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Made in ca
Ultramarine Land Raider Pilot on Cruise Control






 AndrewC wrote:
I get the requirement that Marines needed a boost in the present meta and that they were frequently ignored in preference to other factions, I am also genuinely pleased that GW has heard the pleas of marine players, but am I the only one concerned that they have jumped too far the other way?

Why take any other faction when a marine has it better (YMMV)? People took specific factions because some aspect of their gameplay appealed to them. Is anyone going to bother when they can buy a marine army and get to do all the specific things they could, but better?

It will be interesting to see if there is a major rewrite of the points costs for the units.

Cheers

Andrew


Generally you still get 2 guys per one marine and still double the shots, just less quality of said shots. It'll be interesting to see how this pans out. Marines won't be bottom tier but I don't think they'll be dominating
   
Made in us
Thunderhawk Pilot Dropping From Orbit




San Jose, CA

fraser1191 wrote:I figure stalkers have better damage cause they take more time to aim, are probably more accurate, and hit a critical spot


perfectly reasonable.
   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka





Not Online!!! wrote:


IT's still a bloody Stubpistol which just so happen to has an actual pistol it's range is 6" S3 No Ap D 1. Are you going to tell me that a gakky revolver will even be able to use that ammo?


There is no special equipment required to fire what is basically a depleted uranium bullet.

[im]https://imgur.com/kEUzFF0.png[im]

http://insighthammer.com/ 
   
Made in ca
Ultramarine Land Raider Pilot on Cruise Control






 Daedalus81 wrote:
Not Online!!! wrote:


IT's still a bloody Stubpistol which just so happen to has an actual pistol it's range is 6" S3 No Ap D 1. Are you going to tell me that a gakky revolver will even be able to use that ammo?


There is no special equipment required to fire what is basically a depleted uranium bullet.


It's a pistol unique to him so chalk it up to skill on the user
   
Made in gb
Regular Dakkanaut




 JNAProductions wrote:


If one squad of Plaguebearers is -2 4++...

Shoot the other squad. There can be, at most, one squad affected by the -1 Psychic Power, and one squad affected by the 4++ strat. In addition, the 4++ is declared at the START of the phase, NOT in response to being shot at.


In other words the amazing combo changes nothing, you may as well leave that unit alone and target something else so you are still not getting at the characters hiding behind it who are doing the damage.

Which is my point; the offensive power of SM is definitely going up but not in any sort of game-breaking way and when you look at them against top level lists not really in a game-changing way that we have seen yet. Definitely they are much closer to being able to hang with those top lists but I am not seeing much more than that in anything that has been teased so far. Calm down the hype, this stuff is good but its not any more crazy good than stuff we have been seeing on tables for a while.
   
Made in us
Shrieking Traitor Sentinel Pilot




USA

 AndrewC wrote:
I get the requirement that Marines needed a boost in the present meta and that they were frequently ignored in preference to other factions, I am also genuinely pleased that GW has heard the pleas of marine players, but am I the only one concerned that they have jumped too far the other way?

Why take any other faction when a marine has it better (YMMV)? People took specific factions because some aspect of their gameplay appealed to them. Is anyone going to bother when they can buy a marine army and get to do all the specific things they could, but better?

It will be interesting to see if there is a major rewrite of the points costs for the units.

Cheers

Andrew


Because they look cool and have cool fluff. Easy.


In seriousness, the buffs might not be that bad, but who knows.

"For the dark gods!" - A traitor guardsmen, probably before being killed. 
   
Made in us
Ultramarine Chaplain with Hate to Spare






 AndrewC wrote:
I get the requirement that Marines needed a boost in the present meta and that they were frequently ignored in preference to other factions, I am also genuinely pleased that GW has heard the pleas of marine players, but am I the only one concerned that they have jumped too far the other way?

Why take any other faction when a marine has it better (YMMV)? People took specific factions because some aspect of their gameplay appealed to them. Is anyone going to bother when they can buy a marine army and get to do all the specific things they could, but better?

It will be interesting to see if there is a major rewrite of the points costs for the units.

Cheers

Andrew

Honestly my initial reaction was that it was too much. I might have overacted a bit though it is possible that marines might be a top choice now. However you have to consider how bad they actually were to understand these massive buffs they are getting will only elevate them to the top level of play and not beyond it. If you gave buff like this to say...DE or AM - they literally could not lose a game. This ofc is just if they do not change points much. If any of the core units go up in price that seem to benefit the most from these rules they go from being top choices to garbage really quick. Lets sit back and play it. I am really excited to get out there and try all of these chapters rules out. I am going to spend a lot of money too.

If we fail to anticipate the unforeseen or expect the unexpected in a universe of infinite possibilities, we may find ourselves at the mercy of anyone or anything that cannot be programmed, categorized or easily referenced.
- Fox Mulder 
   
Made in ca
Resolute Ultramarine Honor Guard






Vancouver, BC

The White Scars rules look really bad (or at best, really mediocre) for Primaris, but better for Adeptus Marines

 warboss wrote:
Is there a permanent stickied thread for Chaos players to complain every time someone/anyone gets models or rules besides them? If not, there should be.
 
