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Made in gb
Bonkers Buggy Driver with Rockets





United Kingdom

If the rumoured points changes do take place, I think I can just drop my kommandos down to two units of five rather than two units of ten and then have points to play around with. Or ditch my trukk boys and just add a kannonwagon and more koptas or something.

I certainly like the idea of a foot horde of MANz and Kanz
   
Made in us
Big Mek in Kustom Dragster with Soopa-Gun





Nebraska, USA

foot horde of manz...lol...

COME AT ME BRAH!!
*slowly heaves one leg forward* JUST YOU *heaves another very slowly* WAIT UNTIL *starts panting a bit* GET THERE!!

An ork with an idea tends to end with a bang.

14000pts Big 'n Bad Orkz
6000pts Admech/Knights
7500pts Necron Goldboys 
   
Made in gb
Bonkers Buggy Driver with Rockets





United Kingdom

 Vineheart01 wrote:
foot horde of manz...lol...

COME AT ME BRAH!!
*slowly heaves one leg forward* JUST YOU *heaves another very slowly* WAIT UNTIL *starts panting a bit* GET THERE!!


Hits like a wrecking ball when it gets there.




On turn five
   
Made in ca
Gargantuan Gargant






 Afrodactyl wrote:
 Vineheart01 wrote:
foot horde of manz...lol...

COME AT ME BRAH!!
*slowly heaves one leg forward* JUST YOU *heaves another very slowly* WAIT UNTIL *starts panting a bit* GET THERE!!


Hits like a wrecking ball when it gets there.




On turn five


Old school Ork players would call this da DEFFWING list. I remember back in 5th ed, you could do this. Have 2 Mega Armoured Warbosses (or one of them as Ghazzy) to make the mandatory troops choice Meganobz, and then take the rest of the Meganobz to max out the elites slots. You'd throw them into battlewagons/trukks and rush in. If you wanted to make them feel even more elite, you could cut some guys and have Mad Dok Grotsnik to give every Meganob a 5+ invuln from Cybork Body. It'd be hell expensive and they were a lot squishier back then to stuff like power fists that would cause instant death, but if you managed to swing with any of them, they would absolutely steamroll most things they made into combat with.

Might have to try this kind of army out again if those points drop come to pass.

   
Made in us
Big Mek in Kustom Dragster with Soopa-Gun





Nebraska, USA

Yeah, the old Manz Mizziles tactic.

I used to abuse that move. 2 squads of MANz in a trukk, rocket it up both sides of the board. They either dedicate proper anti-tank weaponry to get rid of like 175pts of stuff, or get their cans opened.
I miss the days of 24" trukk movement....

Course my friend will never let me forget the time i sent them after his Devastator squad sitting at the top of one of those tall/thin GW ruins. I charge him from below, only the 1 lascannon guy can see because hes standing on the hole the ladder went to. Rolls a 6, wounds, dead, guess how many inches i failed that charge by.....because of course it wounds from the front back then lol

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/01/15 01:56:13


An ork with an idea tends to end with a bang.

14000pts Big 'n Bad Orkz
6000pts Admech/Knights
7500pts Necron Goldboys 
   
Made in us
Flashy Flashgitz




North Carolina

My problem with MANz now isn't speed - that's solved by making them trukk boyz.

My problem is just how bad their damage output is without using the hit em harder strat.
   
Made in ca
Gargantuan Gargant






 Dendarien wrote:
My problem with MANz now isn't speed - that's solved by making them trukk boyz.

My problem is just how bad their damage output is without using the hit em harder strat.


Yeah, and the issue of hitting on 4's without Warboss/WAAAGH! banner support makes them also rather swingy with how much actually connects. Hit Em Harder really should have been a built into Meganobz on their datasheet in someway (maybe if it's just on the charge) rather than a very pricy 2CP, since then it disincentivizes you from taking multiple. It does feel that we've mostly missed out on the damage gravy train that some of the other codices that are coming out seem to have in spades.
   
Made in cz
Bonkers Buggy Driver with Rockets





Prague

Over the years I was stockpiling the AOBR deffkoptas. Because I like them and I had a feeling, they will be great some day.

Now they are. So I working on my sweet 15 pack. But the box is still pretty full…

… sunday morning check…

Another 21.

