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I'm bored at work, so I thought I would make a thread. Here's a few from me:

1.) In the fiction Bolter munitions are always described as being "case-less" however a lot of the figures show casings.

2.) A Rapid Fire weapon does not fire twice at half its distance. (i.e. 24" = 2x 12", 18" = 2x 9")

That is all.

Rapid Fire used to work like that. That's one of the big changes that came to 5th edition 40K. It still trips me up sometimes when I use my Sternguard Vets.

What gets under my skin is how Feel No Pain gets handed out like Halloween candy.

You can't shoot into a melee that contains one of your own men. Even if it is a hundred against one, you still can't do it. Seems kind of silly to me.

1) The fact that loyalist Marines are the most common armies on the tabletop, yet the smallest faction in the fluff. Such a great concept, ruined by the fact that almost every 12 year old plays them. The fact that said 12 year-olds also happen to play Ultramarines with Marneus Calgar in a Land Raider doesn't help. Because of this they now have a really bad stigma attached, which can ruin the fun for a lot of their players. Not good.

2) The fact ID weapons still have to roll to wound. If you've been hit in the face with a plasma rifle, you're not going to survive!

3)SPEHSS WULFS!!!


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Oh, and 4) being swept. A single Terminator deals a single wound to a 40-man blob and doesn't die afterwards. He then somehow manages to wipe 39 men off the table, in the space of time it would usually take him to shoot twice with his Stormbolter. Why?

How the ultra marines never loose in the fluff, tyranid invasion....ork waaagh.....they get apparently get through everything but "they take heavy losses" and they can STILL kill anything, I just want to see them killed

This edition: Sweeping Advance, Rapid Fire not being 1/2 of original range, and the S values for an exploding vehicle (S4 Ap- if you're inside a vehicle reduced to a crater? OMGWTFBBQ!1!).

Overall: I dislike the unbalanced nature of the codexes, and that large Torunaments are always 2K pts. Why not 500 or 1K instead, to force new list ideas other then "Carpool/Drop Pod Marines" or "Tanks Galore" for IG or some such...

darkPrince010 wrote:This edition: Sweeping Advance, Rapid Fire not being 1/2 of original range, and the S values for an exploding vehicle (S4 Ap- if you're inside a vehicle reduced to a crater? OMGWTFBBQ!1!).

Overall: I dislike the unbalanced nature of the codexes, and that large Torunaments are always 2K pts. Why not 500 or 1K instead, to force new list ideas other then "Carpool/Drop Pod Marines" or "Tanks Galore" for IG or some such...

Regarding the size of lists:

I believe the intent was to not only force the purchase of models for their tournaments, but to also allow flexibility in the effectiveness of army lists. A lot of armies do not even begin to stand a chance at 1000pts or less.

-J.

Here are my fluff complaints.

1. The Black Legion, no matter the circumstance, is never allowed to get a major, permanent victory. (Throw these poor guys a bone)
2. Ultramarines, no matter the circumstance, are never allowed to get a major, permanent defeat. (Stop throwing these guys bones)
3. The fact that every Space Wolf item, event, rank or base has to include to word Wolf (or a related term, like Fang).
4. Draigo; incase you haven't read the Grey Knights codex, this guy is a living "SCREW YOU" to every Chaos and Chaos Space Marine player, courtesy of Matt Ward.

Jimsolo wrote:You can't shoot into a melee that contains one of your own men. Even if it is a hundred against one, you still can't do it. Seems kind of silly to me.

Hehe, this would be a fantastic change! I'm pretty sure Chenkov would have absolutely no gripes about tarpitting something shiny and expensive with a blob of disposable guardsmen, moving his big guns into LOS then dumping enough live ordnance on the spot to ensure there's nothing left bigger than a matchbox.

Also far too many units are fearless and therefore immune to pinning and far too many have FNP as previously mentioned.

Half of the codexes are for Marines. Half are not.

Also, internet loudmouths. While this isn't necessarily a 40k issue, 40k does have them.

