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New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 09:13:22


Post by: Mad Doc Grotsnik


How do!

Separating out as I think it deserve a topic unto itself, saves folk having to Wade through non-Nid posts elsewhere.

First out the gate? The cinematic trailer. Not only pretty to look at in its own right, but seems to have teases of upcoming models.




Lots and lots to see. Possibly new Carnifex, or a smaller Screamer Killer. Also almost certainly a new Lictor (finally). Pick your own bones.

Then we have the Gaunt shown off. Lovely lithe redone Gaunt, hopefully without its head being split in two with a channel connecting to the lower jaw. Approximately the same size as existing, but a much better and more detailed sculpt. Lovely stuff.



Then? A couple of screen grabs for your delectation. Feel free to add more below.




Automatically Appended Next Post:
We also have the data sheet for Termagants.



Still have their trip of ranged weapons. Mild disappoint at no mention of Stranglewebs or Spike Rifles, but we can’t have everything.

Data sheet is considerably simplified. But not, on second look, as simplified as AoS. The stats are still there, just in different places.

OC is Objective Controls. Every unit will have a rating, indicating how many Points a given model contributes to who controls an objective. Confirmed to be entirely replacing ObSec.












New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 09:18:48


Post by: Tsagualsa


The upper screengrab is biovores firing i think


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 09:21:52


Post by: Mad Doc Grotsnik


Ohhhh I see it now. I thought the gun was grasped in forearms, with the head being a separate bug in the mid ground.

But nope. It’s one bug, with a back mounted bio-weapon.


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 09:29:52


Post by: Bignugs


They look great I hope they are still on the old base size though I think that would be unlikely. Rebasing the old models will be a head ache. Can’t wait to see the new hormagaunts


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 09:39:26


Post by: Kinetochore


New Gaunts are nice - not nice enough for me to face painting another 40 of them though....

Defo picking up a giant brain bug though.

Wonder if there will be many changes to how psychic phase works or if they will bring back the Zoanthropes attack as a shooting attack..


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 10:06:43


Post by: Overread


100% Hyped for this!!

Gaunts without split heads
Psy leader
Screamer Killer (looks like a really great fusion of all 3 generations of tyranids)
Biovores means update in plastic (which hopefully includes pyrovores)
Lictor also appeared for a second so that I hope also gets a plastic update


Which would bring Tyranids to a 100% plastic army with possibly only one missing model - the Red Terror (this new psy unit might not be the Doom but it will likely be as close as counts as)


I do wonder if new gaunts means we might also see new hormagaunts and potentially new weapons for gaunts - eg the spike rifle could make a return!


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 10:30:49


Post by: Mad Doc Grotsnik


The reveal stream pitched this as “the single biggest update Tyranids have ever received”.

That’s….quite a bold claim, as they’ve had two or three redos over the many years I’ve been into 40k. Funnily enough, I consider the most significant also the most awful. Bad 3rd Ed, dirty 3rd Ed. In your bed, on your rug!


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 10:36:14


Post by: Slipspace


 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
The reveal stream pitched this as “the single biggest update Tyranids have ever received”.

That’s….quite a bold claim, as they’ve had two or three redos over the many years I’ve been into 40k. Funnily enough, I consider the most significant also the most awful. Bad 3rd Ed, dirty 3rd Ed. In your bed, on your rug!

IIRC NIds are an army that has got gradual updates in waves, spread across multiple editions. The Gaunts are ancient but they got some new kits for other units this edition, while kits like Warriors are somewhere in the middle. Maybe they're getting a more extensive range refresh all at once.


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 10:36:45


Post by: Scottywan82


Damn! That animation shows a new lictor, new carnifex, new hormagaunts, and new termigants. Plus that new Zoanthrope-esque thing with it's two floating brain buddies. This looks wild.


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 10:43:28


Post by: Mad Doc Grotsnik


Notably, we see more than one of the Big Brain Bug, which to me suggests it’s not a Special Character.

Part of me wants it to be a Norn Queen, but that part of me is silly, very silly indeed. And needs to shut up.


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 10:48:29


Post by: tneva82


 Overread wrote:
100% Hyped for this!!

Gaunts without split heads


Don't bank on this. Undercuts means they cannot have those heads with tongues as one piece. There's alternatives like tongue being separate you glue to the base or maybe underjaw with tongue is separate piece but those open mouth with tongue out aren't one piece unless GW has figured something new with casting.

They aren't as they are just for lolz and to piss off customers. Technical limitations with plastics are a thing.


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 10:53:47


Post by: lord_blackfang


Don't care for new gaunts. Looks like they tried to do 1 sculpt to accomodate both Termagants moving on 4 legs and Hormagaunts moving on 2 legs and made something that looks like it can't do either.


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 10:54:17


Post by: Overread


They could do them like they do the warriors - the mouth part cut out. That works. I just don't want a join seam right down the freaking middle of the entire head!!


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 11:13:33


Post by: Dudeface


 lord_blackfang wrote:
Don't care for new gaunts. Looks like they tried to do 1 sculpt to accomodate both Termagants moving on 4 legs and Hormagaunts moving on 2 legs and made something that looks like it can't do either.


Termagants always moved on 2 legs...


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 11:18:20


Post by: Shuma-Gorath


Cool, I mean personally they can only improve on Tyranids as I really dislike the current range.

Then again I am in the old-school original Tyranid 1st release aesthetic camp being the best.


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 11:23:12


Post by: Shadow Walker


Floating brain bug could be a Norn Emissary that was rumoured. I am sad that there are no Spike Rifles etc. in the Termas sheet but there probably was no space if they are dual with Hormas.


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 11:26:29


Post by: Dudeface


 Shadow Walker wrote:
Floating brain bug could be a Norn Emissary that was rumoured. I am sad that there are no Spike Rifles etc. in the Termas sheet but there probably was no space if they are dual with Hormas.


If they still have 3 weapon options I'm not sure they will share a box.


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 11:31:10


Post by: Shadow Walker


Dudeface wrote:
 Shadow Walker wrote:
Floating brain bug could be a Norn Emissary that was rumoured. I am sad that there are no Spike Rifles etc. in the Termas sheet but there probably was no space if they are dual with Hormas.


If they still have 3 weapon options I'm not sure they will share a box.

If not then there should be more weapon options for Termas but It was also written that Rippers are still included so they will take some sprue space too.


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 11:33:21


Post by: lord_blackfang


-Removed


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 11:34:24


Post by: xttz


Slipspace wrote:
 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
The reveal stream pitched this as “the single biggest update Tyranids have ever received”.

That’s….quite a bold claim, as they’ve had two or three redos over the many years I’ve been into 40k. Funnily enough, I consider the most significant also the most awful. Bad 3rd Ed, dirty 3rd Ed. In your bed, on your rug!

IIRC NIds are an army that has got gradual updates in waves, spread across multiple editions. The Gaunts are ancient but they got some new kits for other units this edition, while kits like Warriors are somewhere in the middle. Maybe they're getting a more extensive range refresh all at once.


Yeah back in the 5th/6th era we'd get a number of kits that would fit into one month of releases, and that was it. There were several smaller updates of around 3-5 new things at a time from 2010-2014.

Using the Necron update for 9th as an indication, Tyranids are likely to get something like 14-16 new things in the space of a few months.

Edit: The other thread had an alternate Termagant datasheet posted, so there may be several versions.



New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 11:38:21


Post by: Dudeface


You're right that in some written fluff they're mentioned as running on all 4's but my mind went back to the visual representations of the past (dawn of war etc) where as far as I can recall, they stand on 2 legs:
Spoiler:



And again in gladius:
Spoiler:




New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 11:42:08


Post by: Mad Doc Grotsnik


Middle limbs are indeed partly for walking/scrambling over terrain, and for slashing things. Even going right back to the days when they were Hunter Slayers



Not to be confused with the Grabber Slasher



New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 11:43:54


Post by: Dudeface


 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
Middle limbs are indeed partly for walking/scrambling over terrain, and for slashing things. Even going right back to the days when they were Hunter Slayers



Not to be confused with the Grabber Slasher



Yeah this was my understanding, they're almost ancillary limbs just used for purchase etc, not that they gallop like a horse or a dog, because the limbs aren't shaped to do that hence why they likely never got animated that way for the games.


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 11:45:02


Post by: Overread


The original Gaunt (I forget its name) walked on 4 legs and carried its gun in its front 2

The redesigned plastic gaunts had a 2 dominant 2 supporting leg arrangement. You can see this on the models. They clearly run and put most weight on their hind 2 legs, but their mid-leg claws were visibly down to provide additional movement support.

The new Gaunts have had a beefy hind leg upgrade and are standing more proud on them with their middle limbs likely now more just for combat and movement aid rather than being part of how they move.
This does bring them in line with their depiction in games/some more modern art.


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 11:47:17


Post by: Dryaktylus




Some more:




Though to be fair: they frequently use their middle pair of extremities for walking.


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 11:50:12


Post by: Tastyfish


Looks like there the new Genestealers are a lot closer to gaunts than they are now, with a gauntlike head and almost a sharkfin carapace.

Looks like what we are calling a Screamer Killer is a Cerebrofex.

Starter set rumours that seem to match this video:
-1 Norn-Maleceptrix (Big brain bug, lesser incarnation of the Norn-Queen, able to 'evolve' units. Semi-feminine???)
-1 Tyranid Primus (Big warrior, Two Devourers, Large sword, Claw-whip, boosts)
-1 Lictor (New form of Lictor)
-2 Magistraunt (Mix of Venomthropes and Pyrovore)
-20 Genestealers (New kit, Options for Armored plates and Acid-claws)
-1 Cerebrofex (Blend of Carnifex and Zoanthroap, Smaller Maleceptor)
-3 Genehunters (New type of Warriors, Shock Troopers, made with Space Marine Geneseeds they literally eat.)


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 12:14:24


Post by: xttz


This seems to be the most accurate list for the starter box:

- 'Two to three new types of Gaunts'
- New Hormagaunts
- Vemon Crawler type unit
- Screamer Killer Carnifex.
- New Lictors
- Winged Warrior
- New Biovores
- Plastic Spore Mines
- Norn Emissary - beefed up Zoanthrope


The same source also very closely matches the marine units which are obviously easier to identify.

The Tyranid list in the post above doesn't include gaunts, which seems like a fairly obvious omission with two kinds in the trailer.


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 12:15:55


Post by: Overread


Potentially GW could release Horm and Terma as the same gaunt box. So it might be that the listing is a new Hormagaunt box, but it includes both build options.


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 12:16:04


Post by: lord_blackfang


Yea we kinda see Biovores and, er, Primaris Zoanthropes in the trailer.


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 12:25:04


Post by: Tsagualsa


 lord_blackfang wrote:
Yea we kinda see Biovores and, er, Primaris Zoanthropes in the trailer.


There's also a split shot where we can see the 'Venomcrawler type unit' chowing down on some dead marines:






New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 12:28:30


Post by: Shadow Walker


Tsagualsa wrote:


There's also a split shot where we can see the 'Venomcrawler type unit' chowing down on some dead marines:

Maybe they are the reimagined Malanthropes?


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 12:30:42


Post by: Dudeface


We could do with a series of snapshots of each gribbly, it was hard to spot or make out some of them.


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 12:34:07


Post by: Tsagualsa


Dudeface wrote:
We could do with a series of snapshots of each gribbly, it was hard to spot or make out some of them.


I'm looking for it, but even at single-image in HD the trailer is just too smudged to make out much. The new hormagaunts seem to be blind though, with a head like the carnifex, and the Lictors look... dumb, with much fleshier tentacles that look like they were combining the feeder tendrils and fleshhooks, similar to the obscure FW Dimachaeron.


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 12:36:14


Post by: Mr. Burning


The boy is hyped for new nids.

Having spent most of the current edition nomming my Space Wolves and my friends Dark Angels with Big Gribbles he now has his sights set on the new Termies and possible Hormies for swarming goodness.

Hoping that new rules do horde nids justice.



New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 12:38:33


Post by: Tsagualsa


Have a possible Hormagaunt:



It's from when it attacks the dread - you can clearly see it has a bone plate instead of eyes, and a well-armed lower jaw with more plating, from the way they move in the trailer it kinda looks like they have higher 'Sharkfin' backs and are 'ramming' the enemy at full speed, literally overrunning them.


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 12:44:02


Post by: Tyel


I think the new Termagants look great - and am kind of hyped for this release in general.

Hopefully like Indomitus the Marines will sell like hotcakes and I can get a cheap Tyranid half.


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 12:47:44


Post by: Mad Doc Grotsnik


Tyel wrote:
I think the new Termagants look great - and am kind of hyped for this release in general.

Hopefully like Indomitus the Marines will sell like hotcakes and I can get a cheap Tyranid half.


Whilst it does do splits, the Loot Group does facilitate straight Side For Side swaps. So if you’re picking up the assumed near guaranteed Big Box Set, you won’t hurt for swapsies.


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 12:52:49


Post by: Tsagualsa


The new Lictor seems much smaller than before, afaik they were always Warrior-sized, but less bulky, now they seem to be about eye-to-eye with a Primaris. I mistook the one at 2:31-2:38 for a Gaunt at first...


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 12:52:59


Post by: Dudeface


Tsagualsa wrote:
Have a possible Hormagaunt:



It's from when it attacks the dread - you can clearly see it has a bone plate instead of eyes, and a well-armed lower jaw with more plating, from the way they move in the trailer it kinda looks like they have higher 'Sharkfin' backs and are 'ramming' the enemy at full speed, literally overrunning them.


If that's a hormagaunt I can't see them sharing a kit.


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 12:54:29


Post by: Tsagualsa


Dudeface wrote:
Tsagualsa wrote:
Have a possible Hormagaunt:



It's from when it attacks the dread - you can clearly see it has a bone plate instead of eyes, and a well-armed lower jaw with more plating, from the way they move in the trailer it kinda looks like they have higher 'Sharkfin' backs and are 'ramming' the enemy at full speed, literally overrunning them.


If that's a hormagaunt I can't see them sharing a kit.


Why, it's just an alternative head and back-vane? And the claws of course.


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 12:59:43


Post by: Dudeface


Tsagualsa wrote:
Dudeface wrote:
Tsagualsa wrote:
Have a possible Hormagaunt:



It's from when it attacks the dread - you can clearly see it has a bone plate instead of eyes, and a well-armed lower jaw with more plating, from the way they move in the trailer it kinda looks like they have higher 'Sharkfin' backs and are 'ramming' the enemy at full speed, literally overrunning them.


If that's a hormagaunt I can't see them sharing a kit.


Why, it's just an alternative head and back-vane? And the claws of course.


So each gaunt body will have additional back pieces, 2 heads, talons and 3 sets of guns + rippers scattered at this point.


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 13:03:00


Post by: Tsagualsa


Dudeface wrote:
Tsagualsa wrote:
Dudeface wrote:
Tsagualsa wrote:
Have a possible Hormagaunt:

Spoiler:


It's from when it attacks the dread - you can clearly see it has a bone plate instead of eyes, and a well-armed lower jaw with more plating, from the way they move in the trailer it kinda looks like they have higher 'Sharkfin' backs and are 'ramming' the enemy at full speed, literally overrunning them.


If that's a hormagaunt I can't see them sharing a kit.


Why, it's just an alternative head and back-vane? And the claws of course.


So each gaunt body will have additional back pieces, 2 heads, talons and 3 sets of guns + rippers scattered at this point.


The back piece is not extremely clear from the video, it could be that they all use the same.

Multiple heads is standard in almost every current kit, multiple weapon options as well.

Some of the gun options might be modular, we also don't know if there will be enough guns of all types for the whole squad or if some are special weapons in this iteration.

It seems like a lot of stuff, but then Tyranids don't have much in terms of individual kit, accessories, knives, grenades and so on. It remains to be seen if biomorphs on the models are still a thing or if they mostly got dumped in favor of more unit types.



New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 13:36:45


Post by: Irbis


Tsagualsa wrote:
Why, it's just an alternative head and back-vane? And the claws of course.

And you know, weapons, pose, plates, and everything else?

Intercessors and Assault Intercessors have identical armor and sergeant options, but poses and weapons alone split them into two boxes...


What I really like here is that weapons now finally dumped another trash 'one-size-fits-none' vestige of 80s rules writing and weapons now can have multiple traits. It never made any sense to me that assault weapons can be fired on the charge but much smaller and handier pistols can't. Also abilities right on sheet, no sign of another 'one-size-fits-none' garbage, uNiVeRsAL SR. Excellent. Having 8-10 of them on a single weapon in new HH reminded me why I despised the inane system even way back in 5th edition, and that was when they were still reigned in and kinda-sorta universal instead of 100+ applies-to-single-unit/weapon cancerous growth they became later.

Also, twin linked is back? Is that still universal re-rolls, because GW did everything to eliminate them in 9th, sometimes in really clunky and dumb ways. I really hope units with dual pistols won't have equivalent of one rerollable pistol, because it would majorly suck. And how it will work with stuff like kellercheese and his three colts? Will he have the only triple-linked pistol in the game? Or will he be the only unit to still have three pistols to remain OP special snowflake?

What is worrying is that there is no sign of points/power levels on the sheet. Hopefully it's just simplified example and they will be there in final product like in 5th edition. No nonsense page flipping 20 times just to build a single squad

Hopefully weapons on the sheet means no more of another annoying garbage, armory system. All weapons should be on a sheet, like in 5th edition too. Though I wonder how they will manage it with terrible entries like tactical squad where unit can pick bolter, bolter, or bolter, but leader has like 20 options. Maybe they will cut down on them, like condensing power weapons to a single entry? Unlikely, given how quickly recently GW folds to complains of minmaxers (*cough* oh no, no cherrypicking all of 0.01% more efficient melee on chaos termies *cough*), but let's remain optimistic.

Another worrying sign is that cancerous damage inflation doesn't seem to be gone. Lowest tyranid chaff still has S5 guns. Hopefully they will be equivalent of medium, not chaff infantry in the next edition, otherwise 10th will be dead on arrival and we will see another round of knee jerk, haphazard toughness and damage boosting. Oh well, we will see, I am just not very optimistic after the stream dudes seemed to have no clue why plasma is spammed so much and seem to think minor downside will reign spam in - and plasma is minor issue compared to truly borken gak some armies get to bring. Hopefully more info here soon, too.


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 13:48:44


Post by: Overread


I think on the gun damage angle one thing we might see a change on is a shift in unit numbers. Last edition of AoS cut down on unit numbers and big blocks of units a LOT - honestly felt like overkill, but they did it.

We might see 40K doing the same. So it might be gaunts are stronger because GW is going to go for less of a "you're going to put 200 of these on the table at once" angle with them.

Which isn't a bad thing. In my view the game goes in cycles like that; periods where armies are smaller to encourage people in; thne periods of big armies as they have a glut of matured customers with big collections using them all at once etc..


It does seem strange to have a S5 weapon on what should be a low tier unit though. Even if they cut down on numbers aspects it still means that a "weak" unit is still pretty strong in stats.

We'll have to see, GW as a design philosophy do love their cinematic BIG damage and that has been a problem when armies just get stronger and stronger and all the numbers go up until it gets silly.


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 13:50:57


Post by: Tyran


Termagants had S5 guns in 4th edition (fleshborer plus toxin sacs), so I really fail to see why S5 fleshborers has everyone's panties in a twist.


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 13:54:26


Post by: Voss


 Tyran wrote:
Termagants had S5 guns in 4th edition (fleshborer plus toxin sacs), so I really fail to see why S5 fleshborers has everyone's panties in a twist.


Because they paid for it. Now its the default cheap option with a better profile (and best overall for the unit).


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 14:17:34


Post by: RedSarge


Some interesting things to note..
The New Termagant heads with open mouths are fine, great in fact. The closed mouth head the teeth seem to have barely enough surface area detail to catch paint.

New Screamer-Kill inspired Carnifex? Cool, very cool. The old plastic Carnifex was apparently one of the 1st purely CAD designed GW releases?
It's tiny now compared to monstrous AoS stuff.

