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Made in us
Shas'ui with Bonding Knife






My guess is North Korea will talk it up, then make crazy demands (I.e. control over South Korea or something) or trump will say something dumb, then peace talks fall apart and North Korea claims it's the US's fault. They don't want to give up their nuke program OR end the war because that's how they've kept power for so long.

DQ:90S++G++M----B--I+Pw40k07+D+++A+++/areWD-R+DM+


bittersashes wrote:One guy down at my gaming club swore he saw an objective flag take out a full unit of Bane Thralls.
 
   
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Assassin with Black Lotus Poison





Bristol

 Wolfblade wrote:
My guess is North Korea will talk it up, then make crazy demands (I.e. control over South Korea or something) or trump will say something dumb, then peace talks fall apart and North Korea claims it's the US's fault. They don't want to give up their nuke program OR end the war because that's how they've kept power for so long.


If that was the case, then why bother talking at all in the first place?

The Laws of Thermodynamics:
1) You cannot win. 2) You cannot break even. 3) You cannot stop playing the game.

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The Dread Evil Lord Varlak





 Wolfblade wrote:
My guess is North Korea will talk it up, then make crazy demands (I.e. control over South Korea or something) or trump will say something dumb, then peace talks fall apart and North Korea claims it's the US's fault. They don't want to give up their nuke program OR end the war because that's how they've kept power for so long.


People forget there was a deal made with NK to shut down its nuclear facilities in the mid-90s. It fell apart in the early 00s over details of exactly how much non-nuclear power generation was to be given in place of the shuttered nuclear facility.

It's possible we'll get a similar deal here, with sanctions relief and conventional fuels being given to NK in exchange for NK agreeing to end its nuclear program. And signs are good, at least at this early stage, that NK might be serious about a peace treaty, as they've already conceded the pre-condition that American troops must leave the peninsula as part of a peace treaty.

But then, just like last time just because we get something it doesn't mean it will last. And it may never even get there, Trump has already pissed off Japan and left them outside of the discussion by agreeing to talks without talking to Japan and their key issue of returning abducted citizens. Then after meeting Abe suddenly the abducted people were back on the list of items that must be resolved, so who knows where that is at.

All that said, one thing that actually gives me a weird kind of hope for these debates is Trump's incompetence and indifference to the mess of issues to be resolved. It's given NK and SK far more power to actually settle the matter themselves, Trump just wants to say he made the deal so he might end up just something of a blank cheque for the two Koreas to bank in order to reach terms. But of course maybe not.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 A Town Called Malus wrote:
If that was the case, then why bother talking at all in the first place?


North Korea has a long history of rapid shifts between reconciliation and aggressive posturing. They like the idea of everyone else jumping to their tune. Not saying they're doing it this time (limited evidence points to some genuine efforts on their part), but it wouldn't be out of the ordinary.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/04/20 08:26:55


“We may observe that the government in a civilized country is much more expensive than in a barbarous one; and when we say that one government is more expensive than another, it is the same as if we said that that one country is farther advanced in improvement than another. To say that the government is expensive and the people not oppressed is to say that the people are rich.”

Adam Smith, who must have been some kind of leftie or something. 
   
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Catskills in NYS

 A Town Called Malus wrote:
 Wolfblade wrote:
My guess is North Korea will talk it up, then make crazy demands (I.e. control over South Korea or something) or trump will say something dumb, then peace talks fall apart and North Korea claims it's the US's fault. They don't want to give up their nuke program OR end the war because that's how they've kept power for so long.


If that was the case, then why bother talking at all in the first place?

Because they think they might be able to get something out of it

Homosexuality is the #1 cause of gay marriage.
 kronk wrote:
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 sebster wrote:
Yes, indeed. What a terrible piece of cultural imperialism it is for me to say that a country shouldn't murder its own citizens
 BaronIveagh wrote:
Basically they went from a carrot and stick to a smaller carrot and flanged mace.
 
   
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Tzeentch Aspiring Sorcerer Riding a Disc





 Co'tor Shas wrote:
 A Town Called Malus wrote:
 Wolfblade wrote:
My guess is North Korea will talk it up, then make crazy demands (I.e. control over South Korea or something) or trump will say something dumb, then peace talks fall apart and North Korea claims it's the US's fault. They don't want to give up their nuke program OR end the war because that's how they've kept power for so long.


If that was the case, then why bother talking at all in the first place?

Because they think they might be able to get something out of it

Or more cynically perhaps its plain stalling. Trump's rethoric just might have given them pause, it happened under Bush Jr. too, they tend to feel more threatened and step up diplomacy combined with weapons development. So then this would be just a blatant stalling tactic while they quickly apply upgrades and expand their missile/nuke arsenal. There is a significant difference between a country that might have one or two nukes and one that managed to gather a dozen or so at least.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2018/04/20 09:59:22


Sorry for my spelling. I'm not a native speaker and a dyslexic.
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The Democratic Party has filed a law suit against Trump & friends for interfering in the 2016 election through connections to Russia.

Spoiler:
The Democratic National Committee filed a multimillion-dollar lawsuit Friday against the Russian government, the Trump campaign and the WikiLeaks organization alleging a far-reaching conspiracy to disrupt the 2016 campaign and tilt the election to Donald Trump.

The complaint, filed in federal district court in Manhattan, alleges that top Trump campaign officials conspired with the Russian government and its military spy agency to hurt Democratic presidential nominee Hillary Clinton and help Trump by hacking the computer networks of the Democratic Party and disseminating stolen material found there.

“During the 2016 presidential campaign, Russia launched an all-out assault on our democracy, and it found a willing and active partner in Donald Trump’s campaign,” DNC Chairman Tom Perez said in a statement.

“This constituted an act of unprecedented treachery: the campaign of a nominee for President of the United States in league with a hostile foreign power to bolster its own chance to win the presidency,” he said.

The case asserts that the Russian hacking campaign — combined with Trump associates’ contacts with Russia and the campaign’s public cheerleading of the hacks — amounted to an illegal conspiracy to interfere in the election that caused serious damage to the Democratic Party.

Senate investigators and prosecutors for special counsel Robert S. Mueller III are still investigating whether Trump associates coordinated with the Russian efforts. Last month, House Intelligence Committee Republicans said they found no evidence that President Trump and his affiliates colluded with Russian officials to sway the election or that the Kremlin sought to help him — a conclusion rejected by the panel’s Democrats.
Trump says allegations of collusion are a ’hoax’
0:26 / 2:38
mute
cc disabled

President Trump on April 18 dismissed allegations that his campaign colluded with Russia in the 2016 presidential election. (The Washington Post)

The president has repeatedly rejected any collusion or improper activity by his campaign. This week, he referred again in a tweet to the “phony Russia investigation where, by the way, there was NO COLLUSION (except by the Dems).”

