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2020/01/17 16:07:54
Subject: First Look Photos: BBC America’s ‘The Watch’ Starring Richard Dormer (Discworld)
BBC America has revealed first-look images from new series The Watch. Comprised of eight episodes, The Watch began filming in Cape Town, South Africa in September and is part of BBC America’s 2020 slate that includes the Emmy®-nominated Killing Eve, Jodie Whittaker’s second season of Doctor Who and Seven Worlds, One Planet, presented by Sir David Attenborough.
Set in a fictional city where crime has been legalized, The Watch is a genre-busting series that follows a group of misfit cops as they rise up from decades of helplessness to save their corrupt city from catastrophe. Uniquely anarchic and thrillingly entertaining, the character-driven drama follows several of Terry Pratchett’s best-loved creations from his “Discworld” novels on a riotous and emotional odyssey. The cast includes Game of Thrones’ Richard Dormer as Captain Sam Vimes, Adam Hugill as Constable Carrot, Jo Eaton-Kent as Constable Cheery, Marama Corlett as Corporal Angua, Lara Rossi as Lady Sybil Ramkin and Sam Adewunmi as Carcer Dun.
Dormer stars as Sam Vimes, Captain of The Watch, disempowered by a broken society that’s reduced his department’s jurisdiction to almost nothing. Jo Eaton-Kent is Constable Cheery, the ingenious non-binary forensics expert, ostracized by their kin and finding a new home and identity. Adam Hugill plays Constable Carrot, the idealistic new recruit, raised by dwarfs, but really a human abandoned at birth. Marama Corlett is the mysterious Corporal Angua who is tasked with Carrot’s training and keeping the rookie alive. Lara Rossi plays the formidable Lady Sybil Ramkin, last scion of Ankh-Morpork’s nobility, who’s trying to fix the city’s wrongs with her chaotic vigilantism.
BBC America previously announced that Brian Kelly (Outlander) and Emma Sullivan (Doctor Who) have joined Craig Viveiros (Agatha Christie’s And Then There Were None) as directors for the series. The show’s lead writer is Simon Allen (The Musketeers). The Watch is set to premiere in 2020.
Automatically Appended Next Post: I'm getting more of a steampunk / post-apocalypse / "Into the Badlands" vibe from it than Discworld, but time will tell...
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2020/01/17 16:10:08
2020/01/17 16:42:17
Subject: First Look Photos: BBC America’s ‘The Watch’ Starring Richard Dormer (Discworld)
have you sold twenty squillion books full of awesome and cleverness ?
No ?
then why do you think meddling with stuff you clearly don't care to understand was a good idea, you been hanging about with those War of the Worlds dinks...
bugger it millenium hand and shrimp :
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/01/17 17:02:00
"AND YET YOU ACT AS IF THERE IS SOME IDEAL ORDER IN THE WORLD, AS IF THERE IS SOME...SOME RIGHTNESS IN THE UNIVERSE BY WHICH IT MAY BE JUDGED."
2020/01/17 17:08:41
Subject: First Look Photos: BBC America’s ‘The Watch’ Starring Richard Dormer (Discworld)
Well that's a very, original, take on Discworld. I'm getting 80s American urban TV style gangs and films vibe from it rather than Discworld or Steampunk.
Whilst you can argue that Discworld is indeed on the industrial march so much just looks wrong. Spraycan graffitie - the little beads holding onto his badge (exceptionally American style); heck there's an electric fan in the background.
edit - yeah far as I can tell Discworld didn't have electricity yet - even by the end of the last books as it was pushing further forward in industry it was still a pre-electrical world. They had magic, of course; and things like Icongraphs (cameras with an imp that paints the picture of what it sees through the lens). Even in Moving Pictures it was Imp powered photography. IT was very much at least just getting to hit the Steam Punk era after a heavy fantasy outset.
I think even the massive computer in the Unseen University was powered by mice and other oddities rather than any kind of proper electricity
I just, well, I yeah I'm kinda lost for words on this interpretation.
Edit - I mean this might be cool to watch, but its looking increasingly like its NOT Discworld.