That Terminator in the trailer got ripped in half by the flying Tyrant! [Yikes! ]

Changing the statline after only two 'new' editions... hmm That doesn't bode well for 40k future permanence when you see a game desperately trying to 'reorganize' itself over and over. [Heavy Gear -> Blitz -> WarMachine 2.0 -> Future Scifi-Better edition plus, plus]

Haven't bought a GW paper-weight since 6-7th because of it, but that's another story. Now we get piles of cards! No more finicky hardbacks, just cards! With artwork? And ATK and DEF values?


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 15:23:04


Post by: Tyran


Voss wrote:
 Tyran wrote:
Termagants had S5 guns in 4th edition (fleshborer plus toxin sacs), so I really fail to see why S5 fleshborers has everyone's panties in a twist.


Because they paid for it. Now its the default cheap option with a better profile (and best overall for the unit).

Considering they are 7pts per model, I would say they are still paying for it.


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 16:01:51


Post by: Shadow Walker


For those who remember updated Necrons releases - how soon can we expect new units other than starter set ones shown? I may be wrong but there were more new Necrons than ones from the starter set, right? I am still hoping for new Genestealers and some LoW.


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 16:11:00


Post by: Tyel


We can't really know without points and other rules but getting upset about fleshborers was silly 9~ months ago. As it stands, everything else being equal, losing the point of AP makes them 66% as effective into 3+ armour. That's a dramatic cut to something that was quite rubbish already.

If many weapons that seemingly gained AP for no reason went back to normal I think it would be quite noticeable. (Although I think some units, mainly fragile assault infantry, needed the buff if they were to bounce off too many things.)

I also think they could combine Termagants and Hormagaunts together. A variety of heads is surely a given. But 10 fleshborers, 10 spinefists, 10 devourers, 10 claws? Seems like a lot on a modern sprue. But who knows.


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 16:27:03


Post by: H.B.M.C.


Whilst there is too much AP in 40k as it stands, I liked the fact that Fleshborders were AP-1. It meant that Termagant shooting had a purpose.


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 16:59:34


Post by: Siegfriedfr


I hope we get a necron sized released for the Nids, altho i believe it will be less impressive.

So far in the video we have :
Old:
-Gaunts
-Gants
-Lictor
-Screamer-Killer (which maybe means a new carnifex kit as well)
-Biovore

New :
-Norn/ Doom
-A new unidentified quadripedal with tentacles in the mouth (3::30)


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 17:20:52


Post by: Shadow Walker


Siegfriedfr wrote:
I hope we get a necron sized released for the Nids, altho i believe it will be less impressive.

So far in the video we have :
Old:
-Gaunts
-Gants
-Lictor
-Screamer-Killer (which maybe means a new carnifex kit as well)
-Biovore

New :
-Norn/ Doom
-A new unidentified quadripedal with tentacles in the mouth (3::30)

There is also a flying one which may be a new Shrike?


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 17:30:06


Post by: streetsamurai


not impressed by the new terma, but then, terma are by far my least favorite models of the range


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 17:30:51


Post by: Grot 6


 Shadow Walker wrote:
For those who remember updated Necrons releases - how soon can we expect new units other than starter set ones shown? I may be wrong but there were more new Necrons than ones from the starter set, right? I am still hoping for new Genestealers and some LoW.


They just had a Codex update last year to the month with a fart in the wind, and their claim to fame was a flyer that dropped ripperswarms...

I was honestly surprised, because once upon a time, a Codex release was kinda a big deal. Now? five minutes later, it's forgotten.

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2022/03/07/the-new-tyranid-codex-is-coming-so-get-your-first-look-at-its-awesome-cover-art/

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2022/03/31/three-more-reasons-to-be-terrified-of-the-parasite-of-mortrex/


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 17:38:34


Post by: RedSarge


I forgot to add.
With the new Termagants, you no longer have to bend there tails or add detail to the carapace with a dremel. GW appeared the have started nicks and cuts into the carapace for you.


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 17:52:07


Post by: Siegfriedfr


 Shadow Walker wrote:
Siegfriedfr wrote:
I hope we get a necron sized released for the Nids, altho i believe it will be less impressive.

So far in the video we have :
Old:
-Gaunts
-Gants
-Lictor
-Screamer-Killer (which maybe means a new carnifex kit as well)
-Biovore

New :
-Norn/ Doom
-A new unidentified quadripedal with tentacles in the mouth (3::30)

There is also a flying one which may be a new Shrike?


If you're referring to the one that rips a Terminator in two, it looks like a Tyrant, but the size is a bit off, so maybe.


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 17:55:29


Post by: Shadow Walker


Siegfriedfr wrote:
 Shadow Walker wrote:
Siegfriedfr wrote:
I hope we get a necron sized released for the Nids, altho i believe it will be less impressive.

So far in the video we have :
Old:
-Gaunts
-Gants
-Lictor
-Screamer-Killer (which maybe means a new carnifex kit as well)
-Biovore

New :
-Norn/ Doom
-A new unidentified quadripedal with tentacles in the mouth (3::30)

There is also a flying one which may be a new Shrike?


If you're referring to the one that rips a Terminator in two, it looks like a Tyrant, but the size is a bit off, so maybe.

Yeah, that one, and indeed its size is too small for a Tyrant so it could be either Shrike/Shrike Prime or some new unit?


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 18:21:27


Post by: Necronmaniac05


 Shadow Walker wrote:
For those who remember updated Necrons releases - how soon can we expect new units other than starter set ones shown? I may be wrong but there were more new Necrons than ones from the starter set, right? I am still hoping for new Genestealers and some LoW.


As i recall, there was quite a wait for the codexes. Indomitus came out June time and i think the Necron Codex didn't drop until September/October time.


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 18:23:41


Post by: SamusDrake


A more classic-style Screamer Killer? That would be awesome.

Not seeing the need for new Termagants when Hormagaunts have a serious drink problem, unless doing both.


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 18:47:53


Post by: Souleater


GW doesn’t seem to have been able to balance Termagant guns since third edition.

They either make them all so useless as to make the choice irrelevant or they produce a clear winner.

I play Kronos so perhaps can be a little more sanguine about the AP going away. If a lot of the General small arms see similar changes it might mean some of our medium to lightly armour troops at least getting a slim chance at a save.

I was hoping they’d try and make each of the guns useful in a different role.


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 22:02:37


Post by: Overread


Necronmaniac05 wrote:
 Shadow Walker wrote:
For those who remember updated Necrons releases - how soon can we expect new units other than starter set ones shown? I may be wrong but there were more new Necrons than ones from the starter set, right? I am still hoping for new Genestealers and some LoW.


As i recall, there was quite a wait for the codexes. Indomitus came out June time and i think the Necron Codex didn't drop until September/October time.


That was honestly longer than I think GW wanted. It was also peek covid madness time. We'd only just come out of the first national UK lockdown and everything was messed up everywhere.


Personally, I think we'll see the codex land a lot sooner this time around.


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 23:00:39


Post by: Acehilator


Background art from the new 40k website:



It is indeed the "Venom Crawler" Valraks set of leaks mentioned. Looks amazeballs.

Also to be clear, the thing ripping the Terminator in half is NOT a Hive Tyrant. It's the new Shrike Prime or whatever the name is going to be.


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 23:02:56


Post by: Overread


This summer is going to be glorious! I might even get enough energy to dig out my two swarm boxes and build some of them!


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 23:10:47


Post by: lord_blackfang


The venom crawler bug looks to be from the digestion stage of invasion?

I'd say it's a safe bet that Valrak's source has access to art/videos in advance, and possibly nothing else.


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 23:44:43


Post by: MajorWesJanson


Looks like a smaller version of the Nautoloid from the TCG


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 23:50:38


Post by: H.B.M.C.


Rumours have had that thing listed as a "Magistraunt", which, to me at least, sounds too much like restaurant for me to take seriously.


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/23 23:50:41


Post by: Loopstah


Trygon is sold out/ no longer available on GW. Rebranding or updating the kit?


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/24 00:08:22


Post by: lord_blackfang


 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Rumours have had that thing listed as a "Magistraunt", which, to me at least, sounds too much like restaurant for me to take seriously.


We see it eating so it checks out


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/24 00:12:14


Post by: Overread


If there's a big new edition and GW are doing a new logo then I'd expect to see most of the Tyranid line pulled at some point just for reboxing.

New box, new stats, new everything. So we will likely see that happen a few times - although right now is a little early for such.


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/24 01:30:07


Post by: morganfreeman


 Irbis wrote:
Also abilities right on sheet, no sign of another 'one-size-fits-none' garbage, uNiVeRsAL SR. Excellent. Having 8-10 of them on a single weapon in new HH reminded me why I despised the inane system even way back in 5th edition, and that was when they were still reigned in and kinda-sorta universal instead of 100+ applies-to-single-unit/weapon cancerous growth they became later.

Also, twin linked is back?


It's worth noting that Twin-Linked is one of the OG special rules. And that Termagants have always been among the most basic of the basic; I think the only USR they've ever had was fleet?

So hopefully the presence of Twin-Linked, without an accompanying explanation, means we'll see the return of USR's and something of a choke-chain back to sanity, rather than 50 different versions of the same thing spread across 10 armies.


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/24 04:10:11


Post by: John D Law


Was 3rd edition the one where everything became Alien ripoffs? Hive tyrant looking like the Alien hive queen and such. The carnifexes with a goofy grinning head and all! Ahhh the good errr weird old days! 🤣


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/24 04:16:47


Post by: H.B.M.C.


Yes, that was 3rd Ed.

We got the Alien Queen Hive Tyrant, and Grinny McRhinohorn Carnifex, and it was kinda awful.

But that's also where the current Gaunts/Gants and Warriors come from (although the latter got a more recent re-cut, but not a redesign).


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/24 04:19:36


Post by: John D Law


I think that was the first appearance of Old One eye as well.


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/24 04:25:19


Post by: H.B.M.C.


The first appearance of Tyranid Special Characters. *shudder*


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/24 06:54:35


Post by: Souleater


As long as ‘special characters’ are really just very rare, difficult to produce and maintain variants, I don’t mine them so much.


Also I would like them to rename Tyranid Primes to be ‘Alpha Warriors’, etc. It would just feel more zoological to me.


New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/24 09:36:35


Post by: xttz


Here's a quick comparison of the Necron 2020 release to give an idea of what Tyranids seem to be getting this year:

Necron contents of Indomitus launch box in 2020:
  • 6 small character/infantry models
  • 3 squad / swarm units
  • 1 small vehicle / monster

  • Apparent Tyranid contents of 2023 launch box (probably incomplete):
  • Shrike alpha? / Lictor / Unidentified warrior-size model = 3+ single models
  • Termagants & rippers / Hormagaunts / Biovores & spore mines = 3 units
  • 'Norn emissary' brain bug / Screamer-killer / 'Venomcrawler' = 3 monster units

  • That seems roughly on par. Then this is what necrons got with/after their codex in 2020 (some of which came later via KT):
    3 small character/infantry models
    3 squad units
    2 small vehicle / monster
    2 large vehicle / LOW
    1 terrain piece

    So speculation time; what could that mean for Tyranids in future? I think that genestealers, shrikes, and a multipart carnifex kit are highly likely. Maybe a plastic spore chimney terrain piece given how they're an iconic Tyranid entity and there are several shown in the trailer.

    What else?


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/24 11:03:33


    Post by: Iracundus


    Conceptually I think GW is struggling with new ideas/niches for Tyranid creatures that don't already overlap with existing ones to some degree. They have also used all the old Epic Hive War creatures except for the Dactylis (which was an artillery creature literally tossing giant explosive fungal pods with giant hands like a catapult, and even that is thematically basically a giant Biovore) and the Malefactor, which was basically a hybrid close combat creature and APC for smaller Tyranids.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/24 11:16:18


    Post by: Tsagualsa


    I think 'nids could do with some more fast attack elements that are not just winged warriors etc. - redone Raveners, some small-medium jetbike-like creatures, maybe a redo of a transport creature from Epic. I fear we'll see an 'Apex Swarmlord' and retinue as the centerpiece model every lineup seems to need today.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/24 11:21:37


    Post by: Overread


     Souleater wrote:
    As long as ‘special characters’ are really just very rare, difficult to produce and maintain variants, I don’t mine them so much.


    Also I would like them to rename Tyranid Primes to be ‘Alpha Warriors’, etc. It would just feel more zoological to me.



    Personally I'm totally fine with the Tyranids having special characters that are mostly just super rare/unique strains of evolution.

    Certain forms might well require certain limited resources to create or are a huge investment in key biomatter that the Swarm doesn't replicate.

    Also we've seen that whilst Tyranids can hyper-evolve and can select specific strains for specific situations; they also are not perfect breeders. Heck a huge part of their adaptation is mass breeding resulting in minor genetic shifts that give benefits in specific situations that they then capitalise on. They do hundreds of thousands to millions of years worth of evolution VERY fast but they still rely on that evolutionary process. So within that there's certainly scope for unique strains to arise that the Hive Mind can't perfectly copy; or which are tricky to copy/create.
    The Swarm is bound to a type of biology that doesn't work like a Mechanicus building something to an SDK where every part down to the nano components is perfectly replicated.



    Also outside of the lore it also gives Tyranids some unique models that can have more powerful or just different stats and abilities without breaking the gameplay. It also means that GW can give them more things as GW clearly likes to give unique/leader models as "we aren't revising your army, but here's a new codex/rules update and 1 model to tide you over" kind of thing. So Tyranids getting leaders and unique strains is 100% ok with me. They've been around for utterly ages (3rd edition) and prior to that a good few models, eg Hive Tyrants, were in effect unique models on the tabletop by the way the game worked in those days.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/24 11:29:24


    Post by: Dudeface


    Iracundus wrote:
    Conceptually I think GW is struggling with new ideas/niches for Tyranid creatures that don't already overlap with existing ones to some degree. They have also used all the old Epic Hive War creatures except for the Dactylis (which was an artillery creature literally tossing giant explosive fungal pods with giant hands like a catapult, and even that is thematically basically a giant Biovore) and the Malefactor, which was basically a hybrid close combat creature and APC for smaller Tyranids.


    I'm not sure they really need more as such, they cover most bases already apart from a plastic superheavy and move the shrikes over.its woefully anti-consumer but what should happen is the nid range changes over time as some gene strains become less relevant or get changed. At some point the biovore might be found to be inefficient for example so the hive mind simply stops producing them.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/24 11:32:35


    Post by: Shadow Walker


     xttz wrote:
    Here's a quick comparison of the Necron 2020 release to give an idea of what Tyranids seem to be getting this year:

    Necron contents of Indomitus launch box in 2020:
  • 6 small character/infantry models
  • 3 squad / swarm units
  • 1 small vehicle / monster

  • Apparent Tyranid contents of 2023 launch box (probably incomplete):
  • Shrike alpha? / Lictor / Unidentified warrior-size model = 3+ single models
  • Termagants & rippers / Hormagaunts / Biovores & spore mines = 3 units
  • 'Norn emissary' brain bug / Screamer-killer / 'Venomcrawler' = 3 monster units

  • That seems roughly on par. Then this is what necrons got with/after their codex in 2020 (some of which came later via KT):
    3 small character/infantry models
    3 squad units
    2 small vehicle / monster
    2 large vehicle / LOW
    1 terrain piece

    So speculation time; what could that mean for Tyranids in future? I think that genestealers, shrikes, and a multipart carnifex kit are highly likely. Maybe a plastic spore chimney terrain piece given how they're an iconic Tyranid entity and there are several shown in the trailer.

    What else?

    Thanks for the Necron releases summary, I was looking for something like this
    As what to expect for nids? LoW is a must have since ages, and there were rumours about a Dominatrix. They could use 10th to finally get rid of FW resin ones or at least most of them but I suspect that they will rather bring new shinies instead. All troop choices will be covered because I cannot imagine them not updating Genestealers, and the rest were in videos or mentioned like Rippers on WarCom. Shrikes are highly probable given the video, and fans asking for them since forever. Carnifex with options is a 100% sure release, the question is will they get rid of SC like OOE or will it be in the kit? That also means we could or not get an updated Red Terror, probably with a new Raveners kit. As to terrain, a Spore Chimney or a Brood Nest could be fun but Capillary Tower would be my favourite to have.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/24 11:35:29


    Post by: xttz


    Iracundus wrote:
    Conceptually I think GW is struggling with new ideas/niches for Tyranid creatures that don't already overlap with existing ones to some degree. They have also used all the old Epic Hive War creatures except for the Dactylis (which was an artillery creature literally tossing giant explosive fungal pods with giant hands like a catapult, and even that is thematically basically a giant Biovore) and the Malefactor, which was basically a hybrid close combat creature and APC for smaller Tyranids.


    Considering how many 1990's design callbacks are in the new trailer, I wouldn't rule out some of those units returning.

    The new brain bug is very much inspired by the original Zoanthrope design, while the lictor, hormagaunt, rippers, and screamer-killer all have varying degrees of influence from their original models.

    Will be interesting to see if any of the Dominatrix, Malefactor, Dactylis, or Hierodule get similar treatments.


    Automatically Appended Next Post:
     Shadow Walker wrote:

    Thanks for the Necron releases summary, I was looking for something like this
    As what to expect for nids? LoW is a must have since ages, and there were rumours about a Dominatrix. They could use 10th to finally get rid of FW resin ones or at least most of them but I suspect that they will rather bring new shinies instead... Carnifex with options is a 100% sure release, the question is will they get rid of SC like OOE or will it be in the kit?


    I reckon that the screamer-killer will be a distinct easy-build / pushfit model with fixed options, while there will be a separate multi-part carnifex kit with a similar design and several build options.

    Very much doubt the Hierophant model would be scrapped as it's still a little large to be done properly in plastic, but a modern Hierodule re-do is certainly a possibility.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/24 11:48:37


    Post by: Iracundus


     xttz wrote:
    Iracundus wrote:
    Conceptually I think GW is struggling with new ideas/niches for Tyranid creatures that don't already overlap with existing ones to some degree. They have also used all the old Epic Hive War creatures except for the Dactylis (which was an artillery creature literally tossing giant explosive fungal pods with giant hands like a catapult, and even that is thematically basically a giant Biovore) and the Malefactor, which was basically a hybrid close combat creature and APC for smaller Tyranids.


    Considering how many 1990's design callbacks are in the new trailer, I wouldn't rule out some of those units returning.

    The new brain bug is very much inspired by the original Zoanthrope design, while the lictor, hormagaunt, rippers, and screamer-killer all have varying degrees of influence from their original models.

    Will be interesting to see if any of the Dominatrix, Malefactor, Dactylis, or Hierodule get similar treatments.


    GW has almost not mentioned the Dominatrix at all, and instead opted to focus on Hive Tyrants as the Tyranid ground swarm leaders. Possibly this is because they are more humanoid and maybe to GW's minds therefore more relatable for the customer. The Dominatrix was also a superheavy and a Titan killer with its psychic pulse or very hard to put down if it went defensive with its warp shield. It would be a LoW like maybe a Lord of Skulls

    The Hierodule got downgraded from scout or Reaver Titan class to FW's superheavy vehicle equivalent. Again more like a LoW equivalent but not suitable for smaller games.

    The Malefactor I don't see GW bringing back in its original APC role as instead GW seems to have gone with the Tervigon concept of spawning Tyranids instead of APC creature.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/24 11:49:48


    Post by: NAVARRO


    Iracundus wrote:
    Conceptually I think GW is struggling with new ideas/niches for Tyranid creatures that don't already overlap with existing ones to some degree.


    Its early to say how they will fully update the Tyranid, but if the Gaunts are any indication of whats coming then yes. I agree with you and IMO nids are Conceptually finished and have been for a long long time.