Suing a foreign country may present legal challenges for the Democrats, in part because other nations have immunity from most U.S. lawsuits. The DNC’s complaint argues Russia is not entitled to the protection because the hack constituted a trespass on the party’s private property.

The lawsuit argues that Russia is not entitled to sovereign immunity in this case because “the DNC claims arise out of Russia’s trespass on to the DNC’s private servers . . . in order to steal trade secrets and commit economic espionage.”

The lawsuit echoes a similar legal tactic that the Democratic Party used during the Watergate scandal. In 1972, the DNC filed suit against then-President Richard Nixon’s reelection committee seeking $1 million in damages for the break-in at Democratic headquarters in the Watergate building.

The suit was denounced at the time by Nixon’s attorney general, John Mitchell, who called it a case of “sheer demagoguery” by the DNC. But the civil action brought by the DNC’s then-chairman, Lawrence F. O’Brien, was ultimately successful, yielding a $750,000 settlement from the Nixon campaign that was reached on the day in 1974 that Nixon left office.

The suit filed Friday seeks millions of dollars in compensation to offset damage it claims the party suffered from the hacks. The DNC argues that the cyberattack undermined its ability to communicate with voters, collect donations and operate effectively as its employees faced personal harassment and, in some cases, death threats.

The suit also seeks an acknowledgment from the defendants that they conspired to infiltrate the Democrats’ computers, steal information and disseminate it to influence the election.

To support its case, the lawsuit offers a detailed narrative of the DNC hacks, as well as episodes in which key Trump aides are alleged to have been told Russia held damaging information about Clinton.

[Inside Trump’s financial ties to Russia and his unusual flattery of Vladimir Putin]

Russia engaged in a “brazen attack on U.S. soil” the party alleges, a campaign that began with the cyberhack of its computer networks in 2015 and 2016. Trump campaign officials received repeated outreach from Russia, the suit says.

“Rather than report these repeated messages and communications that Russia intended to interfere in the U.S. election, the Trump campaign and its agents gleefully welcomed Russia’s help,” the party argues

Ultimately, Trump’s associates entered into an agreement with Russian agents “to promote Donald Trump’s candidacy through illegal means,” the suit concludes.

The suit does not name Trump as a defendant. Instead, it targets various Trump aides who met with people believed to be affiliated with Russia during the campaign, including the president’s son, Donald Trump Jr., his son-in-law Jared Kushner, his campaign chairman Paul Manafort and Manafort’s deputy, Rick Gates.

Manafort and Gates were charged with money-laundering, fraud and tax evasion in a case brought by special prosecutors last year. In February, Gates pleaded guilty to conspiracy and lying to the FBI and is cooperating with investigators. Manafort has pleaded not guilty.

The DNC lawsuit also names as a defendant the Russian military intelligence service, the GRU, which has been accused by the U.S. government of orchestrating the hacks, as well as WikiLeaks, which published the DNC’s stolen emails, and the group’s founder Julian Assange.

The lawsuit was also filed against Roger Stone, the longtime Trump confidante who claimed during the campaign that he was in contact with Assange.

[Roger Stone claimed contact with WikiLeaks founder Julian Assange in 2016, according to two associates]

The Trump advisers and associates have denied assisting Russia in its hacking campaign. Stone has denied any communication with Assange or advance knowledge of the document dumps by WikiLeaks, saying his comments about Assange were jokes or exaggerations.

The DNC lawsuit argues that the Russian government and the GRU violated a series of laws by orchestrating the secret intrusion into the Democrats’ computer systems, including statutes to protect trade secrets, prohibit wire tapping and prevent trespassing.

The party said the Trump defendants committed conspiracy through their interaction with Russian agents and their public encouragement of the hacking, with the campaign itself acting as a racketeering enterprise promoting illegal activity.

The complaint was filed on behalf of the party by the law firm of Cohen Milstein.

The suit contains previously undisclosed details, including that the specific date when the Russians breached the DNC computer system: July 27, 2015, according to forensic evidence cited in the filing.

The analysis shows the system was breached again on April 18, 2016. The hackers began siphoning documents and information from DNC systems on April 22. The suit notes that four days later, Trump foreign policy adviser George Papadopoulos was informed by Josef Mifsud, a London-based professor, that the Russians were in possession of thousands of emails that could be damaging to Clinton.

[Top campaign officials knew of Trump adviser’s outreach to Russia]

The list of defendants in the suit includes Papadopoulos and Mifsud, as well as Aras and Emin Agalarov, the wealthy Russian father and son who hosted the Miss Universe Pageant in Moscow in 2013. Trump, who owned the pageant, attended the event.

The Agalarovs also played a role in arranging a meeting for a Russian lawyer at Trump Tower in New York in 2016, at which Donald Trump Jr. had expected to be given damaging information about Clinton.

Scott Balber, an attorney for the Agalarovs, said the allegations about his clients were “frivolous” and “a publicity stunt.”

“They had absolutely nothing to do with any alleged hacking of any Democratic computer system or any interference in the US election.”

The suit alleges that Trump’s personal and professional ties to Russia helped foster the conspiracy.

The DNC’s lawyers wrote that “long standing personal professional and financial ties to Russia and numerous individuals linked to the Russian government provided fertile ground for a conspiracy between the defendants to interfere in the 2016 elections.”

The lawsuit describes how the then-Soviet Union paid for Trump to travel Moscow in the 1980s.

It also details the history of Manafort and Gates, who worked for Russian-friendly factions in the Ukraine before joining the Trump campaign. Prosecutors have said they were in contact in 2016 with Konstantin Kilimnik, a former linguist in the Russian army who the FBI has alleged had ties to Russian intelligence.


Spoiler-quoted for the work blocked.

Is this just bluster or are the Democrats seriously intending to go forward with this?

For thirteen years I had a dog with fur the darkest black. For thirteen years he was my friend, oh how I want him back. 
   
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Building a blood in water scent

Sounds like a make-work program for the DNC lawyers. There should be wide bi-partisan support for these Job Creators.

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What do they have to lose? They aren't as far ahead in the midterm polls as they theoretically should be, so thy probably won't gain control of Congress, and they need Republican support to impeach Trump. If this causes any conflict within the GOP on how to respond, then it accomplished something. Russia and Wikileaks aside, because those won't go anywhere.

