Switch Theme:

Codex Adeptus Custodes 9th Edition Tactica: Auric Mortalis  [RSS] Share on facebook Share on Twitter Submit to Reddit
»
Author Message
Advert


Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you:
  • No adverts like this in the forums anymore.
  • Times and dates in your local timezone.
  • Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance.
  • Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely.
  • Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net.
If you are already a member then feel free to login now.




Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




PandatheWarrior wrote:
What are you on, katah are making the codex great. I guess people want an entire dex relying on rolling 3+ at crutch timing and ordering stuff from forgeworld.


forgeworld isn't going no where.
   
Made in at
Longtime Dakkanaut




What do you guys think about this Emperor's Chosen list?

Spoiler:

2000p Emperors Chosen (BBCode)

++ Battalion Detachment 0CP (Imperium - Adeptus Custodes) [107 PL, 9CP, 2,000pts] ++

+ Configuration +

Battle Size [12CP]: 3. Strike Force (101-200 Total PL / 1001-2000 Points)

Detachment Command Cost

Detachment Type / Shield Host: Adeptus Custodes, Emperor's Chosen

+ HQ +

Blade Champion [7 PL, -2CP, 110pts]: (Emperor's Chosen): Auric Exemplar, 6. Peerless Warrior, Stratagem: The Emperor's Heroes, Stratagem: Victor of the Blood Games

Shield-Captain in Allarus Terminator Armor [8 PL, -1CP, 135pts]: 3. Superior Creation, Castellan Axe, Praetorian Plate, Stratagem: The Emperor's Heroes, Unstoppable Destroyer

Trajann Valoris [9 PL, 1CP, 170pts]

+ Troops +

Custodian Guard Squad [7 PL, 140pts]
. 2x Custodian w/ Guardian Spear: 2x Guardian Spear
. Custodian w/ Sentinel Blade & Praesidium Shield: Praesidium Shield

Prosecutors [3 PL, 60pts]: Prosecutor Sister Superior
. 4x Prosecutor: 4x Boltgun

Prosecutors [3 PL, 60pts]: Prosecutor Sister Superior
. 4x Prosecutor: 4x Boltgun

Sagittarum Custodians [7 PL, 150pts]
. 3x Sagittarum: 3x Adrastus Bolt Caliver

+ Elites +

Allarus Custodians [3 PL, 65pts]
. Allarus w/ Castellan Axe

Allarus Custodians [3 PL, 65pts]
. Allarus w/ Castellan Axe

Contemptor-Galatus Dreadnought [9 PL, -1CP, 170pts]: Stratagem: Eternal Penitent

Vexilus Praetor [6 PL, 105pts]: Guardian Spear, Vexilla Imperius

+ Fast Attack +

Venatari Custodians [16 PL, 220pts]
. Venatari Custodian
. . Kinetic Destroyer and Tarsus Buckler
. Venatari Custodian
. . Kinetic Destroyer and Tarsus Buckler
. Venatari Custodian
. . Kinetic Destroyer and Tarsus Buckler
. Venatari Custodian
. . Kinetic Destroyer and Tarsus Buckler

Vertus Praetors [12 PL, 270pts]
. 3x Praetor w/ Salvo Launcher: 3x Interceptor Lance, 3x Salvo Launcher

+ Heavy Support +

Telemon Heavy Dreadnought [14 PL, 280pts]
. Telemon Caestus
. Telemon Caestus

++ Total: [107 PL, 9CP, 2,000pts] ++

Created with BattleScribe

I'm beginning to enjoy having two units of prosecutors as objective holders and to do actions.

The two lone allarus terminators are quite flexible, since it's easier to deepstrike them somewhere you want them due to the smaller footprint. If they manage to teleport into the enemy backfield, they can also combo very well with the praetorian plate captain.
I still think one Telemon is a great thing to have as an immovable object that contests the midfield.

Imo this blade champion build is probably the most flexible. You can chuck him towards blobs of skitarii, necrons, wyches or whatever horde unit you come across and he'll slice his way through most of them with his 20-24 attacks that do extra mortal wounds. And he's still good against characters...obviously not as good as the shadowkeepers build, but still.

One major weakness might be the anti tank shooting. 3 bikes might not be enough in that department.
   
