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Posted By Vult  on  01/07/2007 5:43 PM

Not to get to far off topic but this post brings back the feeling after watching the cinematic at the start of Dawn of War....that GW should do a full movie like that.  I mean how kick ass was that first cinematic, I must have watched it a dozen times or more.  It was so well done and I think that if they did a full length movie it could be amazing.

Lets start a new thread, Velt.

I feel the same way. After watching the mark of chaos video (which I still watch) I long for GW to do something more in that vein. I am not sure how much CGI like that costs, but if they could do 5 mins for a flipping video game, why not extend that by 30 times and make an hour and a half type of film.

Remember G.I. Joe? Remember how the cartoon made the toys such a hit toy during the mid-late eighties?

The Dungeons & Dragons cartoon. Do you think half of the people that play that game now that are in their thirties would have tried something like roleplaying if it wasnt for that brilliant marketting move? I know it was the reason I started playing. (By the way, the whole series is now released on DVD, another succesful marketting move)

Starship troopers CGI cartoon. Didnt that win awards at the time it was shown? (although, even the fact that it won awards still didnt keep it from getting cancelled, it was just on far too early in the morning for people like me to watch.)

I could go on and list other crossover success like pokemon, but I think you all get the point.

GW is missing a whole strata of players by not making people pay for their advertisements...oh wait never mind. They think white dwarf fills that niche. Heh. laughable.

GW profits might not be in such dire straights if theyyy could advertise properly with tried and true methods that have been in use since the days of kaptain kangaroo. (Kaptain Kangaroo was the first program to directly market towards children during their programming. Judging by what I see today, and how I acted when saturday morning cartoons were the thing to do, it seems effective enough)

I bet Hasbro could do 40K or WHFB justice if they could keep it from going to clicky bases. My guess is that kirby is banking on thatt, which is why he has invested so much into the company, and to make sure no one else can 'can' him for bad management. He stands to make a tidy profit off of the death of GW when it comes time to sell the GW IP.

Actually I've seen it said a few times over the years that GW has been approached several times about a 40K movie, but they always say no because they want complete control over it and movie studios would never allow that. Guess that means they're waiting for someone to come along and do it right (and that someone is me! Eisenhorn Trilogy!) .. hopefully though if/when it does happen we don't end up with a copy of the D&D movie

And CGI is actually very expensive. Some kids might be able to download a pirate copy of a big 3D app like Maya and learn how to do some cool stuff... but in the real biz of CGI filmmaking, you need a staff of folks to make a movie, weather it's 5 minutes or 30 or 120. Director, art director, storyboards, 3D Modelers, set decorators, lighting specialists (even for computer lights).. and then there's the sound engineers and music folks.. casting director to find actors for the voices if any .. Oh and then you need an editor too. it's really just like a crew for a regular film, only everyone's work on a computer making an animated world instead of a real one. Ever watch the end credits for a big CGI movie, there's a bazillion names under the special effects part Hell, it's prolly cheaper to do em old school with model space ships and blue screens. If you have a small group of really tallented folks it could be pulled off too, but it would take hella long to do

Intellectual property rights.

Well GW obviuosly has IP rights, but that didnt stop alot of companies from taking that IP and handing it to the animators for doing something with.

yeah there is alot of work. I heard that it took 3 years to make Finding nemo.

I just dont understand why this cant be done. There really isnt any reason for it, unless GW wants an inordinate cut of the pie, so the films companies tell them to duff off.

I disbelieve there would be any serious interest in a SciFi movie that was a mash of DOOM, Star Ship Troopers, and Aliens (with the odd space elf and space orc thrown into the mix). Thing is, in a Sci Fi environment there are so many ideas already done before. For any Scifi movie to suceed it requires some serious originality and/or a massive fanatically loyal fanbase. There are loyal GW fans, but only a spec compared to Star Wars or Star Trek. Besides, GW is going to want immense control and a sci fi movie can be made without all that hassle.

well yes and no

something similar happened with the babylon 5 franchise john micheal strazynski created the show and held total control over it and all its related merchandising(and still does). at first WB tried to give suggestions about what they liked to see(fun story about that) but after the first season or so they stopped sending him "suggestions" as he made it clear it was his show and his idea and he would take it elseware if need be, which is why crusade was cancelled after a mere 13 episodes, sci wanted to change the show and JMS told them to fly a kite so to speak.

 

the recent starwars trilogy was also a non-studio affair. lucas had enough tech in production companies like ILM and funds to pay for all 3 films himself without any studio invovlement. it was his films done his way.

 

so it can be done with the right people, it just isn't common.

