This thread contains information and rumours about the 10th edition of Warhammer 40k, the Starter Box for that edition, and the rumoured first two armies to appear: Space Marines and Tyranids.
Contributions by other rumourmongers will be included as they appear and by my discretion
The thread is organized chronologically, with the oldest rumours on top and the newest at the bottom, for ease of appending stuff. Since we're pretty much in the phase of official reveals, i removed the thematic summaries at the end of the thread entirely, as they're no longer worth the effort that is needed to maintain them.
As always, please be nice to each other, follow the forum rules, try to stay on topic and don't flood the thread with too many witty one-liners and zingers - i intend to maintain this thread until 10th edition is released, i.e. probably until mid-june or early july, and too much off-topic and oneliners means more workload for me.
If you come across rumours that you want included, just make me aware of them, ideally with a source i can include, and i'll add them to this post at the earliest opportunity.
Big thanks to all the people that regularly contribute rumours, sources and video recaps: dudeface, matrindur, royrobhobgob, xttz
And now for something completely different: the Rumours!
A burner account on Reddit had a lot to say for 2023:
Space Marines 2.0 codex in 2023
- adds jump assault infantry in a shadowspear style release with World Eaters Pending
- "primaris" terminators held back for 10th edition Ambiguous
10th Ed starters feature Blood Angels and Tyranids:
- new "primaris" terminators; jump death company; captain; sanguinary priest False
- broodlord, new genestealers, macrofex, hypergants, zoanthrope HQ False
Blood Angels faction release:
- Sanguinor (Primarch / avatar of sanguinius), lots of cherubs Pending
- Dante (model has been ready since 2019) True
- Death Company chaplain Pending
- Furioso Redemptor Pending
- Sanguinary guard Pending
- Upgrade sprue Pending
Tyranids:
- Macrofex Pending
- Old One Eye (macrofex size) Pending
- Hypergant swarms (105mm base) Pending
- New genestealers Pending
- New hormaguants True
Another burner account on Reddit chimed in with additional rumours:
- The next codex is Votann. True
- Then Kill Team - set on a space hulk, it’s new kasrkin vs Genestealers (old kit with upgrade sprew) True
- Then guard codex. True
- Then world eaters with Angron. True
- After that Space Marines, Chapter Supplements False
- 'Primaris Terminators' in Gravis Armor, Primaris 'Devastators' Ambiguous
- Launch of 10th will be Tyranids with a range refresh like the necrons saw. True
- Opposite them Generic Space Marines with jump pack assault troops and a jump captain (there is likely more units in the box) False
- Generic Marines are painted as Blood Angels as they’re going to poster boy the launch, along with Dark Angels False
- Both will see large Primaris centric updates (including a Lion model). Ambiguous
- Focus on Imperium Nihilus with “Angels of Death” codex nostalgia Pending
- Demons probably before Space Marines codex False
- 10th edition will be 'another game' that is rebuilt 'from the ground up', i.e. a complete redesign instead of an evolution of 9th edition concepts Ambiguous
- Space Marine chapter supplements that were planned for the end of 9th edition have been postponed due to the enormity of the changes, and will instead be released in 10th edition Pending
- Among the chapters mentioned are Iron Hands and White Scars False
- In 10th edition, the separation between Primaris and Firstborn will be removed, including the keywords True
- Thus, 'Space Marines' of all generations will be one faction, removing restrictions on using certain transports etc. on the tabletop, even if the separation remains in the background
There's direct contradiction to parts of that on Bolter and Chainsword; edited for brevity below, full quote in spoilers
-10th edition will come this year, and be an evolution of 9th edition rules Ambiguous
- The stratagem system will be pruned and greatly simplified, to a list of general stratagems and 1 army-specific stratagem per faction. Describes as similar to 30k reactions. True
- This rumour also mentions Codex chapter supplements that will not be coming in 9th edition, but says nothing about them being redone for 10th
- Both the original poster and a second user allude to 11th edition bringing more significant and sweeping stances still, citing GW's reaction speed as reason why 10th will only alleviate, but not solve all problems GW is aware of
[spoiler]
Dudeface wrote: In contradiction, from Orange Knight on B&C:
Hello all
I have recently come to hear some interesting information pertaining to the year ahead.
-10th edition is indeed coming this year, and apparently some information may come to light at Adepticon.
-10th edition will be an evolution of the core rules of 9th edition, not a complete re-write. There are massive changes coming to the stratagem system. Streamlining and significant cutbacks - I heard mention of a dozen generic stratagems for use across all factions, and a single unique strat per army. (To me this sounds like the reaction system in 30k)
-The Codex chapter supplements are not coming in 9th edition (Fists, Iron Hands, Ultras, etc). They were planned for 9th initially but will now be too close to 10th.
Anyways, this all sounded plausible to me. I'm not sure how GW would plan on an evolution of the rules, whilst scrapping all stratagems from the 9th edition books. The unit rules across all faction have been gutted, and their abilities converted to strats. I don't even want to imagine the volume of FAQs and Errata.
heard (2nd hand, so take that as you will) that GW have indeed become aware of the issues with 40k as it currently stands, and that they are aware of the sentiments of many players.
Unfortunately the gears and mechanisms turn slowly, and any significant changes they come up with are probably years away. What gets released is typically 2 years behind what they are working on at any given time. It's why I have become more cynical about 10th edition - I believe that the real change needed probably won't arrive until 11th.
It's why I believe what I was told about the edition being an evolution of 9th. Now, as others have pointed out, the changes could still be significant and just because the core rules aren't changed completely the various codex books could still be invalidated.
This was backed up by Noserenda:
Id heard similar a while back from someone inside, they know the 9th ed codexes got out of hand but couldn't fix it just yet, I expected to see it in the later codexes (I've not been paying much attention to rules recently though) but an edition reset also makes sense.
- 10th edition will be out this year. Another video with evidence for that is announced for next week True
- Starter box is Space Marines vs. Tyranids. True
- Tyranids will get the same range refresh Necrons got True
- Sources he trusts say: Lictors, something called a 'norn emissary bad gaunt' or something like that, neither i nor the youtube subtitle system seem to be able to make out what he tries to say , Lictor Prime, Lictor Alpha or possibly Lector Prime / Lector Alpha - i'm not able to make out if he means Lictor and mispronounces or if he really means Lector. True
- Friends in the paper industry say that there will be a new partworks magazine for 10th edition may be coming / is in the planning stages Pending
- According to sources he trusts 10th edition will come with indexes for all armies True
- From this he concludes that there will be some sort of 'reset', but says he has no ideas how large that reset will be
- He also concludes that the World Eater codex is 'designed according to 10th edition design paradigms'
- Sources he trusts mention June 24th as a release date for 10th edition, citing a lot staff training seminars right before that date Pending
- He cites as additional evidence that the Arks of Omen series will end a month before
- He speculates that Adepticon in March will center on AoO and the Lion, and Warhammer Fest will center on 10th edition True
Additional stuff from Saturday's video i had not yet summarized:
- He actually takes up the Faeit rumours about HH and says that he also has not heard anything about assault infantry for that game
- According to what he heard HH focus is at the moment mainly on vehicles
- Says he has heard nothing specific about the Terminator kit being usable for 30k and 40k both, only that the Termis will be 'chunky'
- Again says new Terminators in 10th edition box set
- Nothing specific about the rumoured 2 army box set for HH
A lot of stuff from the newest video, i pared this summary down by removing stuff we already heard before:
- Promotional art will show them [the starter box miniatures] as Dark Angels and Hive Fleet Leviathan False
- Tyranid players will receive a new model called an Apex Swarmlord Pending
- Narrative does not appear to be a timeskip but expanding on events elsewhere while the Indomitus Crusade battles the Necrons led by the Silent King. Arks of Omen: The Lion will be the first step in a longform narrative chain tying both galactic conflicts together. True
-Core rules are streamlined
- Psychic Phase and Command Phase are combined True
- Toughness is now only on datasheets with a [Heavy Armour] keyword ability. E.g Terminators, Rhinos, Dreadnoughts etc. Generic troops now only roll to hit when attacking and save when defending. False
- Armour Pen. and Invulnerable saves are unchanged. True
- Crusade is being simplified and behaves closer to Age of Sigmars Path to Glory Pending
- Detachments, Battle forging, Stratagems and CP generation have all be simplified or reworked True
- Game is intended to be faster, with smaller units and a much bigger emphasis on terrain True
- Along with the start box there will be a new series of terrain intended to scale from small to medium to large scale games Pending
- The core rules will be free online with two variants. "Narrative" and "Competitive" True
- There is a codex coming for Dark Admech and one new Xenos race Pending
- A second wave of Votann along with a updated codex is expected to launch in September False
- The way Space Marines will receive a codex and rules for Chapters is changing completely and will be explained in a special White Dwarf releasing in May 2023 and closer to release on the Warhammer Community website Pending
- The new edition will also see GW retiring the current range of Texture Paints and they will be replaced with new products using new materials intended to be another Contrast Paint style product to quickly allow beginners in a partnership with 'Screen Products Limited' Pending
Renowned rumourmonger Whitefang on The Grand Alliance called specific parts of the rumour from 02/07/2023 false, namely
>Core rules are streamlined (I hope so, less layers of rules and more polished gameplay)
>Psychic Phase and Command Phase are combined (same as our Hero Phase)False
>Toughness is now only on datasheets with a [Heavy Armour] keyword ability. E.g Terminators, Rhinos, Dreadnoughts etc. Generic troops now only roll to hit when attacking and save when defending. (big change, maybe we could see something like that to make non-500p monsters more durable or even elite units).
True
Dudeface brings us a new batch of rumours about 10th Starter Box content, new Marines and new Tyranids; sligthly edited version here
New Starter Box is called Leonitus Crusade
SPACE MARINES
-1 Primaris Chapter Master (Think Gravis but not haunched over, Power Sword, Bolt pistol)
-1 Primaris Prosecutor (Two-handed axe)
-1 Primaris Noviate Master (Scout Master, Sniper Rifle)
-10 Primaris Space Marine Intervectors (Jump Pack Primaris, Bolter Gauntlets)
-5 Primaris Noviates (Primaris Scouts, Hellblast Shotguns)
-3 Primaris Arduanters (Primaris Terminators, Graviton Hammers, Shields, new type of Gravis Armor)
-3 Primaris Instigators (Pimaris, Shoulder mounted Grav Cannons)
TYRANIDS
-1 Norn-Maleceptrix (Big brain bug, lesser incarnation of the Norn-Queen, able to 'evolve' units. Semi-feminine???)
-1 Tyranid Primus (Big warrior, Two Devourers, Large sword, Claw-whip, boosts)
-1 Lictor (New form of Lictor)
-2 Magistraunt (Mix of Venomthropes and Pyrovore)
-20 Genestealers (New kit, Options for Armored plates and Acid-claws)
-1 Cerebrofex (Blend of Carnifex and Zoanthroap, Smaller Maleceptor)
-3 Genehunters (New type of Warriors, Shock Troopers, made with Space Marine Geneseeds they literally eat.)
New Kits Tyranid kits:
-New Termagaunts and Hormagaunts, dual kit
-New Biovores and Pyrovores, dual kit that now comes in threes
-New dual kit of Cerebrofex and new super-carnifex (Genetics based off old One Eye)
-Three new big monster kits (They say that most Nid players like their big monsters)
-New Red Terror
New Marine Kits:
-Plethora of new Characters to represent old command structure (Think the old resin character models, each one buffs a specific)
-New flying LoW called 'Overlord Dropship', think a smaller Thunderhawk
-New Demolisher Tank,
-New 'Veteran'; unit of Assault Intercessors
-Arduant Kits can make classic Powerfist and Bolter, but with each get a missile launcher on top)
Valrak now calls out these rumours as trolling and says he does not corroborate them
- Says 'names sound ridiculous' for the marine side
- Calls Tyranid stuff out as 'echo chamber' stuff
- Also calls out the Overlord Drosphip especially as made-up because evidence in novels describes them as much larger than Thunderhawks
- Doubles down and says that he doesn't believe anything in these rumours that was not taken from his videos in the first place
- Dark Angels will get some sort of bodyguard unit to go wit Lion'El Johnson called the Lionguard according to trusted sources True
- Blood Angels: Dante is done and shall be revealed soon True
- Speculation about redone Sanguinary Guard Pending
- Still doubling down 100% on SM vs. Tyranids in 10th box set color=green]True[/color]
- Space Wolves: only speculation
- Grey Knights: no rumours
- Other chapters : Cato Sicarius as a focal character in 10th Pending
- Speculation about a new Lysander in new Terminator armour Pending
- Unspecified chapter-specific supplements originally scheduled for 9th will appear in 10th Pending
- New Models in general:
- New Librarian and Terminators in 10th starter color=green]True[/color]
- New Jump Assault Marines are done and will release soon, their models informed the videogame Space Marine II Pending
- Again mentions allowing classic marine transports to transport Primaris in 10th True
- 'Maybe' a new Space Marine flyer, but not the Overlord Pending
xttz brings us a bunch of rumours from a pastebin with unknown originator:
- There's a convoluted system to roll out digital unit profiles for premade units via the App, the online store and Warhammer+, as well as by unlocks from QR codes in other products Pending
- I can't be arsed to make any sense of this, please read the original Pastebin for yourself
- 10th edition will have a box called 'Vigil of Blood' for seasoned players and a 'series of mini starter boxes' that includes paints and tools for newcomers Pending
- There will be 'Grand Tournament Packs' released every year Pending
- The first GT pack is said to include 'mountains of terrain' and to be GW's most expensive box ever Pending
- GT packs include digital materials, an 'extremely tight ruleset', scoresheets, clocks and digital support for scoring etc. Pending
- Codexes for Space Marines, Tyranids, Orks and Demons are in playtesting Pending
- Supplements for Blood Angels, Space Wolves and White Scars are in playtesting Pending
- Starter box contents as per this rumour: False
1 winged jump primaris captain
1 apothecari toxinmaster
5 sword jump primaris
5 veteran intercessors
5 primaris scouts with grenade launchers
1 heavy offroad atv
1 shrike prime
3 shrikes
8 termagants with fleshborer
8 termagants with harpoon
6 melee gargoyles
dreadnought sized trygon
Mosque style low tech buildings, reinforced with scifi tech and walls, improvised and rugged look, some destroyed old columns and centerpiece angel statue, plastic token set
- Complete reset of the rules, though stil D6-based False
- Index exists and is called 'Warhosts' Ambiguous
- Faster rolling, less re-rolls, unit activations less bound by turn structure Pending
- Turn structure and surrounding elements ported from AoS, no double turn Pending
- You only fight on your turn Pending
- Stat ranges limited to D6 rolls False
- Initiative is back, To-Wound-roll is gone False
- Morale is completely changed True
- Stratagems have be bound to units False
- Armour has numerical value and specific attributes against attacks False
In later posts he added
- High enough Initiative allows to interrupt enemies fighting False
- Starter box contains no Terminators False
- Starter box is called 'Vigil of Blood' and will be previewed much earlier than 10th edition rules, may be as early as end of march. False
02/20/2023 'If you see one, there's another' True: 0 False: 1 Ambiguous: 0 Pending: 6
- Tournament rules are a '4th way to play', not a separate game alltogether Pending
- Tournament rules a more standardized form of current GT rules Pending
- Matched play as default way of play Pending
- More support for smaller games Pending
- Narrative play still there Pending
- Open play basically gone, with assets moved to narrative play Pending
- Codex content will have FAQs on day one, everything else is removed: Legends, White Dwarf supplements etc. will no longer be supported False
- Generic Warlord traits, stratagems and relics that all factions have access to Pending
- Indexes on launch, all stratagems, traits and relics will be greatly condensed or removed True
- Subfactions gone, replaced with traits Pending
- Turret rule is generic for all armies Pending
- Objective secure is gone, securing objectives now works by counting wounds in the vicinity, with bonus for troops False
- Psychic powers greatly reduced Pending
- Playtest material only included Marines, Tyranids and Indexes. Pending
02/21/2023 'Bolter and Chainsword strike again' FAKE!
- AoO is not about the Lion, but poster won't say what it is about. - Poster claim access to a box called Strangleweb with a new Warhammer 40k Logo and full of Blood Angels content
- Box has a booklet, two paints and Tyranids as well as Blood Angels
- Tyranid Pheragaunts: Gargoyle-type, two wings, four claws, look 'amphibious' as well as insectoid
- Blood Angel Intervenators: Jump troops with Eviscerators
- Booklet mentions: Captain Lucael, Indomitus Elite Velani, Tyranid Shrikes, Termagants w/ Spike Rifles, Termagants w/ Fleshborers, Scout Squad Sempre - Termagants look similar to Pheragaunts, longer head plates, tubes connecting throat to weapons
- Unit stat block looks a lot like the AoS unit profile: two dials with values for Move, Initiative and Morale - Evade, Save and Wounds
- Some stats are just symbols, units have keywords like 'Sturdy' or 'Light'
- Original post contains more descriptions, weapon profiles etc., please read it up at your convenience: https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/377648-blood-angels-box-set/
In a further post the poster said that he did not take any pictures and is not in physical possession of the book and the box, and he wants to avoid GW's ire.
In another post, Valrak chimed in and called all of this fake. The original poster in turn said that the 5th book in the Arks of Omen series will be centered on the Sanguinor.
- Lion will have 4 head options, including a full helmet, a bare face, a 'cult' version with hood and one with an open visor/semi-covered face True
- Equipped with a sword, possibly the Lion Sword, and a shield True
- Restates again the theory about the Lion already being returned and active in secret, the chamber on the rock is empty
- Says new models, but not the Lion, will be revealed on Warhammer World Open Day, bigger things will be shown at Adepticon True
- Among them: Snikrot, Dante, Farsight, probably main teaser for the Lion True
02/25/2023 'Some random Rumours for Killteam and more' True: 4 False: 0 Ambiguous: 0 Pending: 2
- Apparently a combat/boarding patrol box for Imperial Agents is on the way, including an Eversor assassin, Rogue Trader + retinue and Navis breachers True
- Codex: Imperial Agents probably coming in 10th Pending
- Says a lot of 10th starter box rumours are fake; wants to check with sources he trusts, video to come probably next week
- Primaris Chapter Command box is in the works, contents unclear according to sources he trusts Pending
- Kill Team: new box called 'Ashes of Faith' with possibly chaos cultists Dark Commune against an unspecified enemy, possibly Exodites True
- Beastmen are coming for Kill Team and getting 'lots of love' - could also be in the 'Ashes of Faith' box instead of Dark Commune, not clear yet True
- Warhammer World open day will reveal Farsight, the 4th AoO book, possibly some of the stuff above True
02/26/2023 'The one with the wayward pdf' Completely Fake!
Spoiler:
RoyRobHobGob appears once again, this time giving us a .pdf of many pages with what appears to be a chatlog with somebody with insight into 10th - and possibly evidence of not quite legal activity.
- Terminators "huge thing" in the boxset, no info if Primaris or Firstborn True
- Terminator Chaptain and Terminator Librarian True
- Bulky, more action poses
- 'Incinerators' new flame squad, like Black Templar Pyreblaster True
- New Veteran Squad, "more ranged type" True
- New ranged only Dreadnought, lascannons and rockets, maybe "chonkier" True
- This one for range, Redemptor as middle ground and brutalis as melee version
- No jump assault marines, will be coming but not in boxset, no idea when True
- Generic ultramarines paint scheme True
- Still gathering Tyranid info, another video in the next weeks
Thanks again to Matrindur for pointing it out and basically writing the summary for me!
03/03/2023 'With a little help from my friends' Fake
- ClockWorkChris (leaked CSM codex among other stuff) says it may be based on real info, but not as extreme. Differences may be due to machine translation
- Korkin (leaked Tyranid & Daemon codex details) says he cannot confirm or deny 10e rules leaks.
- Says that 'something like Indexes' was coming, but does not want to use the term 'Index' as it is too loaded; implies 10th 'Index' will not be the same as at start of 8th edition
03/04/2023 'I did it thirty-five minutes ago'
Spoiler:
For those interested in the leaked document, i took the trouble to boil the ~1500 lines of text down to a more readable 150, removing a lot of convoluted examples, off-topic waffling and stuff that is likely to change anyway or of little relevance like the naming conventions for matched play and such. I also rearranged some things to make for more coherent reading.
Valrak got more info on Tyranids in the 10th starter box - note that Valrak mixes general stuff with box-specific content:
- 'Two to three new types of Gaunts' he does not know the name of True
- New Hormagaunts True
- Vemon Crawler type unit in the vein of a 'Brainbug' True
- New Screamer Killer Carnifex. True
- New Lictors True
- Winged Warrior; unclear if it's multiple or singular, so possibly the HQ opposite the captain True
- New Biovores True
- Plastic Spore Mines, have a 'chunkier' version Pending
- Norn Emissary beefed up Zoanthrope True - other name
- After the box, Tyranids get 'a full range refresh' True
- New Genestealers later on, possibly in another boxed set, possibly Space Hulk or Space Hulk themed Kill Team box w/ new Terminators Pending:
- claims he never said that the starter box will be Tyranids vs. Blood Angels Ambiguous: he claimed it was Dark Angels!
- says the whole BA rumour came from a reddit post and he only commented on it True
- stuff from his sources said that it was Ultramarines vs Tyranids/Leviathan and the box is called Leviathan True
- says there have been rumours for a Space Hulk box set, and we will probably get it, but 'this is not it' because Blood Angels are 'iconic' with Space Hulk Pending
- speculates that the Tyranid in the trailer/poster is probably a new warrior model
- he has heard that Dark Angels are going to get a range refresh, separate video on that coming soon Pending
- further speculates about the fluff text about the western fringe meaning it relates to the 10th edition box set True
- says 'whispers' have told him about new Blood Angel and Space Wolf boxsets Pending
- again says that sources he trusts say that Dante is done True
- speculates that Dante may be released in a boarding patrol or sth. like that Pending
Outside of Valrak's video, rumourmonger korkin has checked with their sources, and now says the 50-page-leak is probably legit, but from a non-final version:
- The next big Kill Team box will be Votann vs. Beastmen according to sources he trusts True
- 'So much more stuff' is coming for KT, Eldar, Space Marines etc. Pending
- Campaign book 'Cthonia' coming for HH, campaign involving Sons of Horus and Imperial Fists True
- Tank commander models for the legions True
- Forge World Knights going plastic according to sources he trusts True
- 'Maybe' hints at Epic as Horus Heresy Epic False
- Epic coming at the end of the year according to sources he highly trusts Pending
- Adeptus Titanicus titans and Aeronautica planes are going to be wrapped into Epic
- Age of Sigmar: Cities of Sigmar are getting a box set reveal Ambiguous
- Blablabla the Lion is coming reiterated for the n-th time
- Dante speculated to be revealed at Adepticon
- More boarding patrols: Agents of the Imperium, Nurgle
- Maybe a trailer for the CGI trailer for 10th edition True
- Apparently stuff is hidden in the background of teaser images
- Mainly about the '1 week to go' Adepticon teaser image
- The left side is a Tyranid symbol, duh
- Valrak concludes from this that they'll show the 10th edition trailer at Adepticon True
It feels to me like we're in the phase where we are probably just threading water before the upcoming official stuff
03/21/2023 'Plots so thickened you'd need a chainsword to cut them'
Spoiler:
GW has taken down the old Warhammer 40k website and replaced it with this:
So very probably that's when the official 10th edition announcement is going to drop.