Edit 2 - Carrot is wearing a chainmail shirt that hasn't even freaking got buttons to do it up. It's an open front chain mail shirt! I mean chain mail in movies and media has a spotty history with the likes of the chain mail bikini and such; but freaking heck how beyond pointless is a chain mail shirt with the front exposed of ANY use?!
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2020/01/17 17:23:29
I was incredibly sceptical and cynical when I heard the plans for the adaption, now I'm straight up taking a hard pass.
I wish them the very best of luck, because they appear to sincerely need it.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/01/17 18:15:20
Mandorallen turned back toward the insolently sneering baron. 'My Lord,' The great knight said distantly, 'I find thy face apelike and thy form misshapen. Thy beard, moreover, is an offence against decency, resembling more closely the scabrous fur which doth decorate the hinder portion of a mongrel dog than a proper adornment for a human face. Is it possibly that thy mother, seized by some wild lechery, did dally at some time past with a randy goat?' - Mimbrate Knight Protector Mandorallen.
Excerpt from "Seeress of Kell", Book Five of The Malloreon series by David Eddings.
"You need not fear us, unless you are a dark heart, a vile one who preys on the innocent; I promise, you can’t hide forever in the empty darkness, for we will hunt you down like the animals you are, and pull you into the very bowels of hell." Iron - Within Temptation
2020/01/17 18:39:27
Subject: First Look Photos: BBC America’s ‘The Watch’ Starring Richard Dormer (Discworld)
I recognize basically nothing in those photographs.
I presume the tall redhead is Carrot. Somehow the short blonde is... Angua, and not Cheery. Ok then.
Jo Eaton-Kent is a weird choice for Cheery, since the primary arc of the character is wanting to have an open and defined gender identity, unlike most dwarfs (and gets ostracized for that). Doing it backwards confuses the message immensely.
Lady Ramkin is a vigilante? (And normal sized. Which.. ugh. So much of her character is bound to the contrast between her size and noble breeding and her compassion and affability with average people)
What are the armored creatures with crossbow guy supposed to be? They're far too small for trolls, orcs don't really exist outside a football player at UU, and goblins are tiny and flowing with mucus.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/01/17 18:44:08
Efficiency is the highest virtue.
2020/01/17 19:32:15
Subject: First Look Photos: BBC America’s ‘The Watch’ Starring Richard Dormer (Discworld)
I am not sure what the person engulfed in flames in the picture with Lady Ramkin is about either.. (getting hurt, yes, but .. how?)
It might be dragon flame with a CGI dragon to come?
Pretty sure its a shot of her in the dragon pens when the burglar gets cooked. The "hole" in the floor is likely what theyve translated an individual "stall" to.
2020/01/20 09:06:02
Subject: Re:First Look Photos: BBC America’s ‘The Watch’ Starring Richard Dormer (Discworld)
Ok, the bad first. That looks absolutely nothing like the Discworld. I didn't expect it to look exactly like Kidby's drawings, but thought at least it would go in that direction.
The good: I still think it looks interesting and will definitely give it a watch. But seeing how everything looks like, they should have just said that this is a very loose adaption.
2020/01/20 09:27:22
Subject: Re:First Look Photos: BBC America’s ‘The Watch’ Starring Richard Dormer (Discworld)
Just re-reading all of Discworld atm. Hard pass on this. I was unlikely to watch this anyway, but definite nope with these visuals.
Adaptation does not have to slavishly follow the original, but most of these changes seem to be for reasons of budget and marketing rather than quality, and that makes me think the end product will be poor quality.
Viterbi wrote: But seeing how everything looks like, they should have just said that this is a very loose adaption.
Well, people do keep saying it's 'Inspired by' not 'Based on'.
Thanks, interesting article, I didn't know that Rhianna and Rob weren't involved anymore. But I have to say, even under "Inspired by" one would expect a little more resemblance to the source material.
2020/01/20 10:34:17
Subject: First Look Photos: BBC America’s ‘The Watch’ Starring Richard Dormer (Discworld)
It looks like another where they've taken some names from a well-known setting and slapped them onto a generic story.
The Dwarven 'ambiguity' of Cheery has been lost.
Angua does not look to be the imposing woman she is usually described as.
