Switch Theme:

Kill Team 2021 news & rumours  [RSS] Share on facebook Share on Twitter Submit to Reddit
»
Author Message
Advert


Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you:
  • No adverts like this in the forums anymore.
  • Times and dates in your local timezone.
  • Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance.
  • Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely.
  • Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net.
If you are already a member then feel free to login now.




Made in au
Grizzled Space Wolves Great Wolf





SamusDrake wrote:
So basically even those only interested in Kreigs and Kommandos will still need the compendium anyway.


No, the Octarius book is what you'd need.

The compendium only comes with rules for vanilla guard and vanilla orks, the Krieg/Veteran Guard and Kommandos come in the Octarius book.

EDIT: From Stahly's video it looks like the book that does come in the starter box does come with the datacards for the Kommandos and DKoK, it's just missing the kill team construction rules and special rules, so it's missing like 3 or 4 pages of the rules compared to the Octarius book.

It's a bit silly they didn't just include the damned Octarius book instead of the "recruit edition" book, it appears to serve the same purpose but just missing a few pages of rules.


This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2022/01/22 11:35:07


 
   
Made in gb
Stubborn Dark Angels Veteran Sergeant






I don't need any more Krieg, but it does come across as the most cost effective way to get them is to buy the starter set and sell off everything else.

I reckon you can get them down to £22-25 net after shipping and selling on facebook before eBay.

I think the market will flood with people trying to do this though so the window will be quick... The other factor is, can you be bothered?

That is selling the other stuff at non scalper prices BTW.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/01/22 11:37:58


My hobby instagram account: @the_shroud_of_vigilance
My Shroud of Vigilance Hobby update blog for me detailed updates and lore on the faction:
Blog 
   
Made in us
Stern Iron Priest with Thrall Bodyguard





AllSeeingSkink wrote:
SamusDrake wrote:
So basically even those only interested in Kreigs and Kommandos will still need the compendium anyway.


No, the Octarius book is what you'd need.

The compendium only comes with rules for vanilla guard and vanilla orks, the Krieg/Veteran Guard and Kommandos come in the Octarius book.

You also need the Tac Ops cards set - looks like the starter really is a starter; no advanced terrain, no equipment, predefined lists, that sort of thing.
So KT: Octarius = Starter + Cards + Octarius book + KZ: Octarius terrain, looks like.

"Three months? I'm going to go crazy …and I'm taking you with me!"
— Vala Mal Doran
 
   
Made in gb
Stubborn Dark Angels Veteran Sergeant






 Mr_Rose wrote:
AllSeeingSkink wrote:
SamusDrake wrote:
So basically even those only interested in Kreigs and Kommandos will still need the compendium anyway.


No, the Octarius book is what you'd need.

The compendium only comes with rules for vanilla guard and vanilla orks, the Krieg/Veteran Guard and Kommandos come in the Octarius book.

You also need the Tac Ops cards set - looks like the starter really is a starter; no advanced terrain, no equipment, predefined lists, that sort of thing.
So KT: Octarius = Starter + Cards + Octarius book + KZ: Octarius terrain, looks like.


There's still Octarius box sets around in the UK from FLGS, picking up one of them is still the most cost effective method.

Here for example for £105 - https://battlegroundgaming.co.uk/products/games-workshop-warhammer-40-000-kill-team-octarius?_pos=2&_sid=349e504bb&_ss=r

And I'm sure there are other places still with them, for potentially less. Crappy prices from GW when you take into account everything, but, you don't have to go down that route yet. There's still some in the US surely

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/01/22 11:41:47


My hobby instagram account: @the_shroud_of_vigilance
My Shroud of Vigilance Hobby update blog for me detailed updates and lore on the faction:
Blog 
   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut





AllSeeingSkink wrote:


No, the Octarius book is what you'd need.

The compendium only comes with rules for vanilla guard and vanilla orks, the Krieg/Veteran Guard and Kommandos come in the Octarius book.

EDIT: From Stahly's video it looks like the book that does come in the starter box does come with the datacards for the Kommandos and DKoK, it's just missing the kill team construction rules and special rules, so it's missing like 3 or 4 pages of the rules compared to the Octarius book.

It's a bit silly they didn't just include the damned Octarius book instead of the "recruit edition" book, it appears to serve the same purpose but just missing a few pages of rules.



Thanks for clearing that up.

I swear GW is going out of their way to encourage players to use Wahapedia, with this new edition of Kill Team. An expensive cockup from day one.

Casual gaming, mostly solo-coop these days.