- Blood Angels and Dark Angels are getting significant new stuff, videos on that in the coming week Pending
- Kill Team is getting a plastic Striking Scorpion versus Space Marine Scouts set. Pending
- Seraphon range is dual use Lizardmen for TOW apparently False
- The dude with the two knives in the trailer is actually a special character from the Starter Box True
- Everything in the trailer will get a model True
- New Space Marine Veterans unit with combi weapons True
- Next week more BA and DA rumours
- Space Hulk rumours also next week
- Valrak himself will be on holiday, the videos are pre-recorded, so no livestreams etc.
03/28/2023 'When the Lion is away his Guard come out to play'
Spoiler:
Reddit/Discord are teasing a box of Lion's Guard someone claims to have gotten by accident:
03/29/2023 'It's on'!
Spoiler:
New short video from Valrak: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b4wruO7lmig Mostly just talking about the disappointing Lion's Guard box, but he mentions that there apparently is a complete leak of the 10th edition book online somewhere, so be prepared!
- Space Marines will get 'a lot of love' in 10th edition (duh) Pending
- Starter Box is just step one Pending
- 'End of Summer' second wave for SM, September/August True
- 'Huge Refresh' for Dark Angels, Blood Angels, Space Wolves Pending
- Dark Angel stuff is from a source he trusts 100% Pending
- Blood Angel and Space Wolf stuff is from a new source Pending
- BA and SW will receive boxed sets Pending
- Dante probably in a boxed set, presented at Warhammer fest (speculation) Pending
- He 'knows' Epic Horus Heresy will be shown of at Warhammer Fest Pending
- Dark Angel box set with brand-new Sammael and Belial (unclear if old or new model) Pending
- Second wave will also include separate kits for the stuff in the 10th box set Pending
- Sanguinary guard: personally believes they'll come, but has no concrete information Pending
- 'Everyone' will get a range refresh like Black Templars: a few units, upgrade frames and a few characters Pending
- Says that will occupy the first half (!) of 10th edition Pending
04/06/2023 'My store owner said'...
Spoiler:
We are now getting the first reports of an official release date, albeit second-hand so far. Thanks to Grzzldgamerps5 for reporting!
Grzzldgamerps5 wrote: The store owner, at my local independent game store, got some memo from GW. He said preorders for 10th starts the last week of May and will be a three week extended preorder window. Has anyone else heard this?
The last saturday in May is 27/05, counting three weeks from there gets us to June 17th, which falls one week short of our so-far best estimate of June 24th, but if we interpret 'Last week of May' as the week after that one, with the saturday being June 3rd, we're landing spot-on.
Also, as godswildcard helpfully points out, the Show-Me Showdown, a large Wargaming convention held in Kansas City July 14-16th, will be using 10th edition rules already, which gives us an upper limit for a release date: https://www.showmeshowdowngt.com
- Sources he trusts say Dark Angels range refresh is coming Pending
- Can't say when Pending
- Size comparable to what the Black Templars got Pending
- Mentions Belial, Ezekiel and Asmodai as characters that will get new models Pending
- Arks of Omen story supports this, as Belial is mortally wounded in AoO: Lion and can probably only be saved by crossing the Rubicon Primaris Pending
- Speculation about Grey Knights range refresh in 10th Pending
- Every SM special character currently in TDA will get a new model treatment (duh) Pending
- Valrak has official permission to film on and stream from Warhammerfest
- Kits from the 10th box set will be released separately at 'the end of summer', which is also when new models will appear Pending
- New chaplain in TDA at this point Pending
- Nothing on Melee Terminators yet
- A trusted source says 'classic' box dreadnoughts and landspeeders will be relegated to Legend rules True
- This was the same source that brought the rumours about SM transports being open to Primaris and vice versa in 10th edition
- Apparently SM codex in ca. August True
- Possibly includes dedicated Primaris Scout Landspeeder Pending
- He has heard 'some things' about Blood Angels, but only about small stuff, no real range refresh yet
- His speculation is that it will be Sanguinary guard modelled to fit in with the new Dante
- Warhammer 40k preview will probably something more than the starter box False
- Trusted source again confirms 24th June as release date, with 10th of June as the start of the preorder window Pending
- Potentially sneak peeks at the first codexes at the event
- New Terminator Chaplain False
- 4-5 new units for Space Marines False
- Also 'most' of the Tyranid refresh False
- Still speculating about a possible HH:Epic reveal tied to the HH reveal on Sunday (apply salt as needed) True
- Just waffling about The Old World, no real idea what is going to get revealed
- He was told that 'by the end of the year something big was coming, something huge, that would shake the foundations' with no more information (duh) Pending
- Trusted source says Bretonia vs. Tomb Kings for starter box Ambiguous
- Kill Team: Restating Ashes of Faith as a box nameTrue
- Eldar vs. SM Scouts in some form is another rumour he heard Pending
- He thinks Terminators vs. Genestealers is a strangly absent 'classical' pairing that would make sense just now
- WarhammerFest will have four factions on display: Ultramarines, Leviathan, Goff Orks and Iyanden Eldar
- Marines with two new Squads: Spearhead Veterans, Incinerators
- Tyranids with Tyrannotrope and Screamer-Killer
- nothing new for Orks, new Waaagh rules, boss buffs for units they join
- nothing new for Eldar, nerfs accross the board, faction ability is a 'gutted' version of Battle Focus (move only one unit at the end of Shooting phase, no bonus to Assault weapons)
- Warlocks and Farseers 'really bad'
- Strands of Fate gone entirely
- Wraith units lose one point of toughness, no more damage reduction abilities
04/29/2023 'Warhammer Fest
Spoiler:
Current 40k roadmap:
05/02/2023 'Carry on my wayward son' True: 0 False:0 Ambiguous:0 Pending: 5
Release date June 24th with 2 week preorder starting June 10th True
Together with SM/Tyranids codex:
Chaplain in Terminator armour Pending
Prime Swarmlord (not from his sources) Pending
Dark Angels range refresh with Belial Pending
Blood Angels will get something, heard Sanguinary Guard Pending
For Space Wolves he heard about a new boxset Pending
Second Waves like Orks got for Aeldari and Votann (Votann may also get a Land Train for Necromunda)
- 'Two or three' Space Marines codexes in 10th edition Pending
- We 'know for a fact' that a new Terminator Chaplain will release with the codex Pending
- Speculation: Terminator Apothecary
- Speculation/Wishlisting: New SM flyer
- Speculation: every Terminator character/special character will get a new model
- Speculation: Grey Knights get a new terminator kit (duh)
- Speculation: new Kaldor Draigo
- Specualtion: not much for Space Wolves in 10th
- unsubstantiated rumours about Sanguinary Guard and Blood Angels stuff
- many rumours about Dark Angels
- Range refresh in the vein of Black Templars coming Pending
- Apparently some Deathwing miniatures were absent for photoshoots, from which he concluded that those that were not will be replaced Pending
- Speculation: one Primarch will return per year Pending
- Fulgrim is obvious among the next ones to return Pending
- KT box will include Space Marine Scouts vs. Striking Scorpions Pending
- Definitely new Plastic Striking Scorpions Pending
- Also new SM Scouts in plastic, similar to Neophytes Pending
- Potentially second wave of Eldar coming after this Pending
- Kill Team: Space Hulk is rumoured Pending
- New Genestealers with this Pending
- Valrak says that he 'always' said that new Genestealers will come with this, instead of the Tyranid range refresh provably false, as this tracker shows
- Genestealers will be the new side in a second-wave box of this new season, Terminators will be the side that gets upgrades to existing models Pending
- mentions Thunderhammers, Lightning Claws and such Pending
- Speculation about Dark Angels theme for the Terminators as part of the DA range refresh Pending
- Fire Overwatch known - Go to Ground: 1 CP, Benefit of Cover AND 6+ Invulnerable Save,
- Rapid Ingress known - Grenade: no details given
- Smoke Screen: Benefit of Cover and Stealth USRs - Command Re-Roll: no details given
- Counter Offensive: no details given
- Insane Bravery: no details given
- Heroic Intervention: 2CP, allows for a charge move of one of your non-Vehicle units after enemy charged one of your units within 6'', no charge benefits though
- Epic Challenge: no details given
- Tank Shock: no details given
- New Tactic Mission if you're playing with them
05/17/2023 'Ford Prefect'
Spoiler:
Dudeface makes us aware of what seems to be a rulebook leak:
- Preorder stuff: preorder day 10th of June confirmed by sources he trusts True
- Two week preorder phase True
- Leviathan box set is only going to be available while stocks last True
- No information about a later MtO
- There will be a queue on the website True
- Limited to two copies per person True
- Price point 200€/1500DK/1800SK/1650NOK True
- The entire month of June will be hyping up free products that you can download
- 2nd of June: core rules and quickstart guide True
- 5th of June: Leviathan datasheets True
- 8th of June: Tyranid datasheets True
- 9th of June: SM datasheets True
- 12th of June: non-codex SM datasheets True
- 13th of June: Chaos SM datasheets True
- 14th of June: Imperium datasheets True
- 15th of June: Xenos datasheets True
- 16th of June: GT packs and points list Ambiguous
- 20th of June: Datasheets for Combat Patrol Pending
- 23rd of June: Boarding Patrol and Crusade material Pending
- Norn Emissary will be a dual kit with a Norn Assimilator Pending
- Terminator Ancient model is coming Pending
- The new 'Epic' will be Warhammer Horus Heresy Legion Imperialis Pending
- Different rules than Epic and I think he means more changes than just a new edition Pending
- Box with Space Marines vs Imperial Army theme, which sounds strange but is from a trusted source Pending
- No specific release date just probably end of summer Pending
- New source about Amazon stuff:
- Cavill wants to do a Eisenhorn series, first season follows the first book.Pending
- He won't be an actor in this show but will probably be some bigger role in the future?Pending
- The Man in the High Castle writers are working on this show as well. Pending
- There will be another anthology-style animation show, 'like Warhammer+, but better' with Blur studios Pending
- Timescale for release is 11th edition launch Pending
Thanks again to Matrindur for making the recap and bringing it to us.
Edit 06/14/2023 'Soldier of 4chan'
Some rumours from 4chan, take with the appropriate barge-load of salt:
- Tyranid wave will incoroporate ''several waves that had been delayed in previous editions''
- Around 8-12 new kits for normal units
- On top of that, what was at one point aimed to be a ''Codex Biotitans'' with 3-4 knight-sized monsters
- ''Another huge wave'' on top of that for 10th edition proper
- And further additional releases for Killteam, Genestealer Cults and ''another Nid character with a Campaign later on''
Edit 06/16/2023 'MoreChan'
We get a huge list from the same person that brought the rumours on 06/14:
Spoiler:
Termagant/Hormagaunt dual-kit
The Hormagaunts have a different head that looks like little Von Ryan's Leapers without the tentacles, has the disgusting spidery mandibles.
Gargoyle/Nightgaunt dual-kit
Comes with a melee variant now, look like little Hive Crones. Wings are back in the middle slots again.
Von Ryan's Leapers/Reaper-Slayers dual-kit
Alt build with "anti-armour claws" (my source is assuming, there was no look at the rules), head looks a little like old dickbeak warriors.
Biovore/Pyrovore dual-kit
You all saw this coming. They're a bit bigger now apparently, otherwise look "how you'd expect".
Screamer-Killer/Razorfex dual-kit
Alt build with heavier claws, completely different head but no plasma spit. Oh, and it can be built as Old One Eye.
Carnifex/Thornback dual-kit
Yeah. There are four fething carnifex variants across two different boxes. These ones have all the gun options but they still have talons. Back-guns as well.
Warrior/Shrike dual-kit
As you probably expected by now. Wings go in the middle slots just like with the new Prime and Gargoyles.
Ravener/Ingester dual-kit
Comes with a variant like a mini-mawloc, no guns smaller arms but huge jaws.
Malefactor/Dactylis dual-kit
Similar to the Exocrine/Haruspex, the front head area completely changes depending on the creature, back either has the transport sacs for things being carried inside or the spore growth sacs. Big front arms positioned in reverse for the Dactylis variant.
Norn Emissary/Norn Assimilator dual-kit
You've probably already heard this thing described at this point. It's effectively a plastic dimachaeron. The assimilator variant has the stomach mouth thing on the Dimachaeron, the Emissary has back tentacles and gak.
Hive Tyrant/Swarm Tyrant dual-kit
There's now a generic version of the Swarmlord that you can take multiple of, somehow this is different from the standard Hive Tyrant and also the Swarmlord itself which can be built using this kit, much like Old One Eye can be made from the Razorfex. But wait. Just hold on. Keep reading.
Tyranid Prime
Comes with the non-winged variant. So I guess technically this is also a fething dual-kit lol.
Deathleaper
Already revealed. It's NOT a dual-kit with the Lictor surprisingly. Guess we're done with those.
Lictor
Basically smack in between the Von Ryan's and the new Deathleaper you've seen, long tail.
Purestrain Genestealer/Ymgarl Stealers dual-kit
Oh just kidding we weren't done with dual-kits. Ymgarls have a fuckload of tentacles, apparently some coming out of the arms too not just the face.
Alright, on to the big stuff...
Viragon
Replaces the Trygon Prime, super-heavy snake bug. More heavily armour plated, enormous mandibles.
Viciator
Big four-legged bio-titan thing with huge wide back plates extending past the sides of the body. Similar to the Hierophant although not as big, more upright body. Head is tucked in and protected under the shell. Arms are fused into one big gun. Apparently has several gun options.
Skorpiodule
8-legged bio-titan. Yes you heard that correctly. It breaks the normal conventions of 6-legs because it is two huge creatures fused together, so it has 12 limbs in total - 8 legs and 4 arms holding weapons, 2 tails (both ending in weapons), and a disgusting fused head with two mouths stacked one above the other like this old Tyranid art. Apparently just fething bristling with disgusting parasitic gak.
And lastly...
The Harbinger
It's not Swarmlord. It's his bigger pissed off brother. They literally Bigger Batman'd him like Primaris. Described to me as like "one of the sculptors must have watched Shin Godzilla and then went to town, it's got another head coming out of the end of the tail".
Edit 06/19/2023
Another video, this time with rumours for a bunch of stuff: https://youtu.be/pou10BZl6tU - Jump Assault Marines are coming with the launch of the SM codex
- Jump Assault Intercessors, to be specific
- Jump Assault Captain
- Terminator Chaplain (most repeated rumour ever )
- Terminator Ancient
- Brand new Biovore for Tyranids
- New Genestealers
- Killteam/Spacehulk ambiguous mumblings
- Horus Heresy: Legion Imperialis based on Epic, but not 'officially Epic'
- Release date: at the end of summer, around same time as SM/Tyranid Stuff (doubtful)
- Warhammer: TOW
- Advises huge amount of salt: TOW launch box set is the last release of this year
- Early next year books and stuff for the non-starter ranges
Edit 06/22/2023 Short update: xttz brings us Discord Rumours that Imperial Armour Datasheets will be released tomorrow.
Why the heck would there be new Firstborn, unless this is a historic box set, and why would a historic set with a plot that isn't relevant to the current setting and models that aren't relevant to the current setting be the starter for a new edition?
lord_blackfang wrote: Why the heck would there be new Firstborn, unless this is a historic box set, and why would a historic set with a plot that isn't relevant to the current setting and models that aren't relevant to the current setting be the starter for a new edition?
That makes me doubt that rumour too...unless the box is some reincarnation of Space Hulk for 40th anniversary.
This feels like a complete list of things that you would want to see but time and again doesn't happen. And mostly just because GW refuses to make those models for some weird reason, not because the models don't need an update or wouldn't sell.
lord_blackfang wrote: Why the heck would there be new Firstborn, unless this is a historic box set, and why would a historic set with a plot that isn't relevant to the current setting and models that aren't relevant to the current setting be the starter for a new edition?
The only reason for new Terminator models for real Marines I can think of that's halfway plausible is that Dark Angels actually get their Primarch and with them as the poster boys next edition, GW wants to provide modern models for Deathwing which, as I understand it, is still largely free of Primaris?
Deathwing Terminators are quite new though- they have 6th or 7th edition kit. So do Blood Angels. The basic kit is much older, I want to say 4th edition? Maybe 3rd.
Haighus wrote: Deathwing Terminators are quite new though- they have 6th or 7th edition kit. So do Blood Angels. The basic kit is much older, I want to say 4th edition? Maybe 3rd.
4th ed for the basic plastic Terminators. And yes, the Deathwing kit is fairly new, but it's in the style of the earlier Terminators. The one thing Terminators need more than anything is a fix to their anatomy which is something present day GW might actually be interested in. New Cadians, Traitor Guard and all that, redone Chaos Marines (let's not talk about their Terminators, though...). Marines have moved on from pre-Primaris times, and not just them. I'd consider that reason enough for a redo.
Plus, it's loyalist Marines. If the kit is ten years old, it's made GW plenty of money and there's no harm in replacing it.
Or they've realised they can fit a primaris marine inside terminator armour if they stretch the joints a little? At some point we all know there will be a consolidation/flattening of the curve.
Dudeface wrote: Or they've realised they can fit a primaris marine inside terminator armour if they stretch the joints a little? At some point we all know there will be a consolidation/flattening of the curve.
As a fan of Terminators I just hope that the sculptors do what they no doubt did before and just make the models (provided the end up looking good, of course) and not even bother to think up any pretext. Let the fluff writers sort out how to deal with that. Which, I'm sure, is going to be messy after the Primaris fluff for upscaled Marines in new marks of armor they came up with. But like I said, for once I'm just hoping that GW does what they always do, let the sculptors do their thing and not worry about what the rules and fluff writers think.
While Valrak has been right with some rumours before, it's worth pointing out that it was also this time last year that he said Tyranids would get "updated gaunts and other refreshed models" with their then-upcoming codex for 9e.
Although I guess if you keep mentioning obvious releases long enough they'll show up sooner or later...
xttz wrote: While Valrak has been right with some rumours before, it's worth pointing out that it was also this time last year that he said Tyranids would get "updated gaunts and other refreshed models" with their then-upcoming codex for 9e.
Although I guess if you keep mentioning obvious releases long enough they'll show up sooner or later...
If they don't want terminators to look ridiculous they'll need to redesign the legs and shoulder area anyway. Given that some thought the new Azrael was "firstborn" I don't put much stock in eye witnesses descerning the status of new marine minis. It should be noted that Jes Goodwin himself said they made the heads and shoulder pads of primaris the same size as before in order to mix and match parts. Primaris wearing some form of TDA would be in line with this.
RazorEdge wrote: Why should they bring new Terminators for the Older Marines instead for the Primaris.
Just make the fluff reflect that primaris can fit in terminator armour and both types of marine can use it, one kit = whatever narrative you want.
Would that even work for GW? In this scenario I imagine the kit has to come with different arms so the Primaris version doesn't use stormbolters. So mundane a bolt weapon that its profile is shared with other units? Yuck!
And you'll have two different datasheets where the Firstborn have weapon options and can ride a Land Raider and the Primaris versions don't and can't.
Terminators are an iconic part of Space Marines and 40k in general. I very much doubt GW would throw that particular baby out with the bathwater, so will likely keep their aesthetics with "And now Primaris work with them because we say so!".
More iconic than mk 7 or mk 6 before it? More iconic than their 40 year old fantasy setting? They've already redesigned terminator armour twice with the Heresy and it was fine. Doubtless the reaction would be different if it were Primaris.
Haighus wrote: Deathwing Terminators are quite new though- they have 6th or 7th edition kit. So do Blood Angels. The basic kit is much older, I want to say 4th edition? Maybe 3rd.
4th ed for the basic plastic Terminators. And yes, the Deathwing kit is fairly new, but it's in the style of the earlier Terminators. The one thing Terminators need more than anything is a fix to their anatomy which is something present day GW might actually be interested in. New Cadians, Traitor Guard and all that, redone Chaos Marines (let's not talk about their Terminators, though...). Marines have moved on from pre-Primaris times, and not just them. I'd consider that reason enough for a redo.
Plus, it's loyalist Marines. If the kit is ten years old, it's made GW plenty of money and there's no harm in replacing it.
I was very disappointed in the new Chaos Terminators. They had a chance to make them look a lot more interesting, like the Legionnaires, especially since I think they nailed it with Abaddon. Here's hoping that there's a new kit with realistic proportions.
Biovores, pyrovores and lictors/deathleaper in new plastics have been on the cards for what feels like forever. I was actually surprised we got the Parasite instead of one of those two options.
GW seem to have this strange view of updating everything to plastic and then just leaving a tiny handful of models in finecast in each model range.
It's doubly confusing considering that Tyranids haven't had a slot for years - which isn't a bad thing all told as they got some big updates and are generally in a good spot, its just a thorn in the side that those kits havn't been updated.
RazorEdge wrote: Why should they bring new Terminators for the Older Marines instead for the Primaris.
Just make the fluff reflect that primaris can fit in terminator armour and both types of marine can use it, one kit = whatever narrative you want.
Kind of hard to make armour that fits head taller and shorter guys at the same time without even affecting height of armour
Keep the backplate and arms the same, and have a pair of frontplates- a traditional terminator styled one, and a primaris version which includes a bit of spacer at the bottom to extend the torso slightly from the hips, making it taller. Then different helmet designs- classic vs gravis styled.
lord_blackfang wrote: Why the heck would there be new Firstborn, unless this is a historic box set, and why would a historic set with a plot that isn't relevant to the current setting and models that aren't relevant to the current setting be the starter for a new edition?
I don't think they mean they will be firstborn, fluff wise. They will almost certainly be Primaris marines wearing Tactical Dreadnaught Armour, just bigger. I think it just means that the armour will resemble traditional TDA, rather than being a redesign that would probably be Mark X with a bit more shoulderpad and neckbracing bolted on.
I think it's fairly clear from Vashtorr that Valrak's source sees the models but doesn't necessarily get to see the design studio's fluff. They might be a photographer or graphic designer etc.