There's been no mention here yet of Vetinari. Too many big changes, and we don't yet know why.
But yeah, where is the magic?
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/01/20 10:55:14
I’m broadly open to this show in itself not being cack. But, going on the character descriptions I’ve concern they’ve rather missed the point of Vimes and the Night Watch.
See, when we first meet Sam Vimes, he’s the burnt out, alcoholic Copper, aided solely by Sgt Colon and Nobby Nobbs. The Night Watch is a joke, and going nowhere.
But over the life of the novels, we see Vimes improve everything. He gets on the wagon, reforges The Watch, marries Lady Sybil, and deals with Ankh-Morpork becoming ever more modern, and all the trouble it brings.
Much of his journey is confronting his own (self confessed) bigotry toward other species.
Angua and Cheery Littlebottom are both key players here, as Igor, Detritus et al.
And for Ankh-Morpork to truly live, I don’t think you can vary too far from the books. Now that doesn’t mean slavishly follow them. Just that you need to keep the central theme. Especially with The Watch.
And here I see mention of John Keel. Let’s just say he’s kind of central to a young Vimes...
In short. The show might be good. Certainly I’ve no reason to currently believe otherwise. But Discworld it is not. Too much variation from the source material.
Fed up of Scalpers? But still want your Exclusives? Why not join us?
I have no emotional attachment to Discworld, and have never read the novels, and all I can say is that everything I've heard, read, and seen about this series makes me have zero interest in it whatsoever. The description of the series and characters here actually makes the whole thing sound like a lazy reinvent of Gotham, and I can't help but feel like Discworld is supposed to be something very much not that from what I know about it.
But, much as you can read Discworld in any order, I feel jumping in with Night Watch is a mistake.
Agreed. In fact reading the books out of order you miss out on ever so much.
Whilst he made each book a stand alone novel, they all interlink with each other. Elements and themes established in one book carry over into the ones that follow. This is both relevant for seeing the world and characters evolve and change, but also for running jokes and themes that spread through the series. Thats before you get to the subtle in-jokes that Terry wove into each story that fit to its central theme for the book. "watch" "witch" and a few other long running mini-series focus on specific characters that you see evolve and develop as well. Like casual unofficial series within the whole.
As for someone having not read them the only advice I can say its to go out and get The Colour of Magic and make a start reading them
Also for all the "inspired by" comments I don't think you can claim that your series is "inspired by" when you slap the series title right onto your own creation. If you call your creation the same name and such then its based on not inspired by - even if you then start to shout about it being inspired by later in the marketing. If they'd called this "The Police Watch" and then renamed all the characters chances are it would be stronger in itself and as a product because it wouldn't slave itself to themes and ideas and preconceptions that its clearly not intending to actually follow through on.
As for those about Cheery’s gender? It’s kinda close to book Cheery. And indeed all Dwarfs.
See, all Dwarfs are male. Even the mothers. Clearly some must be female, but traditionally it’s not discussed. So Cheery being openly female was a bit of a cultural revolution.
Fed up of Scalpers? But still want your Exclusives? Why not join us?
Cheery is obviously a character that a non-binary or trans person might identify with, as she was a fictional character going against her societies ideas about gender (ie. that all dwarves are male).
I think she is a great character, and I can see that they are following the "spirit" of the character, but it seems to me they are trying to make it more ... I dunno, topical, real world related and that seems like a poor reason to change the character.
If the show has lots of that, I am just not gonna enjoy it because Pratchett is dear to my heart and I will not be able to prevent myself from comparing the writing and characterisation in the show to that of the novels.
Da Boss wrote: Cheery is obviously a character that a non-binary or trans person might identify with, as she was a fictional character going against her societies ideas about gender (ie. that all dwarves are male).
I think she is a great character, and I can see that they are following the "spirit" of the character, but it seems to me they are trying to make it more ... I dunno, topical, real world related and that seems like a poor reason to change the character.
Pratchett's books always had parallels to real-world issues. It was pretty much a central theme of the stories. Making her not actually a dwarf kind of deflates the message, though.
I'm ok with an adaption not sticking closely to the original material, so long as the end result is good... but this particular change just seems like a really odd choice.
