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Sterling191 wrote:

Lemondish wrote:


I use the 5Int,1Agg squad a lot. Like, last game I ran 4 of them to spread out and control the board quickly. Haven't considered the Reiver one, though. You find the combat knife/pistols are decent enough to include the extra bodies? I really wish the carbine wasn't unnecessarily more expensive than the auto bolt rifles lol...

I tend to eat the cost on the Carbines actually. It's only two more points than a comparable Intercessor, which is a reasonable tax for what it lets the unit do IMO. The Terror Troops rule alone alongside the 24" Hellfire / 30" Kraken threat range leans into the whole "threat" aspect more than the knife/pistol loadout. The SIA armament is far more valuable than a single close-in attack. It's less CP efficient for sure (as you cant do a cheapo battallion with three near-msu teams) but it gives you some additional options like not combat squadding if you really want to drop a terrifying melee bully unit on somebody.

It may only be a single point of LD, but that's potentially a significant percentage increase of causing downstream casualties in the Morale phase, which magnifies the threat profile of the unit. Which is the whole point of the loadout.

I suppose I never thought of it that way. 2 points for terror troops and the shock grenade, should it ever be necessary.

It's not the absolute bleeding edge of efficiency by any means, but it's a disruptor loadout that can really mess with folks heads if they're not ready for it.

Sterling191 wrote:
It's not the absolute bleeding edge of efficiency by any means, but it's a disruptor loadout that can really mess with folks heads if they're not ready for it.

Well, all things considered, if I were definitely dedicated to the bleeding edge of efficiency I don't think I'd be playing a marine army

I'm largely concerned with "good enough" at the moment, and that sounds both fun and good enough.

Lemondish wrote:

I'm largely concerned with "good enough" at the moment, and that sounds both fun and good enough.

For sure. It requires some finer list management to get a good CP pool to work with, but I support my Fortis boys with a lot of Cadian and Elyssian bodies so it works pretty well for me.

So its decided now!

Got the Start Collecting Box and to make it even funnier and more „my“ KillTeam im going to make them all Japanese-Anime-MainHero-(Cringe) DesuWatcho!!

Have to come up with names for them.
They obviously fight for the holy emperor BANZAI!!!

(And everytime one dies Ill do a sad anime 15min break with a speech )

Sorry for OT

Then the last survivor powers up up rising from the ground as he glows with righteous fury. He does this haggard yell that cracks the earth around him and runs so fast the enemy cannot react. He then cuts a tank in half with a single strike of his blade. Camera cuts to his eyes and they are all huge and filled with anger. Cut to enemy commander looking stunned as this absolute unit chops through his entire army.

 Tibs Ironblood wrote:
Then the last survivor powers up up rising from the ground as he glows with righteous fury. He does this haggard yell that cracks the earth around him and runs so fast the enemy cannot react. He then cuts a tank in half with a single strike of his blade. Camera cuts to his eyes and they are all huge and filled with anger. Cut to enemy commander looking stunned as this absolute unit chops through his entire army.

„Nani?“ *flies by and cuts stuff in half* „Hayai!“

You get the humor


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Came up with a KT List (if theres a separate KT tactics forum ill ask there)

Low model count but pretty much feels like a KillTeam.

Not sold on the Watch Sergeant tho...But I also dont know who to swap him for...

still got 4points left and I feel like for a 100points game that are 3points too much Im missing out...

Have you guys any suggestions?

ImPhaeronWeasel wrote:

 Tibs Ironblood wrote:
Then the last survivor powers up up rising from the ground as he glows with righteous fury. He does this haggard yell that cracks the earth around him and runs so fast the enemy cannot react. He then cuts a tank in half with a single strike of his blade. Camera cuts to his eyes and they are all huge and filled with anger. Cut to enemy commander looking stunned as this absolute unit chops through his entire army.

„Nani?“ *flies by and cuts stuff in half* „Hayai!“

You get the humor


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Came up with a KT List (if theres a separate KT tactics forum ill ask there)

Low model count but pretty much feels like a KillTeam.