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 feeder wrote:
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Curb stomping in the Eye of Terror!

 AlmightyWalrus wrote:
The Democratic Party has filed a law suit against Trump & friends for interfering in the 2016 election through connections to Russia.

Spoiler:
The Democratic National Committee filed a multimillion-dollar lawsuit Friday against the Russian government, the Trump campaign and the WikiLeaks organization alleging a far-reaching conspiracy to disrupt the 2016 campaign and tilt the election to Donald Trump.

The complaint, filed in federal district court in Manhattan, alleges that top Trump campaign officials conspired with the Russian government and its military spy agency to hurt Democratic presidential nominee Hillary Clinton and help Trump by hacking the computer networks of the Democratic Party and disseminating stolen material found there.

“During the 2016 presidential campaign, Russia launched an all-out assault on our democracy, and it found a willing and active partner in Donald Trump’s campaign,” DNC Chairman Tom Perez said in a statement.

“This constituted an act of unprecedented treachery: the campaign of a nominee for President of the United States in league with a hostile foreign power to bolster its own chance to win the presidency,” he said.

The case asserts that the Russian hacking campaign — combined with Trump associates’ contacts with Russia and the campaign’s public cheerleading of the hacks — amounted to an illegal conspiracy to interfere in the election that caused serious damage to the Democratic Party.

Senate investigators and prosecutors for special counsel Robert S. Mueller III are still investigating whether Trump associates coordinated with the Russian efforts. Last month, House Intelligence Committee Republicans said they found no evidence that President Trump and his affiliates colluded with Russian officials to sway the election or that the Kremlin sought to help him — a conclusion rejected by the panel’s Democrats.
Trump says allegations of collusion are a ’hoax’
0:26 / 2:38
mute
cc disabled

President Trump on April 18 dismissed allegations that his campaign colluded with Russia in the 2016 presidential election. (The Washington Post)

The president has repeatedly rejected any collusion or improper activity by his campaign. This week, he referred again in a tweet to the “phony Russia investigation where, by the way, there was NO COLLUSION (except by the Dems).”

Suing a foreign country may present legal challenges for the Democrats, in part because other nations have immunity from most U.S. lawsuits. The DNC’s complaint argues Russia is not entitled to the protection because the hack constituted a trespass on the party’s private property.

The lawsuit argues that Russia is not entitled to sovereign immunity in this case because “the DNC claims arise out of Russia’s trespass on to the DNC’s private servers . . . in order to steal trade secrets and commit economic espionage.”

The lawsuit echoes a similar legal tactic that the Democratic Party used during the Watergate scandal. In 1972, the DNC filed suit against then-President Richard Nixon’s reelection committee seeking $1 million in damages for the break-in at Democratic headquarters in the Watergate building.

The suit was denounced at the time by Nixon’s attorney general, John Mitchell, who called it a case of “sheer demagoguery” by the DNC. But the civil action brought by the DNC’s then-chairman, Lawrence F. O’Brien, was ultimately successful, yielding a $750,000 settlement from the Nixon campaign that was reached on the day in 1974 that Nixon left office.

The suit filed Friday seeks millions of dollars in compensation to offset damage it claims the party suffered from the hacks. The DNC argues that the cyberattack undermined its ability to communicate with voters, collect donations and operate effectively as its employees faced personal harassment and, in some cases, death threats.

The suit also seeks an acknowledgment from the defendants that they conspired to infiltrate the Democrats’ computers, steal information and disseminate it to influence the election.

To support its case, the lawsuit offers a detailed narrative of the DNC hacks, as well as episodes in which key Trump aides are alleged to have been told Russia held damaging information about Clinton.

[Inside Trump’s financial ties to Russia and his unusual flattery of Vladimir Putin]

Russia engaged in a “brazen attack on U.S. soil” the party alleges, a campaign that began with the cyberhack of its computer networks in 2015 and 2016. Trump campaign officials received repeated outreach from Russia, the suit says.

“Rather than report these repeated messages and communications that Russia intended to interfere in the U.S. election, the Trump campaign and its agents gleefully welcomed Russia’s help,” the party argues

Ultimately, Trump’s associates entered into an agreement with Russian agents “to promote Donald Trump’s candidacy through illegal means,” the suit concludes.

The suit does not name Trump as a defendant. Instead, it targets various Trump aides who met with people believed to be affiliated with Russia during the campaign, including the president’s son, Donald Trump Jr., his son-in-law Jared Kushner, his campaign chairman Paul Manafort and Manafort’s deputy, Rick Gates.

Manafort and Gates were charged with money-laundering, fraud and tax evasion in a case brought by special prosecutors last year. In February, Gates pleaded guilty to conspiracy and lying to the FBI and is cooperating with investigators. Manafort has pleaded not guilty.

The DNC lawsuit also names as a defendant the Russian military intelligence service, the GRU, which has been accused by the U.S. government of orchestrating the hacks, as well as WikiLeaks, which published the DNC’s stolen emails, and the group’s founder Julian Assange.

The lawsuit was also filed against Roger Stone, the longtime Trump confidante who claimed during the campaign that he was in contact with Assange.

[Roger Stone claimed contact with WikiLeaks founder Julian Assange in 2016, according to two associates]

The Trump advisers and associates have denied assisting Russia in its hacking campaign. Stone has denied any communication with Assange or advance knowledge of the document dumps by WikiLeaks, saying his comments about Assange were jokes or exaggerations.

The DNC lawsuit argues that the Russian government and the GRU violated a series of laws by orchestrating the secret intrusion into the Democrats’ computer systems, including statutes to protect trade secrets, prohibit wire tapping and prevent trespassing.

The party said the Trump defendants committed conspiracy through their interaction with Russian agents and their public encouragement of the hacking, with the campaign itself acting as a racketeering enterprise promoting illegal activity.

The complaint was filed on behalf of the party by the law firm of Cohen Milstein.

The suit contains previously undisclosed details, including that the specific date when the Russians breached the DNC computer system: July 27, 2015, according to forensic evidence cited in the filing.

The analysis shows the system was breached again on April 18, 2016. The hackers began siphoning documents and information from DNC systems on April 22. The suit notes that four days later, Trump foreign policy adviser George Papadopoulos was informed by Josef Mifsud, a London-based professor, that the Russians were in possession of thousands of emails that could be damaging to Clinton.

