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My friend was making a list and while doing so said to me that regular chaos space marines suck. (he favors khorne)
So i decied to make a list comprised of regular chaos space marines too send him packing.




HQ chaos lord with mark of tzeench
deamon weapon of tzeench (Death Screamer)

Troop 9 marines w/ 1PG, 1MG
1 champion w/ bolter,BP, PF
Rhino w/ EA

9 marines w/ 1PG, 1MG
1 champion w/ bolter,BP, PF
Rhino w/ EA


9 marines w/ 1PG, 1MG
1 champion w/ bolter,BP, PF
Rhino w/ EA

9 marines w/ 1PG, 1MG
1 champion w/ bolter,BP, PF

Heavy 8 marines w/ 1 MG, 3 PG

8 marines w/ 1 MG, 3 PG

You could run a very similar list except with Berzerkers or Plague Marines and it'd be 10x better.

The lord is very unimpressive. I would at least make it a demon prince.

Im assuming its because of what model you have, so maybe just either give it MoS and Lash, or if you dont want to be too terribly overpowered go with MoN and warptime, a very solid combo.

And yeah making them berserkers or plague marines would make the army better.

if i took nurgle or khorne i wouldnt have as many guys and the whole point i was getting across was that its all regular chaos space marines aside from the mark on the lord. the lord was simple because i didnt think that with all the high ap an tank killing multi meltas that i wouldnt be facing that much oppisition with my enemy once they get close enough to assult my lord. Ive always felt that chaos and imperial marines are ment to shoot and if assulted or the chance to assult comes along they can hold their own.

ok.

I run a very similar list....5 troop choice of standard CSM. 3 defensive units and 2 offensive units. with a couple of vindicators for some fire support. It always seems to do well enough to win....i've never destroyed an army to the last man....but i've also never needed to...5 objective grabbing units always seemed to do the trick. Plus there is A LOT of shooting coming my oppenents way. I agree that the standard marine's role is to shoot....I really dislike charging unless I really have to!

I suggest putting the Lord on a Disc of Tzeentch. It'll make him faster and give him an extra attack.

The army is awful. You don't need that many troops. I faced a similar list in a tourney and totally annihilated it. Normal CSM don't cut it. Cult Marines are much better.

wuestenfux wrote:The army is awful. You don't need that many troops. I faced a similar list in a tourney and totally annihilated it. Normal CSM don't cut it. Cult Marines are much better.

So...you faced 1 force of standard CSM and bitched it and that makes the army unplayable?

My advice would be to drop the Tzeentch Lord and replace him with Fabius Bile, then beef all your standard CSM's by enhancing them and suddenly, barring 1/3 of units having something fun happening, for 3 pts each (only the CSM not the havocs or any cult marines, though iconed CSM's work) they are all strength 5 and fearless. With 2 attacks standard in combat and wounding an average toughness 3 opponent on 2's, and orks/marines on 3's (sometimes, once in a blue moon on 2's cause you'd be strength 6 now lol) you're suddenly that much more efficient. Yeah Bile isn't the best in combat and costs a fair wack of points but the benefits he'd give a force like this far outweighs the lack of a Demonweapon wielding Tzeentch lord IMHO. Icons are up to you if you use them, but consider upgrading the Havocs to Chosen so as you can pack the same firepower, but can now infiltrate to get into where you need them to be faster and to also support the combat rhino based troops.

Cheers mate and goodluck with the list,

Auretious Taak.

P.S. Bradmammajamma, so you're mate play's Khorne hey? So he'll have what? Crap loads of berserkers that suck without transports and have to footslog across the board to get to you and only have plasma pistols for ranged attacks? lol. Fabius Bile as I said gives you strength 5, maybe strength 6 if you are really lucky permanently. Give the units icon's of slaanesh and suddenly your strength 5 initiative 5 and that's permenant till the icon dies, if you get the charge, the berserkers are strength 4 I4, whilst you are str/Ini 5 permanently, whose sucky now? Though, at the same time, icon of nurgle could cause all sorts of fun at str/Toughness 5, lol.

Auretious Taak wrote:

My advice would be to drop the Tzeentch Lord and replace him with Fabius Bile, then beef all your standard CSM's by enhancing them and suddenly, barring 1/3 of units having something fun happening, for 3 pts each (only the CSM not the havocs or any cult marines, though iconed CSM's work) they are all strength 5 and fearless. With 2 attacks standard in combat and wounding an average toughness 3 opponent on 2's, and orks/marines on 3's (sometimes, once in a blue moon on 2's cause you'd be strength 6 now lol) you're suddenly that much more efficient. Yeah Bile isn't the best in combat and costs a fair wack of points but the benefits he'd give a force like this far outweighs the lack of a Demonweapon wielding Tzeentch lord IMHO. Icons are up to you if you use them, but consider upgrading the Havocs to Chosen so as you can pack the same firepower, but can now infiltrate to get into where you need them to be faster and to also support the combat rhino based troops.

I've been thinking about this myself. I'd say drop the Tz Lord for Fabius Bile. Have 3 units of beefed up troops and a bunch of Oblits. Give all your champs PFs btw. They will be hitting on Str 10.

Typeline wrote:
I've been thinking about this myself. I'd say drop the Tz Lord for Fabius Bile. Have 3 units of beefed up troops and a bunch of Oblits. Give all your champs PFs btw. They will be hitting on Str 10.

THAT didn't occur to me, cause they are base strength 5...wow, that's hot as. Screw a Power weapon on a Champ in an icon of slaanesh unit! And yes I am slowly building up a Fabius Bile Force myself, it's tricky to say the least, just ignore the cult units, plague marines are great and all, but Enhanced CSM with a mark of Nurgle are cheaper by about 2 points at 10 men, and whilst they lose FnP, they gain the extra strength AND an extra point of initiative (Plague Marines have Initiative 3, normal CSM's go first in this instance...). Thanks for pointing the strength 10 Fist out for me Typeline (though technically when they are awesomely enhanced the fist is equivalent to strength 12 lol, if only!).

You could have some fun and take full units of 20 Enhanced CSM's on foot, wack in an icon, and just march straight into the Berserkers or wait for them to come to you. 20 Fearless CSM's with strength 5 base is one nasty power base to face. 2 Units of them are even worse, especially when equipped with an icon of Nurgle...I think it's about 475 odd pts with 2 meltaguns, icon nurgle and champ with fist and melta bombs (though melta not really needed at strength 10 fist woot pts to save!). 5;03am, sooo stuffed for this assignment!

Oblits are surprisingly good, though a bit costly, but then it comes down to the list as a theme of normal CSM's to bitch Khornate CSM's. Havocs fit better to a point so do Chosen. Personally I'd split the support to a pair of Oblits and a defiler with 2 combat arms and a battle cannon - 5 base strength 10 Dread attacks is nasty as.

I've gone off topic here a bit I think.

Auretious Taak.