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Does anyone know if the index will have items, spells and commands for each faction?

Or will we have to wait for each individual codex?

Thanks.

zamerion wrote:
Does anyone know if the index will have items, spells and commands for each faction?

Or will we have to wait for each individual codex?

Thanks.

We don't know yet. Personally i think there'll be a small amount of faction specific stuff in the indexes, maybe faction specific Strategems, but not the full works of stuff that a full Codex would have. But that's speculation!

zamerion wrote:
Does anyone know if the index will have items, spells and commands for each faction?

Or will we have to wait for each individual codex?

Thanks.

The Indexes are complete 8th Ed updates for all existing factions. I imagine these are more like the 5th-6th Ed erratas than a true codex, simply relisting every weapon and model profile in the new format, as well as new rules, power levels and points totals. I am not sure if they'll include new weapons, but every current weapon and unit in the game will get 8th Ed rules. There'll also be new psychic powers and special rules for each faction as the old ones simply are invalidated for the most part.

One thing I would say is that there are unlikely to be any new units, as GW doesn't produce rules for models that are not yet on shelves due to the Chapterhouse lawsuit. We haven't seen any new models apart from the Primaris Marines, so don't expect Xenos 1, Xenos 2 or Imperium 2 Indexes to have any new units, and don't expect any new units in the Chaos and Space Marine Imperium 1 Indexes besides those in the starter kit or already teased (like Primaris Marine Dreadnoughts and other vehicles)

I've been against GW basically for the last 2 years of release, but hell I'm hyped about the 8th.
Still I'll miss challenges and falling back as for the epic sensation of playing :(

 Emicrania wrote:
I've been against GW basically for the last 2 years of release, but hell I'm hyped about the 8th.
Still I'll miss challenges and falling back as for the epic sensation of playing :(

You can still fall back. It happens on your say so now during combats.

Damn the OP is getting long!
If you want to see how much writing there is in there, press quote and start scrolling!!!
Please don't press send after pressing quote though...


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Emicrania wrote:
I've been against GW basically for the last 2 years of release, but hell I'm hyped about the 8th.
Still I'll miss challenges and falling back as for the epic sensation of playing :(

Hopefully your opponent will be happy to forge the narrative with you, and let you meet your characters meet in the middle

 JohnnyHell wrote:

 Matt.Kingsley wrote:

 wuestenfux wrote:
Thanks!

The Free Core Rules are 12 pages long and contain the basics.

So the free part of the edition looks more like a concession to the gamers than anything else.

Yeah it basically the "Hey is this big, expensive rulebook holding you back from playing? Then don't worry, you can play a heavily stripped down version of the ruleset for some mindless fun."
Useful as a tool to get new or old, old players back that are looking for nothing more than a bit of fun, but for someone more invested in the system as a whole? Not so much.

At the same time though, it's not like that's a bad thing. It still has everything you need to play (aside from unit rules, given there's 0 clarification as to whether they'll also be available as a free download), and compared to the Age of Sigmar rules, the 40k ones even come with a mission!

How is it 'heavily stripped down... for some mindless fun'? It isn't. Scenarios, playstyles (eg Cityfight), missions may add layers of nuance, but the rules are the same. Nothing is stripped down. Rather the reverse - you add complexity if you want it. The "Cityfight Maelstrom Matched Play" Starbucks-length-title format is not inherently 'better' or the default... that's part of their move to Three Ways To Play. Indeed, I see myself using that type of game infrequently.

I never said such a thing was the default.... but it is still a stripped down version of Open Play and as a whole still a stripped down version of the full rules.
But let's be real here, for many people Matched Play or Narrative Play will be the defaults.

 Emicrania wrote:
Still I'll miss challenges

As characters no longer join units, every combat is a challenge!

 xttz wrote:

 Emicrania wrote:
Still I'll miss challenges

As characters no longer join units, every combat is a challenge!

This new rule sounds rather strange.
How do we hide HQs in an army? It appears that each HQ will need a retinue to be viable.

 JohnnyHell wrote:

 Matt.Kingsley wrote:

 wuestenfux wrote:
Thanks!