[Top campaign officials knew of Trump adviser’s outreach to Russia]

The list of defendants in the suit includes Papadopoulos and Mifsud, as well as Aras and Emin Agalarov, the wealthy Russian father and son who hosted the Miss Universe Pageant in Moscow in 2013. Trump, who owned the pageant, attended the event.

The Agalarovs also played a role in arranging a meeting for a Russian lawyer at Trump Tower in New York in 2016, at which Donald Trump Jr. had expected to be given damaging information about Clinton.

Scott Balber, an attorney for the Agalarovs, said the allegations about his clients were “frivolous” and “a publicity stunt.”

“They had absolutely nothing to do with any alleged hacking of any Democratic computer system or any interference in the US election.”

The suit alleges that Trump’s personal and professional ties to Russia helped foster the conspiracy.

The DNC’s lawyers wrote that “long standing personal professional and financial ties to Russia and numerous individuals linked to the Russian government provided fertile ground for a conspiracy between the defendants to interfere in the 2016 elections.”

The lawsuit describes how the then-Soviet Union paid for Trump to travel Moscow in the 1980s.

It also details the history of Manafort and Gates, who worked for Russian-friendly factions in the Ukraine before joining the Trump campaign. Prosecutors have said they were in contact in 2016 with Konstantin Kilimnik, a former linguist in the Russian army who the FBI has alleged had ties to Russian intelligence.


Spoiler-quoted for the work blocked.

Is this just bluster or are the Democrats seriously intending to go forward with this?

Oohhh... not sure if this is smart.

Discovery will be fun!

Live Ork, Be Ork. or D'Ork!


 
   
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Did Fulgrim Just Behead Ferrus?





Fort Worth, TX

I look forward to Russia's countersuit against the CIA and other US agencies for all of our political meddling over the years.

"Through the darkness of future past, the magician longs to see.
One chants out between two worlds: Fire, walk with me."
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Made in gb
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-

 Tannhauser42 wrote:
I look forward to Russia's countersuit against the CIA and other US agencies for all of our political meddling over the years.


I look forward to the counter counter suit when somebody from the Pentagon demands payment for all those Lend Lease jeeps and trucks.

On another note, the oil price slumped a bit when Trump tweeted about the high price of crude.

I wish Trump would complain about the high cost of miniature wargaming

"Our crops will wither, our children will die piteous
deaths and the sun will be swept from the sky. But is it true?" - Tom Kirby, CEO, Games Workshop Ltd 
   
Made in ca
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Building a blood in water scent

 Do_I_Not_Like_That wrote:
I wish Trump would complain about the high cost of miniature wargaming


He probably loves 40k because of all those God Emperor Trump memes his deluded fanbois were producing.

We were once so close to heaven, St. Peter came out and gave us medals; declaring us "The nicest of the damned".

“Anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that 'my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.'” 
   
Made in us
Stubborn Prosecutor





 AlmightyWalrus wrote:
The Democratic Party has filed a law suit against Trump & friends for interfering in the 2016 election through connections to Russia.

Spoiler:
The Democratic National Committee filed a multimillion-dollar lawsuit Friday against the Russian government, the Trump campaign and the WikiLeaks organization alleging a far-reaching conspiracy to disrupt the 2016 campaign and tilt the election to Donald Trump.

The complaint, filed in federal district court in Manhattan, alleges that top Trump campaign officials conspired with the Russian government and its military spy agency to hurt Democratic presidential nominee Hillary Clinton and help Trump by hacking the computer networks of the Democratic Party and disseminating stolen material found there.

“During the 2016 presidential campaign, Russia launched an all-out assault on our democracy, and it found a willing and active partner in Donald Trump’s campaign,” DNC Chairman Tom Perez said in a statement.

“This constituted an act of unprecedented treachery: the campaign of a nominee for President of the United States in league with a hostile foreign power to bolster its own chance to win the presidency,” he said.

The case asserts that the Russian hacking campaign — combined with Trump associates’ contacts with Russia and the campaign’s public cheerleading of the hacks — amounted to an illegal conspiracy to interfere in the election that caused serious damage to the Democratic Party.

Senate investigators and prosecutors for special counsel Robert S. Mueller III are still investigating whether Trump associates coordinated with the Russian efforts. Last month, House Intelligence Committee Republicans said they found no evidence that President Trump and his affiliates colluded with Russian officials to sway the election or that the Kremlin sought to help him — a conclusion rejected by the panel’s Democrats.
Trump says allegations of collusion are a ’hoax’
0:26 / 2:38
mute
cc disabled

President Trump on April 18 dismissed allegations that his campaign colluded with Russia in the 2016 presidential election. (The Washington Post)

The president has repeatedly rejected any collusion or improper activity by his campaign. This week, he referred again in a tweet to the “phony Russia investigation where, by the way, there was NO COLLUSION (except by the Dems).”

Suing a foreign country may present legal challenges for the Democrats, in part because other nations have immunity from most U.S. lawsuits. The DNC’s complaint argues Russia is not entitled to the protection because the hack constituted a trespass on the party’s private property.

The lawsuit argues that Russia is not entitled to sovereign immunity in this case because “the DNC claims arise out of Russia’s trespass on to the DNC’s private servers . . . in order to steal trade secrets and commit economic espionage.”

The lawsuit echoes a similar legal tactic that the Democratic Party used during the Watergate scandal. In 1972, the DNC filed suit against then-President Richard Nixon’s reelection committee seeking $1 million in damages for the break-in at Democratic headquarters in the Watergate building.

The suit was denounced at the time by Nixon’s attorney general, John Mitchell, who called it a case of “sheer demagoguery” by the DNC. But the civil action brought by the DNC’s then-chairman, Lawrence F. O’Brien, was ultimately successful, yielding a $750,000 settlement from the Nixon campaign that was reached on the day in 1974 that Nixon left office.

The suit filed Friday seeks millions of dollars in compensation to offset damage it claims the party suffered from the hacks. The DNC argues that the cyberattack undermined its ability to communicate with voters, collect donations and operate effectively as its employees faced personal harassment and, in some cases, death threats.

The suit also seeks an acknowledgment from the defendants that they conspired to infiltrate the Democrats’ computers, steal information and disseminate it to influence the election.

To support its case, the lawsuit offers a detailed narrative of the DNC hacks, as well as episodes in which key Trump aides are alleged to have been told Russia held damaging information about Clinton.

[Inside Trump’s financial ties to Russia and his unusual flattery of Vladimir Putin]

Russia engaged in a “brazen attack on U.S. soil” the party alleges, a campaign that began with the cyberhack of its computer networks in 2015 and 2016. Trump campaign officials received repeated outreach from Russia, the suit says.