Guys, be carefull. Stockpiling of such ammount of ork models can be addictive…

Seems I need to make some converting project to Nob Bikers or something…

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/01/15 11:09:11


11000p and one Ad Mech T-shirt 
   
Made in it
Waaagh! Ork Warboss




Italy

 Grimskul wrote:
 Dendarien wrote:
My problem with MANz now isn't speed - that's solved by making them trukk boyz.

My problem is just how bad their damage output is without using the hit em harder strat.


Yeah, and the issue of hitting on 4's without Warboss/WAAAGH! banner support makes them also rather swingy with how much actually connects. Hit Em Harder really should have been a built into Meganobz on their datasheet in someway (maybe if it's just on the charge) rather than a very pricy 2CP, since then it disincentivizes you from taking multiple. It does feel that we've mostly missed out on the damage gravy train that some of the other codices that are coming out seem to have in spades.


Or you can run them as turn 2-3 melee threats instead of making them alpha strike threat with the Trukk Boyz keyword. This way they'd keep some of their punch by either being Goffs or Big Krumpaz. And the +1 to hit from a warboss if he's nearby them.

 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




 Tomsug wrote:
If the rumour is true, than following is interesting:

- warbikers and deffkoptas hold - Speedmob deffkopta biker spam is strong now. Would be for the next few months, unless changes in number of units in detachement change something
- Kannonwagons price drop. They are already cool. 2D6 shot weapon + 1CP reroll gives you a lot of shots hitting on 4+ 8-3 3 with the speedwaagh. With 60” range and 12” move, so there is nowehere to hide. Plus 3x Big Shoota for free. Give them a WAGON keyword for the speedmob 5++ and price drop for 20!p and they would be top.
- killa kans - they were already in some top lists. Give them a price drop and Skorcha autohit 12” 5-1 1 + klaws 8-3 3 with support of waaaagh banner would be very good.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
- Kannonwagons + mek guns price drop can be a “nice” core for the castle lists. Use a Killakans as Terminators for TTL and play the passive game. That could be a very strong build.


I'm fairly alone in this but honestly I need to say it. Warbikers AREN'T THAT GOOD. Sorry, they just aren't. Incredibly short range with dakka means you have to get within 9' of your target to really hit them hard. A unit of 3 puts out 10 S5 no AP hits a turn. This is good but not great, and definitely not in a meta where a lot of units get +1 to armor or -1 to hit. Worse, when they inevitably end up in CC because you got charged or you needed to tag something, they are literally just boyz on a bike and as of right now, boyz aren't very good, and a 25pt boy is REALLY not good.

DeffKoptas are great and the only thing I want for them is to become Core, otherwise they are fine.

Kannon Wagon...Who flippin cares? As a reminder, we are talking about COMPETITIVE 40k in this thread so please keep that in mind. But 20pts off a sub par unit that is likely 50pts over priced isn't going to do much for you. A kanonwagon averages 7 shots a turn against 95+% of the units you are going to run into, occasionally you might run into a 11 unit model but its incredibly rare. So it gets 3.5 hits a turn that can't be buffed because the gunners already increased it to +1 to hit. Against a Marine unit that is 2.9 wounds and just shy of 2 Dead Marines a turn. ....no offense but 150pts for a unit that manages 2 dead Marines a turn isn't exactly what I would call competitive. "Ohh but the 3 free big shootas!" again...who cares, you want this thing at max range to keep it relatively safe, so at best its 9 shots, 3 hits and against Marines thats 2 wounds and 0.66dmg. Yet again, not impressive.

You could drop this thing down to 100pts and it would only be competitive because it would be incredibly durable (Unless you are playing against Tau) for its points.

Killakanz: They aren't competitive, they weren't before and they still aren't now. A unit of 3 now runs you 105pts, or 120 with skorchas and LMAO 150 with Rokkitz (someone at GW still has PTSD from Ork Rokkitz). With Skorcha's they could be used as a teleporta strike unit, but that would be better done by a few other units, Meganobz for instance. They are still very fragile for their points cost, not because T, W or Save, but because LD6. So if you lose 2 you have a pretty good chance of failing morale which means you don't really want to play them in units bigger than MSU which dilutes the value of the Teleporta strike. And if you walk them up the board...they won't get there. yeah they might appear sporadically in a top list, but usually they don't do much and they were just a "meh" unit at best. They aren't heavy lifters like Kommandos used to be.

gungo wrote:

You are all looking at this nerf as of todays orks competitive placing.. these nerfs were done when everyone was still crying about ork buggies killrigs kommandos and beastboss on squig being very good units. Today the meta shifted to antitank and anti monster due to dreadkniggts and tyranid monster mash and durable drukari… so buggies are no longer as much a skew…. The good news is bikers are still okay so if chapter approved gives more biker secondaries that list is decent and it’s fun.

