Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

 NinthMusketeer wrote:
So finished going through the battletome. Pretty vood overall, a few things that I can see are a bit better/worse in the artifact/spells department but overall well rounded. Battalions are decent. It looks like taking an enclave is also part of allegiance rather than a side option, which is interesting.

The one issue I am seeing is the Soulrender being too strong at that point cost with the ability to bring back models so easily and allegiance making it difficult to snipe. I strongly suspect Mor'Phann render spam is going to be be a cheese list for Idoneth.

But overall another really good battletome release.

It's funny when the actual themed bit for a faction becomes the 'cheese'.

Once I saw Mor'phann, I figured it was going to get the haterade. I'm in love with the color scheme and fluff(I mean, c'mon! They live in the Realm of Death, their Soulrenders are far more impressive than any other Enclaves'), but man are they going to get hated on if you run a Namarti Corps.

2-6 units of Thralls, 2-4 of Reavers, and a Soulrender.
Battalion makes it so you are always returning 3 Namarti with Lurelight(you don't have to roll! yaaay!)--Mor'phann means you're returning 6 every time you do it.

I'm thinking 2 units of 20 Thralls, 2 units of 10 Reavers?
Take a Tidecaster for the Freezing Mists spell(enemy units can only Pile In 1", even if they have an ability where they'd get to Pile In more), maybe throw in some Eels and an Eidolon for a decent-ish starter list?

I'll likely get the sea king and eels. They'll be from Nautilar, really liking the colour scheme. Plus, they're elves that make sand castles.

If you don't play much is the battletome worth getting for fluff/art? I want to get it but I also don't want to waste money on a book I'll never go over again.

Given that you seem to loathe AoS' direction for background, I'd advise against it.

Even though this did a great job of building up to where we are now. And pg15 namedrops a Keeper of Secrets that has a hate-on for the Idoneth and the new "Seekers of Slaanesh" army tag that we're likely to see.

I'm pretty sure seekers of slaanesh is just referring to the one of the three sub-divisions in Hosts of Slaanesh.

 NinthMusketeer wrote:
I'm pretty sure seekers of slaanesh is just referring to the one of the three sub-divisions in Hosts of Slaanesh.

Quoting page 15 of Deepkin:

The Seekers of Slaanesh--wayward armies of daemons and tainted mortals--roamed the lands and seas of the realms in search of their missing god.

We had the Maggotkin of Nurgle, Disciples of Tzeentch, etc similarly named over time.

The key with the Soulrender is that his ability happens AFTER the Battleshock phase. Considering their bravery of 6 and their 5+ save, they can melt pretty quickly to a good round of shooting or combat. Just force them to make those big battleshock tests.

 Kanluwen wrote:

 NinthMusketeer wrote:
I'm pretty sure seekers of slaanesh is just referring to the one of the three sub-divisions in Hosts of Slaanesh.

Quoting page 15 of Deepkin:

The Seekers of Slaanesh--wayward armies of daemons and tainted mortals--roamed the lands and seas of the realms in search of their missing god.

We had the Maggotkin of Nurgle, Disciples of Tzeentch, etc similarly named over time.

Yeah, the Hosts of Slaanesh are divided into three groups (that even have different allegiance abilities); Seekers, Pretenders, and I can't remember the other name. Seekers are the ones who are actually searching for Slaanesh, that's why they are called 'Seekers' once Slaanesh is released the sub-divisions will be gone, not to mention they wouldn't be seeking anymore. This fluff was first detailed way back in the Grand Alliance Chaos book, it isn't new by any means.

 Kanluwen wrote:
Given that you seem to loathe AoS' direction for background, I'd advise against it.

Even though this did a great job of building up to where we are now. And pg15 namedrops a Keeper of Secrets that has a hate-on for the Idoneth and the new "Seekers of Slaanesh" army tag that we're likely to see.

