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I haven't played as or against Necrons since the new edition change, but I may be playing against a very tactically skilled player in a couple days, and while I generally know what his list has (it's Necrons, spoiler alert it's got warrior blobs wraiths Spyders and maybe a doom scythe or something) I am curious whether anyone familiar with the matchup knows a good strategy available to the orks to win.

I'm leaning right now towards a double CAD extreme MSU style list to try and win by objectives, as I am all but certain I cannot kill what he will bring. Orks can bring a lot of cheap mobility that says "meh" to having hull points stripped or even having units wiped out.

I don't have enough boyz for a green tide so it isn't an option for me.

So what have people tried that's worked? I can't kill his warriors, but I can tie them up good in melee and while wraiths are beyond obnoxious there'll be a lot more boyz than them, and there's only so much they can kill.

I'm not interested in jokey "muh Necrons so OP just win by not playing huhuhuhuhuhuhehehehe I'm funnnny" replies. I get it, people like to spank on game balance. It's not what I'm looking for here.

Lootas are great for pretty much anything necron at ap4 and mass shots. Plus they can out range literally every necron unit except tacyon arrow and doomsday barge.

Orks is a tough match-up for Necrons. You have the right idea to try to win through extreme MSU. Although Necrons are the toughest army right now, their damage output is only mid level.

You should be able to win unless the Necron player does a lot of list tailoring.

The Necron player has access to some good cheap killy things in the form Tomb Blades and Flayed Ones so if the player loads up on those it might be a tougher match for you.

You cannot win in a melee fight against flayed ones. Make sure you shoot them dead before they hit a unit or you've lost that unit. No, you cannot tie them up with boys. Even if you charge them with 30 boys. Or a Manz missile, he loses 0-3models and your squad wipes.

Assault his warriors and immortals. I, with unbelievable luck, once wiped an immortal squad with a single big mek on a bike with a shokk attack gun. I fired, teleported into melee, killed one Necron, he dealt 0 wounds, broke on a 10, and was swept. That will never happen again, but they are weak in the initiative department so long as we aren't wearing mega armor we can sweep our kill. Our nobs/big meks are initiative 3, warbosses 4. Use that to your advantage.

Fire s8 or AP negating weapons. Always, or as much as you can. We need every advantage we can get, and them not getting both rolls and making their second roll at a+1 is as good as we can do.

I recommend Flashgitz as they cut armor and can assault really well.

I'm facing it tomorrow with Zhadsnark, 5x6 Bike units, 3x10 Gretchin and 3 Big Meks, each with 15 Lootas. Shall let you know how they perform.

List-wise: trukk spam. 11 boys + PK/boss pole nob, repeat several times. Use what you want for the rest of the list. War bikers with a biker boss and biker painboy is a good unit. Lootas holding the backfield.

Go forward and fight like proppa orks.

Now that Annihilation Barges have gone out of style, light vehicles are actually pretty decent against Necrons. Their main anti-tank is gauss flayers, meaning it doesn't really matter if you run a Land Raider or a pair of Sentinels. Trukks, Kans and even Dreads and a Morkanaut can work very well.

Just had that game and got tabled T5.

There was a lot of bad rolling on my part to be honest, but nothing really performed, aside Zhadsnark in combat but even then he fluffed

Well, now you know what not to take. You have nothing that is s8 or broke ap in your army except Zadsnark, so of course he performed well.

Yes warriors are armor 4, but everything else is armor 3. 15 s7ap4 bs2 shots a turn for 210pts is awful. Because 90% of the time they were getting 4+/3+ then 4+/5+...

No 30 man boys mobs means you left the wraiths to pick their targets and mulch your backfield.

Small units means they wipe 2 units a turn with superior shooting.

