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HQ

Captain on Bike w/Artificer Armour & Lightning Claws
-Command Squad w/ Apoth, Standard bearer w/storm sheild & Lightning claw, 2x Vet with Melta 1xlightning claw and storm sheild, 1x Vet with 2x Lightning claw

Chaplain on Bike with Digital Lasers

TROOPS

(10)Marines with melta, Multi-Melta, Sarge w/plasma pistol & Power weapon
(10)Marines with melta, Multi-Melta, Sarge w/combi-melta
(10)Marines with melta, Multi-Melta, Sarge w/combi-melta

FAST

(3) Heavy Bolter Attack Bikes
(3) Heavy Bolter Attack Bikes
(3) Multi-Melta Attack Bikes

HEAVY

Thunderfire Cannon
Thunderfire Cannon

=1850

I like Combat Tactics too much to give it up for outflank. No Khan here.

Thunderfires give you an edge over other biker lists. They also bolster up to two terrain peices for other foot troopers.

Attack bikes are like Devestator units that can actually move making them more useful and easier to move.

What do you like/hate here?

Looks pretty good. I don't like taking multi-meltas in static foot squads. I would trade them for missile launchers. I also think you need a bike squad (big enough to be a troop) or a Rhino mounted squad to roll with the command squad. Even if you combat squad, your foot sloggers are gonna have a hard time seizing objectives without any sort of external mobility. Just my two cents though.

Playing Khan doesn't make you lose combat tactics does it? I know if you want to outflanki he does, but just having him in army doesn't auto make you lose combat tactics.

His abilites other than outflank are very good.

Old Man Ultramarine wrote:Playing Khan doesn't make you lose combat tactics does it? I know if you want to outflanki he does, but just having him in army doesn't auto make you lose combat tactics.

His abilites other than outflank are very good.

If you bring Khan, you dont HAVE to outflank, however every unit in the army gives up Combat Tactics for THE ABILITY to do so.

You dont have a choice if you bring him. You lose combat tactics.

PanzerLeader wrote:Looks pretty good. I don't like taking multi-meltas in static foot squads. I would trade them for missile launchers. I also think you need a bike squad (big enough to be a troop) or a Rhino mounted squad to roll with the command squad. Even if you combat squad, your foot sloggers are gonna have a hard time seizing objectives without any sort of external mobility. Just my two cents though.

I think (thru Combat Tactics) MM's can be useful on foot....

....I get too close, you charge, I CHOOSE to fail break check then auto rally on my turn within range with MM. Something I've been thinking about trying....

I was trying to think of a way to stick two stock rhinos or razorbacks in here though for a bit of mobility. Honestly, I dont much care for regular biker squadrons.

Deadshane1 wrote:

Old Man Ultramarine wrote:Playing Khan doesn't make you lose combat tactics does it? I know if you want to outflanki he does, but just having him in army doesn't auto make you lose combat tactics.

His abilites other than outflank are very good.

If you bring Khan, you dont HAVE to outflank, however every unit in the army gives up Combat Tactics for THE ABILITY to do so.

You dont have a choice if you bring him. You lose combat tactics.

I stand corrected, as I just read codex rule.

So you have to pick how you do your surgery. Fair enough.

I think (thru Combat Tactics) MM's can be useful on foot....

....I get too close, you charge, I CHOOSE to fail break check then auto rally on my turn within range with MM. Something I've been thinking about trying....

I was trying to think of a way to stick two stock rhinos or razorbacks in here though for a bit of mobility. Honestly, I dont much care for regular biker squadrons.

That, IMHO, is a horrible use of combat tactics. Walking a squad up with the deliberate intend of getting charged, beaten in combat, breaking and shooting is a waste of points and Marines. Don't get me wrong--Combat Tactics is an awesome rule. I use it all the time. But you're planning on getting beat in assault and losing models before shooting and your opponent still has the chance of catching you with a sweeping advance. Combat Tactics is great for when you are caught out of position but I would never try to be deliberately out of position just to take advantage of it.

As for regular bike squadrons, they aren't the bee knees as a front line assault on their own. But a squadron of 5 (so its scoring) with two meltaguns or flamers and a powerfist weighs in at 185 points and would make a nice supporting unit with your command squad and the attack bikes. They are small enough to get behind cover easily and have a good shooting punch and can mop up infantry units that your attack bikes have decimated. You have enough other targets that they should survive the initial enemy volley to do some damage.

How will it do versus nob bikers and the Chaos SPAM? You know the drill.

G

PanzerLeader wrote:

I think (thru Combat Tactics) MM's can be useful on foot....

....I get too close, you charge, I CHOOSE to fail break check then auto rally on my turn within range with MM. Something I've been thinking about trying....

I was trying to think of a way to stick two stock rhinos or razorbacks in here though for a bit of mobility. Honestly, I dont much care for regular biker squadrons.