I hate a lot of things but I love a fair few as well. Like snake elves, Morathi, Kharadrons, Sylvaneth and what I've seen of Idoneth.

I think Seekers will be a subfaction. It seems odd to me that they'll name the whole faction after a unit and what would they seek if Slaanesh is back?

IIRC the third Slaanesh grouping is Invaders.

 NinthMusketeer wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:

 NinthMusketeer wrote:
I'm pretty sure seekers of slaanesh is just referring to the one of the three sub-divisions in Hosts of Slaanesh.

Quoting page 15 of Deepkin:

The Seekers of Slaanesh--wayward armies of daemons and tainted mortals--roamed the lands and seas of the realms in search of their missing god.

We had the Maggotkin of Nurgle, Disciples of Tzeentch, etc similarly named over time.

Yeah, the Hosts of Slaanesh are divided into three groups (that even have different allegiance abilities); Seekers, Pretenders, and I can't remember the other name. Seekers are the ones who are actually searching for Slaanesh, that's why they are called 'Seekers' once Slaanesh is released the sub-divisions will be gone, not to mention they wouldn't be seeking anymore. This fluff was first detailed way back in the Grand Alliance Chaos book, it isn't new by any means.

Okay, so the name's not new....

The name actually works a lot better than you're making it out to be though. Slaanesh is all about finding that next experience and overindulging. The only real argument I can see against it is that there's a unit called "Seekers of Slaanesh" currently.

drbored wrote:
The key with the Soulrender is that his ability happens AFTER the Battleshock phase. Considering their bravery of 6 and their 5+ save, they can melt pretty quickly to a good round of shooting or combat. Just force them to make those big battleshock tests.

That can be patched with an Eidolon Aspect of the Sea (+3 Bravery bubble), Battleshock Immunity command ability (given you can only shoot the closest unit, make the closest unit immune and you can patch it against shooting without worry), large squads in general (for bonus bravery per 10 models), and banners for at least thralls (which give +1 bravery). Off the top of my head. Could be more.

Boatloads (heh) of thralls under Mor'phann with soulrenders and an Eidolon could end up being super gross to fight. Supplement with soulscryers for outflanking fun and just ewwww.

Anyone have the Idoneth art card from week 1 with the battletome cover and can provide a high-res photo/scan for me?
I can't find a digital version of the batteltome cover artwork without any logos/text.

Anyone know the artist btw? Looks like Mark Holmes (Nurgle, Khorne, Sylvaneth covers for example).

 obsidiankatana wrote:

drbored wrote:
The key with the Soulrender is that his ability happens AFTER the Battleshock phase. Considering their bravery of 6 and their 5+ save, they can melt pretty quickly to a good round of shooting or combat. Just force them to make those big battleshock tests.

That can be patched with an Eidolon Aspect of the Sea (+3 Bravery bubble), Battleshock Immunity command ability (given you can only shoot the closest unit, make the closest unit immune and you can patch it against shooting without worry), large squads in general (for bonus bravery per 10 models), and banners for at least thralls (which give +1 bravery). Off the top of my head. Could be more.

Boatloads (heh) of thralls under Mor'phann with soulrenders and an Eidolon could end up being super gross to fight. Supplement with soulscryers for outflanking fun and just ewwww.

Mor'phann Namarti Cohort with 2x 20 strong Thrall units are going to be a beast to deal with.
A guaranteed 6 Thralls returning every time the Soulrender does it(you don't roll for that, it's an automatic 3 returning--Mor'phann grants +3) is just dirty.

Couple that with a Tidecaster hanging around throwing out Freezing Mists(enemy units piling in can only ever do 1" Pile In, even if they have a special rule saying they can Pile In more) and you'll have some nice board control going on.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Hanskrampf wrote:
Anyone have the Idoneth art card from week 1 with the battletome cover and can provide a high-res photo/scan for me?
I can't find a digital version of the batteltome cover artwork without any logos/text.