I consistently play against Necron a few times a week, please, next time follow some of the advice I gave. Couldn't hurt if you're being wiped right




Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also, that person who said vehicles were viable vs Necron must be playing against Necron players who don't know they strip hull points on 6s with their infantry weapons regardless of armor value. You can't run vehicles that are suppose to live

Haha yeah, I'm thinking of having one large unit of Bikes w/ Zhadsnark and a Painboy on a bike next time, two units of Tankbustas in Tankwagons over two of the Loota units, just for a bit more Strength

FratHammer wrote:

Also, that person who said vehicles were viable vs Necron must be playing against Necron players who don't know they strip hull points on 6s with their infantry weapons regardless of armor value. You can't run vehicles that are suppose to live

That's what he said though - a trukk is almost as durable as a land-raider against them. So trukk spam can be a good way to get your guys closer / protect some of your shootier units from return fire for awhile. They're cheap as chips and fast as hell, and Gauss doesn't cause explode results - so it's pretty much always worth it.

Morgan, I was referring to Okapi's input, which was not good. Read it, you'll see. He suggests kans, morkanauts ect, which are not viable

Funny but naught might be somewhat fine vs crons. Especially Gorkanaught with 3 skorcha meganobs inside.

He has a large frightening blob? He can glance you? Well, he'll need to make 5 glances. And than meganobs disembark, heavy flame stuff to death and pose a threat cause he lacks ap2. While a naught can go sweep another squad in mellee.

He has a bunch of flayed ones that'd obliterate boyz? Naught is here for the resque. They can do squat to a naught and will easilly go down and have a chance of getting swept.

That's not bad kooai. Never looked at it as if he wouldn't take destroyers or stalkers or tons of foot soldiers, but if you can avoid them and use your tactic, that is really good. I think I'll play test it buddy.

Just keep in mind, don't let your mega nobs take too long in a combat. If he hits you with lytchguard or wraiths or any unit with a lord or named character, they are gone from the table.

Sure thing. That's what the rest of your army is gona do - tarpit them all day long.

Kans are perfectly decent against Necron Warriors. To reliably kill one in a Kan in a single round of shooting the Necron player has to use 234 points worth of Warriors; 18 shots, 12 hit, 2 hull points. How much is a Kan again? Gauss flayers are AMAZING against low number, high power vehicles. Against Trukk, Kan, Rhino and Venom spam? Not so much.

Annihilation Barges will tear those to pieces, of course, but it's been a while since I've seen one fielded. Just beware of Night Scythes.

Against Crons;

I found tankbusta's very useful, considering immortals are T4 (that is right yeh?) the Str8 AP3 means you ignore armour and you give him only a 5+ FNP as you are IDing him. 5+ on immortals is pretty poor. This is; if you don't have any other higher priority targets. But in general the AP3 and Str8 is good against most cron units.

Blitz brigade could be potent, with 5 killkannons any blobs are going to take serious wounds, with Ap3, they are looking at only FNP once again. Lootas with AP4 will help mulch warriors. Yeh still FNP as usual but with crons you either need to be looking at doing a few select things;

Ignore Armour to get them down to 1 type of save (as its not the power of FNP that makes crons durable, its the combo of taking 2 save types)

Sweeping, crons have a terrible (I2) time against sweeps. Anything without fearless (warriors, immortals etc) can generally be swept. So you only need inflict enough wounds to win combat and you can destroy the whole unit) - for this you want a fast way to get into combat, so bikes.

MSU - as you mentioned they will suffer against multiple threats. Sure they can tie up units, they can shoot almost all targets effectively with warriors, but if they are shooting non-expensive units then you can simply play to the mission. Personally I like 5 man commando units barebones (50 points - 60 if you add some BS's) They can sit on midfield objectives from the start, then your bikes can boost up into their faces with a nice DLS warboss tanking coversaves - limit their ability to get to midtable and you will pull ahead on objectives if its maelstrom.

There's honestly not much you CAN do. Tomb Blades will ignore your cover and armor, you can't entirely get through Ghost Arks effectively, and Doom Scythes/Heavy Destroyers cause ID everywhere.