    From a narrative point of of view on that trailer they are still the bad bug that needs to be squished... such boring old take
    From a model design point of view the Gaunt is a slight cosmetic update with the exact same conceptual design... that route has been live for 20 years, it's time to move on. Nids evolve so fast that they adapt and generate new mods on the following wave on the same battle... yet Gaunts so far remain unchanged for decades. Makes no sense.
    Even small little things like the fleet selected and its colours have been around forever.

    I will reserve final judgment when we have more models and the gaunt may well be the one off stinker. But I fear nids ideas are stagnant and not evolving at all and just go around in circles.

    Cold with all of this.



    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/24 11:53:29


    Post by: H.B.M.C.


     xttz wrote:
    So speculation time; what could that mean for Tyranids in future?
    I certainly wouldn't say no to Tyranid terrain.

    Don't want a new Carnifex though.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/24 11:59:12


    Post by: Tsagualsa


     NAVARRO wrote:
    Nids evolve so fast that they adapt and generate new mods on the following wave on the same battle... yet Gaunts so far remain unchanged for decades. Makes no sense.


    Maybe gaunts are just an island of stability you arrive at after billions of iterations. Like crocodiles or sharks, they're just so near-perfect and efficient for their role that deviations from it are only temporary in the face of very specific circumstances, and in the long term you'll always fall back to the basic gaunt. Just playing devil's advocate here.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/24 11:59:17


    Post by: Overread


    The thing is the game itself only has so many points and models you can put on a table and it only has so many unique niches that can work at the same time without breaking (eg aircraft almost broke parts of the game when they could only be counted by specific anti-air units).

    At the 32mm scale you do eventually reach a point where an army has enough; where it can't really expand any more because youv'e already got everything mostly covered. New things do similar things to existing things which can be an issue when something is just all round better than something else.

    Tyrainds also have a lot of modular models and heck way back the Carnifex did ALL the heavy support roles. It was the close combat tank artillery anti infantry unit; depending what weapons you gave it.


    At that point there's a few options
    1) Model updates. New models, new sculpts that might not gameplay wise change anything; but which are newer and more modern. Even just the new gaunt upgrade is welcome and will generate sales from new customers and from old ones that like the new design and expand their collection.

    2) Replace - remove a model and replace it with something new. This can work well but can be risky; people do not like losing models and often as not if the replacement is a similar size they will still use the old one. There's a few cases where its welcome - eg the new Greater Demons were generally very popular (plus a good many people can still run the old ones as demon princes).
    But you've got to be careful - do it too often or too much and people can hate it. Esp when its not a material change (eg shifting a bunch from finecast to plastic)

    3) Niche forces. Marines did this to an insane degree. Basically keeping a core and then adding in specialist models that only fit in one sub-group.
    This can work but it can also just bloat the model range. The trap is what marines have where you take a successful thing and copy it out so often that it dominates the design space.

    4) Add an adjacent forces. Genestealer Cults. You add the odd leader/hero to Tyranids and then take a fully separate, but related theme and run with it. Cults are different enough to stand on their own whilst being interesting to Tyranid players who hit their collection limit.



    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/24 12:02:45


    Post by: H.B.M.C.


     NAVARRO wrote:
    Nids evolve so fast that they adapt and generate new mods on the following wave on the same battle... yet Gaunts so far remain unchanged for decades. Makes no sense.
    Makes sense to me.

    The Hive Mind makes creatures to overcome specific obstacles. One would presume that if it made something that turned out to be generally useful in most situations, it would keep that "design" for continued use. So the Termagant was something it might have once created for a specific task, but found that it had value in other circumstances, so kept making it.

    The motto of the Hive Mind should be "Anything you can do I can do better!".



    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/24 12:13:24


    Post by: Iracundus


     NAVARRO wrote:
    Iracundus wrote:
    Conceptually I think GW is struggling with new ideas/niches for Tyranid creatures that don't already overlap with existing ones to some degree.


    Its early to say how they will fully update the Tyranid, but if the Gaunts are any indication of whats coming then yes. I agree with you and IMO nids are Conceptually finished and have been for a long long time.

    From a narrative point of of view on that trailer they are still the bad bug that needs to be squished... such boring old take
    From a model design point of view the Gaunt is a slight cosmetic update with the exact same conceptual design... that route has been live for 20 years, it's time to move on. Nids evolve so fast that they adapt and generate new mods on the following wave on the same battle... yet Gaunts so far remain unchanged for decades. Makes no sense.
    Even small little things like the fleet selected and its colours have been around forever.

    I will reserve final judgment when we have more models and the gaunt may well be the one off stinker. But I fear nids ideas are stagnant and not evolving at all and just go around in circles.

    Cold with all of this.



    I don't mind the Termagant or other Gaunts being mostly unchanged aside from the odd biomorph or weapon options. The reason is because they are cannon fodder and mass produced. I know that sounds obvious but even a slight point increase (or resource spent spawning them) multiplied by however many millions or billions get spawned is a significant cost for the Hive Mind. Why waste too many resources on a creature that is meant to be expended and which can still kill most things through numbers? In background terms, the most common foe would be human equivalent, not Space Marines, and the Termagant does perfectly well against them. The 3rd edition mutation and design your Nid rules reflected this logic to an even greater extent when players did not bother with Fleshborers and used the cheaper Spinefist to create the even cheaper cannon fodder Spinegaunt.

    Against specific select enemies a fleet might introduce changes, such as Hive Fleet Gorgon making its Gaunts resistant to pulse weapon fire. Note by resistant I don't mean they were immune, but maybe once in a while a shot would not be fatal and require a 2nd shot to put the creature down. Multiply that by millions or billions of Gaunts and still that adds up to suddenly the Tau expending much more ammunition.

    So I see Tyranid "special characters" as rare variants or prototypes to be tested. If successful and cost effective, some of those features might be introduced into mass production in the main line of creatures if needed. Otherwise they might just stay as rare variants for specific battlefields and then to reabsorbed afterwards.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/24 14:19:55


    Post by: Shadow Walker


     H.B.M.C. wrote:

    Don't want a new Carnifex though.

    Don't you like the new SC from the video or do you like the current one so much, or both? I ask because I was, and still am a huge fan of the original SC, and I am really happy to see that modern version of it.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/24 14:23:24


    Post by: Tyran


    I don't want to lose the current Carnifex design. The Screamer-Killer being its own thing is fine but not if it means we lose the current kit.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/24 14:24:14


    Post by: Tsagualsa


     Shadow Walker wrote:
     H.B.M.C. wrote:

    Don't want a new Carnifex though.

    Don't you like the new SC from the video or do you like the current one so much, or both? I ask because I was, and still am a huge fan of the original SC, and I am really happy to see that modern version of it.


    Depending on the size of it there's probably room for a new-classic Screamer Killer in a squad support / superheavy infantry role, something like a Kroxigor or whatever, while the current 'fex acts more like a dreadnought or tank. The one in the video seems smaller than a tank-fex, sized more like a Centurion or Obliterator.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/24 14:30:39


    Post by: Souleater


    @Overread I agree. It’s easy to end up with armies starting to gain function of other armies, or worse we end up with redundant model kits because that army has ended up with several units for eg melee combat.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/24 14:32:19


    Post by: Shadow Walker


    Tsagualsa wrote:
     Shadow Walker wrote:
     H.B.M.C. wrote:

    Don't want a new Carnifex though.

    Don't you like the new SC from the video or do you like the current one so much, or both? I ask because I was, and still am a huge fan of the original SC, and I am really happy to see that modern version of it.


    Depending on the size of it there's probably room for a new-classic Screamer Killer in a squad support / superheavy infantry role, something like a Kroxigor or whatever, while the current 'fex acts more like a dreadnought or tank. The one in the video seems smaller than a tank-fex, sized more like a Centurion or Obliterator.

    I think that they want the Carnifex in a pure walker role, when tank role will be fulfilled by Tyrannofex etc. sized creatures, and therefore it will be smaller/shorter than the curent one.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/24 14:44:50


    Post by: Overread


    I don't think the Carny needs to change any more than the gaunt has.

    Update the kit with new styles and designs, improve the mould quality, add little vent tubes and such to the stacks on the back instead of just open vents and such.

    I suspect we'd lose the 2-to-a-box (unless GW went with 3 in a box and made it more expensive)


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/24 15:41:11


    Post by: morganfreeman


    "Universal special rules are back in the game – It doesn’t matter if you’re making a Dimensional Translocation or preparing Death From Below, it’s all a Deep Strike now!"


    The madness of slightly different bespoke rules for one purpose is over. Thank christ for that.

    Here's hoping they don't revert to the 7th edition madness of 20 pages, many of which simply give other special rules. Or take the HH model of having it split between multiplebooks.

    But honestly, even those are better than the absolute pile of retardation which is the current 'system'.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/24 15:49:33


    Post by: Shadow Walker


     morganfreeman wrote:
    "Universal special rules are back in the game – It doesn’t matter if you’re making a Dimensional Translocation or preparing Death From Below, it’s all a Deep Strike now!"


    The madness of slightly different bespoke rules for one purpose is over. Thank christ for that.

    Here's hoping they don't revert to the 7th edition madness of 20 pages, many of which simply give other special rules. Or take the HH model of having it split between multiplebooks.

    But honestly, even those are better than the absolute pile of retardation which is the current 'system'.

    100% this!


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/24 15:59:05


    Post by: H.B.M.C.


     Shadow Walker wrote:
    Don't you like the new SC from the video or do you like the current one so much, or both? I ask because I was, and still am a huge fan of the original SC, and I am really happy to see that modern version of it.
    As always, what we're getting interests me far less than what we're losing.

    A a Chaos player of nearly 30 years I am far too used to having things clawed away from me. As a Tyranid player who's been playing them since before they even had their first Codex, the thought of losing what has taken so long to gain is terrifying.

    As I said earlier in one of the recent news threads, the current Carnifex rules allow for 2x double Devourers. This is unusual in the world of no model/no rules, as the Carnifex kit does not contain four Devourers. It has two. However, by dint of nothing more than GW chosing to package Carnifexes two to a box, you technically get 4 Devourers, and hence the option remains in the rules. And, let's be as clear as we can be: This is the only reason that option is still in the rules.

    If GW were to re-do the Carnifex, do you think it is more likely that it would:

    1. Gain options.
    2. Retain all its existing options.
    3. Lose options.

    New doesn't mean better. Remember that.

    As to the specifics of your query, honestly we haven't got a good enough look at the Screamer Killer to really know what it looks like. Motion blur is a bitch! Having said that, I'm not against the Screamer Killer returning as its own unit, with its own kit. I'm am cool with adding things.

     Tyran wrote:
    I don't want to lose the current Carnifex design. The Screamer-Killer being its own thing is fine but not if it means we lose the current kit.
    This seems like a perfect solution to all problems.

     Irbis wrote:
    Also abilities right on sheet, no sign of another 'one-size-fits-none' garbage, uNiVeRsAL SR. Excellent. Having 8-10 of them on a single weapon in new HH reminded me why I despised the inane system even way back in 5th edition, and that was when they were still reigned in and kinda-sorta universal instead of 100+ applies-to-single-unit/weapon cancerous growth they became later.
    Spoke a little too soon, didn't we?



    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/24 16:09:52


    Post by: Mad Doc Grotsnik


    If they must split USR across books, just ensure each has a reference index.

    Yes, I’m looking at you HH Books.

    I will do that crib sheet at some point.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/24 16:27:09


    Post by: Souleater


    I second the irritation at things like Dance of Wombats: this unit has [USR that we could have just bloody put in the first fething place]

    Fingers crossed that they avoid that.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/24 16:54:04


    Post by: Siegfriedfr


    My problem with the Nids as an army is that huge monsters are mostly one dimensional compared to the number of points required to field them; they pay a DEAR price for their supposedly "tough" statline (which was not tough in 8th and 9th at all compared to the firepower available to all factions).

    Regarding models, i simply do not understand people who "don't want updates to old models", like the Carnifex. I do want a new Carnifex, new warriors, just like i want a new Lictor and Biovores.

    Regarding roles, i feel that Tyranids are lacking in powerful guns on cheap infantry, but as others said, they are mostly "complete" and some models (usually the big ones) have continuous problems with their rules/cost rather than their models.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/24 17:14:57


    Post by: morganfreeman


    Siegfriedfr wrote:
    Regarding models, i simply do not understand people who "don't want updates to old models", like the Carnifex. I do want a new Carnifex, new warriors, just like i want a new Lictor and Biovores.

    Regarding roles, i feel that Tyranids are lacking in powerful guns on cheap infantry, but as others said, they are mostly "complete" and some models (usually the big ones) have continuous problems with their rules/cost rather than their models.


    There are a lot of good reasons to not want to update models. On the technical / gameplay side updating sometimes comes with rebasing and size shifts, which can make it more difficult to play with your OG models if a TO feels like being a bit of a prick. With regards to aesthetics the newer iteration rarely "fits" with the old one, meaning that you can run into a situation where your army looks very disparate and in a bad way. That's before getting into the cases where a new model is a straight visual downgrade from the old one (something a lot of people feel happened when nids went from 2nd ed to 3rd ed.

    For my part I really like the modern fex. It's good looking, has aged very well, and (imo) most importantly is incredibly modular. Which is especially important when GW is pushing harder and harder for glorified push-fit kits for general units.

    With regards to rules.. Nids don't really need powerful guns on cheap infantry. That's what their monsters are for. Nids are generally a horde army, so making those hordes incredibly dangerous on an individual basis is a recipe for disaster. Monster mash should be where the powerful individual models are, where as hordes are more weight of fire / attacks.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/24 17:17:32


    Post by: Siegfriedfr


     morganfreeman wrote:
    Siegfriedfr wrote:
    Regarding models, i simply do not understand people who "don't want updates to old models", like the Carnifex. I do want a new Carnifex, new warriors, just like i want a new Lictor and Biovores.

    Regarding roles, i feel that Tyranids are lacking in powerful guns on cheap infantry, but as others said, they are mostly "complete" and some models (usually the big ones) have continuous problems with their rules/cost rather than their models.


    There are a lot of good reasons to not want to update models. On the technical / gameplay side updating sometimes comes with rebasing and size shifts, which can make it more difficult to play with your OG models if a TO feels like being a bit of a prick. With regards to aesthetics the newer iteration rarely "fits" with the old one, meaning that you can run into a situation where your army looks very disparate and in a bad way. That's before getting into the cases where a new model is a straight visual downgrade from the old one (something a lot of people feel happened when nids went from 2nd ed to 3rd ed.

    For my part I really like the modern fex. It's good looking, has aged very well, and (imo) most importantly is incredibly modular. Which is especially important when GW is pushing harder and harder for glorified push-fit kits for general units.

    With regards to rules.. Nids don't really need powerful guns on cheap infantry. That's what their monsters are for. Nids are generally a horde army, so making those hordes incredibly dangerous on an individual basis is a recipe for disaster. Monster mash should be where the powerful individual models are, where as hordes are more weight of fire / attacks.


    I get it, you don't want change, and you don't want new. You want things to remain as they are. Hardly a constructive point of view.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/24 17:19:55


    Post by: Mad Doc Grotsnik


    For me, the Carnifex kit just doesn’t need a redo.

    Sure it’s knocking on a bit age, but it’s still a kit which stands up to more modern kits. It doesn’t look like an older kit once assembled, and has a bucket of options.

    Would I say no to a redo? Not necessarily. But there are things in more urgent need of an update. Which hopefully we’ll get as well. But if say, the Biovore is skipped to redo the Carnifex? That’s a waste of a slot.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/24 17:27:16


    Post by: Mr_Rose


     Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
    For me, the Carnifex kit just doesn’t need a redo.

    Sure it’s knocking on a bit age, but it’s still a kit which stands up to more modern kits. It doesn’t look like an older kit once assembled, and has a bucket of options.

    Would I say no to a redo? Not necessarily. But there are things in more urgent need of an update. Which hopefully we’ll get as well. But if say, the Biovore is skipped to redo the Carnifex? That’s a waste of a slot.

    The kit? Probably not. The mould? Definitely. I just had to build one of the more recent batches and the wear is bad like apocalyptic. Basically none of the parts assembled correctly without being forced and even then filler was still needed in places. The finished model looks great and all but it was an absolute chore to assemble which is a shame since I remember it being a joy back in the day when it was new.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/24 17:29:25


    Post by: Tyran


    Mind you part of the issue is that the new Screamer Killer is notably different from the current Carnifex.

    I mean, I like the new gaunts because they are clearly updates and improvements on the current designs and I should have little issue mixing them with my existing gaunt swarms.

    But the Screamer-Killer is too different to simply be an update so I would prefer if it is an actual separate unit rather than a replacement.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/24 17:35:36


    Post by: Shadow Walker


     Tyran wrote:

    But the Screamer-Killer is too different to simply be an update so I would prefer if it is an actual separate unit rather than a replacement.

    But it would be weird to have it as a separate unit, and selling both models, when it is simply a Carnifex variant.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/24 17:41:24


    Post by: Tyran


     Shadow Walker wrote:
     Tyran wrote:

    But the Screamer-Killer is too different to simply be an update so I would prefer if it is an actual separate unit rather than a replacement.

    But it would be weird to have it as a separate unit, and selling both models, when it is simply a Carnifex variant.

    It is different enough that you can justify it being a separate unit.

    I mean FFS Space Marines basically got away with pretty much every Primaris being a variant of an already existing Firstborn model without replacing the Firstborn version.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/24 17:44:09


    Post by: Tsagualsa


     Tyran wrote:
     Shadow Walker wrote:
     Tyran wrote:

    But the Screamer-Killer is too different to simply be an update so I would prefer if it is an actual separate unit rather than a replacement.

    But it would be weird to have it as a separate unit, and selling both models, when it is simply a Carnifex variant.

    It is different enough that you can justify it being a separate unit.

    I mean FFS Space Marines basically got away with pretty much every Primaris being a variant of an already existing Firstborn model without replacing the Firstborn version.


    And with having 5 different units that are differentiated by what gun they carry


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/24 18:25:10


    Post by: morganfreeman


    Siegfriedfr wrote:


    I get it, you don't want change, and you don't want new. You want things to remain as they are. Hardly a constructive point of view.


    Bzzzt. Wrong.

    I liked the 3rd edition Tyrant more than the current one. I think Genestealers and Gaunts / Gants could absolutely do with some new kits. I think elements of the Primaris range are excellent, noticeably better than munchkin-marines.

    But having an opinion doesn't make someone afraid of change. And if someone is afraid of change due to GW's current design elements, that's pretty reasonable too. Or do you genuinely prefer that every 5 possessed / 7 plague marines / 10 ork boys / ect being the same dudes in the same pose, CSM not having enough bolters to go around, and every Ork Warboss being the same guy in the same pose is good?


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/24 18:59:55


    Post by: kestral


    I would love to proper Dog Sized termigaunts again in place of the pony/horse sized ones. Why wouldn't you want small soldiers who can hide and climb super well? It is a visual niche that no other army fills.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/24 19:12:06


    Post by: Mad Doc Grotsnik


     Mr_Rose wrote:
     Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
    For me, the Carnifex kit just doesn’t need a redo.

    Sure it’s knocking on a bit age, but it’s still a kit which stands up to more modern kits. It doesn’t look like an older kit once assembled, and has a bucket of options.

    Would I say no to a redo? Not necessarily. But there are things in more urgent need of an update. Which hopefully we’ll get as well. But if say, the Biovore is skipped to redo the Carnifex? That’s a waste of a slot.

    The kit? Probably not. The mould? Definitely. I just had to build one of the more recent batches and the wear is bad like apocalyptic. Basically none of the parts assembled correctly without being forced and even then filler was still needed in places. The finished model looks great and all but it was an absolute chore to assemble which is a shame since I remember it being a joy back in the day when it was new.


    Fair point, and one I don’t have the experience to refute


    Automatically Appended Next Post:
     kestral wrote:
    I would love to proper Dog Sized termigaunts again in place of the pony/horse sized ones. Why wouldn't you want small soldiers who can hide and climb super well? It is a visual niche that no other army fills.


