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 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
For those of us with no real knowledge of Gundam, can anyone recommend a movie or short series as a good primer, so we can see if it tickles our pickles?


War In the Pocket is real short.

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 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
For those of us with no real knowledge of Gundam, can anyone recommend a movie or short series as a good primer, so we can see if it tickles our pickles?


Echoing what the others said, 08th MS Team is a great intro for Gundam if you prefer the focus on Mecha warfare, it's a bit grittier than the other series and is a blast to watch for how short it is. 0080 is another terrific entry point, it focuses more on the human element than the Mecha fighting and is one of the best series to capture that lightning in a bottle Gundam pioneered with "war is hell". Fair warning, the story is a tragedy.
   
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 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
For those of us with no real knowledge of Gundam, can anyone recommend a movie or short series as a good primer, so we can see if it tickles our pickles?


Personally? I'd go with War in the Pocket. You don't need much at all previous knowledge, there's some cool robot fights, and it is the most Gundam series ever, themes-wise.

It is also a personal favorite.
   
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 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
For those of us with no real knowledge of Gundam, can anyone recommend a movie or short series as a good primer, so we can see if it tickles our pickles?


Iron-Blooded Orphans hands down. The most modern of the Gundam series, and the only one my wife has ever been able to fully sit through. I also would recommend Gundam 00, as it has more of the grand soap opera vibe that most gundam series have. IBO is much more character-focused than many of the other series.
   
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I back IBO as well, anything in the UC, has baggage etc.

IBO is an IMO more realistic portrayal of human characters. It's not got all the needless broodiness and the idealistic/political elements whilst core to the story are not as well, wet in their delivery, not to mention it is completely stand alone.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/08/09 16:07:28


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I mean... IBO is a great series, but at 50 episodes, I wouldn't exactly call it a "movie or short series", so I don't think it applies here?

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/08/10 11:24:16


 
   
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Eh, IBO is iffy. 1st Season is pretty good but goes downhill towards the end. Community seems 50/50 on it.

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Same here, I enjoyed S1 even if it meandered a bit. S2 was so-so.
   
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 BlackoCatto wrote:
Eh, IBO is iffy. 1st Season is pretty good but goes downhill towards the end. Community seems 50/50 on it.


Part of the issue I think is content and the other is production.

My very long analysis of IBO;

Spoiler:
Production wise, it's clear some plans for the series changed between Seasons 1 and 2. There were things in season 2 that could have been better set up in Season 1, but instead pop up in season 2 and are thus kind of thrown at the audience with no time to acclimate. This is especially troublesome because Rustal Elion and Julieta Juris are important foils for Orga and Mikazuki in the second season, but their character development is so rushed and wild that there's no real time to take any of it in before your at the ending of the series. And even then, I think most people just hated their guts by that point and had no real sense of what the series was trying to say through them.

The biggest plot tumors here are the opening ten episodes of season 2, which actually don't do much to advance any of the story's themes or plots but serve only to establish the new villains of the season. Something that could have been done in season 1 during the Dort arc relatively easily. The wasted time pushed season 2 into a frantic pace where a lot of things just didn't have the time to grow.

And I think part of the production issue is the content issue; in season 1 of IBO, the audience overwhelmingly missed the point. The writers seemed to realize this on some level (and behind the scenes drama relating to season 2 largely seems to originate with arguments over how best to get the point across). They tried to course correct early in season 2, but I think all they really did was muddy the water on multiple levels.

Content wise is trickier and could also be connected to writing changes made between the seasons. Season 1 was a story about a plucky bunch of child soldiers trying to survive in a cruel world with wits, guile, and raw determination. It's the stuff heroes are made of and I think season 1 won the audience over to Tekkadan's side hard because of it. The problem is that the audience chose to near universally ignore the rather epic foreshadowing provided in season 1;

-Orga and Mikazuki's personal dynamic is insanely toxic, for both of them. The characters are unhealthily codependent on one another and it drives a lot of the needless risks they and Tekkadan take over the series. People were comparing them to Kamina and Simone basically from the start and that's exactly what we were supposed to do. Unfortunately, people lost sight of that at some point and stopped noticing how Orga and Mikazuki are an inversion of Kamina and Simone's dynamic; the deconstruction of Gurren Lagan's reconstruction.
-Tekkadan's loyalty to Orga becomes more and more blind as the series goes on. This is a running theme throughout the series. Ein is blindly loyal to his superiors. Galio and Carta to their friend McGillis. Julia to Rustal. Amida and the Turbines girls to Naze. Many of the deaths the characters face throughout the series play into how they are undone by their own loyalties and the series hams it up hardcore in most cases.
-Orga himself becomes so obsessed with achieving his goals he actually loses sight of them and loses the only member of Tekkadan willing to challenge him late in season 1 (Biscuit).