There is a clear player base bias on orks… we are the fun crazy army not the cool tactical army… even when they talk about competitive ork list like buggy spam they claim it’s just spamming cheap units and rushing the opponent and requires very little thought… when orks won socal decisively in the final there was a massive freak out about it. We are still to this day dealing with the fallback from that tournament. (To be fair the aircraft blocking assault was janky bull crap)


I have yet to see Killrigs deliver on their promised OP(ness) nor has the beastboss. In fact, in competitive gaming I don't really see them at all. I see a lot more units of 5 kommandos hiding in cover capping an objective than I do units like I run in mobz of 10 storming the enemies front lines turn 1.

I do agree there is a competitive player bias against Orkz. We are the lunatic army, we are supposed to never win but be fun to play against on the real players road to victory. We won 1 Major event with a competitive list that relies on being really shooty turn 1 and turn 2 and then basically running out of steam and that has been used as justification to Immediately nerf Ork buggies and planes in general. Dark Eldar and Ad-Mech were dominating the meta for 6+ months, winning almost every event and they got minor nerfs and in the case of DE a lot of heavy buffs. Orkz win 1 event decisively against the worst match up imaginable for the player and suddenly we are public enemy #1 and in need of immediate army correction.

 Grimskul wrote:

With how much GW listens to their competitive player consultants and how those players never seem to have liked using/facing Orks very much in the competitive meta, it wouldn't be surprising that they would be satisfied with Orks with being nerfed into the ground so they don't have to worry about our skew lists.

Was Ork Horde armies unbeatable or OP? Nope, they were a skew infantry list, but competitive players and players in general hated that it basically invalidated their 25 Lascannon/plasma/melta units they were bringing. Hence in 9th Ork boyz are effectively useless and the things we used to buff them are all gone. GW and players hate it when Orkz go counter meta and yet GW keeps building Ork codex's that suck in anything except Counter-meta (9th codex is honestly the best one so far).

 Jidmah wrote:
For competitive events you need to keep in mind that people cram redemptors or death shroud terminators into their lists and you need some sort of solution for such things.
Which means that list 1 is probably the best option.

IMO trukk boyz aren't good enough to warrant being such a big chunk of your army, I'd drop the trukk for some kommadoz.


I have to agree with you Jidmah. I Only take Trukkboyz in my alphork strike because its the only other fast unit we have that is both a 1st turn threat and semi-useful. They aren't good in CC, they aren't durable, but they are astoundingly fast
 Dendarien wrote:
My problem with MANz now isn't speed - that's solved by making them trukk boyz.

My problem is just how bad their damage output is without using the hit em harder strat.

I've never really been a fan of Meganobz in general. They always seem to be Terminators -1 and always priced rather harshly. A terminator (which isn't competitive) is priced at 38pts its got 1 less T than Meganobz but they get an inbuilt 5++ invuln save which makes them more durable against Mutli-wound weapons like Plasma/melta but less durable vs small arms. and honestly, i'm more worried about the melta/plasma than I am boltguns. The terminators also have better ranged weapons and a host of special rules including free teleport strike.

The only competitive terminators right now aren't competitive because of their dmg potential though, they are competitive for their durability. Deathshrouds as Jidmah will attest to are an outlier in that they are incredibly durable AND if they get into CC its going to be a bad day for their opponent. So what do Meganobz bring to the table to compete against that? nothing. They are less durable, they don't have as many buffs, their wargear choices are kind of crap and anything they can do can be done by other units like Kommandos. The solution for me would be to increase a meganobz dmg output rather than buffing their durability. Orkz have always cared more about Krumpin then weathering a storm of enemy fire. Give meganobz +1 attack, give them +1dmg do something.

And finally, Kommandos.

Kommandos atm are +1pt over boyz, boyz are non-competitive crap that are at absolute best a Tax unit, but they aren't even a good tax unit because players routinely give up CP to not take them at all. So yeah, compared to one of the worst units in our codex Kommandos look OP at just 1ppm more. However, they aren't an OP unit in the game right now.