Really I am just taking from this that there will be new, bigger Terminators, and they will still look like Terminators rather than any kind of fundamental reimagining.
lord_blackfang wrote: Why the heck would there be new Firstborn, unless this is a historic box set, and why would a historic set with a plot that isn't relevant to the current setting and models that aren't relevant to the current setting be the starter for a new edition?
I don't think they mean they will be firstborn, fluff wise. They will almost certainly be Primaris marines wearing Tactical Dreadnaught Armour, just bigger. I think it just means that the armour will resemble traditional TDA, rather than being a redesign that would probably be Mark X with a bit more shoulderpad and neckbracing bolted on.
I think it's fairly clear from Vashtorr that Valrak's source sees the models but doesn't necessarily get to see the design studio's fluff. They might be a photographer or graphic designer etc.
Really I am just taking from this that there will be new, bigger Terminators, and they will still look like Terminators rather than any kind of fundamental reimagining.
Best case is they just rescale the 'classic' look, make up some fluff about how the genius of Cawl solved the problem of Primaris in Termi armor, throw some modern-era weapons like Neo-Volkites and Combi-Gravs in the mix, add another alternative to the Cyclone like maybe a force field or whatever, raise the price and call it a day
Dudeface wrote: Or they've realised they can fit a primaris marine inside terminator armour if they stretch the joints a little? At some point we all know there will be a consolidation/flattening of the curve.
As a fan of Terminators I just hope that the sculptors do what they no doubt did before and just make the models (provided the end up looking good, of course) and not even bother to think up any pretext. Let the fluff writers sort out how to deal with that. Which, I'm sure, is going to be messy after the Primaris fluff for upscaled Marines in new marks of armor they came up with. But like I said, for once I'm just hoping that GW does what they always do, let the sculptors do their thing and not worry about what the rules and fluff writers think.
That's what they did and how we got the mess we have, from my understanding. The miniature designers wanted to change direction with marines and the best the lore writers could come up with was what we've got.
I don't believe there'll be 'non primaris' terminators but everything else seems plausible. Any other Tyranid stuff getting long in the tooth?
Dudeface wrote: Or they've realised they can fit a primaris marine inside terminator armour if they stretch the joints a little? At some point we all know there will be a consolidation/flattening of the curve.
As a fan of Terminators I just hope that the sculptors do what they no doubt did before and just make the models (provided the end up looking good, of course) and not even bother to think up any pretext. Let the fluff writers sort out how to deal with that. Which, I'm sure, is going to be messy after the Primaris fluff for upscaled Marines in new marks of armor they came up with. But like I said, for once I'm just hoping that GW does what they always do, let the sculptors do their thing and not worry about what the rules and fluff writers think.
That's what they did and how we got the mess we have, from my understanding. The miniature designers wanted to change direction with marines and the best the lore writers could come up with was what we've got.
I don't believe there'll be 'non primaris' terminators but everything else seems plausible. Any other Tyranid stuff getting long in the tooth?
Gaunts/raveners/carnifex are 4th Ed or older iirc?
GW materials don't agree on the height of marines. Hundreds of arguments about marine heights exist, both pre and post primaris. If you think marines are X.X meters and primaris are Y.Y meters, you're almost certainly wrong, or at least contradicted by at least one book.
In any case there are two routes of obvious solutions:
fluff retcon- Cawl and techmarines refine the primaris process and drain excess growth hormone so primaris going forward lack their aberrant height. Alternately, they use primaris fluids to boost the height of non-primaris marines. Insert whatever 'yadda yadda' works with your headcanon- GW can just change the actual 'canon' anyway.
model rescale (which happens, both intentionally or not). New terminators are more bigger.
GW materials don't agree on the height of marines. Hundreds of arguments about marine heights exist, both pre and post primaris. If you think marines are X.X meters and primaris are Y.Y meters, you're almost certainly wrong, or at least contradicted by at least one book.
In any case there are two routes of obvious solutions:
fluff retcon- Cawl and techmarines refine the primaris process and drain excess growth hormone so primaris going forward lack their aberrant height. Alternately, they use primaris fluids to boost the height of non-primaris marines. Insert whatever 'yadda yadda' works with your headcanon- GW can just change the actual 'canon' anyway.
model rescale (which happens, both intentionally or not). New terminators are more bigger.
Done.
The height isn't the issue it's the proportions. All space marine armour pre primaris is designed for 80's era minis.
GW materials don't agree on the height of marines. Hundreds of arguments about marine heights exist, both pre and post primaris. If you think marines are X.X meters and primaris are Y.Y meters, you're almost certainly wrong, or at least contradicted by at least one book.
In any case there are two routes of obvious solutions:
fluff retcon- Cawl and techmarines refine the primaris process and drain excess growth hormone so primaris going forward lack their aberrant height. Alternately, they use primaris fluids to boost the height of non-primaris marines. Insert whatever 'yadda yadda' works with your headcanon- GW can just change the actual 'canon' anyway.
model rescale (which happens, both intentionally or not). New terminators are more bigger.
Done.
The height isn't the issue it's the proportions. All space marine armour pre primaris is designed for 80's era minis.
So? They can do what they did with the HH Mk6 and change it. Nothing in this process is immutable.
Tyranids also really could do with a plastic lord of war option. In fact, of all the races they're the one that specialises in large monstrous creatures. There's so much GW could do with a Tyranid lord of war so I'm hoping it's on the agenda.
Frankly, I would love a couple of units of larger, more in-scale Terminators for the Firstborn.
But, if indeed the box set is Nids vs Termies, it may have bunch to do with Boarding Actions becoming a mainstream part of 40k.
Consider:
Space Hulk is always popular when it is re-re-re-released (or is it re-re-re-re-released?) and people who own it tend to play it a lot. Boarding Actions is essentially bringing Space Hulk into the whole of 40k with no limits to who can invade what, and I can see 500-1000 point tournaments focusing on this.
Also:
Biovores seed rooms and corridors with spore mines, Lictors emerge from walls/concealed areas as usual. Pyrovores are just industrial strength flamethrowers who can blow open parts of walls to allow the happy little genestealers to go play with the marines.
10th Edition may end up being a tweaking of the current rules (no new codicies needed, jut a couple of updates) and the formalization of the Boarding Actions (and perhaps another 2-3 new modes) for matched play.
Necronmaniac05 wrote: Tyranids also really could do with a plastic lord of war option. In fact, of all the races they're the one that specialises in large monstrous creatures. There's so much GW could do with a Tyranid lord of war so I'm hoping it's on the agenda.
GW has been directly porting a lot of FW resin with HH 2.0 recently. Heriodules would make sense.
Tangential but there's been an amendment to AoO detachments, some exceptions are called out by character name, but "loyalist primarch" is used for gman. Suspect.
Necronmaniac05 wrote: Tyranids also really could do with a plastic lord of war option. In fact, of all the races they're the one that specialises in large monstrous creatures. There's so much GW could do with a Tyranid lord of war so I'm hoping it's on the agenda.
Yeah, FW models (Hierodules, Hierophant, Harridan) or Dominatrix or maybe even Hydraphant would be awesome to have in plastic.
Necronmaniac05 wrote: Tyranids also really could do with a plastic lord of war option. In fact, of all the races they're the one that specialises in large monstrous creatures. There's so much GW could do with a Tyranid lord of war so I'm hoping it's on the agenda.
This was in the fluff section of the Octarius book:
Necronmaniac05 wrote: Tyranids also really could do with a plastic lord of war option. In fact, of all the races they're the one that specialises in large monstrous creatures. There's so much GW could do with a Tyranid lord of war so I'm hoping it's on the agenda.
This was in the fluff section of the Octarius book:
Could be variations of Hierophant or Hydraphant or something new.
Plastic LoW are usually in the baneblade/Knight size category, while Bio-titans are, well titans.
Although there is also the issue that FW superheavy nids are actually downscaled from their Epic and lore versions, where a hierophant is actually the size of a Warlord and a Hierodule was the size of a Warhound.
xttz wrote: While Valrak has been right with some rumours before, it's worth pointing out that it was also this time last year that he said Tyranids would get "updated gaunts and other refreshed models" with their then-upcoming codex for 9e.
Although I guess if you keep mentioning obvious releases long enough they'll show up sooner or later...
Yep, throw the full list at the wall to see what sticks.
Nothing to see here but wishlists.
Plastic LoW are usually in the baneblade/Knight size category, while Bio-titans are, well titans.
Although there is also the issue that FW superheavy nids are actually downscaled from their Epic and lore versions, where a hierophant is actually the size of a Warlord and a Hierodule was the size of a Warhound.
I'm not sure about that. We have the Stompa in plastic (for like 15 years now), and that isn't much smaller than a Warhound and is considerably bigger than a Questoris knight. It looks to be pretty similar in size to a Hierophant, which are pretty spindly and lightweight for a scout-titan equivalent. The Hierophant looks entirely doable as a LoW model in plastic.
Technically Tyranids got one of the first on the Trygon; however with Knights, Stompa and more on the tables now the scene is very different than it was when the Tyrgon landed. Even the Hierodules from forgeworld have both been reclassed as heavy instead of lord of war class because, honestly, whilst they were massive back when Carnifex were the biggest, they are now only average in size class.
So Tyranids do have a gap for a larger Lord of War - something not as big as a Heirophant, but bigger than many of their current bugs.
I could see a Dominatrix being one option for a Lord of War that would bring something powerful to the table and could be scaled down abit to make it practical for the tabletop.
xttz wrote: While Valrak has been right with some rumours before, it's worth pointing out that it was also this time last year that he said Tyranids would get "updated gaunts and other refreshed models" with their then-upcoming codex for 9e.
Although I guess if you keep mentioning obvious releases long enough they'll show up sooner or later...
Yep, throw the full list at the wall to see what sticks.
Nothing to see here but wishlists.
Nothing to see but rumours, there's no course to substantiate anything but he's been very accurate on his recent offerings imo.
He can't win because he doesn't name the source, if it's wrong he's trash, if it's close its a lucky guess and if it's true then it was "obvious". That's the fate of most rumour aggregators.
Haighus wrote: It looks to be pretty similar in size to a Hierophant, which are pretty spindly and lightweight for a scout-titan equivalent.
The annoying part being that lore wise it is actually a battle titan equivalent.
I admit that part of me is annoyed at the idea of getting a Tyranid LOW that is likely going to be at the wrong scale because the current FW models are at the wrong scale and I want the whole thing to be upscaled to their lore proportions.
I mean, Hierophant in the lore is a walking living mountain that can overpower a Warlord, hierophant on the TT is a tiny little thing smaller than a Warhound.
xttz wrote: While Valrak has been right with some rumours before, it's worth pointing out that it was also this time last year that he said Tyranids would get "updated gaunts and other refreshed models" with their then-upcoming codex for 9e.
Although I guess if you keep mentioning obvious releases long enough they'll show up sooner or later...
Yep, throw the full list at the wall to see what sticks.
Nothing to see here but wishlists.
Nothing to see but rumours, there's no course to substantiate anything but he's been very accurate on his recent offerings imo.
He can't win because he doesn't name the source, if it's wrong he's trash, if it's close its a lucky guess and if it's true then it was "obvious". That's the fate of most rumour aggregators.
I don’t get people’s dislike for aggregators. I mean, that’s like getting upset at Dakkadakka because Chadwell O’Cheese and Nostradumbass keep posting clearly fake rumours which never pan out.
Especially when the rumours do in fact pan out.
Please note I’m assuming Chadwell O’Cheese and Nostradumbass are fictional Dakka users here!
Haighus wrote: It looks to be pretty similar in size to a Hierophant, which are pretty spindly and lightweight for a scout-titan equivalent.
The annoying part being that lore wise it is actually a battle titan equivalent.
I admit that part of me is annoyed at the idea of getting a Tyranid LOW that is likely going to be at the wrong scale because the current FW models are at the wrong scale and I want the whole thing to be upscaled to their lore proportions.
I mean, Hierophant in the lore is a walking living mountain that can overpower a Warlord, hierophant on the TT is a tiny little thing smaller than a Warhound.
Are the larger sizes from Epic? I guess they have been retconned.
Although it is entirely possible there are "lesser" and "greater Hierophants. After all, a Hive Tyrant is pretty obviously an upscaled Warrior, so there is some precedence.
Are the larger sizes from Epic? I guess they have been retconned.
Although it is entirely possible there are "lesser" and "greater Hierophants. After all, a Hive Tyrant is pretty obviously an upscaled Warrior, so there is some precedence.
It isn't just from epic, the last 4-5 appareances of Hierophants in the lore puts them as Warlord equivalents.
In Warriors of Ultramar a Hierophant defeats a Capitol Imperialis. In Valedor a Hierophant fights 2 Eldar Revenants and one Phantom titan, killing a Revenant and almost destroying the Phantom. In Gates of the Devourer and Warlord: Fury of the God Machine, a Hierophant and a Warlord are evenly matched. In Shield of Baal a Hierophant shrugs off the firepower of an entire Necron Army.
There is a very obvious disconnect between the model and the lore here.
Are the larger sizes from Epic? I guess they have been retconned.
Although it is entirely possible there are "lesser" and "greater Hierophants. After all, a Hive Tyrant is pretty obviously an upscaled Warrior, so there is some precedence.
It isn't just from epic, the last 4-5 appareances of Hierophants in the lore puts them as Warlord equivalents.
In Warriors of Ultramar a Hierophant defeats a Capitol Imperialis.
In Valedor a Hierophant fights 2 Eldar Revenants and one Phantom titan, killing a Revenant and almost destroying the Phantom.
In Gates of the Devourer and Warlord: Fury of the God Machine, a Hierophant and a Warlord are evenly matched.
In Shield of Baal a Hierophant shrugs off the firepower of an entire Necron Army.
There is a very obvious disconnect between the model and the lore here.
Yeah, I agree that isn't very consistent.
Well, easiest reconciliation is that Hierophants come in different sizes.
xttz wrote: While Valrak has been right with some rumours before, it's worth pointing out that it was also this time last year that he said Tyranids would get "updated gaunts and other refreshed models" with their then-upcoming codex for 9e.
Although I guess if you keep mentioning obvious releases long enough they'll show up sooner or later...
Yep, throw the full list at the wall to see what sticks.
Nothing to see here but wishlists.
Nothing to see but rumours, there's no course to substantiate anything but he's been very accurate on his recent offerings imo.
He can't win because he doesn't name the source, if it's wrong he's trash, if it's close its a lucky guess and if it's true then it was "obvious". That's the fate of most rumour aggregators.
I don’t get people’s dislike for aggregators. I mean, that’s like getting upset at Dakkadakka because Chadwell O’Cheese and Nostradumbass keep posting clearly fake rumours which never pan out.
Especially when the rumours do in fact pan out.
Please note I’m assuming Chadwell O’Cheese and Nostradumbass are fictional Dakka users here!
Its not an issue about aggregators, rumour collectors or even rumours discussions... its how you go about it... This fella and say Spikeybits share common clickbait behaviours which is something I avoid.
Are the larger sizes from Epic? I guess they have been retconned.
Although it is entirely possible there are "lesser" and "greater Hierophants. After all, a Hive Tyrant is pretty obviously an upscaled Warrior, so there is some precedence.
It isn't just from epic, the last 4-5 appareances of Hierophants in the lore puts them as Warlord equivalents.
In Warriors of Ultramar a Hierophant defeats a Capitol Imperialis.
In Valedor a Hierophant fights 2 Eldar Revenants and one Phantom titan, killing a Revenant and almost destroying the Phantom.
In Gates of the Devourer and Warlord: Fury of the God Machine, a Hierophant and a Warlord are evenly matched.
In Shield of Baal a Hierophant shrugs off the firepower of an entire Necron Army.
There is a very obvious disconnect between the model and the lore here.
Yeah, I agree that isn't very consistent.
Well, easiest reconciliation is that Hierophants come in different sizes.
Or that larger ones are so far rare enough no one has worked out or cared to work out they’re separate species, simply referring to the them as Ooooooh feth
xttz wrote: While Valrak has been right with some rumours before, it's worth pointing out that it was also this time last year that he said Tyranids would get "updated gaunts and other refreshed models" with their then-upcoming codex for 9e.
Although I guess if you keep mentioning obvious releases long enough they'll show up sooner or later...
Yep, throw the full list at the wall to see what sticks.
Nothing to see here but wishlists.
Nothing to see but rumours, there's no course to substantiate anything but he's been very accurate on his recent offerings imo.
He can't win because he doesn't name the source, if it's wrong he's trash, if it's close its a lucky guess and if it's true then it was "obvious". That's the fate of most rumour aggregators.
I don’t get people’s dislike for aggregators. I mean, that’s like getting upset at Dakkadakka because Chadwell O’Cheese and Nostradumbass keep posting clearly fake rumours which never pan out.
Especially when the rumours do in fact pan out.
Please note I’m assuming Chadwell O’Cheese and Nostradumbass are fictional Dakka users here!
Its not an issue about aggregators, rumour collectors or even rumours discussions... its how you go about it... This fella and say Spikeybits share common clickbait behaviours which is something I avoid.
So you discredit someone based purely on the titles of their articles and some dramatically worded content?
xttz wrote: While Valrak has been right with some rumours before, it's worth pointing out that it was also this time last year that he said Tyranids would get "updated gaunts and other refreshed models" with their then-upcoming codex for 9e.
Although I guess if you keep mentioning obvious releases long enough they'll show up sooner or later...
Yep, throw the full list at the wall to see what sticks.
Nothing to see here but wishlists.
Nothing to see but rumours, there's no course to substantiate anything but he's been very accurate on his recent offerings imo.
He can't win because he doesn't name the source, if it's wrong he's trash, if it's close its a lucky guess and if it's true then it was "obvious". That's the fate of most rumour aggregators.
I don’t get people’s dislike for aggregators. I mean, that’s like getting upset at Dakkadakka because Chadwell O’Cheese and Nostradumbass keep posting clearly fake rumours which never pan out.
Especially when the rumours do in fact pan out.
Please note I’m assuming Chadwell O’Cheese and Nostradumbass are fictional Dakka users here!
Its not an issue about aggregators, rumour collectors or even rumours discussions... its how you go about it... This fella and say Spikeybits share common clickbait behaviours which is something I avoid.
So you discredit someone based purely on the titles of their articles and some dramatically worded content?
I do what again? You're just getting weird now. I had the misfortune to bump on that fella channel and yikes no way I want that on my feeds. I dont come to Dakka to be lured into click/support his channel either.
xttz wrote: While Valrak has been right with some rumours before, it's worth pointing out that it was also this time last year that he said Tyranids would get "updated gaunts and other refreshed models" with their then-upcoming codex for 9e.
Although I guess if you keep mentioning obvious releases long enough they'll show up sooner or later...
Yep, throw the full list at the wall to see what sticks.
Nothing to see here but wishlists.
Nothing to see but rumours, there's no course to substantiate anything but he's been very accurate on his recent offerings imo.
He can't win because he doesn't name the source, if it's wrong he's trash, if it's close its a lucky guess and if it's true then it was "obvious". That's the fate of most rumour aggregators.
I don’t get people’s dislike for aggregators. I mean, that’s like getting upset at Dakkadakka because Chadwell O’Cheese and Nostradumbass keep posting clearly fake rumours which never pan out.
Especially when the rumours do in fact pan out.
Please note I’m assuming Chadwell O’Cheese and Nostradumbass are fictional Dakka users here!
And both of which are usernames I should've chosen for myself instead of a Cannibal Corpse album
Overread wrote: Technically Tyranids got one of the first on the Trygon; however with Knights, Stompa and more on the tables now the scene is very different than it was when the Tyrgon landed. Even the Hierodules from forgeworld have both been reclassed as heavy instead of lord of war class because, honestly, whilst they were massive back when Carnifex were the biggest, they are now only average in size class.
So Tyranids do have a gap for a larger Lord of War - something not as big as a Heirophant, but bigger than many of their current bugs.
I could see a Dominatrix being one option for a Lord of War that would bring something powerful to the table and could be scaled down abit to make it practical for the tabletop.
Well again. If GW is to bring warlord level plastic imperium is much more likely to get warlord titan than tyranids.
Would be hilarious if Primaris fit inside a Terminator armour but still not inside a Land Raider.
Knowing GW, they'll only fit inside a Land Raider when wearing Terminator armour, but only if they also carry a Twin Helfury Bolter and an El Nino missile launcher and it's tuesday.
Dysartes wrote: It's also entirely possible that BL authors are messing things up (again).
Where's the Hydraphant that someone mentioned cropped up from, anyway?
The original Hierophant model from Epic was a battle titan equivalent, with the Hierodules being slightly smaller scout titan equivalents. When FW came out with their 40k scaled versions, they sized them down relatively speaking to make the Hierophant a scout titan and the Hierodules more in line with something like baneblades or knights. This created an inconsistency between Epic and 40k.
The Hydraphant was the Epic rules writers attempt to resolve this. They said the Epic Hierodule models should be treated as Hierophants, and the Hierophant model should be treated as a new type of creature called a Hydraphant. They got as far as releasing this in a rules PDF, but I think GW stopped supporting Epic before any books or lore were written about it. Leaving the Hydraphant in a semi-canon state.
You can still see the Hydraphant in the current community rules document for Epic, but that's about the only place it exists.
In short, it's really just the original Hierophant model with a new name.
2nd up, I would like firstborn terminators more, and new firstborn terminators is actually a great idea from GW's POV - there are at least 5 firstborn imperial terminator kits currently (all of which kinda suck in comparison to modern scale/detail/proportioned kits), these could all be discontinued in favour of a single decent modern kit simultaneously ticking the boxes of fanservice and reduction of firstborn product lines in favour of primaris.
Insularum wrote: 1st up, I would like to see primaris terminators.
2nd up, I would like firstborn terminators more, and new firstborn terminators is actually a great idea from GW's POV - there are at least 5 firstborn imperial terminator kits currently (all of which kinda suck in comparison to modern scale/detail/proportioned kits), these could all be discontinued in favour of a single decent modern kit simultaneously ticking the boxes of fanservice and reduction of firstborn product lines in favour of primaris.
It would also mean that they could crank out half a dozen+ terminator upgrade frames for chapters etc., these would be guaranteed to sell well.
Dysartes wrote: It's also entirely possible that BL authors are messing things up (again).
Where's the Hydraphant that someone mentioned cropped up from, anyway?
The original Hierophant model from Epic was a battle titan equivalent, with the Hierodules being slightly smaller scout titan equivalents. When FW came out with their 40k scaled versions, they sized them down relatively speaking to make the Hierophant a scout titan and the Hierodules more in line with something like baneblades or knights.
This created an inconsistency between Epic and 40k.