@Alazahr: I agree, and while I understand some armies need supporting units (Tau FW and pathfinders, Nid Guard, etc), I think that if the game isn't balanced at half the size, what makes it balanced at the full size? I can play chess against someone with only pawns and rooks, and it's a balanced game (Not trying to say W40K = Chess in every regard, but hopefully you understand my thoughts here)

The unexistance of plastic Ogryns and Commisars.

The main rulebook not containing a section dedicated to fast transports and all what its "precious cargo" can do.

Oh, and 4) being swept. A single Terminator deals a single wound to a 40-man blob and doesn't die afterwards. He then somehow manages to wipe 39 men off the table, in the space of time it would usually take him to shoot twice with his Stormbolter. Why?

But terminators can't sweeping advance
I do agree with your point, it's very quite strange, it would take him 20 rounds of assault to kill them all and he does it in one, as he "shoots them as they run".

My biggest gripe is newer codexes, seriously an eldar pheonix lord has the same WS and I as an archon, a pirate leader is as competent a fighter as the very first ever aspect warrior, sorry but i don't think so, in fluff Maugan ra stopped an entire tyranid hive fleet, by himself!!! I'd like to see an archon do that.
And yes FnP is given out way too readily, pretty soon it'll be:

Ork boy
6+ armour
Toughhide - Orks are naturally tough so have the Feel No Pain special rule.

Space Marine
3+ armour
Ultramarine - Ultramarines are great, so have the Feel No Pain special rule

DarknessEternal wrote:Half of the codexes are for Marines. Half are not.

+1!

Too many marines! Give the xenos some more love.

The vehicle rules. All of them. They're super-dumbed down and don't make any fething sense.

Why does Mr. Right Sponson Gunner have to sit pretty and not shoot anything because he can't see Mr. Left Sponson Gunner's target?

Vehicle rules have sucked in every edition of 40K since 3rd. Yes, they were clunky and overcomplicated in 2nd, and having a separate datasheet for every Bike or Jetbike in a unit was unwieldy and stupid, but God-damn it they were fun!

+1 Stupid vehicle rules. My tank can't move 12" AND fire because that kind of power would lead to another Heresy.

And the stupidness of the fluff in certain newer books. Grey Knights and Blood Angels, I'm looking at you.

The fact that if i move 12 inches in a transport my guys cant shoot out of fire points as the vehicle is moving to fast but are allowed to jump out then shoot. somehow the tank slowed down enough for them to bail out before shooting.

1. Codex Marines not getting Bolt pistols, bolters and a CCW.

2. Rapid fire bolters. Just give em 18" assualt 2.

3. No splitting fire. C'mon, really? I have a meltagun in that squad, who's in 6" of that nice juicy vehicle. But for some reason, peer pressure gets to him, so he wastes that shot on some Ork boy. Same goes for vehicles.

4. The number of marines. If you picked up Marines thinking, 'Awesome, just like in Heinlein's book!' you are perfectly excused. If you read a BL book and said, 'Man, I want a pre-Heresy Thousand Sons army!', go right ahead. But I think that every Astartes army could just be rolled into 1 book, with some special characters that unlock units and special rules to make your marines more bloody or more wolfy or more darky or more templary.

5. Shooting from vehicles. So, apparently the suspension in the 41st millenium is so bad that moving 12" jostles my 8' tall demi-gods around so much that they can't fire from the vehicle. They can, however, roll right out of one of the hatches and fire perfectly fine.

LoneLictor wrote:4. Draigo; incase you haven't read the Grey Knights codex, this guy is a living "SCREW YOU" to every Chaos and Chaos Space Marine player, courtesy of Matt Ward.

This right here is why I stopped playing 40K; the game isn't even a game anymore, it's just "Insult the dudes who AREN'T imperials, we get more money that way". Space Marines get fourty codexes in the time it takes the Dark Eldar to get one, and the rules are completely skewed in Space Marine Favor....

I agree with everyone of these things. Except the plastic Ogryns/commisars, but only cause i don't collect guard.