Posted By mughi3 on 01/07/2007 10:34 PM
which is why crusade was cancelled after a mere 13 episodes, sci wanted to change the show and JMS told them to fly a kite so to speak.

Ah... so it wasn't just because too many people who watched it started bleeding from the eyes...?

Can you imagine the Eisenhorn trilogy as a live action?

This would probably be the best 'crossover' because it is a series of detective stories with heaps of action, unrequited love and lots of OTT baddies.
People who know nothing about 40k could relate becuse its a simple story with a futre setting, ala bladerunner....

Yes. Eisenhorn has the appeal.
Its a great story (if you ignore the rushed endings). It has unrequited love, good action sequences, fairly original badguys, intrigue, supernatural elements, underdog against an entire emipres inquisition, good guy thats not so good. Yeah, it has alot to offer for studio production. Always wanted to see that put to film.

Dare I say it could be better than Ian Flemming's Bond movies? Of course they could be!

Nothing can be better than Ian flemmings Bonds. Its an institution.

For one thing, movies are really expensive to make, and doing CG is just as expensive, if not more-so than live action (I've seen a lot of people operating under the misconception that doing CG is cheap and easy). GW is not a big company to begin with, so there is very little they can do 'in-house' So aside from securing funding they will have to outsource for the script writing, as well as figuring out what story they want to have the scriptwriter try and tell.

I've talked with my brother about 40k movies, and it always comes around to what Black Library novel (or series, I suppose) would make the best flick. He always goes Storm of Iron (IW player that he is), but I have to say Necropolis of the Gaunt's Ghosts series. Amazing visuals and some huge sense of scale at times - thinking primarily of the enormous Chaos tank thing that sieges the city toward the end.

Non-novel-based, my vote is on either an =][= narrative (Eisenhorn would work nicely) or Armageddon III, as that conflict seems to have the most work done on the fluff and intertwining narratives.

- Boss Salvage

If they ever do an Eisenhorn movie, I vote Patrick Stewart to play Eisenhorn.

Actors for 40k? I think the following actors could make good:

Jean Reno - Imperial Colonel
Ron Perlman - Chaos Commander
Jason Statham - Space Marine Brother Captain
Gary Oldman - Inquisitor
Sean Bean - Arbite Master At Arms
F. Murray Abraham - Imperial Governor

Also, Tilda Swinton could play a cool Farseer.

I think Eisenhorn would be make the best set of films.. As cool as some of the other books are (and I'll admit I haven't read many) I think the Eisenhorn trilogy is what could appeal the most to your average moviegoing person .. if they make a 40K movie, it's not gonna be a movie for every 40K fan, it's something that's gotta appeal to MUCH wider audience if it's to be successful at all. They won't make money making it a niche film catered to all us army men nerds, and if they won't make money they won't make a movie.

If they did Eisenhorn, they'd have to add some stuff to the endings, maybe trim out some fat from the middle.. I don't like how all 3 of the stories kind of abruptly end.

And to play Eisenhorn, I know a lot of folks will disagree, but I say Russel Crowe is perfect

And Robin Williams will have to be in there somewhere, since he's supposedly a 40K fan.. maybe that captian of the ship that drives Eisenhorn everywhere .. forget his name..

The real hold up isn't the lack of ability to make a decent GW movie, it is a combination of GW being unwilling to take the risk at financing and producing such a thing on their own with full creative control while also simultaneously being unwilling to offer a licensing agreement (which means a loss of full creative control) and let some studio to take all the risks.

That and the massive expense of the thing. Even if done as a low budget B-movie thing you are looking at $15-20 million US dollars minimum production budget, which isn't remotely enough to make a decent sci-fi actioner (which it would have to be to have any hope at all being successful).

Compare this to Serenity, which was a rather well done film and had the relatively modest production budget of $40 million, wasn't particularly effects laden, was able to draw upon existing sets, effects and other cost saving measures, as well as having an existing (and rabid) fanbase. Despite all this and a huge targeted marketing campaign, it still tanked at the box office ($25.3 mil Domestic vs $40 mil budget). I dare say GW could do better. Not to mention how heavily they draw upon so many other pop culture elements from other films, it would be asking for a lawsuit.

That all said, I do long for Hollywood to put out a solid sci-fi actioner that has all the cool things that populate the universe 40,000. Power Armor, technology gone very, very wrong, diabolically mutated super beings, cyberpunk blended in with hard sci-fi all set as the backdrop to some compelling humanist tale and iit could be a very, very awesome thing. It just won't be officially a GW film.

I've always thought that Armageddon II would make the best GW intro movie! Classic GW heros (Yarrick) and Villians (Ghazkhul) with the Blood Angels making an appearance at the end and slaughtering everybody in visceral gore!

