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So with the new rules for snipers, is it still worth having telion? from what it looks like, snipers can pick who they want to wound is this correct?

Provided they get a 6 to hit.

Hmmm im wondering if its worth taking Telion now, then just spend those points on something like a secondary or a fortification.

Actually jsut had this discussion in another thread on the effectiveness (or lack there of) in Eldar rangers/pathfinders.

I think it comes down to what you have for troop choices(Eldar snipers are troops, im not sure about what they are in other armies) that compete with the snipers. I wouldnt force them into a list now. But if other units in the same group became less effective it wouldnt hurt to try them out. They seem to be effective at taking out the heavy weapon troops in a unit. For my eldar facing groups of Space marines carrying flamers or missile launchers, snpiers would be great. They wouldnt be as effective taking out sargents due to the look out sir rule. But to clip a missle launcher boots the life of my own units that he would be targeting. Same goes for flamers. I plan on taking snipers now and testing them out. I hope they prove to be worth it.

I have a squad of SM scouts now with telion but if its not worth taking him thats another 75 points I can spend else where. Be it on terrain or a drop pod for my dread.

Backspacehacker wrote:So with the new rules for snipers, is it still worth having telion? from what it looks like, snipers can pick who they want to wound is this correct?

People take Telion for two reasons:
"Free" Camo cloaks for his attached unit.
And the ability to fire a BS5 Missile Launcher.

If ML get Flakk Missile Eventually, then this would be a pretty decent way to get cheap AA.
Also, all of Telion's shots are called or precision or whatever it's called, not just his 6s.

Snipers are great a killing small squads of elite infantry, and with terminators on the rise...

9 sniper scouts with telion and 6th edition sniper rules are a really good unit for a mere 190 points. Being able to nominate wounds to power fist seargeants, thunder hammer/psycannon GKs, scorcerers etc can potentially cripple a units ability to fight effectivly.

I've used them in both of the 6th edition games I've played and they've more than pulled their weight plus drawing a fair amout of fire due to being such an annoyance. In the first game they killed a daemon prince and 2 thousand sons socereres and in the 2nd they dispatched a vindicare assasin and saint celestine!

I just wanted to make sure I am using Telion correctly now. Before, if he wounded, he could place the wound on the model he wanted. Now if he hits, he places the shot on a model, and then rolls to wound??? So if he hits twice, which he should, he can but both wounds on say, the enemy power fister?

One thing to remember also is his free camo cloaks of 5th can stack with camo cloaks if the unit buys them for a +2 to cover. And you roll to wound normal, just keep his separate as he chooses who they are allocated to.

DarbNilbirts wrote:One thing to remember also is his free camo cloaks of 5th can stack with camo cloaks if the unit buys them for a +2 to cover. And you roll to wound normal, just keep his separate as he chooses who they are allocated to.

Two stealths don't stack. You don't need to buy camo for the unit if you take Telion.

Razgriz22 wrote:Actually jsut had this discussion in another thread on the effectiveness (or lack there of) in Eldar rangers/pathfinders.

I think it comes down to what you have for troop choices(Eldar snipers are troops, im not sure about what they are in other armies) that compete with the snipers.

Right. With the Eldar their troop options are such garbage that the snipers are actually one of the best (if not the best)

labmouse42 wrote:

Razgriz22 wrote:Actually jsut had this discussion in another thread on the effectiveness (or lack there of) in Eldar rangers/pathfinders.

I think it comes down to what you have for troop choices(Eldar snipers are troops, im not sure about what they are in other armies) that compete with the snipers.

Right. With the Eldar their troop options are such garbage that the snipers are actually one of the best (if not the best)

Hehe, We take them not because they are amazing, but because they are the best troop we can take for the cheapest price. So does that mean we take them out of inadequacy? lol

Unless I am wrong (I don't think I have been) I have been using Telion with the Aegis Defense Lines + Quad Gun.
10 man unit (all with rifles)
9 camo cloaks (This + Telion + Aegis Line gives a +2 cover save)
Telion.