   
Made in us
Ultramarine Chaplain with Hate to Spare






 Crazyterran wrote:
The White Scars rules look really bad (or at best, really mediocre) for Primaris, but better for Adeptus Marines
Not terrible for inceptors. If their mortal wound on the charge is changed to a more reasonable 4+ instead of 6+ they could even be a core choice.

If we fail to anticipate the unforeseen or expect the unexpected in a universe of infinite possibilities, we may find ourselves at the mercy of anyone or anything that cannot be programmed, categorized or easily referenced.
- Fox Mulder 
   
Made in ca
Courageous Space Marine Captain





white scars IMHO will be solid running mixes, as even intercessors are decent in a close combat fight. but yeah you're gonna wanna have bikes. and even assault marines. (did I really jsut say "you're going to want to have assault marines?! wow)

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/08/10 01:41:12


Ultimately the power of an Inquisitor extends as far as he can make it extend 
   
Made in us
Ultramarine Chaplain with Hate to Spare






We better get a shoots twice stratagem.

If we fail to anticipate the unforeseen or expect the unexpected in a universe of infinite possibilities, we may find ourselves at the mercy of anyone or anything that cannot be programmed, categorized or easily referenced.
- Fox Mulder 
   
Made in ca
Courageous Space Marine Captain





 Xenomancers wrote:
We better get a shoots twice stratagem.


even if we don't I'd say the ability for UMs to rapid fire on the movie'll make up for it

Ultimately the power of an Inquisitor extends as far as he can make it extend 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





Ice_can wrote:

I don't see why your so hyped about UM stalkers they still look meh at best for other chapters that stay in devistator doctrine maybe.



Because 36" -2 D2 is nice? I did the math without Doctrines. Without Doctrine a D2 Stalker actually edges out a Bolt Rifle on 2+ wound targets. Before the D2 change they were close - and I was pointing that out - after the change the Stalker outpaces the Bolt Rifle - after Doctrines it should swing back to the Bolt Rifle, but not by much so I plan on taking both Bolt Rifle and Stalker Intercessors for different purposes.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Ice_can wrote:
 Galef wrote:
 Xenomancers wrote:
The stalker is D2. So tomatoes tomatos vs lots of targets. It's not worth spamming them. It is worth bringing 1 unit though I think to use the sniper stratagem. #1 that does mortal wounds on 6's #2 that allows you to target characters. If there is multi wound stuff to shoot in the game they will perform about equal to a bolt rfile and BETTER on turn 1 by a large margine. They are really bad vs hordes though.If you face hordes - pout that unit into CC first.
In general though, this is how it should be. Same goes if the rumour is true that Auto BRs may be Assault 3.
D2 Stalker and Assault 3 Auto BR are both better than RF BRs at their intended targets, by enough of a margin that 1-2 units with each are worth taking. But the RF BR is a better all-rounder weapon to spam. If the Auto BR is indeed Assault 3 (but 1-2ppm over the RF BR), then GW deserves a pat on the back.

-
Except if your chasing multi damage/snipers why not go eliminators as the look way better than stalkers.
Also their is an underlying assumption going on that the vigilous marine stuff is still valid post codex 2.0

While none of it is game breaking without some of those buffs a number of these options are still relatively weak.


Because they're about 10 points per model more, don't pay the "troop tax", don't objective secured, and will likely be Unit Size 3/6 so you're paying even more for even fewer shots.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/08/10 04:43:11


My WHFB armies were Bretonians and Tomb Kings. 
   
Made in ca
Anointed Dark Priest of Chaos





British Columbia

How many Deathwatch Veterans are putting in for a transfer back to their Chapter for the massive upgrades?

 Crimson Devil wrote:
That's what 7th edition is about. Yelling "Forge the Narrative Pussy!" while kicking your opponent in the dick.
 BlaxicanX wrote:
A young business man named Tom Kirby, who was a pupil of mine until he turned greedy, helped the capitalists hunt down and destroy the wargamers. He betrayed and murdered Games Workshop.


 
   
Made in us
Stalwart Space Marine





Assault 3 auto bolt rifles will be wicked on white scars. Advance a 5-man squad, fire 15 ap-1 shots with tactical doctrine, charge in and do 16-17 attacks depending on chainsword, and then the next turn switch to assault doctrine and either use your pistols or fall back and charge again for shock attack.
   
Made in us
Horrific Hive Tyrant




Tampa, FL

So apparently marines can now deep strike turn 1 with drop pods, now as the only faction in the game to be able to do that now. This is fething ridiculous, even by GW standards. This book is going to be so over the top ridiculous it won't even be funny. This book so far looks like it's WHFB Chaos Daemons level of garbage. I'm honestly very glad that I couldn't do two games at once and chose to put 40k on the backburner for now.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/08/10 11:01:51


- Wayne
Formerly WayneTheGame 
   
Made in ch
Anointed Dark Priest of Chaos





Wayniac wrote:
So apparently marines can now deep strike turn 1 with drop pods, now as the only faction in the game to be able to do that now. This is fething ridiculous, even by GW standards. This book is going to be so over the top ridiculous it won't even be funny. This book so far looks like it's WHFB Chaos Daemons level of garbage. I'm honestly very glad that I couldn't do two games at once and chose to put 40k on the backburner for now.