“Rather than report these repeated messages and communications that Russia intended to interfere in the U.S. election, the Trump campaign and its agents gleefully welcomed Russia’s help,” the party argues

Ultimately, Trump’s associates entered into an agreement with Russian agents “to promote Donald Trump’s candidacy through illegal means,” the suit concludes.

The suit does not name Trump as a defendant. Instead, it targets various Trump aides who met with people believed to be affiliated with Russia during the campaign, including the president’s son, Donald Trump Jr., his son-in-law Jared Kushner, his campaign chairman Paul Manafort and Manafort’s deputy, Rick Gates.

Manafort and Gates were charged with money-laundering, fraud and tax evasion in a case brought by special prosecutors last year. In February, Gates pleaded guilty to conspiracy and lying to the FBI and is cooperating with investigators. Manafort has pleaded not guilty.

The DNC lawsuit also names as a defendant the Russian military intelligence service, the GRU, which has been accused by the U.S. government of orchestrating the hacks, as well as WikiLeaks, which published the DNC’s stolen emails, and the group’s founder Julian Assange.

The lawsuit was also filed against Roger Stone, the longtime Trump confidante who claimed during the campaign that he was in contact with Assange.

[Roger Stone claimed contact with WikiLeaks founder Julian Assange in 2016, according to two associates]

The Trump advisers and associates have denied assisting Russia in its hacking campaign. Stone has denied any communication with Assange or advance knowledge of the document dumps by WikiLeaks, saying his comments about Assange were jokes or exaggerations.

The DNC lawsuit argues that the Russian government and the GRU violated a series of laws by orchestrating the secret intrusion into the Democrats’ computer systems, including statutes to protect trade secrets, prohibit wire tapping and prevent trespassing.

The party said the Trump defendants committed conspiracy through their interaction with Russian agents and their public encouragement of the hacking, with the campaign itself acting as a racketeering enterprise promoting illegal activity.

The complaint was filed on behalf of the party by the law firm of Cohen Milstein.

The suit contains previously undisclosed details, including that the specific date when the Russians breached the DNC computer system: July 27, 2015, according to forensic evidence cited in the filing.

The analysis shows the system was breached again on April 18, 2016. The hackers began siphoning documents and information from DNC systems on April 22. The suit notes that four days later, Trump foreign policy adviser George Papadopoulos was informed by Josef Mifsud, a London-based professor, that the Russians were in possession of thousands of emails that could be damaging to Clinton.

[Top campaign officials knew of Trump adviser’s outreach to Russia]

The list of defendants in the suit includes Papadopoulos and Mifsud, as well as Aras and Emin Agalarov, the wealthy Russian father and son who hosted the Miss Universe Pageant in Moscow in 2013. Trump, who owned the pageant, attended the event.

The Agalarovs also played a role in arranging a meeting for a Russian lawyer at Trump Tower in New York in 2016, at which Donald Trump Jr. had expected to be given damaging information about Clinton.

Scott Balber, an attorney for the Agalarovs, said the allegations about his clients were “frivolous” and “a publicity stunt.”

“They had absolutely nothing to do with any alleged hacking of any Democratic computer system or any interference in the US election.”

The suit alleges that Trump’s personal and professional ties to Russia helped foster the conspiracy.

The DNC’s lawyers wrote that “long standing personal professional and financial ties to Russia and numerous individuals linked to the Russian government provided fertile ground for a conspiracy between the defendants to interfere in the 2016 elections.”

The lawsuit describes how the then-Soviet Union paid for Trump to travel Moscow in the 1980s.

It also details the history of Manafort and Gates, who worked for Russian-friendly factions in the Ukraine before joining the Trump campaign. Prosecutors have said they were in contact in 2016 with Konstantin Kilimnik, a former linguist in the Russian army who the FBI has alleged had ties to Russian intelligence.


Spoiler-quoted for the work blocked.

Is this just bluster or are the Democrats seriously intending to go forward with this?


They've been planning this since the election. It's the whole reason they've investigated, attacked, and flipped every alley he has. Now they've nailed his higher ups and his lawyers, they've laid the ground for an impeachment trial. The hope is that will cow Pence from attempting to continue trump's policies. If that doesn't work they impeach him based on his connection to trump. It's a big chance for a win if they can keep this senate majority.

Bender wrote:* Realise that despite the way people talk, this is not a professional sport played by demi gods, but rather a game of toy soldiers played by tired, inebriated human beings.


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Everyone... please read the DNC's court documents...

Its... freaking hysterical and will likely be thrown out before the discovery phase.

The main thrust of the complaint is, I think, is when the DNC’s servers were hacked. It first happened in July 2015 and then again in April 2016... which they say impacted their own ability to fundraise successfully and communicate confidentially with others.

Are these the same servers that the DNC refused to let the FBI inspect?

Also...they're going for RICO.

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I thought the 'hack' was when an aide left a "not" off of the "Do not open this" note regarding a Russian phishing email?

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 feeder wrote:
I thought the 'hack' was when an aide left a "not" off of the "Do not open this" note regarding a Russian phishing email?

I don't think it's publicly clear... only that Podesta was a victim of an email phishing hack.

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 AlmightyWalrus wrote:
The Democratic Party has filed a law suit against Trump & friends for interfering in the 2016 election through connections to Russia.

Spoiler:
The Democratic National Committee filed a multimillion-dollar lawsuit Friday against the Russian government, the Trump campaign and the WikiLeaks organization alleging a far-reaching conspiracy to disrupt the 2016 campaign and tilt the election to Donald Trump.

The complaint, filed in federal district court in Manhattan, alleges that top Trump campaign officials conspired with the Russian government and its military spy agency to hurt Democratic presidential nominee Hillary Clinton and help Trump by hacking the computer networks of the Democratic Party and disseminating stolen material found there.

“During the 2016 presidential campaign, Russia launched an all-out assault on our democracy, and it found a willing and active partner in Donald Trump’s campaign,” DNC Chairman Tom Perez said in a statement.

“This constituted an act of unprecedented treachery: the campaign of a nominee for President of the United States in league with a hostile foreign power to bolster its own chance to win the presidency,” he said.

The case asserts that the Russian hacking campaign — combined with Trump associates’ contacts with Russia and the campaign’s public cheerleading of the hacks — amounted to an illegal conspiracy to interfere in the election that caused serious damage to the Democratic Party.