The Hydraphant was the Epic rules writers attempt to resolve this. They said the Epic Hierodule models should be treated as Hierophants, and the Hierophant model should be treated as a new type of creature called a Hydraphant. They got as far as releasing this in a rules PDF, but I think GW stopped supporting Epic before any books or lore were written about it. Leaving the Hydraphant in a semi-canon state.
You can still see the Hydraphant in the current community rules document for Epic, but that's about the only place it exists.
In short, it's really just the original Hierophant model with a new name.
Interesting. Looking at the Epic models compared to their 40k counterparts, it is quite reasonable too- the Epic Hierodules and Hierophant are quite similar, and nothing like the FW Hierodules. Decent retcon fudge.
Interesting. Looking at the Epic models compared to their 40k counterparts, it is quite reasonable too- the Epic Hierodules and Hierophant are quite similar, and nothing like the FW Hierodules. Decent retcon fudge.
What do you mean retcon? Clearly some Imperial bureaucrat mixed up the paperwork the first time around.
Galas wrote: Who wants a model bigger than a FW warlord? How could be that even playable.
I know at least 3 people who have 3D printed a model 2X the height of a warlord - at least 1 got painted.
The designer of that model (who withdrew it in the end for various reasons) is now working on another similar scaled model. It actually has longer legs, but a more hunched body and less of a tower top means its coming out shorter - still in the Warlord and bigger scale.
But yeah Warlord sizes are bonkers. That's why we need more stuff in AT!
Galas wrote: Who wants a model bigger than a FW warlord? How could be that even playable.
I know at least 3 people who have 3D printed a model 2X the height of a warlord - at least 1 got painted.
The designer of that model (who withdrew it in the end for various reasons) is now working on another similar scaled model. It actually has longer legs, but a more hunched body and less of a tower top means its coming out shorter - still in the Warlord and bigger scale.
But yeah Warlord sizes are bonkers. That's why we need more stuff in AT!
Or, start making Chaos versions of the models so the game can be played in the 'modern era'. Then they can start making AT-scale models for regular 40k units.
Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:Please note I’m assuming Chadwell O’Cheese and Nostradumbass are fictional Dakka users here!
My source inside the design studio, Totes McRealguy, told me that Chadwell O'Cheese is the pen name Andy Chambers is using to write the 10e ruleset, which he's reverting back to Second Edition Part II, Template Boogaloo. It's true! The box set is going to have Sensei Warbands vs Space Slaan.
H.B.M.C. wrote:Or finally give us the Dactylis.
I can't remember and my books are stowed away - was the Dactylis the draggy-claws, the back-canon, or the spore-yeeter?
H.B.M.C. wrote: The Tyranid Basilisk, as it basically was in Epic.
Isn't that more the Exocrine - ergo massive gun Tyranid.
Granted in Epic there likely is room for multiple types of artillery types quite easily.
Certainly Tyranids could gain a super-spore thrower variation.
Meanwhilst I think the idea of a transport Tyranid has basically been done away with and replaced with a birthing Tyranid and the drop-pods. Which I think fit the army really well at 40K scale and even at Epic scale I think would work well. Esp as Tyranids have gained a lot more tunnelling and such to move around with instead of using dedicated transports.
Admittedly I'm unsure if the Dactylis can be done without it looking silly. But yes a Dactylis/Malefactor kit would be amazing and actually provide currently unavailable capabilities beyond simply being larger monsters.
If the Dactylis and Malefactor get new models, I don't expect them to remain slugs. I mean the Exocrine and Haruspex also were slugs but their redesign gave them legs.
My source inside the design studio, Totes McRealguy, told me that Chadwell O'Cheese is the pen name Andy Chambers is using to write the 10e ruleset, which he's reverting back to Second Edition Part II, Template Boogaloo. It's true! The box set is going to have Sensei Warbands vs Space Slaan.
I have zero interest in the 'present edition' of 40k, but this is brilliant writing.
My source inside the design studio, Totes McRealguy, told me that Chadwell O'Cheese is the pen name Andy Chambers is using to write the 10e ruleset, which he's reverting back to Second Edition Part II, Template Boogaloo. It's true! The box set is going to have Sensei Warbands vs Space Slaan.
I have zero interest in the 'present edition' of 40k, but this is brilliant writing.
Well done.
But yeah, the terminators are the only 'risky' guess here and it's such clickbait.
This is speculation, but something I'm half expecting to see from a Tyranid range refresh based on recent faction updates is a large new Swarmlord kit to use as supreme commander. I could definitely see GW wanting to give it a greater daemon-scaled centrepiece model like Belakor or Silent King. It wouldn't necessarily mean replacing the hive tyrant kit, that datasheet can just gain the option to equip 4 boneswords.
I don’t get people’s dislike for aggregators. I mean, that’s like getting upset at Dakkadakka because Chadwell O’Cheese and Nostradumbass keep posting clearly fake rumours which never pan out.
Especially when the rumours do in fact pan out.
Please note I’m assuming Chadwell O’Cheese and Nostradumbass are fictional Dakka users here!
Its not an issue about aggregators, rumour collectors or even rumours discussions... its how you go about it... This fella and say Spikeybits share common clickbait behaviours which is something I avoid.
Exactly. There's a big difference between anonymous users posting their 'inside knowledge' on a public forum, and someone actively profiting from regular claims via a monetised Youtube channel or website plastered with ads.
Is it really that hard to understand why people see a conflict of interest between "my uncle at nintendo said"-style rumours, and being able to make £100+ each day from it?
xttz wrote: It wouldn't necessarily mean replacing the hive tyrant kit, that datasheet can just gain the option to equip 4 boneswords.
It would rather mean to give sabres to the Tyrant as they are different enough from the sword included in that kit. Or they could create some Tyrant Alpha (being a commander type below the Swarmlord yet level over the ordinary Tyrant) which would use the current Swarmlord model.
This is speculation, but something I'm half expecting to see from a Tyranid range refresh based on recent faction updates is a large new Swarmlord kit to use as supreme commander. I could definitely see GW wanting to give it a greater daemon-scaled centrepiece model like Belakor or Silent King. It wouldn't necessarily mean replacing the hive tyrant kit, that datasheet can just gain the option to equip 4 boneswords.
I don’t get people’s dislike for aggregators. I mean, that’s like getting upset at Dakkadakka because Chadwell O’Cheese and Nostradumbass keep posting clearly fake rumours which never pan out.
Especially when the rumours do in fact pan out.
Please note I’m assuming Chadwell O’Cheese and Nostradumbass are fictional Dakka users here!
Its not an issue about aggregators, rumour collectors or even rumours discussions... its how you go about it... This fella and say Spikeybits share common clickbait behaviours which is something I avoid.
Exactly. There's a big difference between anonymous users posting their 'inside knowledge' on a public forum, and someone actively profiting from regular claims via a monetised Youtube channel or website plastered with ads.
Is it really that hard to understand why people see a conflict of interest between "my uncle at nintendo said"-style rumours, and being able to make £100+ each day from it?
In Valrak's case it's also symptomatic in his really grating presentation - he releases a video every couple of days, on top of his twitter feed an regular livechats, and literally every video is titled something like ''HUGE news GW finall REVEALS ALL! This is AMAZING!'', complete with hyperbolic thumbnails, and then you get a typical padded 7-9 minute, optimized for add revenue nothingburger where a solid 5-7 minutes are waffling, padding and rehashes of what was said in the last videos, and maybe a minute or two of actual new stuff that boils down to a screenshot of a quarter of a page in some book. It's like some 19th century carnival promoter got hold of modern media You just feel duped for even clicking it, even if you skip intro & outro and skim over the rest at 2x speed
xttz wrote: This is speculation, but something I'm half expecting to see from a Tyranid range refresh based on recent faction updates is a large new Swarmlord kit to use as supreme commander. I could definitely see GW wanting to give it a greater daemon-scaled centrepiece model like Belakor or Silent King. It wouldn't necessarily mean replacing the hive tyrant kit, that datasheet can just gain the option to equip 4 boneswords.
I don’t get people’s dislike for aggregators. I mean, that’s like getting upset at Dakkadakka because Chadwell O’Cheese and Nostradumbass keep posting clearly fake rumours which never pan out.
Especially when the rumours do in fact pan out.
Please note I’m assuming Chadwell O’Cheese and Nostradumbass are fictional Dakka users here!
Its not an issue about aggregators, rumour collectors or even rumours discussions... its how you go about it... This fella and say Spikeybits share common clickbait behaviours which is something I avoid.
Exactly. There's a big difference between anonymous users posting their 'inside knowledge' on a public forum, and someone actively profiting from regular claims via a monetised Youtube channel or website plastered with ads.
Is it really that hard to understand why people see a conflict of interest between "my uncle at nintendo said"-style rumours, and being able to make £100+ each day from it?
It's down to their audience to decide if they wish to follow that, I get the news via sites where it's reposted in text so never watch his streams personally. I don't care for the presentation but I'm happy to discuss the content which I consider no less valid due to the delivery method. It's like me trying to get any news/insight on the world eaters on here but the last few pages are mostly filled with "look how bad GW is", to the point I go to B&C instead generally.
Tsagualsa wrote: In Valrak's case it's also symptomatic in his really grating presentation - he releases a video every couple of days, on top of his twitter feed an regular livechats, and literally every video is titled something like ''HUGE news GW finall REVEALS ALL! This is AMAZING!'', complete with hyperbolic thumbnails, and then you get a typical padded 7-9 minute, optimized for add revenue nothingburger where a solid 5-7 minutes are waffling, padding and rehashes of what was said in the last videos, and maybe a minute or two of actual new stuff that boils down to a screenshot of a quarter of a page in some book. It's like some 19th century carnival promoter got hold of modern media You just feel duped for even clicking it, even if you skip intro & outro and skim over the rest at 2x speed
Yeah. I guess at some level I don't mind these people making money - but the level of content to padding is tiny. And different people will react to that in different ways, but I find it annoying.
I mean it takes about 10-15 seconds to read your original post. His video is nearly 9 minutes long.
Tsagualsa wrote: In Valrak's case it's also symptomatic in his really grating presentation - he releases a video every couple of days, on top of his twitter feed an regular livechats, and literally every video is titled something like ''HUGE news GW finall REVEALS ALL! This is AMAZING!'', complete with hyperbolic thumbnails, and then you get a typical padded 7-9 minute, optimized for add revenue nothingburger where a solid 5-7 minutes are waffling, padding and rehashes of what was said in the last videos, and maybe a minute or two of actual new stuff that boils down to a screenshot of a quarter of a page in some book. It's like some 19th century carnival promoter got hold of modern media You just feel duped for even clicking it, even if you skip intro & outro and skim over the rest at 2x speed
Yeah. I guess at some level I don't mind these people making money - but the level of content to padding is tiny.
And different people will react to that in different ways, but I find it annoying.
I mean it takes about 10-15 seconds to read your original post. His video is nearly 9 minutes long.
Indeed.
Also when you add to that tiny "content" delivered what was said on this thread before by xttz
"Although I guess if you keep mentioning obvious releases long enough they'll show up sooner or later... "
Means that anyone guess is as good as his.
Dudeface wrote: It's like me trying to get any news/insight on the world eaters on here but the last few pages are mostly filled with "look how bad GW is", to the point I go to B&C instead generally.
I was complaining to someone the other day I have trouble following actual news and rumors on this site because posts with actual news are immediately buried by pages of speculation or complaints about Primaris. I wish they did something like only allowing actual updates and news on threads here, and linking to a different thread for the ensuing discussion.
Dudeface wrote: It's like me trying to get any news/insight on the world eaters on here but the last few pages are mostly filled with "look how bad GW is", to the point I go to B&C instead generally.
I was complaining to someone the other day I have trouble following actual news and rumors on this site because posts with actual news are immediately buried by pages of speculation or complaints about Primaris. I wish they did something like only allowing actual updates and news on threads here, and linking to a different thread for the ensuing discussion.
Dakka Dakka is definitely nowhere near as useful as it used to be. It used to be my primary resource for community news, but these days I learn most of that elsewhere.
Often I'll pass on some of that info here myself, but just like with the WE thread this week the usual outcome is that only a minority of people want to discuss the news while the majority desperately find excuses to nitpick or derail the thread with unrelated arguments or snarky one-liners. It's behaviour I don't see nearly as much of elsewhere, and a sign of a forum firmly in decline.
If anyone does want to discuss news these days I recommend finding an appropriate community Discord server or two instead. Most of them are run by people actively engaged in the hobby and more eager to stamp out toxic behaviour.
Dudeface wrote: It's like me trying to get any news/insight on the world eaters on here but the last few pages are mostly filled with "look how bad GW is", to the point I go to B&C instead generally.
I was complaining to someone the other day I have trouble following actual news and rumors on this site because posts with actual news are immediately buried by pages of speculation or complaints about Primaris. I wish they did something like only allowing actual updates and news on threads here, and linking to a different thread for the ensuing discussion.
Dakka Dakka is definitely nowhere near as useful as it used to be. It used to be my primary resource for community news, but these days I learn most of that elsewhere.
Often I'll pass on some of that info here myself, but just like with the WE thread this week the usual outcome is that only a minority of people want to discuss the news while the majority desperately find excuses to nitpick or derail the thread with unrelated arguments or snarky one-liners. It's behaviour I don't see nearly as much of elsewhere, and a sign of a forum firmly in decline.
If anyone does want to discuss news these days I recommend finding an appropriate community Discord server or two instead. Most of them are run by people actively engaged in the hobby and more eager to stamp out toxic behaviour.
When the first post is continuously updated by the OP with all the relevant new bits seems to work.
Dudeface wrote: It's like me trying to get any news/insight on the world eaters on here but the last few pages are mostly filled with "look how bad GW is", to the point I go to B&C instead generally.
I was complaining to someone the other day I have trouble following actual news and rumors on this site because posts with actual news are immediately buried by pages of speculation or complaints about Primaris. I wish they did something like only allowing actual updates and news on threads here, and linking to a different thread for the ensuing discussion.
Dakka Dakka is definitely nowhere near as useful as it used to be. It used to be my primary resource for community news, but these days I learn most of that elsewhere.
Often I'll pass on some of that info here myself, but just like with the WE thread this week the usual outcome is that only a minority of people want to discuss the news while the majority desperately find excuses to nitpick or derail the thread with unrelated arguments or snarky one-liners. It's behaviour I don't see nearly as much of elsewhere, and a sign of a forum firmly in decline.
If anyone does want to discuss news these days I recommend finding an appropriate community Discord server or two instead. Most of them are run by people actively engaged in the hobby and more eager to stamp out toxic behaviour.
I'm sorry that the need to consoom has been made impossible via people validly criticizing a product
Tyranids and Marines is solid gold narrative. There is just so much different routes the story can go, with twists and plot-turns.
I hope its Blood Angels against Tyranids -yet again. Last time BA was in trouble the narrative was masterfully crafted so a previously unknown outside force suddenly appeared to sort out the cliffhanger. Hard to top for sure, but GW has proven they can spin a powerful Tyranid narrative.
-Sarcasm
Valrak is a good guy, but gosh he's doing everything to trigger that algorithm. I respect the hustle even if I don't like the content.
After all the waffling, the streams where he waffles some more, and videos where he waffles about primarchs some more, a lot of his 'rumors' have been pretty accurate as of late.
If it's true we're getting a new Terminator sculpt, I'll be pleased. I can finally sit down and make a Tyberos the Red Wake that's not head and shoulders shorter than Primaris. Wouldn't that be nice?
The Tyranid stuff feels like a 'gimme'. GW needs to either squat the bio/pyrovore or update it. Lictor is an iconic and fun unit that deserves plastic.
Someone earlier mentioned why GW keeps leaving behind little bits of finecast in their ranges, and the answer is simple: If they update everything, they won't have anything left to update in the future!
A lot of their updates do 2 things: add something brand new to the faction (shroud runners for Eldar for example) and then hit that nostalgia button by updating something old (howling banshees, dark reapers) and that way they try to get old and new players to buy in to the big release.
They also have a pattern of at least releasing 1 hero or character unit per codex/battletome release if there's nothing else ready for that release. We see this all the time, and most of the time it's something brand new, leaving behind anything they could have updated in favor of a character that will have middling usefulness at best.
So it goes.
Either way, excited for Tyranids to get center stage for a while.
Valrak is pretty amusing at times. I can’t really see why anyone would begrudge the guy making some money doing his thing. There’s obviously an audience for it. Haters gonna hate I guess. Pretty sad tho.
I have recently come to hear some interesting information pertaining to the year ahead.
-10th edition is indeed coming this year, and apparently some information may come to light at Adepticon.
-10th edition will be an evolution of the core rules of 9th edition, not a complete re-write. There are massive changes coming to the stratagem system. Streamlining and significant cutbacks - I heard mention of a dozen generic stratagems for use across all factions, and a single unique strat per army. (To me this sounds like the reaction system in 30k)
-The Codex chapter supplements are not coming in 9th edition (Fists, Iron Hands, Ultras, etc). They were planned for 9th initially but will now be too close to 10th.
Anyways, this all sounded plausible to me. I'm not sure how GW would plan on an evolution of the rules, whilst scrapping all stratagems from the 9th edition books. The unit rules across all faction have been gutted, and their abilities converted to strats. I don't even want to imagine the volume of FAQs and Errata.
heard (2nd hand, so take that as you will) that GW have indeed become aware of the issues with 40k as it currently stands, and that they are aware of the sentiments of many players.
Unfortunately the gears and mechanisms turn slowly, and any significant changes they come up with are probably years away. What gets released is typically 2 years behind what they are working on at any given time. It's why I have become more cynical about 10th edition - I believe that the real change needed probably won't arrive until 11th.
It's why I believe what I was told about the edition being an evolution of 9th. Now, as others have pointed out, the changes could still be significant and just because the core rules aren't changed completely the various codex books could still be invalidated.
This was backed up by Noserenda:
Id heard similar a while back from someone inside, they know the 9th ed codexes got out of hand but couldn't fix it just yet, I expected to see it in the later codexes (I've not been paying much attention to rules recently though) but an edition reset also makes sense.
I'm optimistic about 10th. It doesn't take GW 2 years to write codexes or battletomes (we know this because they've written some books that have been updated within that period of time, like Lumineth and Sisters of Battle), so them being aware of the issues means that hopefully 10th wont get as out of hand as 9th did, balance wise.
drbored wrote: I'm optimistic about 10th. It doesn't take GW 2 years to write codexes or battletomes (we know this because they've written some books that have been updated within that period of time, like Lumineth and Sisters of Battle), so them being aware of the issues means that hopefully 10th wont get as out of hand as 9th did, balance wise.
Uh you know right they can start working on next book before 1st is even out? They didn't need to wait lumineth book 1 to be out before starting to work on 2nd book...nor wait for that to come out before starting on 3rd edition book.
Lol people keep thinking gw does quick changes and forget lead times.
I really don't get the Valrak hate. He isn't a nazi like Arch, and I don't find him particularly grating as a character like... some... other walking hairstyles that have suddenly started popping up on my youtube recommendations....
I can just about (nearly, sort of) understand some manbabies being upset by incorrect rumours when they're (usually pretty transparently) designed to tickle some very specific fancies, but Valrak isn't making them up himself. He's just enthusiastic about the hobby and likes to pass on info he's heard. If you don't share that same enthusiasm then why are you getting het up about what are pretty clearly labelled as rumours in the first place?
Pretty much the only issue with Valrak is that he likes the wrong Manchester football team. The wrong one. Actually, I've changed my mind, he's a despicable human being. BURN THE HERETIC
Id heard similar a while back from someone inside, they know the 9th ed codexes got out of hand but couldn't fix it just yet, I expected to see it in the later codexes (I've not been paying much attention to rules recently though) but an edition reset also makes sense.
Codex creep / special rules creep happens every edition, to the point where some books get rewritten within an edition, or have content added through supplements. I have yet to see why it will be any different going forward.
Id heard similar a while back from someone inside, they know the 9th ed codexes got out of hand but couldn't fix it just yet, I expected to see it in the later codexes (I've not been paying much attention to rules recently though) but an edition reset also makes sense.
Codex creep / special rules creep happens every edition, to the point where some books get rewritten within an edition, or have content added through supplements. I have yet to see why it will be any different going forward.
IMHO the specific problem at the moment is the insane amount of bookkeeping with all sorts of points, doctrines and random stuff like that you have to do at the moment. Among e.g. command points, doctrines, cabal points and so on you'd have to be constantly on the ball to play your own army correctly, yet alone have a vague idea what your enemy is able to do at any given time. It also does not help that in many cases there's multiple layers of nested rules, so that even if you use some sort of app or other assisting systems, you can't often at a glance check up a rule interaction, but have to probe around between the layers. To add insult to injury, the actual effect of these things is often not so big after all, double shots, a reroll, D3 mortal wounds or such, but it's quite irksome that you're constantly in danger of a misplay or oversight.
Id heard similar a while back from someone inside, they know the 9th ed codexes got out of hand but couldn't fix it just yet, I expected to see it in the later codexes (I've not been paying much attention to rules recently though) but an edition reset also makes sense.
Codex creep / special rules creep happens every edition, to the point where some books get rewritten within an edition, or have content added through supplements. I have yet to see why it will be any different going forward.
Change in management, Stu took over about a year ago I think from Cruddace? So far he's been a lot more transparent and vocal, a lot of the more recent changes about sharing the data etc have been on his watch, so there is a chance that an edition starting under his guidance might go differently.
Tsagualsa wrote: IMHO the specific problem at the moment is the insane amount of bookkeeping with all sorts of points, doctrines and random stuff like that you have to do at the moment. Among e.g. command points, doctrines, cabal points and so on you'd have to be constantly on the ball to play your own army correctly, yet alone have a vague idea what your enemy is able to do at any given time. It also does not help that in many cases there's multiple layers of nested rules, so that even if you use some sort of app or other assisting systems, you can't often at a glance check up a rule interaction, but have to probe around between the layers. To add insult to injury, the actual effect of these things is often not so big after all, double shots, a reroll, D3 mortal wounds or such, but it's quite irksome that you're constantly in danger of a misplay or oversight.
Yeah, that's mainly why I've given up on 40K. It's too much volume of rules and too much time spent managing your army's special rules and interactions and stratagem gotchas rather than good, basic, engaging gameplay. GW makes better games. I feel far more engaged when playing Warcry and AT, which also manage to have factions that feel and play differently without an overwhelming amount special rules and such (yes, even AT).
