Is it a matter of technology (e.g., Beskar armor), birthright, genetics, ethos? I think, if anything, that theme is continuing in these episodes. Boba is unique, quite literally, but maybe that is not important. His claim to being Mandalorian (called into question immediately by nationalist zealot Bo Katan last season) hinges on being raised by a Mandalorian father, who himself was a foundling raised by Mandalorians similar to Din Djarin. Being “adopted in” is of huge importance to this show, and it’s not very surprising to see it come up again in Book of Boba Fett, albeit reoriented in a new and interesting way, especially considering Temuera Morrison’s own racial/cultural background.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/06 15:41:38


Post by: Albertorius


The trope (The "Mighty Whitey" trope, actually) is named that way because western media, which has been for a long type "white" coded (I'm spanish, btw, so current USAnian biases say I'm "non-white", exactly the same way as Temuera does) made it much more common, but it's nowhere near something exclusive, and the trope acknowledges it:

As the following examples will show, the trope tends to be used pretty liberally, especially because of the historical difficulty of defining the term "white" (i.e., whether it should primarily refer to Europeans, Caucasoids, or simply light-skinned people). It's most convenient to define this trope as a "modern" character achieving mastery over "ancient" or "backward" characters, not necessary with respect to race per se.


So, to answer your question, yes, I at least mean it to be “people who use blasters and space ships”. And it being basically Lawrence of Arabia in spaaace (the train scene is almost lifted directly, FFS), it fits to a tee.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/06 15:50:26


Post by: Manchu


Yeah but as I already noted, that isn’t how the show works nor does that way of looking at whiteness make much sense in the context of white savior criticisms.

It sounds like you don’t care about racial issues, you just think the show is derivative.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/06 15:54:52


Post by: trexmeyer


You're ignoring that humans have always been at the forefront of Star Wars and also served as canon's primary colonizers and imperealists. They've been consistently depicted as the dominant, or at least preeminent, race in the galaxy. Even media that could easily have non-human leads has humans as primary characters and aliens are secondary. The dominance of humans was actually addressed in the EU at one point: https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Diversity_Alliance. For whatever reason, Disney decided with the ST to keep making human-centric stories. Even The Mandalorian is somewhat guilty of this...outside of Grogu I can't easily recall a significant non-human character from that series.

The White Savior trope doesn't apply 1:1 to any of Star Wars. It can't. It's a different universe with different cultures and a different history. If you reduce that trope down to enlightened, privileged outsider educates and aids "primitives" than it is absolutely applicable in the case of Boba Fett. He's a perfect clone of Jango Fett, one of the best bounty hunters of his time. Jango was wealthy, well-armed, and worked directly with Count Dooku. Boba Fett worked directly for Darth Vader at least once, meaning that he, at least, temporarily served a fascist regime that has consistently been shown to be human-centric and oppressive of aliens. The rare exceptions to that are when the Empire made use of alien inquisitors out of necessity and Grand Admiral Thrawn.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/06 15:56:44


Post by: Albertorius


 Manchu wrote:
Yeah but as I already noted, that isn’t how the show works nor does that way of looking at whiteness make much sense in the context of white savior criticisms.

It sounds like you don’t care about racial issues, you just think the show is derivative.


I don't think it's racist, no, I do very much think it's derivative as hell. And it's using a trope that's not racist, per se, but it's pretty colonialist.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/06 15:57:19


Post by: trexmeyer


 Manchu wrote:

It sounds like you don’t care about racial issues, you just think the show is derivative.


It's not about real world racial issues or if the show is derivative. Everything is derivative. People have just observed that this trope is loosely applicable. I don't understand what the fuss is about.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/06 15:58:34


Post by: Manchu


If we reduce the trope that far then we’ve lost what is problematic about it, too. Again, unless your argument is that Book of Boba Fett is supposed to make actual white people feel better about/ignore actual racism.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/06 15:59:47


Post by: Albertorius


trexmeyer wrote:
 Manchu wrote:

It sounds like you don’t care about racial issues, you just think the show is derivative.


It's not about real world racial issues or if the show is derivative. Everything is derivative. People have just observed that this trope is loosely applicable. I don't understand what the fuss is about.


Right now it's more an issue of "I was expecting The Soprano in spaace (or something, you know what I mean ^^) and I got Lawrence of Arabia in spaace" than anything else. And I'm not sure I care for it.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/06 16:00:28


Post by: Manchu


I agree that this show is not really about mafia politics.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/06 16:02:33


Post by: Albertorius


 Manchu wrote:
If we reduce the trope that far then we’ve lost what is problematic about it, too. Again, unless your argument is that Book of Boba Fett is supposed to make actual white people feel better about/ignore actual racism.


I don't think that it reduces what's problematic: it's still a mighty, technologically advanced outsider telling the "savages" how it's done. Pretty much how most american media depicts Conquistadores.

But anyways. So far, not enough crimelording, too much sandmucking.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/06 16:03:45


Post by: trexmeyer


 Manchu wrote:
If we reduce the trope that far the we’ve lost what is problematic about it, too. Again, unless your argument is that Book of Boba Fett is supposed to make actual white people feel better about/ignore actual racism.


1) I don't understand how you can interpret that anyone is making that argument.

2) Are you saying that you are okay with an enlightened outsider "raising" up the primitives so long as they are not white? Why is that specifically okay? Isn't the core issue of that trope the idea of cultural and intellectual superiority being revealed via a lone individual mastering the primitive native's ways in a short amount of time and then suddenly guiding them on a generational leap forward that they could not achieve on their own? It's a very self-congratulatory concept.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/06 16:08:11


Post by: Manchu


(1) I explicitly said I didn’t see anyone making that argument. I think this is why “white savior” criticisms are red herrings.

(2) I have not seen Boba “raising up” the Tuskens. I don’t think what we have seen in the show makes sense as a white savior narrative.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/06 16:12:10


Post by: Albertorius


 Manchu wrote:
(1) I explicitly said I didn’t see anyone making that argument. I think this is why “white savior” criticisms are red herrings.

(2) I have seen Boba raising up the Tuskens. I don’t think what we have seen in the show makes sense as a white savior narrative.


But is it because Temuera is not white? Would it be different if he was Pedro Pascal? How about Josh Brolin?

Or is it because you don't think that being a technologically advanced character from a "modern" society teaching "ancient" or "backward" tribal people merits the inclusion into the "Mighty Whitey" trope, with the caveats the trope does about race?

I mean, I don't really feel like just race swapping Lawrence of Arabia (which is the main inspiration for this one), Dancing with Wolves or The Last Samurai for black or hispanic characters (for example) would change the underlying narrative one bit.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/06 16:14:48


Post by: Voss


 Albertorius wrote:
 Manchu wrote:
If we reduce the trope that far then we’ve lost what is problematic about it, too. Again, unless your argument is that Book of Boba Fett is supposed to make actual white people feel better about/ignore actual racism.


I don't think that it reduces what's problematic: it's still a mighty, technologically advanced outsider telling the "savages" how it's done. Pretty much how most american media depicts Conquistadores.

But anyways. So far, not enough crimelording, too much sandmucking.


Both of these

Its hitting all the stops of 'Civilized man fixes the Savages,' which is something I expect from the 1980s, not 2020s. Its a step back, regardless of the actor's personal heritage. Which doesn't stop the writers and director from being problematic anyway.

And yeah, I signed up for Underworld Booglaoo, not the really problematic bits of Dances with Arabia.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/06 16:17:59


Post by: Mad Doc Grotsnik


Boba and the Tusken’s.

This is him sort of finding a home and acceptance he’s not had since the first battle of Geonosis. Despite having the Galaxy’s all time record for little brothers, even Clone Wars shows him to have been kind of singular.

Yes Aurra Sing and Co kept him company, but it felt a very much working relationship.

Tattooine? The Tusken’s did save his life, albeit for reasons which are unclear (later sport? Slave labour? Both? Arguments can be made).