Not sold on the Watch Sergeant tho...But I also dont know who to swap him for...

still got 4points left and I feel like for a 100points game that are 3points too much Im missing out...

Have you guys any suggestions?

Kill Team thread over here. You'll find a lot of good stuff there, but some of it has shifted following the Errata. Worth it to ask for clarification if something seems off.

I strongly suggest the Reiver Sergeant with carbine, knife, and grapnel. Lots of crazy shenanigans you can do with this guy.

Thanks will check it out

Not sure if I ever actually gave an update on me trying the Melta Leviathan. I absolutely destroyed my opponent, but the Leviathan didn't do a damned thing. I ended up going against Thousand Sons. He ran Magnus, 10 man Termie squad, 3 Rubric Marine Squads, Ahriman, and the rest sorcerers/exalted.

Turn 1 I baited him into charging my 5 Intercessor 4 Aggressor 1 Inceptor squad with Magnus. I did 9 wounds to Magnus in Overwatch with the Aggressors and a Watch Captain. He killed all the Intercessors and I think 1 of the Aggressors in combat, I just fell back and finished him off on mu turn 1. From there it was mostly cleanup. Kill teams kept moving up and getting rid of Rubrics (2 units of 5 Auto Bolt Rifles, 1 Inceptor, 1 Aggressor) and on turn 2 I dropped in the 10 SB Vets, 10 Hellblasters, Jump Captain, Leviathan, and 10 Hellblasters. Hellblasters killed his unit of Termies, Vets finished off the last of his characters, and the Leviathan killed... 4 Rubrics? His turn 3 he conceded because all he had left was Ahriman and like 2 Rubrics.

I am actually thinking about switching out and just trying 2 Venerable Dreads or 2 Mortis Dreads instead.

Is there any reason to buy normal Aggressors instead of the „easy to build“ ones?

Its not like i have more than enough bolters to convert the flamers to bolters...

Uh it would be if you didn't want to convert the Flamers to Bolters. That seems like too much work for me not gonna lie.

ImPhaeronWeasel wrote:
Is there any reason to buy normal Aggressors instead of the „easy to build“ ones?

Its not like i have more than enough bolters to convert the flamers to bolters...

You'll want the bolter feeds and the missle launchers. Without the bolter ammo, it's almost impossible to tell the difference between flamer and bolter weapons since both are gauntlet mounted barrels about 4mm long.

ImPhaeronWeasel wrote:
Is there any reason to buy normal Aggressors instead of the „easy to build“ ones?

Its not like i have more than enough bolters to convert the flamers to bolters...

Gotta add the frag launchers on their backs, too. Might be able to find cheap Aggressors on eBay from the Tooth and Claw box set.

Ok so looks like the barrel isnt the only thing thats different...a shame really I thought I found myself a crazy deal

 Captain Garius wrote:
Not sure if I ever actually gave an update on me trying the Melta Leviathan. I absolutely destroyed my opponent, but the Leviathan didn't do a damned thing. I ended up going against Thousand Sons. He ran Magnus, 10 man Termie squad, 3 Rubric Marine Squads, Ahriman, and the rest sorcerers/exalted.

Turn 1 I baited him into charging my 5 Intercessor 4 Aggressor 1 Inceptor squad with Magnus. I did 9 wounds to Magnus in Overwatch with the Aggressors and a Watch Captain. He killed all the Intercessors and I think 1 of the Aggressors in combat, I just fell back and finished him off on mu turn 1. From there it was mostly cleanup. Kill teams kept moving up and getting rid of Rubrics (2 units of 5 Auto Bolt Rifles, 1 Inceptor, 1 Aggressor) and on turn 2 I dropped in the 10 SB Vets, 10 Hellblasters, Jump Captain, Leviathan, and 10 Hellblasters. Hellblasters killed his unit of Termies, Vets finished off the last of his characters, and the Leviathan killed... 4 Rubrics? His turn 3 he conceded because all he had left was Ahriman and like 2 Rubrics.