    Well, delving in the foetid morass of my mind? Termagants/Hunter Slayers were described, maybe “best guessed” as being small enough to crawl through a Hive Ship’s arteries to attack intruders from unexpected angles. Never the only line of defence, but a distraction.

    Depending on how rigid their chitin is, that’s still possible, even with them being larger models. If it’s akin to a non-newtonian liquid type properties, it can still be effective armour.

    Kind of like how Mesh armour was first described, now I think about it.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/24 19:28:41


    Post by: drbored


    I look forward to reading another 5 pages worth of people waffling on about whether or not the carnifex is going to be getting an updated kit or not and what will happen when it does.

    I don't have a horse in the race, but so far I'm loving everything I'm seeing, from the trailer to the other pics.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/24 20:08:20


    Post by: NAVARRO


    I could write an essay about such cool topic but no one wants to read that so I will just dip a bit and quote some parts instead XD
    Tsagualsa wrote:
     NAVARRO wrote:
    Nids evolve so fast that they adapt and generate new mods on the following wave on the same battle... yet Gaunts so far remain unchanged for decades. Makes no sense.


    Maybe gaunts are just an island of stability you arrive at after billions of iterations. Like crocodiles or sharks, they're just so near-perfect and efficient for their role that deviations from it are only temporary in the face of very specific circumstances, and in the long term you'll always fall back to the basic gaunt. Just playing devil's advocate here.


    The cool question would be what is the ultimate goal of the Nid DNA manipulation? Generate the perfect nid organism or the perfect nid ecosystem?... Without the constant biomass assimilation to even a mineral level and the new DNA gained from that the race would not expand evolve into new things and would linger into extinction ( much like sharks and crocs are today).

    Overread wrote:snip


    2) Replace - remove a model and replace it with something new. This can work well but can be risky; people do not like losing models and often as not if the replacement is a similar size they will still use the old one. There's a few cases where its welcome - eg the new Greater Demons were generally very popular (plus a good many people can still run the old ones as demon princes).
    But you've got to be careful - do it too often or too much and people can hate it. Esp when its not a material change (eg shifting a bunch from finecast to plastic)
    snip


    If there is a company that has the means to take a risk thats GW and I would welcome that for the sake keeping things going. You and me been with these designs for 20 years and in the beginning of that we were exited since these were fresh, considerably different etc... Can you say that now? No, you can only say that you liked they kept the concepts the same. I don't think these will age well another 20 years because they already have the baggage of the previous design.
    I put them side by side to someone who is not aware or familiar with our toys and they will find it hard to say that these are different.

    H.B.M.C. wrote:
     NAVARRO wrote:
    Nids evolve so fast that they adapt and generate new mods on the following wave on the same battle... yet Gaunts so far remain unchanged for decades. Makes no sense.
    Makes sense to me.

    The Hive Mind makes creatures to overcome specific obstacles. One would presume that if it made something that turned out to be generally useful in most situations, it would keep that "design" for continued use. So the Termagant was something it might have once created for a specific task, but found that it had value in other circumstances, so kept making it.

    The motto of the Hive Mind should be "Anything you can do I can do better!".



    Sure but dont you find it extremely unlikely a race that has at his disposal bazillions of DNA combinations not change at all? Specially when the first wave of this fleet was errr losing? Are you saying nid gaunts won all the battles? XD

    Iracundus wrote:

    I don't mind the Termagant or other Gaunts being mostly unchanged aside from the odd biomorph or weapon options. The reason is because they are cannon fodder and mass produced. I know that sounds obvious but even a slight point increase (or resource spent spawning them) multiplied by however many millions or billions get spawned is a significant cost for the Hive Mind. Why waste too many resources on a creature that is meant to be expended and which can still kill most things through numbers? In background terms, the most common foe would be human equivalent, not Space Marines, and the Termagant does perfectly well against them. The 3rd edition mutation and design your Nid rules reflected this logic to an even greater extent when players did not bother with Fleshborers and used the cheaper Spinefist to create the even cheaper cannon fodder Spinegaunt.
    .


    Cannon fodder should probably be smaller, less complex with no extra symbiotes weapons, harder to hit etc... heck Rippers probably better for that. Speaking resources why even bother with vestigial pair of limbs they have? Surely a gaunt with hands holding different guns ( why is this even a concept these days blows my mind) is more effective than say an ORK squig with 2 legs and a mouth running towards enemies XD

    Good discussion folks keep it going.

    Regarding Fex kit... I think it will happen, one per box, bigger, and with limited biomorphs ( imagine Redemptor dreads ) so they can sell more boxes.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/24 20:19:06


    Post by: Tsagualsa


     NAVARRO wrote:

    Cannon fodder should probably be smaller, less complex with no extra symbiotes weapons, harder to hit etc... heck Rippers probably better for that. Speaking resources why even bother with vestigial pair of limbs they have? Surely a gaunt with hands holding different guns ( why is this even a concept these days blows my mind) is more effective than say an ORK squig with 2 legs and a mouth running towards enemies XD

    Good discussion folks keep it going.

    Regarding Fex kit... I think it will happen, one per box, bigger, and with limited biomorphs ( imagine Redemptor dreads ) so they can sell more boxes.


    If we went by actual efficiency they'd run with flooding planets with viruses and bacteria until everything was soup, not even bothering with larger organisms at all - that would kill everything not protected by completely sealed environments or suits, and these would be pretty much rounding errors to the biomass equations, not able to do anything about it anyway and would have to leave once the 'nids were done with the now-lifeless and -ressourceless ball of rock. It would not make for engaging stories though.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/24 20:23:10


    Post by: NAVARRO


    Tsagualsa wrote:
     NAVARRO wrote:

    Cannon fodder should probably be smaller, less complex with no extra symbiotes weapons, harder to hit etc... heck Rippers probably better for that. Speaking resources why even bother with vestigial pair of limbs they have? Surely a gaunt with hands holding different guns ( why is this even a concept these days blows my mind) is more effective than say an ORK squig with 2 legs and a mouth running towards enemies XD

    Good discussion folks keep it going.

    Regarding Fex kit... I think it will happen, one per box, bigger, and with limited biomorphs ( imagine Redemptor dreads ) so they can sell more boxes.


    If we went by actual efficiency they'd run with flooding planets with viruses and bacteria until everything was soup, not even bothering with larger organisms at all - that would kill everything not protected by completely sealed environments or suits, and these would be pretty much rounding errors to the biomass equations, not able to do anything about it anyway and would have to leave once the 'nids were done with the now-lifeless and -ressourceless ball of rock. It would not make for engaging stories though.


    Are you really saying that a Swarm of ORK squigs running towards the enemy and spitting different nasty things ( if you really want some ranged options) is less engaging than a gaunt with a pistol?


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/24 22:47:40


    Post by: H.B.M.C.


    Siegfriedfr wrote:
    Regarding models, i simply do not understand people who "don't want updates to old models", like the Carnifex.
    How much more clearly can I explain the reasons why beyond what I have already said?

    Siegfriedfr wrote:
    I get it, you don't want change, and you don't want new. You want things to remain as they are. Hardly a constructive point of view.
    What's not constructive is you ignoring every word he just said to instead insult him.

    Try harder.



    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/24 23:11:10


    Post by: Tyel


    I'd have thought the main reason to fear change is £££.

    Surprised to see the love of the Carnifex kit. Never really rated it. Always felt it was too small and hunched - which guess reflects where the Carnifex has ended up in the wider hierarchy - versus its 2nd edition high days - but still.

    But right now, you can buy 12 Termagants for £22.50. Do the new ones look better? Sure. Is that going to make up for being say £35~ for 10 (probably)? So 50-75% more expensive? You can debate it. Especially if Termagants were to say go back down to say 5 points and the rules are very much "bring 90 of these guys or nothing".


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/24 23:14:50


    Post by: H.B.M.C.


    Termagants will likely end up being this edition's Necron Warriors: You'd have to be mad to buy them on their own!


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/24 23:48:05


    Post by: Either/Or


     H.B.M.C. wrote:
    Termagants will likely end up being this edition's Necron Warriors: You'd have to be mad to buy them on their own!


    If terminators are the new assault intercessors I will probably end up with a good size pile of termagants.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/24 23:56:03


    Post by: MajorWesJanson


    Either/Or wrote:
     H.B.M.C. wrote:
    Termagants will likely end up being this edition's Necron Warriors: You'd have to be mad to buy them on their own!


    If terminators are the new assault intercessors I will probably end up with a good size pile of termagants.


    I rather doubt that the recruit starter will be 10 termigants vs 3-5 terminators, one with an assault cannon.

    Did we see a terminator sergeant in the video? I cant recall.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/25 00:11:49


    Post by: Overread


    Indomitus didn't include any Sisters of Battle, but they were key in the promotional video for that edition.

    I wouldn't read too much into how many models are in a box or what's in the box based upon the video.



    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/25 01:33:45


    Post by: Nevelon


    I enjoyed building the 2 ‘fexes I have. Fun kit, did not have any issues with it. Back in the day, when an army was a handfull of squads and something the size of a dread was a big deal, ‘fexes were something to be scared of. But scale creep happened. In a world of knights and super heavies, they struggle to find a role.

    In the last few codexes they have had the wonderfully flexible ‘fex datasheet as well as bespoke ones for the screamer killer amd thornback. I’d love them to make a special throwback mini of the old classic SK, and keep that alongside the flex kit. Best of both worlds. And a monopose launch box SK would not be a bad place for it.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/25 09:04:10


    Post by: Shadow Walker


     Nevelon wrote:
    Back in the day, when an army was a handfull of squads and something the size of a dread was a big deal, ‘fexes were something to be scared of. But scale creep happened. In a world of knights and super heavies, they struggle to find a role.

    Maybe that new Combat Patrol mode would allow it to shine again? Assuming the new Nids CP box includes a Carnifex of course.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/25 09:49:38


    Post by: NAVARRO


    Tyel wrote:
    I'd have thought the main reason to fear change is £££.

    Surprised to see the love of the Carnifex kit. Never really rated it. Always felt it was too small and hunched - which guess reflects where the Carnifex has ended up in the wider hierarchy - versus its 2nd edition high days - but still.

    But right now, you can buy 12 Termagants for £22.50. Do the new ones look better? Sure. Is that going to make up for being say £35~ for 10 (probably)? So 50-75% more expensive? You can debate it. Especially if Termagants were to say go back down to say 5 points and the rules are very much "bring 90 of these guys or nothing".



    I think Gaunts will be initially cheap since Im convinced they will be included on the typical 3x 40k Starting boxsets. Ebay will make them affordable.
    Not sure about how multipart they will be then or if they will release a different multipart sprue/box later on.
    One thing that really works against the price per model is the current dual kit box sets for medium sized creatures, yes you can build two different breeds but the price per box is way to high because of that. Going forward that will potentially make them even more expensive.

    I like the carnifex Kit specially the size of the old boy I think its ideal for large creatures, the problem is not the carni, the problem is that they made all these other ridiculous huge new kits, a pain to store, transport etc.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/25 09:54:23


    Post by: MajorWesJanson


    Looking at the 3 they have shown, I think the body and head are a single part, then legs and arms plug into the sides.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/25 10:42:28


    Post by: Altruizine


    Tyel wrote:
    Surprised to see the love of the Carnifex kit. Never really rated it. Always felt it was too small and hunched - which guess reflects where the Carnifex has ended up in the wider hierarchy - versus its 2nd edition high days - but still.

    When I read something like this it just makes me wonder when the person started playing. There's no way you "always thought it was small" if you saw it when it came out in 2005, except in like a mind-palace way where marines were also too small. But nobody actually expected bigger models at that time, or had really seen them realized in GW plastic.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/25 11:01:42


    Post by: xttz


     NAVARRO wrote:

    I think Gaunts will be initially cheap since Im convinced they will be included on the typical 3x 40k Starting boxsets. Ebay will make them affordable.
    Not sure about how multipart they will be then or if they will release a different multipart sprue/box later on.
    One thing that really works against the price per model is the current dual kit box sets for medium sized creatures, yes you can build two different breeds but the price per box is way to high because of that. Going forward that will potentially make them even more expensive.


    We've seen that the combat patrol version of the termagant datasheet only has fleshborers listed, while the 'normal' datasheet has other weapon options. That could indicate there are two different sets of sprues for termagants, with the launch box & combat patrol getting a simpler pushfit version while a multipart version with build options is sold separately. That could be GW learning from Necron Warrior stock not selling separately because there are so many cheap sources of the models elsewhere.

    I'm expecting a similar situation with the marine terminators as well. Those are more likely to be pushfit like the 9E Bladeguard & Eradicators, with a separate multipart kit later that covers all options.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/25 11:10:57


    Post by: Nevelon


     Shadow Walker wrote:
     Nevelon wrote:
    Back in the day, when an army was a handfull of squads and something the size of a dread was a big deal, ‘fexes were something to be scared of. But scale creep happened. In a world of knights and super heavies, they struggle to find a role.

    Maybe that new Combat Patrol mode would allow it to shine again? Assuming the new Nids CP box includes a Carnifex of course.


    The current Combat Patrol is not that old. But if they are making a major range revamp, it’s probably going away. Especially as we’ve seen the new gaunts and the CP come with 3 dozen of the little biters. Looking at the CPs now, it seems the biggest things tend to be medium tank/dread equivalents. Although there are some ringers in there. Like the Hive Tyrant in our current nid box. How they balance all those is its own thread though.

    IMHO I think the carnifex should have the role of being a solid chunk of toughness and mean, mid-range flexible. Not as much offense or wounds as the big guys, but tough as a dread and able to fill gaps in the swarm. A hammer that can troubleshoot issues on the battlefield and crack them open. But not the hyperspecialized big monster bugs.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/25 11:16:45


    Post by: Tsagualsa


     Nevelon wrote:
     Shadow Walker wrote:
     Nevelon wrote:
    Back in the day, when an army was a handfull of squads and something the size of a dread was a big deal, ‘fexes were something to be scared of. But scale creep happened. In a world of knights and super heavies, they struggle to find a role.

    Maybe that new Combat Patrol mode would allow it to shine again? Assuming the new Nids CP box includes a Carnifex of course.


    The current Combat Patrol is not that old. But if they are making a major range revamp, it’s probably going away. Especially as we’ve seen the new gaunts and the CP come with 3 dozen of the little biters. Looking at the CPs now, it seems the biggest things tend to be medium tank/dread equivalents. Although there are some ringers in there. Like the Hive Tyrant in our current nid box. How they balance all those is its own thread though.

    IMHO I think the carnifex should have the role of being a solid chunk of toughness and mean, mid-range flexible. Not as much offense or wounds as the big guys, but tough as a dread and able to fill gaps in the swarm. A hammer that can troubleshoot issues on the battlefield and crack them open. But not the hyperspecialized big monster bugs.


    From how i see it, GW currently does not like generalists and flexibility anymore, instead going for hyper-specialized niche units. That may or may not be due to the tendency of removing options and making options free: it's much harder to 'break' a one-trick pony by finding a degenerately powerful combination of stuff than it is to do the same with a 'generalist' unit that can potentially bring everything and the kitchen sink.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/25 11:39:09


    Post by: silverstu


     Nevelon wrote:
    I enjoyed building the 2 ‘fexes I have. Fun kit, did not have any issues with it. Back in the day, when an army was a handfull of squads and something the size of a dread was a big deal, ‘fexes were something to be scared of. But scale creep happened. In a world of knights and super heavies, they struggle to find a role.

    In the last few codexes they have had the wonderfully flexible ‘fex datasheet as well as bespoke ones for the screamer killer amd thornback. I’d love them to make a special throwback mini of the old classic SK, and keep that alongside the flex kit. Best of both worlds. And a monopose launch box SK would not be a bad place for it.


    Yeah I love the Fex kit [although I've had problems aligning the back chimneys ] and I really like where it sits now as a bio-dread type build. I've always thought that at that scale there is potential for other monsters too. I'm guessing the new screamer killer and probably the feeder beast sit into the size but perform other roles. From listening to the reveal stream I'm guessing the feeder beast might act as a force multiplier on surrounding units which is something I like the sound of.

    Also the scuttling melee attackers look to be something new rather than hormagaunts - they are squatter,with short tails and seem to have heavy jaws.Valrak said maybe 3 types of gaunts - maybe these are hypergaunts ?


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/25 11:46:23


    Post by: Overread


    I'm liking that it looks like a lot of the newer beasties are going to be in the medium category for size. A lot of the newer additions to Tyranids have been massive monsters and they are awesome, but they are also massive, which presents issues for transporting and such.

    So I'm totally fine with GW perhaps splitting some Carnifex variations into their own sculpts and then having a potentially revised core fex kit along with other options in that middleweight category.

    One thing we might see happen is we might see the Carnifex lose some options but have those options parcelled out to other models. Eg the Screamerkiller is likely going to replace the concept of a fex with 4 scything talons outright as a model. Now chances are you can still use an old fex with talons as a counts as, but the intention moving forward is that you'd use the new kit.

    The "downside" here is that those who have modular fex's with magnets might find that its not as variable as it once was and those with fixed builds it might be more like a model upgrade visually.
    The upside is that it might well increase model visual diversity without bloating the army options itself.

    The Fex on its own does a lot, heck its intention was to be a jack of all trades in terms of options to build with.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/25 11:51:45


    Post by: silverstu


    They could add more/different biomorphs to a revised Fex kit- there is a lot of room on those sprues as is- or they could set them up as pairs on the sprue.
    I have just built and painted two screamer killers.. temped to replace one set of arms now..but no rush.

    I also hope we will get the odd random ripper/organism on different kits as well similar to grots/nurglings/cherubs..


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/25 12:00:55


    Post by: Overread


    Historically we've always had Rippers on random Tyranid Sprue and it would be awesome for that to continue or even get other variations - winged rippers would be cool to see in plastic


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/25 12:10:36


    Post by: Old-Four-Arms


     Overread wrote:
    Historically we've always had Rippers on random Tyranid Sprue and it would be awesome for that to continue or even get other variations - winged rippers would be cool to see in plastic


    From the article on Warhammer Community :

    And don’t worry, they still come with a Ripper Swarm!


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/25 12:32:11


    Post by: Nevelon


    Old-Four-Arms wrote:
     Overread wrote:
    Historically we've always had Rippers on random Tyranid Sprue and it would be awesome for that to continue or even get other variations - winged rippers would be cool to see in plastic


    From the article on Warhammer Community :

    And don’t worry, they still come with a Ripper Swarm!


    Which does not guarantee that they will continue to be splashed into other kits.

    Currently if you build your swarms with just the options in the termagant kit it gets very same-y fast. You have 2 different rippers, the one on the the main sprue and one from the upgrades sprue in a 4:3 ratio. Even just splashing in the one different ripper from the genestealer kit helps makes things a little more interesting.

    I’d love to see unique rippers on every sprue, so we can mix and match to make wildly diverse swarms.

    Fingers crossed.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/25 12:56:12


    Post by: Old-Four-Arms



    I'm actually expecting the Rippers to evolve (hah !), same as the Necron Scarabs did (old vs. new model)

    https://brushandboltgun.com/2020/09/09/video-how-to-paint-necron-scarabs-new-and-old/



    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/25 14:30:38


    Post by: Shadow Walker


    Carnifex discussion made me think about the Warriors. Even though I love the current kit I am also one of the few (judging by the internet nids talks) who liked the look of the 2nd edition ones. Together with SC and Hormas (I am really keen to see their newest minis) from that time they were one of the reasons that sold me on the bugs army. If the GW is, based on the video's SC, going closer to modernized 2nd edition look of the Tyranids, it may also mean that kits like Warriors, and possibly HT could see a reimagination in the near future toward that style.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/25 15:10:30


    Post by: Dudeface


     Shadow Walker wrote:
    Carnifex discussion made me think about the Warriors. Even though I love the current kit I am also one of the few (judging by the internet nids talks) who liked the look of the 2nd edition ones. Together with SC and Hormas (I am really keen to see their newest minis) from that time they were one of the reasons that sold me on the bugs army. If the GW is, based on the video's SC, going closer to modernized 2nd edition look of the Tyranids, it may also mean that kits like Warriors, and possibly HT could see a reimagination in the near future toward that style.