Schnippity

How is it 'heavily stripped down... for some mindless fun'? It isn't. Scenarios, playstyles (eg Cityfight), missions may add layers of nuance, but the rules are the same. Nothing is stripped down. Rather the reverse - you add complexity if you want it. The "Cityfight Maelstrom Matched Play" Starbucks-length-title format is not inherently 'better' or the default... that's part of their move to Three Ways To Play. Indeed, I see myself using that type of game infrequently.

I never said such a thing was the default.... but it is still a stripped down version of Open Play and as a whole still a stripped down version of the full rules.
But let's be real here, for many people Matched Play or Narrative Play will be the defaults.

Oh for sure. I just dispute 'heavily stripped down' when the whole core game is intact and only really cover rules and missions will change. It was too loaded a choice of words to me, is all. It's simpler, not stripped down. And isn't the core rules Open Play? Just keen on accuracy amidst so much angst in this thread. :-)

 wuestenfux wrote:

This new rule sounds rather strange.
How do we hide HQs in an army? It appears that each HQ will need a retinue to be viable.

A unit firing trying to fire at a character can only target them if the character is the closest enemy unit to the firing unit. Basically, plonk a character in the middle of a unit/few units and you're good to go for the most part. It sounds like bodyguards will just flat out not let enemies target characters unless they are all dead.

I've had a confirmation that the prices listed earlier are correct / a wee bit cheaper.

Here are the prices in €, for other currencies, tough titties.

Starter set: €125,-
Rulebook: €45,-
Tactical objective cards: €10,-
Sector Imperialis - objectives: €25,-
Command Dice: €15,-
Wound Tracker: €10,-
Index Books: €20,-
Combat Gauge: €8,-

Also mentioned are..

Death Guard Green spray: €15,50
Death Guard Green base paint : €3,30

Caederes wrote:

 wuestenfux wrote:

xttz wrote:As characters no longer join units, every combat is a challenge

This new rule sounds rather strange.
How do we hide HQs in an army? It appears that each HQ will need a retinue to be viable.

A unit firing trying to fire at a character can only target them if the character is the closest enemy unit to the firing unit. Basically, plonk a character in the middle of a unit/few units and you're good to go for the most part. It sounds like bodyguards will just flat out not let enemies target characters unless they are all dead.

Note this ONLY applies is the character has base wounds 10 or less. If they have base wounds 11 or higher, you can target them as you please.

BrookM wrote:I've had a confirmation that the prices listed earlier are correct / a wee bit cheaper.

Here are the prices in €, for other currencies, tough titties.

Core set: €125,-
Rulebook: €45,-
Tactical objective cards: €10,-
Sector Imperialis - objectives: €25,-
Command Dice: €15,-
Wound Tracker: €10,-
Index Books: €20,-
Combat Gauge: €8,-

Also mentioned are..

Death Guard Green spray: €15,50
Death Guard Green base paint : €3,30

Core set, is that all of the listed bundled? Rulebook, 2 objective card sets, command dice, wound track and combat gauge? What does a €20 Index translate to in GBP? £15 or £20?

 wuestenfux wrote:

 xttz wrote:

 Emicrania wrote:
Still I'll miss challenges

As characters no longer join units, every combat is a challenge!

This new rule sounds rather strange.
How do we hide HQs in an army? It appears that each HQ will need a retinue to be viable.

Check this out:
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/05/09/new-warhammer-40000-characters-may9gw-homepage-post-4/

They later revealed that snipers would have a role by ignoring that rule to pick off characters.

 Deadshot wrote:
Core set, is that all of the listed bundled? Rulebook, 2 objective card sets, command dice, wound track and combat gauge? What does a €20 Index translate to in GBP? £15 or £20?

Core set = starter set. Edited my post to avoid further confusion.

As for other prices, go check any of the GW sites that use € as its currency and compare to one with your currency of choice.

 JohnnyHell wrote:

Spoiler:

 Matt.Kingsley wrote:

 wuestenfux wrote:
Thanks!

Schnippity

How is it 'heavily stripped down... for some mindless fun'? It isn't. Scenarios, playstyles (eg Cityfight), missions may add layers of nuance, but the rules are the same. Nothing is stripped down. Rather the reverse - you add complexity if you want it. The "Cityfight Maelstrom Matched Play" Starbucks-length-title format is not inherently 'better' or the default... that's part of their move to Three Ways To Play. Indeed, I see myself using that type of game infrequently.