Senate investigators and prosecutors for special counsel Robert S. Mueller III are still investigating whether Trump associates coordinated with the Russian efforts. Last month, House Intelligence Committee Republicans said they found no evidence that President Trump and his affiliates colluded with Russian officials to sway the election or that the Kremlin sought to help him — a conclusion rejected by the panel’s Democrats.
Trump says allegations of collusion are a ’hoax’
0:26 / 2:38
mute
cc disabled

President Trump on April 18 dismissed allegations that his campaign colluded with Russia in the 2016 presidential election. (The Washington Post)

The president has repeatedly rejected any collusion or improper activity by his campaign. This week, he referred again in a tweet to the “phony Russia investigation where, by the way, there was NO COLLUSION (except by the Dems).”

Suing a foreign country may present legal challenges for the Democrats, in part because other nations have immunity from most U.S. lawsuits. The DNC’s complaint argues Russia is not entitled to the protection because the hack constituted a trespass on the party’s private property.

The lawsuit argues that Russia is not entitled to sovereign immunity in this case because “the DNC claims arise out of Russia’s trespass on to the DNC’s private servers . . . in order to steal trade secrets and commit economic espionage.”

The lawsuit echoes a similar legal tactic that the Democratic Party used during the Watergate scandal. In 1972, the DNC filed suit against then-President Richard Nixon’s reelection committee seeking $1 million in damages for the break-in at Democratic headquarters in the Watergate building.

The suit was denounced at the time by Nixon’s attorney general, John Mitchell, who called it a case of “sheer demagoguery” by the DNC. But the civil action brought by the DNC’s then-chairman, Lawrence F. O’Brien, was ultimately successful, yielding a $750,000 settlement from the Nixon campaign that was reached on the day in 1974 that Nixon left office.

The suit filed Friday seeks millions of dollars in compensation to offset damage it claims the party suffered from the hacks. The DNC argues that the cyberattack undermined its ability to communicate with voters, collect donations and operate effectively as its employees faced personal harassment and, in some cases, death threats.

The suit also seeks an acknowledgment from the defendants that they conspired to infiltrate the Democrats’ computers, steal information and disseminate it to influence the election.

To support its case, the lawsuit offers a detailed narrative of the DNC hacks, as well as episodes in which key Trump aides are alleged to have been told Russia held damaging information about Clinton.

[Inside Trump’s financial ties to Russia and his unusual flattery of Vladimir Putin]

Russia engaged in a “brazen attack on U.S. soil” the party alleges, a campaign that began with the cyberhack of its computer networks in 2015 and 2016. Trump campaign officials received repeated outreach from Russia, the suit says.

“Rather than report these repeated messages and communications that Russia intended to interfere in the U.S. election, the Trump campaign and its agents gleefully welcomed Russia’s help,” the party argues

Ultimately, Trump’s associates entered into an agreement with Russian agents “to promote Donald Trump’s candidacy through illegal means,” the suit concludes.

The suit does not name Trump as a defendant. Instead, it targets various Trump aides who met with people believed to be affiliated with Russia during the campaign, including the president’s son, Donald Trump Jr., his son-in-law Jared Kushner, his campaign chairman Paul Manafort and Manafort’s deputy, Rick Gates.

Manafort and Gates were charged with money-laundering, fraud and tax evasion in a case brought by special prosecutors last year. In February, Gates pleaded guilty to conspiracy and lying to the FBI and is cooperating with investigators. Manafort has pleaded not guilty.

The DNC lawsuit also names as a defendant the Russian military intelligence service, the GRU, which has been accused by the U.S. government of orchestrating the hacks, as well as WikiLeaks, which published the DNC’s stolen emails, and the group’s founder Julian Assange.

The lawsuit was also filed against Roger Stone, the longtime Trump confidante who claimed during the campaign that he was in contact with Assange.

[Roger Stone claimed contact with WikiLeaks founder Julian Assange in 2016, according to two associates]

The Trump advisers and associates have denied assisting Russia in its hacking campaign. Stone has denied any communication with Assange or advance knowledge of the document dumps by WikiLeaks, saying his comments about Assange were jokes or exaggerations.

The DNC lawsuit argues that the Russian government and the GRU violated a series of laws by orchestrating the secret intrusion into the Democrats’ computer systems, including statutes to protect trade secrets, prohibit wire tapping and prevent trespassing.

The party said the Trump defendants committed conspiracy through their interaction with Russian agents and their public encouragement of the hacking, with the campaign itself acting as a racketeering enterprise promoting illegal activity.

The complaint was filed on behalf of the party by the law firm of Cohen Milstein.

The suit contains previously undisclosed details, including that the specific date when the Russians breached the DNC computer system: July 27, 2015, according to forensic evidence cited in the filing.

The analysis shows the system was breached again on April 18, 2016. The hackers began siphoning documents and information from DNC systems on April 22. The suit notes that four days later, Trump foreign policy adviser George Papadopoulos was informed by Josef Mifsud, a London-based professor, that the Russians were in possession of thousands of emails that could be damaging to Clinton.

[Top campaign officials knew of Trump adviser’s outreach to Russia]

The list of defendants in the suit includes Papadopoulos and Mifsud, as well as Aras and Emin Agalarov, the wealthy Russian father and son who hosted the Miss Universe Pageant in Moscow in 2013. Trump, who owned the pageant, attended the event.

The Agalarovs also played a role in arranging a meeting for a Russian lawyer at Trump Tower in New York in 2016, at which Donald Trump Jr. had expected to be given damaging information about Clinton.

Scott Balber, an attorney for the Agalarovs, said the allegations about his clients were “frivolous” and “a publicity stunt.”

“They had absolutely nothing to do with any alleged hacking of any Democratic computer system or any interference in the US election.”

The suit alleges that Trump’s personal and professional ties to Russia helped foster the conspiracy.

The DNC’s lawyers wrote that “long standing personal professional and financial ties to Russia and numerous individuals linked to the Russian government provided fertile ground for a conspiracy between the defendants to interfere in the 2016 elections.”

The lawsuit describes how the then-Soviet Union paid for Trump to travel Moscow in the 1980s.

It also details the history of Manafort and Gates, who worked for Russian-friendly factions in the Ukraine before joining the Trump campaign. Prosecutors have said they were in contact in 2016 with Konstantin Kilimnik, a former linguist in the Russian army who the FBI has alleged had ties to Russian intelligence.


Spoiler-quoted for the work blocked.

Is this just bluster or are the Democrats seriously intending to go forward with this?
Seems premature at best, more likely just political posturing occupying time & effort that could actually spend on helping the country.

