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So, with Invulnerable Saves on vehicles being the "in" thing now, it seems almost certain Living Metal will become an Invulnerable save. Just curious what you dakkaites think or if you disagree, what should be done to Living Metal?

I think the Monolith is fine as is in this department. They are hard enough to kill without S10 ordinance.

I think living metal is fairly unique and stylish, not to mention iconinc, and is still very applicable in 5th. Maybe a +5 invul on top of it, but I doubt that they'll get rid of it entirely.

Personally I think they should and will replace the current rules with a 4++. It's what I did for my fandex (see signature).

I think it'll be changed to a 5++ and still have the current rules that it does now.
We might be waiting ages for this so just enjoy living metal as it is now I think before they make it better or nerf it.

I'd like it to stay the way it is, it fits and works fine. But this is Matt Ward writing the Necrons so sanity is out the window.

You notice that with the exception of the Battlewagon and KFF Mek, there isn't a single vehicle with AV 14 and an invulnerable save. I think this should stay as it is.

They should have living metal, immune to AP 1 damage bonus, 15 armour all around, 3++ save, only damaged by explodes results but need 2 of such a result to destroy, if it suffers 1 destroyed result it can regenerate on a 3+ and put the counter back to 0.

And be like I dunno 100 points?

The Upgrade?!

or is that 100 points for the model?!

asimo77 wrote:They should have living metal, immune to AP 1 damage bonus, 15 armour all around, 3++ save, only damaged by explodes results but need 2 of such a result to destroy, if it suffers 1 destroyed result it can regenerate on a 3+ and put the counter back to 0.

And be like I dunno 100 points?

So you want to turn the Monolith into a Super-Heavy Apocalypse vehicle?

Before people think I'm crazy I was just joking. Tbh I wouldn't change monoliths at all.


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Though something like that would be epic for trolling, I already love it when all my models get back up.

I don't like living metal the way it is. Both living metal and gauss technology come from an era when glances killed vehicles. As that's no longer the case, gauss needs to be mad better and living metal needs to be made worse (or at least both of them need to be made different).

As it is, the range of weapons which can seriously deal with a monolith is terrifically small, and that you need to bring one of those like 3 weapons in order to play against a good necron player is unfortunate.

What they should do is to make it so that a monlith can still be hurt by all weapons which are good against AV14, but make it tougher, like the proposed invul save, or something equivalent to holofields, or night shields, or have the ability to simply throw away one damage result per turn, or something.

Playing Eldar, I have to try and get lucky with Witchblades, or I'll have to tailor my list to deal with the Monolith. I'd prefer an invulnerable save, but that's the curse of an army consisting of S6 and S8 weapons. Well, or go for phase out.

So what vehicles actually have an invulnerable save?

The KFF does NOT give ork vehicles an invul. It makes them count as obscured, which confers a cover save. In close combat that means nothing.

An invulnerable save does offer protection from close combat attacks. Is this correct Gwar?

I am seeing this issue come up more and more and am mystified by the idea that vehicles getting an invul as opposed to a cover save.

As to the necrons, I like the monolith as is. It's the most unkilllable vehicle in the game at a modest price tag. Without living metal Necrons just got a whole lot less interesting, as is the same if they make we'll be back FNP.

The necrons are iconic and unique. I vote for not making them bland and uninteresting fluff wise.

Hint: New Dark Eldar codex.

You're kidding right?

ummm leave as is, bloody melta spammers

It should have FNP...

If the Necrons are not going to get any other kind of vehicle, then the Monolith should get to keep its current rule set more or less. Perhaps give it upgrade to make it AV 15 would be cool (and insane to kill).

You guys have it all wrong. The monolith won't get any invul saves. In fact, it'll probably lose some things and get a price hike.

Now, the new fast flyer/skimmer transport with multiple missile payloads without a model or a pic in the codex that they will get will defiantly have a ++3 save!

OT: Maybe as a separate upgrade, but probably not re-placing the Living Metal rule(at least I hope not).

Tzeentchling9, you are probably right. GW Doesn't need to sell more monoliths, so they will nerf them and make a new unit super powerful (with a handy new £40 kit).

Actually in all seriousness 15 armour would be pretty neat. But honestly I have a sinking feeling that the new necrons are going to be terrible anyway.

asimo77 wrote:Actually in all seriousness 15 armour would be pretty neat. But honestly I have a sinking feeling that the new necrons are going to be terrible anyway.

Well, with the codex creep people talk about, the new Necrons will probably be REALLY good, but of course that is all speculation as we do not know when will be the next codex update and what exactly the new Necrons will have. We have rumors and such, but if anything is an indication (Dark Eldar), the new Necrons will probably get several new vehicles that will compliment a Monolith that will have more options. Perhaps they will have several types of Monoliths as a choice, each like a different flavor of a Leman Russ or a Land Raider.

Ooo..I would love to take a squadron (trio) of mini-Monoliths that have AV12 all sides and Living Metal.

Well so far the only xenos codex for 5th edition, tyranids, has been kinda lack-luster or so I have heard. Even if deldar are great that's still 1/2 the xenos 5th ed dexes being meh.

Then again I'm a pessimist :(

I suggested AV14 with a 4+ invulnerable save for the monolith a long time ago and still think that's a better rule then the current living metal "nyah, nyah you don't get the rules you think you do" version.

Better protection for more stuff, coupled with not specifically gimping the one race who's tech ought to be good at fighting Necrons...

Jack

So, The best suggestions so far seem to be:
Keep it.
AV 15 but lose it
AV14 with Invul but lose it.

I actually like the idea of a AV15 vehicle..

How many vehicles are there with invulnerable saves?

Kilkrazy wrote:How many vehicles are there with invulnerable saves?

Lots, now the DE codex has come around.

At first it was just Bjorn, now every single vehicle in the DE codex can have one.

Gwar! wrote:So, The best suggestions so far seem to be:
Keep it.
AV 15 but lose it
AV14 with Invul but lose it.

I actually like the idea of a AV15 vehicle..

Im going to need a bigger railgun "Cheify"

Remove its invulnerability to +#d6 weapons (such as melta, eviscerators, chainfists, etc) and give them a 4++ save.