Anyone know the artist btw? Looks like Mark Holmes (Nurgle, Khorne, Sylvaneth covers for example).

Haven't seen an artist listed.

I -think- I had a copy of it in the AoS rumor thread? Will take a look.
I didn't put up week 1! I put up week 2 though. Sorry


Automatically Appended Next Post:
According to Bob from War of Sigmar, the Eels are going to be out on the 19th of May--so preorders would be May 12th.

Seems like 2x30 would be better. Keep in mind the unit needs to survive your combat phase then the opponent's turn before you can bring back models.

 NinthMusketeer wrote:
Seems like 2x30 would be better. Keep in mind the unit needs to survive your combat phase then the opponent's turn before you can bring back models.

The problem is that trick as part of the Namarti Corps would end up being 1200 pts all told...since you're required to take 2 units of Reavers as part of it.

Namarti Corps isn't as necessary as Mor'phann imo. It only affects a single Soulrender in the army and requires Reavers you may not want to take.

 obsidiankatana wrote:
Namarti Corps isn't as necessary as Mor'phann imo. It only affects a single Soulrender in the army and requires Reavers you may not want to take.

Good point. And making the d3 a 3 is less beneficial when it's plus 3 anyways.

 obsidiankatana wrote:
Namarti Corps isn't as necessary as Mor'phann imo. It only affects a single Soulrender in the army and requires Reavers you may not want to take.

Reavers may not be great, but they can still be annoying and at least soak up fire thanks to "Forgotten Nightmares".

While it affects "a single Soulrender in the army" for the Namarti Corps' ability...you can bring multiple Namarti Corps.

 NinthMusketeer wrote:

 obsidiankatana wrote:
Namarti Corps isn't as necessary as Mor'phann imo. It only affects a single Soulrender in the army and requires Reavers you may not want to take.

Which is a good benefit. And making the d3 a 3 is less beneficial when it's plus 3 anyways.

That's what I'm saying. The Corps turns d3 into static 3. Mor'phann gives +3 to the roll.

 obsidiankatana wrote:

 NinthMusketeer wrote:

 obsidiankatana wrote:
Namarti Corps isn't as necessary as Mor'phann imo. It only affects a single Soulrender in the army and requires Reavers you may not want to take.

Which is a good benefit. And making the d3 a 3 is less beneficial when it's plus 3 anyways.

That's what I'm saying. The Corps turns d3 into static 3. Mor'phann gives +3 to the roll.

I derped out; meant to say "good point" to agree with you and typed out something else entirely. Apparently my fingers are very bad at AoS strategy!


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Kanluwen wrote:

 obsidiankatana wrote:
Namarti Corps isn't as necessary as Mor'phann imo. It only affects a single Soulrender in the army and requires Reavers you may not want to take.

Reavers may not be great, but they can still be annoying and at least soak up fire thanks to "Forgotten Nightmares".

While it affects "a single Soulrender in the army" for the Namarti Corps' ability...you can bring multiple Namarti Corps.

Reavers aren't bad at all, they are exceedingly good for objective camping (within the context of the army) and can snipe wizards in a pinch.

 NinthMusketeer wrote:

 obsidiankatana wrote:

 NinthMusketeer wrote:

 obsidiankatana wrote:
Namarti Corps isn't as necessary as Mor'phann imo. It only affects a single Soulrender in the army and requires Reavers you may not want to take.

Which is a good benefit. And making the d3 a 3 is less beneficial when it's plus 3 anyways.

That's what I'm saying. The Corps turns d3 into static 3. Mor'phann gives +3 to the roll.

I derped out; meant to say "good point" to agree with you and typed out something else entirely. Apparently my fingers are very bad at AoS strategy!

All good!

Also - I don't see anything disallowing multiple Soulrenders from affecting the same unit. Theoretically, if a 20 man unit got reduced massively, 2-3 could all hit it and bring it back to full strength.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Kanluwen wrote:

 obsidiankatana wrote:
Namarti Corps isn't as necessary as Mor'phann imo. It only affects a single Soulrender in the army and requires Reavers you may not want to take.