 
   
Made in jp
Longtime Dakkanaut





What's going on with the Kill team starter pricess?120AUD is actually slightly cheaper than the UK price at current exchange rates.
Has hell frozen over?
   
Made in es
Inspiring SDF-1 Bridge Officer






 stahly wrote:
For those that consider getting the new Kill Team starter be aware that it doesn't contain the complete rules for neither Kommandos nor Veteran Guardsmen so you need the Kill Team: Octarius book on top. The gaming board is also just a paper mat.

Here is a detailed comparison between both sets: https://taleofpainters.com/2022/01/review-new-kill-team-starter-set-vs-kill-team-octarius/

Still a good deal though.


Thank you for the info.

Wow. That is incredibly ridiculous.
   
Made in us
Shas'ui with Bonding Knife






It was obvious even when KT21 launched that Octarius would be the most cost effective solution to getting everything needed to play the game (gauges, tokens, cards, rules etc).

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2022/01/22 13:17:19


+++ Thought for the Day: Forget The Narrative — Slaanesh demands more plastic! +++ 
   
Made in es
Inspiring SDF-1 Bridge Officer






 tauist wrote:
It was obvious even when KT21 launched that Octarius would be the most cost effective solution to getting everything needed to play the game (gauges, tokens, cards, rules etc).


Granted, but not having a "buy this, go play the full game" option, or having it only just for a small time window, is bloody stupid. And given they have really gone out of their way to make the doodads "mandatory" for the game, even moreso.
   
Made in at
Pyromaniac Hellhound Pilot





I don't know anyone playing KT 2021 and I suspect a lot of that is the initial put-off of spending £60 on rules alone if you weren't playing Krieg/Kommandos.
   
Made in gb
Grim Dark Angels Interrogator-Chaplain





Cardiff

KT seasons will sell if they keep doing niche/interesting/limited-ish sculpts.

In terms of the game picking up? Hah, just not gonna happen if the core box doesn’t even give you the full rules and you have to buy again to get an extra few pages. Ridiculous.

 Stormonu wrote:
For me, the joy is in putting some good-looking models on the board and playing out a fantasy battle - not arguing over the poorly-made rules of some 3rd party who neither has any power over my play nor will be visiting me (and my opponent) to ensure we are "playing by the rules"
 
   
Made in es
Inspiring SDF-1 Bridge Officer






 JohnnyHell wrote:
KT seasons will sell if they keep doing niche/interesting/limited-ish sculpts.

In terms of the game picking up? Hah, just not gonna happen if the core box doesn’t even give you the full rules and you have to buy again to get an extra few pages. Ridiculous.


That's basically it, yes. If this box had the full rules I probably would have picked it up. As it stands, no way no how.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/01/22 14:06:16


 
   
Made in us
Terrifying Doombull




edit: whoops. Wrong thread.

Kill Team still sounds like a massive headache. Its only upside is a source for squads that they wouldn't otherwise do.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2022/01/22 15:09:19


Efficiency is the highest virtue. 
   
Made in fr
Lesser Daemon of Chaos






JWBS wrote:
 JonWebb wrote:


I really never wanted to post this as I can forsee the comeback right away,

Because it seems to be mostly a strawman. "Painters and sculptors on the breadline" is the most egregious part but it's littered with stuff to criticise tbh.


Well I for one don't see what you are talking about. When I was flipping burgers at McD all of the profit the empire made went immediately into the soda machine's maintenance and in my pockets

-"For the Ruinous Powers!" 
   
Made in us
Bush? No, Eldar Ranger





 Mr_Rose wrote:
AllSeeingSkink wrote:
SamusDrake wrote:
So basically even those only interested in Kreigs and Kommandos will still need the compendium anyway.


No, the Octarius book is what you'd need.

The compendium only comes with rules for vanilla guard and vanilla orks, the Krieg/Veteran Guard and Kommandos come in the Octarius book.

You also need the Tac Ops cards set - looks like the starter really is a starter; no advanced terrain, no equipment, predefined lists, that sort of thing.
So KT: Octarius = Starter + Cards + Octarius book + KZ: Octarius terrain, looks like.


Indeed, the Recruit Edition booklet only has datacards, which is fine for the tutorial campaign, but for real Kill Team games you need the army list, equipment, ploys, and stuff, which is in the Kill Team: Octarius book. Would have been easier to swallow if the Kill Team: Octarius book wouldn't be 25 pounds.

Tac Ops cards are optional, as the rules are printed at the end of the Core Rules book, but it might be more convenient to have cards.