I never said such a thing was the default.... but it is still a stripped down version of Open Play and as a whole still a stripped down version of the full rules.
But let's be real here, for many people Matched Play or Narrative Play will be the defaults.

Oh for sure. I just dispute 'heavily stripped down' when the whole core game is intact and only really cover rules and missions will change. It was too loaded a choice of words to me, is all. It's simpler, not stripped down. And isn't the core rules Open Play? Just keen on accuracy amidst so much angst in this thread. :-)

It's Open Play with 1/4 of the Missions.

Unless there's more to Open Play in the Main Rulebook that we don't know.

 BrookM wrote:

 Deadshot wrote:
Core set, is that all of the listed bundled? Rulebook, 2 objective card sets, command dice, wound track and combat gauge? What does a €20 Index translate to in GBP? £15 or £20?

Core set = starter set. Edited my post to avoid further confusion.

As for other prices, go check any of the GW sites that use € as its currency and compare to one with your currency of choice.

Starter set, got it, cheers!

For the Indexes though it doesn't work as GW uses brackets and not straight comparison. A €20 model or terrain kit wouldn't necessarily be the same in GDP as a €20 Index..

 BrookM wrote:
I've had a confirmation that the prices listed earlier are correct / a wee bit cheaper.

Here are the prices in €, for other currencies, tough titties.

Starter set: €125,-
Rulebook: €45,-
Tactical objective cards: €10,-
Sector Imperialis - objectives: €25,-
Command Dice: €15,-
Wound Tracker: €10,-
Index Books: €20,-
Combat Gauge: €8,-

Also mentioned are..

Death Guard Green spray: €15,50
Death Guard Green base paint : €3,30

Basically lines up with what I had posted for USD.

Weird though, as that didn't line up with the prices some retailers were posting.

Also:
YAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY Death Guard Green Spray! Do you know when that comes out, Brook?

 Kanluwen wrote:
YAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY Death Guard Green Spray! Do you know when that comes out, Brook?

Same date as the other stuff.

 Deadshot wrote:

 BrookM wrote:

 Deadshot wrote:
Core set, is that all of the listed bundled? Rulebook, 2 objective card sets, command dice, wound track and combat gauge? What does a €20 Index translate to in GBP? £15 or £20?

Core set = starter set. Edited my post to avoid further confusion.

As for other prices, go check any of the GW sites that use € as its currency and compare to one with your currency of choice.

Starter set, got it, cheers!

For the Indexes though it doesn't work as GW uses brackets and not straight comparison. A €20 model or terrain kit wouldn't necessarily be the same in GDP as a €20 Index..

That's why you find a product in the same bracket and go from there...

Anyways, this was the price list we got for GBP:

Dark Imperium Starter Set £95.00
Warhammer 40,000 8th:Rulebook £35
Tactical Objective Cards £8.00
Sector Imperialis Objectives £20
Command Dice £12.50
Wound Trackers £8.00
Combat Gauge £6.00
Indices £15.00 each
Dark Imperium Novel £18.00

Automatically Appended Next Post:

 BrookM wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:
YAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY Death Guard Green Spray! Do you know when that comes out, Brook?

Same date as the other stuff.

But I want it now!

Many thanks for the conversion work Kan, it's that easy indeed, I just couldn't be arsed to do it myself.

 BrookM wrote:
Many thanks for the conversion work Kan, it's that easy indeed, I just couldn't be arsed to do it myself.

That wasn't conversion work, someone(I think MongooseMatt?) had posted it a few days ago.

I posted the US prices a few pages back. I don't have them in front of me at the moment but I recall

Box set $160
Indexes $25

Considerinv the rulebook is a full 280 hardcover that's a reasonable price for the starter, and all the indexes are only as much as 3 codexes last edition

Those prices line up with what my FLGS gave me for my pre-order.

Dark Imperium Starter Set $160.00
Warhammer 40,000 8th:Rulebook $60
Tactical Objective Cards $12.50
Indices $25.00 each

Pretty sure, he said he had to order 20 starter boxes for the store in order to get the Space marine stand-up, the display and the demo starter box for the store.