I hadn't lost to Orks a SINGLE time since the new codex dropped. I'm serious.

Crons have always been one of my more regular opponents. I'll just echo a few of the sentiments above..

Low ap and high strength weaponry, preferably combined. KMK batteries, SAGs and flash gitz have been my go-to's for awhile.
And of course at least 2 full mobs. This is the core of my list design for orks in general.

The mobs were stellar every time. Skimmers hate having nowhere safe to flit off to and crons lose to mobs outside of a few select units.

I like the lootas suggestion, in theory since I haven't seen them around much since the new dex dropped. That said I used to face a nasty lootas list so if you wanna go completely shameless and aren't opposed to forgeworld then you could try something like this.. if he doesn't have very specific answers its pretty much no win territory:

Mad Morx- beyond thundork dome

HQ
big mek bp, pk, sag, gitfinda, 3 ammo runts, finkin kap
big mek bp, pk, sag, gitfinda, 2 ammo runts
mekboy junka, deff rolla, 3 bs, 2 grot bomms
mekboy junka, deff rolla, 3 bs, 2 grot bomms

ELITES
mekboy junka, deff rolla, 3 bs, 2 grot bomms
mekboy junka, deff rolla, 3 bs, 2 grot bomms
mekboy junka, deff rolla, 3 bs, 2 grot bomms

TROOPS
11 gretchin
11 gretchin

FA
deffkopta
deffkopta

HS
15 lootas, mek, deffguns
15 lootas, mek, deffguns
15 lootas, mek, deffguns

FT
void relay network, 3 generators- 3/3/3 shields, 1 promethium pipe

1850

I've fought against Necrons a couple times with my Orks. I have a few tips I've figured out. It's a tough fight, if you win (or get close to winning) it will be by covering more of the board than your opponent and doing well on objectives. Ork shooting against Necrons is like shooting ping pong balls at a brick wall, and Assault isn't much better.

1) Warbosses with Powerklaws are a must, preferably buried in a large unit of Boyz, with a Painboy. You need those S10 hits causing Instant Death. It's one of the only good ways to kill Wraiths, and the other T5 Necron units.

2) Painboys, but you already knew this.

3) MegaNobs are great. Just keep them away from things that can kill them, like Lychguard and Wraiths. DO send them against almost everything else.

4) Don't assault Flayed Ones unless you absolutely have to. Stay away from them if possible, they'll cause very heavy casualties in a Boyz squad.

I feel like I login to every thread to say tankbustas

Because str 8 ap3 that's why

I run Blitz Brigades mostly so my army tends to focus on Tankbustas, Flash Gitz, Boyz, and the Battlewagons have Killkannons. Honestly shooting them to death isn't very effective unless your shooting crons out in the open and can bypass their armor. Lootas are decent VS warriors but your shoota based weapons aren't going to put much of a dent in them. I would take slugga boyz vs crons as you want the most amount of CC attacks to increase the margin of victory in CC to break them in 1 round of combat.

Close combat is where you want to be with volume of attacks to chop through them and try to sweep them in CC (remember your nobz are I3). Nob squads are actually really good vs crons as long as you have some boyz to draw away hits from the nob squad. Meganobz are even better but again its good to have boyz who can sweep the crons after the PKs obliterate their numbers. Crons do not have grenades so if you look like your going to be charged, get some cover between you and them so they go down to I1 (chop them down before they get to swing). The melee crons like flayed ones, wraiths, and lychguard are difficult for orks to handle so use your shooting to try and soften them up. Gang up on units of necrons to try and swamp em with bodies.

dominuschao wrote:
Crons have always been one of my more regular opponents. I'll just echo a few of the sentiments above..

Low ap and high strength weaponry, preferably combined. KMK batteries, SAGs and flash gitz have been my go-to's for awhile.
And of course at least 2 full mobs. This is the core of my list design for orks in general.

