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I think the Clone Wars might be more interesting for a minis wargame because the heroes (even if they are of the player's creation rather than from the movies/shows) leading the forces can be more fantastical and heroic in a comic-book style. The Galactic Civil War is too gritty and dystopian to have personalities like the Clone Wars gave us. Darth Vader is obviously something special, but if you can have a game where a CIS side could have guys like Grievous, Cad Bane and even maybe someday a mechanical-legs Darth Maul, facing off against Rex and Obi-Wan? That's just goofy fun.

 Manchu wrote:
No doubt “Phase II” has the in-setting implication of indicating significant change, although not necessarily an improvement. For all I know, equipment may have gotten worse as resources became strained and training became a lower priority than deployment (not unknown in real war). But given that, as a product, they were released alongside B2s, I assume the Phase IIs are a stronger/more expensive unit relative to Phase Is. I guess the two might fight together in a transitionary period, fluffwise.

Fluff wise the Phase 1 armour was produced by Kaminoan's who didn't do a particularly good job of fitting it around humans, so it was not as efficient as it could be. The phase 2 armour was a better fit, had increased modularity and had improvements in its basics systems (better filtration units, audio gear, vox, grav boots etc.). Phase 2 was introduced around the time of the Battles of Sullust and Mon-Cala and was supposed to replace phase 1 entirely but didn't, even to the end of the war.

Some clones even chose to keep their Phase 1 stuff.

I have to admit I expected a pretty early release of Clone AT-RT's, though. Kind of a no-brainer.

According to rumour they are next along with the droid skimmer (STAP). I really wish they would release a cheap CIS commander! Just a generic T would do the job.

IMO the CW are more interesting for miniatures war gaming than the GCW because the former represents a proper war between states where the belligerents fielded traditional militaries in multiple system-wide campaigns rather than a political insurrection characterized mainly by asymmetrical guerrilla tactics.

Turns out making a war game about a war is easier than making a war game about an partisan insurrection.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Turns out making a war game about a war is easier than making a war game about an partisan insurrection.

Although from an outsiders (never played beyond the GenCon demo, only window shopped so far) perspective, the basic starter set Rebels and their (salvaged/stolen) AT-RT would make great Seperatist rebels to add variety to a CIS force, or even as a third party, to be fielded against Clones OR Clankers.

Clone AT-RTs and STAPs would both be awesome.

I‘s also like to see dwarf spider droids, as Corps. Might be interesting to have these be Troopers rather than Vehicles? Something like an Emplacement Trooper unit, but that can Climb/Clamber.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Turns out making a war game about a war is easier than making a war game about an partisan insurrection.

Exactly!

 bubber wrote:
I just want my Death troopers :(

https://www.fantasyflightgames.com/en/products/star-wars-legion/products/imperial-death-troopers-unit-expansion/

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

 Yodhrin wrote:
The point is there are at least four other special forces units that could and IMO should have filled that role.

That's a good point. Could have gone with Republic Commandos, or Galactic Marines. Probably another that I'm forgetting as well.

Man. There's just so much to draw from with the Clone Wars setting.

Something something all just variations on one thing with slight differences in armour!

 Manchu wrote:
This argument about how ARC Troopers are canonically deployed is triggering me hard because I am trying to chill out and enjoy SW again despite the IP being a fething wreck. There isn’t even a reasonable explanation of why the Clone Wars began so there’s no real point grinding our teeth over the GAR order of battle. I am just trying to stay focused on the superficial level of Star Wars actually featuring, ya know, a full scale galactic war.

As HBMC said, the Clone Wars can be mined for so much awesome stuff yet to come!

I'm mainly bringing up the canon thing to illustrate how odd I find it that they'd go out of their way to add a new depiction of a unit previously depicted differently when there are "off the shelf" alternatives that would already match up to that new depiction, and their MO up until this point has very much been reaching for the shelf-based options. It's not a "it's not onscreen in the movies, therefore it cannot exist!" thing or anything like that.

EDIT: And seriously? You guys are just going to keep stating the "muh partisan insurrection" thing as if I hadn't already refuted that in several different flavours of how wrong you are? As a wee reminder; the Galactic Civil War was, in fact, fought as an open war as well as an asymmetrical one, and also by definition asymmetrical warfare is a method of fighting a war.

Everyone gets it, you like the Clone Wars. Can you not just express that preference without trying to minimise the GCW to try and make your opinion seem like more than that?

 AegisGrimm wrote:
I'm finding it really strange that I don't care at all for the prequel trilogy, but at the same time love the idea of a Clone Wars wargame much more than a Galactic Civil War one?

Well, I don't much care for the prequels either, but I do love The Clone Wars series, so... yeah, I'm loving it.

Give me ALL THE ARC TROOPERS.

ABSOLUTELY ECSTATIC about these guys.

Gonna get at least two units. Multiple helmets is great, I need my Phase 1 ARCs.