Tsagualsa wrote: IMHO the specific problem at the moment is the insane amount of bookkeeping with all sorts of points, doctrines and random stuff like that you have to do at the moment. Among e.g. command points, doctrines, cabal points and so on you'd have to be constantly on the ball to play your own army correctly, yet alone have a vague idea what your enemy is able to do at any given time. It also does not help that in many cases there's multiple layers of nested rules, so that even if you use some sort of app or other assisting systems, you can't often at a glance check up a rule interaction, but have to probe around between the layers. To add insult to injury, the actual effect of these things is often not so big after all, double shots, a reroll, D3 mortal wounds or such, but it's quite irksome that you're constantly in danger of a misplay or oversight.
Yeah, that's mainly why I've given up on 40K. It's too much volume of rules and too much time spent managing your army's special rules and interactions and stratagem gotchas rather than good, basic, engaging gameplay. GW makes better games. I feel far more engaged when playing Warcry and AT, which also manage to have factions that feel and play differently without an overwhelming amount special rules and such (yes, even AT).
The core of the problem is that Warhammer 40k is still married to game design conventions and concepts that are at this point at least 30 years old, and a lot of the bolted-on crunch is stuff that tries to make that 'engine' perform like more modern systems that manage the same or better results with a fraction of the effort both on the writing side and on the playing side. Look, for example, how long they took until they adopted something like degrading profiles for tanks and monsters. Other stuff, like e.g. morale checks, function exactly like they did 20 years ago. More egregious examples can be found, like e.g. some psychic powers requiring up to dozens of dice rolls to eventually deal out ~~D6 mortal wounds, and so on. As you said, their side games that were designed from the ground up and according to somewhat more modern standards show that they can actually design decent games, but not if they have to ultimately run on the Warhammer 'engine'.
The core of the problem is that Warhammer 40k is still married to game design conventions and concepts that are at this point at least 30 years old, and a lot of the bolted-on crunch is stuff that tries to make that 'engine' perform like more modern systems that manage the same or better results with a fraction of the effort both on the writing side and on the playing side... Other stuff, like e.g. morale checks, function exactly like they did 20 years ago.
I'd argue that morale is actually worse now than 20+ years ago. The current system just gives you units that either fold to morale as soon as they lose a few models, or effectvely ignore the system completely. Right now morale is simply losing extra models as punishment for losing models. At least in older rule sets there were mechanics for being pinned down, running away, and getting units safe to rally & join the fight again.
Something high on my wishlist for a new edition is a morale system that functions more like Epic 40k / Dawn of War did; units that are right in the thick of the fighting get less combat effective over time, but still have an opportunity to recover. In Epic some unit types were more resistant to this (space marines counted as double models compared to other factions), but everything up to and including titans were susceptible to getting bogged down in fierce enough fighting.
By changing the system from one that outright removes models into one that makes units degrade & possibly recover, it means it can be used with a much wider scope for everyone. Factions like Night Lords should be able to take their fear & terror theme and apply it to almost any opponent, rather than it just being effective against a few factions.
The issue isn't the mechanics themselves, newer games are often just using different systems but they are not always inherently better nor worse.
The main problems with 40K rules are
1) That GW's rules team/resource allocation are just not setup to allow for tight quality rules production.
From the fact that they don't field test enough to the issue that every few years they release a new edition that changes enough of the core rules that its a new slate. So even with their faster adjustments for balance that they are doing right now, it all goes out the window every edition cycle.
2) GW got addicted to expansion books which then branched out into adding value to White Dwarf and online FAQs and Errata. The result is that GW has wound up creating a system of dozens of different rules resources scattershot all over the place which makes it a rather a nightmare to actually keep up with.
3) Somewhere along the lines GW lost the ability (or desire) to write rules in a sensible way. Old codex used to have points and rules and stats all on one page for most units, with a few tables here and there.
Then GW got into the idea of putting points on a separate page, then upgrade points on another; stats for weapon types on another, etc... The result is that the information for one model is no longer mostly on one page but scattershot through the book all over the place. This makes constructing or referencing a model in the book much harder than it should be.
They have got a tiny bit better than their worst, but they still have issues. Heck they still keep putting power-level costs on the model page but points on another.
Sure as they release FAQ and updates to the game many of those values (esp points)might change in update tables, but its much easier if things start out on the same page for each model.
GW is basically running a very messy rules system which makes things more complicated simply because how they have approached it; not really due to the underlaying concept of the rule mechanics.
I'd also add its not a "oh we just need digital rules" issue. Digital rules are simply a different type of reference material. There's no reason that GW couldn't produce tighter rules; stop changing everything every edition; write codex in a more logical way to reference and shift away from updating everything all over the place.
I get a feeling that GW are releasing some of these issues at the HQ end - I think expansion books aren't selling as well as they used too. I think people are showing that getting 2 or so new model stats in a few army updates in a £30+ book every few months is burning people out and making a mess of things.
Fundamentally what we really need is for higher ups at GW to actually value rules as a tight system.
Unlike some others, I do not like the merging of firstborn and Primaris Marines. I think they need to bite the bullet and phase out the firstborn. It's clearly where this is all headed, and having the 2 together in the same army has always been weird.
I am also skeptical about a box set that contains both types of Marines. I am prepared to bet that it'll be Primaris only.
Snord wrote: Unlike some others, I do not like the merging of firstborn and Primaris Marines. I think they need to bite the bullet and phase out the firstborn. It's clearly where this is all headed, and having the 2 together in the same army has always been weird.
I am also skeptical about a box set that contains both types of Marines. I am prepared to bet that it'll be Primaris only.
Merging them may very well be the first step on the road to phasing the Firstborn out, without in-game relevance the need to distinguish both basically dissappears, so you can keep the relevant iconic stuff like Terminators and the O.G. Marine vehicles, but retire the humble Tac Squad etc. while expanding the range with new kits in 'Primaris Scale' but under the generic 'Space Marine' umbrella. Sooner or later the remaining Firstborn kits will be phased out anyway, and what will eventually replace them will just be upscaled 'Space Marines' at least on the model front.
TBH "rebuilt from the ground up" is one of those hyperbolic notions that could mean a lot.
I don't think they'll have a core rules system that is very different to 10th (IGYG etc) but so much of the game's rules now is the rules bloat in every codex that throwing them all out and starting again is pretty much the ground at this point.
The Phazer wrote: TBH "rebuilt from the ground up" is one of those hyperbolic notions that could mean a lot.
I don't think they'll have a core rules system that is very different to 10th (IGYG etc) but so much of the game's rules now is the rules bloat in every codex that throwing them all out and starting again is pretty much the ground at this point.
True. For example, if you really wanted to radically cut out the stratagem system like the posters on B&C said, that would imply that you'd have to issue an errata or fix for every single codex, because the stratagem stuff directly impacts things like relics, army composition and so on. If you count that as a 'big reset' / 'rebuild from the ground up' or 'just an update' is pretty much down to your personal perspective.
Snord wrote: Unlike some others, I do not like the merging of firstborn and Primaris Marines. I think they need to bite the bullet and phase out the firstborn. It's clearly where this is all headed, and having the 2 together in the same army has always been weird.
This! They should use the Arks stories to tell some bla bla bla how Firstborn were decimated while valiantly defending something/somewhere/everywhere etc. etc. The result will be that the remaining few survivors will play no role in the galaxy wide wars and therefore only Primaris will be representing SM on the table.
Snord wrote: Unlike some others, I do not like the merging of firstborn and Primaris Marines. I think they need to bite the bullet and phase out the firstborn. It's clearly where this is all headed, and having the 2 together in the same army has always been weird.
This! They should use the Arks stories to tell some bla bla bla how Firstborn were decimated while valiantly defending something/somewhere/everywhere etc. etc. The result will be that the remaining few survivors will play no role in the galaxy wide wars and therefore only Primaris will be representing SM on the table.
That's more or less what they did with Shield of Baaliirc - Blood Angels and their successors won a phyrric victory against the Tyranids and were decimated in the process, but then Cawls Primaris reinforcements showed up and bolstered them back up to about the strength they were at before.
If Valraks rumour about the 10th starter box being BAs versus Tyranids is true, that's basically the justification for a box of just Primaris right there.
Snord wrote: Unlike some others, I do not like the merging of firstborn and Primaris Marines. I think they need to bite the bullet and phase out the firstborn. It's clearly where this is all headed, and having the 2 together in the same army has always been weird.
I am also skeptical about a box set that contains both types of Marines. I am prepared to bet that it'll be Primaris only.
Honestly I think Primaris were just going to be the new marine sculpts and then someone at HQ said - why not both at once.
It explains why their entire line almost copies the core marine unit roster unit for unit with equivalents. It's also so strange to have one army with basically two armies within it.
I think if Primaris had really been very different and brought totally new things to the table entirely it would have done better, but as it stands they are "odd" when paired with regular marines.
At the same time I can't see GW losing all regular marines. Some things like Rhinos and Landraiders are just so iconic to the range, to the marketing and so heavily set with 40 years of gaming behind them that to remove them for hovertanks I think would be a mistake.
I feel like Primaris are part of the legacy of choices from the Kirby era which weren't lore, gamer or customer focused and as a result end up being sore thorns in how to sort things out now. Esp since GW can't just split the Space Marines into two separate armies across every chapter
How many kits would be needed to merge them?
Tactical, devistator and terminator primaris kits cover what I feel is needed. Merge the lines as a all marines fall into the same profile feels best with where we are at.
Apple fox wrote: How many kits would be needed to merge them?
Tactical, devistator and terminator primaris kits cover what I feel is needed. Merge the lines as a all marines fall into the same profile feels best with where we are at.
I don't think you even need specific kits for that, just an upgrade sprue with some replacement weapons. Ironically following the 30k rollout process with intercessors, then either the base bolter or the bolt rifle, either/or can cease to exist. Assuming terminators are coming imminently ofc.
Apple fox wrote: How many kits would be needed to merge them?
Tactical, devistator and terminator primaris kits cover what I feel is needed. Merge the lines as a all marines fall into the same profile feels best with where we are at.
I don't think you even need specific kits for that, just an upgrade sprue with some replacement weapons. Ironically following the 30k rollout process with intercessors, then either the base bolter or the bolt rifle, either/or can cease to exist. Assuming terminators are coming imminently ofc.
I would like that, a good upgrades box like that would be awesome.
If it’s a full box that goes a decent way for a few units, it would probably be better than trying to do seperate boxes.
They do them for necromunda already as well, and those are good.
Overread wrote: Honestly I think Primaris were just going to be the new marine sculpts and then someone at HQ said - why not both at once.
It explains why their entire line almost copies the core marine unit roster unit for unit with equivalents. It's also so strange to have one army with basically two armies within it.
Or Gathering Storm was originally meant to lead into Age of Girlyman and the botched launch of AoS scared GW enough to backpedal on their 40k plans. It doesn't take a tinfoil hat to believe that the same GW that blew up Warhammer Fantasy figured they could drop classic Marine and see Marine players happily rebuy their entire army, then saw the failure of AoS and just couldn't risk taking chances on their biggest source of income. So we got both coexisting alongside each other.
I for one won't be sad to see the division between the two Marine sides go, if that is what's going to happen. Put out an upgrade sprue so you can make Primaris with classic weapon options, say a boltgun is a boltgun regardless of slight cosmetic differences and let everyone ride in any transport. Done.
You could even go so far as to have one unit entry in Troops so you can make Intercessors with all bolters and a grenade launcher or a Tactical Squad with special and heavy weapon, and repeat that for the other FOC slots so you won't even have all these slightly different squads in the codex anymore. But I suspect that's a little too optimistic. I don't think GW is willing or able to consolidate the game in such a way.
That's too straightforward. How about a 1pt strategem that lets only ultramarines take specifically a flamer and a missile launcher in an intercessor squad, and it's called an invictarius tacticarium squadente team and they make a kit for it that is only available in a splash release kill team box?
Overread wrote: Honestly I think Primaris were just going to be the new marine sculpts and then someone at HQ said - why not both at once.
It explains why their entire line almost copies the core marine unit roster unit for unit with equivalents. It's also so strange to have one army with basically two armies within it.
Or Gathering Storm was originally meant to lead into Age of Girlyman and the botched launch of AoS scared GW enough to backpedal on their 40k plans. It doesn't take a tinfoil hat to believe that the same GW that blew up Warhammer Fantasy figured they could drop classic Marine and see Marine players happily rebuy their entire army, then saw the failure of AoS and just couldn't risk taking chances on their biggest source of income. So we got both coexisting alongside each other.
Sounds like nonsense to me.
There was never any plan to "AoS" 40k. The move to AoS was done because Warhammer Fantasy wasn't selling. AoS does. The shift might have been somewhat bumpy, but it has turned out to have been a pretty sound decision for them.
40k has always sold well, so there was never any big plan to blow the universe up.
Primaris Marines were just a rescaling and redesign exercise that needed some in-universe lore to cover the gradual phase-in of Primaris-sized marines and possible phase-out of non Primaris-sized marines. With the advent of plastic 30k, that may never even happen, however. Even if that was the intention, it wasn't ever going to happen overnight since 40k AND Marines themselves continue to be so popular.
Overread wrote: Honestly I think Primaris were just going to be the new marine sculpts and then someone at HQ said - why not both at once.
It explains why their entire line almost copies the core marine unit roster unit for unit with equivalents. It's also so strange to have one army with basically two armies within it.
Or Gathering Storm was originally meant to lead into Age of Girlyman and the botched launch of AoS scared GW enough to backpedal on their 40k plans. It doesn't take a tinfoil hat to believe that the same GW that blew up Warhammer Fantasy figured they could drop classic Marine and see Marine players happily rebuy their entire army, then saw the failure of AoS and just couldn't risk taking chances on their biggest source of income. So we got both coexisting alongside each other.
That's a good point cause GW did write themselves into the last 100 years and less of the 40K age and then had to backpedal the dates. The management that made AoS could well have tried for "And now 50K!"
Primaris Marines were just a rescaling and redesign exercise that needed some in-universe lore to cover the gradual phase-in of Primaris-sized marines and possible phase-out of non Primaris-sized marines. With the advent of plastic 30k, that may never even happen, however. Even if that was the intention, it wasn't ever going to happen overnight since 40k AND Marines themselves continue to be so popular.
We have two data points that directly support this explanation:
1. 'Truescale' marines were a popular concept long before Primaris became a thing, were featured in WD and on the website several times, and were among the more popular conversions, including aftermarket kits to help 'truescale' the regular miniatures.
2. The Deathwatch kits that were released comparatively short time before the first Primaris kits were, at the time, noted for being bigger than standard Marines, and much more in line with at-the-time current 'truescale' builds, and with the later Primaris kits.
ekwatts wrote: I really don't get the Valrak hate. He isn't a nazi like Arch, and I don't find him particularly grating as a character like... some... other walking hairstyles that have suddenly started popping up on my youtube recommendations....
I can just about (nearly, sort of) understand some manbabies being upset by incorrect rumours when they're (usually pretty transparently) designed to tickle some very specific fancies, but Valrak isn't making them up himself. He's just enthusiastic about the hobby and likes to pass on info he's heard. If you don't share that same enthusiasm then why are you getting het up about what are pretty clearly labelled as rumours in the first place?
He understandably doesn't report the source of any rumour, but then it's also YouTube, so you need to feed the algorithm, so he reports every rumour, regardless of how reliable or not it is. He could filter stuff he strongly suspected was nonsense, but that means fewer videos which means death by algorithm.
Not his fault, it's YouTube. But I get the frustration people have with it as well.
Overread wrote: Honestly I think Primaris were just going to be the new marine sculpts and then someone at HQ said - why not both at once.
It explains why their entire line almost copies the core marine unit roster unit for unit with equivalents. It's also so strange to have one army with basically two armies within it.
Or Gathering Storm was originally meant to lead into Age of Girlyman and the botched launch of AoS scared GW enough to backpedal on their 40k plans. It doesn't take a tinfoil hat to believe that the same GW that blew up Warhammer Fantasy figured they could drop classic Marine and see Marine players happily rebuy their entire army, then saw the failure of AoS and just couldn't risk taking chances on their biggest source of income. So we got both coexisting alongside each other.
Sounds like nonsense to me.
There was never any plan to "AoS" 40k. The move to AoS was done because Warhammer Fantasy wasn't selling. AoS does. The shift might have been somewhat bumpy, but it has turned out to have been a pretty sound decision for them.
40k has always sold well, so there was never any big plan to blow the universe up.
Primaris Marines were just a rescaling and redesign exercise that needed some in-universe lore to cover the gradual phase-in of Primaris-sized marines and possible phase-out of non Primaris-sized marines. With the advent of plastic 30k, that may never even happen, however. Even if that was the intention, it wasn't ever going to happen overnight since 40k AND Marines themselves continue to be so popular.
Just sell top 3 miniature game.
Problem wasn't it wasn't selling. Problem was it wasn't selling space marine level.
Apple fox wrote: How many kits would be needed to merge them?
Tactical, devistator and terminator primaris kits cover what I feel is needed. Merge the lines as a all marines fall into the same profile feels best with where we are at.
I don't think you even need specific kits for that, just an upgrade sprue with some replacement weapons. Ironically following the 30k rollout process with intercessors, then either the base bolter or the bolt rifle, either/or can cease to exist. Assuming terminators are coming imminently ofc.
Or go the other way and say the Codex Astartes v2.0 no longer permits mixed weapon squads, so existing Heavy and Special Weapon Troopers are re-assigned into the appropriate specialist squads. No extra sprues needed that way.
I intend to maintain this thread until mid-year when, as far as we know, 10th edition will release or at least be announced. It stands to reason that we will see a lot of rumours until then, some of them probably contradictory. Primaris/Space Marine discussion is well within the scope of this thread due to them being included in the starter box with near certainity, as is discussion about a possible 'remodelling' of the core game, so go for it.
That being said, i'd appreciate it if we kept AoS-related discussions and rehashes of its history down to a minimum, in order not to clutter up this thread too much.
ekwatts wrote: I really don't get the Valrak hate. He isn't a nazi like Arch, and I don't find him particularly grating as a character like... some... other walking hairstyles that have suddenly started popping up on my youtube recommendations....
I can just about (nearly, sort of) understand some manbabies being upset by incorrect rumours when they're (usually pretty transparently) designed to tickle some very specific fancies, but Valrak isn't making them up himself. He's just enthusiastic about the hobby and likes to pass on info he's heard. If you don't share that same enthusiasm then why are you getting het up about what are pretty clearly labelled as rumours in the first place?
He understandably doesn't report the source of any rumour, but then it's also YouTube, so you need to feed the algorithm, so he reports every rumour, regardless of how reliable or not it is. He could filter stuff he strongly suspected was nonsense, but that means fewer videos which means death by algorithm.
Not his fault, it's YouTube. But I get the frustration people have with it as well.
Another problem is if you watch his videos, YouTube starts to show you more that all feed into that algorithm. So people may have there entire experience shift with it.
I know I get way better content after some pruning to what I see, and no shortage to 40k content.
Tsagualsa wrote: Added the B&C rumours to the OP and edited them for brevity.
Thanks, appreciate it.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Give the rumors of Lionel Johnson returning I think it's most likely the new Terminators are going to be Deathwing. Which does not make a large amount of sense since DA got a big refresh in 20...15?
Ultramarines would make the most sense again Nids but that's my official guess. Dark Angels in 2023.
Tsagualsa wrote: Added the B&C rumours to the OP and edited them for brevity.
Thanks, appreciate it.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Give the rumors of Lionel Johnson returning I think it's most likely the new Terminators are going to be Deathwing. Which does not make a large amount of sense since DA got a big refresh in 20...15?
Ultramarines would make the most sense again Nids but that's my official guess. Dark Angels in 2023.
The assumed series of events is vashtorr or whoever wakes up the Lion as part of Arks of Omen in 9th ed. The logical assumption is the Lion becomes the dominant character on the nihilus side of the imperium, with the 10th ed starter being the siege of baal.
ekwatts wrote: The shift might have been somewhat bumpy, but it has turned out to have been a pretty sound decision for them.
No. The original decision to kill off WHFB and replace it with AoS nearly ended GW's fantasy line. It was a complete disaster that was widely (and accurately) mocked for being some of the worst wargaming rules ever written. What succeeded was GW's second plan, the revised version of AoS they desperately threw together after the original plan failed. The success of the second plan doesn't change the utter failure of the original concept. That is what scared them off from making any major changes to 40k. And if they had full knowledge of how their original AoS plan was going to fail I suspect we would have seen a more moderate revision of WHFB instead.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
deano2099 wrote: He understandably doesn't report the source of any rumour, but then it's also YouTube, so you need to feed the algorithm, so he reports every rumour, regardless of how reliable or not it is. He could filter stuff he strongly suspected was nonsense, but that means fewer videos which means death by algorithm.
Not his fault, it's YouTube. But I get the frustration people have with it as well.
It's absolutely his fault. It's his deliberate choice to pursue maximizing his monetization ability over providing reliable information to the community. It's an understandable choice, of course, but let's not pretend that it is somehow not a choice.
Tyran wrote: ... they are rumors. The unreliability is actually part of the definition.
Not really. Some rumors are unreliable nonsense posted by some random person with zero credibility, some "rumors" are actually leaks by people (usually playtesters) with inside information and a news source like Valrak may have solid proof that the leaks are accurate but be unwilling to put their source at risk by revealing that proof.
So they are releasing a boxed set with a mixture of Primaris and current Terminators (along with the new Azrael). That was a bit of a surprise, although I think the original rumour was that this was going to be a 10th Edition release. Instead, it's just an interim set that forces you to buy a bunch of existing models if you want the new ones.
Tyran wrote: ... they are rumors. The unreliability is actually part of the definition.
Not really. Some rumors are unreliable nonsense posted by some random person with zero credibility, some "rumors" are actually leaks by people (usually playtesters) with inside information and a news source like Valrak may have solid proof that the leaks are accurate but be unwilling to put their source at risk by revealing that proof.
So if they don't verify the reliability by naming the source, you might say they're a rumour by definition and therefore open to unreliability?
It honestly pisses me off when people act like this is some life or death pillar of society type situation where a rumour must be vetted and have a reliable source. It becomes a fact at that point. People don't post on here because of these bs interrogations. The chaos marines leaker started posting on here after some of us were pasting the news over, they stopped because they kept being "called out" and met with negative hostility.
Dudeface wrote: So if they don't verify the reliability by naming the source, you might say they're a rumour by definition and therefore open to unreliability?
Scenario A: a playtester comes to Valrak with a copy of the playtest material and gives him some stuff to post. You as the reader don't know who the source is but Valrak does.
Scenario B: Valrak sees some random reddit comment about a "rumor" and reposts it to keep his engagement metrics up. Nobody involved knows where the "rumor" came from or if it has any credibility at all.