He saves the kid seeing a potential opportunity for freedom. Something to trade his life for.

He’s also still recovering from his trip to the Sarlacc. With no other captives to assist him in escape (such as being able to get off world, mentioned in Chapter 1).

I think we’re seeing a kind of mutual respect thing. He owes the Tusken’s his life - but they hadn’t granted him his freedom.

So yes, there are elements of outside bonding with natives. But I wouldn’t say it’s necessarily Mighty Whitey stuff going on. Boba is self interested. That’s what I’m seeing as his current driving force.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/06 16:18:25


Post by: trexmeyer


ASFAIK, it's the only trope that fits that description despite it being a reoccuring plot point across science fiction and fantasy, to include instances where no "white" people are involved. For some reason The Matrix is accused of being a white savior film even though Keanu Reeves has Chinese and Hawaiian ancestry.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/06 16:23:17


Post by: The_Real_Chris


Ok... how would you have equipped and trained a bunch of technologically backward people to be able to conduct a successful raid on a high tech target? At some point they have to get more advanced at fighting to fulfil that particular mission, so what is the way of doing that that doesn't fit that trope?


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/06 16:25:05


Post by: Albertorius


Anyways...

I have actually thought the tusken stuff was more interesting, overall, or at least the pacing and narration was better. The crimelording stuff so far has been kind of... not very good.

As I'm not really that interested on the tusken stuff, even if it's better, so far the show is failing to grip me.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/06 16:26:54


Post by: trexmeyer


The_Real_Chris wrote:
Ok... how would you have equipped and trained a bunch of technologically backward people to be able to conduct a successful raid on a high tech target? At some point they have to get more advanced at fighting to fulfil that particular mission, so what is the way of doing that that doesn't fit that trope?


https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/TechnologyUplift

Might Whitey/White Savior doesn't necessarily involve a technological uplift. In The Last Samurai, Tom Cruises' character conforms to samurai's level of technology, not the other way around. I believe the same is true of Avatar, but I never watched it, I've only read the plot points.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/06 16:27:18


Post by: AduroT


I’m not even really mad or hate that Fett is leaning hard on the tropes, I’m just pointing them out. Mandelorian also was quite trope-y with a whole lot of western cliches, and I still enjoyed that one a good bit. I do hope they resolve the flashbacks soon though because I prefer the current storyline.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/06 16:27:40


Post by: Albertorius


The_Real_Chris wrote:
Ok... how would you have equipped and trained a bunch of technologically backward people to be able to conduct a successful raid on a high tech target? At some point they have to get more advanced at fighting to fulfil that particular mission, so what is the way of doing that that doesn't fit that trope?


Yeah... that's the trope, when the one that does it is a "modern" outsider, so pretty much you can't. So either you don't use "a bunch of technologically backward people to conduct a successful raid on a high tech target" or the main character is one of the above, and it's the one that devises the way to do it.

Or you do it anyways, fit the trope and hope it doesn't offend anyone.

For the record, I'm not offended, I'm just pointing it out.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/06 17:01:15


Post by: Voss


For the record, I'm not offended, I'm just pointing it out.

yeah, the bigger problem is the show so far is tropes all the way down, and its spelled out exactly where they're from.

If/when it does go back to doing something substantial with the 'current' plot, I fully expect a severed bantha head to materialize on his bacta tank.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/06 19:26:20


Post by: Manchu


The white savior narrative appears to presume that the non-white people are inferior to their white savior. The technological aspect is just a symbol for deeper moral superiority. To me, Book of Boba Fett does not presume this, which makes sense considering this presumption was already explicitly rejected in The Mandalorian. The show does not presume the moral superiority of the Tusken people, either, as noble savages. Evoking these tropes seems useless and, for lack of a better term, “clickbaity.”

I think the real issue the show is working with is that offworlders trivialize and underestimate the Sand People. This is also how his rivals view Boba Fett: as just a gun for hire, not a real player. Boba is a man who sees possibilities that others overlook. This is what the whole contrast with the Rodian prisoner showed us.

Another thing I have noticed is the way offworlders assume they understand Tatooine but don’t, at all. They have a literally superficial view inasmuch as they only see the surface of the sand. But we are beginning to see that there is a dynamic, vibrant ecosystem beneath the wave-like dunes, just like there is a multitude of flora and fauna within the ocean.

This is really a show about hidden depths.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/06 20:01:29


Post by: Albertorius


 Manchu wrote:
The white savior narrative appears to presume that the non-white people are inferior to their white savior. The technological aspect is just a symbol for deeper moral superiority. To me, Book of Boba Fett does not presume this, which makes sense considering this presumption was already explicitly rejected in The Mandalorian. The show does not presume the moral superiority of the Tusken people, either, as noble savages. Evoking these tropes seems useless and, for lack of a better term, “clickbaity.”

I think the real issue the show is working with is that offworlders trivialize and underestimate the Sand People. This is also how his rivals view Boba Fett: as just a gun for hire, not a real player. Boba is a man who sees possibilities that others overlook. This is what the whole contrast with the Rodian prisoner showed us.

Another thing I have noticed is the way offworlders assume they understand Tatooine but don’t, at all. They have a literally superficial view inasmuch as they only see the surface of the sand. But we are beginning to see that there is a dynamic, vibrant ecosystem beneath the wave-like dunes, just like there is a multitude of flora and fauna within the ocean.

This is really a show about hidden depths.


Not really, depends on the exact expression of the trope; for example, The Last Samurai or Avatar tend to go the other way around, depicting them usually as more spiritually enlightened (usually by way of drugs, mescal or whatever) but technologically stuck in the past, or "in tune with nature" or whatever the specifics are, which then the "mighty foreigner" adopts as their own, as only the mighty foreigner can bridge the new and old.

But I believe this is enough from me already, and it doesn't really matter.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/06 20:02:36


Post by: Manchu


I’m not really interested in processing media into neatly sorted wiki categories. The white savior criticism is directed at racism. It’s not just a category of trope for the sake of being cataloged. As I posted earlier:
 Manchu wrote:
For those who say that Boba Fett is a white savior, what exactly are you getting at? When we say Kevin Costner played a white savior in Dances With Wolves, the point is to criticize the film for fictionalizing the historical plight of non-white people for the purpose of emotionally reassuring, in the face of ongoing racism, actual white people in the audience. Are people arguing that the point of Book of Boba Fett is to comfort white people about real racism?


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/06 20:03:02


Post by: Voss


 Manchu wrote:
The white savior narrative appears to presume that the non-white people are inferior to their white savior. The technological aspect is just a symbol for deeper moral superiority. To me, Book of Boba Fett does not presume this, which makes sense considering this presumption was already explicitly rejected in The Mandalorian. The show does not presume the moral superiority of the Tusken people, either, as noble savages. Evoking these tropes seems useless and, for lack of a better term, “clickbaity.”

Nonsense. They're the tropes the show is deliberately trying to evoke, or the writers/director are utterly incompetent and lazy. They may, in the end, try to subvert them, but they're highlighting Civilized Man/Noble Savage dichotomy over and over and over again with familiar scenes from familiar movies.

I think the real issue the show is working with is that offworlders trivialize and underestimate the Sand People. This is also how his rivals view Boba Fett: as just a gun for hire, not a real player. Boba is a man who sees possibilities that others overlook. This is what the whole contrast with the Rodian prisoner showed us.

That's... um. That's a leap. The Rodian had at best, resigned himself to being a slave, because the alternative was death. It was day one from Boba, and he was still trying to fight his way out. Its just not that deep.

Another thing I have noticed is the way offworlders assume they understand Tatooine but don’t, at all. They have a literally superficial view inasmuch as they only see the surface of the sand. But we are beginning to see that there is a dynamic, vibrant ecosystem beneath the wave-like dunes, just like there is a multitude of flora and fauna within the ocean.