Tac marines are now 12 pts aswell... Supposedly.


https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/766717.page

A Mostly Renegades and Heretics blog.
_______________________________

Who would win:
10'000 + years of veterancy, or some raidy Boys?
(Not Online in regards to the new Red Corsair battalion CP boost.) 
   
Made in us
Horrific Hive Tyrant




Tampa, FL

I mean maybe it won't actually end up that bad. But from all the previews and stuff, this book seems like it's in a tier all its own that's head and shoulders better than everything else in the game.

- Wayne
Formerly WayneTheGame 
   
Made in ch
Anointed Dark Priest of Chaos





Wayniac wrote:
I mean maybe it won't actually end up that bad. But from all the previews and stuff, this book seems like it's in a tier all its own that's head and shoulders better than everything else in the game.


He now, equivalent units of Chaos pay now officially spike tax.
It is never bad when a whole faction pays spiketax.

https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/766717.page

A Mostly Renegades and Heretics blog.
_______________________________

Who would win:
10'000 + years of veterancy, or some raidy Boys?
(Not Online in regards to the new Red Corsair battalion CP boost.) 
   
Made in ca
Courageous Space Marine Captain





keep ion mind CSMs are going to be getting a FAQ that offically gives them shock assault. with any luck they'll tweek the points costs for CSMs then too

Ultimately the power of an Inquisitor extends as far as he can make it extend 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





Wayniac wrote:
So apparently marines can now deep strike turn 1 with drop pods, now as the only faction in the game to be able to do that now. This is fething ridiculous, even by GW standards. This book is going to be so over the top ridiculous it won't even be funny. This book so far looks like it's WHFB Chaos Daemons level of garbage. I'm honestly very glad that I couldn't do two games at once and chose to put 40k on the backburner for now.


That was the big thing about Drop Pods when they were new. Half of them automatically came in on Turn 1 while other people were rolling for reserves. They're getting some of that back that made them worth taking.

My WHFB armies were Bretonians and Tomb Kings. 
   
Made in gb
Dakka Veteran






Yeah, Drop Pods deffo need something to make them worthwhile. I'd be pretty happy even with them just getting a load cheaper tbh.
   
Made in it
Regular Dakkanaut




They still carry old Marines only and those die like flies.
   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka





Wayniac wrote:
So apparently marines can now deep strike turn 1 with drop pods, now as the only faction in the game to be able to do that now. This is fething ridiculous, even by GW standards. This book is going to be so over the top ridiculous it won't even be funny. This book so far looks like it's WHFB Chaos Daemons level of garbage. I'm honestly very glad that I couldn't do two games at once and chose to put 40k on the backburner for now.


I honestly don't see a problem with this if pods stay at their current price.

[im]https://imgur.com/kEUzFF0.png[im]

http://insighthammer.com/ 
   
Made in us
Ultramarine Land Raider Pilot on Cruise Control






 Daedalus81 wrote:
Wayniac wrote:
So apparently marines can now deep strike turn 1 with drop pods, now as the only faction in the game to be able to do that now. This is fething ridiculous, even by GW standards. This book is going to be so over the top ridiculous it won't even be funny. This book so far looks like it's WHFB Chaos Daemons level of garbage. I'm honestly very glad that I couldn't do two games at once and chose to put 40k on the backburner for now.


I honestly don't see a problem with this if pods stay at their current price.


They still have restrictions like they always did. I don't remember people screaming about drop pods at the start of 8th. The sky isn't falling, but drop pods are
   
Made in us
Locked in the Tower of Amareo




Still nothing to put in the pod...
   
Made in au
Ork-Hunting Inquisitorial Xenokiller




Centurion W4 and Aggressors W3, and big hoorahhhh to norm marines making it. A lot of tactics now to all include vehicles.

If norm marines didn't make it than we all would go primaris, just go 32's with higher base size and Deathwatch, but you made it...) (I still am all now DW)

Good review at https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g-aq0Uv3r4E

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/08/10 13:48:26


14k Generic Space Marine Chapters
20k Deathwatch
10k Sisters of Battle
3k Inquisition
4k Grey Knights
5k Imperial Guard
4k Harlequins
4k Tau



 
   
Made in fi
Chaplain with Hate to Spare






Yes! Extra wound for Gravis! Now they're good! I said just a couple of days a go that this is what they need.

Only the insane have strength enough to prosper. Only those who prosper may truly judge what is sane. 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





Gig Harbor, WA

 Nazrak wrote:
Yeah, Drop Pods deffo need something to make them worthwhile. I'd be pretty happy even with them just getting a load cheaper tbh.


Drop pods can't carry Primaris. I don't think GW is going to care much about them at this point.
   
Made in it
Longtime Dakkanaut




Ok, this is getting too much now.
Welcome to necron 7th!

Say goodbye to any semblance of balance we finally got in this edition after years of careful changes!

Now we can only hope in the next CA to increase the cost of everything marine...
   
 
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