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Apologies If this thread has already been done. A few weeks ago, I asked if it were possible to get a 1500 point, 40k army, for around £120. Long story short, I've given up on GW and their prices, and I've decided to take the plunge and get into FOW, especially now I've seen German kubelwagens for sale!!

Anyway, what size of force do you need for a game (points wise) and how much does it cost on average? By game, I mean one that would last 2hrs, something around the 1000/1500 points marks. Budget wise, I'm sorted for paints/materials etc

I figured that smaller models would be cheaper. I just hope it's not a typical GW -need-2000-points minimum-for-a-game-situation.

Thanks for the help.

The answer to your question is three words: Plastic Soldier Company.

Points wise, it is very similar to 40k.. 1500 is the norm, 1750 is a bit bigger, 2000 is fine if you have tank companies but bogs down if you are doing soviet infantry hordes.

However, there is one extra wrinkle in FoW that 40k doesnt have.. time period. FoW is broken down into 3 time periods, Early, mid and Late war. The rules are the same, just the army lists are different. That way you don't get PanzerIIs trying to kill an IS-2!

Before deciding, figure out what your local players are playing. If your local area typically plays late War, then get LW stuff. If you want to go super on-the-cheap, germans is the way to go. In Mid-War, you can take a Tiger IE as HQ, then 2 more TigerIE for each of your combat platoons. This is about 1300 points for 3 x 15 dollar models!! A blister of dudes for a support infantry platoon (another 14 bucks roughly) and you are at 1500 points.

Late War is similar, just swap out Tiger IEs for King Tigers. You can run 4 x King Tigers at 1500 points. Another great list is 6 x Tiger IEs in late war. beauty of it is you can use them for MW or LW.

As Olympia pointed out, if you want to make a "regular" list, a 3rd party company called Plastic Soldier Company makes box sets of 5 x vehicles, all plastic, for pretty cheap. A russian company called Zvezda (Red Star) makes German and Russian stuff only, but they are even cheaper.

2 box sets of shermans from PSC gives you an all tank list for MW for Brits or USA, or form part of a tank list for Russians, since the Russians had lend-lease stuff. 50 bucks

or 2 box sets of panzer IVs, same thing. 50 bones.

I used to play GW games for a good solid 15 years until last year. Thats when I played Flames of War. I havent thrown a single dice or painted a single thing since then that isn't Flames of War. As I like to joke with my friends, in Flames of War, I never have to worry that the next army book that comes out, matt Ward will let Canadians use Tigers!!! It sounds ridiculous, but its true. Since its historical, I don;t need to worry about the fluff-raping that goes on in GW books nowadays.

Hope you enjoy FoW as much as I do.

If you start with a Tank Company for Late War and focus on standard Tanks: Shermans, StuGs, Panzer IVs and such, you can get in for 1500 or 1750 very cheap. You can later add options and such. Tanks go from $4-$15 depending on manufacturer. If you have more time than money, look at Plastic Soldier Company, Game Models, Zvezda.

Thanks for the replies. Finally, what is the book to get for fighting in Russia '41-43?

I believe Eastern Front is the one you want - it's 1942-43.

DirtyJon wrote:If you start with a Tank Company for Late War and focus on standard Tanks: Shermans, StuGs, Panzer IVs and such, you can get in for 1500 or 1750 very cheap. You can later add options and such. Tanks go from $4-$15 depending on manufacturer. If you have more time than money, look at Plastic Soldier Company, Game Models, Zvezda.

Does anyone know how the new PSC Stugs compare to other manufacturers? Specifically the Peter Pig and old glory ones, what kind of detail level do they have?

My thread on the new StuGs

Exhumed wrote:My thread on the new StuGs

Awesome stuff, thanks for that

Do_I_Not_Like_That wrote:Thanks for the replies. Finally, what is the book to get for fighting in Russia '41-43?

As mentioned, Eastern Front covers in the fighting in the Soviet Union during the Mid-War (42-43) period. Early War Soviet Union hasn't been covered yet, but it's expected that Battlefront will release the book for that (with German, Soviet, Finnish, Hungarian, and Romanian formations) late Summer 2012. Campaigns in eastern Europe during 1944 and the very beginning of 1945 are covered in Grey Wolf and Red Bear, both of which are due out for release on Saturday (they're compilations and updates of four previously released books).

One last question. Does anybody know the points value of this SS infantry company, from the top of their head. I can get it for dirt cheap. It contains the following troops:

Company HQ, two Motorcycle with Sidecars, two Infantry Platoons each with Command team, Light mortar team, Anti-tank Rifle team and four Infantry squads.

Do_I_Not_Like_That wrote:One last question. Does anybody know the points value of this SS infantry company, from the top of their head. I can get it for dirt cheap. It contains the following troops:

Company HQ, two Motorcycle with Sidecars, two Infantry Platoons each with Command team, Light mortar team, Anti-tank Rifle team and four Infantry squads.

In the book Burning Empires (which uses the 1st SS in Greece for its SS list), that comes out to just over 600 points. That's an EW company, and the points might vary somewhat if you built it for MW.

FoW is a better bang for your buck compared to 40k, especially if you run armored.

In my experience, Tiger companies arn't the greatest till you reach a high enough points value where you can get some decent infantry support. because infantry lists are extremely powerful at low points compared to armored companies, the infantry just swarm the tanks and take them out with bazookas. on the flip side if you face an allied armored company at low points you might not make any friends.