Kommandos only excel when in cover. If they aren't in cover they die in droves, if they aren't in cover they are just boyz in CC. They have an incredibly situational buff that makes them great and if they aren't in that situation they are crap. Hitting them with a 20% nerf is a bit ridiculous in my opinion. Ironically, if this "leak" is true, that means GW addressed one of our competitive units by making it 20% worse but failed to address the plethora of sub-optimal units which force us to take Kommandos over those units. Why the hell would I take a unit of Tankbustas when every other faction in the bloody game is getting D6+2 or D6+4 for dmg output, what did we get? D3 shots...but also -1 to hit if you move. Likewise, why would I take Burnaboyz who are still garbage and require a transport, why would I take painboyz when i'm not bringing any troops because GW nerfed them all? Why would I take a Mek ever? Why etc etc etc.

I would really like GW to stop nerfing every good unit we get that isn't even remotely as broken as units that have been around significantly longer. The damn chickenwalkers just got nerfed and are still one of the best units in the game, Drukhari got "nerfed" but didn't really LOL. My favorite was the Incubi going up in price but their transport going down by the exact same amount which meant they literally stayed the same.

I'm really hoping this is BS otherwise orkz are going to be in a bad place for awhile again.


 Tomsug wrote:
Semper krumps under the radar

 
   
Made in cz
Bonkers Buggy Driver with Rockets





Prague

Semper, what you say is more or less right, but miss the point.

1. Warbikers
One of the three valid and well working lists is a Speed Mob.

Warbikers are the only units, you can take in SpeedMob to do the actions. I don' t say they are great. I say, they will be common and well serving.

Because in Spead Mob they have 20” M, 5++, inbuilt -1 to hit and 3W. Which makes them really hard to be compared with the boyz.

But you are right, their CC is shity and Dakka too. But in squads of aprox. 5 they deal enough damage to kill 5-10 model squads of light infantry on the wings and play the game for points.

2. Kannonwagon
Kannonwagon was used times to times already before and my guess is, that it will be used again. The reason is the main gun in combination with +1 to hit and 12”M and 60” range. This mean, you will be always in range of something interesting.

If you make real game calculation, Kannonwagons have better ROI than Kustom Mega Kannons. Because:
1. KMK are slow and 36” = 50% time have no targets.
2. Any Mek Guns trigger SMG Spam PTSD and die T1 or T2. Really. In shooting army, they work more like a dedicated T1 target.

If Kannonwagons get WAGON keyword, they could be in SpeedMob and get
- free advance
- 5++
- fallback and shoot strategem

Which improves them a lot.

Btw. your calculation of their damage is not fair. Shooting with damage 3 weapon to W2 marines?

Do it like Kannonwagons are used:
Take 2 KW, 7 shots in average each, one of them burn 1CP to reroll number of shots = about 16 shots = 8hits = shooting on some T7 multiwound model = about 5 wounds, in Speedwaagh turn Ap-3 ends in some 5++ = about 3-4 penetrate x 3DMG = 9-12W down = Contemptor Dradnought down. Before he can shoot on you. And that is what counts.

3. Killakans - honestly I don't know why and how, but if you check Tactical Innovations, there were Killkans lists couple of times. And Mark Perry is their great fan right know (or was before Christmas). So don' t say they are not competitivy. Yes, they are crazy and they are rare. But they score on GTs.

11000p and one Ad Mech T-shirt 
   
Made in fr
Been Around the Block





I had some questions:

What are the best HQ for orks right now ?

Are the regular foot warbosses good and what is best on them: PK or Big choppa ?
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




Right, warbikes are ok, but only when in the AoR, otherwise they are mediocre. They are just really fast/tough boyz with ok guns.

Kannonwagon...yeah its crap. Go compare it to the new HH the tau get. Its worse in every single way possible. And Yeah no, a KMK is way better. For the same price I can take 3 KMK's with points left over, and I can position them to cover the entire board with relative ease. And I assure you, 3xD6 S8 -3AP D6dmg shots are significantly better than 2D6 shots, -2AP and 3dmg, especially durability wise since its spread over 2-3 units and are so damn cheap they aren't worth shooting with most things. As far as "50% of the time not having a target" ...The only time this edition that has happened was 2 games for me. And both times it was Turn 2-3 and it was because everything in range had died. Not a good argument Tom.