These flaws are largely acknowledged toward the end of the series but the moments are often muted and understated. Personally, I like that. I saw exactly what the writers were getting across. I think a lot of people though missed it entirely and were just pissed by the trauma congaline that began with Naze and Amida's deaths and then continued right up to the finale.

I think that while we were meant to identify and cheer for Tekkadan, the audience was not supposed to ignore the obvious flaws in the characters. That becomes a problem because come season 2 the obvious flaws in the characters become a huge plot point and a big part of how the season plays out.

People went in expecting a story about how the crazy awesome underdog protagonists pull it out their ass and save the day.

Instead, they got a story about how the admirable but fundamentally youthful and naive heroes get themselves into a horrible situation and plot armor isn't real.

Tekkadan's luck ran out. McGillis for all his cut throat scheming, was just as naive and childish as Orga. The title of the series is actually incredibly fitting on multiple levels. Iron Blooded Orphans can refer to the Gundam frames who won the calamity war only to be cast aside as evil in the aftermath. It can refer to Gjallerhorn, a relic of a apocalyptic age ill-fit for a recovering world. It can refer to McGillis and Tekkadan quite literally, as the 'human debris' that is being left behind by the state of things and struggling not just to survive but to live as human beings. For me, this is a huge plus for the series.

It has a constant air of tragic romanticism akin to stories like the Iliad or Le Mort d'Arthur. And maybe that's the problem too because people don't always recognize traditional tragedy anymore. People loved Tekkadan so much by the end of season 1, they were ignoring the questionable nature of many of Orga's decisions and how his hardening became reflected in those around him. Moments between him and Mikazuki that were meant to be dark and 'oh that's not good' were instead viewed as awesome. Orga's plans that constantly risked it all were treated as just being narrative convention of anime protagonists, not wildly reckless decisions that pinned all hope of victory on significant amounts of luck (and more often than not, Mikazuki's insane level of skill).

When those habits came home to roost in season 2, it came off to a lot of people as bs rather than part of the message.

Unfortunately, I think these themes are more often than not far too understated maybe and don't come across well to anyone who isn't very very actively looking for them. In some ways I think the story was even written with an expectation that the audience would read a lot meaning into it. But the audience never really did that. I think the ambition of IBO undid it a little bit toward the end.

I'd also say the Iok Kujan is a serious problem for season 2. The guy is phenomenally incompetent, and banally stupid on top of that. With Carta, he naivete was somewhat endearing because there was this air of competency about her that was undone by her obvious case of wrong genre savvy. She's a 'knight in shining armor' who'd be the hero of another story but in this one is the romantic fool getting her ass handed to her by a team of savvy combat pragmatists. Iok on the other hand doesn't even have Carta's positive traits. He's just fething stupid and the loyalty shown to him by his men is so wildly out of wack with his actual abilities it's unbelievable.

The late in season 2 explanation for why that is is so dumb, it falls on its face instantly as SOD breaking. It maybe makes more sense to a Japanese audience where the incompetent son of a great man is a common narrative convention, especially in period dramas. To a western audience though, the guy is too stupid to live and he keeps living anyway, making the deaths of numerous characters we actually liked come off as more and more bitter. Easily one of the best parts of the final ending is finally seeing Iok die and the joy of Akihiro getting to be the one to do it.

By that point though, I think Iok had done a lot of damage to the credibility of the plot. He survived too many things that should have killed him, and it made the season 2 downward spiral of 'being determined and clever isn't going to save you when your luck runs out' part of the series come off like bs rather than a sober wake up call that Iron Blooded Orphans wasn't a shonen battle manga and actions have consequences. Unless your Iok. If your Iok you basically get away with everything and every faceless mook loves you no matter how many of them you get killed and how absolutely nothing you accomplish.

Orga got people killed too. And McGillis. And Rustal. But all three of them had enough success under their belt that it was easy to overlook their feth ups. Not so much with Iok, who I honestly think managed to muddy the waters of season 2 horribly and really killed a lot of its momentum.