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Curb stomping in the Eye of Terror!

 NinthMusketeer wrote:
 AlmightyWalrus wrote:
The Democratic Party has filed a law suit against Trump & friends for interfering in the 2016 election through connections to Russia.

Spoiler:
The Democratic National Committee filed a multimillion-dollar lawsuit Friday against the Russian government, the Trump campaign and the WikiLeaks organization alleging a far-reaching conspiracy to disrupt the 2016 campaign and tilt the election to Donald Trump.

The complaint, filed in federal district court in Manhattan, alleges that top Trump campaign officials conspired with the Russian government and its military spy agency to hurt Democratic presidential nominee Hillary Clinton and help Trump by hacking the computer networks of the Democratic Party and disseminating stolen material found there.

“During the 2016 presidential campaign, Russia launched an all-out assault on our democracy, and it found a willing and active partner in Donald Trump’s campaign,” DNC Chairman Tom Perez said in a statement.

“This constituted an act of unprecedented treachery: the campaign of a nominee for President of the United States in league with a hostile foreign power to bolster its own chance to win the presidency,” he said.

The case asserts that the Russian hacking campaign — combined with Trump associates’ contacts with Russia and the campaign’s public cheerleading of the hacks — amounted to an illegal conspiracy to interfere in the election that caused serious damage to the Democratic Party.

Senate investigators and prosecutors for special counsel Robert S. Mueller III are still investigating whether Trump associates coordinated with the Russian efforts. Last month, House Intelligence Committee Republicans said they found no evidence that President Trump and his affiliates colluded with Russian officials to sway the election or that the Kremlin sought to help him — a conclusion rejected by the panel’s Democrats.
Trump says allegations of collusion are a ’hoax’
0:26 / 2:38
mute
cc disabled

President Trump on April 18 dismissed allegations that his campaign colluded with Russia in the 2016 presidential election. (The Washington Post)

The president has repeatedly rejected any collusion or improper activity by his campaign. This week, he referred again in a tweet to the “phony Russia investigation where, by the way, there was NO COLLUSION (except by the Dems).”

Suing a foreign country may present legal challenges for the Democrats, in part because other nations have immunity from most U.S. lawsuits. The DNC’s complaint argues Russia is not entitled to the protection because the hack constituted a trespass on the party’s private property.

The lawsuit argues that Russia is not entitled to sovereign immunity in this case because “the DNC claims arise out of Russia’s trespass on to the DNC’s private servers . . . in order to steal trade secrets and commit economic espionage.”

The lawsuit echoes a similar legal tactic that the Democratic Party used during the Watergate scandal. In 1972, the DNC filed suit against then-President Richard Nixon’s reelection committee seeking $1 million in damages for the break-in at Democratic headquarters in the Watergate building.

The suit was denounced at the time by Nixon’s attorney general, John Mitchell, who called it a case of “sheer demagoguery” by the DNC. But the civil action brought by the DNC’s then-chairman, Lawrence F. O’Brien, was ultimately successful, yielding a $750,000 settlement from the Nixon campaign that was reached on the day in 1974 that Nixon left office.

The suit filed Friday seeks millions of dollars in compensation to offset damage it claims the party suffered from the hacks. The DNC argues that the cyberattack undermined its ability to communicate with voters, collect donations and operate effectively as its employees faced personal harassment and, in some cases, death threats.

The suit also seeks an acknowledgment from the defendants that they conspired to infiltrate the Democrats’ computers, steal information and disseminate it to influence the election.

To support its case, the lawsuit offers a detailed narrative of the DNC hacks, as well as episodes in which key Trump aides are alleged to have been told Russia held damaging information about Clinton.

[Inside Trump’s financial ties to Russia and his unusual flattery of Vladimir Putin]

Russia engaged in a “brazen attack on U.S. soil” the party alleges, a campaign that began with the cyberhack of its computer networks in 2015 and 2016. Trump campaign officials received repeated outreach from Russia, the suit says.

“Rather than report these repeated messages and communications that Russia intended to interfere in the U.S. election, the Trump campaign and its agents gleefully welcomed Russia’s help,” the party argues

Ultimately, Trump’s associates entered into an agreement with Russian agents “to promote Donald Trump’s candidacy through illegal means,” the suit concludes.

The suit does not name Trump as a defendant. Instead, it targets various Trump aides who met with people believed to be affiliated with Russia during the campaign, including the president’s son, Donald Trump Jr., his son-in-law Jared Kushner, his campaign chairman Paul Manafort and Manafort’s deputy, Rick Gates.

Manafort and Gates were charged with money-laundering, fraud and tax evasion in a case brought by special prosecutors last year. In February, Gates pleaded guilty to conspiracy and lying to the FBI and is cooperating with investigators. Manafort has pleaded not guilty.

The DNC lawsuit also names as a defendant the Russian military intelligence service, the GRU, which has been accused by the U.S. government of orchestrating the hacks, as well as WikiLeaks, which published the DNC’s stolen emails, and the group’s founder Julian Assange.

The lawsuit was also filed against Roger Stone, the longtime Trump confidante who claimed during the campaign that he was in contact with Assange.

[Roger Stone claimed contact with WikiLeaks founder Julian Assange in 2016, according to two associates]

The Trump advisers and associates have denied assisting Russia in its hacking campaign. Stone has denied any communication with Assange or advance knowledge of the document dumps by WikiLeaks, saying his comments about Assange were jokes or exaggerations.

The DNC lawsuit argues that the Russian government and the GRU violated a series of laws by orchestrating the secret intrusion into the Democrats’ computer systems, including statutes to protect trade secrets, prohibit wire tapping and prevent trespassing.

The party said the Trump defendants committed conspiracy through their interaction with Russian agents and their public encouragement of the hacking, with the campaign itself acting as a racketeering enterprise promoting illegal activity.

The complaint was filed on behalf of the party by the law firm of Cohen Milstein.

The suit contains previously undisclosed details, including that the specific date when the Russians breached the DNC computer system: July 27, 2015, according to forensic evidence cited in the filing.

The analysis shows the system was breached again on April 18, 2016. The hackers began siphoning documents and information from DNC systems on April 22. The suit notes that four days later, Trump foreign policy adviser George Papadopoulos was informed by Josef Mifsud, a London-based professor, that the Russians were in possession of thousands of emails that could be damaging to Clinton.