    Having just got wrapped up in the hype and bought a unit of warriors, after assembling them I kinda feel they have too many options at this point? I last touched nids late 4th so it's not totally foreign but having 4 melee options and 3 ranged for each warrior feels a bit much. Especially when all 3 guns are fundamentally anti-infantry to one degree or another. They could almost go to heavy melee, melee, standard gun and 1 in 3 heavy gun and I don't feel much would be lost, but I am out of touch.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/25 15:29:51


    Post by: H.B.M.C.


    Too many options? For real?


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/25 15:32:27


    Post by: Nevelon


    Nids have a lot of options, but the design space they have to work in in a bit small. So instead of different guns shining in different roles, you can just take the option that maths out to the best call 95% of the time. Same with melee options.

    Which is not a unique problem. Most armies have similar issues.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/25 15:35:16


    Post by: Shadow Walker


    Looking again at the Norn Emissary (or whatever it will be called), and I think it could be a Silent King style miniature with his two floating servants.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/25 15:44:02


    Post by: Nevelon


     Shadow Walker wrote:
    Looking again at the Norn Emissary (or whatever it will be called), and I think it could be a Silent King style miniature with his two floating servants.


    My question there is if it’s just going to be one base/statline, or if those are going to be like tau drones with their own rules separate from the big brain bug.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/25 15:50:57


    Post by: H.B.M.C.


     Shadow Walker wrote:
    Looking again at the Norn Emissary (or whatever it will be called), and I think it could be a Silent King style miniature with his two floating servants.
    I think that's the idea.

    I just hope it's not a special character.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/25 16:00:41


    Post by: Shadow Walker


    Nevelon wrote:
    My question there is if it’s just going to be one base/statline, or if those are going to be like tau drones with their own rules separate from the big brain bug.

    I think that the smaller ones are some kind of psychic amplifiers which would give various bonuses to both psychic tests and stats etc., and could have a separate statline so you could target them, and therefore be able to reduce the effectiveness of the big brain bug.

    H.B.M.C. wrote:
    I just hope it's not a special character.

    Yeah, me too.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/25 16:11:17


    Post by: Dudeface


    H.B.M.C. wrote:Too many options? For real?


    Is answered by:

    Nevelon wrote:Nids have a lot of options, but the design space they have to work in in a bit small. So instead of different guns shining in different roles, you can just take the option that maths out to the best call 95% of the time. Same with melee options.

    Which is not a unique problem. Most armies have similar issues.


    I can't see why you'd ever want the spinefists? Devourer vs deathspitter is basically down to "can you spare 5 pts" given one is better against nearly any target than the other. In melee, is there a reason dual swords and sword + whip needs to be different rules other than legacy at this point? Rending claws > scything talons to the point they might as well not exist and having multiple weapons seems a bit pointless, i.e. what is the benefit of 4 scytals despite being an option, or 4 rending claws?

    There's customisation for customisations sakes.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/25 16:19:09


    Post by: Shadow Walker


    Back when we had templates, Deathspitter was using small blast one, and it made it different enough from the Devourer. So yeah, they could do much better job to make weapons different enough now when the templates are gone.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/25 16:58:42


    Post by: Overread


    Also one of the legacies of Tyranids having lots of multi weapon options was having a smaller model roster at the time.

    We didn't have 5 different tanks, we have 1 Carnifex kit which did all those roles in one depending on the weapons you gave it.

    Warriors were much the same.


    I can agree that as time has passed its got harder to fit all these weapons in when the range has been growing and gaining more and more model diversity.

    That said spinefists have always been rather boring. They are the "you take these because they are cheap" weapon and nothing more to help you really bolster out an army that was focusing on swarming.




    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/25 17:07:44


    Post by: BobtheInquisitor


    All those spare bits made conversions easier and more fun. And if you wanted to play Tyranids in BFG, you could make the bulk of your fleet from your 40k Tyranid bits box.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/25 17:07:49


    Post by: H.B.M.C.


    Dudeface wrote:
    There's customisation for customisations sakes.
    No it's a matter of implementation. It's like when people whinge about USRs and never realise that so many other games use USRs, so the USR problems in 40k are down to how they were implemented, not the fact that USRs exist in the first place.

    If there's too much crossover between Warrior (or Gaunt, or anything) options then they need to do a better job at making the weapon types distinct. We know they can do it with other armies, so why not 'Nids?





    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/25 18:31:24


    Post by: Shadow Walker


    I wonder what role will Norn Emissary play? We already have bugs which use psychic powers as their main way of attack with Zoans, Neuro and Maleceptor. Will it be just another but more powerful? It would be like Dominatrix but smaller, and flying? Or, and here is my personal dread/heresy, it is a new reimagined Dominatrix with new, trademarked name?


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/25 18:36:22


    Post by: Tsagualsa


     Shadow Walker wrote:
    I wonder what role will Norn Emissary play? We already have bugs which use psychic powers as their main way of attack with Zoans, Neuro and Maleceptor. Will it be just another but more powerful? It would be like Dominatrix but smaller, and flying? Or, and here is my personal dread/heresy, it is a new reimagined Dominatrix with new, trademarked name?


    Probably the later, a 'Dominatrix' that fits smaller games, has a googleable name and possibly spams stuff like the old 'Catalyst' psychic power or something like that. I guess a 'support caster' with buffs is something the Tyranids don't really have at the moment, maybe that's their niche for this unit.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/25 18:36:40


    Post by: Mad Doc Grotsnik


     Shadow Walker wrote:
    I wonder what role will Norn Emissary play? We already have bugs which use psychic powers as their main way of attack with Zoans, Neuro and Maleceptor. Will it be just another but more powerful? It would be like Dominatrix but smaller, and flying? Or, and here is my personal dread/heresy, it is a new reimagined Dominatrix with new, trademarked name?


    If as the stream suggested psychic powers are now unit abilities? Maybe the Norn Emissary will be the Buffing Bug? Something you float around your main swarm dishing out psychic shields and that?


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/25 18:38:54


    Post by: Overread


    Yeah I could see it being a buffing bug whilst the Malceptor and Zoanthrope are the attack bugs.
    OR
    It could be a debuff or mix of the two - a unit that doesn't hurt anything but makes the whole situation weighted in favour of the tyranid side


    Norn Queen/Dominatrix* was always a massive model not really for the 40K game space, so this doesn't have to replace that model; just perhaps provide another psy creature at the 32mm scale without being a vast monster.



    * I recall some early epic lore/wd lore was that the dominatrix was the mount and a norn queen sat atop in the throne blasting out powers. Then later it changed to the dominatrix being the powerhouse of the main model and a warrior sitting on top manning the top gun .


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/25 18:43:14


    Post by: Mad Doc Grotsnik


    I can dig out my Hive War book and check the original lore. But I don’t think big beastie or embedded beastie were ever said to be Norn Queens?


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/25 18:44:11


    Post by: Overread


     Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
    I can dig out my Hive War book and check the original lore. But I don’t think big beastie or embedded beastie were ever said to be Norn Queens?


    I've got a feeling it was mentioned in the white dwarf when Tyranids were released for Epic 40K


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/25 18:51:02


    Post by: Mad Doc Grotsnik


    I could also go for a de-buffing bug. Something which affects enemy units.

    Lots of possibilities in that.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/25 18:57:39


    Post by: xttz


     Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
    I can dig out my Hive War book and check the original lore. But I don’t think big beastie or embedded beastie were ever said to be Norn Queens?


    They're not explicitly called norn queens, but there is a part about them laying eggs to expand the swarm:

    Spoiler:


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/25 19:33:38


    Post by: Arson Fire


    There are only a couple of places where norn queens have been described, but they're said to be absolutely massive. Filling most of a chamber on the hive ship that's many hundreds of meters tall. So it doesn't really jive that they would be able to be contained within a dominatrix.

    I also had a dig through the old white dwarfs from around the release of tyranids in epic a while back (around white dwarf 183/184 I think), and there's nothing in there suggesting the rider is a norn queen either. I'm pretty sure that whole idea is just someone's head-canon, which they edited into one of the wiki's for a few years. Long enough for plenty of people to read it, and lore youtubers to repeat it without checking the lack of sources until it became 'common knowledge'.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/25 20:08:00


    Post by: Overread


    At the same time its clear that the Dominatrix has had quite a few shifts in its lore over the years. Which is pretty common for something that hasn't been a model in a long time and for GW to shuffle things around.

    I agree Norn Queens have been - since 3rd edition? Vast behemoths that reside in the Hive Ships (where the line between queen and ship is blurry) and are, far as we know, the top most organism of the Hives in general. At least Hive Fleets are said to follow Queens* and we don't know of any entities greater, thus far.


    *In so much as the Tyranid Swarm shows individuality/variation in behaviour despite it all being one giant unity as well.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/25 20:15:38


    Post by: Tsagualsa


     Overread wrote:
    At the same time its clear that the Dominatrix has had quite a few shifts in its lore over the years. Which is pretty common for something that hasn't been a model in a long time and for GW to shuffle things around.

    I agree Norn Queens have been - since 3rd edition? Vast behemoths that reside in the Hive Ships (where the line between queen and ship is blurry) and are, far as we know, the top most organism of the Hives in general. At least Hive Fleets are said to follow Queens* and we don't know of any entities greater, thus far.


    *In so much as the Tyranid Swarm shows individuality/variation in behaviour despite it all being one giant unity as well.


    I think we can actually pinpoint the almost ship-sized Norn Queens to 'Warriors of Ultramar' from 2003, which is late 3rd edition, which is AFAIK the first time a detailled description was given in 'modern' 40k.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/25 20:20:22


    Post by: Arson Fire


     Overread wrote:
    At the same time its clear that the Dominatrix has had quite a few shifts in its lore over the years. Which is pretty common for something that hasn't been a model in a long time and for GW to shuffle things around.

    I agree Norn Queens have been - since 3rd edition? Vast behemoths that reside in the Hive Ships (where the line between queen and ship is blurry) and are, far as we know, the top most organism of the Hives in general. At least Hive Fleets are said to follow Queens* and we don't know of any entities greater, thus far.


    *In so much as the Tyranid Swarm shows individuality/variation in behaviour despite it all being one giant unity as well.

    Norn queens have been that way since advanced space crusade in 1990.
    Spoiler:

    Consistent with Warriors of Ultramar in 2003.
    Spoiler:
    The sight of the Norn Queen was something that Uriel would never forget for as long as he lived. The creature was massive, easily the size of a Battle Titan, its bulk filling the chamber with countless means of producing its monstrous offspring. A vast, mucus-ribbed tube hung from the walls, pulsing with disgusting motion and dripping great swathes of egg sacs to a slime filled pool where nurse organisms carried them away in great, scooped pincers.

    Huge pools of protoplasmic ooze bubbled and burst with motion as screeching infant beasts were drooled from its surface along bony chutes to begin growing almost as soon as they hit the ground. Thousands of gelatinous incubation larvae hung from resinous mucus on the great arched ceiling, supported on huge ribs of bone, each thicker than the columns in the Temple of Correction on Macragge. Stinking fluids coated the floor and foetid steam gusted from millions of tiny orifices in the walls. Ropes of dripping intestine and nutrients pumped viscous fluids into the belly of the Norn Queen, its vast, bloated head fused with the ribbed ceiling of the chamber. Six-legged creatures that resembled fat spiders crawled all over its body, cleaning, feeding and ministering to their queen. Huge javelin-like spines protruded from her bony carapace, each dripping with hissing poisons.

    The Norn Queen itself was as much a part of the bio-ship as an individual creature.


    Also I disagree that there have been shifts in the lore of the Dominatrix. The fact is they have barely been mentioned since their initial appearance in 1995. They get namedropped in codexes from time to time, with brief descriptions that don't really add to or change anything about them. But there have been no big lore updates about them, as they were only in a single game which has been in stasis for a couple of decades, so there has been no reason for GW to do anything more with them. They just exist as presented in the old Hive War rulebook.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/26 00:36:23


    Post by: Iracundus


     Overread wrote:
    Yeah I could see it being a buffing bug whilst the Malceptor and Zoanthrope are the attack bugs.
    OR
    It could be a debuff or mix of the two - a unit that doesn't hurt anything but makes the whole situation weighted in favour of the tyranid side


    Norn Queen/Dominatrix* was always a massive model not really for the 40K game space, so this doesn't have to replace that model; just perhaps provide another psy creature at the 32mm scale without being a vast monster.



    * I recall some early epic lore/wd lore was that the dominatrix was the mount and a norn queen sat atop in the throne blasting out powers. Then later it changed to the dominatrix being the powerhouse of the main model and a warrior sitting on top manning the top gun .


    The Dominatrix background has never changed. Sounds like you have been either misremembering or have read someone's fan fiction or misunderstanding of the Tyranid background who mistook Dominatrix for Norn Queen.

    The Dominatrix creature was the leader of the ground based swarms. The Dominatrix proper was the fusion of the big creature with the "Aliens space jockey" on the back, and neither one alone was the Dominatrix. In Epic, it was a super-heavy, and could regenerate and had a warp field. It had a bio-cannon on its back, which was decent and lots of short range spines for anti-infantry work. What really made it deadly though was it was a psyker and could use a power (I think it was Warp Pulse or something like that) and it had a linear template and basically hit like multiple Volcano cannon hits, either downing shields or destroying Titans and super-heavies. It also had the largest Synapse range of any Tyranid ground creature. However in the editions since Epic Hive War, GW has focused more on the humanoid Hive Tyrants (since those can appear on a 40K battlefield) and de-emphasized the Dominatrix, even though originally the Tyrants were the expendable consort minds of the Dominatrix. Mere lieutenants in other words to the command unit of the Dominatrix, which was in size more like a Capitol Imperialis. Titans were bigger, but they were the goons to the ground swarm queen that was the Dominatrix.

    What was the key part of the Dominatrix was that it was capable of producing more Tyranids (not in game terms but in background terms). It could lay eggs or otherwise spawn more Tyranids.



    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/26 05:17:20


    Post by: tneva82


     MajorWesJanson wrote:
    Looking at the 3 they have shown, I think the body and head are a single part, then legs and arms plug into the sides.


    Any head with tail outside isn't single piece unless gw has made breakthrough in plastic casting.


    Automatically Appended Next Post:
    Dudeface wrote:

    I can't see why you'd ever want the spinefists? Devourer vs deathspitter is basically down to "can you spare 5 pts" given one is better against nearly any target than the other. In melee, is there a reason dual swords and sword + whip needs to be different rules other than legacy at this point? Rending claws > scything talons to the point they might as well not exist and having multiple weapons seems a bit pointless, i.e. what is the benefit of 4 scytals despite being an option, or 4 rending claws?

    There's customisation for customisations sakes.


    Of course that's now. If gw didn't care about profits(hah!) it wouldn't have to bb so and instead each has role they are good at.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/26 07:54:07


    Post by: Iracundus


    tneva82 wrote:
     MajorWesJanson wrote:
    Looking at the 3 they have shown, I think the body and head are a single part, then legs and arms plug into the sides.


    Any head with tail outside isn't single piece unless gw has made breakthrough in plastic casting.


    Automatically Appended Next Post:
    Dudeface wrote:

    I can't see why you'd ever want the spinefists? Devourer vs deathspitter is basically down to "can you spare 5 pts" given one is better against nearly any target than the other. In melee, is there a reason dual swords and sword + whip needs to be different rules other than legacy at this point? Rending claws > scything talons to the point they might as well not exist and having multiple weapons seems a bit pointless, i.e. what is the benefit of 4 scytals despite being an option, or 4 rending claws?

    There's customisation for customisations sakes.


    Of course that's now. If gw didn't care about profits(hah!) it wouldn't have to bb so and instead each has role they are good at.


    Tyranid ranged weapons are a relic from 2nd edition days, when they were better differentiated.

    Spinefists (and before that the spikerifle) were for AP at the expense of lower Strength. Fleshborers were the Strength option. Devourers were for number of shots. Deathspitters were high Strength single shot blast weapons. Barbed Stranglers were big blast. Vencom Cannons were basically best with high strength, decent rate of fire, and range but only a few creatures had access.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/26 09:02:03


    Post by: Shadow Walker


    Random thought - if there is a really big Tyranid line refresh, one that does not care about the date of release of particular models, then my nr one for such a change from the newest ones would be Toxicrene. Those tentacles are so stupidly designed that it should be punishable for all responsible for creation of that model.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/26 09:30:33


    Post by: Danny76


     Tastyfish wrote:
    Looks like there the new Genestealers are a lot closer to gaunts than they are now, with a gauntlike head and almost a sharkfin carapace.

    Looks like what we are calling a Screamer Killer is a Cerebrofex.

    Starter set rumours that seem to match this video:
    -1 Norn-Maleceptrix (Big brain bug, lesser incarnation of the Norn-Queen, able to 'evolve' units. Semi-feminine???)
    -1 Tyranid Primus (Big warrior, Two Devourers, Large sword, Claw-whip, boosts)
    -1 Lictor (New form of Lictor)
    -2 Magistraunt (Mix of Venomthropes and Pyrovore)
    -20 Genestealers (New kit, Options for Armored plates and Acid-claws)
    -1 Cerebrofex (Blend of Carnifex and Zoanthroap, Smaller Maleceptor)
    -3 Genehunters (New type of Warriors, Shock Troopers, made with Space Marine Geneseeds they literally eat.)


    Did this rumour appear before or after the video do we know?


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/26 09:38:56


    Post by: xttz


    Danny76 wrote:
    Looks like what we are calling a Screamer Killer is a Cerebrofex.

    Starter set rumours that seem to match this video:
    -1 Norn-Maleceptrix (Big brain bug, lesser incarnation of the Norn-Queen, able to 'evolve' units. Semi-feminine???)


    That rumour was from around a month ago and is very clearly proven wrong by the space marine content it lists, pretty much none of which are in the trailer:
    Spoiler:

    New Starter Box is called Leonitus Crusade

    SPACE MARINES
    -1 Primaris Chapter Master (Think Gravis but not haunched over, Power Sword, Bolt pistol)
    -1 Primaris Prosecutor (Two-handed axe)
    -1 Primaris Noviate Master (Scout Master, Sniper Rifle)
    -10 Primaris Space Marine Intervectors (Jump Pack Primaris, Bolter Gauntlets)
    -5 Primaris Noviates (Primaris Scouts, Hellblast Shotguns)
    -3 Primaris Arduanters (Primaris Terminators, Graviton Hammers, Shields, new type of Gravis Armor)
    -3 Primaris Instigators (Pimaris, Shoulder mounted Grav Cannons)


    These rumours are the best fit for official info:

    New video from Valrak about the 10th boxset

    - Terminators "huge thing" in the boxset, no info if Primaris or Firstborn
    - Terminator Chaptain and Terminator Librarian
    - Bulky, more action poses
    - 'Incinerators' new flame squad, like Black Templar Pyreblaster
    - New Veteran Squad, "more ranged type"
    - New ranged only Dreadnought, lascannons and rockets, maybe "chonkier"
    - This one for range, Redemptor as middle ground and brutalis as melee version
    - No jump assault marines, will be coming but not in boxset, no idea when
    - Generic ultramarines paint scheme

    Valrak got more info on Tyranids in the 10th starter box - note that Valrak mixes general stuff with box-specific content:

    - 'Two to three new types of Gaunts' he does not know the name of
    - New Hormagaunts
    - Vemon Crawler type unit in the vein of a 'Brainbug'
    - New Screamer Killer Carnifex.
    - New Lictors
    - Winged Warrior; unclear if it's multiple or singular, so possibly the HQ opposite the captain
    - New Biovores
    - Plastic Spore Mines, have a 'chunkier' version
    - Norn Emissary beefed up Zoanthrope

    - After the box, Tyranids get 'a full range refresh'
    - New Genestealers later on, possibly in another boxed set, possibly Space Hulk or Space Hulk themed Kill Team box w/ new Terminators +


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/26 09:40:42


    Post by: Shadow Walker


    Danny76 wrote:
     Tastyfish wrote:
    Looks like there the new Genestealers are a lot closer to gaunts than they are now, with a gauntlike head and almost a sharkfin carapace.