2020/01/21 00:14:38
Subject: Re:First Look Photos: BBC America’s ‘The Watch’ Starring Richard Dormer (Discworld)
I second all of the "hmmm" comments; on the one hand not looking like a stock swords and sorcery world could be a good thing, so that it doesn't look like a Game of Thrones rip-off. But it's going to be hard to give up on the classic look from the original artwork.
Likewise, Discworld has always been a "mirror of worlds", to explore alternate takes on concepts and events from the real world. It's been a looong time since the original guard books, so updating it to incorporate modern concepts and issues would be fine, but some of the descriptions coming out don't really bear any resemblance to the original ideas. I'm still curious and would dearly love for this to be a success, to bring a whole new generation to the books, but at the moment I have significant reservations.
Finally, for anyone in the thread who hasn't read the books and is thinking of starting; do not start with the Colour of Magic!! I dearly love it, but it's rather a mess; more of a spoof of DnD and pop-culture fantasy tropes than a true novel. I generally recommend starting with Mort, Guards, Guards or even The Wee Free Men and following their respective series, using this handy chart (spoilered for size):
Zed wrote: *All statements reflect my opinion at this moment. if some sort of pretty new model gets released (or if I change my mind at random) I reserve the right to jump on any bandwagon at will.
2020/01/21 00:31:10
Subject: First Look Photos: BBC America’s ‘The Watch’ Starring Richard Dormer (Discworld)
I rather enjoyed the Colour of Magic. I get that its not as good as his latter books and that the series grows in power (quite quickly) but I don't discount it so quickly as some.
I think its a good starting point because whilst it is a bit of satire on fantasy its also the real last age of fantasy for Discworld - you can see the fantasy world within it that the Disc once was and you can see the very beginning of the world making big changes and starting to take those all important steps.
So...I feel the previous Discworld TV stuff has been pretty hit-and-miss, mainly due to some pretty serious pacing issues, IMO. Having something "inspired by" initially seemed like a good idea, especially for an ongoing TV series. But this just looks really weird and not in a good way. The world seems a little too up-to-date, which is concerning when one of the really interesting things from the DW books was the parallels and unique divergences from our own world, often with that signature dose of DW ingenuity/pragmatism. I'm not seeing much of that here, though admittedly it's hard to tell from a bunch of stills.
Then there are the characters themselves. I'm not one to demand everyone looks exactly the same as they're described in the novels and I think character/attitude is more important than looks in the long run. But this seems really jarring, especially Sybil, Angua and Cheery. Their looks are actually a key part of their character in a lot of cases, mainly through how Sybil and Angua subvert expectations based on their appearances and being a Dwarf is a key part of Cheery's character but I can see how in Cheery's case you can transpose some of those details while still keeping the core of the character intact. My worry right now in Cheery's case is that the producers seem to be parading the non-binary part of the character very heavily and I have little confidence they're going to be playing that off in any more than token fashion. I'll be pleasantly surprised if they do.
Lots of warning signs and alarm bells so far with this. Definitely a case of wait and see but it's not looking good so far.
2020/01/21 12:18:01
Subject: First Look Photos: BBC America’s ‘The Watch’ Starring Richard Dormer (Discworld)
I think the thing that clashes most for me is the electric fan in the Watch office (but then, is it actually electric). I'm still keen to see the show. I'm happy to accept the more steampunky look to a 'late era' Discworld and to avoid a 'comedy Game of Thrones' look.
2020/01/21 12:23:04
Subject: First Look Photos: BBC America’s ‘The Watch’ Starring Richard Dormer (Discworld)
MarkNorfolk wrote: I think the thing that clashes most for me is the electric fan in the Watch office (but then, is it actually electric). I'm still keen to see the show. I'm happy to accept the more steampunky look to a 'late era' Discworld and to avoid a 'comedy Game of Thrones' look.
I sort of get the worry about a comedy GoT look but I think Ankh-Morpork is such a richly detailed city that's a character in its own right it seems a little odd to change it so much. And if the production designers can't make Ankh-Morpork look unique and interesting without it coming off as a parody of something else that would be a big red flag for me if I was financing the production.
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