Also, re-roll # of shots isn't going to net you an extra 2 shots on average. But even if it did its 16 shots, 8 hits (barring any -1) 5.3 wounds, invuln kicks in and reduces it to 3.5, Duty eternal kicks in and reduces it to 7dmg on average. No idea where you got 9-12W from.

As far as Killakanz, for some reason I can no longer pull up lists on best coast pairing, but I'll bet you that you can't find more than 1 or 2 ork players using Killakanz in top 4 placings . And those 1-2 players are likely bringing MSU Kanz. Reducing them by 5pts doesn't fix the biggest problems with that unit which is speed and dmg output.



Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Mr Raptor wrote:
I had some questions:

What are the best HQ for orks right now ?

Are the regular foot warbosses good and what is best on them: PK or Big choppa ?


That is entirely dependent on what list type you are building.

Speedfreakz? You need Warboss on warbike or the ugly Deffkilla Wartrike. IF you are running a goff list featuring a lot of alphork strike units, you likely want Warbosses on foot or in mega armor. If you are running a beast heavy list you want the beastboss, either on squigosaur (barring this stupid nerf) or on foot in a Wagon. So the choice is up to you and your list construction.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/01/15 22:00:07


 Tomsug wrote:
Semper krumps under the radar

 
   
Made in gb
Regular Dakkanaut




Tomsung, how are you getting two kannon wagons shooting an average of 7 shots. Aren't you limited to only one of the 2d6 gun upgrades? Maybe I'm missing something...
   
Made in us
Heroic Senior Officer





Western Kentucky

CaptainO wrote:
Tomsung, how are you getting two kannon wagons shooting an average of 7 shots. Aren't you limited to only one of the 2d6 gun upgrades? Maybe I'm missing something...

Kannonwagons are the FW version of a battlewagon that get the supakannon. Its s8, ap2 base, and flat 3 damage with a 60" range

'I've played Guard for years, and the best piece of advice is to always utilize the Guard's best special rule: "we roll more dice than you" ' - stormleader

"Sector Imperialis: 25mm and 40mm Round Bases (40+20) 26€ (Including 32 skulls for basing) " GW design philosophy in a nutshell  
   
Made in us
Flashy Flashgitz




North Carolina

 Mr Raptor wrote:
I had some questions:

What are the best HQ for orks right now ?

Are the regular foot warbosses good and what is best on them: PK or Big choppa ?


Pretty much all warbosses see play, with KFF meks and Wartrikes making it into vehicle based lists like Freebooterz.

Beastboss on squig or on foot are both quite nasty with Big Killa Boss and Eadwhoppas Killchoppa relic.

Biker boss is still competitive as well, usually with Brutal But Kunnin and Da Killa Klaw.

I've used the standard footboss a lot and he's great if you make him a trukk boy (again using Brutal But Kunnin and Killa Klaw).

I personally really like a Deathskull mega armored warboss with Cybork Body and your pick of a WLT. He's a great late game piece for battling over objectives.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/01/16 02:46:28


 
   
Made in it
Waaagh! Ork Warboss




Italy

 Mr Raptor wrote:
I had some questions:

What are the best HQ for orks right now ?

Are the regular foot warbosses good and what is best on them: PK or Big choppa ?


All kinds of warbosses are good. Deffkilla wartrike is good in a speedwaaagh list, useless otherwise.

Big mek in mega armour with KFF and dead shiny shoota is also nice. If Deathskulls works well also with tellyport blasta and Opportunist trait. Some, even competitive players, bring the standard big mek with KFF but I hate him since it's just an extremely overpriced slugga/choppa nob once its KFF has blown.

PK better than big choppa, both relics are good though. Warboss in mega armour is good with standard choppa, better give him a relic to make him tougher.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
SemperMortis wrote:

I've never really been a fan of Meganobz in general. They always seem to be Terminators -1 and always priced rather harshly. A terminator (which isn't competitive) is priced at 38pts its got 1 less T than Meganobz but they get an inbuilt 5++ invuln save which makes them more durable against Mutli-wound weapons like Plasma/melta but less durable vs small arms. and honestly, i'm more worried about the melta/plasma than I am boltguns.



I'm not sure about that. Most of the weapons that target them are AP-3 at most which means they keep a 5+ save, exactly the same that the Terminator built in invuln. If the opponent fires meltas or more powerful weapons against 35ppm infantries instead of more juicy vehicles good for me.