[Top campaign officials knew of Trump adviser’s outreach to Russia]

The list of defendants in the suit includes Papadopoulos and Mifsud, as well as Aras and Emin Agalarov, the wealthy Russian father and son who hosted the Miss Universe Pageant in Moscow in 2013. Trump, who owned the pageant, attended the event.

The Agalarovs also played a role in arranging a meeting for a Russian lawyer at Trump Tower in New York in 2016, at which Donald Trump Jr. had expected to be given damaging information about Clinton.

Scott Balber, an attorney for the Agalarovs, said the allegations about his clients were “frivolous” and “a publicity stunt.”

“They had absolutely nothing to do with any alleged hacking of any Democratic computer system or any interference in the US election.”

The suit alleges that Trump’s personal and professional ties to Russia helped foster the conspiracy.

The DNC’s lawyers wrote that “long standing personal professional and financial ties to Russia and numerous individuals linked to the Russian government provided fertile ground for a conspiracy between the defendants to interfere in the 2016 elections.”

The lawsuit describes how the then-Soviet Union paid for Trump to travel Moscow in the 1980s.

It also details the history of Manafort and Gates, who worked for Russian-friendly factions in the Ukraine before joining the Trump campaign. Prosecutors have said they were in contact in 2016 with Konstantin Kilimnik, a former linguist in the Russian army who the FBI has alleged had ties to Russian intelligence.


Spoiler-quoted for the work blocked.

Is this just bluster or are the Democrats seriously intending to go forward with this?
Seems premature at best, more likely just political posturing occupying time & effort that could actually spend on helping the country.

I've talked to couple of my Democrat friends just now... they recognize that this isn't a thing, but wants it to move forward as payback for all the GOP "investigations" during the Obama years...

bah...

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Probably work

 whembly wrote:

I've talked to couple of my Democrat friends just now... they recognize that this isn't a thing, but wants it to move forward as payback for all the GOP "investigations" during the Obama years...

bah...


Yeah, that's a responsible precedent to set.

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On moon miranda.

The lawsuit is probably DoA and most likely a waste of time, and sounds like more bloviating.

Results shouls be sought in November, or at least from the current Mueller probe if something concrete is uncovered. A lawsuit seems...silly.

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Curb stomping in the Eye of Terror!

On 4/20...

Sen. Chuck Schumer to introduce bill to “decriminalize” marijuana.

New found respect for federalism? ...or, midyear campaign electioneering?

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Building a blood in water scent

The first step of the Nixon impeachment was a 1m lawsuit by the DNC for damages related to the break in.

Maybe looking to repeat?

We were once so close to heaven, St. Peter came out and gave us medals; declaring us "The nicest of the damned".

“Anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that 'my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.'” 
   
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On moon miranda.

 whembly wrote:
On 4/20...

Sen. Chuck Schumer to introduce bill to “decriminalize” marijuana.

New found respect for federalism? ...or, midyear campaign electioneering?
I imagine its probably the latter mixed with acknowledging that the current legal setup around marijuana is indefensible public policy rather than any federalism concepts.

IRON WITHIN, IRON WITHOUT.

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 feeder wrote:
The first step of the Nixon impeachment was a 1m lawsuit by the DNC for damages related to the break in.

Maybe looking to repeat?


Not necessarily. More likely, they smell blood, and are going for a civil suit since it does not need to be 'beyond a reasonable doubt'.

Also, a President can be sued, regardless of his position as a law enforcement position, unless he wants to play the "sovereign immunity' card which would be political suicide at this point.


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Building a blood in water scent

 BaronIveagh wrote:
 feeder wrote:
The first step of the Nixon impeachment was a 1m lawsuit by the DNC for damages related to the break in.

Maybe looking to repeat?


Not necessarily. More likely, they smell blood, and are going for a civil suit since it does not need to be 'beyond a reasonable doubt'.

Also, a President can be sued, regardless of his position as a law enforcement position, unless he wants to play the "sovereign immunity' card which would be political suicide at this point.


Yeah, probably.

Looks like McCabe is going to sue the Trump admin.

Must be lawsuit season or something.

We were once so close to heaven, St. Peter came out and gave us medals; declaring us "The nicest of the damned".

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Curb stomping in the Eye of Terror!

Huh...

North Korean leader: We no longer need nuclear tests, state-run media reports

Wouldn't trust them at all... but, still.




Automatically Appended Next Post:
 feeder wrote:
 BaronIveagh wrote:
 feeder wrote:
The first step of the Nixon impeachment was a 1m lawsuit by the DNC for damages related to the break in.

Maybe looking to repeat?


Not necessarily. More likely, they smell blood, and are going for a civil suit since it does not need to be 'beyond a reasonable doubt'.

Also, a President can be sued, regardless of his position as a law enforcement position, unless he wants to play the "sovereign immunity' card which would be political suicide at this point.


Yeah, probably.

Looks like McCabe is going to sue the Trump admin.

Must be lawsuit season or something.

Heh... watching a man who’s repeatedly called for loosening libel laws suddenly forced to shield himself with the high standard of “actual malice” as a libel defendant? Would be quite juicy twist eh???

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/04/21 02:09:33


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Forutantely, current libel laws prevent the president From suing based on libel.

Wonder how long that it will take before he starts pushing congress to change that, and then how long until they start trying to pass a bill to loosen the libel laws.

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Fort Worth, TX

 Vaktathi wrote:
 whembly wrote:
On 4/20...

Sen. Chuck Schumer to introduce bill to “decriminalize” marijuana.

New found respect for federalism? ...or, midyear campaign electioneering?
I imagine its probably the latter mixed with acknowledging that the current legal setup around marijuana is indefensible public policy rather than any federalism concepts.


Eh, we'll see if it gets anywhere. There's always someone in Congress trying to push a marijuana bill, but it never goes anywhere. Maybe it'll be different with a bigger name attached, but I think we're still a good 2-4 years from it happening.

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I'll bet China was getting nervous about that mountain collapsing and told Kim to shut it down immediately, and thats why they've shuttered that facility. Its not like they lose anything that wasn't already pretty much spent.

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 Wolfblade wrote:
Forutantely, current libel laws prevent the president From suing based on libel.

Wonder how long that it will take before he starts pushing congress to change that, and then how long until they start trying to pass a bill to loosen the libel laws.
I'd like to see it happen. In general I feel like media is able to get away with too many blatant lies that are ultimately a use of free speech that harms individuals and/or communities. I'm sure Trump & co would be shocked when after opening up those laws they found themselves targets of lawsuits while being unable to go forward with any themselves. Turns out you can't sue the truth.

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I chose an avatar I feel best represents the quality of my post history.

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