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http://us.games-workshop.com/news/sneakpeek/Warhammer/image1.jpg 

Postives: Quite like the repeating handgun, repeating pistol, the cloaks, and the fact that the legs have stirups.  The "facial expression" of the champion's horse seems to be good.  There is a musician, which leads one to presume that pistoliers can get one again.

Negatives: hmm, no barded horses, gorilla jaws, skull helmet, grenade launcher for the champion that is the size of a mortar...actualy, that would be a good conversion, make the grenade launcher into a properly scaled mortar.  Horses are as from the basic pistoliers since they are on the same sprue, and are terrible.

Conclusion, these look as if they were designed for Warmachine, and no, that is not a compliment.  For models we will be stuck with for at least 5 years, these are extremely disapointing.

I like the new horses, and the rest isn't bad. I still have the old outriders with "gasp" a skull helmet.

Considering what a "grenade" of the times in size, the launcher is about right.

All in all not bad. Not super, but not bad.

You no like WARMACHINE?

I think they're fine.

The only things I dislike about the set are the heads and the lack of independent sprues for the horses.

As to the comment on barding, it's a pretty unrealistic expectation to have barded horses in the kit. It would likely be difficult to make "add on barding" that looked respectable, and having two sets of horses in one set, well, do I have to go there?
Ultimately, I'd much rather have the option to assemble the kit as outriders OR pistoliers, then have one of the units be made in metal. Remember that GW is increasingly out to reduce the shelf space requirements of its model ranges. This is just an example of this.

Ultimately, I'd much rather have the option to assemble the kit as outriders OR pistoliers, then have one of the units be made in metal. Remember that GW is increasingly out to reduce the shelf space requirements of its model ranges. This is just an example of this.

Oh I agree, just not so pleased that one of the main options for the unit is going to cost an extra $25 to build.  For a $35 regiment set, I have come to expect 8-10 plastic mounted units, not five, so that extra plastic could have been an extra 5 horses.  And add on barding is not completely out of the question, it would only take a few peices.  Zveda does it with their empire-ish knights, and those are in a slightly smaller scale.

Posted By Zubbiefish on 10/24/2006 1:36 PM
You no like WARMACHINE?

Not in the slightest.  May be the best game ever, but the look and cost are things I have no interest in.

Hmm.... I'm undecided on what I think about those figs. At least until I can get a better look. So far I'm not particularly impressed as they don't appear to be an improvement over the existing models, especially with the ridiculous grenade launcher thingy. Black powder weapons I get, but I'm growing tired of the ever creeping insertion of late 19th century weaponry.

Most worrisome is the price. Is it going to be five plastic horsemen for $35?!? Ughh. No thanks, regardless of quality.

Woohooo!

IG Roughriders with assault cannons, now we are talking!

Everything tastes better with Rending!

Outriders with miniguns?

Why, God, why!?

Posted By lasgunpacker on 10/24/2006 2:33 PM

Posted By Zubbiefish on 10/24/2006 1:36 PM
You no like WARMACHINE?

Not in the slightest.  May be the best game ever, but the look and cost are things I have no interest in.

*sniggers*

Yet for the cost of your IG army, I could field an army for all four factions of Warmachine. You might be right about the look (except those horsies are too bad for even Warmachine) , but cost ?

Plastic horsies: pretty.

Guns: not big enough.

Bring me more skulls (TM).

Posted By bigchris1313 on 10/24/2006 9:58 PM
Outriders with miniguns?

Why, God, why!?

If one of the heads looks like a tabacco chewin' Jesse Ventura I can think of at least one reason why.   

Maybe not turn every thread into "GW stuff = x amount of PP stuff."

I love the idea of using those repeater guns as assault cannons. Too funny.

Or use them for Necromunda heavies. They can "count as" anything you
can afford.

"This here's a heavy stubber...or something."

With a little conversion they'd make great Vostroyan Rough Riders.

I kind of like them (glad I saved my 5th ed. figures), tho giving cavalry a move-or-fire weapon seems odd. I guess you could run them off to one side, then stand-and shoot if you get charged.

Only a couple of months till the new codex, I mean Army Book!

And if you are going to compare, compare correctly. 5 Soulhunters are $80... and still look just as bad. Well, to me at least.

I like the look of the new pistoliers a lot more than the outriders, but I do like the armour and cloaks. Nice change. I wonder if some of my old outriders will fit on the new horses.

I think if I hear one more person compare weedy cav on plastic horses to the stunningly huge (bigger than a dreadnought) all metal cav in Warmachine I'm going to vomit.

WM cav is one of the FEW cav models that are the correct scale as compared to infantry. i.e. A model on foot should not be taller than a war horse's head.

Posted By RussWakelin on 10/25/2006 10:00 AM

And if you are going to compare, compare correctly. 5 Soulhunters are $80... and still look just as bad. Well, to me at least.

I think if I hear one more person compare weedy cav on plastic horses to the stunningly huge (bigger than a dreadnought) all metal cav in Warmachine I'm going to vomit.

WM cav is one of the FEW cav models that are the correct scale as compared to infantry. i.e. A model on foot should not be taller than a war horse's head.

Whatever dude, all plastic or all metal $100 is ludicrous for 5 cavalry regardless of system.  The announcement of that cavalry was what immediatley sell all models for WM.  Soulhunters are not bigger than a dread by the way...

My point is I think the fairest way to compare models and price is from a size and complexity stand point.

One could just as easily state that $50 is way to much for 5 infantry models, regardless of system, but that would be a silly statement now wouldn't it, because Terminators are large models with lots of detail, and it's not fair to compare them straight up to other infantry.

I'm not stating that the Outriders are a bad deal, I'm just saying show me another company that produces a model as large and complex (ie. # of bits) as a Warmachine cav model for $20.

As for size, it is true I've yet to see the Cryx cav in person, but I have seen the Menoth and Khador cav on the table and believe me, they are big.

I think this re-occurring topic is inspiring me to write an article on how to fairly compare model costs from company to company.

Posted By RussWakelin on 10/25/2006 10:47 AM

 

I'm not stating that the Outriders are a bad deal, I'm just saying show me another company that produces a model as large and complex (ie. # of bits) as a Warmachine cav model for $20.

 

 

actually Dark Age Dragyri are very comparable if not bigger overall than the WM Cavalry and the sculpts are easily comparable and you're looking at $12-$15 per model for them.  Complexity I don't see as an issue with price as you can take any model and break it down by bitz.and i see detailed sculpts more appealing than complex scultps overall.  But since that isn't what this thread is about, i'll halt my comparisons here.

It's all apples to oranges and most assuredly based on personal opinion. Just be assured though that the Cryx models are weedy, and will not be bought. I can do without them in my Cryx force. I don't really like the sculpts either, so that is a lot to pay.

No matter the cost, I would much rather pay $30 for some models I feel "eh" about, rather than $80.

Pics of the outrider/pistoleer sprues are up on Warseer. Some nice bits.

The Dragyri are all on 50mm bases? Wow, I didn't know that.

As for # of bits, complex models (ie with a lot of detail) must be broken down into smaller bits to improve casting quality. The more bits you have, the more labor it takes to make a model, and therefore the more cost.

But you're right, this really isn't the place for this discussion ... it's just I hate to see any company get slammed for price when they put out a really good quality product. (GW included)

I think I'll start a thread else where to dig up ideas on what models to compare when doing pricing analysis.

That's fair. Any price is too high if you don't like the models.

Looks like we're seeing smaller "regiment" sets afterall:
www.cytadela.pl/modules.php

The powder monkey is boss

Alright! Half as many figs for the same excellent price! Awesome!

It will likely be a lower cost. How much lower, I'm not sure.

I'm not really sold on the empire soldiers, but I like the handgunners, if only because the handguns are so hilariously large (and because they come with a monkey....).

Posted By lasgunpacker on 10/24/2006 2:33 PM

Posted By Zubbiefish on 10/24/2006 1:36 PM
You no like WARMACHINE?

Not in the slightest.  May be the best game ever, but the look and cost are things I have no interest in.

Long time coming but.. splain.
I like thier figs (there are exeptions) what don't you like?

Posted By Drake_Marcus on 10/25/2006 6:37 AM

If one of the heads looks like a tabacco chewin' Jesse Ventura I can think of at least one reason why.   

Well, that justifies the one minigun.  And the others?

It's probably the usual. Cartoony look of the jacks. A lot of odd perspective and shoulder pad problems with a lot of the figs. They are really a different look, and very "chunky" I don't like a lot of them, but enough to make me play. In hordes I really want to like the circle, but again, the figs are just "ok". Some of them just don't look right. But I like the style of the army, so will probably end up getting them.

And haven't you seen the new kommandoes for Khador. Egads those things rea horrendous!

Just because miniguns are ultra cool, and extra shooty.

Wow, looks like my Praetorian Rough Riders will be getting some company soon

Russ:  The cryx cav are small(er).  However, they're also significantly cheaper in price than the Khador ones.  As to those who say they look bad... I thought so too, until I bought the soulhunters.  They are -very- detailed and dynamic.