The mobs were stellar every time. Skimmers hate having nowhere safe to flit off to and crons lose to mobs outside of a few select units.

I like the lootas suggestion, in theory since I haven't seen them around much since the new dex dropped. That said I used to face a nasty lootas list so if you wanna go completely shameless and aren't opposed to forgeworld then you could try something like this.. if he doesn't have very specific answers its pretty much no win territory:

Mad Morx- beyond thundork dome

HQ
big mek bp, pk, sag, gitfinda, 3 ammo runts, finkin kap
big mek bp, pk, sag, gitfinda, 2 ammo runts
mekboy junka, deff rolla, 3 bs, 2 grot bomms
mekboy junka, deff rolla, 3 bs, 2 grot bomms

ELITES
mekboy junka, deff rolla, 3 bs, 2 grot bomms
mekboy junka, deff rolla, 3 bs, 2 grot bomms
mekboy junka, deff rolla, 3 bs, 2 grot bomms

TROOPS
11 gretchin
11 gretchin

FA
deffkopta
deffkopta

HS
15 lootas, mek, deffguns
15 lootas, mek, deffguns
15 lootas, mek, deffguns

FT
void relay network, 3 generators- 3/3/3 shields, 1 promethium pipe

1850

Does this list use the old rules for the Deff Rolla? Because that would be nice to have.

There is only one thing orks have at their disposal to beat the crons.

Boyz, a serious ff ton amount of boyz. Bully boyz work as well..

Load up your trucks with the bully boyz formation and push the pedal to the metal.. There is your first big threath the crons just cannot ignore. In the meantime run like crazy with mass amounts of boyz. By the time the crons have disposed of your meganobz it is to late. There are to much boyz at their doorstep.

Crons are good, and have good staying power... Besides wraiths and a Lord they do not realy have a reliable CC option. And crons tend to be always outnumbered... Take that weakness and push it to your advantage!

 Waaghboss Grobnub wrote:
There is only one thing orks have at their disposal to beat the crons.

Boyz, a serious ff ton amount of boyz. Bully boyz work as well..

Load up your trucks with the bully boyz formation and push the pedal to the metal.. There is your first big threath the crons just cannot ignore. In the meantime run like crazy with mass amounts of boyz. By the time the crons have disposed of your meganobz it is to late. There are to much boyz at their doorstep.

Crons are good, and have good staying power... Besides wraiths and a Lord they do not realy have a reliable CC option. And crons tend to be always outnumbered... Take that weakness and push it to your advantage!

No good CC option? Lychguard, Praetorians, and of course, Flayed Ones. Flayed Ones especially will annihilate whole units of boys at a time. You need to shoot them.

 krodarklorr wrote:

 Waaghboss Grobnub wrote:
There is only one thing orks have at their disposal to beat the crons.

Boyz, a serious ff ton amount of boyz. Bully boyz work as well..

Load up your trucks with the bully boyz formation and push the pedal to the metal.. There is your first big threath the crons just cannot ignore. In the meantime run like crazy with mass amounts of boyz. By the time the crons have disposed of your meganobz it is to late. There are to much boyz at their doorstep.

Crons are good, and have good staying power... Besides wraiths and a Lord they do not realy have a reliable CC option. And crons tend to be always outnumbered... Take that weakness and push it to your advantage!

No good CC option? Lychguard, Praetorians, and of course, Flayed Ones. Flayed Ones especially will annihilate whole units of boys at a time. You need to shoot them.

Yeah ok, but who playes those units nowadays? All i see is wraiths, oh look wraiths, oh look! Even more wraiths! The opponents i face as crons are ALL shooty armies, so Lychguard are to slow, praetorians to fragile and small groups, and Flayed ones dont even stand a chance.... They all get shot to pieces, so i need fast units.

Does this list use the old rules for the Deff Rolla? Because that would be nice to have.