It would be more like a band of brothers/saving private ryan or whatever type movie, being accessible that way vs just straight sci-fi.

Its unfair to say every Sci-fi idea has been done and 40k is just another sci-fi setting. 40k has a VERY rich background that makes almost anything possible.

Eisenhorn would also make a good movie, but I think Armageddon would definetely highlight the "in the grim darkness of the far future, there is only war!" tagline.

The role of eisenhorn should go to one of the following:

Patrick Warburton.
Yeah he does mostly codemy, but a movie like this could be his break into a more serios acting roles. He has the eisenhorn look, for certain.


en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patrick_Warburton

Or
Christopher meloni (see fischig below) he has to be one of the two actors though. Melonis only problem with being eisenhorn is that the man is short. I dobt without alot of creative filming that they can make him appear to be a imposing character such as eisenhorn without it.



Titus endor should be played by: Vincent d'Onofrio. he is a potentially a handsome man who has the wise cracking abilty that endor had. I could see vincent playing this betrayer part well.



Aamos should be played by: max von Sydow. he dont have much time left, GW better grab this choice while they have the chance. The guy played ming the merciless for chrissakes.


Maxilla should be played by: Ian Mckellan. he can be fabulously foppish if allowed to leave him to his natural state. besides, the actor that plays maxilla simply must be gay in real life to properly portray how "Fabulous" maxilla is. Did you see him dance on saturday night live? I swear whenever I think of maxilla, ian shows his poncy face.
 



Midas should be played by: Michael clarke duncan.
great actor. really great. he has the winning charm of the Loh stick smoking Midas. he also has presence. the perfect choice. He is a very tough guy, but you know youll cry when he dies.


Fischig should be played by: None other than Christopher meloni. if there is a guy who has the handsome rugged look of a completly good cop that is too good for his own good, it would have to be him. Plus, he can do codemdy, so he has a bit of range that might be needed.


For the role of Bequin: Not sure. there is so much good female talent out there to choose from, trying to get the perfect bequin would be tough. If I had my way, I would pick Monica belluci. What better person to play an untouchable than a very attractive woman who can never be loved by anyone. I can feel the heart break already with the women in the theatres.

And one more picture for ragnar, so that he feels this thread has some worth...



Well thats my dream team.

Good Idea making this a new Thread Hellfury....

I have to say that the general public (non 40K players) would not swallow anything but a win by the side of "order".  I know i say that with a little bias because I play GK's but you cant JUST appeal to the 40K community.  You have to make a movie that people who have never heard of the game can enjoy.  And the simple facts are the BIGGEST part of 40K revolves around marines.  IG would be cheaper but there is just to much story with marines not to do the movie based on one of the loyalist forces.  Then you would HAVE to explain what happened 10K years ago with the emperor and Horus (im seeing a short snipit, like a glimpse into the past of that fight).

After that you can throw in any enemy you want (but people are gonna wanna see Chaos marines heading off with loyalists) and you dont have to give it a full our "good guys" victory win in the end to keep people wanting to see more.  Leave it with a cliff hanger that makes it look like the good guys win but you dont really know for sure.

I dont like reading posts where people say "everything in the sci fi class of movies has been done"......bs!  That is what makes sci fi so special....there is NO LIMIT to what you can do with it!!!  There is WAY to much story in 40K to ever think that they couldnt make a move with an idea that has "already been done".

My personal vote for the first movie would have to be something to do with the Space Wolves.  I dont know if any of you remember but the 2nd edition codex had a story in the back that was about 4 or 5 pages long and it shows the wolves all sitting ready for battle and talking about "space wolf stuff".  Ragnar and Njal are there and when they make planetfall they are beset on by Tyranids and Genestealers.  It is an amazing battle and would be a KICK ASS way to start a movie.  Then you could go into any of the space wolf books.

But truth is, there is SOOOO many good stories who is to say what it could be made from...they could all be amazine (if done right).

Posted By Hellfury on 01/08/2007 9:17 AM
The role of eisenhorn should go to on of the following:

So no Eisenhorn? :p


I do agree that the 40k universe is large enough and broad enough to allow for a fresh sci-fi flick, I just don't think GW will ever relax their stranglehold on the creative process to allow a quality film to be produced. This doesn't even scratch the surface of the generally terrible fan-fic quality of writting BL pushes out and quality writing would be critical in making a screenplay worth a damn.

Posted By nyarlathotep667 on 01/08/2007 9:40 AM

So no Eisenhorn? :p

heh, you caught me mid edit while making choices above. it took me awhile.

Good lord, I'm with you on the Monica Belluci angle Hellfury O_O

- Boss Salvage

Monica Belucci as Eisenhorn AND Bequin? Awesome!

An Eisenhorn movie would have great costumes...or at least very accurate
ones since there was so much in the novels to help you with that heh.

I'd like to see Gaunt's Ghosts done as a "band of Brothers" type project. That coud be very cool. I remember reading the Abnett said that Goran Visnjic is the face of Ibram Gaunt, so that might be cool.

Other than that, Eisenhorn would be a great choice, although I'd go for Daniel Craig over Stewart or Crowe, if he wasn't laden with Bond requirements. But in the end, you can't do a 40k movie without Space Marines. So, I have to go with Bill King's "Space Wolf" for a great first 40k movie. Why? Because it starts with Vikings in a savage landscape, has a love interest, and then slowly moves in to the gothic future, with Ragnar getting turned in to a Space Marine. Sew it up in the end with a little chaos cult on Fenris, and you have a great 1:45 of movie. It is a great "what the hell is going on?" book, and would make for a nice 40k primer.

But who to play Ragnar....?

engine

If the GW movie had Gaunt's Ghosts, the producers could always see if they could get the leftover Starship Trooper MI costumes on the cheap for background Cadians.  I know that they've already been recycled once for use in the Gundam Live Action movie.

Imperium (marines, guard, Inquisition) vs Chaos is the best way to go overall. I would totally exclude tyranids completely. People who don't know 40K (ie the general public and just about every credible movie reviewer) would just say "they just copied off Aliens" and the movie won't be taken half as seriously as it should. There could be hints of em, subtle things kinda like how you see the alien skull at the end of Predator 2, something like that.. No orcs either, they just wouldn't fit in a sci fi film for the public.. for a video game like dawn of war, sure, but not a movie. Folks just wouldn't get it. Tau, maybe, eldar maybe, Necros no because they look like the terminator. But I think space elves and anime aliens are gonna be too much... so keep it simple, imperium vs chaos. 2 things GW loves most about the whole game anyway. Other things maybe mixed in for spice but not a real part of the overall story. Like the Eldar "cameo" in the last Eisenhorn book...

That being said, they need to keep it looking excatly like the game. Movie marines look like game marines. ships look like the BFG models, etc. Marine power armor costumes could be hard to pull off IMO but it could be done. The armor could also be done all in CGI, I've seen it before, basically the actors jut wear green motion capture suits and the CGI folks place the armor over it somehow. I think they did it for one of those spy kids movies, the one where they're in some kinda video game.

And the film should be a trilogy, since that spells franchise for the hollywoold folks and franchise = money. After the trilogy, there should probably also be a prequel done based on the Horus Heresy. But who would play the Emperor?

I actually think Conquest of Armegeddon would make a great movie because of it's simplicity and big battle scenes. It has a little bit of marine, chaos, and Orks. It also has those classic flashbacks to earlier wars that do well in movies. Not the best written book but I think it would carry over well into a movie.  Multiple sets could be pulled off easier since most of the book takes place in a jungle area.

as cool all of that stuff sounds, and I really would love to see some major butt-kicking sci-fi epic like in the DoW Intro, there's one thing you guys forgot.

they already did a 40k film. It's called Inquisitor, and was basicly a test if GW could pull of something like that. three short films, one about some Dark Angels fighting Chaos Guys, one thing with some stupid rubber Orks shooting Ultras and I forgot what the third part was about. something with 'Nids I think. my point is, it was horribly, I mean Ed Wood-horrible.
don't know where to get it though, couldn't find it on youtube.

While the idea is, at face value, interesting, try and imagine the execution. Can you honestly see an actual 40K movie being anything other than the worst movie in existance?

GW writes great background material. Their stories, however, are awful regardless of the form that they take. GW comic books, novels, even the short stories in the codices... excremental. Most of the "big stories" in 40K- the betrayal of the Emporer, the rise & fall of Conrad Kurtz, 2nd & 3rd wars for Armageddon, for example- are trite war-porn populated by wooden mary-sues. It doesn't help that much of the imagery and storylines are liberally borrowed from other sources.

Can you see a top-tier director taking on any of this? Good writers? A-grade actors? No. This is Uwe Boll country, folks. At the very best you might get something close to Fantastic Four or Blade 3. We're talking pigs at the ends of wrists.

Anung, you have no idea what you are talking about.

The short films you possibly are referring to where not even 10 minutes long total! They used to be played on a loop at the games days of old, like 10 YEARS AGO!

So if that is your justification for why a movie wouldn't work, because some garbage can studio used a rubber ork head, then you are completely clueless.