Made in us
Been Around the Block




Emperor's Chosen made it to the finals at Fabricator's Forge GT yesterday, just barely losing to Twisted Helix GSC on the last turn. The guy ran 2 bike captains, 8 bikes, 3 pallas, and 3 caladius.

https://pastebin.com/F46KFtFp

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/01/17 15:48:07


 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




Oh boy I hope the meta isn't back to oops all calladius
   
Made in us
Been Around the Block




Ka'tahs don't even work on most of that list. I'm guessing he wanted to take something simpler and familiar to play for a first GT outing.
   
Made in us
Damsel of the Lady




The Pallas are doing work in there too. It's a leafblower list. I'd classify those as a kind of skew list. If you don't run into anyone prepared for it you're fine, but if you do find an opponent prepared for it; you're wrecked.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/01/17 15:36:41


 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




artific3r wrote:
Ka'tahs don't even work on most of that list. I'm guessing he wanted to take something simpler and familiar to play for a first GT outing.


Ka'tahs aren't important.

They are a tiny boost to the army, but otherwise mostly ignorable.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Audustum wrote:
The Pallas are doing work in there too. It's a leafblower list. I'd classify those as a kind of skew list. If you don't run into anyone prepared for it you're fine, but if you do find an opponent prepared for it; you're wrecked.


This has always depended on the strength of the leaf blower

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/01/17 15:59:22


 
   
Made in us
Monster-Slaying Daemonhunter




I'm actually excited by the rumored leaks for our CA/ Day 1 DLC. Trajaan is going down in points cost, as are bikes, and dreads.

   
Made in us
Been Around the Block




stratigo wrote:
artific3r wrote:
Ka'tahs don't even work on most of that list. I'm guessing he wanted to take something simpler and familiar to play for a first GT outing.


Ka'tahs aren't important.

They are a tiny boost to the army, but otherwise mostly ignorable.



You're joking, right? The ability to spend 1 CP to give any infantry unit one of 12 stances isn't important?

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/01/17 17:26:59


 
   
Made in at
Longtime Dakkanaut




artific3r wrote:
stratigo wrote:
artific3r wrote:
Ka'tahs don't even work on most of that list. I'm guessing he wanted to take something simpler and familiar to play for a first GT outing.


Ka'tahs aren't important.

They are a tiny boost to the army, but otherwise mostly ignorable.




You're joking, right? The ability to spend 1 CP to give any infantry unit one of 12 stances isn't important?


I don't think the point was to say that the stratagem to put one unit into another Ka'tah Stance is bad. But rather that the Ka'tah themselves are not that important for the army to function successfully.

I'm not sure where I stand on this, because the Ka'tah can be situationally very powerful. For example it can be downright game winning if you manage to prevent a crucial unit from falling back with the Kaptaris stance....but this won't ever happen consistently.
But the main deciding factors that make the army function are the shield hosts and stratagems.
   
Made in sk
Fresh-Faced New User



Slovakia

Yeah, the thing with katas is that, true, you don't need them. You can make lists without katas and be perfectly fine.
But saying you can just ignore them because they are tiny boosts, is not exactly correct.

Some of them can be really great and the ability to use any stance on a unit for 1cp can be very good. Like doing actions after advance or Advance and shoot. I was able to deploy teleport Homer turn 1 with a bike cap in opponents dz thanks to the katas. He survived and scored me 4 points. Advance and shoot with Salvo bikes for t1 alpha strike was also pretty handy.
+1A/1dmg can be very useful against dg.

The usefulness of the katas depend on your list and game plan. Which is great. They give you more options.
   
Made in us
Been Around the Block




I suspect the ka'tahs are what's going to separate an average Custodes player from a great one. All the depth of the codex is locked up in the ka'tahs and the Emp's Chosen strat.

Using just the datasheets, basic strats, and non-Emperor's Chosen shield hosts will probably be a sort of baseline way to play the army. But I really think the real test of skill (and perhaps the real power of the book, who knows) is going to be in learning how to get mileage out of 1) your stance order, 2) Esteemed Amalgam, and 3) Martial Discretion.

Your stance order is obviously super important because if you get it right, you won't have to burn as much CP on Martial Discretion to get the effect you want on the unit you want, which would then free up Esteemed Amalgam for use on something else, or simply save you 1 CP for any of the other myriad, highly useful 1 CP strats.

Esteemed Amalgam can essentially be thought of as 5 strats in 1. Martial Discretion is 12 strats in 1. Not sure I'd describe a set of 17 strats that work on your whole army (excluding vehicles) as ignorable.