Do you see why one of these is a rumor and one is a leak being labeled a "rumor" only to keep the source from getting into trouble? And how, even if you as the reader don't see the proof, the people publishing leaks are able to confirm them and eliminate the reliability issue?
It honestly pisses me off when people act like this is some life or death pillar of society type situation where a rumour must be vetted and have a reliable source. It becomes a fact at that point. People don't post on here because of these bs interrogations. The chaos marines leaker started posting on here after some of us were pasting the news over, they stopped because they kept being "called out" and met with negative hostility.
This seems like a rather hyperbolic response to pointing out that Valrak has a poor signal to noise ratio.
Dudeface wrote: So if they don't verify the reliability by naming the source, you might say they're a rumour by definition and therefore open to unreliability?
Scenario A: a playtester comes to Valrak with a copy of the playtest material and gives him some stuff to post. You as the reader don't know who the source is but Valrak does.
Scenario B: Valrak sees some random reddit comment about a "rumor" and reposts it to keep his engagement metrics up. Nobody involved knows where the "rumor" came from or if it has any credibility at all.
Do you see why one of these is a rumor and one is a leak being labeled a "rumor" only to keep the source from getting into trouble? And how, even if you as the reader don't see the proof, the people publishing leaks are able to confirm them and eliminate the reliability issue?
It honestly pisses me off when people act like this is some life or death pillar of society type situation where a rumour must be vetted and have a reliable source. It becomes a fact at that point. People don't post on here because of these bs interrogations. The chaos marines leaker started posting on here after some of us were pasting the news over, they stopped because they kept being "called out" and met with negative hostility.
This seems like a rather hyperbolic response to pointing out that Valrak has a poor signal to noise ratio.
Of course I can see the difference, my issue is that fact you expect that on a news and rumour platform you want only to receive facts being presented to you as rumours, for reasons that you've not really expanded on. Is your time and mental capacity too valuable to have conversations about rumours and hypotheticals?
Dudeface wrote: Of course I can see the difference, my issue is that fact you expect that on a news and rumour platform you want only to receive facts being presented to you as rumours, for reasons that you've not really expanded on. Is your time and mental capacity too valuable to have conversations about rumours and hypotheticals?
Shockingly yes, I do want a better signal to noise ratio where only credible leaks are presented and not random nonsense, even if it means the news guy's youtube engagement metrics are a bit lower. What exactly does it add to the conversation when I can make a reddit post about "my source tells me Tau are getting squatted in 10th" and 15 minutes later the rumor sites will all have it posted as YOU WONT BELIEVE WHAT GW IS DOING IN 10TH CLICK HERE TO SEE?
Dudeface wrote: Of course I can see the difference, my issue is that fact you expect that on a news and rumour platform you want only to receive facts being presented to you as rumours, for reasons that you've not really expanded on. Is your time and mental capacity too valuable to have conversations about rumours and hypotheticals?
Shockingly yes, I do want a better signal to noise ratio where only credible leaks are presented and not random nonsense, even if it means the news guy's youtube engagement metrics are a bit lower. What exactly does it add to the conversation when I can make a reddit post about "my source tells me Tau are getting squatted in 10th" and 15 minutes later the rumor sites will all have it posted as YOU WONT BELIEVE WHAT GW IS DOING IN 10TH CLICK HERE TO SEE?
You're critiquing their presentation rather than the content. As a rumour aggregator they can choose to present any and/or all rumours they find at their discretion. The part you seem to be struggling with is that a rumour doesn't need to be verified, sourced reliably nor held back for validity checks.
The click bait title is purely algorithms and presentation, you don't personally have to watch it, if someone reposts it like here.
It's a rumour. It's not a fact. None of it is. If you don't enjoy a hobby discussion about things that aren't factually accurate, I suggest you dont invest time in a rumour thread.
Dudeface wrote: Of course I can see the difference, my issue is that fact you expect that on a news and rumour platform you want only to receive facts being presented to you as rumours, for reasons that you've not really expanded on. Is your time and mental capacity too valuable to have conversations about rumours and hypotheticals?
Shockingly yes, I do want a better signal to noise ratio where only credible leaks are presented and not random nonsense, even if it means the news guy's youtube engagement metrics are a bit lower. What exactly does it add to the conversation when I can make a reddit post about "my source tells me Tau are getting squatted in 10th" and 15 minutes later the rumor sites will all have it posted as YOU WONT BELIEVE WHAT GW IS DOING IN 10TH CLICK HERE TO SEE?
You're critiquing their presentation rather than the content. As a rumour aggregator they can choose to present any and/or all rumours they find at their discretion. The part you seem to be struggling with is that a rumour doesn't need to be verified, sourced reliably nor held back for validity checks.
The click bait title is purely algorithms and presentation, you don't personally have to watch it, if someone reposts it like here.
It's a rumour. It's not a fact. None of it is. If you don't enjoy a hobby discussion about things that aren't factually accurate, I suggest you dont invest time in a rumour thread.
The thing is they aren't using discretion. They are putting out 100%. Clicks for cash. They don't care about sharing rumours. Just making $$$$$$$.
Give them rumour that space marines gets removed from game in 10th and they will put up video about it. What does that do?
They don't actually contribute to the community. They are leeching off from it
Dudeface wrote: As a rumour aggregator they can choose to present any and/or all rumours they find at their discretion
Yes, that's exactly what I said. Valrak could choose to post only credible information. Or he could choose to repost anything and everything that is ever mentioned by anyone. It is entirely at his discretion, and he has made the deliberate choice to repost everything because that's what maximizes his engagement metrics and his personal income.
The part you seem to be struggling with is that a rumour doesn't need to be verified, sourced reliably nor held back for validity checks.
And why not? Why should every random piece of nonsense be reported as a rumor without any attempt to confirm that the source is credible? What value is there in posting nonsense just to fill a quota of posts per week?
Yeah. Only in GW realm rumour sources are "everything must be told regardless of what! I don't need to do any actual WORK to do some basic checks for the cash!"
It's just cash for not doing any real work. Worse than beggars on street.
As is there's zero reason to believe every "anonymous source" they report is actually anonymous source and not just them making up clickbait titles for profit.
So…don’t watch him. He’s under no obligation to produce his show with you in mind.
Rumours are….rumours. Tidbits and whispering without initial substantiation. If he came with LVO type proof it wouldn’t be a rumour, would it. It’d be news.
He’s on a real roll with rumour accuracy. And now it seems we’re almost certainly getting The Lion soon.
Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote: So…don’t watch him. He’s under no obligation to produce his show with you in mind.
Ah yes, the classic "if you don't like it stop talking about it". That's definitely a valid defense for something and not an attempt to silence criticism.
Rumours are….rumours. Tidbits and whispering without initial substantiation. If he came with LVO type proof it wouldn’t be a rumour, would it. It’d be news.
You know there's a middle ground, right? Leaks of information where the person reporting it knows that it is fact but can't reveal their source yet. For example, we get lots of leaks from playtesters where it is very likely that the person reporting them has seen the actual playtest material and the absence of official comment from GW doesn't make it any less credible. But just reporting on the stuff that is credible doesn't generate enough clicks and re-tweets and such, and so the people who are more concerned with monetization strategies than quality content are incentivized to repeat every piece of nonsense they find.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
tneva82 wrote: Yeah. Only in GW realm rumour sources are "everything must be told regardless of what! I don't need to do any actual WORK to do some basic checks for the cash!"
It's just cash for not doing any real work. Worse than beggars on street.
As is there's zero reason to believe every "anonymous source" they report is actually anonymous source and not just them making up clickbait titles for profit.
You know, I bet with the way AI is going recently you could make an AI rumor channel that aggregates every random "rumor" post and re-posts them, along with making up filler "rumors" to make sure its posts per day quota is maintained. Valrak and BOLS better cash in now before the AI replaces them!
Valrak is an aggregator. He’s passed info. If he thinks it’s credible, he passes it on to us.
Nowhere in his chosen role here is an obligation to make his shows palatable to you specifically.
I also note you’ve not addressed the now fact that Valrak has been accurate of late. Nope, no siree Bob. Can’t acknowledge that, because then you’re odd complaint about him not vetting anything and that rumours should be news looks….really rather silly and baseless.
Many years ago, as we headed into 4th, I was a rumour monger for a short period. Because I had illicit access to play test copies of rules. I blew up, as I believe the cool kids say these day, Portent (might’ve been Warseer) with new the Assault Cannon was getting rending.
I had a full copy of the rulebook first, explaining the Kill Team type rules from right up the back. And some nerk was saying I was wrong, that stuff didn’t exist, and how the Assault Cannon had “Reaping”, not Rending.
Swift PM with a photo of me, book in hand, face redacted, flipping the bird soon put paid to that goon.
Asmodai wrote: Everytime Valrak has said "this rumour is coming from a source I absolutely trust", it has been 100% true.
The ones that he's said "This got sent to me and I'm passing it on" have a more mixed track record.
He makes it very easy to determine how much weight to put on things.
At this point it seems reasonable to assume that his trustworthy source is someone on the photography or magazine/social media production side of things, who gets to see stuff a couple of months in advance due to the necessities of the production workflow. It's practically the only way someone could be right so many times and in many cases down to the posing of individual miniatures etc.
What I find funny is that so far people seem to hate Valrak simply because he makes a lot of videos with sometimes shady rumors. I am not a fan of his and do not watch his videos, but I have yet to see a reason why people hate the man so much.
I thought that this was supposed to be a thread about the possible upcoming 10th edition. I have no idea who Valrak is nor do I care. If you don't like the source for whatever reason then ignore it.
How about discussing the rumor(s) and not the presenter. Reliability of the presenter is perfectly in bounds as a measure of belief but his presentation should be irrelevant to the discussion itself.
Eldarsif wrote: What I find funny is that so far people seem to hate Valrak simply because he makes a lot of videos with sometimes shady rumors. I am not a fan of his and do not watch his videos, but I have yet to see a reason why people hate the man so much.
I don't hate him (way too strong a feeling). I just can't listen to his video's as I personally find his delivery to be flat and difficult to listen to (not sure if it's his real voice or a filter, but I lose interest quickly while listening to him).
But I share the bafflement at those who don’t like him not figuring out just….don’t watch him then.
It’s so Mary Whitehouse, a “TV morality” campaigner. A weird old women who never figured out nobody at all is forcing you to watch telly or films you don’t want to watch, or that your preference extends solely to yourself, and your family if you’ve young’uns. The worst sort of Pearl clutching, hand wringing moral minority fusspot intent on projecting their moral standards on others.
But I share the bafflement at those who don’t like him not figuring out just….don’t watch him then.
It’s so Mary Whitehouse, a “TV morality” campaigner. A weird old women who never figured out nobody at all is forcing you to watch telly or films you don’t want to watch, or that your preference extends solely to yourself, and your family if you’ve young’uns. The worst sort of Pearl clutching, hand wringing moral minority fusspot intent on projecting their moral standards on others.
I do neither like his voice nor his presentation, but i like his reliable rumours very much. I can stand his presentation for the ~5 minutes every other day it takes to watch them just fine, and will continue to summarize relevant stuff into this thread, so that people do not have to watch him if they don't want to It's kind of the reason why i made this thread - i limited it to 10th edition and related rumours because i don't want it to be overrun with the pointless and repeated 'Lion' stuff.
I think you're generalising and escalating things in a strange way that are only projections of your mind.
I dont hate or love, I just dislike his "content" and said so. So I dont watch/support or give credit to what he does. Not sure what is so hard to comprehend here... After that is just people not understanding diversity and obviously gakking on different opinions.
Could care less if you or other people give him money. I dont and thats all im saying.
I think you're generalising and escalating things in a strange way that are only projections of your mind.
I dont hate or love, I just dislike his "content" and said so. So I dont watch/support or give credit to what he does. Not sure what is so hard to comprehend here... After that is just people not understanding diversity and obviously gakking on different opinions.
Could care less if you or other people give him money. I dont and thats all im saying.
Which is fine. Don’t like and don’t watch? Zero problemo duder. But it’s those who proclaim to dislike him, but seem to still watch his shows are utterly baffling. Like those complaining about the new Velma series.
Just….I mean….if you don’t wanna watch it? Don’t bloody watch it. There are dozens if not hundreds of shows and YouTube channels not to my taste, so I, y’know…just don’t watch them. I try to expend as little energy as I can in that regard.
Dudeface wrote: Of course I can see the difference, my issue is that fact you expect that on a news and rumour platform you want only to receive facts being presented to you as rumours, for reasons that you've not really expanded on. Is your time and mental capacity too valuable to have conversations about rumours and hypotheticals?
Shockingly yes, I do want a better signal to noise ratio where only credible leaks are presented and not random nonsense, even if it means the news guy's youtube engagement metrics are a bit lower. What exactly does it add to the conversation when I can make a reddit post about "my source tells me Tau are getting squatted in 10th" and 15 minutes later the rumor sites will all have it posted as YOU WONT BELIEVE WHAT GW IS DOING IN 10TH CLICK HERE TO SEE?
You're critiquing their presentation rather than the content. As a rumour aggregator they can choose to present any and/or all rumours they find at their discretion. The part you seem to be struggling with is that a rumour doesn't need to be verified, sourced reliably nor held back for validity checks.
The click bait title is purely algorithms and presentation, you don't personally have to watch it, if someone reposts it like here.
It's a rumour. It's not a fact. None of it is. If you don't enjoy a hobby discussion about things that aren't factually accurate, I suggest you dont invest time in a rumour thread.
The thing is they aren't using discretion. They are putting out 100%. Clicks for cash. They don't care about sharing rumours. Just making $$$$$$$.
Give them rumour that space marines gets removed from game in 10th and they will put up video about it. What does that do?
They don't actually contribute to the community. They are leeching off from it
No matter how you feel about it they aren't going to stop/change. Their $$$ > your opinion.
Meanwhile your ranting about it here just annoys the rest of us. And doesn't add anything of value to the conversations.
So why don't you just give it a rest?
I think you're generalising and escalating things in a strange way that are only projections of your mind.
I dont hate or love, I just dislike his "content" and said so. So I dont watch/support or give credit to what he does. Not sure what is so hard to comprehend here... After that is just people not understanding diversity and obviously gakking on different opinions.
Could care less if you or other people give him money. I dont and thats all im saying.
Which is fine. Don’t like and don’t watch? Zero problemo duder. But it’s those who proclaim to dislike him, but seem to still watch his shows are utterly baffling. Like those complaining about the new Velma series.
Just….I mean….if you don’t wanna watch it? Don’t bloody watch it. There are dozens if not hundreds of shows and YouTube channels not to my taste, so I, y’know…just don’t watch them. I try to expend as little energy as I can in that regard.
I don't have enough hours in my life to watch the things I like, so it's easy for me to ignore the channels I dislike. Then again everyone is free to do what they want with their time.
Regarding the content I think it would be more tolerable ( maybe not XD) if he had a sniper approach to rumours more than the avalanche of shotgun shots he thrives for...
It's absolutely his fault. It's his deliberate choice to pursue maximizing his monetization ability over providing reliable information to the community. It's an understandable choice, of course, but let's not pretend that it is somehow not a choice.
Sort of. But the thing is, if he did that, if he put out five-minute videos with just reliable rumours every couple of weeks, we wouldn't be linking his stuff here, because no-one would know who he was, as no-one would be watching his videos. Because the algorithm wouldn't be serving up those videos.
He has a choice, but the choice is to basically not exist. Someone putting out accurate rumours which are well-vetted isn't useful to the community if no-one has heard of them.
It's absolutely his fault. It's his deliberate choice to pursue maximizing his monetization ability over providing reliable information to the community. It's an understandable choice, of course, but let's not pretend that it is somehow not a choice.
Sort of. But the thing is, if he did that, if he put out five-minute videos with just reliable rumours every couple of weeks, we wouldn't be linking his stuff here, because no-one would know who he was, as no-one would be watching his videos. Because the algorithm wouldn't be serving up those videos.
He has a choice, but the choice is to basically not exist. Someone putting out accurate rumours which are well-vetted isn't useful to the community if no-one has heard of them.
The reliable rumourmonger nobody has heard of sooner or later becomes a source for someone who is willing to do the obnoxious marketing spiel, it's just a function of how the algorithmic selection works. The stuff you see is the stuff that conforms best to the algorithm, there's no practical way around it.
Which is fine. Don’t like and don’t watch? Zero problemo duder. But it’s those who proclaim to dislike him, but seem to still watch his shows are utterly baffling. Like those complaining about the new Velma series.
I have zero opinions of the dude himself because I avoid 40K Youtube content. Part of the issue is when people start a rumor thread with just the video or a link to one of his videos instead of just putting the rumors. And before someone just says "well, just don't be lazy and watch the video", not all of use want to watch a damn video for the rumors, that's why we come to Dakka and not Youtube. It gets annoying that people push his content when most of us just want the rumors and not some internet personality.
Again, no problem there at all. I likewise has a distaste for a thread which is no more than a video.
By all means share the vid, but also pot the content for casual readers.
Valrak though seems to get a lot of vindictive flak from certain posters, where even when a rumour he presented bears out, they insist it doesn’t count. It’s like that relative that when playing Trivial Pursuit refuses your right answer, because you didn’t verbalise the punctuation marks on the card, and you have to go by what the card says because that’s the rule so you didn’t actually answer it right because you didn’t verbalise the punctuation shown on the card. And then when you do, it’s “well I suppose I’ll have to let you have it then” said in a huffy and petulant manner.
It just boggles the mind that folk can be that obstinate. If you don’t like the guy, you don’t like the guy. Not my or anyone else as business. But when it’s just more aimless, baseless, fact devoid moaning, it wears very thing very quickly.
I hope these rumors are true because this world desperately needs new lictors, genestealers and terminators. Getting rid of the Primaris keyword would also be much appreciated.
Snord wrote: Unlike some others, I do not like the merging of firstborn and Primaris Marines. I think they need to bite the bullet and phase out the firstborn. It's clearly where this is all headed, and having the 2 together in the same army has always been weird.
This! They should use the Arks stories to tell some bla bla bla how Firstborn were decimated while valiantly defending something/somewhere/everywhere etc. etc. The result will be that the remaining few survivors will play no role in the galaxy wide wars and therefore only Primaris will be representing SM on the table.
That's more or less what they did with Shield of Baaliirc - Blood Angels and their successors won a phyrric victory against the Tyranids and were decimated in the process, but then Cawls Primaris reinforcements showed up and bolstered them back up to about the strength they were at before.
If Valraks rumour about the 10th starter box being BAs versus Tyranids is true, that's basically the justification for a box of just Primaris right there.
endlesswaltz123 wrote: They're going to need to shift on those older Terminator sculpts somehow... Lumping them in a box is one way.
So they're opening existing boxes of Deathwing terminators just to put them in a different box?
Unlikely. They probably increased the quantity on the last production run of Deathwing Terminators knowing they were going to need X copies for all the boxes worldwide.
I've had a think (dangerous and painful), the marine half must include troops, it's a starter box and always contains a troops choice. So unless terminators are moving to troops, which seems unlikely we have a couple of logical conclusions:
- more easy built intercessors
- unlikely to reuse infiltrators again
- unlikely to reuse assault intercessors
- jump intercessors are troops?
- assault intercessors get jump packs but same entry
IF these rumors prove to be true.. looking at the Dark Vengeance box, the Marine side had 5 termies, 10 tacticals, 3 bikes and several characters.
Don't/didn't the BA (rumored to be the posterboys for this box) have some rule that they could take assault squads as troops ? If so, 5 new termies +
10 assault troops (be they assault intercessors or some new jump pack-equipped unit) + HQ would fit the bill (with possibly some room to spare).
Personally, I don't care if the Firstborn/Primaris distinction will go away, I'm just hoping for some decent new minis (upscaled Indomitus-pattern Terminators and "old-school" (with the ribbed back) Purestrains).
If the rumors are true AND they are planning to include a troops choice then it could be scouts. If we're going to have brand new primaris terminators why not brand new primaris scouts also? GW made a Terminators and Tyranids box set for Advanced Space Crusade back in the day, RTB16 if you're keeping score. You can see it here:
I actually think I have this somewhere. Looks a lot like a starter box contents to me and we all know GW has been keeping an eye on it's past self lately.
Zhrukal wrote: If the rumors are true AND they are planning to include a troops choice then it could be scouts. If we're going to have brand new primaris terminators why not brand new primaris scouts also? GW made a Terminators and Tyranids box set for Advanced Space Crusade back in the day, RTB16 if you're keeping score. You can see it here:
I actually think I have this somewhere. Looks a lot like a starter box contents to me and we all know GW has been keeping an eye on it's past self lately.
There will almost certainly be a troops or two per army, it wouldn't be much of a launch/beginner product otherwise. Unless they scrap force orgs as we know them ofc.
Zhrukal wrote: If the rumors are true AND they are planning to include a troops choice then it could be scouts. If we're going to have brand new primaris terminators why not brand new primaris scouts also? GW made a Terminators and Tyranids box set for Advanced Space Crusade back in the day, RTB16 if you're keeping score. You can see it here:
I actually think I have this somewhere. Looks a lot like a starter box contents to me and we all know GW has been keeping an eye on it's past self lately.
Scouts aren't troops anymore. They could change it back, I suppose, but that was definitely a 'the devs feel players are making armies wrong' decision (ie, not taking tacticals/intercessors), so I don't see them reversing that any time soon.
The T&T box was a repack of models from the original Space Hulk, its expansion (the hybrids and librarian) and ASC. It wasn't a starter box, it was just a way to sell the boxed games models again.
It would also be a real rubbish modern starter, given the changes to those units over the years.
endlesswaltz123 wrote: They're going to need to shift on those older Terminator sculpts somehow... Lumping them in a box is one way.
So they're opening existing boxes of Deathwing terminators just to put them in a different box?
Unlikely. They probably increased the quantity on the last production run of Deathwing Terminators knowing they were going to need X copies for all the boxes worldwide.
Unlikely as in snowball in hell has bigger chance. They cast sprues for these boxes specifically.
Scouts aren't troops anymore. They could change it back, I suppose, but that was definitely a 'the devs feel players are making armies wrong' decision (ie, not taking tacticals/intercessors), so I don't see them reversing that any time soon.
I mean they just changed the FOC so you don't need to take troops any more...
Scouts aren't troops anymore. They could change it back, I suppose, but that was definitely a 'the devs feel players are making armies wrong' decision (ie, not taking tacticals/intercessors), so I don't see them reversing that any time soon.
I mean they just changed the FOC so you don't need to take troops any more...
Only for Arks of Omen games.
The core rules still need Troops for any of the main detachments, and it'd make sense to include either a Patrol or a small Battalion in a starter set.