As pointed out in my review, it's still a good value set for the models and core rules alone.

 
   
Made in gb
Fanatic with Madcap Mushrooms







 stahly wrote:
 Mr_Rose wrote:
AllSeeingSkink wrote:
SamusDrake wrote:
So basically even those only interested in Kreigs and Kommandos will still need the compendium anyway.


No, the Octarius book is what you'd need.

The compendium only comes with rules for vanilla guard and vanilla orks, the Krieg/Veteran Guard and Kommandos come in the Octarius book.

You also need the Tac Ops cards set - looks like the starter really is a starter; no advanced terrain, no equipment, predefined lists, that sort of thing.
So KT: Octarius = Starter + Cards + Octarius book + KZ: Octarius terrain, looks like.


Indeed, the Recruit Edition booklet only has datacards, which is fine for the tutorial campaign, but for real Kill Team games you need the army list, equipment, ploys, and stuff, which is in the Kill Team: Octarius book. Would have been easier to swallow if the Kill Team: Octarius book wouldn't be 25 pounds.

Tac Ops cards are optional, as the rules are printed at the end of the Core Rules book, but it might be more convenient to have cards.

As pointed out in my review, it's still a good value set for the models and core rules alone.


Or buy the box for the models and terrain alone and gift rules to local charity...

   
Made in au
Owns Whole Set of Skullz Techpriests






Versteckt in den Schatten deines Geistes.

Seems like GW went really far out of their way to create as many barriers to entry for KT right from the word go, from stupid shape-based measuring, to a mystifying array of rule books and supplements.

Industrial Insanity - My Terrain Blog
"GW really needs to understand 'Less is more' when it comes to AoS." - Wha-Mu-077

 
   
Made in us
Stern Iron Priest with Thrall Bodyguard





Dunno what’s mystifying about the mini rule book being mini? Lacking the fluff section just makes it more portable, which is a good thing, no?

"Three months? I'm going to go crazy …and I'm taking you with me!"
— Vala Mal Doran
 
   
Made in us
Araqiel






 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Seems like GW went really far out of their way to create as many barriers to entry for KT right from the word go, from stupid shape-based measuring, to a mystifying array of rule books and supplements.


Everything about GW in the last couple of years indicates that they looked at video games and wanted to emulate that market with its DLC and microtransactions. Why sell one or two main products when you can break them apart and trickle them out over a few years. And then when everyone has finally had enough of that garbage, you can say you've listened and will be streamlining the next edition, only to start the process anew.
   
Made in au
Grizzled Space Wolves Great Wolf





 Mr_Rose wrote:
Dunno what’s mystifying about the mini rule book being mini? Lacking the fluff section just makes it more portable, which is a good thing, no?


The mini rulebook is fine, in fact I'll probably grab a mini rulebook even though I have the full book from the Octarius set already.

The problem is you get Krieg and Kommandos in the starter box but you have to separately buy the Octarius book to get the full rules for them. Then if you want a different Kill Team, you need the Compendium.

It makes it a bit unappealing to get into the game. I think there's a good argument for the Compendium simply being free or very cheap, and instead of the "recruit edition" book that you get in the starter they could have bundled the Octarius book instead. It would have made the game much more appealing to new players.

On top of all that, the rules just feel really poorly written, GW need to hire a good editor because there's sections of the rulebook that take multiple paragraphs to explain something that could be said in a couple of sentences.


This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/01/22 16:45:14


 
   
Made in es
Inspiring SDF-1 Bridge Officer






 Mr_Rose wrote:
Dunno what’s mystifying about the mini rule book being mini? Lacking the fluff section just makes it more portable, which is a good thing, no?


Not really, no. A 96-pages book is not any more portable than a 144-pages book. Being smaller does, but not the page difference. And they could have just made a 144-pages small book, if they so wanted.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
AllSeeingSkink wrote:
 Mr_Rose wrote:
Dunno what’s mystifying about the mini rule book being mini? Lacking the fluff section just makes it more portable, which is a good thing, no?


The mini rulebook is fine, in fact I'll probably grab a mini rulebook even though I have the full book from the Octarius set already.

The problem is you get Krieg and Kommandos in the starter box but you have to separately buy the Octarius book to get the full rules for them. Then if you want a different Kill Team, you need the Compendium.

It makes it a bit unappealing to get into the game. I think there's a good argument for the Compendium simply being free or very cheap, and instead of the "recruit edition" book that you get in the starter they could have bundled the Octarius book instead. It would have made the game much more appealing to new players.