TLDR: Iron-Blooded Orphans is a really distinctive story in the Gundam franchise. It's a really good story with some rather obnoxious flaws that can be a serious sore spot for some of the audience though. The audience revolted when they didn't get the ending they wanted and instead got a bitter and tragic allegory about the folly of ambition, blind loyalty, the death of innocence, and cruelty of an uncompassionate world that I think really resonates with the present times we live in. People seemed to be expecting Mobile Suit Gundam: Red Dawn, but instead they got Mobile Suit Gundam: Beasts of No Nation.

Personally, I admire the series' ambition and approach to the franchise's themes and motifs and how it embraces post-modernism on a conceptual level.

I can't really blame people for not liking the show though. It's very different from pretty much everything else in the franchise, especially because is absconds in some ways from establishing a clear moral high ground. Or at least, it was supposed to. The main characters of the story were so charismatic in so many ways that a lot of the audience overlooked the obvious problems in their team dynamic.

This message was edited 10 times. Last update was at 2021/08/10 21:44:32


   
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I mean, I tend to refer to Mikazuki as "the Walking, Talking War Crime" so...
   
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That is an excellent analysis, thank you for sharing.
   
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 Albertorius wrote:
I mean, I tend to refer to Mikazuki as "the Walking, Talking War Crime" so...


Honestly, I think that's utterly missing the point of his character.

Spoiler:
Mikazuki is the pinnacle of his peers. He is someone who only knows how to fight to survive and relies on Orga to help him deal with the world he doesn't understand.

Except Orga doesn't really understand it either. Mikazuki is a child soldier whose tragedy is that his best friend couldn't really help him, and he couldn't really help his best friend. He's not a dispassionate monster, though he can come off that way because of his stoicism. Mikazuki appears inhuman to those who don't know him but is presented as one of the most human characters in the story because of the simplicity of his desires; life, love, and happiness and who ultimately dies giving that to his friends when his own chance for it is lost (come the final battle, there's no real way to save Mika as he cannot move without being attached to Barbatos. He doesn't fight to his death because he's a blood thirsty monster. He fights to his death because it's all he has left after the choices he's made and he's accepted the consequences of his life as the only life he could ever live).

There's a reason a number of games released since the series ended have achievements titled 'more human than anyone else' attached to Mikazuki. Part of Julieta's understated late series character development is realizing this and accepting that Mikazuki isn't really a devil, but rather someone just like her who fought for the things he loved. Mikazuki wasn't a monster. He was a child soldier. He didn't get the opportunity to live a normal life and could never find his way to one until it was too late to do anything about it. That's a big part of what I love about him. Unlike Kira, Amuro, Kamill, or all the other child soldier's in this franchise who become philosophers after talking to some people, Mikazuki takes the classic Gundam protagonist and plays his role completely straight. Child soldiers are fethed up. They don't really get to be children and a lot of them never get to grow up.


I think a lot like IBO's story, his character suffers in the west from a lack of cultural context. Mikazuki overtly references a number of similar cultural figures that would be very familiar to a Japanese audience but completely alien to a westerner (I can only really spot it because of a few history books I've read). It's a compounded problem because making Mika so quiet and stoic certain makes him cool on screen but it also presents an inaccurate image of who he is inside. Only very quiet and slow scenes offer much indication that Mikazuki would rather be doing something else with his life but doesn't know how to get there (hence the tragedy of Orga, who Mika trusts to take him to the destination despite Orga clearly not knowing anymore than Mika about how to get there).

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2021/08/11 00:43:24


   
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I wouldn't say Amuro is much a philosopher at all for awhile. Most of OG Gundam is him essentially having PTSD before realizing "Wow...I'm really good at killing people.

Meanwhile Kamille is a very.... special child. He is less philosophy and more so someone else's philosophy on him.

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 BlackoCatto wrote:
I wouldn't say Amuro is much a philosopher at all for awhile. Most of OG Gundam is him essentially having PTSD before realizing "Wow...I'm really good at killing people.

Meanwhile Kamille is a very.... special child. He is less philosophy and more so someone else's philosophy on him.


Well tragic stories are part of what makes it gundam (except ZZ that was a bit to happy for most fans coming off zeta).

The joke was always about Tomino introducing you to interesting but flawed characters with a deep back story...and then killing them.



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 Albertorius wrote:
I mean... IBO is a great series, but at 50 episodes, I wouldn't exactly call it a "movie or short series", so I don't think it applies here?


Absolutely anything in UC doesn't apply to this either though as the first time newtype pops up you'll be WTF.

The UC Gundam movies are not exactly a good primer as well, I find them more useful if you know what is going on rather than not - a recap for ready made fans.