This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/01/17 20:11:30


 
   
Made in us
Monster-Slaying Daemonhunter




artific3r wrote:
I suspect the ka'tahs are what's going to separate an average Custodes player from a great one. All the depth of the codex is locked up in the ka'tahs and the Emp's Chosen strat.

Using just the datasheets, basic strats, and non-Emperor's Chosen shield hosts will probably be a sort of baseline way to play the army. But I really think the real test of skill (and perhaps the real power of the book, who knows) is going to be in learning how to get mileage out of 1) your stance order, 2) Esteemed Amalgam, and 3) Martial Discretion.

Your stance order is obviously super important because if you get it right, you won't have to burn as much CP on Martial Discretion to get the effect you want on the unit you want, which would then free up Esteemed Amalgam for use on something else, or simply save you 1 CP for any of the other myriad, highly useful 1 CP strats.

Esteemed Amalgam can essentially be thought of as 5 strats in 1. Martial Discretion is 12 strats in 1. Not sure I'd describe a set of 17 strats that work on your whole army (excluding vehicles) as ignorable.





If the new CA shows tanks and telemons getting a points drop/rules buff, (Neither currently get Katas) then you can kiss all this complexity goodbye, because it's still gonna be Bike Captains and Robots with Tanks, all day.

Keep in mind they are also shifting all the ways you score secondaries. Anything over 10 wounds now counts as a vehicle for scored points according to the leaks. That means Trajaan with his +2 wounds. Also, they've hinted at re-designing the way missions are played in majors. Custodes don't have a tier list until at least 2 months after the CA/last FAQ/Update. Because what's the point in assigning something as "The best way to play" when we don't even know what they plan to FAQ/CA to death yet.
   
Made in us
Dakka Veteran





Lebanon NH

Actually, that makes a nice opening:

Any idea when the FAQ or forge-world updates are supposed to come?
   
Made in us
Monster-Slaying Daemonhunter




The leaks have been coming non-stop since the custodes drop, so I feel soon, but no idea.
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
artific3r wrote:
I suspect the ka'tahs are what's going to separate an average Custodes player from a great one. All the depth of the codex is locked up in the ka'tahs and the Emp's Chosen strat.

Using just the datasheets, basic strats, and non-Emperor's Chosen shield hosts will probably be a sort of baseline way to play the army. But I really think the real test of skill (and perhaps the real power of the book, who knows) is going to be in learning how to get mileage out of 1) your stance order, 2) Esteemed Amalgam, and 3) Martial Discretion.

Your stance order is obviously super important because if you get it right, you won't have to burn as much CP on Martial Discretion to get the effect you want on the unit you want, which would then free up Esteemed Amalgam for use on something else, or simply save you 1 CP for any of the other myriad, highly useful 1 CP strats.

Esteemed Amalgam can essentially be thought of as 5 strats in 1. Martial Discretion is 12 strats in 1. Not sure I'd describe a set of 17 strats that work on your whole army (excluding vehicles) as ignorable.





If the new CA shows tanks and telemons getting a points drop/rules buff, (Neither currently get Katas) then you can kiss all this complexity goodbye, because it's still gonna be Bike Captains and Robots with Tanks, all day.

Keep in mind they are also shifting all the ways you score secondaries. Anything over 10 wounds now counts as a vehicle for scored points according to the leaks. That means Trajaan with his +2 wounds. Also, they've hinted at re-designing the way missions are played in majors. Custodes don't have a tier list until at least 2 months after the CA/last FAQ/Update. Because what's the point in assigning something as "The best way to play" when we don't even know what they plan to FAQ/CA to death yet.


So it is extremely unlikely that dreads or tanks get ka'tahs because the current dread doesn't, it would indeed be weird if they did.

But again, neither need Ka'tahs, they are powerful without them.
   
Made in us
Blood Angel Terminator with Lightning Claws






Are we expecting any changes to the Telemon's weapon profiles or just a points adjustment?

GW: "We do no demographic research, we have no focus groups, we do not ask the market what it wants" 
   
Made in gb
Grim Dark Angels Interrogator-Chaplain





Earth

got a game against custodes with my deathwing tomorrow, any tips ?
   
Made in us
Never Forget Isstvan!






kill the bikes fast as you can. Dont know your opponents list but that advice will always help.

