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I've read and watched a lot of sci-fi in my time and so like most fans of the genre you just sort of get used to the ridiculous psuedo-science that accompanies it. That being said though, the Tyranid Narvhal seen here:
http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Narvhal is how the Tyranid get around and seems especially absurd. It's some sort of space Narwal that can suck itself into a planets gravity-well from anywhere. Is this, in the Dakka's opinion, even remotely feasible even by the low standards of sci-fi psuedo-science techno babble?

Yep.

It's how the "carrier" bugs in Starship Troopers were theorized to have gotten around.

Whether it's possible or not I don't know but I do find it imposible to take it seriously. How does affecting a planets gravity cause solar flares?

I think having the name Narvhal doesn't really help.

They don't affect just the planets they're going to devour.

They harness the gravity of the actual system they're targeting.

Futzing with a star, period, is going to cause reaaaaaaaaally bad things. With gravity altered, it(theoretically) can't continue to compress the gases contained within, etc.

Actually, Artificial Gravity is probably just as unrealistic, but more necessary within the sci fi realm.

Assuming that technology is advanced enough to create artificial gravity, the propulsion system is actually quite feasible. you just need to create a large gravity well in front of your fleet and continue to move it forward iin order to conitously fall faster and faster towards the system.

Based on that, if you then add in the assumption that the amount of gravity is relatively fixed (such as a law of conservation of mass and energy) then you would need to pull the gravity from somewhere, namely the destination system would be easiest.

As far as the effects on the system, totally believable if the amount that gravity pulled was lessened throughout the entire system. The sun's and earth's cores are under extreme pressure which will push out rather catostophically if gavity is lessened, thus creating solar flares, volcanic eruptions, tsunamis, etc

Kanluwen wrote:Yep.

It's how the "carrier" bugs in Starship Troopers were theorized to have gotten around.

Really? I didn't know that. Guess that's where they got it from.


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tylermenz wrote:Actually, Artificial Gravity is probably just as unrealistic, but more necessary within the sci fi realm.

Assuming that technology is advanced enough to create artificial gravity, the propulsion system is actually quite feasible. you just need to create a large gravity well in front of your fleet and continue to move it forward iin order to conitously fall faster and faster towards the system.

Based on that, if you then add in the assumption that the amount of gravity is relatively fixed (such as a law of conservation of mass and energy) then you would need to pull the gravity from somewhere, namely the destination system would be easiest.

As far as the effects on the system, totally believable if the amount that gravity pulled was lessened throughout the entire system. The sun's and earth's cores are under extreme pressure which will push out rather catostophically if gavity is lessened, thus creating solar flares, volcanic eruptions, tsunamis, etc

Gravity isn't a resource to be stolen like air and water. It's a force of nature created by mass. And the Narvhal isn't taking but merely getting itself into the gravity well somehow.

Furthermore a person falling on earth has a terminal velocity of 195 kph. Don't know how a Narvhal's bigger mass effects that equation but were talking about 100 of kphs as opposed to the many times the speed of light that thing seems to be clocking.

KamikazeCanuck wrote:
Furthermore a person falling on earth has a terminal velocity of 195 kph. Don't know how a Narvhal's bigger mass effects that equation but were talking about 100 of kphs as opposed to the many times the speed of light that thing seems to be clocking.

There's no terminal velocity in space to speak of, so it could keep accelerating to within a fraction of the speed of light.

Silly though it is, it makes a ton more sense than trying to justify the discovery of warpspace by what is essentially a hyper-evolved, intergalactic anthill.

I'll never understand the fascination with the plausibility of pseudo-science from universes that openly promote friggin MAGIC (and demons, and space whales, and literal god-entities...)

Disastrous side effects are caused by this method of manipulating a system's gravity. The ensnared planets will often experience earthquakes, solar flares, tidal waves or other natural disasters in the period between a Narvhal harnessing the system's gravity and the Tyranid fleet actually arriving. For the Tyranids this is of course another weapon as the defenders will be busy and disorganised dealing with their own planet turning against them

Given all the natural disasters these past coupla years, I think its pretty safe to say one is on its way here as we speak.

Retribution wrote:...literal god-entities...)

I think the largest problem with the Narvhal is the whole ignoring relativity part. Ok, sure you can make fake gravity wells accelerate you at darn near the speed of light, but when you get there the sun will have died of old age. Also each one of the little particles in deep space in your way is not such a minor particle anymore.