But mostly this.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/01/22 16:44:07


 
   
Made in de
Fully-charged Electropriest






AllSeeingSkink wrote:
Then if you want a different Kill Team, you need the Compendium.


Only if you want one of the Kill Teams there. By now we have three WD Kill Teams (usually more interesting than those in the Compendium), and I guess we'll see more.
   
Made in ca
Regular Dakkanaut





Just use wahapedia folks. Problem solved.
   
Made in at
Discriminating Warrior





Austria

so you need Warhammer+ as well to get the WD rules if you started the game after the WD was released

by all this, this is not the small intro game for newcomers into the 40k universe

this is the game for veteran players who don't like the direction that 40k is going or don't like the gameplay any more


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Gregor Samsa wrote:
Just use wahapedia folks. Problem solved.

of course, but if you go that way, why even play a GW game in the first place?

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/01/22 18:21:11


Harry, bring this ring to Narnia or the Sith will take the Enterprise

M41 - Alternative Rules for Battles in the 41st Millennium (40k LRB Project) 
   
Made in us
Stubborn Prosecutor





California

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Seems like GW went really far out of their way to create as many barriers to entry for KT right from the word go, from stupid shape-based measuring, to a mystifying array of rule books and supplements.


This is kind of why i've avoided GW games alltogether recently, blood bowl aside. I just really dislike how GW handles their rulesets. Especially compared to bolt action which has been a stable 2nd edition for years and years.

 
   
Made in gb
Leader of the Sept







I do t see it as a barrier to entry, it’s a barrier to completionism. To start the game you can buy the rule book amd whatever supplement you want and you can play the game.

Please excuse any spelling errors. I use a tablet frequently and software keyboards are a pain!

Terranwing - w3;d1;l1
51st Dunedinw2;d0;l0
Cadre Coronal Afterglow w1;d0;l0 
   
Made in gb
Guard Heavy Weapon Crewman




It's a matter of target audience, the starter set for the price is a great way to get people new to Games Workshop into Kill Team. It is functionally the same as the mid-level 40K starter, of no use to existing players other then a cheap way to get models but a cheap way in for those who are at the very beginning. The rules are self contained and have a basic handholding set of missions. Things like fluff are excised from the rule book as the target audience won't be involved in that yet.

Regarding the missing rules for the Orks and Guard this is also consistent with other starters and has one aim, to drive further sales. Which as a business is the whole point of the starter from GWs point of view. Again this in analogous to the 40k starter if you go on to want to play further with your models you have to buy a codes for the chosen army. For an existing player who is going to dive straight in with the game these slimmed do army lists will seem superfluous but that is precisely why they work for the intended audience of the set.

GW made a mistake making this set so close in content to Octarius to which it begs comparison and will always loose to. Ocatarius is effectively a boxed game, you need never buy another book or model and you can still play full fat Kill Team. It was fantastic value and exactly what some one who is already in GWs game space would want to get into the game. I am somewhat surprised they didn't continue Octarius as an 'advanced' starter set much in the same way they have different levels for 40K.

Where I think they have gone wrong with KT is trying to make it a 'two book' game but then making the second book so bloated. I like the idea you pick up the core rules and a book for your team. But whereas a codex in 40K works due to the size of the game and amount of fluff this will never be true for KT. GW needed to hit a price point for the second book so it has rules and fluss for two teams, missions a mini campaign. This is frustrating if you just want the Ork rules for example. It would be much better if the books were cheap and thin and just contained the content pertaining to one team. The you would only be spending say £5 or so on top of the box to upgrade to your teams full rules. Instead you get lumbered paying £25 for content you may not want.
   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut





 Albertorius wrote:
 Mr_Rose wrote:
Dunno what’s mystifying about the mini rule book being mini? Lacking the fluff section just makes it more portable, which is a good thing, no?


Not really, no. A 96-pages book is not any more portable than a 144-pages book. Being smaller does, but not the page difference. And they could have just made a 144-pages small book, if they so wanted.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
AllSeeingSkink wrote:
 Mr_Rose wrote:
Dunno what’s mystifying about the mini rule book being mini? Lacking the fluff section just makes it more portable, which is a good thing, no?


The mini rulebook is fine, in fact I'll probably grab a mini rulebook even though I have the full book from the Octarius set already.

The problem is you get Krieg and Kommandos in the starter box but you have to separately buy the Octarius book to get the full rules for them. Then if you want a different Kill Team, you need the Compendium.