I don't really think offworlders give a damp fart about Tatooine. Its a convenient rock outside any government's control, perfect for crime. Its ecosystem never needs to matter to them.
If anything, the only metaphorical crap we have about depths and oceans and underneath the sand is its something to desperately break out of, because subsurface be-tentacled ocean-trees are evil, and will pull you down. (Whether it be your past on an ocean planet or all-devouring tentacle monsters trying to eat you. Break out and use technology to forge the broken remains into something better.

This is really a show about hidden depths.

Eh. The private conversations between the characters suggest otherwise. They're just lost at sea and in over their heads.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/06 20:05:29


Post by: Manchu


LOL Voss, I get it, you are too cool for this show. Opinion noted.

I’ll drill down a bit more on the Rodian contrast for posters who care about the show.

For the Rodian, everything is clear because he thinks he already knows it all. Sand People are brutal savages. If you try to escape, they’ll kill you. If you don’t do what they say, they’ll kill you. They are incomprehensible otherwise.

This is all wrong. They did not kill Boba when he tried to escape. The things they do don’t make sense if they are simply murderous. Why have a child and a dog take them out to dig black melons? Enslaving prisoners to obtain water does not seem to be their culture at all.

Furthermore, why do they want the prisoners to see the swoop gangers brutalizing moisture farmers? They are trying to communicate something. It seems to me that message is, we don’t do that. We can live alongside moisture farmers, in the normal course of things. It’s offworlders like the swoop gangers that are the savages, not us.

I think the child was given the task of teaching the prisoners a survival skill. Again, what’s the message? Tatooine isn’t barren. If you know where to look, you can find everything you need to survive. Again, the message seems to be, we are not ignorant brutes. We are not necessarily even hostile.

The theme here shows us how Boba begins to conceive of the ecosystem of not only the Dune Seas but the whole planet, not excluding the offworlders. There is a lesson here, too, about Mos Espa and its relation to the wider planetary system. This world need not be ruled by violence, mistrust, and selfishness. There is a natural harmony here in which everyone can participate and cooperate. The obstacle is narrow-mindedness.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/06 23:17:45


Post by: trexmeyer


I don't know why people dislike the Tusken Raiders. They're fascinating. My favorite parts of KotOR and SWTOR were interacting with them. I could watch a whole series about them.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/06 23:31:01


Post by: Voss


 Manchu wrote:
LOL Voss, I get it, you are too cool for this show. Opinion noted.

Yep, definitely exactly that. I wasn't disagreeing of your assessment, I'm just too cool for the show.

I’ll drill down a bit more on the Rodian contrast for posters who care about the show.
For the Rodian, everything is clear because he thinks he already knows it all. Sand People are brutal savages. If you try to escape, they’ll kill you. If you don’t do what they say, they’ll kill you. They are incomprehensible otherwise.
This is all wrong. They did not kill Boba when he tried to escape. The things they do don’t make sense if they are simply murderous. Why have a child and a dog take them out to dig black melons? Enslaving prisoners to obtain water does not seem to be their culture at all.

Or dead slaves don't do work. Living slaves do go dig magically appearing water gourds. Like I said the first time, you're overcomplicating things. Filling in a LOT for the show, which isn't doing the heavy lifting on the work you're ascribing to it.

Furthermore, why do they want the prisoners to see the swoop gangers brutalizing moisture farmers? They are trying to communicate something. It seems to me that message is, we don’t do that. We can live alongside moisture farmers, in the normal course of things. It’s offworlders like the swoop gangers that are the savages, not us.

It seemed to me that wasn't intended by the Tuskens. Just the writers needed to show it in episode 1 so that in episode 2, he could go beat up the bikers in the 'Memberberries Bar and Grill' so that the train plot could happen.

I think the child was given the task of teaching the prisoners a survival skill. Again, what’s the message? Tatooine isn’t barren. If you know where to look, you can find everything you need to survive. Again, the message seems to be, we are not ignorant brutes. We are not necessarily even hostile.

He taught them how to find the magic water gourds? He just ordered the slaves to dig in the sand. He didn't teach them anything about it, how to spot likely locations, or provide the tools they were using in the next episode, nothing. Just dig or be punished.

The theme here shows us how Boba begins to conceive of the ecosystem of not only the Dune Seas but the whole planet, not excluding the offworlders. There is a lesson here, too, about Mos Espa and its relation to the wider planetary system. This world need not be ruled by violence, mistrust, and selfishness. There is a natural harmony here in which everyone can participate and cooperate. The obstacle is narrow-mindedness.

Yeah... we'll see how the show shakes out. He wants to head a criminal empire. That's his actual goal- not a free a harmonious planet. Doing that without violence or selfishness seems, honestly, ludicrous. And again, not the show they advertised.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/06 23:56:33


Post by: Lance845


The criticsm of white saviour isn't about the uplifting of the white guy. Its the back seat an entire race of "lessers" take to the outsider.

A japanese man who dances with wolves his way through a south american tribe would be just as fethed a piece of narrative. No white people involved. The japanese is still playing the white saviour because the trope namer being white doesn't prevent the application of the trope with a recast.

Likewise a first nation shaman guiding a white guy is still a magical black man. Because he serves the same narrative function. His blackness isn't necessary to fufill the tropes role.


Its really not that complicated.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/07 00:31:44


Post by: Manchu


trexmeyer wrote:
I could watch a whole series about them.
Me too. And it looks like we’re going to have that, to some degree.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/07 01:01:53


Post by: techsoldaten


trexmeyer wrote:
You're ignoring that humans have always been at the forefront of Star Wars and also served as canon's primary colonizers and imperealists. They've been consistently depicted as the dominant, or at least preeminent, race in the galaxy. Even media that could easily have non-human leads has humans as primary characters and aliens are secondary. The dominance of humans was actually addressed in the EU at one point: https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Diversity_Alliance. For whatever reason, Disney decided with the ST to keep making human-centric stories. Even The Mandalorian is somewhat guilty of this...outside of Grogu I can't easily recall a significant non-human character from that series.

The White Savior trope doesn't apply 1:1 to any of Star Wars. It can't. It's a different universe with different cultures and a different history. If you reduce that trope down to enlightened, privileged outsider educates and aids "primitives" than it is absolutely applicable in the case of Boba Fett. He's a perfect clone of Jango Fett, one of the best bounty hunters of his time. Jango was wealthy, well-armed, and worked directly with Count Dooku. Boba Fett worked directly for Darth Vader at least once, meaning that he, at least, temporarily served a fascist regime that has consistently been shown to be human-centric and oppressive of aliens. The rare exceptions to that are when the Empire made use of alien inquisitors out of necessity and Grand Admiral Thrawn.


Watching Greedo's shameless execution by the human corsair never sat right with me.

The whole series should have been about his family's search for justice, instead of this glorification of human domination of an entire galaxy. It's a story about 2 groups duking it out for the right to oppress literally everyone else everywhere, not some formative myth to be celebrated.

Any creative enterprise dealing in these tropes is supremacist and should be condemned.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/07 02:07:38


Post by: H.B.M.C.


 techsoldaten wrote:
Watching Greedo's shameless execution by the human corsair never sat right with me.

The whole series should have been about his family's search for justice, instead of this glorification of human domination of an entire galaxy. It's a story about 2 groups duking it out for the right to oppress literally everyone else everywhere, not some formative myth to be celebrated.

Any creative enterprise dealing in these tropes is supremacist and should be condemned.
Poe's Law prevents me from ascertaining whether you are agreeing with trexmeyer, or just mocking him.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/07 02:40:52


Post by: LordofHats


I don't know but I'd totally watch a sitcom about Greedo's family's unrelenting and bumbling quest for revenge against *checks description* 'some pink mammal melon-fether and a giant Ewok'


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/07 02:53:01


Post by: trexmeyer


 LordofHats wrote:
I don't know but I'd totally watch a sitcom about Greedo's family's unrelenting and bumbling quest for revenge against *checks description* 'some pink mammal melon-fether and a giant Ewok'


His uncle shows up in SotE and doesn't care that Han killed Greedo.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/12 08:40:39


Post by: Mad Doc Grotsnik


Chapter 3

Spoiler:
Well that was pretty cool. Far less flashback, lots of modern day stuff.