Yes it does. The rollas really added to its counter punch. A mega dread works decent here too due to the opponent being forced to attack the dome.

 Waaghboss Grobnub wrote:

 krodarklorr wrote:

 Waaghboss Grobnub wrote:
There is only one thing orks have at their disposal to beat the crons.

Boyz, a serious ff ton amount of boyz. Bully boyz work as well..

Load up your trucks with the bully boyz formation and push the pedal to the metal.. There is your first big threath the crons just cannot ignore. In the meantime run like crazy with mass amounts of boyz. By the time the crons have disposed of your meganobz it is to late. There are to much boyz at their doorstep.

Crons are good, and have good staying power... Besides wraiths and a Lord they do not realy have a reliable CC option. And crons tend to be always outnumbered... Take that weakness and push it to your advantage!

No good CC option? Lychguard, Praetorians, and of course, Flayed Ones. Flayed Ones especially will annihilate whole units of boys at a time. You need to shoot them.

Yeah ok, but who playes those units nowadays? All i see is wraiths, oh look wraiths, oh look! Even more wraiths! The opponents i face as crons are ALL shooty armies, so Lychguard are to slow, praetorians to fragile and small groups, and Flayed ones dont even stand a chance.... They all get shot to pieces, so i need fast units.

This is the first place I have seen Necron unit referred to as "fragile."

Alcibiades wrote:

 Waaghboss Grobnub wrote:

 krodarklorr wrote:

 Waaghboss Grobnub wrote:
There is only one thing orks have at their disposal to beat the crons.

Boyz, a serious ff ton amount of boyz. Bully boyz work as well..

Load up your trucks with the bully boyz formation and push the pedal to the metal.. There is your first big threath the crons just cannot ignore. In the meantime run like crazy with mass amounts of boyz. By the time the crons have disposed of your meganobz it is to late. There are to much boyz at their doorstep.

Crons are good, and have good staying power... Besides wraiths and a Lord they do not realy have a reliable CC option. And crons tend to be always outnumbered... Take that weakness and push it to your advantage!

No good CC option? Lychguard, Praetorians, and of course, Flayed Ones. Flayed Ones especially will annihilate whole units of boys at a time. You need to shoot them.

Yeah ok, but who playes those units nowadays? All i see is wraiths, oh look wraiths, oh look! Even more wraiths! The opponents i face as crons are ALL shooty armies, so Lychguard are to slow, praetorians to fragile and small groups, and Flayed ones dont even stand a chance.... They all get shot to pieces, so i need fast units.

This is the first place I have seen Necron unit referred to as "fragile."

Yeah well, crons are easy to beat if you know what to do and a bit of luck. 4+ armour save is Mweh, not good, not bad, and a 5++ rean roll is nice, but 2/3 chance to fail. And there is a serious amount of ap4/3/2 out there. Destroyer attacks, which eldar so lovely like to spam make even shorter work of your crons. Fragile might have been a poor word choice, but in the games i have seen crons tend to go down quite fast,... unless i play... i throw a unreal amount of sixes and fives.... to great frustration of my opponents

Waaghboss, I see 1-2, 10-20 man units of flayed ones every game and they are terrifying. There is always one unit of lytchguard and usually 1 unit of deep striking praetorians...

And we are orc players not Eldar. I don't care what is fragile to an OP codex. I care only about what the op wanted, which is how we Orcs compete against their vastly superior rules.

And like I said before, play Maelstrom matches gives us a huge opportunity to win. Case in point, Monday I played my buddy who plays Necron. Turn 6 when the game ended I had a Morkanaut, 9boys w/nob and 2cans left. (I was trying out what kooai had said) and he had most of his army left. I won 8-2. All he had was first blood (a trukk) and slay the warlord.

Tactical objectives able to be gained while we have units on the board are our friends. If we are counting on winning by objectives at the end of the game... We're sol.