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New(er) GW Empire Page

Stumbled upon this mostly by accident.  Clearly the real meat of this update is in the updated Empire Miniatures Gallery.  Most isn't new, but better non-blurry pics anyway

- Boss Salvage

As predicted, GW has halved the number of troops in their sets (to 10) and I would bet good money they haven't halved prices.

My brother - whose mildly interested in Empire, which is more than can be said for me - and I couldn't figure out any benefit to 10 models per box, given how state troops and such need to be run with max rank, etc. Possibly it 'works' for missile troops fielded in min-size squads, but there's no way it comes down to anything but Greed Worship. Bleh.


... maybe we'll be surprised and 10 models will only go for, say, $20. Price increase, but to only $2 a model, instead of double that ...

- Boss Salvage

What a joke... Based on the European prices GW is still convinced they should sink their own ship rather then let increased competition hurt their profits. "They'll never take us alive!"

Well, seeing as how 10 Space Marines goes for $35, I wouldn't put it past them to charge $30-35 for 10 new Empire state troops.  Is there any boxed set of 10 models cheaper than $30?  I mean, there's boxed sets of 5 models for $20....

I'm not too optimistic, price-wise.

I thought the old ones were fine anyway.  If it were me, I'd be picking up as many of the old boxes as I could right about now.

At first I wasn't put off by the new State Troop sculpts, but a closer look (at un-blurry pictures) has changed my mind. I don't particularly mind the giant feathers. But the legs are all skinny, and spread awkwardly apart. Do our troopers have diarhea? The shoes are not proper German 16th c. 'bearpaws', and at least one guy is barefoot! I won't be buying any of these new figures. Meh.

On the other hand, the Helstorm rocket launcher doesn't totally suck, and the new pistoliers look pretty good.

According to Alliance Distributors;

<table width="100%" border="0"> <tbody> <tr> <td nowrap="nowrap">GAW 86-06-N</td> <td>Warhammer Fantasy Battle: Empire State Troops</td> <td align="right">$22.00</td> </tr> </tbody> </table>

<table width="100%" border="0"> <tbody> <tr> <td> </td> <td nowrap="nowrap">GAW 86-09</td> <td>Warhammer Fantasy Battle: Empire Handgunners</td> <td align="right">$22.00</td> </tr> </tbody> </table>

These Suck Ass... Hard.

The new state troops are truly terrible sculpts that are a travesty against the current Perry ones.

And 10 men a box? Under new Warhammer the rules state all units must have ranks of 5 wide minimum. 2 ranks? Come on GW you know as well as us that a decent sized unit needs at least 15.

So two boxes for one usable unit. Assuming they are 12 pounds each thats 22 pounds that gives you an extra 5 men you don't really want. And thats better than the current box for 18 pounds... how exactly?

This is arse, this entire army release is arse, as was the orc and goblin army. The only new releases that empire needed were addressed in Storm of Chaos. And the Knightly order grand masters!!!! Please for the love of god how old are these? Stop messing around with good plastic core sets (you left marines alone didn't you?) and fix these outdated metals.

Woe that I should live to see such dark times....

$2.20 per figure isn't too bad, even for plastic. Marines are $3.50 each. Still, I think these sculpts are very, very bad, and are nothing like a bargain at the price.

I've not played Fantasy in 10 years now, but I went to your link: $65 for a Steam Tank?!?!? This is probably a reason I don't get into Fantasy and stay with one GW core system (40K). Too costly to get into multiple GW systems.

Posted By fellblade on 12/05/2006 8:37 AM
$2.20 per figure isn't too bad, even for plastic. Marines are $3.50 each. Still, I think these sculpts are very, very bad, and are nothing like a bargain at the price.

I couldn't disagree more about the sculpts, but you're entitled to that opinion.  What we can all agree on is that the price is insane.  Once again I say:

"You'll never take us over alive!"

Eh, more bits, more options, more price.

Oh well, life goes on. You either buy, or you don't.

I like the new sculpts, will be adding them to my force. 10 man regiment sets suit me fine. 2 boxes for 20, then 10 man detachments. Basically what I field now.

Posted By Hordini on 12/05/2006 6:33 AM
Well, seeing as how 10 Space Marines goes for $35, I wouldn't put it past them to charge $30-35 for 10 new Empire state troops.  Is there any boxed set of 10 models cheaper than $30?  I mean, there's boxed sets of 5 models for $20....

I'm not too optimistic, price-wise.

I thought the old ones were fine anyway.  If it were me, I'd be picking up as many of the old boxes as I could right about now.

Price will be twenty bucks a box for 10 guys.

Wow, I really hate that rocket launcher.

The price thing goes without saying.

Just to solidify then...

Before: 22 men for $35 (including the men on the HQ sprue)
New: 10 for $22 or $44 for 20.

$1.59 per man vs $2.20

38% price hike? did I get that right?

But we get new superior sculpts! And we might even get some token bitz!

The amazing thing, of course, is how cheap empire troops are in terms of pts.  I don't even want to imagine putting together a detachment army after a 38% or 20% price hike.

IIRC, it was 19 men with the HW sprue before, because the old sprues were four men each, for a unit cost of $1.84 a man. If the boxes were $20, that would be a pretty negligible increase. Now, we know they won't be $20, instead they'll be $22, making it a 20% price hike, or roughly what we've gotten used to every year or two.

Personally, what annoys me, and I'm guessing what annoys everybody else, is that this repackaging and hidden price hike comes at the same time empire units pretty much had to go from 20 men to 25 men (4x5 to 5x5 in V7), and the new empire book actually give the new infantry a price break.