I suggest IBO as you will get enough out of the first 5 episodes to make a decision of whether it is for you or not, as there is plenty of action and character development to get the franchise - the start of all are fairly consistent in this approach.

I'd say Unicorn would be a good start as well as it does actually explain enough of the phenomena within the UC within the episodes... However, Banagher and 'Audrey' are so wet and illogical/emotional (Audrey less so tbf) it can be off putting if you are an adult imo.

EDIT: Forgot to mention the most awful character in Unicorn, Riddhe....

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2021/08/11 07:23:54


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 LordofHats wrote:
 Albertorius wrote:
I mean, I tend to refer to Mikazuki as "the Walking, Talking War Crime" so...


Honestly, I think that's utterly missing the point of his character.


It's also a short hand, you know ^^


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 endlesswaltz123 wrote:
 Albertorius wrote:
I mean... IBO is a great series, but at 50 episodes, I wouldn't exactly call it a "movie or short series", so I don't think it applies here?


Absolutely anything in UC doesn't apply to this either though as the first time newtype pops up you'll be WTF.

The UC Gundam movies are not exactly a good primer as well, I find them more useful if you know what is going on rather than not - a recap for ready made fans.

I suggest IBO as you will get enough out of the first 5 episodes to make a decision of whether it is for you or not, as there is plenty of action and character development to get the franchise - the start of all are fairly consistent in this approach.

I'd say Unicorn would be a good start as well as it does actually explain enough of the phenomena within the UC within the episodes... However, Banagher and 'Audrey' are so wet and illogical/emotional (Audrey less so tbf) it can be off putting if you are an adult imo.

EDIT: Forgot to mention the most awful character in Unicorn, Riddhe....


As I said, I believe War in the Pocket would be a very good intro to the franchise, IMHO, and it's also on the short side. And you need about as much info as any WWII film.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2021/08/11 14:25:11


 
   
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 BlackoCatto wrote:
I wouldn't say Amuro is much a philosopher at all for awhile. Most of OG Gundam is him essentially having PTSD before realizing "Wow...I'm really good at killing people.

Meanwhile Kamille is a very.... special child. He is less philosophy and more so someone else's philosophy on him.


True, but later in life he gets a lot more introspective. In Tomino's Zeta novel Amuro becomes a bit more of a philosopher. Here's an excerpt when talking about Newtypes.

Spoiler:
A Newtype... That was not the same thing as having ESP. Borrowing the words of a pilot named Amuro Ray who apparently awakened as a Newtype, "Newtypes are people capable of mutual understanding with no misconceptions." According to Amuro, they did this without ESP or the use of telepathy.

"Maybe you could call it enlightenment, although I don't think it has anything to do with the enlightenment they talk about in eastern religions. I don't have any personal experience with religious teachings or enlightenment, so I can't compare or critique them. But to me, it doesn't mean just partial understanding of another person. I'd call it total understanding. That person's beliefs, their history, what they intend to do next... you understand all of those things as they take on a comprehensive shape.

"Clairvoyance? It's not that either. If that was it, you could see everything about another person. In that case, I'd be disturbed to see it. It's better to say you can see the actions that the other person intends to perform. So if they're an enemy, I can see this enemy's intention to kill me through the pattern of their actions. That's what it's like... Of course, these appear in different particular ways. Think of this as a general description... That's all I can tell you."


The longer quote has him pontificating on religions and enlightenment.
   
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 endlesswaltz123 wrote:

I'd say Unicorn would be a good start as well as it does actually explain enough of the phenomena within the UC within the episodes... However, Banagher and 'Audrey' are so wet and illogical/emotional (Audrey less so tbf) it can be off putting if you are an adult imo.

EDIT: Forgot to mention the most awful character in Unicorn, Riddhe....


I feel like Unicorn really suffers from UC baggage. It's runtime has so much technobabble nonsense where they repeat tired old concepts without even really explaining them. Drink when someone says "Newtype" is likely to kill a man, but it comes with shockingly little meaning at this point in the evolution of sci-fi storytelling. The emergence of Newtypes hasn't been an exciting concept since the 80's, but Unicorn expects it to still carry the same sense of mystery some 30+ years later.
   
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 The Red Hobbit wrote:
 BlackoCatto wrote:
I wouldn't say Amuro is much a philosopher at all for awhile. Most of OG Gundam is him essentially having PTSD before realizing "Wow...I'm really good at killing people.

Meanwhile Kamille is a very.... special child. He is less philosophy and more so someone else's philosophy on him.