    Looks like what we are calling a Screamer Killer is a Cerebrofex.

    Starter set rumours that seem to match this video:
    -1 Norn-Maleceptrix (Big brain bug, lesser incarnation of the Norn-Queen, able to 'evolve' units. Semi-feminine???)
    -1 Tyranid Primus (Big warrior, Two Devourers, Large sword, Claw-whip, boosts)
    -1 Lictor (New form of Lictor)
    -2 Magistraunt (Mix of Venomthropes and Pyrovore)
    -20 Genestealers (New kit, Options for Armored plates and Acid-claws)
    -1 Cerebrofex (Blend of Carnifex and Zoanthroap, Smaller Maleceptor)
    -3 Genehunters (New type of Warriors, Shock Troopers, made with Space Marine Geneseeds they literally eat.)


    Did this rumour appear before or after the video do we know?

    It was 02/09/2023 'The 4chan rumours' according to 10th rumours thread. Also it is obvious that SC is not a ''Cerebrofex'' from the list above.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/26 10:13:53


    Post by: Mad Doc Grotsnik


    Got some more screen grabs.

    Not the clearest I’ll happily admit, but the best I can do!




    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/26 10:20:56


    Post by: Matrindur


     xttz wrote:
    These rumours are the best fit for official info:

    New video from Valrak about the 10th boxset

    - Terminators "huge thing" in the boxset, no info if Primaris or Firstborn
    - Terminator Chaptain and Terminator Librarian
    - Bulky, more action poses
    - 'Incinerators' new flame squad, like Black Templar Pyreblaster
    - New Veteran Squad, "more ranged type"
    - New ranged only Dreadnought, lascannons and rockets, maybe "chonkier"
    - This one for range, Redemptor as middle ground and brutalis as melee version
    - No jump assault marines, will be coming but not in boxset, no idea when
    - Generic ultramarines paint scheme

    Valrak got more info on Tyranids in the 10th starter box - note that Valrak mixes general stuff with box-specific content:

    - 'Two to three new types of Gaunts' he does not know the name of
    - New Hormagaunts
    - Vemon Crawler type unit in the vein of a 'Brainbug'
    - New Screamer Killer Carnifex.
    - New Lictors
    - Winged Warrior; unclear if it's multiple or singular, so possibly the HQ opposite the captain
    - New Biovores
    - Plastic Spore Mines, have a 'chunkier' version
    - Norn Emissary beefed up Zoanthrope

    - After the box, Tyranids get 'a full range refresh'
    - New Genestealers later on, possibly in another boxed set, possibly Space Hulk or Space Hulk themed Kill Team box w/ new Terminators +

    Not just the best fit, its an exact fit to what we saw in the launch trailer

    Valrak should be doing new videos with more infos about this and future stuff this week so will be very interesting to see


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/26 10:38:32


    Post by: Tsagualsa


     Matrindur wrote:
     xttz wrote:
    These rumours are the best fit for official info:

    New video from Valrak about the 10th boxset

    - Terminators "huge thing" in the boxset, no info if Primaris or Firstborn
    - Terminator Chaptain and Terminator Librarian
    - Bulky, more action poses
    - 'Incinerators' new flame squad, like Black Templar Pyreblaster
    - New Veteran Squad, "more ranged type"
    - New ranged only Dreadnought, lascannons and rockets, maybe "chonkier"
    - This one for range, Redemptor as middle ground and brutalis as melee version
    - No jump assault marines, will be coming but not in boxset, no idea when
    - Generic ultramarines paint scheme

    Valrak got more info on Tyranids in the 10th starter box - note that Valrak mixes general stuff with box-specific content:

    - 'Two to three new types of Gaunts' he does not know the name of
    - New Hormagaunts
    - Vemon Crawler type unit in the vein of a 'Brainbug'
    - New Screamer Killer Carnifex.
    - New Lictors
    - Winged Warrior; unclear if it's multiple or singular, so possibly the HQ opposite the captain
    - New Biovores
    - Plastic Spore Mines, have a 'chunkier' version
    - Norn Emissary beefed up Zoanthrope

    - After the box, Tyranids get 'a full range refresh'
    - New Genestealers later on, possibly in another boxed set, possibly Space Hulk or Space Hulk themed Kill Team box w/ new Terminators +

    Not just the best fit, its an exact fit to what we saw in the launch trailer

    Valrak should be doing new videos with more infos about this and future stuff this week so will be very interesting to see


    The videos coming this week will be 'canned' material as Valrak is on holiday, so we probably won't get too much new/exciting stuff.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/26 11:03:34


    Post by: Acehilator


    The rumour that contained "Cerebrofex" and "Magistraunt" is fake, as are all the other ones with "Apex Swarmlord" and whatever.

    The only correct set of rumours is the one Valrak made public. The Tyranid Reddit indeed identified the third Gaunt variant, new Spore Mines will be part of the Biovore kit so that's happening too, the only unconfirmed thing is if there will be a new Mucolid Spore or not.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/26 13:22:51


    Post by: Shadow Walker


    Acehilator wrote:
    The Tyranid Reddit indeed identified the third Gaunt variant.

    Do you mean this one?

    [Thumb - newnid.jpg]


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/26 15:14:33


    Post by: Acehilator


    Yes, although while the sketch is nicely done, it's not fully correct. After rewatching the trailer in 0.25 speed, it's interesting to note that almost all melee gribbly action in the trailer was these guys, the only time a classic Hormagaunt is visible is when the video cuts to the planet for the first time, when the Marine pulls the blade out of the dying one.


    OG Hormagaunt (lower jaw with teeth, smooth skin on the lower jaw, armor plating all the way to the back of the skull, standard Tyranid eyes):





    New kid on the block (lower jaw with no teeth, skin across the side of the lower jaw split into two sections, only two armor plates on the front half of the skull, no eyes or very deep socket):




    Also short, stumpy tails and a totally different body carapace compared to the original. After the light touch they chose with the Termagant rework, I would be surprised if they went for a radical Hormagaunt redesign.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/26 15:32:53


    Post by: Shadow Walker


    Acehilator wrote:
    no eyes or very deep socket

    IMO it looks like the latter.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/27 09:09:47


    Post by: silverstu


    I looked at the video again- one of the lead charging gaunts has a big head crest- maybe a hive node? They definitely look more dog like- short and squat than hormagaunts - the bodies are more like stealers/hive guard. Interesting to see what the actual models will look like.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/27 11:35:55


    Post by: MajorWesJanson


    With a light touch on Termigants, GW could be free to make Hormagaunts more unique, to better differentiate the two units visually.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/27 11:40:57


    Post by: Mad Doc Grotsnik


    On the potential for redesigned Hormagaunts? The current design are used for the Space Marine 2 trailer.




    Now. This is not proof as such. But my argument is that GW is normally super strict about how things are portrayed in other media. This is to ensure a cohesive visual language across different portrayals.

    Big Assumption Here of course is that the studio behind SM2 haven’t seen the new ones and their demos and trailers are just using the old look as a place holder.

    But otherwise, I don’t think Hormies are changing significantly.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/27 11:45:01


    Post by: Tsagualsa


     Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
    On the potential for redesigned Hormagaunts? The current design are used for the Space Marine 2 trailer.

    Spoiler:



    Now. This is not proof as such. But my argument is that GW is normally super strict about how things are portrayed in other media. This is to ensure a cohesive visual language across different portrayals.

    Big Assumption Here of course is that the studio behind SM2 haven’t seen the new ones and their demos and trailers are just using the old look as a place holder.

    But otherwise, I don’t think Hormies are changing significantly.


    I think it's both, in a way: we may get 'old-style' hormagaunts as a variant of the new termagants, and the 'blind gaunts' that look more like a mini-fex as a new kit with another additional variant. Tradgaunts as light infantry and skirmishers, Newgaunts as heavier infantry but still weaker than stealers, or in another niche. Make stealers rely more on infiltration and sneaking while the Newgaunts are cheap/sturdy enough to do wave tactics.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/27 12:19:43


    Post by: GaroRobe


    Since it’s Tyranids, any change amongst models could just be handwaved away as the hive fleet slightly evolving the design of the Xenos. Like during the events of SM2, the older forms of hormaguants still existed and then when the latest hive fleets arrived in 10th edition, the designs were tweaked to make them even more deadly


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/30 03:42:42


    Post by: Grzzldgamerps5


    Planning to get back into 40k. Last I played was 7th at the start. Played 40k since it was born though.

    Anyway, planning on tyranids. All close combat. Just a swarm of teeth and claws!

    What’s the most models one could have in a 2k list? 200? 300? 400?


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/30 09:17:38


    Post by: Shadow Walker


    Grzzldgamerps5 wrote:
    Planning to get back into 40k. Last I played was 7th at the start. Played 40k since it was born though.

    Anyway, planning on tyranids. All close combat. Just a swarm of teeth and claws!

    What’s the most models one could have in a 2k list? 200? 300? 400?

    Better wait for the 10th because all the points values will be made irrelevant, just like any lists, and also there will be plenty of new models, including new ones for Troops like Hormas/Termas etc.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/30 10:09:29


    Post by: Aash



    Automatically Appended Next Post:
    Grzzldgamerps5 wrote:
    Planning to get back into 40k. Last I played was 7th at the start. Played 40k since it was born though.

    Anyway, planning on tyranids. All close combat. Just a swarm of teeth and claws!

    What’s the most models one could have in a 2k list? 200? 300? 400?


    The 2023 points are available free on the Warhammer Community site:
    https://www.warhammer-community.com/downloads/#warhammer-40000

    Here’s the pdf:

    https://www.warhammer-community.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/01/GQO2sMiMAgmdzDng.pdf

    A quick look puts termagants at 7pts per model and hormagaunts and gargoyles at 8pts per model before upgrades for the cheap troops options. Warriors start at 30pts per model.
    The cheapest HQ is the Tyranid Prime at 85pts

    Assuming you want to max out the number of models, the Arks of Omen detachment lets you take up to 9 troops units, so 9 units of 30 termagants at 7pts each is 1890pts, a Tyranid Prime HQ at 85 pts is 1975pts, leaving 25 pts for upgrades possibly.

    So it looks like the maximum models in a 2000pt tyranid army is probably 271, unless I’m missing something.
    I doubt it would be a very effective force though.

    As others have said, this might all change in 3 months when 10th Ed launches.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/30 11:14:32


    Post by: tneva82


    Aash wrote:


    Assuming you want to max out the number of models, the Arks of Omen detachment lets you take up to 9 troops units, so 9 units of 30 termagants at 7pts each is 1890pts, a Tyranid Prime HQ at 85 pts is 1975pts, leaving 25 pts for upgrades possibly.


    IF you want max out take the 3 compulsory and 9 optional for troops=12 troop slots.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/30 16:36:41


    Post by: NinthMusketeer


    Tyranids could use more 'small' bugs, I hope it is a new kit alongside hormies.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/30 16:41:02


    Post by: Kanluwen


     NinthMusketeer wrote:
    Tyranids could use more 'small' bugs, I hope it is a new kit alongside hormies.

    I mentioned this before elsewhere, but there's new genus catalogued/hinted at in the Octarius campaign book. Roughly Gaunt sized but with more 'specialized' mutations, ala single eyes.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/31 15:17:45


    Post by: xttz




     Kanluwen wrote:
     NinthMusketeer wrote:
    Tyranids could use more 'small' bugs, I hope it is a new kit alongside hormies.

    I mentioned this before elsewhere, but there's new genus catalogued/hinted at in the Octarius campaign book. Roughly Gaunt sized but with more 'specialized' mutations, ala single eyes.


    Octarius dropped hints for at least two new guant types, "tri-claws" and "cyclopeans".

    I saw a discussion on the 10e trailer the other day and someone pointed out that there are new style gaunts with crab-style claws seem to be more grot-sized than hormagaunt-sized. That would be an interesting new angle.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/31 15:19:56


    Post by: NAVARRO


    That quality of painting per troop means in 10 years time you will have a squad of them finished


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/31 15:20:46


    Post by: Dudeface


    Oh look they seem to be running bipedally.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/31 15:26:43


    Post by: H.B.M.C.


    This is new artwork. Sorry if it's been posted already:




    There's a few of the big Norn Things floating around there, which alleviates my concern that it would be a Silent King-style character. The mini will probably still cost as much as the Silent King, but y'know...



    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/31 15:31:49


    Post by: Matrindur


    Spoiler:

    Really like the bottom one but way too much work just for a termagant


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/31 15:40:56


    Post by: GaroRobe


    Those redacted fleet colors are very cool. I was kind of hoping they'd have a "new" Hive Fleet introduced in the box set. Kraken is very iconic, but the new color schemes for the Tau (Vio'ra/white) and Necron (bronze) really made the ranges pop. Plus, I feel like if there's a massive tyranid invasion about to go down, I would have thought they'd have introduced a fourth major hive fleet that rivals kraken, behemoth, etc.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/31 15:41:35


    Post by: Mentlegen324


     Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
    On the potential for redesigned Hormagaunts? The current design are used for the Space Marine 2 trailer.




    Now. This is not proof as such. But my argument is that GW is normally super strict about how things are portrayed in other media. This is to ensure a cohesive visual language across different portrayals.

    Big Assumption Here of course is that the studio behind SM2 haven’t seen the new ones and their demos and trailers are just using the old look as a place holder.

    But otherwise, I don’t think Hormies are changing significantly.


    It's odd how they don't have the new design for the Cadian Guardsmen either, yet they have the new Jet Pack Dante has.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/31 16:14:21


    Post by: Kanluwen


    I didn't see a Cadian Gate badge on them, nor the Astra Militarum winged skull or the Whiteshield Stripe.

    Might just be "generic PDF/Guardsmen" designs now.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/31 16:29:40


    Post by: Tyran


    Also while the video is mostly a rehash of known Tyranid war lore, it does confirm that the Cordon Impenetra failed.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/31 16:32:52


    Post by: Shakalooloo


    Wonder if we'll finally get a Kryptmann model out of all this. He's been mentioned in the lore for at least 30 years now, hasn't he?


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/03/31 18:12:00


    Post by: Old-Four-Arms


     Shakalooloo wrote:
    Wonder if we'll finally get a Kryptmann model out of all this. He's been mentioned in the lore for at least 30 years now, hasn't he?


    First popped up in a WD short story IIRC. If we were to get a Kryptmann mini, they should absolutely include a Grabber-Slasher as well.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/01 05:51:02


    Post by: drbored


     H.B.M.C. wrote:
    This is new artwork. Sorry if it's been posted already:




    There's a few of the big Norn Things floating around there, which alleviates my concern that it would be a Silent King-style character. The mini will probably still cost as much as the Silent King, but y'know...



    Definitely an interesting piece.

    Lotta emphasis on the white helmeted veterans.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/01 06:18:48


    Post by: Zenithfleet


    Just chiming in to say I'm overjoyed that we may get a Carnifex (i.e. Screamer-Killer) that actually looks like a Carnifex again.

    Yes, I'm one of the six or seven Tyranid fans in the world who doesn't much like the plastic 4th ed kit. It's a great model on its own merits, and was impressive when it came out, but it doesn't look like a proper Carnifex. Wrong silhouette. I even prefer the 3rd ed grinfex over it, weirdly enough. (The grinfex looks fine if you give it four of the really big plastic claws, and maybe leave off the mandibles so its face is more shark-like.)

    But then I prefer the 'whole planetary ecosystem coming to kill you' Chtorran aesthetic of the earlier Tyranid ranges to the 'hundred breeds of alien dog' style from 4th ed onward.

    Old-Four-Arms wrote:
     Shakalooloo wrote:
    Wonder if we'll finally get a Kryptmann model out of all this. He's been mentioned in the lore for at least 30 years now, hasn't he?


    First popped up in a WD short story IIRC. If we were to get a Kryptmann mini, they should absolutely include a Grabber-Slasher as well.


    I won't be happy until there's a Fleshstealer, Razorwing brood and Protoid.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/01 06:54:25


    Post by: Shakalooloo


    Zenithfleet wrote:
    Yes, I'm one of the six or seven Tyranid fans in the world who doesn't much like the plastic 4th ed kit. It's a great model on its own merits, and was impressive when it came out, but it doesn't look like a proper Carnifex. Wrong silhouette. I even prefer the 3rd ed grinfex over it, weirdly enough. (The grinfex looks fine if you give it four of the really big plastic claws, and maybe leave off the mandibles so its face is more shark-like.)

    But then I prefer the 'whole planetary ecosystem coming to kill you' Chtorran aesthetic of the earlier Tyranid ranges to the 'hundred breeds of alien dog' style from 4th ed onward.


    You're not alone. I liked the Tyrnaids better when they were more distinctive, with the angry Screamer-Killer, the 'look at my innards' Warriors, and the Lictor being the only one with scything talons.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/01 07:44:49


    Post by: GiToRaZor


     NAVARRO wrote:
    That quality of painting per troop means in 10 years time you will have a squad of them finished


    My brain is shutting down at the thought that someone actually painted this and will pretend that this was done in photoshop.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/01 07:54:14


    Post by: Olthannon


     Matrindur wrote:
    Spoiler:

    Really like the bottom one but way too much work just for a termagant


    It says Hive Fleet unknown for the top left but I figure it looks pretty close to the Hive Fleet Tiamet colours.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/01 08:13:50


    Post by: Strg Alt


     xttz wrote:


     Kanluwen wrote:
     NinthMusketeer wrote:
    Tyranids could use more 'small' bugs, I hope it is a new kit alongside hormies.

    I mentioned this before elsewhere, but there's new genus catalogued/hinted at in the Octarius campaign book. Roughly Gaunt sized but with more 'specialized' mutations, ala single eyes.


    Octarius dropped hints for at least two new guant types, "tri-claws" and "cyclopeans".

    I saw a discussion on the 10e trailer the other day and someone pointed out that there are new style gaunts with crab-style claws seem to be more grot-sized than hormagaunt-sized. That would be an interesting new angle.


    Hmm...strange that GW doesn´t acknowledge the vintage Hive Fleet with a purple/blue paint scheme. That´s by the way also the choice of colours for my collection of aliens.

    Link:
    https://ibb.co/album/zQ78KH


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/01 08:48:23


    Post by: Dudeface


    Not sure of the context or validity of this but was interesting to see, just also can't see where it was removed from B&C.

    https://www.reddit.com/r/Tyranids/comments/128g14k/i_managed_to_screenshot_the_leak_from_bc_before/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=android_app&utm_name=androidcss&utm_term=3&utm_content=share_button


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/01 08:50:42


    Post by: Tsagualsa




    I guess it's related to the date.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/01 08:52:45


    Post by: Dudeface


    Tsagualsa wrote:


    I guess it's related to the date.


    Oh ffs, I'd not even realised what day it was.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/01 08:56:23


    Post by: H.B.M.C.


    It would almost pass muster if not for the date.

    "... can destroy Vassal Spores to re-roll psychic tests..."

    'Cept 10th doesn't have psychic tests.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/01 08:56:52


    Post by: Shadow Walker


    At first it was genuine but the Ceravex part was rather weird, and then...yeah the Date


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/01 09:02:49


    Post by: Tsagualsa


     H.B.M.C. wrote:
    It would almost pass muster if not for the date.

    "... can destroy Vassal Spores to re-roll psychic tests..."

    'Cept 10th doesn't have psychic tests.


    Also 'Ceravex' is a protected trademark for a supplier of CNC grinding machine tools, which is probably a bit too close for comfort for GW legal.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/01 09:24:15


    Post by: Dudeface


     H.B.M.C. wrote:
    It would almost pass muster if not for the date.