Reavers may not be great, but they can still be annoying and at least soak up fire thanks to "Forgotten Nightmares".

While it affects "a single Soulrender in the army" for the Namarti Corps' ability...you can bring multiple Namarti Corps.

I'm not saying they're terrible, just that you may or may not actually want them in your army. If you don't, 280pts plus battalion cost is a hard pill to swallow. And then you have to consider if the cost of the battalion is worth automatic 3's for a single Soulrender versus taking those points and investing them into just another Soulrender.

 obsidiankatana wrote:

 NinthMusketeer wrote:

 obsidiankatana wrote:

 NinthMusketeer wrote:

 obsidiankatana wrote:
Namarti Corps isn't as necessary as Mor'phann imo. It only affects a single Soulrender in the army and requires Reavers you may not want to take.

Which is a good benefit. And making the d3 a 3 is less beneficial when it's plus 3 anyways.

That's what I'm saying. The Corps turns d3 into static 3. Mor'phann gives +3 to the roll.

I derped out; meant to say "good point" to agree with you and typed out something else entirely. Apparently my fingers are very bad at AoS strategy!

All good!

Also - I don't see anything disallowing multiple Soulrenders from affecting the same unit. Theoretically, if a 20 man unit got reduced massively, 2-3 could all hit it and bring it back to full strength.

 Kanluwen wrote:

 obsidiankatana wrote:
Namarti Corps isn't as necessary as Mor'phann imo. It only affects a single Soulrender in the army and requires Reavers you may not want to take.

Reavers may not be great, but they can still be annoying and at least soak up fire thanks to "Forgotten Nightmares".

While it affects "a single Soulrender in the army" for the Namarti Corps' ability...you can bring multiple Namarti Corps.

I'm not saying they're terrible, just that you may or may not actually want them in your army. If you don't, 280pts plus battalion cost is a hard pill to swallow. And then you have to consider if the cost of the battalion is worth automatic 3's for a single Soulrender versus taking those points and investing them into just another Soulrender.

100pts for the Battalion isn't too bad, compared to some others.

Right now, it's going to be very dependent upon what you want to accomplish. If you're wanting to be KING OF THE NAMARTI!!!!1!!, then it wouldn't hurt to run a few Namarti Corps.

40 Thralls comes out to 560pts, 20 Reavers come out to 280pts, and 100 pts for the Soulreaver--add in the 100 pts for the Battalion and you're sitting on 1040pts for that setup.
2 setups like that comes out to 2080pts, leaving (for a 2500pt game as an example) 420pts for whatever you want.

Sure, but those 100pts are spot on for a second Soulrender. Boils down to an extra artifact and guaranteed 3 on the d3 roll vs having two Soulrenders for 2d3 brought back, +3 each for Mor'phann, with potentially more if the Soulrenders get kills.

Not to say one is guaranteed better than the other, but it's a choice to be made.

Honestly though you're only paying 50 points for the battalion benefit, because the extra artifact & deployment benefits for any battalion are generally worth 50 points in effectiviness for showing up. I wouldn't run two but one leaves plenty of room in points even when using 30-man thrall units (which is what Mor Phan should be doing). A 20-man unit can very easily be singled out and killed between your combat phase and the enemy's turn.

 NinthMusketeer wrote:
Honestly though you're only paying 50 points for the battalion benefit, because the extra artifact & deployment benefits for any battalion are generally worth 50 points in effectiviness for showing up. I wouldn't run two but one leaves plenty of room in points even when using 30-man thrall units (which is what Mor Phan should be doing). A 20-man unit can very easily be singled out and killed between your combat phase and the enemy's turn.

You just have to keep track of which Soulrender is auto-rolling 3 and which isn't. Which is academic, but I'll always forget personally.

Add some extra fish to the special one's base.