Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

While the rules are not designed for competitive play, I think a fun day could be had in running an Apocalypse tourney.  The key would be to structure it so that all elements of the game are a factor, with battle points being roughly equal to paint, theme, and sports.  Here’s my concept:

 

Apocolyptic Tournament (AT)

 

<!--[if !supportLists]-->1)      <!--[endif]-->Every player must bring a 3000pt roster.  This roster must follow the apocalypse rules, but otherwise need not follow a FOC, may come from multiple codices, all 0-1 and similar restrictions are ignored, and units that require other units may be always be taken.  Only one of each special Character may be taken.

<!--[if !supportLists]-->2)      <!--[endif]-->Every Player must have a prepared, not necessarily written, background for their army.  This should be no more than a few sentences, and will be used as part of the scoring for theme.

<!--[if !supportLists]-->3)      <!--[endif]-->The bulk of every army must be painted.  Unpainted units and models are allowed at the Judges discretion, but a few unpainted or partially painted models will not disqualify a player from participating.

<!--[if !supportLists]-->4)      <!--[endif]-->Between rounds, players must vote on Players Choice.  Each player lists three armies, ranked 1^st, 2^nd, and 3^rd.  Players choice awards are given for most 1^st place votes, using 2^nd and 3^rd place votes as tie breakers.  Additional awards may be given out at the Judges discretion.

<!--[if !supportLists]-->5)      <!--[endif]-->The AT will be two rounds, with a break for judging between.  Each round will last 3.5 hours in total.  The most a player may bid for deployment is 15 minutes.  If a game turn ends with less than 20 minutes remaining, a further turn may only be taken if both players agree. 

<!--[if !supportLists]-->6)      <!--[endif]-->When a round ends, the judge will call time.  Once this is called, any games being played immediately end, and objectives are counted, even if in mid turn.  Any player that rolls a die or moves a model after the call of time will lose 5 tournament points. 

<!--[if !supportLists]-->7)      <!--[endif]-->After the call of time, players have 5 minutes to turn in their Score Sheets.  Any player turning in a Score Sheets after that five minutes will lose 5 Tournament Points.

<!--[if !supportLists]-->8)      <!--[endif]-->For every round, each player must fill out a Score Sheet.  The player must fill out how many objectives he and his opponent each claimed, and then grade his opponent on Sports, Paint, and Theme <strong style="">using the guidelines below[/b]!

<!--[if !supportLists]-->9)      <!--[endif]-->Each player earns Tournament Points for <st1:city w:st="on"><st1:place w:st="on">Battle</st1:place></st1:city>, Paint, Theme, and Sports, plus the possibility of Bonuses.  There are 100 tournament points available from <st1:city w:st="on"><st1:place w:st="on">Battle</st1:place></st1:city>, Paint, Theme, and Sports, with bonuses for Players Choice awards and Distinctions.  The breakdown is as follows: 30pts for battle, 20 for sports, 25 for paint, and 25 for theme.

<!--[if !supportLists]-->10)  <!--[endif]--><st1:city w:st="on"><st1:place w:st="on">Battle</st1:place></st1:city> points: Each game is worth up to 15 battle points.  A player simply scores 3 battle points for every objective claimed at the end of the battle.  If a player claims all six, he does not score extra Battle Points but may qualify for a Bonus.

<!--[if !supportLists]-->11)  <!--[endif]-->Sports points: After every game, each player is scored by his opponent for sportsmanship using the following chart:

+2: My opponent knew the rules of 40k, Apocalypse and his codices well and was fair and reasonable when we had a rules dispute.  He did not call judges excessively, nor did he complain when I called a judge.

+2: My opponent was accurate and consistent in measuring (no bonus inch) as well as in re-rolling cocked dice and judging line of sight.

+2: He did not stall excessively when playing and he made it clear at all times what he was rolling for and why.

+2: He was a decent opponent and I would not mind playing him again.

+2: he was a great opponent and I would look forward to playing him again

Note that a player can score all of them, and if they are a great opponenet they are also a decent opponent.

 

<!--[if !supportLists]-->12)  <!--[endif]-->Paint points.  After each game, each player is scored by his opponent for painting using the following chart:

+2: Every model has three colors and a painted base

+2: Every model is fully painted with a flocked base

+2: Every model is highlighted with layers, drybrushing, a wash, etc.

+2: Every model is well detailed: eyes, weapons, unit badges, talons, teeth etc. are all painted highlighted

+2: The army is extensively converted and/or painted to a very high standard. 

 

 

In addition, every army is judged by the Judge on a scale of 0-5.  The Judge is free to award those points as he sees fit, but these points are meant to truly separate the best painted armies from each other.  The recommended breakdown is as follows:

0: armies that are minimum three colors

1: Armies that are tabletop standard

2: mostly tabletop standard, but with some showpiece models, or two clearly unrelated but top notch armies combined for the AT.

3: An army composed mostly of high level painting, most likely an 1850 army expanded. 

4: An army entirely at a high level of painting, similar to gamer armies shown in WD or Black Gobbo

5: A GT winning level army

 

<!--[if !supportLists]-->13)  <!--[endif]-->Theme Points: After each game, each player is scored by his opponent for theme.  To do so, ask your opponent what the theme or concept for his army was.  When judging your opponent, score him for how well he accomplishes the theme he intended, not necessarly how well you like the idea for his theme.  To score, use the following chart:

+2: Half or more of his units support or fit neatly with his stated theme.

+2 Nearly all of his units support of fit neatly with his stated theme.

+2 Ally choices were logical and fit within the stated theme.

+2 He took units or upgrades that support his theme at the expense of in game utility

+2 His intended theme was obvious simply by looking at his army.