To sum up, you'll need more, you'll want more, and they're going to be more expensive.

I can think of two reasons to do this:
1) the people who come up with the package size don't set prices. 10 man boxes are better for gamers, not counting price.
2) they couldn't justify giving us 20 men for $35.

I'm going with a combination of both, myself.

The skirmishers are 20 for $35.

For a while I was under the impression we got 20 men + a 10 man detachment for 44...which I could have lived with.

But ffs 10 men in a box is gak. gak. I like the new sculpts, and it was wise that they made the state troops all in one box (bitz heaven for me and my dumb conversions), but I'm sorry 10 men boxes are stupid. Now I'll NEVER get any new recruits for empire here...bleh...slowed GW.

You know, some exec (Kirby?) is sitting in his sumptuous office cackling "SUCKERS!! YOU'LL NEVER FIGURE IT OUT WILL YOU!!! MWHAHAHAHAHAHA!" as he gets paid inordinate amounts of money to drive GW into the ground while the rest of us look on in horror as our beloved hobby is slowly destroyed by greed.

Oh well, if the sculpts weren't bad enough for me (not to mention my other, uh, gripe), the prices ensure that I'll not be buying anything for use with my vampires. They didn't even put out new barded steeds, for chrissakes, those figs have been needing replacement for eons.

Complete list of prices (in pounds) and models from the UK site:

http://uk.games-workshop.com/storefront/store.uk?do=List_Models&code=300943&orignav=13

I think they want everyone to buy this:

http://uk.games-workshop.com/storefront/store.uk?do=Individual&code=99120202018&orignav=13

Pants are less puffy than the older plastics... so I say Hells yeah motherfudger! I could see buying the detachment box. I like that idea a little more than the 10 man boxes but I could go either way, still just Dogs of War conversion fodder to me.

Has anyone seen the detachment box on the advance orders section?

http://store.us.games-workshop.com/storefront/store.us?do=List_Models&code=302101&orignav=302101&ParentID=258885&GameNav=9

$45 for 30 guys...20 Fighter types and 10 Shooter types.

This seems more like a realistic regiment building set. The State Troop set should really be called the Detachment set...and vice versa.

Indeed. I even linked it in my post, you know the one that is two places above yours.

take a look at some Landsknecht  or Plunderhosen pictures some time.... see any puffy there?  oh yes.  That is what the empire should look like, and what it has looked like since the game started.

On the topic at hand, 10 man boxes annoy me, $22 boxes are really annoying, and the new awful sculpts really seal the deal.  I mean really, gigantic feathers, the lack of puff, and a belt full of geegaws for every trooper I could have dealt with, but those faces are terrible. Fortunately I already bought up some existing state trooper boxes, have all the spearmen and handgunners anyone could ever want, and the beloved militia box is not going away.

then again, and let's be honest here, with some 8000 points of empire, I am hardly the target market for GW.  Sure, I would have bought more reigments, but never enough to equal those that look at these marble mouth morons with feathers and think "Kewl!".

But in your 8000 points of Empire, you have not a single Helstorm Barrage Rocket. Buy one you must. Especially now that the beloved volley gun has been so tragically, gratuitously nerfed.

DEAR GODS TELL ME WHAT THEY DID TO MY HELBLASTER!!!!!!

And as for that 3 man deal, THAT is the direction GW should go for the Empire. Drop the price by 5 - 10 bucks and then they're set for smart.

From Memory: (in other words, this pro'lly ain't perfect):
110 points.

Roll artillery dice to generate shots, once for each barrel. Misfires are bad.
Shots are resolved at crew's BS. S5, -2AS, 24" range. I don't remember anything stating that there were no penalties for long range, skirmish, etc.; so assume standard to-hit penalties & bonuses apply.
You can attach a Master Engineer and use his BS.

Misfires: 1= boom!
2 = two-turn click on all barrels
3-4 = one-turn click on all barrels
5 = click on this barrel only
6 = this barrel & remaining barrels generate 10 shots each... as they explode & destroy the gun & crew. Boom!

So: we've lost our automatic hits.  We must now roll to hit and roll to wound.  No more the heady days of vaporizing skirmishers & such.  We still have three chances to misfire every turn, and we now have twice the chances of blowing ourselves up.  As an added bonus, we can now attach a hero, so he can share in the increased chance to blow up.

Gimme my old rules, I'll pay the extra 15 points.

They did this to sell rocket launchers, I know they did.  Rockets only have one chance to blow up each turn.  It's pretty cool, though; if it misfires, you center the template over the launcher.  (That contraption is going way out on the flank, yessirree bob.)  And it does a S5 hit to everything under the template.

Posted By Zoned on 12/06/2006 10:11 AM
Has anyone seen the detachment box on the advance orders section?

http://store.us.games-workshop.com/storefront/store.us?do=List_Models&code=302101&orignav=302101&ParentID=258885&GameNav=9

$45 for 30 guys...20 Fighter types and 10 Shooter types.

This seems more like a realistic regiment building set. The State Troop set should really be called the Detachment set...and vice versa.

http://store.us.games-workshop.com/storefront/store.us?do=List_Models&code=302101&orignav=302101&ParentID=258885&GameNav=9

At $5 for 30 that's a $1.50 a model.  Less than the current $1.59.

Go team GW!

Posted By Kid_Kyoto on 12/06/2006 6:39 PM

At $5 for 30 that's a $1.50 a model.  Less than the current $1.59.

Go team GW!

$5 for 30!  That's like, $0.17 per model!   What a great deal!  But your link keeps taking me to some greedy corporate online store  with a much higher price...