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Daemon Prince, Wings, Warptime - 155

10 Chaos Space Marines, Plasma Gun, Lascannon, Icon of Chaos Glory, Rhino - 230

10 Chaos Space Marines, Plasma Gun, Lascannon, Icon of Chaos Glory, Rhino - 230

10 Chaos Space Marines, Plasma Gun, Plasma Gun, Icon of Chaos Glory, Rhino - 225

10 Chaos Space Marines, Flamer, Flamer, Icon of Chaos Glory, Rhino - 205

10 Chaos Space Marines, Flamer, Flamer, Icon of Chaos Glory, Rhino - 205

Chaos Vindicator - 125

Chaos Vindicator - 125

Pretty self explanatory army. 2 defensive units (PG and LC), and 3 offensive units to grab objectives. The vindicators are there to take out mass amounts of troops and deal with any pesky armour.

Your thoughts please. Do I have too many Troop units? Should I replace them with units that are more specialized? I have played about 8 games with the current config. And have won 5, lost 1 and drew 2.

Thanx

personally i would have one cult squad in there but that is up to you. may i suggest that you remove one of the defencive squads and replace with havoks, 4 heavies instead of 2.

other than that if you want to win this list looks ok, but may nurgle rot on the deamon prince would be good?

I'll see if I can work the points out for a havoc squad....I do agree that 4 would be better than 2. My only thought was that in a worst case scenario, the defensive squads can claim objectives as well. I really have never liked to dump a lot of points into one model....and to me DP are ALWAYS a target. Sure T6 would be nice, but it won't help him from krak missles, or lascannons.

As for the cult squad, which one would you suggest? I see a lot of people running Nurgle these days.

I'm more interested in that game you lost - why did you lose? What happened? What could have won it for you?

ohm242 wrote:Your thoughts please. Do I have too many Troop units? Should I replace them with units that are more specialized? I have played about 8 games with the current config. And have won 5, lost 1 and drew 2.

Normally I'd say moar Oblits, moar Lash. But the list as is, is working for you so stick with it. I like it too very simple. Although I really do think Oblits would do better than the vindis.

I think three vindis is always better than two. In general three is always better than two, lol.

Maybe you have too many troops. I don´t really think that you need so many troops. it´ll be maybe five objectives, but you just need to hold three, or simply one more than your opponent (in Tournaments that´s not really true).

You have five units for holding objectives, and eight (counting the rhinos) for contesting. It´s maybe too much, don't you think?

Two Lash Princes are always good. And if you are using Vindicators you can use Lash for taking your adversary dangerous (and Powerful armour) minis out of cover, hugging together and waiting for a big blast.

And now that I´m talking about vindis, in 5th they have lost a lot of his utility. With everyone getting cover saves, not AP1 (for penetrating vehicles) and the changes on accuracy on pie plates, you would maybe think about other options for your army. But if you have the models they can be still of good use, so just try them and find a way of optimizing them.

One last thing: A lot of Kill Points. It´s almost always the same with mechanised forces, and you say you are more worried about objectives, but I just have to remark it, lol.

More thoughts:

If you want really good defensive troops, why don't you try Plague Marines? They are really resilient...

And I´ve just realized that the vindis are naked. Maybe you would find a good use of putting them demonic possession (for keep firing even if you receive some glancings) and/or dozer blades (really cheap and useful).

Maybe Demonic Possession is expensive at 1500, but Dozer Blades will save your life more than once if you are moving your vindis to front line of your adversary (and you should do it, because you don't really have a lot of distance to play with).

Chaos vindicators come with dozer blades.

Thousand sons would be good

The reason I haven't put any cult marines into my lists is the point value of them. To field a similar 10 man unit of plague marines ismore points then I really want to spend. In addition cult squads can't take any long range weapons to deal with armour (Slaanesh is the only exception)

You do make a VERY valid point about the number of Kill Points my list has.....is 8 a lot? I figured that bigger units would be tougher to take down....that's my reasoning behind that decision. If I should tone down the kill points to 5 or 6 then I might as well through in cult marines and follow the crowd.

Your list has 13 KP. The transports are separate. I don't see it being a problem though. With the IoCG it won't be a problem.

Spellbound wrote:Chaos vindicators come with dozer blades.

Ooops! My mistake, sorry.

Typeline wrote:Your list has 13 KP. The transports are separate.

Exactly, each asignated transport counts as one KP. You can use (empty if neccesary) them to contest enemy objectives in the other two missions, but in KP, 13 KP is a lot of KP IMHO...

Typeline wrote: I don't see it being a problem though. With the IoCG it won't be a problem.

Why?

ohm242 wrote:The reason I haven't put any cult marines into my lists is the point value of them. To field a similar 10 man unit of plague marines ismore points then I really want to spend.

Well, that's the deal with good units. Sometimes they are expensive, but sometimes that points are wise spent points. Anyways, if you fell good with standard marines they are not bad. Plague Marines IMHO have more advantages than disadvantages, but that´s your choice to make. Think that taking more expensive units sometimes is good for having less KP (and you have a lot of that. Yeah, with standard marines you have more bodies, but with Plague Marines these bodies are twice resilient, and remember that your Chaos Space Marines eventually DO shall known fear, icon or not.

ohm242 wrote:In addition cult squads can't take any long range weapons to deal with armour (Slaanesh is the only exception)

Sorry, I´m not sure about this... With armour you mean Vehicle armour, don't you? Because for a moment I tought you were talking about armor saves. Yeah, you don't have long distance antitank, but the way the new table of vehicles damage works, I really feel that the only good ranged anti-tank is Melta at close distance and Tau Railgun. Anyways if you are inside the Rhino you are not making lots of long distance shots, and if you are standing outside and just using them (rhinos) for covering LoS, you will not have really good LoS yourself (we are talking about 7 tanks here).

A squad of Plague Marines inside a Rhino, going out and destroying any tank in the game (excepting the monolith) with Meltas doesn´t sound bad, but maybe it sounds better than it really is, lol.

Tried a game today using Noise Marines.....I do see the how valuable they are. VERY expensive units, but the firepower that they rained down upon my oppenent had his jaw on the ground for the majority of the game....Next game i'm going to try some plague marines....but i'm not sure what to pair them with. I'm thinking 3 small squads of terminators to deep-strike off of personal icons and combi-plasma/heavy flamers. So 3 squads of PM with 2 meltaguns, rhino, and i'm debating on a plague champion with fist. I'll see what my points look like. Thanx for all the advice....and opening my eyes to the cult armies!!!