I suspect they might be divisive, but I really liked the Mod gang. Perhaps a bit too on the nose for real world analogue for some, but I liked the stylings.

Rancors confirmed to be great big hungry Doggos who only fight if forced. Can’t wait to see Boba riding it, because that’s gonna be cool as.

Good exposition overall. And once again, we see a Disney+ show varying its episodic run time to whatever is needed to tell that part of the story, and largely avoid fillers.

Chase scene wasn’t exactly high speed, but I kind of liked that. The Major-domo isn’t a race car driver, and it took place on twisty narrow streets.

Roll on Chapter 4 and further escalation!


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/12 09:18:02


Post by: AduroT


I’m realizing just how sad Boba’s claim to being in charge really is. Like you’d think when he killed Bibb he’d have taken over the operation. Instead it was just him and Fennec. He just kind of showed up by himself and said I own everything now with no organization or backing of any kind. He’s just hollow.

Im down with the designs of the mod gang on their own, but the idea of them seems poor. Poor street kids with no jobs who can’t even afford water, but did pay who knows how much for all those fancy shiny cybernetics and shiny custom speeders. They look very out of place for their surroundings.

Machete showing up and espousing how loving and emotional Rancors really are is just golden.

The action scenes, both the fight and the chase, seemed quite poor to me.

Overall this episode is where I’m really starting to lose interest in this series.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/12 09:22:26


Post by: Mad Doc Grotsnik


I quite like that the action isn’t filmed in blur-o-vision, and we can quite easily follow who’s hitting who and with what.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/12 09:40:59


Post by: AduroT


Sure, but the hits don’t seem to matter. I mean sure action show fight, but when a wookie with electrified metal spikes on his knuckles punches someone in the face, I expect that to leave a mark. Dude gets stabbed four times, barely an inconvenience. Only one single attack seemed to have any lasting effect at all.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/12 09:48:29


Post by: Mad Doc Grotsnik


I see what you mean. Could be down to Robert Rodriguez being restrained by what’s allowed to be shown?

I know he’s done the Spy Kids films, so has done kid friendly stuff. But I know him from his more R rated silliness.

Star Wars falls somewhere between the two in terms what can and can’t be shown. Violence is an inherent part of it, but barring Ponda Baba’s severed arm, you don’t tend to see blood nor bruising overall.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/12 09:53:04


Post by: Lance845


Wow. Those are very slow speeders.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/12 09:59:54


Post by: Mad Doc Grotsnik


Well, they are Space Mopeds, not exactly a vehicle noted for top speed. A fact which seems to consistently escape the local scrotes, who will insist on gunning their mobile hair dryer’s engines into the wee small hours.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/12 12:55:33


Post by: xerxeskingofking


I had a few issues with the space mod gang, mainly because of the strong "urban youth" associations that mods have to me. These were a bunch of london council estate brats in the middle of a desert city, southern English accents and all.

For me it was somewhat suspension breaking them being on a mostly rural/wilderness Tatooine when they'd be a much better fit for, say, Coruscant, or Corellia or some other urbanised planet. As it was, it felt as jarring as if they'd been early 90's gang bangers with do rags, baggy trousers and space R&B playing on a floating beat-box and stong Brooklyn accents.

the chase also suffered a little for me, mainly because i kept thinking "your in a FLYING CAR, why dont you try and raise your altitude so you can get some speed up?" I get that not all speeders can but we know plenty do (see: attack of the clones speeder chase), and i would have liked the speeder driver to at least TRY and gain altitude, or otherwise show he couldn't so we understand that hes limited to the ground, or sufficient overhead cover that trying to go high would be pointless.

semi-related side note, I know the space palanquin the Twins sit on bothered a few people for not having enough bearers for the apparent weight, but thats something that didnt bother me as its in a setting with widespread use of anti-grav, and systems small enough to fit into the palanquin would not be out of the question. the bearers arent taking most of the weight, they are their as part of the display of power the palanquin shows.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/12 13:06:59


Post by: AduroT


Right. I’m not opposed to the idea of a mod street gang, but for down on their luck kids in a poor dirty desert town, all their tech was so shiny and clean and new looking, right down to their matching custom cherry power ranger speeders.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/12 13:24:12


Post by: Mad Doc Grotsnik


It’s how Mods were though. Their rides took precedence.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/12 13:46:20


Post by: Stevefamine


This show is CRUSHING the mando series. Episode 2 + 3 really took it

Really good so far!


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/12 15:14:09


Post by: H.B.M.C.


I completely forgot this was on today.

What does that say?


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/12 15:33:21


Post by: Voss


 H.B.M.C. wrote:
I completely forgot this was on today.

What does that say?


That's OK. It went full farce today. To the point that it made Dexter Jettser's 50s Roller-Droid Diner look like a serious attempt at cinematography.

But hey, at least it set the stupid storylines from the first two episodes on fire and just moved on.
Now I'm confused why the 'real story' needed 3 episodes of set-up and red herrings.

 AduroT wrote:
I’m realizing just how sad Boba’s claim to being in charge really is. Like you’d think when he killed Bibb he’d have taken over the operation. Instead it was just him and Fennec. He just kind of showed up by himself and said I own everything now with no organization or backing of any kind. He’s just hollow.

Yeah. I... don't know how they sold this show. I get the basic premise is interesting to people (Be Fett, Do Crime), but the implementation is utterly gak.
Take the worst Mobster movie you can think of, add weird asides into other genres for no reason and no resolution and added in the Emperor's New Clothes fable (or the stories about the Emperor of San Francisco).


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/12 15:41:44


Post by: trexmeyer


Robert Rodriguez has done some decent films.
Spoiler:
Sin City, From Dusk till Dawn, Once Upon a Time in Mexico, Desperado.

For whatever reason he has been dreadful with Star Wars. He's 1/3 and The Mandalorian episode he directed looked cheap.
I don't like Good Guy Fett. Vespa Gang was awful. How did that get approved?


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/12 15:42:35


Post by: Voss


 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
It’s how Mods were though. Their rides took precedence.


I'm pretty sure that's not the point AduroT is making. They don't match the setting (or the color palette of the show). It'd be like doing a london gang show with actual cowboys.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/12 15:53:18


Post by: The_Real_Chris


Wow. Weird. 1960's cyberpunk meets mob meandering. If they had had ex imperial speeders that were bashed up that might explain something, but all of a sudden saying you can have the $100,000 men in a universe that until now uses unaugumented soldiers makes zero sense.

But Rancors just want love.

60's stars wars, what Lucas dreamt of when he was little.

Plus anyone with a British accent would have been executed as an Imperial by now surely?


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/12 15:56:06


Post by: ListenToMeWarriors


Felt like two episodes mashed together...some great bits and some really WTF bits. Still overall enjoying it though...just hope the robot fetishism rainbow coloured Speeder gang get bumped off quick.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/12 16:48:51


Post by: Voss


Probably the most interesting thing in the episode is the oblique Old Republic reference: 'the Kintan Striders,' the Nikto (species) bike gang. The 'Kintan Kings' were a Nikto swoop (bike) gang on Nar Shaddaa.

'Kintans' in general are a rancor-like (but smaller) animal(ish) species (with some tool use), or big lizard-gorillas with chest faces depending on how you want to look at them. First appearance is actually in New Hope, as one of the unnamed Holo-chess pieces.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/12 18:29:45


Post by: Togusa


This show has been great so far, I'm really enjoying it, more so than the Mandalorian. I wasn't expecting the Rancor to make an appearance in the show, mostly because Jabba the Hutt used it as a tool of terror and torture in order to keep his subjects in line and retain power. But here we are given another view of the creature, which I really like. They're just big doggos.