And some armies really suck at lower than 2k. Necrons have 1 (viable) list at 500, 20 warriors and lord with res orb. A bit higher and maybe you can add a few units. woopdy-******-doo

Damaging vehicles. It just blows. This literally happened in a game the other day:

My brother: "so I just rolled a 4 against your predator, what is that?"
Me: "immoblized"
Bro: "awesome, so it can't shoot anymore?"
Me: "nope, I can shoot all my guns next turn, and they can swivel too"
Bro: "now how does that work?"
Me: "beats me. Oh look my immoblized pred just put a lascannon through your zoanthropes face. Sucks"

Also, there need to be more modifiers to the damage table. Because even though it was just a glance, my opponent always rolls a 6. So my tank is immobilized because you glanced it?

Wouldn't it be more interesting if the vehicle damage table was based on 2d6 instead of 1d6?

I have a feeling it's a topic that's been discussed to death in Proposed Rules however.

The built in bias towards marines irks me.

The marines codexes being half the available forces is irritating.

The tournaments where the same netlist for the same army show up in all three games, due to lack of internal balance and the prevalence of no brainer uber units in certain (*cough* mostly marine *cough* ) codexes.
I'm not kidding on this one. I played exactly the same list on the same table 3 games in a row. The only difference was the rules arguments and the face of the player opposite.

Black Library fluff. They really REALLY need to read the existing fluff sometimes. Let the IOM lose heroically (if you must) sometimes, for gods sake, or write from a non-human perspective.


Also the plot armour on Marines in General and the Gray Knights in particular. There isn't a single loss in their timeline, as far as I remember, and Draigo is a touch much, even for Ward's Marineophilia...


Above all the assumption by the hordes of IOM fanboys (GW writers included) that whatever an alien race can do Humanity is or was automatically better at, despite the lack of any prior fluff proof (beyond a mention that humanity had better tech in the Golden Age than the bolt-on boxes it uses now.. )

Ascalam wrote:The built in bias towards marines irks me.

The marines codexes being half the available forces is irritating.

The tournaments where the same netlist for the same army show up in all three games, due to lack of internal balance and the prevalence of no brainer uber units in certain (*cough* mostly marine *cough* ) codexes.
I'm not kidding on this one. I played exactly the same list on the same table 3 games in a row. The only difference was the rules arguments and the face of the player opposite.

Black Library fluff. They really REALLY need to read the existing fluff sometimes. Let the IOM lose heroically (if you must) sometimes, for gods sake, or write from a non-human perspective.


Also the plot armour on Marines in General and the Gray Knights in particular. There isn't a single loss in their timeline, as far as I remember, and Draigo is a touch much, even for Ward's Marineophilia...


Above all the assumption by some folk that whatever an alien race can do Humanity is or was automatically better at, despite the lack of any fluff proof (beyond a mention that humanity had better tech in the Golden Age.

It irks alot of people i do beleive.

Biel-tan and Saim-hann differ greatly in their tactics and fighting style, but they're stuck in the same codex
Night Lords and Word Bearers differ differ greatly in their tactics and fighting style, but they're stuck in the same codex

I don't think it's ever going to change however, as GW has a raging hard on for anything IoM

As one guy i work with is far too overfond of quoting (at least i assume it's a quote)


' God has a hard-on for Marines ! '

Maybe that explains why the Emperor created so many little boytoys in big shoulderpads

If he said it, you can quote it (you could even quote that!)

It all makes sense now

darkPrince010 wrote:This edition: Sweeping Advance, Rapid Fire not being 1/2 of original range, and the S values for an exploding vehicle (S4 Ap- if you're inside a vehicle reduced to a crater? OMGWTFBBQ!1!).

Yeh and S3 outside the vehicle because shrapnel doesn't exist or is covered in bubble wrap in the far future...

Sweeping advance negating WBB, when normally a mob of grotz with rocks would have no chance of running down and destroying a Necron Warriior unit

The current rules for combat resolution.