That, IMHO, is a horrible use of combat tactics. Walking a squad up with the deliberate intend of getting charged, beaten in combat, breaking and shooting is a waste of points and Marines. Don't get me wrong--Combat Tactics is an awesome rule. I use it all the time. But you're planning on getting beat in assault and losing models before shooting and your opponent still has the chance of catching you with a sweeping advance. Combat Tactics is great for when you are caught out of position but I would never try to be deliberately out of position just to take advantage of it.

You're taking my "if Charged" plans a little too literal. Obviously, planning on getting charged and losing combat isnt the best use of troopers, but when you get close enough to use MM's, CC is going to inevitably become a danger. At least the tac squads are prepared for it. If they get close enough to use melta weaponry without getting charged or simply shot at, so much the better.

I'm not planning on haphazardly throwing them into harms way, but they do need to be within 24" to be effective. Thats moving toward distances where close combat becomes a very real danger.

Green Blow Fly wrote:How will it do versus nob bikers and the Chaos SPAM? You know the drill.

G

No better/worse than any other list out there. This list has the advantage of hamstringing bikernobs with the Thunderfires...no more turboboosting for them and taking dangerous terrain tests whenever they want to move.

Eventually, when a unit of nobs gets close enough, hopefully there is enough mobile firepower in this list to soften them so that the command squad can charge and dispatch the nobs successfully.

That is a great idea for the thunderfire cannon.

G

I'm amazed that noone had any opinions as far as demolishing my list here...perhaps it deserves the *dakka stamp of approval*?

I'm looking to make it better as I pick up the remaining models that I need to complete it...

...any suggestions of things to take out and what to replace them with....I'm going to stick to the basic idea however.

I just have a question, why not give your entire command squad storm shields as you don't have to drop any weapons to do so...Is it a points thing?

Overall, I like the list, and the attack bikes is a great way to go for the mobile fire power, especially with the new lower costs...

I wouldn't go so far to say it should be approved yet.

G

the maximum strengh on your bikersquad is 4 how again beat you things like armour12+walkers?

and by adding the chappy to that squad you cant use your beloved combat tactics to escape...

avatar would have a good day vs this army to, because each weapon with s >5 has the melta rule (which against he is immun!)

my advice would be, drop the chappy, the lone powerweapon and one thunderfire, get another unit of
bikers or some dreadnoughts (very good vs deamons and other assault armys).then add atleast one powerfist to the bikesquad (i would give a thunderhammer to the captain..) and upgruade the tactical multimeltas to rockets or lascannons.

greetings Badger

mray01 wrote:I just have a question, why not give your entire command squad storm shields as you don't have to drop any weapons to do so...Is it a points thing?

Pretty much. I'm only missing a single storm sheild...on the guy with dual LC's. With only him and the Apoth (who cannot get any gear) missing Inv saves...I figure the unit is fairly safe.

...I could trade in the standard for another sheild though....hmmm....

You can take a shield for the marine with lightning claws.

G

Badger wrote:the maximum strengh on your bikersquad is 4 how again beat you things like armour12+walkers?

Hopefully with shooting. I'm not dumping enough TH's or PF's into the squad to handle them, by the same token, walkers wouldnt be very well served attacking them anyway, not with all the stormsheilds in the unit. Perhaps a few meltabombs though....

and by adding the chappy to that squad you cant use your beloved combat tactics to escape...

Tactics is more for the tac squads to keep them shooting.

avatar would have a good day vs this army to, because each weapon with s >5 has the melta rule (which against he is immun!)

Not that worried about avatar's...they're slow and get gunned down by bolter fire easily enough.

my advice would be, drop the chappy and one thunderfire

The Chaplain is what makes the command squad devestating in close combat. A metric ton of hitting power would be lost without his rr's to hit given to the squad. With him aboard this unit can handle softened up Nob biker squads, full ones if they run low on powerfists.

Thunderfires also severely hamper Nob Bikers....I like having two of them in the list.

Green Blow Fly wrote:You can take a shield for the marine with lightning claws.

G

I know, like I said, its a points thing....dont think I'll be missing much without him having one. Its a choice really between the standard and the Sheild.

Just wanted to chim ein... attack bikes are pretty sweet in term sof mobile firepower. I think your use of thunderfire is also topnotch. They are going to be a great way to slowdown and soften up nob bikers. I would drop the LC from the captain and go with a relic blade. I'd also consider switching over the digital laser as well.

I amnot 100% sold on the bike command squad. It's a good unit but not necesarily as good as the point cost might suggest.

ender502

ender502 wrote:Just wanted to chim ein... attack bikes are pretty sweet in term sof mobile firepower. I think your use of thunderfire is also topnotch. They are going to be a great way to slowdown and soften up nob bikers. I would drop the LC from the captain and go with a relic blade. I'd also consider switching over the digital laser as well.

This was something I was DEFINATLY thinking about doing. This would leave room for a combi-weapon as well on the hero.