You can use Telion for shooting the Quad Gun. This gives you a BS of 6, (+2 to hit with rerolls)
Also you can use his ability to target models when firing the Quad Gun, nice for snipping characters, or even better hidden weapon guys. A fun ability, a little pricey but something different.

That is correct.

Are you sure that you get to allocate the hits from the autocannon if Telion is firing it? That's pretty disturbing.

Yes, the rules for emplaced weapons says that the rules of a model giving the gun his BS apply to the weapon.

So Vindicare assassins and Telion can snipe with an emplaced weapon.

Isn't the quad gun already twin linked?

Yeah, so a BS above 5 does nothing else for it, but the Vindicare's Deadshot ability confers to the gun.

Two stealths don't stack. You don't need to buy camo for the unit if you take Telion.

Actually, the most recent FAQ states that camo cloaks add +1 to cover save and telion's wargear got changed as well, he got an added camo cloak, so the effects of stealth and camo cloaks stack now.

Yup, Camo cloaks are now better then stealth.

There's so many things I'd rather have than snipers. Especially with expanded allies options.
So many things that will not need to roll 6 to be good.

Though BS5 gun crew combo is somewhat interesting.

juraigamer wrote:Snipers are great a killing small squads of elite infantry, and with terminators on the rise...

I would love to see your reasoning behind this...

Ailideon wrote:Unless I am wrong (I don't think I have been) I have been using Telion with the Aegis Defense Lines + Quad Gun.
10 man unit (all with rifles)
9 camo cloaks (This + Telion + Aegis Line gives a +2 cover save)
Telion.

You can use Telion for shooting the Quad Gun. This gives you a BS of 6, (+2 to hit with rerolls)
Also you can use his ability to target models when firing the Quad Gun, nice for snipping characters, or even better hidden weapon guys. A fun ability, a little pricey but something different.

Telion (even with only 5-man) is now a really good point invesment if he is used to man the Quad Gun. Nothing like the look on your opponent face when you keep putting 4 wounds on his powerfist/special weapon/lord/... Plus if a unit comes in from reserve (infantry or flyer), the quad gun can intercept and Telion can still fire his stalker bolter on his shooting phase. 2+ cover save (on Aegis or Bastion Battlement) is very hard to remove.

PotionsN'Balms wrote:

Two stealths don't stack. You don't need to buy camo for the unit if you take Telion.

Actually, the most recent FAQ states that camo cloaks add +1 to cover save and telion's wargear got changed as well, he got an added camo cloak, so the effects of stealth and camo cloaks stack now.

^This^
+2 for cover is pretty awesome and needed now cover saves are generally lower.
Telion's shot have lost something though, as it was only 6s really that I cared about anyway.
Overall, he is keeper and even more virtually an autoinclude when taking vanilla marines as allies.

Grey Templar wrote:Yes, the rules for emplaced weapons says that the rules of a model giving the gun his BS apply to the weapon.

So Vindicare assassins and Telion can snipe with an emplaced weapon.

So a Dark Reaper Exarch with Fast Shot or Crack Shot can use it on the gun?
Not that this is a good reason to take them, but it's fun to think about.

I'm not seeing how stealth and camo cloaks would stack. Camo cloaks give the model stealth....if you already have the ability, there's nothing in the rules that I have seen would make you stack them together.

KGatch113 wrote:

I'm not seeing how stealth and camo cloaks would stack. Camo cloaks give the model stealth....if you already have the ability, there's nothing in the rules that I have seen would make you stack them together.

FAQ changed camo cloak into giving the model +1 cover save, not giving stealth, so they stack together.

Thank you.

Very tricky change there. Since it no longer grants stealth, you can't give a camo cloak to a Lord Commissar and give +1 to a 40 man IG blob.

But since Telion has stealth, he still gives the squad +1...so if they buy cloaks, they get +2. Hmmmmmmm

It clearly says in the rulebook at Stealth and Shrouded stack as well....So if you put Snipers+Telion into cover, during Nightfighting....