It makes it a bit unappealing to get into the game. I think there's a good argument for the Compendium simply being free or very cheap, and instead of the "recruit edition" book that you get in the starter they could have bundled the Octarius book instead. It would have made the game much more appealing to new players.



But mostly this.


I don’t know what you guys are talking about really.
You get two books in the box. Core Rules, and the Recruit thing, which says it has fluff and rules for these two kill teams. So isn’t that everything you need?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Isn’t this what you’d need to make one of these two Kill Teams?:

“Discover the background behind the kill teams included in the box, including rules for fielding them in games of Kill Team”

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/01/23 00:14:04


 
   
Made in au
Grizzled Space Wolves Great Wolf





Danny76 wrote:
 Albertorius wrote:
 Mr_Rose wrote:
Dunno what’s mystifying about the mini rule book being mini? Lacking the fluff section just makes it more portable, which is a good thing, no?


Not really, no. A 96-pages book is not any more portable than a 144-pages book. Being smaller does, but not the page difference. And they could have just made a 144-pages small book, if they so wanted.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
AllSeeingSkink wrote:
 Mr_Rose wrote:
Dunno what’s mystifying about the mini rule book being mini? Lacking the fluff section just makes it more portable, which is a good thing, no?


The mini rulebook is fine, in fact I'll probably grab a mini rulebook even though I have the full book from the Octarius set already.

The problem is you get Krieg and Kommandos in the starter box but you have to separately buy the Octarius book to get the full rules for them. Then if you want a different Kill Team, you need the Compendium.

It makes it a bit unappealing to get into the game. I think there's a good argument for the Compendium simply being free or very cheap, and instead of the "recruit edition" book that you get in the starter they could have bundled the Octarius book instead. It would have made the game much more appealing to new players.



But mostly this.


I don’t know what you guys are talking about really.
You get two books in the box. Core Rules, and the Recruit thing, which says it has fluff and rules for these two kill teams. So isn’t that everything you need?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Isn’t this what you’d need to make one of these two Kill Teams?:

“Discover the background behind the kill teams included in the box, including rules for fielding them in games of Kill Team”


They're cut down rules, it's missing a few additional pages you get in the Octarius book needed to construct the army list, equipment details and special rules. Tale of Painters gave a review which explains the differences...

https://taleofpainters.com/2022/01/review-new-kill-team-starter-set-vs-kill-team-octarius/

What you get in the starter:
Recruit Edition booklet with ... datacards for Veteran Guardsmen and Ork Kommandos (no army list or additional tac ops/spec ops rules like ploys, equipment or assets)


What you get in Octarius:
Octarius Campaign book with complete rules for Veteran Guardsmen and Ork Kommandos...



Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Flinty wrote:
I do t see it as a barrier to entry, it’s a barrier to completionism. To start the game you can buy the rule book amd whatever supplement you want and you can play the game.


I disagree, if you are trying to get someone new into the game (and not being dishonest about what you'll have to buy down the line) then saying you have to buy a $40USD on top of the starter to get the full rules for the models you already have, it's a bit of a turn off. Then $50 if you want to start another Kill Team that wasn't in the boxed set. Then you're probably going to want (though admittedly don't need) the cards, so another $18.

If you don't see that as a barrier to entry, okay you're free to hold that opinion, but I think it is a bigger barrier than need exist. A game like Kill Team should be an easy and cheap entry into 40k, I think the way GW have parted up things makes it less appealing to start the game.

In a world awash with board games and table top games, a lot of people don't just look at the price of the starter set, they look at how much they're likely going to spend to meaningfully get into the game. Things like "this contains EVERYTHING you need to play the included models" versus "this only contains the cut down version of what you need to play the included models" is a barrier. Likewise not having appealing options for people who want to start but don't want DKoK/Kommandos isn't great for getting new people into the game.



This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2022/01/23 01:20:18


 
   
Made in gb
Stubborn Dark Angels Veteran Sergeant






For what is meant to be a predominately miniature making company, they sure do seem hell bent on making as many ways to charge for rules as possible. The latest chapter approved is an absolute disgrace of a money grab, even by GW's standards and so is all of this...

IT COULD EASILY ALL BE IN ONE BLOODY BOOK!

Not to mention the inevitably cash grab expansion to allow mixed kill teams and commander units again.

I'm not one of the GW pessimists, but this really is actually just quite a nasty and mean cash grabbing move by them.

My hobby instagram account: @the_shroud_of_vigilance
My Shroud of Vigilance Hobby update blog for me detailed updates and lore on the faction:
Blog 
   
 
Forum Index » News & Rumors
Go to: