Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Zalek wrote:

Cawl is an absolute tank, He can tank full rounds of fire from whole army.

There are few good choices for Cawl

1) Protect Destroyers. He will let those destroyers shoot all day long. -1 Toughness is not too big of a deal

2) Cohort Cybernetica. This unit will not die. Also Robots with Memento-Mortispex is great. And he will be tanking at T7

3) Keep him by himself. I had a few games where there was few big objectives, so he can just camp them and draw a lot of fire. Your opponent won't be able to move him from an objective.

I also like bringing Knight or onagers to walk next to Cawl for buffs.

However, my play group start to consider Cawl to be unfun, so I won't be able to bring him as much as I like in the future :(


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Aaranis wrote:
Holy Molly I have a newfound respect for my 5 Infiltrators now. I faced an Iron Hands list with a triple Vindicator squadron in it, and as I wondered where in Hell I could go with my Infiltrators so they could be useful (there was only like 8-9 non-vehicle models on the field on his side) I found myself close to the Vindicators. So I charged them, rolled... and destroyed two of them. With 5 Infiltrators. With Taser Goads.

As a makeshift anti-armour they look nice indeed with these S6 hits. On the charge they have 21 attacks that hit on 3+, with 6's adding two more hits each. As it's resolved against rear armour most of the time it will be 10 and you only have to roll a few 4+ to destroy one.

The more I play with the same list, the more I get good with what I have. Even managed a victory against a CC Eldar list the other day !

Do you infiltrate or outflank your Infiltrators mostly? I never had success with them, although it might be because my main opponent is Tau so too many instant kill for them to do anything (Same thing happens with dragoons)

Careful with Cawl at T5 in the Destroyers unit, he's not Eternal Warrior and thus may be victim of Instant Death if a S10 AP1 Blast comes right in his face...

I always infiltrate them so as to make something menacing for the enemy to consider, and they can be closer to objectives or just out of sight more easily. I don't trust Outflank, you still can't charge at the turn you arrive and worse is that it's on Turn 2, and they may as well never arrive and not at the right side. Another option may be to deploy them normally with Scout and if you don't get the first turn, you may have something to charge at yours. Never played against a Tau player yet, but I can wait for as long as necessary, I'm in no rush

My use for Cawl: drop him in a unit of Vanguards for Scout and -T in CC, then drop an inquisitor with rad grenades in there with them. His 2d6 S4 attacks at I10 are pretty amazing when the enemy has -2T. I vaporized a fully powered screamerstar with that and Litany of the Electromaner (War Con for canticles on everyone).

 Aaranis wrote:

Zalek wrote:

Cawl is an absolute tank, He can tank full rounds of fire from whole army.

There are few good choices for Cawl

1) Protect Destroyers. He will let those destroyers shoot all day long. -1 Toughness is not too big of a deal

2) Cohort Cybernetica. This unit will not die. Also Robots with Memento-Mortispex is great. And he will be tanking at T7

3) Keep him by himself. I had a few games where there was few big objectives, so he can just camp them and draw a lot of fire. Your opponent won't be able to move him from an objective.

I also like bringing Knight or onagers to walk next to Cawl for buffs.

However, my play group start to consider Cawl to be unfun, so I won't be able to bring him as much as I like in the future :(


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Aaranis wrote:
Holy Molly I have a newfound respect for my 5 Infiltrators now. I faced an Iron Hands list with a triple Vindicator squadron in it, and as I wondered where in Hell I could go with my Infiltrators so they could be useful (there was only like 8-9 non-vehicle models on the field on his side) I found myself close to the Vindicators. So I charged them, rolled... and destroyed two of them. With 5 Infiltrators. With Taser Goads.

As a makeshift anti-armour they look nice indeed with these S6 hits. On the charge they have 21 attacks that hit on 3+, with 6's adding two more hits each. As it's resolved against rear armour most of the time it will be 10 and you only have to roll a few 4+ to destroy one.

The more I play with the same list, the more I get good with what I have. Even managed a victory against a CC Eldar list the other day !

Do you infiltrate or outflank your Infiltrators mostly? I never had success with them, although it might be because my main opponent is Tau so too many instant kill for them to do anything (Same thing happens with dragoons)

Careful with Cawl at T5 in the Destroyers unit, he's not Eternal Warrior and thus may be victim of Instant Death if a S10 AP1 Blast comes right in his face...

I always infiltrate them so as to make something menacing for the enemy to consider, and they can be closer to objectives or just out of sight more easily. I don't trust Outflank, you still can't charge at the turn you arrive and worse is that it's on Turn 2, and they may as well never arrive and not at the right side. Another option may be to deploy them normally with Scout and if you don't get the first turn, you may have something to charge at yours. Never played against a Tau player yet, but I can wait for as long as necessary, I'm in no rush

That is not how instant death works. Rolls to wound are on average toughness (5). Once a wound allocated and unsaved, then the instant death rule is queried against the toughness of the model on a model by model basis (6). If a wound is allocated to a kataphron and it is unsaved, then it is queried against the toughness (5) of the kataphron.

Wulfey wrote:

That is not how instant death works. Rolls to wound are on average toughness (5). Once a wound allocated and unsaved, then the instant death rule is queried against the toughness of the model on a model by model basis (6). If a wound is allocated to a kataphron and it is unsaved, then it is queried against the toughness (5) of the kataphron.

Really ? I've been doing that wrongly most of the time then, thanks for the clarification. But you still roll your To Wound rolls on the biggest average Toughness in the unit ? It's for the allocation of Wounds to save that you use the Toughness value of the model ?

You roll to wound vs the unit's majority toughness.

Once you allocate a successful wound to a model, then you assess S vs T for purposes of ID, (denying) FNP/RP, and any other rules that interfere with things like AP values and cover and such, and roll any possible save accordingly

 IHateNids wrote:
You roll to wound vs the unit's majority toughness.

Once you allocate a successful wound to a model, then you assess S vs T for purposes of ID, (denying) FNP/RP, and any other rules that interfere with things like AP values and cover and such, and roll any possible save accordingly

Okay, that's what I had in mind as well. I'll remember it for my next games !

On another subject, I'll be testing a full 10 squad of Vigilators Sisters of Silence, the ones with the AP2 Greatswords this thursday in a 1500 pts game. I'm placing my Techpriest Dominus with them, equipped with Anzion's Pseudogenetor, the Eradication Ray and a Stasis Field. That should make a decently resilient CC unit to deal with psykers and other CC units coming too close. I won't be facing any psykers sadly but I'll see how they perform nonetheless. Wasn't satisfied with the Culexus as he was too slow and pricey for his somewhat average resilience, so in the two games I played in which I tested him he didn't do much at all. Hoping the Sisters of Silence will be nice !

Anyone tried Sisters of Silence in their AdMech lists ? What is your way of dealing with Psykers ?

HI

What do you guys use for Psychic support for your Ad Mech armies.

I was planning to add some psychic to my army but torn between
1) Tiggy Conclave
2) White Scars Conclave
3) Psykana division
4) Any other options???

I use some Grey Knights or Greyfax for my anti psychic.
Grey Knights are great versus small units of psykers hiding in the backline, they can deepstrike and throw psyk-out grenades in the unit hiding the psykers.
If deep striking ain't your thing, then you could use interceptors for that 30" jump move towards the enemy psykers.
Add in some incinerators and you got a scary fast anti psyker unit that can also deal some heavy damage against the squad the psyker is hiding in.
Fastest way I got rid of Tigurius was two interceptors squads jumping next to Tiggy's suad and throwing in two psyk-out grenades Tigurius gets hit by them, rolls 1 on the perils table, fails the leadership test, bye bye Tiggy.
This was ofcourse quite some luck on my side, but in my opinion Grey Knights are a wonderful ally versus psykers as they add extra dices for your deny the witch rolls and are pretty good in taking out most psykers without much support from other units.

Zalek wrote:
HI

What do you guys use for Psychic support for your Ad Mech armies.

Sisters of Silence in Rhinos

Two 25 point astropaths. Gets me a whole phase back for 50 points.

I still think Librarius Conclave is good for support. It is a cheap way to get some better LD and roll on some good tables.

I'm starting to like the idea of cawl tanking for a unit of sisters of silence.

 buddha wrote:
I'm starting to like the idea of cawl tanking for a unit of sisters of silence.

How would they get anywhere though?

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

 buddha wrote:
I'm starting to like the idea of cawl tanking for a unit of sisters of silence.

How would they get anywhere though?

The AdMec way... Walking!

When it comes to competitive 40k is there a place for the Cohort Cybernetica?

They have:

Torrent Flamers

Twin Linked Cover Punishing Hvy Phosphor

MC Smash

FNP//IWND//T7//3+//5++

I feel like the unkillable robots would be great against hordes of Ynnari in particular. They will likely ignore even massed Poison and Scatbike shooting, no matter how many extra phases they get. Plus the weapons are tailor made to be anti-Aeldari

So, since the FAQ nerfed grenades, does that increase the viability of Transonic Blade Ruststalkers? The loss of grenades but added Strength of the attacks (Str 6 on the Charge is not bad), almost seems to even out the options. But Chord Claws are still pretty awesome. I wish the Blade version was better, since dual-wielding blades looks really cool.

buddha wrote:I'm starting to like the idea of cawl tanking for a unit of sisters of silence.

Hey I just had an idea, a Techpriest Dominus with the Raiment of the Technomartyr, in squad of Sisters of Silence with flamers. They would have Cognis and so when charged would ALWAYS inflict 3 hits per flamer to the attacker. No one will charge you !

casvalremdeikun wrote:So, since the FAQ nerfed grenades, does that increase the viability of Transonic Blade Ruststalkers? The loss of grenades but added Strength of the attacks (Str 6 on the Charge is not bad), almost seems to even out the options. But Chord Claws are still pretty awesome. I wish the Blade version was better, since dual-wielding blades looks really cool.

What was the FAQ about concerning grenades ?

What was the FAQ about concerning grenades ?

Only 1 grenade per unit per phase. No more 5 haywire grenades in assault from the ruststalkers.

Jackal444 wrote:

Only 1 grenade per unit per phase. No more 5 haywire grenades in assault from the ruststalkers.

Oh all right, I always knew this like that. I never use grenades so I never had to think about this haha.

As anti-vehicle I feel the Infiltrators are best suited for the job because of the number of S6 attacks they can make on a vehicle, there's no AP but it matters not when you just want to wreck it. Sure, one Haywire grenade is still nice to throw beforehand, I admit.

Ruststalkers are still better with the grenades as if they charge into terrain they are striking last, which is very common for them. Grenades are more than just haywire.

skycapt44 wrote:
Ruststalkers are still better with the grenades as if they charge into terrain they are striking last, which is very common for them. Grenades are more than just haywire.

Good call. I might still use the Transonic Blade bit on the sword arm since they look a little cooler.

 Aaranis wrote:

Hey I just had an idea, a Techpriest Dominus with the Raiment of the Technomartyr, in squad of Sisters of Silence with flamers. They would have Cognis and so when charged would ALWAYS inflict 3 hits per flamer to the attacker. No one will charge you !

Raiment of the Technomartyr affects only Cult Mechanicus models. If Cawl is in your army, you can give another character the incredible Memento-Mortispex relic which can also grant Cognis to all models in a unit.

 axisofentropy wrote:
Raiment of the Technomartyr affects only Cult Mechanicus models. If Cawl is in your army, you can give another character the incredible Memento-Mortispex relic which can also grant Cognis to all models in a unit.

Ah, forgot it only affected Mechanicus models. Are flamers really good ? I see a lot of love for these weapons, personally the only time I fielded my Torrent flamers with the Kastelan they were nigh useless, while my Phosphor Blasters always shred enemy like nothing. Asking because I'm wondering if I won't buy some flamer Sisters of Silence too. The swords were tried today, and I love them. 30 attacks at S4 AP2 shredded those Marines.

For psychic support, I like to use either a Sisters of Silence squad or Coteaz.

The Sisters are amazing at shutting down powers near your models.

Coteaz, for 100 points, is a great support option. Psychics, 2+ save, and has a great intercept ability...just a steal for the cost.

You cannot go wrong with either unit tho.

So I know this was addressed in the OP, but Sydonian Dragoons. What should I equip them with? On one hand, the Lances make them murderous in CC by laying down a ton of fairly high strength wounds. But on the other hand, the Sniper Rifle does as well through the Rad Poisoning rule. To me, the fact the chicken walkers have aluminum foil armor augmented by cover, I would be better off with the Sniper Rifle.

And the Phosphor Serpenta, yay or nay? Seems like yay on both accounts, since it gives the Lance a ranged weapon, but it also boosts the Sniper Rifle's effectiveness through the Lumigen rule.

The Snipers Rifle makes them too expensive for the number of shots. At least the Lance gives them a prime purpose to charge stuff and sweep.

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
The Snipers Rifle makes them too expensive for the number of shots. At least the Lance gives them a prime purpose to charge stuff and sweep.

That's kind of my thought. And I have a ton shooting anyway. What about the Phosphor Serpenta?

 casvalremdeikun wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
The Snipers Rifle makes them too expensive for the number of shots. At least the Lance gives them a prime purpose to charge stuff and sweep.

That's kind of my thought. And I have a ton shooting anyway. What about the Phosphor Serpenta?

If you have the points go for it, because if you get shot on your way to the enemy or if you're charging something serious that can hurt it, you risk a destroyed weapon result and it will be your lance that break down. With an additional Phosphor Serpenta you have 50% chance of your +3 S Tesla lance to break, which is nice. I had that happened to a game recently, only equipped mine with the lance.

As of the Radium Carbines, I think one or two isn't enough, you should commit a force to it if you want to use them. Let's say you run an Ironstrider Cavaliers formation, so 2 units of Dragoons and one of Ballistarii. Leave the Ballistarius alone because he's overpriced, build one unit of like 3-4 Dragoons all with Radium Jezzails + Phosphor Serpentas, and the other unit consisting of 1-2 Dragoons with Lances. Now all this comes as Flank Attack at turn one with rerolls to pick the side from which you arrive, and you can't charge in the turn you arrive anyway because the rules say so. You have 3-4 Serpentas shots that will light up your target, followed by 6-8 shots of Radium Jezzails, that on 6's to Wound inflict twice the Wounds at AP2. For bonus you can use the Ballistarius to shoot at it too, while in cover behind another Dragoon, then you finally charge your Lances unit at turn two if the target survived. Should be good enough against any target, remember you have Preferred Enemy against a character and his unit of your choice at the start of the game.

I'd like to try that but I'm reluctant on buying so many Ironstriders, they're expensive money-wise and I'd need a lot

I am suddenly reminded of the fact that Walkers DON'T have the Smash rule for whatever reason(because a kick to the face from a giant chicken walker wouldn't send something flying if it wasn't immediately turned to meat pulp). It makes the Taser Lance a little less desirable. I am only looking at one unit of two for the time being. Historically, Dragoons were mounted gunmen, which also makes me lean toward the guns.

Edit: I forgot to mention that I would be running the Dragoons in a Skitarii Maniple, so they would be rocking Scout to go with Dunestrider so the entire board is within their reach, basically

Having some Dragoons in a Skitarii Maniple is great, scout + crusader makes for some very fast chicken.

I do not really mind walkers having no smash, Dragoons with lances are still worth their salts. Their diet should mostly exist of other light vehicles and small groups of objective campers. As they destroy these units in one or two turns. Otherwise they stay to long in combat.