    "... can destroy Vassal Spores to re-roll psychic tests..."

    'Cept 10th doesn't have psychic tests.


    We don't have a psychic phase, I didn't clock that psychic tests were gone however?


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/01 09:30:32


    Post by: tneva82


    Yea. Psychic powers with test without phase been a thing so just because phase goes doesn't mean test must go as well


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/02 10:21:39


    Post by: silverstu




    Dunno- sounds plausible - the weird assault gaunts from the video could be paragaunts.
    The big walker beast in the image circled could be the ceravex ? Massive, big gun looks like tentacles at the front.


    [Thumb - 51F05A3E-CB7F-4FB2-9DFC-61F735788361_1_201_a.jpeg]


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/02 10:32:38


    Post by: xttz


     silverstu wrote:


    Dunno- sounds plausible - the weird assault gaunts from the video could be paragaunts.
    The big walker beast in the image circled could be the ceravex ? Massive, big gun looks like tentacles at the front.


    Worth pointing out that the name 'Magistraunt' was used 2 months ago in a long set of rumours from 4chan:

    New Starter Box is called Leonitus Crusade

    SPACE MARINES
    -1 Primaris Chapter Master (Think Gravis but not haunched over, Power Sword, Bolt pistol)
    -1 Primaris Prosecutor (Two-handed axe)
    -1 Primaris Noviate Master (Scout Master, Sniper Rifle)
    -10 Primaris Space Marine Intervectors (Jump Pack Primaris, Bolter Gauntlets)
    -5 Primaris Noviates (Primaris Scouts, Hellblast Shotguns)
    -3 Primaris Arduanters (Primaris Terminators, Graviton Hammers, Shields, new type of Gravis Armor)
    -3 Primaris Instigators (Pimaris, Shoulder mounted Grav Cannons)

    TYRANIDS
    -1 Norn-Maleceptrix (Big brain bug, lesser incarnation of the Norn-Queen, able to 'evolve' units. Semi-feminine???)
    -1 Tyranid Primus (Big warrior, Two Devourers, Large sword, Claw-whip, boosts)
    -1 Lictor (New form of Lictor)
    -2 Magistraunt (Mix of Venomthropes and Pyrovore)
    -20 Genestealers (New kit, Options for Armored plates and Acid-claws)
    -1 Cerebrofex (Blend of Carnifex and Zoanthroap, Smaller Maleceptor)
    -3 Genehunters (New type of Warriors, Shock Troopers, made with Space Marine Geneseeds they literally eat.)


    How many of those units did we see in the trailer video?


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/02 12:03:12


    Post by: silverstu


    its probably just a harpy flying low


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/02 13:46:56


    Post by: Platuan4th


    Dudeface wrote:
     H.B.M.C. wrote:
    It would almost pass muster if not for the date.

    "... can destroy Vassal Spores to re-roll psychic tests..."

    'Cept 10th doesn't have psychic tests.


    We don't have a psychic phase, I didn't clock that psychic tests were gone however?


    With the mention of stuff like "psychic weapons", the impression I got was it's going to a Heresy-like system where you only test if the power specifically tells you to test.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/02 20:29:15


    Post by: Grzzldgamerps5


    Good stills of lictor from viddo

    [Thumb - 1E758C85-853C-434F-8CF3-529DCADFB717.jpeg]
    [Thumb - 43A88CB6-701A-42B1-A546-743877A431AA.jpeg]
    [Thumb - B4C2C9CD-90B8-46DB-8537-160F8D743DD7.jpeg]
    [Thumb - 7E1D91ED-6C76-47CA-877C-FAB0CEE46EF0.jpeg]
    [Thumb - 2AC68745-A13F-4EEE-BC55-60EDE7B0406F.jpeg]


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/02 21:07:59


    Post by: No_Marines_Here


    So I think Nids in 10th may be my opportunity to finally have a proper go at 40k. With my painting speed, I'd love to get a head start. Has anybody seen a list of models that we are confident will not get an update?


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/02 21:15:35


    Post by: Acehilator


    Raveners
    Zoans/Venoms
    Harpy/Hive Crone
    Tyrannocyte/Sporocyst
    all "regular" big monsters

    Question marks on the Carnifex (unclear if the new Screamer-Killer is standalone or not), and Warriors (double kit with Shrikes is possible).

    All the small stuff will get updates. Will probably take a few months, though.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/02 21:16:22


    Post by: Kanluwen


    I would expect Shrikes to be their own kit, to be honest.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/02 21:33:46


    Post by: No_Marines_Here


    Acehilator wrote:
    Raveners
    Zoans/Venoms
    Harpy/Hive Crone
    Tyrannocyte/Sporocyst
    all "regular" big monsters

    Question marks on the Carnifex (unclear if the new Screamer-Killer is standalone or not), and Warriors (double kit with Shrikes is possible).

    All the small stuff will get updates. Will probably take a few months, though.


    Plenty to love there, thank you. Time to begin hunting ebay methinks!


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/02 21:45:55


    Post by: Mr_Rose


    Would be happy to have shrikes back. My conversions could stop collecting dust then.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/03 02:02:54


    Post by: modelhunter


    Just as a side. Given the video release, does anyone have view on what terrain will be thrown into the Starter Boxset? Outdoors, jungle setting?


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/03 02:52:36


    Post by: MajorWesJanson


    IIRC, indomitable didn't have terrain, or did recruit or elite starters. Just the command starter.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/03 04:18:16


    Post by: H.B.M.C.


    I wish it had terrain... Tyranid-infested terrain would be magical.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/03 04:49:54


    Post by: MajorWesJanson


     H.B.M.C. wrote:
    I wish it had terrain... Tyranid-infested terrain would be magical.


    Command edition starter with the same snapfit buildings and pipes as the 9th ed version except overgrown with nid tendrils and cysts would be pretty cool.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/03 05:45:46


    Post by: Snrub


     MajorWesJanson wrote:
     H.B.M.C. wrote:
    I wish it had terrain... Tyranid-infested terrain would be magical.


    Command edition starter with the same snapfit buildings and pipes as the 9th ed version except overgrown with nid tendrils and cysts would be pretty cool.
    I've got a Battle for Macragge project bubbling away in the back of my mind, so some infested terrain styled around late game Caldaris from Dawn of War II would be awesome.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/03 08:11:19


    Post by: Shadow Walker


     Kanluwen wrote:
    I would expect Shrikes to be their own kit, to be honest.

    I still hope for a dual Shrikes/Raveners kit.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/03 10:04:10


    Post by: silverstu


    No_Marines_Here wrote:
    Acehilator wrote:
    Raveners
    Zoans/Venoms
    Harpy/Hive Crone
    Tyrannocyte/Sporocyst
    all "regular" big monsters

    Question marks on the Carnifex (unclear if the new Screamer-Killer is standalone or not), and Warriors (double kit with Shrikes is possible).

    All the small stuff will get updates. Will probably take a few months, though.


    Plenty to love there, thank you. Time to begin hunting ebay methinks!



    Gargoyles will probably be fine as well and warriors had an update to their paint scheme in recent promo shots so I'd say they are ok too. Haruspex and Tervigon are pretty safe too.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/03 11:07:22


    Post by: Dudeface


     silverstu wrote:
    No_Marines_Here wrote:
    Acehilator wrote:
    Raveners
    Zoans/Venoms
    Harpy/Hive Crone
    Tyrannocyte/Sporocyst
    all "regular" big monsters

    Question marks on the Carnifex (unclear if the new Screamer-Killer is standalone or not), and Warriors (double kit with Shrikes is possible).

    All the small stuff will get updates. Will probably take a few months, though.


    Plenty to love there, thank you. Time to begin hunting ebay methinks!



    Gargoyles will probably be fine as well and warriors had an update to their paint scheme in recent promo shots so I'd say they are ok too. Haruspex and Tervigon are pretty safe too.


    Question mark on the tyrant, some other rumours (likely fake at this point) had the swarmlord as a bigger knight sized centrepiece, but I can't see them re-doing the tyrant again, it's a very good kit.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/03 11:15:57


    Post by: Overread


    Dudeface wrote:
     silverstu wrote:
    No_Marines_Here wrote:
    Acehilator wrote:
    Raveners
    Zoans/Venoms
    Harpy/Hive Crone
    Tyrannocyte/Sporocyst
    all "regular" big monsters

    Question marks on the Carnifex (unclear if the new Screamer-Killer is standalone or not), and Warriors (double kit with Shrikes is possible).

    All the small stuff will get updates. Will probably take a few months, though.


    Plenty to love there, thank you. Time to begin hunting ebay methinks!



    Gargoyles will probably be fine as well and warriors had an update to their paint scheme in recent promo shots so I'd say they are ok too. Haruspex and Tervigon are pretty safe too.


    Question mark on the tyrant, some other rumours (likely fake at this point) had the swarmlord as a bigger knight sized centrepiece, but I can't see them re-doing the tyrant again, it's a very good kit.


    Well we already know that GW are taking the screamer killer build for the Carnifex and making it into its own kit (unless they are doing a total revamp of the carnifex kit itself).

    So GW could well take the Swarmlord out of the Hive Tyrant kit and simply give the Tyrant and option to take swords. Perhaps even calling them something like Swarm Knights or such to denote that they are lesser copies of the Swarmlord itself. Then give the Swarmlord its own much larger model.


    Personally I kind of hope they don't do that; I'd rather see GW sink resources into a new much larger model that's unique and fresh if they are going to go that way. Of course a reworked hero model is a good way to add more models and more range diversity without bloating the rules side of things


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/03 15:56:05


    Post by: Acehilator


    The Apex Swarmlord or whatever it was called was from one of the bogus leaks. That's not happening.

    But I forgot Gargoyles. The only small gribbly that will stay. Still wondering about the Hormagaunt/new Gaunt situation. And wondering if Termagants will share the fate of Ork Boyz. New models, terrible rules.



    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/03 15:59:24


    Post by: Matrindur


    Nothing to see here


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/03 16:02:52


    Post by: Tsagualsa


    It's not new, it has been used in promo material since the new website went online.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/03 19:43:06


    Post by: morganfreeman


    Acehilator wrote:
    The Apex Swarmlord or whatever it was called was from one of the bogus leaks. That's not happening.

    But I forgot Gargoyles. The only small gribbly that will stay. Still wondering about the Hormagaunt/new Gaunt situation. And wondering if Termagants will share the fate of Ork Boyz. New models, terrible rules.



    Boyz were in the unenviable position of being the cornerstone of most competitive ork lists for several editions (primarily via skew and stratagem support, but still) which earned them a thrashing to ensure GW could move other ork product; especially with boys +1 on the way.

    AFAIK nids haven’t wanted to run swarms or termies since 5th, maybe 6th edition. So it stands to reason that GW will swing the pendulum back for an edition or two to encourage lots of sales of the new kit. They’ll probably fall out of favor around the same time GW swings back into encouraging boyz blobs for ork players.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/03 21:35:18


    Post by: Acehilator


    They didn't have to move other Ork product when the new Boyz were the product GW wanted to move. Same with Beastsnagga Boyz, the Beastsnagga foot boss, or the buggies when those were release in the prior wave.

    On second thought, maybe Gants will still work. Damage output of Devourers vs MEQ is still the same (compared to current Fleshborers) vs MEQ, and better vs GEQ. And with three enhancements you can put WL trait + relic on the Tervigon and still have one support pick open. Just wondering if Maw-Claws and Heightened Senses (or something comparable) will be present in the new Codex.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/04 13:20:32


    Post by: Shadow Walker


    So yesterday we had new Primaris LT, maybe today they will show us new Shrike?


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/04 13:55:07


    Post by: Matrindur


     Shadow Walker wrote:
    So yesterday we had new Primaris LT, maybe today they will show us new Shrike?

    I wouldn't expect another reveal this week since they only talked about a single new mini in the Sunday article. Maybe the rest of the Termagants since we already saw a few so they aren't really "new" anymore?


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/04 13:58:47


    Post by: Shadow Walker


     Matrindur wrote:
     Shadow Walker wrote:
    So yesterday we had new Primaris LT, maybe today they will show us new Shrike?

    Maybe the rest of the Termagants since we already saw a few so they aren't really "new" anymore?

    If that would mean new Rippers shown then I am all for it


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/04 15:14:52


    Post by: NAVARRO


     Shadow Walker wrote:
    So yesterday we had new Primaris LT, maybe today they will show us new Shrike?


    Terminators


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/04 15:19:26


    Post by: Shadow Walker


     NAVARRO wrote:
     Shadow Walker wrote:
    So yesterday we had new Primaris LT, maybe today they will show us new Shrike?


    Terminators

    And tomorrow more of stats/rules etc. :( .....unless they will use Tyranids as examples this time instead of SM (yeah, I know)?


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/04 15:38:20


    Post by: Asmodai


     Shadow Walker wrote:
     NAVARRO wrote:
     Shadow Walker wrote:
    So yesterday we had new Primaris LT, maybe today they will show us new Shrike?


    Terminators

    And tomorrow more of stats/rules etc. :( .....unless they will use Tyranids as examples this time instead of SM (yeah, I know)?


    Tomorrow is Oath of Moment - but they could do two previews in one day again.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/04 15:42:17


    Post by: Shadow Walker


     Asmodai wrote:
     Shadow Walker wrote:
     NAVARRO wrote:
     Shadow Walker wrote:
    So yesterday we had new Primaris LT, maybe today they will show us new Shrike?


    Terminators

    And tomorrow more of stats/rules etc. :( .....unless they will use Tyranids as examples this time instead of SM (yeah, I know)?


    Tomorrow is Oath of Moment - but they could do two previews in one day again.

    At least Thursday will not be dissapointing for Nids being reserved for HH


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/05 11:10:41


    Post by: NAVARRO


    Since I just rebased some old Gaunts convos that I had into Necromunda zone mortalis 25mm bases I wonder how many will actually rebase their swarms if the official bases for Gaunts turn out to be 28.5mm like the pics seem to suggest.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/05 11:37:54


    Post by: Platuan4th


    Not me. Rebasing 300+ models just for an extra 3.5mm of base isn't worth the work, especially when Hornagaunts want to break off their bases as easily as they do already.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/05 11:41:17


    Post by: Tsagualsa


     Platuan4th wrote:
    Not me. Rebasing 300+ models just for an extra 3.5mm of base isn't worth the work, especially when Hornagaunts want to break off their bases as easily as they do already.


    Yeah, rebasing a dozen Marines or whatever when the change is actually relevant is one thing, but a 100+ swarm models in an template-less edition where the base footprint rarely matters is just an unreasonable ask... just don't be a dick about min-maxing the last fraction of an inch for unit coherency or squeezing the absolute last model in for CC attacks, and you should be good.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/05 11:47:14


    Post by: Geifer


    I don't think Termagants get new bases. The picture from the latest Warhammer Community looks like 40mm bases for Terminators and 25mm bases for Termagants remain the default.



    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/05 11:49:02


    Post by: Overread


    Honestly the only Tyranids that should get new bases are Genstealers - its not even like you can stand them base to base anyway unless they are facing backwards


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/05 11:49:05


    Post by: Nevelon


    I never bothered to rebase my terminators, and that was a much more relevant size change.

    Base size is mostly a wash on pros/cons. And a slight bump in size is not worth the effort.

    I’ll put the new guys on the new bases, but am unlikely to change my old ones.

    I don’t play in tournaments, so not a big deal for the one spot people might be fussy about it.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/05 11:52:48


    Post by: NAVARRO


     Geifer wrote:
    I don't think Termagants get new bases. The picture from the latest Warhammer Community looks like 40mm bases for Terminators and 25mm bases for Termagants remain the default.


    Those look like slightly wider than 25mms to me, but for better comparison check out the pic with old VS new VS SM pic on this link.
    https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/03/23/warhammer-preview-online-adepticon-the-hive-mind-evolves-the-horde/


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/05 12:47:29


    Post by: Geifer


    Hmm, yeah. The gaunt in that picture is definitely on a 28mm base. I hope that doesn't mean Terminators will be on 50mm bases after the embiggening.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/05 12:51:21


    Post by: Overread


    GW "we've introduced a new base for gaunts - the 26.5mm base - which when you measure it is actually 27mm "

    Is the kind of thing we could expect. I do hate tiny base size increases because it 100% feels just like they are doing it for the sake of it and yes it messes with the game balance a bit but really its not a game changer. Some base sizes make sense, some feel utterly random


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/05 12:54:06


    Post by: NAVARRO


     Geifer wrote:
    Hmm, yeah. The gaunt in that picture is definitely on a 28mm base. I hope that doesn't mean Terminators will be on 50mm bases after the embiggening.


    Not sure, but now that you mention termis bases I just noticed the Terminator with that rock base, I hope thats not moulded with the feet.
    I really dislike the trend to add more bases sizes in intermediate sizes. Gets to a point you need to check the website for official sizes.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/05 13:08:39


    Post by: MajorWesJanson


    The rock base probably is molded, but these 5 terminators are probably the ETB starter versions, with a full kit coming out later, like assault intercessors.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/05 13:48:56


    Post by: Geifer


    Yeah, not a fan of tactical rocks, but duplicates standing on the exact same rock is less of an issue with starter set models you'll likely only buy once.

     NAVARRO wrote:
     Geifer wrote:
    Hmm, yeah. The gaunt in that picture is definitely on a 28mm base. I hope that doesn't mean Terminators will be on 50mm bases after the embiggening.


    Not sure, but now that you mention termis bases I just noticed the Terminator with that rock base, I hope thats not moulded with the feet.
    I really dislike the trend to add more bases sizes in intermediate sizes. Gets to a point you need to check the website for official sizes.


    Shame the Marine isn't painted in Scythes of the Emperor colors. We could joke how it's the Giant's Coffin and scale creep on Marines has become completely ridiculous.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/05 14:07:48


    Post by: Platuan4th


     MajorWesJanson wrote:
    The rock base probably is molded, but these 5 terminators are probably the ETB starter versions, with a full kit coming out later, like assault intercessors.


    It could be like the Captain in the 9th ed starter where it can be built with or without the various base elements.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/05 21:02:48


    Post by: NinthMusketeer


     Overread wrote:
    GW "we've introduced a new base for gaunts - the 26.5mm base - which when you measure it is actually 27mm "

    Is the kind of thing we could expect. I do hate tiny base size increases because it 100% feels just like they are doing it for the sake of it and yes it messes with the game balance a bit but really its not a game changer. Some base sizes make sense, some feel utterly random
    While I completely, 100% agree with the sentiment it is worth noting that even going from 25mm to 26mm IS significant, because it takes the base from less than an inch to more than an inch. Given the amount of 1" distances in the game* that are relevant it can potentially matter in a noteworthy way... as opposed to similar tiny changes which do nothing.

    *Admittedly more relevant in AoS where coherency is 1".


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/05 21:14:12


    Post by: Stevefamine


     Platuan4th wrote:
    Not me. Rebasing 300+ models just for an extra 3.5mm of base isn't worth the work, especially when Hornagaunts want to break off their bases as easily as they do already.


    I just finished painting the 100+ Gaunt mark... not going to rebase anything here. These should all be grandfathered in. Same with the Carnifex 60mm Round


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/07 14:09:47


    Post by: Shadow Walker


    From today's article: "For their army ability, the Tyranids can manipulate Battle-shock tests with Synapse and Shadow in the Warp – but we’ll find out what those do when we have a closer look at the Tyranid faction next month.'' Ugh, so we have a looong wait :(


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/07 14:37:05


    Post by: H.B.M.C.


    RIP Synaptic Link and Adaptive Physiologies (Apr 2022 - June 2023).

    Goodbye to the two best and most thematic rules Tyranids have ever received.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/07 14:45:42


    Post by: Shadow Walker


     H.B.M.C. wrote:
    RIP Synaptic Link and Adaptive Physiologies (Apr 2022 - June 2023).

    Goodbye to the two best and most thematic rules Tyranids have ever received.

    Could they be in some Detachment rules? Or Stratagems?