True, but later in life he gets a lot more introspective. In Tomino's Zeta novel Amuro becomes a bit more of a philosopher. Here's an excerpt when talking about Newtypes.

Spoiler:
A Newtype... That was not the same thing as having ESP. Borrowing the words of a pilot named Amuro Ray who apparently awakened as a Newtype, "Newtypes are people capable of mutual understanding with no misconceptions." According to Amuro, they did this without ESP or the use of telepathy.

"Maybe you could call it enlightenment, although I don't think it has anything to do with the enlightenment they talk about in eastern religions. I don't have any personal experience with religious teachings or enlightenment, so I can't compare or critique them. But to me, it doesn't mean just partial understanding of another person. I'd call it total understanding. That person's beliefs, their history, what they intend to do next... you understand all of those things as they take on a comprehensive shape.

"Clairvoyance? It's not that either. If that was it, you could see everything about another person. In that case, I'd be disturbed to see it. It's better to say you can see the actions that the other person intends to perform. So if they're an enemy, I can see this enemy's intention to kill me through the pattern of their actions. That's what it's like... Of course, these appear in different particular ways. Think of this as a general description... That's all I can tell you."


The longer quote has him pontificating on religions and enlightenment.


At that point Amuro isn't really a kid anymore. By Char's Counter Attack he is nearing 30.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 LunarSol wrote:
 endlesswaltz123 wrote:

I'd say Unicorn would be a good start as well as it does actually explain enough of the phenomena within the UC within the episodes... However, Banagher and 'Audrey' are so wet and illogical/emotional (Audrey less so tbf) it can be off putting if you are an adult imo.

EDIT: Forgot to mention the most awful character in Unicorn, Riddhe....


I feel like Unicorn really suffers from UC baggage. It's runtime has so much technobabble nonsense where they repeat tired old concepts without even really explaining them. Drink when someone says "Newtype" is likely to kill a man, but it comes with shockingly little meaning at this point in the evolution of sci-fi storytelling. The emergence of Newtypes hasn't been an exciting concept since the 80's, but Unicorn expects it to still carry the same sense of mystery some 30+ years later.


The reason why it feels like baggage is because it is the epilogue to Char's Counter Attack. It'd be like starting someone in media res to the series and told to sink or swim.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Albertorius wrote:
 LordofHats wrote:
 Albertorius wrote:
I mean, I tend to refer to Mikazuki as "the Walking, Talking War Crime" so...


Honestly, I think that's utterly missing the point of his character.


It's also a short hand, you know ^^


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 endlesswaltz123 wrote:
 Albertorius wrote:
I mean... IBO is a great series, but at 50 episodes, I wouldn't exactly call it a "movie or short series", so I don't think it applies here?


Absolutely anything in UC doesn't apply to this either though as the first time newtype pops up you'll be WTF.

The UC Gundam movies are not exactly a good primer as well, I find them more useful if you know what is going on rather than not - a recap for ready made fans.

I suggest IBO as you will get enough out of the first 5 episodes to make a decision of whether it is for you or not, as there is plenty of action and character development to get the franchise - the start of all are fairly consistent in this approach.

I'd say Unicorn would be a good start as well as it does actually explain enough of the phenomena within the UC within the episodes... However, Banagher and 'Audrey' are so wet and illogical/emotional (Audrey less so tbf) it can be off putting if you are an adult imo.

EDIT: Forgot to mention the most awful character in Unicorn, Riddhe....


As I said, I believe War in the Pocket would be a very good intro to the franchise, IMHO, and it's also on the short side. And you need about as much info as any WWII film.


War in the Pocket and Thunderbolt I would say for an intro. Origin is also good as well, but a little longer.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2021/08/11 16:20:27


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Update!

Both English and Japanese versions of Gundam Zeta are on Funimation.

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I also saw all the Rebuild of Evangelion movies over on Amazon Prime. Not Gundam I know, but Gundam adjacent and maybe folks here will be interested.

GundamInfo recently put up the Reconguista in G compilation films on Youtube recently. I don't think the series is very good, but the art was pretty gorgeous (very Eureka 7 if anyone liked that). The main series had a problem with Bellri being kind of a wet noodle who shuffled wherever the plot needed him. The movies make that worse in my opinion. Aida would have been a much better focus character.

   
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Gathering the Informations.

Popping in to say I have my first Gundam model kit coming in the next few weeks...

Pale Rider DII (Titans)

My Gundam loving brother picked it out to give me something to do between commission projects this fall.

