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 Ensis Ferrae wrote:

ian wrote:

Most highstreet stores are disapearing because of online sales.
How long do you think hobby stores will last without customers

The internet seems to have changed our focus to how cheap can we get stuff and thats means strip back as much service as possible

I had read an article, I think maybe back in January (??) wherein the author (who actually has some decent credentials for the article) showed a definite trend that the Brick and Mortar shops are coming back. Yes, there was a period in the late aughts that physical stores were disappearing but, that trend is reversing/has reversed.

People in essence realized what a good shop is/looks like, and the good shop owners are meeting/exceeding that look. Sure, a B&M cannot cut prices as much as an online retailer, however, you cannot adequately get advice from an online retailer. One example the author used (he has a board game background) was a customer had previously bought a board game from him. They were in the market for a new game and sought his advice. Being able to question/pick apart/analyze what a person/group likes and dislikes about a product helped him fit that customer to a different product. He writes how on other occasions, people in his shop provided that feedback and demoed a product for/with another customer.


Long story short, I think we saw a period where many of the "bad" shops were run under because they were clueless as to what people wanted, and we saw the rise of internet dealers. I don't think internet dealers are going away, but the B&M shop is making something of a comeback as owners are realizing what they offer over online, and capitalizing on that.

I tried to make this point earlier but was disregarded because i am "obviously not aware of store running costs".

Brick and mortar shops have always held an advantage over online- many advantages in fact. The problem in this industry is most of the people who run the shops think the only way to make money is by selling models.

One FLGS owner i spoke to even went as far as to say "my GF said either get rid of the models or start a shop... so i started a shop", to him this is just an extension of a hobby and i suspect this is the same for a lot of shops that go out of business rather quickly.

Professionally speaking - Its downright unbelievable how ignorant some of these shop owners are as to how much money they could be making off people in this hobby, there seems to be a complete lack of predatory attitude towards sales, marketing and market research that just breeds failure and this attitude of entitlement.

But thats one thing that puts me off is forced sales

ian wrote:
But thats one thing that puts me off is forced sales

Its not forced sales- Its marketing, presenting and building your business in a way that makes a customer feel they ARE obligated to buy from you.

If you have a shop that contributes to the community, has a great atmosphere, good product range (actually having new releases on release weekend.... imagine that), good tables, fun events... the list is endless; you will in turn feel that paying full RRP on a product is not only worth it but you will be happy to do so as well.

But that's not cultivating an obligation, that's cultivating a desire.

Making a customer feel obligated is a very speedy and efficient way to not have customers any more.

 Desubot wrote:

 techsoldaten wrote:
Surprised by some of the responses in this thread.

A friend of mine used to own a FLGS. Someone spending $500 or more would usually get a deal on whatever they were buying, up to 25% off. He even did a Forgeworld order every 2 weeks, which meant everyone got free shipping.

I thought most FLGS' operated this way, and it's usually cheaper to buy from them.

It depends

some times you have to actually start a relationship become and regular and generally be a cool dood and talk.

its not something you should expect from a store, but you can absolutely work things out with people so long as you arent a social potato.

Sadly, sometimes the game store owners are the social potatos...


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Sneggy wrote:

The shop has a wide range and can direct order stuff in for you (order before monday and get it that thursday for GW product.) everything is 10%off. 15% off on orders over £100 and 20% off on orders over £250.

See, if I had a store like this locally I believe they would get a good chunk of my money anyway regardless of whether I played in store or not

I've been through many game stores over the years, and now buy exclusively online. With the 'Australia tax' on top of already ludicrous prices for most things, and then some gouging on top, it's ALWAYS cheaper for me to get something shipped to my door from the UK or Canada (used to be the US too, but shipping costs have become crazy lately).

I still remember my longest serving LGS had a great manager that built up huge goodwill (an often overlooked commodity) and a terrible owner who wanted maximum profits no matter what. I used to buy there exclusively, much to the vocal chargrin of the local GW, where we'd play the occasional game.

However, it got to the point where the LGS prices were double or more what everything cost online (with GW being even more), which became completely unjustifiable when looking to build a new army. The owner was mortally offended that none of us were grateful, when he'd have a 10% off sale and no one would buy. 190%! Gee, what a discount! Worse, they were the distributor for most stock and could easily have sold it cheap enough that people would buy out of loyalty.

I still remember how they refused to stock Infinity, so a mate organised import of all the books and miniatures line himself. He built the scene from scratch, ran tourneys himself and was in contact with Corvus Belli for prize support out of pure love for the game. Due to his hard work, Infinity took off and became quite profitable as everyone got into it. The store, seeing this, first insisted he supply them at a loss to himself, and when he refused they stocked it themselves, but at a massive markup over what we were all paying. They were furious we didn't immediately shift to buying from them. Because we owed them our loyalty dammit!

That store ended up firing its manager of 8 years, who we all followed to his next game store job, vindictively removed all gaming tables from the store 'to punish us' (which only hurt business more) and went out of business a short time later, after 20 years plus. With all that going on, there was no way 'loyalty' was going to force me to prop them up.

I've never felt bad about buying from non-local stores since. It's a global market now and I'm not a charity. Businesses compete or they die. Too many game stores just want to sell stuff without any effort to build a scene or attract customers, because prior to the internet, customers had no other choice. If you're in playing games regularly, and they allow you to do so without a 'buying stuff requirement', you may feel loyalty and want to reward them with your hard-earned dollars. Or you may not. But you never have to, even if you game there every day. It's on them to give you a reason to buy that you feel is justified, there's no obligation, and price is not the only way to communicate value.

I live in Melbourne florida, and in the past 10+ years, there were three main gaming stores in the area.

Now there are only two.

Why did the third fail? They failed to cultivate a local respect for it's customers. They went with a mostly online business, and began selling 40k bits. By doing so, they ignored friday night magic, store sales, etc... for space to hire people to cut and sell bits.

So out of three stores, one attempted to go "online" it was the only one that closed.

The other two still function, and are doing quite well. They knew how important it was to foster a respect for the locals, providing something the internet cannot - a gaming space to meet like minded people and enjoy playing games.

Brick stores do just fine if the people running them aren't, fools.

In the defense of all business owners (Being one myself) most of them fail in the first 5 years. It is a ridiculously high number, so if you have one that lasts over 5 years you are the some of the lucky few. Businesses surviving is the exception, not the norm.

I would wager the closure rate is a combination of financial related, physical burn-out, and emotional toll.

 Easy E wrote:
In the defense of all business owners (Being one myself) most of them fail in the first 5 years. It is a ridiculously high number, so if you have one that lasts over 5 years you are the some of the lucky few. Businesses surviving is the exception, not the norm.

I would wager the closure rate is a combination of financial related, physical burn-out, and emotional toll.

Making it to the 5 year Mark is an achievement all it's own.

I go to a FLGS for my convenience, and will support a store if the staff is reliable, friendly and knowledgeable. If the store is run by staff that isn't reliable, cliquish, or snobby then I can find other places to spend my coin.