JOIN MY CRUSADE and gain 4000 RT points!
http://www.eternalcrusade.com/account/sign-up/?ref_code=EC-PLCIKYCABW8PG 
   
Made in us
Monster-Slaying Daemonhunter




 Ferrum_Sanguinis wrote:
Are we expecting any changes to the Telemon's weapon profiles or just a points adjustment?


So far I've just heard points drops. And CA rarely if ever changes rules, just points. Then again, in this CA they are radically altering missions, objectives, and how secondaries work, so who knows? This wouldn't be the first time GW has violated precedent. My biggest hope for a profile change would have been in the form of a day 1 FAQ for specific units. That obviously didn't happen, so now all we have to hope for is a MFM sometime in the next few months? Unless there is another way GW has updated specific FW units before? White dwarf maybe?
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut




Some thoughts after playing some games with new codex and seeing that the leaks are indeed correct. Heads up I am playing custodes through a “take an hold” style of list. If you are planning on bringing a more leaf blower style list like that GT one above this is less relevant to you.

1) Conservai (advance and do actions) is the best kha’tah stance IMO. This is pretty much for 1 reason. With it you can setup a midpoint objective banners on the first turn that you otherwise couldn’t reach. This has the downside of your opponent potentially contesting some objectives if he gets the first turn, but that also could
draw him too far out/cause him mis- position his units. Additionally, this does require you to roll high enough on your advance roll to make it to the objective, but we can help this by being solar watch/becoming solar watch. Anything that can get you extra points is cash money IMO.

2) CP usage will be divided between “defensive stratagems” “tanglefoot “ “heroic intervention, “emperors chosen strat,” and “other stuff” You’ll need a darn good reason to use “other stuff.” Once again our CP is very important.

3) Points adjustments make non single Allarus terminators more interesting, as they’re no longer completely outclassed by wardens, Also, everyone getting knives for free is a bigger buff than it may look on the surface. A free extra attack on everyone adds up fast, and is a real buff to our offensive capabilities. Think the book looks significantly stronger after this update.

This message was edited 4 times. Last update was at 2022/01/18 13:21:18


 
   
Made in ch
Regular Dakkanaut




I found this leak about custodes points:

Codex Changes
Blade Champion +10
Bike Captain -10
Foot Captain -5
Allarus Captain -10
Trajann -10
Valerian -10
Allarus Terminators -5 per model
Vertus Bikes -5 per model
Land Raider -20

FW changes
Aquilon Terminators -5 per model
Telemon -20
Coronus Grav-carrier -30
Orion & Ares -50
   
Made in de
Mighty Chosen Warrior of Chaos






Misericordia are free(see designer note)

pics of points leak:
Spoiler:

   
Made in us
Damsel of the Lady




FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
 Ferrum_Sanguinis wrote:
Are we expecting any changes to the Telemon's weapon profiles or just a points adjustment?


So far I've just heard points drops. And CA rarely if ever changes rules, just points. Then again, in this CA they are radically altering missions, objectives, and how secondaries work, so who knows? This wouldn't be the first time GW has violated precedent. My biggest hope for a profile change would have been in the form of a day 1 FAQ for specific units. That obviously didn't happen, so now all we have to hope for is a MFM sometime in the next few months? Unless there is another way GW has updated specific FW units before? White dwarf maybe?


Just a note, MFM is going up for pre-order on the 22nd of this month. It's very soon.

Sadly, I don't think there's any profile updates incoming. Likely, within 2-3 weeks we get a FAQ that adds Katah to some FW stuff. Probably minimal from there. Just my guess though.
   
Made in us
Blood Angel Terminator with Lightning Claws






IMO Ven. Land Raiders needed to drop at least 40 pts to start being viable. Everything else looks great though.

GW: "We do no demographic research, we have no focus groups, we do not ask the market what it wants" 
   
Made in us
Monster-Slaying Daemonhunter




Are telemons still worth going dual Storm Cannons? It feels like they are super powerful at 220ish points but at 250, ehh. Also, with the -10 in bike cost, that effectively makes HB bikes more cost effective than terminators for hunting down characters. Meltas are now basically a free upgrade. If Miseracordias are free now, bikes are the ultimate horde defense now. No one wants to mess with 240pt squads that can wipe hordes off the map in a single turn.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
speaking of leaks, Tau have a commander plasma rifle option that is Assault 2, ap5 3 flat damage, ignores invulns. YIPPEE. It can go on any of their battlesuit commanders.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/01/18 16:42:34


 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
Are telemons still worth going dual Storm Cannons? It feels like they are super powerful at 220ish points but at 250, ehh. Also, with the -10 in bike cost, that effectively makes HB bikes more cost effective than terminators for hunting down characters. Meltas are now basically a free upgrade. If Miseracordias are free now, bikes are the ultimate horde defense now. No one wants to mess with 240pt squads that can wipe hordes off the map in a single turn.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
speaking of leaks, Tau have a commander plasma rifle option that is Assault 2, ap5 3 flat damage, ignores invulns. YIPPEE. It can go on any of their battlesuit commanders.