The street kids were a pleasant surprise, a friend at work described them too me this morning before I got to see the show and she made them sound way, way worse than they are. In fact I think there is a lot of potential for the characters. Black Brrsantan was great, really hoping he comes back and wants to fly with the crew.

I am starting to wonder if Chelli Aphra is going to either make an appearance or be at the very least name dropped like they did for the Witches of Dathomir.

But anyways, reading online discussions about it has taught me an important lesson...

People over analyze this stuff, treating it as if it's some all important topic that must be picked apart and held up to a lens made mostly out of real world glass...It's fiction, entertainment. Enjoy it how you wish, but Jesus a lot of you are full of yourselves with some of these opinions.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/12 19:34:51


Post by: Formosa


this was the most "star wars is for kids" episode of both Mandalorian and Boba Fett so far, slap stick trope car chase with whatever those totally out of place "gang" members were.

Murder Furry was cool though, hope he comes back


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/12 20:56:59


Post by: endlesswaltz123


 Formosa wrote:
this was the most "star wars is for kids" episode of both Mandalorian and Boba Fett so far, slap stick trope car chase with whatever those totally out of place "gang" members were.

Murder Furry was cool though, hope he comes back


Agree, the car chase was so poor, and slow, are you really telling me those speeders and bikes can only go 30-40mph?

Black Krrsantan was cool, but then fairly easily dealt with in the end also, it felt like a waste.

Lastly, I'm not sure I enjoy star wars without the space travel, and different worlds etc... Tatooine is cool and all, but we have seen a hell of a lot of it. Boba taking on, or trying to take over Crimson Dawn would have been a cooler concept imo.

Oh well....


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/12 21:02:47


Post by: LunarSol


 endlesswaltz123 wrote:

Lastly, I'm not sure I enjoy star wars without the space travel, and different worlds etc... Tatooine is cool and all, but we have seen a hell of a lot of it. Boba taking on, or trying to take over Crimson Dawn would have been a cooler concept imo.


Well, if there's a bright center of the universe, you're on the planet closest to that core. Literally everything happens here.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/12 21:06:49


Post by: Lance845


I'm calling it. The crime syndicate that the twins don't want to fight is Dark Sun and we are getting Prince Xizor reveal in the last episode.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/12 21:10:13


Post by: AduroT


I kind of assume it’s Crimson Dawn since all the Star Wars comics have been obsessed with them lately.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/12 21:12:42


Post by: Voss


 Lance845 wrote:
I'm calling it. The crime syndicate that the twins don't want to fight is Dark Sun and we are getting Prince Xizor reveal in the last episode.


Not the Pykes? I mean, lets have some conservation of enemies and plotlines. No need to buildup yet another conflict then drop it to switch to a completely different one again.
Its only a 7 episode show, after all.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/12 21:31:02


Post by: Lance845


It's Starwars Street man. The more people we can bring in for nostalgia purposes and make everyone have them meet everyone else the more likely it is to happen. Darth Maul is also dead by this point. So minimal chance of some Starwars streeting.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/12 22:05:55


Post by: warboss


That was lame. Not even mediocre but plain lame. And the FX of him jetpacking into the crashed speeder scene are worse that fan film quality. And why does every "villain" need to be redeemed or show their fluffy side? First Boba and now the rancor. I suppose the season finale will be how the wampa on Hoth was just epicurious and a very talented gardener during the summer.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/13 00:16:49


Post by: epronovost


So far probably the best episode that actually gives a bit of a setup for the series. The flashbacks aren't just there to explain how Boba survived the escape of Luke and Han. Now, it can serve as a setup for some bad blood between the Pikes, the villain of the series, and the hero.

On the street gang, I must say that their appearance seems to clash with the rest of Tatooine, but I suppose that's sort of the point. Street gangs tend to dress in ways that aren't really conformist. The slow speed-ish pursuit makes sense considering how small and narrow the streets are and the idea of "space vespa" was pretty funny.

The fact that Fett could take a punch from a wookie with a powerfist seemed to me a bit strange. Shouldn't have this smashed his head easily? I know Fett was shown both on this show and in the Mandalorian to be tough as old boots and very strong (if not very quick and agile), but still.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/13 02:08:08


Post by: Voss


Now, it can serve as a setup for some bad blood between the Pikes, the villain of the series, and the hero.

Sure. But honestly, the setup for the series was:

Fett: I declare myself Boss of Tatooine.
Anyone else: No.

We didn't need to see a labored, trope-filled backstory if it just ends in the most predictable fashion possible. The first three episodes are basically Boba being a clueless disaster magnet as the inevitable happens.

And to add insult to injury, we are still likely to be punished with the painstakingly dull story of how exactly Boba trudges from the end result of his adventures in the Dunes all the way to the intersection with the Mandalorian story before we finally get to the unnecessary explanation of the beginning of the first episode. Followed by a brief shootout (for justice!) and... something something sequel bait.

Rather than, you know, actually building and protecting a criminal empire from the start, which might have been actually interesting.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/13 04:28:39


Post by: epronovost


Voss wrote:
We didn't need to see a labored, trope-filled backstory if it just ends in the most predictable fashion possible.


You are right that so far, while I enjoy the show, it's neither original nor particularly innovative in anything. It does play its tropes well though. I enjoy slow worldbuilding episode in series, especially in anthology series like Star Wars.

So far, the only thing I would say is a blast, a really good thing, in this series is the soundtrack. I think its really good. Star Wars, in my opinion, never disappoint when it comes to music and sound design.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/13 06:49:12


Post by: endlesswaltz123


I think the main thing that is irking me is, they went to all that trouble to give Boba his dues in the madalorian, making him extremely smart, calculated and competent...

He now is just coming across as a fraud - a little like some of the theories of him used to be, all the gear no idea and used to luck his way through things.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/13 08:07:09


Post by: Manchu


I love the pun on “Mod” here, very funny stuff. Someone upstream ITT said that Mods belong in an urban setting rather than a frontier cow town. That’s true but of course this is Mos Espa, a sprawling city, rather than Mos Eisely.

Why are people ITT so convinced the rancor is just what meets the eye? Seems fairly clearly set up as another Hutt plot to kill Boba, with Machete even given an ominously ambiguous line.

I really enjoyed getting to see a Wookie go all out ferocious, tearing into throats, slamming people across rooms, etc. It took eight people to defeat Krrsatan — well eight people and a trap door.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/13 08:58:43


Post by: Lance845


 endlesswaltz123 wrote:
I think the main thing that is irking me is, they went to all that trouble to give Boba his dues in the madalorian, making him extremely smart, calculated and competent...

He now is just coming across as a fraud - a little like some of the theories of him used to be, all the gear no idea and used to luck his way through things.


When did he appear smart, calculating, or competent in the Mandolorian? He literally shows up. Wants his armor. Kills some storm troopers. Misses with his backpack rocket doing better then he intended to on accident, and then just does whatever the Mando wants for the rest of the show.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/13 10:05:31


Post by: MarkNorfolk


I'm enjoying the show, but that was a poor episode to watch. I was interested in the Tuskan stuff, but that's been killed off, (just as I was starting to thing the 'Flashback' is the real story) and the awful biker gang acted RADA by graduates like 1983 Doctor Who. That was a really slow, dull chase scene*. The Rancor is cool though. I'm guessing nobody will complain he hasn't got a litter when he rides into town on a Rancor.

*I guess, to be kind, the chase had to be that slow to allow for all the hallmarks of an urban car chase: falling boxes, pedestrians fretting over crossing the street, smashing through something two people are carrying... although to be done properly, the two guys carrying the painting should have dodged all the traffic before accidently damaging it themselves.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/13 10:13:11


Post by: H.B.M.C.


Oh my God! It was the Pykes all along! What a blistering revelation that raised neither my eyebrows nor my heart rate, a bit like that walking-speed speeder chase.

At least the music's good, he said, damning with faint praise...


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/13 10:32:55


Post by: Graphite


 Manchu wrote:
I love the pun on “Mod” here, very funny stuff. Someone upstream ITT said that Mods belong in an urban setting rather than a frontier cow town. That’s true but of course this is Mos Espa, a sprawling city, rather than Mos Eisely.


I'm not the only one who noticed that! Who are the rockers?

Why are people ITT so convinced the rancor is just what meets the eye? Seems fairly clearly set up as another Hutt plot to kill Boba, with Machete even given an ominously ambiguous line.


Really could go either way. We know Rancor form strong bonds, or at least their trainers form strong bonds with them. But if the Hutts gave me a Big Monster... yeah, no way on earth am I going near that thing.

I really enjoyed getting to see a Wookie go all out ferocious, tearing into throats, slamming people across rooms, etc. It took eight people to defeat Krrsatan — well eight people and a trap door.


I think what Boba said to Krrsatan was interesting. Boba has spent his life working for dodgy, or downright evil, people. He's done with that. He doesn't want to be a crime boss because that's what he wants to do. He's just fed up working for people.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/13 10:37:27


Post by: H.B.M.C.


 Manchu wrote:
I really enjoyed getting to see a Wookie go all out ferocious, tearing into throats, slamming people across rooms, etc. It took eight people to defeat Krrsatan — well eight people and a trap door.
The Wookie was sent to kill a man who was asleep in a bacta tank. He failed utterly, and then failed to kill any of the much smaller and weaker people that tried to stop him.

It wasn't a good showing for the Wookie.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/13 10:53:42


Post by: beast_gts


 H.B.M.C. wrote:
 Manchu wrote:
I really enjoyed getting to see a Wookie go all out ferocious, tearing into throats, slamming people across rooms, etc. It took eight people to defeat Krrsatan — well eight people and a trap door.
The Wookie was sent to kill a man who was asleep in a bacta tank. He failed utterly, and then failed to kill any of the much smaller and weaker people that tried to stop him.

It wasn't a good showing for the Wookie.


Black K used to work alongside Boba for Jabba (and then Vader) - it's possible he wanted to give him a fighting chance.

But yeah -
Spoiler:


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/13 11:08:33


Post by: AduroT


To be “fair” to him, Krrsantan comes from blood soaked gladiatorial pits, not a school for stealthy assassins. Shanking a dude in his sleep’s not really his style. And even with the six/seven people fighting him at once, he was holding his own, and only went down thanks to Dues Ex Trapdoor.

Someone earlier mentioned Aphra. It would be interesting to see her, but I don’t think she has any reason yet to be involved. She typically shows up for ancient tech and archaeological stuff. When she briefly met Boba she hard noped right out, and while she hangs out with Krrsantan quit a bit, that’s more just she owes him a ton of money and he follows her around to make sure she doesn’t die before paying him back. She’s ditched people she likes more for less so I doubt she’d care about his shenanigans.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/13 11:32:04


Post by: Albertorius


From now on, I won't be able to think about the city as anything else but Mos Vespa.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/13 11:37:17


Post by: AduroT


All the mentions of Vespa just don’t work for me, because when I think of Vespa I think of FLCL, and the Vespa in that show was WAY faster than these “Speeders”.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/13 11:51:46


Post by: beast_gts


 AduroT wrote:
Im down with the designs of the mod gang on their own, but the idea of them seems poor. Poor street kids with no jobs who can’t even afford water, but did pay who knows how much for all those fancy shiny cybernetics and shiny custom speeders. They look very out of place for their surroundings.

I thought they seemed more like rich kids playing gangsta


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/13 12:17:28


Post by: AduroT


beast_gts wrote:
 AduroT wrote:
Im down with the designs of the mod gang on their own, but the idea of them seems poor. Poor street kids with no jobs who can’t even afford water, but did pay who knows how much for all those fancy shiny cybernetics and shiny custom speeders. They look very out of place for their surroundings.

I thought they seemed more like rich kids playing gangsta


I don’t see rich kids complaining about the price of water in how many weeks of wages it takes to pay for it.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/13 12:20:12


Post by: beast_gts


 AduroT wrote:
I don’t see rich kids complaining about the price of water in how many weeks of wages it takes to pay for it.
Yeah - that's where my theory falls down


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/13 13:37:21


Post by: Manchu


 Albertorius wrote:
Mos Vespa.
Gotttttem! made me smile thx


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/13 14:59:56


Post by: The_Real_Chris


Voss wrote:
Rather than, you know, actually building and protecting a criminal empire from the start, which might have been actually interesting.


I can only assume for Disney reasons the crime boss doesn't do any actual crime...


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/13 15:14:23


Post by: Ork-en Man


Looked like souped up Hover Rounds to me.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/13 15:22:01


Post by: MDSW


I am really on the fence about this series. It just seems the script and plot are so simple and juvenile. Hey, props to Jon Favreau and all, but he needs some help with script writing or something as the dialogue is severely lacking and just not getting any depth after 3 episodes.

Maybe Jon did not write this last one, not sure, but I may bail on this; however, I will give it another episode or two to see if it improves.

Sorry for my possibly unpopular opinion.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/13 16:32:17


Post by: Ouze


 AduroT wrote:
I’m realizing just how sad Boba’s claim to being in charge really is. Like you’d think when he killed Bibb he’d have taken over the operation. Instead it was just him and Fennec. He just kind of showed up by himself and said I own everything now with no organization or backing of any kind. He’s just hollow.


Any man who has to say "I am daimyo" is no daimyo.



The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/13 16:46:46


Post by: Manchu


I would agree that a dedicated writer might make for a better series, overall.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/13 16:59:09


Post by: Voss


 Ouze wrote:
 AduroT wrote:
I’m realizing just how sad Boba’s claim to being in charge really is. Like you’d think when he killed Bibb he’d have taken over the operation. Instead it was just him and Fennec. He just kind of showed up by himself and said I own everything now with no organization or backing of any kind. He’s just hollow.


Any man who has to say "I am daimyo" is no daimyo.



At least he's saying it to more than one person and a robot now, right?

His 'empire' is up to two orcs, a handful of dumb kids, a stereotype and a big dog.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/13 18:53:57


Post by: Geifer


Out of curiosity, for anyone who's not so happy with how Book of Boba is shaping up, would it make a difference how you view it if the show had been named "Bombad Boss Boba" and advertised as a comedy instead? There seem to be a lot of raised eyebrows over stylistic choices and Boba's portrayal as somewhat bumbling. Would it make a difference to you if your expectations had been set accordingly from the beginning?

As for me, I'm still enjoying it. The latest episode had a good few laughs. Danny Trejo's appearance didn't hurt.

The space vespa gang needs more exposition, though. They look entirely too flashy for Tatooine, which isn't really capitalized on except for a bit of attitude the teenage delinquents give old man Boba when they first meet. Might come down the line, I guess.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/13 19:03:57


Post by: AduroT


He’s not bumbling enough to make it an actual comedy, he’s merely inept.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/13 19:41:42


Post by: Voss


 Geifer wrote:
Out of curiosity, for anyone who's not so happy with how Book of Boba is shaping up, would it make a difference how you view it if the show had been named "Bombad Boss Boba" and advertised as a comedy instead? There seem to be a lot of raised eyebrows over stylistic choices and Boba's portrayal as somewhat bumbling. Would it make a difference to you if your expectations had been set accordingly from the beginning?


Well, its certainly part of my problem with the show as is. I expected a confident, experienced and effective individual with a plan. (and people in Jabba's/Bib's organization, or allies in the overall crime syndicate or _something_) Not just trying to fake being the Boss to a handful of people who know better.

He reminds me of Luke at the beginning of New Hope: an idealistic dreamer with no idea how anything really works, or how to accomplish anything beyond 'fly ship.' And it doesn't work for someone who's been kicking around the galaxy for decades, with a reputation strong enough that Darth Vader himself has to caution him about going too far.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/13 23:31:08


Post by: epronovost


 AduroT wrote:
He’s not bumbling enough to make it an actual comedy, he’s merely inept.


I don't think we can call Fett inept in the series so far. In fact, we have spent most of the first three episodes in the past while Fett was living with the Tuskens and the only thing we have actually seen him do in present day is receive the welcomes of his ''supposed'' goons, get challenged by one of them, him making a run to get some money from his lackey which goes perfectly fine, foil a bold assassination attempt by expert assassins, catch a survivor and made him talk, threaten the mayor who wasn't taking him seriously, solve a minor dispute in his territory, recruit a bunch of talented small criminals to bolster his security, foil an assassination by a famous bounty hunter, "get him on his side" and that's it so far. Fett isn't inept at all, he simply hasn't done much beside you starting his new job with the casual routine tasks. He doesn't seem all too surprised he is encountering resistance from his supposed underlings and rivals, but he explicitly doesn't want to go hard on them, trying to win them over by showing off that he is a reasonable and generous man who can make them profit from his business. Fett doesn't want to be a cruel gang lord; he explicitly wants to ''civilize'' the criminal underground of Tatooine. We haven't seen him to enough so far to call him inept, there hasn't been enough time in the three episode so far to say that his action fails or are ill advised. Yes, he is idealist, but that comes with a character whose main motive is changing a bad and firmly entrenched tradition.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/14 01:22:04


Post by: Lance845


Honestly I think the problem at this point is Dave Filoni.

As much as everyone loves him for his work in all the "best" stuff since the prequels, he really only does a couple of things.

1) explain gak that doesn't need explanation for fan service/nostalgia sake. More than anything else Dave Filoni is responsible for Starwars street.

2) Often very simplistic narratives. Especially when you are looking at the over all story. I mean look at Bad Batch? Look at Book of Boba Fett? You get a simple set up and you run down it with as many stops on SW street as you can get.

I think Jon Favreau is responsible for all the best parts of the Mandolorian and I think BoBF is more a DF project than a JF project.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/14 02:54:24


Post by: Voss


epronovost wrote:
 AduroT wrote:
He’s not bumbling enough to make it an actual comedy, he’s merely inept.


I don't think we can call Fett inept in the series so far. In fact, we have spent most of the first three episodes in the past while Fett was living with the Tuskens and the only thing we have actually seen him do in present day is receive the welcomes of his ''supposed'' goons, get challenged by one of them, him making a run to get some money from his lackey which goes perfectly fine, foil a bold assassination attempt by expert assassins, catch a survivor and made him talk, threaten the mayor who wasn't taking him seriously, solve a minor dispute in his territory, recruit a bunch of talented small criminals to bolster his security, foil an assassination by a famous bounty hunter, "get him on his side" and that's it so far. Fett isn't inept at all, he simply hasn't done much beside you starting his new job with the casual routine tasks. He doesn't seem all too surprised he is encountering resistance from his supposed underlings and rivals, but he explicitly doesn't want to go hard on them, trying to win them over by showing off that he is a reasonable and generous man who can make them profit from his business. Fett doesn't want to be a cruel gang lord; he explicitly wants to ''civilize'' the criminal underground of Tatooine. We haven't seen him to enough so far to call him inept, there hasn't been enough time in the three episode so far to say that his action fails or are ill advised. Yes, he is idealist, but that comes with a character whose main motive is changing a bad and firmly entrenched tradition.


Is that his motive? If it is, we can definitely call him inept. He has no lever with which to change entrenched tradition. He has no support, he has no constituents, he has no backers, supporters, wealth, infrastructure, or, well, anything. He can't communicate with some of the people theoretically under his jurisdiction, with others, he has no idea if he's being threatened or not (he was). An army the Hutts don't want to deal with just showed up on his doorstep, and the one person who came to him for assistance, he instantly betrayed.

he simply hasn't done much beside starting his new job with the casual routine tasks.

Yeah, that's part of the problem. He thinks he has a routine when he doesn't even have an organization, can't actually interact with the people he's claiming to be subordinates, and with faced with a hostile force, he feels he has time to play with his new dog.
What part of that shows he isn't an inept buffoon?

trying to win them over by showing off that he is a reasonable and generous man who can make them profit from his business.

???
He showed himself to be completely unreasonable and demanded profits be cut and refused to solve problems.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/14 06:52:18


Post by: Ahtman


Complete conjecture but I wouldn't be surprised if this was all part of some plan to lure the Pykes out and get revenge for the killing of Boba's adopted family of Tusken; he could be a bit more cunning than letting on. In the episode it was the biker gang but wouldn't be surprised to find out later they were contracted by the Pyke to ambush the Tusken.

Of course he could also just be winging it I don't know.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/14 14:24:02


Post by: Voss


In the episode it was the biker gang but wouldn't be surprised to find out later they were contracted by the Pyke to ambush the Tusken.

That honestly seems a given. The bikers are a known, predictable quantity. Boba led Tuskens proved to be an expensive problem.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/14 14:29:22


Post by: Geifer


I'm not even sure it was the bikers. The only proof is the gang graffiti and anyone could put that on a tent. The Pykes might have killed the Tuskens themselves and left the mark there for extra incentive.

Not that it makes much of a difference.

Edit: Actually, it might now that I think about it. Considering what Boba said about scumbag employers, he might be irate to find out that the Pykes killed his tribe directly and then used him to take out the competition, as it would leave the bikers blameless for the massacre. He's now made to kill them out of vengeance when otherwise it would have just been business. That should be a significant difference to Boba.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/14 15:40:18


Post by: Ahtman


Sort of like how in the original Star Wars Stormtroopers tried to make it look like Tusken Raiders hit the Land Crawler and killed a bunch of Jawas.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/15 03:04:05


Post by: Captain Joystick


I'm not very positive on the series thus far.

Spoiler:
I gave the first episode the benefit of the doubt because I thought they were constrained by some kind of mandate demanding they stick to a relatively short runtime, the second episode proved that wasn't the case as it decompressed a bit and gave the tusken story arc room to breathe with great presentation overall, only for all of that to be discarded in the third episode which is somehow even more aggressively lazy than the first, rushing from story beat to story beat until we reach a climactic... low-speed speeder chase.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/16 08:50:56


Post by: StygianBeach


Yeah I am the same. First episode I was a bit doubtful (mainly due to the dismal 'assassination' attempt), second episode I enjoyed.

Third episode was like the first, where the assassination attempt was bizarrely incompetent. I did warm up to the Vespa crew when I saw the Vespas though. They were quite comical and the chase IMO fit tonally, I just hope they killed the guy that ran, or an angry mob did. Otherwise, he just got away with smashing up the city and disrespecting the crime boss.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/17 10:33:27


Post by: Pacific


 warboss wrote:
That was lame. Not even mediocre but plain lame. And the FX of him jetpacking into the crashed speeder scene are worse that fan film quality. And why does every "villain" need to be redeemed or show their fluffy side? First Boba and now the rancor. I suppose the season finale will be how the wampa on Hoth was just epicurious and a very talented gardener during the summer.


That last sentence really did make me laugh, completely get what you mean


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/17 14:46:05


Post by: LunarSol


Finally saw the third episode. The Hutts are good, everything else... not so much.

So, the inciting incident actually had me giggling. First Boba goes up to an NPC and gets a lazily written MMO quest and promises to murder some people for money, then we learn those people already did what he was going to do so... hard to be mad about it.

Again the Hutts were super interesting and as incompetent as everyone seems to be I the new assassination attempt was a little fun and I kind of look forward to rancor riding.