Scouts aren't troops anymore. They could change it back, I suppose, but that was definitely a 'the devs feel players are making armies wrong' decision (ie, not taking tacticals/intercessors), so I don't see them reversing that any time soon.
I mean they just changed the FOC so you don't need to take troops any more...
Only for Arks of Omen games.
The core rules still need Troops for any of the main detachments, and it'd make sense to include either a Patrol or a small Battalion in a starter set.
Yes, but we are talking about a starter for the next edition, and there has been conjecture that the Arks of Omen FOC is a sign of things to come.
Scouts aren't troops anymore. They could change it back, I suppose, but that was definitely a 'the devs feel players are making armies wrong' decision (ie, not taking tacticals/intercessors), so I don't see them reversing that any time soon.
I mean they just changed the FOC so you don't need to take troops any more...
Only for Arks of Omen games.
The core rules still need Troops for any of the main detachments, and it'd make sense to include either a Patrol or a small Battalion in a starter set.
Yes, but we are talking about a starter for the next edition, and there has been conjecture that the Arks of Omen FOC is a sign of things to come.
Updated the first post with the newest round of rumours; the Tyranid Stuff seems believable, obviously a Lictor box would strive to have some sort of alternate build, and a 'assuming direct control'-gaunt seems like something GW would do.
10th edition will be out this year. Another video with evidence for that is announced for next week
Will be largely misleading. I can point to evidence now:
- GW historically releases in summer
- it's 3 years since the last release, on a 3 year cycle
- the document validity document (lol) and competitive seasons all end in summer
- they're out of codex to release
- The GW open in May is the only one without a 40k Singles round conveniently
Edit: to clarify, I'm saying expect something like that, or it had better be a document with dates on.
Tsagualsa wrote: Updated the first post with the newest round of rumours; the Tyranid Stuff seems believable, obviously a Lictor box would strive to have some sort of alternate build, and a 'assuming direct control'-gaunt seems like something GW would do.
He confirmed in the comments that norn emissary is what he wanted to say so that is correct. Also since he said Lictor correctly shortly before I think he meant to say Lector Prime/Alpha and it wasn't a slip of the tongue.
Lector Prime/Alpha could be a new unit and a "Captain/Lieutnant" equivalent, same as Necrons got with their Overlord/Royal Warden in the 9th starter
10th edition will be out this year. Another video with evidence for that is announced for next week
Will be largely misleading. I can point to evidence now:
- GW historically releases in summer
- it's 3 years since the last release, on a 3 year cycle
- the document validity document (lol) and competitive seasons all end in summer
- they're out of codex to release
- The GW open in May is the only one without a 40k Singles round conveniently
Edit: to clarify, I'm saying expect something like that, or it had better be a document with dates on.
Yeah, i put 'evidence' in italics for a reason. I also suspect something like that, especially the validity document is a dead giveaway. It's still something many more casual players that don't follow stuff like that closely are not aware of, so it's legitimate to make it known to a wider audience as supporting evidence IMHO, but of course it's not clear evidence in the stricter sense. More like circumstancial evidence, or hints.
He confirmed in the comments that norn emissary is what he wanted to say so that is correct but since he said Lictor correctly shortly before I think he meant to say Lector Prime/Alpha and it wasn't a slip of the tongue.
Lector Prime/Alpha could be a new unit and a "Captain/Lieutnant" equivalent, same as Necrons got with their Overlord/Royal Warden in the 9th starter
Scouts aren't troops anymore. They could change it back, I suppose, but that was definitely a 'the devs feel players are making armies wrong' decision (ie, not taking tacticals/intercessors), so I don't see them reversing that any time soon.
I mean they just changed the FOC so you don't need to take troops any more...
Only for Arks of Omen games.
The core rules still need Troops for any of the main detachments, and it'd make sense to include either a Patrol or a small Battalion in a starter set.
Yes, but we are talking about a starter for the next edition, and there has been conjecture that the Arks of Omen FOC is a sign of things to come.
Except the context was an old reprint box, and Zhrukal specifically said "If the rumors are true AND they are planning to include a troops choice then it could be scouts."
It wasn't about the new FOC, but the assertion that scouts are troops.
Kanluwen wrote: Lictor Prime/Alpha might simply be Deathleaper's genus being made into a "generic" thing, ala Doom of Malan'tai being made into the Neurothrope.
Yeah, if we go by naming conversions the Prime is synaptic and the Alpha is a Lictor+ / Deathleaper with filed-off serial numbers. Now a 'Lector' may be anything, but i think it would be a very bad idea from a marketing perspective to have both Lectors and Lictors in the same army
I wonder if the 'Norn Emissary' is a renamed Dominatrix. Given that GW would be unlikely to want to keep that original name.
The name kind of fits with the dominatrixes role as a norn-queen's main psychic link to ground-side tyranid forces.
Could be the big plastic centerpiece model that nid fans have been after.
Overread wrote: GW has Slaanesh - I think the Dominatrix is safe name wise.
Norn Emissary sounds more like an infiltration unit or something akin to that rather than a huge towering titan of psy energy and all.
To me it sounds like some sort of focus for the hive mind's awareness, which also means focus for all sorts of psychic/synaptic shenanigans. With the potential to burn out the biological 'relais' of course.
Arson Fire wrote: I wonder if the 'Norn Emissary' is a renamed Dominatrix. Given that GW would be unlikely to want to keep that original name.
The name kind of fits with the dominatrixes role as a norn-queen's main psychic link to ground-side tyranid forces.
Could be the big plastic centerpiece model that nid fans have been after.
Honestly probably a big factor in not keeping that name is that it's harder to trademark. There's definitely going to be a few other 28mm scale 'Dominatrix' models out there already...
I could see them keeping a few callbacks to the original unit though. Tyranid units often get Imperial high gothic names as well, so something like Tyranicus Dominatus would still work.
Assuming that the Norn Emissary and the "bad Gaunt" are two separate things. Could the bad Gaunt be a Barbed Gaunt? Or if it is referring to one model, some kind of squad leader or minor character from a new Gaunt type? For example a squad of Barbed Gaunts led by a Norn Emissary
A Lector is according to a quick Google search "a reader, especially someone who reads lessons in a church service". So if its not a mispronunciation of Lictor, then maybe some kind of Chaplin like unit for Nids that buffs other models or effects synapse?
You've got things like "Hive Tyrant" and "Swarmlord" and such that are just normal words. Not everything is named "Tervigon" and "Maleceptor" and such, just most things.
drbored wrote: You've got things like "Hive Tyrant" and "Swarmlord" and such that are just normal words. Not everything is named "Tervigon" and "Maleceptor" and such, just most things.
I'd much rather have something called a Norn Emmissary than the brains trust we had around the time "Venomthrope" and "Pyrovore" were created.
Arson Fire wrote: I wonder if the 'Norn Emissary' is a renamed Dominatrix. Given that GW would be unlikely to want to keep that original name.
The name kind of fits with the dominatrixes role as a norn-queen's main psychic link to ground-side tyranid forces.
Could be the big plastic centerpiece model that nid fans have been after.
It wouldn't be just rename. Dominatrix is tyranid's equilavent of Warlord titan...so unless it's giant 6000pts or so model it would be total rewrite of dominatrix. And if you have more like angron size model not named dominatrix what would make it renamed dominatrix? Different size, appearance, capability and name...
tneva82 wrote: Contents? So far seen names of 4 but 5th was mystery last i saw.
We know there's 5th. Do we know who it's About? If lion comes pre-10th that book is logical for it and name would likely be lion el'johnson etc. Would also then make sense for gw to keep title secret as long as possible as name would be giant spoiler...
From WD:
Spoiler:
That means Arks of Omen and The Lion if real, wrapped up by May.
Arson Fire wrote: I wonder if the 'Norn Emissary' is a renamed Dominatrix. Given that GW would be unlikely to want to keep that original name.
The name kind of fits with the dominatrixes role as a norn-queen's main psychic link to ground-side tyranid forces.
Could be the big plastic centerpiece model that nid fans have been after.
It wouldn't be just rename. Dominatrix is tyranid's equilavent of Warlord titan...so unless it's giant 6000pts or so model it would be total rewrite of dominatrix. And if you have more like angron size model not named dominatrix what would make it renamed dominatrix? Different size, appearance, capability and name...
The dominatrix in Epic was more Warhound scale, with the Heirophant being in between Reaver and Warlord-sized.
Scale is fairly moot though as model sizes for Epic & 40k in the 90's were both heavily limited by the casting technology of the time, and since then lots of units that originated in Epic have been redesigned at a smaller or larger scale. The Hierophant is the most obvious example.
Yeah was about to say, the dominatrix may have been the nid supreme commander unit in epic but it wasn't the beefiest bio-titan around. It was smaller than both the hierophant and the hierodule, although that was before the sizes of those two units were retconned. So it's hard to say how big it should be now. Like other units ported from epic, it would inevitably be heavily redesigned.
Overread wrote: GW has Slaanesh - I think the Dominatrix is safe name wise.
The snarky thing to say is that nothing is safe from GW, but instead I'll point out that the Mistress of Repentance has been (unnecessarily) renamed to something else. Doesn't mean a new take on a Dominatrix is definitely going to suffer the same fate, but the precedence is there and it would be foolish to outright rule it out. Because, you know, nothing is safe from GW.
On a side note, first time I read the rumor I misread the thingy as Nom Emissary. Now cannot be unseen.
Overread wrote: GW has Slaanesh - I think the Dominatrix is safe name wise.
The snarky thing to say is that nothing is safe from GW, but instead I'll point out that the Mistress of Repentance has been (unnecessarily) renamed to something else. Doesn't mean a new take on a Dominatrix is definitely going to suffer the same fate, but the precedence is there and it would be foolish to outright rule it out. Because, you know, nothing is safe from GW.
On a side note, first time I read the rumor I misread the thingy as Nom Emissary. Now cannot be unseen.
You've got things like "Hive Tyrant" and "Swarmlord" and such that are just normal words. Not everything is named "Tervigon" and "Maleceptor" and such, just most things.
Both of those are quite old unit names, and Swarmlord isn't a dictionary word. It's probably trademarkable in the context of a toy soldier if someone else doesn't already have it.
Danny76 wrote: So was there some kind of “Valrak reveals all” video today about the Lion or was it nothing?
Yesterday, actually, but the Tarot card did not pan out and showed something about Farsight instead
Which was pretty obvious, seeing that we apparentyl get 4 cards per book, and are on card two for Farsight/Snikrot right now. The first Lion card will come in three weeks at the earliest.
Where is all the tarot stuff.
Never got posted in the AoO thread here did it?
There's a handy summary on reddit:
Format's pretty simple; Numeral. Name of the Card - High Gothic Blurb - "Card Reader's Description" - What the image on the card actually is - What I think it means.
----
I. Galaxy - De Galaxis Profundi - "The galaxy burns in the fire of ambition, another round of a great game begins." - Depicts an orrery draped with bells on ribbons, alongside a goblet and bowl of fruit. - My Interpretation; Not much meaning, just set up.
II. The Despoiler - Hereticus Ultima - "The despoiler, venom in his hearts, and blood on his blades. What new darkness does he bring?" - Depicts a King with a flaming crown, seated upon a throne of Chaos. There is a snake around his throat, and he holds a scroll and an apple with maggots - My Interpretation; This one's super obvious, it's Abaddon.
III. The Hulk - Gargantua Perditum - "The Hulk, the Arks of Omen, Monuments of iron, and stone, and hate, and time." - Depicts a Castle on an island, encircled by a ring of stars, with skeletons approaching by boat. - My Interpretation; The castle is the Imperium in general, and the boats are the actual arks, ships of death if you will.
IV. The Silver Key - Clavargentis - "Ah, the silver key. New doorways, new paths, new possibilities." - Depicts a key made of gears, floating in space. - My Interpretation; With AoO: Abaddon out, this one is pretty obvious, it's the prophesized key Abaddon and Vashtorr are trying to make.
----
V. The Great Hoste - De Infernum Legionis - "The great hoste, a blood red tide of singing blades. Led by..." - Depicts 8 Wolf Heads impaled on Spears - My Interpretation; It's the World Eaters
VI. Hound - Abominus - "The hound, a great beast, unliving but undying, it claws at reality's gate." - Depicts a great wolf's head in front of an eight-pointed star. Its mouth is drooling blood into a chalice. There's also some skull candles. - My Interpretation; It's Angron
VII. The Shattered World - Apocalyptus Est - "The shattered world, devastation, annihilation, the future reeks of cataclysm." - Depicts an angelic figure with long hair and golden wings. Surrounded by four cherubs with skulls for heads. - My Interpretation; My gut reaction was Cadia, but maybe it's just general prophetic doom. Could also just be the planet Angron is fighting on; Malakbael.
VIII. God Emperor (Inversed) - De Imperator Invertus - "God Emperor, inversed, the Imperium's end, the fall of humanity's empire." - Depicts the Emperor's Skull upside down. - My Interpretation; My friend put a ton of stock into this and said it was GW hinting the Emperor would die. I'm more skeptical, I say it means the Imperium is teetering on the brink of destruction (like it always has been), or maybe they'll just lose this one battle. I wager we'll know what it means once the Angron book comes out.
----
IX. Daemon - Malevolus - "Daemon, the veil grows thin, malignancy bleeds through, from one world, into the next." - Depicts some spooky eyes looking through a broken wall. - My Interpretation; It's Vashtorr manifesting into reality to fight things.
X. Astartes - Angelus Mortis - "Astartes. And here stand the angels of death, bloodied, but unbroken." - Depicts an angelic figure in green robes, holding a broken sword and a shield, standing in front of a forest and a pyramid, and behind a pile of bodies. - My Interpretation; It's the Dark Angels
XI. The Lightning Tower - De Fulminatorum Colossi - "The lightning tower. A great war. Fire and wrath unleashed on sacred rock." - Depicts a stone tower being struck by lightning amidst a raging sea. - My Interpretation; This one is definitely the Rock. We now know Vashtorr is attacking it in book three from the boxset, afterall.
XII. Daemon (Inversed) - Malevolus Invertus - "Daemon, inversed. And yet... chaos is fickle, forever turning upon itself." - Depicts two daemons stabbing each other. - My Interpretation; We're gonna get some chaos infighting. Vashtorr vs. The Fallen perhaps? Those guys do have a way of worming themselves into every Dark Angels plot.
----
XIII. The Horde - Beastiarus Magnifactor - “The Horde. A horde descends, scarlet and crimson souls, blood drunk, blood maddened, flooding the galaxy.” - Depicts a hand emerging from a pile of rats and reaching for Farsight’s Sword. - My Interpretation; I reckon Angron and the World Eaters are gonna end up fighting Farsight and his Exclave. I could also see this being Orks, a different “Horde” faction out for a good bit of violence, given the World Eaters were previously called “The Hoste”
XIV. The Young Warrior - De Bellicosa Novitius - “The young warrior. And a light gutters in the endless black, it may scourge the red tide. It may drown beneath its waves.” - Depicts a human warrior leading a horse to some signposts. However, the horse has the Tau Empire symbol on its armor, and the warrior is holding Farsight’s sword. - My Interpretation; Further indication of Farsight facing off against the horde.
The Norn emissary gaunt - in 3rd edition there used to be a mutation you could give a gaunt to act as a hive node, becoming a synapse creature. This could be an evolution of that.[model wise it was a gaunt with a warrior head],
Regarding XIII: It's got to be the Orks, since GW has already stated that Book 4 is "a strictly Xenos affair". Also, doesn't Farsight have some unfinished business with Orks?
XIV talks about a "red tide", which doesn't sound like Orks to me. Might be Tyranids if it's supposed to be strictly Xenos.
On the one hand that fits with the rumors of Tyranids being the other poster boy of 10th ed. On the other hand we saw and Ork silhouette in the new year's preview?
silverstu wrote: The Norn emissary gaunt - in 3rd edition there used to be a mutation you could give a gaunt to act as a hive node, becoming a synapse creature. This could be an evolution of that.[model wise it was a gaunt with a warrior head],
You may be right. Totally forgot about the old mutant genus rules.
Studio tyranids have been mostly purple and ivory for a while, idk if the lore has much to say about any commonly accepted colourations but the presentation of the models doesn't say red. I'd say tide can only probably suggest Tyranids, Orks, or Chaos though.
silverstu wrote: The Norn emissary gaunt - in 3rd edition there used to be a mutation you could give a gaunt to act as a hive node, becoming a synapse creature. This could be an evolution of that.[model wise it was a gaunt with a warrior head],
Kind of.
It was a no-Brainer, army theme reading upgrade which upped the Ld from 5 to 10, neatly removing any need to manage your synaptic web, allowing boring Monstrous Creature heavy lists to dominate, as your two troop tax units no longer needed any kind of support.
silverstu wrote: The Norn emissary gaunt - in 3rd edition there used to be a mutation you could give a gaunt to act as a hive node, becoming a synapse creature. This could be an evolution of that.[model wise it was a gaunt with a warrior head],
Kind of.
It was a no-Brainer, army theme reading upgrade which upped the Ld from 5 to 10, neatly removing any need to manage your synaptic web, allowing boring Monstrous Creature heavy lists to dominate, as your two troop tax units no longer needed any kind of support.
It remains to be seen what they do with the concept, but imho the fact that it's noticeable enough to make it into early-stage rumours counts against it just being a 10-point morale upgrade of no great importance. At least it seems that it gets its own dedicated model, which probably means a significant-ish battlefield role.
JWBS wrote: Studio tyranids have been mostly purple and ivory for a while, idk if the lore has much to say about any commonly accepted colourations but the presentation of the models doesn't say red. I'd say tide can only probably suggest Tyranids, Orks, or Chaos though.
GW does occasionally change the poster boys of some factions. Currently for Eldar it's Saim Hann after Iyanden was in the spotlight during 7th ed. Tau used to have T'au front and center, these days it's Vior'la I think.
Tau fought Leviathan and Gorgonzola already, with the former being the poster boys for now, but we can't rule out that someone else takes the spotlight next edition.
I doubt that this red tide is tyranid related. Sounds more like a khorne thing to me.
If it were tyranids, unless they come up with a new fleet then behemoth is the fleet with the most red colouration. Although they're past their prime and I wouldn't expect them to become the poster boys again. Maybe one of the splinters of behemoth which have been mentioned a few times in recent codexes, like the court of the nephilim king. But I very much doubt it.
silverstu wrote: The Norn emissary gaunt - in 3rd edition there used to be a mutation you could give a gaunt to act as a hive node, becoming a synapse creature. This could be an evolution of that.[model wise it was a gaunt with a warrior head],
Kind of.
It was a no-Brainer, army theme reading upgrade which upped the Ld from 5 to 10, neatly removing any need to manage your synaptic web, allowing boring Monstrous Creature heavy lists to dominate, as your two troop tax units no longer needed any kind of support.
Given the size of the cranium compared to the body, one could definite argue it was a "big brain" upgrade...
Geifer wrote: XIV talks about a "red tide", which doesn't sound like Orks to me. Might be Tyranids if it's supposed to be strictly Xenos.
On the one hand that fits with the rumors of Tyranids being the other poster boy of 10th ed. On the other hand we saw and Ork silhouette in the new year's preview?
To conclude, Hrud or bust! I have spoken.
Based on what happens in the new Arks of Omen Angron book its
Spoiler:
An entire Imperial Crusade Fleet (and whoever else was there) declared traitor after going insane from the destruction of a DOAT Psyker Fueled Mini-astronomican device used beyond its limits.Only survivors unaffected are Grey Knights, Custodes and Sisters of SIlence
Either that, or the effects of that event on someone else.
Geifer wrote: XIV talks about a "red tide", which doesn't sound like Orks to me. Might be Tyranids if it's supposed to be strictly Xenos.
On the one hand that fits with the rumors of Tyranids being the other poster boy of 10th ed. On the other hand we saw and Ork silhouette in the new year's preview?
To conclude, Hrud or bust! I have spoken.
Based on what happens in the new Arks of Omen Angron book its
Spoiler:
An entire Imperial Crusade Fleet (and whoever else was there) declared traitor after going insane from the destruction of a DOAT Psyker Fueled Mini-astronomican device used beyond its limits.Only survivors unaffected are Grey Knights, Custodes and Sisters of SIlence
It may be a setup for finally doing proper traitor guard in 10th.
Geifer wrote: XIV talks about a "red tide", which doesn't sound like Orks to me. Might be Tyranids if it's supposed to be strictly Xenos.
On the one hand that fits with the rumors of Tyranids being the other poster boy of 10th ed. On the other hand we saw and Ork silhouette in the new year's preview?
To conclude, Hrud or bust! I have spoken.
Based on what happens in the new Arks of Omen Angron book its
Spoiler:
An entire Imperial Crusade Fleet (and whoever else was there) declared traitor after going insane from the destruction of a DOAT Psyker Fueled Mini-astronomican device used beyond its limits.Only survivors unaffected are Grey Knights, Custodes and Sisters of SIlence
It may be a setup for finally doing proper traitor guard in 10th.
Added summaries for today's and saturday's videos to the OP.
Probably at the end of the week, maybe sooner if i have time, i'll reorganize the OP and hide the older updates in a spoiler or something.
Question: do you think we need thematical summaries for the topics box set, 10th edition in general, marines and tyranids, or do you think the chronological updates are enough?
Added summaries for today's and saturday's videos to the OP.
Probably at the end of the week, maybe sooner if i have time, i'll reorganize the OP and hide the older updates in a spoiler or something.
Question: do you think we need thematical summaries for the topics box set, 10th edition in general, marines and tyranids, or do you think the chronological updates are enough?
You're doing a grand job and at this stage chronological is fine but at some point in the not too distant future it might need to be grouped by topic, but I'd also argue at that point each topic is it's own thread. Only extra feedback I can suggest is posting the summaries in with these comments like the one I'm replying to so people aren't then forced to go to the OP. Thank you again though, doing great work.
That aside, I think the date feels right given everything else we know is happening. Indexes without a huge reset are bizarre, the suggestion that WE are a peek behind the curtain is interesting as it leaves a question mark if they'll need an index entry or not.
Added summaries for today's and saturday's videos to the OP.
Probably at the end of the week, maybe sooner if i have time, i'll reorganize the OP and hide the older updates in a spoiler or something.
Question: do you think we need thematical summaries for the topics box set, 10th edition in general, marines and tyranids, or do you think the chronological updates are enough?
You're doing a grand job and at this stage chronological is fine but at some point in the not too distant future it might need to be grouped by topic, but I'd also argue at that point each topic is it's own thread. Only extra feedback I can suggest is posting the summaries in with these comments like the one I'm replying to so people aren't then forced to go to the OP. Thank you again though, doing great work.