Might actually pick up enough to run multiple variations at any time

I like the look of the ARC Troopers. Got to add a unit to my army. May as well get Padme, too. Not the least for contrast. All those clones can get samey. I really hope we'll see the Grand Gungan Army at some point, too.

While the AT-RT rumor makes sense as it's a cheap and easy addition, it won't do me any good. I already have two for my Rebels and I'm not sure I need any more with a different rider. I'd rather have something new and exciting. Not sure what would fit size wise, though. So many of the cooler Clone Wars things will probably not fit on the table.

Cad Bane is cool. Makes me wonder why I always end up with the factions that don't get bounty hunters. Oh well, I'll probably buy one just to paint, then.

I hope we don't have too long to wait for generic commanders. Empire and Rebels got theirs about three quarters of a year after the starter set's release. Hopefully Clone Wars will get the same treatment.

 AegisGrimm wrote:
So is Legion increasingly going to plastic minis on sprues? All these expansions make definite mention of "hard plastic" in the descriptions.

I don't know how far reaching the change is supposed to be, but it was my understanding from what Gencon visitors said after Clone Wars were announced that FFG wanted to switch to hard plastic. Seeing as how we even get individual characters in that material now, it seems to me that full hard plastic is the goal.

Anyone got anything more recent or concrete than that?

 Manchu wrote:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Turns out making a war game about a war is easier than making a war game about an partisan insurrection.

Exactly!

To each their own, but at the standard army size of 800 points I have a hard time fitting thirty guys in my Rebel army, vehicle crews included. That's a good size to have a tactical game with and I think FFG was wise to go with smaller army sizes than 40k or even Bolt Action have. At that kind of game size I'm going to have to say, say what you will, I'm sure space terrorists can gather 30 guys and grab some vehicles from their local used speeder dealer and not look like they have a hard time filling their roster.

Honestly I have the exact opposite problem you seem to have. I don't think the GRAND ARMY OF THE REPUBLIC will look all that grand, considering clones even cost more points than Rebels and Stormtroopers. Legion is about a couple of squads of guys. You don't need droid factories and cloning facilities to fill a force of so modest a size. Don't get me wrong, It's cool to get all the new Clone Wars toys and adding two factions to the original two will do the game good, but purely mechanically the game is more suited to the down to earth skirmished of the Glactic Civil War than the huge spectacles that are part of the Clone Wars.

 Albertorius wrote:

 AegisGrimm wrote:
I'm finding it really strange that I don't care at all for the prequel trilogy, but at the same time love the idea of a Clone Wars wargame much more than a Galactic Civil War one?

Well, I don't much care for the prequels either, but I do love The Clone Wars series, so... yeah, I'm loving it.

I like best that with Cad Bane and Rex FFG starts giving us Clone Wars units from very early on. It's just a shame that they don't have their priorities straight. Where's Ahsoka?

 BobtheInquisitor wrote:
So, is Imperial Assault completely dead then? Would anyone play it with Legion mins? I've got a complete set of IA rules and tiles I was hoping to trade away--should I not even bother and just trashe them?

So what do you mean when you say "complete set"? I intend to do exactly as you said and play with a combo of Legion minis and 3D prints. PM me what you have and what you might want in trade.

 Taarnak wrote:

 BobtheInquisitor wrote:
So, is Imperial Assault completely dead then? Would anyone play it with Legion mins? I've got a complete set of IA rules and tiles I was hoping to trade away--should I not even bother and just trashe them?

So what do you mean when you say "complete set"? I intend to do exactly as you said and play with a combo of Legion minis and 3D prints. PM me what you have and what you might want in trade.

the imp assault minis are smaller in scale & not the same as each other.

 bubber wrote:

 Taarnak wrote:

 BobtheInquisitor wrote:
So, is Imperial Assault completely dead then? Would anyone play it with Legion mins? I've got a complete set of IA rules and tiles I was hoping to trade away--should I not even bother and just trashe them?

So what do you mean when you say "complete set"? I intend to do exactly as you said and play with a combo of Legion minis and 3D prints. PM me what you have and what you might want in trade.

the imp assault minis are smaller in scale & not the same as each other.

Yeah I know. I was intending to replace all the minis with Legion ones where possible and 3D prints where that is not possible. My IA minis were a casting mess and the scale of the figures was all over the map. Legion is mostly consistent there at least.

 Taarnak wrote:

 bubber wrote:

 Taarnak wrote:

 BobtheInquisitor wrote:
So, is Imperial Assault completely dead then? Would anyone play it with Legion mins? I've got a complete set of IA rules and tiles I was hoping to trade away--should I not even bother and just trashe them?

So what do you mean when you say "complete set"? I intend to do exactly as you said and play with a combo of Legion minis and 3D prints. PM me what you have and what you might want in trade.

the imp assault minis are smaller in scale & not the same as each other.

Yeah I know. I was intending to replace all the minis with Legion ones where possible and 3D prints where that is not possible. My IA minis were a casting mess and the scale of the figures was all over the map. Legion is mostly consistent there at least.