I was all set to feel like the internet was overreacting on the biker gang but... wow, they looked actively terrible and out of place. They feel like they'd be part of a completely different franchise, though a big part of that is just being on Tatooine. Anywhere else and... maybe? Tatooine though has kept a pretty consistent look even in the prequels.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/17 17:59:12


Post by: Geifer


Yeah, I thought they should have done something illustrative with the bikers. I don't have a problem with them per se, and I can well imagine a story for why they look the way they do, but it's something the show fails to actually show. Maybe they will, down the line. Book of Boba has an odd structure to it.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/17 21:11:31


Post by: Voss


 LunarSol wrote:
Finally saw the third episode. The Hutts are good, everything else... not so much.

So, the inciting incident actually had me giggling. First Boba goes up to an NPC and gets a lazily written MMO quest and promises to murder some people for money, then we learn those people already did what he was going to do so... hard to be mad about it.

Again the Hutts were super interesting and as incompetent as everyone seems to be I the new assassination attempt was a little fun and I kind of look forward to rancor riding.

I was all set to feel like the internet was overreacting on the biker gang but... wow, they looked actively terrible and out of place. They feel like they'd be part of a completely different franchise, though a big part of that is just being on Tatooine. Anywhere else and... maybe? Tatooine though has kept a pretty consistent look even in the prequels.

Had they been parked outside the wacky roller-robo-diner in Attack of the Clones, I doubt many would have blinked at them (beyond the complaints that scene already gets).
Maybe the streets of Naboo as well, given the fetish from chrome spaceships.

But part of the Tatooine aesthetic (and the OT in general) is that nothing looks shiny and new. So it looks really weird. If they had been rustlers and poachers riding cyber-hounds or something... well. Honestly there are a lot of options that could have fit if they tried.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/18 13:45:24


Post by: MDSW


I never really got the motive and power behind the Hutts - big, slovenly creatures that need support and help even to move - how did they become this huge criminal organization with all of these followers? Why did not someone knock off the fat bas#@rds long ago?

Maybe it is in the books, as I never caught on in the movies/series.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/18 13:49:28


Post by: AduroT


To be fair they’re big slovenly creatures NOW, but we’ve seen exceptions that show they Can be a physical force capable of wrecking people.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/18 14:00:32


Post by: Mad Doc Grotsnik


 MDSW wrote:
I never really got the motive and power behind the Hutts - big, slovenly creatures that need support and help even to move - how did they become this huge criminal organization with all of these followers? Why did not someone knock off the fat bas#@rds long ago?

Maybe it is in the books, as I never caught on in the movies/series.


Seems they developed interstellar travel quite early on by galactic reckoning. This enabled them to spread to other systems, and co-opt the civilisations therein.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/18 14:41:01


Post by: Jadenim


I don’t know whether it’s in the canon, but I always had it in my head that they were very long lived, so just gained power and wealth by out living people.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/18 16:06:52


Post by: LunarSol


Money. They have money.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/18 16:10:49


Post by: Mad Doc Grotsnik


Also a society setup to exploit their holdings.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/18 16:13:28


Post by: Ahtman


Remember Jabba was originally a human. It was later they decided giant slug was the way to go. It was visually more interesting but also meant having to reverse engineer a backstory as opposed to being like that from the start.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/18 16:17:00


Post by: LunarSol


 Ahtman wrote:
Remember Jabba was originally a human. It was later they decided giant slug was the way to go. It was visually more interesting but also meant having to reverse engineer a backstory as opposed to being like that from the start.


Almost everything in Star Wars is a reverse engineered backstory. It is not a franchise that has ever really had a plan.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/18 16:17:18


Post by: Mad Doc Grotsnik


Hutt Space is pretty large. Pretty much an Empire unto itself. With the Hutts at the top of the pecking order.

When they spread to places like the Outer Rim, it’s entirely likely they have more money and muscle than any existing government structure. So it’s really not until the totalitarian Empire came along that anyone had the numbers, resources and will to really do anything about them.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/18 16:21:34


Post by: Ahtman


 LunarSol wrote:
 Ahtman wrote:
Remember Jabba was originally a human. It was later they decided giant slug was the way to go. It was visually more interesting but also meant having to reverse engineer a backstory as opposed to being like that from the start.


Almost everything in Star Wars is a reverse engineered backstory. It is not a franchise that has ever really had a plan.


No kidding but not everyone marinates in making-of information on films. It isn't a dramatic revelation just a bit of understanding how these things develop and why there is often some oddities.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/18 23:26:59


Post by: endlesswaltz123


The thing with Hurts is, they look slow, they seem slow, but we've never really seen one move quickly when needed too.

A bit like a Dairy cow, you assume they are slow, but when they need too, you don't want to be in the way.

We also have only seen the more indulgent Hutts in the shows, we haven't seen the warrior versions that are apparently fairly muscular.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/19 00:50:37


Post by: Voss


 LunarSol wrote:
 Ahtman wrote:
Remember Jabba was originally a human. It was later they decided giant slug was the way to go. It was visually more interesting but also meant having to reverse engineer a backstory as opposed to being like that from the start.


Almost everything in Star Wars is a reverse engineered backstory. It is not a franchise that has ever really had a plan.


But it had enough space (no pun intended) to drop this stuff in.
Though it becomes weird when they go back to the same tiny pool with the same old characters and/or contradict backstory bits they already worked out. (granted, for a value of 'they' that's actually stupidly complicated)


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/19 08:54:04


Post by: Mad Doc Grotsnik


Chapter 4 was great! And that leitmotif right at the end? Tantalising.

Spoiler:
Surely it’s not just gonna be Dinn though? I reckon we might see him and Bo-Katan et al rock up.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/19 10:02:17


Post by: AduroT


So the flashbacks are done, though it takes the majority of the episodes runtime to wrap them up. Krrsantan’s bit seems odd to me because in the comics he appears to be more of an anything for the money type of dude so I’m surprised he turned down the offer. The last scene on the balcony I just think about the Simpsons meme “Money can be exchanged for goods and services”. I can’t believe he had to be told that right after hiring a guy.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/19 10:02:57


Post by: Formosa


This is the last episode I am going to give this series a chance with, I have a personal rule that if a series does not get good after 4 episodes I just ditch it, older seasons (with 20+ episodes) I used to get half way through a season but in the day and age of 10 or less episode series I just would rather watch something good.

Thus far Boba fett is quite bad.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/19 10:06:34


Post by: AduroT


 Formosa wrote:
This is the last episode I am going to give this series a chance with, I have a personal rule that if a series does not get good after 4 episodes I just ditch it, older seasons (with 20+ episodes) I used to get half way through a season but in the day and age of 10 or less episode series I just would rather watch something good.

Thus far Boba fett is quite bad.


I am still very much on the fence myself, but I would say give it one more after this one, simply because they finally wrap up the flashbacks in this one and I’m curious how it does when focused entirely on the current events.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/19 10:47:02


Post by: Mad Doc Grotsnik


As much as I’ve enjoyed this show, I do suspect it might play better binge watched.

I mean, they’ve a fair amount of ground to cover. Last time we saw Boba, he was disappearing into the Sarlacc. Next, he’s walking up to a critically wounded Fennec.

That’s a gap of around 5 years, give or take. This episode suggests a timescale for how long he was in the Sarlacc, which interestingly seems to contradict that the Jawas took his armour only a few days after the battle that sent it down there in the first place (first mentioned in a pre-sequels set Aftermath novel).

We now reasonably know he was down there for a decent while, and has been out for probably a few months to date (though how much time he spent with the Sand People remains largely undefined).

Whilst it doesn’t feel the flashbacks really worked all that well, I reckon bingeing the whole thing in a oner will turn out to somewhat improve appreciation.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/19 10:47:17


Post by: H.B.M.C.


Well, this one was pretty good.

With the exception of the completely unnecessary "chase the small droid around the kitchen" bit, that is.


The Book of Boba Fett @ 2022/01/19 11:03:16


Post by: AduroT


I would wager he wasn’t in the Pit all that long, he can’t have been without food/water, and it’s more likely he spent some years with the sand people. It’s really hard to pin down the exact timeline because nothing has seemed to take very long.