Relativity is ignored because the ship compresses the space in front of it and then falls through the compressed space. It is using gravity to make the distance traveled shorter. I think this is similar to the way the warp drives from Star Trek function.

I thought that the Narval just pulled itself forward... I havent read my nid fluff in a while but I remember thinking that it was a stupid slow way to get around.

Anavrin wrote:

KamikazeCanuck wrote:
Furthermore a person falling on earth has a terminal velocity of 195 kph. Don't know how a Narvhal's bigger mass effects that equation but were talking about 100 of kphs as opposed to the many times the speed of light that thing seems to be clocking.

There's no terminal velocity in space to speak of, so it could keep accelerating to within a fraction of the speed of light.

It's using the gravity of its target planet so it would be the planets terminal velocity.


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svendrex wrote:Relativity is ignored because the ship compresses the space in front of it and then falls through the compressed space. It is using gravity to make the distance traveled shorter. I think this is similar to the way the warp drives from Star Trek function.

Nope Star Trek uses warp space exactly like Imperium but there's has less Deamons.

It's using the gravity of its target system.

Not a specific planet.

Retribution wrote:I'll never understand the fascination with the plausibility of pseudo-science from universes that openly promote friggin MAGIC (and demons, and space whales, and literal god-entities...)

The fascination is the same as the fascination with the plausibility of science in universes that openly promote magic (and ghosts, and aliens, and literal god-entities...). People like to talk about how worlds 'work'.

Anyhow, read this:
http://nitessine.wordpress.com/2008/05/19/argumentum-ad-fireballum/

tylermenz wrote:Actually, Artificial Gravity is probably just as unrealistic, but more necessary within the sci fi realm.

Assuming that technology is advanced enough to create artificial gravity, the propulsion system is actually quite feasible. you just need to create a large gravity well in front of your fleet and continue to move it forward iin order to conitously fall faster and faster towards the system.

Based on that, if you then add in the assumption that the amount of gravity is relatively fixed (such as a law of conservation of mass and energy) then you would need to pull the gravity from somewhere, namely the destination system would be easiest.

As far as the effects on the system, totally believable if the amount that gravity pulled was lessened throughout the entire system. The sun's and earth's cores are under extreme pressure which will push out rather catostophically if gavity is lessened, thus creating solar flares, volcanic eruptions, tsunamis, etc

Of course that means they are likely limited to the speed of light or less, which means it would take them 900 gazillion years to get anywhere. As such they would be a nonexistent threat when the Imperium has warp technology. They could launch fleet after fleet year after year at the various threats, or just move the organic life out of the way of the tenrdils starving them.

Its a jump the weiner dog moment.

Tyranids had warp drive in past editions,but it got replaced by that Narvhal thing which I hate.

It's the Warhammer Universe. Everything is tongue in cheek.

M.

I don't see what's wrong with it.

Amaya wrote:I don't see what's wrong with it.

The fact that an organic being uses gravity of a star system to achieve FTL(again organic).

IvanTih wrote:The fact that an organic being uses gravity of a star system to achieve FTL(again organic).

As opposed to an organic being capable of instantaneous teleportation, like the imperium has?

IvanTih wrote:

Amaya wrote:I don't see what's wrong with it.

The fact that an organic being uses gravity of a star system to achieve FTL(again organic).

Well how else are they going to get around?

In the Grim Darkness of the 41st millenium, there is only Narvhal Drafting!

Seriously, the Tyranids invented intergalactic Nascar.

No offence, but this is 40k.
I find the idea of highly advanced fish-faced like people somewhat funny, but 40k has it.

To be honest, nids tend to have alot of weird fluff that comes back on its self.
For all we know, the next book could state they use wishes to teleport, or that they can speak to humans.

۞ Jack ۞ wrote:or that they can speak to humans.

Again?

I think the Narvhal is better for them than warp travel, given the effect Tyranids have on the warp.

Also, I read "Narvhal Drafting" as "Narvhal Drifting" twice.

Both are amazing ideas.

Nids are also the most alien of all Xenos. I really don't have an issue with them using bizarre traveling powers.

Again?

From what i understand, its the hive mind that does the talking fom a synapse creature.
By that i ment every basic breed (so talking gaunts, and even spore mines )



Edit: gakky spelling.

۞ Jack ۞ wrote:From what i understand, its the hive mind that does the talking fom a synapse creature.

Give this a read.