I see

I bought the AT-ST thinking it was a bargain but it's tiny!!

Doing the same. I was hoping to see all of the IA figs makes the jump to Legion after the rebel commander showed up in the specialists pack. Most of them have from the base set, the rest have some close-enough stand-ins or can be rebased to match like the Nexu, but that gets harder and harder the more expansions you look at. Really hoping we get everything re-tooled by the end, I've really come to appreciate the Legion scale over the IA and WotC figs, even though I have such a large collection of them.

Only problem with these previews is how far out they are, I'm still waiting for PhaseII troopers and Super Battledroids to release

Reports indicate that Phase II Clones and SBDs will be released on the 28th (and I think the tanks as well?). Personally I'm really looking forward to adding those ARC troopers to my clones, those models are excellent!

I feel like FFG has come a very long way in a very short time with this game. Those commando droids with their guns poking through the shields are crazy.

I wouldn't mind a late February release for those. I've still got enough clones to paint so I'm not in a hurry myself*, but the extra variety will do the Clone Wars era armies good. Always feels a little odd to play with your Rebel army with its wide variety of units against someone starting up Legion with clones or droids.

I think sculpting quality was there from the beginning. Most troopers I handled have enticing poses and the only thing that's holding them back is being cast in PVC. The switch to plastic is a welcome one. I'm looking forward to seeing those Phase II Clones in person and comparing them to my PVC ones.



*Who am I kidding, I'll get an expansion to my Republic army regardless of how much of it is painted...

Wrong thread! Ignore!

I think Legion's early models were certainly decent (especially the vehicles which were and are IMO excellent) but there's still a notable difference in model quality between, say, the Rebel Troopers and the Pathfinders, despite them both being broadly the same sort of thing (humans or humanoids in cloth with helmets and rifles) -- the Pathfinders are notably more detailed and FFG has said in interviews that they've been getting more proficient with the technology.

Similarly, the Phase I Clones are both a bit nicer-looking than the Stormtroopers and easier to swap arms with and assemble in a variety of poses (despite still being PVC). Now we have Phase II Clones coming at the end of the month in hard plastic with different options on the sprue, ARCs with custom flying stands and jetpack options on the horizon... things are looking exciting!

Hmm, I thought separation of the arms made Clones harder to work with than Stormtroopers. Shaving down both the shoulder and wrist pegs for a proper fit (and then gluing three parts together instead of two) gave me more trouble than only having to adjust the shoulders on the Stormtroopers. I certainly remember a lot more swearing on account of the Clones...

Agreed on the improved quality of the newer models, though. Now that you mention it, newer PVC models are crisper than the earlier ones.

 Kingsley wrote:
Reports indicate that Phase II Clones and SBDs will be released on the 28th (and I think the tanks as well?). Personally I'm really looking forward to adding those ARC troopers to my clones, those models are excellent!

I feel like FFG has come a very long way in a very short time with this game. Those commando droids with their guns poking through the shields are crazy.

Yeah, word is the 28th for everything bar the AAT, though take with a massive grain of salt and temper your expectations depending upon which country you live in.

 ingtaer wrote:

 Kingsley wrote:
Reports indicate that Phase II Clones and SBDs will be released on the 28th (and I think the tanks as well?). Personally I'm really looking forward to adding those ARC troopers to my clones, those models are excellent!

I feel like FFG has come a very long way in a very short time with this game. Those commando droids with their guns poking through the shields are crazy.

Yeah, word is the 28th for everything bar the AAT, though take with a massive grain of salt and temper your expectations depending upon which country you live in.

Indeed. Here in Portugal, we expect to get those by the end of March's first week.

Most of their stuff is sold out or very hard to get

anyone know if this is because the game is doing so well, or is FFG producing Legion in China (or a different reason)?

The move to hard plastic is making Legion more tempting for me, for sure. PVC has been the real barrier for me since the days of the original GenCon demos caught my attention.

 kodos wrote:
Most of their stuff is sold out or very hard to get

anyone know if this is because the game is doing so well, or is FFG producing Legion in China (or a different reason)?

they don't do their own casting like GW so can't just run off more when they need them, they need to wait for the next order 'wave'. Factory slots are always hard to get hold of (Dakka's own Maelstroms edge looks to produce their plastic in more than one place from the look of the sprues and i'm sure being able to get things made in a timely fashion is part of the reason why)

you see the same thing with Wyrd, PP, CMON etc and because it's selling it's very noticeable for FFG and legion (note CMON has been pretty awful in terms of availability even when their games weren't selling well so there are probably other issues there too)

 OrlandotheTechnicoloured wrote:

they don't do their own casting like GW so can't just run off more when they need them

I know that, that is why I asked.
There can be several reason why things don't work out. One being that the game sells better as FFG thought when they ordered their plastic and now have to wait for the next slot/wave to be shipped.
while a simple planning mistake to move from PVC to plastic would be another reason.