It's the possible 4++ and +1 save granted by the shields that makes termies more durable than meganobz but if they have it they also become one dimensional, typically only melee. And they're usually worse than meganobz in rolling the charges, which makes them unrealiable even with built in deep strike.

Since 8th I've always considered them as Terminators +1, or in line with shield/melee weapon terminators. Before that, the old AP system definitely favored termies as AP2 and AP1 weapons bypassed meganobz save completely and termies were more resilient overall even with just 1W.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/01/16 08:06:37


 
   
Made in cz
Bonkers Buggy Driver with Rockets





Prague

SemperMortis wrote:
Right, warbikes are ok, but only when in the AoR, otherwise they are mediocre. They are just really fast/tough boyz with ok guns.

Kannonwagon...yeah its crap. Go compare it to the new HH the tau get. Its worse in every single way possible. And Yeah no, a KMK is way better. For the same price I can take 3 KMK's with points left over, and I can position them to cover the entire board with relative ease. And I assure you, 3xD6 S8 -3AP D6dmg shots are significantly better than 2D6 shots, -2AP and 3dmg, especially durability wise since its spread over 2-3 units and are so damn cheap they aren't worth shooting with most things. As far as "50% of the time not having a target" ...The only time this edition that has happened was 2 games for me. And both times it was Turn 2-3 and it was because everything in range had died. Not a good argument Tom.

Also, re-roll # of shots isn't going to net you an extra 2 shots on average. But even if it did its 16 shots, 8 hits (barring any -1) 5.3 wounds, invuln kicks in and reduces it to 3.5, Duty eternal kicks in and reduces it to 7dmg on average. No idea where you got 9-12W from.

As far as Killakanz, for some reason I can no longer pull up lists on best coast pairing, but I'll bet you that you can't find more than 1 or 2 ork players using Killakanz in top 4 placings . And those 1-2 players are likely bringing MSU Kanz. Reducing them by 5pts doesn't fix the biggest problems with that unit which is speed and dmg output.


Bikers - yes, in Speedmob ok,out of the speedmob wet noodles good maybe in minimum squads for fast objective taking (better than stromboyz imho… stormboyz die much faster).

KW
1. We have different experience with Mek Gunz and Kannonwagons. I spent the autumn playing with both of them in a buggy list. That could be an important context. I don' t say I' m Competitive Judge of Absolute True and the reason I was doing this check was because I had brand new painted models and I was looking to find the way how to use them. But the results of my autumn artilery check was what I said - in really dense terrain like Tactical Tortoise use on TTS, Mek Guns suffer to shoot on the right target. Be careful! I don' t mean no target at all. I mean the target, you want to die. Something to shoot at is there pretty common. Typical situation in T1 and T2 is you need to get the antitank down. Mostly some kind of dreadnoughts or something. Two or three models opponent really down want to have shot down. So he hide them. When I had the Mek Gunz, it sucked. He had better movement and was able to keep this models out of the range or behind LOSblock.

On the other side Kannonwagons? One in each corner of my backfield, 12”M and about 3,5” hull. Get the target into the crossfire T1 mostly not a problem. And hold the objective with the other side of the hull too.

Few times I used them in combination with two wazbooms. Alphastrike was really massive and it really was like in 8th - who goes first delete the opponents important units. But go second was stupid, basicly, if aou spent 850p or something in units, that either fly or sit in the back, you don' t have a feets on ground to score.

Their damage output is not great. But good enough in combination with what I write above to be mentioned.

2. Keep in mind I speak about KW also in SpeedMob context and future. We' ll see…

Killrigs and Beastboss - in your previous post - yeah, everybody was screaming and the results doesn' t seem like that. My theory is, that Killrig model is so ugly, nobody wants it at home. But it is just the question of personal preference

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/01/16 08:46:55


11000p and one Ad Mech T-shirt 
   
Made in it
Waaagh! Ork Warboss




Italy

 Tomsug wrote:


Killrigs and Beastboss - in your previous post - yeah, everybody was screaming and the results doesn' t seem like that. My theory is, that Killrig model is so ugly, nobody wants it at home. But it is just the question of personal preference


Ugly, takes forever to paint it, utterly expensive, just recently released and only works in multiples.

 
   
Made in cz
Bonkers Buggy Driver with Rockets





Prague

Everything works best in multiples. I have a golden Rule 3.