 

In addition, every army is judged for theme on a scale of 0-5 by the Judge.  The Judge is free to use his discretion in awarding those points.  The Judge is free to judge not only the effectiveness of the theme, but also the nature of the theme.  For example, an army that is nothing but 10 squads of terminators with two assault cannons each clearly has a consistent theme, but it’s not a particularly interesting or fun one.  A suggested breakdown follows:

0: there is little to no discernable theme

1: The theme is noticeable, but chosen more for power than for storytelling.

2: The Theme is well executed but generic.  The army looks and feels real.

3: The Theme is both clear and interesting, and would be fun to play against.  Not only does the army feel real, but it tells a story.

4: the theme is executed to the point where tabletop effectiveness is compromised. 

5: Every aspect of the army, from composition to paint to tactics, is governed by the story that the army tells.

 

 

 

<!--[if !supportLists]-->14)  <!--[endif]--> In addition to the 100 Tournament Points freely available, there are bonus points available.  The number of bonus points varies based on the size of the event, with more added as the number of participants goes up.  Some bonuses also increase in value as the number of participants goes up.

 

Basic Bonuses:

Players choice: +5pts, plus an additional +5

Best Painted: +5 pts

Best Theme: +5 pts

Best General: +5 pts (based on total objectives, if a tie, use sports, theme, and paint, in that order, to break a tie)

 

<!--[if !supportLists]-->15)  <!--[endif]-->the prizes and awards given are as follows:

Best Overall: Player with most tournament Points, including bonuses.  Use Sports, Theme, Paint as tie breakers in that order.

Best Paint: Player with highest paint score.  If a tie, judges discretion applies.

Best Theme: Player with highest theme score.  If a tie, judge’s discretion applies

Toughest Day: Player with highest sports, with lowest battle points as the               tie breaker

 

 

Looks interesting but there seem to be a few issues. The first is that you have a lot of things that need to be scored and you are only giving your players 5 minutes to figure out all the end of game stuff (who controls which objectives and the like) and then figure out more than one sliding scale scoring system for sportsmanship and the like. You're either going to end up with lots of players getting screwed out of 5 points when they take the time to properly consider their scoring or you are going to get a lot of hastely scribbled out score cards. You probably want to expand the time frame to 10 or maybe even 15 min. And don't forget to shout out a "time is almost up" warning when they only have a couple of min left.

The other issue that seems to be inherent is the "theme" scoring. While I love the idea of giving people additional points for theme armies it seems that some of the way you have it set up won't work quite the way you would like. For example, somone playing a 1st and 10th Company Dark Angels army (terminators and scouts) would probably score rather high on the theme score (its a clear theme, its far from being a min/max list, its rather obvious from just looking at the army what it is). On the other hand, a "home brew" eldar craftworld that may follow some rather interesting and well though out pattern with differing paint schemes to various units that might not be obvious to others would end up scoring fairly low. If nothing else, the theme would not be "obvious simply by looking at his army" regardless of how much work and how well done it was. Just something to think about.

What's up with the player's choice award? "Players choice: +5pts, plus an additional +5 " Is it worth 5 points or is it worth 10?

Good point. This is obviously a rough draft, and I love the notes.

Players choice is basically 5pts per 10 people at the event. Somehow the line "+5pts for ever 10 players past the first 10" got lost. So, in a 20 player AT, players choice is 10, runner up is 5. In a 30, it's 15 and 10. This could get adjusted to every 8, or 6, or whatever players want.

Yeah, five minutes might not be enough time, that'll need to be tested. That's an easy fix.

For theme, it's a hard needle to thread. It's a huge part of the hobby, and I think it should be a big part of the scoring for this sort of event. How about modifying the final criterion to "the theme would be readily obvious to any person well versed in the background for his race(s)."

That means while the average player might not recognize DE warriors, Rangers, Warwalkers, Vypers, Reavers, and Rough Riders as any sort of theme, a die hard Eldar player would be delighted somebody is building an exodite list.

I mean, if a player has a homebrewed craftworld that is essentially a pile of units he thinks is neat, that's a cool army, but it's not the tightest theme. If instead he took all Aspect Warriors, Autarchs, and Fire Prisms based on a highly martial Craftworld that doesn't allow seers and guardians to fight much, that'd be a cool theme.

What might be helpful is to think of armies that people think are good themed lists that will get hurt by this scale.

I think the theme points are reasonable. If the theme is subtle enough that it only involves color patterns or marking for distinction than it is not an obvious theme.

For instance, in my eldar army I use blue to designate basic and shooty units, with red trim or helmets. Assaulty and eliter units get more red coloring with blue helmets. The theme is carried out throughout the list, however few people notice the distintion because while characteristic it is a subtle paint scheme that requires a close look to see that its not jsut how I randomly painted my figures.

However, my chaos army is heavily converted with tentacles everywhere and anked, or partially clothed females wrapped in tentacles everywhere, mounted on vehicles, painted on the doors and sides, . It is easily recognized by everyone that sees it that the overriding theme is an uber possessed slaaneshi hentai army. It is actually an emperors children army called the Tentacle tide and no one can mistake the theme.

I would expect the chaos army to get more points for theme, while i would expect my eldar to pick up more points in the battles as it is highly effective combination of units where the chaos army loses some effectiveness to field thematic models that fit the theme even though more killy combos are available.

Many themes go into armies .. kill marking patterns and grey vest for veterans while regular squads get green ones, etc. However, while there is a pattern to those kind of things, they really don't constitute a theme.

Good points for either side of the subject though, and to the OP I think its a great setup with the few minor adjustments here. Maybe even simplify the scoring down so there arent 20 catagories to consider.

Meph