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 ruminator wrote:

nkelsch wrote:
This is not just a horde issue, gunlines can often have 20+ minute shooting phases, especially since shooting decisions seem to waste way more time than marching horde models forward 6".

It is a double-standard. Horde players are expected to be rushed and sloppy because people are 'bored' waiting for them even if they are moving models at a reasonable pace.

They then break out the precise measurements when they want to unload their gunline on that horde for 20 minutes and want tons of template coverage.

Some armies *WILL* take longer to play and will use more of the time. Assault armies often have a long assault phase on THEIR turn. Gunlines have long shooting phases. Equal time is not reasonable in any aspect of 40k. And hurrying people to gain an advantage is also unreasonable.

This. You rush your movement only for the opponent to try his blast template in about 10 different positions before shooting - and then repeat for each shot - and then saying it's entirely your fault for the game being slow. Also, once I've moved the front line of a unit forward you can measure the range in my turn while I move the rest of my models. There is no need to wait until your turn.

Actually given the recent wound allocation FAQ I need to do just that so I can determine which models are in range for wounding. I'm not saying players that have long shooting phases don't need to speed up as well (generally you can eyeball the best spot for your blast or template reasonably quickly). Essentially my point is this, if the game is not moving along toward finishing on time both players need to play more quickly, but the player using the majority of the time (usually horde, or blob) assumes the greater burden of speeding up. If my turns take only 30 minutes (total) and yours take more than 2 hours, the greater savings of time comes by you speeding up. IF you cannot move your models fast enough, ask for help, I can measure 2" coherency and move your models up as well, if units are not going to shoot, roll the run when you move them initially, bring dice in groups that are easy to pick up quickly (if you need to count out the 60 dice every time your unit shoots, it wastes time.) , roll your opponents to wound dice as your saves (if they let you), own a TAC template (so you can measure the move for your front row and then move the rest 2" up behind.), I've seen ork players with Magnetic deployment trays (to allow them to set there models up more quickly). There are plenty of ways to speed things up that are not "move faster", passing the buck to everyone else is unreasonable, you are not going to have 6 hours to play a game at a tournament, learn to play your army as efficeintly as possible, and you can finish your games, but you need to aim to be able to do so using only 1/2 the allowable time. While time used is not always equal, then it is the Horde Ork player Vs the Nid player, or the Blob guard player, both players need a lot of time, so you need to plan accordingly, and then be happy when you have more time.

Here is a two prong problem I find for slowing game play to a crawl:

Me: slow due to being less practiced and trying out all kinds of armies/configs that kept upping the learning curve.

Friend: likes rules exploits, requires checking rules from opponent to "prove him right". Sometimes misinterpretation or a pure "grey zone" rule is discovered blowing his game strategy bringing us to an impass.

Summary:

Taking rules to the edge kill time like no other = if you exploit make a note/list of the pages that support this tactic to help speed it along (you were researching it anyway). Forcing others to "look it up" is like blackmailing them into "Accept what I say, or you do not get to play."

Newbies should stick with an army and loadout that is reasonably consistent until they can get some speed to their game. Looking up rules for your own army is not good, your opponent will be depending on you explaining some of the stranger rules with confidence and an offer to show where it is in the Codex.