If paint something, do it in sets of 3. Mostly not max squads (spams will be nerfed) but “clever” 3.

3 buggies of each
3 x 5 of Kommandos /stormboyz /tankbustas etc - works like independed units, or large squad
3 x 2 mekgunz
3 x 5 bikers
Etc…

Effective in painting and allows you to build most of the lists +/-.
….
Just my 3 Jets sucks now….

AndExcept Mekboy Workshop of course…

I have to say, that Killrig is for me so gork damn unacceptable, I working on my own. But it takes even more time….

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Danmark

I like how the kill rig looks...

Hope, is the first step on the road to disappointment.

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Waaagh! Ork Warboss




Italy

 Tomsug wrote:
Everything works best in multiples. I have a golden Rule 3.

If paint something, do it in sets of 3. Mostly not max squads (spams will be nerfed) but “clever” 3.



The kill rig is a gorkanaut/morkanaut sized and priced (in currency) model though. Paying for 3 of them, assembling and painting them all is a massive investment of money and time. Unlike nauts it's still a 190 points model though, so it really needs redundancy to work at competitive levels.

It's a model that is supposed to be a centerpiece, not something that should follow the clever 3 rule.

 
   
Made in de
Ork Admiral Kroozin Da Kosmos on Da Hulk






It's really just what a battlewagon should be...

Earth is not flat
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Bonkers Buggy Driver with Rockets





Prague

 Blackie wrote:
 Tomsug wrote:
Everything works best in multiples. I have a golden Rule 3.

If paint something, do it in sets of 3. Mostly not max squads (spams will be nerfed) but “clever” 3.



The kill rig is a gorkanaut/morkanaut sized and priced (in currency) model though. Paying for 3 of them, assembling and painting them all is a massive investment of money and time. Unlike nauts it's still a 190 points model though, so it really needs redundancy to work at competitive levels.

It's a model that is supposed to be a centerpiece, not something that should follow the clever 3 rule.


Mehh, I have a plan to do 3 Nauts and it will be a great army! Knight armies also have more knights.

The only models do not fitting in rule of 3 are Stompa and Gargantuan Squigogh. They are simply too huge.

Nauts are small models. Smaller than regular Knights. Take a Landrider, stand it on the back and that it is. Every Demon is significantly bigger. And people play them in 3-4 per list…

And yes, it is significant ammount of work and money. Man have to dream in the right scale…

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2022/01/16 13:42:22


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You can’t use kannon wagon in speedmob and it will never get the wagon keyword this edition… Gw does not touch datasheets in a forgeworld supplement once it’s been released unless it’s horribly overpowered…furthermore if they did touch the fw supplement I hope to hell they fix nobs on bikes to have the big red button(6” advance), +1 wd, and cloud of smoke(-1 to hit). This is the only unit keeping speedmob from being much stronger competitively (aka a decent assault unit)… I prefer core keyword too …… 3-5x goff nobs on bikes w pks or bc for 12x str8 ap-1 d2 atks with exploding 6s and 3+ to hit…ld7 and 12 wds at t5 at 4+, 5++ and -1 to hit.. for 105pts

Killrigs are extremely strong don’t know what competitive lists you guys are looking at but a vast majority of the goff pressure list consists of at least 2x killrigs filled with beastsnaggas. This list is doing better competitively then either speedmob (which has secondary mission scoring issues) or recent freebooter speedwaagh lists (which lack thier original alpha strike and leave squads of buggies more vulnerable) And 3x killrigs is not a common build.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/01/16 14:24:11


 
   
Made in cz
Bonkers Buggy Driver with Rockets





Prague

Yeah, Killrigs are a core of one of the strongest ork builts. That is agreed. The point was, that it is not OP like some said. It does not bully every GT like the Freeboota buggy + jets list did. It is “just” normal strong built like at least 5-10 other faction has.

I' m very careful in saying “GW will never do this and that” since they changing the core rules out of blue…

But you' re right, giving Kannonwagon WAGON keyword is so simple, logic and usefull, Gw propably skip it…


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CA22 preorder next weekend. Good.

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And Tamiya Epoxy Putty is sold out in half of the europe. What a news on Sunday evening!