But Tigers make excellent support tanks for Infantry companies.


if you want an armored force I would go for anything that isn't Tigers. Panther companies are a nice compromise between saving money by getting high point value units and wanting something that performs well. The greater point freedom allows you to get some infantry support to cover your tanks.

if infantry or combined arms is your style then an infantry company of some kind is what you will want. Then you have to pick between mechanized infantry or footsloggers

mech infantry = Panzergrenadiers, Panzerpioneers, anything with panzer on the front of its name. You can usually get an SS version of whatever you want to run(more elite troops)

Footsloggers = Fallschirmjagers, Waffen SS(maybe these are mech?), anything that doesn't have a Panzer on the front.



The thing to remember with FoW is that each individual army list usually represents an actual historical formation(or a couple related formations) and there can sometimes be only a slight difference between 2 different lists(like Fallschirmjagers in Fortress Europe have some different support options as opposed to those from Hell's highway)

You can also use many models interchangably. A PanzerIV is a PanzerIV regardless of the actual unit. Infantry are even easier to use in different lists due to their small size. so don't think that because you bought a certain model means you are stuck with it only in a certain list.

So on the value for money question, would the late war German infantry that the plastic soldier company do be ok for say mid or even early war?

I didn't think the uniform changed much over the war, but I'm no expert of course.

i don't think it would make a big deal really apart from to the uber anal. The PSC box set for infantry comes with MG34s as far as i can tell so that at least fits the early war.
If you want a monetary breakdown for what I've got in my 1800-ish point army-
From PSC--
2 or 3 inf platoons (not built the third yet but should be able to get it) £18.50
Panzer Platoon £16.50
StuG Platoon £16.50

From Forged in Battle--
HMG Platoon £5
FlaK 88 battery £18 ish

From Battlefront--
HMG platoon £6.75

Coming to a grand total of about £80.
I kinda doubt you could get a 40k army of similar points for that kind of outlay.

All i can say is Old glory....packs of models for 9 dollars..

or Skytrex.

Cheers for the replys guys, I'll have a look at those sites too.

olympia wrote:The answer to your question is three words: Plastic Soldier Company.

This is wisdom. I started a Soviet force this year, it's at about 1,750 points right now. I bought the core of my army, about a thousand points worth, from Plastic Soldier Company. That's fifteen T34s and a company of infantry for about £60.

15mm WWII is incredible value to play right now and this trend is likely to continue.

Yes, the value in FoW comes from the widespread playerbase of the rule set and the fact you can't IP a WWII soldier. So competition in the market really thrives. I know I started with Battlefront minis for my Germans and my Finns, but I am going to go PSC for my Russians.

Keep in mind though, the PSC infantry poses are atrocious. What's worse, several poses are copied between minis on the sprue, and even those minis have only slight variation between them most of the time.

That said, it's 15mm so at table distance, no one can really tell so long as all the parts are in the right places. So you get what you pay for.

Another thing about value for your money, there won't ever really be a time where there isn't a good 15mm WWII rules set.

Vertrucio wrote:Keep in mind though, the PSC infantry poses are atrocious. What's worse, several poses are copied between minis on the sprue, and even those minis have only slight variation between them most of the time.

That said, it's 15mm so at table distance, no one can really tell so long as all the parts are in the right places. So you get what you pay for.
.

Definitely, for Germans I'm going Peter Pig for the infantry as you don't need that many of them, and I've seen some great work with them to make them look like hardened vets on the battlefield. If I ever get round to a Russian strelkovy 'operation human shield' force then most certainly it will be PSC

Hi Exhumed.
Have you got any pics of painted up Skytrx command decision infantry minis?
As some of the photos of the bare metal minis faces dont look too good...(It could be the shadow /angle though...)

Ta in advance...

HEre is some of the Old Glory models. Waffen SS.

Well, I'm happy to say that I've looked at some army lists from the FOW site (17th SS) and I can put together a 1500 point force for £40!! Strawberries and cream!! Thank you plastic soldier company.

It's mostly infantry with no transport and Panzer IV Hs, but it's bloody cheap! Gods knows how good it will be in battle, but I could never go back to GW now.

Do_I_Not_Like_That wrote:Well, I'm happy to say that I've looked at some army lists from the FOW site (17th SS) and I can put together a 1500 point force for £40!! Strawberries and cream!! Thank you plastic soldier company.

It's mostly infantry with no transport and Panzer IV Hs, but it's bloody cheap! Gods knows how good it will be in battle, but I could never go back to GW now.

In January Plastic Soldier are releasing Panthers (£15 for 5) and later in the year Tigers (probably for the same price) and artillery (no details yet). You may also want to check out their Stug IIIs and 250/1s (also £15 for 5).

Plastic Soldier also do multi box deals at 20% off on their website.

Panthers at 5 for 15!! Merry Christmas! And It's only the 24th. Thanks for that snippet of info.

Do_I_Not_Like_That wrote:Panthers at 5 for 15!! Merry Christmas! And It's only the 24th. Thanks for that snippet of info.

Hey, in Sweden we celebrate christmas the 24th ;D

HI again.
Are the Old Glory and Skytrex Command Desision minis the same range .(US and UK distributors?)

Thanks for the pics of the Waffen SS col, Krazy Kenny.(Great paint job too!)

They look loads better painted.

Thanks....

PSC Sherman V and VC Firefly are to be released soon , just in time for me to start my new Late War British List, HORAY!!!(11th Armoured Division.)
(British infantry and M5 Halftracks are to be released later in the year...)

The update on the PSC site looks very promsing indeed. Lanrak, my mate ordered me some Skytrex panzerschreck and panzerfaust guys last week, delivery was pretty quick. Not picked them up from him yet but he says generally they are about as good as the BF ones; I know what you mean about the faces but I've yet to see them first-hand. I'll get them painted ASAP and post something up along with my other painted bits including the PSC troops and forged in battle models.
Merry Jesusmas!