I am actually thinking about switching out and just trying 2 Venerable Dreads or 2 Mortis Dreads instead.

what would you switch out for the vens or Mortis ? the levi ?

Has anyone tried Deathwatch plus Blood Angels/Space Wolves allies? For the additional PUNCH in melee?

If yes how did it go?

Im thinking of „cheap“ scout battalion (if going with Angels) and then Sanguinary Guard? Or DeathCompany? Maybe a smash captain

If Wolvesmaybe their Dreadnoughts? Or thunder Cavalry?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Has anyone tried Deathwatch plus Blood Angels/Space Wolves allies? For the additional PUNCH in melee?

If yes how did it go?

Im thinking of „cheap“ scout battalion (if going with Angels) and then Sanguinary Guard? Or DeathCompany? Maybe a smash captain

If Wolvesmaybe their Dreadnoughts? Or thunder Cavalry?

Space Wolves would be a better choice at this point. Outflanking makes sense. Simple as that.

ight get in a bit trouble as I'm going to be asking a similar question in other tactics threads over the next couple of days.
I'm looking at changing up my current guard/dkok army into an inquisitorial task force of 1350 of guard and 650pt of sister, grey knights and deathwatch that can be swapped out to keep the army feeling fresh while having a cohesive theme for display.
Any suggestions of a good general purpose 650pts of Deathwatch?
Unlike the other 2 forces I haven't really got a particular list in mind as there's so many combinations of units I like that it will be possible to cram many of them in that amount of points.
Ideally though it will be a single detachment that has some anti-tank punch, units/combinations I find interesting are:

Dual melta terminator captain with stormbolter or fragcannon totting veterans (I also like the visuals of storm bolters with storm shields but not sure its worth the points)

Some sort of shooty dread, again i like the aesthetics and wisdom of ancients and the doctrines make for a nice antitank. FW is not off limits, a grav-bombard leviathan would be .lovely but is a struggle to fit in especially with the relic rule, the contemptor mortis offers some nice fire power with out that issue, but then again the Deredeo is cheap enough that you could fit an apothecary along side which with the pavaise might make a nice defensive block with some intercessors. Or am I barking up the wrong tree thinking of autocannon strength shots with doctrines as anti-tank, after all they will only be wounding leman russes on 4's for 2 damage..

Dropping in 5 veterans with stormbolters and/or fragcannons while the other half of the killteam is bikes and vanguard veterans for some nice mobile obsec.

A block of autobolter intercessors with aggressors for mobile(ish) T5 obsec that puts down a lot of S4 shots and some decent punch in melee (maybe this in conjunction with the deredeo and apothecary though that would tie up all the points available).


For reference the guard force is a bit weird, with 2 squads of DKOK engineers with priests in valks, 3 minmum squads of grenadiers with plasma in centaurs, and 3 10 man grenadier squads baby sitting a marshal and lord commissar. Plays a bit like a poor mans dark eldar (HERESY!) but I think it suits the theme of inquisitorial special forces.

You seem to be jumping around all over the place here on what you want the force to do, so it's difficult to really provide much help except to say that you'll find cheaper, more effective anti-tank elsewhere. Don't rely on DW to provide that.

Sorry I've left it pretty open ended, I'm not expecting to fill the roles of all those combinations of units, mealy giving examples find interesting. In regards to anti-tank DW may not be the most points efficient (are they at anything) but surely their +1 to wound and rerolls work well with lascannon Morris dreads or even fragcanons equipped veterans deep striking, in both cases wounding t8 on 2's and rerolling the 1s.

I play DW & DKok, and Lemondish is right, if anything I'd swap the roles. Batallion of Korps for 5cps, 2-3 Conquerer russes, 3 basilisks, and one engineer squad for fun, because I get you, they're cool models with fun rules. Then run 1k or so of DW, and focus them around a Watchmaster, who makes everything so much better. Maybe 1 vet squad, 2 primaris squads, a libby, a squad of hellblasters and a Leviathan for s7 dakka? That's the kind of list I'd go for, 13-14cps too.

I've found the Autocannon Deredeo to be decent on its own in a CSM army. While it doesn't have Special Ammo, the rerolling to hit and wound with a plus to wound bonus would probably be excellent vs several targets.

You're right, it could be a great match for DW, I'll give it a proxy some time!

 grouchoben wrote:
You're right, it could be a great match for DW, I'll give it a proxy some time!

It has a few great things going for it compared to the Levi. It's about 70 - 90 points cheaper depending on if you bring HK missiles with your Levi (you should), sits in your elite slot, which is easier to unlock for cheap, and can grant for boys a 5+ invuln. I imagine a couple of these with a couple apothecaries could really give you some insane durability, especially if you go with those mixed T5 squads. A couple units with majority T5, 2W each, 2+ save in cover and 5++ sounds pretty great.

grouchoben wrote:I play DW & DKok, and Lemondish is right, if anything I'd swap the roles. Batallion of Korps for 5cps, 2-3 Conquerer russes, 3 basilisks, and one engineer squad for fun, because I get you, they're cool models with fun rules. Then run 1k or so of DW, and focus them around a Watchmaster, who makes everything so much better. Maybe 1 vet squad, 2 primaris squads, a libby, a squad of hellblasters and a Leviathan for s7 dakka? That's the kind of list I'd go for, 13-14cps too.

I definitely agree with you, that would be more effective, but would massively effect the play style and theme of the army. I want the dkok "storm troopers" to out number the ordo militant numbers considerably and main battle tanks just feel a little out of place in an inquisition army in my opinion.

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:I've found the Autocannon Deredeo to be decent on its own in a CSM army. While it doesn't have Special Ammo, the rerolling to hit and wound with a plus to wound bonus would probably be excellent vs several targets.

Aye tempted by this with lemon dishes suggestion of intercessors/aggressors and an apothecary. Do you have experience of the hellfire plasma cannonade? The 10 points cheaper make it easier to fit in the list and the gets hot is easily mitigated just not sure if number of shots or quality of shots is the best bet.

The Plasma does good damage, but you pay a lot for that AP, and to be honest most of your dangerous targets are gonna have at least an okay Invul, and that extra range with the extra shots really does matter.

Im not sure about the deredeo...although I do see nice synergy with venerable Dreds I think AP-1 and „only“ 8 shots is not enough to really be worth 200+ points

With 2x SCA Levi I pack 20 Str7 shots -2 PLUS hunterkiller missles...This sounds WAY scarier to me than 8shots -1AP
(also in Math against T7 3+/5++ its ahead).

The only problem I see is unlocking it and the point cost...Do Deathwatch really need 13CP or are they also good with 9?

There's always the option of 2 contemptor mortis, for the same cost as the leviathan you get 16 S7 AP-1 shots, with double the range, which I think is worth the -1 AP on something you want to keep still. You also get more wounds in total, which is handy and they aren't relics so no unlock needed.

ImPhaeronWeasel wrote:
Im not sure about the deredeo...although I do see nice synergy with venerable Dreds I think AP-1 and „only“ 8 shots is not enough to really be worth 200+ points

With 2x SCA Levi I pack 20 Str7 shots -2 PLUS hunterkiller missles...This sounds WAY scarier to me than 8shots -1AP
(also in Math against T7 3+/5++ its ahead).

The only problem I see is unlocking it and the point cost...Do Deathwatch really need 13CP or are they also good with 9?

You're definitely not going to get the same killing power, that's true - but you're trading it for nearly 100 points free to use elsewhere, a usually cheaper and easier unlock, and a massive improvement in durability for everyone around it. I have always felt as if the Leviathan is just too many points in one basket between its normal cost, its unlock cost, and the current meta urging folks to be able to handle a Knight Castellan. The Levis 14 T8 wounds aren't going to last long without also sticking it into the Teleportarium.

I'm going to try out the Deredeo because at least on paper it looks capable.