Just to play all my armies, I need Core Rulebook, Imperial 1, Chaos, Xeno 1 and Tactical Objective Deck. Am glad for the 15% discount to store regulars!

 Matt.Kingsley wrote:

 JohnnyHell wrote:

Spoiler:

 Matt.Kingsley wrote:

 wuestenfux wrote:
Thanks!

Schnippity

How is it 'heavily stripped down... for some mindless fun'? It isn't. Scenarios, playstyles (eg Cityfight), missions may add layers of nuance, but the rules are the same. Nothing is stripped down. Rather the reverse - you add complexity if you want it. The "Cityfight Maelstrom Matched Play" Starbucks-length-title format is not inherently 'better' or the default... that's part of their move to Three Ways To Play. Indeed, I see myself using that type of game infrequently.

I never said such a thing was the default.... but it is still a stripped down version of Open Play and as a whole still a stripped down version of the full rules.
But let's be real here, for many people Matched Play or Narrative Play will be the defaults.

Oh for sure. I just dispute 'heavily stripped down' when the whole core game is intact and only really cover rules and missions will change. It was too loaded a choice of words to me, is all. It's simpler, not stripped down. And isn't the core rules Open Play? Just keen on accuracy amidst so much angst in this thread. :-)

It's Open Play with 1/4 of the Missions.

Unless there's more to Open Play in the Main Rulebook that we don't know.

The free core rules of 8th Edition are literally a heavily stripped down version as compared to the 'full rules' of 8th Edition AND as compared to 7th Edition or most any prior edition. There's no getting around that. Existing gamers expect certain things from 40k... points, for example. The free rules represent a stripped down, super basic version of what people expect. I know A LOT of people who play or have played 40k. I don't know anyone who seriously expects to play any games using just the free rules.

If this is anything like Age of Sigmar, the majority of players won't consider anything other than Matched Play. All organized events will be Matched Play. Some people will play Narrative, but generally only with close friends. Open Play will be rare.

The free rules sort of feel like demo or tutorial rules. "Don't worry about mission objectives or strategems or making sure your armies are balanced. Let's just roll some dice and learn how movement and combat work. You can read up on the full rules after you learn the basics."

 wuestenfux wrote:
Thanks!

The Free Core Rules are 12 pages long and contain the basics.

So the free part of the edition looks more like a concession to the gamers than anything else.

No. As others have stated, it is something that helps new players get into the game.

A lot of board games are now posting rules online as well - so you can check them out - and then decide if you want to get the game.

This is a great idea (well, if you have a good game...).

Player 1 : "Hey, you play that 40k thing, how is it"
Player 2: "I like, it, but check out the rules, they basic game is free online"
Player 1: "Oh, cool, if I like them, I will check it out more...."

So are they just doing indexes so you have your army lists and can play now, but they're still gonna do separate new codexes later? But.. the datasheets for every unit are gonna be free PDFs too right, so you don't really need the books?

I don't really play often, so if that's the case I'd rather stick to PDFs till they put out new codexes for the armies I play.

I'll probably just pick up the rulebook and cards.. starter set is tempting, I'd love to paint all those new models... but I know I'll never get around to it :(

But.. the datasheets for every unit are gonna be free PDFs too right, so you don't really need the books?

I guess you will need the index books since you will find the pt costs in there.
If the data sheets are free as the warscrolls in AoS, I don't know.

 Kriswall wrote:


The free rules sort of feel like demo or tutorial rules. "Don't worry about mission objectives or strategems or making sure your armies are balanced. Let's just roll some dice and learn how movement and combat work. You can read up on the full rules after you learn the basics."

That isn't at all how the free rules are structured. Matched play will still be dominant, of course.

So, points wise. In all honesty, Battlescribe and Army Builder will have them pretty much as soon as the indices are released. Since, Battlescribe is free you could get away with just using it to build your armies.

The dataslates may or may not be available for free online. I haven't see where they said they would be up just like AoS. But, since the rest of the game has gone to the AoS format. That might be a safe bet.

That leaves Stratagems, I am betting someone will do a cheat sheet almost immediately. But, that is the item that you will need from the codices.

They aren't horridly expensive. You should support your local gaming store and buy the one you need for your army.