This message was edited 4 times. Last update was at 2022/01/16 18:36:37


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 Blackie wrote:
 Tomsug wrote:


Killrigs and Beastboss - in your previous post - yeah, everybody was screaming and the results doesn' t seem like that. My theory is, that Killrig model is so ugly, nobody wants it at home. But it is just the question of personal preference


Ugly, takes forever to paint it, utterly expensive, just recently released and only works in multiples.


I'm with you entirely Blackie, I have yet to buy/build one yet because its ugly as hell and massively expensive. I have $300 from tournament winnings waiting for Kommandos to get released, nerf or not I love the model and I want 30 of them. Killrigs...competitive but I just don't want to look at them. I might buy some eventually and do some conversion work on them. I'd love to make them into a parody of something.

 Jidmah wrote:
It's really just what a battlewagon should be...
Agreed again. The battlewagon looks wonderful but its rules are trash. It sucks in CC even with the deffrolla, its not that durable for its points, its shooting is god awful and at the end of the day its just a really big transport that we don't have a use for. if GW made it more durable and decent in CC it might have a place as a combat transport. ATM, my 3 wagonz are collecting dust.

gungo wrote:
You can’t use kannon wagon in speedmob and it will never get the wagon keyword this edition… Gw does not touch datasheets in a forgeworld supplement once it’s been released unless it’s horribly overpowered…furthermore if they did touch the fw supplement I hope to hell they fix nobs on bikes to have the big red button(6” advance), +1 wd, and cloud of smoke(-1 to hit). This is the only unit keeping speedmob from being much stronger competitively (aka a decent assault unit)… I prefer core keyword too …… 3-5x goff nobs on bikes w pks or bc for 12x str8 ap-1 d2 atks with exploding 6s and 3+ to hit…ld7 and 12 wds at t5 at 4+, 5++ and -1 to hit.. for 105pts

Killrigs are extremely strong don’t know what competitive lists you guys are looking at but a vast majority of the goff pressure list consists of at least 2x killrigs filled with beastsnaggas. This list is doing better competitively then either speedmob (which has secondary mission scoring issues) or recent freebooter speedwaagh lists (which lack thier original alpha strike and leave squads of buggies more vulnerable) And 3x killrigs is not a common build.



I'm not seeing it gungo. I mentioned I lost the ability to check lists on BCP but in 40kstats i haven't been seeing many at all.

 Tomsug wrote:
Semper krumps under the radar

 
   
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Regular Dakkanaut




 MrMoustaffa wrote:
CaptainO wrote:
Tomsung, how are you getting two kannon wagons shooting an average of 7 shots. Aren't you limited to only one of the 2d6 gun upgrades? Maybe I'm missing something...

Kannonwagons are the FW version of a battlewagon that get the supakannon. Its s8, ap2 base, and flat 3 damage with a 60" range


Thanks for clarifying that dude.
   
Made in gb
Tough-as-Nails Ork Boy




United Kingdom

gungo wrote:
You can’t use kannon wagon in speedmob and it will never get the wagon keyword this edition… Gw does not touch datasheets in a forgeworld supplement once it’s been released unless it’s horribly overpowered…furthermore if they did touch the fw supplement I hope to hell they fix nobs on bikes to have the big red button(6” advance), +1 wd, and cloud of smoke(-1 to hit). This is the only unit keeping speedmob from being much stronger competitively (aka a decent assault unit)… I prefer core keyword too …… 3-5x goff nobs on bikes w pks or bc for 12x str8 ap-1 d2 atks with exploding 6s and 3+ to hit…ld7 and 12 wds at t5 at 4+, 5++ and -1 to hit.. for 105pts

Killrigs are extremely strong don’t know what competitive lists you guys are looking at but a vast majority of the goff pressure list consists of at least 2x killrigs filled with beastsnaggas. This list is doing better competitively then either speedmob (which has secondary mission scoring issues) or recent freebooter speedwaagh lists (which lack thier original alpha strike and leave squads of buggies more vulnerable) And 3x killrigs is not a common build.



Kill rig builds are just lost under all these freeboota buggy/dakkajet builds
.
the other issues are it's a large difficult model to paint and with drukari dark lance D3+3 boats everywhere players just whince at the thought of all the damage going into it.

...i like it though

SMASH  
   
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It’s not though goff pressure lists are mainly dual Killrig lists they have surpassed the freebooter speedwaagh lists in tournaments.

Freebooter speedwaagh use to win by alpha strike which is harder for it to do in the current meta.
   
 
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