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From the GT site:

from the GT site
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Changes to Lists allowed at Grand Tournaments and Games Day Tournaments:
Due to unforseen circumstances, we have removed three lists (and rules) from those previously allowed for Grand Tournaments and Games Day Tournaments. These lists (and rules) are: Ghark Ironskin and the Ogre Rhinox Riders, Imperial Guard Armored Companies, and Feral Orks.

We understand that these changes may cause concern for those players who had planned to run these armies at our events this year and for this we apologise. If you have already purchased a ticket for one of our Grand Tournaments or Games Day Tournaments and feel the need to have your ticket refunded please contact our Direct Services team at 1-800-394-GAME.

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I tend to agree with this. At least re: Armored Companies and Feral Orks. They're pretty broken lists.

Would have been cooler to have done before tickets went on sale, but it's still pretty early, and they are offering refunds. Good show.

Why would they remove Feral Orks ? I can understand people whining about Rhinox Riders and the AC but Feral Orks?

Which unit is it, madboyz? S5 and fearless for cheap?

Armored Company, that I get, but why the Rhinox Riders and Feral Orks? OK is a terribly weak army that has only been further hampered by the v7 ruleset while Orks only other viable army list is Speed Freakz...

IIRC they suffer from animosity and are strength 4.  Some people whine about the squiggoths but they are not scary either.  I certainly never had a problem with them when I played against them, and i run a notoriously soft list.

So at this point are there any lists left that aren't straight from main codexes?  I know a comrade has been slowly working on a massive feral ork list and may have already signed on to the Vegas GT, so this will be a surprise.  So should we just put out the "orks need not apply" sign? 

 

 

Posted By Dice Monkey on 02/13/2007 12:13 PM
IIRC they suffer from animosity and are strength 4.  Some people whine about the squiggoths but they are not scary either.  I certainly never had a problem with them when I played against them, and i run a notoriously soft list.

with Pig Docs, Madboys have an above average chance of being str5 and are only 7 pts each.  This makes them pretty great, despite thier occasional animosity roll.

BS3 make orkses shootin' a little shootier.  This makes orkses shooting pretty good for their points.

Squiggoths a T7 5 wound monsterous creature for 60 pts is a pretty great bargain.

and a Nob Mob on boars with burnas and Burna-toting warboss on cyboar make for brutal and 'Ard cavalry.

They have been pretty mean in local tournaments here.  I can see why they we pulled like Armoured company.  They're fine for standard play though.

I would be prepared for these kinds of changes in sanctioned tournament play.
GW was alluding to this type of tourney alteration a 2 years ago.(or whenever people through a stink about pirate zombies being second teir...)

Posted By Mannahnin on 02/13/2007 11:51 AM
I tend to agree with this. At least re: Armored Companies and Feral Orks. They're pretty broken lists.

Would have been cooler to have done before tickets went on sale, but it's still pretty early, and they are offering refunds. Good show.

Why is AC broken?

the rhinox cavalry list is one of the more unbalanced lists ever made for fantasy (imho)
I have to agree with their removal
the IG armored company is just unfun to play against
but yeah, the feral orks are orks, but they are a 3rd edition chapter approved list, maybe they just don't jive with 4th ed?

Of course Guard, Necrons, DE,and Orks are also 3rd edition lists. I thinking they don't jive either.

Now is that rhinox riders list banned, ro just the riders rules or both?

Are Kroot still legal?

Wait, there's a list for OK that's only rhino cav?? Holy hell that ain't right ...

- Boss Salvage

Actually, the reason why those lists were removed is because they use Forgeworld models. Rhinoxes for the Ironskin list, Squiggoths for Feral Orks, and Vanquishers and Salamanders for the Armored Company.

Posted By StubaSquad on 02/13/2007 1:56 PM
Actually, the reason why those lists were removed is because they use Forgeworld models. Rhinoxes for the Ironskin list, Squiggoths for Feral Orks, and Vanquishers and Salamanders for the Armored Company.

Your reasoning doesn't make any sense to me...

Posted By logan007 on 02/13/2007 2:05 PM

Posted By StubaSquad on 02/13/2007 1:56 PM
Actually, the reason why those lists were removed is because they use Forgeworld models. Rhinoxes for the Ironskin list, Squiggoths for Feral Orks, and Vanquishers and Salamanders for the Armored Company.

Your reasoning doesn't make any sense to me...

I agree, I don't buy that at all.

Posted By Lordhat on 02/13/2007 12:50 PM

Posted By Mannahnin on 02/13/2007 11:51 AM
I tend to agree with this. At least re: Armored Companies and Feral Orks. They're pretty broken lists.

Would have been cooler to have done before tickets went on sale, but it's still pretty early, and they are offering refunds. Good show.

Why is AC broken?

I know thats sarcasm!

 

1-1-0 vs AC

Remember, GWUS has been having a spat with Forgeworld for years now, perhaps that animosity has yet to be resolved. It wouldn't surprise me in the least if we next hear that they'll be cutting loose SoC, EOT and Armageddon lists since the codices are no longer in print (despite the free .pdfs on GW's website).