They haven't been worth the dual cannons in like a year.

The best build is cannon fist.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also, the rate of ignore invul that is coming out tells me this is GW's new "thing" and, well, we're pretty fethed. The army lives and dies off of invuls.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/01/18 17:44:26


 
   
Made in at
Longtime Dakkanaut




stratigo wrote:
FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
Are telemons still worth going dual Storm Cannons? It feels like they are super powerful at 220ish points but at 250, ehh. Also, with the -10 in bike cost, that effectively makes HB bikes more cost effective than terminators for hunting down characters. Meltas are now basically a free upgrade. If Miseracordias are free now, bikes are the ultimate horde defense now. No one wants to mess with 240pt squads that can wipe hordes off the map in a single turn.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
speaking of leaks, Tau have a commander plasma rifle option that is Assault 2, ap5 3 flat damage, ignores invulns. YIPPEE. It can go on any of their battlesuit commanders.


They haven't been worth the dual cannons in like a year.

The best build is cannon fist.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also, the rate of ignore invul that is coming out tells me this is GW's new "thing" and, well, we're pretty fethed. The army lives and dies off of invuls.


The new Tau Bork'an specific stratagem previewed on warcom is probably one of the strongest strats in the entire game: "2CP pick a friendly unit and one weapon of that unit, ignore invulns with that weapon." Geez, thats powerful....not only because it can ignore invulns, but for the sheer flexibility since it works on any weapon you need it to.

Edit: and according to Auspex tactics Tau commanders or Ghostkeel can get a prototype plasma rifle with Ap5, dmg3 that just straight also ignores invulns. So at least 3 options in the Tau codex to just ignore invulns. I know we need the full codex to assess how strong Tau are, but is anyone else worried as a Custodes player?

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/01/18 18:16:49


 
   
Made in us
Dakka Veteran





Lebanon NH

Wow, that strat is basically: "pick a custodes unit to kill this phase". I bet the tau players are loving this! (our faction, not so much...)
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut




artific3r wrote:
I suspect the ka'tahs are what's going to separate an average Custodes player from a great one. All the depth of the codex is locked up in the ka'tahs and the Emp's Chosen strat.

Using just the datasheets, basic strats, and non-Emperor's Chosen shield hosts will probably be a sort of baseline way to play the army. But I really think the real test of skill (and perhaps the real power of the book, who knows) is going to be in learning how to get mileage out of 1) your stance order, 2) Esteemed Amalgam, and 3) Martial Discretion.

Your stance order is obviously super important because if you get it right, you won't have to burn as much CP on Martial Discretion to get the effect you want on the unit you want, which would then free up Esteemed Amalgam for use on something else, or simply save you 1 CP for any of the other myriad, highly useful 1 CP strats.

Esteemed Amalgam can essentially be thought of as 5 strats in 1. Martial Discretion is 12 strats in 1. Not sure I'd describe a set of 17 strats that work on your whole army (excluding vehicles) as ignorable.



I agree with this take completely. I suspect the people that are down on katahs either haven't played with them enough or aren't even bothering to give them a fair shake in the first place. Katahs are potent and impactful if you use them correctly and depending on the match ups. Rendax makes our anti vehicle capability so much better across our whole army since the auto wounding on 6's applies to both shooting and melee and the +1S can basically be translated to +1 to wound in a lot of circumstances. Calistus increases our early/late game mobility significantly. Conservai makes action secondaries like Deploy Teleport Homer much more viable for us now. Dacatarai/Kaptaris can seriously neuter melee armies if used properly. And if things like Venatari Lances and Pyrithite Spears from FW get auric, you'll be seeing more people use Salvus too. All of those things spread across more or less army wide really adds up. You can seriously do some pretty nutty things with katahs that you wouldn't be able to if you know how to use them. Sleep on them at your own peril.
   
 
Forum Index » 40K Tactics
Go to: