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My one problem with harlequins is the daemon match up. As a competitive player, it's not unreasonable to face at least one daemon army in a tournament, especially at higher tables. Most of their units are a decent toughness, usually with multiple wounds. Everything having an invulnerable save also takes away from the kisses and (to a lesser extent) caresses, typically what we need in a TAC setting to deal with other armies. Stopping screamers is easy with a wraithknight. But we miss out on the better transports that DE give us then, not to mention the anti-air.

We can ally in all we want, but at the end of the day, it feels to me that Harlequins need more than what they have now.

We want transports that can deep strike in order to fix the hammer & anvil mission. Raiders, go!
We want strong, ranged, durable anti-tank. Wraithknights, go!
And now we're at 3 sources, still wanting anti-air.


That all being said, you can definitely dance around and out play an opponent. Harlequins can compete with all 7th edition codices, hands down.

A Masque detachment or the 'revenge' formation are both going to be 1850 or so with options and gear. No real room for allies! You can do the detachment for less but its all worthless without upgrades.

I am most definitely going to run Harlies solo in a formation (for the reroll 1's) to see how it goes.

That said, I think the best bet will be 2-3 of the smaller formations combined and then Eldar or Dark Eldar to taste. Both offer lots to the harlies in way of table presence, AA, AT and so on.

 Massaen wrote:
A Masque detachment or the 'revenge' formation are both going to be 1850 or so with options and gear. No real room for allies! You can do the detachment for less but its all worthless without upgrades.

I am most definitely going to run Harlies solo in a formation (for the reroll 1's) to see how it goes.

That said, I think the best bet will be 2-3 of the smaller formations combined and then Eldar or Dark Eldar to taste. Both offer lots to the harlies in way of table presence, AA, AT and so on.

You're overstating the investment in a detachment. 3 troupes w/ kisses and Starweavers + a Voidweaver is ~640. Add to taste elites slots and it's ~ 800 or so points. Taking 2 Starwevers in the FA slot saves a lot of points there, and makes the points investment not more significant than any other ally source. The issue is more that Harlies have two very specific weaknesses that need to be addressed, are commonly present in most competitive lists, and whomever you pick as an ally will be using all their points addressing these two weaknesses.

That's exactly why DE make such a good choice, their AA/AT options are cheap enough you can actually get some other goodies as well.

I had mentioned earlier about writing an article about harlequins for torrent. Here it is:
http://www.torrentoffire.com/6690/return-of-the-laughing-god


Note that I've also tried the Revenge with Dark Eldar and a different version of Eldar. I'm still torn on what's the best way to run them and certainly learning more and more tricks with the army. It's quite fun!

I don't allready have the manual, but I have 1 question: In the starweaver box, the crew is able to be equipped with the Zephyr blade, but in WD dataslade there isn't anything about it.
If I can not equip the crew with that weapon, what is the meaning of including that weapon on the sprue?

There really isn't one outside of cosmetics; in fact, the models in the back of the Starweaver are completely decorative. Most people (myself included, and even pics from the codex back it up) seem to be planning to leave the Starweavers empty and use those "extra" models as more Troupe Players.

Drazosh wrote:
There really isn't one outside of cosmetics; in fact, the models in the back of the Starweaver are completely decorative. Most people (myself included, and even pics from the codex back it up) seem to be planning to leave the Starweavers empty and use those "extra" models as more Troupe Players.

Nailed it. If you buy 3 starweavers you are essentially getting a bonus troupes box worth of quins.

I think I'm going to at least keep the gunner on the Starweaver, as I think it would look kind of silly empty, but to each his own. The other Harlies on the Starweaver sprue are fair game for kitbashing, of course!

Edit: I read your ToF article, Rypher. Very nice! Can you tell us a little more about the games you've played so far? What did you play against, points level, what worked what didn't.

 Asmodas wrote:
I think I'm going to at least keep the gunner on the Starweaver, as I think it would look kind of silly empty, but to each his own. The other Harlies on the Starweaver sprue are fair game for kitbashing, of course!

No one's going to send in the clown police either way, I suspect!

I suppose, if you really wanted to, you could use the zephyrglaive-wielder in the Starweaver kit to sub out the passenger on a Skyweaver if you decide to swap between bolas and glaives between games. I personally have an aversion to one-use weapons (even really good ones), but it's not a bad option.

I'll talk a little more about them and the possible list I'm running for the RTT this weekend later tonight.

Kicking an idea around, and the thread is falling off the page so I'll post.

Mini Seer Council with a Harlie Detachment. 2 Farseers + ~5 warlocks, standard detchment of 3 x 5 troupes w/starweavers, Voidweaver, 2-3 Shadowseers.

Idea here is that the council is fast, and dangerous, resilient but small enough to be an enticing target. Traditionally (back when Baron was more than a line in text), Seer Council made it's name by being tough and impossible to nail down in combat and multi-charging. It's damage output was ok at best, and then only because you could all but guarantee charging every other phase. W/out HnR easily accessible, Seer council is dying rather quickly: it simply doesn't do enough dmg to keep from being tarpitted.

Enter quins. In this scenario you actually don't care if the Seer Council does any damage, you just need to tie up multiple units for a few turns while the heavy lifters get in place. Turbo boost the council up front and center to take pressure off your glass cannons, 2+/2++ re-rollable does what it does to keep you pretty well whole through the ensuing shooting phase. Turn 2 Seer council positions for a multi-charge to lock as much in combat as it can reach, absorbing overwatch for the quins. This will even allow the quins to kill/run down/HnR after combat and minimize the possible retaliation fire as well as preventing casualties from a second round of combat.

Anywho, just an idea that came to me that I think could have some legs. Looked over at all my unused Jet bikes and thought about the council just isn't viable w/out HnR. But with all the CC talent Harlies bring losing HnR isn't nearly that big a detriment, and the durability they provide is arguably the best in the game. So perhaps there's a bit of synergy there. Certainly wouldn't be the ez mode council of old, but it could have some pretty strong legs.

The problem with that is that they are incredibly slow. So it's probably easily to move out range of them.

I actually think that some of the Phoenix Lord from ELdar would be a good add to the Harlequin army, not sure which ones yet, but there are a couple that are pretty amazing.

Made even more so with the fact that if they join a Harlequin Squad they'll get hit and run plus the fleet charge ability.

Hollismason wrote:
The problem with that is that they are incredibly slow. So it's probably easily to move out range of them.

I actually think that some of the Phoenix Lord from ELdar would be a good add to the Harlequin army, not sure which ones yet, but there are a couple that are pretty amazing.

Made even more so with the fact that if they join a Harlequin Squad they'll get hit and run plus the fleet charge ability.

Slow? I'm not sure I know which you're talking about here. Harlequins are pretty fast as is, with starweavers and move/run/charge . Seer Council is/would be mounted on jetbikes, so that's obviously not an issue there. There was not really any consideration of having the council on foot, incase that was what you were thinking.

For PL's: Karandras, Fuegan, or Maugan Ra. The usual suspects. I think Karandras wins out here, being 6 S8 at initiative AP2 swings. He can pretty easily just ride along in a Starweaver and turn one squad into a nasty murder machine.

Just remember karandras can't join any of the harlie units before the game starts!

 Rypher wrote:
Last week (before we knew the rules for the SS, DJ, and formations), I used a harlequin primary with an eldar CAD. I was seriously impressed with the Solitaire, both in resiliency and destruction. He only took 1 wound the entire game and was able to lock up a seer council for three turns, then hit & run away to contest the relic.

I second the idea that the company of heroes formation (1 of each elite) is a nice benefit to getting the models on the table, especially if you want a more traditional army.

I'm testing out the main formation with everything, seeing as how I already have 90% of the models and good proxies/conversions for the rest. The biggest boon of it is re-rolling 1's, especially when combined with the starmist raiment on the warlord or the solitaire in general. Pressing crescendo is also amazing for them, considering the aforementioned raiment.

I agree with being super impressed by the Solitaire. Holy cow! I used him in a game yesterday, (I threw the base 145 pt solitaire in with my Eldar force just to see how the model was, my opponents were OK with it, I thought I could do it normally but I suppose it made my army unbound, either way it was a casual game). Long story short, my lone solitaire went all sneaky like along the side of the board, and at turn three I blitzed him from a ruin he was hiding in and dove into assault against a standard Wraithknight. First round of combat the solitaire got the knight down to 1 wound. (The knight was already at 5.) The knight hit back, only dealing one wound (thank you eternal warrior and 3++ ). He used his spirit seer to get within 6" of the knight and grant it one wound thanks to some Iyanden wargear. Then that following turn my little solitaire flipped his way up the side of the knight to finish the beast with a fatal pair of attacks which I would like to think hit the neck and decapitated him. Or something, point is the little sucker killed it.

Can a Solitaire take the gun from the Enigmas fo the Black Library that shoots a number of times equal to his attacks or not, I can't tell at all.

I see that he can take Enigmas but the list is confusing me.

 Massaen wrote:
Just remember karandras can't join any of the harlie units before the game starts!

Huh? Why? What is the difference between him and the WWP carrying Archon that everyone suggested?

The new Infiltrate change makes it impossible .

Hollismason wrote:
The new Infiltrate change makes it impossible .

True, but infiltrate isn't necessary. Starweaver can be just about anywhere turn 1 (you wouldn't be able to charge anyway), so infiltrating isn't all that big a deal. Hide em behind BoLS, then pop out and charge. To that end, the PLs are all pretty decent. If you decide you really need a beat stick to go with your Harlies they'll all do ok. Jain Zar would actually make them very hard to hit (-5 WS), increasing the units durability significantly as most units would need a 5+ just to hit them in combat. Fuegan gets split shot, which opens up a lot of options. Mugan Ra would go better in a DJ squad, tanking for them, but not a bad choice. Asurmen is good, but he has to be taken as WL and his WL traits (D3) have to come from the eldar book, and none of those are all that great. S5 AP2 instant death is nothing to sneeze at though, and he's also the only one that gets an invuln, so not a bad choice.

I am thinking of using DE as allies for my Harlequins but I will be modeling them as Exodites.

Exodites are the only faction of Eldar that are missing I think, unless Forgeworld has made some. Be pretty cool to have all the factions represented.

Hollismason wrote:
Can a Solitaire take the gun from the Enigmas fo the Black Library that shoots a number of times equal to his attacks or not, I can't tell at all.

I see that he can take Enigmas but the list is confusing me.

Nope - he can only get the named harlequins kiss - which is terrible for a solitaire

Used a unit of 4 Harlies + Troupe Master + Shadowseer in a Starweaver today, simply because i haven't used my Harlie models in ages and wanted to give them a go, using a proxied venom.

They seemed...unchanged. They still die when they get hit, as 3 Harlies exploded when the transport was hit by a biovore, D6 hits on the unit inside is rough. But the remaining 3 kicked ass and took names, clearing out 10 Termigants, 2 Hive Guard and took the last 3 wounds off a tervigon.

I don't feel that the special weapons stood out to much compared to plain old rending, but maybe i just got unlucky. The things that i did see as a massive improvement was Flip Belts ignoring terrain while charging letting me keep my colossal initiative and also the Shadowseer was a BOSS. 5 Fleshbane attacks worked wonders against the High T Hive Guard and Tervigon and Veil of Tears is better then before.

I think i'll have to give them another go, and include a Solitare, before i will give them fair judgement.

I'm going to play around with a different build than I have seen so far. I think the Wraith Fighter sounds like a perfect compliment to the leadership shenanigans of the Harlequins. It is ML 1 and comes stock with Terrify, but the best part is the mindshock pod requires a re-roll of successful morale tests. With that in mind, I am thinking of blending in an Eldar Wraith list:

Harlies:
2 Death Jesters
3 Shadowseers (one is ML 2)
3 Starweavers
3 Troupes
1 Void Weaver

Eldar:
2 Spirit seers
8 Wraithblades
1 Wraithfighter
1 Wraithknight

The ML2 Shadow seer goes with the spirit seers in the Wraith blade unit, the other two go with the troupes. In my experience, Wraithblades can be played aggressively (T6, 4++, Fearless). They are slow, but getting "quicken" on them helps. The biggest thing is you need to know where you want to go, because you walking them and you don't want to be out of position. But they are great at sticking in combat and can free the harlies to crash in and finish up the combat. Plus, the blades and the knight are fire magnets, and will keep the heat off the Harlies while they get into position.

Actually, does the Shadowseer confer hit and run if with the unit? Even better!

I know it has zero anti-air and only one troop, but eh, what are you going to do?

Wraithfighters are honestly hot garbage, I don't care what anyone says if they were less points then yeah maybe. Their 180 points which is ridiculous.

Hollismason wrote:
Wraithfighters are honestly hot garbage, I don't care what anyone says if they were less points then yeah maybe. Their 180 points which is ridiculous.

Oh, I know, and they are 185 points, not 180 But this is the one instance in which I can see they are useful.

Still terrible and what happens if you face Nids or a army that has a lot of fearless, it does nothing.

I will say Death Jesters hilariously are going to be the bane of Riptides. Take that -2 test on LD7 Mr. I don't got fearless

So I didn't get a chance to write up some ideas, but I've gotten in a few games with the quins.

First off, I think the harlequins can compete with if not utterly demolish any 7th edition codex. They're also fairly decent against Tau and Eldar, but struggle with daemons due to their invulnerable saves and mitigating most leadership based tests.

As an army, I like including dark eldar alongside them. Getting raiders for them is a Godsend, especially for the hammer & anvil matchups where you want to put pressure deeper on the board. Portal archon (or succubus if you have the points for a glaive) with armour of misery is a nice combo, as most of us have pointed out. I would actually advocate for some razorwings or void ravens for anti-air and anti-tank, with dissies for extra horde killing on the raiders. The quins do enough attacks to whittle down hordes and deal with MCs thanks to kisses.

Today however, I ran Eldar CAD with the Heroes' Path formation. Losing out on Rising Crescendo was actually fine with the trade offs of nabbing stealth & shrouded and infiltrate. A few serpents, some wraithknights, and jetbikes shored up the weaknesses of harlequins (anti-air & anti-tank, respectively) while still letting me be super tricky with them.
I typically deployed the solitaire to put pressure on middle of the table for turn 2 charges and deterred anyone wanting to infiltrate or deepstrike into my backfield. The death jester was happy to infiltrate, though he did outflank for one game. The shadowseer outflanked all three games, taking backfield objectives while sitting on a 2+ cover and veil of tears.

The solitaire lived through games 2 and 3, but died to 5 marines game 1. 2 wounds from overwatch and 1 wound from a single marine that hit and I happened to roll 2,1,1 for saves, haha. Still, he was incredibly impressive as always.

Supporting the quins was easy enough. The DJ made some immortals run off my own table edge late game when they wanted to capture one of my back objectives, instant killed nurglings, and was able to camp on objectives as needed. Having three units that were just annoying enough was all I needed, as well as adding a very nice combat punch and trickery.

I wound up going 3-0 and taking 2nd, losing out first place by 3 battle points, haha. Good ole competitive gaming at its finest.

Edit - I forgot to add that supporting the charges was great. I had some jetbikes actually charge in before a solitaire to eat the overwatch. Same thing with a wraithknight and solitaire later. The solitaire mulched many squads today, certainly earning his place in my list.

Played a game, harlequins slaughter anything they get into combat with with ease, solitaire with hit and run is amazing, jet bikes are a rip off and the shadowseer wasnt much help but that was just due to the circumstance. Shadowseers are a must take and the solitaire with rerollable 3+ if he runs is great.

Caress is all you need. Just lots of caress.

Dont bother with pistols, they make your expensive unit do nothing more.

Solitaire at one of those tomb necron centipedes, a squad of scarabs, 20 warriors and didnt take a wound. It was amazing. Must take.

Didnt use death jester, any harlequin vehicles or much of anything, just had 12 harlequins, 4 bikes, shadowseer and solitaire.

Does anyone have any tips for Starweavers? Some people are saying the only way to effectively take troupes is large groups on foot to be more effective in melee. I really like the idea of six in a transport with covering fire but another person said the shuriken fire was best for popping transports. Any thoughts?

I've always thought a small unit in a Starweaver is compensated for by the shuriken cannons softening up the target the turn before. Isn't transport popping what all the haywire is for or is there another tactic here?