Posted By logan007 on 02/13/2007 2:05 PM

Posted By StubaSquad on 02/13/2007 1:56 PM
Actually, the reason why those lists were removed is because they use Forgeworld models. Rhinoxes for the Ironskin list, Squiggoths for Feral Orks, and Vanquishers and Salamanders for the Armored Company.

Your reasoning doesn't make any sense to me...

Sure it makes sense, it's just not a good reason. FW models and rules are not widely available to the mass public. Most people playing against them will have no idea what they do until they face off against that person and maybe hae a few minutes before game to read over the opponent's Imperial Armor book or online print out. Now, you or I may not have a problem with that, but remember GW plays to the lowest common denominator, and there are plenty of idiots out there that are too stupid to find a way to beat these new, unseen models and would complain about it being "unfair" that they didn't have a chance to prepare against such obviously broken models as a salamander, never mind the rules for most of the stuff has been on FWs website for years. Weak sauce.

Still, I'm all behind banning AC from tournaments. besides being unfun to play against, it's one of those armies that you either prepared to play and brought a lot of tank killing (in which case you'll probably win) or you didn't prepare for and will probably lose. Plus the fact that there's been about 20 differant versions of the list, including 3 differant ones currently available (the latest WD list, the one on the GW website, and the Imperial Armor list).

Feral Orks I've never fought against, but it's a shame to see them not allowed. Even if they were broken (and I don't see how compared to asscan spam and deamonbomb lists), at least it would mean more ork players in the tournament circuit. I've long come to the conclusion that GW is purposefully raping orks and their players becuase of a falling out with Andy Chambers. There's no other explanation than that.

As for rhinox riders I don't really care, but it sucks that once again people are spending that much for GW models (even if their FW GW models) and can't use them. Don't play OK, don't even play WHFB that much, but a gamer at my FLGS has some VERY nicely painted ones and I seem to remember them being quite nasty from his discription.

Maybe it's just the new person in charge of GT's didn't want them included. Still early enough to make the change so they did it.

Thomas

Posted By wynnstudio on 02/13/2007 3:59 PM
Maybe it's just the new person in charge of GT's didn't want them included. Still early enough to make the change so they did it.

Thomas

Jeff Hall's not running the show?

Who is?

Maybe it has nothing to do with Forgeworld at all.

All of the mentioned lists use Chapter Approved rules entry's. Maybe they are trying to limit it to only currently printed material. Who knows.

Posted By Kid_Kyoto on 02/13/2007 1:13 PM
Are Kroot still legal?

I will make it legal.

Posted By Abadabadoobaddon on 02/13/2007 6:50 PM

Posted By Kid_Kyoto on 02/13/2007 1:13 PM
Are Kroot still legal?

I will make it legal.

You have da powa !

Posted By xnet445 on 02/13/2007 5:48 PM

Posted By wynnstudio on 02/13/2007 3:59 PM
Maybe it's just the new person in charge of GT's didn't want them included. Still early enough to make the change so they did it.

Thomas

Jeff Hall's not running the show?

Who is?

See this thread (about the 2007 GT tickets going on sale) in which we learn that GWUS, in all of their "wisdom" let go yet another one of their exemplary employees.

Anyhow, the out of print doesn't hold any water to me as GW offers all such lists as downloadable .pdfs for free on their site and as such there is no excuse for people not being able to find out about them, even if they don't own a computer with an internet connection at home (go to a public library, Kinko's, or even a computer café . Even the Armored Company is all *that* broken (not the WD/.pdf list at least), and in this MEq infested world the same things that punch through 2+/3+ armor punch through 13-14 AV.

Still pretty crappy of GW, but it's what we can come to expect now after having Jeff raise our hopes only to have them dashed and to see him (most unfortunately) loose his job.
 

Posted By nyarlathotep667 on 02/13/2007 2:35 PM
Remember, GWUS has been having a spat with Forgeworld for years now, perhaps that animosity has yet to be resolved.

I think this is pretty old news, considering I can order FW stuff from my local GW store now. 

On one hand, I can't say I'm sorry to see the AC and Feral Orks go.  Both lists have their problems.  On the other hand, I know I'd be pi$$ed if they'd banned the LatD, since I've already started working on an army.  So I can sympathize with anyone this affects. 

It would be nice if GW would post there reasons for some of there actions every once in a while.
There are alot of us that have 1 2 or even 3 armys that are from chapter approved or non in print codex.
I would be pissed if all of a sudden they said you cant use the army you built painted and finally got ready for a GT.
Lets see 13th company, ferel, speed freaks, latd, kroot
All ready to go

Hey Jeff
come on over to www.40kwreckingcrew.com
Your always welcome on our board

marc parker

armored company was a bit broken, feral orks were hard as nails and the rhinox riders were cool..

take away one of those and it's no big deal, take away all three and it's like showing up for dinner and getting 3 peas, 1 carrot, a teaspoon of mashed potatoes with no gravy, a finger of beef and a shot glass 1/4 full of vinegar to drink.. 

take Jeff Hall from the mix and the host just came over and spit on your dish..While I normally don't pile on, this is just one ludicrous move after another. GW is sure to be hanging by the short and danglies pretty soon and with no net below, it's not looking good