Anyone able to help me get an idea of what to be expecting?
   
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What grade is it?

standard, master, perfect?

the higher the standard the more complex the parts.

the rubber washer link system is a bandai iconic design. so the kit will go together well, it just depends on the level of detail you get.



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Gathering the Informations.

"HGUC"?

It's a 1/144. That's all I've got!
   
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High Grade Universal Century. Not the most complicated kits, probably similar to building a Redemptor or something similar, but you don't need glue and the parts are pre-colored so you don't need paint. It's mostly the experience of sprue clipping and clicking parts into pace. I find it very zen. I'm personally fond of the Master Grade kits. That new Eclipse Gundam is very tempting. HG/RG scale is better if you're going to buying a lot of them though. The MG 1/100 scale fills up shelves pretty quick.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 LordofHats wrote:
I also saw all the Rebuild of Evangelion movies over on Amazon Prime. Not Gundam I know, but Gundam adjacent and maybe folks here will be interested.


As a story, the Rebuilds didn't really click with me. The characters just feel more bombastic and less sincere than their original incarnations. Bringing thing to a close with an Eva duel with the primary antagonist felt a little cliche where the original was anything but. That said, when it came down to exploring Gendo and how he is in many ways trapped in the same failures as Shinji and seeing both move past that was compelling and I like the final sendoff even if I'm not enamored with the spectacle that it takes getting there. The meta narrative is likely more interesting than the actual narrative, which might just be something I had accepted about the original. I wasn't "pleased" with the Rebuilds, but they've given me a lot to think about and the more I do, the more I find myself appreciating them. That's pretty fundamentally Eva in the end.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2021/09/09 14:29:40


 
   
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 Kanluwen wrote:
"HGUC"?

It's a 1/144. That's all I've got!


At that scale it is most likely a standard kit. so it should be pretty simple to assemble with minimal extra detailed/moving parts.




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Member of the Ethereal Council




USA

 LunarSol wrote:
As a story, the Rebuilds didn't really click with me.


I think that it was good enough until the third movie. The third movie was a huge 'wtf is this now' of weirdness one after the other and the films kind of lost me because the series fully embraced its nonsensical side and revealed that what was ultimately a shallow series meant to troll otakus is... a very shallow series that just doesn't hold up when you try to do too much with it. The action scenes were still great and Eye-Patch Asuka does look pretty bad ass. The new character girl is just empty fan service.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/09/09 23:09:31


   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka





I wouldn't call it shallow exactly. There's a lot of depth to what's going on, but its more meta narrative than consistent worldbuilding. The original is a pretty raw examination of depression and social anxiety that does a great job taking the kaiju premise and subverting a lot of its tropes into something that quickly birthed a new generation of tropes of its own.

I think the third is easily the weakest of the 4 though in terms of having anything meaningful to say. In a lot of ways I feel like the 4th is working double duty to add substance. I do think the weakest thing about the 4th one is that it goes for more of a final boss fight that doesn't feel like it does as much with the characters as EoE and 25-26. There are definitely perfect moments, like Shinji showing a pretty great understanding of exactly how he hurt Asuka, but those moments feel very at odds with the relatively empty action that lacks the sense of desperation and purpose that made the original so iconic.

The new girl is definitely a bit of a waste. It is interesting that she represents an actual responsible adult point of view into the mix, but outside of a couple nudges towards the end, she's really never a compelling character.
   
Made in us
Purposeful Hammerhead Pilot




United States

Regarding EVA: Most of my friends getting into Anime today vastly prefer the rebuilds to the original series. It may just be a case of "what you started with." I think the 2nd rebuild film is one of the better anime films I have ever seen. It has just always stuck with me for some reason. I enjoyed the new movie a lot, felt like a really good closure for a franchise that has always had trouble with that.

This may just be a meme but I have always heard that Mari was introduced as a commentary on people who complained about wanting eva pilots that weren't incredibly flawed individuals, and how an EVA pilot that enjoyed their job would just come across as a complete psychopath. I was surprised they gave her so much focus in the last film as I firmly believed that was true.


concerning Reconguista in G now on youtube. I found the films incredibly charming. I think I agree about the whole Bellri being a wet noodle thing, but I am enjoying the ride so far. Can't wait for the 3rd movie.
   
Made in us
Powerful Pegasus Knight






Darn, they still cant get the original OP to Zeta in the US still. Funimation version for both English and Japanese uses a generic OP and EP. They did keep the regular score thoughx but sound effects differ between the translations.

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