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/07 14:48:16


    Post by: H.B.M.C.


    Well Adaptive already is, but Synaptic Link should just be part of Synapse alongside Shadow in the Warp.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/07 14:54:47


    Post by: NAVARRO


    At this point in time do we think revealing a small part of the new rulesets without sharing the full content and new context is a errrr pointless exercise?


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/07 15:03:27


    Post by: Shadow Walker


    H.B.M.C. wrote:Well Adaptive already is, but Synaptic Link should just be part of Synapse alongside Shadow in the Warp.

    So we must wait until next month, unfortunately, to see what a Synapse actually is.

    NAVARRO wrote:At this point in time do we think revealing a small part of the new rulesets without sharing the full content and new context is a errrr pointless exercise?

    Yeah, you are probably right.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/07 15:22:49


    Post by: MajorWesJanson


     NAVARRO wrote:
    At this point in time do we think revealing a small part of the new rulesets without sharing the full content and new context is a errrr pointless exercise?


    We are talking about it, aren't we?


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/07 16:51:03


    Post by: Mad Doc Grotsnik


     Geifer wrote:
    I don't think Termagants get new bases. The picture from the latest Warhammer Community looks like 40mm bases for Terminators and 25mm bases for Termagants remain the default.



    Complete aside?

    But this pic pleases me in a certain way. Because the Terminators look like they’re perfectly capable of completely annihilating the Termagants, calmly and in a methodical manner, in just a single volley.



    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/08 06:41:34


    Post by: Mr_Rose


     Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
     Geifer wrote:
    I don't think Termagants get new bases. The picture from the latest Warhammer Community looks like 40mm bases for Terminators and 25mm bases for Termagants remain the default.



    Complete aside?

    But this pic pleases me in a certain way. Because the Terminators look like they’re perfectly capable of completely annihilating the Termagants, calmly and in a methodical manner, in just a single volley.


    Between Oath of Moment and Fury of the First pushing them to 2+ w/re-rolls to hit and 16+6 shots, they really should. But that might be a waste of the Oath if there’s almost anything else on the field. At all.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/08 09:01:53


    Post by: Dudeface


     Mr_Rose wrote:
     Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
     Geifer wrote:
    I don't think Termagants get new bases. The picture from the latest Warhammer Community looks like 40mm bases for Terminators and 25mm bases for Termagants remain the default.



    Complete aside?

    But this pic pleases me in a certain way. Because the Terminators look like they’re perfectly capable of completely annihilating the Termagants, calmly and in a methodical manner, in just a single volley.


    Between Oath of Moment and Fury of the First pushing them to 2+ w/re-rolls to hit and 16+6 shots, they really should. But that might be a waste of the Oath if there’s almost anything else on the field. At all.


    They actually don't without Oath though after some quick maffs.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/08 09:56:46


    Post by: Aash


    Dudeface wrote:
     Mr_Rose wrote:
     Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
     Geifer wrote:
    I don't think Termagants get new bases. The picture from the latest Warhammer Community looks like 40mm bases for Terminators and 25mm bases for Termagants remain the default.



    Complete aside?

    But this pic pleases me in a certain way. Because the Terminators look like they’re perfectly capable of completely annihilating the Termagants, calmly and in a methodical manner, in just a single volley.


    Between Oath of Moment and Fury of the First pushing them to 2+ w/re-rolls to hit and 16+6 shots, they really should. But that might be a waste of the Oath if there’s almost anything else on the field. At all.


    They actually don't without Oath though after some quick maffs.


    That's what I worked out too. Without knowing what "devastating Wounds" does for the Assault cannon, it looks like one round of shooting from the terminators will kill 7 termagants; with the OC rules, the three remaining Termagants can still hold an objective against the 5 terminators.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/08 10:13:45


    Post by: Geifer


    Actually sounds nice to me provided is a game wide drop in lethality and not a Terminator specific problem. That's the direction in which the game needs to move.

    Not that shooting matters here. At this point they're in punching distance.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/08 10:55:38


    Post by: punisher357


     MajorWesJanson wrote:
     NAVARRO wrote:
    At this point in time do we think revealing a small part of the new rulesets without sharing the full content and new context is a errrr pointless exercise?


    We are talking about it, aren't we?


    Exactly, GW did this deliberately. It's good marketing, in theory. If they released too much right now, before production is ready, people could burnout waiting. If they trickle small amounts of information, it reinvigorates people and piques interest. If the timing is too far off though, people will lose interest.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/08 22:04:05


    Post by: Grzzldgamerps5


    punisher357 wrote:
     MajorWesJanson wrote:
     NAVARRO wrote:
    At this point in time do we think revealing a small part of the new rulesets without sharing the full content and new context is a errrr pointless exercise?


    We are talking about it, aren't we?


    Exactly, GW did this deliberately. It's good marketing, in theory. If they released too much right now, before production is ready, people could burnout waiting. If they trickle small amounts of information, it reinvigorates people and piques interest. If the timing is too far off though, people will lose interest.


    At this rate of reveals for 10th, 11th edition will arrive before they finish with 10th sneak leaks & reveals.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/09 08:14:19


    Post by: Shakalooloo


    New 'nids does nothing for me but kindle the flame of hope that we'll finally get a Saint Praxedes model, fighting the hive fleets from within.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/09 08:41:36


    Post by: Dudeface


    Grzzldgamerps5 wrote:
    punisher357 wrote:
     MajorWesJanson wrote:
     NAVARRO wrote:
    At this point in time do we think revealing a small part of the new rulesets without sharing the full content and new context is a errrr pointless exercise?


    We are talking about it, aren't we?


    Exactly, GW did this deliberately. It's good marketing, in theory. If they released too much right now, before production is ready, people could burnout waiting. If they trickle small amounts of information, it reinvigorates people and piques interest. If the timing is too far off though, people will lose interest.


    At this rate of reveals for 10th, 11th edition will arrive before they finish with 10th sneak leaks & reveals.


    Even at 4 articles a week they had/have over 20 drops between adepticon and warhammerfest to cover some content in the launch box and some basic rules, since both will be revealed in full at the event. So not really? Pace seems OK to me and allows them to keep some stuff in the back pocket.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/09 09:12:28


    Post by: Tsagualsa


    Dudeface wrote:
    Grzzldgamerps5 wrote:
    punisher357 wrote:
     MajorWesJanson wrote:
     NAVARRO wrote:
    At this point in time do we think revealing a small part of the new rulesets without sharing the full content and new context is a errrr pointless exercise?


    We are talking about it, aren't we?


    Exactly, GW did this deliberately. It's good marketing, in theory. If they released too much right now, before production is ready, people could burnout waiting. If they trickle small amounts of information, it reinvigorates people and piques interest. If the timing is too far off though, people will lose interest.


    At this rate of reveals for 10th, 11th edition will arrive before they finish with 10th sneak leaks & reveals.


    Even at 4 articles a week they had/have over 20 drops between adepticon and warhammerfest to cover some content in the launch box and some basic rules, since both will be revealed in full at the event. So not really? Pace seems OK to me and allows them to keep some stuff in the back pocket.


    They're probably holding back on a lot of stuff because leaks have been kind of heavy this year, siloing the reveals is perhaps intended to reduce the severity of any given leak and to give them some backup stuff they can use to keep the hype going if any leaks should happen.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/09 10:06:29


    Post by: kestral


    I won't be buying any Termigants if they are bigger than the current ones, who are already too big. That said, they fix the worst issue from the present range... ...their tails are not ramrod straight.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/09 13:50:02


    Post by: Shadow Walker


     kestral wrote:
    I won't be buying any Termigants if they are bigger than the current ones, who are already too big.

    https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/03/23/warhammer-preview-online-adepticon-the-hive-mind-evolves-the-horde/ article said that they are bigger than older ones.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/09 14:21:16


    Post by: Overread


    I think its more that they are just a little taller in the hind leg with a back that crests rather than lays flat. If anything that comparison photo makes their heads look a little smaller. Same for guns and arms - but it could be a bit of photoshopping as it looks like two models grabbed and scaled on the base size instead of being photographed side by side.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/09 14:35:48


    Post by: Greenfield


     Overread wrote:
    I think its more that they are just a little taller in the hind leg with a back that crests rather than lays flat. If anything that comparison photo makes their heads look a little smaller. Same for guns and arms - but it could be a bit of photoshopping as it looks like two models grabbed and scaled on the base size instead of being photographed side by side.


    Yeah, I think 'bigger' can be a difficult comparison to make for miniatures made years or decades apart. Modern Citadel miniatures tend to be a lot finer, so parts like heads and hands often do shrink. A lot of miniatures are unambiguously taller than prior versions but that's also not clear cut with this kind of crouching or stooping pose. Those look like they'd fit in together okay to me, although I do think the base might be 28.5mm.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/09 14:50:13


    Post by: NAVARRO


    Greenfield wrote:
     Overread wrote:
    I think its more that they are just a little taller in the hind leg with a back that crests rather than lays flat. If anything that comparison photo makes their heads look a little smaller. Same for guns and arms - but it could be a bit of photoshopping as it looks like two models grabbed and scaled on the base size instead of being photographed side by side.


    Yeah, I think 'bigger' can be a difficult comparison to make for miniatures made years or decades apart. Modern Citadel miniatures tend to be a lot finer, so parts like heads and hands often do shrink. A lot of miniatures are unambiguously taller than prior versions but that's also not clear cut with this kind of crouching or stooping pose. Those look like they'd fit in together okay to me, although I do think the base might be 28.5mm.


    They look way to similar which is good for people that want to have more of them to go with their armies.
    Personally theres little in this update for people looking for something different.



    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/09 15:02:04


    Post by: Dryaktylus


    They look a bit taller, though their body is not as long as that of the current ones (and also crouched). I think they're fine and I'll get a box, but more probably for smaller games or Kill Team. For large broods I have enough of the 2nd edition models and the 1st edition Tyranids/Hunter-slayers.

     NAVARRO wrote:
    Greenfield wrote:
     Overread wrote:
    I think its more that they are just a little taller in the hind leg with a back that crests rather than lays flat. If anything that comparison photo makes their heads look a little smaller. Same for guns and arms - but it could be a bit of photoshopping as it looks like two models grabbed and scaled on the base size instead of being photographed side by side.


    Yeah, I think 'bigger' can be a difficult comparison to make for miniatures made years or decades apart. Modern Citadel miniatures tend to be a lot finer, so parts like heads and hands often do shrink. A lot of miniatures are unambiguously taller than prior versions but that's also not clear cut with this kind of crouching or stooping pose. Those look like they'd fit in together okay to me, although I do think the base might be 28.5mm.


    They look way to similar which is good for people that want to have more of them to go with their armies.
    Personally theres little in this update for people looking for something different.


    For me they look definitely a lot better. I stopped buying most new Tyranid models in 3rd edition, Termagants among them. The current models aren't really detailed and were too large for their stats - so I continued use my old ones. As a lot of other models today are larger than back then, the size is now more tolerable. But I'd only buy the new ones.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/09 15:02:55


    Post by: alextroy


    Dudeface wrote:
    Grzzldgamerps5 wrote:
    punisher357 wrote:
     MajorWesJanson wrote:
     NAVARRO wrote:
    At this point in time do we think revealing a small part of the new rulesets without sharing the full content and new context is a errrr pointless exercise?


    We are talking about it, aren't we?


    Exactly, GW did this deliberately. It's good marketing, in theory. If they released too much right now, before production is ready, people could burnout waiting. If they trickle small amounts of information, it reinvigorates people and piques interest. If the timing is too far off though, people will lose interest.


    At this rate of reveals for 10th, 11th edition will arrive before they finish with 10th sneak leaks & reveals.


    Even at 4 articles a week they had/have over 20 drops between adepticon and warhammerfest to cover some content in the launch box and some basic rules, since both will be revealed in full at the event. So not really? Pace seems OK to me and allows them to keep some stuff in the back pocket.
    I think they are doing basic rules change concepts on the lead up to Warhammer Fest, using examples from armies to illustrate. The core rules will become largely known at Warhammer Fest, so that is when they will pivot to talking about specific armies in the new edition.

    That being said, I expect the examples giving from now to Warhammer Fest to be Adeptus Astartes and Tyranid Faction only. As the New Edition Release Factions, I expect they will be the ones people can experience the #New40K at events playing. So their rules will also be largely known after Warhammer Fest. They can use them as examples leading up knowing everyone will know them soon enough.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/09 15:13:54


    Post by: Dysartes


     NAVARRO wrote:
    They look way to similar which is good for people that want to have more of them to go with their armies.
    Personally theres little in this update for people looking for something different.

    So the update is good for people who want Tyranid models, and not for those who, for some reason, want non-Tyranid models in the Tyranid faction?

    Well, that's a relief.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/09 15:33:40


    Post by: NAVARRO


     Dysartes wrote:
     NAVARRO wrote:
    They look way to similar which is good for people that want to have more of them to go with their armies.
    Personally theres little in this update for people looking for something different.

    So the update is good for people who want Tyranid models, and not for those who, for some reason, want non-Tyranid models in the Tyranid faction?

    Well, that's a relief.

    I think what I posted was pretty clear. Just in case you did not deliberately missed it.

    If you want more of the same your covered with this refresh... If you have plenty of Gaunts this update will not make you go out of your way to get more.
    Or do you think that collectors with hundreds of Gaunts would not jump in an hundred more if the models were different enough.

    Besides the idea if you dont do the exact same freaking model its not Nid anymore is mind-blowing shortsighted. But there you have it.


    Automatically Appended Next Post:
     Dryaktylus wrote:
    For large broods I have enough of the 2nd edition models and the 1st edition Tyranids/Hunter-slayers.

    For me they look definitely a lot better. I stopped buying most new Tyranid models in 3rd edition, Termagants among them. The current models aren't really detailed and were too large for their stats - so I continued use my old ones. As a lot of other models today are larger than back then, the size is now more tolerable. But I'd only buy the new ones.


    If I was new to Nids I would wait and get the new ones for sure in box sets, theres a technology gap in these minis.
    But since Im covered I will like yourself just cherry pick the new incoming stuff, potentially some new cool and more interesting models ahead.
    Im a bit worried with the Pictures on the video for the Lictor since they look not particularly inspiring...



    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/09 16:23:49


    Post by: Kanluwen


    Spoiler:

    We now have 3 unique "unidentified" Hive Fleets/Splinters comin'. Here's the third.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/09 16:40:55


    Post by: Grzzldgamerps5


     NAVARRO wrote:
     Dysartes wrote:
     NAVARRO wrote:
    They look way to similar which is good for people that want to have more of them to go with their armies.
    Personally theres little in this update for people looking for something different.

    So the update is good for people who want Tyranid models, and not for those who, for some reason, want non-Tyranid models in the Tyranid faction?

    Well, that's a relief.

    I think what I posted was pretty clear. Just in case you did not deliberately missed it.

    If you want more of the same your covered with this refresh... If you have plenty of Gaunts this update will not make you go out of your way to get more.
    Or do you think that collectors with hundreds of Gaunts would not jump in an hundred more if the models were different enough.

    Besides the idea if you dont do the exact same freaking model its not Nid anymore is mind-blowing shortsighted. But there you have it.


    Automatically Appended Next Post:
     Dryaktylus wrote:
    For large broods I have enough of the 2nd edition models and the 1st edition Tyranids/Hunter-slayers.

    For me they look definitely a lot better. I stopped buying most new Tyranid models in 3rd edition, Termagants among them. The current models aren't really detailed and were too large for their stats - so I continued use my old ones. As a lot of other models today are larger than back then, the size is now more tolerable. But I'd only buy the new ones.


    If I was new to Nids I would wait and get the new ones for sure in box sets, theres a technology gap in these minis.
    But since Im covered I will like yourself just cherry pick the new incoming stuff, potentially some new cool and more interesting models ahead.
    Im a bit worried with the Pictures on the video for the Lictor since they look not particularly inspiring...



    Even if some “old” kits don’t change, I’m waiting to buy it all together with the new stuff. Chances are I can mix and match bits between old & new!


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/09 16:41:19


    Post by: NAVARRO


    The painting level displayed by the Heavy metal team for nids is so much better now that the old schemes look almost like a new scheme.


    Automatically Appended Next Post:
    Grzzldgamerps5 wrote:


    Even if some “old” kits don’t change, I’m waiting to buy it all together with the new stuff. Chances are I can mix and match bits between old & new!


    I think some models will be inevitable in the sense that they will be widely available on most box sets.
    So for Gaunts I expect them to be on the 3 starter box sets and then a year or so after on the Hachette magazine. The question will be if they will ever release a more complete / complex individual multipart regiment box set for Gaunts.
    But the easy build Gaunt will be widely available and also probably cheap on eBay. Combat patrols, boarding patrols will have them too, making actualy hard not to get some by default.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/10 13:56:36


    Post by: Matrindur


    In a surprising twist what we saw in the trailer weren't Lictors but Von Ryan’s Leapers
    As ambush predators, they have much in common with Lictors, but rather than being lonewolves, these are pack-hunters.

    So these are basically lesser Lictors that hunt in groups?

    Spoiler:




    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/10 13:58:37


    Post by: Mad Doc Grotsnik


    Wibble!

    They look fun!


    Automatically Appended Next Post:
    And….I’m not sure these were mentioned in the “leaks”?


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/10 14:01:34


    Post by: Tsagualsa


     Matrindur wrote:

    So these are basically lesser Lictors that hunt in groups?


    Funny enough, they're more related to Hormagaunts as far as fluff goes, they've been represented on a single card of the old Sabretooth CCG more than a decade ago



    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/10 14:03:00


    Post by: H.B.M.C.


    This is what I was afraid of. New things instead of updated old things.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/10 14:03:49


    Post by: Shadow Walker


     H.B.M.C. wrote:
    This is what I was afraid of. New things instead of updated old things.

    It does not exclude the new Lictors incoming.


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/10 14:04:12


    Post by: Tsagualsa


     H.B.M.C. wrote:
    This is what I was afraid of. New things instead of updated old things.


    Some of the recent nid rumours mentioned a 'Viragon', which also appeared on a single Sabretooth CCG card, at that time being a Trygon variant...


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/10 14:05:25


    Post by: Shadow Walker


     Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:

    And….I’m not sure these were mentioned in the “leaks”?

    Some leaks told about CC warriors so it may be them mistaken?


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/10 14:06:43


    Post by: H.B.M.C.


     Shadow Walker wrote:
    It does not exclude the new Lictors incoming.
    Doesn't include the possibility either.

    I mean, we assume those things in the trailer were updated Biovores. What if they're not?


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/10 14:08:47


    Post by: Tsagualsa


     Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:

    And….I’m not sure these were mentioned in the “leaks”?


    Well, mistaking them for slightly smaller Lictors is a mistake i'd forgive people even if they were well-versed in tyranids

    That being said, with them looking and presumably working like lesser Lictors, i'll guess we get a Killteam out of them?


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/10 14:10:25


    Post by: Shadow Walker


     H.B.M.C. wrote:
     Shadow Walker wrote:
    It does not exclude the new Lictors incoming.
    Doesn't include the possibility either.

    I mean, we assume those things in the trailer were updated Biovores. What if they're not?

    You were also afraid that Termies are gone come with 3 man squads based on the video. I know that GW disappoints more often than not but hey, maybe this time Nids are gonna be on the safe side?


    New Nids for New Edition. Deathleaper pp45 @ 2023/04/10 14:20:07


    Post by: vipoid


     Matrindur wrote:
    In a surprising twist what we saw in the trailer weren't Lictors but Von Ryan’s Leapers
    As ambush predators, they have much in common with Lictors, but rather than being lonewolves, these are pack-hunters.
    Spoiler:

    So these are basically lesser Lictors that hunt in groups?

    [spoiler]

    [/spoiler]


    The mouths having both tentacles and mandibles really doesn't work for me.

    Also, is it me or are they a little chunky? Looks like the Hive Mind needs to exercise them a little more.

    That aside, my main concern is what niche they fill that isn't already filled by Lictors and such.