That aside, I think the date feels right given everything else we know is happening. Indexes without a huge reset are bizarre, the suggestion that WE are a peek behind the curtain is interesting as it leaves a question mark if they'll need an index entry or not.
Alright, i'll do that for the next update, makes sense. For the time being i'll keep the topics together because they tend to appear in the sames videos, maybe the army-specific ones can be split off later when we have more info. I think until then the summaries are good enough, and can be ported over to a new thread if the need arises.
Valrak's latest video says the release day is June 24th, and that GW staff are being told they're not allowed to book leave around then.
FWIW, I know GW have done the not allowed to book leave around previous 40k launches and this is about the same level of notice, so I can believe that.
He also speaks a bit about how he's not sure how much of a "reset" the rules are, but just that it is a codex reset and the edition will have indexes at launch. So sounds a bit more consistent with the other rumours.
The Phazer wrote: Valrak's latest video says the release day is June 24th, and that GW staff are being told they're not allowed to book leave around then.
FWIW, I know GW have done the not allowed to book leave around previous 40k launches and this is about the same level of notice, so I can believe that.
He also speaks a bit about how he's not sure how much of a "reset" the rules are, but just that it is a codex reset and the edition will have indexes at launch. So sounds a bit more consistent with the other rumours.
The Phazer wrote: Valrak's latest video says the release day is June 24th, and that GW staff are being told they're not allowed to book leave around then.
FWIW, I know GW have done the not allowed to book leave around previous 40k launches and this is about the same level of notice, so I can believe that.
He also speaks a bit about how he's not sure how much of a "reset" the rules are, but just that it is a codex reset and the edition will have indexes at launch. So sounds a bit more consistent with the other rumours.
In one of his videos from a few months back he said he'd heard 10th edition would be coming towards the end of the year, though.
The Phazer wrote: He also speaks a bit about how he's not sure how much of a "reset" the rules are, but just that it is a codex reset and the edition will have indexes at launch. So sounds a bit more consistent with the other rumours.
A codex reset with indices at launch means a pretty big rules change. An incremental core rules change doesn't require that, or at least didn't for past edition changes.
If they're jumping ship already, that would honestly make 8th/9th the shortest and least successful 'era' of 40k.
The Phazer wrote: He also speaks a bit about how he's not sure how much of a "reset" the rules are, but just that it is a codex reset and the edition will have indexes at launch. So sounds a bit more consistent with the other rumours.
A codex reset with indices at launch means a pretty big rules change. An incremental core rules change doesn't require that.
The B&C rumours say that the rules itself are changing only incrementally, but the Stratagem system is basically reset totally. That would fit with these rumours, because almost every faction has alternative force org rules etc. that at the moment work with or through stratagems, and that would need to be adressed by an index or a FAQ/ruling of some sort.
The out of control power creep of the codexes is the biggest issue with 9th, IMHO. The framework of the rules doesn’t need a hard reboot, just all the books with their layerd special rules, strats, and damage/resilience proliferation arms race.
A set of indexes might be just what the Dr. ordered. Plus GW gets to sell us a set of those at the start, and new codexes when they get around to it.
The Phazer wrote: He also speaks a bit about how he's not sure how much of a "reset" the rules are, but just that it is a codex reset and the edition will have indexes at launch. So sounds a bit more consistent with the other rumours.
A codex reset with indices at launch means a pretty big rules change. An incremental core rules change doesn't require that.
The B&C rumours say that the rules itself are changing only incrementally, but the Stratagem system is basically reset totally. That would fit with these rumours, because almost every faction has alternative force org rules etc. that at the moment work with or through stratagems, and that would need to be adressed by an index or a FAQ/ruling of some sort.
Hmm, I would think a FAQ (or online 'index') would be the way to go then. Because the most likely scenario (in line with those B&C rumors) is bringing the other books (and their pages and pages of strats, traits and etc) in line with a much shorter lists in the World Eater's codex. (And avoid the outrage that would come from invalidating the ~4 month old codex)
The Phazer wrote: He also speaks a bit about how he's not sure how much of a "reset" the rules are, but just that it is a codex reset and the edition will have indexes at launch. So sounds a bit more consistent with the other rumours.
A codex reset with indices at launch means a pretty big rules change. An incremental core rules change doesn't require that.
The B&C rumours say that the rules itself are changing only incrementally, but the Stratagem system is basically reset totally. That would fit with these rumours, because almost every faction has alternative force org rules etc. that at the moment work with or through stratagems, and that would need to be adressed by an index or a FAQ/ruling of some sort.
Hmm, I would think a FAQ (or online 'index') would be the way to go then. Because the most likely scenario (in line with those B&C rumors) is bringing the other books (and their pages and pages of strats, traits and etc) in line with a much shorter lists in the World Eater's codex.
Indeed, but 'Indexes' can mean a lot of different things, it may be just that, some sort of free online resource, printed in or alongside WD, sold as a book or even all of that. We have historical examples for all of that, so until we get more solid rumours it would be foolish to rule that out. I agree that the most likely outcome is pages and pages of 'Remove stratagem X. Remove stratagem Y. Stratagem Z now costs no CP. Remove...'
Valrak did a new video today with some interesting things, its not from his usual sources but as he said:
This is not from my sources but does match some of what I've heard from my own:
Summary:
Spoiler:
>Warhammer 40,000 10th edition is launching June 24th 2023
>Starter box is Adeptus Astartes vs Tyranids.
>Promotional art will show them as Dark Angels and Hive Fleet Leviathan
>Dark Angels will receive a model of Lion El'jonson
>Tyranid players will receive a new model called an Apex Swarmlord
>Narrative does not appear to be a timeskip but expanding on events elsewhere while the Indomitus Crusade battles the Necrons led by the Silent King. Arks of Omen: The Lion will be the first step in a longform narrative chain tying both galactic conflicts together.
>Core rules are streamlined
>Psychic Phase and Command Phase are combined
>Toughness is now only on datasheets with a [Heavy Armour] keyword ability. E.g Terminators, Rhinos, Dreadnoughts etc. Generic troops now only roll to hit when attacking and save when defending.
>Armour Pen. and Invulnerable saves are unchanged.
>Crusade is being simplified and behaves closer to Age of Sigmars Path to Glory
>Detachments, Battle forging, Stratagems and CP generation have all be simplified or reworked
>Game is intended to be faster, with smaller units and a much bigger emphasis on terrain
>Along with the start box there will be a new series of terrain intended to scale from small to medium to large scale games
>The core rules will be free online with two variants. "Narrative" and "Competitive"
>There is a codex coming for Dark Admech and one new Xenos race
>A second wave of Votann along with a updated codex is expected to launch in September
>The way Space Marines will receive a codex and rules for Chapters is changing completely and will be explained in a special White Dwarf releasing in May 2023 and closer to release on the Warhammer Community website
>The new edition will also see GW retiring the current range of Texture Paints and they will be replaced with new products using new materials intended to be another Contrast Paint style product to quickly allow beginners in a partnership with 'Screen Products Limited'
Matrindur wrote: Valrak did a new video today with some interesting things, its not from his usual sources but:
Just want to share this, now I don't really go off other peoples sources but some stuff in here is what I've been told and haven't spoken about so it peaked my interest:
Summary:
Spoiler:
>Warhammer 40,000 10th edition is launching June 24th 2023
>Starter box is Adeptus Astartes vs Tyranids.
>Promotional art will show them as Dark Angels and Hive Fleet Leviathan
>Dark Angels will receive a model of Lion El'jonson
>Tyranid players will receive a new model called an Apex Swarmlord
>Narrative does not appear to be a timeskip but expanding on events elsewhere while the Indomitus Crusade battles the Necrons led by the Silent King. Arks of Omen: The Lion will be the first step in a longform narrative chain tying both galactic conflicts together.
>Core rules are streamlined
>Psychic Phase and Command Phase are combined
>Toughness is now only on datasheets with a [Heavy Armour] keyword ability. E.g Terminators, Rhinos, Dreadnoughts etc. Generic troops now only roll to hit when attacking and save when defending.
>Armour Pen. and Invulnerable saves are unchanged.
>Crusade is being simplified and behaves closer to Age of Sigmars Path to Glory
>Detachments, Battle forging, Stratagems and CP generation have all be simplified or reworked
>Game is intended to be faster, with smaller units and a much bigger emphasis on terrain
>Along with the start box there will be a new series of terrain intended to scale from small to medium to large scale games
>The core rules will be free online with two variants. "Narrative" and "Competitive"
>There is a codex coming for Dark Admech and one new Xenos race
>A second wave of Votann along with a updated codex is expected to launch in September
>The way Space Marines will receive a codex and rules for Chapters is changing completely and will be explained in a special White Dwarf releasing in May 2023 and closer to release on the Warhammer Community website
>The new edition will also see GW retiring the current range of Texture Paints and they will be replaced with new products using new materials intended to be another Contrast Paint style product to quickly allow beginners in a partnership with 'Screen Products Limited'
Matrindur wrote: Valrak did a new video today with some interesting things, its not from his usual sources but:
Just want to share this, now I don't really go off other peoples sources but some stuff in here is what I've been told and haven't spoken about so it peaked my interest:
Summary:
Spoiler:
>Warhammer 40,000 10th edition is launching June 24th 2023
>Starter box is Adeptus Astartes vs Tyranids.
>Promotional art will show them as Dark Angels and Hive Fleet Leviathan
>Dark Angels will receive a model of Lion El'jonson
>Tyranid players will receive a new model called an Apex Swarmlord
>Narrative does not appear to be a timeskip but expanding on events elsewhere while the Indomitus Crusade battles the Necrons led by the Silent King. Arks of Omen: The Lion will be the first step in a longform narrative chain tying both galactic conflicts together.
>Core rules are streamlined
>Psychic Phase and Command Phase are combined
>Toughness is now only on datasheets with a [Heavy Armour] keyword ability. E.g Terminators, Rhinos, Dreadnoughts etc. Generic troops now only roll to hit when attacking and save when defending.
>Armour Pen. and Invulnerable saves are unchanged.
>Crusade is being simplified and behaves closer to Age of Sigmars Path to Glory
>Detachments, Battle forging, Stratagems and CP generation have all be simplified or reworked
>Game is intended to be faster, with smaller units and a much bigger emphasis on terrain
>Along with the start box there will be a new series of terrain intended to scale from small to medium to large scale games
>The core rules will be free online with two variants. "Narrative" and "Competitive"
>There is a codex coming for Dark Admech and one new Xenos race
>A second wave of Votann along with a updated codex is expected to launch in September
>The way Space Marines will receive a codex and rules for Chapters is changing completely and will be explained in a special White Dwarf releasing in May 2023 and closer to release on the Warhammer Community website
>The new edition will also see GW retiring the current range of Texture Paints and they will be replaced with new products using new materials intended to be another Contrast Paint style product to quickly allow beginners in a partnership with 'Screen Products Limited'
Video:
Spoiler:
I find this quite difficult to believe because of the broadness of it. Not only has this guy supposedly seen marketing material, he's also seen miniatures close to release, stuff even further off including brand new unannounced army plans, new codex books, new waves for already existing armies, has seen the rules in upcoming codexs, has specific dates for releases, and knows what GWs buisness plans are regarding paints.
That's the sort of thing covering aspects of several different jobs and/or someone higher up. It's too varied in scope to seem like something someone could have actually found out/leaked themselves.
Matrindur wrote: Valrak did a new video today with some interesting things, its not from his usual sources but:
Just want to share this, now I don't really go off other peoples sources but some stuff in here is what I've been told and haven't spoken about so it peaked my interest:
Summary:
Spoiler:
>Warhammer 40,000 10th edition is launching June 24th 2023
>Starter box is Adeptus Astartes vs Tyranids.
>Promotional art will show them as Dark Angels and Hive Fleet Leviathan
>Dark Angels will receive a model of Lion El'jonson
>Tyranid players will receive a new model called an Apex Swarmlord
>Narrative does not appear to be a timeskip but expanding on events elsewhere while the Indomitus Crusade battles the Necrons led by the Silent King. Arks of Omen: The Lion will be the first step in a longform narrative chain tying both galactic conflicts together.
>Core rules are streamlined
>Psychic Phase and Command Phase are combined
>Toughness is now only on datasheets with a [Heavy Armour] keyword ability. E.g Terminators, Rhinos, Dreadnoughts etc. Generic troops now only roll to hit when attacking and save when defending.
>Armour Pen. and Invulnerable saves are unchanged.
>Crusade is being simplified and behaves closer to Age of Sigmars Path to Glory
>Detachments, Battle forging, Stratagems and CP generation have all be simplified or reworked
>Game is intended to be faster, with smaller units and a much bigger emphasis on terrain
>Along with the start box there will be a new series of terrain intended to scale from small to medium to large scale games
>The core rules will be free online with two variants. "Narrative" and "Competitive"
>There is a codex coming for Dark Admech and one new Xenos race
>A second wave of Votann along with a updated codex is expected to launch in September
>The way Space Marines will receive a codex and rules for Chapters is changing completely and will be explained in a special White Dwarf releasing in May 2023 and closer to release on the Warhammer Community website
>The new edition will also see GW retiring the current range of Texture Paints and they will be replaced with new products using new materials intended to be another Contrast Paint style product to quickly allow beginners in a partnership with 'Screen Products Limited'
Video:
Spoiler:
I find this quite difficult to believe because of the broadness of it. Not only has this guy supposedly seen marketing material, he's also seen miniatures close to release, stuff even further off including brand new unannounced army plans, new codex books, new waves for already existing armies, has seen the rules in upcoming codexs, has specific dates for releases, and knows what GWs buisness plans are regarding paints.
That's the sort of thing covering aspects of several different jobs and/or someone higher up. It's too varied in scope to seem like something someone could have actually found out/leaked themselves.
Yeah, unless the source of that rumour got hold of something like an internal report, training material for staff seminars that are months off or something like that that list stretches belief in some aspects - it looks like wishlisting added in to known rumours and spiced up with some guesswork. What gives it away IMHO is the stuff about the background, that usually does not get included in the material that leaks with that amount of detail. Usually it's just parts of backcovers, short fluff blurbs from boxes or store descriptions and such if anything at all.
Matrindur wrote: Valrak did a new video today with some interesting things, its not from his usual sources but:
Just want to share this, now I don't really go off other peoples sources but some stuff in here is what I've been told and haven't spoken about so it peaked my interest:
Summary:
Spoiler:
>Warhammer 40,000 10th edition is launching June 24th 2023
>Starter box is Adeptus Astartes vs Tyranids.
>Promotional art will show them as Dark Angels and Hive Fleet Leviathan
>Dark Angels will receive a model of Lion El'jonson
>Tyranid players will receive a new model called an Apex Swarmlord
>Narrative does not appear to be a timeskip but expanding on events elsewhere while the Indomitus Crusade battles the Necrons led by the Silent King. Arks of Omen: The Lion will be the first step in a longform narrative chain tying both galactic conflicts together.
>Core rules are streamlined
>Psychic Phase and Command Phase are combined
>Toughness is now only on datasheets with a [Heavy Armour] keyword ability. E.g Terminators, Rhinos, Dreadnoughts etc. Generic troops now only roll to hit when attacking and save when defending.
>Armour Pen. and Invulnerable saves are unchanged.
>Crusade is being simplified and behaves closer to Age of Sigmars Path to Glory
>Detachments, Battle forging, Stratagems and CP generation have all be simplified or reworked
>Game is intended to be faster, with smaller units and a much bigger emphasis on terrain
>Along with the start box there will be a new series of terrain intended to scale from small to medium to large scale games
>The core rules will be free online with two variants. "Narrative" and "Competitive"
>There is a codex coming for Dark Admech and one new Xenos race
>A second wave of Votann along with a updated codex is expected to launch in September
>The way Space Marines will receive a codex and rules for Chapters is changing completely and will be explained in a special White Dwarf releasing in May 2023 and closer to release on the Warhammer Community website
>The new edition will also see GW retiring the current range of Texture Paints and they will be replaced with new products using new materials intended to be another Contrast Paint style product to quickly allow beginners in a partnership with 'Screen Products Limited'
Video:
Spoiler:
I find this quite difficult to believe because of the broadness of it. Not only has this guy supposedly seen marketing material, he's also seen miniatures close to release, stuff even further off including brand new unannounced army plans, new codex books, new waves for already existing armies, has seen the rules in upcoming codexs, has specific dates for releases, and knows what GWs buisness plans are regarding paints.
That's the sort of thing covering aspects of several different jobs and/or someone higher up. It's too varied in scope to seem like something someone could have actually found out/leaked themselves.
I believe this is from a different source than the previous rumours, the other set were form someone in marketing and Valrak also mentioned knowing about their training days etc. so it's not impossible he has a few higher ups feeding bits.
Interesting that we've now heard three different chapters are the "poster boys" for the starter set. But Dark Angels would make sense to me, they're going to want to tie everything back to the Lion's return for a while, and a Dark Angels versus Tyranids conflict hasn't really been done before, unlike Ultramarines and Blood Angels. Then again, there are some fundamentals that speak to the other direction - one of the reasons for picking Ultramarines before was the ease of painting them, and for Dark Angels in a box like this you're going to end up with different coloured Marines for example.
Having said that, I was also of the opinion before that they might lean into Ultramarines versus Tyranids to go with Space Marine 2, so who knows at this point.
Edit: On the rules I'm not a big fan at all of removing stat checks in the game depending on special rules, but I guess that is conditional that the toughness value needs a complete reset to use the range much more. If we remain in a situation where all general infantry is either three or four I guess it makes sense.
I'm not saying anything about the potential valdity of these rumours, but dropping toughness altogether from basic troops sounds like an interesting change! Should make heavier armour mean something again.
Condensing most hit-wound-save rollathons to just hit-save sounds like it would speed combat resolution up considerably, especially when bucketfulls of dice are flying around.
If these rumours turn out to be true, we will be moving into uncharted waters.. exciting! Maybe it will be rubbish, or maybe it'll turn out an improvement, remains to be seen of course..
Unless GW suddenly get better at writing, that sounds like a lot of awful.
So much of the current bloat seems to come from trying to make the streamlined rules interesting.
And I can’t see that getting better if they just streamline it more.
Will probably just lead to more issues and wouldn’t be happy for most of that.
Assuming the rumor regarding toughness saves is true it will be interesting to see where the break point between roll and no roll falls. Per the rumor Terminators will get a roll. I imagine anything less than power armor (or the equivalent) will not get a roll. I wonder which side of the rule power armor will fall on?
Minor extra observation I've see elsewhere, the boarding action warriors are the stock image GW models but have been repainted, which would make sense in light of a wider faction revamp. The broodlord and stealers however, have not.
Ultimately the thing that bugs me most about 'no toughness' is that people buying the books neat the end of the edition and getting to use them all of none months.
It's a raw friggin' deal, if true.
On the subject of the actual rules I am not sure I understand how weapons will function. A lascannon will be a single shot ( made up scenario ) that wound-hits on a 2+ and then maybe you get a save ( if not modded away )? And perhaps this 'heavy armor' modifies that roll so it's a 4+ against a tank?
If it isn't a D10 system that seems like it will make everything feel really flat.
We really need like some sort of Addendum that recaps the full extent of these rumours, with the specific sources seperated so we aren't bonked down in this plethora of rumours.
Segersgia wrote: We really need like some sort of Addendum that recaps the full extent of these rumours, with the specific sources seperated so we aren't bonked down in this plethora of rumours.
I will do this the coming weekend, as that needs a bit of time and i want to preserve the distinction between 'trusted' sources and other rumour origins.
Daedalus81 wrote: Ultimately the thing that bugs me most about 'no toughness' is that people buying the books neat the end of the edition and getting to use them all of none months.
It's a raw friggin' deal, if true.
On the subject of the actual rules I am not sure I understand how weapons will function. A lascannon will be a single shot ( made up scenario ) that wound-hits on a 2+ and then maybe you get a save ( if not modded away )? And perhaps this 'heavy armor' modifies that roll so it's a 4+ against a tank?
If it isn't a D10 system that seems like it will make everything feel really flat.
I think the idea is lascannon shoots, does it hit? if yes is the target "heavy armour"? If yes then roll to wound, if not proceed to save. If the wound roll is successful roll to save.
Apple fox wrote: Unless GW suddenly get better at writing, that sounds like a lot of awful.
So much of the current bloat seems to come from trying to make the streamlined rules interesting.
And I can’t see that getting better if they just streamline it more.
Will probably just lead to more issues and wouldn’t be happy for most of that.
yeah, main problem usually is that GW removes too much from the core to streamline, than runs out of possibilities to make each faction unique after a certain point and starts adding rules back for the factions coming after that point (which looks like it is not a big problem in AoS as somehow the factions are unique without adding tons of special rules)
also just by looking at the "free" core, streamlining of the core is not the problem and never was, Codex bloat was and this is now the 3rd Edition in a row GW does not understand this and again starts with a limited core
the only thing to hope is that this time they get the Index right and not just copy&paste current unit stats without adapting to the new rules like they did in 8th
F28: War Always Changes streamlines toughness and armour together, and it makes for a significantly faster take on the core 40K experience without really losing anything. I wouldn't be surprised if GW is looking at how many people are leaving "the hobby" for slightly more elegant rulesets like this and One Page Rules, and has decided to copy some aspects of those rules.
“Promotional art will show them [the starter box miniatures] as Dark Angels and Hive Fleet Leviathan.”
Sounds like someone got potato cam pictures of the Wrath of the Soul Forge King and Tyranid boarding patrol boxes.
So let's fix 9th's lethality issues by making it even easier to kill things.
That sounds like a GW solution alright.
Smaug wrote: “Promotional art will show them [the starter box miniatures] as Dark Angels and Hive Fleet Leviathan.” Sounds like someone got potato cam pictures of the Wrath of the Soul Forge King and Tyranid boarding patrol boxes.
Seems weird to go from "Blood Angels and Tyranids! Blood Angels and Tyranids! Blood Angels and Tyranids!" for months and months to suddenly swerve to "Nope, actually Dark Angels and Tyranids!".
The BA vs Tyranids is because god forbid Tyranids fight anyone else but BA, I feel.
But yeah, the original source of this was 4chan, so take that as you will. Big green text post, could be prophecy, could be nothing.
the idea that they'd go to a Warcry-esque way of hitting/saving except for 'Heavy Armor' things as a way to 'simplify' the game feels... opposite of what they are claiming. Having exceptions inherently complicates things.
Also, Crusade becoming more like Path to Glory is basically the opposite of what anyone wants. People love Crusade, hate PtG, why would they go that way?
Time will tell. I feel like some of this absolutely could happen, like a second wave of Votann and calling the new model an 'Apex Swarmlord', but a lot of the rest feels like bunk.
